IRC log of #maemo for Thursday, 2010-12-30

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pradeep_jacekowski, what do you mean by dead platforms???00:00
jacekowskipradeep_: maemo is dead00:01
jacekowskipradeep_: n900 is last phone with maemo00:01
jacekowskipradeep_: and replacement will arrive soon00:01
eppbecause i want to inject packets.00:02
pradeep_hmmm i think so00:03
pradeep_but meefo is partly open source00:03
pradeep_but is meego not built from maemo00:03
SpeedEvilpradeep_: sort-of.00:03
SpeedEvilIn the same way that if you knock down a house, you can rebuild it using some of the same bricks.00:04
SpeedEvilThat doesn't make it a similar house.00:04
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timeless_mbpanyone here happen to have a "local mirror" of "debian"? :)00:08
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Venemojacekowski: well when Maemo "dies", we can always switch to MeeGO00:17
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kerioa "mirror" of "debian"?00:20
ShadowJKwidelands has a game timer. I've wasted 11 hours playing one game on N90000:20
kerioyeah, i "mirrored" your "debian"00:20
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timeless_mbpkerio: i'm looking for someone who could run a script on what would be roughly the set of all packages that could be installed from debian-stable (only one [presumably the latest] version per package)00:25
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* trumee strange imageviewer doesn't support bmp image format01:57
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BCMMthere seem to be multiple packages that provide for some sort of timed profile changes (going silent at night, etc.) - anyone prefer any specific one, for a reason?02:51
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jacekowskii was looking at psp specs02:53
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jacekowskiand it has 300MHz mips processor02:54
luke-jr300MHz sucks :P02:54
jacekowskiwith very shitty graphic processor02:54
jacekowskiand it should be possible to emulate it at reasonable speed at n90002:54
MohammadAGjacekowski, 33302:55
MohammadAGjacekowski, actually, some/most first gen PSP games ran at 222MHz02:55
ShadowJKdunno, emulating 300MHz MIPS on 600MHz could be tricky02:55
MohammadAGand some custom firmware raised that to 333MHz02:56
jacekowskiit was sony firmware02:56
MohammadAGthen sony unlocked the CPU in an update so devs can use it02:56
luke-jreven my router has 400MHz :p02:56
MohammadAGjacekowski, yes, but old games with old firmware libs had 222MHz as the top CPU speed02:56
MohammadAGbut think about it02:56
MohammadAGthe PSP is 400x272 or sth02:57
MohammadAGand the games look pixelated on that02:57
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jacekowskithing is that psp is running old mips02:57
MohammadAGjacekowski, anyways, is there even a PC emulator for PSP games?02:57
jacekowskilot of them02:58
jacekowskione in java02:58
pupnikjacekowski: what system has ever been emulated by a host system with 2x the mhz of the emulated system?02:58
MohammadAGfor games?02:58
MohammadAGI thought they only emualted homebrew02:58
jacekowskithey emulate games as well02:58
MohammadAGpupnik, 3x02:58
pupnikok 302:59
ds3speaking of emulators, anyone got stella running with the n900?02:59
MohammadAGas I said, some games ran at 22202:59
ds3and have debs for the n90002:59
pupnikyes ds3 - it's ugly but works02:59
jacekowskipupnik: first, arm is a lot faster02:59
ds3pupnik: got working debs for the n900?02:59
pupniknot really02:59
jacekowskipupnik: i mean, new cortex is a lot faster than 30 years old r400002:59
MohammadAGjacekowski, then it's very possible to get an emulator03:00
MohammadAGbut keep this in mind03:00
ds3jacekowski: but the r4000 doesn't have the nice branch avoidance setup that the ARMs have03:00
pupnikwell i know someone who is writing a PSP emulator :)03:00
MohammadAGa PSP can run PS1 games03:00
MohammadAGand we see how those perform on the N90003:00
jacekowskiMohammadAG: how?03:00
MohammadAGso unless you get the SGX working properly with it...03:00
MohammadAGjacekowski, crap03:00
MohammadAG10-15 FPS03:00
MohammadAG(without SGX fyi)03:01
jacekowskioverclock it to like 800MHz03:01
MohammadAGwould rather have it graphically accelerated03:01
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jacekowskips1 was running 33MHz mips r300003:02
jacekowskino chance03:02
jacekowskiemulate 200MHz r400003:03
jacekowskiunless there are major screw ups in that code03:03
jacekowskibut hmm03:03
jacekowskiqemu has like 1 to 10 instruction rate in fully emulated mode03:03
MohammadAGwell, I think it runs full speed on the pandora03:03
jacekowskifor x8603:03
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MohammadAGand the pandora has the same specs as the N900 (?)03:03
jacekowskiwell, there is one linux psp emulator03:04
jacekowskiwe can see if it works at all03:04
MohammadAGit should03:04
wolf^MohammadAG, sony doesn't allow running games at 333 mhz03:04
MohammadAGFPS might be in the 0.xs03:05
MohammadAGwolf^, CFW does, right03:05
jacekowskiThe PSP uses two 333 MHz MIPS32 R4000-based CPUs, a GPU with 2 MB onboard VRAM running at 166 MHz, and includes 32 MB main RAM and 4 MB embedded DRAM in total.[4] The hardware was originally forced to run more slowly than it was capable of and most games ran at 222 MHz.[124] However, with firmware update 3.50 on May 31, 2007, Sony removed this limit and allowed new games to run at a full 333 MHz.[125]03:05
jacekowskiwolf^: it does03:05
jacekowskitwo 333MHz cpus03:05
MohammadAGwait what03:05
wolf^jacekowski, you won't pass certification if you run at 333 mhz03:06
MohammadAGthat means like 666MHz?03:06
jacekowskiwolf^: it does03:06
jacekowskiwolf^: read that03:06
jacekowskiwolf^: Sony Confirms Full PSP CPU Speed (Updated)03:06
jacekowskiMohammadAG: sort of03:07
jacekowskiMohammadAG: but not exactly03:07
MohammadAGcan we focus on the fact that some games were in fact running on 222?03:07
jacekowskiit's more like 2+2<403:07
MohammadAGjacekowski, weird, never heard of that mentioned anywhere03:07
jacekowskiMohammadAG: on two cpus03:07
MohammadAGthe two CPUs part03:07
jacekowskiMohammadAG: wikipedia03:07
MohammadAGjacekowski, maybe the second one is the GPU?03:07
MohammadAGwikipedia can have mistakes03:08
jacekowskiquick google confirms it03:08
jacekowskieven some code translation is not going to help03:09
jacekowskiwith very good jit there will be at least 20% performance impact03:09
MohammadAGI'm still not sure about the 2 CPU part03:09
luke-jrMohammadAG: 666 with hyper-threading maybe03:10
luke-jrMohammadAG: without, more like 80003:10
luke-jr(or 600 for 222)03:10
MohammadAGI'm quite sure it was one CPU03:11
MohammadAGas others say/confirm on another IRC server03:11
luke-jrjacekowski: if the binary format is sane and there's no DRM code in them, you could probably pre-recompile MIPS to ARM03:12
luke-jrpre-virtualize too03:12
MohammadAGjacekowski, it seems the CPU is one, and the Media engine is another processor03:13
trumeeCan ovi maps do turn by turn navigation on N900?03:13
trumeeofcourse without voice.03:14
luke-jrtrumee: with network03:14
MohammadAGhe secondary CPU present in the Media Engine is functionally equivalent to the primary CPU save for a lack of a VPU03:14
trumeeluke-jr, is there a way to simulate the route?03:14
luke-jrtrumee: not afaik03:14
trumeeluke-jr, i am installing ovi suite hopefully which can let me load the whole map to the device03:15
wolf^jacekowski, also, about that shitty psp gpu, n900 has much worse one03:19
jacekowskii very much doubt that03:20
jacekowskiquality of graphic on n900 is a lot better than psp03:20
pupnikit's nice that you have an opinion jacekowski03:21
wolf^i have code running on psp and n90003:21
wolf^and it's 60 vs 20 fps03:21
jacekowski20fps is still acceptable03:22
wolf^yeah, lol03:22
ShadowJKwolf: same resolution too?03:22
wolf^same resolution03:22
wolf^basically a rebuild for n900, without chaning any assets03:22
* ShadowJK suspects everything except video is limited to about 20 on n900 :-)03:23
wolf^if you do software rendering you can have very smooth fps03:23
DocScrutinizertrumee: go for marble03:24
jacekowskithat marble thing03:24
jacekowskiis it only me03:24
jacekowskior it's very slow03:24
DocScrutinizerit's slow, but getting faster :-D03:25
MohammadAGjacekowski, nope, not only you03:25
jacekowskigetting faster as in?03:25
MohammadAGbut it's better than google maps which have all API to israel blocked03:25
jacekowskinext release will be faster03:25
MohammadAGexcept for the iPhone03:25
* MohammadAG grumbles03:25
pupnikthe guy writing a psp emu for ARM is 18 years old now and he's got a fair amount done03:26
MohammadAGwhat's new in QtMobility 1.1 again?03:27
* MohammadAG sees no link to a changelog03:27
jacekowskipupnik: what age has to do with it?03:28
luke-jrwolf^: fps != quality03:29
luke-jrMohammadAG: that's probably "Israel"'s fault03:30
MohammadAGluke-jr, no, I'll blame apple for it03:30
technomikeI cannot wait to get my N900 USB port fixed :)03:30
MohammadAGluke-jr, it was fine before the iPhone was released03:31
pupnik  math on the beach (sfw)03:31
comawhitedoes Maemo support two finger touch?03:31
comawhiteaww nutz03:31
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MohammadAGthe hardware doesn't03:31
luke-jrcomawhite: to an extent03:31
luke-jrMohammadAG: it does03:31
