| unclouded | no idea. maybe I should look at the source for the watchdog package after I've rebuilt the fs from scratch. at least I can make notes this time | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| merlin1991 | unclouded: which watchdog? | 00:00 |
| merlin1991 | you can disable a few with flasher | 00:00 |
| unclouded | N900. I read that NOLO sets up the watchdog and it needs attention periodically otherwise it will power down | 00:01 |
| kerio | can't we unsetup it? | 00:01 |
| unclouded | so if an initrd wants to spend time with fsck then it should also reset the watchdog timer periodically | 00:02 |
| merlin1991 | if you set the device into r&d mode a few watchdog related things are turned off | 00:02 |
| int_ua | IIRC, developer mode | 00:02 |
| merlin1991 | just for testing | 00:02 |
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| kerio | merlin1991: does NOLO also enable the serial console that uses up power? | 00:03 |
| merlin1991 | kerio: don't ask me, I only have the high level view of that stuff :D | 00:03 |
| kerio | feature request for Pali: kernel module to pet the watchdog | 00:04 |
| merlin1991 | kerio the idea is to pet the watchdog from userspace so you can grab situations where the system has gone bonkers in userspace | 00:05 |
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| merlin1991 | a kernel module would leave you with a basically useless watchdog | 00:06 |
| kerio | we don't have that for normal computers, why do we have that for the n900? | 00:06 |
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| merlin1991 | because the n900 is more than a computer ;) | 00:06 |
| kerio | why? what does it have? | 00:06 |
| unclouded | doesn't the kernel already have support? we have to do something to /dev/twl4030_wdt ( from userspace) | 00:06 |
| kerio | an integrated modem? | 00:06 |
| merlin1991 | and you don't worry about burning through your batter in the night when you pc is running | 00:06 |
| kerio | unclouded: i meant something that actually tickles the watchdog, not something that only provides access | 00:06 |
| merlin1991 | whilst a mad userspace on the n900 can ruin your connectivity when you need it | 00:06 |
| unclouded | ah, I understand now | 00:07 |
| kerio | merlin1991: a mad userspace is something to fix | 00:07 |
| merlin1991 | kerio: it is still desireable to recover from a mad user space on a battery based system | 00:08 |
| kerio | my laptop doesn't do that! | 00:08 |
| * kerio is against all things nokia | 00:08 | |
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| merlin1991 | ping ludens | 00:09 |
| merlin1991 | err luf | 00:09 |
| merlin1991 | stufu non context aware autocoplete :D | 00:10 |
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| luke-jr_ | anyone want to have an IRC new years party in #tonal tonight? <.< | 00:35 |
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| janemba_ | hello | 00:39 |
| janemba_ | Where can I download openvpn package ? It seems that .install have a corrupt URL or maemo extras repository does not contain this package | 00:40 |
| luf | janemba_: have you tried http://maemo.org/downloads/product/Maemo5/openvpn/ ? | 00:43 |
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| luf | There is openvpn package in extras: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/fremantle/free/o/openvpn/ | 00:49 |
| luf | .... and also newer in extras-devel (but extras should be more stable). It's not good idea to use extras-devel if you don't know what are you doing. | 00:51 |
| janemba_ | luf: yes | 00:51 |
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| luf | janemba_: I checked it with apt-get now and it works. | 00:53 |
| luf | janemba_: Have you tried HAM? | 00:53 |
| janemba_ | luf: hmmm...I'm using FAM but maybe I need to update my repos | 00:54 |
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| luf | Maybe yes. I did apt-get update; apt-get install openvpn | 00:55 |
| luf | And also check apt-cache show openvpn | 00:55 |
| kerio | janemba_: don't use fapman | 00:55 |
| kerio | it's kinda bad | 00:55 |
| janemba_ | kerio: oh ? So what AM should I use ? | 00:56 |
| luf | janemba_: HAM | 00:56 |
| kerio | if you want to use a graphical one, use HAM | 00:56 |
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| int_ua | kerio: why is it bad? | 00:57 |
| luf | int_ua: it's too fast ;) | 00:58 |
| luf | I think it's ok when you don't upgrade cssu using fapman. But I saw such warning several time on maemo-cssu. | 00:58 |
| int_ua | kerio: it's a nokia thing, isn't it? ;) | 00:58 |
| kerio | int_ua: no, fapman isn't from nokia | 00:59 |
| kerio | it just does some freaky shit with dpkg | 00:59 |
| int_ua | luf: I upgrade CSSU using FAM | 00:59 |
| int_ua | kerio: HAM is nokia, I mean :) | 01:00 |
| kerio | oh, it is | 01:00 |
| kerio | that's why it's hopelessly bad | 01:00 |
| int_ua | that's what I'm saying | 01:00 |
| int_ua | what exactly with dpkg? | 01:01 |
| janemba_ | do you use openvpn-applet | 01:01 |
| janemba_ | ? | 01:01 |
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| int_ua | janemba_: I did a year ago | 01:02 |
| kerio | int_ua: it uses its own repo cache, and last time i heard it didn't run some pre*/post* scripts | 01:02 |
| janemba_ | int_ua: Did you encounter some issues to import your vpn files ? | 01:03 |
| int_ua | kerio: oh, so that's why I had to reinstall u-boot in terminal | 01:03 |
| int_ua | janemba_: IIRC, no, do you? | 01:03 |
| int_ua | kerio: any bugreport link to follow? | 01:03 |
| kerio | idk | 01:04 |
| janemba_ | int_ua: it's ok I use openvpn from command-line :) | 01:04 |
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| BCMM | how well does XMPP work on the n900? | 01:24 |
| BCMM | i'm trying to test it with Gajim on my desktop, and they send IM to each other fine but both claim the other can't do voice calls | 01:24 |
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| roostrus` | For me it's even skype calls do not work properly | 01:27 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ((so that's why I had to reinstall u-boot in terminal)) exactly. uBoot is one of those pkgs that definitely fail in fapman | 01:50 |
