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| Stskeeps | how's it going? | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| javispedro | well, more relaxed lately :) | 00:00 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, finished up gsoc? | 00:01 |
| javispedro | yep, it even worked :) | 00:02 |
| pupnik | wow javispedro lives | 00:02 |
| javispedro | hey pupnik | 00:02 |
| pupnik | happy evning | 00:02 |
| pupnik | what's news | 00:02 |
| GAN900 | Kill the zombie! | 00:02 |
| javispedro | It's a trap! | 00:02 |
| Stskeeps | javispedro: cool :) | 00:02 |
| GAN900 | crashanddie, don't ping my if you're going offline. | 00:03 |
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| javispedro | well, someone started porting gpSP again, and my PM inbox is flooded with the usual questions... | 00:05 |
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| Stskeeps | heh | 00:06 |
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| alterego | Hah | 00:09 |
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| javispedro | priority gmail inbox is a god send, a pity it does not work with offline gmail | 00:12 |
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| Venemo | w00t_: ping | 00:19 |
| Venemo | ~seen w00t_ | 00:19 |
| infobot | w00t_ is currently on #maemo #meego. Has said a total of 4 messages. Is idling for 15h 12m 4s, last said: 'moin thiago_home btw :)'. | 00:19 |
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| ZogG | MohammadAG, ping | 00:22 |
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| MohammadAG | bong | 00:23 |
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| DeeGeneRaL | hey hey hey anyone here knows how to mess with nokia n800? | 00:31 |
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| javispedro | you can throw it into a bucket filled with salt water. | 00:31 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - it may blend. | 00:31 |
| DeeGeneRaL | lol | 00:31 |
| SpeedEvil | In what manner mess with? | 00:31 |
| DeeGeneRaL | maybe | 00:32 |
| DeeGeneRaL | well i mean with reformatting or reflashing it | 00:32 |
| DeeGeneRaL | or adding another OS to it | 00:32 |
| Venemo | ~flashing | 00:33 |
| infobot | hmm... flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 00:33 |
| Venemo | DeeGeneRaL: do you have a specific question? :) | 00:33 |
| DeeGeneRaL | okay, yes i do | 00:34 |
| DeeGeneRaL | my n800's screen is scrolling out of no where so im wondering what can i do to fix it | 00:34 |
| DeeGeneRaL | ?< question mark | 00:35 |
| javispedro | ah... | 00:35 |
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| javispedro | DeeGeneRaL: like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcm5TYGwTwU ? | 00:35 |
| DeeGeneRaL | yes | 00:35 |
| DeeGeneRaL | but if i click to go on the web or play mp3's it stops | 00:36 |
| keesj | somebody should write a small TSR that puts the screen in the correct position :p | 00:37 |
| MohammadAG | lol nice bug | 00:37 |
| DeeGeneRaL | crazy bug | 00:37 |
| javispedro | "hardware bug". | 00:37 |
| MohammadAG | oh shit bug ^ | 00:37 |
| DeeGeneRaL | im searching to see if anyone out there has found a fix for it | 00:37 |
| MohammadAG | make the SW x wobble with it | 00:37 |
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| MohammadAG | s/x/X/ :P | 00:38 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah - I'd go wit hardare bug. | 00:38 |
| SpeedEvil | Though I'd try flashing it. | 00:38 |
| DeeGeneRaL | so far i see difficulty if i use win xp, but with linux its easier. but i only have windos | 00:39 |
| RST38h | javispedro heya | 00:39 |
| alterego | Heh, WinDOS | 00:39 |
| RST38h | javispedro: what is cooking? anything new and exciting? | 00:39 |
| javispedro | RST38h: helo. nope, just blowing the dust off the old plucker maemo port | 00:40 |
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| DeeGeneRaL | i was hoping of just placing the os image on SD card and doing everything from the n800 | 00:40 |
| RST38h | javispedro: care to finish that openttd thing? the "newspaper" banners that show up make it unplayable =) | 00:41 |
| DeeGeneRaL | and ive read so far that replacing the screen is the way to fix it. | 00:41 |
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| DeeGeneRaL | i wonder if installing android (a different OS) would change the way the tablet reacts.? | 00:45 |
| javispedro | RST38h: you can disable them and put tickers only | 00:45 |
| Venemo | DeeGeneRaL: try nitdroid if you wish, but don't expect too much | 00:45 |
| RST38h | javispedro: axk | 00:46 |
| RST38h | i.e. ack | 00:46 |
| DeeGeneRaL | ill try anything, but i need tut's | 00:46 |
| DeeGeneRaL | lol | 00:46 |
| DeeGeneRaL | im looking on youtube. right now | 00:46 |
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| DeeGeneRaL | whats bad about nitdroid? | 00:47 |
| DeeGeneRaL | venemo | 00:47 |
| timeless | sp3000: basic wishes for a phone: | 00:48 |
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| timeless | 1. if the volume is 3/10 for talking, then when a call is dropped don't play the call error tone at 10/10! | 00:49 |
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| * timeless kicks an s40(?) phone | 00:49 | |
| DeeGeneRaL | i was told i can try Lubuntu on my n800. but i still need tut | 00:49 |
| lcuk | timeless, as you get older, you get deafer :P | 00:49 |
| RST38h | deader too | 00:49 |
| timeless | 2. when syncing calendar events don't undelete events(!) | 00:49 |
| kerio | lubuntu? | 00:49 |
| ShadowJK | hm, I get that with some N900 events too :) | 00:49 |
| timeless | lcuk: because the phones keep yelling at you? | 00:50 |
| lcuk | ye! | 00:50 |
| lcuk | it never used to happen :D | 00:50 |
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| lcuk | s ^ | 00:50 |
| timeless | shadowjk: that was my n900, i'll yell at the mfe guy about it later | 00:50 |
| timeless | (2) | 00:50 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Read about compcache btw? | 00:51 |
| timeless | 3. don't try to be connected to presence when there's absolutely no network (including no cellular coverage) :o | 00:51 |
| timeless | 4. do try to keep date and time for more than 20s w/o a primary battery (grr) | 00:52 |
| RST38h | timeless: Good. None of these will ever be fixed in your N900. | 00:52 |
| javispedro | makes for a wonderful phone, eh? | 00:52 |
| timeless | - worst case, store the last time you had to a writable bit and use it as a seed when you ask the user for the new time | 00:53 |
| ShadowJK | timeless, that date/time thing is strange, because when it prompts for settings, the data/time suggested always look correct to me | 00:53 |
| timeless | it's still going to be better than 2009(!) | 00:53 |
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| timeless | shadowjk: that's your cell network fixing things up | 00:53 |
| timeless | supposedly it should do that | 00:53 |
| timeless | but it rarely works in .eu | 00:54 |
| sp3000 | ShadowJK: there's a sim in your phone?!!! | 00:54 |
| sp3000 | heretic ...er | 00:54 |
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| timeless | 4. if you're a map or camera and are trying to deal w/ gps | 00:54 |
| ShadowJK | timeless, yeah ime on .fi operators you only get time updates when you connect to gprs | 00:55 |
| timeless | don't claim there's no gps fix when the system and other apps *have* a gps fix (_rr!) | 00:55 |
| ShadowJK | lol | 00:55 |
| DeeGeneRaL | what i dont get is that the screen scrolling doesnt happen when its booting up... | 00:55 |
| timeless | shadowjk: i'm in .uk atm | 00:55 |
| ShadowJK | ah, you escaped | 00:55 |
| timeless | 5. don't reset the geotagging prefs each time the user switches sims (grr!) | 00:56 |
| timeless | shadowjk: summer vacation | 00:56 |
| SpeedEvil | 6. Don't round off the GPS position to the nearest second | 00:56 |
| MohammadAG | anyone got any experience with routers? | 00:56 |
| sp3000 | ...in autumn, in the uk -- sounds like summer alright :P | 00:56 |
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| MohammadAG | this linksys WRT350Nv2 is kinda borked | 00:57 |
| SpeedEvil | MohammadAG: yes - I have a 1/4", and a 1/2" one | 00:57 |
| RST38h | 7. Kill Tracker. Really, just kill Tracker. | 00:57 |
| timeless | sp3000: how's the weather in .fi? | 00:57 |
| MohammadAG | 192.168.1.1 (router's IP) points to N900 | 00:57 |
| SpeedEvil | 8. With fire. | 00:57 |
| timeless | the weather here has been fine | 00:57 |
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| sp3000 | timeless: 12 to 16°C says foreca | 00:58 |
| timeless | 6. if you're a map app (maep) and the user turns on tracking, don't lose the track just because the user closed your window (!) | 00:58 |
| sp3000 | my pocket had switched the applet to tampere in the morning, and I was confused | 00:58 |
| timeless | heh | 00:58 |
| * RST38h surprised after finding out that the whole reason for Silverlight has apparently been an embedded video player | 00:58 | |
| timeless | rain? | 00:58 |
| sp3000 | as it was showing heavy rain and it was sunny ;) | 00:58 |
| MohammadAG | SpeedEvil, Linksys/TP-Link | 00:58 |
| MohammadAG | I don't mind DD-WRT/OpenWRT | 00:58 |
| ShadowJK | timeless, it resets geotagging to disabled "randomly" for me | 00:58 |
| timeless | rst: heh? | 00:58 |
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| MohammadAG | that was a question btw :P | 00:58 |
| timeless | shadowjk: really? please file a bug? | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | <timeless> 4. do try to keep date and time for more than 20s w/o a primary battery (grr) | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | get a replacement | 00:59 |
| timeless | i was assuming | 00:59 |
| timeless | mohammadag: eh? | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | mine keeps date and time | 00:59 |
| timeless | mine loses it if i don't swap sims fast enough | 00:59 |
| timeless | and keeps it if i do | 00:59 |
| MohammadAG | it always resets settings when swapping sims | 00:59 |
| timeless | i swap sims a lot atm | 01:00 |
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| ShadowJK | timeless, well I was roaming at the time, same sim as always, and aggressively denying the 17 "Connect to Internet?" popups per second... | 01:00 |
| ShadSEC | MahammadAG, I heard you once had your vibro working for a full night.. was it continuous? I am wondering how much stress can the vibro stand | 01:00 |
| timeless | i have 3sims and 2phones instead of 3sims and 3phones :( | 01:00 |
| Shadikka | that sounds... just wrong. | 01:00 |
| timeless | one of my n900s is at home | 01:00 |
| sp3000 | wait, the camera app has exactly one setting that's accessed only through the menu? | 01:01 |
| timeless | shadikka: which? | 01:01 |
| * sp3000 never realized it was that awesome | 01:01 | |
| timeless | sp3000: spunds right | 01:01 |
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| javispedro | well, I doubt the battery cover will be able handle 1 phone:2 SIMs for long | 01:01 |
| MohammadAG | ShadSEC, no, was using the call vibra pattern | 01:01 |
| ShadSEC | oh ok | 01:01 |
| MohammadAG | the connection dialog sucks | 01:01 |
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| MohammadAG | it pops up in offline mode | 01:01 |
| kerio | 2sims1phone | 01:01 |
| * ShadowJK discovers geotagging disabled itself again | 01:01 | |
| timeless | sp3000: finnish ui design ftw | 01:02 |
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| MohammadAG | timeless, ha? | 01:02 |
| sp3000 | I'm sure it looked good on paper | 01:02 |
| Shadikka | timeless: "I heard you once had your vibro working for a full night" taken out of context. | 01:02 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: geotagging gets disabled if your phone is in offline mode | 01:02 |
| Shadikka | I had to think for a couple of heartbeats before realizing this was #maemo. | 01:02 |
| ShadSEC | I was thinking about running it directly in relation to signal strenght, but probably thats not very safe.... | 01:02 |
| MohammadAG | vibra motor was broken you perverts :P | 01:02 |
| timeless | sp3000: w/ lots of beer | 01:02 |
| ShadSEC | lol | 01:02 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: I have given up. I use gpxrecorder - the desktop widget - take pics - and then run a geocoder app to geocode the pics against the timestamp and gpx date. | 01:03 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: Works well. | 01:03 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Too complex.I do not geocode at all. | 01:03 |
| sp3000 | RST38h: facepalm | 01:03 |
| timeless | 7. if you're making a database of call logs, include the elapsed time(!) | 01:03 |
| * sp3000 is reminded of bluetooth-on-update | 01:03 | |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Just using a Canon camera. It produces better pictures too. | 01:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Same thing works with canon | 01:04 |
| timeless | - even if you can't imagine a use for it (because you're a spoiled finnish hillbilly) | 01:04 |
| SpeedEvil | you just take a pic of the time on the phone first. | 01:04 |
| javispedro | heh | 01:04 |
| javispedro | then ocr it | 01:04 |
| SpeedEvil | no | 01:04 |
| RST38h | ahhahha | 01:04 |
| timeless | speedevil: got a non desktop app ver of that? | 01:05 |
| sp3000 | SpeedEvil: righto, just have the day's newspaper and a watch handy ;) | 01:05 |
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| SpeedEvil | You take the time once. You then look at the offset of this time and the local clock | 01:05 |
| SpeedEvil | and correlate against the GPX | 01:05 |
| RST38h | it is all too complicated. | 01:05 |
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| SpeedEvil | http://josm.openstreetmap.de/ does it | 01:05 |
| * sp3000 claims using a phone screen for that is cheating | 01:05 | |
| RST38h | complicated things are weighted against their true value, then usually discarded | 01:05 |
| SpeedEvil | but that's not really standalone. | 01:05 |
| SpeedEvil | There are standalone packages | 01:05 |
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| timeless | sp3000: oh, i got to use Ovi for windows in Leeds | 01:06 |
| sp3000 | sounds exotic | 01:06 |
| timeless | my host family had some nokia phones which were more or less working fine w/ pc suite | 01:06 |
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| sp3000 | you fixed that right ;) | 01:06 |
| timeless | until they got an "update" for Ovi Suite | 01:06 |
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| timeless | when i got there, they were upset that this "update" had broken everythinh | 01:07 |
| javispedro | update! | 01:07 |
| timeless | s/nh/ng/ | 01:07 |
| infobot | timeless meant: when i got there, they were upset that this "update" had broken everything | 01:07 |
| javispedro | xp->vista like update. | 01:07 |
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| * ShadSEC wonders if running the vibro continuoysly at half brightness would cause more stress than full brightnes for half the time | 01:07 | |
| timeless | they were also trying to figure out the point of ovi music | 01:07 |
| timeless | they'd pretty much concluded it was useless | 01:08 |
| sp3000 | ShadSEC: on the user? | 01:08 |
| timeless | we eventually discovered it was possible to use | 01:08 |
| timeless | oh right. | 01:08 |
| ShadowJK | timeless, ive never seen pcsuite do anything good, I bet some manager discovered pcsuite had accidentally become useful, and mandated rewrite back to the normality of "Launch 100 megs if resident services that do absolutely nothing besides poll random crap 99.9% of the time when you havent got a phone plugged in" :) | 01:08 |
| ShadSEC | so3000, on the motor... what sick thing are you thinking about? | 01:08 |
| sp3000 | well it sounded like an interesting experiment ;) | 01:09 |
| javispedro | PCSuite used to sync with a variety of Windoze calendar apps | 01:09 |
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| javispedro | Ovi Suite syncs with ... | 01:09 |
| timeless | 8. if you have an MMC slot with a magic plastic door (s60), then you better show the user a clear indicator for "door ajar" when there's a card inserted and you're ignoring it(!)! | 01:09 |
| sp3000 | dunno, pcsuite's been happy about the interwebs connectivity stuff when I've needed such | 01:10 |
| javispedro | Outlook. | 01:10 |
| javispedro | and it doesn't even do that well. | 01:10 |
| timeless | pcsuite does a couple of things | 01:10 |
| ShadSEC | I guess I will find out, I just hope it is not too hard to replace if burnt | 01:10 |
| ShadowJK | s60 and also N8x0 :) | 01:10 |
| timeless | 1. it creates dun connections which you can later use w/o pc suite (important) | 01:10 |
| sp3000 | ShadSEC: ...the user? | 01:10 |
| crashanddie_ | ~ping | 01:10 |
| infobot | ~pong | 01:10 |
| ShadowJK | and N900 (magic magnet held by fumes of glue and hope) | 01:10 |
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| timeless | 2. it has a backup app, for when you want to have your s60 phone serviced by nokia care/nokia house | 01:11 |
| ShadSEC | sp3000, the user will be fine :) | 01:11 |
| timeless | 3. it provides safer than raw mass storage access via windows explorer(etc) for computers/devices that don't support MTP (n900, wXP?& | 01:12 |
| javispedro | wxp supports mtp when wmpx (x >= 10) is installed for all I know | 01:12 |
| timeless | 4. it provides a vaguely working sync solution for outlook users who don't use exchange server | 01:12 |
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| timeless | javispedro: ok | 01:12 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ass rage mode safer than...? o.O | 01:13 |
| timeless | anyway, pcsuite is not entirely useles | 01:13 |
| timeless | oh, on some phones it's possible to write sms's using pcsuite | 01:13 |
| javispedro | it syncs with obsolete but still easier to use (think grandma) PIM software like Lotus Organizer | 01:13 |
| timeless | which could be cool if your phone is e.g. a lipstick phone w/ no buttons | 01:13 |
| ShadowJK | Admittedly I only used it in the days of cables with usb-serial converters in the plug :) | 01:14 |
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| timeless | ovi suite is just a usability nightmare | 01:14 |
| timeless | the music thing totally failed to address the user's goal: | 01:14 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | seems you're having fun :) | 01:15 |
| timeless | "load music from computer onto phone" | 01:15 |
| timeless | doc: i also recovered a deleted photo from someone else's MMC | 01:15 |
| timeless | oh | 01:15 |
| timeless | back to phone design | 01:15 |
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| RST38h | oh well | 01:15 |
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| timeless | 9. if you include gps, always include a way to show satellite info, because "general area" is a crappy indication | 01:16 |
| RST38h | It is not like Nokia's Ovi* stuff not working is news | 01:16 |
| timeless | rst: you're a techy | 01:16 |
| RST38h | In fact, the rule of thumb is "if it spells 'ovi' it does not work" | 01:17 |
| timeless | i rarely encounter *normal* native English speakers w/ ovi | 01:17 |
| timeless | the reason is that ime, they don't buy nokia phones in the first place | 01:17 |
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| RST38h | Brits do | 01:17 |
| ShadowJK | general area? you mean like when Ovi Maps places this red dot on the map miles off because it doesn't really know where you are? | 01:17 |
| javispedro | if they're pissing their enterprisey customers, killing pcsuite, and not-entirely-pleasing young hipster customers, with that ovi disaster, who are they gonna piss next? | 01:17 |
| timeless | (this remains true, the phones in question were free) | 01:17 |
| RST38h | And,bloody hell,they are native English speakers, right? | 01:17 |
| timeless | rst: keyword here is buy | 01:17 |
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| RST38h | javispedro: YOU! | 01:18 |
| timeless | but, yeah, this british family had 2 | 01:18 |
| javispedro | touché. | 01:18 |
| RST38h | javispedro: (and only because they already pissed ME) | 01:18 |
| timeless | shadowjk: when maep draws a circle big enough to cover small countries | 01:18 |
| ShadowJK | :) | 01:18 |
| RST38h | javispedro: My personal theory is that the Elop guy will go after Blackberry in US market | 01:18 |
| RST38h | javispedro: Whatever that may mean | 01:19 |
| timeless | rst: there was a lady in nokia-us who tried that | 01:19 |
| RST38h | So, they will probably be pissing US suits next | 01:19 |
| ShadowJK | timeless, you know that's when location system has nfc, and just looks at the country code of the cell network :) | 01:19 |
| javispedro | and was killed by the management inquisition? | 01:19 |
| timeless | she was more or less blamed for the entire e-series disaster | 01:19 |
| RST38h | e-series is a disaster? really? | 01:19 |
| timeless | rst: from someone's perspective | 01:20 |
| RST38h | One would never know, given that E72 is one of the best sellers | 01:20 |
| ShadowJK | E series is the only s60 devices I've had :-) | 01:20 |
| RST38h | So, with Elop we may see a bit more of the E-series now =) | 01:20 |
| RST38h | E900! E900! (C)wazd | 01:20 |
| ShadowJK | sure, they're marketing fail like usual.. | 01:21 |
| timeless | shadowjk: ... | 01:21 |
| timeless | marketting | 01:21 |
| timeless | nokia | 01:21 |
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| ShadowJK | but to me it was "omg, qwerty! fast typing!" | 01:21 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Maybe finns should start selling them at IKEA stores or something... | 01:21 |
| timeless | two words never found together in positive sentences | 01:21 |
| timeless | rst: ikea is swedish.. | 01:21 |
| RST38h | swedish, finnish, who gives a damn | 01:22 |
| javispedro | that can be solved with a quick war | 01:22 |
| timeless | and given nokia's record, if they do, it'd be a good time to short ikea... | 01:22 |
| ShadowJK | actually nokia managed by accident a rather cute viral marketing of E71 in .fi | 01:22 |
| timeless | do tell | 01:22 |
| MohammadAG | tactical nukes ftw | 01:22 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Persuade IKEA to start making niches corresponding to common Nokia phones in their wood furniture | 01:22 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, I'll check compcache tomorrow, gotta go now | 01:23 |
| ShadowJK | timeless, well actually it was a copy of a successful advert for Commodore 64 back in the days | 01:23 |
| MohammadAG | night o/ | 01:23 |
| RST38h | g'night | 01:23 |
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| javispedro | nite MohammadAG | 01:23 |
| javispedro | lcuk: btw, there? | 01:24 |
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| ShadowJK | Same 80s-look on the ad, but with E71 instead of C64, and the text "The Republic's communicator" instead of the original "The Republic's computer". It appealed to all those adults that grew up with the then extremely common C64 8-bit computer :-) | 01:25 |
| javispedro | Just fit an E72+1 into a C64 chassis | 01:25 |
| lcuk | javispedro, yeah but my head has melted someway along the way | 01:25 |
| lcuk | i am going to play portal for a bit | 01:25 |
| javispedro | lcuk: np | 01:26 |
| timeless | heh | 01:26 |
| crashanddie | ~ping | 01:26 |
| infobot | ~pong | 01:26 |
| ShadowJK | So yeah, copy of a 80s ad by a company that died because they didn't keep up with the competition and failed at marketing.. | 01:26 |
| ShadowJK | :D | 01:26 |
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| RST38h | javispedro:pocketable c64 chassis | 01:27 |
| timeless | heh | 01:27 |
| timeless | only works in finland.. | 01:27 |
| ShadowJK | yep | 01:27 |
| javispedro | RST38h: it will nearly sell itself! | 01:27 |
| lcuk | JeriEllsworth (on freenode) wrote that c64 in a joystick mod a few years ago :) | 01:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | lcuk: don't smoke too much catnip | 01:27 |
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| ShadowJK | timeless, you know if the right people tried do what you just did, observe normal people trying to use stuff... | 01:28 |
| SpeedEvil1 | Ok - I've lost here I reset the data usage counter - it's not in settings -> internet connections. | 01:28 |
| * javispedro checks his "what will nokia do next" crystal ball: "release ipad clone". | 01:28 | |
| lcuk | heh DocScrutinizer | 01:28 |
| RST38h | naaah | 01:29 |
| ShadowJK | but then again, whenever I observe normal people trying to use computers I mostly want to shoot myself | 01:29 |
| lcuk | would be a shame if they were so short sighted :) | 01:29 |
| lcuk | but anyway, gnite guys \o | 01:29 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil1, it's in settings-phone | 01:29 |
| javispedro | cya lcuk | 01:29 |
| SpeedEvil1 | So it is. | 01:30 |
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| SpeedEvil | Thanks | 01:30 |
| RST38h | #define normal_people | 01:30 |
| javispedro | p(normal_people, buy_iphones) := true | 01:31 |
| ShadowJK | http://enivax.net/jk/data.png :D | 01:32 |
| RST38h | p(has_iphone,goes_mad) := true | 01:32 |
| timeless | speed: it's in phone | 01:32 |
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| timeless | 10. if you're going to have a data counter and it's going to have a date field | 01:33 |
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| timeless | .. don't default to "i don't know qhwn i started counting" (!) | 01:34 |
| timeless | - just fill the field in as soon as the user gives you a date | 01:34 |
| javispedro | default to the unix epoch ;P | 01:34 |
| timeless | 11. don't use a single running counter for data, use a database, and tag the sim and the day | 01:34 |
| SpeedEvil | 12. Tell the fucking user when the SIM is malfunctioning | 01:35 |
| timeless | - it's likely that two different sims will have totally unrelated data plans (duh) | 01:35 |
| * SpeedEvil sighs. | 01:35 | |
| timeless | speedevil: i've actually gotten that message iirc | 01:35 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: yes. | 01:35 |
