IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2016-11-03

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Oksanalibdevlock1, libdevlock-bin, and osso-systemui-devlock are all apparently written by Nokia.00:05
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freemangordonOksana: well, I was asking about the developer00:14
freemangordonI found who it is, its name is in devlocktool binary00:15
freemangordon*he is00:15
merlin1991iirc the tklock didn't free the pixbuf for the image of the slider00:15
merlin1991that leak was worse :D00:15
freemangordonmerlin1991: ooh, you're alive :)00:15
freemangordonmerlin1991: well it is really not freed, but I woudn;t call that a leak00:16
* Oksana wonders what "package imported" means, makes it more difficult to see .deb files from
merlin1991Oksana: sample?00:16
freemangordonmerlin1991: ah, you mean the stock one, not the REed one00:16
merlin1991freemangordon: yep00:17
freemangordonyeah, it was leaking hard00:17
freemangordonOksana: seems there was autobuilder for closed stuff00:17
freemangordonor they copied .debs by hand to stage00:18
merlin1991import strongly hints at a "incoming" dir in the repo00:18
freemangordonmerlin1991: while you are here - what's going on with CSSU-stable release?00:18
OksanaHmm, where is non-closed then? It should be somewhere in Extras, right?00:18
freemangordonOksana: no00:18
merlin1991Oksana: cssu00:18
infobotit has been said that cssu is, or (Community Seamless Software Update)00:18
freemangordonwell, on github00:19
merlin1991stable release, I'm strugling with time, but it will happen this weekend or within the next week00:20
merlin1991but for -testing, I'm completely lost what in -devel is considered goot enough for -testing atm00:20
OksanaHow does it get installed then, if it is not in repositories? Github has "releases" thingie, for publishing debs ;-) In case it cannot be put into autobuilder for some mysterious reason00:20
freemangordonmerlin1991: well, I am lost too, after all this time00:21
freemangordonOksana: through CSSU repos00:21
merlin1991Oksana: to go for it directly00:22
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freemangordonmerlin1991: but there was a script IIRC to compare -testing vs -devel00:22
merlin1991but generally speaking the packages interface does not pick up cssu stuff00:22
merlin1991freemangordon: yeah but that doesn't tell me if the stuff in -devel is "good" ;)00:22
merlin1991freemangordon: you mean
freemangordonyou only need to tell me or Pali about the "stuff", I guess we'll know the status00:23
freemangordonmerlin1991: don;t remember what exactly does this script compare00:23
merlin1991-stable -testing -devel and git00:24
merlin1991fancy with colours00:24
freemangordonah, yes00:24
merlin1991all thanks to Pali00:24
freemangordonso that's a good starting point00:24
Paliyea :-)00:25
Palihi merlin!00:25
freemangordonbut there shouldn;t be much new stuff in -devel00:25
Oksanafreemangordon: Thank you :-) /apologies for grumpiness, it would be neat sometime to have CSSU repositories visible in packages interface, but it's a distant feature request, just like https for TMO, and thumb branch for auto-builder /00:25
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merlin1991Pali: I read you mail about dirty cow, but to ship that we have to decide what we put in a cssu kernel00:27
merlin1991up to now the only cssu with kernel is -thumb00:27
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OksanaWhy is Nokia still specified as maintainer of mce? mce is REed, right?01:01
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OksanaDoesn't libcodelockui1 have a corresponding libcodelockui-dev? Okay, libcodelockui1-dev...01:09
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jonwilI dont know who should be the maintainer for MCE but yeah it should be changed I guess :)01:29
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jonwiland yes libcodelockui has a dev package (although that reverse engineered clone is incomplete and still has the //todos that I added to let people know whats missing and still needs cloning)01:34
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RasielIs there have the sources of maemo system can use now ?01:40
jonwilwhat do you mean?01:40
jonwilsome parts of maemo are open source, some have been reverse engineered and others are still closed.01:41
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RasielI want to use my Nokia N900 ,but the sources server is not work.01:45
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jonwilWhat exactly are you trying to do?01:48
jonwilDownload packages from the nokia servers?01:48
jonwilIf so, there is a way to get them working via an unofficial mirror although I dont know the details off the top of my head01:49
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jonwil might help01:50
jonwilStill no closer to figuring out what I might do for the coding contest...01:50
OksanaHmm, why do I see only osso-systemui-devlock, but not osso-systemui-devlock-dev or osso-systemui-devlock-dbg? Either not REed yet, or not put into repositories yet? | jonwil : Going by other packages, it should be called libcodelockui-dev, not libcodelockui1-dev. Compare: libosso1 and libosso-dev, for example.01:52
jonwilask Nokia why its libcodelockui1-dev01:52