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| int_ua | Doc: any packages list to start investigating what causes that? | 02:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | it's pretty simple what causes that in this particular case: someting in the pre-install script doesn't work under fapman | 02:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I guess it is a requester | 02:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, maybe it's not this, maybe it's just fapman's missing ability to to install system components | 02:40 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which need this "the phone will not work (not even emergency calls) during that time" | 02:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and a reboot | 02:41 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | check out sysupd | 02:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | softupd | 02:43 |
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| Macer | wtf | 02:53 |
| Macer | this wrt610n is running like crap | 02:53 |
| Macer | am i missing something here? | 02:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | fapman is deliberately simplistic to gain a bit of speed against HAM | 02:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | int_ua: look, HAM sourcecode is open, yet somebody thought it was a good idea to start from scratch building an app manager rather than improving HAM | 03:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | int_ua: what's your guess of the quality of the design of such an app? | 03:04 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | "duh, I don't get what this is meant to do, let's omit it. And that's exactly the same, so scratch that too. And this looks overly complicated, I bet I can find a simpler algo" | 03:06 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | "look! it's a FAAAAST app, I'll call it fapman" | 03:06 |
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| robbiethe1st | Bah, apt-get is where it's at! | 03:08 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | even apt-get fails for some pkgs | 03:09 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, at least it's not exactly working as expected | 03:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | mind that apt-get upgrade is strongly deprecated | 03:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and apt-get dist-upgrade is outright forbidden | 03:11 |
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| SpeedEvil | apt-get dist-upgrade puts wp7 on it. | 03:13 |
| merlin1991 | DocScrutinizer05: I have yet to run over a pkg where apt-get failed | 03:15 |
| merlin1991 | but I never tried todo firwmare updates with it | 03:15 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | well, probably that statement about pkgs that don't work was not to the point, it's more like there are missing command options in apt-get to do all that HAM does | 03:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | once you know your pkg names, an apt-get install [--$<other-options>] $<pkgname> will usually work, I guess | 03:52 |
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| spoofy | Hello | 05:16 |
| spoofy | I cannot install scratchbox (apt-get update in install script failed), is scratchbox.org is down? | 05:17 |
| spoofy | Is there any mirror? | 05:17 |
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| SpeedEvil | most people are asleep at this time | 05:47 |
| spoofy | Not me.. | 05:47 |
| SpeedEvil | you may get a better response if you ask 4 hours ago | 05:47 |
| spoofy | I should making a new nmap and other goodies for maemo.. | 05:48 |
| SpeedEvil | :-) | 05:48 |
| SpeedEvil | never used scratch box myself | 05:48 |
| SpeedEvil | them limited development I've done has been on device | 05:48 |
| spoofy | can you just open scratchbox.org website? | 05:49 |
| spoofy | SpeedEvil: I'm making a PPwniePhone maemo os image.. | 05:49 |
| SpeedEvil | still loading | 05:49 |
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| SpeedEvil | still, so I think it's fair to say down | 05:50 |
| spoofy | end of the world.. | 05:50 |
| spoofy | damn it | 05:50 |
| spoofy | It's 5am in my timezone right now | 05:51 |
| SpeedEvil | 4 hetre | 05:51 |
| SpeedEvil | Germany? | 05:52 |
| spoofy | Poland | 05:52 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 05:52 |
| spoofy | So maemo users will not have a nice christmas gift | 05:53 |
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| SpeedEvil | :'( | 05:55 |
| spoofy | yeah.. | 05:55 |
| unclouded | it was down when I tried the other day too | 05:55 |
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| spoofy | http://www.sendspace.com/file/pkgn1r < This is just a working nmap 6.01 | 05:58 |
| spoofy | not optified version | 05:58 |
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| spoofy | I have a fully working (not freezing and glitching) newest metasploit on my n900 | 05:59 |
| spoofy | and much more.. | 06:00 |
| SpeedEvil | :-) | 06:00 |
| * SpeedEvil has mialaid his n900. | 06:00 | |
| SpeedEvil | grr | 06:00 |
| SpeedEvil | it's in the house somewhere... | 06:00 |
| unclouded | can you still SSH in to it? | 06:01 |
| SpeedEvil | no | 06:01 |
| SpeedEvil | battery dead | 06:01 |
| SpeedEvil | I think | 06:01 |
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| unclouded | I was hoping you would be able to get in and make it make some noise :( | 06:03 |
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| spoofy | DocScrutinizer06: Hi | 06:03 |
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| spoofy | ugh damn it.. | 06:04 |
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| int_ua | DocScrutinizer05: I think HAM would be more tolerable if it showed any progressbar. But the way it is now it gets me furious. Like "WTF is it doing?! Talking to Curiosity through DTN?" | 06:47 |
| int_ua | If apt-get is really broken I'm veeeeery disappointed. If it was done by nokia... I'll get over it. It would better be nokia. | 06:49 |
| int_ua | also, HAM lacks checkboxes for selective upgrade. Did you try to upgrade, like, 5 packages in it? | 06:51 |
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| * int_ua launched update check in HAM. Observed it saying nothing for almost 5 minutes. 4:50. | 06:58 | |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: HAM uses a different algorithm to solve dependencies | 09:55 |
| kerio | there's an option to make it use APT's | 09:55 |
