IRC log of #maemo for Friday, 2017-07-14

DocScrutinizer05prolly best to have a forward 302, will even re-educate google afaik00:00
DocScrutinizer05I realy wonder what I had on my mind when I created those .install00:08
DocScrutinizer05  aka recommended.install looks halfway decent, right. But what the heck is - looks borkd ( [install] ! instead [catalogs] )00:10
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* DocScrutinizer05 is so lazy, can't get around to test both versions to see which works00:18
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DocScrutinizer05freakin bot!00:27
DocScrutinizer05ok, I slightly updated stuff on ~jrrepos00:28
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sicelopyobd is for communicating with your car via obd to see engine fault codes and clear them00:53
DocScrutinizer05thanks! :-)00:54
siceloalso can fo live capture of many sensors .. although thus is dlow in pyobd n900. i found obdgpslogger to be much better on n900 for that.00:55
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mike727Help... I'm worried that I might of bricked my N9. #harmattan02:11
mike727I was on Australia firmware (with CMT using 003) & telephony was not working. I tried "--erase...." flash with 005 & it failed.
DocScrutinizer05exactly why I lost all interest in N902:17
mike727James T. Kirk: Give it too me straight. Is she dead?02:20
DocScrutinizer05Idunno Jim, possibly yes02:21
DocScrutinizer05though a Nokia repair shop - so you find one - might still be able to downgrade-flash it02:22
DocScrutinizer05also there might be hacks invented by community to cope with this situation. I might have missed those since... like I said I lost all interest in HARM / N9 because of that design02:24
mike727Okay, will have to be patient and see. Still looking at the bright side, just won an auction for a n900 with otterbox at a nice price :D02:24
DocScrutinizer05otjers in here might be more savvy with HARM02:25
DocScrutinizer05so linger on, repeat question every 12h or somesuch02:25
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Sicelo009Nso from what i understood from freemangordon's explanantion, iphbd is responsible for queuing data for transmission via network. is it possible to tweak/adjust its parameters, e.g. how often it sends?11:53
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Sicelo009NDocScrutinizer51: perhaps you could change /topic in connection with voting :-)11:55
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Sicelo009Nanother unexpected reboot ... swap on uSD not helping12:32
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Sicelo009Nif i didn't love the N900 so much, I'd trash it12:37
Sicelo009Nuninstalled cvm/phoneme now (although i've had it before with no issues)12:39
WizzupI use my N900 mostly for calls/sms, casual browsing and (mostly!) xterm+ssh12:40
WizzupSometimes I use recaller12:40
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Sicelo009Nfor me it's everything :-)12:41
mike727can you do load speaker with recaller? When I try, I have an echo. I guess it doesn't do sound cancelation like how the phone prevent's feedback during a call.12:43
L29Ahbuy a few n900s and switch them when they break12:45
mike727The n900 was my first phone, had it for 2 years. For me, it's a hassle to install programs, but I still love it. I was stunned when I first figured out FMTX, so awesome.12:45
mike727Number 4 is on the way12:46
Sicelo009NL29Ah: unfortunately can't find any this side :-(12:46
mike727Yes, was unexpected; no one else had bid. I laughed a few months ago seeing one going up so high with the bidding frenzy. Still worth every penny.12:49
mike727I'm guessing people had a break from ebay after the site-wide 20% off. So there was less people to find it.12:51
mike727*155 off promotion12:54
WizzupSicelo009N: well, I usually have a laptop with me... :)12:56
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer0512:57
*** DocScrutinizer05 changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo | N9/harmattan related questions please in #harmattan ! | "firmware" see ~lf ~tabletsdev ~combined ~emmc ~flasher sdk: ~sb | | Source: | Chanlog: | #maemo-ssu is where the (few) devels and maintainers of the maemo-future meet"12:57
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DocScrutinizer05mike727: revcaller works great for me, since years and 1000s of calls13:01
DocScrutinizer05recaller even13:01
DocScrutinizer05only nasty thing: it breaks completely when storage full13:01
