IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2011-02-01

« Monday, 2011-01-31 Index Wednesday, 2011-02-02 »
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Venemoachipa: thx00:22
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`Ika_Musumehello how do i formar my sd to fat16 using xterm maemo500:34
`Ika_Musumeformat00:34
lardman|homefdisk00:34
`Ika_Musumefdisk?00:34
ricki8024isn't fdisk for partitioning?00:35
`Ika_Musumesimply type fdisk?00:35
lardman|homewell that's the first step00:35
lardman|homethen mkfs.something-fat00:35
lardman|homewhere something might be v, but who knows00:35
lardman|homesee what busybox provides00:35
`Ika_Musumewell it doesnt work00:36
lardman|homebut first see which partition you want to format and make sure it's umounted00:36
`Ika_Musumefdisk not found00:36
lardman|homehave to be root00:36
lardman|homebut yeah skip the fdisk bit if you know the partition00:36
`Ika_Musumei am00:36
`Ika_Musumeits a empty sd00:37
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lardman|homehmm, try /sbin/fdisk or /usr/sbin/fdisk and see if it's hiding00:37
lardman|homethough "mount" will also tell you which partition was mounted, and you can just umount that and reformat it00:38
lardman|homes/was/is00:38
`Ika_Musumei probaly dont have it00:39
`Ika_Musumeit cant find this fdisk00:39
lardman|homeyou should do really00:39
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ricki8024me nether00:40
lardman|homehmm, I spoke too soon, I can't find it either00:40
lardman|homeso check which partition you want to format and use mkfs.vfat00:41
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`Ika_Musumehttp://img145.imageshack.us/img145/6746/screenshot2011013123440.png00:42
lardman|homeI guess it will be mmcblk1p100:42
`Ika_Musumewell /media/mcc1?00:43
lardman|homethat's the mount point, you need the partition device00:43
lardman|homeso run "mount" and see which /dev entry is mounted there00:43
`Ika_Musumejust type mount?00:44
lardman|homeyep00:44
`Ika_Musumewoa thats some list00:44
`Ika_Musumewhat do i have to find in there?00:45
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lardman|homelook for /media/mmc1 and see which /devmmcblkXpX is attached to it00:45
lardman|homesorry missed a /00:45
lardman|homedev/mmcblk*p*00:46
`Ika_Musumewell like you said its mmcblk1p100:46
lardman|homehmm, and missed the leading one too, not typing well this evening00:46
lardman|homecool00:46
lardman|homewell in that case you need to unmount it using umount (note there's no n in there)00:46
lardman|homee.g. umount /media/mmc100:46
lardman|homeor umount /dev/mmcblk1p100:46
lardman|homeeither will work00:47
`Ika_Musumekk00:47
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`Ika_Musumemy sd is gone from the file manager00:49
`Ika_Musumenow what?00:50
lardman|homegood00:50
lardman|homecheck it's also gone from the output of mount00:50
lardman|homeyou wanted vfat?00:50
`Ika_Musumeit is00:50
`Ika_Musumefat16 i want00:50
lardman|homethen issue: mkfs.msdos /dev/mmcblk1p100:50
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`Ika_Musumeok done00:52
lardman|homeright, you're sorted then00:52
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lardman|homemount /media/mmc1 will probably remount it for you00:52
`Ika_Musumeits formated?00:52
lardman|homeyeah, it probably gave you some little bit of info that it was working00:52
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lardman|homeI think it just writes a header, doesn't bother to clear the existing data00:53
lardman|homeso it's quick00:53
MohammadAGwhat does packet filtered in ping mean?00:54
MohammadAGthere's no internet access on a desktop00:54
`Ika_Musumemount cant find /media/mmc1 in /etc/fstab00:54
lardman|home`Ika_Musume: in which case do: mount /dev/mmcblk1p1 /media/mmc100:55
`Ika_Musumekk00:55
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lardman|homeyou may or may not need to tell it the partition format type with -t00:55
ricki8024packet filtered means that there was neither a response that the host is reachable nor unreachable. is a firewall between host and the ping destination?00:55
lardman|homebut try without to begin with00:55
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lardman|homeMohammadAG: or is it like my uni where they annoyingly filter pings anyway just to make it hard to work out if your network is up and running00:56
`Ika_Musumeworked thx00:57
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lardman|home`Ika_Musume: cool, np00:57
pupnikhttp://www.spaceflightnow.com/news/n1101/31otv2/  [ January 31, 2011: The U.S. military's second robotic X-37B space plane is in Florida preparing for blastoff March 4 on another secret mission ]00:57
lardman|homepupnik: cool, that's a cool tpy - though the Russians did it before00:58
lardman|homes/tpy/toy00:58
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lardman|homepupnik: seen these? http://www.russianspaceweb.com/bor.html01:00
pupnikno, i did not, thanks lardman|home01:00
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`Ika_Musumewhy is it kread only01:01
`Ika_Musumeread*01:01
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eichiis there some application, to use n900 as some kind of "wacom tablet" input system?01:02
pupnikat least the army device doesn't suffer those assymetrical loads on launch01:02
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pupnikeichi: it should be possible to use 'synergy' server on N900 - to control a PC - but i don't know if anyone has01:03
lardman|home`Ika_Musume: does dmesg say it's been mounted ro as there's corruption? Otherwise perhaps it's the mount params01:03
`Ika_Musumeitk works just removed ms and connected again01:03
lardman|homepupnik: yeah but those weren't an issue thus far really, more the fact that the oriber wasn't at the top of the stack so could be hit by stuff01:03
Nils^hello. n900: do you know a way to send sms via bash (and therefore over ssh from my computer?) I don't have bluetooth and want to send sms from my phone-number01:04
lardman|home`Ika_Musume: mount options then, glad it's sorted01:04
pupniklardman|home: the only new capability that army plane gives them is the ability to capture a foreign satellite and bring it back for analysis01:06
lardman|homeand also I suppose their own, what's the load capability?01:07
pupnikoh yeah.  um dunno01:07
lardman|homethat was part of the justification for the shuttle wasn't it01:08
lardman|homeand then the trade-off between load cap and cross-range ability to allow polar orbits iirc meant that it wasn't ideal for anything in particular01:08
lardman|homethough all primarily military requirements01:09
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Venemoachipa: thank you01:14
achipaVenemo: yw01:14
achipaVenemo: did you try it ?01:14
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Venemoachipa: not yet, I've been busy01:15
Venemoachipa: tomorrow I'll give it a shot :)01:15
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achipaVenemo: :) ok01:16
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Venemobyebye now and have a good evening01:17
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lardman|home~lart HAM for locking the db when I connect to the interweb01:47
* infobot dumps 42 tons of dirt, manure, and fish heads on HAM for locking the db when I connect to the interweb01:47
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lardman|homephew, mbarcode pushed and python plugin fixed and pushed02:43
* lardman|home heads for bed02:43
lardman|homenight all02:44
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SpeedEvilnight!02:44
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wmarone-n900can someone dispose of PradaBrada?02:46
MohammadAGwmarone-n900, I'd like to02:47
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ricki8024i'm confused. On my n900 i installed rootsh. Now i can 'sudo su' or 'sudo gainroot' to get a root shell. But there must be a difference between those two commands03:06
Sc0rpiusor just "root"03:06
Sc0rpiustype just "root"03:06
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ricki8024that seems to be similar to 'sudo su'03:06
ricki8024but what exacly does 'sudo gainroot'?03:07
Sc0rpiussudo lets you execute a command as root03:07
Sc0rpiussu = substitute user, without any argument you become root03:07
ricki8024so far so good03:07
trip0su != super user?03:08
Sc0rpiusno!!!03:08
* trip0 feels less super03:08
Sc0rpiussu is SUBSTITUTE USER03:08
Sc0rpiussu user <--- you become user03:08
trip0switch user?03:08
