Wizzup | https://wizzup.org/maemo-leste-ascii-h-d-n900-3.jpg - devuan ascii on n900 with h-d | 00:39 |
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Wizzup | 3d is not yet powervr, we need to resolve one more issue there, but should not be too far out | 00:40 |
pkill9 | what's h-d? | 00:49 |
Wizzup | hildon-desktop | 00:49 |
Wizzup | but also hildon-home and some others | 00:50 |
Wizzup | basically the window manager on the n900 and some other things | 00:50 |
pkill9 | that is niiice | 00:50 |
Wizzup | we'll try to make a dd-able image for sd card this week I think | 00:50 |
pkill9 | :D thanks for the work | 00:51 |
pkill9 | so does this use a much newer kernel? | 00:51 |
Wizzup | see picture - yes | 00:51 |
Wizzup | 4.15 | 00:51 |
pkill9 | :O | 00:52 |
pkill9 | sorry didn't look carefully | 00:52 |
pkill9 | lol | 00:52 |
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sicelo | Wizzup: yay! | 07:39 |
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Juest0 | nice, so it is completed yet? | 07:48 |
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Wizzup | Juest0: no, but when we have a ddable developer image in a week or two, we can try to get more people involved | 09:53 |
Wizzup | once there is a stable base, adding other things might be easier | 09:54 |
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Juest0 | no other platforms than arm and n900 yet? | 10:17 |
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Juest0 | alright thanks Wizzup | 10:17 |
Wizzup | Juest0: freemangordon has been testing on amd64 | 10:17 |
Juest0 | how that went | 10:17 |
Wizzup | well, it runs? | 10:17 |
Juest0 | all of it? | 10:18 |
Wizzup | no, what I showed you | 10:18 |
Juest0 | oh right | 10:18 |
Wizzup | there's a lot of things that are not ported, this is just the base | 10:18 |
Wizzup | hopefully more people can then show up and help porting more :) | 10:18 |
Juest0 | well, the base runs? :p | 10:18 |
Wizzup | hildon-desktop and such, yes | 10:18 |
Juest0 | im yet to upgrade my devuan vm and i am running low on disk space plus an infected installation i am yet to resolve :( | 10:19 |
Wizzup | wait a week or two :) | 10:21 |
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Juest0 | heh | 10:26 |
Juest0 | alright | 10:26 |
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enyc | Wizzup: hrrm... to what extent can new kerenl be used with original maemo system, too ... ? | 15:25 |
Wizzup | idk, some parts might work, others not, it's been done before with pali's kernel, but requires some changes to rootfs as well | 15:26 |
Wizzup | not interested in looking backwards though :) | 15:26 |
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enyc | kk | 15:27 |
enyc | Wizzup: intention is to have a working system that integrates with existing open parts of maemo/hildon or so ??? | 15:28 |
Wizzup | intention is to have a modern base (devuan/debian) with maemo/hildon components so that it can be used as a phone/internet-tablet just like n900, on the n900 and other phones | 15:32 |
Wizzup | will write more about it soon | 15:32 |
enyc | Wizzup: goodgood! | 15:35 |
pkill9 | Wizzup: how close are you to releasing it? | 15:37 |
enyc | Wizzup: My input towards testers -- you mention SD cards... It would be really good if you could make decent howto for SD-card-only based install, with howot make existing common maemo "bootmenu" able to provide this as a boot-option. Preferably, workable as "extra" partition on larger sd-card, allowing existing maemo with /media/mmc1 to co-exist with 'experimental devuan on /media/mmc1p3 sort of | 15:38 |
enyc | thing.... Not everybody will have/want separate-n900 or so to 'test' with. Not everybody will be u-boot/etc expert. | 15:38 |
Wizzup | enyc: this is how IU use it | 15:42 |
Wizzup | how I use it | 15:42 |
Wizzup | sd card only | 15:42 |
Wizzup | if you have u-boot installed via ham you only need to select 'boot from sd card' or type 'run sdboot' | 15:42 |
Wizzup | it's not rocket science | 15:42 |
Wizzup | :) | 15:42 |
Wizzup | but yes, we'll do some writeup | 15:43 |
enyc | Wizzup: ok, what about those using "bootmenu" rather than "u-boot" ? | 15:43 |
Wizzup | enyc: bootmenu is u-boot | 15:43 |
Wizzup | afaik | 15:43 |
enyc | Wizzup: check, don't assume, it may be awrapper around it or so | 15:43 |
Wizzup | doubti t | 15:43 |
Wizzup | it's just u-boot with some scripts | 15:43 |
enyc | Wizzup: yes, check the wrapper-scripts etc WORK with your arrangement | 15:44 |
Wizzup | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=81613 | 15:44 |
Wizzup | enyc: I don't understand why you act like that, I know it's u-boot | 15:44 |
enyc | Wizzup: because i don't have a definite confirmation/explanation what the "bootmenu" wrapper-scripts/tools are | 15:44 |
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enyc | Wizzup: also, the other thing that would be worth checking, is "co-existance" with sd-card maemo data parttiton and maemo Swap-on-SD-card (flopswap). Is it possible to have those working with maemo "as usual" and have a e.g. 4th partition on the SD-card, to "boot devuan from" ? | 15:45 |
Wizzup | bootmenu is u-boot with some scripts that generate u-boot config file/menu | 15:45 |
Wizzup | enyc: yes | 15:46 |
enyc | Wizzup: excellent =) | 15:46 |
enyc | ok, good =) write those all up, collect seggusionts etc etc, highly agree! | 15:46 |
