IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2017-09-13

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mike727Thinking of getting a Droid4. Is there anything additional too , that I should look at?05:26
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merlin1991freemangordon: pong10:18
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sicelointerestingly enough, on the blueborn android app, the N900 appears with a medium level of risk, while other Android devices come up with high risk10:30
Wizzupjust simple stack protects should fix this issue\10:35
Wizzupe.g. any recent kernel with stack protector or any grsec kernel since like forever10:35
Wizzupyet another argument for a modern sw stack :10:35
KotCzarnydefine 'recent' and 'forever'10:35
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WizzupKotCzarny: hmm... 2004? earlier?10:38
Wizzup(wrt forever)10:38
Wizzupand you can look when CC_STACKPROTECTOR was introducted10:39
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KotCzarnymy 3.4 kernel has only 'oops on overwriting canary' style of stack protector10:39
KotCzarnyi think it was added around 3.1410:40
Wizzupwell, it's been in grsec since like forever10:40
KotCzarnywish you luck patching grsec into vendor kernels, he  he10:41
Wizzupthere's a reason I don't use vendor kernels if I can10:41
Wizzupif I can help it*10:41
bencohnot that this is relevant any longer since they basically decide to go closed-source all the way10:42
bencohwell, gpl-compliant-but-distributed-to-customers-only-and-nobody-will-publish-it10:42
Wizzupsome people still have access, but yeah10:43
bencohbottom line: "meh"10:43
Wizzupyes. but I still stand with their vision on security :)10:43
bencohsame here10:43
Wizzupalso the 4.9 patchset is maintained for 2 years by minipli10:43
Wizzupso it's not quite gone yet, and perhaps by the time they will have changed their mind10:43
bencohoh, so he eventually picked up the project?10:43
Wizzuponly for 4.910:44
bencohyeah, but ... that's cool10:44
Wizzuphe's maintaining the patchset again 4.9 lts10:44
bencohis there still a chan for non-subcribers? I mean .... their former chan went private and we all got kicked, so ...10:45
Wizzupthere's #pax, but it's not super active10:46
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sicelowondering if setting
sicelo /proc/sys/kernel/randomize_va_space can improve things a little for N900?10:59
sicelocurrently it is 1, on Jolla it is 210:59
WizzupI wouldn't count on the n900 kernel being useful in this regard11:02
Wizzuplinus didn't take security seriously then, still mostly doesn't11:02
siceloyes it doesn't solve the problem .. but there is mention, at least on Jolla pages, that ASLR can help a bit11:03
KotCzarnyor just dont run bt all the time11:04
siceloof course11:05
bencohwhich is much better battery-wise anyway :)11:05
siceloweird that armis notified linux on 15th Auguest, when everyone else was notified around 4 months before11:09
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sixwheeledbeastWanted to deal with companies that would agree to promote/advertise the companies findings first?12:40
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parazydwhere could one find the hildon-icons and/or sdk-default icons .deb ?14:12
jonwilAccording to the SDK repository information, the package osso-icons-default is marked "Provides: hildon-icons"14:36
parazydthen there's just that bug to fix. that package tries to overwrite a part of hicolor-icon-theme and doesn't manage to get instaled14:37
VajbKotCzarny: name for "wind of change" would be Scorpions ehehe14:42
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ff_MaeScorpionsom :)15:13
ff_how hard is to leave active hw keyboard when device is in sleep mode?15:16
Vajbwould it be the same to just ssh to device?15:17
ff_looking for some solution on to device15:20
ff_it's simple leave touch enabled when device is in sleep mode, but dunno hw kb15:21
Vajbno idea. Maybe u wanna check "phone-control" wiki15:22
ff_nothing there about that15:23
Vajbbeats me, then15:23
