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| merlin1991 | arcean and everybody else who went for testing-testing, di you notice anything out of the ordinary? | 01:31 |
|---|---|---|
| arcean | I would say no :) | 01:31 |
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| luf | freemangordon: I think it's good time for testing new bluez-4.99 ;) | 10:52 |
| kerio | luf: i keep having minor issues when connecting my BT headphones to the n900 | 11:25 |
| kerio | but they work fine once connected | 11:27 |
| kerio | and it only happens once in a while, so it's an unfindable bug :( | 11:27 |
| luf | kerio: no report no issues ... | 11:27 |
| kerio | i know :( | 11:27 |
| luf | What's exactly the problem? | 11:27 |
| kerio | i get the "connected" message and the icon in the status area, but after a tiny bit it disappears, the bluetooth icon still blue and the UI still reporting it's "connected" | 11:28 |
| kerio | usually disconnecting it and reconnecting it fixes it right away | 11:28 |
| luf | Hmmm ok. | 11:29 |
| luf | What are you tryiing to connect? HF or computer? | 11:29 |
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| kerio | luf: A2DP | 11:30 |
| luf | So audio ... | 11:30 |
| kerio | yep | 11:31 |
| kerio | http://www.lg.com/us/cell-phone-accessories/lg-HBS700-tone <- these ones | 11:31 |
| kerio | (they're *really* neat) | 11:31 |
| luf | I think it doesn't matter which kind. There is probably some ugly bug in audio. I'll try to find it but to be honest I'm short on time this week. | 11:32 |
| Skry | kerio: those do look neat, how's the audio (music) quality? | 11:36 |
| kerio | Skry: pretty good | 11:36 |
| kerio | compression artifacts tend to be exacerbated by the decode-encode-decode though, so you *really* want to start with some good quality audio | 11:37 |
| kerio | say, V0 VBR MP3s, or some high-bitrate CBR | 11:37 |
| kerio | the range is kinda poor, but i think that's also a problem of the n900 | 11:38 |
| kerio | it's perfectly fine if you keep your phone in a jacket's pocket, a bit less so if you keep it in your pants' pockets | 11:38 |
| kerio | it's got some heavy bass though, so you might need to get used to it in the beginning | 11:40 |
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| Skry | I have mostly flacs so that's no prob, and stuff I mostly listen is not that bass heavy. I was thinking about spending ~80eur to wired headphones so might as well give those a try. | 11:42 |
| kerio | mind you, they still sound worse than a good pair of wired headphones | 11:43 |
| kerio | they're just a lot more convenient, imo | 11:43 |
| Skry | well, they must beat those headphones that came with n900 so should be improvement anyways | 11:45 |
| kerio | i said *good* :) | 11:45 |
| luf | kerio: I'm just curious had you change all pulseaudio rates in N900 to 44100 from 48000? | 11:46 |
| kerio | luf: i changed the default one iirc | 11:46 |
| kerio | could it be the reason? | 11:47 |
| kerio | i changed default-sample-rate from 48000 to 44100 | 11:47 |
| luf | No I thinking about totally different thing ;) | 11:47 |
| kerio | luf: how many resample methods are there, btw? | 11:47 |
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| luf | Very few :( | 11:48 |
| luf | Just speex and two unusable as I remember. | 11:48 |
| kerio | luf: how do i check what's going on with pulseaudio at a specific time? | 12:03 |
| kerio | for instance, how do i check what's the samplerate of a certain stream? | 12:03 |
| luf | kerio: pactl list | 12:08 |
| kerio | luf: anyway, how do we configure audio sink? | 12:09 |
| luf | kerio: :) Look into the history ... | 12:09 |
| kerio | anyway, it feels like your bluez is a bit less reliable :( | 12:12 |
| kerio | it makes no sense though, it's the same codebase | 12:12 |
| kerio | maybe it's just that i notice these annoyances more, though? | 12:13 |
| kerio | luf: why is your pulseaudio +0m6? | 12:16 |
| luf | kerio: I like feelings :) | 12:18 |
| luf | It's easy to find the problem with it. | 12:18 |
| luf | kerio: pulseaudio because of some bt patch + new module? | 12:18 |
| kerio | luf: so? | 12:19 |
| kerio | +0m6 would be harmattan | 12:19 |
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| luf | No. | 12:19 |
| luf | It's just version of the package not the maemo version as I understand from packages (changelogs). | 12:20 |
| kerio | why do you think +0m5 is called m5? | 12:20 |
| kerio | luf: anyway, there *should* be no resampling in pulseaudio | 12:21 |
| kerio | sink input from mafw is s16le 2ch 44100hz | 12:21 |
| kerio | and the sink output to my headphones is s16le 2ch 44100hz | 12:21 |
| luf | And what do you mean with less reliable - worse sound? disconnecting? lagging? | 12:24 |
| kerio | disconnecting sometimes | 12:25 |
| kerio | but as i said, maybe it used to happen before too and i just didn't focus on it | 12:25 |
| luf | It's the same as with stock ... | 12:25 |
| kerio | apophenia is a bitch | 12:26 |
| luf | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=51894 | 12:29 |
| luf | for example ... | 12:29 |
| luf | But I can't say if it's more/less often with stock/4.99 | 12:30 |
| kerio | yeah, yeah | 12:30 |
| kerio | that's what i was guessing | 12:30 |
| kerio | luf: what would really be awesome would be an ICD plugin to do PANU in a simple way :3 | 12:34 |
| luf | :D Sure. | 12:37 |
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| luf | It should be nice project for you, isn't it? | 12:37 |
| kerio | luf: that would involve me doing things | 12:38 |
