IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2018-09-20

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Vajbwhat is the editor of choice if you use linux for coding? Vim?08:24
Vajbin windows I've been using Eclipse and VS code, but now I installed Devuan ascii to another laptop and thought to try it out08:25
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felangga@Vajb I always use atom :)08:30
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felanggabut it's bit heavy08:30
KotCzarnymcedit is included 'for free' with mc08:31
felanggaanother choice is sublime, but it not free08:31
Vajbmc is midnight commander?08:35
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KotCzarnyit is very flexible08:35
KotCzarnyyou can customize menu to have few handy actions available08:36
KotCzarnyie. diffing files of choice, calling help, syncing files whatever one could need08:36
KotCzarnybut if you are used to some IDE (ie. eclipse), you might find it lacking autocompleting functions08:37
Vajbim not sure yet which one like more. Notepad++ or some IDE. Both have their moments08:41
Vajband i rather use light software, because my laptop is not newest model08:41
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* Maxdamantus works as a mostly-Java programmer and practically always uses vim.09:30
MaxdamantusThough I normally have eclipse open for some static analysis tasks, and automatically adding imports.09:31
* Oksana usually uses vim, but dislikes vim's heavy documentation on Maemo 5 - takes up space, I think...09:32
* Maxdamantus has maemo all on eMMC so doesn't care about such things.09:32
MaxdamantusThe main issue I have on maemo though is that my terminal seems to exit if I press escape too quickly, which happens frequently in vim.09:33
Maxdamantus(so I intentionally slow my input down)09:33
* Maxdamantus hasn't got around to figuring out why that happens.09:33
OksanaDoes pressing escape in terminal, without vim, make terminal exit? Not for me, how about you?09:37
MaxdamantusHolding it down does.09:37
MaxdamantusIt doesn't exit if I just press it once.09:37
* Oksana tries to reproduce: X Term, vim .zebra.log, Esc-Esc-Esc-Esc..., nothing happens09:38
OksanaDo you have escape mapped to hardware keyboard? Because I am just pressing Esc on touchscreen, in X Term09:38
MaxdamantusAre you pressing a key, or the button on the screen?09:38
MaxdamantusYes, mapped to a key.09:38
MaxdamantusI don't think it happens if I touch the button rapidly.09:38
OksanaDoes it happen on your desktop, if you open Terminal and hold down Escape on keyboard?09:39
MaxdamantusActually, I figured out a while ago that it happens to some other applications too.09:39
MaxdamantusSo it'll be the WM that does it, not the terminal itself.09:39
OksanaAs in, is it intended functionality of X Term, or is it a bug, or is it feature of window manager?09:40
Maxdamantusor else some library in Maemo or something.09:40
MaxdamantusIt happens to Opera too.09:40
Maxdamantusand the "Settings" dialogue.09:40
Maxdamantusbut iirc it doesn't happen to things like gvim or urxvt.09:41
MaxdamantusSo maybe it's something in Maemo's libgtk or something.09:41
OksanaGvim is open-source, right? Should be possible to look into what they are doing with their window, to make it Esc-proof?09:41
OksanaCompare it side-by-side with something else that does close when Esc is held down.09:42
MaxdamantusDoesn't happen to the xterm in debian either.09:43
MaxdamantusSo I don't think there's anything that makes it "esc-proof" .. I think the maemo programs just decide to exit under those circumstances for some reason.09:43
OksanaBut X Term in Maemo isn't exactly the same as X Term in Debian, right? So, there may be window flags involved, similarly to rotate-or-not flags.09:45
MaxdamantusI remember running xterm under some X11 tracing program a while ago and I don't think I could see anything odd happening there, except for the application destroying its window.09:47
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JuestoOksana: Xterm in x11 is way different than osso-xterm, yes09:55
JuestoEsc should work for closing?09:56
JuestoOksana: you can just delete vim manpages i guess :)09:57
Juestoi use:09:57
JuestoWindows: notepad++09:57
JuestoMac: TextWrangler09:58
JuestoLinux: gnome 2 gedit/mate's pluma or xfce mousepad or leafpad09:58
Juesto*nix/posix cli: nano09:59