| timeless | speedevil: i've actually gotten that message iirc | 01:35 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: It is a very occasional 'sim registration failed' | 01:35 |
| timeless | i can't recall if i took a picture of it | 01:35 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: This is a very, very poor wording. | 01:36 |
| ShadowJK | also log the operator used :/ | 01:36 |
| timeless | oh, that's one of my favorites | 01:36 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: It also does not indicate that there is a problem in the cell-info-box in the status area. | 01:36 |
| ShadowJK | because my n900 fails at distinguishing home operator from roaming.. | 01:36 |
| SpeedEvil | And if the phone is locked - the only appearance of it is in syslog | 01:36 |
| timeless | 12. for roaming data, treat each roaming operator as a distinct entry | 01:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Which is so mind-bendingly broken... | 01:36 |
| timeless | (per day) | 01:36 |
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| SpeedEvil | Which reminds me - I need to call t-mo and get a new SIM | 01:37 |
| SpeedEvil | cleaning it has not worked. | 01:37 |
| timeless | 14. if there's a problem w/ the sim, do use the cell provider field for it | 01:37 |
| timeless | hrm, we'll skip 13 | 01:38 |
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| RST38h | ShadowJK: simply disable roaming | 01:38 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: it is damn expensive anyway | 01:38 |
| ShadowJK | "Sim registration failed" is also a problem with the network sometimes.. Cycling via offline for a minute fixes it for me | 01:38 |
| timeless | 15. if there's a problem sending an sms, and you use a conversation style view, do provide the error report inline in the conversation, it's probably important(!) | 01:38 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, disable roaming on n900? | 01:39 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: I'm 96% sure here it's with the SIM here. | 01:39 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: No, disable roaming at your cell service operator | 01:39 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadowJK: Bending the SIM contacts out meant I had a basically solid connection for a day. | 01:39 |
| ShadowJK | ah | 01:39 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Call them and tell you do not want roaming on this sim card, period. | 01:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | timeless: (skip 13) doesn't matter - there's been 12, 12a | 01:39 |
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| ShadowJK | actually I want to be able to tell n900 "dont use data and dont ASK to use data unless I manually activate data, and then don't do any background shit like checking for updates or email" | 01:41 |
| timeless | doc: yeah | 01:41 |
| timeless | that brings me to | 01:42 |
| DocScrutinizer | 16 | 01:42 |
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| timeless | 16. if you're going to let apps bring up a dialer prompt (ovi maps) provide a way for the user to dismiss the dialog for an extended period for that app (because it's stupid) | 01:42 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: That is actually doable for email. | 01:42 |
| javispedro | ShadowJK: rewire your brain so that it reflexively dismisses the selection connection dialog. works! | 01:43 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: The only offender is the Ovi Maps (and the Camera app that wants to do geotagging) | 01:43 |
| timeless | 17. geotagging should be done automatically but not while taking photos | 01:43 |
| timeless | ...grr | 01:43 |
| ShadowJK | and upgrade checking which eats a few megabytes when you do connect to internet | 01:43 |
| RST38h | 18. KILL TRACKER ALREADY. | 01:44 |
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| timeless | pissing off the user while on a train... | 01:44 |
| javispedro | 99. Don't piss the damn user. | 01:44 |
| timeless | shadowjk: problem "apt sucks" | 01:44 |
| timeless | solution: ditch apt | 01:44 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: There is another funny problem there | 01:44 |
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| RST38h | ShadowJK: Take any wifi network that wants authorization or a click-through | 01:44 |
| timeless | the problem is that apt really is not a good design for package updates | 01:45 |
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| RST38h | ShadowJK: When you connect to it, all your messaging accounts activate and start trying to sign in at once | 01:45 |
| ShadowJK | solution a): let me disable the checking b) teach phone to distinguish between home operator and other operators and only check for updates on home operator | 01:45 |
| timeless | rst: yeah, that's fun | 01:45 |
| javispedro | (btw: without any ssl checking, which means the AP's captive proxy now has all of your messaging account credentials) | 01:45 |
| timeless | javis? eeps?! | 01:46 |
| javispedro | or at least those who use https-like login :) | 01:46 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Which a) usually makes some of them stuck and requires command line kill and b) freaks out the poor hotspot which has not expected such a hot activity | 01:46 |
| javispedro | timeless: I've never seen it complain about wrong ssl cert, which my older palm used to do when a captive proxy was redirecting login attempts to its stupid site. | 01:46 |
| timeless | javis: please set up an evil hotspot and test | 01:47 |
| kerio | not evil | 01:47 |
| kerio | just dumb | 01:47 |
| timeless | and file a bug | 01:47 |
| timeless | evil = answers all dns w/ one ip | 01:47 |
| RST38h | yea, filing a bug is especially helpful nowadays | 01:47 |
| kerio | timeless: NOTABUG/WONTFIX | 01:48 |
| * javispedro sets an evil dns instead | 01:48 | |
| timeless | = answers 443 w/ a | 01:48 |
| timeless | kerio: bugs at this point are info gathering for future products | 01:48 |
| javispedro | kerio: tbh I'm not sure wheter it's a bug a "normal" user would want fixed. | 01:48 |
| SpeedEvil | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10354 | 01:48 |
| povbot | Bug 10354: Symbol virtual keyboard inconsistent to access from hardware keyboard. | 01:48 |
| timeless | and they more or less always have been | 01:48 |
| javispedro | talk.google.com tends to cause lots of ssl cert warnings periodically | 01:48 |
| kerio | timeless: the "evil" one stops dns tunneling | 01:48 |
| SpeedEvil | WONTFIXASSPECWRITERISANASSHAT | 01:48 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Ah I can quote these for hours | 01:48 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: From that stupid no-physical-keyboard-layout-switch bug (still not fixed) to no-copy-in-modest to tracker-brings-system-down to system-slows-down-in-5-days | 01:49 |
| SpeedEvil | In what planet should not mashing the sym and shift keys not consistently bring up the sym keybs | 01:49 |
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| kerio | planet maemo | 01:49 |
| kerio | since you need sym+fn | 01:50 |
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| kerio | not sym+shift | 01:50 |
| SpeedEvil | well - yeah | 01:50 |
| kerio | i actually prefer it this way | 01:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | in sovjet russia system brings down tracker | 01:50 |
| SpeedEvil | the bug description is right | 01:50 |
| kerio | SpeedEvil: you wouldn't be able to do ctrl+number | 01:50 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: And yes, I almost feel like at Nokia the design specs are detrimental to development rather than helpful =) | 01:51 |
| timeless | rst: they are | 01:51 |
| timeless | always | 01:51 |
| timeless | it's a flaw we inherited from the hardware ethos of the mother company | 01:51 |
| SpeedEvil | I disagree somewhat. | 01:52 |
| timeless | maybe we can lose it w/ new management | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | design specs are good, when they are used to enforce a sane UI. | 01:52 |
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| timeless | ... | 01:52 |
| kerio | YEAHRIGHT/NOTACHANCE | 01:52 |
| RST38h | you won't hehe | 01:52 |
| timeless | +1 | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | And avoid user pointless UI breakage. | 01:52 |
| timeless | speed: not going to happen | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | But design specs used as a defence against bugs in the design specs. | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | ... | 01:52 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah. | 01:52 |
| timeless | to do that you need something else | 01:53 |
| RST38h | Only if you stop writing exact specs internally and your management can somehow sell it to its management as the right thing | 01:53 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: An AK47? | 01:53 |
| timeless | more or less you need me w/ despotic powers | 01:53 |
| * javispedro lols at #10354 | 01:53 | |
| RST38h | bug #10354 | 01:53 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10354 Symbol virtual keyboard inconsistent to access from hardware keyboard. | 01:53 |
| javispedro | the above one :P | 01:53 |
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| timeless | the spec authors historically sat next to eachother | 01:53 |
| ShadowJK | some s60 devices have dedicated sym and ctrl keys :) | 01:53 |
| timeless | and didn't manage to product compatible specs | 01:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | MTHEL >> AK47 | 01:54 |
| kerio | DocScrutinizer: requires *way* more power | 01:54 |
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| timeless | shadowjk: iirc my e61i did | 01:54 |
| DocScrutinizer | that's the point :-P | 01:54 |
| kerio | do you have enough eneloops | 01:54 |
| timeless | sadly i recycled it @nokia house | 01:54 |
| timeless | they don't service it anymore :( | 01:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer | kerio: more power in => more power out | 01:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer | kerio: MTHELS work with acetylene and deuterium and fluor iirc | 01:56 |
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| * javispedro notes that while Jabber accounts do have a "do not ignore invalid certificates" setting, GTalk accounts do not. | 01:58 | |
| DocScrutinizer | do NOT ignore... sweeeeet | 01:58 |
| javispedro | translating from spanish locale, not the real message, but same meaning. | 01:59 |
| timeless | javis: install my localization | 01:59 |
| timeless | it gives you a tool to do string lookups | 01:59 |
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| SpeedEvil | Woo! | 02:02 |
| * SpeedEvil has a | | 02:02 | |
| SpeedEvil | (after digging through the hoover for it) | 02:02 |
| nox- | moin | 02:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | seen http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=815104#post815104 ? | 02:03 |
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| * SpeedEvil wonders where his class D amp is at. | 02:06 | |
| luke-jr | any hope in fixing some tiny 100-wire cable thing found connecting a cell phone LCD/webcam/speaker to the main base? | 02:08 |
| nox- | is anything known about problems falling back to gsm if no 3g? /me had to force gsm to stop gsm keeping disconnecting... | 02:08 |
| luke-jr | x.x | 02:08 |
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| ShadowJK | nox-, in general it's a big problem with every device, since 3g-2g fallback needs both modem firmware and operator's network to be bugfree | 02:10 |
| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: generally not. | 02:10 |
| luke-jr | :/ | 02:10 |
| ShadSEC | is there a way to tell the network go from gsm gprs to 3.5g without having to reconnect and thus changing ip? | 02:10 |
| luke-jr | honestly, I'd just as much prefer to hijack the LCD for something else… | 02:11 |
| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: I have repaired a 0.5mm pitch FPC that I tore. And it was 'fun' | 02:11 |
| luke-jr | at this point it's all in pieces | 02:11 |
| ShadowJK | as such, when you complain to device vendor, they blame the operator's misconfigured network, and when you complain to operator they blame the vendor's buggy firmware | 02:11 |
| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: hijacking the LCD is typically very tricky. | 02:11 |
| ShadowJK | only thing I've ever seen work was when thousands of cuatomers returned their devices and canceled their contracts | 02:11 |
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| nox- | ShadowJK, heh ok | 02:12 |
| SpeedEvil | Can anyone remind me of the search terms for the nokia n900 'manual' | 02:12 |
| nox- | so ill just have to switch to 3g from time to time to see if 3g is back (it was working earlier...) | 02:12 |
| ShadowJK | ShadSEC, it doesn't disconnect for me, keeps IP and stuff | 02:12 |
| ShadowJK | I'd suspect it depends on the operator then | 02:12 |
| nox- | yeah | 02:12 |
| luke-jr | it's down to two silver-backed LCD pieces now | 02:13 |
| luke-jr | I suspect I might be in for a mess if I take those apart? | 02:13 |
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| ShadSEC | shadowjk, you just change the mode to 3g and it keeps the connection up with the same ip? | 02:14 |
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| luke-jr | http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=1644470&l=b249b87927&id=1496065002 | 02:16 |
| luke-jr | is there any hope⁇? XD | 02:16 |
| timeless | shadsec: try an ipv6 tunnel :) | 02:16 |
| ShadowJK | ShadSEC, yep. There's a second or two where no data is moving, though | 02:16 |
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| timeless | if your inpoint is ipv6 and your outpoint is the other side of the tunnel | 02:17 |
| timeless | you might survive local ipv4 changes better :) | 02:17 |
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| luke-jr | hmm | 02:18 |
| ShadSEC | timeless, in fact I am using openvpn, but I was wondering if the switch would be doable | 02:18 |
| luke-jr | that camera connector is intact… maybe I can build a portable video recorder | 02:18 |
| timeless | sp3000: ping | 02:19 |
| sp3000 | yawn | 02:19 |
| ShadSEC | ShadowJK, in mine, it changes the ip | 02:19 |
| * sp3000 opens an eye | 02:19 | |
| luke-jr | SpeedEvil: ^ | 02:20 |
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| sp3000 | SpeedEvil: which manual is that | 02:21 |
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| timeless | uh, how do i get that? | 02:24 |
| timeless | err, not that, soome other that :) | 02:24 |
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| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: In principle yes. | 02:26 |
| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: However - do you have a microcontroller or camera coprocessor that can eat a frame in 1/60th of a second. | 02:26 |
| SpeedEvil | sp3000: http://nds1.nokia.com/phones/files/guides/Nokia_N900_UG_en.pdf | 02:28 |
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| sp3000 | SpeedEvil: yeah, "user guide", but manual could be other things too :) | 02:32 |
| SpeedEvil | sp3000: yes - I was hoping for different verbiage in the manual. | 02:32 |
| SpeedEvil | To fight a bug | 02:33 |
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| timeless | hey, how do i force modest to send mail? | 02:37 |
| timeless | grr | 02:38 |
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| timeless | hrm, what's my password? | 02:40 |
| BugBlauw | 1234? | 02:40 |
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| timeless | does modest store passwords in plaintext somewhere convenient? | 02:41 |
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| timeless | oh, hkb fail | 02:41 |
| SpeedEvil | timeless: apt-get threaten modest | 02:42 |
| javispedro | timeless: gconf | 02:42 |
| javispedro | /apps/modest/accounts iirc | 02:42 |
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| javispedro | actually /apps/modest/server_accounts | 02:43 |
| Shadikka | I must be tired for laughing at "apt-get threaten" | 02:43 |
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| Shadikka | That would be an useful thing to have every so often, though. | 02:44 |
| javispedro | fyi APT = "Advanced Persistent Threat" | 02:45 |
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| derf | Hmm, no one has packaged gdb 7.0 or higher? | 02:55 |
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| timeless | derf: we (nokia) have it somewhere | 03:01 |
| timeless | there was iirc rumblings about pushing it somewhere public | 03:01 |
| timeless | ask eero (by mail) | 03:02 |
| derf | Probably easier to just try to build it myself. | 03:02 |
| derf | All I want to do is actually look at NEON registers. | 03:02 |
| nox- | heh i also expected problems but gdb head built just fine on freebsd too | 03:02 |
| nox- | (tho that was x86 not arm :) | 03:03 |
| timeless | i've built gdb cross for arm | 03:03 |
| timeless | it wasn't a problem | 03:03 |
| timeless | gdb s wellbehaved | 03:03 |
| nox- | yeah looks like | 03:03 |
| derf | Well, I want to actually run it on the device. | 03:04 |
| nox- | i think i also had a cross gdb for arm once... | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | umm | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | isn't it there? | 03:04 |
| derf | 6.8.50 is there. | 03:04 |
| derf | That's too old. | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 03:04 |
| * javispedro remembers seeing gdb7 package | 03:04 | |
| javispedro | http://chaos.troll.no/~harald/gdb7/ | 03:04 |
| * lcuk looks around | 03:04 | |
| derf | Where? | 03:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Why newer? | 03:05 |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 03:05 |
| SpeedEvil | neon | 03:05 |
| derf | javispedro: Brilliant. | 03:05 |
| javispedro | hm.. readme says it's scratchbox, though | 03:05 |
| javispedro | hope it works | 03:05 |
| lcuk | derf, thats renamed binary to allow both versions | 03:05 |
| lcuk | there is a direct version around too (I built it for this purpose based on Harrys initial work) not sure though where it is | 03:06 |
| derf | lcuk: I'm not sure what you mean. | 03:06 |
| lcuk | derf, the version of gdb7 that javispedro just pointed out | 03:06 |
| lcuk | has a binary called gdb7 afaik | 03:06 |
| derf | Oh, that's fine. | 03:06 |
| lcuk | sure | 03:06 |
| lcuk | am just highlighting it | 03:06 |
| lcuk | theres some other minor diffs too I believe, but harry built that to get qt compatability | 03:07 |
| derf | Yeah, thanks. I probably would've scratched my head for a bit otherwise. | 03:07 |
| lcuk | which the old gdb didnt have | 03:07 |
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| derf | Hmm, still no NEON support in that one. | 03:09 |
| lcuk | derf, was it in 6.8? | 03:10 |
| derf | Huh? | 03:10 |
| lcuk | neon support | 03:11 |
| derf | If it was in 6.8, why would I need a newer version? | 03:11 |
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| lcuk | derf, 6.8 crashes for qt development | 03:12 |
| derf | I don't care about Qt development. | 03:12 |
| javispedro | good reason to get a newer one for pr1.2+1 sdk ;P | 03:12 |
| lcuk | pr2.1? :P | 03:12 |
| lcuk | 2.2 even | 03:12 |
| javispedro | while someone's at it, kill the libsdl-ttf2.0 package for the next SDK too :) | 03:12 |
| lcuk | see! my brain is mashed | 03:12 |
| * lcuk giggles | 03:13 | |
| timeless | javis: y? | 03:13 |
| javispedro | bug #10450 | 03:13 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10450 libsdl-ttf2.0 missing from device repositories | 03:13 |
| timeless | cute | 03:13 |
| javispedro | basically a debian-incompatible package got introduced intro sdk which broke existing debian-based extras package and _all_ applications using it | 03:13 |
| timeless | impressive | 03:14 |
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| lcuk | hmm there should be an alias on that bug | 03:15 |
| javispedro | tbh I made an error there, shouldn't have ever suggested moving sdk package into extras | 03:15 |
| javispedro | should have checked for debian-guidelines-violating binary package names first :( | 03:16 |
| lcuk | is the internal alias syntax int-123456 on bugs.maemo.org? | 03:17 |
| javispedro | think so, but poke andre, I do not know about bmo organization | 03:17 |
| lcuk | its late for andre, doesnt really matter, but I know the internal # | 03:17 |
| timeless | just search the open bugs list | 03:19 |
| timeless | find some examples | 03:19 |
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| javispedro | lcuk: note that we (council & afaik marcell) are also searching for a "escape path" with some conflicts/replaces/overwrites trickery | 03:20 |
| lcuk | sure | 03:20 |
| timeless | i don't think you need conflicts | 03:21 |
| timeless | replaces should be sufficient | 03:21 |
| javispedro | never trust h-a-m | 03:21 |
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| javispedro | (also see bug report itself) | 03:21 |
| timeless | i read it | 03:23 |
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| timeless | i didn't see anything saying replaces alone doesn't work | 03:23 |
| timeless | make a foo-0 ver+1 with no files | 03:23 |
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| timeless | make a foo-0-0 which depends foo-0 (that ver+1) with your files | 03:24 |
| javispedro | note that a transaction installing such package | 03:24 |
| javispedro | would depend on foo-0 ver+1 and foo-0-0 while foo-0 ver is installed | 03:24 |
| timeless | have people depend on foo-0-0 for your happy dependy ver | 03:24 |
| javispedro | and foo-0-0 is trying to overwrite foo-0 's files | 03:25 |
| javispedro | they are no longer foo-0 's files in foo-0 ver+1 | 03:25 |
| timeless | pre-depend | 03:25 |
| javispedro | but I could believe h-a-m panicking there. | 03:25 |
| timeless | it's easy enough to test | 03:26 |
| timeless | but it's 1.30am | 03:26 |
| timeless | and i'm on vacation | 03:26 |
| * javispedro would prefer to kill the sdk package with fire and pretend nothing ever happened, pissing -devel users | 03:26 | |
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| javispedro | or maybe I should just push the sdl_ttf upstream to bump their version number. | 03:28 |
| javispedro | sounds like a good enough evil plan. | 03:28 |
| javispedro | (would piss sdk repo users, though >:) ) | 03:28 |
| lcuk | it wouldn't piss them off, they would calmy send black helicopters | 03:29 |
| timeless | heh | 03:30 |
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| timeless | this-version-bumped-becuase-someone-tail-wagged-thw-nokia-dog | 03:30 |
| javispedro | :) | 03:31 |
| timeless | s/uase-someone-tail-wagged-thw/ause-someone-tail-wagged-the/ | 03:31 |
| infobot | timeless meant: this-version-bumped-because-someone-tail-wagged-the-nokia-dog | 03:31 |
| javispedro | hm. | 03:31 |
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| * javispedro envisions connecting meegotouch correction features with infobot's s command | 03:32 | |
| timeless | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wag_the_Dog | 03:32 |
| timeless | for people who missed the reference.. | 03:32 |
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| timeless | (kinda) | 03:33 |
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| timeless | basically in this case someone scarred nokia into doing the wrong thing | 03:34 |
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| javispedro | and the nokia dog thus ate someone's packaging homework. | 03:35 |
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| timeless | :) | 03:36 |
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| ShadSEC | finally | 03:42 |
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| ShadSEC | it's not exactly what i wanted but now I can create a connection with gconf and then send dbus disconnect and connect to that connection | 03:43 |
| ShadSEC | but i surrender fighting against wlancond/icd2 :( | 03:43 |
| timeless | shadsecz: um, fmms managed.. | 03:44 |
| ShadSEC | yep, fmms is doing bassically the first part | 03:44 |
| ShadSEC | for creating the connection | 03:44 |
| ShadSEC | using gconftool | 03:44 |
| ShadSEC | or maybe other way? donno, but it does create the connection | 03:45 |
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| SpeedEvil | ShadSEC: great. | 03:48 |
| SpeedEvil | well - somewhat great. | 03:48 |
| ShadSEC | its not the way it should be... | 03:49 |
| ShadSEC | but it works for my program though | 03:49 |
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| ShadSEC | so now i can go on | 03:49 |
| javispedro | you know icd2 has a public API? | 03:49 |
| ShadSEC | lets see what other surprises i will have to sort :( | 03:50 |
| ShadSEC | javispedro, I could string the dbus call, but I didn't find a way to send it from commandline | 03:50 |
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| ShadSEC | wlancond settings_and_connect would have been ok, but i coulnt | 03:51 |
| javispedro | I think we've reached the point where you should explain what you are trying to do. | 03:51 |
| javispedro | overview | 03:51 |
| ShadSEC | and anyway the way "should" be, just using iwconfig and stuff... now that I had to surrender it doesnt mattermuch | 03:52 |
| javispedro | http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#goal | 03:52 |
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| ShadSEC | haha | 03:53 |
| ShadSEC | the goal is just an airoscript like with some addons | 03:53 |
| * SpeedEvil forgets what airoscript is again. | 03:54 | |
| * SpeedEvil sighs. | 03:54 | |
| ShadSEC | but this is just for the part of setting a connection with some gathered data | 03:54 |
| ShadSEC | airoscript is an interface to aircrack-ng | 03:54 |
| javispedro | is this connection temporary? | 03:54 |
| javispedro | or permanent until the user decides to kill it? | 03:55 |
| ShadSEC | depends on the case... both are correct :) | 03:55 |
| ShadSEC | I mean, I need to manage both options | 03:55 |
