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| DocScrutinizer05 | [admin announcement] we need to take down www.maemo.org for maintenance for 1..2h - since static.m.o is on same VM, you'll see rendering issues and massive slowdowns on wiki.m.o etc as well | 00:53 |
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| ShadowJK_ | freemangordon; "memory_sync_page: no page for 006b1000" proc_memory_sync: InValid address parameters 00667c10 70800" | 01:36 |
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| Gear_ | hi | 11:55 |
| Gear_ | I installed pwnie express on my secondary phone, my primary phone is almost dead and I need to transfer the data to the one that currently has pwnie express | 11:56 |
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| Gear_ | I need to transfer all data from one n900 to another one | 12:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer06 | drive-by asker? | 12:33 |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: not to mention that pwnie express shit | 13:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | lol | 13:00 |
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| kerio | "i'm a hacker but i don't know what scp is" | 13:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or even BM | 13:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~hacker | 13:01 |
| infobot | rumour has it, hacker is someone that hacks. see hacking. or an interesting essay can be found at http://sine.com/essay/perversion-of-hacker.html, but Someone who plays with stuff, and figures things out just to satisfy his own idle curiousity. | 13:01 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ~hacking | 13:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~wiki hacker | 13:01 |
| infobot | At http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker (URL), Wikipedia explains: "{{wiktionary|hacker}} 'Hacker' may refer to: * Hacker (term), a term used in computing for several types of person ** Hacker (computer security) someone who accesses a computer system by circumventing its security system ** Hacker (hobbyist), who makes innovative customizations or combinations of retail electronic and computer equipment * Hacker (programmer subculture), who combines ... | 13:02 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 always feels an irresistable urge to hit the face of everybody using this term in meaning #2 of wikipedia | 13:03 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | probably related to my age | 13:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | when I was young (and a hacker), a hack been for example making the PDP11 play a song | 13:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, ok, sub-bullet #1 I meant: Hacker (computer security) | 13:07 |
| hardfalcon1 | DocScrutinizer05: I know that feeling, but at some point it becomes (IMHO) more helpful accepting that new meaning than to waste power to try to oppose the way people use a certain term | 13:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | often even confused with cracker or even script kiddie | 13:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hardfalcon1: alas true | 13:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you can't educate the worls | 13:09 |
| hardfalcon1 | it is more important to explain to people the *actual* problems we have than to waste time with trying to get them to adopt a new vocabulary | 13:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | world* | 13:09 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | *old* vocabulary | 13:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | even genuine original vocabulary | 13:09 |
| hardfalcon1 | wel, to *them*, it is "new" | 13:09 |
| hardfalcon1 | *well | 13:09 |
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| hardfalcon1 | think of discussing for example quotas for women in management positions with hardcore feminists | 13:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, for all you kids and noobs out there: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_(programmer_subculture) :-D | 13:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm all for quotas, particularly in prison and unemployment ;-P | 13:12 |
| hardfalcon1 | instead of discussing the actual topic with you, a lot of them will try to force their own vocabulary as a replacement for the common "mainstream" vocabulary down your throat | 13:12 |
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| hardfalcon1 | well in the beginning, I was strictly opposed to quotas because I consider them as a form of psoitive discrimination, and I don't believe that you should fight discrimination with more discrimination | 13:13 |
| hardfalcon1 | but in the meantime, I've come to a point where I don't give a shit anymore | 13:13 |
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| hardfalcon1 | I think women should have equal chances, which implies that we'll end up wit 50% women in management positions at some point in time - so if the women really want quotas, they shall have quotas | 13:15 |
| hardfalcon1 | anyhow, as far as the term "hacker" is concerned: I was once on a student's faire where I represented my hackerspace in luxembourg | 13:16 |
| SpeedEvil_ | you're assuming that the same proportion of men as women want to spend lots of time at work. | 13:17 |
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| hardfalcon1 | my standard answer to "What's a hacker?" was "Somebody who finds an unorthodox or creative solution for a problem. So if your grandma's water boiler is broken and she uses the coffee machine to get hot water, you can consider her a hacker." | 13:18 |