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ricki8024but if i 'sudo gainroot' ~ is /home/user, if i 'root' or 'sudo su' ~ is /root03:08
ricki8024o.O03:08
ricki8024strange03:08
Sc0rpiussudo gainroot is different, it's a special shell (/usr/sbin/gainroot(03:09
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ricki8024whats the reason behind this?03:09
Sc0rpiuswell it's a special command that calls a bad shell (ash) with root privileges03:09
Sc0rpiusno reason03:10
Sc0rpiusthe thing is when you install rootsh, then you can sudo to whatever command you want03:10
Sc0rpiussince I use bash, I'd prefer just to type "root"03:11
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ricki8024i use bash to. but even if i use bash after that gainroot thing ~ is still /home/user and different rc-files are loaded03:12
ricki8024ok, so i guess i just forget about 'sudo gainroot'?!03:13
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ricki8024shouldn't the home dir be the same no matter which shell is in use?03:15
Sc0rpiusevery user has a different home dir03:15
Sc0rpiusroot user has /root03:15
Sc0rpiususer has /home/user03:15
Sc0rpiusother users has /home/login03:15
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ricki8024but after 'sudo gainroot'. whoami returns 'root' but the .bashrc from /home/user is loaded.03:20
Sc0rpiusyeah normal behavior03:21
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Sc0rpiusit's like the difference between: "sudo suroot" and "sudo su -03:22
Sc0rpiuserr03:22
Sc0rpiusit's like the difference between: "sudo su root" and "sudo su - root"03:22
ricki8024never saw something like this on my desktop. but will try next time i'm in front of it.03:23
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Extendshi there, I can I add a link to maemo icon in my application.pro file? On symbian I just add the variable ICON:path03:33
Extendsbut, I don't know how can I do that on maemo...03:34
ExtendsI talk about qt to maemo03:34
villagerricki8024: "sudo su" is technically redundant... "sudo" is a command that gives you root privileges... "su" is a command that switches the "logged-in" user in the shell; not just grants extra privileges, it completely switches user03:34
villager(though only for that shell, of course)03:35
ricki8024sure. but since 'su' does not work on my n900 as on my debian desktop i found 'sudo su' does give me a root shell03:36
ricki8024i'm still learning ;)03:37
Sc0rpiuswell but you can use su to get the whole login environment, actually there's no other way to do it03:37
Sc0rpiusI mean "sudo su -"03:37
Sc0rpiushow can you replace that?03:37
Sc0rpiusand that's exactly what command "root" does03:38
Sc0rpius(sudo su -)03:38
villagerSc0rpius: on a normal desktop, "su -" without sudo in front would work... though maybe not on the n900 I suppose03:38
Sc0rpiusin a normal desktop, "sudo su - " will give you root without the password (if the correct entry is in /etc/sudoers)03:38
Sc0rpiusand su - (without sudo) would ask you for a password, if the root user has one03:39
villagersure, you may get a password prompt, but it's certainly a way to "replace that"...03:40
Sc0rpiusmy point is: two different commands for two totally different purposes03:40
Sc0rpiusin the N900 you can't use "su" without the "sudo"03:41
Sc0rpiususer:/home/user> su03:41
Sc0rpiussu: must be suid to work properly03:41
Sc0rpius;)03:41
ExtendsSomeone can help me with my question?03:41
wmarone-n900that's because of busybox, last I checked03:41
villager"must be suid"? so it just takes a chmod to work, I guess...03:41
wmarone-n900you would need to set the entire busybox binary to suid for it to work03:42
Sc0rpiusnot reallyuser:/home/user> su03:42
Sc0rpiussu: must be suid to work properly03:42
Sc0rpiuserr sorry03:42
Sc0rpiusnot really03:42
Sc0rpiussu is an internal busybox command03:42
Sc0rpiuslrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 7 Oct 3 2009 /bin/su -> busybox03:42
villageroh yeah, stupid busybox03:42
ricki8024Extends: i would love to but have no idea, sorry03:43
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Sc0rpiusand I didn't understand the question03:43
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ricki8024well, same here to be honest03:44
Extendsthanks man, I found nothing about this in the forum03:46
Sc0rpiuswhat do you exactly want to do?¿03:46
villagerricki8024: in any case, that's the difference... sudo gives you root privileges, but doesn't change who you are... while su changes your identity, you now are root, and are no longer the user03:48
ExtendsSc0rpius, you  talking to me?03:48
ricki8024ok, but then i don't understand why whoami returns root if just the user user gets root previleges03:49
Sc0rpiusyeah03:50
ricki8024however, this sudo thing seams strange to me anyway. if its part of the security architecture that previleges are seperated so strictly, why should a normal user be able to run a command with root previleges?03:50
Extends I can I add a link to maemo icon in my application.pro file? On symbian I just add the variable ICON:path03:51
ricki8024with his normal login password!03:51
Extendsbut, I don't know how can I do that on maemo.03:51
villagerricki8024: the man page for whoami seems to say it shows the effective user id (i.e. the privilege level), not the real user id... but the kernel does know the difference03:51
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Sc0rpiuswhat's a "application.pro" file?03:52
ExtendsI talk about qt to maemo03:53
villagerricki8024: normally sudo does not allow that, but the rootsh package installs an override to allow that... that's its purpose03:53
Sc0rpiusthe thing is, in Maemo, you can't specify a path to icons03:54
villagerricki8024: actually any system admin may allow the users on his system to run any command he chooses with root privileges with their own password - but only the commands he chooses03:54
Sc0rpiusall icons must be in some special folders, can't be whatever you want03:54
Sc0rpiusand then until you hit ctrl-d03:54
Sc0rpiuserr03:54
Sc0rpiusand then03:54
Sc0rpiusyou should specify ICON:name03:54
Sc0rpiushttp://wiki.maemo.org/Packaging_a_Qt_application <--- maybe that will help03:55
Extendshum, for example, I add this to symbian " ICON = icon.svg"  (this is my icon name). So I just need to do the same to maemo ?03:56
villagerricki8024: sudo normally does not allow anything, just what the sysadmin wants... for some privileged tasks, it's better than giving users the root passwords, don't you think?03:56
Sc0rpiuswell i don't think a .svg file works03:57
Sc0rpiusit has to be a .png file, it's kinda different in Maemo03:57
Sc0rpiusthere'Extends it should work if the icon is03:58
Sc0rpiuserrr03:58
ricki8024i need to dig deaper into that. i want to know what the vanilla debian install on my desktop gives what rights to the regular user. since i'm root and user at once user should be as limited as possible i think03:58
Sc0rpiusdelete and insert are way too near in this keyboard03:58
Extendsokay, I will try that, and my icon is svg format, this is okay?03:59
Sc0rpiusno, it's not ok04:00
Sc0rpiusit has to be png in UNix04:00
Sc0rpiusyou should look at the examples04:00
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Extendsokay, thanks04:02
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ExtendsI wiill look for some examples04:03
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aoeu_Can I still overclock (say via kernel-config) while using h-e-n?04:15
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blackthorneHi04:16
luke-jraoeu_: the general rule is, overclocking is for fools04:17
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aoeu_luke-jr: Would you like to enlighten me, why you think that is the case?04:18
aoeu_But before that, can I still overclock when I have h-e-n installed?04:19
luke-jraoeu_: chip lifetime varies greatly by clock speed04:19
luke-jrfor example, if it's clocked at 600 MHz (the default maximum), the OMAP will fry within a year04:19
luke-jrIIRC, lifetime shortens exponentially04:20
blackthorneis there actually people overclocking the N900?04:21
aoeu_blackthorne: What do you mean by that?04:21
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Sc0rpiuseveryone that has overclocked has fried their phones04:22
aoeu_Sc0rpius: what is your source of data?04:22
blackthornewell, have you heard of anyone that increased his n900 CPU clock speed?04:23
aoeu_Before we (potentially) jump into such discussions,I'd like to get an answer first whether I can have h-e-n installed and still overclock?04:23
ShadowJKyes, some get over 1GHz04:23
aoeu_blackthorne: Uh, yes. Have you?04:23