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DocScrutinizer05huh? what's the problem? my kbd works great to undim screen15:31
DocScrutinizer05and slide-open kbd unlocks device here15:31
ff_ok, but how to enable hw kb and not to unlocks dev15:33
DocScrutinizer05that's paradox15:33
DocScrutinizer05locking device has the only purpose to not act on touchscreen and kbd events15:34
ff_why? I can leave touch enabled when dev is in sleep mode, it's not paradox15:34
DocScrutinizer05what is "in sleep mode", N900 never is in sleep mode15:35
KotCzarnyhe means locked and display off15:35
KotCzarnylocked as in switch locked15:35
KotCzarnynot keycode locked15:35
DocScrutinizer05yep, the whole purpose is "don't accept imput, don't show output"15:36
DocScrutinizer05so "how do I accept input in 'don't accept input' mode?" is a paradox question15:36
bencohhe never mentioned this "don't accept input" mode ;)15:37
KotCzarnyhe means 'unlock only hwkb part'15:37
Vajbim interested of the use case of this hack.15:37
DocScrutinizer05I suggest you redefine the function of lockswirch then, since it's not "lock" you want15:38
DocScrutinizer05"lock" means "no input from kbd"15:39
ff_ the same but with hw kb15:40
DocScrutinizer05maybe you only want to dim screen, or whatever. I faul to understand the purpose15:40
bencohDocScrutinizer05: or it could mean "no input from screen" :)15:40
DocScrutinizer05bencoh: definitely not since a lock also might involve device lock15:41
DocScrutinizer05and the purpose of lock is to avoid any unintented input events, and dim screen so battery savings15:42
ff_ok Doc, I'm looking for solution to turn off display & graphics chip, and it leaves hw kb enabled15:43
DocScrutinizer05anyway the *purpose* is unclear15:44
DocScrutinizer05that's easy :-)15:44
DocScrutinizer05look to /etc/mce/mce.init, it defines dim times and levels15:45
DocScrutinizer05then there's also the generic X11 screen lock15:45
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DocScrutinizer05if you only wanr brightness=0, there is a method in phonecontrol for that, or ask me if not15:47
ff_but ondemand not with tklock15:47
DocScrutinizer05jowever be aware that any kbd input will undim screen#15:47
ff_looking sth independent for tklock15:49
DocScrutinizer05mce.ini screen dimming is not tklock15:49
DocScrutinizer05Tochscree+Keyboard-lock does what the name suggests15:51
DocScrutinizer05when I slide open my device, screen goes dim, then black/off after 30s, any kbd press reactivates it15:52
DocScrutinizer05so I think that's exactly what you want15:52
DocScrutinizer05it's already there, see etc/mce/mce.ini15:52
ff_no, I want use hw kb during screen is dim15:54
ff_mce.ini can enable +/- but not whole hw kb15:58
DocScrutinizer05forget tklock15:58
DocScrutinizer05you do not want TtouchscreenKeyboarflock15:59
DocScrutinizer05you don't get it, or I don't get it. I just told you my device accepts kbd input just fine even when after <30s>(adjustable) the display went completely dim16:00
DocScrutinizer05for this the device does NOT tklock after 30s, just dims screen16:00
ff_ok, and after 30s when I use hw kb screen goes on, but I wish it stays dim16:05
ff_that's the case16:05
DocScrutinizer05see stuff like16:06
DocScrutinizer05# Policy for keypad interrupts16:06
DocScrutinizer05# 2 - leave keypad interrupts on even after blanking16:06
DocScrutinizer05#     (used to support pass-through of +/-)16:06
DocScrutinizer05# 1 - disable interrupts immediately16:06
DocScrutinizer05# 0 to wait until display is blanked16:06
DocScrutinizer05then you probably want to set brightness=016:07
DocScrutinizer05unblanking screen on input events is embedded deeply inside X1116:08
DocScrutinizer05I'd guess16:08
DocScrutinizer05not that blind typing would nake any sesne to me16:08
DocScrutinizer05pretty much sounds like XY problem16:08
infoboti heard xy is The XY problem: You want to do X, but don't know how. You think you can solve it using Y, but don't know how to do that, either. You ask about Y, which is a strange thing to want to do. Just ask about X.
