IRC log of #maemo for Saturday, 2011-01-08

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yaccOk, where can I define a script that gets run when bnep0 comes up?00:03
yacc/etc/network/interfaces seems to be ignored, but I'll test in a moment again ;)00:03
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yaccCan it be that the power kernel is missing some modules by default: When I plug in the USB cable no pop up comes, only after running mad and selecting windows networking the popup shows up. The host PC does not show any USB devices either, ...00:05
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MohammadAGalterego, where?00:07
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psycho_oreospower kernel isn't missing anything, I can get pc suite mode after plugging in the USB cable between the n900 and the PC00:11
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psycho_oreosshould I say its not missing anything of that sort..00:12
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nomisMhm, I think tvbgone made it into the repositories.00:31
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crashanddie_why I declined an invitation to CES this year, I don't know:;page00:57
alteregoHello :D00:58
alteregoAnyway, there are always hot girls at tech conferences00:59
crashanddie_yeah,but hot damn, that brown chick?00:59
alteregoI wouldn't rate one above the other tbh01:01
MohammadAGdoesn't france have hot girls?01:01
MohammadAGholy crap01:01
crashanddie_DocScrutinizer51: check link01:01
alteregoThere are hot girls everywhere :P01:01
crashanddie_yeah, but these ones already know you're a geek (because you're at a tech conference), and still talk to you01:02
MohammadAGalterego, usually, you try to go out with them, not decline the invitations01:02
DocScrutinizer51I'm a Asia fan01:02
crashanddie_DocScrutinizer51: I'm dating a half caucasian, half korean chick who grew up in India ;)01:03
DocScrutinizer51crashanddie_: go to the district. Same applies (except s/geek/redneck/)01:03
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MohammadAG;thum second thoughts anyone01:03
DocScrutinizer51they get paid for talking to you in both cases01:04
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crashanddie_MohammadAG: I don't like the whorish look01:04
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DocScrutinizer51and usually they hate it01:04
crashanddie_wtf, I wanted to google "list of community episodes", and ended up with qpixmap?01:05
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DocScrutinizer51Hoshi Sato >> seven01:08
MohammadAGcrashanddie_, did I say I do?01:08
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MohammadAGsh: Hoshi not found01:09
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ZogG_workThe theremin was originally the product of Russian government-sponsored research into proximity sensors01:11
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crashanddie_oh, and if anyone doesn't know community, just watch these three clips:
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ZogG_workcrashanddie_: community tvshow?01:16
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ZogG_workcrashanddie_: this is better01:17
ZogG_workthough bibliotek is classic01:17
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crashanddie_no, this is the best:
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ZogG_workcrashanddie_: no, this
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alteregoJust used my N900 to watch a filem on my xbox01:20
alteregoUsing my remote controller app and a usb cord in mass storage01:20
alteregoyes :P01:20
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alteregoSorry, it's a private joke :D01:21
ZogG_workcrashanddie_: el tigre chino01:21
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Shapeshifterwtf happened to ping -W? busybox?01:21
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nomischem|st: I just put the tvbgone package into maemo Extras. If you're curious, check it out.01:21
alteregoWhat do it do?01:21
alteregodoes ..01:22
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Shapeshiftertimeout in seconds01:23
SpeedEvilIt provides an aiming graticule so you can throw your n900 accurately through the TV.01:23
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nomisalterego: it sends lots of infrared tv switch off codes.01:24
Shapeshifterbah busybox. curses!!01:24
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Shapeshifterboo busybox, yay whoever packaged real ping for the repos01:27
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ZogG_workShapeshifter: don't like it? do it better01:29
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infobotmessy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils01:32
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MrBawbShapeshifter: you might want to check out the package mtr-tiny if you haven't already01:37
DocScrutinizer51yay for mtr01:37
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alteregonomis: oh, I've got a script that does that so I can find out remotes for whatever device.01:40
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nomisalterego: yeah, this applet is more about switching off that annoying TV in the restaurant...  :)01:50
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alteregoWell, my script does the same thing :P01:51
alteregoThough it tells you the config file, so you know how to change the channel.01:51
jacekowskii've tried it01:52
jacekowskiand it worked first time01:52
jacekowskibut not second01:52
jacekowskiand third01:52
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Tuco_mariawhere can i get CHROME for MAEMO?01:56
alteregoI don't KNOW01:57
Tuco_mariaoh my...01:58
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Tuco_mariais there an alternate mail CLIENT available?02:00
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jacekowskiTuco_maria: THERE is AN article ON my WEBSITE with LINKS02:00
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dueseTuco_maria: claws mail02:01
alteregoThere are SEVERAL mail CLIENTs02:01
Tuco_mariaclaws mail INTERFACE is not NICE02:01
jacekowskiTOUGH life02:01
Tuco_mariahey jace, whats your WEBSITE??02:01
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jacekowskimy WEBSITE address is
jacekowskioh i failed02:02
jacekowskimy WEBSITE address IS
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alteregoI thought WE WERE doing RANDOM capitalization.02:03
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Tuco_mariaoh man, ther ARE no MAIL clients there02:03
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Tuco_mariaonly CHROME02:03
jacekowskiTuco_maria: BUT there is CHROME there02:03
Tuco_mariathats nice02:03
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Tuco_mariai will ASK my mentor IF its safe to INSTALL it02:04
jacekowskiIT'S very UNSAFE02:04
Tuco_mariaoh no02:04
Tuco_mariawill it ERASE my stuff?02:05
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alteregoYou need to flash chrome os to use chrome02:05
Tuco_mariado i need to REBOOT the device?02:06
jacekowskiIT will CAUSE cancer INFERTILITY and MAY poke YOUR eyeballs OUT02:06
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alteregoYou need to ANTIBOOT your DEVICE02:07
Tuco_mariahow does SOMEONE do that??02:07
BCMMwhat the hell happened in here?02:08
BCMMeither my IRC client is broken, or you are all broken.02:08
Tuco_mariaARE you using CHROME too?02:08
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inzBCMM, about this happened: s/\w+/rand 3 < 1 ? uc($&) : $&/ge02:12
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keriowhy are WE all randomly CAPITALIZING some words?02:17
jacekowskiI don't know TUCO_MARIA started IT02:17
Tuco_mariats NOT my FAULT02:17
Tuco_mariai just wanted CHROME02:17
jacekowskiI want GOLD02:18
BCMMyeah what HAPPENED to chrome?02:18
kerioi want to sleep02:18
kerioand i want internet access in my dreams02:18
jacekowskisome PATENT issues, BUT i MOVED it TO my REPOSITORY02:18
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Tuco_mariaarent you AFRAID of the CYBERPOLICE?02:20
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jacekowskithat PATENT is NOT valid IN eu02:25
Tuco_mariaso, WHY is it not in EXTRAS? isnt nokia FINNISH??02:26
jacekowskinokia IS doing BUSINESS in USA02:27
ds3are THEY done?02:28
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alteregoHow hard is it to get gcc on the N900?02:30
alteregoAnyone here do it?02:30
* alterego guesses a chroot is probably the nicest way.02:31
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Tuco_mariai dont KNOW02:32
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jacekowskialterego: just APT-GET it02:35
crashanddie_next one to random cap gets bitch slapped02:38
alteregojacekowski: yeah, will it fit?02:38
crashanddie_alterego: yeah, should do02:38
crashanddie_alterego: apt-get build-essential02:38
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alteregois freeglut3 right for gles2 and egl?02:39
jacekowskialterego: it SHOULD02:40
alterego-dev that is02:40
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* crashanddie_ bitchslaps jacekowski 02:40
alteregoHeh, we have no buildafessential :P02:41
* alterego checks -devel repo is enabled02:42
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Tuco_mariahey JACE, how do i ADD your REPOSITORY???02:47
alteregocan't even install gcc :/02:47
jacekowskiI don't KNOW02:47
jacekowskiGOOGLE knows02:47
Tuco_mariaI dont HAVE google AVAILABLE02:49
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ZogG_workjacekowski i had swedish gf from Stockholm once =)03:03
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Tuco_mariai GIVE up, cant get CHROME to install03:15
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mikki-kunhm... isn't the internal client good enough?03:22
mikki-kunand i think there was some qtmail or something03:22
mikki-kunmaybe install fapman and then search there for mail (just type and it searches live)03:23
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Tuco_mariaBAD name, GOOD app03:26
mikki-kuni was like "WTF?! what's that a name for?!" but now i got used to it03:27
mikki-kunyou can't even compare it to the standart app-manager from nokia03:28
mikki-kunwhich takes ages to load03:28
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DocScrutinizerWtF Is gOiNg oN HeRe?03:38
Robot101DocScrutinizer: i don't KNOW its REALLY annoying isn't IT?03:38
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DocScrutinizerYeS iT Is03:38
Tuco_mariathats KINDA emo Doc...03:39
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DocScrutinizeryou're kinda prone for +q03:39
Robot101Tuco_maria: seriously, what's wrong with your shift/capslock, is it stuck to the space bar or something?03:39
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Tuco_mariaI dont have a caps lock key, real men hold shift all the time03:40
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DocScrutinizerwhatever - you've been warned. It's not just me being especially grumpy today, I also have to care about those who complain03:41
Tuco_mariapeople actually complained?03:41
Tuco_mariai just wanted to install chrome03:42
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crashanddie_Pro-tip: don't tell your CEO you're on twitter, unless you're really really sure you're ready to see him "follow" you.03:45
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ZogG_worki made my acc private03:46
DocScrutinizerbetter yet: don't use twitter at all :-P03:46
crashanddie_yeah well, I had kinda stopped03:48
crashanddie_I just have it as a notifier on the desktop, with the people I kinda enjoy reading03:48
crashanddie_Until... today03:48
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mikki-kunbut where is chrome for the n900 actgually?03:52
mikki-kuni only know of chromium03:53
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mikki-kunhm, does here anybody use diaspora?04:00
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crashanddie_DocScrutinizer: honestly, had the idiot kept going with his random capsing, I would've probably... KICKED him.04:01
crashanddie_anyway, 3 AM04:01
crashanddie_Time to stop working04:01
crashanddie_'later all.04:01
DocScrutinizercrashanddie_: cya, and yes I was amazed you didn't04:02
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crashanddie_I was really busy?04:03
crashanddie_anyway, good night all04:03
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nox--good idea04:03
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ZogG_workDocScrutinizer: do u sleep at all?04:12
ZogG_worki think u are robot04:12
DocScrutinizerdamn, now you noticed it04:12
ZogG_worki'm gonna tell everyone04:13
DocScrutinizernobody wil believe you :-D04:13
DocScrutinizermy algorithms are too good04:13
ZogG_workDocScrutinizer: try to devide by zero04:14
DocScrutinizerI'm trying, but it doesn't compute. denominator missing04:16
dotblankWhats the easiest way to clone the autobuild server?04:17
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DocScrutinizererrr, copy the harddisk?04:17
dotblankBecause I keep getting binaries that are completely different once I feed it into the autobuilder04:17