Sc0rpiusaoeu_: forums04:24
blackthornegee... What a big world04:24
aoeu_Sc0rpius: Not substantial04:24
ShadowJKand some have had their n900 die after a few weeks of 800MHz04:24
Sc0rpiusyeah04:24
aoeu_Sc0rpius: To say everyone is a too much of a claim to make.04:24
Sc0rpiusactually on topic NOW: Epic OC fatality: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=6879504:25
Sc0rpiusthat's another "don't wanna listen to you guys" fella who fried his phone04:25
Sc0rpius"Phone was running on 950mhz ideal with swappolube on proposed settings."04:25
blackthornewell, I love hacking but I also love my N900. No way, I'm doing that04:26
Sc0rpiusI don't even installed the power kernel04:26
Sc0rpiusI'm fine with OMAP04:26
ShadowJKI'm actually overclocking my N800 and N810 :) Their mmc controllers, that is :)04:27
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blackthorneI've probably did more underclocking than overclocking in my life04:28
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aoeu_Maybe I'm just too adventurous, that I'm willing to get a replacement unit if my N900 dies, but since I got my tablet almost a year ago, it has been overclocked non-stopped and it still works fine. BUT, that does not mean that it won't break anytime, too.04:35
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Sc0rpiuswell since N900 is EOL, it'll be hard to find a replacement soon04:35
aoeu_Sc0rpius: Yes.04:36
aoeu_Which leads me to my question, what is the most extensive work load have you put on your N900?04:37
blackthornewhat about the battery lifetime?04:37
aoeu_blackthorne: Several hours, but I have spare batteries (not mugen ones).04:37
aoeu_How much have you used your N900 beyond sms and calls? What are the most intensive things you've done with it, on a non-overclocked mode?04:38
cehtehits not N900 which is EOL, its nokia :P04:39
ShadowJKI hit the ram and io barrier much sooner than cpu barrier.. though once I used mencoder to encode time lapse video at camera native resolution, resulting file was of course unplayable on n900 :)04:40
cehtehyes, ram is the most precious resource on the device .. oh my why didnt they add 512 MB or even 1GB04:41
blackthorneI have all the best smart phones, from the N900 to the iPhone 4. I have to say the N900 has the best fun factor for me04:44
cehtehi dont want any other yet04:45
ShadowJKdidn't exist for omap at the time :)04:45
blackthorneTo be perfect: a little better hardware, thinner design, bigger App market, HD recording, MMS support and longer battery lifetime04:47
cehtehcool, the imgur plugin rox04:47
* ShadowJK bought a second n900 because nothing more interesting exists yet04:48
cehtehwell there is always something which can be better04:48
cehtehbut i didnt seen that in any acceptable device yet04:48
cehtehcompass is high on my list and much longer lasting battery04:48
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ShadowJKthinner and bigger battery dont combine :)04:49
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cehtehhttp://i.imgur.com/b1bJ9.jpg  works :)04:50
ShadowJKbut it'd be awesome to have a tool that tells user that the facebook widget and calendar widget alone drops battery life from 7 to 1 day :P04:50
cehtehShadowJK: well yes, when you dont combine that with price :)04:50
ShadowJKeven with money :P04:50
blackthorneOk, to be perfect it also required a better touch Ui and compass04:50
cehtehcalendar drops battery much? i didnt notice04:51
cehtehdont use facebook and other stuff04:51
blackthorneWhich are the most greedy widgets when it comes to battery lifetime?04:51
cehtehany one wich needs regular updates over the web and doing fancy graphics for sue04:52
cehtehsure04:52
cehtehomweather .. but you can configure it conservatively and dont put it on your first (visible) desktop04:53
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cehtehthe map widget sux power like no tomorrow .. gps and map downloads on and constant graphics updates04:54
ShadowJKand anything written by anyone that says things like "but I'm only using 0.5% cpu"04:54
cehtehyeah04:54
cehtehomweather got a lot better than in the beginning, the guys learned04:55
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billkjust installed power kernel - now unable to scan/see any access points that I used to connect to ok08:38
billkbut mobile hotspot works ok! - how can I get back to normal wifi access?08:39
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* ieatlint stares in astonishment at this single line of code: QPointer<QVBoxLayout> _layout = new QVBoxLayout;09:51
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RobbieThe1stieatlint: What about it?09:56
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DocScrutinizermooo09:59
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ieatlintRobbieThe1st: not saying it's not valid, but to me it's a wtf, why not just use QVBoxLayout*?10:00
RobbieThe1stHave you tried replacing it with that and see if it works the same?10:01
ieatlintno, but i see the entire use of that var, and there's nothing else odd about it10:01
ieatlintexcept that it's the first time the original author declared a layout (or a widget) on the heap instead of the stack :(10:02
RobbieThe1stodd10:03
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JaffaMorning, all10:33
DocScrutinizermoo Jaffa10:33
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DocScrutinizerieatlint: sorry, that's way beyond what I understand about friggin C++10:35
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DocScrutinizermaybe it's about type of _layout var, to be a generic Qpointer rather that a particular QVBoxLayout ?10:37
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DocScrutinizererr QVBoxLayout*10:38
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DocScrutinizeror maybe the simple C style deref pointervar* semantics doesn't work for Qobjects and their Qpointers?10:39
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DocScrutinizerI.E. QVBoxLayout* is a simple C pointer, not a QPointer ?10:41
DocScrutinizermeh, nevermind10:41
ieatlintyeah, qvboxlayout* is just like the c equiv10:42
ieatlintqpointer, in my semi-limited understanding, is equiv to gpointer10:42
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ieatlint"A guarded pointer, QPointer<T>, behaves like a normal C++ pointer T *, except that it is automatically set to 0 when the referenced object is destroyed (unlike normal C++ pointers, which become "dangling pointers" in such cases). T must be a subclass of QObject"10:43
ieatlintheh, ok, so there is potential for that form being useful10:43
DocScrutinizerso that's it :-D10:43
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ieatlintbut it still makes no sense in this context :P10:43
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ieatlintto give an idea, the main() function for this builds 95% of the gui itself, with all widgets are on the heap (and qt follows a similar parent-child relationship as gtk, so that's a big no-no)10:45
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DocScrutinizerieatlint: I know what's heap and stack, but I miss to follow your hidden rationale about widgets living in either of those11:00
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ieatlintah, well if you care, it a  hierarchy.... eg, you have a window widget, so you place a box in it, and then a label in the box.  then you destroy the window, so it destroys it's child (the box), which destroys its child, and so forth11:02
ieatlintmemory management11:02
DocScrutinizerfine, so what's the problem with heap here?11:03
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ieatlintnothing, heap is mandatory... if you put something from the stack on there, the parent will try to free it at some point11:04
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ieatlintand that's a segfault11:04
DocScrutinizeras long as each object's ~destructor is called correctly I don't see the problem11:04
ieatlintbad programmers get away with it sometimes because simple guis don't destroy objects until you exit11:04
ieatlintbut if you've ever had a gui app (linux or windows) that crashes when you quit...11:05
DocScrutinizeroh yeah, obviously objects won't love to live on stack11:05
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ieatlinteh, it can be more dangerous than leaking a bit of memory11:06
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DocScrutinizersure, I guess ~destructor would try to give the (stack!) memory back to heap manager, and when this one would accept it then it occasionally gets reallocated or whatever - you mustn't do this11:09
