IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2012-05-14

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DocScrutinizer(which expands to:)
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GeneralAntillesJaffa, OK.00:35
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tgalalMohammadAG: u there?00:48
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DocScrutinizerhey GeneralAntilles o/00:52
MohammadAGtgalal, yeah, heading to bed though00:53
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DocScrutinizerGeneralAntilles: if you're short on topics for MWKN, the current move to a "cssu-extras repo" of some sort might be interesting, incl tomorrow's 1800UTC meeting on #maemo-ssu01:01
GeneralAntillesI don't have enough coherence tonight to add articles.01:02
GeneralAntillesSunday is the worst possible night for me to be doing MWKN01:02
GeneralAntillesIt's my Friday in more ways than one.01:03
DocScrutinizerwell, anyway I'd appreciate you joining meeting tomorrow :-D01:03
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GeneralAntillesWhat, you want me to troll? :P01:05
DocScrutinizeryour trolling is magnitudes better than some other seriously meant contribution01:06
GeneralAntillesI'm putting that on my tombstone.01:07
* DocScrutinizer hands a Friday evening drink to GeneralAntilles01:08
GeneralAntillesI wish!01:08
* GeneralAntilles is on cold medicine instead.01:08
DocScrutinizerdamn, get well soon01:09
GeneralAntillesWeek.5 now.01:09
DocScrutinizerI know that, seems I had same shite01:09
GeneralAntillesIt's everywhere.01:09
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DocScrutinizerGeneralAntilles: OT, shall I get T60 ( or C-29 ( ?01:12
GeneralAntillesYou really want to lug a Toughbook around?01:13
DocScrutinizererr CF-2901:13
DocScrutinizerwhen I really do lug some laptop around, then I prefer a toughbook01:13
GeneralAntillesI'd get the Lenovo, personally.01:14
GeneralAntillesBut I don't abuse my devices very much.01:14
DocScrutinizerthat'S the point01:14
DocScrutinizerme neither01:14
GeneralAntillesAlmost half the price.01:14
GeneralAntillesSo if you break it you can just get another one. :P01:14
DocScrutinizerthis laptop here is home for spiders, despite I'm using it 24/701:15
DocScrutinizerit never really moves01:15
GeneralAntillesWhy not get: ?01:15
DocScrutinizeris it "better" than the T60? regarding build quality etc. Or at least same?01:16
GeneralAntillesHrm, good question.01:17
GeneralAntillesShould be the same build quality.01:18
DocScrutinizerdo you by any chance know if it's glossy screen or matte screen01:20
GeneralAntillesThinkWiki doesn't say.01:22
DocScrutinizerwell, seems it's matte01:29
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GeneralAntillesieatlint, lintblog is your blog!01:31
* GeneralAntilles epiphanies.01:31
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DocScrutinizerthough >>1680x1050 Pixel, WSXGA TFT, Samsung LTN154P3-L02 Panel,<< ( vs >>1280 x 800 WXGA<<  on that pc-topline page. GPU also differs. WTF?!01:33
GeneralAntillesYeah, the resolution kinda sucks.01:35
GeneralAntillesLooks like it's the base model.01:36
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DocScrutinizermhm, yeah02:01
DocScrutinizeranyway, looks good. And allegedly good linux support02:02
DocScrutinizerI think it's t500 then02:02
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muellis3uh. Can't connect to (Connection refused)02:32
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Muellik. back up again. Probably logrotate HUPping the Apache...02:36
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Sc0rpiusI just noticed that new Xephyr doesn't work with scratchbox.03:34
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Sc0rpiusI had to dig an older version :S03:35
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LaoLang_coolhi, how to let the notification for sms not grouped in one10:05
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* merlin1991 can't find the wiki page with the allowed user sections for maemo :/10:57
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LaoLang_coolHi, how to let the sms notification not group into one?11:45
LaoLang_coolnot be grouped into one11:45
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ShadowJKthere's no setting for that11:49
LaoLang_coolShadowJK, I have a feeling that it's configureable, maybe need some config file editing11:51
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DocScrutinizernot afaik12:06
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DocScrutinizerwe recently checked how grouping is done, it's a function of notifier itself basically12:06
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LaoLang_coo_DocScrutinizer, hmm, so sad..12:09
DocScrutinizersee phone-control wikipage12:10
DocScrutinizeryou however might want to strings the relevant plugin, maybe find a gconf key not publicly known12:11
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DocScrutinizerps delivers /usr/sbin/sms-manager, /usr/sbin/csd -m -p call -p gprs -p info -p net -p sim -p simpb -p sms -p ss12:12
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MohammadAGDocScrutinizer: You can break grouping12:42
DocScrutinizerenlighten us, oh master :-D12:43
MohammadAGSomewhere there there's a comfig12:44
MohammadAGCan you ls all those dirs and pastebin?12:45
merlin1991hm omp update /me reads changelog12:45
DocScrutinizerI ought mention you're obviously the master of notification:
MohammadAGls /etc/hildon-* | pastebinit12:45
MohammadAGAnyone? merlin1991? :p12:49
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merlin1991sry mag12:50
merlin1991THIS API HAS BEEN DISABLED. Please use Pastebin's new API.
