IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2012-01-09

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vortigaunthey guys01:38
vortigaunti just got a free n900 :)01:38
vortigaunti was wondering if you guys can point me to a nice and up to date tutorial on flashing01:38
infoboti heard maemo-flashing is
VladNistornice. someone stole mine :)01:39
vortigaunti googled a bunch of them .. but i dont want to brick this01:39
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vortigauntthat sucks :|01:39
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VladNistor:) enjot it, it's nice piecw of hw01:40
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vortigaunti know .. i've been looking to have one for a while01:40
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vortigaunti've been using it for 3 days now ... its awesome01:41
vortigauntso the link infobot gave me ... should i follow that ?01:42
vortigaunti want to completly wipe it.. fresh install01:42
DocScrutinizerread the *whole* page, as it's a bit mixedpickles structured01:43
DocScrutinizerthen you want to flash both COMBINED and VANILLA01:43
vortigaunti sure will :)01:43
VladNistorgood lad01:43
vortigaunthope i wont f* up this .. seems complicated01:48
vortigauntthanks guys!01:48
plateits not complicated02:02
platehold down U as you insert battery while its polugged into a pc02:03
platei tend to brick things so good messing w/ debian and vanila kernel that even 6-second-hold on power button doesnt do anything thus the battery thing, im sure you can flash w/o removing battery tho02:04
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fosstuxHi! I'm trying to reflash my n900. On Win7 64bit all I get is Suitable USB device not found, waiting.02:55
fosstuxNothing elsen.02:55
fosstuxWhen trying to flash on Linux (Fedora 16), I get USB device found found at bus 002, device address 009. Error claiming USB interface: Device or resource busy02:56
fosstuxI'm running the flasher as root.02:56
fosstuxWhat am I doing wrong?????02:56
robbiethe1stUh, make sure modules 'phonet' and 'cdc_phonet' are unloaded02:56
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fosstuxrobbiethe1st: the two modules get loaded as soon as I plug in the phone...03:02
SpeedEvilyou need to blacklist them03:02
fosstuxok. got it03:02
robbiethe1stBlacklist em03:02
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fosstuxI've now flashed the emmc with flasher-3.5 -f <image>.bin -f -R. Now I want to flash the root image. Do I have to change the syntax?03:04
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fosstuxthanks - it worked03:26
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DocScrutinizerI wonder if I should charge each wiki user 1ct for each time I clean out a spam07:32
DocScrutinizerI'd ove to charge the spammers, but alas I won't get a cent from either07:38
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Sicelohmm, jonwil mia12:09
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badcloud_keyboard only web browsing for n900?15:11
chem|stbadcloud_: make a complete sentence!15:11
badcloud_chem|st: *is there*...15:12
chem|stbadcloud_: you can use modest keyboard only... or are you looking for text-only shell browsing?15:12
badcloud_vimperator won't install on fennec and I haven't found a conqueror port for maemo15:12
badcloud_modest kbd?15:13
chem|stah ok that way... no idea15:13
chem|stis your touchscreen broke?15:13
badcloud_no, but zooming in/out to hit links is irritating15:14
jogahmm...I think it works really well, even with my desktop browser I sometimes try to double click on paragraphs to make it focus :)15:14
Siceloi didn't know u could use modest without using ts15:14
badcloud_what's modest?15:15
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badcloud_you mean microb?15:15
Sicelostock email client15:15
chem|stsry modest is the email client15:15
chem|styeah microb15:15
badcloud_how can you use microb w/out ts?15:16
chem|stboth starting with m and both I do not make use of...15:16
chem|stthought you could ctrl shift... lmch+15:16
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badcloud_what about links web browser? can it be installed on the n900?15:19
chem|stI'd say I was sure that there is a way to "tab" but there isn't afaics15:19
badcloud_DAMMIT, pentadactyl won't install either15:20
Wizzupbadcloud_, you could file a feature request at pentadactyl15:20
WizzupI perhaps somehow compile firefox for arm15:21
WizzupPerhaps debian chroot?15:21
badcloud_good ideas15:21
chem|styeah links is available15:21
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badcloud_E: Package links has no installation candidate15:22
badcloud_chem|st: or did you mean via debian chroot?15:23
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stef_204hi, thinking of switching from Nokia N900 to N9--but not convinced if worth it or not. Pretty happy with N900. Anyone here using N9?15:30
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andre__stef_204, some people.15:34
stef_204ok, do you know what the feedback is?15:35
