IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2014-01-28

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robbiethe1stOK, guys, I need some help02:50
robbiethe1stI'm trying to use my USB barcode scanner with my N900. I've got HEN etc.02:50
robbiethe1stI've been able to get it to connect, and when I scan a barcode, things /sort of/ work... but only letters, no numbers. (keymapping issue?)02:51
robbiethe1stWhen plugged into my Debian PC, works fine.02:51
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DocScrutinizer05yeah, so it probably emulates a kbd, and your mapping is incorrect for the keyboard it emulates03:46
DocScrutinizer05robbiethe1st: ^^^03:46
DocScrutinizer05check syslog or lsusb how it registers to system03:47
robbiethe1stI know it emulates a kbd03:49
DocScrutinizer05would make quite a lot of sense. Try whatever apps are available to switch to external USB-attached kbd03:49
DocScrutinizer05I bet it emulates a standard 104-key PC USB kbd03:49
DocScrutinizer05so check/google for HEN+keyboard+maemo03:50
DocScrutinizer05and see how to conveniently switch to support for 104key03:50
robbiethe1stextkbd. Lets see03:51
robbiethe1stGood to go03:55
DocScrutinizer05robbiethe1st: you might want to disable the external 2keyboard" barcode reader for X11 and directly read from it in your barcode reader app04:07
robbiethe1stActually, I want to paste the codes into VIM... save em to a text file04:07
robbiethe1stseems to work04:07
DocScrutinizer05otherwise input from barcode rader might end up in arbitrary apps running on N900, whatever just has focus04:07
DocScrutinizer05ooh, VIM. Then this is exactly what you want04:08
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robbiethe1stYup. Plan is to save it to text, input a few hundred codes, then copy that file onto a PC for further processing04:08
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* DocScrutinizer05 wonders if robbiethe1st just uses VIM because it seems like the easiest way. While maybe a 'readmybarcode >>mybarcodes.txt' would do same thing with better adapted function specs04:25
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robbiethe1stMaby. Though I can't imagine anything easier than open VIM, put in insert mode, and scan codes.04:26
robbiethe1stThe scanner adds a \n after each code, so...04:27
r00t|eeepcdamn, my scanner does not send a newline... it's damn annoying...04:27
robbiethe1stThis one's the cheapest USB one I could find on ebay04:28
r00t|eeepcmine is a used one that cost like $700 back when it was now ;)04:28
r00t|eeepcnice part is it has a motorized scanner that detects the code in any orientation, and ps/2 and rs232 output04:29
r00t|eeepc(probably could be configured to add a newline if i had the manual)04:29
robbiethe1stThis is a cheap one. It just flashes a laser back and forth, and scans so long as you are somewhere near horizontal04:30
r00t|eeepci'd use a serial one and hook up a bluetooth module04:30
r00t|eeepcmuch more convenient04:30
r00t|eeepcalso, mind your poor little micro-usb port04:31
robbiethe1stWhy? Ebay has bluetooth ones easily.04:31
robbiethe1stalso I tried one we had at work, and couldn't get it to pair04:31
r00t|eeepcbut the bluetooth module is $7 or so... while a scanner with bluetooth is... $50+?04:31
robbiethe1stBut I also didn't look for any special software04:31
r00t|eeepca bluetooth barcode reader should be either rfcomm or HID, no special software needed04:32
robbiethe1stIt just wouldn't pair 'pairing error'04:32
r00t|eeepcbtw, why not use camera + image processing?04:33
r00t|eeepcno extra hw needed04:33
robbiethe1stI'll try it with mbarcode, but for some reason I doubt it'll paste the code to a text file04:35
r00t|eeepcwe call it "open source"04:35
r00t|eeepcpersonally i found mbarcode completely useless... it's so slow to start that in the time it takes you could just type in the contend of the code a few times...04:37
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robbiethe1stwhat else is there?04:38
r00t|eeepci wonder how they managed to make it perform so badly... it's not written in java or anything04:38
r00t|eeepci dunno... i'd just go for v4l grabber + image processing04:39
robbiethe1stlots of work04:39
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robbiethe1stI mean, I've now got a good, easy solution04:39
r00t|eeepcexcept it doesn't work ;)04:39
robbiethe1stThe only problem with it was the keymap04:40
robbiethe1stextkbd did.04:40