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dotblanklike, the autobuilder seems to remove signals and slots from my ui files04:18
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dotblankAlso it doesn't seems to omit my qgraphicsview widget completely04:18
DocScrutinizernow that's weird04:18
dotblankalso it seems*04:18
dotblankbut I buid my app in my sbox and everything works04:19
dotblankI made sure I don't have any ifdefs and the like.. and I don't04:19
dotblankmy debian rules are building with qmake-qt404:19
dotblankshould it just be qmake now?04:19
DocScrutinizerhmm, iirc there's some magic on autobuilder to choose the lowest version libs that still will compile, to keep backwards compatibility for packages04:20
dotblankhmm... maybe if I set the build depends version numebrs04:20
dotblankbut how would it even still compile?04:20
DocScrutinizerno idea really04:20
DocScrutinizersounds starnge04:21
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dotblankI looked at the build log and nothing warns or echo's any errors about it04:21
DocScrutinizeraren't the logs and intermediate files available on buildhost?04:21
DocScrutinizerand still the binary doesn't behave and does what exactly?04:22
dotblankok.. My application "groove" from the repos when built manually show a downlaod progress bar04:23
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dotblankit isn't using the QProgressBar or anything liek that.. Its custom using QGraphics04:23
DocScrutinizerand you're running this locally built app on N900?04:23
dotblankwhen you get the autobuilt version it hides the progress bar04:24
dotblankDocScrutinizer, yes04:24
dotblankwell from my sbox04:24
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dotblankscp'd over04:24
DocScrutinizersorry, I can't help. Have no experience with buildhost04:25
dotblankisn't it just pbuilder all fancy?04:25
dotblankno idea how to setup pbuilder for an arm target04:25
DocScrutinizerI'd try to get hold of the intermediate files, after preprocessor mangled them04:26
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dotblanklibqt4-core libqt4-dbus libqt4-declarative libqt4-gui libqt4-maemo504:28
dotblankthose are what it pulls to link against04:28
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ZogG_workwatching good film04:29
dotblankMaybe this is why04:29
dotblankmy n900 has qt 4.704:30
dotblankmy sdk has qt 4.604:30
dotblankI bet thats it04:30
dotblankI bet it links with qt 4.704:30
dotblankand builds it with that04:30
ZogG_workwhy would u use qt4.704:31
dotblankwell.. the autobuilder seems to use it..04:31
dotblankI may see if I can force it to use a different one04:31
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ZogG_workdotblank: just punch it in the face04:36
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dotblankwell right now i'm updateing the sdk and see if I get the same issues as the autobuilder04:38
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chem|stnomis: have to send in my device for insurance issue first but will have a look when it is back ty!04:42
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BCMMis it normal for "QIcon::fromTheme("go-down")" to not work on maemo?05:06
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ZogG_workBCMM: last time we talked portage was updated again05:09
ZogG_workit's 2.1.98 nowi think05:09
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BCMMZogG_work: i don't see a 2.1.9805:10
ZogG_workmaybe i just told wrong05:10
ZogG_workor was it
ZogG_workanyway the day we talked i synced and got new version05:12
ZogG_worki think we need talk about it everyday05:12
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BCMMi'm new to Qt and might be doing things stupidly, but presumably there is a small collection of standard icons available? i'm just trying to draw a simple arrow pointing down. QPushButton next(QIcon::fromTheme("go-down"), ""); works fine on my desktop, showing an icon from KDE's icon set. am i going about things the wrong way?05:13
BCMM(i get no error or anything; just a button with no icon)05:13
ZogG_workdid u draw it?05:23
ZogG_worki don't understand anything in it at all but as it fromTheme probably u put the icon in wrong place05:24
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BCMMZogG_work: no, i'm trying to use standard icons05:25
ZogG_workare u sure it has "go-down name?05:26
ZogG_workhmm google should05:27
ZogG_workgoogle showed me that it's ok05:27
ZogG_worktry to use ' instead of "05:27
BCMMZogG_work: uh, that's C++ source code.05:28
BCMMlooking at /usr/share/icons/hicolor/, it appears maemo doesn't have standard icons05:28
ZogG_workfwd_button->setIcon(QIcon::fromTheme("go-next", QIcon(":/icons/go-next.png")));05:28
BCMM(also, i know that code is correct-ish, because the same code running on my desktop uses KDE's standard up and down icons)05:29
BCMMZogG_work: thanks, but that's pretty much the same05:30
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BCMM(except that you're setting the icon on a button that already exists instead of creating a button, and that's a right-pointing instead of down-pointing button.)05:30
BCMMarrow, rather05:30
BCMMin any case, go-next.png is also in standard icon themes, but absent on maemo05:31
BCMMi can use rss_reader_move_down though05:32
ZogG_workno way maemo doesn't have standart icons05:32
BCMMi can understand them not putting in a full set of freedesktop icons to save space, since that would include loads of stuff that would never get used05:32
ZogG_workjust maybe u should set the default dir05:33
BCMMZogG_work: to what?05:33
ZogG_workas hildon is not qt05:33
ZogG_worki mean not all icons05:34
ZogG_workbut at least the most standart05:34
ZogG_workas they are used in apps05:34
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ZogG_workDocScrutinizer: i was talking about stand-art =)05:41
BCMMis there anything wrong with using rss_reader_move_down in my application, and is there anything like a collection of maemo-style icons that one can use in applications?05:42
BCMM(other than the general_ icons, which i already found)05:43
DocScrutinizerI think the hildon icons you can assume to exist. Otherwise your app should have its own icon set05:43
DocScrutinizernot sure what's going to happen to rss_reader_move_down if I deinstall rss reader05:44
DocScrutinizerquite obviously you'll not find KDE icons on maemo05:46
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BCMMDocScrutinizer: i wasn't expecting to find KDE's icons, nor was i using them, specifically05:57
BCMMgo-next.png is a freedesktop standard05:58
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DocScrutinizer51ooh, wasn't aware there's a freedesktop set of icons. Anyway i'm not too optimistic about maemo/hildon's freedesktop conformity06:01
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BCMMDocScrutinizer51: yeah it's neat, means KDE and Gnome stuff use the same icon-naming scheme, and an application that wants to fit in on either can just say it wants the current theme's "Save" icon or whatever and look good on either06:05
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BCMMi can see why taht isn't in maemo though, since for example the Oxygen set is 40MB06:06
DocScrutinizer51hmm, so either it comes with maemo/hildon by default, or there should be a pkg to install those icons06:06
BCMMa freedesktop set, you mean?06:07
BCMMwell, the chief problem is probably the way one doesn't exist :)06:07
BCMMi mean, to match maemo's style06:07
BCMMthe main reason i'm surprised is that maemo has i quite distinctive icon style, especially when it comes to arrows06:08
BCMM^a quite06:09
BCMMand i don't know why i haven't noticed inconsistancy06:09
DocScrutinizer51probably if there was such a icon pkg, then apps had to find a way to extract and install only the icons they need06:09
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BCMMi mean that little "v"-shaped arrow with no stem is in quite a few places, even being used to indicate when the window icon is clickable06:11
BCMMof course, the browser uses a more traditional arrow for no particular reason...06:11
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dotblankYea I didn't notice a freedesktop icon set06:22
BCMMDocScrutinizer51: heh, there is indeed some failure from having each app reinvent icons06:22
BCMMdiff /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/hildon/general_back.png /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/hildon/qgn_back_fsm.png06:22
dotblankor at least I tried to use it06:22
BCMMwhat do "fsm" and "qgn" stand for there?06:22
BCMMdotblank: there is definitely, definitely not one, at least in scratchbox06:24
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jacekowskiinfobot: fsm is Flying Spaghetti Monster06:25
infobot...but fsm is already something else...06:25
infobotfsm is probably The Flying Spaghetti Monster, the deity of the internet06:25
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dotblankugh.. I really don't want to rewrite my whole playlist system again :(06:27
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ZogG_workscrew you guys, i'm going home =)06:44
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pupnikgood mooorning maemotnam!06:52
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SpeedEvil - on-topic - really06:58
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SpeedEvilIs anyone in a position to tcpdump the above app, when it's scanning a barcode?06:59
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* pupnik salutes kthomas_vh 07:09
pupnikwell i'm too stupid to set up samba in 201107:09
pupnikor someone's messing with me07:10
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ZogGpupnik why would you need samba at all?07:29
jacekowskiSpeedEvil: it's probably using tesco grocery api07:29
SpeedEviljacekowski: what do you mean by that?07:30
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SpeedEviljacekowski: I was assuming they have a private API - hence the question.07:30
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jacekowskiit's probably same api07:31
pupnikZogG: share media stuff07:31
pupnikoh firewall.. duh07:31
SpeedEviljacekowski: I'd not seen this at all, thanks.07:32
SpeedEviljacekowski: how new is this?07:32
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jacekowskiat least year or so07:33
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ZogGpupnik ftp, networksharing, bluetooth07:37
ZogGlet the F windows to try to find solution07:37
ZogGwe don't bend anymore07:37
pupnikthere should be a knots2 client for android i guess07:39
pupnikthen my friends could download that07:39
pupnikand i wouldn't have to mess with samba07:39
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yahyayahim currently using the n900 and today my fone went crazy.  It wont go past the boot screen without powering down.07:48
yahyayahanyone have any ideas to trouble shooting this issue07:48
SpeedEvilDid you do anthing to it?07:49
yahyayahrecently updated the firmware07:52
yahyayahive had this isssue before but i would boot after a couple tries07:52
yahyayahunfortunately this time it just keeps rebooting and never goes into the nokia splash screen07:52
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SpeedEvilSorry - I'm particularly tired ATM - going to sleep. Good luck07:55
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yahyayahany one have any advice07:59
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pupnikhi yahyayah08:16
yahyayahhello pupnik08:16
pupnikreflash the device08:17
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yahyayahi will give it a try08:17
yahyayahwhen i plug in my usb and power up the phone it continues to keep rebooting but doesnt go into the nokia splash,  do you think the phone will stay on long enough to flash it08:18
SpeedEvilIt doesn't need to get that far to flash08:19
pupnikif i said 'no' what would you do?08:19
SpeedEvilI would first try removing the battery fgor 5 mins08:19
pupnikif i said 'yes' what would you do?08:19
pupnikreflash the device08:20
yahyayahThank you much, i will give it a try08:21
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jef91Howdy folks, so I just got an N900 off ebay and the person who had it before me left a lock code on it... I even reflashed the eMMC and PR1.3 images and it still asks for a code at startup - any ideas how I can get around this?08:45
FauxFauxThere's like a million google results for how to recover the lock code; they're reasonably involved though.08:45
jef91Gah fuck my life.08:45
jef91Why didn't flashing the eMMC reset it?08:45
jef91thought it was suppose to wipe everything08:46
FauxFauxI'd happily fuck pretty much anything tbh.08:46
SpeedEviljef91: you've tried the stock 12345?08:46
jef91and 0000008:46
SpeedEvilyou've mailed the seller?08:46
jef91yea just did08:47
jef91pain in the ass though, wanted to get it setup tonight08:47
pupnikjef91: perhaps you should take it to the police08:47
pupnikif your seller didn't have the code08:47
jef91pff *rolls eyes*08:47
pupnikor are you the thief?08:47
jef91Jag off.08:47
jef91Guess I'll wait for his response. He won't be getting very good feedback.08:48
jef91Peace guys, late here. Heading off to sleep,08:49
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pupnikin an era where contacts and data are so important, stealing such devices is like horse theft in the american west08:50