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| hardfalcon1 | SpeedEvil_: In countries where women are not forced to spend most of their time raising children because there is a working and affordable public infrastructure that can take care of the children while the mother is a work, they actually *do* spend a similar proportion of time working | 13:21 |
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| hardfalcon1 | but TBH I don't wanna discuss social politics here, if I wanna discuss social politics, I'll give me the pain to go to the "queer geeks panel" at the 30C3 | 13:24 |
| hardfalcon1 | s/to go/of going/ | 13:24 |
| infobot | hardfalcon1 meant: but TBH I don't wanna discuss social politics here, if I wanna discuss social politics, I'll give me the pain of going to the "queer geeks panel" at the 30C3 | 13:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ~botsnack | 14:02 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer05: :) | 14:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | wow | 14:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | lol @ *C3, I heard last one had funny issue involving lots of red cards | 14:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | one guy even tried to collect as many of them as he could get ;-P | 14:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and a girl allegedly created XXX-rated wall tags out of them, which I consider an excellent hack indeed | 14:12 |
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| ashley | what's the status of recorder on Fremantle? I've found http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=55430 which states the recorder is the newest version of maemo-recorder application, but recorder-0.3.4's README file still states that "Maemo Recorder is a simple graphical utility for recording audio from microphone on Nokia internet tablets, mainly the 770." and I'd like to know whether it's compatible with Fremantle/N900 or not... | 19:40 |
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| Sc0rpius | ashley, I think what you're looking for is recorder-0.3.4 | 19:50 |
| Sc0rpius | maemo-recorder even if it has build for Fremantle it looks like it was mainly for Diablo instead of Fremantle | 19:50 |
| Sc0rpius | and both packages (from the same author) haven't been updated in years. | 19:51 |
| Sc0rpius | like most N900 apps :) | 19:51 |
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| Sc0rpius | if it's in the repositories then it is for the N900. | 19:52 |
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| ashley | yep, recorder (versions 0.3.1-0.3.4) is at http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/source/r/recorder/ (and I assume precompiled binaries are in a different folder, too); finding the link wasn't as easy as I had hoped, though | 19:56 |
| ashley | (and it's a shame that the source code for the Harmattan recorder app has been basically lost :/) | 19:57 |
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| kerio | hey, the cubieboard has an arm cortex A8 and i2c | 20:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ashley: you know a lot about mediawiki I heard? | 20:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | is that right or incorrect? | 20:16 |
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| ashley | you would think so since I've been a MediaWiki developer since 2008 ;-) | 20:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yep | 20:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-) | 20:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so, would you be willing to explain how to properly delete SPAM (not undo or rollback) | 20:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I found http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:REVDEL so far | 20:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but it seems that's not installed on wiki.m.o | 20:18 |
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| ashley | depends on what is your definition of properly and what kind of spam (i.e. new page creations or spamming over an old, pre-existing wiki page); RevisionDelete is a core MW feature since 1.16 (see http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:RevisionDelete) but the maemo.org wiki is running 1.15.5 (http://wiki.maemo.org/Special:Version) so it's either not available or at least not enabled | 20:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I also found http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Selective_deletion but that's a PITA for sure | 20:21 |
| ashley | for new spam pages, ordinary deletion works; for individual spam revisions...it's a bit more complicated if we're doing it w/o RevisionDelete | 20:21 |
| ashley | there is the possibility of deleting the entire page and selectively restoring all but the spam revision -- but it's ugly and usually not worth the trouble, which is why most patrollers and admins on most wikis either undo/rollback the spam (or RevisionDelete it) | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the problem we want to tackle is spammers adding ther URLs to existing pages, so google will find and index then, even when they are not most recent version anymore | 20:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | s/then,/them,/ | 20:23 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer05 meant: the problem we want to tackle is spammers adding ther URLs to existing pages, so google will find and index them, even when they are not most recent version anymore | 20:23 |
