IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2010-07-27

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crashanddiepeb_: please deactivate your script00:18
crashanddiepeb_: on next iteration, you will be quieted until you deactivate it00:18
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zashpeb_: http://sackheads.org/~bnaylor/spew/away_msgs.html00:20
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ultrasparc-viiimortini: in qtD when I make a layout and then go to Form->view code it's all in C... is there a way to get the layout in python? Wondering how I'm going to use qtD for making pyQt layouts00:30
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marcusAnybody having trouble updating the mana world on n900?00:31
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FireFlyHm00:33
FireFlyIs there any way other than rebooting, to get to the enter pin screen if you didn't enter pin code during the actual startup?00:34
kerio huh... open telephone00:35
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FireFlyOh00:36
FireFlyDidn't think about that :p00:36
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DocScrutinizerFireFly: power button, switch on telephone mode00:36
FireFlyNice00:36
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tremnite all, sweet dreams00:38
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DocScrutinizernow is Qt (say a button) implemeted as a *.so, or is it statically linked or compiled in to the ELF?00:41
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logix2does this ovimap suite predownload maps00:57
logix2how the fuck does it come they dont have this for linux when maemo is linux00:58
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MohammadAG51cause linux users are hardcore00:59
* DocScrutinizer hands MohammadAG51 a large icecone (strawberry) for man-db-n90000:59
MohammadAG51we use a magnetized pin to find north00:59
* MohammadAG51 hands DocScrutinizer the beer he owes him01:00
chadino maps for lebanon :(01:00
MohammadAG51or israel01:01
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chadii was reading the forums, and noticed that they switched to new maps01:02
chadilebanon was previously available, but when they upgraded, it's not anymore01:02
* DocScrutinizer snatches ice away from MohammadAG5101:02
DocScrutinizermandb: Warnung: /opt/man/man1/locate.1.gz ist eine freihängende symbolische Verknüpfung01:03
chadifor now, I am using AGTL01:03
DocScrutinizerdangling symlink01:03
DocScrutinizerplus 100 more01:03
MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, ignore the shitload of errors01:03
MohammadAG51warnings*01:03
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DocScrutinizer100? thousands!01:05
DocScrutinizerman locate -> :-)01:05
* DocScrutinizer shrugs and gives ice back to MohammadAG5101:06
MohammadAG51see? :D01:06
DocScrutinizer2>/dev/null ?01:06
MohammadAG51maybe01:07
MohammadAG51but 0=/dev/zero01:07
DocScrutinizer2>/tmp/delete_me_I_am_nonsense.log01:07
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MohammadAG51OMG OMG OMG01:08
MohammadAG51SpeedEvil, level pack 2 & 3 in the ovi store01:08
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logix2try cat /dev/zero > /dev/sda01:08
DocScrutinizerAB?01:08
MohammadAG51yeah01:09
MohammadAG51€2 each01:09
DocScrutinizerlogix2: try cat /dev/random >/dev/wetware/neocortex01:10
alterego01:10
MohammadAG51wow01:11
MohammadAG51so each level pack has 3x21 levels?01:12
DocScrutinizerI actually don't get the hype about AB. NumptyPhysix is much more fun01:12
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MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, ever played it?01:14
* DocScrutinizer stares at blue flashing LED of N900, frowns and mumbles swearwords about stupid new "features" of xchat01:14
DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: I tried some stages of first level. Found it rather boring01:15
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MohammadAG51mine blinks green01:15
DocScrutinizerprobably I'm too different to the standard human being01:15
ieatlintanyone here tried to implement the sharing dialogue api in qt?01:15
MohammadAG51three arms?01:15
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ieatlintam wondering how stupidly impossible it is01:15
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DocScrutinizeronly 3?01:16
Ljrn900...01:16
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SpeedEvilI've ***'d all stages in the first 3*21 stages.01:18
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keriohow do i use the radio chip to scan for a free frequency?01:23
ShadowJKheh01:27
ShadowJKwhich one?01:28
MohammadAG51SpeedEvil, i'm continuing where i left it a month ago, stuck on 3-501:28
SpeedEvilkerio: read the page on category:n900 hardware01:28
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Robot101DocScrutinizer: he's on irc here - or e-mail him, marco.barisione@collabora.co.uk - with patches if you wish :D01:53
DocScrutinizerRobot101: yeah I noticed that. Seems to be afk for this week though? I'll mail him I guess01:54
DocScrutinizerthanks01:54
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TermanaN900good morning01:56
Robot101DocScrutinizer: yeah he's at guadec this week01:56
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DocScrutinizer<UTG>morning TermanaN900 </UTG>01:57
DocScrutinizererrr UGT01:58
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DocScrutinizerMohammadAG51: SpeedEvil: how many % of N900 owners are hardcore AB adicts?01:59
DocScrutinizerguess01:59
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DocScrutinizeri.e. how many downloads of level packs will OVI see?02:00
MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, 1, the rest will be pirated02:00
DocScrutinizerROTFL02:01
DocScrutinizergasp02:01
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* ShadowJK has on more than one occasion tried to create an ovi account, but has so far not succeeded02:03
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* DocScrutinizer has tried to understand OVI basic concept and failed miserably02:03
MohammadAG51ovi's better on symbian tbh02:03
DocScrutinizeryou bet02:03
MohammadAG51i used it to backup calendar contacts and notes02:04
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DocScrutinizerI hoped to do this with N900... guess everybody is aware of the result by now02:05