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Arkenoiflashlight-extra or cl-launcher?09:31
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dsfai used transmission and it worked just fine until 1 time it crashed n900 and i had to remove the battery and from that time on it keeps crashing it as soon as it starts download a file no matter how many times i reinstalled it and i don't know what to do...09:37
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MaikBHello.  I can't find `less' in the fremantle/extra-09:43
MaikBIs it gone?09:43
dotblankI'm so giddy, I got abstractitemmodel to work :)09:45
SpeedEvilut;s inb ti0igth09:46
SpeedEvilit's in tools, I think09:46
MaikBtools you say..09:46
MaikBSpeedEvil, thats a category, right?09:47
MaikBapt-get install less fails09:47
ShadowJKsdk tools repository09:48
ShadowJK(which is different from dsk repository, which is bad to use on device)09:48
MaikBSpeedEvil, ShadowJK : thx, I'll go for that09:49
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MaikBSpeedEvil, ShadowJK : worked, thx!09:54
MaikBnow I can read man pages while Im in the gym09:54
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pupnik  barcoo barcode scanner - quite fast10:11
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Arkenoithe problem with barcodes is absense of decent general purpose barcode search engine10:17
Arkenoiyou may find *some* books, *some* dvds and *some* consumer goods10:17
Arkenoiscanning, say, a bottle of wine and getting a decent review on what's inside is rare luck :-(10:18
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SpeedEvilArkenoi: See above.10:35
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SpeedEvilArkenoi: it's a store API - so only does what they sell.10:36
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tazwhere on the n900 are CA-certs stored? i know where i put them  >>  /usr/share/ca-certificates  and link them to /etc/ssl/blah but where do the majority of them live?11:21
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tazwaait try the filemanager install bit11:28
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ieatlintfrom what i recall hearing about that, it was a UI-related bug, in which on very rare occasion, the UI for sending an SMS which switch to a different recipient from your list of open SMS conversations12:51
ieatlintand the UI would always reflect the recipient when you pressed send, but it would change without user intervention, which reports that it was a race condition of sorts (like if you're switching between 5 SMS conversations, it could randomly pop back to one you previously looked at, and you may not realise it as you type out a message)12:53
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danyhi all12:57
danyhi all12:57
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eichihello. if i bye a n900 from a person, which used the kernel patch for 800mhz, is this device maybe a problem, or is overclocking from 600 tu 800 no problem at all?13:29
TsuyoI overclocked mine up to 900 and it's working very well13:30
eichiokay. hm, maybe the device will die sooner, bit i think, its not a problem13:32
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TsuyoIf my device dies too fast, i just reflash it, and send it back. :p13:33
TsuyoDepends, what dies at the end.^^13:33
alteregoeichi: no guarantees it'll last as long as those that haven't oc'd but 800 isn't as bad as others'13:33
TsuyoI read, someone pushed it onto 1900 mhz.13:35
TsuyoIt's like a god damn bomb in your pants13:35
alteregoPersonally I wouldn't overclock, my device is too important to me.13:36
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TsuyoWell you see a big difference between 650 and 900 ;)13:37
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alteregoIt's not important to me, the device is more than capable for all my needs.13:37
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alteregoI'm still suprised of how well it performs, like using mplayer the other day to watch a divx copy of inception13:38
maybeWTFyou clearly need to overclock so you can run xplane and asphalt5 at the same time without any framerate loss13:38
alteregoIt was brilliant, it's only the display that lets it down in that regard, under low light13:38
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alteregoThey pause on context switch ..13:39
alteregoSo it doesn't matter :P13:39
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TsuyoOh, today i watches some Videos on my N900. Well.. connected to my TV. And it was kinda.. slow Oo13:41
TsuyoIt tooked like 20 seconds to pause that video13:41
TsuyoIt's simple Avi13:41
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TsuyoDoes someone have that trouble too? It stucked some seconds too while playing13:42
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ArkenoiTsuyo, install replacement pulseaudio package13:44
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TsuyoAye ;)13:44
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Termanagood morning13:58
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spiritdwhere can I find configuration file for xterm?14:08
spiritdor is there any other terminals?14:08
DocScrutinizer~tell Tsuyo about omap-oc14:12
DocScrutinizerxterm is configured via gconf afaik14:12
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spiritdDocScrutinizer I am getting weird behaviour... everytime i tries to mount or chroot /.debian or something like that14:14
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spiritdi tries to run xterm....14:14
spiritdit tries to mount ... etc14:15
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DocScrutinizersorry you lost me14:15
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spiritdhappens everytime i run xterm14:26
spiritdi looked at shorcut ... and its is ok osso-xterm ... no args14:27
ieatlintmight be part of his bash profile14:27
DocScrutinizersomebody messed around with your startup scripts (~/.profile etc)14:27
ieatlintor sh, or whatever the hell busybox is giving14:27
spiritdye thats what i am finding14:28
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spiritddont have .profile14:29
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spiritdonly .bash_history .ash_history14:30
ieatlintcheck for an /etc/profile14:31
spiritdits links to /etc/osso-af-init/ad-defines.sh14:32
spiritdnot symlink...14:32
spiritdin file14:33
spiritdsource /etc/osso-af-init/af-defines.sh14:33
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spiritdwhats default shell for user and root?14:36
BCMMspiritd: busybox's /bin/sh14:36
BCMMshells people actually like are available too14:37
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infobotmessy... err busybox is meant for lean scripting. Regarding all the missing options and immanent limitations (see su) it's not really the interactive shell of choice. A lot of people hate busybox because a lot of system integrators don't understand the difference between busybox and a decent user interactive shell plus unix utils14:39
DocScrutinizert900:~# ls -l `which sh`14:39
DocScrutinizerlrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root            7 Dec 12 04:50 /bin/sh -> busybox14:39
BCMMbusybox is like MacOS14:39
BCMMby which i mean PS doesn't do what you want and it drives you mad14:40
BCMMdunno why i capitalised that14:40
BCMMaww, no BSD fans getting angry...14:40
spiritdand why is used busybox's /bin/sh and not bash or full sh?14:40
DocScrutinizersee above. It's meant for scripting and low mem usage14:41
BCMMit is a "full sh", isn't it? i mean, it fulfils POSIX's requirements?14:41
keriospiritd: because nokia14:41
BCMMspiritd: yeah, low mem usage. applications are kinda allowed to expect a POSIX-compatible sh, and i'm sure lots come with a wrapper script or something that requires it14:42
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DocScrutinizeractually you must not replace busybox for user standard shell or you will get bootloop14:42
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BCMMstarting a larger shell for each of those might actually matter on a machine like the n90014:43
BCMMDocScrutinizer: what does "standard user shell" mean?14:43
BCMMyou mustn't change your login shell, or mustn't try and replace /bin/sh?14:43
spiritdsettings in passwd?14:43
DocScrutinizerhell, it didn't matter on my 128MB 300MHz-PII panasonic toughbook14:43
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spiritdwhere can I change which shell will be used?14:44
DocScrutinizeryeah, settings in passwd,14:44
BCMMi have user:*:29999:29999::/home/user:/bin/bash and no bootloop, what gives?14:45
DocScrutinizerdo not replace neither /bin/sh nor user's login shell14:45
BCMMoh, sorry. misread "yeah, settings in passwd," as a reply to my "what must i not do"14:45
DocScrutinizerBCMM: probably you don't have bash in /etc/shells14:45
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BCMMDocScrutinizer: no, i misunderstood and wondered why it was all working fine14:46
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BCMMso they depend on the difference between bourne and busybox in some script, or what?14:46
DocScrutinizeryes, and right so. It's supposed to fail14:46
DocScrutinizeryes, exactly14:46
DocScrutinizerthey use busyboxisms in initscripts14:47
DocScrutinizerI heard14:47
BCMMhang on, what's supposed to fail?14:47
spiritdso if i did this "user:*:29999:29999::/home/user:/bin/bash" bash will not be used?14:47
BCMMwhy is that supposed to fail?14:47
DocScrutinizerexcept if it "fails" because bash isn't in etc/shells14:47
BCMMi used bash-setup, iirc14:48
spiritdand if I add it?14:48
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BCMMmaybe that's why it's in /etc/shells for me14:48
DocScrutinizerhmm, so it works for you now?14:48
DocScrutinizeryou start up xterm and have bash?14:49
BCMMDocScrutinizer: yeah. ssh too14:49
DocScrutinizergreat!! maybe they fixed that nonsense in initscripts14:49
DocScrutinizerthe info is from back with 1.0 iirc14:49
spiritdi dont have /etc/shells14:50
DocScrutinizerthen you also won't get any other login shell14:50
RST38hMoo all.14:50
DocScrutinizermoo RST38h14:50
BCMMDocScrutinizer: why would init scripts care what the *user* uses as a login shell?14:50
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DocScrutinizeryeah, a miracle14:50
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RST38hDoc: Anything exciting while I was away?14:51
BCMMoh god, you actually did mean that there were initscripts that depended on user's login shell?14:51
DocScrutinizerit had been confirmed it doesn't matter for root, but bootloops for user changed login shell14:51
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spiritdBCMM so how did you setup bash as default shell for xterm?14:51
DocScrutinizerRST38h: yea! I was away ;-P14:52
BCMMspiritd: can't remember i'm afraid, but it was either using bash-setup, the normal linux way of doing it, or both14:52
DocScrutinizerspiritd: a shell isn't default for xterm. Rather for a user account14:52
spiritdbtw i changed passwd for user to bash and still getting this "mount shit message"14:53
DocScrutinizeradd /etc/shells14:53
DocScrutinizerotherwise your setting in passwd gets ignored14:54
DocScrutinizerin passwd only shells are allowed that are in /etc/shells14:54
* RST38h laughs satanically14:54
spiritdwell but it shows -bash-2.05b$14:54
DocScrutinizerif you try anything else, it defaults to /bin/sh14:54
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DocScrutinizercheck ~/.bashrc and ~/.profile and /etc/profile14:58
DocScrutinizeralso scrutinize your easy-debian installation/setup15:02
DocScrutinizer...or whatever it is that does a chroot15:02
DocScrutinizerchroot isn't normal part of maemo xterm startup15:02
DocScrutinizerBCMM: yes, it seems either initscripts or xsession setup depends on user's login shell15:04
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DocScrutinizermy guess would be it's xsession15:05
DocScrutinizerand as killing X causes device to reboot afaik15:06
* ShadowJK found a cool benchmark app through googling15:08
DocScrutinizerdamn, I miss a proper console under shift-alt-F1, on maemo :-)15:08
ShadowJKSandisk class 2 microsd, 4k random writes: 18.58 kbyte/s15:08
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ShadowJK512k random writes: 1511 kbyte/s15:09
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spiritdit looks that osso-xterm runs debian script15:17
spiritddunno why15:17
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ieatlintfree ice cream sandwiches for everyone15:19
* MohammadAG has a bad feeling about his USB port15:22
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DocScrutinizerspiritd: it gets called in any of the .profile et al files15:24
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DocScrutinizerspiritd: try >> bash --verbose15:25
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DocScrutinizermorning lardman15:28
lardmanhi doc15:28
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: check it!!15:28
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: *you* know how to disassemble and what to check and how to fix15:29
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spiritdDocScrutinizer where can i get default profile bashrc etc?15:30