mike727On "load speaker" ?13:01
DocScrutinizer05settings are a tad tricky13:01
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Sicelo009Ni also remember it evidently had a memleak of sorts ..13:02
DocScrutinizer05does it?13:02
mike727I need some initiative to learn :)13:02
Sicelo009Ni remember mention of that. iirc even the dev decided to produce orecchiette instead. i could be mistaken .. it's a while a go13:03
DocScrutinizer05I remember I had some unexpected results from "source" setting13:04
DocScrutinizer05wellllllll, recaller is a hildon desktop applet, seems they *all* memleaked at time13:05
Sicelo009Ntrue :-)13:05
DocScrutinizer05one of the worst design decisions in maemo5: desktop applets all being one process13:06
DocScrutinizer05mike727: you got CSSU?13:07
mike727Currently, I'n not sure. I think I installed it before on one of them.13:10
DocScrutinizer05you should get CSSU!13:10
DocScrutinizer05it fixes a *lot* of issues, like the memleaks Sicelo009N mentioned13:10
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mike727Yes, of course. Thank you. Some people need to be told to step out of the fire.13:11
DocScrutinizer05Sicelo009N: btw you ever used saera? I installed it just recently and was amazed how flawlessly it installed13:19
DocScrutinizer05and of course of the T2S13:19
DocScrutinizer05had no chance yet to really test it13:19
DocScrutinizer05but it's using pocketsphinx, incredible13:20
WizzupWorks on maemo?13:20
DocScrutinizer05seems so13:20
DocScrutinizer05though I guess pocketsphinx must have evolved into another galaxy since then13:21
DocScrutinizer05*maybe* the old pocketsphinx is even better suited for N90013:22
DocScrutinizer05recent versions might need octocore ;-P13:22
Wizzupnot sure what I'd use it for, but fun13:23
Wizzupwonder how much battery it eats13:23
DocScrutinizer05that been actually a little... suspicious13:23
DocScrutinizer05though afaik it needs activation via buttonpress13:24
DocScrutinizer05doesn't listen all the time13:24
DocScrutinizer05not sure about that though13:24
DocScrutinizer05anyway it been smarter back when ("AI") than alexa is today X-P13:25
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DocScrutinizer05and YOU control the AI13:26
Wizzupyeah, I just have no use for it13:26
DocScrutinizer05unlike friggin alexa and friends13:26
Wizzupwhat I mostly just need is an easy way to record some thoughts or ideas I have (audio rec), and then be able to sort them in a simple manner13:26
DocScrutinizer05well, making calls while driving scooter was a start for example13:27
ceenegrepping voice and real life conversations :)13:27
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DocScrutinizer05I think saera and mappero/whatever should get beaten into shape to be on par with damn android google "Drive"13:29
DocScrutinizer05say destination, get voice directions13:29
DocScrutinizer05say contact names to make a call13:30
WizzupI don't think that's easy13:30
DocScrutinizer05#1 for sure not, except for a few well known destinations13:30
DocScrutinizer05you (err pocketsphinx) wouldn't know how to spell the street names correctly13:31
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Wizzupdo you know a current drive app helper that works?13:34
WizzupI haven't really found any that can actually calculate routes, and def. not with up to dat emaps13:35
WizzupI mostly just rely on gps13:35
Wizzupeither with maep or cloudgps13:35
Wizzup[one of them always crashes when searching for placs]13:35
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mike727modRama is still actively being developed. No offline routing yet.13:41
Wizzupah that seems pretty active yeah13:44
mike727The menus a bit confusing to me, too many options.13:47
mike727Any N9 folk here? : Zerorize flash failed (due to downgrade). Phone refuses to attempt flash (basic & Zerorize). The flasher does Identify the phone (bootloader good?). Should I reboot or Cold flash?13:53
KotCzarnynope. they are on #harmattan13:53
mike727yep, sorry. Seems like only tumble weeds there.13:54
KotCzarnyfigures. ;)13:54
KotCzarnymaemo ftw!13:54
mike727If I get it working, will give it to my little sister, when see says all the other kids at school have phones. It's nice in white.13:56
KotCzarnykids shouldnt have phones till 12-14yo13:58
KotCzarnyit breakes their social skills learning13:58
KotCzarnywhich is sad and changes the future world to the worse one13:59