* merlin1991 facepalms12:50
merlin1991seems the pastebinit package in -devel needs an update12:50
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merlin1991also DAFUQ since when does pastebin have a login?12:51
merlin1991MohammadAG:  ^^12:52
MohammadAGmerlin1991: Pastebin notification-groups.conf12:53
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer: Remove Group=_grouped_messages12:55
MohammadAGLaoLang_coo_: ^12:55
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MohammadAGmerlin1991: Y U NO HV SOCIALITY12:58
MohammadAGAnd gpodder12:58
merlin1991afaik I do have sociality12:58
MohammadAGWe modify that file12:58
MohammadAGHmm, pastebin notifications.conf12:59
merlin1991ah yeah only have sociality on my n9 :D12:59
merlin1991and nope I don't need gpodder :D12:59
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: you da man!13:01
MohammadAGOh and destination13:01
DocScrutinizer(pastebinit)  netcat 123413:01
MohammadAGThat overlays the WM_Class with the nane13:02
MohammadAGWindow with WM_class name13:02
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: wtf [sms-message-class-0] ??13:05
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer: Random name13:05
MohammadAGIdk, it's the way they implement sounds13:06
MohammadAGFucked up but yeah...13:06
ieatlintGeneralAntilles: yes, yes it is13:07
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DocScrutinizerstill need notifications.conf?13:08
MohammadAGOnly for a memory refresh13:08
MohammadAGI thought I was modifying that13:08
DocScrutinizersee your query13:09
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* DocScrutinizer idly wonders how many N900 are available via RDP13:11
* DocScrutinizer ponders to link his 3rd device to for public ssh access13:12
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MohammadAGSadly there's no .d directoru13:16
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: reverse ssh tunnel magic?13:16
DocScrutinizermerlin1991: yes, that's what I thought of13:16
merlin1991and then crate a user on maemo.could.... that is just allowed to run a command (n900access or whatever)13:17
merlin1991which builds a ssh tunnel into your device?13:17
DocScrutinizerI could even create a dedicated subdomain, like, and have a CNAME for it13:19
MohammadAGthp's mini rant
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DocScrutinizerI don't like to publish dyndns name of my local IP13:20
MohammadAGErr, abill_uk13:21
MohammadAGNot egoshin, sorry egoshin13:21
merlin1991Removing all DKMS Modules13:21
* merlin1991 starts to wonder if apt-get upgrade was such a good idea after all13:21
MohammadAGDebian way of kernel modules13:21
MohammadAGThey'll be rebuilt in postinst later13:22
merlin1991it's the nvidia package :D13:22
merlin1991and it appears to be stuck13:22
MohammadAGIt's how I suggested modules on maemo13:22
MohammadAGBut there's no gcc to build with13:22
DocScrutinizera PITA13:23
MohammadAGmerlin1991: Don't kill it13:23
DocScrutinizerand in my book an overkill as well13:23
merlin1991MohammadAG: no worries I'm patient13:23
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merlin1991I think it's time I roll my own dist for maemo dev13:24
merlin1991buntkuh is starting to annoy me big time13:24
MohammadAGI wish I could have the latest cores of Ubuntu with gnome 213:25
* DocScrutinizer coughs a bit, and curses the realization that adding complexity results in chaos, and chaos creates virus eventually13:25
MohammadAGI have nothing against unity13:26
DocScrutinizerbuntkuh, MOOOO13:26
MohammadAGOnly the person who decided it was mature enough to ship13:26
DocScrutinizershoot Shuttleworth13:26
MohammadAGOr better, the person who made the decision that users will like Ubuntu more13:26
DocScrutinizer(or whatever his name)13:26
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jacekowskiMohammadAG: ubuntu seems to be user hostile13:27
jacekowskiMohammadAG: using nouveau drivers by default13:27
merlin1991nouveau drivers are awesome :D13:27
DocScrutinizerbuntkuh is a brainfuck, by design13:27
merlin1991with my card they change into a mode above the monitor resolution13:27
merlin1991perfect :/13:27
MohammadAGYeah, me too :D13:27
MohammadAGIt actually scrolls though13:28
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: I don't see how it's so brainfuck by design13:28
merlin1991it is linux kernel + xorg + kde13:28
MohammadAGIt wasn't at some point13:28
merlin1991and no kernel + wayland + unity :D13:28
MohammadAGThat's kubuntu13:28
DocScrutinizerall taken as hostages by Shuttleworth, then abused13:28
merlin1991MohammadAG: buntkuh is kubuntu ;)13:28
MohammadAGNo, buntkuh is Ubuntu :p13:28
MohammadAGOh wayland13:29
DocScrutinizeris there a big difference?13:29
DocScrutinizerbot crap13:29
MohammadAGWhen will it replace X13:29
MohammadAGI'm so excited to break X13:29
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: though give me the alternative with apt based package management, and recent software / drivers13:30
merlin1991and kde / gnome2 :D13:30
DocScrutinizerwtf apt13:30
DocScrutinizerdiff yum aptitude ->files don't differ13:30
MohammadAGApt is not mandatory on a Debian system13:30
StyXmanMohammadAG: debian is a little behing in kde releases right now :(13:31
merlin1991MohammadAG: debian is also a little behind other realeases13:31
MohammadAGDebian packages are always behind really13:31
MohammadAGAs I said13:31
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merlin1991on debian I get no sound or 3d accel unless I roll my own13:31
MohammadAGUbuntu core + gnome 2 = heaven13:31
merlin1991so my requirements: apt, recent, proper window system are only met by kubuntu :/13:31
k273Linux Mint merlin1991 ?13:32