comawhitewhat's the extent?03:31
MohammadAGI'm not talking about simulated multitouch03:31
comawhiteI mean like pinching, spreading apart03:31
MohammadAGit doesn't in the sense you want03:31
luke-jrcomawhite: only one finger can move03:31
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luke-jrcomawhite: pinching requires 2 moving fingers03:32
MohammadAGluke-jr, that's not multitouch03:32
MohammadAGthat's confused singletouch03:32
wolf^luke-jr, how do you quantify quality?03:37
luke-jrwolf^: what looks pretty03:37
wolf^n900 cannot into pretty due to the fps issues03:37
wolf^and even ugly driver bugs that lock up the phone03:38
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wolf^it runs at maybe 2 fps03:39
wolf^if i put the resolution up it hangs up the display03:40
wolf^( )03:43
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: (confused single) ack03:44
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FIQ|n900oh, awesome, amsn nowdays require something that is unavailable, rendering it useless to use. >_>03:49
jacekowskithread local storage?03:50
jacekowskiwolf^: i've seen better stuff in 4k category03:50
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FIQ|n900the security thing which acronym definition i've forgotten03:51
MohammadAGFIQ|n900, sorry about that03:51
MohammadAGapparently, it's hardcoded to look in /opt, and the tcl packages are optified03:51
DocScrutinizer~weather EDDN03:51
aptNuernberg, Germany; (EDDN) 49-30N 011-03E 318M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0120 UTC; Dew Point: 3 F (-16 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.24 in. Hg (1024 hPa); Relative Humidity: 92%; Temperature: 5 F (-15 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the E (080 degrees) at 2 MPH (2 KT)03:51
MohammadAGhumidity 92 lol03:51
jacekowskidoes it mean under water?03:51
SpeedEvil92% humidity is not a lot of humidity at -16C03:51
FIQ|n900sounds warm03:51
MohammadAG~weather Israel03:52
aptI can't find station code "ISRAEL" (see or for ICAO locations codes).03:52
FIQ|n900~weather Sweden03:52
aptI can't find station code "SWEDEN" (see or for ICAO locations codes).03:52
SpeedEvil92% humidity means that there is 92% of the most water the air can hold at -16c03:52
nox-use airport codes03:52
FIQ|n900~weather stockholm03:52
SpeedEvil~weather EDIN03:52
aptI can't find station code "STOCKHOLM" (see or for ICAO locations codes).03:52
aptI can't find station code "EDIN" (see or for ICAO locations codes).03:52
nox-~weather muc03:52
aptI can't find station code "MUC" (see or for ICAO locations codes).03:52
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MohammadAG~weather LLJR03:53
aptI can't find station code "LLJR" (see or for ICAO locations codes).03:53
luke-jr~weather 3352303:53
aptI can't find station code "33523" (see or for ICAO locations codes).03:53
mikki-kunis apt our bot?03:53
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MohammadAGit's the same as infobot03:53
mikki-kunohhhh, ok03:54
DocScrutinizerno !  she's *mine*!03:54
BCMMpupnik: probably something very similar to the host03:54
mikki-kunDocScrutinizer: you gotta train your slave better...03:54
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BCMMpupnik: woah, sorry, i was reading the scrollback and thought i was reading current stuff03:54
DocScrutinizer~weather LBBG03:57
aptBurgas, Bulgaria; (LBBG) 42-29N 027-29E 28M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0130 UTC; Dew Point: 17 F (-8 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.30 in. Hg (1026 hPa); Relative Humidity: 85%; Temperature: 21 F (-6 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the W (280 degrees) at 2 MPH (2 KT)03:57
DocScrutinizer~weather LLBG03:57
aptBen-Gurion International Airport, Israel; (LLBG) 32-00N 034-54E 49M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0150 UTC; Dew Point: 37 F (3 C); Pressure (altimeter): 29.80 in. Hg (1009 hPa); Relative Humidity: 44%; Temperature: 59 F (15 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: Variable at 2 MPH (2 KT)03:57
Noma~weather EFTP03:58
aptTampere / Pirkkala, Finland; (EFTP) 61-25N 023-35E 112M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0150 UTC; Dew Point: 5 F (-15 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.03 in. Hg (1017 hPa); Relative Humidity: 92%; Sky conditions: overcast; Temperature: 6 F (-14 C); Visibility: 1 mile(s); Weather: Light snow; Wind: from the NNE (020 degrees) at 5 MPH (4 KT); Windchill: -4 F (-20 C)03:58
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MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, 15C :(04:00
* MohammadAG wants subzero temperatures too :(04:00
mikki-kunis there any sense behind those codes?04:00
DocScrutinizer~weather EDDM04:00
aptMunchen, Germany; (EDDM) 48-21N 011-47E; last updated: 2010.12.30 0150 UTC; Dew Point: 19 F (-7 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.21 in. Hg (1023 hPa); Relative Humidity: 85%; Sky conditions: mostly cloudy; Temperature: 23 F (-5 C); Visibility: 3 mile(s); Wind: from the NE (050 degrees) at 5 MPH (4 KT); Windchill: 15 F (-9 C)04:00
SpeedEvilmikki-kun: They are airport codes04:01
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SpeedEvil~weather EQGL04:03
aptI can't find station code "EQGL" (see or for ICAO locations codes).04:03
SpeedEvil~weather EGQL04:03
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: you can have them for take away04:03
aptLeuchars, United Kingdom; (EGQL) 56-23N 002-52W 0M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0150 UTC; Dew Point: 35 F (2 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.21 in. Hg (1023 hPa); Relative Humidity: 100%; Sky conditions: partly cloudy; Temperature: 35 F (2 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the WNW (290 degrees) at 7 MPH (6 KT); Windchill: 28 F (-2 C)04:03
mikki-kun~weather EDDL04:04
aptDuesseldorf, Germany; (EDDL) 51-18N 006-46E 41M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0150 UTC; Dew Point: 28 F (-2 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.24 in. Hg (1024 hPa); Relative Humidity: 86%; Sky conditions: mostly cloudy; Temperature: 32 F (0 C); Visibility: greater than 7 mile(s); Wind: from the NE (050 degrees) at 2 MPH (2 KT)04:04
mikki-kunhm... no wonder i ain't freezing anymore04:04
SpeedEvilThat's about right - leuchars - for me - it's about 10 miles from here.04:05
SpeedEvilYeah - it's warmed up so much I turned the heating off.04:05
SpeedEvilWell - apart from electric blanket.04:05
mikki-kun~weather LSZH04:06
aptZurich-Kloten, Switzerland; (LSZH) 47-29N 008-32E 432M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0150 UTC; Dew Point: 33 F (1 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.18 in. Hg (1022 hPa); Relative Humidity: 100%; Sky conditions: obscured; Temperature: 33 F (1 C); Visibility: less than 1 mile; Weather: Fog; Wind: Variable at 1 MPH (1 KT) (direction variable)04:06
* DocScrutinizer suspects SpeedEvil has a heating just for sake of waterpipes and LiIon cells04:06
mikki-kunok, no snow when i get home04:06
DocScrutinizerwell, I seem to spot a certain logic in these codes. I still fail on fist letter though04:07
mikki-kunDocScrutinizer: what does the second D stand for in germany?04:08
DocScrutinizerif E stood for Europe, so why is Israel like Swiss L then04:08
DocScrutinizermikki-kun: not entirely sure. maybe a filler04:08
mikki-kunDat schöne München liegt im noch schöneren Freistaat Bayern! (bin in Augsburg geboren ^^) - Beautiful Munich lies in the georgeous free state Bavaria!04:09
mikki-kuni guess those guys didn't know when they made those codes Germany is also seperated into states...04:10
DocScrutinizerbut then04:11
DocScrutinizer~weather ETFB04:11
aptI can't find station code "ETFB" (see or for ICAO locations codes).04:11
DocScrutinizer~weather ETSF04:12
aptFuerstenfeldbruck, Germany; (ETSF) 48-12N 011-16E 535M; last updated: 2007.10.09 0544 UTC; Dew Point: 39 F (4 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.24 in. Hg (1024 hPa); Relative Humidity: 100%; Sky conditions: mostly clear; Temperature: 39 F (4 C); Visibility: less than 1 mile; Weather: Mist; Wind: from the S (190 degrees) at 1 MPH (1 KT)04:12
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mikki-kunTeudschland? XD04:12
mikki-kuneither i fail to see the logic here or those codes were made by drunks...04:12
mikki-kuni guess later one is the case04:13
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Termanagood morning04:17
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mikki-kunTermana: good morning :)04:18
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pupnikexpensive low temps04:23
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aptflashing is, like,
DocScrutinizermikki-kun: TTR04:35
DocScrutinizernow reassigned to miliTary04:36
DocScrutinizerE=northern Europe, L=southern Europe04:37
nox-~weather eddh04:38
aptHamburg-Fuhlsbuettel, Germany; (EDDH) 53-38N 010-00E 15M; last updated: 2010.12.30 0220 UTC; Dew Point: 15 F (-9 C); Pressure (altimeter): 30.30 in. Hg (1026 hPa); Relative Humidity: 92%; Sky conditions: mostly cloudy; Temperature: 17 F (-8 C); Visibility: 1 mile(s); Weather: Mist; Wind: from the ENE (070 degrees) at 3 MPH (3 KT)04:38
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DocScrutinizerEDD = international civil german airport04:40
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mikki-kunseems it is really made way too complicated...04:45