stef_204There's a lot of reviews at the moment and depending who writes them--whether they are Linux buffs or Windows buffs--the review is positive or negative15:36
stef_204I guess if the piece is done by a Windows PR, Meego had "no future", N9 is "stillborn", etc.15:37
stef_204or, N9 is excellent from the Linux buffs15:37
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stef_204They were saying the same re. Maemo but IMHO, Maemo is still being used by a wide base, if I am not mistaken, and has lots of aps developed for it15:38
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petteriif you are happy with N900, i see no need to switch to anything. For me N9 really rocks15:39
petteriand most of people I know that had N900 have upgraded to N915:40
WizzupIs the battery a lot better?15:40
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petterii charge it mostly every night, but i would say that it last two days15:42
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stef_204petteri: ok, that's good feedback. I can get the N9 for "free" with a contract extension but before doing that I am trying to get more feedback15:50
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stef_204one thing I read is that it had no ability to render "flash" when browsing15:50
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stef_204flash is so widely used that that point seems to be a negative--it's going to be some time before HTML5 is the norm, IMO15:51
petterino flash support and the browser does not have any settings, but at least it is fast :)15:51
stef_204perhaps there is some other browser that can be installed which would would render flash??15:51
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petteriprobably not15:52
stef_204petteri: what about texting? no problems with the touchscreen, no keyboard?15:53
petterino problems. The virtual keyboard is nice15:54
petterione thing that is good to note is that N9 does that much common with N900 in the UI side15:55
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petteriall apps are new, maps work, calendar and email are usable, etc...15:56
petteridoes not have that much common with N900 i meant to say :)15:57
stef_204right, I understoodd, no worries15:58
stef_204IMAP email is OK?15:58
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stef_204how is the app store, repository...? not that many aps developed or starting to get there?15:59
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petterii think the app situation is also better than N900 at least there are more commercial ones16:01
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edheldilfredddd:  Hi, were you successful with Jabber and SSL? If you wrote me, I have missed that16:03
petterii am not missing anything, but at least at twitter i see complains that whatsapp is not ported to N916:03
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stef_204thanks for the feedback. let me kow if anything else is worth noting on switching from N900 to N9.  I'll probably go ahead and get the N9, looks pretty nifty; and keep using the N900 for backup number16:07
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freddddedheldil, there is still an issue with the used XMPP client and wildcard certificates, I got as far as trying the first build, and sending a new log to Robot101, he was then waiting to advise a knowledged friend about it.16:11
freddddThis was Saturday.16:11
freddddNothing new has happened since then, waiting for a new build to try.16:11
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edheldilfredddd:  ah, ok. Thanks for the effort16:24
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freddddedheldil, I am prety sure it will get fixed, I am ready to continue testing and provide feedback, then we just have to hope it will get accepted by CSSU, as I am not too sure how well CSSU is going, I can not really remember last time my phone updated.16:42
Robot101fredddd: merlin1991 is waiting for us to say it works and he'll include it16:43
freddddRobot101, did you make a new build?16:43
freddddI can test it, if so.16:43
freddddI only tested the first build that was setup, and it did not work, I ended up giving you new logs of it.16:43
freddddThat was Saturday.16:44
Robot101no we didn't work out why the old code didn't workso there's nothing to change/update yet16:44
Robot101maybe just put in loads of DEBUG and see if we can figure out that way why it doesn't work16:44
Robot101but I am in 2 days of meetings so I've not got time for that atm16:45
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freddddRobot101, it seems that wild card certificates are troublesome?16:59
freddddIf I could I would perhaps generate the certificates individually, but my provider does not allow for such an option.17:00
Robot101? it's your server isn't it? you can get certificates for free from startssl17:00
Robot101but I'd rather fix it17:00
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freddddRobot101, I would like to stick to just one certificate provider, I kind of paid around 140 euros for it, so I would naturally be keen on resorting to the one I paid for and trying to figure out the best solution with that. =p17:02