ff_blind typing, that's what I want16:09
ff_magic sentence: blind typing16:09
DocScrutinizer05~wiki blind typing16:10
infobotI couldn't find a matching article in wikipedia, look for yerselves:
DocScrutinizer05it would help a lot when you actually would explain what *exactly* you want to achieve, IOW what's the usage scenario16:12
ff_but it will not blind, when run some app16:12
DocScrutinizer05in a usage scenario, terms like tklock have to purpose16:12
DocScrutinizer05yoz ask about technical means to achieve an obscure goal, please explain the real goal instead16:13
ff_need it for example for mplayer16:14
DocScrutinizer05mplayer without display makes little sense, no?16:14
ff_not for me at least16:15
KotCzarnyff_: there are media players that can run with screen off and reacting to some hw keys16:15
DocScrutinizer05why the heck would I run a video media player without any display?16:16
ff_and it for some short key, without using screen16:16
KotCzarnykeys on the rim of the n900 are not normal kb, and can be left enabled16:16
DocScrutinizer05and what's so nad about the display coming up anyway when I press a key to control the player?16:16
bencohDocScrutinizer05: mplayer can be used as a music player as well I'd say16:17
ff_media player doesn't have speed up tempo function16:17
KotCzarnydepends on media player16:17
KotCzarnyhar har16:17
bencohKotCzarny: please, dno't16:17
DocScrutinizer05bencoh: and what's the terrible impact of display going active for 5 s when I press a key?16:17
KotCzarnybencoh: dont what?16:18
* KotCzarny is innocent of everything16:18
bencohDocScrutinizer05: dunno, increased light in a dark room? :)16:18
DocScrutinizer05the set brightness to zero!!16:18
bencohor maybe he wants to avoid any touch input altogether16:18
DocScrutinizer05or maybe he tells us what he wants16:19
ff_bencoh is right16:19
ff_but that's only one usage16:20
DocScrutinizer05there's a solution to every requirement, but I'm not inclined to guess what might be the right selution whan you don't tell us the requirements16:20
bencohthis reminds me of the fact that we didn't solve the "tklock/codelock/powermenu interrupts mplayer audio playback for a second"16:21
DocScrutinizer05specifying requirements by listing what doesn't work is not a feasible approach16:21
bencoh(or any player other than gst-mafw, basically)16:21
KotCzarnybencoh: if you ever find the cure, shout16:21
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bencohKotCzarny: I stopped looking for it tbh16:22
KotCzarnyadding app to audio group works for a while, then it's reset by something16:22
bencohthat's what I thought then16:22
bencohbut iirc we eventually arrived to the conclusion that even that didn't always work(?)16:22
KotCzarnyyeah, see the 'reset' part16:23
ff_KotCzarny: has osc speed up tempo function?16:23
KotCzarnyff_: i have it in code, just didnt enable16:23
bencohKotCzarny: no I mean, without "waiting for a while"16:23
bencohbut I kinda forgot16:23
KotCzarnyff_: i'm using code from sox for effects16:23
KotCzarnywhen i get around for next release code spree i will probably add it16:24
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infoboti guess question is if you have a question and want people to give useful answers, make sure you have read this first:    >>This guide will teach you how to ask questions in a way more likely to get you a satisfactory answer.<<16:25
ff_KotCzarny: nice hint, I'll check it16:26
KotCzarnysubscribe to the tmo thread, i post release notes there16:27
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ff_N900 screen has 60Hz refresh rate, can it be 120Hz or sth around it? Graphic chip can handle max about 180Hz?16:39
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sixwheeledbeastAre you requiring multiple functions while the screen is off? Or just play/pause?17:13
sixwheeledbeastfor example17:13
ff_would be nice to have 120Hz when device is on power adapter, and 60Hz on battery, but that probably needs some work with kernel / xorg / clutter or not?17:14
ff_I can pause/play forward/backward with headset button but need some more17:14
sixwheeledbeastYou can make the device utilise the camera_focus while locked17:15
sixwheeledbeastI use this for skip track17:15
ff_need more than one or two, active hw kb is what I need17:19
ff_I can use touch screen, but that wouldn't be precisely enough17:21
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KotCzarnyhmm, i wonder if there is a way to programatically enable hwkb without going through the normal unlock17:23
KotCzarnybut i'm afraid screen lock takes over the display front17:24
KotCzarnyand will receive the keys without passing further17:24