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, it's fine with a USB cable, but the new charger needs some power to be taken out15:30
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: then plug the charger to some crappy junk device with a micro USB some 100s of times. Then it will get better15:31
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MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, or I could file it15:32
* MohammadAG uses an N86 to file it15:33
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: use a soft pencil (the pen with graphite) and "paint the 0.2*0.3mm backsides of the two hooks on wider side of plug15:36
DocScrutinizerthe graphite will stick to that surfaces and lubricate the hooks when unlocking15:37
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: I mean the area that you block on when scrating acros that side of plug with your fingernail. The small steep backside of that node-shaped 2 notches15:38
DocScrutinizers/node/nose/ :-)15:39
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DocScrutinizerwhen you hold the plugh upwards and look at its small side, then you need to paint the "noses" nostril-surface :-D15:40
DocScrutinizersoft pencils are great for that kind of lubrication tasks15:42
DocScrutinizerspiritd: I suggest you uninstall and reinstall bash pkg15:45
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MohammadAGgot it :D15:45
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: even painting the whole outer surface of the plug won't hurt15:46
DocScrutinizerit might buckle15:46
trumeeis there webpage to check if N900 is under warranty?15:46
DocScrutinizernice thing about graphite: it doesn't flow to places where you don't want it15:47
DocScrutinizertrumee: yes15:47
trumeeDocScrutinizer: where?15:47 I guess15:47
DocScrutinizertwo users here in this chan found it some 7 days ago15:48
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DocScrutinizerI never looked for it15:48
trumeeDocScrutinizer: ok found it,
DocScrutinizerI'm *very* anxious to learn if your device as well has 10 days warranty left over :-D15:49
DocScrutinizeror maybe only 2 today15:49
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trumeeDocScrutinizer: "Yes - your device with the serial number is still within the warranty period in this country". doesnt say how much?15:50
trumeealterego: did you buy your device in the UK?15:52
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MohammadAGis tmo covered by warranty?15:52
trumeeDocScrutinizer: any idea what is the standard Nokia warranty period?15:53
lardmanmy pre-summit device is also within warranty15:53
toggles ?15:53
spiritdhmm ... i installed scratchbox ... but i am not "user" but "ubuntuuser"15:53
lardmanspiritd: should be fine15:54
spiritdbut i cant sudo gainroot15:55
lardmanuse fakeroot15:55
MohammadAGsudo su silly15:55
lardmanin sb?15:56
* trumee is thinking to buy a cheap usb cable from ebay and file its usb port.15:56
lardmantoggles: where has all that come from then?15:56
spiritdbtw is it normal when i want ENTER in scratchbox i must ctrl+enter in ubuntu?15:56
lardmanin the UI? I seem to remember a bug for that15:57
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spiritdy in UI15:58
spiritdi have 10.04 ubuntu15:58
spiritdsu command not found15:58
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spiritdfck how can i change user withou su? :D15:59
DocScrutinizerpossibly related to NK-enter bug of maemo15:59
lardmanjust use fakeroot to perform root actions15:59
MohammadAGwhy use the terminal UI?15:59
MohammadAGuse the shell you get when you use /scratchbox/login15:59
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spiritdMohammadAG my osso-xterm on n900 giving me this
spiritdso i am trying to find default configs to reset it16:00
spiritdit has somethins to do with easy-debina chroot16:01
lardmanspiritd: you were talking about scratchbox tho?16:01
lardmanon the N900?16:01
spiritdon ubuntu 9.0416:01
lardmanright, so use fakeroot for that16:02
lardmanand don't use xephyr, use the /scratchbox/login shell16:02
spiritdi have problem on my n900... but dunno what is wrong so i am trying to find how it works if its ok in scrachbox and than compare it with n90016:02
lardmanoh I see16:02
MohammadAGssh and purge osso-xterm16:03
lardmanand your problem is that you can't find a file on /media/mmc1/ ?16:03
MohammadAGthen install it again16:03
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* lardman goes back to browsing the interweb16:04
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spiritdMohammadAG ok16:05
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DocScrutinizer51MHD is sooooooooo cute16:08
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DocScrutinizer51ctl(down), bs, bs, bs = forward roll windows. ctl(up) = select first window16:10
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toggleslardman: no idea, came through "Nokia n900" on facebook16:11
DocScrutinizer51ctl(down), bs(down), ctl(up): ctl= backwards roll windows. bs(up); keep task switcher16:11
alteregotrumee: yup16:11
lardmantoggles: fair enough, just all seems somewhat optimistic16:11
DocScrutinizer51in takswitcher: qwer = window 1234 select16:12
MohammadAGtoggles, lol16:12
DocScrutinizer51shift-qwer = window1234 close16:12
toggleslardman: agreed, probably rubish16:12
MohammadAGa PR can't include MeeGo :P16:13
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MohammadAGit's about 2GBs in size16:13
spiritdMohammadAG doesnt work still getting
lardmanMohammadAG: well that would be possible16:13
lardmanMohammadAG: though you'd need to flash it to the emmc16:13
lardmanI don't fancy that as an "OTA" download though :)16:14
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MohammadAGspiritd, that doesn't seem to be terminal actually16:15
MohammadAGif you look closely, you'll notice the spinning icon16:15
MohammadAGit's the screenshot16:15
spiritdyes.. but it happens everytime i run xterm first... without previous exterm windows16:16
spiritdand shorcut is osso-xterm16:16
spiritddunno where from is called that chroot :/16:16
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MohammadAGbut terminal opens fine?16:17
MohammadAGyou could've mentioned that before :P16:18
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spiritdye it opens fine16:18
MohammadAGrm /home/user/.cache/launch/
MohammadAGthen close terminal16:18
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MohammadAGand reopen it16:18
DocScrutinizerspiritd: I explained to you this is unrelated to osso-xterm. So why are you still trying to reset things for xterm that are unrelated?16:19
spiritdMohammadAG nice... fixed16:19
spiritdMohammadAG how did you know that? :D16:19
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MohammadAGspinning window indicator16:20
DocScrutinizeromg, you are asking about sb and don't even mention it. MEH16:20
MohammadAGno DocScrutinizer16:20
MohammadAGit's the screenshot hildon loads16:20
MohammadAGthe PVR thing, to make stuff iPhone-y16:20
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, you know, the thing that loads directly when pressing an icon16:21
* DocScrutinizer swears to not try and help anybody for the next 24h16:22
MohammadAGit seems to have taken a screenshot of easy debian for osso-xterm16:22
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DocScrutinizerI should have known when he posted that crappy photo of screen16:22
MohammadAGthe spinning indicator next to X terminal16:23
MohammadAGosso-xterm never does it16:23
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: yeah I completely got it now. Just never thought somebody could come here with such a crappy description of problem16:23
trumeealterego: any idea what is the duration of nokia's warranty in UK?16:24
MohammadAG1 year16:24
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: spiritd  never mentioned his termnal returns to normal after that initial fake screen snapshot that confused him. I assumed there's a real persisting problem16:25
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MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, i know, i figured that out though :P16:25
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DocScrutinizerwell, I'm done with maemo and noobs for today16:26
* MohammadAG should be a nokia tester16:26
MohammadAGthough i cba to use bugzilla, so I shouldn't16:27
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: not you, spiritd should be a nokia tester16:27
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DocScrutinizertime for 1264843016:27
MohammadAGis that T9? :P16:28
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DocScrutinizerprintf "%x" 1264843016:29
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MohammadAGprintf "%x\n" 1264843016:30
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MohammadAGuse \n :P16:31
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DocScrutinizerprintf "\n\t\t\t\t\t\e[34;41m%x\e[m\n" 1264843016:37
DocScrutinizeresp for you, MohammadAG16:37
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DocScrutinizer(missing \n) I'm spoiled by basic-esque semantics of shell echo, appending a nl unless you explicitly tell it not to do16:45
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DocScrutinizerwhat's been the friggin basic semantics? print "no nl please;"16:46
DocScrutinizersomething like that16:46
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BCMMsemantics meaning "syntax" here, i guess?16:46
DocScrutinizersyntax it about correct sequence of lexems16:47
DocScrutinizersemantics is about what it actually does16:47
DocScrutinizerso yeah, what's been the syntax for 'no nl' for the fsckdup semantics in basic?16:48
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BCMMcompletely and utterly implementation-specific, like anything BASIC?16:49
BCMMwasn't there a version that had something similar to ms batch file syntax on that?16:49
DocScrutinizersure, there's not THE basic16:51
BCMMTHE basic?16:51
BCMMwhich one is THE basic?16:51
BCMMoh god, for once i've started a flamewar by accident16:51
DocScrutinizernevertheless most basic dialects had a semantic of including a nl/cr to each print command, unless you "escaped" it somehow16:52
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BCMManyway, i think it involves using a ; in ways specifically designed to upset C programmers16:52
DocScrutinizerBCMM: you realized the "there's not" before "THE basic" ?16:53
DocScrutinizers/not/no such thing like/ .16:54
BCMMoh, sorry. i read "that's not"16:54
BCMM"sure, but that's not THE basic"16:54
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DocScrutinizerfirst basic dialects I used had not even a renumber16:57
DocScrutinizerand any line entered without a linenumber heading it were immediate commands16:57
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DocScrutinizerthose were the times. Well those times are probably gone forever, unless I'll bring then back a little bit later... :-P17:00
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DocScrutinizer</quote FZ>17:00
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trumeeIs fmtx-faker required with the latest fmtxd1.3 patch by jacekowski?17:01
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BCMMDocScrutinizer: you're porting blassic to the n900?17:08
BCMM(heh, kinda want to use the most awkward possible interpreter just to annoy iphone users)17:08
pupnikgates wrote the CBM PET basic :/17:09
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* trumee first programming language was Gw-basic17:11
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trumeeseems fm-faker is not required at all. good.17:18
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trumeewhy there no src files in this package, ?17:30
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ShadowJKsigh, benchmarking microsd cards with sheevaplug turns out to be somewhat random17:38
* ShadowJK ponders upgrading kernel, maybe SD slot instability is fixed..17:38
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pupnikShadowJK: how do you disable kernel caching17:40
pupniki think i had a thread on t.m.o for that17:41
pupnikahh sync; time sh -c "dd if=/dev/zero of=/media/mmc1/testfile bs=1M count=100;sync"17:42
pupnikahh also need to change cpu governor to 'performance17:42
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pupnikecho performance > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor17:44
ShadowJKThat kind of benchmark is useless and pointless17:48
ShadowJKI'm not interested in sequential write speed17:48
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ShadowJKI want to know the speed under random 4k writes17:49
lcukShadowJK, well make a simpler test function17:50
lcukthat uses numerous small files17:50
ShadowJKWhich for a class 2 sandisk card is 18.5 kbyte/sec and class 4 kingston is showing 17.04 kbyte/sec :)17:50
ShadowJKI already found a program for it, "Rebench"17:50
ShadowJKthough there appears to be two of them :)17:50
DocScrutinizerlcuk: ++ :-D17:51
ShadowJKI'm bypassing the filesystem too, writing directly to the partition17:51
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ShadowJK(destroying anything that was on the cards in the first place917:51