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| javispedro | then I believe your current approach is the best one. | 03:56 |
| ShadSEC | ie. one of the options is an aid to locate an AP based on signal strenght | 03:56 |
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| javispedro | if icd2 doesn't know anything about the connection you're setting up most apps will plainly refuse to even attemp to use it | 03:57 |
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| javispedro | s/apps/GUI apps | 03:57 |
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| SpeedEvil | ShadSEC: you saw http://maemo.org/packages/view/autofreewifi/ ? | 03:58 |
| ShadSEC | for that, theres no problem because I just put the interface in monitor mode and used sniffed beacons | 03:58 |
| ShadSEC | oh really? | 03:58 |
| ShadSEC | it doesnt affect much my goal, but its interesting to know | 03:58 |
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| ShadSEC | but if I have setup in gconf and instructed icd to connect it, it should know about it | 03:59 |
| javispedro | yes, that's why I was saying that was the best approach if your "goal" includes leaving the connection on and allowing the user to use it to for ex. browse the www | 03:59 |
| ShadSEC | it is not intended, but I guess it doesnt matter | 04:00 |
| ShadSEC | anyway it has been a great opportunity to learn a bit about how maemo does some things | 04:01 |
| ShadSEC | even if dont like some of the ways | 04:01 |
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| ShadSEC | speedevil, yep, it is also easy to automate the scan/attack/crack/connect of a wep ap | 04:04 |
| SpeedEvil | I'd like the ability to monitor APs signal strength and correlate against gps too. | 04:05 |
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| ShadSEC | speedevil, i thought about that, and it would be great, but i won't be doing that now, too complex considering signal strenght alone is working for my purposes | 04:10 |
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| ShadSEC | I only do a conversion to a scale 1 to 10, a full graph, and espeak saying the scale.. it simple and it works | 04:12 |
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| SpeedEvil | k | 04:13 |
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| felipec | the results of measuring battery life for FFmpeg's vorbis decoder with gst-av: http://felipec.wordpress.com/2010/09/14/gst-av-0-3-better-performance-for-vorbis-and-mp3/ | 04:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | https://datatype.helixcommunity.org/Mp3dec | 04:26 |
| SpeedEvil | I keep meaning to try compiling | 04:26 |
| SpeedEvil | - integer optimised mp3 decoder | 04:26 |
| SpeedEvil | Interesting results | 04:28 |
| SpeedEvil | I vaguely recall that wav was a little better still | 04:28 |
| javispedro | nice! | 04:29 |
| felipec | kulve: ^ | 04:30 |
| javispedro | i guess on aac the picture will look quite worse though? | 04:30 |
| ShadSEC | SpeedEvil, but wav also involved much more fs io, which is the biggest bottleneck on n900 | 04:30 |
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| ShadSEC | involves | 04:30 |
| SpeedEvil | ShadSEC: Well... | 04:30 |
| ShadSEC | so perhaps its even better to play mp3? | 04:30 |
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| SpeedEvil | ShadSEC: The SD/eMMC can go at 15megabytes/s | 04:31 |
| SpeedEvil | so 'CD quality' is 1% utilisation | 04:31 |
| ShadSEC | speedevil, in theory... but in my tests, it drops to under 1mb/s sometimes for unknown reasons | 04:31 |
| ShadSEC | i would really like to know WHY | 04:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Swapping can be it. | 04:32 |
| ShadSEC | probably, it happens when transferring LARGE files (hundreds of mb) | 04:32 |
| SpeedEvil | oh | 04:32 |
| ShadSEC | it ALWAYS happens | 04:32 |
| felipec | javispedro: yes, AAC is much more complex... although there are many kinds of AAC | 04:33 |
| SpeedEvil | that's just stuff not using madvise | 04:33 |
| felipec | but there's only one way to know ;) | 04:33 |
| javispedro | :P | 04:33 |
| SpeedEvil | madvise(sequential) or whatever it is | 04:33 |
| SpeedEvil | to tell the kernel not to cache the file | 04:33 |
| lcuk3 | felipec, *applause* | 04:33 |
| javispedro | quite impressive ffmpeg beats the propietary mp3 codec. yet another blob less! | 04:34 |
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| felipec | javispedro: I don't think it's surprising... I've seem how the internal algorithms were developed, and how the FFmpeg community does it | 04:39 |
| felipec | I was expecting a bit better performance... maybe in a few months :) | 04:40 |
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| ShadSEC | javispedro, now that i remember... did you know wlancond settings_and_connect dbus call is not showing in dbus_monitor? | 04:42 |
| javispedro | it is. | 04:42 |
| ShadSEC | really? | 04:43 |
| javispedro | yes.. | 04:43 |
| javispedro | system bus | 04:43 |
| ShadSEC | i am pretty confident it doesnt in mine.. | 04:43 |
| ShadSEC | yeah --system | 04:43 |
| javispedro | args to dbus-monitor? | 04:43 |
| lcuk3 | felipec, reproducability - with these battery scripts now, its easier to tell whether a given tweak is actually giving an improvement | 04:43 |
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| ShadSEC | dbus-monitor --system | 04:43 |
| javispedro | iirc it won't show method_calls by default | 04:43 |
| ShadSEC | :S | 04:43 |
| * lcuk3 goes to bed anyway, still didnt get to play portal, damn steam still hasnt finished updating | 04:44 | |
| javispedro | try dbus-monitor --system --type=method_call | 04:44 |
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| ShadSEC | oh, anyway | 04:44 |
| felipec | lcuk3: yes, actually I think I made a change in gst-av that improved the performance | 04:44 |
| ShadSEC | it wont show | 04:44 |
| lcuk3 | awesome! | 04:44 |
| ShadSEC | i did strace dbus-daemon, and it isn't seeing the call | 04:44 |
| ShadSEC | so it won't show | 04:44 |
| javispedro | huh??? | 04:44 |
| javispedro | it doesn't work that way | 04:45 |
| javispedro | see dbus_add_match function | 04:45 |
| javispedro | you're going to make me try it.. | 04:45 |
| lcuk3 | felipec, with these kind of algorithms, can you send "frames" of music data through a known number of times and check time taken | 04:45 |
| ShadSEC | well, i was desperate, thought that maybe it wasn't showing everything for a reason, and evething should go thrugh dbus-monitor, so i straced it | 04:45 |
| lcuk3 | ie, like I would do to develop a blitter | 04:46 |
| ShadSEC | and everything was showing there as with dbus-monitor, but again not wlancond requests | 04:46 |
| lcuk3 | or is the best way to get like for like basing it on drain | 04:46 |
| ShadSEC | then, with the help of speedevil it seemed it probably was using a sock instead of regular dbus | 04:46 |
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| javispedro | no, it's using the system bus | 04:47 |
| felipec | lcuk3: well, for the algorithm itself you can use time | 04:47 |
| ShadSEC | well, unless if made some big mistake in my multiple tests, it wasn't | 04:47 |
| ShadSEC | I couldnt spot it stracing wlancond or icd2 directly | 04:47 |
| ShadSEC | but not on dbus monitor | 04:47 |
| felipec | lcuk3: and the algorithm is the bigger CPU consumer, but it's not the only factor: GStreamer and Pulseaudio benefit of having bigger buffers, I found out by using OProfile | 04:48 |
| ShadSEC | i could in strace i mean | 04:48 |
| lcuk3 | cool | 04:48 |
| felipec | lcuk3: by running the battery script I found that the difference with gst-ffmpeg wan't as big as I expected, so I increased the buffer size even more, to 1 second, and that seemed to give a bit more performance | 04:49 |
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| felipec | gst-ffmpeg pushes buffers as they come, which are very small... gst-av aggregates 1 second, and then pushes | 04:50 |
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| felipec | but as you can see, that doesn't make _that_ much of a difference... but some :) | 04:51 |
| RST38h | Verizon is evil. They make random parts of the network inaccessible. | 04:52 |
| RST38h | Why would ANYONE disconnect www.metageek.net for example? | 04:52 |
| SpeedEvil | err | 04:54 |
| lcuk3 | felipec, one observation from your blog - you explain the Y units (hours of playback) only after the second graph | 04:54 |
| SpeedEvil | that's not responding here | 04:54 |
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| felipec | lcuk3: right... I thought it was obvious, but perhaps not (updated) | 04:56 |
| RST38h | Speed: Maybe Verizon is not to blame then... | 04:56 |
| RST38h | OMG they actually productized Windows on CE4100... | 04:56 |
| RST38h | Wait, it says Windows Media Center EMBEDDED, so, no miracles | 04:57 |
| ShadSEC | do you guys know of any audio player that you can script which exact portions (from 31 second to 47, then from 4:19 to 5:14, etc...) you want to play while also letting control to go off those limits using the slider or something? | 04:59 |
| ShadSEC | and yeah, i know i use to ask weird questions :P | 05:01 |
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| * felipec goes to sleep | 05:04 | |
| SpeedEvil | felipec: mplayer wavs - ~50mA | 05:07 |
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| RST38h | AMOLED vs SuperLCD: http://www.engadget.com/photos/spot-the-difference-htc-desires-slcd-versus-amoled/ | 05:11 |
| RST38h | LCD actually looks like a better choice... | 05:11 |
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| SpeedEvil | power consumption IRL | 05:12 |
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| RST38h | that too | 05:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Also appropriate themingmay reduce power use signifcatnly on oled | 05:13 |
| RST38h | better blacks appear to be the only advantage of amoled, based on these photos | 05:13 |
| RST38h | btw, weird procedural question: who actually elects the next nokia ceo? | 05:15 |
| RST38h | is it done by biggest shareholders or else? | 05:15 |
| SpeedEvil | It's based on karma isn't it? | 05:15 |
| SpeedEvil | CEO is appointed by the board I think | 05:15 |
| SpeedEvil | so sort-of | 05:16 |
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| javispedro | blog karma | 05:17 |
| javispedro | heh. | 05:17 |
| RST38h | and who appoints the board? =) | 05:17 |
| javispedro | let's promote maemo.org karma until it takes over the entire company | 05:17 |
| RST38h | let us just make Texrat CEO and run the hell away | 05:17 |
| javispedro | heh | 05:19 |
| javispedro | at least Nokia would never have surface mounted micro USB connectors again! | 05:19 |
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| SpeedEvil | The board is comprised of officers of the company, and large stockholder represerntative AIUI | 05:20 |
| RST38h | javispedro: it would have an M5 screw running through the whole device,including the usb socket | 05:22 |
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| javispedro | well, let's start buying Nokia stock. | 05:32 |
| * SpeedEvil buys a 3310. | 05:33 | |
| javispedro | how much does the 51% of Nokia cost? | 05:34 |
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| luke-jr | lol | 05:38 |
| SpeedEvil | It would be one way to get the community council more voice. | 05:41 |
| RST38h | javispedro: about 5% of google. Have you got any? | 05:41 |
| * javispedro looks at pockets | 05:42 | |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Yea, and force them to bring back the Maemo4! | 05:42 |
| SpeedEvil | 'Ok - you're dropping symbian, and going opensource on _everything_'. :) | 05:42 |
| * RST38h cackles evilly | 05:42 | |
| SpeedEvil | Though symbian on small stuff probably still makes sense | 05:42 |
| * javispedro tries to find "Nokia" on businessesforsale dot com | 05:43 | |
| javispedro | well, at least I can now be the owner of a radioshack store! | 05:44 |
| RST38h | Why would you want to be? | 05:44 |
| javispedro | to have customers to piss on! | 05:45 |
| luke-jr | RST38h: my thought exactly | 05:45 |
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| RST38h | javispedro: Just build yourself a 2-storied portaloo and charge for entrance | 05:46 |
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| * RST38h gave up and installed MohammadAG's apt-get | 06:29 | |
| RST38h | Dear Nokia, please stop insulting your users by breaking their tools. | 06:30 |
| asj | what's broken now? | 06:30 |
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| RST38h | asj:Cannot install stuff from ovi store repo | 06:42 |
| RST38h | Have to use HAM for that | 06:42 |
| asj | RST38h: there's nothing in the ovi store you want ;p | 06:42 |
| RST38h | Actually, there is | 06:43 |
| * RST38h wanted to try Weatherbug, saw it today on...eh...iPad | 06:43 | |
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| asj | RST38h: it's better than omweather? I always htought weathebug was just a spyware install method for windows | 06:50 |
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| CreamyG | fuck ups, just got a card in the mail from them today saying if i don't pick up a package today they're sending it back | 06:52 |
| CreamyG | cuz apparently they can't find their way into a 20 story apartment building, even though homeless people seem to figure it out | 06:53 |
| luke-jr | CreamyG: yeah, that's annoying | 06:54 |
| luke-jr | I live in a house and the mailman can't be bothered to even knock | 06:54 |
| CreamyG | i especially like how it's package 2/2 and the other one got in fine, the guy was like "sorry it took so long" | 06:54 |
| luke-jr | he just writes up a card and puts in my mailbox | 06:54 |
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| CreamyG | yeah the postal service does that here, and ups too | 06:55 |
| CreamyG | common complaint, they're just so damn cheap | 06:55 |
| CreamyG | i mean the hours to pick up my package is 7-11am or 4-7pm, apparently they can't employ someone to work all day | 06:55 |
| CreamyG | then they aren't open saturday or sunday | 06:55 |
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| CreamyG | i'm surprised they actually splurged on a stamp to mail me this card. not sure how it took 11 days to get across town though, probalby only can pay someone to mail letters once a week lol. | 06:57 |
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| ljp | thats because 11am to 4pm is when they hired the gorillas to work at stomping boxes | 06:59 |
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| CreamyG | yeah i doubt there's anything left of my package by now. probably just a box of broken glass and crushed dreams. | 07:03 |
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| CreamyG | wow when outlook 2010 fails to do something with a useless error ("There was an error") it asks you "was this information useful". is that some sort of joke? how can an error message be useful if it doesn't state the problem? | 07:08 |
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| CreamyG | i wish i could answer "yes and no" and then ask if my response was useful | 07:11 |
| luke-jr | LOL | 07:12 |
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| septiq | Hi has someone successfully used LATEST (0.6.1-1) mikkov's openvpn-applet ? | 07:42 |
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| septiq | where can I download old versions packages ? | 07:54 |
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| rmrfchik | http://itunes.apple.com/ru/app/fashism-mobile/id388026124?mt=8 | 09:24 |
| rmrfchik | nuffsaid | 09:24 |
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| ilon | is it possible to change layout / size of the toolbar used for fullscreen mode kin the terminal? | 09:42 |
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| X-Fade | Morning | 09:50 |
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| mece | mornin' | 10:00 |
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| crashanddie | morning maemo | 10:10 |
| ilon | morning | 10:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | morning | 10:14 |
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| mece | hey question, should last weeks meego for n900 release be completely empty? For some reason there are no icons or anything. The only button is the arrow type thing at the bottom, which blurs the background when I click it. | 10:16 |
| Stskeeps | mece: possibly | 10:17 |
| Stskeeps | mece: we're right now coming out of 2-3 weeks hell with qt | 10:17 |
| mece | alrighty | 10:17 |
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| mece | so possibly something working in tomorrows release then? | 10:17 |
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| mece | hm. is events.nokia.com the place to go to watch the keynotes at nokia world? | 10:19 |
| X-Fade | mece: Doesn't look like there will be a feed this year. | 10:20 |
| mece | ahj | 10:20 |
| mece | http://streamstudio.world-television.com/CCUIv3/frameset.aspx?ticket=678-750-8959&target=en-default-&status=preview&browser=ns-0-0-0-10-0&stream=flash-video-500 | 10:20 |
| mece | haha | 10:20 |
| mece | twitter helped | 10:20 |
| X-Fade | Lol :) | 10:20 |
| X-Fade | I didn't see that on the events pages? :) | 10:21 |
| mece | me neither. someone tweeted the url | 10:21 |
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| crashanddie | interesting, the SIP on Maemo fails due to the CPU going in low-power mode? | 10:25 |
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| crashanddie | Whenever the screen is no longer lit, the call quality drops dramatically | 10:25 |
| joga | hmm...I don't know the specifics about that but if the cpu has something important to do, why would it go to low-power mode... | 10:27 |
| crashanddie | hmm, unrelated issue, forcing the screen to be lit still results in random quality loss | 10:27 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: This is why the phone app forces the cpu at higher rate. | 10:28 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: For cell calls at least. | 10:28 |
| crashanddie | joga: run an app at nice 19, and you'll see how it'll handle your precious tasks :P | 10:28 |
| crashanddie | X-Fade: hmm | 10:28 |
| crashanddie | X-Fade: and SIP is handled differently? | 10:28 |
| crashanddie | X-Fade: surprising, considering it's the same framework | 10:28 |
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| X-Fade | No idea, just ask the overclockers ;) They had their values reset all the time when answering a call. | 10:29 |
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| crashanddie | haha | 10:30 |
| jacekowski | morning | 10:30 |
| crashanddie | morning jace | 10:30 |
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| mece | heey the link works. I see movement :) | 10:48 |
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| crashanddie | lol... musopen collected $50k | 10:55 |
| Stskeeps | musopen? | 10:55 |
| crashanddie | they initially hoped for $11k, and thought that would be a stretch | 10:55 |
| crashanddie | a project to record copyright-free music scores and release the audio to public domain | 10:55 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 10:55 |
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| dneary | crashanddie, URL? | 10:56 |
| crashanddie | http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/Musopen/record-and-release-free-music-without-copyrights | 10:56 |
| Tott3[AEX] | sup? | 10:58 |
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| crashanddie | Tott3[AEX]: not much, you? | 10:59 |
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| Tott3[AEX] | nothing pretty much | 10:59 |
| Tott3[AEX] | waiting for my new phone to arrive=/ | 11:00 |
| crashanddie | n900? | 11:00 |
| Tott3[AEX] | yeah | 11:00 |
| crashanddie | dneary: sounds like a pretty honourable cause, doesn't it? | 11:00 |
| mece | nice! | 11:03 |
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| mece | ..err regardning musopen | 11:03 |
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| ieatlint | not that i think that musopen thing is a bad idea, but i have to wonder what kind of unintended fallout could come from it | 11:07 |
| Scelt | http://pastebin.com/kqD56TmU wat | 11:08 |
| ieatlint | how much do symphonies make from the recordings of this music? .. would kinda suck if they lost a major funding source, as they're not exactly profiteering | 11:08 |
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| crashanddie | ieatlint: "symphonies"? | 11:10 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: you mean orchestras? | 11:10 |
| ieatlint | don't get pedantic on me :P | 11:10 |
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| crashanddie | orchestras, like most musicians, make most of their money from live performances, not recording | 11:11 |
| dneary | crashanddie, Indeed. | 11:11 |
| crashanddie | or specific commandeered works, just like this one | 11:11 |
| crashanddie | if I pay an orchestra to record a song for me, I own the copyright, not them | 11:11 |
| ieatlint | yes | 11:11 |
| dneary | A friend (musician) recently lamented that it is impossible to find high quality sheet music, even of public domain works from previous centuries, online | 11:11 |
| ieatlint | i'm just questioning if this could put them into financial trouble by taking away a funding source | 11:12 |
| dneary | crashanddie, sheet music is very expensive. | 11:12 |
| ieatlint | i realise live performances may be their main income, but as i understand, they're not doing too well already | 11:12 |
| dneary | ieatlint, Only if the recording companies stop asking orchestras to record major works... | 11:12 |
| ieatlint | but i'm entirely speculating -- just saying from what i understand, it's a concern that is due some basic investigation | 11:13 |
| ieatlint | dneary: that is kinda my point... if recordings are in the public domain, the incentive for them to hire an orchestra is low | 11:14 |
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| dneary | ieatlint, Yeah, because if I sing "Imagine" and release it as a public domain work, no-one will ever buy the Lennon version again... | 11:15 |
| ieatlint | heh | 11:17 |
| ieatlint | this clearly has no hope of being a productive conversation | 11:17 |
| dneary | ieatlint, Two orchestras with different conductors record the same piece of music, but it's not the same | 11:18 |
| dneary | That's the point I was making | 11:18 |
| ieatlint | enjoy your veiled idealism, i'll be over here in the grey area | 11:18 |
| ieatlint | yes, i'm quite aware of that | 11:18 |
| dneary | ieatlint, Bear in mind that most of these works are public domain, and have been for centuries | 11:18 |
| ieatlint | the music itself is, but the performance is not | 11:19 |
| dneary | There will always be a market for excellent classical musicians | 11:19 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: what you have to understand is that there isn't just "one" recording of say, Prokofiev's Piano Sonata or Korsakov's String Quartet. There are many different versions and most people enjoy very different qualities to different orchestras. Even the same orchestras can have specific performances based on who conducts them | 11:19 |
| ieatlint | crashanddie: and 90% of the general public that goes out and buys a classical cd doesn't give a fuck | 11:20 |
| dneary | crashanddie, He'd better be good, though... :) | 11:20 |
| crashanddie | So to answer your question, there won't be any fallout from having yet another recording by a relatively unknown east-european orchestra, the only difference is that some works will be available for re-use in other works | 11:20 |
| dneary | (musopen, I mean) | 11:20 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: that is completely besides the point, really. Obviously, musopen doesn't target 98% of the general population | 11:20 |
| dneary | crashanddie, We could have a resurgence of classical riffs in dance music! | 11:20 |
| ieatlint | crashanddie: no, it just means a recording company could take a copy of the music, put it on a cd, and sell it at the store for $20 as they do now | 11:21 |
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| dneary | I can just imagine putting Four Seasons with the Amen break | 11:21 |
| ieatlint | brb | 11:21 |
| dneary | ieatlint, That depends on the license | 11:22 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: and it wouldn't sell any better than the other 500 versions of the same work | 11:22 |
| dneary | And if they had to label it "CC by-sa", then someone who bought it could use it for whatever they wanted | 11:22 |
| crashanddie | they're going for CC0 from what I can tell | 11:23 |
| crashanddie | dneary: maybe they can get Barenboim to conduct? | 11:25 |
| dneary | It seems like you know more about classical music than me :) | 11:25 |
| ieatlint | public domain isn't cc | 11:25 |
| crashanddie | cc0 is pretty much | 11:26 |
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| Khertan_ | Hi ! | 11:27 |
| ieatlint | well, they're going for public domain | 11:28 |
| Khertan_ | hum pyqt is available for symbian ? | 11:28 |
| ieatlint | which means no copyright applies | 11:28 |
| ieatlint | yes, people could buy a cd of it and copy it and redistribute | 11:28 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: and the whole point of cc0 is to waive all copyrights | 11:29 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: please google things before trolling | 11:29 |
| ieatlint | but it in no way compels anyone to put up a notice saying so | 11:29 |
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| ieatlint | crashanddie: dude, google shit yourself http://www.musopen.com/faq.php#2 | 11:29 |
| Khertan_ | N9 at the NokiaWorld !!!!!!!!! http://bit.ly/9fDfd9 | 11:29 |
| crashanddie | dneary: my dad is a baritone soloist, and transverse flute player, my mum had a child choir and wrote, conducted and produced some 18CDs in total | 11:30 |
| crashanddie | I grew up listening to Vivaldi on my birthdays | 11:31 |
| jacekowski | crashanddie: i feel sorry for you | 11:31 |
| crashanddie | no need, it's a great experience in the end | 11:31 |