| kerio | int_ua: at some point (with extras-devel enabled and the option to show every package) i clocked HAM's apt-worker taking 100% cpu for 14 minutes before becoming reactive again | 09:56 |
| kerio | int_ua: anyway, apt works, but it doesn't support killing everything except itself to update system packages in bulk | 09:57 |
| kerio | for instance, installing cssu-thumb without an already thumby kernel would be impossible | 09:57 |
| kerio | Pali: would kernel-cssu install silently over stock if you've got fiasco-image-update-ask installed? | 09:58 |
| kerio | and/or is the launched binary optified? | 09:59 |
| Pali | kerio, it checking kernel version string | 10:00 |
| Pali | if kernel has different substring it will ask | 10:00 |
| kerio | Pali: isn't the thing that asks for confirmation part of HAM? | 10:00 |
| Pali | that dialog window is binary application in HAM package | 10:01 |
| kerio | so if that's thumby... | 10:03 |
| kerio | does HAM have a special case for itself? | 10:03 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | ~moo | 10:37 |
| * infobot mooooooooo! I am cow, hear me moo, I weigh twice as much as you. I am cow, eating grass, methane gas comes out my ass | 10:37 | |
| int_ua | I thought it was penguin | 10:38 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 opens letterbox. No apocalypse... | 10:38 | |
| * DocScrutinizer05 mehs and closes letterbox | 10:38 | |
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| * DocScrutinizer05 wonders where to burn that giant solstice fire | 10:40 | |
| jaska | http://imgur.com/XKQkK (december 21 relevant) | 10:42 |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: elop's house! | 10:43 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: without elop we never would've seen jolla | 10:51 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | jaska: exactly what I just did, just the outside not been bright and hot but dim, cold, and rain washing away the snow | 10:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | rain on snow is a very effective method of nature to increase the amount of suddenly to dissipate water per area, thus creating nice floods | 10:54 |
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| jaska | i wish... -20c | 11:01 |
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| kerio | it's about +20 here | 11:04 |
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| kerio | actually no, more like +15 | 11:04 |
| kerio | but i've still got the flu :c | 11:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | HAIL DEAR SUN!!!! | 13:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | come up again now | 13:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | see? I'm the master of sun | 13:12 |
| StyXman | DocScrutinizer05: dunno, it's cloudy here, I can't see the sun | 13:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | believe me, it obeyed ;-D | 13:13 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | going higher for northern hemisphere since ~2 min now | 13:14 |
| trx | :) | 13:16 |
| SpeedEvil | the sun is a lie | 13:16 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.yr.no/place/United_Kingdom/Scotland/Markinch/meteogram.png | 13:16 |
| jpinx | still going strong here in asia | 13:16 |
| SpeedEvil | been doing this for a couple of days now | 13:16 |
| jpinx | unless it just doesn't come up tomorrow.... :( | 13:16 |
| SpeedEvil | 50mm rain, and cloud 24 hours | 13:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :-/ | 13:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | maybe you could use some of the golden yellow of this critter http://www.ebay.de/itm/LASER-11-WATT-Copper-Vapor-Laser-Kupferdampflaser-/140897424720#ht_2456wt_1396 | 13:18 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm hoping for the auction ending soon, so I'm not doing sth silly until then | 13:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ;-D | 13:19 |
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| int_ua | :) | 13:26 |
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| SpeedEvil | nice | 13:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | indeed | 13:32 |
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| SpeedEvil | selling, or buying? | 13:34 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | buying, of course | 13:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | NOIWONTNOIWONTNOIWONTNOIWONTNOIWONT | 13:41 |
| RST38h | YOUWILLYOUWILLYOUWILL | 13:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | RST38h: if I do, will you volunteer for my first live target? X-P | 13:43 |
| RST38h | No, but I would like a Youtube video of that! | 13:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | check out the already existing tubevid | 13:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-R4Kq2l7xE | 13:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | this critter probably actually can lure down lightning into that mirror | 13:46 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 is temped to go and probe resistance of beam ion channel with a multimeter ;-P | 13:48 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, up to 5kW pulses | 13:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | GRRRRR, I should drill my mains | 13:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | will help at least fro the DSL router | 13:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | to stop me from bidding for it | 13:49 |
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| SpeedEvil | I wish it was possible to remotely share these things. | 14:22 |
| SpeedEvil | I mean, you could easily get several people willing to pay a couple of hundred, if they could use it at home in an hours notice | 14:23 |
| StyXman | SpeedEvil: sounds like a hacklab | 14:24 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah, that sort of thing, | 14:25 |
| SpeedEvil | doesn't work so well when in the sticks with no car though. | 14:25 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: | 15:30 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | now THAT's what I call a laserprinter: http://www.taufenbach.de/anwendungen/ | 15:35 |
| RST38h | Nahaaah | 15:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | >>Schneiden von Pappe:<< DAFAQ! | 15:37 |
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| RST38h | Doc: here is a question for you: http://www.dihalt2.nm.ru/main/pricol/laserrez.gif | 15:37 |