DocScrutinizerthose are the decent tests17:51
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Gyjfhow fast is the n900 wireless NIC btw?17:52
pupnikShadowJK: since those cards are being used to store media, a large sequential write is relevant to most ppl17:52
ShadowJK802.11g, so 54M?17:52
lcukGyjf, in a vacuum or at ground level?17:53
ShadowJKpupnik, yes well, even the slowest card is "fast enough" then, imo :)17:53
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ShadowJKI'm looking for a card that could host an operating system well17:53
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pupnikah ok17:53
Gyjfwell, i dont have any vaccum at hand, so ground level will do17:53
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ShadowJKor swap17:53
pupnikgot a link to 'rebench' ShadowJK ?17:54
lcukGyjf, i dont actually know, merely that I have never wondered "why isn't this faster"17:54
pupnik ?17:54
ShadowJKwow, the FTL in this Kingston card is horrible17:55
Gyjfhehe thats funny cause its FTL :P17:56
pupnikthank you ShadowJK that is GREAT17:57
ShadowJKCheck out the benchmark results in that article too17:57
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: where's the .deb for maemo? ;-D17:58
lcukor rather: why isn't it available from maemo.org17:58
ShadowJKI'm not running it on maemo17:59
lcukwhat then?17:59
ShadowJKFirst thing I had with a free SD slot, my sheevaplug18:00
ShadowJKcould have run it on my desktop too but I didn't find my card reader :(18:00
lcukShadowJK, I thought that the DUT also had impact on performance18:00
DocScrutinizerthere's a constant rate of complaints about maemo semi-freezing when copying to eMMC18:00
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lcukDocScrutinizer, thats because you repeat the test everyday:P18:01
ShadowJKThat's more of a kernel tuning issue..18:01
DocScrutinizerlcuk: not really18:01
lcukdevice under test18:01
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: I know. But to tune kernel properly you need decent figures of IO performance18:02
ShadowJKFrom what i've seen, writes are fast as long as the file being copied/moved is smaller than easily available ram18:02
lcukmy eyes bleed whenever I see single post links from tmo18:02
lcukcentred text from forum is awful to read18:03
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DocScrutinizeryeah, mine too, was a matter of seconds to ponder if I provide a better link or go with this one18:03
lcukis better18:03
ShadowJKWell, this kingston card is quite phenomenal, it's approximately as slow handling sequential writes as random writes18:03
pupnikyes i also noticed device becoming unusable copying large > 400 MB files18:03
pupnikwant to start a new t.m.o thread for benchmarking microSD?18:04
DocScrutinizerusually I do this:
DocScrutinizerheh, lcuk - you were faster than me18:05
pupnikyou benchmark by copying photos?18:05
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pupnikrebench git errors out in make here18:11
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pupnikneed gsl..18:11
ShadowJKYou need a c++ compiler and libgsl installed18:11
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pupnikwhat's libaio.h: No such file or directory supplied by?>18:13
pupnikah nm18:13
ShadowJKlibaio-dev :)18:13
pupnikwell maybe a statically linked version would be best for maemo18:14
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pupnikError opening device: Not a directory18:18
pupnikError opening device: Is a directory18:18
ShadowJKyou probably want to create a big file with dd to do tests on18:19
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ShadowJKunless you want ot do destructive testing like I'm doing18:19
pupniki have a microsd card which can be overwritten18:19
pupnikshows as /dev/sdb18:20
DocScrutinizerpupnik: any good ointer to a howto-link-statically?18:20
DocScrutinizerpointer even18:20
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DocScrutinizerI gather it shouldn't be difficult, nevertheless I never managed to wrap my head around it18:21
pupniknot offhand18:21
pupnik   some info for pkg-config18:22
DocScrutinizerand heaven knows I considered how nice a statically linked executable wuld be, quite some times18:22
pupnikyou can run into dependency hell18:23
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DocScrutinizereven compared to having .so locally and adapting ld_path18:23
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pupnikShadowJK: are you invoking rebench with /dev/sdb (for e.g.) as the target?18:26
ShadowJK/dev/mmcblk0p1 actually18:26
pupnikoh partition as a target18:27
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DocScrutinizerpupnik: LOL, yeah dlopen() for sure isn't exactly compatible with static linking18:30
DocScrutinizerpupnik: thanks for the link :-)18:30
pupnikShadowJK: is the device mounted?18:33
pupnikmmap2(NULL, 4096, PROT_READ|PROT_WRITE, MAP_PRIVATE|MAP_ANONYMOUS, -1, 0) = 0xb78d100018:33
pupnik_llseek(3, 0, 0xbfd36c08, SEEK_CUR)     = -1 ESPIPE (Illegal seek)18:33
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pupnikapparently my kernel thinks a flash device is not positionable18:36
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pupnikmmm bad partition table18:38
pupniknope. still munged18:40
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ShadowJKheh, okay, so I had stride size set to 512 bytes when I ran sequential write test on sandisk. Clas 2 card, 2M /sec write speed it gave. On the kingston class 4 card this gave also 2M, but it started as slow as random writes18:47
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ShadowJKwith stride size = block size, the kingston flies...18:47
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ShadowJKSo the sandisk was clever enough, that when I wrote several times to the same erase block, it didn't actually modify flash contents until I moved on..18:48
ShadowJKwhile the kingston is blindly writing to the flash all the time18:48
ShadowJKAtleast that's how I interpret the results :P18:48
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DocScrutinizersounds consistent18:59
ShadowJKThis is a gigantic spreadsheet already and I've only partially tested 2 cards19:00
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DocScrutinizerhehe, yeah. What do you expect?19:00
ShadowJKI still have 3 microSD cards, 2 miniSD cards, 2 SD cards (one is broken and I don't remember which), and those are just the unused ones..19:02
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ShadowJKSo let's see.. This kingston has a write throughput of 10 Megabytes per second for purely sequential 128 kbyte chunks (the chunks being after eachother). When two threads are doing that at the same time, throughput drops by a factor of 10 to about 1 Megabyte/s :)19:09
ShadowJKI need to rerun with this on the sandisk 8g19:10
pupnikwell this finally works19:10
pupnik# rebench --paged  -t mmap -o read -w seq /media/disk-2/testdir/testfile19:10
DocScrutinizerclose enough to random writes19:10
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ShadowJKdoes it work without paged?19:11
ShadowJKbecause with --paged RAM will be used to cache writes and reads19:11
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pupnikCan't use mmap with direct IO (use --paged): Invalid argument19:11
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DocScrutinizerShadowJK: that fits well into the figure of 40ms for a flashpage erase19:12
ShadowJKdoes -t stateless work? THat's what Im using19:12
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pupniknope: Error opening device: Not a directory19:13
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pupnikoh well19:14
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: so you basically could say flash has a cylinder size of 128..256kB, and a seek time of ~40ms for writes19:14
pupnikpaio also broke19:14
ShadowJKyeah, except the sandisk card is being cleverer than this19:15
ShadowJKIt's almost like it has some ram cache in there :)19:15
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: sandisk doesn't park the heads between consecutive writes ;-D19:16
ShadowJKI guess shitstorm happens if it loses power in the middle19:16
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ShadowJKmaybe this explains why SmartQ's internal sandisk memories randomly died on unclean shutdown19:16
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DocScrutinizerSD cards definitely are not meant to shutdown hard19:17
DocScrutinizeractually flash is worse in that respect than classic HDD19:18
DocScrutinizermuuuch worse19:18
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chxthat's interesting19:20
DocScrutinizerthe sequence >read out to buffer, modify buffer, erase flashpage, write buffer back to flashpage<< for arbitrary writes clearly shows there's a window for maximum damage much worse than all you might see on a proper built HDD. And that's the best case sequence wrt hard shutdown19:21
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ShadowJK256K chunk(s) will be in an "undefined" state after hard shutdown19:21
DocScrutinizeryep, also management data might get destroyed19:22
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DocScrutinizerquestionable if you ever recover from that19:22
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ShadowJKThese kingston cards are probably fake, it says "Japan" on them19:22
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lardman|homeanyone know if the N900 GPS works with no SIM?19:23
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luke-jrlardman|home: not really, but in theory19:23
DocScrutinizerlardman|home: sometimes it does, though not as good as with SIM19:23
luke-jrmaybe with good vision of the sky for a couple of hours19:23
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DocScrutinizerand with location test running so the GPS isn't shut down after 60s without a fix19:24
lardman|homeWell I'm looking to intercept some supl data, so I guess SIM will be need to get cell id19:24
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lardman|homeis there a cellid database accessible somewhere?19:24
ShadowJKno :)19:24
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MrBawbthere are some partial ones19:25
ShadowJKOperators consider it proprietary information19:25
DocScrutinizerfor some areas there is19:25
MrBawbuser-submitted info19:25
lardman|homeShadowJK: yeah I know19:25
DocScrutinizerfor UK there's allegedly even an official one19:25
lardman|homeok, that's good19:25
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ShadowJKGoogle Maps on j2me and symbian if you had a GPS unit used to report back to google CellID,GPS-coord so they could build a db :)19:25
DocScrutinizeras in UK carriers have to provide info about locations of their BTS19:26
DocScrutinizergoogle for openbmap19:27
lardman|homeI'll explain what I'm looking at, namely injecting LTO data into the SUPL stream to avoid needing to connect to the SUPL server19:27
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lardman|homeDocScrutinizer: will do19:27
MrBawblardman|home: location-proxy is the process that contacts the supl server, I think19:28
MrBawbit's at least one of the processes (if there's more than one)19:28
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lardman|homeyep, I was thinking that a supl-proxy would be nice and easy, no need to understand the way the location framework talks to the chipset19:28
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SpeedEvilThe UKs official one blows goats.19:29
SpeedEvilIt's not suitable for programmatic use19:29
DocScrutinizerlardman|home: in Germany (maybe elsewhere as well) O2 is sending position of BTS in CB-channel 221, as gauss-wegener coords19:29
lardman|homewell wasting time like that could explain the poor quality ;)19:29
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lardman|homeso anyone have any reasons why it might not work?19:31
lardman|homei.e. shoot it down now19:31
SpeedEvillardman: what - just woke up19:31
lardman|homenot sure how much data would need to be cached from NASA's LTO, or alternatively the number crunching required to predict19:32
lardman|homehey SpeedEvil19:32
lardman|homeam thinking about inserting a supl proxy and trying to inject LTO generated data to avoid needing to bring up a net connection19:32
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lardman|homelong term orbit19:33
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SpeedEvilThat does not of itself generate position, it just delays the decay of the sat coords19:33
lardman|homei.e. ephemeris data predicted a few days out, or some such19:33
lardman|homeyes indeed19:33
lardman|homeI'd like to get the GPS up faster without needing live assistance data19:34
lardman|homeas something to do of a Saturday afternoon ;)19:34
DocScrutinizeralas N900 seems isn't considered worthy by Nokia to learn support CBSMS19:34
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SpeedEvilTurning the GPS on, when on power, and maybe even intermittently when not may be an idea19:35 maybe voting for helps19:35
povbotBug 8347: Cell Broadcast Feature not available19:35
lardman|homeDocScrutinizer: nothing will help for Maemo5 now I don;t think19:36
SpeedEvilDoibt it.19:36
SpeedEvilIT's not maemo519:36
SpeedEvilit's hw19:36