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| jacekowski | hmm, that would be hardcore | 11:32 |
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| jacekowski | play some vivaldi on 1kW amp in a car | 11:32 |
| crashanddie | would sound like crap though | 11:32 |
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| Khertan_ | No meego product launch today :( | 11:33 |
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| jacekowski | Khertan_: you are on nokia world? | 11:34 |
| jacekowski | ehh | 11:34 |
| jacekowski | waste of money | 11:34 |
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| jacekowski | £700 to liten to their advertising | 11:35 |
| Khertan_ | jacekowski: oh .... no just listening the live streaming while working | 11:35 |
| Khertan_ | http://events.nokia.com/nokiaworld/home.htm | 11:35 |
| jacekowski | i was considering going there but then i saw the price | 11:35 |
| jacekowski | and unless free n900 is included then it's not worth it | 11:35 |
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| Khertan_ | currently it s look like brain wash : symbian more used plateform | 11:37 |
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| mece | I want meego with the camera module from N8 | 11:40 |
| mece | ... and a keyboard. | 11:40 |
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| X-Fade | Hm mechanical shutter. | 11:41 |
| mece | exactly | 11:41 |
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| X-Fade | Lol, Tron :) | 11:42 |
| mece | hmm is it my stream or the n8 that is lagging? | 11:42 |
| Khertan_ | hum ... some resume the Apple keynote in 3 words most used by steve, awesome, amazing, beautiful ... the first words i remember from this presentation is : 'blablabla' | 11:42 |
| Khertan_ | :) | 11:42 |
| mece | oh it's my stream | 11:42 |
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| dneary | X-Fade, You're not available at all this week for a Maemo team meeting? | 11:43 |
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| X-Fade | dneary: I already told Jaffa that I'll free the thursday afternoon slot. | 11:43 |
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| dneary | X-Fade, OK | 11:44 |
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| Khertan_ | ah ... word amazing :) | 11:47 |
| mece | haha | 11:48 |
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| Khertan_ | some say that his english accent is horrible ... but hum ... at leat i prefer his accent than texan one ... i can clearly understand him ! | 11:50 |
| mece | pretty good for a finn, imo. | 11:51 |
| TermanaDesire | Besides that it sounded like he said the phone has a buddies. I don't think that's what he was saying though | 11:53 |
| TermanaDesire | Buddy* | 11:53 |
| mece | "It's biiig" | 11:53 |
| mece | lol | 11:53 |
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| mece | Khertan_, what's new in the new khweetur? | 11:55 |
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| mece | hmpf my stream died | 11:56 |
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| X-Fade | mece: mine too. Totally crapped out. | 11:57 |
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| mece | :/ | 11:57 |
| X-Fade | mece: Server is too busy | 11:57 |
| mece | it's back | 11:57 |
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| mece | no it's gone again | 11:59 |
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| abstract3d | hi, how i can install again skype to my n900? @skype.com its not for free afaik and @store.ovi i cannot downloaded | 12:19 |
| X-Fade | abstract3d: It is on your device by default? | 12:21 |
| kerio | really? Symbian^3? | 12:22 |
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| kerio | :| | 12:22 |
| kerio | WHERE'S MEEGO | 12:22 |
| X-Fade | Not there yet :) | 12:22 |
| kerio | do you guys have a link to the video feed btw? | 12:23 |
| X-Fade | kerio: No :) It is already overloaded. | 12:23 |
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| kerio | aw | 12:23 |
| psycho_oreos | damn fans ;) | 12:23 |
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| TermanaDesire | Kerio - There's no meego announcements at nokia world | 12:29 |
| kerio | TermanaDesire: more to the point - wtf is nokia doing | 12:30 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer, did you ever find the /cmd to tell xchat to disable join/part messages? | 12:46 |
| lcuk | I saw it discussed the other day | 12:46 |
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| lcuk | I know theres no UX in settings for it | 12:46 |
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| mece | bäck | 12:52 |
| TermanaDesire | We didn't even notice you gone. :p kidding | 12:53 |
| mece | I'm sure you were all shocked and distressed by my absence :D | 12:54 |
| mece | hey nice: http://www.slideshare.net/rbarroca/redesign-nokia-ovi-store | 12:54 |
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| mece | that E7 does look pretty sleek I must say. I hope the upcoming meego phone will be as nice. | 12:55 |
| crashanddie | abstract3d: Skype is integrated in the N900's UI | 12:56 |
| crashanddie | abstract3d: there is no standalone application to install or run | 12:56 |
| mece | abstract3d, Skype is not installed if you bought your phone in India. | 12:56 |
| crashanddie | lol, really? | 12:56 |
| crashanddie | That sucks. | 12:56 |
| crashanddie | Indian government ftw! | 12:57 |
| mece | well you can simply install the global firmware to fix that though. | 12:57 |
| mece | now that is ftw :) | 12:57 |
| crashanddie | djeezus | 12:58 |
| crashanddie | Nokia needs to stop the suit culture | 12:58 |
| crashanddie | or at least make people wear nice suits | 12:58 |
| crashanddie | that guy looks like a financial director of the local bank | 12:58 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: It is a Voda guy. | 12:59 |
| TermanaDesire | He is. Are you paying attention? | 12:59 |
| nidO | you mean the vodafone guy? | 12:59 |
| TermanaDesire | :p | 12:59 |
| mece | my stream died. | 12:59 |
| crashanddie | mece: I probably stole your stream :P | 12:59 |
| SpeedEvil | stream? | 12:59 |
| * SpeedEvil woke up. | 12:59 | |
| nidO | nw2010 stream | 12:59 |
| SpeedEvil | url/ | 13:00 |
| nidO | http://events.nokia.com/nokiaworld/home.htm | 13:00 |
| nidO | vodafone guy just dribbling about ecosystems and communities atm tho | 13:00 |
| X-Fade | Hehe "We should reduce choice for the customer" :) | 13:00 |
| mece | oh.. I was looking at the other stream. this one works very well. | 13:00 |
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| mece | hmm apparently the keynotes did not appease the finnish stockholders. NOK down 1.2% | 13:02 |
| crashanddie | Vodafone is saying: "We'll probably use android in a couple years" | 13:02 |
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| crashanddie | "I'm enthusiastic, even though I look like I'm about to go hang myself." | 13:03 |
| SpeedEvil | crashanddie: enthusiastically | 13:03 |
| mece | LOL | 13:03 |
| mece | wtf is he on about?? | 13:04 |
| nidO | "doesnt indicate any intention other than a common intent" | 13:04 |
| nidO | nice. | 13:04 |
| crashanddie | mece: he's on drugs, apparently. Good stuff, too. | 13:04 |
| mece | hahahahahah | 13:04 |
| crashanddie | industry collaborations? | 13:05 |
| mece | oh man that E7 is pretty. Grr argh! | 13:05 |
| SpeedEvil | Who does he remind me of... | 13:05 |
| nidO | yer the e7's looking real nice | 13:05 |
| mece | Whyyyyy isn't it a meego phone. | 13:05 |
| SpeedEvil | because meego isn't ready. | 13:05 |
| mece | I know. | 13:05 |
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| mece | I want it to be. | 13:05 |
| mece | I like this guy. | 13:06 |
| crashanddie | This guy looks like the lovechild between steve jobs, terry wogan and steve ballmer. And then a bit of the gene pool of churchill. | 13:06 |
| mece | has an air of stephen fry about him, imo. | 13:06 |
| sharpneli | The bets are on. How likely it is that Nokia abandons Meego and moves to windows phone?-) | 13:06 |
| SpeedEvil | He doesn't look like he's going to hang himself. | 13:06 |
| mece | I'm going with no. | 13:06 |
| nidO | zero. ceo's from other businesses arent anything special. | 13:07 |
| crashanddie | sharpneli: lol, do you really want to be banned from this channel? | 13:07 |
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| SpeedEvil | Moving to android in acouple of years would not astonish me. | 13:07 |
| crashanddie | SpeedEvil++ | 13:07 |
| nidO | neh | 13:07 |
| mece | I have high hopes for meego. | 13:07 |
| sharpneli | crashanddie: Just spoke out my nightmares .D | 13:07 |
| SpeedEvil | mece: Me too. | 13:07 |
| crashanddie | sharpneli: then your nightmares are stupid, futile and illogical. | 13:08 |
| SpeedEvil | mece: But android has damn huge traction. | 13:08 |
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| mece | SpeedEvil, Well I suppose, but meego exists, so all is not lost. | 13:08 |
| sharpneli | crashanddie: Let us hope so. | 13:08 |
| SpeedEvil | This guy is saying insanely boring stuff, but it's great delivery. | 13:08 |
| mece | SpeedEvil exactly! | 13:08 |
| crashanddie | great delivery? | 13:08 |
| nidO | exactly. huge traction leads to huge userbase leads to becoming the predominant platform, leads to being the one that everyone criticizes and the one that people want "anything but.." | 13:08 |
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| mece | meego needs to compete with symbian too | 13:09 |
| SpeedEvil | I don't see iphone going away. I think android will eat some of windows and other devices share. | 13:09 |
| crashanddie | meego will ever compete with symbian | 13:09 |
| crashanddie | s/ever/never/ | 13:09 |
| infobot | crashanddie meant: meego will never compete with symbian | 13:09 |
| mece | LOOOL | 13:10 |
| mece | good end there :D | 13:10 |
| crashanddie | that was one dud of an ending | 13:10 |
| mece | it was funny | 13:10 |
| lcuk | "tea | 13:10 |
| nidO | all he needed was a bowler hat to go with that end. unsuprising lack of any laughs atall though | 13:10 |
| crashanddie | "meh" | 13:10 |
| lcuk | england and tea | 13:10 |
| mece | oh well. I liked that guy. Best speaker | 13:10 |
| lcuk | tea | 13:10 |
| lcuk | tea | 13:10 |
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| mece | lcuk, it was a joke... | 13:10 |
| * mece pats lcuk on the back saying "there there" | 13:11 | |
| * lcuk goes for a cup of tea | 13:11 | |
| SpeedEvil | mece: The most important thing to remember from this years nokia world is always to wear your wristband. | 13:11 |
| * SpeedEvil wonders if this wristband will run meego. | 13:11 | |
| mece | SpeedEvil, I'm not wearing mine!!! Omg! Zombies! RUUNN!!!!!! | 13:11 |
| * lcuk goes to coffee shop actually, but meh | 13:12 | |
| * SpeedEvil continues lying in bed, and catches up on email. | 13:12 | |
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| nidO | working sucks :( | 13:13 |
| lcuk | anyone know how long battery will take to charge via the plug | 13:13 |
| SpeedEvil | Not being able to work sucks. | 13:13 |
| lcuk | i normally use usb but needed a turbocharge | 13:13 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: To do what? | 13:13 |
| lcuk | to charge it | 13:14 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: To be fully charged - around a couple of hours | 13:14 |
| lcuk | it was wailing at me | 13:14 |
| mece | gaah. I want next weeks meego! | 13:14 |
| lcuk | and I want to be going out in ~10mins | 13:14 |
| mece | erm tomorrows I means | 13:14 |
| nidO | I find to fully charge from the wall is like 3 hours | 13:14 |
| nidO | from dead to full | 13:14 |
| SpeedEvil | It charges to 80% in maybe an hour. | 13:14 |
| mece | nidO, note that ... erm what SpeedEvil said., | 13:15 |
| nidO | hm hadnt seen that, was checking battery-eye | 13:15 |
| mece | typical lithium charging. fast while safe, and slowly creeping up to full. | 13:15 |
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| lcuk | ok ta, I will just leave it till I am ready to go and see where its upto | 13:16 |
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| mece | hey question | 13:28 |
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| mece | how is QtQuick related to QML? | 13:29 |
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| mece | ok got it. Thanks for the help :P | 13:35 |
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| mece | QML is the markup part of QtQuick FYI. | 13:35 |
| nidO | glad we could help :> | 13:36 |
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| MNZ | meh. mplayer -> alsa vs. mplayer -> PA mp3 playback is only about 10mA less. Translates to close to an hour of extra playback. Is it worth it :/ | 13:48 |
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| SpeedEvil | check mplayer - sox | 13:49 |
| SpeedEvil | I mean | 13:49 |
| SpeedEvil | mplayer - wav | 13:49 |
| SpeedEvil | see if it's the codec | 13:49 |
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| MNZ | gst -> PA vs mplayer -> PA is almost no difference. Nothing that could not be attributed to the error margin | 13:50 |
| kerio | MNZ: disabling PA is always worth it | 13:51 |
| kerio | if anything, because then you can actually use your n900 while listening to music | 13:51 |
| kerio | also i thought using hw decoding was much easier on the battery anyway | 13:52 |
| MNZ | kerio, apparently it's not that simple, there's a lot to consider | 13:52 |
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| MNZ | and they aren't doing audio on the DSP for a reason, as explained to me | 13:52 |
| kerio | what reason? | 13:52 |
| MNZ | basically that the DSP is good for huge chunks of data, but the savings for doing audio would be minuscule, if any | 13:53 |
| kerio | MNZ: it's still offloading from the cpu | 13:54 |
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| kerio | leaving it free for the user | 13:54 |
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| kerio | imo | 13:54 |
| MNZ | well, yeah. but I'm not going to be able to do audio dec on the DSP anyway. Way above my skill level | 13:54 |
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| kerio | well, i guess just removing PA will be enough | 13:55 |
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| MNZ | cpu usage is around 42% with PA and around 32% without. (using mplayer) | 13:57 |
| MNZ | with gst I'm not sure if all of PA's cpu usage will be gone (about 15-17%) because I have a feeling it's resampling as well and that may have to be done elsewhere | 13:58 |
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| MNZ | PA usage is at about 7-8% only when mplayer is using PA | 13:58 |
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| X-Fade | MNZ: Did you try Mohammad's SSU, or at least the updated PA packages? | 13:59 |
| MNZ | X-Fade, no, guess I should try them out now. | 13:59 |
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| X-Fade | They fixed some issues with stuttering etc. Might be good to see if it helps in cpu usage too. | 14:00 |
| MNZ | it's going to need kernel-power :S meh | 14:01 |
| MNZ | It's weird actually but I very rarely experience audio stutter. And I have more than once listened to music + web + xchat with no problems | 14:02 |
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| X-Fade | MNZ: I had it all the time. | 14:02 |
| MNZ | mp3s? | 14:02 |
| X-Fade | Yes. | 14:03 |
| abstract3d | crashanddie: i have deleted as i can remember :$ | 14:03 |
| abstract3d | skype | 14:03 |
| nidO | hm, it occurs to me the design of the e7 seems kinda bad for thumb typing | 14:05 |
| X-Fade | nidO: Why? | 14:05 |
| nidO | well having seen a video of it the lips on the left and right edges look really akward to get your thumb round - using both the e90 and n900 to thumb type my thumbs are always basically flat against the device | 14:06 |
| nidO | not possible with the e7 | 14:06 |
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| SpeedEvil | Where are these updated pa patches? | 14:08 |
| MNZ | SpeedEvil, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=60788 | 14:08 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 14:08 |
| MNZ | heh, with .wav mplayer starts at about 2% and drops to 0.7-1.3 for the rest of the playback | 14:08 |
| MNZ | and no PA | 14:09 |
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| SpeedEvil | Grrr. | 14:10 |
| SpeedEvil | I want fcam | 14:10 |
| SpeedEvil | So I need stock kernel. | 14:10 |
| SpeedEvil | meh | 14:10 |
| MNZ | mplayer wav -> PA: mplayer is at about 2% and PA at 7% | 14:10 |
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| nidO | didnt they fix fcam <> titans compatibility a while ago? | 14:10 |
| SpeedEvil | nope | 14:10 |
| SpeedEvil | well - not as of last week | 14:10 |
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| nidO | * Removed kernel-power-flasher as a conflict | 14:11 |
| nidO | * Removed blessn900 as a conflict (this was a bug in fcam) | 14:11 |
| nidO | * Now compiles a version for the power kernel and a version for | 14:11 |
| nidO | the vanilla kernel and packs them both into the same .deb | 14:11 |
| pigeon | anyone here actually at nokiaworld? | 14:13 |
| SpeedEvil | nidO: Is this the version intherepos? | 14:13 |
| nidO | yeah, was uploaded a month ago, and promoted to extras on 8th september | 14:13 |
| nidO | 1.0.6-1 | 14:14 |
| SpeedEvil | Well - wasn't working as of a week ago | 14:15 |
| * SpeedEvil ponders trying again. | 14:15 | |
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| tybollt | hmm | 14:16 |
| tybollt | still no ovi contacts for the N900? At the rate meegoo is developing I suppose it'll never happen.. sigh... | 14:17 |
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| kerio | SpeedEvil: there's fcam-drivers for the power kernel | 14:24 |
| mece | tybollt, what's ovi contacts? | 14:24 |
| tybollt | the killer app that was available to all Nokia-phones (but the N900). | 14:26 |
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| sejo | how do I reset the data counter (personal data widget) | 14:33 |
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| SpeedEvil | sejo: I asked this yestrerday.... | 14:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Aha | 14:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Settings -> phone | 14:37 |
| SpeedEvil | Then click on 'home/roaming data counter' | 14:37 |
| SpeedEvil | and you can resert it tehre | 14:37 |
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| sejo | ach cool | 14:40 |
| sejo | thx | 14:40 |
| seif | hey guys | 14:41 |
| kerio | what killer app? | 14:41 |
| kerio | SpeedEvil: what happens to my battery if i leave bluetooth on? | 14:41 |
| lcuk | virtual chainsaw app | 14:41 |
| kerio | lcuk: make a liqchainsaw | 14:42 |
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| lcuk | that would be messy | 14:42 |
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| ShadowJK | just having bluetooth on is an effect small enough that it's hard to measure, I think | 14:43 |
| kerio | on and invisible | 14:43 |
| kerio | so there's not even the periodical transmission of the beacon or whatever it's called | 14:44 |
| crashanddie | lol at nokia wanting to say "our developer community is becoming more diverse", but it sounded like "becoming more divorced" | 14:44 |
| seif | ok any nokia devs here | 14:44 |
| seif | how do i subscribe to photo taken events :) | 14:44 |
| SpeedEvil | kerio: on but idle - almost nothign | 14:44 |
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| kerio | so autodisconnect on bluetooth is useless | 14:44 |
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| ShadowJK | if they're polling for connections to decide when to shut down bluetooth, it's damn easy to make the software eat more power on the cpu than idle bluetooth | 14:46 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lcuk: (xchat join/quit) sorry? there's of course a GUI interface to set this property | 14:46 |
| lcuk | hmm DocScrutinizer51 i couldnt find it when I looked | 14:46 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | still looking? | 14:46 |
| lcuk | can you take a snapshot, my xchat enabled device is all the way downstairs | 14:46 |
| lcuk | and I am trying to eat a bowl of rice | 14:47 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | now a snapshot is really difficult | 14:47 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | it's in chan tab contextmenu | 14:47 |
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| lcuk | battery mostly charged btw | 14:49 |
| lcuk | just took it off from downstairs charger and theres only ~1pixel from top | 14:50 |
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| TermanaDesire | Best way to measure remaining battery life | 14:56 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer51, not seeing it | 14:59 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lcuk: btw in my xchat there's a bug that doesn't allow context menu when you select chanswitcher switcher-type tree | 14:59 |
| lcuk | TermanaDesire, see the script that felipec uses here, developed right here by (afaik) ShadowJK DocScrutinizer51 and SpeedEvil and others http://felipec.wordpress.com/2010/09/14/gst-av-0-3-better-performance-for-vorbis-and-mp3/ | 15:00 |
| lcuk | (i hope I got the names right :P) | 15:00 |
| lcuk | \o/ huzzah, @nokia aired my question | 15:01 |
| lcuk | https://twitter.com/nokia/status/24468860277 https://twitter.com/nokia/status/24468922825 | 15:02 |
| felipec | lcuk: I don't think it was DocScrutinizer, but I can't find nick | 15:02 |
| lcuk | felipec, doc has certainly been here talking with the guys | 15:02 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | eh? | 15:03 |
| lcuk | they have been getting into the low level nitty gritty on a regular basis | 15:03 |
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| lcuk | DocScrutinizer51, you and the battery script discussions | 15:03 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | ooh the bq27k readout ? | 15:03 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | well very first script probably was the one mentioned in | 15:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | ~batteryfaq | 15:04 |
| infobot | methinks batteryfaq is http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Battery_Questions_and_Answers | 15:04 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | for FR | 15:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | the one now usually used was done by shadowjk | 15:05 |
| felipec | lcuk: ok, updated the post | 15:07 |
| TermanaDesire | Lcuk - there was suppose to be a second sentence with what I said it was apart of a joke. Guess it didn't send for some reason | 15:07 |
| TermanaDesire | Thanks anyway :p | 15:07 |
| chibi-taiga | still wierd, my n900 dont wannaconnect to my tp link router | 15:09 |
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| chibi-taiga | and i changed it to b g only | 15:10 |
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| mece | oh wow.. there's the qmlviewer for N900.. which means I can hack qml stuff on device! | 15:26 |
| mece | which is awesome. | 15:26 |
| mece | oh.. only 54 megs of libraries to download. | 15:27 |
| mece | sigh | 15:27 |
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| MohammadAG51 | probably to / :P | 15:28 |
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| mece | does qt -experimental go to /? | 15:28 |
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| lcuk | mece, alterego has been hacking with qml for a while | 15:28 |
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| mece | lcuk, yeah. I just never realized I could do it on device. | 15:29 |
| lcuk | heh | 15:29 |
| lcuk | if not for on device, then whats it for :P | 15:29 |
| mece | without compiling and whatnot. | 15:29 |
| mece | yeah :) | 15:29 |
| mece | didn't go to / at least :) | 15:30 |
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| Khertan_ | mece: be carreful with experimental ... pyqt experimental conflict with python2.5-qt4* | 15:31 |
| Khertan_ | :) | 15:32 |
| lopz | hi :) | 15:33 |
| mece | how does one launch a qml then? | 15:34 |
| ccooke_ | Afternoon, all | 15:34 |
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| lolloo | afternoon | 15:36 |
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| mece | ah found it. | 15:37 |
| mece | /opt/qt4-maemo5/bin/qmlviewer | 15:37 |
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| mece | Weeeeee! It works :D:D | 15:38 |
| mece | Khertan_, can I make khteditor launch qmlviewer? | 15:38 |
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| DocScrutinizer51 | mece: where's the problen? | 15:43 |
| mece | DocScrutinizer51, no problem. Just that khteditor doesn't launch qml files with qmlviewer, and highlighting doesn't work. infact it gets stuck. | 15:45 |
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| DocScrutinizer | mece: aren't there several system() and dbus launch calls to implement what you ask for? | 15:47 |
| mece | DocScrutinizer, I have no idea what you're talking about. I just do /opt/qt4-maemo5/bin/qmlviewer text.wml -fullscreen | 15:49 |
| lcuk | mece, Khertan_ is having some issues with the highlighting, he has stressed about it during last couple of weeks afaik | 15:50 |
| mece | figured one could make khteditor do the same | 15:50 |
| mece | lcuk, ok. Works fine with py stuff though. | 15:50 |
| lcuk | it should be able to, see what he says when he gets back | 15:50 |
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| lcuk | yeah, the old gtk highlighter used to work over lots of languages afaik | 15:50 |
| lcuk | i used to use it for c | 15:51 |
| mece | lcuk, ok. khteditor is just so smooth and fast that everything else is just annoying :) | 15:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | mece: maybe your lack of understanding what I'm talking bout is related to my lack similarly about "can I make khteditor launch qmlviewer". I read that as "can app A start app B" | 15:51 |
| lcuk | sure mece | 15:51 |