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SpeedEvilYou have to fit all the airports in the world into a four letter code.04:50
* SpeedEvil flashes his phone.04:50
SpeedEvilMaybe now sound'll start working.04:50
mikki-kunSpeedEvil: problems with your sound?04:51
mikki-kunthere was a bug in a package04:52
mikki-kunit rebuilt a nokia-buult package which it acutally shouldn't04:52
SpeedEvilSomehow pulseaudio wasn't starting.04:52
SpeedEvilIn principle, I'm in favour of this.04:52
SpeedEvilAha - Mr Hands! With sound.04:53
DocScrutinizerthis sound is the true reason why PA was broken in that package mikki-kun mentioned04:55
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mikki-kunahhh, pulse audio04:56
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pupnikn900 would be a nice platform to try to fix-up the PA problems05:11
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pupniki believe there's one full-time employee making exactly what, no progress whatsoever there...05:11
pupniknot to sound bitter or anything05:12
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SpeedEvilI think if you kill him, you can take his job.05:13
SpeedEvilOr is that only in some star-trek episodes.05:13
SpeedEvilI forget05:13
DocScrutinizerjust thought about the funny fact of startrek assuming everybody is equipped with this magic universal translator - except klingons05:16
DocScrutinizerprobably a natural extrapolation of the way US Americans think about languages other than US English05:17
DocScrutinizeroh, there have been other languages than "starfleet" and klingon actually, e.g. binar which sounded like a defect modem and probably wasn't compatible with universal translators, so the binarians had to switch beteen their own language and natural "star fleet"05:21
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SpeedEvilAlso that silly 'cite precedents' language that made no sense at all.05:22
pupnikI'd be curious to see how much of PA's load is caused by the lowpass filter, versus how much is caused by the PA architecture itself05:23
pupnikgiven that driving alsa itself takes up basically no cpu time at all05:23
ieatlintDocScrutinizer: your analysis is missing the oft-cited fact that (post TOS, anyway), klingons are black, portrayed as primitive and predisposed to violence05:24
pupnikwonder if all you need to do is plug headphones in for that05:24
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pupnikanyone care to test PA playback cpu load with headphones vs speakers?05:24
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DocScrutinizerI think that has been done. By SpeedEvil ?05:37
SpeedEvilI dont' rememrbe05:38
pupnikwell if you do it sometime, please drop me a private message with your resuls (so i don't miss it)05:38
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Termanapupnik, DocScrutinizer, SpeedEvil - PA uses less CPU usage with headphones than the speakers05:44
TermanaSomething about no having to run the speaker protection algorithm on headphones (? IIRC)05:44
pupnikand how much is that, roughly05:44
pupnike.g. use 'top' to monitor it05:45
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DocScrutinizersth like 20% vs 10%? IIRC05:49
ShadowJKSpeedEvil, shaka, when the walls fell05:51
ShadowJKxkcd had a slightly related comic05:51
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n900evilyeah - that05:53
n900evilwow do I have a lot of apps I actually use05:53
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pupnikDocScrutinizer: yeah, the percentage figure does depends on the particular app and current cpu speed though05:59
pupnikso the governor does need to be locked05:59
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Termanapupnik, without headphones it's 16-18%, with headphones 9-11%, so roughly what DocScrutinizer said anyway :p06:01
pupnikhey thanks06:01
toresbea real question is why the hell is the sound API using up 10% of the CPU06:02
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toresbeI've got a real axe to grind with pulseaudio. I find that every. fucking. sound problem I have had the last four years have been solved immediately by doing "sudo rm /usr/bin/pulseaudio; sudo ln -s /bin/cat /usr/bin/pulseaudio; sudo killall pulseaudio"06:03
MohammadAGwell, that won't work on maemo06:04
toresbeThat's true. :)06:04
MohammadAGmafw's open source, can be fixed for music06:04
MohammadAGphone app isn't, you're stuck to PA I'm afraid ;)06:04
toresbeI'd be happy if somebody just made pulseaudio not suck, break and hog.06:05
MohammadAGsign me up for that too06:05
toresbe(That said, it seems like a workable architecture for mobile units, in terms of all the different stuff you have to pull off with sending sound all around the place, so I definitely see the point)06:06
toresbebut the audio API using 20% CPU util on sound playback is just absurd to me. And it's 5AM so I'm grumpier than normal.06:07
pupniktoresbe: i'm glad that you're grumpy06:07
toresbeWhilst walking home from work I played back a digitized recording of a 1963 performance of music on a PDP-1 computer.06:08
toresbeI found it somewhat ironic that I was using a computer so many orders of magnitude faster to listen to that recording, and carrying it in my pocket :)06:08
pupnikthey also did computer singing around that time 'daisy'06:09
* Gh0sty imagines toresbe with a long grey beard now06:09
toresbeI'm 22 but I'm grumpier and oldfartier than my years.06:09
Gh0styhm them you are3 my ae?06:09
toresbepupnik: Yeah, that was an IBM 7094 Mk II, and very much not real-time06:09
Gh0styim 28 and pdp-1 does not tell me anything06:10
toresbeI've written and run Hello World on it :)06:10
Gh0styive been working sometimes on stuff like older alpha and sparc machines06:11
Gh0styand probably some dec06:11
toresbeWell, "Hello Worrld", anyway. The curator was trying to catch a train...06:11
Gh0stybit nothing too serious06:11
ds3bare handed or with a train glove?06:11
Gh0styi am still from the dos generation however06:11
toresbeds3: The console printer was "cleared" for non-glove use.06:12
Gh0styand still happy to have known it06:12
toresbepupnik: The IBM rendered the waveforms onto seven-track data tape which was then fed to a DAC.06:12
Gh0styknowing dos and bat scripting really helped to understand linux shell at start06:12
toresbepupnik: The PDP-1 however, just had some internal CPU flags and registers wired out to a PCB with some capacitors to smooth the waveform. :)06:12
Gh0styoh and at home we had a commodore 12806:12
Gh0stystill have06:12
toresbeIt was very much a students' hack.06:13
Gh0styearliest games i have are still written by hand purely by typing codde listings from books06:13
toresbeThe 7094 was a vastly more expensive machine than the PDP-1.06:13
Gh0styman im getting old :(06:13
toresbeThe security in the PDP-1 machine room was lax enough that they could sneak in at night and solder on the CPU. The students would pick the lock on the computer room at times like 3AM, and added an indexed add instruction to the CPU :)06:14
Gh0styand now awake at 5am06:14
Gh0stydamn medicins :(06:15
Gh0stythey suck06:15
Gh0stytalking of which06:15
Gh0stywe have a fun issue at work06:15
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Gh0stysome older sun boxes arrived from our disaster center06:16
toresbepupnik: I actually really like the rendition of the Little Fugue in G Minor by JS Bach:
Gh0stywe still want to use em06:16
Gh0styapparently both storage boxes are locked06:16
Gh0styno keys to be found anywhere06:16
Gh0styand both have a broken disk ...06:16
Gh0stycan power them without keys06:16
Gh0stybut cant remove disks without unlocking ...06:17
Gh0styfor now they can run in degraded mode but seriously who could imagine such a stupid problem ... :p06:18
pupniktoresbe: yeah computer music was fun.  NeXT was a neat platform for it too06:18
toresbeI'd imagine.06:19
toresbeNever played with one, though I do have access to a cube06:19
pupnikit was just having a nice dsp with decent audio out06:21
toresbeDSPs are nice things :)06:22
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pupnikangry birds is so random sometimes06:28
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pupnikhard to believe people get 3 stars on some of these..06:35
rm_youis there angry birds for maemo? :P06:35
Termana... yes06:35
rm_youreally? lol06:35
rm_youshould grab06:35
Termana... really06:35
Termanain the Ovi Store06:36
Termana(ovi store... LOL)06:36
rm_youlol didn't know they actually had software in that :P06:36
pupnik think it was first made for n900 wasn't it?06:37
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rm_youwas it? :P06:38
rm_youI am SO out of the loop06:38
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* rm_you disappears06:39
pupniki saw i very early ... i think jan 2010 or so06:39
pupnikit was like the first game announced for ovi store or somethign06:40
pupnikit's remarkably inducive of replaying levels06:40
pupnikdue to the chaos of the many interacting elements06:40
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pupnikbahaha the pigs have a swedish flag06:47
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Arkenoiis 4th level pack out already?06:59
DocScrutinizeryeah, I heard somebody coded a virus and called it "angry birds level4-pack"07:01