lardman|homeSpeedEvil: yes, to refresh the ephemeris data before they expire19:36
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SpeedEvilIt's depressing there isn't a way to talk in depth to the GPS19:37
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lardman|homewell there's that page on the wiki about communicating with it19:37
MohammadAGhmm, chemistry is mindfuck sometimes19:37
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lardman|homebut that's reverse engineering of the protocol19:37
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chem|stMohammadAG: sometimes?19:38
SpeedEvillardman: naah - I mean in depth.19:38
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MohammadAGchem|st, doing my ASs, Unit 3B is hard19:39
SpeedEvillardman: Someone got the openmoko freerunner to do ~5cm accuracy, with another nearby freerunner19:39
lardman|homeSpeedEvil: yeah, but no real way we're going to be able to do that19:39
DocScrutinizerI can understand N900 not supporting SAT/STK, but honestly these missing standard features all the time, like SSC (which got enabled with *#-ena and a easteregg after massive complaints), and CBSMS, and whatnot else - that's an insult and impudence19:39
chem|stMohammadAG: have no idea what you are talking about...19:39
lardman|homeSpeedEvil: that's pretty good! :)19:39
MohammadAGGCEs chem|st19:40
lardman|homeMohammadAG: what's up with your chemistry then?19:40
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chem|stMohammadAG: that is far off of what I would call mindfucking19:41
lardman|homeDocScrutinizer: what are those acronyms?19:41
DocScrutinizerSIM App Toolkit, Cell Broadcast SMS19:41
DocScrutinizerSupplementary Service Codes19:42
DocScrutinizerwhile the last one isn't correct, it's the plain service codes that weren't implemented/enabled19:42
lardman|homeok, thanks19:42
DocScrutinizernot the supplementary ones19:42
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lcukany idea how I detect the maemo version,  diablo/fremantle?19:43
chem|stlcuk: guess you mean the other way19:44
DocScrutinizerOSSO_PRODUCT_RELEASE_NAME='Maemo 5'19:44
lcuknm have found another way already in code, ta19:45
DocScrutinizerlcuk: >>set19:45
lcuk(reading /proc/component_version)19:45
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lcukgets me an RX-34  RX-44 RX-48 etc19:45
DocScrutinizerset|less even19:46
DocScrutinizeror echo $OSSO_PRODUCT_RELEASE_NAME19:46
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DocScrutinizerecho $OSSO_VERSION#19:48
DocScrutinizerecho $OSSO_VERSION19:48
DocScrutinizerif you want to have it in detail19:49
DocScrutinizerchecked it on N810-diable and N900-maemo519:49
DocScrutinizerlooks good19:49
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DocScrutinizerlcuk: I guess those envs are there for that precise purpose19:51
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infobotDocScrutinizer: aw, gee19:59
lcukDocScrutinizer, thanks \o19:59
DocScrutinizerlcuk: yw19:59
lcuknow I just have to make sure liqcalendar runs on it ;)20:00
lcukand without a diablo scratchbox20:00
lcukI am forced to have to do it the old fashioned way ;)20:00
lcukDocScrutinizer, I am getting bug reports from users on diablo20:00
lcukand to diagnose/fix I need to build/test20:00
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lcukDocScrutinizer, well liqbase apps were initially designed to run well on n8x0 :)20:01
DocScrutinizerso you're going to have some if (arch() == "diablo") ?20:01
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lcukDocScrutinizer, I already have some of that20:02
lcukbut theres a single bug crept in20:03
lcukwhich I didnt check against20:03
lcukits relating to the x11 overlay handling20:03
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lcukactual code code still works, its initialisation thats screwed20:03
MohammadAGwhy does telepathy's dbus signal send status instead of name when someone goes online/offline20:04
DocScrutinizermaybe because telepathy is a bit screwed?20:04
DocScrutinizerwell, probably it's my mind that gets screwed when I try to understand how telepathy works20:05
MohammadAGit's nice actually20:05
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MohammadAGthat's called mindfuck :P20:06
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MohammadAGi want an online/offline presence indicator20:07
DocScrutinizerper contact*account?20:07
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DocScrutinizerwell, anyway ask me why hal is sending same useless dbus signal for arbitrary switch state changes20:09
DocScrutinizerwithout any proper detail about state of switch, or even which particular switch20:10
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DocScrutinizernah, don't ask me. I don't want to enter that mood20:11
lardman|homein both cases the signal designer seems to have assumed that the app will then query specifics20:11
lardman|homerather than maintaining its own internal state and updating that when it receives a DBus signal20:11
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DocScrutinizerwhich is BS20:11
lcukapt-get install build-essential20:12
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* lcuk has missed that line :)20:12
lardman|homewell yeah, it would be almost cost free to add extra info to the messages20:12
DocScrutinizerand it would be muuuch less cost than every app polling the details off /sys et al each time20:13
lardman|homealterego: you about?20:13
lardman|homeDocScrutinizer: sure20:14
lardman|homegoing back a bit, here's the supl stuff:
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lcukapt-get install libliqbase-dev20:16
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lcukand then I can build liq apps :)20:16
lcukon the n810 :D20:16
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lcukhrm, problem (code built ok) which package gives /usr/bin/install   (needed for make install)20:24
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ShadowJKBest performing card so far: Kingston 512MB Mini-SD from 200620:44
ShadowJK(for random write perf)20:44
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DocScrutinizerlcuk: diablo has no dump-area for kernel OOPS and panics, like maemo5's mtd2 aka "log" ?20:46
lcuki dont know?20:46
pupnik_ShadowJK: any good microsd for that?20:46
pupnik_small writes20:46
DocScrutinizeranybody with diablo knowhow give me a pointer/hint how to figure what makes my N810 reboot randomly?20:47
lcukn80 doesnt reboot randomly20:48
lcukyou are imagining things20:48
DocScrutinizerooh, so it's a scheduled reboot then, based on a fractal timeschedule20:48
lcuksounds reasonable20:49
ShadowJK/proc/bootreason, /var/lib/dsme/stats20:49
DocScrutinizermeh, I wonder why your comments are so extemely helpful usually20:49
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: I checked both20:49
DocScrutinizerno luck20:50
ShadowJKtimestamp on 32wd_to and sw_rst?20:50
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ShadowJKlol, this .5G kingston minisd sucks otherwise, I'm not getting more than 500 kbyte/s out of it :)20:53
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ShadowJKit even seems to be running slower with sequential writes than with random writes..20:53
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: what timestamp?20:53
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DocScrutinizerNokia-N810-23-14:~# cat /var/lib/dsme/stats/32wd_to20:55
DocScrutinizera bit high maybe20:55
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lcukDocScrutinizer, do you have a diablo scratchbox there?20:57
TsuyoIs it possible to extend the ram of the N900? I knew a way to do that in Windows via USB-Sticks20:58
ShadowJKAnd you can't extend ram in windows via usb sticks, it's a scam20:58
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lcukshame hmm20:58
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TsuyoI think that was some kind of virtual ram20:58
TsuyoRead it years ago, so i can't remember much20:58
DocScrutinizerTsuyo: linux has that type of virtual ram since ~50years20:59
DocScrutinizerit's called swap20:59
ShadowJKThere's 768M of it20:59
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ShadowJKon N90020:59
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lcukwindows uses usb sticks as a faster prelaunch thingy or some uber cache or something21:00
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lcukso its not quite a memory extension, but it does do things faster than just putting swap onto hard drive21:00
DocScrutinizeruseless cruft21:00
DocScrutinizereven slower than usual HDD21:00
lcukyeah lolloo thanks21:00
TsuyoI don't even think about to extend my ram, just read it a few minutes ago and wanted to know, if it's legit ;)21:01
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ieatlintit's actually valid... it works for anything that requires small amounts of throughput, but benefits from low latency... like a bunch of tiny files21:01
lollooHDD is around 150mbit21:01
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lcuklolloo, depends on the HD and interface in use21:02
DocScrutinizerieatlint: c't tested it and found boot times are same or longer than without21:02
lcukDocScrutinizer, possibly with latest kit and high caches on the drives now21:02
lollooSSDs are avbove 200mbit21:03
lcukbut seems reasonable for when its been used in slightly older kit21:03
lcuklolloo, this isnt ssds21:03
lcuksince an ssd is indistinguishable from hard drive21:03
lcukreadyboost is for actual usb flash drives afaik21:03
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lollooI bought gskills pheonix pro ssd21:03
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lollooit reads peak 250mb21:04
lolloosata 2 ofcourse21:04
DocScrutinizeryeah, SSD is about fopen() / s though21:05
DocScrutinizerand there are *huge* differences21:05
ieatlintwell, i've little experience with current versions of windows, and never used readyboost, so i'll readily admit that my perceptions of it actually being remotely useful are way off21:05
DocScrutinizersame here21:06
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DocScrutinizerI only recall it has been tested worthless in c't quite some time ago21:06
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ShadowJKMy 5400 RPM harddrives do 100 Megabytes/sec, which is something like a gigabit/sec...21:09
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ShadowJKsequential is a bit of a meaningless number though, unless you spend your days copying data from one harddrive to another21:11
lollooor you have an OS on it21:11
ShadowJKFor that you want IOPS21:11
ds3with a modern drive, how do you do sequential? is there a method of access that lets you line up with the physical geometry?21:11
ieatlinti'm actually about to install and SSD in my laptop, heh21:11
haltdefwant vertex 3 pro :>21:12
lolloogo for crucial if you have sata 321:12
ieatlintds3: assuming hdd, i think it's mostly assumed that sectors will be roughly consecutive most of the time21:12
ShadowJKds3, it's still linear21:12
lollooruns above 300mb21:12
ieatlintexcepting bad sector stuff and plate changes21:12
ShadowJKlook at the random iops instead, it's a much more useful number on how the drive performs with an OS on it21:13
lollooyeah your right.21:13
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DocScrutinizerNokia-N810-23-14:~# cat /proc/bootreason21:13
ds3but with sector remapping, even that isn't true all of the time nor is it true between runs21:14
DocScrutinizerhowever I got nfc how to figure what is causing the wd to trigger21:14
ShadowJKThe blind quest for sequential throughput is what gave us the crappy SSDs that benchmarked 300 megabyte/s, yet typing a single line of chat into an Instant Messenger made the entire machine lock up for half a second.21:14
ds3ShadowJK: early stock eeePC drives? :D21:14
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: I even did things like running top in a remote shell session21:15
ShadowJKds3, no those were actually SD cards weren't they?21:15
ShadowJKDocScrutinizer, nfi really :)21:15
ieatlintnah, early eeepcs were ssd21:15
ShadowJKoh I thought they were emmc or sd :)21:15
ieatlintbut the cheap ones... equiv to a flash drive, but with a minipci interface21:15
ShadowJKeverything jmicron anyway21:16
ds3ShadowJK: no, miniPCIe cards21:16
ShadowJKbefore Indilinx came along21:16
ieatlinthappily the drive going into my laptop is not one of those fun flawed ones, but an intel x25-m21:16
ShadowJKI'm not sure anyone has beaten x25-m yet :)21:17
ShadowJKexcept maybe with slc21:17
ieatlinti think it has.. these are relatively cheap now21:17
ieatlintthis drive sells for $180 now21:17
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haltdefsf-1200 based drives are the best for now I believe21:18
lollooOCZ use them.21:18
ieatlintbut my browser will move faster, and i won't be as freaked about the risk of scratching a platter21:18
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haltdefmmhmm, delightful 120GB vertex 2e on my desktop, indilinx based solid 2 on laptop21:19
haltdefI know sata 6gbps drives were just around the corner but sod it :P21:20
lollooi updated my gskills ssd firmware last month21:20
lolloonow supports trimming.21:21
ShadowJK ah I guess intel was beatne long time ago21:22