jonwilsee for the official binaries to confirm that :)01:53
jonwilas for devlock, so far all that's been reverse engineered is osso-systemui-devlock-dev01:54
jonwilunless there is something out there that isn't in CSSU01:54
Oksanajonwil: About coding contest: Look at small (and not so small) ideas at
Oksanaosso-systemui-devlock-dev is not in repositories, yet... And osso-systemui-devlock-dbg will appear in repositories at the same time as osso-systemui-devlock itself, I guess01:55
jonwilosso-systemui-devlock package from Nokia is in nokia repos (or mirrors of those)01:56
* Oksana meant REed version of osso-systemui-devlock ;-)01:57
jonwilthere is no REd version of osso-systemui-devlock01:57
jonwiljust osso-systemui-devlock-dev :)01:57
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jonwiland osso-systemui-devlock-dev is in cssu-devel repo
* Oksana is currently wrestling with ; a clone of tklock, so far changelog, compat and control changed from tklock to devlock01:58
jonwilHow are you going to do the reverse engineering? IDA?01:59
OksanaBeginning with groundwork, such as debian thingies. Will worry about .c later, using and whatever can be useful.02:03
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Rasielsorry ping time out02:05
jonwilif you dont understand reverse engineering, you probably wont be able to get osso-systmeui-devlock going, I understand what I am doing and I cant make it happen.02:06
jonwilBut good luck to you anyway :)02:06
jonwilAs for that list of ideas, ugh, Python. Not going there.02:08
OksanaThank you :-) I will not forget about IDA, but I will take a look at objdump and radare, nevertheless. Some time later, after taking care of debian thingies02:08
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jonwilif you can make it happen, more power to you :)02:08
gryjonwil: I think half of the point is taking python apps and rewriting them in c and hildon02:08
jonwilyeah but I dont know python02:08
jonwilso I cant do that02:08
jonwilDont know the first thing about korean so I cant do that either02:09
Oksanajonwil: I especially like idea of making GTK+Hildon calculator (frontend), to replace current Qt-based calculator. Tiny and not Python at all02:09
gryafaik we don't have to read the python, just look at what the app does and write the same logic in another language02:09
gryand it's not a reverse engineering task, just a question of hildonizing things02:09
jonwilnone of those seem like things I care about either02:09
gryone thing at a time02:09
jonwilI dont care about mediaplayer things02:09
OksanaHmm, feel free to RE something you care about :-) I just don't know much about innards of GPS and cellular, but would be glad to see either of them REed (even if only partially, one package at a time)02:11
jonwilyeah so would I02:12
jonwilbut I lack the skills to pull that off :)02:12
jonwilas for calculator, the stock calculator is GTK is it not?02:12
jonwilOh wait I see now, the stock calculator is GTK02:12
jonwiland the open clone is QT02:12
jonwilWhich entity is referred to by BOM in the "BOM plugin for omweather"?02:14
jonwilits obviously some sort of weather agency02:14
jonwilbut in which country?02:14
OksanaBOM is australian02:14
jonwilI should know that, I check their website all the time :)02:15
jonwilI didn't even know they had an API...02:15
* Oksana added a link to omweather bom plugin on github, it is possible that it just needs debian packaging?02:16
OksanaJust refresh the ideas page, and you will see links. No idea how to make them click-able, they are currently in text02:18
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Oksanaa/me waves from mobile02:24
jonwilI dont really see anything on that page that I have any real interest in working on.02:25
jonwilDont use my N900 for media things.02:25
OksanaaOkay :-)  feel free to recommend it to somebody else more GUI-oriented ?02:26
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jonwilthe link seems broken btw02:26
jonwilit doesn't work02:26
OksanaaNot for media things... Because of CPU or because of quality of speakers or because of something else?02:27
jonwilI am on my PC at home all the time for media things02:27
OksanaaYes, telepathy website changed recently. Refresh the page, there is a better "link" now02:27
jonwiland when I am out-and-about I dont want to do media things (I hate headphones and dont want to play music through speakers and annoy people around me)02:27
OksanaaI like to play music on a bus at the same volume as ambient noise. More cheerful than just seeing gloomy people silently reading facebook02:29
jonwilWhat exactly is meant by "empathy chess integration"?02:29
OksanaaPlaying chess with a contact. Not with computer, not with a human located geographically at same phone, but with a telepathy contact at other side of the planet02:30
jonwilso empathy is an existing chess program?02:30
jonwiland this is about using telepathy to make it work on n900?02:30
OksanaaNay, telepathy is the provider of d-bus tubes. I am hoping that existing osso-chess-ui progam emits d-bus signals for the movies it is making02:31
OksanaaLike: osso-chess-ui would send a d-bus signal over telepathy's d-bus tube, across Internet-or-something, to a contact with similar d-bus tube and chess-board02:32
jonwilosso-chess-ui is open source02:34
jonwiland it uses gnuchess as its engine under the hood02:34