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pupnikkey seems to be restarting the levels if your first shot doesn't pay off big07:02
mikki-kunhm... soon my compiles shall run faster and better than ever before as two machines will do them!07:11
mikki-kunehhhh, sorry, wc >.<07:11
mikki-kunseems i should go really to bed x)07:11
DocScrutinizerwc -l07:11
mikki-kunwc == wrong channel =p07:11
MohammadAGthanks lcuk :)07:12
mikki-kunMohammadAG: new media player?07:12
DocScrutinizerummm 000 songs?07:13
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, placeholder :P07:13
MohammadAGjust to test what would happen if 999 songs were there07:13
DocScrutinizerI hope there's place for >999 songs07:13
MohammadAGFYI, over 9000 works just as fine07:13
mikki-kunGO MOHAMMAD GO!!!07:13
mikki-kunis that a late christmas-present for us all maemonians? :)07:14
MohammadAGnicolai got song listing working :)07:14
MohammadAGwe just need to polish it07:14
SpeedEvilpupnik: I went through after ***'ng all of them, and on most levels managed to get significantly more than the *** highscore07:14
DocScrutinizera nice directory based fileselector is fine for me07:15
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pupnikbtw i see 4 levels... 2. Danger Above and 4. The Big Setup07:15
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MohammadAGand by polish I mean tidy the code, not make reflected album art07:16
Arkenoithe big setup?07:16
MohammadAGyes, new pack name afaik07:17
pupnikwell it definitely gets sickening after retrying a lefel for the 12th time07:17
MohammadAGmikki-kun, I'd consider it early valentine's day07:17
MohammadAGk, that's weird, late christmas it is07:17
Arkenoii see it, but it says i can get in the the ovi store and when i click on ovi store it says i should upgrade my device :-)07:17
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mikki-kunMohammadAG: awwwww, you wanna spread luv with it? ;)07:18
Arkenoi"We are sorry bla bla bla"07:18
MohammadAGosso-product-info -s OSSO_VERSION="RX-51_2009SE_20.2010.36-2_PR_MR0" 2> /dev/null || exit 007:19
MohammadAGArkenoi, run that in a root shell and reboot07:19
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG: WTF? || exit 0 ???07:20
MohammadAGidk, ask Nokia07:20
MohammadAGDocScrutinizer, cat /var/lib/dpkg/info/mp-fremantle-generic-pr.postinst07:21
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MohammadAGor whatever package you have07:21
DocScrutinizerhmm, sometimes it's a bit funny to copy a line from a script and suggest to run that single line in a shell07:22
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MohammadAGthe first button is pressed07:29
MohammadAGI just got it working like Nokia's button (style)07:29
mikki-kunMohammadAG: looks really good :)07:34
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ArkenoiMohammadAG, did not help07:42
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MohammadAGmikki-kun, :)08:05
mikki-kunhopefully nokia will learn how they should have actually coded that beast...08:05
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pupnikgetting audio out the speakers on maemo costs more CPU than android's entire VM/bytecode-interpreter08:14
* pupnik slow hand claps08:15
* Termana beats pupnik silly08:16
MohammadAGYou're not the one who can decide that08:16
* MohammadAG beats Termana 08:17
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pupnikI have no evidence that this issue is a priority for the coming meego / N908:23
pupnikAnd it doesn't look like a trivial thing to fix08:25
DocScrutinizerfind / -name '*pulse*' -exec rm {} ;08:26
MohammadAGtry the PA package with the FIFO implementation08:26
MohammadAGor was it LILO08:26
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MohammadAGtoo many *I*O cap, can't remember08:27
pupnikthanks MohammadAG - will do08:27
pupnikany more keywords to search with?08:27
MohammadAGit's on bugzilla08:27
MohammadAGmusic stutters browsing08:27
MohammadAGsearch for those08:27
pupnikthanks again08:27
* MohammadAG tries to find it08:28
DocScrutinizerfind / -name '*pulse*' -o -name 'pa*' -exec rm {} ;08:29
MohammadAGbug 719008:29
povbot`Bug music stutters while multi-tasking, especially browsing web08:29
MohammadAGshould be the last comment there08:29
* DocScrutinizer yawns08:29
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* ShadowJK always suspected music stuttering was mostly insufficient caching of the input file by the media player, as internet streeamed radio almost never stutters for me08:36
MohammadAGmediaplayer or mafw?08:37
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DocScrutinizer51ewwww dawn08:46
iratieHas anyone ever successfully unlocked a Nokia C6? I attempted to purchase a code from a retailer, but they said they couldn't do it and refunded my money08:46
doc|homeiratie: might be a better idea to try #symbian (if it exists)08:47
Appiahdoes it even run maemo?08:47
iratieI'm not sure what maemo is, I searched for nokia IRC and found this room08:48
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ShadowJKNo it doesn't run maemo08:48
Appiahit's a OS08:48
doc|homeit's symbian...08:48
doc|homeonly the n8/900 runs maemo08:48
ShadowJKThe best way to unlock is to buy it unlocked in the first place :-)08:48
doc|homedamn it, n8x0/n900 :)08:48
Appiahgood morning doc|home :D08:49
doc|homemorning Appiah08:49
RST38hn8-900 was good though08:49
iratieGot it cheap because I thought I could put a FIdo sim in a Rogers phone what with them being the same GSM provider and all08:49
doc|homeRST38h: could be confusing :/08:49
doc|homeiratie: that should be possible08:50
doc|homethen again, maybe they're even more anal than they used to be08:50
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pupnikn8 is a beautiful looking device imo08:52
MohammadAGit's nice in the hand08:53
iratiedoc: no deal, super anal08:56
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pupnikiratie: maemo runs on the Nokia N900 - a linux-based phone09:05
pupnikhi ddsfs09:07
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iratiewhat's this bb5 business about, anyone know?09:07
iratiethe C6 (RM-624) is not listed on any lists of BB5 phones but nor do most unlockers acknowledge it exists09:08
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lolcat^So how do you get it? We’ve packaged it for Debian Squeeze/Ubuntu 10.04 package and for Fedora 13, i386 and x86_64.09:55
lolcat^Can it play it?09:55
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RobbieThe1stlolcat: Probably not. We need an ARM deb(debian/ubuntu) package10:03
RobbieThe1stlolcat: If you can get the source, compiling it is possible.10:03
* timeless_mbp sighs10:06
timeless_mbpthat the maemo sdk vmware image was not LTS really sucks10:06
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Jaffatimeless_mbp: Maemo dev envs sub-optimal shock10:09
timeless_mbpJaffa: i wanted to do an apt equation solver10:09
timeless_mbpbut i couldn't apt-get update because the distro it was using didn't exist10:10
Jaffatimeless_mbp: Nokia took *far* too long to realise that giving good, cross-platform dev tools was the single most important factor10:10
Jaffatimeless_mbp: Doh10:10
* Jaffa wonders what version is being used in the customised image he's using.10:10
timeless_mbpso i just updated to Jaunty10:11
timeless_mbpw/o rebooting into it10:11
timeless_mbpcan i do another update before rebooting, or is that bad?10:11
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Jaffatimeless_mbp: I *think* that's risky.10:14
timeless_mbp seems to indicate i can't use dist-upgrade10:15
* timeless_mbp tries do-release-upgrade10:16
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timeless_mbpoh nice, it doesn't like my gcc packages10:17
timeless_mbpwow, that's cool, it estimated the download time for ~200mb as 3min10:17
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timeless_mbphrm, i think my solver works10:37
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timeless_mbphrm, no10:41
timeless_mbpit's not working properly10:41
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RST38hPackrat has a builtin solver.10:43
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timeless_mbpis packrat a maemo thing?11:17
timeless_mbpi think my solver now works11:17
timeless_mbpnote that what i want to solve is a nonstandard problem11:18
timeless_mbpit's a coverage question instead of an optimal question11:18
jacekowskiwhat does it solve?11:19
jacekowskii see11:20
timeless_mbpthe input is all packages suggested by all tasks11:20
timeless_mbpthe output is all packages which are available from Packages which could be pulled in via Pre?Depends/Recommends to satisfy those packages11:21
timeless_mbpthe initial question was "what portion of the world is covered by tasks"11:21
timeless_mbpthe answer is slightly over 10%11:22
timeless_mbpwhich was in line with our guess11:22
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timeless_mbpworld here is debian-stable11:23
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timeless_mbpjacekowski: do you have a debian install?11:25
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jacekowskii do11:26
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elysionhi! anyone know how to open a popup like this on n900?11:39
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daxt_Hello , anybody managed to shoot HD videos with N900 ?11:40
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RobbieThe1stdaxt_: Not possible, I'm pretty sure11:42