| luf | As I saw you have a lot of time at uni ;) | 12:39 |
| luf | kerio: bluez - disconnecting. I need some debug logs and maybe also hcidump if you're able to collect it .... | 12:41 |
| kerio | luf: i checked the syslog (it wasn't doing debug output though) and it only said "bluetoothd: audio device disconnected" or something similar | 12:42 |
| luf | kerio: Are you sure you had bluetoothd in debug (-d '*') ? | 12:42 |
| kerio | as i said, i didn't have it in debug mode :) | 12:43 |
| luf | It's useless without debug. | 12:43 |
| kerio | luf: the issue is a lot simpler than i thought, i think | 13:51 |
| kerio | it's a range issue | 13:51 |
| kerio | luf: keeping the connection open requires less quality than opening a new one, or reopening it after powersaving | 13:52 |
| kerio | is there a way to pump up the tx power? | 13:52 |
| kerio | :3 | 13:52 |
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| luf | kerio: I don't know. I'm not such good in hw ... | 14:42 |
| luf | kerio: Do you have some debug? Or from what you judged that it's txt power? BTW increasing tx power leads to higher battery usage. | 14:43 |
| kerio | luf: it connects fine when i'm holding the n900 vaguely close to my headphones, it doesn't connect when the n900 is in my pocket :) | 14:43 |
| luf | kerio: And are you sure the problem is on N900 side? | 14:45 |
| kerio | i think it's a mix of bad range on the n900 *and* the headphones | 14:46 |
| luf | That's for sure true :D You didn't miss any option ... | 14:46 |
| kerio | to be fair the range on the n900's bt is fairly awful | 14:47 |
| luf | I have no problem in car ... even in the back part (for baggage). | 14:49 |
| luf | What's awful for you? | 14:50 |
| luf | kerio: can you next time you'll meet the bug with disconnected x icon and status connected try to run hcitool to see what BT is thinking? I need to know if it's a problem of bluez or just AIS or whatever ... | 14:55 |
| kerio | k | 14:57 |
| luf | kerio: have you started working on icd plugin for bluez PANU client? :) | 14:59 |
| kerio | nope | 14:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: most likely BT-TXlevel is fixed | 15:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: my N900 connects to sony headset even when meters away, and range seems like going thru 2 walls from living room to kitchen | 15:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (~ 8m) | 15:33 |
| kerio | maybe it's these headphones then | 15:33 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: also, A2DP is a lot more heavy than HSP/HFP | 15:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if you don't have N900 alu case, it probably is the headset, yes | 15:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and I'm talking about listening to music, so A2DP | 15:35 |
| kerio | i have a plastic case, it shouldn't affect radio | 15:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | depends on the plastic | 15:35 |
| luf | DocScrutinizer05: do you mean some alu plactic? | 15:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | luf: nope | 16:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | WLAN is known to not work nicely when some quite common case-plastic is too close to antenna, it gets detuned | 16:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | BT has same freq | 16:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | even shares same antenna | 16:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on some devices | 16:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | normal windowglass is known to give GPS a -6 to -18dB | 16:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pastic isn't any different in that regard, depending on the particular material and thickness | 16:23 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | plastic* | 16:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the funny example to figure: PIR motion detectors don't work thru window glass at all | 16:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | quite counter-intuitive | 16:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | something being transparent or non-conductive doesn't mean it's negligible for RF | 16:26 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: i remember my range sucking even before i had the otterbox, though | 16:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: a lot of 'egoistic' WLAN AP in the neighborhood may spoil BT as well | 16:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mind you, they share same frequency | 16:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | even your own AP might suffice to give BT a hard living | 16:30 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: hm, i should try when i'm at my countryside house | 16:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | good plan | 16:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | there've been several reports that streaming media from internet via WLAN to N900 to BT headset doesn't work at all, since WLAN and BT have to 'co-exist' andthat can't work when both have to do a 100% job | 16:32 |
| jon_y | isn't wifi and bt spread spectrum? | 16:41 |
| jon_y | as long as it isn't too crowded, it should work regardless of frequency overlap | 16:42 |
| * kerio starts counting the visible wifi APs | 16:52 | |
| kerio | 20 plus hidden | 16:53 |