| mece | DocScrutinizer, okay :) I'm glad we understand eachother then. Either way it's not really an issue. I don't mind launching from xterm. | 15:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | mece: :-D | 15:54 |
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| MNZ | DocScrutinizer, did you see my power measurements for mplayer with/without PA? | 16:25 |
| DocScrutinizer | MNZ: nope | 16:27 |
| DocScrutinizer | o.O | 16:28 |
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| MNZ | basically it's a difference of 10mA | 16:28 |
| DocScrutinizer | friggin lot | 16:28 |
| MNZ | translating to about 1hr of extra playback | 16:28 |
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| MNZ | AND mplayer -> PA is approx same as gst -> PA in terms of total usage | 16:29 |
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| MNZ | but PA cpu usage is significantly less for mplayer -> PA. But at the same time, mplayer usage makes up for the cut in PA usage | 16:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | errr, 1320mAh / (x hours * y mA) = 132mAh / ( x+1 hours * y-10 mA) - please solve that for me :-P | 16:30 |
| DocScrutinizer | s/132m/1320m/ | 16:30 |
| infobot | DocScrutinizer meant: errr, 1320mAh / (x hours * y mA) = 1320mAh / ( x+1 hours * y-10 mA) - please solve that for me :-P | 16:30 |
| MNZ | what I did was more like: 1.4/0.085 - 1.4/0.075 :D | 16:31 |
| DocScrutinizer | IOW: how much hours of playback are you assuming with and without PA? | 16:32 |
| MNZ | mplayer -> PA = approx 16 hours (screen off of course) | 16:32 |
| X-Fade | Default mediaplayer usage gives about 20 hours. | 16:32 |
| MNZ | without PA it's about 18 hours, so two more not one | 16:33 |
| DocScrutinizer | :nod: | 16:33 |
| MNZ | actually, this is with measuring with powerscript running and outputting to console | 16:33 |
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| MNZ | so there's wifi involved | 16:33 |
| MNZ | probably as X-Fade said, it's more | 16:33 |
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| MNZ | I haven't tested with the new PA patches, mostly because it involves installing kernel-power | 16:34 |
| MNZ | mplayer wav -> PA is ~1% cpu btw, while w/PA it's ~2 + 8% PA. Which is friggin weird. And I still cannot figure out why PA usage is waaay higher when it's gst accessing it | 16:37 |
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| X-Fade | MNZ: headphone output? | 16:39 |
| X-Fade | MNZ: Or speakers? | 16:40 |
| MNZ | X-Fade, headphone. With speakers there's the added punch of a highpass filter | 16:40 |
| X-Fade | Yes, just wanted to make sure you noticed that :) | 16:40 |
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| pigeon | so, i assume source for /usr/lib/libGLES_CM.so isn't available for the n900... | 16:43 |
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| MohammadAG | crashanddie, ping? | 17:03 |
| jacekowski | MohammadAG: i think i may have what you need | 17:04 |
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| DangerMaus | hmmm intersting the modem stays conencted while on the phone | 17:07 |
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| SpeedEvil | On 3G, it can | 17:08 |
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| crashanddie | MohammadAG: pong | 17:09 |
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| DangerMaus | 3.5 where im at atm | 17:11 |
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| seif | guys | 17:20 |
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| seif | i installed python-telepathy last night on the mameo | 17:20 |
| seif | and ever since i cant recieve calls | 17:20 |
| seif | i only get a "missed call" alert | 17:21 |
| DangerMaus | heh | 17:21 |
| MohammadAG | then...uninstall it? | 17:24 |
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| RST38h | http://gizmodo.com/5637551/is-steve-jobs-a-closet-ninja | 17:28 |
| RST38h | Yes, yesssss | 17:28 |
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| crashanddie | WE WERE RIGHT, BITCHES. | 17:37 |
| crashanddie | going for a fag | 17:37 |
| crashanddie | 'later | 17:37 |
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| jacekowski | who's the bitch? | 17:47 |
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| toggles_1 | Cheers | 17:56 |
| GAN900 | Nokia is still full of fools. | 17:58 |
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| GAN900 | It's embarrassing when your big yearly event is filled with last year's tech. | 17:59 |
| Lynoure | GAN900: you are there now? | 17:59 |
| GAN900 | Lynoure, no. | 18:00 |
| GAN900 | Jaffa went | 18:00 |
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| MohammadAG | GAN900, new display isn't old, the rest... well | 18:02 |
| MohammadAG | meh | 18:02 |
| jacekowski | n8? | 18:03 |
| Shapeshifter | isn't it possible to make the calendar NOT add an alarm to every event you create? | 18:03 |
| MohammadAG | E7 | 18:04 |
| Shapeshifter | annoying as hell | 18:04 |
| MohammadAG | C6-01 | 18:04 |
| MohammadAG | C7 | 18:04 |
| Noma | GAN900: last year's tech? N8 has camera that no other device has and the ClearBlack Display has been told to be better than Super AMOLED for example | 18:04 |
| * RST38h shrugs | 18:05 | |
| Lynoure | N8 camera makes me weep when shopping for a high-zoom compact digital camera | 18:05 |
| jacekowski | Noma: still worse than my compact camera | 18:05 |
| ShadowJK | I bet that camera is noisier than any other camera :) | 18:05 |
| RST38h | It is a Symbian device. We know these. | 18:05 |
| ShadowJK | yeah... | 18:05 |
| RST38h | And yes, a noisy little pinhole camera is just that, no matter how many mpx | 18:05 |
| Lynoure | Because I want a plain camera, but hard to find one that would have sensor even close to the one N8 has. | 18:05 |
| ShadowJK | I gues symbian would be fine if they could make OpenC work, and add a posixy-bsd-ish layer too, so you could actually run apps you need :/ | 18:05 |
| jacekowski | Lynoure: so? | 18:06 |
| ieatlint | ah geek conferences... where everyone sits around awkwardly without saying a word to each other | 18:06 |
| RST38h | Lynoure: Canon S95 | 18:06 |
| jacekowski | Lynoure: it's not about sensor | 18:06 |
| Lynoure | jacekowski: partially it is. | 18:06 |
| jacekowski | Lynoure: it's not about sensor for last 4 years | 18:06 |
| Lynoure | jacekowski: would be nice to have all. | 18:06 |
| jacekowski | optics is now the problem | 18:06 |
| jacekowski | but you can't fix that without making it bigger | 18:06 |
| Shapeshifter | ieatlint: add beer. | 18:06 |
| MohammadAG | ieatlint, lol | 18:06 |
| Lynoure | jacekowski: that's not what my friends who are into photography say... | 18:06 |
| ieatlint | Shapeshifter: that comes later, it's 8am | 18:06 |
| Shapeshifter | oh | 18:07 |
| Lynoure | jacekowski: easy enough to find decent lenses even in compact cameras. (not phone cameras, though) | 18:07 |
| RST38h | Lynoure: I am not sure what you are smoking but N8 camera is 1) no zoom 2) no optical resolution and 3) noise | 18:07 |
| Shapeshifter | that's early for any conference to show up to | 18:07 |
| MohammadAG | Lynoure, being into something != being a pro about it | 18:07 |
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| RST38h | In other words, it is a typical smartphone camera | 18:07 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: you've obviously never been to the maemo summit? | 18:07 |
| MohammadAG | I was into linux three/four years ago | 18:07 |
| Lynoure | RST38h: I'm not smoking anything, I'm coveting the sensor and only the sensor | 18:07 |
| ieatlint | yeah, well, blame intel/nokia | 18:07 |
| hrw | ~curse some maemo devs for not following http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/ar01s02.html | 18:07 |
| infobot | May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, some maemo devs for not following http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/ar01s02.html ! | 18:07 |
| * MohammadAG wants another maemo summit | 18:07 | |
| RST38h | Lynoure: What is the diagonal size of that sensor you are "coveting"? | 18:08 |
| ieatlint | am at a meego dev day | 18:08 |
| crashanddie | that doesn't answer my question | 18:08 |
| ieatlint | and nope, never been to a maemo summit | 18:08 |
| Lynoure | MohammadAG: _pro_(getting paid for it) photographers do not care much for compact cameras anyway. | 18:08 |
| crashanddie | I've rarely seen as much inter-communication as at the maemo summit | 18:08 |
| crashanddie | Lynoure: sorry? | 18:08 |
| MohammadAG | Lynoure, which is why a DSLR mops the floor with an N8 | 18:08 |
| Lynoure | RST38h: 1/1.83” | 18:08 |
| crashanddie | Lynoure: I've sold quite a few pictures (thus by your standards, qualify as a pro), and my favourite camera is an LX3 | 18:08 |
| MohammadAG | even if both are 12MPs | 18:08 |
| ieatlint | i'm mostly joking, heh.. have actually seen a lot of communication at conferences | 18:08 |
| crashanddie | ieatlint: oh, ok. sorry | 18:09 |
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| Shapeshifter | crashanddie is not fooling around | 18:09 |
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| Lynoure | RST38h: most compacts still have 1/>2" | 18:09 |
| Lynoure | or, actually, all I've seen. | 18:09 |
| Shapeshifter | s/not/never/ | 18:10 |
| crashanddie | Lynoure: I do have two 40ds with the wide-portrait lens and the the tele, but the lx3 is by far the camera I get the best pictures with (in terms of spontaneity of the subjects) | 18:10 |
| RST38h | Lynoure: Good. And, if I understand correctly, the entire camera package is what, 5mm thick? | 18:11 |
| crashanddie | and as long as we're not talking low light, quality wise we're not far off the mark either | 18:11 |
| Lynoure | MohammadAG: like I said, I only covet the sensor. I have 0 interest in phone cameras | 18:11 |
| Lynoure | RST38h: see above about coveting and stuff :) | 18:11 |
| Shapeshifter | I wouldn't mind a smartphone being as large as a compact camera, if its as good as a compact camera | 18:11 |
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| ieatlint | the best thing about this so far, is that an awesome irish pub is across the street | 18:12 |
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| RST38h | Lynoure: it is notclear why would anyone "covet" a sensor alone, sans the rest of the package | 18:12 |
| RST38h | there is not much you can do with the sensor | 18:12 |
| RST38h | Shapeshifter: Casio. | 18:13 |
| hrw | tracker-cfg and currencyconverter have broken .desktop files | 18:13 |
| Lynoure | RST38h: I'd like to see good sensors in compact cameras... but so far manufacturers are not bothering | 18:13 |
| zap | Anybody knows what to do if all my icons somehow got broken? I mean, I enter the app menu and I don't see any icons... | 18:13 |
| RST38h | Shapeshifter: They have got an Exilim that is also a cell phone. And they are not very bad cameras for their size/cost | 18:13 |
| RST38h | Lynoure: And you are wondering if it is a conspiracy, right? :) | 18:13 |
| zap | /usr/bin/gtk-update-icon-cache is a empty script, anybody knows if this is normal? | 18:14 |
| Shapeshifter | My favourite compact still is the Sony DSC-P200. such great pictures, all manual controls that actually do something and good grip | 18:14 |
| RST38h | Laws of Physics vs. Wannabe Cellphone Photographers, Part Deux | 18:14 |
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| Lynoure | RST38h: gosh you are belligerent today | 18:14 |
| RST38h | Not today, *always* :) | 18:14 |
| RST38h | "British teenager Luke Angel has been banned from the US for sending an email to the White House calling President Obama an obscenity. The 17-year-old says he was drunk when he sent the mail and doesn't understand what the big deal is." | 18:15 |
| RST38h | Ehehehe | 18:16 |
| Shapeshifter | U S A, U S A amirite? | 18:17 |
| Lynoure | RST38h: I don't think it's a conspiracy, I think most people using compact cameras are still mostly people taking photos of their kids on a sunny beach. Thus does not make sense. | 18:17 |
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| RST38h | Lynoure: It does not make sense for other, more funamental reasons | 18:19 |
| RST38h | Lynoure: One of which is that having a bigger sensor requires a bigger optics package | 18:19 |
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| RST38h | Lynoure: So does real, optical zoom | 18:19 |
| RST38h | Or any decent optics that do not resemble a pinhole camera | 18:20 |
| RST38h | For a reference check N93 and N93i, these have real cameras | 18:20 |
| Shapeshifter | I thought about buying a new compact but when I read reviews and looked at all the sample pictures, my DSC-P200 still seemed superior. I'm not sure if they fixed it now but a year ago they just cared about MPXs shoving them onto miniature sensors making all blurry, noise-reduction-damaged pictures | 18:20 |
| Shapeshifter | 7MPX always seemed like enough | 18:21 |
| crashanddie | 3MPx is enough for most uses | 18:21 |
| Shapeshifter | true | 18:21 |
| RST38h | As long as you are only publishing these photos to the web, yes | 18:21 |
| zokier | at least canon has actually lowered their mpx count, and I think than nikon did that too | 18:22 |
| crashanddie | which includes: most uses | 18:22 |
| RST38h | For prints, 3mpx is kinda low | 18:22 |
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| crashanddie | RST38h: heck, evene 3mpx timelapse is enough for 1080p HD | 18:22 |
| Shapeshifter | as long as you're not printing them on huge fine-printed posters | 18:22 |
| RST38h | standard prints too | 18:22 |
| crashanddie | no | 18:22 |
| RST38h | you want 5-6mpx for prints | 18:22 |
| crashanddie | standard print goes perfectly for 3mpx | 18:22 |
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| Shapeshifter | ah. so I said 7, thought you were answering to my number | 18:23 |
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| RST38h | btw, has there been a nokiaworld keynote already? what'sup? | 18:24 |
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| yannux | someone know this building error ? http://pastebin.com/dbxV3NZH | 18:25 |
| VenemoN900 | Hey guys | 18:25 |
| VenemoN900 | yannux: what error? | 18:26 |
| RST38h | yannux: apt-get install mce-dev | 18:26 |
| RST38h | yannux: inside sb of course | 18:26 |
| yannux | get from maemo builders | 18:26 |
| yannux | https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/vlc-remote_0.6-1/armel.build.log.FAILED.txt | 18:26 |
| MohammadAG | shove it in build-depends | 18:27 |
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| MohammadAG | Build-Depends: mce-dev int he control file | 18:27 |
| MohammadAG | source section | 18:28 |
| MohammadAG | in the* | 18:28 |
| yannux | ok i've just understand, trying that | 18:28 |
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| yannux | is there a command to know what we need to put in Build-depends ? | 18:29 |
| hrw | http://maemo.org/packages/view/currencyconverter/ is not maintained anymore in extras as it is now paid app in ovi store. what are rules for making non-maintainer upload with small bugfix? | 18:29 |
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| lcuk | hrw I haven't seen the specific rules - X-Fade may know specifically? | 18:30 |
| MohammadAG | hrw, I usually keep the maintainer field the same, but add my name in debian/changelog | 18:31 |
| MohammadAG | as I did for fmrdsnotify | 18:31 |
| VenemoN900 | hrw, if it is open source, then I guess there is no problem with it | 18:31 |
| VenemoN900 | ask X-Fade for details | 18:31 |
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| hrw | X-Fade: what is your opinion? | 18:34 |
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| javispedro | moo | 18:37 |
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| javispedro | "Nokia hires Peter Skillman, former Palm Design VP, as MeeGo user experience chief" | 18:37 |
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| yannux | MohammadAG: thanks, building OK :) | 18:38 |
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| RST38h | javispedro: No file system. 64000-byte limit on the apps. | 18:38 |
| RST38h | javispedro: Start praying now. =) | 18:38 |
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| * javispedro has fond memories of the 64k resource limit | 18:39 | |
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| javispedro | Now you know why the multitasking poll | 18:41 |
| RST38h | yesss | 18:42 |
| javispedro | Nokia is planning to kill multitasking, palmos style!! | 18:42 |
| RST38h | javospedro: funny thing is, I do not think it is a joke | 18:42 |
| RST38h | javispedro: next stop: HTML5/CSS based UI! | 18:42 |
| javispedro | ah, webos. if only it was js alone | 18:43 |
| Noma | Maemo 5's UI is partially HTML and CSS based already | 18:43 |
| crashanddie | holy fucking crap | 18:43 |
| Noma | for example the messaging application | 18:43 |
| javispedro | it is a mix of java, javascript, html5, css, and some native code | 18:43 |
| crashanddie | people moaning about sliced bread being sliced into an odd number of slices... | 18:43 |
| RST38h | ahhaha | 18:43 |
| RST38h | javispedro: however you slice it, the end of the world is coming. | 18:44 |
| RST38h | javispedro: I am sure they will have to drop Qt now! =)~ | 18:44 |
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| Khertan_ | does there is problem with maemo extras assistant ? garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/ give me a 404 | 18:44 |
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| RST38h | javispedro: Skip on Harmattan (who needs it anyway) and produce a whole new JS-based device at the end of 2011! | 18:45 |
| javispedro | Khertan_: works here | 18:45 |
| Khertan_ | javispedro: lol the 32k limit you mean about the palm os binary limit :) | 18:46 |
| Khertan_ | javispedro: thx | 18:46 |
| javispedro | Khertan_: https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/ | 18:46 |
| javispedro | Khertan_: 32k is short jump limit | 18:46 |
| MohammadAG | https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/ wfm | 18:46 |
| javispedro | resource/database record limit is 64k (actually 64000, not 64KiB) | 18:46 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: I always wonder why they didn't bid on palm ;) | 18:47 |
| Khertan_ | javispedro: yes database limit ... i was more worried about the 32k jump limit | 18:47 |
| javispedro | you made quite long "if" branches, then :) | 18:48 |
| * MohammadAG has a suggestion | 18:48 | |
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| MohammadAG | separate maemo from nokia | 18:48 |
| MohammadAG | make it a standalone project | 18:48 |
| Khertan_ | http://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/ give a 404 error and https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/ is ok ... funny :) | 18:48 |
| MNZ | isn't that what meego is for :D ? | 18:48 |
| javispedro | MohammadAG: nobody really wants maemo the distro | 18:49 |
| javispedro | people want Hildon the UI | 18:49 |
| Khertan_ | javispedro: yep ... but trying to port a scripting language mean long if branch :) | 18:49 |
| MohammadAG | I said maemo, not some RPM based crap | 18:49 |
| Khertan_ | javispedro: this is what stop me to port python to palm os :) | 18:49 |
| MohammadAG | I like the idea of full OSS, but RPM is... crap | 18:49 |
| javispedro | Khertan_: heh :) | 18:49 |
| javispedro | Khertan_: there was a port iirc, but they removed quite a lot of stuff from the interpreter | 18:49 |
| MohammadAG | >>> EOF | 18:49 |
| crashanddie | LMAO | 18:50 |
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| crashanddie | finally got my blackberry | 18:50 |
| Khertan_ | javispedro: i'll not call that a port :) | 18:50 |
| Khertan_ | crashanddie: lol | 18:50 |
| crashanddie | had been using everything with the same SIM card on the N900 | 18:50 |
| crashanddie | skype, google talk, imap, the lot | 18:50 |
| * RST38h checked out the NokiaWorld keynote | 18:50 | |
| crashanddie | put it in the crackberry, nothing works | 18:50 |
| SpeedEvil | I love blackberries. | 18:50 |
| crashanddie | phone works, but no internet, nothing | 18:50 |
| RST38h | No,these guys are no Steve Jobses... | 18:50 |
| SpeedEvil | I got about a kilo from bushes by a path the other day. | 18:50 |
| crashanddie | turns out, the line is configured for iPhone | 18:50 |
| javispedro | RST38h: let me guess. Symbian phone, symbian phone and ... wait for it .. yet another symbian phone. | 18:51 |
| crashanddie | which prevents blackberry services to function properly | 18:51 |
| Khertan_ | crashanddie: of course you didn't paid for the "blackberry option" | 18:51 |
| Khertan_ | :) | 18:51 |
| RST38h | javispedro: "YOu can share a photo you have just taken! Imagine that!" | 18:51 |
| * MohammadAG buys an iPhone | 18:51 | |
| MohammadAG | what else can I do? | 18:51 |
| Khertan_ | symbian sucks | 18:51 |
| Khertan_ | :) | 18:51 |
| RST38h | javispedro: "Features no longer sell phones. Price sells phones!" | 18:51 |
| javispedro | pirates! sharing photos is for piratees!! | 18:51 |
| Khertan_ | sorry it s must go out | 18:51 |
| RST38h | javispedro: "C7! It is sleek!" | 18:52 |
| MohammadAG | javispedro, right, right, and... wait for it... right | 18:52 |
| MohammadAG | javispedro, nah, we have transmission for that | 18:52 |
| Khertan_ | good evening | 18:52 |
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| RST38h | And they are presenting 4 Symbian phones that (surprise!) look almost exactly the same and run the same software | 18:53 |
| MohammadAG | 4? | 18:53 |
| MohammadAG | hmm | 18:53 |
| MohammadAG | E7, C6-01, C7 | 18:53 |
| MohammadAG | did I miss another one? | 18:54 |
| javispedro | but but but one runs Symbian Enterprisey edition! | 18:54 |
| SpeedEvil | I actually want a more agressive sharing plugin | 18:54 |
| RST38h | E8 | 18:54 |
| nidO | he probably includes the n8 for some reason | 18:54 |
| MohammadAG | wtf | 18:54 |
| MohammadAG | E8? | 18:54 |
| RST38h | N8 sorry | 18:54 |
| SpeedEvil | open shutter -> take pic -> close shutter -> autoshare | 18:54 |
| nidO | n8 was not presented today | 18:54 |
| RST38h | rrrrrrrevolutionary! | 18:54 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, that's nothing new :P | 18:54 |
| * RST38h likes the way he says rrrrrrrevolutionary | 18:55 | |
| RST38h | Mohammad: Well, the NokiaWorld2010 site shows a huge N8 showing videos | 18:55 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: and pretty much nothing else | 18:55 |
| nidO | exactly, you wouldnt use the model of a device you havent introduced yet because the introduction's that day, to show videos of them introducing said device | 18:56 |
| nidO | would they | 18:56 |
| javispedro | http://events.nokia.com/nokiaworld/home.htm | 18:56 |
| javispedro | check it, it does show 4 phones | 18:56 |
| RST38h | So, cutting the crap, no mention ofMaemo or Meego so far? | 18:56 |
| javispedro | (right on the js-based slow slider) | 18:56 |
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| RST38h | This guy looks ridiculous :( | 18:57 |
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| SpeedEvil | Odd - I see no feed on the above page | 18:57 |
| SpeedEvil | Is it still ongoing? | 18:57 |
| RST38h | He should stop copying Jobs, he is no Jobs=( | 18:57 |
| RST38h | http://events.nokia.com/nokiaworld/home.htm | 18:58 |
| javispedro | offering a set of identical-looking phones with similar feature sets is not exactly what I think is going to kill Jobs. | 18:59 |
| RST38h | Nothing (other than cancer) is going to kill Jobs. | 18:59 |
| * javispedro wonders if they all have capactivie screen | 19:00 | |
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| RST38h | Right now, Nokia should be happy if it manages to kill RIM | 19:00 |
| SpeedEvil | Odd - still no video. | 19:00 |
| RST38h | Chances for which are pretty low anyway =( | 19:00 |
| MohammadAG | isn't RIM already dead? | 19:00 |
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| RST38h | Maybe in .IL, but not in the US | 19:01 |
| ShadowJK | They all run the same software, but even so, the next useful-looking tiny app that comes out of Nokia is for some unexplainable reason only going to work on half of them? :-) | 19:01 |
| RST38h | They are providers of "secure, ubiquitous business email" | 19:01 |
| SpeedEvil | TERRORISTS! | 19:01 |
| SpeedEvil | Only terrorists want secure email. | 19:01 |
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| RST38h | SpeedEvil: Well,you should ask Arkenoi about the "secure" part. He says it is pure snake oil | 19:02 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: None of the suits ever bother to check what "secure" means for RIM ;) | 19:02 |
| SpeedEvil | dunno - not investigated. | 19:02 |
| MohammadAG | tbh | 19:02 |
| kerio | if you use strong crypto, you're a terrorist | 19:02 |
| SpeedEvil | I was under the impression you could have a secure server controlled by your company | 19:02 |
| kerio | it's proven | 19:02 |
| MohammadAG | BBs and iPhones fail over here :P | 19:02 |
| MohammadAG | most people use Symbian | 19:02 |
| kerio | why wouldn't you want your government spying on you otherwise | 19:03 |
| ShadowJK | ugh, forum nokia... | 19:03 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: I am sure it is the sand getting in =) | 19:03 |
| MohammadAG | some admin at my school sold his iPhone and got an N900 (sigh) | 19:03 |
| javispedro | ShadowJK: so far completely worthless. | 19:03 |
| DangerMaus | prob hand the crypt to the nsa or gov to go snooping | 19:03 |
| RST38h | Mohammad: Or the lack of bacon! | 19:03 |
| kerio | BACON | 19:03 |
| MohammadAG | bacon indeed xD | 19:03 |
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| DangerMaus | bacon bacon yumyum | 19:04 |
| MNZ | BBs are the shit with all the trendy folks here, the rest of the populace use symbian, with less than one percent probably using samsung/etc. I think I'm the only N900 in a few 100km radius | 19:04 |
| ShadowJK | javispedro, no I was trying to access forum nokia to get specs on these new things, and the site is kinda b0rked | 19:04 |
| javispedro | ShadowJK: if you get to know if any of them is resistive please tell | 19:04 |
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| SpeedEvil | is the video borked for anyone else? | 19:04 |