ff_ enable hwkb without going through the  normal unloc17:25
ff_k is what I'm looking for17:25
KotCzarnythat way one could use rim keys to enable/disable hwkb, and maybe launch app to do some things17:26
KotCzarnyif you arent afraid you might take a look into screenlock source17:26
KotCzarnywhat it does and maybe hack your way through it17:27
ff_where that source is available?17:28
KotCzarnyrepo maybe?17:28
KotCzarnythere are few lockscreen related packages in repos17:31
ff_ok, I'll look for it17:31
bencohdepends on what you're referring to by "screenlock"17:31
bencohyou should check out mce17:31
bencoh(I guess)17:32
ff_script for headset button & mplayer
ff_yes, mce unlocks +/- which is part of hw kb17:33
KotCzarnynothing 'tklock' related though17:33
bencohff_: ah, so you're basically trying to enable audio keys when locked?17:34
ff_no, whole hw kb17:34
bencohKotCzarny: that was actually the second thing we tried to understand re mplayer / audio groups17:34
KotCzarnyNext bet is to use open source version of osso-systemui-tklock17:34
bencohthat's the "lock screen"17:34
bencoh(the one with the slider)17:34
bencohiirc there isn't much there apart from the UI17:35
DocScrutinizer05((~questionenable hwkb without going through the  normal unlock is what I'm looking for)) no, what you're looking for is an alternative to lock, and I still fail to understand the requirements of that alternative. *Maybe* they are: no touchscreen events, no energy waste on backlight17:36
DocScrutinizer05dman mouse17:36
KotCzarnytklock plugin event eater window17:36
KotCzarnyso yeah, there is a dummy window eating all events17:37
KotCzarnynext thing would be checking if it still shows with screen off, or its done different way17:38
DocScrutinizer05why mess with tklock when you simply could make your app display a black screen and discard all pointer events?17:38
KotCzarnybecause tklock probably shows on top17:39
DocScrutinizer05it's totally pointless to mess around with stuff without knowing the requirements17:39
KotCzarnyand eats all events17:39
DocScrutinizer05KotCzarny: THEN DONT ENABLE TKLOCK!17:39
DocScrutinizer05tklock is not the thing you look for17:40
bencohDocScrutinizer05: as far as I'm concerned, I'd like a workaround to the fact that I can use volkeys with stock mediaplayer, but not with mplayer17:40
DocScrutinizer05when you need to change/disable 90% of what it does17:40
bencohthat alone is good enough a reason for the workaround he's trying to achieve17:41
DocScrutinizer05ff_ never really told what's the workaround to achieve17:41
DocScrutinizer05always was xy17:41
sixwheeledbeastfrom what I gather all the functions of mplayer without the screen17:42
KotCzarnyhrm. where did i put gpio xh headers17:42
DocScrutinizer05when you say you want tklock to learn to allow more than just F6/F7 aka Vol+/- keys enabled, then yes, that's a decent requirement spec17:42
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DocScrutinizer05and indeed a reasonable feature request17:43
DocScrutinizer05however so far there's screen dim and there's tklock. For all requirements I heard so far screen dim is sufficient, doesn't need tklock.17:45
sixwheeledbeastI am happy with play, skip forward and volume which is possible on locked device. I would imagine dim screen would be an issue if in a pocket...17:45
DocScrutinizer05you might define a new function tklock/2 that doesn't lock the kbd17:46
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DocScrutinizer05when however the usecase is exactly "all the functions of mplayer without the screen" then I'd suggest to modify mplayer to show black screen and ignore touch input events17:48
DocScrutinizer05then you don't need to mess up tklock function but simply never do tklock17:48
ff_but that dosen't save power, 300mW wasted17:49
ff_graphic chispet is powered in that state17:50
DocScrutinizer05then use X11 screenlock17:50
DocScrutinizer05it's even a kernel function since 1986+-17:51
DocScrutinizer05you can shut down display even in consoles17:51
DocScrutinizer05no tklock needed17:52
ff_is it on maemo?17:52
KotCzarnyi think screen blank is supported by most systems17:52
DocScrutinizer05since it's a genuine kernel function I'd hope yes it is17:52
DocScrutinizer05keep in mind you need to enable display when your app loses focus (for ctrl-BS taskswitcher), or when a powerbutton-menu gets displayed, or when your app gets closed or receives a "enable display" hotkey17:55
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DocScrutinizer05but indeed what bencoh somwhat suggested (teach tklock to enable more buttons than just vol-keys) is a nice approach when implemented correctly17:57