mike727certainly. Got my first phone at 20, 2 years ago. Did feel a bit left out during high school.14:00
mike727It's crazy seeing school kids who have evidently beat there parents into buying them the latest iphone14:01
Sicelo009NDocScrutinizer05: re-saera - no. although i did read the specs and it seems awesome14:02
mike727One parent I talked to who has kids ~10yrs old, said she has too, becase all the other parents buy it for their kids.14:03
Sicelo009Nmike727: for me Ovi Maps works awesome14:06
mike727offline routing ?  Awhile back, it didn't want to follow my location.14:08
mike727Sicelo009N: original stock?14:10
Sicelo009Nonly think stock can't do is offline search. offline routing works ootb. then of course, main other problem is updated map tiles14:13
mike727offline routing is made to work by 'out of the box' ?  Meaning CSSU ?14:16
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Sicelo009Neven in non-ccsu :)14:17
Sicelo009Njust you don't easily notice due to ovi maps requesting connection as sson as it launches14:18
mike727is there a difference between 'stock' & 'ootb'  ?14:19
Sicelo009Nsorry for confusing .. in simpler terms - the Ovi Maps already on your N900 is able to do offline routing. you don't need to do anything special to achieve that14:20
mike727thanks will have to give it a go. :)14:21
Sicelo009Nproblem will be the outdated maps if your area changes fast. where i am - they are still at leat 95% correct14:23
mike727For map updates did you need to change a setting, something like:  ?14:25
Sicelo009Nthat is not realted to any maps application. that's system-wide gps setting used for all location-aware applications. will only work if you have the latest certificate-related packages (see a-gps thread on tmo)14:28
mike727Likely why I've had problems ?  Thank you. I guess when I last looked at it, I was too lazy to try and understand it's importance.14:30
WizzupSicelo009N: ovi maps for me is mostly heavily outdated maps14:33
Wizzupdo they get updated still?14:33
Wizzupor do your roads just not change :)14:33
Sicelo009Nyes not much changes here :p14:34
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Sicelo009Nre - mappero ... interesting that mike727 has roughly ame problem with menu/ui. i've also found it a difficult application to use. of course, i do appreciate the effort!14:42
infobotSicelo009N meant: re - modrana ... interesting that mike727 has roughly ame problem with menu/ui. i've also found it a difficult application to use. of course, i do appreciate the effort!14:42
mike727Yes, its great work. It looks like they have got offline routing working as well
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jpb22Hi all, trying to get in touch with admin, but bounces... does anyone have a contact point? Thanks14:53
merlin1991jpb22: this is a good contact point15:00
merlin1991what kind of admin are you searching, forums, mail, website, repository?15:01
jpb22merlin1991: website, technically speaking. My forum account was deleted some time ago, but the profile remains and I have no access to modify or remove it.15:02
jpb22I would paste the url but since everything here is publicly logged, it would be somewhat self defeating15:02
merlin1991ah so garage then15:03
merlin1991I can do that15:03
jpb22(since I am looking to remove it due to privacy concerns)15:03
merlin1991pm me the old nick15:03
jpb22awesome, sure thanks15:03
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Sicelo009Noh nice ... can get iphbd to operate in debug mode15:51
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freemangordonSicelo009N: well, you can even compile it with debug symbols :)21:46
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DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: re kernel servie livetime: ever checked centos?22:04
DocScrutinizer05seems LTS support for 2.6.32(?) kernel until 2020 at least22:05
freemangordoncould be, but that doesn;t help us much for maemo22:08
DocScrutinizer05hmm, the patches should apply cleanly, no?22:09
freemangordonI guess there is a difference between 2.6.28 and 2.6.3222:09
DocScrutinizer05there for sure is22:10
freemangordonbut sure, usually they can be backported22:10
DocScrutinizer05but way less than between 2.6.28 and 4.x.x22:10
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DocScrutinizer05kernel LOC 10,118,757(2.6.28)->12,532,667(2.6.32)22:19
DocScrutinizer05doesn't say how much changed, of course22:19
KotCzarnywhat about .28->.29 ?22:20