daxt_RobbieThe1st - i highly doubt11:42
RobbieThe1stAt least, not without some sort of custom driver, and even then, you are talking about a few FPS11:43
daxt_N900 camera is pretty much capable in capturing HD frames11:43
daxt_so why cannot it put them together into a video ?11:43
RobbieThe1stAh, but at what speed?11:43
Spookjesingle frames, yeah.. but at least 25/second is something else..11:43
daxt_isn't it possible to put them in 25 fps ?11:44
RobbieThe1stuh.. what?11:44
daxt_theoritically N900 has the hardware to capture HD video11:44
daxt_yet why its not implemented yet ?11:44
Spookjewhere does that statement come from?11:45
Spookjedoes it have the hardware to provide 25 HD frames/second?11:45
RobbieThe1stBecause the driver is closed-source?11:45
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Spookjethat as well11:45
daxt_so lets make an open source driver :D11:45
Spookjeyou're not waiting on us to start working on that are you?11:46
RobbieThe1stWell, the real issue is, though - the camera itself isn't good enough to do much more than it is.11:46
RobbieThe1stHeck, even your 5mpix images have to be steeply downsampled to get rid of the noise11:46
daxt_there must be a way to get this done11:47
daxt_coz i see smaller devices with much slower speeds recording HD videos11:47
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daxt_such as handycams11:47
daxt_if they can do it , why N900 cannot ? :|11:47
RobbieThe1stIt's all in the -hardware-11:47
RobbieThe1stas in the camera module.11:47
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RobbieThe1stThose devices have a custom ASIC that simply takes the incoming frames and does all the processing. Ours only does 800x480.11:48
* timeless_mbp chuckles @
daxt_so that means i have to wait till N1000 releases :(11:49
RobbieThe1stalso, it's a ET8EK8 by Toshiba11:49
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daxt_or if i can connect a HD handycam to N900 , then i dont need N900 to shoot videos :D11:50
jacekowskidaxt_: hd video in n900 is not going to be very good11:50
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jacekowskiyou get decent quality of pictures only because of reasonably long exposure times11:50
RobbieThe1stActually, if you want HD video... Just upsample it on your computer, run it through graycstoration... and you'll have just as good a result11:50
BluesLeecan someone assist with scratchbox setup?11:51
jacekowskilens is too small to handle anything more11:51
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daxt_Robbie that is a good idea11:51
jacekowskito record good HD video11:51
jacekowskiyou need11:51
timeless_mbpah yes..
Venemo_N900good morning everyone :)11:51
jacekowskibig good *glass* lens11:51
jacekowskisensitive low noise sensor ( that can be mitigated by even bigger lens )11:52
jacekowskiand hardware capable of encoding that video in real time11:52
RobbieThe1stTheoretically, couldn't the DSP be used to do quite a bit of the encoding work?11:53
Venemo_N900yeah jacekowski11:53
jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: it could11:54
jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: but it's not going to help a lot11:54
jacekowskiyou need hardware encoder for it to work11:54
Appiahhow about a n900-HD addon , just make a alittle bit bigger and attach it on the back11:55
* Appiah ducks11:55
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RobbieThe1st...Yea, I need a new screen. My screen cracked over a week ago and has been slowly getting worse over time. I got a replacement ordered tonight.12:01
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Venemo_N900RobbieThe1st: how did you manage to crack it?12:02
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RobbieThe1stIt was inside a soft case at the time, and I think something(spare battery corner? USB cable-connector? bit of gum? ) got jammed against it12:03
RobbieThe1stodd thing is, the digitizer is perfectly fine12:03
Venemo_N900so only the lcd is cracked, but touching works fine? interesting.12:03
RobbieThe1stYup - I checked on the paint app12:04
RobbieThe1stI had to recalibrate it once, as it was slightly off... but it's pretty much dead on now12:04
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RobbieThe1stIn case you're curious:
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RobbieThe1stIt started out like this, two weeks ago:
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Venemo_N900RobbieThe1st: I'm sorry for your N90012:11
RobbieThe1stYea, I know.12:12
RobbieThe1stOh, well... It's going to be a $40 and one harrowing experiance replacing it(Not too worried about doing it, worried about not being careful enough)12:12
Spookje$40? that's cheaper than i'd thought12:13
Venemo_N900there're vids on youtube about how to disassemble an n90012:13
RobbieThe1stYea; I've seen a video and have the official leaked disassembly manual12:14
RobbieThe1stActually, wait... It was ~50 all told including shipping12:14
RobbieThe1stClose enough, though12:14
Spookjewell good luck with the replacement.. I'd offer tips if I had any :P12:16
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Spookjemy n900 is now about a month old, so no need for disassembling yet12:16
daxt_there is a power kernel , have u installed it yet ?12:17
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Spookjenope haven't seen any need to yet12:18
daxt_Robbie what happened to the screen man ?12:19
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RobbieThe1st[02:03:00] <RobbieThe1st> It was inside a soft case at the time, and I think something(spare battery corner? USB cable-connector? bit of gum? ) got jammed against it12:21
RobbieThe1st[02:03:12] <RobbieThe1st> odd thing is, the digitizer is perfectly fine12:21
SpookjeI have a TV like that btw, it's very decorative :P12:21
RobbieThe1stThis is only the -second- LCD I've ever had cracked; last was in a laptop many years ago my brother kicked in the screen.12:22
daxt_Robbie ru going to replace the LCD ?12:22
keriotmux is much better12:22
daxt_good luck12:22
RobbieThe1stSee above12:22
kerioRobbieThe1st: are you an EE?12:22
RobbieThe1stNo, but I've taken a couple of courses12:23
RobbieThe1stAnd I've disassembled more than my share of equipment. I even disassembled(and -reassembled- a 17" desktop LCD(I mean the module itself!)12:24
daxt_any clues on what will be the successor of N900 ?12:24
RobbieThe1stNope; there's some codename, but nothing concrete12:24
RobbieThe1stI don't care, personally - My OC'd n900 with tweaked settings is plenty fast for me12:25
daxt_How many of you keep only the N900 with you and nothing else ?12:25
* RobbieThe1st raises hand12:25
* Spookje too12:25
Spookjewell ok, the work phone..12:26
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SpookjeI've actually been looking around for a cheap secondhand one to fiddle around with..12:26
daxt_i also shud get a 2nd hand N90012:27
Spookjekeep one for using, one for anything else :P12:27
daxt_who is selling one ?12:27
RobbieThe1stI'd like one cheap too! :P12:27
Spookjeprolly everyone in here :P12:27
RobbieThe1stBut I don't have the ~250-300 I'd need12:27
daxt_Nokia must be keeping some N900 reserves12:27
daxt_lets wikileak them12:27
Venemo_N900I could use another N900 for development, yes12:28
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RobbieThe1stHeck, what I -really- want is a N900 prototype model. I've seen one YT video of one, and I'd love to play with one12:28
delphiin my country its arround 600 eur, far too much for me to pay to have a spare one :)12:28
Appiahbut the price has dropped12:29
Venemo_N900RobbieThe1st: what for?12:29
daxt_anybody selling the N900 u have ?12:29
Spookjesecondhand here is about 200 euro's12:29
Appiahdelphi: cant you get it for about 400eur nowdays?12:29
RobbieThe1stVenemo_N900: Cause it just looks cool, and being able to say I have a prototype would be awesome.12:29
kerioRobbieThe1st: hell no you don't12:29
delphiAppiah here, no.12:29
Appiahdelphi: where are you?12:29
delphidont know about second hand tho12:30
delphibut second hand here means stolen and locked..12:30
RobbieThe1stI saw that video. It's cool12:30
Appiahno n900 is locked12:30
Venemo_N900it may be locked12:30
daxt_in my country i guess there are only less than 100 N900s are available12:30
RobbieThe1stImport from elsewhere?12:31
Venemo_N900daxt_: where is that?12:31
delphihow come? operators lock the phones so you can only use their sims..12:31
daxt_Venemo - Sri Lanka :D12:31
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delphiimport would cost alot of money12:31
delphias we are not in EU12:31
daxt_how many of u have overclocked ur N900 ?12:32
Venemo_N900delphi: I thought Serbia is in the EU, hm.12:32
jacekowskidaxt_: some, and some overclocked n900 failed12:33
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delphianyways, i got my new one for arround 200 eur from Telenor12:33
delphiVenemo_N900 not yet12:33
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Venemo_N900that's nice12:33
daxt_jace what was the reasons to fail ?12:33
delphiin a few years maybe12:33
RobbieThe1stI did a custom-oc; nice comfortable voltages at each setting. I have it at 250-950 normally, and can run it stabily at up to 115012:33
jacekowskihigher frequency == higher currents == more wear12:33
jacekowskiand then you add additional heat produced12:34