DocScrutinizer05since it avoids device deadlocks from a particular app blowing chunks and misbehaving17:58
DocScrutinizer05can't be hard to augment the list of enabled-in-tklock keys arbitrarily17:58
DocScrutinizer05see mce.ini18:00
DocScrutinizer05# Policy for keypad interrupts18:00
DocScrutinizer05# 2 - leave keypad interrupts on even after blanking18:00
DocScrutinizer05#     (used to support pass-through of +/-)18:00
DocScrutinizer05seems this is a never fixed regression in PR1.3 where that got hardcoded in mce instead of obeying to the mce.ini parameter18:01
DocScrutinizer05so a subject for CSSU18:02
DocScrutinizer05suggestion: re-implement that mce.ini parameter and augment to  DisableKPImmediately=2,'list of keycodes to enable'18:04
DocScrutinizer05if the list is empty, it defaults to +/- keys aka F6/7(?), otherwise only the listed keycodes are enabled. wildcard '*' allowed to enable all18:05
ff_that would be a solution18:09
DocScrutinizer05:-) \o/18:09
DocScrutinizer05hint to implementer: postinst script needs to edit mce.ini to set DisableKPImmediately=218:13
DocScrutinizer05since that's what mce does right now, unconditionally18:13
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ff_ah, forgot evkey, duh, evkey -d -t -1 /dev/input/event1 , workaround but will be work18:17
DocScrutinizer05can't find manpage and evkey has no decent -h18:21
DocScrutinizer05so nfc what that does18:21
ff_it wait until -d / down key press and prints its number18:22
ff_-u wait until realese key18:23
ff_-t wait until given time in ms18:25
ff_-t -1 wait infinity18:26
DocScrutinizer05sixwheeledbeast: ((I would imagine dim screen would be an issue if in a pocket...)) well, you hardly have kbd slide open when in pocket, and sliding open does unlock device anyway18:32
DocScrutinizer05if it's only about the touchscreen events that need to get blocked, there are other possible approaches than tklock18:34
DocScrutinizer05it's always also a question if that behavior is appropriate regardless of the app that has focus18:35
DocScrutinizer05((that behavior)) to e.g. disable ts-events. Probably it would be better to let app just consume the events but process them in a different way - immediately blank screen again - when screen blanked18:37
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DocScrutinizer05while true; do evkey -d -t -1 /dev/input/ts; dbus-send foo.mce mce/dimscreen; done18:41
ff_-s print numbers of all pressed keys18:42
DocScrutinizer05of course THIS (my evkey thing) is not the right solution since it's completely bypassing X11 event pipeline and thus is unaware of app losing focus18:45
DocScrutinizer05it's just sketching what the mainloop in app should do when receibing a touchscreen X11 input event18:46
ff_dbus-send mcs/dimscreen is interesting this one: dbus-send --system --type=method_call --dest="" --print-reply "/com/nokia/mce/request" or different?18:46
DocScrutinizer05I'd think it's rather set_thlock or somesuch18:47
infobothmm... phonecontrol is
ff_right dbus-send --system --type=method_call /com/nokia/mce/request string:"locked" that one?18:48
DocScrutinizer05ooh nope18:48
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ff_is it simple to higher display freshrate in maemo? default is 60Hz18:50
ff_ok, thank you with hw kb, now it is quite simple18:51
DocScrutinizer05  doing "the opposite"18:54
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DocScrutinizer05 >>Thanks, the first method (dbus) works with no issue<< MEH not for me19:10
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DocScrutinizer05dman lack of dbus introspection on all Nokia dbus services. alegedly since "impossible in this coding environment" ROTFL19:18
ff_yes, some dbus inspector would be helpful19:22
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ff_maybe d-feet ?19:24
DocScrutinizer05the services themselves don't support introspection19:26
DocScrutinizer05they lack the data/functions for it19:26
DocScrutinizer05from strings mce:19:26
DocScrutinizer05[Notice] -Sigyn- Your actions in #maemo tripped automated anti-spam measures, but were ignored based on your time in channel; stop now, or automated action will still be taken. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact a member of staff19:27
DocScrutinizer05repeating pattern. My fault19:38
DocScrutinizer05should have used pastebin19:38
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DocScrutinizer05found string "DimImmediately"19:44
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infobotI guess you mean the handhelds sources, see