Juestognome 3 is way too bloated09:59
* Oksana agrees about Gnome 3, though didn't use it much if at all10:01
Juestogtk3 mainly10:08
Juestomate or xfce are better choices10:08
Juestolxde is outdated10:09
Juestohow it's going Oksana?10:12
OksanaLots of things to do.10:14
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Vajboh yes i forgot gedit14:49
sixwheeledbeastVajb: I use vi for terminal or Pluma which is MATE's fork of gedit.14:52
sixwheeledbeastI don't seem to get on with nano which seems to be a default option on some distros.14:55
Vajbi use nano for system tweaks only15:03
Vajbjust tried pluma coz it was installed by default15:03
Vajbit misses one feature that i like15:03
Vajbdoubling brackets and quotes etc15:04
KotCzarnymcedit highlights brackets15:04
sixwheeledbeastdoubling brackets?15:05
MaxdamantusPresumably inserting ')' after typing '('15:05
Maxdamantusand hoping that you don't move the cursor before you actually type the ')' or something, dunno.15:06
* Maxdamantus has always found that annoying in editors that have it.15:06
* Maxdamantus also struggles to see the practical use.15:06
KotCzarnyhighlighting is ok tho15:06
KotCzarnyhelps finding bigger scopes easily15:07
MaxdamantusYeah, even vim highlights.15:07
Vajbyeah, what Maxdamantus said15:07
Vajbhelps keeping things organized for me15:07
sixwheeledbeastI don't want to have things inserted for me, it does highlight the appropriate brackets if you are on that line15:08
Vajbyeah i saw highlighting it is good feature too15:09
Maxdamantus'%' is one of my main navigation features in vim.15:10
Maxdamantus(jump to corresponding bracket/brace)15:10
KotCzarnyyup, same for mcedit15:10
Vajbvim seems like overly complicated15:10
sixwheeledbeastYou may find a plugin that adds auto bracket closure for pluma.15:11
Vajbi can't help but think that it was designed for very specific keyboardlayout15:11
MaxdamantusI really feel that it's the opposite WRT layout.15:11
Vajbi use finnish keyboard so things are not that convenient to get15:12
Maxdamantusvim works really well even on N900 (disregarding my escape issue I mentioned that I have)15:12
Maxdamantusbecause it *doesn't* assume things about the keyboard.15:12
Maxdamantuseg, vim doesn't require combinations involving things like alt/meta, ctrl, etc15:12
KotCzarnyin mcedit it's alt-b (going to matching bracket)15:12
MaxdamantusPretty much every other editing system does assume those tricky combinations.15:13
KotCzarnysimply because there are many functions and only so many keys15:13
MaxdamantusI use Dvorak, and have not done any remapping in vim.15:13
Vajbi need combination for each and every type of bracket for example15:13
KotCzarnygtk has one nice feature of being able to remap bindings15:13
KotCzarnybut in mcedit you have menu available on click as a secondary way of accessing it15:14
* Vajb should invest on learning keyboard shortcuts...15:14
KotCzarnyalthough, as i've said, highlighting is enough15:14
Vajbhehe i can imagine you thoughts of some of the ide's i've tried15:15
MaxdamantusI feel like if one were to actually invest in learning shortcuts, might as well just invest in learning vim navigation.15:15
Vajbthey can insert even methods for you15:15
Maxdamantussince probably all popular editors have plugins for vim-style input.15:16
KotCzarnylearning shortcuts is only worthwhile for things you actually use/need15:16
KotCzarnyie. undo/redo15:16
KotCzarnyand maybe save/save as15:16
sixwheeledbeastI like using Alt to shift lines about in pluma15:16
Vajbjust today i learned very convenient shortcut for web browsing alt+left arrow15:17
KotCzarnymark/move block15:17
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CreteilHi all22:38
CreteilWhat is the problem ? : Sorry, it seems that you are using an IP address or a proxy that is listed in the forum anti spam blacklist.22:38
CreteilFeel free to contact our staff on irc freenode #maemo channel.22:38
infobotrumour has it, unbanip is please contact techstaff <at> maemo <dot> org with your request, or see ~techstaff, or see, or if your ip is dynamic, try changing it, or tags: RBL, tmo IP blocked, spam22:39
CreteilI don't see the fact that my IP (fixed) used for spamming the Maemo forum...22:40
CreteilIt apear suddenly when I was reading a thread and clicking on next page the message occur.22:41
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