IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2017-07-25

kalincan someone help me to setting up pyOBD?00:01
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sixwheeledbeast^I imagine you are having repo issues? I have never had an issue with pyOBD.00:02
kalinno, it isn't a repo issue00:03
kalini think it is a side effect of instaling audacious00:04
sixwheeledbeast^well what happens if you start pyOBD from a terminal? Is audacious python?00:04
kalinno no no00:05
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kalinwhen i install audacios the phone had a broken/missing packages00:06
kalinthis is a second time that i have to reflash the phone after audacious00:06
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kalinso now i have fresh flashed n900 with only pyOBD installed00:07
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kalinand when i try to start pyOBD the phone loading something few seconds and close the app00:09
sicelo23:04 < sixwheeledbeast^> well what happens if you start pyOBD from a terminal?00:09
kalinwhait a second to try00:10
kalindid i have to be root?00:11
sixwheeledbeast^er I would hope not00:11
kalinthe terminal says not found00:12
siceloroot's needed to establishh the rfcomm connection .. butt iiirc it calls sudo for that .. also haven't used it in a hwile00:14
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sixwheeledbeast^python /opt/pyobd/pyobd.py00:14
kalin"No module named dbus"00:16
sicelohow did you install pyobd ...00:17
sicelobecause python-dbus *is* a dependency  .. so install that00:18
kalinApp manager00:18
infobotrefer ~flashing; (also .exe!), or or generally   HARMattan(N9):; list of filenames/md5sums:, or
infobotemmc is probably is or see ~emmc200:19
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kalinthanks sicelo , i will try today because first i have to install rootshell to use apt-get and add repo mirror00:22
kalinnow i will go to get some sleep00:22
kalinGN to all00:22
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ff_sicelo: try load CPU to 100% and then check internet connection00:28
ff_accidently I found that this matter00:28
ff_accidently I found that this matter00:29
ff_when I download through wifi with 100% load CPU by for example encoding audio, average speed is about 96% of max available00:29
ff_but when nothing use CPU, download average speed decrease to about 65% of max available00:30
ff_maybe the same effect is with 2G/3G GSM internet connection00:30
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sixwheeledbeast^Er so there is an issue with repos or broken packages of some sort00:34
ff_it's look like CPU's sleep timer introduce quite a lot delay into connection response00:48
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DocScrutinizer05hmm, that might make sense. Though probably because of packet / timer aggregating that's done in maemo to keep CPU in suspend mode as much as possible, and only do pending jobs (timer, IO) on bursts every now and then01:31
DocScrutinizer05to avoid this, probably you don't need 100% load on CPU, what you need is frequent forced wakeups so the IO can get done,  while sleep 0.02; do :; done01:34
DocScrutinizer05or simply slide with your fingernail over the screen in a circular or other constant movement and see if IO speeds up during that. Touch controller will produce IRQs plenty01:37
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DocScrutinizer05sicelo: ^^^01:37
DocScrutinizer05sixwheeledbeast^: I thik that's the right direction01:39
infoboti guess #maemo lazyflashing is
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*** DocScrutinizer05 changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf (or ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher) sdk: ~sb | | Source: | Chanlog: | #maemo-ssu is where the (few) devels and maintainers of the maemo-future meet"01:40
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sixwheeledbeast^busybox sleep is only whole numbers?01:41
infobotmessy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su, passwd, nice, ps, diff as used by mc...) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils01:42
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DocScrutinizer05it might have msleep or usleep01:42
sixwheeledbeast^in fact busybox sleep has no arguments I recall. just full numbers01:42
DocScrutinizer05don't know01:42
Juestobusybox is just a swiss army knife unix utils01:43
DocScrutinizer05sucks, it has neither msleep not usleep01:43
Juestoit is intended for embedded devices01:43
DocScrutinizer05jiemy take on busybox you see above01:43
Juestogo compare the size of a bunch of unix utils to busybox binary with the same utils01:43
DocScrutinizer05who cares?01:44
sixwheeledbeast^er yes, the issue is our little devices are useful to have some better functionality than other embedded devices.01:45
DocScrutinizer05I installed quite a bunch of gnu utils plus mandb and still no problems with free space on /01:45
sixwheeledbeast^bash4 has an opt version I believe01:45
DocScrutinizer05the major advantage of busybox is: it's a single monolithic binary, so the system doesn't need to load it again for 99% of scripts written for it01:47
DocScrutinizer05it's basically an interpreter of its own, for scripts01:47
DocScrutinizer05this is mainly a performance advantage01:48
DocScrutinizer05thus buybox is nice for lean scripting, like e.g. by using it instead of init01:48
DocScrutinizer05or to run init scripts01:49
DocScrutinizer05but honestly, messybox is pathetic, do e.g a `ps --help`01:49
DocScrutinizer05I know there's a pimped version that has more compile options for functions01:51
DocScrutinizer05but it still stays sub-par compared to proper unix toolbox01:51
DocScrutinizer05particularly when it comes to cmds_of(8)01:52
DocScrutinizer05nice is borked, su is borked and can't ever get fixed01:52
DocScrutinizer05meh, I ranted so many times about that thing I get bored doing it01:53
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sixwheeledbeast^I wonder if you could replace it for the latest version. Seen as Maemo is 1.10.2 and the latest is 1.27.101:56