jonwilso someone who actually knows how to play chess (and knows telepathy) could probably make it happen.02:34
jonwilBut I dont know the first thing about how to program telepathy (which is why reverse engineering things that talk to it has been impossible for me so far)02:34
OksanaaYes, that's why it could be easy: it's relatively open-source. Hopefully, our telepathy is not too old for d-bus tubes02:35
jonwiland I keep soundly getting beaten every time by the AI on the maemo chess (even on the easiest setting)02:35
jonwilso that's not something I will do.02:35
OksanaaI would also like GNU Go, and gui for it. It's not as well-known as GNU Chess, though02:36
jonwilI wouldn't mind Backgammon for the N900, that's a game I am actually good at...02:37
jonwilbut writing a backgammon AI from scratch doesn't sound fun02:37
jonwiland I dont know of any existing backgammon game I could port02:37
OksanaaA more intuitive (than Cute CW) version of Morse Code GUI could be good, too.02:37
OksanaaYou would probably need to write frontend for it. But engine is already in existence, no problem02:40
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jonwilit already has a gtk ui although how one would go about porting that to the N900 I dont know02:46
jonwilIt might be worth putting some of the things from that other link under
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jonwilhave a list there of things people want but cant do themselves02:48
jonwilso people who can code but lack ideas can go there and look for them02:48
jonwilright now that list is mostly sailfish stuff02:48
jonwilI might add the gnubg port to that wishlist :)02:49
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OksanaPorting has two levels. 1) Mostly unmodified package working on N900, dependencies matched, *.desktop probably moved to appropriate location, put into Extras-repository; 2) GTK ui completely re-written into Hildon, package renamed appropriately to reflect the difference from original02:53
Oksanagry: First, how to make external links on iki clickable? Second, consider copying some of the things from here under
gryOksana, [duck duck](
gryOk, will do02:55
* Maxdamantus has played a bit of gnugo (via qgo) on his N900.02:55
Maxdamantuswas quite slow, and I'm not very good at Go so was probably using a low level.02:55
Maxdamantus(the gnugo bit, that is)02:55
MaxdamantusProbably better to run it remotely to save battery and time.02:56
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jonwilAdded the GNU Backgammon thing to the wishlist on the wiki03:03
jonwilAs for the coding contest, nothing on the wishlist has any interest for me (dont do SFOS and dont use emulators on my N900)03:06
jonwilas for "remove proprietary graphics from games" its been done for chess and mahjong and just needs doing for lmarbels03:06
jonwilchess and mahjong sounds have also been done03:07
jonwilI dont have the art skills to do it for lmarbles though so thats out :)03:07
jonwilplus that's not really coding in any case :)03:07
jonwilAt this point unless I end up finding something on that has yet to be reverse engineered AND that I have an interest in reverse engineering AND that I am capable of reverse engineering, the top contender for what I will do in the coding contest is an app for my local public transport agency03:10
jonwilThe agency provides REST and SOAP APIs for doing route/journey planning03:11
jonwiland some Google GTFS and GTFS-realtime data for their routes and operations03:11
jonwiland their mobile site got rewritten recently and isn't usable on the old N900 browser anymore03:12
jonwilso an app using their APIs and data seems like a great thing.03:12
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jonwilLibs for doing rest/soap are easy to find (probably already something in the repos somewhere)03:13
jonwiland I bet there is code out there for parsing Google GTFS and GTFS-realtime data03:13
jonwilfor the UI I am thinking QT since I know more about QT than GTK and since I have a big fat QT4 programming book sitting in my box of books :)03:17
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* Oksana dislikes Qt; nothing personal, it's just not the "default" widget toolkit for Hildon; and it would be nice to have "universal" transport app, similar to "universal" email client Modest; with various plugins (GTFS, REST, SOAP APIs) requesting configuration (like, web-server, port, similar)03:28
jonwilexcept that the APIs and data is likely to be totally different for each agency03:29
jonwilwell not the Google GTFS03:29
jonwilbut the APIs03:30
OksanaWell, that's the problem: need yet another plugin for each agency. Just like omweather and its plugins...03:30
OksanaHowever, if there were several well-known APIs (like GTFS), then one plugin would be enough for several agencies at the same time03:31
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jonwiloh great, looks like if I want to do Google GTFS-realtime data on Maemo I need to find a way to get Google Protocol Buffers working on Maemo06:05
jonwiland more so get them going with the ancient GCC 4.2.1 version Maemo is stuck with06:07
jonwilIf I can find the right debian packages for protobuf (the runtime side in particular) I could try and back-port it06:07
jonwilThat might be a good place to start06:07