jacekowskithat adds more wear to it as wel12:34
RobbieThe1stTrue, but remember that this chip-design is designed to go up to 1000mhz12:34
jacekowskino it's not12:34
Venemo_N900delphi: well then I was mistaken12:34
jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: that's bullshit12:34
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delphiVenemo_N900 btw, maybe you misunderstood me, by EU i mean European Union, not Europe (it is in Europe) :)12:34
RobbieThe1stOurs may be rated for 500-600, but they make the same basic design up to 1ghz12:35
jacekowskiit's designed to run at 600MHz max12:35
Venemo_N900delphi: yes, I also meant the Union.12:35
jacekowskisilicon design yes12:35
Venemo_N900delphi: :)12:35
jacekowskibut manufacturing process isn't12:35
jacekowskisilicon is different in faster version12:35
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daxt_is it possible for N900 to tune into UHF ?12:35
RobbieThe1stAre you sure about that?12:35
RobbieThe1stAnd not just different binning?12:35
jacekowskithat's why you can run it at higher frequency12:36
jacekowskibut it's not going to last very long12:36
daxt_guys can N900 tune into TV Channels ?12:36
jacekowskiti has some docs on that subject12:36
RobbieThe1stI'll start worrying when loads of n900s start dying12:36
jacekowskidaxt_: no12:36
jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: they do12:36
delphidaxt_ maybe via usb TV card12:36
jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: ussualy not die completly12:37
jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: but they start doing strange thing12:37
RobbieThe1stNah; I haven't seen them. I have seen people over-oc and get it unstable at said frequenc12:37
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jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: read logs of this channel12:37
Venemo_N900well the N900's default speed is fast enough for me12:37
delphiyeah, n900 speed is fine12:37
jacekowskiRobbieThe1st: just if it starts working unstable even on normal frequencies, don't blame nokia12:38
delphii never oc'd mine..12:38
RobbieThe1stPossible. Either way, mine's doing fine as it is, and while it -may- die sooner than it would otherwise, I'm much happier at it's performance12:38
RobbieThe1stHeck, I've always assumed I had no warranty, getting it used and all12:38
RobbieThe1stand considering I'm running quite a bit from devel(including my own stuff)... Yea. I'm a big boy and will take care of myself12:39
RobbieThe1stNo need to whine at someone else if things don't work right12:39
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Venemo_N900hehe, yeah12:40
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Flyser__Hi, the microUSB connector of my n900 is becoming loose. What is Nokias standpoint on this? Will they fix this with warranty?12:47
kerio92Flyser__: yup12:48
kerio92common problem, they got some heat from the customers12:48
Flyser__will they repair it or replace the whole device?12:49
Venemo_N900Flyser__: yes, they will12:49
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Flyser__at least some good news :)12:49
Venemo_N900Flyser__: dunno, probably they'll repair if they can12:49
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Flyser__well. it will come off sooner or later again if they just repair it12:50
RobbieThe1st Same if they replace it...12:51
Venemo_N900not necessarily12:51
RobbieThe1stDid they improve it?12:51
Venemo_N900I plug my usb in and out >10 times a day and it works fine12:52
Flyser__RobbieThe1st: well. *maybe* they dont use surface mounted connectors in recent versions ...12:52
RobbieThe1stI... don't think so. I suspect we'd hear of it by now if they did12:53
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Flyser__too bad ...12:59
Flyser__well. maybe I get a new n900. mine has some other flaws. it would be cool, if they would go away too ;)13:00
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Venemo_N900Flyser__: what flaws are them?13:04
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Flyser__Venemo_N900: it fell down a few times, so the metal frame of the display is a bit dented ;)13:07
Flyser__it was my fault. so I don't expect nokia to fix this ;)13:07
Venemo_N900well I once dropped my device badly, and it began malfunctioning13:08
Flyser__I am also starting to see a brighter spot on the display13:08
Venemo_N900I took it to a repai centre but "forgot" to mention that I dropped it. they replaced it with a new one13:08
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Flyser__I also think, that my headset or the headset port of my n900 is broken13:10
Flyser__it does not detect if the original nokia headset is plugged in13:10
Flyser__but the headset works in my notebook and other headphones work in my n90013:10
Flyser__so this is a slightly weird bug^^13:10
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Flyser__s/in/with/ ;)13:11
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yaccAnyway to capture the commands sent to pnatd via bluetooth DUN?13:17
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timeless_mbpmy maemo sdk machine is now running LTS13:19
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apti guess lts is Leaning Toothpick Syndrome.13:24
timeless_mbplong term support13:24
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Venemo_N900RST38h: if this is true, the guys at Nokia became total nuts14:02
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Flyser__Hi, Is it possible to find out the serial number of a nokia n900 by software (i.e. without looking under the battery)15:27
Venemo_N900good question15:27
Nomayou mean the IMEI code?15:28
tank-manif there was, It would have been nice to do a one click to download the firmware15:28
Flyser__no. the number I have to enter here:
Nomaso the IMEI number :p15:28
Noma*#06# in phone application15:28
Venemo_N900Flyser__: you can find out mac addresses with ifconfig, but I dunno about imei15:28
Flyser__oh. didn't know it was the IMEI ;)15:28
Venemo_N900Noma: right! thanks15:29
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SpeedEvilAlso - settings -> about product15:29
Flyser__thanks. that worked^^15:30
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Flyser__are there any bootloader images available?15:32
Venemo_N900I think the PR also flashes the bootloader but you'll need someone more knowledgeable than me for that, like DocScrutinizer15:33
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Flyser__the reason is, that I installed nitdroid and want to remove it completly15:34
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TermanaFlyser__, bootmenu has nothing to do with flashing the bootloader15:35
Flyser__Termana: no?15:36
TermanaFlyser__, you need to uninstall all the packages NITdroid installed in Maemo15:36
TermanaFlyser__, no.15:36
TermanaNOLO is signed15:36
Flyser__how does it work then?15:36
TermanaNITdroid couldn't touch it if they wanted to15:36
TermanaEither they are using bootmenu or u-boot chain loading15:37
TermanaIf it's the first, it's just a Maemo executable that gets booted to by default, if it's the second you need to reflash your kernel15:37
Flyser__and what part of the system do I have to reflash to reset it to factory default15:37
Flyser__where can I find a kernel image?15:38
TermanaTo get rid of bootmenu it is a package that you need to install, if it's u-boot you need to flash the kernel15:38
TermanaFlyser__, in the COMBINED image available on tablets-dev15:38
aptflashing is, like,
Venemo_N900Flyser__: the combined pr contains the kernel, rootfs, and other things15:39
Flyser__ahhh, I thought it contains just the rootfs15:39
Flyser__thanks :)15:39
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* alterego watches shutter island.15:59
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LantiziaHey is there a way of minimizing a video while it's playing (like the promotional video that comes on the N900 demonstrates)16:45
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alteregoLantizia: it automatically pauses.16:46
lardman'allo 'allo16:46
Lantiziaalterego, watch the video again16:46
alteregoHey lardman :)16:46
lardmanhi alterego16:46
Lantiziayou'll see they press near the top left while the video is playing16:46
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Lantiziaand it allows them access to the 6 box menu icon16:46
DocScrutinizerLantizia: what minimizing?16:47
lardmanalterego: is columbus your app?16:47
Lantiziathus when you look at the multitask screen you can see the video still playing16:47
alteregolardman: yeaah16:47
alteregoLantizia: well, don't believe in everything you see on TV? :P16:48
Lantiziawell tbh I noticed this on day one well over 12 months ago16:48
Lantiziabut i just figured by now this functionality would have appeared16:48
alteregoThere are lots of things wrong with that video tbh16:48
alteregoLike the Portrait to landscape transition when the incoming call comes.16:48
Lantiziaany ideas why they changed the music it uses too?16:48
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Lantiziathe revised eMMC changes it16:49
lardmanalterego: do you have the code online? I'd like to look at how you render the compass16:49
alteregolardman: well, you can pick up the source code from extras-devel16:50
alteregoI've not yet stuck it into gitorious16:50
lardmanok cool16:50
alteregoYou want libcolumbus btw16:53
alteregoOh wait.16:53
