| peterleinchen | nevertheless, no time for referendum or such | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| pichlo | Yes, this calls for an immediate discussion! | 00:00 |
| juiceme | yes, that will take a bit of time to set up | 00:01 |
| Oksana | Ok. Referendum can be held about American and Asian trademarks. European trademarks just need to be renewed-transferred. | 00:01 |
| Win7Mac | no need for referendum about TMs | 00:01 |
| * Oksana doesn't know how Oceania fits into trademarks. And Antarctic... | 00:02 | |
| Oksana | Win7Mac? | 00:02 |
| Win7Mac | HiFo has about 3000 Euro | 00:02 |
| Win7Mac | We can't cover worldwide | 00:02 |
| juiceme | okay, that's good, it will cover the quick ones | 00:02 |
| pichlo | Sounds like enough for EU + US | 00:03 |
| peterleinchen | but what IS the benefit for US? | 00:03 |
| gerbick | Is US even necessary? | 00:03 |
| pichlo | Last time I heard - and that was ages ago, possibly 2 years? - HiFo had about 4000 | 00:03 |
| pichlo | So we do not spend so much | 00:03 |
| juiceme | who's got the right-to-sign-nameof HiFo in bank transfers? | 00:03 |
| Oksana | Are Eu and De same or different? Like, one fee for Eu, one fee for De, or one fee for both of them? | 00:04 |
| juiceme | DE is part of EU, or was at least last time I looked :) | 00:05 |
| Win7Mac | DE is 300, EU is another 1.000 Euro iirc | 00:05 |
| Oksana | Let's just renew them both? | 00:05 |
| pichlo | Another? That doesn't sound right. | 00:06 |
| juiceme | I'd say the europe is priority, then comes US and lastly, if at all Asia | 00:06 |
| pichlo | +1 | 00:06 |
| gerbick | Agree | 00:06 |
| Oksana | Ask Roschier Brands Attorney about cost and such? And yes, Europe is urgent. | 00:06 |
| Win7Mac | imho we should keep costs for such stuff minimal and spend it for infra + development | 00:07 |
| peterleinchen | no. DE essential, Then possibly EU,US,Asia | 00:07 |
| juiceme | Oksana, good idea. I hope they don't charge for just asking them, huh? | 00:07 |
| peterleinchen | Win7Mac, yes | 00:07 |
| gerbick | Are we 100% sure that DE is not part of the EU in regards to how that paperwork should be done? | 00:07 |
| Win7Mac | servers are in DE/Eu so that is mandatorty only imho | 00:07 |
| juiceme | peterleinchen, I am treating DE and EU as one when I talk about EU | 00:07 |
| pichlo | gerbick, +1 | 00:08 |
| Win7Mac | gerbick, DE is part of the EU ;) | 00:08 |
| chem|st | Win7Mac: there are only 4 regions up for renewal, and I would keep those. Your note on "having Germany is enough" is doubtfully right as why would Nokia register a special EU TM if an EU country is sufficient? | 00:08 |
| pichlo | Can we have that verified? | 00:08 |
| chem|st | and it is not about servers | 00:08 |
| gerbick | Ich weiss! But it's strange to hear that DE and EU have separate prices whereas if you do EU, DE should be covered too. | 00:08 |
| Win7Mac | Hi chem|st ;) | 00:08 |
| Oksana | Win7Mac: I would happily donate to cover cost of EU trademark registration. Since Eu does seem to be expiring soon, too, just like De. | 00:09 |
| chem|st | it is a TM not a note "I am here" | 00:09 |
| Oksana | chem|st: Welcome! 4 regions up for renewal? Eu, De, what else? | 00:09 |
| juiceme | chem|st, hi! | 00:10 |
| chem|st | Oksana: please read upon where it is registered... it is FI EU US and WO or WL or something | 00:10 |
| * chem|st waves his hat "Hello!" | 00:10 | |
| chem|st | we could skip FI but that is the origin and I would keep it that way | 00:11 |
| Oksana | :-) Not going to skip anything where it is already registered. | 00:11 |
| Oksana | ((FI EU US and WO or WL or something)) Link? | 00:12 |
| chem|st | WO or WL or whatever it is called is a global registry so you only need those countries extra that do not accept that registration | 00:12 |
| chem|st | Oksana: google? | 00:12 |
| chem|st | EM FI US WO | 00:13 |
| peterleinchen | chem|st, but re-registering all would exceed available money | 00:14 |
| chem|st | EM is europe WO is some global thing | 00:14 |
| chem|st | peterleinchen: does it? | 00:14 |
| chem|st | peterleinchen: how do you know? | 00:14 |
| MentalistTraceur | Personally, I actually suggest we consider doing EU TM renewal, and not the DE. While it may be cheaper, at least from a general principles standpoint, it seems to me like having the EU one will be legally 'cleaner' than having the DE one. While I have no legal experience on this, I'd imagine there's a fairly united set of treaties and convensions requiring EU countries to respect EU ... | 00:14 |
| MentalistTraceur | ... TMs roughly the same across the board. However, there might be some quirk in German law that leads to DE TMs not working the same in Germany as they do in the rest of Europe. On the other hand, I recognize there may be some details I don't know about w.r.t. the same kinds of quirks applying to different European countries' treatment of EU trademarks... | 00:15 |
| chem|st | we have some $3.5k that could cover at least EM US WO as they are all about 800eur | 00:15 |