MohammadAGOr Ubuntu with gnome 2?13:32
merlin1991I could try mint one day, but I fear it's going to be even worse than buntkuh :D13:32
DocScrutinizermerlin1991: I really don't see rationale behind dpkg vs rpm wars13:33
DocScrutinizerin the end the UI is same for both13:33
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: quite simply I need apt in order todo what I want todo13:34
merlin1991thus no rpm :D13:34
DocScrutinizerhell, I even heard aptitude can use rpm as well13:34
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merlin1991if there were proper rpm packages for the stuff I use I'd use rpm13:34
DocScrutinizermerlin1991: that's a moot argument13:34
merlin1991I don't prefer on over the other13:34
DocScrutinizerI need apt because I want apt13:34
merlin1991I need apt because I use stuff that needs apt :D13:35
psycho_oreosalien ftw13:35
merlin1991alien only drives me crazy13:35
DocScrutinizeralien or buntkuh and shuttleworth madness, your choice13:35
MohammadAGUser preference13:36
DocScrutinizerhonestly the only valid reason you *need* to use apt is you want to develop an apt patch13:37
DocScrutinizerI even managed to install maemo SB on a RPM system13:37
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k273and why call it buntkuh?13:40
merlin1991k273: kuh is german for cow ;)13:40
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DocScrutinizerand bunt == colored/checkered13:40
merlin1991and alien is a tool to make rpm packages out of debs and vice versa13:40
k273ah I remember alien, yeah13:40
k273checkered cow lol13:41
DocScrutinizertbh I don't care at all if a new system/distri is rpm or deb now. Things like sysV-init / upstart / systemd matter way more to me -  i strongly despise the latter 213:42
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merlin1991imo upstart is even worse than systemd :D13:42
merlin1991though I still like the elegance of the openelec boot system13:43
merlin1991just shellscripts that properly source a few base settings and then start everything :)13:43
DocScrutinizerwell, sounds like sysV13:44
MohammadAGUpstart isn't that bad13:44
DocScrutinizeryeah, see maemo13:44
MohammadAGBoots fine :p13:45
merlin1991MohammadAG: systemd and sysV-init also boot fine13:45
DocScrutinizerinitctl --help ->Report bugs to <>13:45
Hurrianwait, is systemd being ported to maemo?13:45
merlin1991Hurrian: no worries:D13:45
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merlin1991not enough manpower to hold DocScrutinizer back whilst we do that in cssu ;)13:45
DocScrutinizerHurrian: no way :-)13:46
Hurrian(side note, Ubuntu maintainers don't like systemd, they've spent too much time on their upstart)13:46
DocScrutinizerand poettering never would use upstart and fix the few things he doesn't like with it - NIH13:47
DocScrutinizersame way he didn't fix ALSA13:47
infobot'sth is poettering' means it acts invasive, possessive, destructive, and generally in an egocentric exacerbating negative way. ``this cancer is extremely poettering''13:47
* DocScrutinizer suspects lennart poetering doesn't know how to read manpages, so prefers to write stuff new himself13:48
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DocScrutinizerbtw merlin1991, systemd definitely doesn't boot so fine13:53
DocScrutinizeropenmoko SHR revently adopted systemd, and since then we got all sorts of hickups in boot ;-)13:54
merlin1991quite possibly you did some configuration wrong ;)13:54
DocScrutinizeryeah, and debugging that is real fun in systemd13:54
LaoLang_coo_MohammadAG, thank you!13:54
DocScrutinizerindeed, weldone MohammadAG13:55
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: dunno debugging upstart is pita aswell13:55
DocScrutinizerno doubt13:55
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merlin1991never had to debug sysV-init yet, so nfc there13:55
DocScrutinizer~hail sysV init13:55
* infobot bows down to sysV init and chants, "I'M NOT WORTHY!!"13:55
MohammadAGLaoLang_coo_: Remove destination too:)13:55
MohammadAGAnd you're welcome13:55
LaoLang_coo_MohammadAG, remove destination? what does it mean? My english is poor ;p13:56
MohammadAGDestination= line in the config file under sms-message13:57
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LaoLang_coo_MohammadAG, oh, got it, I've removed all Group=_grouped_messages in that file, and I can't find my config file has any Destination line..14:17
LaoLang_coo_oh, my mistake..14:18
LaoLang_coo_I don't know what's the use of Desination line?14:18
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: you don't want to remove _all_ Group=_grouped_messages, just for sms or whatever it's been you were about to tweak14:22
DocScrutinizera secion is from one [some-header] to [next-header]14:22
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: for sms you want to edit section [sms-message]14:23
DocScrutinizer[missed-call]  might be another candidate for user tweaking, to get a separate notification for each missed call14:25
LaoLang_coo_DocScrutinizer, I don't think group notification is usefule for me :)14:25
LaoLang_coo_I want to see all notification seperately14:26
LaoLang_coo_What does Destination line do? I don't understand the line14:26
DocScrutinizerwell, for e.g. [chat-message] it might get messy14:26
DocScrutinizerit seems Destination somehow links the notification to a window14:26
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG should know details, I guess14:27
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: for [chat-message] this will raise a notifier aiui14:28
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: and this another one14:28
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: and a third14:28