alteregoNo you want just columbus :D16:53
lardmangot it, thanks16:53
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lardmanso can you scroll the compass or is it just a display widget?16:54
alteregoHow do you mean scroll?16:55
lardmanwell I've been writing an augmented reality app, but lacking a compass I plan on using a compass widget to allow the user to align the display16:55
lardmanso I was thinking that the user should be able to scroll the compass from side to side to change the direction16:56
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alteregoYeah, I was thinking of doing something similar in my app for setting a target bearing.16:56
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lardmanIn retrospect I think that rather than a complete widget, I should render something like your compass slider at the bottom of my QGLWidget which also shows the camera16:58
alteregoBut no, it's not scrollable :)16:58
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lardmanthen it can be selected in code if there's no hw e-compass present16:58
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lardmanalterego: np, the draw code will be useful, thanks :)16:59
alteregoI've yet to optimize that tbh16:59
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alteregoI was planning on improving it a little.16:59
alteregoActually, you can implement draggability to it quite easy.16:59
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lardmanyes, I guess using a mouse move event17:00
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alteregoJust process move events and set X difference to +/- heading() and use setHeading()17:00
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lardmanthe widget needs to know how many degrees are displayed across the width17:01
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lardmanand for me that will depend on the angular field of view of the camera17:02
DocScrutinizerpupnik: hahaha :-P17:02
lardmanwhich I must get round to measuring :)17:02
DocScrutinizerpupnik: not really an 'interactive' presentation17:03
DocScrutinizerpupnik: or maybe it was and I didn't notice what it did to my system :-o17:03
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pupnikone really should sandbox all browsing17:04
pupnikor throw your hands in the air (like you just don't care)17:04
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DocScrutinizerwell, at very least all my boxes need the ROOT pw for sudo17:06
DocScrutinizer(yes! incl N900)17:07
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alteregoKind of defaults the point in sudo doesn't it?17:10
alterego~defeats ..17:11
DocScrutinizernot at all17:11
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DocScrutinizersudo as in braindamaged buntkuh defeats the purpose of root account17:11
pupnikthat's what i thought17:12
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DocScrutinizersudo su / sudo gainroot with NO password is as bad and fubar as the same with querying user password17:22
DocScrutinizeryou are free to visit my tools wikipage for a 2-liner to fix that17:23
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alteregoI juse use ssg tbh17:25
DocScrutinizer(so the "bar" part wasn't meant literally :-D )17:25
aptit has been said that ssh is and or see ssh-keygen, or see ssh-agent, or a way of telling someone to be quiet17:25
alteregoalias rootme='ssh root@localhose'17:25
aptalterego's host is:
DocScrutinizerthat doesn't mean no malware can use sudo su and make you enter your user password17:26
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alteregoMy user doesn't have a password17:27
aptthanks, DocScrutinizer17:27
DocScrutinizereven better17:27
DocScrutinizerso I gather sudo gainroot works without any password17:27
DocScrutinizermalware's wet dreams17:28
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alteregoI don't have gainroot17:29
DocScrutinizerI burp17:30
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pexiis 'root' alias for sudo gainroot?17:30
BCMMpexi: cat $(which root)17:33
BCMMexec sudo gainroot --use-su17:34
DocScrutinizeralterego: you're aware a virus could bring his own rootsh.deb and install it without you noticing?17:34
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BCMMtoo many layers of stuff which exist only to run stuff for my tastes...17:34
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pexiso yes it is17:35
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alteregoDocScrutinizer: if such a virus existed, yes.17:35
DocScrutinizernow that's the most lame placation I ever heard every day17:37
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DocScrutinizernot "security by obscurity", no, a mere "security by >>doesn't exist yet<<" haha17:38
aptthanks, Venemo17:38
Venemoapt is the new infobot?17:38
DocScrutinizerinfobot thought she's wearing her secont name this week17:38
Venemoso she stole the name from apt,17:39
DocScrutinizer~dict apt17:39
aptDictionary 'apt' (3 of 11): Automatically Programmed Tools ;; mentally quick and resourceful; "an apt pupil"; "you are a clever reason well and your wit is bold"-Bram Stoker  ;; Address Pass Through.17:39
Venemoapt = advanced package tool :) afaik :)17:40
DocScrutinizeranother pissing TLA17:40
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DocScrutinizer~info apt17:42
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aptapt: (Advanced front-end for dpkg), section admin, is important. Version: 0.8.10 (sid), Packaged size: 2110 kB, Installed size: 6048 kB17:42
DocScrutinizer~info dpkg17:43
aptdpkg: (Debian package management system), section admin, is required. Version: (sid), Packaged size: 2276 kB, Installed size: 6860 kB17:43
aptmethinks apt is a pu'ssy licker17:43
Venemo~info rpm17:44
aptrpm: (package manager for RPM), section admin, is optional. Version: 4.8.1-6 (sid), Packaged size: 821 kB, Installed size: 1200 kB17:44
Venemoshe is clever17:44
DocScrutinizershe's apt17:44
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Venemowhy is she renamed from infobot to apt?17:44
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DocScrutinizersome flaw or ooopsie @ TimRiker17:45
DocScrutinizerinfobot got lobotomized some 3 days ago17:46
DocScrutinizernot entirely clear as apt and infobot are same instance of process afaik17:46
apt- Uptime for infobot -17:47
aptNow: 14d 5h 57m 1s running infobot 1.5.4 (SVN) -- linux17:47
apt1: 59d 8h 41m 19s running infobot 1.5.4 (SVN) -- linux, ended Sun Nov 14 18:39:57 201017:47
apt2: 57d 3h 9m 23s running infobot 1.5.4 (SVN) -- linux, ended Fri Jun 26 20:39:27 200917:47
apt3: 36d 20h 47m 14s running infobot 1.5.4 (SVN) -- linux, ended Tue Aug  4 17:38:59 200917:47
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DocScrutinizernext restart of ibot at latest will make infobot personality resurrect17:49
luke-jrdid kexec ever get fixed?17:49
DocScrutinizerit's puzzling me how all infobot identities can break away while ibot keeps running the personalities apt17:50
DocScrutinizerlooks to me like freenode stuff klined or globalkicked infobot17:50
DocScrutinizeror staff even17:51
Venemomaybe you guys should contact the staff at #freenode and tell them that infobot is harmless17:51
DocScrutinizerNB a ~chaninfo shows ibot is thinking it has joined all the channels that know her as infobot, though evidently she's missing in all those channels17:52
DocScrutinizerVenemo: I did that 2 days ago17:52
DocScrutinizerVenemo: they deny any responsibility17:52
SpeedEvilhave you hit the bot with strace as it boots, to see if it is trying to join?17:53
Venemocouldn't you just ask them to unban it?17:53
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DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: I dunno what Tim is doing. I'm sure he has better means to trace ibot17:53
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alteregoI keep forgetting how awful QTableView's are next.17:54
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DocScrutinizerinteresting detail: tim vanished from irc same time as infobot17:54
DocScrutinizer~seen timriker17:54
apttimriker <~timr@bzflag/projectlead/TimRiker> was last seen on IRC in channel #infobot, 2d 13h 55s ago, saying: 'yw'.17:54
DocScrutinizerI got NFC what's going on really17:56
* alterego is starting to feel hungry17:57
* SpeedEvil feeds alterego carrots.17:58
DocScrutinizerwhat I know however is you can trick ibot to join a channel twice: as apt *and* infobot. That's not a nice thing to watch17:59
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DocScrutinizerso if and when ever infobot shows up here, any chanop is suggested to immediately /kick apt18:00
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DocScrutinizerok, for some funny tests18:03
ShadowJKI'm guessing freenode rejected the join as flood throttling during a split perhaps, and infobot's irc stack doesn't realize it18:03
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ShadowJKI'd try telling infobot to leave the channel,then tell it to join18:03
ShadowJKrequires some better than normal user privs with it though18:03
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: something along that line, yes18:03
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: the problem is: infobot is not logged in18:04
DocScrutinizerShadowJK: so I can't tell infobot to join #maemo18:05