ieatlintdoesn't ever accept it.. will always segfault11:10
DocScrutinizerthat's why you create objects with new() (=heap), rather than instantiating a simple new var (=stack)11:10
ieatlintyeah, and when you want to confuse new programmers, you use alloca()11:11
DocScrutinizerbut pointers to objects can live on stack, except if they are objects themselves ;-P11:11
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DocScrutinizerooh, I ***love*** C++11:13
ieatlinti only recently learnt of alloca(), the way to make variably-sized arrays on the stack without breaking c89 rules11:13
DocScrutinizer</irony>11:13
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ieatlintheh, yeah, and i suck at c++ :(11:14
ieatlinti'm on the stage defined as "oh, it's like c, but with classes!"11:14
DocScrutinizersame here11:15
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DocScrutinizerthat's why I found it rather funny when MohammadAG asked how to embed c into c++ - though it's maybe a valid question if only I understood enough of c++11:16
ieatlintit is, i do it11:16
DocScrutinizerfor me a c++ code is 60..90% plain c, with a few special extensions11:17
DocScrutinizerso I think you don't need any special embedding11:18
ieatlintto use c in c++, you do: extern "C" { <c code goes here }11:18
DocScrutinizersee? ignorant here11:18
ieatlintand it's common to then put that in a preprocessor of "#ifdef __cplusplus"11:18
* DocScrutinizer waves and heads off for breakfast out11:19
ieatlintso that you can use the same code for regular c then without ever running into issue11:19
ieatlintenjoy :)11:19
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soltyscan someone tell me where does maemo store wifi passowrd ?11:21
psycho_oreosgconf11:22
soltyshow to get it ?11:22
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psycho_oreossearch on the forums/wiki for that enumerating a list of possible gconf settings11:23
soltysmhm11:23
ieatlintlook around in /home/user/.gconf perhaps11:23
ieatlintor maybe that's .config, hehe11:24
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psycho_oreosthat reminds me, any of you guys noticed that under gconf, it has said that the warranty is labelled as invalid?11:27
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Toadpolehow does one install meego with a non-standard kernel on the n900?11:44
lcukToadpole, you start by asking in #meego or #meego-arm, but in general the meego wiki pages explain differentiation and building images with kernel adaptions included11:45
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lcukthe official team are currently looking at (afaik) the .37 kernel and putting the nice pvr/pm modules and stuff in11:46
Toadpolegreat, thanks lcuk11:46
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billkwhere can I go for help/information on a wifi problem with the power users kernel for the n900 ??11:49
Toadpolewhats the problem?11:50
billkno managed mode wifi, but works ok with mobile-hotspot.  flash old kernel back and can connect to AP again11:51
billkcant see what problem is11:51
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RST38hWell. Moo.12:02
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RobbieThe1stAh, technology! http://qdb.us/30545112:20
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Venemokerio: ping12:47
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keriopong?12:50
Venemokerio: you are good with Python, right?12:51
keriokinda12:51
keriowhy?12:51
VenemoI need some help regarding a Python thing12:52
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keriogo right ahead12:53
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Venemokerio: pm'd you12:57
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DocScrutinizersoltys: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=68063     [on popular demand] recover key/passphrase of WLAN13:15
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soltysDocScrutinizer: thanks13:36
DocScrutinizerclick thanks on wiki ;-D13:36
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haltdefhrm, anyone noticed the media player swapping left and right audio channels for no apparent reason?13:41
DocScrutinizerhard to tell. You need to check the whole chain, esp your headset etc13:44
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DocScrutinizerattaching a weak 1.5V battery to tip and base of headphone jack will make the real left earpiece click13:45
DocScrutinizerthen you need a media file (.wav, .mp3) that's definitely correct with test signals' assignment to channels13:46
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DocScrutinizerhaltdef: I've seen ~50% of headphones having wrong channel assignment13:48
haltdefthat's the thing, it's not a permanent thing, it just decides to change them around on its own13:48
DocScrutinizerseems esp cheap chinese brands do not care at all. Often there's no labels or marks whatsoever for left and right, leaving it up to your guess what's the correct orientation13:49
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haltdefdecent pair of sony earphones, happens on every other earphones I've tried too13:50
DocScrutinizerhaltdef: errm, what? You say mediaplayer is swapping channels for the very same .mp3, from one playback to next?13:50
haltdefdifferent mp3s, different times13:50
DocScrutinizerI'd accuse the .mp3 to be inverse stereo13:51
haltdefeven if it sounds normal most of the time but swaps over what seems to be randomly? only on the n900?13:52
DocScrutinizerwhy do you assume .mp3 to be correct and mediaplayer to do nonsense?13:52
haltdefbecause the mp3 is fine everywhere else13:52
haltdefI change track and channels are still swapped13:53
MohammadAGmediaplayer doesn't do anything to play music13:53
MohammadAGmafw's playing everything13:54
DocScrutinizererr, as long as you don't have a single known good test mp3 file to select for playback every time you suspect something fishy, I'd not follow up on this report13:54
haltdefI hear you, will grab a left/right test mp3 from somewhere13:55
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DocScrutinizerplease ping me with your results and findings13:55
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DocScrutinizerI'd not deny possibility of a bug in PA or even ALSA, maybe regarding hw codec/mixer setup or sth13:56
haltdefnoticed the n900 making my music sound different a while ago, only hit me last week the stereo channels were getting swapped :P13:57
DocScrutinizerthere are several places where you could swap channels13:57
haltdefmm13:57
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banozhi there13:57
banozis it possible to port cmake 2.8 to maemo ?13:57
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DocScrutinizer~wtf mm14:00
infobotGee...  I don't know what mm means...14:00
DocScrutinizer~mm14:00
infobotShared Memory Library. URL: http://www.engelschall.com/sw/mm/14:00
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haltdefgot a wav on n900 with a voice saying "left right" over and over, normal now, just have to wait until weirdness happens and try then :P14:01
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achipaX-Fade: time has come to kick mscp into gear14:09
X-Fadeachipa: Ok here then ;)14:09
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X-Fadeachipa: So do I need to push some packages through the repo chain?14:09
achipayes14:10
achipaso, in order: block promotions of stuff that depends on libqt4-bearer-hotfix, qtquickcompat14:10
achipaand then push those two to extras14:11
achipathen we test mscp, and if it's okay, we push that too14:11
achipaat least that's the plan :)14:11
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X-Fadeachipa: What is the reasoning behind block them first?14:12
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achipajust to avoid a race condition, but if you think you can do the promotion reasonably soonish, then the order is irrelevant14:12
achipathe point being that we should not have apps directly dependent on them in testing or extras14:13
X-FadeI can script it. So it could be fast.14:13
X-Fadeachipa: Can you provide a list of exact package names and versions that need to get pushed?14:14
achipaX-Fade: qtquickcompat 0.1.0 and libqt4-bearer-hotfix 4.7.0~git20101112-0maemo114:15
achipaof course, these might get updated in which case I'll poke you again :)14:16
X-Fadeachipa: Sure.14:16
achipa(the important part of these updates being promoted in a synced manner, not by automatic dependency pulling - hence the need for a block)14:17