freddddAlthough I appreciate your suggestion.17:02
freddddRobot101, do you use Postfix also?17:02
freddddI am cracking my mind on why my mail client refuses to connect, and times out.17:03
freddddDovecot / IMAP is working, I am glad for that.17:03
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Robot101maybe your ISP filters port 25 - try enabling port 587 (submission) and test that instead?17:03
freddddI try to connect to Postfix, mail client times out, with no helpful error but "Time Out", and Postfix does not log any signs of me trying to connect.17:03
freddddThey do not.17:03
freddddI am trying to STARTTLS on port 25, I tried to do normal SSL on 465 but nothing.17:04
freddddnetstat -lnp shows postfix is up and listening.17:04
freddddBut I can not see what port though.17:04
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freddddI remember setting up Postfix before following the same tutorial and things worked out, only difference now is that I have my wild card certificate and configured Postfix towards it.17:05
freddddBut if that would error, surely, my mail client should tell me, or Postfix should log failures or errors.17:05
freddddGoing to see what it does on 587.17:06
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Robot101have you tried conecting with netcat?17:06
freddddNo idea what that is. D:17:06
fredddd* Connecting to SMTP server: ...17:07
fredddd*** Error occurred while sending the message.17:07
fredddd/var/log/mail.log <- shows nothing about me trying to connect.17:07
freddddIt does show other postfix messages such as the server having started up, so the log works as far I am concerned.17:07
nid0netcat will just manually connect to the port, for testing mailserver access you can also just use telnet17:07
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freddddLooks like netcat is just going to time out as well on that port.17:10
freddddnetcat 2517:10
freddddLeads to just a new line with the cursor blinking.17:10
Robot101fredddd: it seems to respond well to me on port 25, with STARTTLS working too with openssl s_client17:11
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Robot101fredddd: means it's more likely a problem on your end / your network17:11
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nid0yep, smtp server responds fine here too17:11
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freddddIf I configure my mail on Maemo, and pick TLS.17:12
freddddIt will use STARTTLS?17:12
freddddOr do I need to resort to 465 (SMTP) / 993 (IMAP)?17:12
Robot101TLS means STARTTLS, so it should be normal ports, 25 or 587 for SMTP and 143 for IMAP17:15
fledermausfredddd: aha. hello. which version of openssl do you have, that currently fails the ssl certificate check inside gabble?17:16
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freddddMaemo mail does not send out my mail upon configuring and port 25, using TLS, and the credentials for SMTP are the same as IMAP (same database), IMAP working, I can conclude the credentials are ok.17:23
freddddWhat is the equivalent of aptitude show openssl but then for apt-get?17:24
fledermausapt-cache show ...17:24
Robot101fledermaus: you can dig's packagedb17:25
fledermausor dpkg -l ...17:25
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fledermausRobot101: good idea.17:25
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freddddBut no idea if it is installed.17:25
Robot101dpkg -l17:26
freddddUh, ii, whatever that means.17:26
freddddI usually use aptitude for this, little experience with apt thingies.17:27
fledermausii is you asked for it to be installed, and it is installed.17:27
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freddddI see.17:28
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Robot101fredddd: the first two lines from dpkg -l are a key, the capital letter is the one that appears in the appropriate column (requested, actual)17:29
fledermauswell, assuming openssl don't number their releases backwards, that's slightly newer than the version that works for me17:29
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fledermausso it's not an old-library problem.17:29
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freddddRobot101, Maemo mail does not send out mail either, and /var/log/mail.log shows nothing about it trying to connect, I am so confused by this.17:30
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edheldilfredddd: since you are unable to connect with netcat/telnet, I think it's your provider's doing18:16
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freddddI will ask at the channel of my provider.18:19
freddddMy home connection ISP?18:19
freddddOr my VPS provider?18:19
freddddI believe my VPS provider is clean on this, my home connection ISP however.18:19
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edheldilfredddd:  home connection. They like to do that to "prevent" end user spam.18:28
edheldilHave you managed to connect to the submission port?18:29