enyc | do you have maemo-camera working in devuan ? | 15:46 |
enyc | err n900 camera i mean | 15:47 |
Wizzup | I don't know, didn't check yet, other stuff to sort first. What we want it something that boots and is usable for development, and then developers can pick this up | 15:47 |
enyc | nods! | 15:48 |
enyc | dev environment includes qemu-system-arm chroot ?? | 15:48 |
enyc | err qemu-user-arm i mean | 15:48 |
bencoh | enyc: for n900 mainline support: https://elinux.org/N900 | 15:48 |
bencoh | it's relatively up-to-date | 15:48 |
Wizzup | enyc: no, not at this point | 15:49 |
enyc | bencoh: ooooooooooooooooooh recent kernels ... | 15:49 |
bencoh | Wizzup: btw, building arm packages on devuan/ascii (or debian/stretch) is as simple as runing dpkg-buildpackages, except for packages where multilib/paths support is broken | 15:50 |
bencoh | -s | 15:50 |
Wizzup | bencoh: do you mean dpkg-buildpackage sorts out the cross compiler or qemu stuff | 15:50 |
bencoh | cross-compiler stuff (no qemu as far as I can tell), yes | 15:50 |
Wizzup | ok | 15:51 |
Wizzup | well, we also have autobuild env, but yeah | 15:51 |
bencoh | all you have to do is install the deps for the target arch | 15:51 |
Wizzup | I've done most of the powervr testing on the deviec itself via ssh | 15:51 |
Wizzup | bencoh: neat | 15:51 |
bencoh | xorg-server is broken for instance, and you need to relocate its .pc file to build packages depending on it | 15:52 |
bencoh | nothing too difficult though :) | 15:52 |
Wizzup | bencoh: in the end we'd want everything in jenkins/ci | 15:54 |
bencoh | Wizzup: native build, or cross? | 15:55 |
Wizzup | native | 15:55 |
bencoh | ah | 15:55 |
Wizzup | bencoh: everything at http://maedevu.maemo.org/ is already native ly built | 15:55 |
bencoh | yeah | 15:55 |
bencoh | I know | 15:55 |
Wizzup | ack | 15:55 |
enyc | hrrm nokia-n900's expensive to find now ?? | 15:56 |
bencoh | unfortunately there is no real (working) cross build environment for debian (apart from the one I mentioned, but it's still not completely supported) | 15:56 |
bencoh | enyc: depends on where you live and what you're looking for | 15:56 |
Wizzup | enyc: bout 25 euro | 15:58 |
bencoh | Wizzup: seriously? where from? | 15:58 |
Wizzup | .nl | 15:58 |
Wizzup | I bought about 5 for that price | 15:58 |
bencoh | hmm ... okay, I really need to get one | 15:59 |
bencoh | any link? :) | 15:59 |
Wizzup | they only ship to nl, it's refurbished, but I can get one and send it your way | 15:59 |
Wizzup | it's like a dutch ebay | 15:59 |
bencoh | that'd be awesome :) | 15:59 |
Wizzup | ok, poke me about it a bit later :) | 16:00 |
bencoh | sure ... thanks! :) | 16:00 |
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enyc | bencoh: I (thought) the core of debian (compliers etc) is all that really 'needs' to cross-build, then qemu-user chroots (or real hardare) can do rest of the work ? | 16:27 |
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DocScrutinizer05 | bootmenu is *inside* linux, called from preinit. uBoot is *before* linux | 23:25 |
freemangordon | right | 23:27 |
DocScrutinizer05 | it's just Pali decided to bastardize the bootmenu file hierarchy and syntax to configure uBoot by running a wizard that "compiles" the uBoot config file from bootmenu special entries | 23:28 |
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DocScrutinizer05 | but technically bootmenu and uBoot are totally orhogonal | 23:28 |
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DocScrutinizer05 | hi freemangordon :-) | 23:31 |
freemangordon | hi! | 23:33 |
DocScrutinizer05 | and then there once been (*DEPRECATED*) multiboot that flashed a new kernel from within the system and then rebooted the system into another system. Obviously something every normal MoBo manual warns you NOT to do regularly and only with very stable and secure power supply | 23:34 |
DocScrutinizer05 | ~maemo-multiboot | 23:35 |
infobot | maemo-multiboot is, like, deprecated, and a horrible hack. PROBLEMS WITH NITDROID/MULTIBOOT? reflash rootfs&kernel aka COMBINED | 23:35 |
DocScrutinizer05 | to put it even more concise and to the point: multiboot is a shellscript run by busybox, uBoot is a bootloader to load kernels and hand them rootfs pointers | 23:44 |
DocScrutinizer05 | ooops | 23:44 |
DocScrutinizer05 | to put it even more concise and to the point: bootmenu is a shellscript run by busybox, uBoot is a bootloader to load kernels and hand them rootfs pointers | 23:44 |
DocScrutinizer05 | backupmenu is a "plugin" for bootmenu | 23:45 |
DocScrutinizer05 | so you can think of bootmenu as maemo's "init s" | 23:46 |
DocScrutinizer05 | which is another occasion that shows clearly why we don't want systemd in maemo | 23:47 |
Juesto | hey freemangordon how is the amd64 experience of hildon coming? | 23:48 |
DocScrutinizer05 | not like systemd could even run maemo since both want exclusive control over cgroups | 23:48 |
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Maxdamantus | To be fair, systemd doesn't have to be the first process that is ever run, like with practically any sane init system. | 23:54 |
Maxdamantus | as long as the "bootmenu" execs it as pid 1, it shouldn't conflict with bootmenu itself. | 23:54 |
Maxdamantus | on my (Debian) system at work, my initramfs mounts the root filesystem, pivot_roots into it and execs systemd. | 23:56 |
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