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: not sure if that's what you actually want14:29
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: you probably can't find any time to answer, from all that notifier closing you have to do14:30
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: :-D14:30
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MohammadAGDestination overlays the notification on the window14:32
MohammadAGWithout it, the messaging app would be open but the notification would show next to it14:33
LaoLang_coo_thank you all, you're all gurus!14:34
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DocScrutinizerawesome: >>Destination=FIXME  <<14:35
DocScrutinizermoo chem|st14:35
* chem|st throws some BBQed steaks into channel14:36
chem|stdrop a cheesy sausage in a closed gas griller and you get an instant smoker^^14:36
DocScrutinizercheesy sausage - perverted14:38
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chem|stis there some better than panucci for listening to audiobooks?14:40
chem|stDocScrutinizer: one of nine...14:41
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chem|stDocScrutinizer: I think my n900 is now becoming wheatbeer'hickups... every now and then some applications crash, the maps-upgrade failed several times... any ideas despise reflashing14:44
MohammadAGchem|st: Mind pullimg the plug on
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DocScrutinizerchem|st: umm, maybe flushing14:46
chem|stMohammadAG: pulled14:47
chem|stDocScrutinizer: another suitable idea...14:47
MohammadAGTime of death 2:4714:47
* chem|st runs to toilet and tries flushing it...14:47
chem|stConfirming death at 2:47, he's dead Jim14:48
chem|stMohammadAG: it still bothers me that you or even someone like you is after wazzup14:49
DocScrutinizerchem|st: seriously, rinse it thoroughly again, distilled water, then 99% ethanol14:49
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DocScrutinizerthen dry for a week14:49
chem|stDocScrutinizer: I doubt it... it was working flawlessly for about a year now14:49
DocScrutinizerchem|st: get a spare, they're rather cheap now, used ones on fleabay14:50
chem|stDocScrutinizer: fleabay or ebay? I don't want to order from some ozzy flea-market14:51
DocScrutinizerbtw, I all of a sudden recall a fixing procedure I did in a NE555 in a automotive wiper interval module: heat the whole chip with soldering iron for 10..15s (probably evaporates humidity that might have gone in thru cracks in chip case), then spray the whole chip with oil while it's still hot14:52
DocScrutinizerfixed the wiper interval for another ~3 years, then I sold the car14:53
DocScrutinizermight still work today ;-D - or the car is square meanwhile14:54
DocScrutinizerOpel btw14:55
MohammadAGchem|st: After? I have an iPhone so I don't _need_ Wazapp14:56
MohammadAGI have whatsapp thougj14:56
DocScrutinizerchem|st: you probably know better than me if silicon oil or mineral oil is better suited for that14:56
chem|stDocScrutinizer: "acid-free"14:57
DocScrutinizersure thing14:57
DocScrutinizerI'm wary re silicon oil, maybe it is a sovent to the silicon chip?14:58
DocScrutinizersolvent even14:58
DocScrutinizerlike mineral oil is to plastics14:58
StyXmansolvent green!14:58
StyXmansorry, it won't happen again...14:59
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chem|stmost oils for textile machinery or suitable should do15:00
DocScrutinizernobody _needs_ wazapp15:03
chem|stsynthetic, oxidation stable, acid-free ~ "nähmaschinenöl"15:03
chem|stDocScrutinizer: nobody sane wants wazapp15:03
DocScrutinizerI don't even want to recall what it actually _is_15:03
chem|stnobody sane wants apple products without a "power" in its name15:03
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chem|stthose 80% apple fanatics whom need apple products for confidence in/and their circle of friends are poor creatures, the 20% buying it for reasonable facts include 2% reliable and 18% just to do not know better...15:07
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer: Some people here can't afford credit for SMS15:07
MohammadAGThey use PAYG so don't have a data plan15:07
MohammadAGAnd some of those have an S40 device15:08
chem|stMohammadAG: some people need to realise that facebook-apps like birthday-calendar are things not replacing things but being additional garbadge so is whatsUp15:08
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chem|stMohammadAG: what is payg?15:09
MohammadAGPay as you go15:09
MohammadAGThey use free wifi spots to use whatsapp15:09
chem|stin terms of that you want something using even less bandwidth than whatsapp15:09
MohammadAGThey don't have data15:10
MohammadAGAnd why not FBchat? MSN? Skype?15:10
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chem|sticq? or anyother BLINGBLING*shit15:10
MohammadAGFB chat is XMPP, there's no easy way to set it up and have it always running on a Symbian fevice15:11
MohammadAGThey all suck on Symbian15:11
MohammadAGSkype sucks battery life15:11
chem|stany jabber client will do15:11
chem|stand don't tell there arent any good jabber clients for s4015:11
MohammadAGAny jabber client sucks on Symbian chem|st15:12
MohammadAGOn an N900 you argument is valid15:12
TermanaSymbian sucks15:12
TermanaEnd of story15:12
DocScrutinizerwell, does this relate to the fact Symbian sucks, by any chance?15:12
MohammadAGThat sums it up nicely15:12
DocScrutinizerTermana: :-D15:12
chem|stTermana: thanks for your enlightement... wanna bring hitler into play too?15:12
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TermanaDon't be an angry nazi15:13
chem|stthank you!15:13
MohammadAGSo anyway back on subject15:13