| ShadowJK | C6 probably is. A guy at work has one | 19:04 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: No,just you. you have been naughty again! | 19:04 |
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| ShadowJK | We had a really tough time to determine whether it was resistive or not, btw | 19:05 |
| javispedro | if _at least_ _ONE_ of the identical-looking phones is resistive in a sea of capacitive screens, well. | 19:05 |
| javispedro | ShadowJK: you don't have a stylus nearby? | 19:05 |
| ShadowJK | it didn't come with one | 19:05 |
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| ShadowJK | but the screen worked with a pen, so.. | 19:05 |
| javispedro | bad vibe | 19:05 |
| javispedro | if it works with a pen it's resistive. | 19:05 |
| SpeedEvil | There is a perceptible springiness to a resistive screen | 19:06 |
| SpeedEvil | the screen indents by 0.1mm or so | 19:06 |
| MohammadAG | just wear a glove or 10 | 19:06 |
| ShadowJK | Oh wait, I think his was a C6-00 and this new one is C6-01? I wonder what hte difference is | 19:06 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Different phones | 19:06 |
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| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, oh we couldn't find it.. or rather, you stop pressing once it reacts, and it reacted instantly.. | 19:07 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - reflect a distant scene off the touchscreen | 19:07 |
| MohammadAG | like the X3 and the X3-02 | 19:07 |
| SpeedEvil | and you can see the indent | 19:07 |
| javispedro | Yet another identical-looking phone with similar feature set | 19:07 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Some bright light at Nokia decided that this naming convention will make it easier for customers | 19:07 |
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| nidO | the c6-01 is capacitive | 19:07 |
| MohammadAG | Nokia's losing it hardware-wise | 19:07 |
| ShadowJK | oh god, why the hell do they have different phones with same name? wtf? | 19:07 |
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| MohammadAG | they're doing it the apple way | 19:07 |
| MohammadAG | old hardware in new devices | 19:07 |
| javispedro | the also sell the same phone with different names | 19:07 |
| javispedro | *they | 19:07 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Because the bright light said "why do we have all these numbers, let us have no more than 10 models in each category, with bigger numbers being better" | 19:08 |
| MohammadAG | the iPhone 2G was lulz | 19:08 |
| MohammadAG | 2MP cam, no 3G, shitty specs overall | 19:08 |
| MohammadAG | but it worked | 19:08 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: That light has been too bright to consider what happens when new phones come out and the name space gets clobbered | 19:08 |
| ShadowJK | hah, "Display Touch Technology" is "-" on C6-01, N8, E7-00, but "Resistive single touch" on C6-00 | 19:08 |
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| MohammadAG | Capacitive on all 3 afaik | 19:08 |
| javispedro | kik | 19:09 |
| nidO | no, the c6-01 specs on nokia clearly state a capacitive amoled screen | 19:09 |
| javispedro | lol | 19:09 |
| javispedro | so all of the phones ara capacitive low res screens. so much for choice. | 19:09 |
| MohammadAG | Symbian^3 needs multitouch | 19:09 |
| MohammadAG | at least for Nokia's apps | 19:09 |
| SpeedEvil | Haha. | 19:09 |
| MohammadAG | javispedro, symbian has always been 640x360 on touch devices | 19:10 |
| SpeedEvil | Nokiaworld live webstream. | 19:10 |
| javispedro | what Symbian^3 truly need is insanity. a sane user cannot live with it. | 19:10 |
| SpeedEvil | Fails on n900 with 'latest flash needed' | 19:10 |
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| MohammadAG | ROFL | 19:10 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, lol, but that into bmo just for the laughs | 19:10 |
| MohammadAG | fake flash version | 19:10 |
| ShadowJK | put that* | 19:10 |
| SpeedEvil | 'I was heartbroken not to be able to watch the exciting world-changing announcements at ...' | 19:11 |
| javispedro | lol | 19:11 |
| MohammadAG | too much drama | 19:11 |
| MohammadAG | xD | 19:11 |
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| ShadowJK | So this E7-00 thing has 4" screen? | 19:11 |
| MohammadAG | yeah, with a shitty res | 19:12 |
| ShadowJK | C6-00 has "Video Ringtones", which isn't mentioned for C6-01 | 19:12 |
| MohammadAG | and an ARM11 CPU | 19:12 |
| ShadowJK | lulz | 19:12 |
| ShadowJK | It says ARM11 on them all? | 19:12 |
| MohammadAG | yes | 19:12 |
| MohammadAG | No cortex A8s afaik | 19:12 |
| MohammadAG | or A9s | 19:13 |
| javispedro | btw 640x360 res is called "nHD" seemingly | 19:13 |
| javispedro | I wonder if the n stands for "negative" | 19:13 |
| ShadowJK | A9 basically doesn't exist yet | 19:13 |
| MohammadAG | wasn't it mHD? | 19:13 |
| MohammadAG | I remember it was an m on my N97 | 19:13 |
| MNZ | mostlyHD? | 19:13 |
| RST38h | javispedro: N stands for "nuclear" | 19:13 |
| SpeedEvil | magnetohydrodynamic! | 19:13 |
| RST38h | javispedro: I thought you knew | 19:13 |
| SpeedEvil | It's a caterpillar drive! | 19:13 |
| Noma | ai think it's neljännesHD in Finnish, "quarterHD" | 19:13 |
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| javispedro | MohammadAG: might be, just looking at wikipedia | 19:13 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: A9 does exist | 19:14 |
| javispedro | "Nuclear High Definition" truly sounds like a Jobs catchphrase | 19:14 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Just not being produced in large numbers | 19:14 |
| MohammadAG | hmm, nHD | 19:14 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, well kinda, I saw someone on IRC that had one. It was one and a half core in an FPGA, running at 50MHz :-) | 19:14 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Remember, starting with Cortex, ARM works with manufacturers to adjust architecture to their processes | 19:15 |
| MohammadAG | javispedro, would sell well over here :P | 19:15 |
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| MohammadAG | that would* | 19:15 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: Well, I can put an ARM7 into FPGA, does not mean it does not exist :) | 19:15 |
| SpeedEvil | Two ARM7 + ARM1 = ARM15 | 19:15 |
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| * RST38h needs to go to the airport in 45 minutes | 19:16 | |
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| crashanddie | going home | 19:17 |
| crashanddie | see y'all | 19:17 |
| MohammadAG | I wonder why Nokia killed the d-pad | 19:17 |
| MohammadAG | cya crashanddie | 19:17 |
| RST38h | SpeedEvil: "Satan Runs ARM666!" | 19:17 |
| RST38h | Good marketing slogan too | 19:17 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: Because we, punks, complained about it so much! | 19:17 |
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| RST38h | MohammadAG: No dpad, no problem. | 19:18 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, why? | 19:18 |
| javispedro | ARM666 now on the Nokia C666 running Symbian^666 | 19:18 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: Because it sucked. | 19:18 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, why? | 19:18 |
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| MohammadAG | arrows don't work for games | 19:18 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: Nokia has been either too cheap or too stubborn to copy dpad design from some gaming system, like SEGA or something | 19:18 |
| MohammadAG | not that the N900 has any exciting ones | 19:18 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: Instead, they kept coming up with their own, visually attractive, but fragile and uncomfortable designs | 19:19 |
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| RST38h | MohammadAG: N800 dpad was barely useful. N810/N97 dpad was useless | 19:19 |
| MohammadAG | I liked the N97's one tbh | 19:19 |
| SpeedEvil | They don't have on-platform games. | 19:19 |
| SpeedEvil | They can't push emulators as the answer to games for rights reasons. | 19:19 |
| ShadowJK | I found N800 dpad useful :/ | 19:19 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: E70/E50/E61 had a little stick instead, which (surprisingly) worked for most users, but got worn out soon | 19:20 |
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| MohammadAG | N73 too | 19:20 |
| MohammadAG | it broke on a friend's phone | 19:20 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: Later E61 analogs have got "optical" dpad which also was a disaster | 19:20 |
| MohammadAG | but the N97's D-Pad was good imo | 19:20 |
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| RST38h | MohammadAG: + *all* Nokia deviced have ENTER key mapped to dpad center | 19:20 |
| nidO | e90's dpad both internal and external worked well too | 19:20 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: Which makes it useless for gaming | 19:20 |
| ShadowJK | E75 has the N810 dpad in a more sensible location .. | 19:20 |
| MohammadAG | RST38h, remap? | 19:21 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: WHERE? :) | 19:21 |
| MohammadAG | I really can't press two arrows on the n900 together | 19:21 |
| MohammadAG | I used to be able to go up-right on the N97 | 19:21 |
| MohammadAG | but the N97 ran the emu at 11 fps fullscreen, so.. meh | 19:21 |
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| RST38h | MohammadAG: They basically have to force themselves to look at a SEGA gamepad and copy dpad design | 19:21 |
| MohammadAG | screw d-pads | 19:22 |
| MohammadAG | add a sixaxis analog stick | 19:22 |
| RST38h | MohammadAG: Yes, it will be akin to losing virginity, but shit, at least they will get the best dpad | 19:22 |
| RST38h | no, no, the analog stick won't do, requires thick hardware | 19:22 |
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| javispedro | "Nokia has something big with Maemo....." (skip 1 year) "Nokia has something big with Meego...." (skip 1 year) "Nokia has something big with MeCloneWebOS...." (skip 1 year) "Nokia has something big with S40...." | 19:23 |
| MohammadAG | the analog stick on the PSP is k | 19:23 |
| * MohammadAG skips 1 year | 19:23 | |
| MohammadAG | Nokia has something big with bankruptcy | 19:23 |
| * RST38h skips 5 more years: Nokia had something in common with Commodore | 19:24 | |
| ab | RST38h, Nomodore | 19:24 |
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| RST38h | ab: HTML5! CSS! JS! | 19:25 |
| RST38h | ;) | 19:25 |
| ab | RST38h, stop screaming! you are an interrupt, not a speaker :) | 19:25 |
| lcuk | MohammadAG, accelerometer. | 19:25 |
| RST38h | ab: Just causing exceptions... | 19:26 |
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| MohammadAG | lcuk, accelerometer and touch fail for epic games | 19:26 |
| MohammadAG | like quake 3 :P | 19:26 |
| lcuk | i never said touch | 19:26 |
| MohammadAG | I'm just saying | 19:26 |
| MohammadAG | my head hurts | 19:26 |
| MohammadAG | brb | 19:27 |
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| lcuk | in years gone by, I have seen people with old style joysticks leaning over and tilting joystick to try and get round that tricky corner more | 19:27 |
| ab | RST38h, I'm sure you have seen this: http://www.z80.info/sint.htm | 19:27 |
| lcuk | nowadays the technology is there to allow it! | 19:27 |
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| RST38h | ab: yea, and much much worse... | 19:28 |
| ab | RST38h, please rename yourself into FFh :) | 19:28 |
| RST38h | ab: My favorite one was someone storing temporary values on the NES PPU bus | 19:28 |
| ab | that should have been really cool thing to do | 19:29 |
| RST38h | ab: By writing into a non-existing PPU register, then reading back after several instructions | 19:29 |
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| ab | :) | 19:30 |
| * luke-jr grumbles | 19:31 | |
| luke-jr | N900 keeps losing its SIP registration | 19:31 |
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| javispedro | hah, htc's also going to announce some phone tomorrow | 19:38 |
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| ml-remote | uninteresting android phones! whee! | 19:40 |
| javispedro | competition to uninteresting symbian phones! | 19:40 |
| luke-jr | ml-remote: and what IS interesting? | 19:40 |
| ml-remote | javispedro: yay, uninteresting market! | 19:41 |
| ml-remote | luke-jr: broadcom going open source, only thing that would be more exciting would be imagination, arm, and qualcomm opening their video drivers | 19:41 |
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| ml-remote | but that's unlikely, so I'm just kinda sitting idle | 19:42 |
| MohammadAG51 | ml-remote, bd's going open? | 19:42 |
| ml-remote | MohammadAG51: yeah, didn't you see the buzz regarding their wifi drivers? | 19:42 |
| luke-jr | ml-remote: Broadcom is going open source? | 19:42 |
| luke-jr | err | 19:42 |
| luke-jr | they're opening wifi drivers that have been replaced already? | 19:43 |
| MohammadAG51 | luke-jr, yeah, didn't you see the buzz regarding their wifi drivers? | 19:43 |
| luke-jr | that's hardly Broadcom going open source | 19:43 |
| DocScrutinizer51 | lo MohammadAG51 | 19:43 |
| MohammadAG51 | :P | 19:43 |
| luke-jr | that's them releasing irrelevant code | 19:43 |
| ml-remote | luke-jr: irrelevant? | 19:43 |
| javispedro | luke-jr: some of those still only had ndiswrapper | 19:43 |
| MohammadAG51 | hey DocScrutinizer51 | 19:43 |
| luke-jr | yes, irrelevant | 19:43 |
| wazd | Peter Skillman (what an awesome second name) - my first real competitor :D | 19:43 |
| luke-jr | javispedro: it was only a matter of time | 19:43 |
| javispedro | wazd: palmos guy! | 19:43 |
| ml-remote | luke-jr: how so, considering it's for their newest chipsets? | 19:43 |
| MohammadAG51 | i hate broadcom | 19:44 |
| MohammadAG51 | intel's cards are awesome | 19:44 |
| luke-jr | "Broadcom going open source" headline is for when they release a port of Linux supporting 100% of their chipset | 19:44 |
| MohammadAG51 | at least connecting using those on ubuntu takes half a sec | 19:44 |
| wazd | javispedro: I should change my name to Andrew Shopmaster or something :) | 19:44 |
| luke-jr | so I can run Linux on my cable modem | 19:44 |
| javispedro | :) | 19:44 |
| luke-jr | and tell it to ignore the stupid caps <.< | 19:44 |
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| ml-remote | luke-jr: certainly more probable now than before, and you can always bash them more | 19:44 |
| MohammadAG51 | OpenWRT wfm, sorta :p | 19:44 |
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| ml-remote | I'm sure people making moves towards being open love being bashed | 19:44 |
| wazd | javispedro: or Andrew Conceptlord :D | 19:45 |
| luke-jr | ml-remote: technically speaking, what they're doing is still illegal | 19:45 |
| javispedro | Conceptmaster is ok | 19:45 |
| luke-jr | by violating the GPL once, they forever lost the privilege of copying the code | 19:45 |
| luke-jr | they can't just start complying now to make it all ok | 19:45 |
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| javispedro | oh, i didn't notice the n8 can charge both from the 2mm plug and mUSB port | 19:46 |
| ml-remote | luke-jr: how did they violate the GPL? | 19:46 |
| MohammadAG51 | could be for OTG | 19:46 |
| luke-jr | ml-remote: by not distributing the source | 19:46 |
| ml-remote | luke-jr: ahh, even Linus will argue that | 19:47 |
| dos1 | luke-jr: how not distributing the source is violating GPL? | 19:47 |
| luke-jr | dos1: Linux is GPL. | 19:47 |
| luke-jr | read the GPL, or hire a lawyer to do so | 19:47 |
| wazd | javispedro: seriously, if he's really the guy behind webos UI concept, then MeeGo Nokia Handset UI is safe :) | 19:47 |
| dos1 | luke-jr: did they distrubute Linux as binary only? :p | 19:48 |
| luke-jr | dos1: yes, a binary patch for it | 19:48 |
| luke-jr | aka "kernel module" | 19:48 |
| dos1 | luke-jr: i know what's GPL, kernel module etc. are, you don't have to explain everything to me like to kid | 19:49 |
| luke-jr | dos1: you asked. | 19:49 |
| dos1 | luke-jr: and distributing binary kernel modules is not violating GPL | 19:49 |
| luke-jr | it is | 19:49 |
| dos1 | that's why i asked, where did they violate GPL | 19:49 |
| luke-jr | like I said, if you have questions, hire an IP lawyer | 19:49 |
| dos1 | luke-jr: maybe you should do that? ;) | 19:49 |
| luke-jr | dos1: don't need to | 19:50 |
| dos1 | neither me | 19:50 |
| javispedro | luke-jr: if you apply a binary patch by yourself and never distribute the resulting binary, how does it violate the GPL? | 19:50 |
| javispedro | (note that broadcom is not doing that -- broadcom is shipping the patched binary with their products, so they're guilty) | 19:50 |
| luke-jr | javispedro: patches are derived works | 19:50 |
| ml-remote | bbl | 19:51 |
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| luke-jr | dos1: "I've had the misfortune of talking to a lot of different IP lawyers over the years about this topic, and every one that I've talked to all agree that there is no way that anyone can create a Linux kernel module, today, that can be closed source." | 19:53 |
| luke-jr | http://www.kroah.com/log/linux/ols_2006_keynote.html | 19:53 |
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| dos1 | luke-jr: you mean code, which was later released by Cisco for WRT54G? | 20:02 |
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| Khertan_n900 | Hi again | 20:06 |
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| luke-jr | dos1: hm? | 20:06 |
| dos1 | luke-jr: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcom#GPL_violation | 20:06 |
| Khertan_n900 | Maybe someone can help me. It seems i broke notification in Khweeteur>0.0.29 each time i click on a notification it launch an other Khweeteur process instead of calling back the actual ruuning one. | 20:07 |
| Khertan_n900 | is there a way to monitor dbus on device ? | 20:07 |
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| luke-jr | dos1: sure, that is sufficiently vague that it might be their first GPL violation | 20:08 |
| Jaffa | Ev'ning | 20:08 |
| Khertan_n900 | aiv ningue Jaffa | 20:09 |
| luke-jr | dos1: while nobody actually has the authority to grant Broadcom a new license to Linux, I personally think it'd be fair to do so if they've released the driver source, and at least licensed a firmware for free redistribution | 20:09 |
| * Jaffa needs to find thp at the Nokia World party tonight. | 20:09 | |
| dos1 | luke-jr: ok, but from where did you get that: "by violating the GPL once, they forever lost the privilege of copying the code"? | 20:09 |
| luke-jr | dos1: the GPL itself | 20:09 |
| Jaffa | ...and apparently missed some free N8s being given out :-/ | 20:09 |
| luke-jr | dos1: the GPL gives no "rehabilitation" method | 20:10 |
| Khertan_n900 | :) | 20:10 |
| luke-jr | so when revoked, it reverts back to standard copyright (= no copying) | 20:10 |
| Khertan_n900 | what will you do with an n8 ... it s run meego ... | 20:10 |
| Khertan_n900 | s/it s run/it s run symbian | 20:11 |
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| barisione | what does the blue LED flashing twice mean? | 20:12 |
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| ml-remote | message has arrived | 20:12 |
| barisione | ml-remote: that's just a single flash | 20:12 |
| ml-remote | mine flashes twice | 20:12 |
| ml-remote | maybe that's just for e-mail? | 20:13 |
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| maemouser | same here | 20:13 |
| barisione | hm | 20:13 |
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| ml-remote | in fact I've only seen my LED make 4 colors: yellow, orange, blue, and green | 20:13 |
| MohammadAG51 | actually | 20:14 |
| MohammadAG51 | the LED is RGB | 20:14 |
| dos1 | actually | 20:14 |
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| dos1 | there are three LEDs ;) | 20:14 |
| barisione | yeah, but this is 2 flashes in quick sequence | 20:14 |
| MohammadAG51 | as dos1 said | 20:15 |
| MohammadAG51 | three LEDs | 20:15 |
| barisione | ah, you are right for SMSes it's twice | 20:15 |
| MohammadAG51 | yellow is a mix of orange and some other colour | 20:15 |
| barisione | but this phone doesn't show any new SMS | 20:15 |
| MohammadAG51 | err | 20:15 |
| maemouser | get led pattern editor and see it in action | 20:15 |
| MohammadAG51 | red and some other colour | 20:15 |
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| MohammadAG51 | kill mce and interface with it directly | 20:15 |
| MohammadAG51 | you can do new colours | 20:15 |
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| MohammadAG51 | more than 6 | 20:15 |
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| kerio | hi all | 20:21 |
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| kerio | is someone kind enough to compile iodine 0.4.2 for me? | 20:22 |
| kerio | :3 | 20:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | err | 20:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | i compiled iodine for someone | 20:22 |
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| kerio | so you can do the same for me! | 20:22 |
| kerio | :D | 20:22 |
| MohammadAG51 | Version: 0.6.0-rc1-maemo1 | 20:23 |
| realitygaps | anyone tried the uboot for n900 yet? | 20:23 |
| MohammadAG51 | is in devel | 20:23 |
| MohammadAG51 | b-man`, did | 20:23 |
| kerio | MohammadAG51: hmm | 20:23 |
| kerio | i hope it works on a 0.4.2 server | 20:23 |
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| kerio | it doesn't :( | 20:27 |
| realitygaps | trying to figure out converting zImage to uImage, any special command line options needed for mkimage (-a or -e)? | 20:30 |
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| * frals slaps VDVsx around a bit with a large trout | 20:32 | |
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| VDVsx | ~chase frals | 20:36 |
| * infobot chases frals | 20:36 | |
| frals | :P | 20:36 |
| VDVsx | infobot, bad bot | 20:36 |
| infobot | Bad bot, bad! No cookie for you! | 20:36 |
| VDVsx | he has Alzheimer it seems | 20:36 |
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| GAN900 | I love it when FedEx delivers to an address 1500 miles away, and doesn't get a signature because they know it's wrong. | 20:44 |
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| tybollt | france, or dritten reich, as we know it :) | 20:45 |
| cyanogen | i'm trying to play back a video file with phonon and i keep getting an error saying that gstreamer0.10-plugins-good is not installed, but it is | 20:46 |
| cyanogen | is this a bug or am i doing it wrong? :) | 20:46 |
| lcuk | cyanogen, that will be qt trying to be too clever I guess | 20:48 |
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| lcuk | since it sounds like its looking for something it thinks comes from the plugins-good package | 20:48 |
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| GAN900 | Anybody at the MeeGo dev watchamagoo? | 20:49 |
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| lcuk | GAN900, qgil and regiie at least | 20:49 |
| lcuk | reggie even | 20:49 |
| lcuk | at least htats what I think | 20:49 |
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| lcuk | cyanogen, does phonon work on android? | 20:49 |
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| * lcuk vanishes | 21:01 | |
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| trumee | Saw this comment in engadget about E7 liked it, holds true for N900 as well. "If a device supports multitasking, it should have enough power to avoid this UI lag. If it doesn't have enough power, it should manage it's tasks so that the user doesn't experience this lag. The smart in smartphone should refer to the phone, not to it's users." | 21:05 |
| frals | bah | 21:06 |
| javispedro | bah. | 21:06 |
| korhojoa_ | bah | 21:06 |
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| mece | bah. | 21:06 |
| korhojoa | overclock it = lag gone | 21:06 |
| frals | i prefer a device allowing me to do whatever i want with it over being restricted so i can see some transition effect at x fps | 21:06 |
| korhojoa | tbh, my n900 has been acting up a little lately. it didn't want to quit the media player :D | 21:07 |
| korhojoa | i almost resorted to taking out the battery, but luckily pressing the power switch helped | 21:07 |
| frals | wtb votes :( http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-testing_free_armel/fmms/1.2.5/ | 21:08 |
| frals | VDVsx, i hear you are a frequent fmms user, vote! | 21:08 |
| GAN900 | trumee, it's a function of optimization, not power. | 21:10 |
| VDVsx | frals, not really :D | 21:10 |
| frals | bah! :p | 21:10 |
| ShadSEC | I am almost sure that wlancond is using a minimum signal quality threshold for allowing connection (when the connection would be perfectly usable below it)... any idea where can I avoid or change that threshold? | 21:10 |
| trumee | GAN900: i liked the last bit of the comment about smartphone, made me laugh. | 21:11 |
| Tott3[AEX] | Hey anyone using Hermes? | 21:11 |
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| cyanogen | ack got pulled into a meeting :/ | 21:12 |
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| ALoGeNo | hello all.. | 21:16 |
| Tott3[AEX] | yo | 21:16 |
| Tott3[AEX] | Are you using Hermes?^^ | 21:16 |
| ALoGeNo | hey is there any possibility to run maemo5 in qemu? | 21:17 |
| trumee | Tott3[AEX]: i have used it in the past. | 21:17 |
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| Tott3[AEX] | Do i have to name my contacts as their called on etc Facebook to get their pictures? | 21:17 |
| Tott3[AEX] | Or does it recorgnise the number? | 21:17 |
| trumee | Tott3[AEX]: no idea! | 21:17 |
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| Tott3[AEX] | doh;( | 21:17 |
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| trumee | Tott3[AEX]: not sure if Hermes can read phone numbers from facebook. | 21:18 |
| Tott3[AEX] | Don't think it can | 21:18 |
| Tott3[AEX] | Can't check either, think i'll get my phone tomorrow=P | 21:18 |