| RST38h | Doc: What was it? | 15:38 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | RST38h: nfc. A pattern to cover an area with continuous path as uniformly as possible? | 15:50 |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: nah, that would have to be an iterated step of a space-filling curve | 15:54 |
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| kerio | that spiky stuff can't fill shit | 15:54 |
| RST38h | Doc: Nope | 15:54 |
| RST38h | Doc: This is what the plastic tray looks like after you use it to cut cabbage for the salad. With an industrial laser cutter. | 15:55 |
| kerio | hahahaha | 15:55 |
| kerio | nice | 15:55 |
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| amospalla | guys, does media player sort songs by track number? | 16:58 |
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| amospalla | it seems it does, but for some reason, I assumed it didn't for some quite time :/ | 17:14 |
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| ShadowJK | It depends on Id3 tags, iirc | 17:27 |
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| amospalla | ShadowJK: it's all tagged, yes | 17:32 |
| amospalla | I tested it right now, and it does sort by track number (but does not show it) | 17:32 |
| kerio | it depends on what that POS tracker decided | 17:32 |
| ShadowJK | Iirc it doesn't sort properly if you've got an album in a directory, and numbered filenames | 17:34 |
| kerio | it doesn't sort properly if tracker decides to shit itself and fails to read correct Id3 tags | 17:36 |
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| ShadowJK | that too ;p | 17:38 |
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| peterx | Hi! I have some problem with my n900. I installed nitdroid, it worked quite well for some weeks, I was able to reboot to maemo several times. But now, the phone is in some kind of boot loop. Using flasher to boot other initrd images works, but I cannot get back to my old system. | 17:44 |
| peterx | the nokia logo appears and when it disappears, the phone seems to be off again | 17:45 |
| kerio | :s | 17:45 |
| kerio | *how* did you install nitdroid? | 17:45 |
| peterx | I used the auto-installer | 17:46 |
| peterx | could it be enough to re-flash some initrd image? | 17:46 |
| kerio | maemo doesn't use initrd | 17:46 |
| peterx | actually I am not sure if I know how the multiboot process actually works | 17:47 |
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| kerio | multiboot is a piece of crap | 17:47 |
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| peterx | can I replace it using flasher? | 17:47 |
| kerio | peterx: did you uninstall the stock kernel modules in your fremantle install? | 17:48 |
| peterx | kerio: I am not sure | 17:48 |
| kerio | did you install a different kernel? | 17:48 |
| peterx | kerio: there were some errors regarding conflicting packages | 17:48 |
| peterx | I am not sure which package ended up installed at the end, but I think I replaced it | 17:48 |
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| kerio | peterx: how "much" can you boot now? | 17:49 |
| peterx | kerio: anything that is loaded from flasher | 17:49 |
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| kerio | and nothing else? | 17:50 |
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| peterx | kerio: nothing else | 17:50 |
| kerio | fun | 17:50 |
| kerio | try flashing the kernel | 17:50 |
| peterx | also it seems that the backlight is not always turned on | 17:50 |
| peterx | which one? | 17:50 |
| kerio | flasher-3.5 -F COMBINED.bin --flash-only=kernel -f | 17:50 |
| kerio | the one from COMBINED | 17:51 |
| kerio | (aka the stock one) | 17:51 |
| kerio | peterx: also note that nitdroid-installer is a piece of shit | 17:53 |
| peterx | kerio: I only wonder why it worked so lang | 17:56 |
| peterx | long | 17:56 |
| peterx | maemo also reported some issues with faulty memory | 17:56 |
| peterx | when connecting it via usb | 17:56 |
| peterx | so perhaps it is the flash wearing out?? | 17:56 |
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| kerio | can you pastebin the actual output from flasher? | 17:57 |
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| peterx | kerio: sure | 18:01 |
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| peterx | kerio: ok, most of the information is about the image. the flashing process only says 1705 kB and "done" | 18:04 |
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| peterx | kerio: ah great, at least the menu appears now | 18:04 |
| kerio | multiboot is also a huge piece of crap | 18:05 |
| peterx | kerio: ah, it's back from the dead! | 18:06 |
| peterx | thank you very much | 18:06 |
| peterx | ! | 18:06 |
| kerio | backup your data and do a full reflash, really | 18:07 |
| peterx | kerio: hm, I rather backup my data and move to a different phone | 18:09 |
| kerio | you mean move to a phone | 18:10 |
| freemangordon | :D | 18:10 |
| kerio | unless you were actually using android | 18:10 |
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| peterx | using android as a phone on the n900 is the only thing that does not work... | 18:12 |
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| freemangordon | ~seen ivgalvez | 18:26 |
| infobot | ivgalvez <~ivgalvez@89.140.113.138.static.user.ono.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 23h 19m 1s ago, saying: 'speak later'. | 18:26 |
| freemangordon | nice :( | 18:26 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | yoh | 20:04 |
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| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: Can you tell me how to install scratchbox? It seems that scratchbox.org is offline. What Can I do? :/ | 20:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ouch | 20:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | get a vmware image | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ther should be one rather outdated one I think | 20:28 |
| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: on vmware image I can't compile ruby - processor/core/module? error | 20:28 |
| spoofy | Yeah it's on ubuntu 10.04 lts | 20:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | or ask merlin1991or thedead1440 or crahsanddie/teotwaki if they got mirrors | 20:29 |