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edheldilyes. I see that it closes connection, though18:29
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Shapeshiftermhh. tethering doesn't work anymore for some reason. the bluetooth connection is made and the client laptop gets an IP from my n900 but it can't connect to the internet...18:45
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timelessanyone awake?19:14
timelessi'm trying to figure out how to deal with:
timelessit makes mention of "fees"19:15
RST38hYou want a Canadian police certificate?19:15
timelessbut i can't find a corresponding document within
timelessi want a Finnish issued certificate19:16
timelessfor use in Canada19:16
RST38hOh shit19:16
timeless(i got an FBI issued letter for use in Canada)19:16
timelessbut the finnish web site is well...19:16
timelessyeah, shit isn't a bad way to describe it19:16
timeless(crap would be a better way)19:16
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RST38hBasically it is a piece of paper from Finnish Internal Affairs ministry (or whatever it is called) saying you do not have criminal history that they know of19:17
RST38hAs you appear to be an American, you probably do not need it19:17
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RST38hJust get on from Maryland branch of FBI or whoever gives these in the US19:17
timelessi got the fbi one19:18
RST38hSo, why the finnish one?19:18
timelessbut my lawyers want me to get one from finland19:18
timelessbecause i spent 5 years there19:18
timelessobviously i could have been a  criminal for those 5 years19:18
timelessedheldil: the logic is pretty sound19:18
RST38hYeah, smuggling vodka etc19:18
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timelesschewing tobacco?19:19
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* timeless can't remember what that's called19:19
edheldilselling counterfeit goods, like Nokia phones. That's what ACTA protects us from! ;-)19:19
RST38hAnyway, based on personal experience, the best would be to *call* the Finns at the phone number quoted by the Canadians and *ask*19:19
RST38hThey will tell you everything about the fees, etc.19:19
timelessRST38h: based on personal experience, i'd have to call by 4pm finnish local time19:19
timelesswhich would be um19:19
RST38hOf course19:20
timeless9am i guess19:20
RST38hdoes not sound so bad19:20
timelessyeah, it could be worse :)19:20
* timeless sighs19:20
SpeedEvilOn the subject of legitimate non-smuggled goods that are a really bad idea:19:20
timelessSpeedEvil: Steve Jobs action figures!19:20
timelessRST38h: oh, i misread it19:21
timelessit isn't pay in advance19:21
timelessi'd be invoiced19:21
RST38hYou *really* wanna call19:22
RST38hDo not believe anything Canadian gov site says about Finnish gov19:22
ruskie <-- moar19:22
edheldilSpeedEvil:  that cup holder is OK, I guess ;-)19:22
SpeedEvilruskie: I've said before it's likely for patents19:22
timelessRST38h: i can't believe that the poliisi site is powered by notes19:23
timelessthat's just scary19:23
timelessoh right, i was supposed to look up my finnish identity number19:24
timeless(i've thankfully forgotten it, i wonder if someone else knows it)19:24
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timelessSpeedEvil: it's really 10 characters19:26
timeless6 are birthdate, another character is spent for the century19:27
timelessand then 3 digits for the person19:27
timelessfinland doesn't support having more than 1000 people born on a given day19:27
edheldiltimeless:  hmm, we have st. similar, but it 6 digits for date, 3 for personal number and 1 digit for checksum19:29
timelessone could probably break the finnish system by having 1000 foreigners apply for work permits19:29
timeless(as long as they had the same birthdate)19:29
timeless(actually the number would be smaller, since native borns count against the limit)19:29
SpeedEviltimeless: Also by impregnating 70000 or so finnish girls.19:30
edheldiland it also contains sex encoded in month number19:30
* timeless wonders what the system would do19:30
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SpeedEvilThough doing them all in one day may be tiring.19:30
timelessSpeedEvil: that would take too long :)19:30
timelessand be moderately expensive19:30
timelessthe general cost of breaking the system by using live people would be cheaper :)19:30
* timeless hunts lunch19:31
* SpeedEvil is baking chicken.19:31
* edheldil hopes lunch will not hunt timeless instead19:31
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freddddRobot101, besides SMTP 25, it would operate at 587? Postfix?19:39
freddddMy ISP blocks all incoming below 1024 and outgoing on 25. =/19:39
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Robot101fredddd: in postfix/ there should be a line for "submission" which is basically SMTP on a different port19:41
Robot101fredddd: if that's there and uncommented, postfix will already be working on port 58719:42
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freddddUncommented it, restarting, testing.19:43
freddddHoping for the best. >.<19:43
freddddSMTP authentication failure. x.x19:49