| korhojoa | hermes doesn't | 21:18 |
| korhojoa | Tott3[AEX], also it needs them to be named somewhat correctly | 21:18 |
| korhojoa | if they aren't, you can merge them | 21:18 |
| Tott3[AEX] | Ah okay, cheers | 21:19 |
| ALoGeNo | mer needs run under maemo5?, i mean chrooted.. | 21:19 |
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| ALoGeNo | when i run start-hildon run but i cant see buttons in the desktop :/ | 21:20 |
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| ALoGeNo | please, i was 2 weeks testing and looking for help but im a little confuse :/ | 21:22 |
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| ALoGeNo | mer needs maemo behind? | 21:23 |
| javispedro | #mer | 21:23 |
| javispedro | and -- of course not. | 21:24 |
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| ALoGeNo | hola javi, no puedes hecharme un cable plis? | 21:24 |
| javispedro | pm me | 21:25 |
| ALoGeNo | k :) | 21:26 |
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| ShadSEC | I think this confirms my suspicions: "#define WLANCOND_RSSI_PENALTY 25 // 25dBm" | 21:34 |
| ShadSEC | Any idea how to change that value? | 21:34 |
| SpeedEvil | what suspicions? | 21:35 |
| javispedro | what suspicions, indeed? | 21:35 |
| SpeedEvil | Thatthevaticanisattheheart of a conspiracy to crack HDMI? | 21:35 |
| ShadSEC | that wlancond is using a minimin threshold for allowing initial association to an AP (when the connection would be perfectly usable below it) | 21:36 |
| ShadSEC | I want to tell it not to use it temporarily, or being able to change the value | 21:36 |
| javispedro | wlancond is not as smart as you think | 21:36 |
| * SpeedEvil thinks it may have the intelligence of a blended kitten. | 21:37 | |
| ShadSEC | well, in my tests it is showing it is not doing the initial association unless the signal is well below minimun possible | 21:37 |
| ShadSEC | and that define seems to confirm it, doesnt it? | 21:38 |
| SpeedEvil | But wlancond is part of the closed-source crown jewels. | 21:38 |
| ShadSEC | yes | 21:38 |
| javispedro | nope | 21:38 |
| javispedro | wlancond is open | 21:38 |
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| ShadSEC | so that I cannot change the define, but maybe there some way to tell it to do it | 21:38 |
| * SpeedEvil sighs at the retardation. | 21:38 | |
| SpeedEvil | It is? | 21:38 |
| javispedro | ye | 21:38 |
| ShadSEC | perhaps it is configurable | 21:38 |
| * SpeedEvil sighs at the retardation. | 21:38 | |
| javispedro | the crypto parts aren't (separate binary) | 21:38 |
| ShadSEC | open? full open source it is not, is it? | 21:39 |
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| ShadSEC | theres some code and documentation, yes | 21:39 |
| javispedro | yes, the entire source code of the wlancond daemon is available. | 21:39 |
| javispedro | you maybe missed it because it is quite small. as I said, the daemon doesn't do much. | 21:39 |
| ShadSEC | but if i cannot change the #define and recompile unless it provices some functional way to do, its closed for me :( | 21:39 |
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| javispedro | http://mxr.maemo.org/fremantle-20091116/source/osso-wlan/dbus-handler.c | 21:40 |
| ShadSEC | oh, btw, maybe when i refer to wlancond I also do to icd | 21:40 |
| SpeedEvil | I missed it as there is no nice page listing all theopen parts. | 21:40 |
| javispedro | there you have the implementation of settings_and_connect handler | 21:40 |
| ShadSEC | as they both collaborate in the same mess | 21:40 |
| kerio | btw guys http://pastebin.com/kqD56TmU | 21:40 |
| ShadSEC | javispedro, thx, gonna read | 21:41 |
| toggles_1 | Anyone in .it around Milano looking for work? | 21:41 |
| blizzow | what kind of work? I will move to Milano. | 21:42 |
| blizzow | ;) | 21:42 |
| kerio | i'm about 500 km lower | 21:42 |
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| kerio | and i'm also studying at the uni | 21:42 |
| kerio | and i'm not skilled enough for a job | 21:43 |
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| toggles_1 | blizzow: automatic metro installation, central control system, linux + hw installation and testing | 21:44 |
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| toggles_1 | pm me if you are around here | 21:44 |
| kerio | ooh, milan is adding a new metro line? | 21:45 |
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| toggles_w | kerio: yes, that metro | 21:45 |
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| FrieT | hey MNZ! /me cursing at slow vmware scratchbox:P | 21:58 |
| MNZ | FrieT! | 21:58 |
| MNZ | How're your speakers? alive and kicking I hope :D | 21:58 |
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| FrieT | sure are. didn't manage to compile yet, still setting up scratchbox | 21:58 |
| FrieT | it's darn slow on vmware | 21:58 |
| FrieT | but my new workstation is arriving later this week | 21:59 |
| FrieT | that should blast its way through this | 21:59 |
| MNZ | keep me posted! | 21:59 |
| FrieT | and allow for -j16 compiles on raid0 ssd's | 21:59 |
| FrieT | i shall! | 21:59 |
| Venemo | hey guys&girls | 22:00 |
| MNZ | hello again Venemo | 22:00 |
| *** FIQ|n900 is now known as SQUEEEE | 22:00 | |
| FrieT | question: did anyone think of clustering the n900 into something neat?;P | 22:00 |
| MNZ | FrieT, heh is it worth it? | 22:00 |
| *** SQUEEEE is now known as FIQ|n900 | 22:00 | |
| FrieT | sure! think about the fun we could have at a flashmob using ad-hoc wifi! | 22:01 |
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| * FrieT crawls back into the dark geekcave | 22:01 | |
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| MNZ | I'm imagining things yes..... reminded me of improv everywhere B) | 22:02 |
| FrieT | ok wth! this image is outdated and wants to update 1186 packages.. noooot going to happen :D | 22:02 |
| * FrieT clicks the handy revert to snapshot button:p | 22:02 | |
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| kerio | in a beowulf cluster, the crappiest nodes have GigE | 22:02 |
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| kerio | clustering over wifi is counterproductive | 22:03 |
| FrieT | depends | 22:03 |
| MNZ | kerio, I don't think he wants clustering for processing purposes | 22:03 |
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| FrieT | if they're highly independent blocks of computative work.. | 22:03 |
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| MNZ | or not | 22:03 |
| FrieT | nahh this is just a "because we can" thing | 22:03 |
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| FrieT | but latency isn't always the limiting factor. it usually is. | 22:04 |
| FrieT | we could be a walking folding@home cluster! doing a funny dance while folding! | 22:04 |
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| FrieT | ok frustrating. the prefab image only supports UP on vmware :& | 22:05 |
| kerio | there's no folding@home for arm | 22:06 |
| SpeedEvil | qemu | 22:08 |
| FrieT | qemu? | 22:08 |
| FrieT | why not just bochs? | 22:08 |
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| ShadowJK | qemu is probably faster than bochs? | 22:08 |
| FrieT | on arm ? | 22:08 |
| FrieT | can't really do native stuff on it can it? | 22:08 |
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| ShadowJK | I think qemu still does JIT on arm? | 22:09 |
| FrieT | that'd be neat | 22:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://www.adobe.com/support/security/advisories/apsa10-03.html | 22:09 |
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| FrieT | uh | 22:09 |
| *** till- has joined #maemo | 22:09 | |
| FrieT | so adobe has yet another vuln | 22:09 |
| FrieT | who still cares? | 22:09 |
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| DocScrutinizer | Now I see why Nokia felt like not reacting to last flash vulnerability :-P | 22:10 |
| FrieT | wake me up when a week passes without someone finding an adobe-induced hole | 22:10 |
| FrieT | well ofc ourse | 22:10 |
| ShadowJK | DocScrutinizer, why's that? | 22:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | why's what? | 22:11 |
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| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: adobe flash vulnerabilities? | 22:12 |
| DocScrutinizer | ShadowJK: I don't know why there's another one every other month | 22:12 |
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| kerio | poor coding? | 22:25 |
| FrieT | poor coding? nah | 22:25 |
| FrieT | no way | 22:25 |
| MNZ | bad luck | 22:25 |
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| FrieT | yes it's all about luck | 22:26 |
| FrieT | :p | 22:26 |
| FrieT | ok hmz | 22:26 |
| FrieT | wth is this | 22:26 |
| * FrieT tries to get this weird prefab ubuntu scratchbox image to work | 22:26 | |
| *** FredrIQ has joined #maemo | 22:27 | |
| FrieT | apparently there's a new svn location | 22:27 |
| FrieT | updated that | 22:27 |
| FrieT | hz | 22:27 |
| FrieT | hmm | 22:27 |
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| FrieT | great it ruined the graphic settings | 22:27 |
| DangerMaus | lol | 22:27 |
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| *** zzztrumee is now known as trumee | 22:28 | |
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| FrieT | why does it have a gui anyhow | 22:30 |
| FrieT | MNZ! curse this thing ! :p | 22:30 |
| MNZ | FrieT, meh why don't just use debian like the rest of us :P | 22:31 |
| FrieT | i thought the prefab image would make it *easier* !! | 22:31 |
| FrieT | i can see now how wrong i was ! | 22:31 |
| FrieT | :p | 22:31 |
| MNZ | in theory, yes.... just pop it on and it works. | 22:31 |
| MNZ | weird | 22:31 |
| FrieT | it's horribly outdated | 22:31 |
| MNZ | do you have any debian CDs?? | 22:32 |
| FrieT | nop | 22:32 |
| FrieT | but netboot will do | 22:32 |
| FrieT | netinstall | 22:32 |
| FrieT | even | 22:32 |
| FrieT | wait it's downloading scratchbox | 22:32 |
| FrieT | finally | 22:32 |
| FrieT | skipped the "convert to vmware" | 22:32 |
| FrieT | now at least it doesn't fuck up the graphics | 22:32 |
| FrieT | i already converted to vmware for it, ffs | 22:33 |
| FrieT | otherwise it wouldn't be running now would it!:p | 22:33 |
| Gh0sty | ^^ | 22:33 |
| Gh0sty | tzijn ook altijd dezelfde die ge overal tegenkomt ;) | 22:33 |
| Gh0sty | hi FrieT :P | 22:33 |
| FrieT | ghost! | 22:33 |
| FrieT | wie gehst mensch:) | 22:33 |
| Gh0sty | good | 22:33 |
| FrieT | fellow n900 user?:) | 22:34 |
| Gh0sty | still at work trying to bend my head around non-working webservers :x | 22:34 |
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| Gh0sty | ofcourse :p | 22:34 |
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| FrieT | impressive:D | 22:34 |
| FrieT | non-working webservers ey | 22:34 |
| FrieT | :D | 22:34 |
| FrieT | i was scheduled for a whole day of pain and misery | 22:34 |
| Gh0sty | the usual nothing new there ... | 22:34 |
| Gh0sty | new hardware on its way :) | 22:34 |
| FrieT | but surprisingly it all worked out very well | 22:34 |
| FrieT | was done at 15h | 22:35 |
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| Gh0sty | well i also got some good news | 22:35 |
| Gh0sty | no working on thursday from 2am till 6am :p | 22:35 |
| FrieT | you died | 22:35 |
| FrieT | ? | 22:35 |
| FrieT | oh | 22:35 |
| FrieT | close enough | 22:35 |
| Gh0sty | while i normally start at 7am ;) | 22:35 |
| FrieT | hurray | 22:35 |
| * FrieT scratches head | 22:35 | |
| FrieT | :p | 22:35 |
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| FrieT | grrrrr | 22:36 |
| FrieT | 8meg/s download | 22:36 |
| FrieT | slowpoke!:( | 22:36 |
| FrieT | 5 minutes eta.. i don't have no 5 minutes | 22:36 |
| MNZ | 8 what per how much now? | 22:36 |
| trumee | Crap, my mobile provider three is sucking out a lot of money from me because i go above my free minutes every month. Is there a way to pop-up a warning for mobile call timer? | 22:36 |
| MNZ | I do 25kb/s | 22:36 |
| FrieT | 8mbit:s | 22:37 |
| trumee | I end up paying double the cost of the contract and it sucks | 22:37 |
| FrieT | i'm spoiled to working on the datacenter machines MNZ | 22:37 |
| SpeedEvil | trumee: *SPs should be compelled to provide a simple API | 22:37 |
| FrieT | where i come from harddisks are the bottlenecks when downloading large files ;D | 22:37 |
| trumee | Is there any script i can run which can count the mobile timer and pop up a warning. | 22:38 |
| SpeedEvil | trumee: A JSON page for example with a simple 'you have this much left' number | 22:38 |
| MNZ | FrieT, yeah I know that feeling B) I have access to a bunch of 100mbit connections. Not much, but a nice change from 256kbit | 22:38 |
| SpeedEvil | trumee: So you just need to tell a standard app about it and it works across all *SPs | 22:38 |
| FrieT | sure is | 22:38 |
| trumee | SpeedEvil: Three used to send me warning when i was on a 24month contract, but on there sim-only contract they dont send me warnings | 22:38 |
| SpeedEvil | :/ | 22:39 |
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| FrieT | i do enjoy the occasional ratelimiting though | 22:39 |
| trumee | SpeedEvil: yes, there indeed is a webpage which i can lookup but i forget to do it every month. | 22:39 |
| FrieT | that 9600baud retro feeling | 22:39 |
| FrieT | i love it | 22:39 |
| FrieT | really gt try it to re-appreciate what you ahve | 22:39 |
| FrieT | have* | 22:39 |
| SpeedEvil | trumee: I don't mean a random webpage, that differs with every ISP. | 22:39 |
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| FrieT | introduce random packet loss, some latency, and police the shit out of your connection. eye-opener:) | 22:40 |
| SpeedEvil | trumee: I mean a fixed format one that can be displayed prominently on your desktop. | 22:40 |
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| MNZ | lol | 22:40 |
| trumee | SpeedEvil: i see. But for now is there a way to query the mobile timer on N900 | 22:40 |
| SpeedEvil | Sorry - I'm just wibbling. | 22:40 |
| FrieT | mobile timer? | 22:40 |
| SpeedEvil | I do that a lot. | 22:40 |
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| johnsq | Hi | 22:40 |
| FrieT | is that like an eggcooking thing? | 22:40 |
| SpeedEvil | ssh root@phone beep | 22:40 |
| SpeedEvil | argh | 22:40 |
| FrieT | omg | 22:41 |
| FrieT | at least go for ssh user@phone sudo beep | 22:41 |
| trumee | FrieT: yes, Phone > Call timers > Mobile calls | 22:41 |
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| FrieT | ah thàt | 22:41 |
| FrieT | ok | 22:41 |
| FrieT | no clue.. i'm wondering where SMS is stored | 22:41 |
| FrieT | exported my old ones to txt's from symbian | 22:41 |
| FrieT | nowhere to import em to though | 22:41 |
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| FrieT | sometimes i miss symbian:) | 22:42 |
| FrieT | notably the sip client :P | 22:43 |
| trumee | FrieT: dont get me started on sip :( | 22:43 |
| genewitch | hey guys hey did you know that you can create so much heat while fucking that you can literally melt latex rubber? | 22:43 |
| trumee | sip SUCKS on N900 | 22:43 |
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| FrieT | trumee: i wouldn't go for sucks.. i'd go for blows. | 22:44 |
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| FrieT | and well.. yeah.. it doesn't support the GSM codec.. which is pretty funny :p | 22:44 |
| satmd | it does not?! | 22:44 |
| FrieT | nop | 22:44 |
| trumee | FrieT: Here you go, my favourite bug #10388 | 22:44 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388 Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? | 22:44 |
| satmd | I think I made gsm calls with it over sip | 22:44 |
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| FrieT | uhm | 22:44 |
| FrieT | i mean de gsm codec | 22:44 |
| satmd | me too | 22:45 |
| FrieT | well that works on symbian | 22:45 |
| FrieT | not on maemo | 22:45 |
| FrieT | g971 works | 22:45 |
| FrieT | so does ilbc | 22:45 |
| FrieT | so does xLaw | 22:45 |
| satmd | I think it has to do with the sip switch codec preferences | 22:45 |
| trumee | It is choppy for me on any codec, i have tried with g729/ilbc/pcmu | 22:45 |
| genewitch | works on the n800 | 22:45 |
| FrieT | well | 22:45 |
| FrieT | it's least choppy with pcmu | 22:45 |
| * satmd puts testing on his todo list | 22:45 | |
| FrieT | less cpu usage | 22:45 |
| FrieT | it's a cpu related issue | 22:45 |
| genewitch | i wonder why the sip client sucks on a cellphone | 22:45 |
| genewitch | i can't imagine | 22:45 |
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| ShadowJK | hm, update to sygic | 22:46 |
| * ShadowJK considers install MM10 | 22:46 | |
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| FrieT | because they didn't develop the audio part of maemo properly genewitch | 22:46 |
| trumee | It is a jitter buffer issue in gstreamer which causes sip to suck on N900 | 22:46 |
| genewitch | mine uses maemo too | 22:46 |
| pupnik | http://www.adobe.com/support/security/advisories/apsa10-03.html <<< September 13: Security Alert >>> A critical vulnerability exists in Adobe Flash Player 10.1.82.76 and earlier versions for Windows, Macintosh, Linux, Solaris, and Adobe Flash Player 10.1.92.10 for Android. This vulnerability also affects Adobe Reader 9.3.4 for Windows, Macintosh and UNIX, and Adobe Acrobat 9.3.4 and earlier versions for Windows and Macintosh. | 22:46 |
| pupnik | ^^ does that affect N900 flash ? | 22:46 |
| FrieT | we already know and do not care | 22:46 |
| FrieT | and yes it probably does | 22:46 |
| FrieT | do not use flash if you care about security | 22:46 |
| FrieT | apt-get remove adobe* && done:) | 22:47 |
| FrieT | :p | 22:47 |
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| trumee | FrieT, genewitch: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=792298&postcount=21 | 22:47 |
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| FrieT | uh | 22:48 |
| FrieT | Trewas | 22:48 |
| FrieT | trumee | 22:48 |
| FrieT | unless they throw out their current audio subsystem | 22:48 |
| FrieT | this is never going to be fixed | 22:48 |
| trumee | FrieT: sip jitter is broken on N900 | 22:48 |
| FrieT | my e61 could do this flawlessly without overheating like an oven | 22:49 |
| FrieT | n900 can't | 22:49 |
| FrieT | because of codec cpu load and PussAudio | 22:49 |
| trumee | FrieT: same here N95 rocks here but N900 doesnt work | 22:49 |
| FrieT | well; Symbian is a mature thing. It's not running on over-powered phones eiter. | 22:49 |
| FrieT | this is the downside of having lots of cpu cycles: you get away with cutting corners | 22:50 |
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| trumee | I dont mind cpu load as long as the voice quality is ok. But with the current firmware i get choppyness in about 10 minutes into the call | 22:50 |
| FrieT | lol i get choppiness from start to finish | 22:50 |
| FrieT | whenever cpu hits 100% | 22:50 |
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| trumee | FrieT: on my device the cpu load doesnt go to 100% it stays about 35% with pcmu but still choppyness happens | 22:51 |
| FrieT | 35%!? | 22:51 |
| FrieT | did you bypass pulseaudio? | 22:51 |
| trumee | yes with pcmu | 22:51 |
| FrieT | pulseaudio eats 30% on a good day | 22:51 |
| trumee | with G729 it is about 55% | 22:52 |
| FrieT | wtf | 22:52 |
| FrieT | ok this i need to see | 22:52 |
| * FrieT dives into phone | 22:52 | |
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| FrieT | crackle crackle | 22:53 |
| FrieT | :p | 22:53 |
| FrieT | 7360 1 user S < 12996 5.2 28.6 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-stream-engine | 22:53 |
| FrieT | 6223 1 pulse R < 4616 1.8 27.0 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --system --high-priority | 22:53 |
| FrieT | pcmu. | 22:53 |
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| lolloo | is there a way to to send websites links from my phone to PC over bluetooth? | 22:53 |
| FrieT | that's at 850 mhz btw | 22:54 |
| trumee | 870 1 pulse S < 4240 1.7 27.2 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --system --high-priority | 22:54 |
| trumee | 4430 1 user S < 12932 5.2 16.7 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-stream-engine | 22:54 |
| trumee | with ilbc | 22:54 |
| FrieT | 7360 1 user S < 12932 5.2 33.8 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-stream-engine | 22:54 |
| FrieT | 6223 1 pulse R < 4576 1.8 31.4 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --system --high-priority | 22:54 |
| trumee | and stock frequency | 22:55 |
| FrieT | at 550mhz | 22:55 |
| FrieT | ok switching to ilbc | 22:55 |
| FrieT | but ilbc was horrible i recall | 22:55 |
| FrieT | let's see | 22:55 |
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| FrieT | btw | 22:56 |
| FrieT | lcuk | 22:56 |
| FrieT | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8574 | 22:56 |
| povbot | Bug 8574: Subfolders of Zimbra IMAP server not appearing/not available | 22:56 |
| FrieT | -> it was never committed and included to 1.2 | 22:56 |
| FrieT | ok forget it .. this IS ilbc :) | 22:57 |
| FrieT | are you testing using silence or smt else? | 22:57 |
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| trumee | FrieT: oops! that was not ilbc | 22:58 |
| FrieT | i know i tried em all and settled on something | 22:58 |
| FrieT | thought it was alaw | 22:58 |
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| FrieT | but seems to be ilbc | 22:58 |
| lcuk | FrieT, yes it was discussed and was a misfire, you knew this already I believe and were watching the bug as the change occured | 22:58 |
| lcuk | thanks for noticing, shit happens occasionally. | 22:58 |
| FrieT | lcuk: well yup, it does, just no clue where to go from here? | 22:59 |
| lcuk | well I am going to watch a movie, I don't know about you. | 22:59 |
| trumee | 870 1 pulse R < 4408 1.7 28.8 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --system --high-priority | 22:59 |
| trumee | 4496 1 user S < 12936 5.2 19.1 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-stream-engine | 22:59 |
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| trumee | this is pcma | 23:00 |
| lcuk | but regarding the bug, the devs have been pinged by the bug state changes | 23:00 |
| FrieT | i mean as far as that patch goes lcuk.. :)) | 23:00 |
| FrieT | kay i guess i'll just wait and see what changes happen in that space | 23:00 |
| lolloo | is there a way to to send websites links from my phone to PC over bluetooth? | 23:00 |
| lcuk | and so will see what happens | 23:00 |
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| FrieT | 6223 1 pulse R < 4464 1.8 40.4 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --system --high-priority | 23:00 |
| FrieT | 7420 1 user S < 12956 5.2 24.7 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-stream-engine | 23:00 |
| lcuk | yeah, having a recent ping is good for it though :) shall follow up | 23:00 |
| FrieT | this is g729 | 23:00 |
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| * FrieT rolls his eyes at pulseaudio | 23:01 | |
| lolloo | what are you all talking about, I might helo | 23:01 |
| lolloo | help | 23:01 |
| FrieT | just venting at the sip client ;) | 23:01 |
| lcuk | FrieT, for the record the overclocking is bad | 23:01 |
| MNZ | ~overclocking | 23:02 |
| infobot | "OK, listen up. This is your CPU." apt drops the CPU into a hot frying pan. "This is your CPU on overclocking. Any questions?" | 23:02 |
| FrieT | lcuk: i know. | 23:02 |
| trumee | FrieT: g729 is not usable on N900 | 23:02 |
| lcuk | since thankfully the bug problem isnt your issue I cant tell you off about it, but I feel like mentioning it anyway :) | 23:02 |
| FrieT | trumee: obviously :p | 23:02 |
| FrieT | lcuk: it's even worse: it's undervolted & slightly overclocked. | 23:03 |
| lolloo | is there a website or forum I can read about? | 23:03 |
| trumee | FrieT: for that matter any codec on stock frequency in unusable until Nokia/Collabora devs get their act together | 23:03 |
| lolloo | about what your talking | 23:03 |
| trumee | They need to learn one or two things from symbian. | 23:03 |
| FrieT | ilbc is usable somehow | 23:03 |
| lcuk | trumee, wtf? | 23:03 |
| FrieT | lcuk: SIP is very very cpu intensive, and barely usable in the current state;) | 23:04 |
| trumee | lcuk: yup, sip is flawless on N95. | 23:04 |
| lolloo | SIP? | 23:04 |
| lcuk | how is that any codec? | 23:04 |
| lolloo | SIP? | 23:04 |
| lolloo | where can I read about it from? | 23:04 |
| FrieT | lcuk: because one codec is more cpu intensive than the other? | 23:04 |
| lcuk | thousands of hours of videos and music are played daily using rock solid codecs etc | 23:04 |
| trumee | lcuk: i tried g729/pcmu/ilbc, all of them have choppiness although varyling levels of cpu loads | 23:04 |
| FrieT | lcuk: did you ever try making a sip call on an n900? | 23:05 |
| trumee | :) | 23:05 |
| lolloo | SIP? Whats that? | 23:05 |
| FrieT | 6223 1 pulse R < 4540 1.8 42.6 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --system --high-priority | 23:05 |
| FrieT | 7450 1 user S < 13012 5.2 19.0 /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-stream-engine | 23:05 |
| FrieT | this is what it does | 23:05 |
| lcuk | dont have reliable internet data connection - i use normal calls | 23:05 |
| lolloo | where can I read about it? | 23:05 |
| dr34m | is there some resource friendly mp3 playing alternative than the stock built in media player on the n900 ? | 23:05 |
| trumee | lollo, voip-info.org | 23:05 |
| FrieT | lcuk: then please don't talk down on us when we're bringing up a real issue.. | 23:05 |
| trumee | dr34m: mplayer, Mediabox | 23:06 |
| lcuk | FrieT, the general "any codec is unstable" is patently wrong | 23:06 |
| FrieT | hmmm unusable i thought he said | 23:06 |
| FrieT | which is correct | 23:06 |
| FrieT | the sip implementation is unusable. | 23:06 |
| lcuk | fair, but point stands | 23:06 |
| trumee | lcuk: i get choppiness on most of the codecs i have tried | 23:06 |
| lcuk | thats closer | 23:07 |
| FrieT | no it does not lcuk - but the fault is not the codecs. | 23:07 |
| trumee | g729/ilbc/pcmu/pcma what else remains? | 23:07 |