infobotTo build Debian packages from source code: first, add a deb-src line to your sources.list file.  Then "apt-get build-dep _pkg_" and "apt-get -b source _pkg_" to retrieve the build-dependencies, and the source.  The resulting .deb files will be in `pwd`.19:49
DocScrutinizer05there it is  but why T F is a 404?19:52
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DocScrutinizer05;a=blob_plain;f=tklock.c;hb=HEAD  "static gboolean ts_event_control(gboolean enable)"  and "static gboolean kp_event_control(gboolean enable)"20:04
DocScrutinizer05no idea where the system filters for F6/720:04
DocScrutinizer05I guess static gboolean generic_event_control() just uses the above mentioned sysfs nodes and writes 1 or 0 to */enable20:06
DocScrutinizer05as in    return generic_event_control(mce_keypad_sysfs_disable_path, enable);20:07
DocScrutinizer05static gboolean disable_eveater(gboolean silent);  sounds interesting but defned elsewhere, so... I'm lost20:14
ff_forget about it, evkey is good enough for that purpouse20:15
DocScrutinizer05typedef enum { [...]/** Event eater UI active */ MCE_TKLOCK_UI_EVENT_EATER = 2,  [...]} tklock_ui_state_t;20:16
ff_yes, eater, as KotCzarny mencioned, is responsible for catching all key press20:21
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DocScrutinizer05yes, and AIUI it's not getting enabled when vol-keys are active ib tklock20:34
DocScrutinizer05so *all* key events should get through, and I don't know if anything else will filter out all but F6/720:34
DocScrutinizer05hmm, prolly can test this20:35
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DocScrutinizer05OK, DisableKPImmediately=2 indeed keeps keyboard events enabled, at least on evkey -d -t -1 /dev/input/event1   level20:40
DocScrutinizer05I *guess* apps like mediaplayer which want receive Vol+/- events while tklock are bypassing mce completely and enable keyboard via sysnode directly20:41
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DocScrutinizer05indeed *everything* seems to receive all kbd events even in tklock when DisableKPImmediately=2, so I guess here you are :-D20:43
DocScrutinizer05tested desktop ctrl-BS (taskswitcher), and "test" ascia, bit resulted in expected action triggered while tklock and display dark20:44
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DocScrutinizer05s/ascia, bit/ascii, both/20:45
infobotDocScrutinizer05 meant: tested desktop ctrl-BS (taskswitcher), and "test" ascii, both resulted in expected action triggered while tklock and display dark20:45
DocScrutinizer05bencoh: ^^^20:45
DocScrutinizer05bencoh: sed -i 's/DisableKPImmediately=./DisableKPImmediately=2/' /etc/mce/mce.ini; stop mce; start mce20:48
DocScrutinizer05slide open kbs, start mplayer, tklock, check vol-keys20:49
DocScrutinizer05check other keys as well20:49
DocScrutinizer05ROTFL! or - instead `stop MCE; start mce` maybe just try `mce --version`20:51
DocScrutinizer51blindtyping in xchat20:53
DocScrutinizer51ff_: see this???20:54
DocScrutinizer05file closed20:56
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DocScrutinizer05so let me rephrase: I *guess*^H^H^H KNOW apps like mediaplayer which want receive Vol+/- events while tklock are bypassing mce completely and enable keyboard via sysnode directly  and EVIDENTLY *everything* receives all kbd events even in tklock when DisableKPImmediately=220:59
DocScrutinizer05ff_: any other questions?21:00
ff_here vol +/- works, but not others keys, even playing mplayer or media player, maemo stock here21:05
DocScrutinizer05check your mce version21:06
DocScrutinizer05check DisableKPImmediately=221:06
DocScrutinizer05I typed to xchat while in tklock, so why would mplayer not receive *all* keypresses as well21:06
ff_mce v1.8.12621:07
DocScrutinizer05get CSSU mce then21:07
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DocScrutinizer05actually i'm ahppy about that, I've not been mistaken on the regression in PR.13 mce, just I didn't know it was fixxed in CSSU already21:10
ff_DisableKPImmediately=2, ok, newer version is needed, thx for that solution21:10
DocScrutinizer05yw :-D21:10
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blapis there a maemo music player with GUI that allows to shuffle-play a directory of music files?21:14
blapcan you reccomend one?21:14
infoboti heard oscp is
DocScrutinizer05that was fast, even for you ;-P21:14
KotCzarnynah, it was slow. i had to type /msg #maemo etc21:15
DocScrutinizer05konversation has nice cmd aliases21:16
DocScrutinizer05  /9 is21:16
KotCzarnyi'm too lazy to write my /alias'es21:16
blapwhen did that get a gui?21:17
KotCzarny1.6 years ago21:17
blapvery nice, thanks21:18
blapcould it work on sailfishOS?21:19
KotCzarnyi have n9, but havent gotten around to port it yet21:19