Juestoprobably if you compile from good sources sixwheeledbeast^01:57
Wizzup$ busybox sleep --help01:59
WizzupBusyBox v1.25.1 (2017-01-25 13:22:31 CET) multi-call binary.01:59
WizzupUsage: sleep [N]...01:59
WizzupPause for a time equal to the total of the args given, where each arg can01:59
Wizzuphave an optional suffix of (s)econds, (m)inutes, (h)ours, or (d)ays01:59
Wizzup$ time busybox sleep 0.1s01:59
Wizzupfurther questions?01:59
WizzupBeing stuck forever on an old version of software doesn't make it crap nor messy. It just illustrates how important a healthy ecosystem is, where packages are kept up to date02:00
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Wizzupbusybox is one of the best things out there02:01
WizzupAnd you can easily build a whole distro with/around it - see alpine linux02:01
DocScrutinizer05IroN900:~# time busybox sleep 0.1s02:02
DocScrutinizer05sleep: invalid number '0.1s'02:02
Wizzup>software that is 7 years old02:03
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DocScrutinizer05budybox is a monolithic binary that does multiple things and none of them correctly. Just like systemd ;-)02:04
WizzupThis is the most retarded thing I've read today02:04
DocScrutinizer05great :-P02:05
Wizzupbusybox is the exact opposite of systemd, it's lean, minimal, clean. And as I said, you can build an entire distro with decent init system with it.02:05
Wizzupalpine linux is really just openrc+busybox+apk (their package tool)02:05
Wizzupit's amazingly fast and lean02:05
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Wizzuptheir networking scripts are at least as decent as debian ones02:06
DocScrutinizer05a bag of bugs02:06
sixwheeledbeast^So if busybox can be updated it should be done via CSSU? Seen as it's a system package in the SSU repo02:09
Wizzupmaybe, but I'm not sure what you'd gain.02:10
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WizzupYou'd have to check if it still supports such old kernels (likely)02:10
Wizzupcan probably compile it statically, too02:10
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sixwheeledbeast^well sleep to decimal places for starters. I assumed you ran the above on an N900?02:11
Wizzupin fact, I have a armv7 static busybox here on my laptop02:11
WizzupI will scp it to my n900 and see02:11
Wizzupoh, it's a PIE02:12
Wizzupdoubt the n900 can handle PIE :p02:12
Wizzupthe n900 kernel*02:12
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WizzupI copied the powerpc binary.02:13
Wizzupgo me.02:13
WizzupNokia-N900:~# ./bb --help02:14
WizzupFATAL: kernel too old02:14
WizzupSegmentation fault02:14
Wizzupsoftware needs to stay in sync ;)02:14
DocScrutinizer05sixwheeledbeast^: please sonsider that all scripts are tested against exactly this version of busybox with all its bugs02:16
DocScrutinizer05there's a busybox-power which everybody interested can install instead or on top of the system busybox02:16
DocScrutinizer05users rendered their system fcked up simply by defining bash instead busybox as user user's default shell02:17
sixwheeledbeast^The latest version has allsorts of extra utils as standard. There's also a size question too.02:18
DocScrutinizer05you're aware that when you use busybox with anything not-busybox as shell, the binaries your system needs to load for each command are way larger than what they would be in genuine decent unix toolbox? Since each time the multi-purpose huge busybox binary needs to get loaded and started when your shell calls $whatever in stat, ls, dir, date, `busybox --help`02:29
DocScrutinizer05I just might mention that e.g. jolla/mer decided against busybox and for a 'normal' sheel afaik, after long pondering02:32
DocScrutinizer05shell* plus gnu utils02:33
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DocScrutinizer05btw it seems like for N900, busybox-power as system shell actually reduces availble free space on /, vs busybox('normal') and gnu utils on opt03:03
DocScrutinizer05reason: system shell can't live on /opt. And busybox-power of course is larger than busybox-'normal'03:04
Wizzup'huge busybox binary needs to get loaded' sounds kind of weird03:06
WizzupIt usually lives in the cache03:06
Wizzupand linux also doesn't need to load the whole binary either03:13
Wizzupthat's usually loaded on demand03:14
Wizzupso I'm not sure how much that really matters.03:14
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DocScrutinizer05I'm not going to embarrass myself by answering with a quote03:29
Juestoits difficult to find a n900 nowdays03:33
Juestohow does busybox behaves on something like Mach03:34
Juestoor BSD?03:34
Wizzupbusybox is for linux03:36
Wizzupactually, I am not sure about that03:36
WizzupI know BSD was working on their own -
Wizzupthere's your answer03:37
Wizzupthe same as on most posix compliant OSes I guess03:37
Wizzupalmost 3am.03:43
OksanaLike Nokia N900, but without keyboard and FM transmitter, apparently. Also, capacitive touchscreen, not resistive. Similar processor, same 800x480 display resolution.03:52
OksanaPossible to change OS on it:
* Oksana wonders whether it would be a nice porting target for Maemo 5... But let's check first if the Android port managed to get cellular to work.03:55
Wizzupwhy not droid4?03:55
OksanaEither I am very poor at search, or something, because I cannot find droid 4 on EBay03:59
OksanaOr Gumtree03:59
OksanaAt the same time,
Wizzupmotorola droid 404:01
OksanaYes, I searched for motorola droid 4. Nice article in Wikipedia...04:02
Wizzupi got 4 from ebay, arriving tomorrow04:04
OksanaNice :-)04:12
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stryngsAnyone at DEFCON this yr?04:41
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buZzdangit, knew i forgot something when i arrived home >_<11:19
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dreamerwhich is ..11:26
buZzchecking those AT commands for docscrut11:31
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dreamerah .. 'those' ..11:32
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