banozdoes anyone know why with maemo and using cmake, sometimes no .so files are generated?14:17
X-Fadeachipa: yeah, but if I push them then they will be there instantly.14:18
achipaexactly14:18
achipaalso, bergie said something about poking you if I need some tweaks for the REST interface part14:18
achipayou up for a few mods ? :)14:19
achipanothing big, just want to avoid multiple queries in kisstester that make it slow14:19
* alterego wonders why every one and their mother has to create a new thread every time there is a new phone announced (that's not even Nokia ffs)14:21
X-Fadeachipa: Sure, can you file a bug with those so I don't forget?14:21
RST38hX-Fade: the qthello wart still occurs14:22
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RST38hX-Fade: "size mismatch" for v1.1.114:22
alteregoI think Nokia knew that t.m.o was going to become a crap hole and decided, in MeeGo, to make it much more clear in regards to developer and user seperation.14:22
achipaX-Fade: aye14:22
X-Fadelunch brb14:22
RST38hYou are saying tmo is a craphole. I am saying it is a living community.14:22
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alteregoI may be being a bit harsh, I'm not in the best of moods.14:23
RST38hAnd if Nokia does not like communities consisting of real, chatting, conjecturing, bullshitting, etc people, it is their problem14:23
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alteregoHeh14:23
alteregoYes, I never really thought of it like that ;)14:24
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RST38hAnd yes I understand that from the management point of view it is way better to have a community made of corporate employees told to go and create a community14:24
alteregoIt would certainly be easier to follow though if it was just the 10 active maemo app developers :D14:24
banoz/j #kinect14:24
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JaffaRST38h: There's a culture on TMO though of "ooh, shiny thing" without being sufficiently worried about what it'll do to their primary phone.14:26
JaffaRST38h: And then said user moans about newbie complexity when somehting else breaks.14:27
JaffaRST38h: And, like typical users, they don't read the docs.14:27
* Jaffa is also perhaps not in the best of moods ;-)14:27
* lcuk slides bacon buttie over14:27
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JaffaTa. Much better.14:27
alteregoOoh, I'm actually eating a fish finger sandwich14:27
JaffaAww, unfair.14:27
* Jaffa had a Swedish sausage, topped with cheese and stuff, with gravy and mash potato.14:28
JaffaBut that was two hours ago :-(14:28
DocScrutinizerhaltdef: speaker-test http://paste.debian.net/106207/ alas probably not available and also maybe not even applicable for maemo armel & PA14:28
alteregoHeh14:29
RST38hJaffa: Yes,I am well aware of the notion that 90% of tmo posters aremindless vermin14:29
alteregoI am  bit too hungover for life today14:29
RST38hJaffa: Also aware of the Sturgeon's law14:30
RST38hJaffa: Still, you want a community made of live people? Here is your community. Want to segregate it by merit a little bit? No problem, look at devianart for how it can be done, for example.14:30
* DocScrutinizer passes alterego a glass of vodka with lemon14:30
alteregoUrgh, no thanks14:31
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alteregoToo much vodka last night14:31
alteregovodka + guinness + sambucca14:32
Appiahgj14:32
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JaffaRST38h: I don't suggest that 90% of tmo posters are mindless vermin, FWIW.14:32
RST38hJaffa: And if you just want all of them to shut up, you have got meego.com :)14:32
JaffaRST38h: Maybe 90% of posts ;-)14:32
alteregoHeh14:33
RST38hJaffa: Nice, quiet, positive, business like, and you can fire people for talkingtoo much!14:33
DocScrutinizeralterego: trust me - I know how to deal with that :-D14:35
* DocScrutinizer trows an Aspirin into that vodka lemon14:36
alteregoHahah14:36
alteregoNice :P14:36
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alterego#meego-handset14:37
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alteregoErm ... whoops14:37
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achipaMohammadAG: heya, poked people so the marge request should be in14:41
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DocScrutinizermarge request: http://cache2.allpostersimages.com/p/LRG/8/830/F52Y000Z/poster/the-simpsons-marge.jpg14:43
DocScrutinizer;-D14:43
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DocScrutinizerhmmpf, bugs in alsaped.conf - wonder whether and where to report15:06
DocScrutinizergrep tvut /usr/share/policy/etc/rx51/alsaped.conf15:07
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pupnikok one of the fun things to type into youtube is "Feynman"15:20
DocScrutinizergrep -n 'ihfandheadset    = @outband_cancellation@' /usr/share/policy/etc/rx51/alsaped.conf15:21
DocScrutinizerhey Feynman, my alter ego15:21
pupnik:)15:22
pupnikAdventures of a Curious Character15:22
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DocScrutinizerA friend of mine donnated me the book "you must be joking, Mr Feynman". He told me the first few chapters he thought the book is about me :-)15:34
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E0xDocScrutinizer: he must be joking, Mr DocScrutinizer.15:39
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MohammadAGachipa, cool :D15:43
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X-Fadeachipa: packages pushed.15:45
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alteregoHeh, I'm not even planning to promote Columbus but it's already gor 9/10 votes :D15:47
E0xMohammadAG: hi , the package of hildon-desktop with the desaturize instead of blur get keybinding broke15:47
E0xor maybe i miss something15:47
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E0xi mean , now i can't use ctrl+back for taskmanager call , or just beging type for contact search15:49
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MohammadAGE0x, gconf-schemas --register hildon-desktop-keys.schemas15:52
MohammadAGrun that as root and reboot/killall hildon-desktop15:52
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E0xMohammadAG: cool , thx work just fine..15:55
DocScrutinizergconf-schemas --register - WAAAAAH a new g* spell15:55
DocScrutinizer~nuke g*15:55
* infobot prepares 100 missle silos, and targets them at g* ... B☢☢M!15:55
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Venemolol DocScrutinizer16:17
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lardmanhow bright are compilers?16:43
lcuklardman, hmm16:43
DocScrutinizerlardman: 4216:43
lardmane.g. is it better to declare my inner for loop iterator inside the for loops or declare once at the start of the fn16:44
lardmanand then add 42 of course16:44
DocScrutinizerusually a good compiler should optimize out such things, unless explicitly instructed not to do16:45
lardmanok, well we'll see how good MATLAB's lcc compiler is then16:45
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keriogcc -O11 -ffast-math -funroll-all-loops -fblazing-balls-of-holy-awesomeness16:46
lardmanWindows I'm afraid16:46
lardmanthough I could install gcc I guess16:46
SpeedEvilLook at the generated code.16:47
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DocScrutinizeralways a good idea16:47
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lardmanyep16:47
DocScrutinizeror simply write sensible code16:47
lardmanwell that's why I was asking16:47
DocScrutinizerbasicaly there's for sure no *advantage* to do things that need to be done once, inside a for loop16:48
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lardmanexcept if it makes it easier for the compiler to optimise it away16:48
lardmanthat was my only thought16:48
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DocScrutinizerso how could that open opportunities to optimize - except moving that crap outside of the loop where it belongs nayway?16:49
lardmantwo loops, one inside the other16:50
DocScrutinizerdefine "declare inner for loop iterator"16:51
lardmanfor(x=x_start;x<x_len,++x) for(y=y_start;y<t_len:++y) do something16:51
lardmanso whether to declare y within the first loop, in the hope of making the compiler's life easier16:52
lardman as it will remain a register variable anyway16:52
SpeedEvilIs there any reason you're doing ++y?16:52
DocScrutinizerlike in for(int x=x_start;x<x_len,++x) for(int y=y_start;y<t_len:++y) ?16:53
lardmanno, typo16:53
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DocScrutinizeryou'll probably need to compare assembler output of both versions16:54