enycdoes it make sense to backport patches...22:22
enycrather, forward-port  maemo patches//drivers to 2.6.32 instead?22:22
KotCzarnysure, as long you dont hit roadblocks in blobs22:23
enycnot forgetting any security-fixes that came along in kernel 2.6.28 -> 2.6.32 diff itself anyway... let alone 'since then'22:24
enycalso, i wonder if stretch//ascii libc6 etc is 'compatible' with 2.6.32 -- my experience is jessie can work on 2.6.32 though differences in xorg/video/udev sorts of things can be a problem depending on config/usage22:26
enycKotCzarny: has anybody made a diff of 2.6.28 'stock' and 2.6.28 'maemo/power' kernel anyway??22:26
KotCzarnyyou can do it yourself, maemo's kernel source is available22:28
enycKotCzarny: righ,t where?  but in any case i was wondering how much this had been ''investigated'' already you see22:28
enycI don't have an online arm box i can rebuild tese things from hrrm22:28
enycthough, is that kernel normally compiled on intel using the maemo dev enviroment DocScrutinizer05 pointed out ???22:29
enycwith arm crosscompilation22:29
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DocScrutinizer05To download the full report, please visit The Linux Foundation’s Publication’s website at:
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infobotSince Fri Jul 14 19:42:33 2017, there have been 0 modifications, 0 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 0 commands.  I have been awake for 8m 39s this session, and currently reference 119688 factoids.  I'm using about 78824 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 1.85/0.03 child 0/022:51
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enycKotCzarny: can't see the amemo source / building instructions on the wiki....22:54
enycKotCzarny: and i'd rather have talked with Pali or so first if they are still contactable!22:54
KotCzarnydo you know the basics of debian packaging/building ?22:54
enycKotCzarny: or whoever it is whose already familiar with patching the power kernel so far22:54
enycKotCzarny: I think so, but I may not be best choice as to person to spend lots of time on it22:55
DocScrutinizer05keeping kernel and core system of *maemo* in a working status is one thing. Porting packahes to maemo though is another one, until recently you could basically just re-compile any debian package for maemo and fine (leave aside needed adaptions for hildon). Since systemd this doesn't apply anymore to an increasing number of packages. That's where devuan comes in, as the distro that continues to be what debian was22:55
DocScrutinizer05of course you also can port old maemo packages to modern devuan, but the result isn't a devuan system but a debian/devuan system with maemo 'apps'22:57
DocScrutinizer05S/isn't a devuan/isn't a *maemo*/22:58
DocScrutinizer05of course you also can port old maemo packages to modern devuan, but the result isn't a *MAEMO* system (incl all the core system twekas to make it perform excellent in a phone environment) but a debian/devuan system with maemo 'apps'22:59
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enycDocScrutinizer05: if core or maemo patched including kernel bumped to 2.6.32 LTS (worth trying if not too hard imho), will devuan stretch armhf chroot work on that kernel ?  especially is libc6 backwards-compatible-enough ?23:02
DocScrutinizer05that's a too complex question for me to answer. sorry23:03
enycdebian/devuan jessie, so far as I can tell, works with minimum 2.6.32 kernel23:04
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DocScrutinizer05I'm pretty sure any devuan stuff can run in a carefully crafted chroot or other container or virtulization under maemo23:07
enycfor jessie, libc6 has to be 'patched' (minimally) to 'allow' 2.6.28 (simple comparison check)23:08
DocScrutinizer05libc6 in container just needs to play nice with the old kernel we have. You can ensure this since we have source of both the kernel and the libc623:08
enycsince this is simply changing '32' to '28' in a version-check, i wonder if the devuan libc6 maintainer would be happy to carry that patch in devuan, as its' harmless to everobyd else running newer kernels anyway, in my view.23:09
DocScrutinizer05this is really sytsem development 10123:09
enyci.e. not need custom build / rebuild on every security update, etc etc23:09
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enycoh, devuan doesn't override glibc package anyawy, hrrm23:39
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