robbiethe1stNow, all I need to do is plug it in, run HEN, start VIM, press i, and just start scanning codes.04:41
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r00t|eeepci still wonder how long the micro-usb port will last in mobile usage like that, if you use it regularly04:41
robbiethe1stThis is a one time thing. But I am slightly worried about it; one of these days, I'll open er up and solder it in place04:43
robbiethe1stActually, I'd be more worried about the times I've dropped my n900 while plugged in... thing hanging on the cord isn't so good04:44
robbiethe1stAlso, mind, I've already lost one N900 a couple of years ago. Broken USB port04:44
r00t|eeepci don't think hanging on the cord is a problem at all, but hitting the ground with the plugged-in connector first04:44
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r00t|eeepci had the port break in one... which was no problem (used external charger)... until it broke and needed to be re-flashed04:46
robbiethe1stYou didn't have backupmenu, did you?04:46
r00t|eeepcin my current one the port work, but not 100% reliable...04:46
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r00t|eeepcbackupmenu is a useless piece of crap... beacuse it needss the rootfs to be still intact04:47
robbiethe1stPartially intact, mind you04:47
robbiethe1stBut I've not seen rootfs corruption04:48
robbiethe1stOptfs corruption, quite a bit04:48
r00t|eeepcwell, it just froze on the nokia logo screen, where it would normally display the kernel version (dev mode enabled)04:48
robbiethe1st...Though, actually, more that I think about it, even I've relied on flashing a rootfs image a few times04:48
robbiethe1stActually, have you looked at re-soldering the port?04:49
r00t|eeepcyes, and in the process ripped off two of the five solder pads04:51
r00t|eeepci also tried on the debug connector with no luck04:51
robbiethe1stI've done the same04:51
robbiethe1stI'm going to have to try again, one of these days04:51
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r00t|eeepci have previously re-soldered the cardbus/pcmcia slot on a notebook... that has quire a few more contacts, but at a less insane pitch, and with more room to work in04:52
robbiethe1stI'm thinking next time to try hot-air-rework on it, after heating the whole thing up a bit04:53
r00t|eeepc(interestingly the issue was the exact same... bad design with too much stress on the solder joints)04:53
robbiethe1stOf course, if I /do/ get a working USB port... I'm going to solder the top of the port to the metal cans on each side04:53
r00t|eeepcdon't assume soldering like that is easy... you need to apply a LOT of heat to the connector shield to solder it, which is likely to juse cause more damage04:54
DocScrutinizer05you're soldering what? the top to the metal cans?04:56
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r00t|eeepci guess he means the connector shield to the shields on the pcb04:57
DocScrutinizer05soldering USB like ~usbfix needs a 60W or better 100W soldering iron04:57
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robbiethe1stI've got a temp-controlled 60w + hot air rework station, and last I tried, I just managed to get cold joints04:58
robbiethe1stthings just solidified as soon as they touched the ground pad04:58
DocScrutinizer05heating up the ground pads is not easy04:58
DocScrutinizer05that's why you need the 100W04:58
DocScrutinizer05alternatively you use insanely high temperature, so copper of groundplane heats up faster locally than it can dissipate the heat to the wide area04:59
robbiethe1stMy thought is perhaps heating the entire board up to say 120F, slowly... let it sit there for a while, then shield the chips around it and just hot-air-melt it05:00
DocScrutinizer05sure heating up the whole thing to ~80°C before you start will help a lot05:00
DocScrutinizer05hot air is fine for the tiny electrical contacts, but for the huge groundplane stuff you want a old fashion monster iron05:01
robbiethe1stI may have to grind myself a custom tip... my thin one couldn't get enough heat to it05:01
robbiethe1stsee if I can come up with something05:01
DocScrutinizer05I'd use that one if I still had it:
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DocScrutinizer05ideal tip shape, ideal power05:04
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robbiethe1stOr, maby I'll just get a NeoN90005:04
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robbiethe1stboard for it05:04
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DocScrutinizer05good plan :-)05:35