MohammadAGWhatsapp is always connected when there's a connection15:14
MohammadAGIt always runs in the background15:14
DocScrutinizerI guess this wazap thing is like skype or twitter: there are better concepts since ages, but the unwashed masses aren't aware and nobody and nothing will make them reconsider now15:14
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chem|sthow about writing a good reliable jabber client for s40 instead of wazzup for Qt?15:15
MohammadAGBetter concepts? It is XMPP15:15
chem|stDocScrutinizer: +115:15
MohammadAGYou could say whatsapp is the best XMPP client15:15
chem|stMohammadAG: that is not the concept15:15
chem|stdoes it support FB gmail i++?15:16
MohammadAGThat's locked to one server15:16
MohammadAGPlus the concept of using phone numbers as usernames made it easier for people to connect15:17
chem|stone client to serve them all, on my shitty old sony, on my beauty n900... and the successor...15:17
chem|stMohammadAG: oh nice... why not use real names and birthdates?15:18
MohammadAGCause theres a shitload of John Smiths around the world15:18
DocScrutinizerthere's also a shitload of companies around the world that pay really good for approved real phonenumbers they can spam with SMS and unsolicited phonecalls15:19
chem|stMohammadAG: lol, I don't want any shitty software firm to know all my inner guts why should I want them to know my phonenumber?15:20
MohammadAGThen don't use it15:20
chem|stthought you might get it...15:20
DocScrutinizerjust like googles "does no evil" - right?15:20
MohammadAGI'm forced to use it cause it's the only way to talk to certain people for me15:21
chem|stMohammadAG: make them use other clients if they want to talk to you!15:21
LaoLang_coo_any one could provide a vim73 for maemo?15:21
DocScrutinizerwell, for me those people aren't worth talking to15:21
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DocScrutinizerjust like those morons that send me .doc15:21
MohammadAGThere are no other clients on their platform15:21
DocScrutinizermy fault?15:22
MohammadAGNo, but it's not mine or theirs15:22
chem|stI know I cannot get any of those lazy basterds to hop on an IRC channel if not providing a "click here and you are in" solution, but a jabber client should be possible?15:22
chem|stMohammadAG: speaking of s40 right?15:23
MohammadAGThat and S6015:23
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chem|sthow about bombus?15:24
DocScrutinizerLaoLang_coo_: what's vim73 ?15:24
MohammadAGBasically whatsapp on s60 is like empathy on the n90015:24
MohammadAGTelepathy even15:25
chem|stI used that about 5 years ago and it was usable even on dumbphones15:25
ruskieLaoLang_coo_, iirc vim is already available15:25
MohammadAGI'm not sure what that is but I guarantee it:15:25
MohammadAGOOM kills it15:25
MohammadAGDoesn't auto start15:25
MohammadAGDoesn't switch connections sanely15:25
chem|stMohammadAG: then add up its GPLed15:26
LaoLang_coo_DocScrutinizer, vim.org15:26
LaoLang_coo_ruskie, yes, but it's version 72, not 7315:26
MohammadAGAnd that means people can edit it15:26
ruskieLaoLang_coo_, so?15:26
MohammadAGYet they don't15:26
LaoLang_coo_73 has some features interesting15:27
LaoLang_coo_that 72 hasn't15:27
DocScrutinizerisn't it amazing how this works every single time? provide some shitty service where losers can get something for "free", some morons happily use it and put pressure on all their peer groups to jump on the train as well15:27
ruskieDocScrutinizer, only if you let it?15:28
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TermanaReplace "service" with device and it starts to sound like the N950, N9 and the Maemo community.15:28
DocScrutinizerI personally don't. I e.g. removed skype from all my boxes15:29
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DocScrutinizerTermana: indeed15:29
HurrianDocScrutinizer, only for one year, apparently15:29
DocScrutinizerHurrian: "free"? sure, those basterds wanna make big money, that'S the whole purpose15:30
MohammadAGHurrian: Reregistering clears the timer I think15:30
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: OOH? how so, if you're registering with you plain real phone number?15:30
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Hurriani don't really get the point of whatsapp and bbm, you pay for it + mobile data15:30
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MohammadAGDocScrutinizer: The server doesn't keep track15:31
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Hurrianthe thing that makes people buy blackberries and deal with the shit software15:31
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MohammadAGWhich is stupid but...15:31
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: haha again15:31
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: they can change that any time, and they _will_, as soon as their user pool reached critical mass15:33
Hurrianone of two things happen: people who become so attached to it deal with the changes (see bookFace) or 2, mass user exodus15:34
Hurrian(see myspace, etc)15:34
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer: It has reached critical mass already15:34
MohammadAGThey make money from the one time iOS paynent15:35
HurrianMohammadAG: depends what country you're in15:35
MohammadAGWhatsapp costs 1.99 on the iPhone15:35
chem|stmy sister mentioned ' and if you don't pay after 12 month your abook is gone...' she ment just empty as you did not pay for whatsapp so it destroys your previously downloaded abook on your phone and only after you payed you get it back!15:35
MohammadAGThe app15:35
chem|stMohammadAG: it hasn't15:35
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MohammadAGThat's not true15:36