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freddddJan  9 18:52:13 acantha postfix/smtpd[1765]: setting up TLS connection from d54$19:53
freddddJan  9 18:52:14 acantha postfix/smtpd[1765]: Anonymous TLS connection establish$19:53
fredddd(then a disconnect)19:53
freddddDo you think SSL error might be causing this? =/19:53
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fledermauscan you crank up the logging on postfix?19:54
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timelessoh, sorry, someone was right, there's a check digit20:27
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ruskie <-- gee because ya know I want my power adapter to store my passwords...20:53
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timelessruskie: err21:45
timelessthe idea is you have 2 power adapters21:45
timelessthe one you leave at home/work21:45
timelessand the one you take with you when you travel21:45
timelessthe one at home/work is your emergency key21:45
timelessand is in a locked space21:45
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timelessthe one you take with you while traveling is just a normal unhelpful power adapter21:45
timelessit's really not a bad idea21:46
timelesswhen i got an MBP @Nokia, i got 2 adapters21:46
ruskieI already see this going bad in so many ways21:46
timelessthe easiest way to go bad is if you somehow manage to confuse the normal one with the special one21:46
ruskieusers will take a random one21:46
ruskieand not even care21:46
timelessbut that's solvable21:46
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timelessthe adapter could have an (led backed) icon indicating it has passwords21:47
ruskielike the don't write down your passwords but change theme every 90 days solution?21:47
timelessthat's terrible21:47
rm_worki'd lose it T_T21:47
timelessi can't remember something i don't use for >10 days21:47
timelesswhenever i need to check my "" account21:47
timelessi reset the password21:47
timelessis that secure?21:47
timelessheck no21:48
timelessdo i have a choice?21:48
timelesswhy not? because the a** behind the site block password storing21:48 is that like a snail mail -> digital service?21:48
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timelessthere's no snail involved21:48
timelessjust the snail vendor and an evault21:48
timelessit saves on dead trees21:49
timelessit's not a bad theory, just a horrid implementation21:49
timelessdoesn't support mobile devices21:49
timelessdoesn't support arbitrary web browsers21:49
timelessdoesn't allow password storing21:49
timelessdoesn't allow easy storing of remote content21:49
ruskiewell considering that trees for paper are purpose grown I don't really see much of a problem ;)21:49
timelessdoesn't allow easy printing of remote content21:49
ruskiebut ok21:49
ruskiewent off on a tangent21:50
timelessi'm more or less forced by payroll to use these idiots21:50
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timelessto be fair21:52
timelessthere are worse systems21:52
timelessmy finnish bank for instance21:52
ruskiewe just switched to google apps for business at work21:52
timelessto communicate with them securely, i need to log into their web site21:52
ruskieI'm happy we're getting rid of the pop3 crud we had so far21:52
timelesswhich requires a number from a plastic card21:52
timelessif i take out that card in public, anyone w/ a camera can record all the numbers on the side of the card i'm using21:53
ruskiebut then I cried when my manager asks me... can I use POP3?21:53
timelessthis is obviously "secure"21:53
timelessbecause it's something that only I have21:53
timelessme, and anyone who ever sees me use it...21:53
timelessand any mounted camera whereever i am...21:53
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timelessand after i run out of numbers, i have to have a replacement mailed to me at a Finnish address21:54
timelessthey don't ship out of the country, because that wouldn't be "secure"21:54
timelessand no, you can't stock up on cards21:54
timelessthat wouldn't be "secure"21:54
ruskiethat's why the only stuff I ever do with mobile banking is transfering money between known accounts... anything that isn't known requires a OTP made up of 2 chars from an 8 char password they sent me21:54
timelessoh, i don't think they send you an email indicating that you have "secure email"21:55
timelessso i think you have to poll them21:55
timelesssee above for how expensive that is...21:55
timelessat least w/ epost, i can cost them money each time i need to use their stupid service21:55
ruskiehow come?21:55
timeless(call +1800 == free for me, costs for them)21:55
timeless(... to reset my password)21:56
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philheatonQuiet in here...23:38
merlin1991you can't exepect an irc channel to be full of life 24/723:39
philheatonI don't. Was just commenting.23:40
freemangordonmerlin1991, any development with MohammadAG's case?23:40
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merlin1991so far not23:43
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