| dr34m | trumee thx ill give it a try the standard player is a bit annoying | 23:07 |
| FrieT | gsm - but that's not supported. | 23:07 |
| FrieT | even tho it's the cheapest codec both on cpu and bandwidth alike :p | 23:07 |
| lcuk | i guess though I am not the person to talk about sip | 23:07 |
| lcuk | wheres the bug report? | 23:07 |
| FrieT | nowhere. where do i report "PA is a pig" ? | 23:07 |
| trumee | lcuk, bug #10388 | 23:07 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388 Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? | 23:07 |
| lcuk | ta | 23:08 |
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| FrieT | 40% cpu load on PA alone for a sip call is put mildly.. insane? | 23:08 |
| trumee | lcuk: it has been sitting there, also see this http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=792298&postcount=21 | 23:08 |
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| FrieT | trumee: this cannot "just be fixed" with what i'm seeing here.. hope you got better luck | 23:09 |
| lcuk | FrieT, i wouldnt know but 40% cpu doesnt sound overly bad if its actually using it? | 23:09 |
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| FrieT | lcuk: 40% cpu for piping audio to /dev/dsp is horrendeous | 23:09 |
| lcuk | do all the codecs use the dsp? | 23:10 |
| FrieT | if nokia signs your paychecks i suppose i'd understand.. | 23:10 |
| DangerMaus | hmmm..... for some reason i cant use my bt keyboard with the n900 anymore i tried deletimg it and re pairimg it it pairs but wont connect it still works with the 770 | 23:10 |
| MNZ | lcuk, no. | 23:10 |
| FrieT | oh the decoding is being done in telepathy-stream | 23:10 |
| FrieT | that uses another 30-40% | 23:10 |
| trumee | FrieT: cant i ise plain alsa or something for sip calls, without pulse-audio | 23:10 |
| lcuk | FrieT, I am just asking the questions that come into my head | 23:10 |
| trumee | *use | 23:10 |
| lcuk | the same way I and others answered your questions before | 23:10 |
| FrieT | lcuk: cultural differences.. no offence meant on my part ! | 23:11 |
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| FrieT | i do appreciate the time you took to help me out with all kindsa stuff so far | 23:11 |
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| FrieT | trumee: plain alsa would be nice yes. | 23:11 |
| FrieT | i know asterisk is ported | 23:11 |
| FrieT | and i know asterisk can do console (/dev/dsp) device .. | 23:12 |
| trumee | FrieT: i have installed it on N900, but never got around to using it via console | 23:12 |
| FrieT | "console" for asterisk means "local audio device" | 23:12 |
| FrieT | it'll accept stuff like dial console/extension | 23:12 |
| FrieT | i tried it with a usb "skype"-style handset a year or 2 ago | 23:13 |
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| lolloo | Nice | 23:13 |
| FrieT | well it worked.. | 23:13 |
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| lolloo | phone like | 23:13 |
| lolloo | awesome | 23:13 |
| FrieT | uh. | 23:13 |
| FrieT | k. | 23:13 |
| lolloo | vid calls too? | 23:14 |
| trumee | lolloo: yes | 23:14 |
| lolloo | wow | 23:14 |
| trumee | i have tried h.263 and they work on sip | 23:14 |
| lolloo | I would like to knwo how to do it | 23:14 |
| trumee | lolloo: voip-info.org | 23:14 |
| lolloo | for N900? | 23:14 |
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| lolloo | h.263 most my movies use this codec | 23:15 |
| FrieT | that's 264 | 23:15 |
| lolloo | oh right | 23:15 |
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| FrieT | anyhow | 23:15 |
| trumee | FrieT: it would be good if you vote for bug 10388 | 23:15 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388 Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? | 23:15 |
| FrieT | trumee | 23:15 |
| FrieT | ilbc can be used somewhat | 23:16 |
| lolloo | does fring do same thing? | 23:16 |
| FrieT | uh | 23:16 |
| lcuk | FrieT, have you attempted to follow any of the observations on the thread following the bug? | 23:16 |
| FrieT | fring does not do sip | 23:16 |
| trumee | FrieT: it does actually | 23:16 |
| lolloo | it does voice calls over wlan | 23:16 |
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| FrieT | it does not; they do the sip handling on their end and proxy it to you | 23:16 |
| trumee | FrieT: ah. ok | 23:16 |
| lolloo | wow FrieT | 23:17 |
| trumee | FrieT: i dont like my voice traffic tunneling through their proxy | 23:17 |
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| FrieT | me neiter | 23:17 |
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| FrieT | also because my PBX is on the LAN | 23:17 |
| FrieT | that's kinna | 23:17 |
| lolloo | sip can be done manuelly? | 23:17 |
| FrieT | a bummer | 23:17 |
| FrieT | =D | 23:17 |
| lcuk | and yes, trumee voting on the bug, and adding any additional info as presented on the bug is useful | 23:17 |
| trumee | i have a shiny asterisk and freesiwtch servers here unusable on N900 | 23:17 |
| FrieT | yup.. | 23:17 |
| FrieT | MNZ: any chance you get the dsp to do echo cancellation? | 23:18 |
| lolloo | so when I setup SIP, I can call anyone? | 23:18 |
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| FrieT | lolloo: no. | 23:18 |
| lolloo | oh | 23:18 |
| trumee | lcuk: i have been on email with Mikhail regarding the bug but after the initial email excahnge my emails have been ignored | 23:18 |
| lolloo | what then? | 23:18 |
| trumee | lcuk: it seems Nokia devs are not interested in fixing this bug | 23:18 |
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| lolloo | Nokia are greedy | 23:19 |
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| FrieT | trumee: seems to me you're looking at a combination of issues | 23:19 |
| FrieT | more of an architectural issue | 23:19 |
| FrieT | rather than just "sip client problem" | 23:20 |
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| trumee | FrieT: it is a jitter issue in gstreamer rtp afaik | 23:20 |
| FrieT | obviously there's no reason this should not work flawlessly on a 600mhz ARM chip. | 23:20 |
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| FrieT | trumee: there's more to it - no attempt at echo cancellation, no gsm codec, no call forwarding, yada yada yada | 23:21 |
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| FrieT | check the sip client in your n97 (or my 234 years old e61), you'll see what i mean | 23:21 |
| trumee | FrieT: no voicemail notification as well | 23:21 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | hi, | 23:21 |
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| FrieT | yup | 23:21 |
| FrieT | hence | 23:21 |
| FrieT | n900 is not "a phone" really | 23:22 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | boot/zImage-2.6.28-20101501+0m5.fiasco is in a zImage format? | 23:22 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | or is it in fiasco format? | 23:22 |
| trumee | FrieT: android apparently has good sip client | 23:22 |
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| trumee | sipdroid i think it is called | 23:22 |
| FrieT | no clue. | 23:22 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | yes I tired sipdroid, it need special setup for asterisk | 23:22 |
| trumee | it even has voicemail MWI support. something which Nokia devices never had | 23:22 |
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| FrieT | there's one other option | 23:23 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | does a fiasco image contain low level stuff like xload? | 23:23 |
| FrieT | a skype to sip bridge!:p | 23:23 |
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| FrieT | skype client is decent! | 23:23 |
| trumee | GNUtoo|laptop: i dont have personal experience, only heard other people talk about it. | 23:23 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | ok | 23:23 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | about sip, I should compile a decent sip client | 23:24 |
| trumee | FrieT: i did have a skype to sip here before. maybe need to investigate it | 23:24 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | ekiga failed | 23:24 |
| FrieT | trumee: na, those things are horrible | 23:24 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | not for maemo but for SHR | 23:24 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | so...does someone knows for boot/zImage-2.6.28-20101501+0m5.fiasco ? | 23:24 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | maybe DocScrutinizer ? | 23:24 |
| trumee | GNUtoo|laptop: decent client i ever had was twinkle, but it is only on qt3 | 23:24 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | trumee, then compile it? | 23:25 |
| lcuk | trumee, FrieT | 23:25 |
| lcuk | Comment #9 from Jehan (reporter) 2010-06-15 18:31:12 GMT+3 [reply] | 23:25 |
| lcuk | For me the problem does not seem to persist if power saving is disabled for the | 23:25 |
| lcuk | WLAN connection on the N900. | 23:25 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | or install it via debian chroot | 23:25 |
| trumee | GNUtoo|laptop: cant use it on N900 coz it doesnt use Qt4 | 23:25 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | really? | 23:25 |
| lcuk | can you both confirm that for you please | 23:25 |
| lcuk | using stock system | 23:25 |
| lcuk | ie reflash to proper kernel | 23:25 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | lcuk, PSM issues? which one? | 23:26 |
| trumee | lcuk: i am stock kernel. and disabling PSM doesnt make any difference | 23:26 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | what's the issue | 23:26 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | I've an ifconfig wlan0 down issue | 23:26 |
| trumee | lcuk: in-fact i tried usb-networking with the same response. | 23:26 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | with the stock kenrel sources | 23:26 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | but different defconfig | 23:26 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | and 1 patch | 23:26 |
| lcuk | trumee, | 23:26 |
| lcuk | could you please switch it and try now for me tho | 23:27 |
| trumee | lcuk: try what? | 23:27 |
| lcuk | disable psm | 23:27 |
| trumee | lcuk: disable PSM and make a phone call? | 23:27 |
| lcuk | and tell me if it effects you | 23:27 |
| lcuk | yes, its one of the things, you have my attention, lets go through the motions | 23:27 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | I'm afraid of bricking the device | 23:27 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | I don't know if I should flash that: | 23:28 |
| GNUtoo|laptop | boot/zImage-2.6.28-20101501+0m5.fiasco | 23:28 |
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| trumee | lcuk: ok. let me do this. although i have done this many times before | 23:28 |
| lcuk | how would I setup a sip system at my house? | 23:28 |
| FrieT | asterisk@home/freepbx? | 23:28 |
| lcuk | IDK, i use my phone to make calls | 23:29 |
| lcuk | i am not a server admin | 23:29 |
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| lcuk | you guys are the specialists and should know how to do all this stuff | 23:29 |
| lcuk | is it easy to do? | 23:29 |
| FrieT | why use a unix workstation to do your calls with? *ducks* :> | 23:29 |
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| FrieT | well asterisk@home/freepbx / whatever it's called now | 23:29 |
| lcuk | you guys are hte ones wanting to do that | 23:29 |
| FrieT | is an appliance style thing | 23:29 |
| FrieT | has a webinterface | 23:29 |
| lcuk | and shouting loudly when it doesnt | 23:29 |
| lcuk | so.. | 23:29 |
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| GNUtoo|laptop | lcuk, it's not easy but there is a creative common book on asterisk | 23:30 |
| trumee | FrieT: ok, here you go. disables PSM, voice audio is lost every few seconds | 23:30 |
| lcuk | so its not the sort of problem a normal user will have encountered? | 23:30 |
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| FrieT | lcuk: it's a problem business users will encounter imo | 23:30 |
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| trumee | lcuk: choppiness kicked in at 1:16 minute | 23:31 |
| lcuk | ok | 23:31 |
| lcuk | but for the first 1:15 it was ok? | 23:31 |
| trumee | lcuk: if i do Hold call >Activate call choppiness goes away | 23:31 |
| trumee | lcuk: the audio was lost for a few seconds before that | 23:31 |
| lcuk | ok trumee just - it was ok for first minute? | 23:31 |
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| trumee | lcuk: no. audio was lost | 23:32 |
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| FrieT | amazing if you have it last that long.. here it starts out by being choppy .. :) | 23:32 |
| lcuk | so why was choppiness kicked in at 1:16 ? | 23:32 |
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| FrieT | then improves a bit:p | 23:32 |
| trumee | lcuk: 2:47 seconds, audio is completely gone now | 23:32 |
| lcuk | ok trumee | 23:32 |
| lcuk | if you hang up and make a new call | 23:32 |
| trumee | Hold call and Activate call, brings it back | 23:32 |
| lcuk | does it do same | 23:32 |
| lcuk | or choppy from start? | 23:33 |
| trumee | let me try | 23:33 |
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| trumee | choppy at 00:18 seconds | 23:33 |
| trumee | audio lost at 00:38 seconds | 23:34 |
| trumee | lcuk: so there you have it. | 23:34 |
| lcuk | ok trumee | 23:34 |
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| lcuk | try rebooting and tell me time to choppy please | 23:34 |
| FrieT | i can't reproduce that behaviour.. | 23:34 |
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| lcuk | just for shits n giggles | 23:34 |
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| trumee | lcuk: i have an auot-pickup audiobook running here. so if you want to try calling it via sip, let me know | 23:34 |
| trumee | lcuk: ok, bear with me. rebooting N900 | 23:35 |
| lcuk | k | 23:35 |
| FrieT | anyhow.. i 'll try asterisk one of these days on the n900 | 23:35 |
| FrieT | lcuk: is there an easy way to bypass pulseaudio ? | 23:35 |
| trumee | FrieT: it would be interesing if there is a gui for *, it is lame to use cli to make calls. | 23:36 |
| lcuk | idk but PA is tied to the system at many points, talk to MNZ | 23:36 |
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| FrieT | k | 23:36 |
| FrieT | trumee: yeah would be interesting | 23:36 |
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| MNZ | who's talking about PA! show yer self! | 23:37 |
| FrieT | i cursed it a few minutes ago | 23:37 |
| FrieT | for eating 40% cpu during sip calls:P | 23:37 |
| javispedro | bypassing pulseaudio tends to break speakers | 23:37 |
| FrieT | i do not care | 23:37 |
| FrieT | please do not worry about my speakers | 23:37 |
| FrieT | :p | 23:37 |
| javispedro | then kill it and use the alsa device. | 23:38 |
| MNZ | javispedro, that is being taken care of by yours truly | 23:38 |
| FrieT | :> | 23:38 |
| MNZ | but it's not just the lame highpass filter that PA is doing | 23:38 |
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| FrieT | MNZ: please tell me the dsp can do echo cancellation! ;p | 23:38 |
| MNZ | FrieT, it can do anything. You just need to write the code for it :D | 23:39 |
| FrieT | neat | 23:39 |
| trumee | lcuk: choppiness kicks in at 1:40 after reboot | 23:40 |
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| trumee | Hold Call >Activate Call makes it work again. | 23:40 |
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| lcuk | is that the same for an inbound call by chance? | 23:41 |
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| trumee | lcuk: yes it is the same | 23:41 |
| lcuk | ok | 23:41 |
| trumee | lcuk: but the audio is clear for the remote party. | 23:41 |
| lcuk | throughout all these tests its been clear? | 23:41 |
| trumee | yes | 23:41 |
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| trumee | remote party can hear absolutely fine. | 23:42 |
| trumee | although, as soon as choppiness kicks in i do hold/activate. | 23:42 |
| lcuk | who else uses sip that you know of? | 23:43 |
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| trumee | it is embarrassing because remote party gets to listen my hold music and we loose the conversation | 23:43 |
| trumee | lcuk: what do you mean? | 23:43 |
| madtop | yo http://cgi.ebay.com/2X-BATTERY-CHARGER-NOKIA-N900-5800-X6-5230-Nuron-/400153959310?pt=PDA_Accessories&hash=item5d2b08db8e can one of you confirm that this is safe? | 23:43 |
| lcuk | trumee, well who else uses sip from their n900? | 23:43 |
| trumee | lcuk: all the people voting on bug 10388 | 23:43 |
| povbot | Bug https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=10388 Choppy audio in SIP conversation, WLAN power save problem? | 23:43 |
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| lcuk | no | 23:43 |
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| lcuk | those are the 9 people out of however many thousands that it might work properly for | 23:44 |
| mece | i don't even know what sip is? I'm sipping this tea though. I don't see how my N900 is involved. | 23:44 |
| trumee | lcuk: plus the thread on tmo http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=792298 | 23:44 |
| trumee | lcuk: but i dont think many people use sip on N900 | 23:44 |
| groovehunter | hi, on N900 i am missing the setting for internet-connection non-WLAN | 23:44 |
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| madtop | lcuk, i use sip, why? | 23:45 |
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| lcuk | madtop, does it work happily for you? | 23:45 |
| madtop | works pretty well even over 3g | 23:46 |
| lcuk | read last bits of scrollback, do those things happen | 23:46 |
| madtop | but has some random problems, which I'm not sure are the fault of my sip provider or bandwidth or whatever | 23:46 |
| madtop | i just joined the channel | 23:46 |
| lcuk | ok madtop | 23:46 |
| madtop | sometimes it seems like certain people i call have problems hearing me, or that it will cut out | 23:46 |
| trumee | lcuk: dont think there are many people who run their own pbx server | 23:46 |
| lcuk | immediately after reboot, one user experiences bad choppyness/cutting out on his system after ~1:15 | 23:46 |
| lcuk | trumee, do you want to try connecting to a public service provider? | 23:47 |
| trumee | lcuk: 3g is another ball game | 23:47 |
| madtop | hmmmm, ive not paid attention to reboot and times | 23:47 |
| lcuk | and seeing if its your server config then | 23:47 |
| lcuk | madtop, the reboot isnt important, its basically every call is unusable after a minute on his system | 23:47 |
| trumee | lcuk: no its not my server config. i have tried default install of two pbxes, asterisk and freeswitch | 23:47 |
| trumee | plus my N95 and hardware sip ata work fine | 23:48 |
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| madtop | i use voip.ms...the problems ive had are as follows: when phone ideals for a while, i have to disable and re-enable the sip thing in order for it to connect | 23:48 |
| trumee | on both these pbx servers. | 23:48 |
| lcuk | but voice quality is ok madtop ? | 23:48 |
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| trumee | madtop: that might be just the sip client losing registration | 23:48 |
| FrieT | madtop: that might be keepalive issues | 23:48 |
| trumee | FrieT: +1 | 23:48 |
| FrieT | set it explicitly instead of relying on "auto" | 23:49 |
| lcuk | trumee, what I am suggesting is trying a server you havent configured | 23:49 |
| madtop | also, the sip interface is highlighted in a way so that you cant see which connection you're clicking on when selecting your server/account before the class | 23:49 |
| madtop | call* | 23:49 |
| lcuk | it *would* determine if its a config issue server side, that granted the n95 might handle differently | 23:49 |
| lcuk | or if its your server | 23:49 |
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| madtop | there are plenty of little bugs and things to improve with maemo/sip | 23:49 |
| FrieT | lcuk: it most definitely is not his server config | 23:49 |
| FrieT | definately* | 23:50 |
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| FrieT | yes there are little things to improve | 23:50 |
| trumee | lcuk: as i said i have tried with both freeswitch and asterisk. it is not a pbx issue. | 23:50 |
| FrieT | but a good start would be making it usable;D | 23:50 |
| genewitch | sorry about earlier, for some reason whenever i wake my computer up it defaults to this channel | 23:50 |
| madtop | but i havent had unusability after a certain amount of time...... ive had sip just cut out (they can hear me i cant hear them) after a seemingl consistent amount of time for a while, but it hasnt happened for a bit | 23:50 |
| genewitch | i do have a question though | 23:50 |
| lcuk | trumee, i dont know how this all works, you have seen, I am a novice at this | 23:50 |
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| lcuk | but when some people experience no call quality issues and you do | 23:50 |
| FrieT | lcuk: name one..? | 23:51 |
| lcuk | it makes sense to look | 23:51 |
| madtop | have they tried it on good wifi? | 23:51 |
| genewitch | I have maemo installed to my internal SD card, and for some reason the desktop and user interface is all... weird, like the onscreen keyboard won't come up, everything is grey, none of the buttons look right | 23:51 |
| lcuk | FrieT, name one what? | 23:51 |
| genewitch | it just started doing this a couple of days ago | 23:51 |
| FrieT | i'd be happy to talk to someone who has a SIP client running on the n900 and does not have any call issues | 23:51 |
| FrieT | that way i could learn from that person | 23:51 |
| trumee | FrieT: luke-jr doesnt have anyy issues apparenlty, he runs asterisk as well | 23:51 |
| FrieT | but up till i talk to someone like that, i'm sure it's not me. works with way too many devices to just go "barf" on n900 | 23:51 |
| FrieT | luke-jr, you around? | 23:52 |
| lcuk | trumee, madtop just said his calls dont have same problem - and the other things are peripheral registration things as you just highlighted yourself | 23:52 |
| FrieT | "does not have any issues" can mean "i tried and it works" | 23:52 |
| FrieT | lcuk: that only happens when there are no commands executed within a timewindow though | 23:53 |
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| FrieT | never during a call | 23:53 |
| lcuk | sure | 23:53 |
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| lcuk | trumee is having call time issues | 23:53 |
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| FrieT | not really | 23:53 |
| lcuk | reproducably so | 23:53 |
| genewitch | why is the n900 sip client so much different from the n800 sip client? | 23:53 |
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| FrieT | he's having what he thinks are sip issues | 23:53 |
| lcuk | FrieT, well every call he just made did the same thing | 23:53 |
| FrieT | but if reconnecting his sip client | 23:53 |
| trumee | lcuk: i am happy set up extensions on my pbx for people to test if they want | 23:54 |
| FrieT | does not make it work again | 23:54 |
| FrieT | it's an audio thing | 23:54 |
| FrieT | it might just as well be PitA | 23:54 |
| lcuk | trumee, it would be easier for you (who knows about sip) to connect to some other known working server | 23:54 |
| FrieT | good point | 23:54 |
| genewitch | my sip server works | 23:54 |
| madtop | when is there another update for stuff like sip, contacts, and the core apps? | 23:54 |
| FrieT | "works" does not mean "is usable for acceptable conversations" ;) | 23:54 |
| trumee | lcuk: yes i dont think it is a sip issue, rather it is an audio issue as highlited by Nokia and Collabora devs. | 23:54 |
| madtop | there are so many easy things to fix | 23:55 |
| FrieT | anyhow.. i'm not complaining per se. i have my ATA's and SIp phones.. | 23:55 |
| lcuk | trumee, but people with same software connect to different servers | 23:55 |
| lcuk | and dont experience this problem | 23:55 |
| FrieT | lcuk: they do, or they just "tried for kicks" | 23:55 |
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| FrieT | there's no way this doesn't happen to everyone.. | 23:55 |
| lcuk | genewitch, do you use sip from your n900? | 23:56 |
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| lcuk | (i saw your real reason for being here and will come back ot in in a minute | 23:56 |
| genewitch | no, sorry, i was only talking about my sip service. i have an n800. | 23:56 |
| FrieT | i have audio hickups all the time. | 23:56 |
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| FrieT | ok how about this trivia: | 23:56 |
| lcuk | FrieT, you and trumee do seem to have issues yes | 23:57 |
| FrieT | i can make an acceptable sip call | 23:57 |
| FrieT | when clocked at 850meg | 23:57 |
| lcuk | genewitch, your gtk themes could have gotten corrupted? | 23:57 |
| genewitch | lcuk: Any way to fix that without a wipe? | 23:57 |
| lcuk | can you still boot from rootfs and see whether the folders are all fine and stuff? | 23:57 |
| FrieT | so as much as i dread the thought of making someone try this: trumee: tried running at a higher clockspeed ? | 23:57 |
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| trumee | FrieT: no not interested in OC | 23:58 |
| lcuk | FrieT, i can fry an egg acceptably on my n900 at 850mhz | 23:58 |
| genewitch | lcuk: i will try that | 23:58 |
| lcuk | that doesnt mean its the right fix | 23:58 |
| FrieT | i'm not saying it's a fix | 23:58 |
| FrieT | i'm saying it's an indication it's not a "bug" but just horribly inefficient code | 23:58 |
| lcuk | and since greatest majority of users do not overclock and works for them.. | 23:58 |
| FrieT | it does not work for them lcuk | 23:58 |
| trumee | FrieT: +1 | 23:59 |
| FrieT | drop that assumption please.. most users don't know Sip.. | 23:59 |
| trumee | lcuk: this is an incorrect reasoning. | 23:59 |
| trumee | FrieT: ++1 | 23:59 |
| FrieT | im not doing it for karma trumee:p | 23:59 |
| lcuk | ok :) | 23:59 |
| FrieT | i'm just thinking out loud | 23:59 |
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