DocScrutinizerand I have no privileges to tell apt to change nick :-P18:05
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DocScrutinizerI have 'privileges' to completely tear down ibot, so it would reboot/restart. I'm reluctant to do this18:06
DocScrutinizereven that would restart the frontend only, but not the mysql database18:07
DocScrutinizerif there's a problem in mysql then thw whole 4h of restart wouldn't help18:07
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xkr47how are smses stored on disk? any way I can grep them for some content? or perhaps an app18:08
ShadowJKWhen I ran infobot it used bdb :D18:08
DocScrutinizerumm, I'm not quite sure18:09
DocScrutinizerthink it was mysql on Tim's machine18:09
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DocScrutinizerapt: botsnack18:10
aptaw, gee, DocScrutinizer18:10
DocScrutinizereverything fine18:10
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jhbHi *, does anybody know a way to permanently enable the reflow in microb (so that I don't have to do ctrl+shift+i). Btw, new to the channel, new to the device :-)18:21
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Venemojhb: welcome to our world :)18:22
Venemojhb: unfortunately I don't know the answer18:22
jhbVenemo: thanks for the welcome :-)18:22
Venemotimeless_mbp: do you know something about this?18:23
timeless_mbpon phone18:23
timeless_mbpjhb: iirc there's no pref for it18:23
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jhbtimeless_mbp: too bad, would have been nice18:24
jhbbut thx18:24
luke-jrdoes fcam still require custom kernel modules with PR1.3?18:26
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MohammadAGluke-jr, why wouldn't it?18:29
luke-jrjust thought maybe they merged it into their kernel18:30
luke-jrlike I did for Gentoo18:30
MohammadAGnope, they caused some more conflicts, but they work now18:30
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luke-jrkernel_2.6.28-20103103+0m5 is PR1.3?18:34
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luke-jrMohammadAG: what conflicts?18:38
luke-jrmy fcam patch for PR1.2 applies cleanly18:38
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MohammadAGwhen the patches for 1.3 were added into kernel-power some problems happened18:38
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pupnik  Defcon 18 Pwned By the owner - What happens when you steal a hackers computer18:41
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luke-jrMohammadAG: what's that got to do with fcam?18:42
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MohammadAGit doesn't, 1.3 had new cam patches18:43
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RST38h"In That Rabbit Game from Thomas Perl you are a kleptomanic rabbit head with wings."18:46
RST38hthp! what have you been smoking?!?18:46
RST38hCan I have some? =)18:47
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timeless_xchatlantizia: you might be able to use the browser with youtube minimized19:15
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timeless_xchatlantizia, iirc the functionality was *removed* from media player to "improve" battery life19:16
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SpeedEvilIs there a way - an official way - to get it to play video with the screen locked?19:18
SpeedEvilI want to listen to TV programs sometimes19:18
SpeedEvilmedia player19:18
SpeedEvilI've exploited the silly 'incoming message sound unpauses player' before19:19
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alteregoAwww :)19:22
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timeless_xchatspeedevil, hrm, doubtful19:25
timeless_xchatyou can suppress lock and stuff19:25
timeless_xchati actually gave the tv as radio argument when they insisted on breaking the feature19:25
timeless_xchatsorry, i tried19:26
SpeedEvilSmart software that can't be overridden is so annoying.19:26
SpeedEvilyeah - one voice of sanity has problems thogh.19:26
timeless_xchatgenerally, i think that stuff can be done from browser19:26
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SpeedEvilI mean recorded programs19:27
SpeedEvilI use get_iuplayer to get all my media19:27
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timeless_xchattry mohammadag's media player?19:29
* timeless_xchat pokes sivang 19:30
SpeedEvilI just use mplayer - which works OK19:30
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Guest77484protip: don't hold shift when pressing left volume key in xchat19:36
satmdwill it crash?19:37
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Guest26074Hi, I have searched the web and the wiki and have been unable to find newbie instructions to sync the N900 PIM to Linux without using a 3rd party like GoogleCalender. Could someone offer a pointer or two?19:47
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satmdbut... it involves some work19:49
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Guest26074I did look there and that seems to be what I will probably use but the instructions are a bit lacking. Like do I install SyncEvo on the phone or the PC or both?19:50
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Guest26074Good to know that I am looking at the correct application though :D19:51
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lolcat^How can I run spotify on the maemo device with offline?19:54
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DocScrutinizerGuest26074: known "feature" :-D20:05
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DocScrutinizererr, Guest7748420:05
Guest26074Any suggestions for the best forum to ask?20:06
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Guest26074I want to advocate for the n900, maemo, etc., but the WAF not as good as I need.20:07
* alterego wonders what movie to watch now.20:08
* Guest26074 thinks that the Internet needs better searching tools.20:09
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SpeedEvilalterego: Bring It On20:16
alteregoLame :P20:16
alteregoThink I'll just make some pasta and see what's on the box20:18
* SpeedEvil imagines movie crossovers.20:19
pupnikalterego: try to find this stuff for your pasta...
pupnik"Dimensional Force Bean Paste"20:20
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SpeedEvil adds to any sauce20:22
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Guest26074How about ?20:23
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Guest26074So, it looks like the SyncEvolution mailing list is probably the best bet to find newbie instructions.20:26
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alteregoDamnit, ran out of pasta.20:27
* alterego cooks rice instead.20:27
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GAN900Better for you anyway.20:33
GAN900Brown rice.20:33
RST38hWith ants!20:34
RST38h[FAITH (noun) - Feeling that makes you eat brown rice without checking if it moves]20:34
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pupnikRST38h:  Bungee Jumping Russian Style20:41
GAN900RST38h, mine usually comes out of the cooker.20:41
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RST38hpupnik: Looks painful. And I seem to recognize this particular ruin.20:42
pupnik   "In the lawless mountain realms of Asia, a Yale professor finds a case against civilization"  (beautiful pic!)20:44
RST38hGAN: ok, s/rice/raspberry jam =)20:46
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alteregoHrm, 300 is on tonight, not seen it yet.21:03
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* SpeedEvil imagines a film with 42.8 Bonds.21:05
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GeneralAntillesand too much slomo21:16
luke-jrwhy is gitorious so freaking slow today?21:17
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alteregoBetter being slow than offline like it was the other day :P21:20
rcgany info about certificate being expired?21:20
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DocScrutinizerprobably the certificate expired ;-D21:35
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rcgit did21:51
rcgbut any info whether this is a known issue and we get a new one?21:51
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thpRST38h: why oh why? ;)22:19
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JZAhi anyone know whats the deal with the virtual images for maemo sdk23:37
JZAI dont see the big difference from the description on server and desktop23:37
alteregoJZA: if you read it carefully you'll see that it's "Ubuntu Server" and "Ubuntu Desktop" so maybe you should look at the differences between them ;)23:41
alteregoAs they're the OS template ...23:41
JZAalterego: well I read and didnt really tell me much..... only thing I got is non-linux23:41
alteregoIt says plenty.23:42
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JZA# Virtual image with Ubuntu Server Intrepid installed - used as sandbox for building C/C++ applications and also other utilities for non-Linux host operation systems. It is used for ESbox Eclipse-based product to provide non-Linux host system programming for Maemo platform.23:42
JZA# Virtual image with Ubuntu Desktop Intrepid installed - the same as previous one, but for non-Linux system usage23:42
JZAis it me or both are for non-linux system23:42
alteregoThat's because they're VMs ..23:43
alteregoBecause you can't install scratchbox on Windows or OS X23:43
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