| spoofy | I want to give a christmas gift to maemo users.. | 20:29 |
| spoofy | http://thecust.net/nelisquare/hathor-sdk/ < This is the only mirror I can find | 20:30 |
| spoofy | but It's not "mirror" it's a backup of scratchbox | 20:30 |
| spoofy | and it's not working with apt to install from script | 20:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ask the pretty active guys around CSSU, they might have a solution, esp merlin1991 | 20:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Pali, freemangordon | 20:32 |
| * spoofy pokes merlin1991 | 20:32 | |
| spoofy | Ok. I'll do that ;) | 20:32 |
| spoofy | thx btw. | 20:32 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm just drowning in stuff on my dish, regarding all this maemo et al migration & backup / mirroring & continued services topic | 20:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yw, thanks for bringing up the topic | 20:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's nearly impossible to pick up on all the loose ends | 20:34 |
| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: All existing services will be available after backup? | 20:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no matter where you look, everywhere stuff is dangling, loose, or already falling off the far end of the table | 20:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | spoofy: no idea, really | 20:35 |
| spoofy | I can pay for a hosting to help the community | 20:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | scratchbox for example is a pretty new and unclear construction site | 20:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | see fundraiser thread | 20:35 |
| spoofy | rly... It's extreme important to have all of this stuff | 20:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | *sigh* I'm aware of that | 20:36 |
| spoofy | I know that maemo 4< is dead right now but fremantle is not | 20:36 |
| spoofy | n900 is still a best (clearly based on debian) phone | 20:36 |
| spoofy | I beg of you - don't let the world end! | 20:37 |
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| spoofy | I have many sources to make and upload updated packages to extras-devel repo | 20:39 |
| spoofy | For example nmap, ruby, subversion, midori | 20:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=88222&highlight=fundraiser | 20:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | also join board about what's going on, oh wait you're supposed to do that via council (I.E. *me* :-o) | 20:43 |
| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: I'm not registred on forum yet (shame on me) | 20:44 |
| spoofy | I planned to do that after release of PPP | 20:44 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you don't need a registration to click that paypal link | 20:45 |
| spoofy | It's seems that you have a money to pay for hosting at next month. I don't have alot of money (I'm a polish student ;) ), but you can count on me for a small payment | 20:47 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | you can help with organisational stuff as well, keep track of what's backup'ed where, what's not backuped at all yet, and answer questions here or even on tmo (should work for another 6 days at least, and registration should be low-effort and fast) | 20:48 |
| spoofy | from TMO: "Good idea, i think the Jolla guys should be our most likely allies." I agree with that | 20:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, most of us do | 20:49 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | except ... nah, I'm not going to throw mud here | 20:49 |
| spoofy | Did someone contact with jolla guys about this stuff? | 20:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yes | 20:49 |
| spoofy | and? | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I mustn't (SIC!) talk about it | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and that's not jolla's fault | 20:50 |
| spoofy | uh :/ | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, somebody going a tiny bit nuts | 20:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, this is a open community, even jolla insists in that | 20:51 |
| spoofy | I know that mer/harmattan/sailfish is a whole another story but fremantle is a "father" | 20:52 |
| spoofy | of meego/mer etc. | 20:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | spoofy: just another thing on my plate, since it seems nobody else is willing to handle it in a sensible manner | 20:52 |
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| spoofy | Ugh.. I can only update most of critical stuff i.e. ruby and port other things to make fremantle still usable | 20:55 |
| spoofy | btw. I'm from arcean | 20:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nokia had a funny insane NDA policy. Seems some of the maemo 'entities' try to mimic Nokia in more than just this regard, and maybe even top it | 20:55 |
| RST38h | Doc: Haven't you figured it out since maemo.org times? | 20:56 |
| RST38h | Doc: For some people,creating policies is the only "contribution" they can make, the only accomplishment | 20:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | indeed, looks like you got a point there | 20:57 |
| RST38h | Doc: So they keep creating those, while everybody else scuttles to work around them | 20:57 |
| spoofy | that's true | 20:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well, when I got 2introduced" into council, it was made utterly clear to me that there is NO NDA whatsoever | 20:58 |
| spoofy | but I'm not right person to judge. | 20:58 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | so I'm pretty puzzled to hear that now other entities are actively pushing NDA crap | 20:59 |
| RST38h | what other entities? jolla? | 20:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | though those entities are as well a spawn of community | 20:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | *not* jolla! | 20:59 |
| spoofy | I prefer to do something first and THEN talk about it.. ugh nvm | 20:59 |
| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: just keep in faith and do not give up ;) | 21:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | lemme put it this way: in HF there's one or two layers too many | 21:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | lawyers :-d | 21:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | just like there been way too many lawyers involved into maemo.nokia.com | 21:02 |