TsuyoI'm new into app development. If i enter "ifconfig usb0 up" into my terminal, i loose my connection to the internet, has someone encountered that problem too?21:22
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lardman|homecu later chaps, /me heads to grab some food21:24
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ieatlintTsuyo: you fucked up your routes21:24
DocScrutinizerdn't you think this description is missing a few bits?21:24
MohammadAGisn't zerojay part of the maemo community?21:24
Tsuyoieatlint: Pardon?21:24
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DocScrutinizerTsuyo: which OS, which terminal, etc pp21:25
ShadowJKso, without really knowing what you're trying to do or what the guide you're following is trying to do, I'd imagine that if you executed that on a computer or a phone, which was connected to the internet through another interface such as eth0 or wlan0, through or a network, that new network you create would overlap the old one and take precedence, and the device in question would be trying to contact the default gateway over21:25
TsuyoI'm using Archlinux21:25
ShadowJK the wrong interface21:25
Tsuyostandart xfce4 terminal21:25
Tsuyo-t +d21:25
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TsuyoMy connection is going throgh cable21:25
Tsuyothrough*. Gah.21:25
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ieatlintso i don't have a one line answer, but the basic situation is that your default route is being changed when you run that command21:26
DocScrutinizerTsuyo: we have no f'ing clue about your setup. There are terminals all over the place. And we don't even know if your question is maemo5 related21:26
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ieatlintwhich shouldn't happen normally, but may be related to something like networkmanager getting pissy21:27
TsuyoAh, well, sorry. I wanted to develop small qt apps for my N900. i fellowed this tutorial:
TsuyoIt's working well, except, that i don't have an internet connection while connected to my device21:27
DocScrutinizeryou connect your desktop PC to N900 via USB, and that moment the PC is losing internet connectivity?21:28
Tsuyoafter i enter "ifconfig usb0 up" to connect to my device, yes.21:29
luke-jrTsuyo: is your real LAN 192.168.2.* ?21:29
ieatlintyou want to add an interface entry there for usb0... don't enter a gateway or nameservers for it (leave your normal eth0 or similar unchanged)21:29
luke-jrTsuyo: that's why21:30
ieatlintoh, haha21:30
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DocScrutinizerone possible explanation: your PC detects N900 as a network access, and tries to cnfigure your system to route data to N900 rather than your former internet21:30
luke-jrTsuyo: if you want to make USB + Ethernet a single network, you need a bridge21:30
luke-jrwhich Linux doesn't make easy21:30
Tsuyo: /21:30
luke-jrwhat OS?21:30
ieatlintyeah, simple solution is change your network's ip address range21:31
ieatlintslightly less simple solution is change the phone's ip address21:31
TsuyoAye, give me a second. I load up MAD21:31
luke-jrTsuyo: do you care if your N900 can connect through it?21:31
ieatlinti would really not try and do a bridge... that's a lot of extra shit that is generally unnecessary21:31
Tsuyoluke-jr: no.21:32
luke-jrTsuyo: then just use another range for N90021:32
luke-jrifconfig usb0
Tsuyolooks like .. its workig :)21:33
TsuyoThank you guys :)21:33
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ieatlintnote that if you just changed the ip on the phone, you will have to repeat that step every time you reboot the phone21:34
Tsuyowouldnt be a problem for me.21:35
lolloonice congrats.21:35
TsuyoI don't even restart my phone often21:35
SpeedEvilThere is a stupid hack to do init scripts when you don't want to do init scripts.21:36
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SpeedEvilQueen Beecon can launch scripts at system start.21:36
SpeedEvilDo that21:36
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ieatlintand thus today had the first female political assassination in the US21:40
ShadowJKtell me someone starting with P got it21:40
ieatlinthey, that's my rep :P21:41
ieatlintnah, some woman from arizona that i've never heard of21:41
ShadowJKoh wow, this 512M kingston is performing compeltely the opposite way of the Kingstons..21:41
ShadowJKthe microsd kingstons :)21:41
DocScrutinizerkingston vs Kingston?21:41
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ShadowJKalso the microsd kingsotns are a bit dubious, I think they all came from HK21:42
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ShadowJKit seems to be running faster at rewrite than at write..21:43
ShadowJKAlso seems to run faster the more threads I throw at it21:44
ShadowJKThis makes about as much sense as ketchup on pancakes21:44
lcukwhat os are you testing this in?21:45
lcukoh this is on shiva isnt it21:46
lcukso get onto #shiva or whatever and moan there21:46
lcukor start testing on maemo21:46
ShadowJKThis is basically direct to hw, the OS and HW shouldn't be interfering at all21:47
luke-jrthat makes no sense :P21:47
ShadowJKIf I tested on N900 I'd see the same values21:47
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talineohi, can someone help me with an n810 problem, I think I have some bad bad mistake (like updating udev and reboot the tablet ...)21:49
ShadowJKapt-get upgrade is mostly a mistake21:49
VladNistor-mobthere was some crap flying around the net about pr 1.4 in Q2 2011, it's just that isn't it?21:49
luke-jrtalineo: yeah, that's a mistake21:49
ShadowJKVladNistor-mob, April 1st is in Q2 2011, right?21:50
lolloowow nice!21:50
talineoluke-jr: is this some mistake I can get out of ?21:51
VladNistor-mobyes, it starts then, and I also see your point21:51
VladNistor-mobjust wondering though21:51
talineothe device start and restart again and again ...21:51
lcukbug 1138421:51
povbotBug Diablo extras & extras devel badly signed with Fremantle repository key21:51
luke-jrtalineo: cold-flash?21:51
lcukX-Fade, ping, can something be done about this please :$21:51
VladNistor-mobluke-jr, that comes with menopause i hear21:52
ShadowJKlcuk, you know how people are always saying "Get a fast class 6 or class 10 card" when talking about N900 for MeeGo and such, I've only tested half the unused cards I have, and I'm already finding that higher class rating doesn't mean universally faster21:52
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lcukShadowJK, i dont know21:52
luke-jrtalineo: do you have another OS installed?21:52
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lcukbecause testing on one device does not mean same results on maemo devices21:53
talineolukep-jr: no21:53
luke-jrtalineo: otherwise, if it's /really/ important to just undo it, I could probably help you build a recovery kernel, but it would take so much time I'd have to charge for it21:53
lcuksince in part its how the os talks to the card too21:53
talineoluke-jr: no21:53
luke-jrtalineo: probably a couple of days21:53
luke-jrif it's not important, just reflash ☺21:53
luke-jrbut do it soon21:54
talineoluke-jr: sorry it's hard to follow you21:54
luke-jrbroken OS tend to not charge your battery21:54
talineowhat means reflash ?21:54
MohammadAGShadowJK, and I'm guessing a class 10 isn't faster than the eMMC right?21:54
luke-jrdownload the firmware and flash it21:54
talineoloosing it all ?21:54
luke-jrMohammadAG: class 2 is probably faster than eMMC21:54
luke-jrtalineo: yes21:54
talineobut just the OS and Apps, not home data ?21:55
lollooblame nokia for software charging21:55
luke-jrnot sure, possibly everything21:55
ShadowJKMohammadAG, I don't think you can unviersally say that21:55
luke-jrShadowJK: I do. the eMMC is SLOW21:55
luke-jrI just threw an off-the-shelf 2 GB uSD in mine and it was faster21:55
talineofor the battery I remove it for now, so no big problem21:55
ShadowJKI'm pretty sure these Class 4 Kingstons are slower :-)21:56
luke-jrtalineo: ok, but still don't wait weeks21:56
luke-jrbatterys discharge over time21:56
ShadowJKYou would lose /home, but /media/mmc1 /media/mmc2 would be saved21:56
DocScrutinizeryeah :-S21:57
DocScrutinizerdiablo is awesome21:57
talineohome is very problematic, because of gpe21:57
DocScrutinizerwhen optification is just that, what's diablo partitioning then?21:58
infobotoptification is probably a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the partitioning is FUBAR, or,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish somebody had looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", or bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 sentence321:58
ShadowJKluke-jr, I haven't figured out a way to sanely benchmark the emmc yet..21:59
luke-jrShadowJK: dd21:59
ShadowJKfirst, dd is a stupid benchmark. it tells you nothing. Second, you'd need to run your benchmark tool when the device is in a state where it's not using the emmc, at all21:59
DocScrutinizerrun dd with realtime scheduling22:00
ShadowJKNot good enough :P22:00
ShadowJKYou'd need to run the benchmark without /home, without MyDocs and without swap22:00
DocScrutinizerdisable irq22:00
ShadowJKWhich means running it from one of the early bootscripts right after the mmc driver has been loaded but before swapon and mount22:01
DocScrutinizeryeah, even rt will pass control to system, when waiting for IO22:01
luke-jrShadowJK: it's called Gentoo22:01
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DocScrutinizerooh, I thought that's the name of this year's flu virus22:01
user___hey, how do I lookup the wep key I stored on this thing?22:02
lcukX-Fade, ahh it doesn't actually block usage of the repo, it just gives bad warning when you refresh22:02
user___instead of having it show up as stars in the internet connections prefs22:02
DocScrutinizeruser___: iwconfig will show you the encryption key in hex22:03
ShadowJKBut anyway, Kingston Class 4 MicroSD, sequential writes in 512k blocks: 10 megabytes/second. Same card, 4 threads writing sequentially in 128k blocks: 500 kbyte/s. Sandisk class 2 (yes, two) card, 4 threads writing sequentially in 128k blocks: 3.3 Megabytes/second.22:03
ShadowJKThe class 2 is outperforming the class 4 by a factor of 6.22:03
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ShadowJKThe class 6 only wins in the single-tasking digital camera use case22:04
DocScrutinizeruser___: nfc where it's stored though22:04
ShadowJKsorry, class 422:04
toresbemaybe buying the class 6 wasn't a good idea then22:04
ShadowJKWell it's not the entire story22:04
user___instead of having it show up as stars in the internet connections prefs22:04
infobotsomebody said nfc was No Fucking Clue22:05
ShadowJKThe whole story is something like "A good class 2 beats a shitty class 6."22:05
user___how do I look in nfc?22:05
toresbeI have nfc.22:05
keriothe problem is that "ULTRA SUPER XXXXXTREME" SDs are heavily optimized for very fast sequential writes22:06
DocScrutinizerprobably you need to dig through all gconf keys to find it22:06
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ShadowJKInside the microSD is a small little ARM MCU that translates block device requests from the host into reads and writes to the flash. The speed difference I'm observing comes most likely from the "good" card having a more capable ARM processor inside, or having more sophisticated programming than the "cheap" class 4 :)22:07
user___how do I get to gconf keys? can you give me a path?22:08
keriowhy can't i use the raw memory inside the SD? :(22:08
lcuk? microsd has ARM chip inside?22:08
SpeedEvilyes luck22:08
keriolcuk: yup22:08
kerioand it's pretty much gratis22:08
ShadowJKlcuk, yes22:08
keriobecause the cost of testing the NAND before selling it without a controller is bigger than the cost of the controller22:09
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ShadowJKAround 2006 or so I saw Transcend advertising that their SD cards' CPU could be reprogrammed on the fly22:09
ShadowJKOf course, you'd only gotten info on how to do that if you paid them megabucks :(22:10
talineoluke-jr: how many would you charge ?22:10
kerioµSDs are a *tiiiiiiiiny* cpu and a nand22:10
SpeedEvilphysically tiny22:10
SpeedEvilIt's quite capable logically22:10
jaskaprobably mmuless arm?22:10
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keriowell, i'd assume that, being a cpu, it has at least AND and XOR22:11
SpeedEvil32 bit, mmuless, probably22:11
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SpeedEvilgetting 200K of RAM on the CPU isn't cheap, and pretty much means you're into 32 bit territory22:11
keriodoes that mean that all of our hacker badges should be revoked because nobody can run arbitrary code on microSDs they own?22:12
SpeedEvilArbitrary code is interesting, as it'd allow raw-mode.22:12
SpeedEvilAs well as other things.22:12
ShadowJKThey also have to be able to run that DRM shit that *SD supports (but nobody uses)22:12
lcukcan someone please back this up with web resources22:13
kerioShadowJK: except windows phone 722:13
SpeedEvil lcuk22:13
ShadowJKI was going to paste that :)22:14
* MohammadAG programs his uSD's CPU to compile a kernel22:14
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SpeedEvilmicroSDs are insane - they have multiple shaved chips stacked on top of each other22:15
MohammadAGhow do I decapsulate a uSD?22:18