MohammadAGWhatsapp only reads the abook15:36
chem|stthat was a selffullfilling promise15:36
DocScrutinizerOOOH GREAT!15:36
MohammadAGchem|st: Android right?15:36
DocScrutinizerplease delete my addr from all your devices - IMMEDIATELY!15:36
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chem|stMohammadAG: pls elaborate15:37
chem|stI'm no android but you just talk like you became one15:37
MohammadAGI'm talking about whatsapp not deleting contacts15:38
chem|stwhat do you mean by 14:36 < MohammadAG> chem|st: Android right?15:38
MohammadAGIf it does it faces a lawsuit15:38
chem|stit was a joke my sister did a few days ago when we talked about whatsapp15:38
MohammadAGIf it ever did its on android because of the borked sync system15:38
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DocScrutinizerwell, just another spyware, just like facebook15:39
chem|stnothin' to worrie but as you mention it iOS sync system is as reliable as a cat between feeding times15:39
MohammadAGiOS doesn't sync15:40
DocScrutinizerfsckng getting invitation SPAM as some moron uploaded his adrbook with my addr in it15:40
MohammadAGWell, not with apps anyway15:40
chem|stMohammadAG: why the hell does it read your addressbook? to automagically connect all people in it? I DO NOT WANT THAT15:41
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DocScrutinizerchem|st: facebook does exactly that as well (iirc it was facebook)15:41
chem|stMohammadAG: it doesn't exactly15:41
DocScrutinizerand of course google15:42
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chem|stDocScrutinizer: if you upload your addressbook yes! google+ does that aswell as soon as possible15:42
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: did you eat my voting token? :D15:42
merlin1991or when should they get sent out? :D15:42
MohammadAGchem|st: It asks for permission you know15:42
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MohammadAGWazapp for example doesn't auto sync15:43
chem|stfor every single entry?15:43
DocScrutinizerwe are about to check things:
povbotBug 12612: Community Council election process isn't working at all15:43
MohammadAGchem|st: No, for the abook15:43
chem|stwell without syncing what happens?15:43
chem|styou enter numbers by hand?15:44
MohammadAGYou can receive messages and provably add contacts nanuallu15:44
chem|stbut if my mother uploaded her abook she will be notified that I am on, right?15:45
DocScrutinizer"may I help you to keep your addrbook safe? (see [ ]yes, [ ]no, I don't mind you doing it, so go ahead"15:45
chem|stor I will get a request at least15:45
MohammadAGNot notified no, Viber does that15:45
MohammadAGBut if she clicks on your contact you'll be on15:45
MohammadAGYes, Viber notifies you about new contacts15:46
chem|stok there goes your best implementation15:46
MohammadAGViber is WhatsApp for voice15:46
DocScrutinizerone big ripoff for morons - sorry, of course except those listening15:47
MohammadAGAlbeit less stable and keeps a copy of your abook with names on their servers15:47
chem|stMohammadAG: you do know that there is no reason to have 2 programs for that?!15:47
MohammadAGchem|st: Yes15:47
chem|ststrike 215:47
chem|stMohammadAG: please go ahead15:48
MohammadAGAnd to maje it worse Viber uses a custom voice engine15:48
MohammadAGNot modified VoIP15:48
teotwakiwtf, that sentence didn't parse.15:48
MohammadAGThey use their own protocol15:48
chem|stteotwaki: which?15:48
teotwaki"to maje it worse"15:48
teotwakioh, make15:48
chem|stMohammadAG: to save live streams?15:48
merlin1991DocScrutinizer: gotta love your comment re council on irc on the bugreport :D15:49
MohammadAGThey keep a record of phone calls15:49
DocScrutinizerteotwaki: enable autocorrection!15:49
teotwakiDocScrutinizer: I write my documents using LaTeX, d'you really think I use autocorrect?15:49
chem|ststrike 3 you are OUT!15:49
chem|stcan we close the chapter "WhatsApp" now?15:49
DocScrutinizerteotwaki: each human brain is using autocorrect all the time, on all channels15:50
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DocScrutinizerexcept yours ;-P15:50
teotwakiOh, and if anyone here still writes their documents with Word or OpenOffice, you need to stop. Right now. Grab LyX, or learn basic LaTeX. You'll thank me later.15:50
MohammadAGThere's also voxer for a PTT over Internet15:50
merlin1991teotwaki:  LaTeX sounds dirty ;)15:51
MohammadAGI use echo "crap" > file teotwaki15:51
chem|stteotwaki: a word in proper length and starting and closing silb matching a "real-word"..."should" get corrected by your brains15:51
chem|stteotwaki: I tex my CV ever since15:52
teotwakiMohammadAG: you just wrote "crap teotwaki" to the `file` file.15:52
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chem|steven my CV15:52
teotwakiMohammadAG: yes.15:52
* teotwaki kicks Termana15:53
teotwakilong time no see, T.15:53
chem|stI bet MohammadAG dropped on to console to test15:53
teotwaki(fyi, it's crashanddie)15:53
MohammadAGchem|st: I'm testing it in my head15:54
Termanateotwaki, ahh, right.15:54
TermanaI was wondering weather I really knew you or not15:54
MohammadAGTo me it seems that I had to use echo crap > file << teotwaki15:54
chem|stteotwaki: why teh altered nick?15:54
teotwakiguess I got bored.15:54
teotwakiof the old one.15:54
MohammadAGToo much bad luck15:55
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: I guess that won't work at all15:55
MohammadAGThen how does EOF work?15:55
DocScrutinizeryou mean here-documents15:55
DocScrutinizerthey work with commands using stdin15:56
teotwakicontent here15:56
teotwakifor example:15:56
teotwakicat <<HEREDOC15:56
DocScrutinizerNOT with echo though15:56
MohammadAGOh right nvm15:56