blapit says disconnected21:21
KotCzarnyit's the gui21:21
KotCzarnydid you read first time help?21:21
KotCzarnyin short, it consist of server (core) and remote (ui)21:21
KotCzarnypress 'gears' icon to spawn core21:22
blapwhere to i press to see first time help?21:22
blapok ty21:22
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KotCzarnyui can connect to local or remote core (ie. you can control media player running on windows or linux from your n90021:23
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KotCzarnyand it's true the other way round too, ie. you can use your laptop/pc to control media playing on n90021:24
blapok i navigated to my podcasts directory21:25
blaphow do i shuffle play all files in this directory?21:25
KotCzarnyenable [S]huffle mode and just press 'next'21:25
KotCzarnyor 'play'21:25
blapi press "s"?21:26
KotCzarnyeither on kb or the button on screen21:26
blapthen "p"?21:26
KotCzarnydont remember the kb shortcut, might be 'n' for next21:26
KotCzarnyor space for 'play/pause'21:26
blapp moves me to next line in the directory listing21:26
blapspace works and moves me to next song21:27
blap's' didn't enable shuffle, but S icon did21:27
KotCzarnyas i've said, dont remember n900's shortcuts. i use it mostly on my laptop, and sometimes on n900 on the go (but then using ui)21:28
blapare the [1] [2] icons in the left for playlists?  directory shortcuts?21:28
KotCzarnythey are for storing favs21:28
KotCzarnymight be dir/file/http link shortcuts21:29
blaphow can i assign the current directory to one of these?21:29
KotCzarnypress 'm' it will change into M then press number button to store current dir or track21:29
KotCzarnythough in ui it only stores dirs21:30
KotCzarnybut you can edit ~/.oscp/oscp.conf and put specific files/links there21:30
blapcpu use is nicely low21:31
KotCzarnyyou can close gui to make it even lower21:31
KotCzarnycore will keep on playing21:31
blapis there a way to reduce pulseaudio cpu use? it shows 35-38% here21:31
blapsometimes lower21:31
KotCzarnynope. evilaudio is just that way :/21:32
ff_can it use alsa directly?21:32
KotCzarnyyes, but you will need to be careful21:32
ff_mplayer on alsa has much lower CPU usage21:33
KotCzarnyone of the things pa does is protecting louspeakers via software filters21:33
KotCzarnyso it would be only safe to use direct alsa via headphones21:33
ff_but from time to time it's some instable21:33
blapi talked to someone and he explained how one can make alsa mixer adjust volume per-applicatino21:33
blapbut nobody has written the program for it yet21:34
KotCzarnywell, oscp uses internal soft-volume21:34
KotCzarnyso setting volume in oscp doesnt touch system one21:34
blapthis might be a good project to reduce people's need for pulseaudio on the desktop21:34
blapalso firefox requires pulseaudio now21:35
ff_on pa works flawlessly21:35
KotCzarnyhehe, or just knowing your system. /me doesnt use pa on any of his laptops21:35
KotCzarnyblap: google: apulse21:35
blapyes i installed apulse21:35
KotCzarnystill, it's sad that cancer bit that deep into linux software ecosystem21:36
KotCzarnyblap: there is also ncurses remote if you prefer text ui/ssh21:37
blapcan maemo be ported to other hardware?21:37
KotCzarnyit is being done21:38
KotCzarnythough it depends what you define as 'maemo'21:38
blapif the other platform is arm, would it require recompiling all the applications?21:38
KotCzarnyfmg and folks work on devuan+maemo based fusion21:39
KotCzarnythat would work on any device with mainline kernel21:39
KotCzarnyand supported by devuan21:39
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ff_does pulseaudio use more cpu because of some plugins / enhance or sth else?21:40
KotCzarnyff_: conversions, enhancers, mixers21:40
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blapi read somewhere 'speaker protection' also21:41
infobotrumour has it, xprot is and
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DocScrutinizer05/<blap> but nobody has written the program for it yet)) huh?21:42
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blapthe program to do volume control per-application just using alsa21:43
blapthis seems to be the main advantage to the end-user21:45
blapadding this capability would remove the incentive to install PA for many people21:45
blapi think21:46
KotCzarnyi've never got the point of per-app volume need system wide21:46
DocScrutinizer05no program needed21:46
KotCzarnyand because people are lazyf*cks, evilaudio was born21:46
DocScrutinizer05alas yahoo obviously has nuked all group fora, so twinklephone is gone. maybe you find in some archive21:47
KotCzarnyyahoo got sold (again) few months ago21:47