| chem|st | MentalistTraceur: EU is not EG is not EEG is not (forgott the fourth abbrev.) | 00:16 |
| juiceme | beautiful, then the situation is not so bad as I feared | 00:16 |
| chem|st | so now please someone send a mail to hifo and ask those folks (not me) to take care of that... roschier is the brands attorney... | 00:16 |
| chem|st | we have till EOM to claim and renew for the normal price, after that we have 6 months to renew at an exceeded fee, after that we need to register from scratch | 00:17 |
| chem|st | at least that is for europe | 00:18 |
| chem|st | what I read | 00:18 |
| juiceme | good | 00:18 |
| peterleinchen | sounds good | 00:19 |
| juiceme | let's do that then, who'd like to write da mail? | 00:19 |
| juiceme | it's the board mail address | 00:19 |
| chem|st | in July we loose HK in August we BR CA IN MY TH TW (basically asia) | 00:19 |
| gerbick | Stupid question - how do we raise money to avoid losing this in any area? | 00:20 |
| juiceme | I suppose there was probabl no special strategy with Nokia when it registered TM's in those areas? | 00:21 |
| chem|st | gerbick: as soon as we (MCeV) have a bank account we can accept donations, papers are with juice atm | 00:21 |
| juiceme | gerbick, ask for donations I'd say, same as before. The current cash is all donations | 00:21 |
| Oksana | Ok, so we send letter to Hildon Foundation asking them to renew all trademarks expiring in February. | 00:21 |
| chem|st | I hope this bankaccount thing is over this month once and for all (found a global player) | 00:21 |
| chem|st | Oksana: those words are too kind I believe | 00:22 |
| Oksana | Ok. But it will be a special paper insanity to transfer trademarks and domain registration from Hildon Foundation to MCeV. | 00:22 |
| juiceme | "send letter to Hildon Foundation demanding them to renew all trademarks" ? | 00:22 |
| Oksana | Not all, just those expiring in February. | 00:23 |
| chem|st | Ryan needs to call roschier and ask them what is possible and negotiate, I asked that 3 times now in different ways | 00:23 |
| juiceme | Oksana you are right there, and it will probably cost too :( | 00:23 |
| gerbick | What would be the impact - beyond extended fees if we go into the secondary renewal (see Chemist notes earlier) in the 6 month phase? Do we risk losing, being challenged by another company or anything else? | 00:23 |
| Oksana | juiceme: I dearly hope that the bank account will be available for donations soon. | 00:24 |
| Win7Mac | chem|st, three times? without CC'ing me or board@ ? | 00:24 |
| chem|st | this 6 month thing is what "I" read about for EM no idea about the others | 00:24 |
| juiceme | Oksana me too, let's see how it goes. I've got a stack of papers I need to go to a bank here with and get them signed to transfer to germany | 00:25 |
| chem|st | Win7Mac: not lately... ever sicne! and you asked about the same didn't you? | 00:25 |
| chem|st | I wrote to board and not to single persons | 00:25 |
| juiceme | chem|st so is it tha roschier is unco-operative? | 00:26 |
| chem|st | the us-hifo is - they sleep | 00:26 |
| juiceme | ah | 00:26 |
| chem|st | I know I am not all that responsive myself but when there is a deadline closing up on me I get things done no matter what... | 00:26 |
| * juiceme yawns... past of my bedtime | 00:27 | |
| Oksana | Maybe, somebody from US ( gerbick ? MentalistTraceur ? ) can attempt to contact us-hifo? | 00:27 |
| juiceme | I'll drop off now, so gnite all! | 00:27 |
| * Oksana if it would make any difference... | 00:27 | |
| chem|st | juiceme: go to be.... I will have a look for the meeting minutes and what is needed for court the next days... as that what you send me won't get accepted (I learned) | 00:27 |
| Oksana | Good night, juiceme ! | 00:28 |
| chem|st | bed | 00:28 |
| peterleinchen | juiceme, gnite | 00:28 |
| juiceme | chem|st, okay, I'll wait what you can send | 00:28 |
| juiceme | nite! | 00:28 |
| gerbick | It's 17:28 in the US, so not sure why they'd be "asleep" | 00:28 |
| chem|st | lol | 00:28 |
| peterleinchen | gerbick, another rofl | 00:29 |
| chem|st | gerbick: sleeping for months... | 00:29 |
| gerbick | that's GMT -5 easter standard time, earlier on the West Coast (GMT -2 there) | 00:29 |
| gerbick | ... | 00:29 |
| Oksana | Depends on spam filters, transport and other real life... | 00:29 |
| gerbick | well dang | 00:29 |
| gerbick | That went over my head | 00:29 |
| chem|st | :D | 00:29 |
| chem|st | ryan blinked once... just once | 00:30 |
| Oksana | blinked?.. | 00:30 |
| chem|st | I have to admit that it is on me that we are not just putting this through... but waiting for banksters to return calls and check what is possible takes time... | 00:31 |
| chem|st | Oksana: I give up... | 00:31 |
| Oksana | Do not, please :-) | 00:31 |
| gerbick | If you require US communication, I'll gladly assist where I can be of some help. | 00:32 |