| spoofy | if anyone will have some information about scratchbox PLEASE let me know | 21:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | merlin1991: ping ^^^^ | 21:02 |
| * DocScrutinizer05 mumbles "approaching *sponsors* with an NDA, what an utter nonsense" | 21:05 | |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | probably once more born from mere ignorance of RL practice in administration of stuff etc | 21:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, cya guys, it's solstice eve here | 21:10 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and I wasted the best hour of the evening for a council meeting that defacto didn't even happen | 21:11 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | balance for this week:: offered:2h/week for council work, spent:~25h this week | 21:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | most of it wasted though | 21:12 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: to be fair, the rest of the council seemed happy without you | 21:14 |
| kerio | or at least the HF board | 21:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | obviously | 21:14 |
| kerio | ohai spoofy | 21:15 |
| kerio | is your debian going well? | 21:15 |
| spoofy | kerio: hayo ;) | 21:15 |
| spoofy | my debian? I reinstall it to aptosid :D | 21:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's just that I'm not happy with the way the board performs right now, and I'm not the only one feeling like this | 21:16 |
| spoofy | Doc.. I just beg of you.. Don't let the maemo die.. | 21:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and for council it's not much better | 21:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | spoofy: I already shot most of my powder | 21:17 |
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| kerio | spoofy: it's not like your n900 is going to suddenly stop working though | 21:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | only so much I can do when other entities or persons don't play along | 21:17 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: yes it is | 21:18 |
| kerio | losing the maemo.org knowledge base would suck balls, ofc | 21:18 |
| spoofy | critical stuff is repositories, scratchbox | 21:18 |
| spoofy | then the forum and wiki stuff | 21:19 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: bit rot isn't that fast of a process | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | critical stuff is a list of stuff, first and foremost | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: you got NO idea | 21:19 |
| spoofy | kerio: my n900 is going well :) Yesterday I bought a DC-16 and new otterbox :) | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | see 'bitrot' of wiki | 21:19 |
| spoofy | nokia care replaced board after usb break | 21:19 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: see signing keys for repos | 21:20 |
| kerio | spoofy: watch out for the pieces of plastic that sit right below the keyboard, they're easily broken if you remove the otterbox carelessly | 21:20 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: see URLs suddently dangling | 21:20 |
| qwazix | spoofy, wow! New board from Nokia AND new otterbox! | 21:20 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: dangling urls? where? | 21:21 |
| kerio | :o | 21:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not yet, just a threat | 21:21 |
| spoofy | and new 16Gb 10class sdhc sandisk and I ordered new 1500mAh polarcell battery ;P ultimate setup | 21:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | due to happen maybe one week into the future | 21:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | though for scratchbox it's already true | 21:21 |
| kerio | spoofy: what are you going to use the uSD for? | 21:21 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it seems | 21:21 |
| spoofy | nvm kerio I already know that :) I broke my first otterbox like that :D | 21:22 |
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| qwazix | spoofy, both otterbox and usb fix from Nokia are considered miracles nowadays... | 21:22 |
| spoofy | kerio: few partitions i.e. fat, partition for truecrypt, partition for swap | 21:23 |
| spoofy | qwazix: my board was produced in 2012.11 ;) | 21:23 |
| kerio | spoofy: then you probably wanted an old class4 | 21:23 |
| kerio | class 10 uSDs suck at random I/O | 21:23 |
| spoofy | it seems that nokia order a few boards ;) | 21:23 |
| kerio | even sandisk ones | 21:23 |
| kerio | qwazix: i bought an otterbox brand new from amazon italy this summer | 21:24 |
| spoofy | kerio: ... <speechless> and you tellin me this NOW? Oh my god. | 21:24 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: you ever managed a server with high visibility, a lot of traffic, and quite a constant load of DoS attacks? | 21:24 |
| spoofy | Doc I do ;) | 21:24 |
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| * kerio whoises | 21:25 | |
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| qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, not really. Biggest server I've managed, news site, about 25000 visits/day | 21:25 |
| qwazix | no DoS attacks yet fortunately | 21:25 |
| spoofy | DoS attacks.. ugh kids gettin a botnets for a few BTC | 21:25 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: you really should talk to Reggie before volunteering for that particular job, then | 21:26 |
| spoofy | there's no chance to aware of that - even hardware ids like cisco don't help | 21:26 |
| qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, I just volunteered for doing the moving, not managing the new server | 21:27 |
| kerio | meh, buying a botnet for bitcoins | 21:27 |
| kerio | you can buy much better things with bitcoins | 21:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | haha, seems somebody at board got that pretty wrong then | 21:27 |
| qwazix | which according to board is not going to be needed so I'm dismissed | 21:27 |
| spoofy | yeah to make your own :P | 21:27 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kudos to board's technical expertise | 21:28 |
| qwazix | And I even did that reluctantly just because I felt it would be a shame if tmo was not moved just because nobody cared to do the move. | 21:28 |