blapDocScrutinizer05: what is that?21:47
KotCzarnythis time to verizon afair21:47
DocScrutinizer05or you google for ALSA softvol, and understand how ALSA config files can execute arbitrary functions to e.g. expand ENV $VAR21:48
DocScrutinizer05or get PID and name of own process for name of softvol control in mixer21:49
DocScrutinizer05no program needed for any of that21:49
DocScrutinizer05ALSA is even way better than Polypaidio in that the mixer control is persistent, so you don't got nuts over trying to adjust volume of a notification jubgle that has a control only for 0.4s21:51
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DocScrutinizer05just define as e.g `cat /proc/self/cmdline|cut -f1` resp the according @FUNC equivalent in ALSA21:57
DocScrutinizer05no witchcraft21:58
DocScrutinizer05what's getting tricky is getting *rid of* old controls since they are persistent and stopping mixer will write them back into the config files21:59
DocScrutinizer05so you need to stop mixer, then edit config file, then restart mixer21:59
blapi don't think the average pulseaudio user wants to do all that22:02
DocScrutinizer05I don't think the average PolypAudio user gives a fsck. But when you start discussing alleged advantages of PA, then this isn't one. ALSA can do this, with no user interaction at all22:03
DocScrutinizer05It was able to do per-app volume controls before Poettering thought about PulseAudio22:04
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DocScrutinizer05you probably missed the idea that >>define as e.g `cat /proc/self/cmdline|cut -f1` resp the according @FUNC equivalent in ALSA<< implied it'S needed only once, and from then on the controls will inherit the name of the app22:06
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DocScrutinizer05no matter which app is started with that ALSA config file22:08
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DocScrutinizer05apps resulting in identical name for the will share same control22:09
DocScrutinizer05so it's entirely up to you (as app devel, maintainer/packager, or user) to create a nifty .alsarc and possibly pass in env vars to define the ALSA mixer control the app should use22:10
DocScrutinizer05ALSA could even start a script that parses a config file with "appma,e" tuples to determine the control.name22:12
DocScrutinizer05same script could pop up a requester asking user for picking an existing control or create a new one, for that app, when the app isn't assigned yet. You can literally do wahtever you want, with very little effort and zilch real geavy coding. While in PA you can do... prolly ZILCH?22:14
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DocScrutinizer05damn Yahoo!22:32
DocScrutinizer05err  in FF just works22:37
DocScrutinizer05or NOW it just works22:37
DocScrutinizer05anyway here you are:
blapthank you DocScrutinizer0522:45
DocScrutinizer05yw :-)22:45
blapi ask less for myself (i do not need it) but i would like to help fight poetteringware22:52
blapbut it's far down on my list22:52
DocScrutinizer05oooh F U yahoo, crippling the file22:56
DocScrutinizer05sorry for that, fixing it22:56
DocScrutinizer05ok fixed
blap"You can also use @args [ NAME SLAVE ] shortcut. The [...] is just a syntax shortcut for numbered lists. Instead of "a.0=x; a.1=y; a.2=z" you can write "a=[ x y z ]" (the "=" and ";" are optional, see details in )"23:04
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DocScrutinizer05yeah, I liked it verbose ;-)23:11
DocScrutinizer05try to spot the ALSA docs part about @FUNC etc23:11
DocScrutinizer05there's the really nifty stuff23:12
DocScrutinizer05and if nothing is smart enough in genuine ALSA, have a look at my patch:
DocScrutinizer05this niftly lil fancy can run arbitrary stuff at audio device open and audio device close, and when the executed process returns error, so will asound_open() call in app23:16
DocScrutinizer05so e.g you could start the audio amp before your app plays the fire alarm audio23:16
DocScrutinizer05or in maemo, your arbitrary VoIP softphone could kick the vibrator when the ringer audio device starts playing a ringtone23:17
DocScrutinizer05and stop the vibrator as soon as the audio stream stops and closes23:18
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DocScrutinizer05blap: that stuff
DocScrutinizer05 {                 @func concat                 strings [ "a1" "b2" "c3" ]         }23:27
blapcopying that to notes23:30
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DocScrutinizer05@func getenv !!23:52
DocScrutinizer05the docs are a mess. As with all in ALSA. The functions are nice23:55

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