| ashley | there is http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:AbuseFilter but I can guarantee that the most recent version will _not_ work with a MW version as old as 1.15 and I'm not sure how stable the older versions are (I recall AbuseFilter went through quite heavy development before it became even somewhat stable) | 20:24 |
| ashley | out of general curiosity and somewhat related to the spam issue, what's the plan for upgrading wiki.maemo.org to the most recent version of MediaWiki (and hopefully fixing a few annoying bugs while we're at it), or is there no such plan yet? | 20:24 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | there's no maintainer to pursue such plans, so far | 20:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | we're running in a permanent mix of holiday-mode, emergency-mode, and maintenance-mode | 20:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | (we == techstaff) | 20:26 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | IOW: short of manpower | 20:26 |
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| ashley | well, for what it's worth, I'd gladly like to help you guys out with that, given that the MediaWiki 1.15.x branch will soon celebrate its fourth birthday ;-) (as per http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Release_notes/1.15) | 20:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you're more than welcome to apply for a maintainer role for mediawiki service | 20:27 |
| ashley | is there a formal process or somesuch or shall I just raise my hand and say, "I'm interested"? :-) | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | however, please be aware that maemo services seen lots of customizations during the years, and have to integrate into the whole system | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the latter :-) | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I'll walk you thru the "formal process" then | 20:29 |
| ashley | \o consider me interested in wiki.maemo.org and upgrading it, then | 20:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fine! :-) | 20:29 |
| kerio | =D | 20:29 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ashley: /query? | 20:31 |
| ashley | based on a quick look at https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/maemo2midgard/mediawiki/ , there's the custom skin which needs upgrading (should be relatively simple to do, just need to find a few hours to actually do that, test it and iron out the bugs) and some wonky dark magic related to the upper/lowercase usernames | 20:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | that sounds wonderful | 20:31 |
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| kerio | that sounds so fun | 20:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | So what's the takeaway from the council handover meeting? | 21:18 |
| kerio | GeneralAntilles: bauer's a twat | 21:32 |
| kerio | but, i mean, we already knew that | 21:32 |
| Win7Mac | make sure you quote all his few comments | 21:33 |
| Win7Mac | that'd speak for itself | 21:33 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | the most important quote though is the lots of silence | 21:39 |
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| Wulfe | lol | 21:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm sure I asked at least three times when will be next HiFo BoD meeting, I can't recall I've seen any answer whatsoever | 21:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: I think the takeaway is "MCC handed over, HFC established and started productive work by evaluating state of HiFo bank account management plus a few other minor topics" | 21:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and "HFC uttered *severe* concerns regarding the way the bank account gets handled by HiFo BoD currently" | 21:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | "HFC instructed BoD to immediately fix the issues found relating to bank account management - the *latest* till next Friday" | 21:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | "particularly HFC instructed BoD Bauer to *immediately* remove persons from signature list that have parted HiFo, and to cooperate with BoD Woodward to get the latter on said signature list" | 21:50 |
| kerio | is there a stronger synonym than "instruct"? | 21:53 |
| Win7Mac | who is the next HiFo-treasurer? | 22:00 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: my english is pretty poor as soon as it's not about stuff related to electronics | 22:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | actually my active vocabulary is maybe 0.1% of my passive one | 22:04 |
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| kerio | pretty much the same here | 22:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | suggestion, advice, instruction, order - that's about it with my active vocabulary for that | 22:07 |
| Win7Mac | *gave order to... | 22:07 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | maybe a few circumscriptions like "ultimately demand" | 22:08 |
| Win7Mac | I'd also metion the general disaproval about current situation with Bod in general (JJ not responsive), but esp. secretary doing a lousy job. | 22:12 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | well, though I can't disagree, personally, it's for sure not PC and good style to do that kind of public bashing as member of a official entity that's meant to cooperate with HiFo | 22:19 |