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MohammadAGAnyway, you're all wrong15:56
chem|styes, and we are proud to be!15:57
DocScrutinizerI'm BAD, never wrong ;-P15:57
MohammadAGIt would return I: command not found15:57
teotwakinot it wouldn;t15:57
MohammadAGYes, it would15:57
* merlin1991 is starting to get some serious brainfuck15:57
DocScrutinizerIroN900:~# echo foo >x bar15:58
DocScrutinizerIroN900:~# cat x15:58
DocScrutinizerfoo bar15:58
teotwaki$ I foo15:58
chem|st"you dirty useless basterd!" "hey... I'm not dirty!"15:58
MohammadAGMohammadAG: I use echo "crap" > file teotwaki15:58
teotwaki$ I use echo "crap" > file teotwaki15:58
teotwakislau@khem-val /tmp $ cat file15:58
teotwakiuse echo crap teotwaki15:58
teotwakialso, just before that I typed:15:59
teotwaki$ function I {15:59
teotwaki> echo $*15:59
teotwaki> }15:59
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teotwakibrb, colleague needs help on bugtracker15:59
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: don't mess with unix gurus ;-P16:00
chem|stfunny networkwall-outlet vlan request in another channel... "in room 666 we need to add up another socket to our vlan" socketNo dvl 666.116:01
chem|stso back to my audiobook problem... is there any non-python audioplayer reading m3u playlists than panucci?16:03
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* DocScrutinizer trows in for teotwaki's colleagues16:05
DocScrutinizerthrows even16:05
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chem|stI do not want to use mediaplayer as I'd like to keep it A simple and B keep my car-playlist within th widget and not remember the chapter I was in everytime I switch16:06
teotwakiI listened to that not later than last night, DocScrutinizer16:06
teotwakiThough, it sounded a lot better on my R3's, than the shitty work headphones16:06
* teotwaki dives into fixing sprintf's again.16:07
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DocScrutinizerwell, whole Zoot Allures is an example why gapless mp3 playback is mandatory17:01
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DocScrutinizerfull album flac FTW17:02
DocScrutinizereven better: just .iso, with cuelist17:03
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, good at simple C?17:08
MohammadAGreturn; returns the whole function, break; breaks a loop17:08
MohammadAGsuppose I have a loop for items in a list, and I don't want to process a certain item17:08
MohammadAGhow do I break from the loop for only that item?17:08
MohammadAGdoesn't that continue the function?17:09
MohammadAGah ok, nvm17:10
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MohammadAGthanks DocScrutinizer17:10
DocScrutinizercontinue breaks the current loop iteration, resumes with next iteration17:11
DocScrutinizerbreak breaks the whole loop17:11
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MohammadAGwhat data type would be suitable for 80.6667?17:30
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DocScrutinizerwell, probably int still, keeping in mind you multiply each value by e.g 10.000 before adding/storing/subtracting from that var. And divide the var value by 10.000 before using it for e.g printout17:32
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MohammadAGthat doesn't work in this case17:33
DocScrutinizerif your var holds unit foo, than call the var microfoo and assume it holds units of 0.000001 foo17:33
MohammadAGalso why?17:33
MohammadAGit's not a constant *1000, can be 20.117:33
MohammadAGthe data is from a server17:34
DocScrutinizerbecause using float is bad, prone to calculation errors, slow, bloats code...17:34
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DocScrutinizerin COBOL there's a thing like 77 foo PIC 999.99999917:36
DocScrutinizerin C there's no such var type with implicit decimals afaik17:36
DocScrutinizerI might be wrong17:36
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jaskafixed point?17:39
luke-jrfixed point doesn't work if you need floating point17:43
luke-jrbut a single sample/example doesn't tell you whether you do or not17:43
luke-jralthough, 80.6667 does suggest 80 and 2/3, rounded to a fixed thousandth point17:44
jaskacobols is probably bcd fixed point17:45
DocScrutinizerjaska: in COBOL you can have all data types you want :-D17:45
jaskanever seen any real cobol :)17:46
DocScrutinizerBCD, display, computational...17:46
DocScrutinizerusual (unspecified) vars are BCD17:46
DocScrutinizerwith a very special sign handling17:47
DocScrutinizerI only know as "Ueberloch", a term originating from punchcards17:47
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DocScrutinizer9(4).9(2) DISP is using ASCII representation (without the decimal separator aka dot) in memory17:49
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DocScrutinizerthere's another syntax that allows to include the dot17:49
DocScrutinizerCOMP is similar to C int17:50
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DocScrutinizerthere's also scientific IIRC, which is basically C float17:52
DocScrutinizer(<MohammadAG> it's not a constant *1000, can be 20.1) you need to parse the input, normalize it to the decimal separator17:55
DocScrutinizerI just looked into scanf, but didn't find directly to the right format17:56
DocScrutinizerbasically you extend from "." e.g 4 chars to the right, filling with zeroes, like 20.1 -> 20.1000. Then remove dot. Done17:57
DocScrutinizerI'm sure there are stdlibs for that, possibly even in scanf17:58
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MohammadAG../../sociality-mtf/src/albumpage.h:56: error: redefinition of 'class GridItemCreator'18:00
MohammadAG../../sociality-mtf/src/albumpage.h:57: error: previous definition of 'class GridItemCreator'18:00