lardmanok, as I feared16:55
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lardmanbut not to worry, cycles are cheap16:55
SpeedEvilOr bench16:55
DocScrutinizerbench = PITA16:56
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DocScrutinizerasm listing FTW16:56
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lardmanThe difference in time will be miniscule, I was just wondering as I move this code from MATLAB to C16:56
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RST38hlardman: You do not want to free yourself from MATLAB runtime? =)16:57
lardmanMATLAB is good for visualisation, so this is in a mex file16:57
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SpeedEvilDo several implementations. Pick which one wins at first run.17:00
SpeedEvilThis way you have all sorts of fun hardware dependant bugs, depending on random stuff.17:00
lardmanas the code takes ~8min to run and this is just setup code, I think it probably won't matter too much17:00
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* lardman curses the fact MATLAB uses () for array elements17:04
`Ika_Musumeuhm guys yesterday i was asking howto format my sd rite? but how come my phone name changes to this http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/2404/screenshot2011020116043.png17:05
`Ika_Musumehow can i change that17:05
lardmanhmm17:05
SpeedEvilFunky17:06
lardmanwell you'll never confuse it with a humble flash drive when you've got it attached to your desktop17:06
`Ika_Musumehuh?17:07
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`Ika_Musumeanyaways can anyone help me change it?17:08
lardmanMount it on a desktop PC and change the name there?17:09
SpeedEvildosfslabel on the n900 should do it17:09
`Ika_Musumewell there its called n90017:10
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SpeedEvildosfslabel /dev/mmcblk0p1 fish17:10
SpeedEvilWill rename the thing fish17:11
DocScrutinizer51fishy17:12
`Ika_Musumelol17:12
`Ika_Musumeit stay the same17:13
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SpeedEvilyou wil need to unplug and replug it17:13
DocScrutinizer51maybe even need to reboot it17:13
`Ika_Musumehow its the main memory of n90017:13
DocScrutinizer51though I doubt17:14
`Ika_Musumereboot i can do17:14
lardmanThe "main memory" is the partition you just tried to rename, i.e. ~/MyDocs17:14
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`Ika_Musumewell its the 32 internal memory17:15
`Ika_Musumenot an sd17:15
DocScrutinizerumm, no. That's in HFM17:15
cos^heh, maemo 5 sdk installer isn't working very well. it opens in text editor if opened by default. i set it as executable and running it does nothing17:15
`Ika_Musumeif you say so17:15
DocScrutinizerHFM transcodes whatever is in partition label, it's using an own definition of that17:16
DocScrutinizerdunno what it's based on, maybe /etc/hostname17:16
cos^"run in terminal" asks "Do you want to install missing package "python-qt4"? (Type "y" to install) "..and selecting y closes the installer17:16
lardmancos^: running as root?17:17
DocScrutinizerthere are other config files as well, for that17:17
cos^lardman: of course not17:17
lardmancos^: well iirc you have to run it with sudo....17:17
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cos^lardman: ok.. now it asks to run as root after i installed python-qt4 manually17:18
cos^not very great user experience17:18
lardmanthey should have put their check earlier17:18
cos^naturally it doesn't offer to escalate the privileges, so it has to be run from console anyway17:18
cos^why bother write a install wizard, if it needs to be run from console17:19
DocScrutinizer`Ika_Musume: I suggest a ``grep -r BCM2048 /etc /home/user''17:24
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lardmandoes the partition need to be umounted before that dos-namey thing will work?17:25
`Ika_Musumeuhh17:25
`Ika_Musumeill try17:25
* lardman wonders how well that copy&replace MATLAB->C conversion just worked....17:26
* DocScrutinizer wonders how `Ika_Musume managed to get such a weird name in HFM17:30
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`Ika_Musumeidk17:32
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`Ika_Musumebtw nothing happends17:34
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DocScrutinizerhmm, home/user probably is useless anyway17:36
DocScrutinizerto grep there, that is17:36
`Ika_Musumeohwell17:37
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DocScrutinizer^C17:40
DocScrutinizer;-)17:40
`Ika_Musumeits only in the phone , mass memory is called n90017:40
`Ika_Musumeon pc17:40
DocScrutinizerif only I could recall where I've seen this friggin naming definitions for HFM17:41
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lardmanSomewhere under settings iirc one can change the device name17:41
lardmane.g. Bluetooth17:41
DocScrutinizeryeah, but only bluetooth17:42
lardmanperhaps it's used for more than that?17:42
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`Ika_Musumelol it is17:44
RST38hlardman: nah17:44
`Ika_Musumeso bluetooth name eh17:44
RST38hlardman: the actual name is also changeable via some file in /etcthough17:44
lardmanyep17:44
`Ika_Musumei changed bt and it worked17:45
DocScrutinizermeh, so why didn't the grep work then?17:45
`Ika_Musumedunno17:45
lardmanand your device will be fishy when you next use mass storage :)17:45
`Ika_Musumemaby not the right plugins?17:45
`Ika_Musumewell im happy that its back to its old name17:46
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RST38hHeh...Apple barred Sony's eReader app from its app store.18:08
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banozhi there18:17
banozcan you tell me how to install strace?18:17
banozI used apt-get install strace but I get: tpackage strace is not available, but is referred to by another package.18:18
SpeedEviltools repository18:19
SpeedEvilhttp://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/devtools/maemo518:19
banozuhm18:19
banozpackage seems strace..18:20
SpeedEvilstrace is there, once you enable the repo18:21
banozI enabled18:21
banozmy sources.list contains: # fremantle tools18:22
banozdeb http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/tools free non-free18:22
banoz# fremantle tools sources18:22
banozdeb-src http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/tools free non-free18:22
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RST38hIndian students duped by Tri-Valley University in California have been fitted with GPS devices by US immigration authorities.18:29
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DocScrutinizert900:~# apt-cache policy strace18:36
DocScrutinizerstrace:18:36
DocScrutinizer  Installed: 4.5.18-1.1+0m518:36
DocScrutinizer *** 4.5.18-1.1+0m5 018:36
DocScrutinizer        500 http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/tools/free Packages18:36
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trumeeRST38h, silly american policy19:39
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vi_so, anyone gona port trem to the n900?20:20
wmarone-n900trem?20:20
vi_tremulous!20:20
vi_has anyone else noticed the massive bug with kernel-config script yet?20:22
merlin1991vi_, is the current trem ioquake3 based or did they move to xreal?20:22
vi_it is ioquake20:22
vi_but debian armel does not use opengles20:23
vi_so there is no hardw. accel.20:23
vi_making 0.25 fps20:23
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vi_you follow?20:24
merlin1991yep20:24
vi_so how do i make it use opengles?20:24
vi_a magic symlink or two?20:24
merlin1991rebuild from sratch I fear20:24
vi_or does the code need to be altered?20:24
vi_lame20:24
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merlin1991afaik there are asm parts in the x86 code wich you have to convert20:25
vi_there is already an arm port of trem thatruns20:25
merlin1991also you'd have to get around opt / rootfs limitations20:25
vi_my rootfs is 10GB XD20:26
merlin1991well common user rootfs is smallish :)20:26
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merlin1991but I think with the right tweaks in the fs code of the engine you could have all the data files in MyDocs20:26
vi_there is an arm port of trem that runs but without HW accel.20:27
vi_all trem data is stored in home directory20:27
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vi_only 400k binary is in rootfs space20:27
vi_(excuse my tersness, i am on the n900)20:28
merlin1991is the data in /home/user or in /home/user/MyDocs20:28