| Win7Mac | yea, you're probably right. So, GeneralAntilles, please put it in some nice words ;) | 22:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | each aspect would need more in depth evaluation to estimate the actual situation and circumstances. However what's evident and obvious is BoD's blatant failure to schedule and hold meetings, and it seems rather clear why we see this failure | 22:23 |
| Win7Mac | he does not serve the community anymore | 22:24 |
| Win7Mac | maemo, that is | 22:24 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Win7Mac, nice words I can /usually/ manage. | 22:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | What's the timeline for initiating board elections? | 22:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: ASAP | 22:44 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Good | 22:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the plan is to pick up on the already running nomination period and announced elections | 22:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | of course this plan has to get approved/adopted by HFC | 22:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | since in pre-HFC times nobody can make fixed plans regarding that | 22:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | the idea however been that HFC would adopt the planning/schedule/announcements done in the past by MMC | 22:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and approve them retroactively | 22:47 |
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| Win7Mac | are the rules about BoD elections set and ACK'ed by HFC an BoD? | 22:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the rules are to be defined by HFC, not yet done | 22:48 |
| Win7Mac | BoD has to accept? | 22:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 22:48 |
| Win7Mac | gooood... | 22:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | BoD has to accept that there *are* elections... or not | 22:50 |
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| Win7Mac | how can that be rejected, it's in the bylaws there have to be | 22:51 |
| Win7Mac | it's HFCs job | 22:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | a BoD that refuses to accept the legitimately announced and held elections would not have any way to stick to their position | 22:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | exactly | 22:51 |
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| Win7Mac | well, then lets hope he keeps on refusing and the issue is soon to be resolved ;) | 22:54 |
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| GeneralAntilles | How will bank account handover be handled.... | 22:57 |
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| Win7Mac | ...but he could refuse the legitimately of the announcement (by MCC) and therefore the whole election... | 22:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | no, since that's not job of BoD, that's job of MFC | 23:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: handover? | 23:01 |
| Win7Mac | MFC? | 23:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | HFC | 23:02 |
| Win7Mac | but, you know, HFC is not MCC | 23:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so what? | 23:03 |
| Win7Mac | HFC has to put rules first, then announce? | 23:03 |
| Win7Mac | that's at least what I#d expect | 23:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | there's a HFC, it's HFC's job to define election rules to their liking, and it's not BoD to accept or reject that decision of HFC | 23:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you're assumning | 23:04 |
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| Win7Mac | but there timetables for election-period | 23:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | there's no such rule that says elections have to get announced only after HFC published rules | 23:05 |
| Win7Mac | well... | 23:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | honestly, why discuss all possibilities how BoD could spoil that election? | 23:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | is there any sane rationale in doing that now? | 23:06 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm already bored of this type of discussion with Mr Bauer | 23:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I don't like to do it for my leisure with !MrBauer | 23:07 |
| Win7Mac | no, but whats the point in ignoring bylaws and risk that elections have to be reheld and loose even more time? | 23:08 |
| Win7Mac | no offense here, just don't want to see the next drama | 23:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | please point me to any bylaws *I* ignored! | 23:10 |
| Win7Mac | not *YOU* ofc, HFC | 23:11 |
| Win7Mac | ! | 23:11 |
| Win7Mac | he's an advocate, he searches for those holes... | 23:11 |
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| Win7Mac | s/hole/breach | 23:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so please you do the same, instead of playing argumenting with me as sparrings partner | 23:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Assuming a new board is elected. | 23:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | GeneralAntilles: aah, no idea. Probably depends on what the bank requires for that | 23:14 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I love the abdication of responsibility for financial matters and the complete involvement in things involving potential elections. | 23:21 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | indeed | 23:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Mind blowing | 23:24 |
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