MohammadAGhow the fuck18:00
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, I used float, well, qreal, it's a typedef to float18:00
MohammadAGit's just for storage18:01
DocScrutinizerdoesn't matter18:01
MohammadAGwhat about double?18:01
DocScrutinizeryou can't "only store" float, you always need to convert to and from float18:01
DocScrutinizerand odds are you can't store 20.1 to float at all18:02
MohammadAGanyway the compilation error above18:02
MohammadAGwhy does it happen18:02
DocScrutinizerit might turn out to become 20.099999999999983418:02
MohammadAG56: class GridItemCreator : public MAbstractCellCreator<MWidgetController>18:02
MohammadAG57: {18:02
DocScrutinizer(why) binary representation vs decimal representation18:03
DocScrutinizerthere are perfectly pretty values in decimal you simply can't store in a binary var18:04
DocScrutinizerlike you can't display 1/3 in decimal18:05
DocScrutinizerthat's btw the reason why you NEVER should test float ==18:07
MohammadAGmeh, it's because I hate #endif before the end of the .h file18:07
DocScrutinizerfloat is *always* inaccurate18:08
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* DocScrutinizer hopes his Lenovo T500 will arrive before this shitty laptop fan finally stops working completely and CPU fries19:14
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jean_brathello fellas19:27
jean_brathi DocScrutinizer19:28
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DocScrutinizerhi jean_brat19:34
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jean_brathi DocScrutinizer19:37
DocScrutinizer[Fr 11. Mai 2012] [17:48:23] <DocScrutinizer> jean_brat: it's absolutely madatory to take care about cdc_phonet kernel module on your PC19:37
DocScrutinizer[Fr 11. Mai 2012] [17:48:43] <DocScrutinizer> do "lsmod|grep phonet"19:37
DocScrutinizer[Fr 11. Mai 2012] [17:48:56] <DocScrutinizer> if that shows anything, you're in trouble19:37
DocScrutinizer[Fr 11. Mai 2012] [17:50:28] <DocScrutinizer> when best part of ~flashing been written, there's been no cdc_phonet kernel module by default on most distros19:37
DocScrutinizer[Fr 11. Mai 2012] [17:50:40] <DocScrutinizer> nowadays it's ubiquitary19:38
jean_bratit shows nothing19:38
jean_brati black listed as suggested earlier and rebooted the machine before i started anything19:39
jean_bratsince its a 64bit machine19:39
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DocScrutinizerhumm, maybe you should boot a 32it system. There's a plethora of live-CDs with linux19:42
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jean_bratwhy i am curious is i am not getting any errors19:43
DocScrutinizerhmm, flasher seems rather unhelpful regarding proper diagnostic output19:44
DocScrutinizeresp for flashing of eMMC19:44
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jean_bratthere are some GUI wrapper on these flashers for windows19:46
jean_brathave you tried them?19:46
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DocScrutinizerI don't have any windows machine here19:54
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MohammadAGyeah, DocScrutinizer opens his windows manually20:09
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jean_brathi DocScrutinizer20:25
jean_bratjust to narrow down all the possibility20:25
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DocScrutinizerjean_brat: evidently your N900 boots, as you see the jumping dots. This means kernel and basic linux system are OK20:27
DocScrutinizerjean_brat: if the first boot process results in machine magically shutting down unnoticed, I'd not know for sure what would cause this. Given you flashed eMMC so /home and /opt are existing and empty, and you haven't plugged in any USB during first boot20:29
jean_bratif the image file is not properly downloaded, will the excutable will still try to load the image without some kinda crc check or something?20:29
jean_bratif the image file is not properly downloaded, will the excutable will still try to load the image without some kinda crc check or something?20:29
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DocScrutinizerat least for eMMC afaik20:29
MohammadAGCommunity SSU meeting in #maemo-ssu in 30 minutes20:31
DocScrutinizerre-download your eMMC (and fiasco?) files, and do a md5sum, compare that to... I guess there are md5sums at Nokia's download site20:31
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: thanks for reminder20:32
MohammadAGyou're welcome :p20:34
DocScrutinizerjean_brat: make sure you always use versions tagged 'latest' in right col20:35
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jean_bratyes i did the latest one.. am downloading em again20:37
jean_bratDocScrutinizer, how to check the checksome?20:37
DocScrutinizermd5sum <yourfile>20:37
DocScrutinizerjr@halley:~> md5sum /home/jr/Documents/N900/maemo5.0-flashing/images/RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin20:39
DocScrutinizer488809ff96a0a05479d692e9f77aeb4f  /home/jr/Documents/N900/maemo5.0-flashing/images/RX-51_2009SE_10.2010.13-2.VANILLA_PR_EMMC_MR0_ARM.bin20:39
merlin1991 even easier20:39
DocScrutinizerN.B. this might be no correct md5sum in this paste20:40
merlin1991dl the md5sum sfile to the same dir20:40
merlin1991and run20:40
merlin1991md5sum -c SUMFILE20:40
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DocScrutinizerGeneralAntilles: how's about your rant now?20:57
DocScrutinizererr, trolling you called it20:57
DocScrutinizerCommunity SSU meeting in #maemo-ssu *NOW*20:57
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pablocastellanoskonelix: greetings22:09
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