merlin1991because /home/user would still be limited to 2 gb20:29
vi_anyway i have put a 50$ bounty on maemo talk for the first dev who can get me tremming.20:29
merlin1991hrhr20:29
merlin1991I think I have something to hack on :)20:29
vi_the data will be in the users home directory20:29
vi_it is only 100mb anyway20:29
merlin1991talk link?20:29
vi_uh, i am on irssi on n900. cant paste links so easy. just search maemo talk for the work bounty20:30
vi_^word20:30
merlin1991xchat > irssi ;)20:31
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felluirssi > *20:32
felluvi_, why you cant paste links easy?20:32
felluJust paste o.o20:32
felluclick on the "X Terminal" and then paste o.o20:32
felluNot so hard20:33
merlin1991fellu my main concern wit irssi on the n900 is, the time I tried it I couldn't get it to switch channel tab :D20:33
fellu:D20:33
felluthere is esc for that20:33
felluon the touch screen20:33
felluesc + 120:33
felludo same the alt + 120:33
felluesc is like alt in irssi20:33
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felluhard to join to all channels again and again with different client I use at home .P20:34
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vi_whadya think bro?20:40
andre__vi_: that your spellchecker is broken20:42
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vi_bleh20:42
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vi_well the offer is legit anyways20:43
merlin1991well I'll give it a try anyway20:43
merlin1991time I finally read that opengles book I own :)20:43
vi_:)20:44
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vi_a20:47
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vi_i wish there was an email solution that didnt totally suck balls20:53
vi_i wish there was an email solution that didnt totally suck balls20:55
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lardman|homeanyone know of anything that can take assembly language (i.e. objdump output) and output pseudo-C ?20:56
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vi_lol20:57
vi_what you are talking about is the mad dream of a feverish reverse engineer(ist)20:57
lardman|homeit's quite doable, just wondering if someone's actually bothered to do it20:58
vi_actually, it isnt20:58
vi_what architecture?20:58
lardman|homerally? why not?20:58
lcukint d1,d2,d3,d4;20:58
lardman|homereally even20:58
lcukint *a1,a2,a3,a4;20:59
lcuk;)20:59
* lcuk should add more *s20:59
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lardman|homelcuk: exactly, was just how the opo revtran output used to look :)20:59
* lcuk shudders20:59
lcukmind you, i have written similar in visual basic20:59
* lcuk hides20:59
vi_well the best you can get is ida pro (if you can convince them to sell it to you)21:00
lardman|homeyes, and you need the add on thingy afaik21:00
vi_then lateraly ollie dbg, but for x86 only21:00
lardman|homeaqualung used to work, but not now21:00
vi_well if ya already know why are you asking?21:01
lardman|homeis /sys/class/sec/ Android only, or do we see that under normal Linux?21:01
lardman|homevi_: I'd like something that works better21:01
lardman|homeand without ida21:01
vi_compilation isnt like a one-way-hash its more of a rubiks cube21:02
vi_there are many ways to arrive at the final construct21:02
lardman|homeI know that, I don't expect to run it, tweak one line and be able to re-compile21:02
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lardman|homebut it is tiring looking at assembly all the time21:03
vi_well if there is a better prog then i dont know it21:03
vi_yup21:03
vi_get used to it bro21:03
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lardman|homeI wish I'd not left my laptop at work, sounds like a decent little project while my wife's watching silent witness21:03
vi_uk huh!21:03
lardman|homeyep21:04
vi_woot21:04
vi_what are you trying to reverse?21:04
lardman|homeGalaxy Tab init21:04
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vi_ooooft21:05
vi_well good luck with that!21:06
lardman|homeit will be easy enough, init is not very large21:06
vi_why21:06
lardman|homebecause it does things that the released code does not21:06
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lardman|homeit knows whether you've held down a key to enable recovery mode, I want to intercept that and start Meego in that case, otherwise exec the existing Android init21:07
lardman|homeso really I could just do it all with strings output, but it would be nicer to have something that generates pseudo-code, which is what I think everytime I do this21:08
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lardman|homehmm, impressive, objdump seems to have output an awful lot of "undefined instruction"s21:10
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makulkaralterego, hey are you around?21:20
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timeless_xchatso, anyone here going to fosdem?21:22
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alteregomakulkar: yup21:25
alteregomakulkar: what's up?21:25
makulkaralterego, awesome.. need a quick help!21:25
alteregoSure, go ahead21:26
makulkaralterego, apt-get install/source in scratchbox failed for me. Saying 404 error and packages not authenticated!21:26
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alteregodid you start by doing apt-get update?21:27
alteregoHave you made any modifications to /etc/apt/sources.list21:27
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makulkaralterego, yes21:27
alteregoCan you pastebin.com the contents of your sources.list file21:28
makulkaralterego, i had run update before. Trying agian now21:28
makulkaralterego, Great! did update and then apt-get source worked..21:29
makulkaralterego, thanks once again!21:29
alteregoNo problem ;)21:30
vi_alterego, i have put a bounty up on maemo talk for tremulous21:30
vi_somone yesterday said you may be interested21:30
vi_just a headsup :)21:31
alteregoI'll have a look :)21:31
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vi_just search for bounty21:31
alteregoCool21:31
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N900dudeYo21:45
N900dudethe n900 sucks ballz21:45
RST38hok21:45
RST38hGot anything else to say?21:46
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AlbundyYa21:46
vi_on the contrary sir, you mother sucks ballz.  mine to be precise.21:46
SpeedEvilMine doesn't.21:47
SpeedEvilIt's in my pocket right now.21:47
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AlbundyIts a PO21:48
AlbundyPos21:48
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vi_woah, how can i getz n9oo to suck mi ballz pls21:48
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AlbundyEverything slow and clunky man21:48
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vi_what is?21:49
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vi_basicaly n900 is not for noobs21:49
GNUtoo|laptopwhat do you intend by noob?21:49
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GNUtoo|laptopsomeone could argue that smartphones are not for noobs21:50
vi_just n9oo is not for noobz21:50
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GNUtoo|laptopyes but what kind of people is a noobz? it has a GUI etc...21:50
vi_unfortunatly you need to learn a thing or two before you can exploit its full potential21:51
FoneManYou dudes dont like a discussion, do yous? You just insult people, do ya?21:51
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vi_people who constantly go on the forum complaining about permissions21:51
GNUtoo|laptopwhy do "noobs" need to exploit the full potential21:51
vi_-_-21:52
vi_they dont21:52
FoneManWhut?21:52
GNUtoo|laptopyes, and why is it an issue?21:52
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GNUtoo|laptopI mean it won't be different with other devices21:52
FoneManN900 slow for me why?21:52
vi_they hear us banging on about how ace the n900 is only to be horrified that it doesnt set itself up21:52
vi_a complex tool requires effort to learn ro use effectivly21:53
FoneManN900 aint complex man21:53
vi_ok, shoot it foneman.  why does your n900 suck?21:54
GNUtoo|laptopfor instance take android21:54
GNUtoo|laptopandroid is complex too21:54
GNUtoo|laptopit has multiple screens21:54
vi_wut?21:54
GNUtoo|laptopand need learning from non-tecnical people21:54
vi_that is not what i am talking about21:54
GNUtoo|laptopit's no different21:54
vi_a fucking chimp can operate androind and maemo21:54
FoneManBecause the stylus is crap and screen is a disaster21:54
GNUtoo|laptop<vi_> that is not what i am talking about -> that's why I asked to define a noob21:54
* lcuk adores the n900 screen21:55