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Tekk_anyone have issues with mumble not working? installing in app manager gives a dep failure because it wants like 1.2.4 when the repo has 1.2.606:07
Tekk_and if you decide to be naughty and just install it with apt-get, it fails to actually pick up anything audio related. It sees all the devices and everything fine but there's o output or input (presumably the mumble-11x package does something to fix this)06:08
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kwtm2Is the RX-51 the hardware part of the N900?  (reading about the Neo900)06:48
robbiethe1stRX-51 is the model06:51
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kwtm2wow, there are quite a few challenges to making the Neo900 a reality.06:58
kwtm2(just finished reading the "feasibility study").  I hope we find a big enough market for it.06:58
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Tekk_kwtm2: link?07:06
kwtm2Tekk_: That's from
Tekk_yeah, found it on the site07:10
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Tekk_hm, noticed an nfc in the best case specs. does that mean other half like functionality in that case?07:12
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DocScrutinizer05that's up to you to switch your profile or wallpaper or theme when NFC detects a certain tag13:58
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kerioDocScrutinizer05: ooh, how will the neo900 support battery hotswap?14:45
keriowill that also mean that we can have pure-hardware battery charging?14:47
DocScrutinizer05kerio: that's pretty much unrelated14:59
keriomh, fair enough15:00
DocScrutinizer05hotswap basically works like: connect all dispensable consumers directly to battery, buffer the rest from a huge buffer capacitor that we charge to a multiple of needed voltage and use as some sort of UPS15:02
DocScrutinizer05e.g. modem has 3 power supply pins, of which one is low-power and can keep the modem alive for a few secons from a pretty small buffer cap15:03
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kerioi see15:03
keriothat's neat15:03
kerioso you'll still have to be quick with the hotswap15:03
DocScrutinizer05of course TX will fail and modem needs to resume after that15:04
DocScrutinizer05that's the point about "ultrafast batteryswap procedure"15:04
DocScrutinizer05the charging is planned to be exactly like TI reference in e.g. beagleboard, i.e. based on twl4030. Evaluation pending, we don't want to run into a true deadlock where device can't charge when battery deep discharged15:10
DocScrutinizer05in GTA04 it allegedly works flawlessly15:10
DocScrutinizer05I'm still not happy with the GTA04 circuitry since it uses a linear regulator which has a pretty poor efficiency15:11
keriolike the n900 ahem ahema15:11
DocScrutinizer05what's wrong with Neo900? it charges from almost all situations except broken rootfs and already defect EOL battery15:12
infobotDocScrutinizer05 meant: what's wrong with N900? it charges from almost all situations except broken rootfs and already defect EOL battery15:13
DocScrutinizer05it's a tad unfortunate that you will discharge your battery by bootlooping when rootfs broken, and you can't restore rootfs via simple normal flashing when battery is too low15:14
DocScrutinizer05you can recover even from that with rescueOS and similar RAM-based charger software15:16
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DocScrutinizer05Neo900 might not support classical flashing at all, and instead boot from uSD, so even less of a recovery hassle even when your NAND based rootfs is broken. You simply insert a uSD that has a sane working rootfs and you're good to go for charging and for flashing NAND15:18
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chem|stscript: read backscroll^^16:10
DocScrutinizer05script didn't say anything the last few days, it seems16:21
DocScrutinizer05chem|st: I'm not able to join meeting tonight16:25
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chem|stDocScrutinizer05: noted16:38
chem|stI am talking with him in another channel about neo90016:38
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SAiFhuh? where is the crontab?18:34
MMN-oHave you installed a cron daemon?18:37
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SAiFdo you have to?18:42
SAiFI cant find any..18:42
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jogawell, opened up the n900 with broken usb and the port was just loose there, took a couple of pics