| kerio | so yeah | 16:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | jon_y: BT is freq hopping afaik | 16:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | WLAN isn't exactly spread spectrum | 16:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but if a sufficient number of WLAN AP mess up each channel available for BT to hop on, BT can't work properly | 16:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | WLAN rather is TDMA, leaving open timeslots between pkgs sent | 16:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if several WLAN AP use same freq (which is chan +/- 2, due to sidebands), then it becomes more and more unlikely that BT finds such an open timeslot in that range of BT channels | 16:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | in my book WLAN is already zombie state in real life, due to absolute overload / crowding of RF band | 17:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and every luser and his dog ramp up both bandwidth used (by N etc), as well as TX power to shout down the neighbor | 17:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | since none of those lusers gets the catch that a proper cable is a million times better than crappy WLAN for connecting their PC to the router 30cm away | 17:04 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 waits for frist DSL-routermodem to come with WLAN only, no more ethernet ports at all | 17:05 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | thne they bitch about their crappy DSL connections while they don't realize it's actually the WLAN that doesn't go beyond 1 or 2 MBit, due to them themselves and all their neighbors basically 'abusing' WLAN for a cable replacement for distances of 2m between stationary devices | 17:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and that | 17:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | 's where BT has to stand a living | 17:09 |
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| kerio | poor bt :( | 17:14 |
| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer05: did you try the new testing already? | 17:27 |
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| merlin1991 | who else in here tried the pre release -testing? | 17:35 |
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| vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: I have a solution. | 18:23 |
| vi__ | I have a 5dB gain enternal aerial to my AP. | 18:23 |
| vi__ | It works. | 18:23 |
| vi__ | So I going to replace it with 3 9dB antennas. | 18:23 |
| vi__ | There are no free channels near my home. | 18:24 |
| vi__ | If you cannot beat them...DESTROY THEM WITH POWER. | 18:24 |
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| kerio | vi__: still won't work | 18:45 |
| kerio | you can't magically put bigger antennas and expect your wifi network to work better | 18:45 |
| kerio | it's still going to be crowded as fuck | 18:46 |
| vi__ | Yes, but if everyone else gets really shitty service, they might fuck off my channel. | 18:57 |
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| tadzik | is it advised to optify package which consists of a single 148K binary + manpages? | 21:20 |
| Pali | yes | 21:22 |
| tadzik | okay | 21:22 |
| Pali | btw, autobuillder doing optification if debian/optify file has auto | 21:23 |
| tadzik | that's the first time I hear about autobuilder | 21:24 |
| tadzik | is that something garage-related? | 21:24 |
| Pali | it is builder for extrad-devel | 21:27 |
| Pali | but now not working | 21:28 |
| Pali | (also maemo wiki not working) | 21:28 |
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| Pali | merlin1991, freemangordon, can you test new battery applet? | 21:43 |
| Pali | and next question: What about creating new fiasco rootfs image with pr1.3.1 + cssu-stable and without some preinstalled apps (cheery, ...) | 21:45 |
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| tadzik | what package is responsible for the behaviour of a longpress in, for example, file manager? | 21:59 |
| kerio | Pali: it's going to be tough to do | 22:03 |
| kerio | Pali: but go right ahead :3 | 22:04 |
| kerio | Pali: the ubifs image is going to be a bitch to work with | 22:05 |
| Pali | kerio, I can generate ubifs image, no problem | 22:06 |
| Pali | and I can also unpack and edit it | 22:06 |
| kerio | Pali: cool | 22:06 |
| kerio | i doubt the scripts will run nicely in a chroot jail | 22:06 |
| kerio | but you could do the things they do manually | 22:06 |
| kerio | i mean things like HAM | 22:07 |
| Pali | and I have patches for block2mtd.ko driver which creating mtd device from block | 22:07 |
| Pali | which allows me to mount ubifs image on computer without nandsim | 22:07 |
| kerio | you'd have to run ICD at the very least for HAM to work | 22:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | merlin1991: sorry, not yet | 23:07 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | though I could install it on a fresh device, I'd not be able to find the time to test it at all, since I'm a tad ill (flu) | 23:09 |
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| tadzik | who can I ask questions related to hildon codebase? | 23:10 |
| wmarone | probably best to just ask | 23:15 |
| tadzik | that got no response :) | 23:16 |
| tadzik | what package is responsible for the behaviour of a longpress in, for example, file manager? | 23:16 |
| tadzik | I believe that's just the context menu | 23:16 |
| merlin1991 | tadzik: arcean knows best, but he's currently not here | 23:16 |
| tadzik | I'll look around for him, thanks | 23:17 |
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