lcukits touchable and precise :)21:55
FoneManResistive screen in 2011 seriously dude21:55
* GNUtoo|laptop too like resistive touchscreen21:55
vi_for example writing cron jobs and upstart scripts to automate the phone=advanced21:55
GNUtoo|laptopthey are the way to go if you want to leverage GNU/Linux applications21:55
GNUtoo|laptopelse everything must be rewriten21:55
FoneMan600 mhz procesor is for pussies dude21:55
GNUtoo|laptopwhich isn't great21:55
GNUtoo|laptopyou end up with something like android21:55
lcukFoneMan, ok, my only misgiving about capacitive is the low resolution21:56
GNUtoo|laptopwhere you have a market21:56
GNUtoo|laptopand most of the stuff that is on the market is properitary21:56
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GNUtoo|laptopand I bet not free as in cost too but I didn't verify21:56
vi_yes 600mhz is for pussies -_-21:56
GNUtoo|laptopbut on the other hand21:56
lcuki don't care *what* technology it ends up being, but a high precision pen for times its needed is important.21:56
makulkaralterego, btw, could you point me to all code of columbus example you gave me if possible?21:56
GNUtoo|laptoptheir base is more free21:56
FoneManEverything just crawls on the n900 like a frikin turtle21:56
GNUtoo|laptopas in freedom21:56
GNUtoo|laptopvi seem a troll21:56
* lcuk runs laptops at 600 and 800mhz respectively21:57
vi_you were probably conceived on a 233mhz pii21:57
vi_i am a troll?21:57
lcukvi_, i wish more people were21:57
GNUtoo|laptopand it's an armv721:57
GNUtoo|laptopvi_, yes it seem so21:57
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lcukif you were, your apps would be dreamy on 600mhz21:57
lcukthink back just a few years: amigas had 7mhz21:57
GNUtoo|laptoparmv7 with NEON + linaro gcc patch is very fast21:58
GNUtoo|laptoptake an openmoko freerunner21:58
GNUtoo|laptopit has 400Mhz21:58
FoneManIts a plastick brick that squeeks like an old duck21:58
GNUtoo|laptopand armv421:58
vi_because i had the audacity to suggest that while n900 has more potential it is proportionally harder to use said potential?21:58
GNUtoo|laptopthat is slow21:58
vi_perhaps the chap saying 600mhz is for pussies is the troll21:58
vi_you noob21:58
GNUtoo|laptopvi_, yes21:59
GNUtoo|laptopsorry21:59
GNUtoo|laptopI do 2 things at once21:59
vi_np breh21:59
GNUtoo|laptopso I tought it was you that was saying that21:59
vi_i like to argue too much :)21:59
FoneManDont matter who saying what the thing is n900 sucks ballz people22:00
GNUtoo|laptopbasically imagine you want to make a device that can leverage GNU/Linux applications22:00
GNUtoo|laptopyou need high resolution and capacitive touchscreen22:00
GNUtoo|laptopand an hardware keyboard is great too22:00
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FoneManThe fone part is a disaster everytime i get a call the screen becomes jibberish and shit22:01
GNUtoo|laptopI never used the phone part on maemo22:01
GNUtoo|laptopso I can't tell22:01
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vi_ignore foneman22:02
FoneManNo more support for n900 either sucks man22:02
vi_foneman is ass22:02
RST38hGoogle is planning to hire "dozens" of software engineers, product managers, user-interface experts and "others who have ideas for mobile apps," and it's apparently already shifted some of its current employees to work in this new "apps lab."22:03
vi_why do you need a cap touch screen?22:03
RST38hHow interesting22:03
GNUtoo|laptopFoneMan, that's because a lot of the base system is non-free, so try meego or SHR22:03
vi_seriously22:03
FoneManCoz i dont wanna be fuckin around with a stylus22:03
vi_ignore foneman22:03
* Sicelo agrees with vi_ about FoneMan22:04
vi_(fwd slash)ignore foneman22:04
GNUtoo|laptopwhy did you buy an n900 if you don't like stylus22:04
vi_and he will fuck off22:04
vi_i like the stylus22:04
vi_whos beefin on le stylo22:04
vi_?22:04
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FoneManWhut?22:05
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* kerio beefs on le stylo22:11
keriowhatever that means22:11
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kerioi actually almost never use the stylus22:12
kerioi pretty much always use the finger22:12
vi_except with MC right!!!!22:12
kerio?22:13
SpeedEvilI use the stylus.22:13
SpeedEvilBut only to kill.22:13
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RST38hSpeed: How come you did not tell him who you kill with your stylus?22:14
FoneManNo stylus? How?22:14
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vi_holy shit there is some balls stirring22:14
vi_flash 10.122:15
vi_from meego22:15
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vi_on the forum22:15
keriovi_: emacs is better than you, btw22:17
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wmaronevi_: iirc, the one that's getting passed around is the TI evaluation binary22:19
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SpeedEvilThe binary does not have accelleration - so ...22:35
Venemowho cares about flash anyway?22:35
wmarone-n900lots of people, sadly22:36
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Venemoheh22:38
Venemoit is a nice thing to have, yes22:38
Venemobut not that important22:38
Venemomost flash on the net I block with adblock anyway :P22:38
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jaskalooks like some forumadolfs removed the links22:44
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Jaffajaska: Sod off22:45
Jaffajaska: a) it's piracy; b) the Community Council is *trying* to get a proper release and TI have requested that they don't get contacted by random people (and randoms distributing their IP won't help)22:46
luke-jrit's not piracy.22:46
luke-jrstop spreading FUD22:46
wmaroneluke-jr: it's being distributed in violation of the license agreement, whatever it is, it has no place on TMO22:47
luke-jrcopyright infringement is one thing, piracy is another.22:47
Jaffaluke-jr: "piracy" is a common (even if historically inaccurate) term for the distribution of software in violation of the copyright holder's license and agreement.22:47
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wmaronewell if you want to correct that, you'll have to go back 300 years :P22:47
Venemois there anyone who is good with X keymaps?22:48
luke-jrJaffa: not merely historically. presently wrong.22:48
SpeedEvilyarrrr!22:48
luke-jrit is common FUD that should not be encouraged or spread22:48
wmaronewhatever22:48
SpeedEvilluke-jr: you disagree that it's piracy, or you disagree that it's being distributed in violation of copyright?22:48
luke-jrcopyright infringement is *nothing* compared to piracy22:48
luke-jrSpeedEvil: I disagree that it's piracy.22:48
luke-jrpiracy is raiding ships at high seas, etc22:49
luke-jrgenerally involves murder and other serious criminal activity22:49
luke-jrcopyright infringement is not even criminal, let alone gravely immoral as piracy is.22:49
Jaffaluke-jr: Yes, I was implying that people distributing Flash 10 were rapists.22:49
Jaffaluke-jr: Stop arguing for the sake of it.22:49
luke-jrJaffa: fine. then stop spreading FUD22:50
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* SpeedEvil is unsure what point luke-jr is arguing.22:51
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luke-jrSpeedEvil: merely that copyright infringement shouldn't even be *compared* to piracy, let alone equated.22:51
SpeedEvilYou want to defend the good name of Pirates, who did not ever infringe copyright, just looted, and pillaged?22:51
JaffaSpeedEvil: No, the good name of copyright infringers.22:52
luke-jrcopyright infringement is merely the violation of a civil law, that has no moral relevance beyond obedience to State.22:52
JaffaSpeedEvil: And that the colloquial usage of "piracy" on an IRC channel when someone else uses the term "forumadolfs" is perfectly suitable and substantive.22:52
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Jaffas/\./ to argue about./22:54
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piggzis mfe open sourced by nokia? (i guess not)23:03
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javispedromoo.23:28
lcukbaa23:29
javispedroboo.23:29
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DocScrutinizermaa23:44
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korhojoailma23:47
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pupnik_any of you think jews organized 9/11?23:51
wmaroneno, but I bet you have23:52
trxlol, have i entered the wrong channel? :D23:52
wmaronetrx: no, you encountered pupnik23:52
trx:))23:53
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