| Oksana | I will send out letter to Hildon Foundation board (they have three different emails, right?) and tell them that all Maemo trademarks expiring in February need to be renewed. If they have any problems, they are welcome to reply to council and tell about said problems, asap. | 00:33 |
| Oksana | gerbick: Maybe, chem|st can give phone numbers of members of us-hifo? ;-) | 00:33 |
| Oksana | I do not even remember who is currently members of HiFo... | 00:34 |
| peterleinchen | oksana, Ryan Abel, Gido Griese, ... | 00:36 |
| peterleinchen | oksana, demand all TMs to be renewd, not only Feb expiring | 00:37 |
| Oksana | Gido Griese is one of the board email addresses, I recognise it :-) Thank you, peterleinchen | 00:37 |
| peterleinchen | that was what I understood | 00:37 |
| Oksana | All TMs to be renewed? Ok, but Feb need to be done NOW, as in, before EOM | 00:38 |
| Oksana | But yes, having HiFo to renew all TMs at once is better, because later the bank account will be transferred to MCeV, and it would be troublesome for MCeV to renew trademarks which Nokia transferred to HiFo. | 00:39 |
| peterleinchen | yep | 00:40 |
| gerbick | +1 | 00:40 |
| peterleinchen | sorry, but I have to leave now, too. good night/day/evening | 00:40 |
| Oksana | And they should consult Roschier ASAP, and tell Council ASAP if there aren't enough funds or something to do it. | 00:40 |
| Oksana | Good night peterleinchen | 00:40 |
| * pichlo happy to donate towards TM fees if needed | 00:45 | |
| gerbick | ditto | 00:45 |
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| Win7Mac | There's no need for a bank account anymore if we renew TM worldwide since we're broke then ;) | 00:45 |
| pichlo | My personal monthly allowance is 200GBP. Of those, 50 go to charity. I am happy to donate 50. | 00:46 |
| Win7Mac | Our funds could be spent much better i believe | 00:46 |
| * pichlo waves bye | 00:48 | |
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| Win7Mac | Good nite o/ | 00:48 |
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| Oksana | Good night! | 00:48 |
| gerbick | hey guys, I need to run out of the office - they're shutting off the lights (that's a hint) | 00:48 |
| gerbick | Feel free to send who I need to contact in the US and I'll gladly do so. | 00:49 |
| * Oksana thinks that bank account will be needed, either way; and if there is something else which needs funds, feel free to point it out. At this moment, we just want to keep maemo trademark protected, for the sake of domain registration, and possible new popularity of Maemo, once it gets ported to newer devices | 00:50 | |
| Oksana | gerbick: Will look it up. | 00:52 |
| gerbick | take care guys... | 00:53 |
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| MentalistTraceur | Oksana, that said, we need to be aware that protecting Maemo requires us to not be financially broke as an organization. | 00:55 |
| MentalistTraceur | Protecting Maemo in general is not necessarily best achieved by spending as much of our money as possible on TM renewals. | 00:55 |
| Oksana | Donations. | 00:55 |
| MentalistTraceur | True, but those may be better funelled elsewhere, depending on how much of those there ends up being. | 00:56 |
| Oksana | Yes. But if the current amount in HiFo bank account is enough for TMs renewal, it will not be difficult to re-fill it. | 00:57 |
| * Oksana would consider the strain well-worth it. | 00:57 | |
| Oksana | Maemo trademark is important not only by itself, but for freenode channels and maemo.org domain registration, too. And I still do not get why MeeGo-something edition of Windows goes unchallenged. It even has elements from Tolkien realm, if I understand the rings correctly. | 00:59 |
| MentalistTraceur | I suspect because those who own the mark don't care enough. Also, probably, because getting your IP rights enforced against anything made in China (which is where the thing I think you're talking about comes from) is notoriously difficult. | 01:01 |
| Oksana | Win7Mac's remarks are a good opportunity to figure out exactly where funds should go in the future. Better hardware for maemo.org? Or something else? Either way, it's a good way to raise awareness and start a donation drive - if he doesn't keep his words as cryptic as "could be spent much better". | 01:02 |
| MentalistTraceur | *Nod* Anyway, I'll be heading out now, since the meeting seems to have wrapped up. | 01:03 |
| MentalistTraceur | I might be back on here later tonight, but if not, g'night. | 01:04 |
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| warfare | maemo.com KK went through, waiting for maemo.org | 10:30 |
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| freemangordon | Hi guys, I am still looking for a big enough window of spare time to assess the thumb target in the autobuilder, hopefully will have such till the end of this week | 20:48 |
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| Oksana | Thank you! :-) | 23:45 |
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