SpeedEvilnitric+sulphuric acid, warmed, sprayed over the chip22:18
ShadowJKDoes it also "decasulate" human hands?22:19
SpeedEviluse a flouropolymer rubber gasket to contain it.22:19
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SpeedEvillcuk: you basically don't get datasheets or other info for the NAND controller chips, as the are made to be sold only to people making 10M cards at a time.22:20
SpeedEvilthough mabe that may be pessimistic22:21
keriolet's buy 10M cards22:21
SpeedEvilthe above chip is mentioned in the bunnie blog22:21
SpeedEvilwell - a related chip22:21
SpeedEvilthis is a CF flash controller22:22
lcukSpeedEvil, its just not required under normal circumstances22:22
kerioa µSD for nerds22:22
lcukits a memory card22:22
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SpeedEvilwhat's not required?22:22
ShadowJKThis is why I'm hoping Windows Phone 7 will take off, because I suspect Microsoft will create a IOPS based Speed Rating for memory cards :)22:23
ShadowJKLike how their ReadyBoost requirements changed the market22:23
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ShadowJKIt'd be nice to get told about the failure modes too beforehand :)22:27
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keriono, srsly, OpeµSD22:28
kerioi'd buy that22:28
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SpeedEvilMe too. I'd love it as a datalogger.22:32
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DocScrutinizermeh, who's user____?22:40
MohammadAGwhere's libqtm's git?22:40
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DocScrutinizeranyway: dig up wlan key:  gconftool-2 -R /|grep -C15 <SSID-of-AP>22:41
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rhkfinDo you have git working OK on N900/Maemo? Trying to git clone something, I get git: 'remote-curl' is not a git-command. See 'git --help'.23:24
BCMM_rhkfin: did you install git-core?23:25
rhkfinBCMM_: installed 'git', will check -core..23:25
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rhkfinindeed I didn't. And funny enough, it will remove the package 'git'23:26
rhkfindid'nt expect that.23:26
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rhkfinBCMM_: thanks, got my first pyqt app running on maemo :)23:28
mgedmindebian had a git package for "GNU Interactive Tools"23:28
mgedminnobody knows what it is, nobody cares about it, but when Linus wrote Git, the package had to be named git-core23:28
BCMM_oooooh, that's why23:29
rhkfinok, weird..23:29
rhkfinthanks mgedmin23:29
mgedminI think there was an early Maemo port named 'git', and then someone else later ported the Debian git-core package and had to add Replaces: git because they both ship /usr/bin/git or something like that23:29
mgedminI'm just guessing23:29
Gyjfwas it Linus who wrote it?23:29
Gyjfthen it has to be good23:29
BCMM_they need a system of package categories23:30
rhkfinGyjf: git? yes23:30
* Gyjf downloads23:30
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rhkfinIt's a fun story :)23:31
trumeesomething has been bothering me. I am using a DC-10 charger which gives out 1.2A current. Does it put more pressure on the car battery?23:31
rhkfin"Take CVS as an example of what not to do; if in doubt, make the exact opposite decision."23:31
trumeeDocScrutinizer: any comment?23:31
chx this is the "other" git23:31
* trumee had his car alternator fail the other day. Could that be due to DC-10 charger?23:32
BCMM_it isn't even anything to do with GNU...23:32
rhkfinhow do I take a screenshot from CLI (over ssh?)23:33
BCMM_oh, apparently it is on GNU mirrors23:33
ZogGMohammadAG, ping23:33
ZogGi have good news for you23:33
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HtheBhi :)23:35
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MohammadAGHtheB, hey23:37
MohammadAGZogG, do tell :P23:37
HtheBhow r u23:37
ZogGMohammadAG about broadcom23:37
MohammadAGHtheB, fine I guess23:37
MohammadAGZogG, it can't be good then :P23:38
MohammadAGin fact, i'm using my N900 to reply cause my PC wlan timed out, so nice timing23:38
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* MohammadAG waits for PC to connect to click that23:38
ZogGMohammadAG, Since the release of that new open driver, it has been integrated into the recent Linux kernel release 2.6.37, where it can be actively improved upon by the entire Linux community. It was also included in Ubuntu 10.10, or Maverick Meerkat, last fall.23:38
ZogGMoving forward, Linux users of hardware with Broadcom chips will no longer have to give wireless another thought.23:38
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MohammadAGZogG, isn't that old?23:39
MohammadAGit is old23:39
MohammadAGsince I'm on 10.10 :P23:39
HtheBMohammadAG, I noticed something about my N900 :D23:40
rhkfinHei any pointers for screenshot tools?23:40
MohammadAGZogG, I just got the "i have good news for you" part on my PC23:40
NIN101They should just fix their b43 crap.23:40
MohammadAGrhkfin, yeah, CTRL+Shift+p23:41
NIN101Or at least make it more open and not so restritcted.23:41
HtheBremember the bluetooth.... well.. it seems to be that the "bluetooth is working" in the background. When you search for a device, it DOES find my N900... but that's all :(23:41
HtheBI can't send any files to the N900 :p23:41
MohammadAGrhkfin, press the three buttons, screenshot will be in the photos app23:41
DocScrutinizertrumee: err what?23:41
ZogGrhkfin built in option for screenshots23:42
ZogGNIN101 it is open now23:42
ZogGMohammadAG got the link23:42
rhkfinMohammadAG: nice, will check!23:42
ZogGwhat chip/ kernel do you have23:42
trumeeDocScrutinizer, sucking out 1.2A from the car battery is bad?23:42
ZogGDocScrutinizer heil hypnotoad23:42
NIN101ZogG: 14e4:431523:42
BCMM_trumee: a car battery can cope with 1.2A23:43
ZogGtrumee sucking anything is bad23:43
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DocScrutinizertrumee: what makes you think you're doing that?23:43
ZogGNIN101 you are not MohammadAG  =)23:43
ZogGNIN101 what chip is it?23:43
NIN101lol, nvm23:43
rhkfinZogG: MohammadAG where do I find the files in the file structure?23:43
trumeeDocScrutinizer, my car alternator died. was wondering whether the DC10 charger killed it.23:43
ZogGrhkfin screenshots?23:44
rhkfinZogG: yes23:44
DocScrutinizerwhat's a dc-1023:44
rhkfinZogG: not in DCIM23:44
MohammadAGrhkfin, /home/user/MyDocs/.images/Screenshots afaik23:44
DocScrutinizerthe standard wallcharger?23:44
BCMM_trumee: a charged car battery should handle that for like a day and a bit23:44
MohammadAGor Images/Screenshots in the file manager23:44
trumeeDocScrutinizer, Nokia DC-10 charger23:44
MohammadAGDCIM is camera23:44
ZogGBroadcom would like to announce the initial release of a fully-open23:44
ZogGLinux driver for it's latest generation of 11n chipsets...... It supports multiple current chips (BCM4313,23:44
ZogGBCM43224, BCM43225) as well as providing a framework for supporting23:44
ZogGadditional chips in the future,23:44
toresbeDocScrutinizer: At most, 380 passengers23:44
rhkfinMohammadAG: ok, thanks, found them23:44
trumeeBCMM, good to know that23:44
MohammadAGZogG, isn't wl.ko open already?23:45
MohammadAGrhkfin, ty23:45
ZogGyes but they add support23:45
DocScrutinizertrumee: you expect me to google for dc-10 now?23:45
ZogGand i helped one girl actually to start the wifi on arch23:45
ZogGi think she has same chip23:45
ShadowJKDC-10 is a Nokia car charger with 1.2A 5V output23:45
DocScrutinizeror run the to other room, to check if the standard wallcharger is a DC-10??23:45
ZogGit's just included in 27 kernel23:45
ShadowJKIt probably has a switch mode converter23:45
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: thanks23:45
ZogGso update =)23:45
toresbeShadowJK: 1.2A 5V output does _not_ mean it has a 1.2A 12V input.23:45
trumeeDocScrutinizer, nope. if you havent heard of it.23:46
ShadowJKtoresbe, yes23:46
DocScrutinizertrumee: this charger most likely will draw less than 1.2A from battery23:46
ShadowJKtoresbe, in fact it would probably melt down if it had 12V input :-)23:46
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DocScrutinizertoresbe: exactly23:46
ShadowJKuh 12V 1.2A input23:46
trumeeit charges N900 very quickly though23:46
MohammadAGZogG, the N900 runs 2.6.28 :P23:47
trumeeabsolutely fantastic charger23:47
DocScrutinizertrumee: the N900 can not charge more quickly than with the standard wallcharger23:47
DocScrutinizertrumee: as N900 never ever takes 1.2A input23:47
trumeeDocScrutinizer, much better than 500mA charger.23:47
DocScrutinizersure, N900 takes some 800..900mA at max23:47
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DocScrutinizerand what was that nonsense with killing your converter?23:48
DocScrutinizerar what's an alternator anyway?23:48
trumeeDocScrutinizer, i thought i was loading the car electronics too much23:48
ZogGMohammadAG how is n900 releated you wanted wlan card?23:49
DocScrutinizerno way, dude23:49
* trumee is a happy bunny now23:49
DocScrutinizertrumee: your zigarette lighter might make trouble with the 20...50A it takes23:49
DocScrutinizertrumee: but not a wimpy usb charger23:50
trumeeSygic absolutely needs a DC-10 charger.23:50
trumeeusb charger doesnt cut it for gps usage23:51
ShadowJKthe car stereo probably uses more than the charger23:51
DocScrutinizeryou bet it does23:51
trumeeShadowJK, oh. really23:51
MohammadAGZogG, you said 27, not 3723:51
ZogGMohammadAG i meant 3723:52
trumeewhat about the chargers which convert to AC.23:52
ZogGi'm dyslexic =)23:52
DocScrutinizertrumee: AIUI DC-10 *is* a usb charger, no?23:52
ShadowJKYeah it is23:52
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ShadowJKBut he probably used some generic weak crap before23:52
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ZogGtrumee your car can explode from awesomeness from n90023:52
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ZogGbe carefull23:52
ZogGDocScrutinizer can prove it23:53
DocScrutinizersure, be careful!23:53
trumeeShadowJK, yes used a 500mA charger from ebay. pathetic charging.23:53
ShadowJKInverter -> AC Wall charger -> N900 will most definitely waste a shitload of power23:53
DocScrutinizeryes, I bet23:53
ShadowJKMore than car stereo, less than car headlights23:53
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: ack23:53
* MohammadAG ponders installing the Ubuntu natty 2.6.37 kernel23:54
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ZogGMohammadAG do you have broadcom on PC or laptop?23:55
MohammadAGShadowJK, look on the bright side, at least it allows the car body to help the FMTX :p23:55
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ZogGby PC i mean Desctop23:55
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DocScrutinizerShadowJK: though I'd feel better with such a setup, as I've seen several devices freeing magic blue smoke, due to poorly OVProtected USB car chargers, and then somebody engaged the starter while phone charging23:55
MohammadAGZogG, PC = laptop23:55
MohammadAGso I use both to refer to, both23:55
ZogGMohammadAG PC for me is Desktop23:55
ZogGas laptop is more mobile computer23:55
ZogGand Pc is personal, but in kinda way personal in my room computer23:56
ShadowJKDocScrutinizer, I'm not so sure... looking at the $15 inverters people buy from ebay...23:56
ZogGotherwise you can call any phone PC now as it's yours =)23:56
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MohammadAGZogG, both are personal for me23:56
ZogGMohammadAG, where was the problem on laptop and you have broadcom there tifht?23:56
MohammadAGno one touches my PCs23:56
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: I got a FR here with a label: "declared dead 2008-08-23. Died while charging on a scooter that got started"23:56
ZogGi did23:56
ZogGi touched it in dirty palce23:57
MohammadAGactually, no one knows how to, I leave them on a logged out tty when I'm away23:57
ZogGwhat's wrong with me23:57
lcukssh root@MohammadAG touch /usr/bin/omg_ponies23:57
MohammadAGthe problem is broadcom :P23:57
ZogGi bet your mom can hack in and play soduku online on facebook23:57
* MohammadAG changes root password from root to something else23:57
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ZogGMohammadAG wait say me again the chip23:57
trumeeDocScrutinizer, what do you mean got started?23:58
DocScrutinizeregage starter23:58
DocScrutinizerturn the key23:58
ZogGdamn she is offline23:58
pupnikhow hard is it to get hildon running on a standard laptop/netbook?23:58
MohammadAGstart the engine23:58
ZogGthe girl i helped with broadcom23:58
trumeeDocScrutinizer, what happens at startup?23:58
ZogGshe has one with new eeepc23:58
ZogGis it hte same chip?23:58
DocScrutinizerthere's severe noise and spikes on 12V23:58
MohammadAGZogG, what's her number? I can ask directly23:58
ZogGMohammadAG, anyway i wouldn't rush to buy new if i was you23:59
trumeeDocScrutinizer, ah!23:59
trumeeDocScrutinizer, i will be careful in the future.23:59
ZogGMohammadAG, she is queen, as she is really pretty young ang gentoo guru =)23:59
ZogGi'm affraid of pretty and smart girls23:59
DocScrutinizerso cheap shit USB chargers will feed those to your phone ---> BOOOM23:59
MohammadAGZogG, the speed I'm downloading 2.6.37 at makes me think otherwise23:59
ZogGthere should be at least something i'm better23:59
ZogGbut as i'm ugly and stupid23:59

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