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sicelojonwil: there is backgammon for n900, offscr-backgammon08:37
OksanaIs it open-source?..08:43
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jonwilI think offscr-backgammon was in the old ovi store09:00
jonwilwhich is gone09:00
jonwilI dont believe it was open source09:00
jonwilin fact I am sure it wasn't09:12
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bencohyup it's in ovi09:24
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jonwilIf I can figure out how to read the GTFS and GTFS-realtime data on the N900 I think the transit app I am planning to write should be doable09:42
bencohgtfs ? google traffics?09:43
jonwilGoogle transit09:45
jonwilpublic transport agencies publish data in that format and apps can use it09:46
jonwilGTFS provides data on routes, stops, schedules etc09:46
jonwilthen GTFS-realtime is real-time tracking data on top of that09:46
bencohdon't they have a public API for that09:46
bencohin json/xml iirc09:47
jonwildifferent agencies do different things09:47
jonwilThe transport agency in my area provides Google GTFS data09:47
jonwilplus a GTFS-realtime data feed09:47
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jonwilplus also a REST/SOAP API for journey planning/scheduling09:48
jonwilall 3 of which I plan to use in my app09:48
jonwilREST isn't a problem, there are libs for that in the repos09:48
bencohno I mean ... google has an api for that right?09:48
jonwilgoogle doesn't have an API09:48
jonwilor if they do, its not one I have seen09:49
jonwil is what I see with Google09:49
jonwiland that is just the specs for GTFS and GTFS-realtime09:49
bencohthey at least do for directions09:50
jonwiloh wait I see now, its part of the Google Maps API.09:50
jonwilBut that's not what I need09:50
jonwilI have a specific feature set in mind for the app based on what I personally want to do with it.09:50
bencohwhich is?09:51
jonwilI want to write something that uses the REST API to let me do journey planning (they have a mobile website but they recently upgraded it and now its useless on the N900 browser)09:51
jonwilAnd '09:51
jonwilAnd I want to use the GTFS and GTFS-realtime APIs to track things09:52
jonwilI want something to track buses comming to the stop I am at09:52
jonwiland tell me when the next bus is due09:52
jonwilwell bus/train/tram/ferry since this agency does all 4 :)09:52
jonwilI also want something that I can use (again via the GTFS-realtime data) to follow the vehicle I am currently riding on and display the upcoming stops so I know when to get off.09:53
jonwilThe Google Maps API wont help with the features I want09:53
jonwilhence why I want to be able to read GTFS and GTFS-realtime data on the N90009:54
jonwilGTFS is just text files and I bet I could find a C/C++ library that reads them and port that to the N90009:54
jonwilBut GTFS-realtime uses Google Protocol Buffers09:55
jonwiland so I need to figure out how to get that thing ported to the N90009:55
jonwilwell I was wrong and I cant find a C/C++ library for parsing GTFS10:01
jonwilbut I am probably just not using the right search terms :P10:01
jonwilcertainly though getting protocol-buffers working on the N900 is key to my app, otherwise I cant do what I want10:01
bencohjonwil: err iirc I've built protobuf already10:09
bencohjust haven't had time to clean/push it to extras10:09
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bencohjonwil: protobuf/c++ is already present in extras*, and I have protobuf-c lying around if you want10:14
jonwilis protobuf/c++ the latest version?10:17
jonwiland what package(s) do I want?10:18
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bencohI dunno what you're looking for to be honest, so ... no idea ;)10:42
bencohprotobuf-c is 0.14 here10:42
bencohprotobuf is latest in extras ... 2.4.x10:42
jonwilAccording to the latest release from Google is 3.1.011:13
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jonwilLooks like the .proto file for GTFS-realtime needs protobuf 2.x anyway11:36
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jonwilok, I got the .proto file to spit out a .cc file and a .h file and the result compiles in scratchbox with the included gcc12:08
jonwilSo that seems to be going12:08
jonwilSo I got the protobuf stuff installed properly12:08
jonwilAt least I hope so12:08
jonwilI also got librest for the REST api installed12:08
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jonwilnow all I need is to find something to parse GTFS and I can start working on this app (well that and I need a name)14:25
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jonwila C/C++ library more specifically :)14:54
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jon_yjonwil: use flex/bison? :)15:05
jonwilI dont know the first thing about using flex/bison or how to write parsers15:14
jonwilI dont think flex/bison is the right tool for GTFS data in any case15:14
jonwilsince its comma delimited text15:15
jon_yuse perl :)15:16
jon_y$\ = q{,}; @results = map {...} <STDIN>;15:17
jon_yflex/bison isn't hard to pick up if you know regex15:18
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_maniac_GTFS data is just a zip of csv-like files. not sure of GTFS-relatime, didn't touch that.16:06
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