| spoofy | qwazix: agree :) | 21:28 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | honestly I've got the terrible feeling that board is deciding on technical micromanagement with no experience *at all* in that domain | 21:29 |
| qwazix | Re tmo move, Reggie said will help do it so I'm pretty confident it will go well :) | 21:30 |
| qwazix | Don't know about the rest though. | 21:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Reggie said he wil help moving the database | 21:31 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not more | 21:31 |
| qwazix | Moving the files and redirecting the DNS shouldn't be anything terrible though. | 21:31 |
| spoofy | ugh.. mysqldump & cp.. | 21:32 |
| qwazix | yeah, that | 21:32 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | all the comments from board's site however prove they don't even know the difference between a vserver and a dedicated server, not to mention requirements of management vs managed servers | 21:32 |
| qwazix | AIUI they're moving everything to vservers until the boxes arrive at nemein | 21:33 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no, Nemein is doing that | 21:33 |
| qwazix | yes, that, my bad. | 21:33 |
| spoofy | I thought that maemo is intended for Linux users.. | 21:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | board is doing pretty much nothing regarding technical stuff, but tries micromanagement | 21:34 |
| qwazix | from there however there's no indication whether they'll just move the vm's onto the new boxes, or migrate services again | 21:34 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Nemein definitely won't move twice | 21:34 |
| qwazix | 'they' == whoever will do it | 21:35 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | so forget that stuff, Nemein moves the shite to the new boxen when installed (btw 2HE I heard, per box) | 21:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and then it's up to board | 21:36 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which in my book still doesn't feel really familiar with the whole problem | 21:36 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | and since they are not familiar with it, they can't ask the right questions to Nemein, just pestering them with "noob noise" | 21:38 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the professional admins I placed on the CC of that notorious mail, they got so pissed that they are even blaming me for that now | 21:39 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | while everybody inside this maemo "management" waterhead just ignored them completely | 21:39 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, I know such stuff from the 'inside a company' perspective | 21:40 |
| qwazix | I just don't think those things are done via commitee | 21:41 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | from that POV council and board are acting worse than worst users right now | 21:41 |
| qwazix | (in such a short time that is) | 21:41 |
| qwazix | Right thing to do is appoint one BoD member do the job. Only one person talks with pro admin which get's paid to oversee the migration, | 21:42 |
| qwazix | planning things with HF's interests in mind | 21:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: they are not meant to be done from inside any such commitee at all | 21:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | HF is here to delegate | 21:42 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | not to do micromanagement on technical stuff | 21:42 |
| qwazix | yes that (my english skills are already on vacation) | 21:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but they don't delegate at all, they oscillate between doing nothing and micromanagement | 21:43 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | where "doing nothing2 only means they probably do their lawyer talks during that time | 21:44 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I'm pretty sure their plate is more than full with organizational stuff for getting funds etc, and finding proper arrangements to delegate responsibilities | 21:45 |
| qwazix | it looks like my phone died from low battery :) | 21:45 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so they shouldn't talk to Nemein | 21:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | they should delegate that | 21:46 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but what they do is not even inviting anybody to eventually delegate that stuff to, to such talks | 21:47 |
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| qwazix | Million Dollar Question: We know the servers that are being bought, why is there no indication about the co-lo cost from Nemein? | 21:47 |
| spoofy | Doc: Again I beg of you.. Just hit someone who is responsible and DO NOT let the maemo die | 21:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | for Nemein as well as for my sysadmin friends and me that feels like we're doing 1st level help desk to a user called Hildon Foundation | 21:48 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | cya, my friend waiting for me | 21:49 |
| qwazix | bye | 21:49 |
| spoofy | cya | 21:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | spoofy: I'm not going to let maemo down, but again I'm not wonderwarthog, my powers are limited | 21:49 |
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| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: just.. Do what you can do best and keep in faith | 21:50 |
| spoofy | I can only make update's and port stuff to maemo to make it usable | 21:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | huh? how about taking a part time responsibility as a co-admin? | 21:51 |
| spoofy | and give a small donation | 21:51 |
| qwazix | Off Topic: how do you configure xchat to join after registering with nicserv? | 21:51 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | join channels? | 21:51 |
| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: I can help if there will be a problem. I can secure whole platform | 21:52 |
| qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, yep | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | spoofy: much appreciated, please mail me at joerg at openmoko dot org | 21:52 |
| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: I will ;) | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: longpress on channel tab (not in tree config) | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | add to favourites | 21:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | spoofy: rather: council at maemo dot org, CC <me> | 21:53 |
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| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: i think he wants to wait for identification before joining | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ooh | 21:53 |
| kerio | qwazix: login to the server with "user:pass" as the password | 21:53 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | yep | 21:54 |
| kerio | and hope the services change your host before you join | 21:54 |
| kerio | or use SASL | 21:54 |
| kerio | which is the shit | 21:54 |
| qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, already in favorites, but it joins freenode, then channels, then registers nick | 21:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | yeah | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I know | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | see kario's comment | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | user:password as server password is the trick | 21:54 |
| qwazix | will try that, thanks | 21:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | use your 'root' account name | 21:55 |
| qwazix | ok | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | which is qwazix as well, it seems | 21:55 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: you know you can change which one is your main one, right? | 21:55 |
| qwazix | yep | 21:55 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no I don't know that | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2012-12-21 20:55:28] [Notice] -NickServ- Information on qwazix (account qwazix): | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | [2012-12-21 20:56:23] [Notice] -NickServ- Information on kerio (account kerio): | 21:56 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | go change your account name please! ;-P | 21:56 |
| spoofy | DocScrutinizer05: ugh my mail client isn't working yet.. please mail me and describe all problems about servers and I'll see what I can do : spoofy at os dot pl ;) | 21:56 |
| kerio | why? | 21:56 |
| kerio | you're the weird one | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | as you claimed it can be done? | 21:57 |
| qwazix | Will the N900 charge faster on a 4A charger? | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | cya fellas | 21:57 |
| ShadowJK | qwazix; nope. | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ping me on DocScrutinizer51 | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if some emergency | 21:57 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: /ns set accountname | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | o.O | 21:57 |
| qwazix | ShadowJK, what's the max that it can take advantage of? | 21:57 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: thanks | 21:58 |
| kerio | B :) | 21:58 |
| kerio | B:) | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | qwazix: 1A | 21:58 |
| kerio | B) DEAL WITH IT | 21:58 |
| kerio | dammit you broke the combo | 21:58 |
| qwazix | DocScrutinizer05, thanks | 21:58 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer05: isn't it 1.1? | 21:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | kerio: more like 0.95 | 21:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | possibly less | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | but that doesn't make the world go down | 21:59 |
| ShadowJK | qwazix; the maximum power it will charge battery with is 4.2V 0.95A. | 21:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~0.95*4.2/5 | 22:00 |
| infobot | 0.798 | 22:00 |
| ShadowJK | So 5V/1A input should cover that fine | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ~0.95*4.2/5 / 0.8 | 22:00 |
| infobot | 0.9975 | 22:00 |
| qwazix | So if I plug it in an 4A charger, it will just use 0.95 right? | 22:00 |
| ShadowJK | yes | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | for 80% efficiency | 22:00 |
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| qwazix | No harm doing it? | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | no | 22:00 |
| ShadowJK | As long as it's 5V, no harm | 22:00 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | o/ | 22:01 |
| qwazix | \o | 22:01 |
| qwazix | ShadowJK, thanks. | 22:01 |
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| ShadowJK | AGPS data use for 3 hours: 300kbyte | 22:06 |
| ShadowJK | (gps active, indoors, only occasional gps fixes succeed) | 22:07 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | qwazix: use ZNC or another irc bouncer, and you're rid of that login problem | 22:25 |
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| * qwazix notes down to read about irc bouncers | 22:25 | |
| DocScrutinizer51 | do a /whois on my nick | 22:26 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | an irc bouncer is basically a proxy | 22:26 |
| qwazix | Yes, I see the result in the other tab, I suppose pratchett.freenode.net is the bouncer? | 22:28 |
| kerio | hm | 22:28 |
| kerio | ShadowJK: that's not a lot | 22:28 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | nope | 22:28 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | my bouncer runs on my lagrange server | 22:29 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | aka maemo cloud-7 de | 22:29 |
| qwazix | ok, that was my next guess :) | 22:29 |
| kerio | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vppbdf-qtGU ? | 22:29 |
| kerio | oh, not that la grange :( | 22:29 |
| qwazix | So you are always logged in there (cloud7), and you just access it from your pc? | 22:30 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | I access the bouncer from my n900 | 22:31 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | and the bouncer is always logged in | 22:31 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | and keeps backscroll for me | 22:31 |
| qwazix | sounds cool. | 22:31 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | it is cool | 22:32 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | see PM | 22:32 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | query | 22:32 |
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