joga(of pads on pcb and the connector itself)20:29
jogaI guess I at least need to get a spare port, only seem to have spare miniusbs now20:29
jogaalso need to get some compressed air...20:31
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SiceloSAiF: alarmed might just have all you need.. unless you have 'special' need21:11
DocScrutinizer05right, since there is no cron on maemo21:11
DocScrutinizer05alarmd is as close as it gets to crond21:12
DocScrutinizer05and you could use alarmclient to manage alarmd "crontabs", but you don't want to go that bumpy road. Rather use alarmed21:13
DocScrutinizer05(somebody should port alarmed to default PC linux, as a decent frontend to cron)21:14
DocScrutinizer05joga: why? all looks pretty "easy", just solder port to PCB again21:15
DocScrutinizer05looks like you were extremely "lucky" with your usb breakage21:16
jogayeah considering the pads are ok21:16
jogait just looks a bit filthy but haven't cleaned it up really yet21:16
DocScrutinizer05that's the point21:16
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DocScrutinizer05first of all you need to clean port and PCB pads with solder iron and solder wick21:17
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DocScrutinizer05then go for:21:17
jogayeah, got those21:17
infobotusbfix is probably - and **NEVER** use epoxy (unless you want to seal your device for underwater)21:17
jogaye, glanced at that, I guess I'll do the scrape thing21:17
jogaafter I get over this flu I'll try21:18
DocScrutinizer05you can remove/cut/bend the "roof" over contacts of port, to better reach them21:18
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DocScrutinizer05nevermind, not really21:19
jogathe spot looked a bit tight but I guess others have managed to do it nevertheless :)21:19
DocScrutinizer05the mech fix pads *under* the port are dead, bit that's not relevant21:19
DocScrutinizer05yeah, hot air might help21:20
DocScrutinizer05anyway just make sure you wetted pads and contacts properly with solder, and applied SMD(!)-flux to both. Then place USB in correct location and fix (sticky tape or tiny solder blob on one side)21:22
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DocScrutinizer05then either hot air or iron with thin tip, and just heat up the 5 contacts21:22
DocScrutinizer05then fix port thoroughly according to ~usbfix21:23
jogaDocScrutinizer05, thanks21:24
DocScrutinizer05if nothing of all that works for you - use 10mm thin wires to connect port to pads. Bend wires up to form inverted U while pushing port back into correct location, before fixing it on both sides21:24
DocScrutinizer05this is a botch, but should work "good enough"21:25
DocScrutinizer05if soldering the 5 contacts turns out to be too hard21:26
DocScrutinizer05wires must not be longer than 10mm21:26
jogaI don't have a hot air gun and just some basic flux pen but I think I can manage one way or another21:26
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jogaI guess I can just barely reach back there with the finest tip I got... besides the flex cable and some plastic beside it, are there any extra sensitive components near there I might screw up if I heat it too long?21:35
jogathe tip is pretty crap heat transfer wise21:35
DocScrutinizer05lift off the uSD daughterboard21:42
DocScrutinizer05protect camera!21:42
DocScrutinizer05then you're basicaly fine21:42
DocScrutinizer05take care of the flex cable though, it's not really easily damanged but non-recoverable if you damage it21:43
DocScrutinizer05it won't break when you take care a bit about it21:44
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jogaooooh it lifts off eh, didn't realize to try but figures21:47
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jogascared to lift it though...should it just pop out if done right?21:53
jogathe service manual just mentions how to get the camera out but didn't find proper procedure for the uSD21:54
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r00t|homei cut away the shield next to the usb connector when trying to solder it...21:57
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jogar00t|home, did you succeed?22:05
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jogaok this picture is useful...
joganow to figure out how to achieve that without screwing up the flex..22:13
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jogaah, got it22:20
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