ShadowJKWell it's relative.. doing anything at all on symbian is difficult, so when the Image gallery knows how to put it on ovi you rejoice at phone no longer holding your files hostage...02:05
DocScrutinizeryeah, actualy oviu share is the only thing that somewhat works on maemo02:05
MohammadAG51and the ovi store (/me laughs)02:06
DocScrutinizernot for me02:06
DocScrutinizermaybe becuase I was so stupid to visit it with desktop PC02:06
MohammadAG51lol02:06
MohammadAG51building a .sis is much harder than building a deb02:07
DocScrutinizercouldn't find any app to *buy*, even sygic was advertised "FREE"02:07
ShadowJKThey don't have a working "No I'm not looking for apps for my eeepc, show me stuff for <x> instead"-option02:07
ShadowJKor atleast not last time i looked :P02:08
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Justushi02:08
Justusis there something like a sygic support channel?02:08
MohammadAG51not that we know of02:08
DocScrutinizerwas so depressing an experiance last time, I'm not temped to give it a second try anytime soon02:08
JustusI have some questions concerning their mobile maps application before I buy it ;)02:08
Justusok, I'll give it a shot here ;)02:08
ShadowJKDocScrutinizer, oh ovo never shows you everything, you get some random subset of what's available, and no "next page" button02:08
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DocScrutinizernice02:09
ShadowJKJustus, I think the version in ovi is 7 day trial02:09
JustusI allready tried that02:09
JustusIs it possible to make the app tell me how far away the next turn is?02:09
DocScrutinizerpick today, never know if you'll find it tomorrow XP02:09
DocScrutinizermight work :-P02:09
JustusIt allways told me to "turn left/right now" even when the turn was a few crossings away02:09
Justussometimes the message was repeated and sometimes not, which lead to some interesting results ^^02:10
MohammadAG51would be lulz if the demo could be purged to be retrialed02:10
DocScrutinizeryou bet it can02:10
Justusso am I stupid or is this really the only way it can announce turns? ^^02:11
ShadowJKThere's a thing in settings, it shows a row of icons representing various areas of the screen. At first I thought you could pick between 4 different predefined layouts, but it's actually allowing you to customize what's displayed02:11
DocScrutinizerexcept if they hold a central database of IMEI02:11
MohammadAG51set up a job in alarmd to purge and reinstall it every 7 days02:11
MohammadAG51DocScrutinizer, doubt it02:11
DocScrutinizerJustus: sorry, no sygic user here02:12
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DocScrutinizer(== me is no...)02:12
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Justusdang02:12
Justusah well, it was worth a try02:12
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JustusSygic support it is then ;)02:12
DocScrutinizermaybe try in +12h02:12
DocScrutinizerpast midnight in Europe02:13
Justusno need to tell me02:13
Justus<- german ;)02:13
ShadowJKSettings - Advanced settings - next next .. and I have Time of arrival, current speed, distance to destination, signal indicator02:13
JustusShadowJK: I know the cool stuff of the sygic app02:13
Justusthe thing with the "turn now" is the ONLY downside I found02:13
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DocScrutinizercorrect timing of correct guidance speech output is an art02:14
Justuswell, they're not even trying02:14
ShadowJKI think I turned off the antialiasing/smoothing of gps signal in the .ini02:15
DocScrutinizerI know what I'm talking about, was part of the crew odds are has built your builtin car navi as well02:15
ShadowJKit was hopelessly late for me02:15
ShadowJKbut also after some time all the voice prompts get delayed by seconds02:15
ShadowJKlike, desynced with what's going on on the screen02:16
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DocScrutinizerblame friggin PA02:16
ShadowJKyep, and alsa02:16
DocScrutinizerif something odd is going on with audio, chances are it's PA's fault02:17
DocScrutinizersee, on my laptop I get delays of days (! literally) for audio output02:17
DocScrutinizerreal fun, you close a window, in the morning, next day in the night it goes "plop"02:18
ShadowJKsicko02:18
DocScrutinizerabsolutely02:18
DocScrutinizercan't iven think of any story explaining that02:19
DocScrutinizereven*02:19
DocScrutinizerfact is it's PA related, maybe also phonon02:19
TermanaN900DocScrutinizer, PA doesnt like that you rag on it, so it plays up for you! :P02:20
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DocScrutinizerobviously02:20
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ShadowJKYeah if I had set my computer to go *plop* at closing window, I'd have hard time coming up with excuses too02:20
DocScrutinizerI'll lock it to the dark cellar for 2 weeks02:20
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JustusI just found the most epic part of sygic mobile maps ^^02:21
Justusit has a country overview, with different rules for allowed speed and so on02:21
Justusthat is pure gold02:21
ShadowJKalso whether you need winter tyres in the winter02:22
ShadowJKand if headlights must be on at all times02:22
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Justushow I hope that there is a solution to this one issue02:23
DocScrutinizer>>All features of the microprocessor are not exploited in the N900.<<02:23
DocScrutinizerewrrm02:23
DocScrutinizeris that GB English?02:23
TermanaN900N900 exploitation!?02:24
Justusit's a little grammar bug I'd guess02:24
TermanaN900you bad people :P02:24
DocScrutinizerfor me it sounds like "all the features are unused in N900"02:24
JustusSet the "not" in the front of this sentence and you have it02:24
Justusno02:24
Justusnot all features are used02:24
DocScrutinizercorrect English for me would be "Not all features of the microprocessor are exploited in the N900<<02:25
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Justusas I said, put the "not" in front and your good02:25
DocScrutinizeryep02:25
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LjLDocScrutinizer: to me, "not all" sounds more natural than "all ... not", but the two mean the same thing02:30
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DocScrutinizerthat's a false friend in semantics for Germans then02:32
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DocScrutinizernot links forward, not backwards02:33
DocScrutinizerall x are (not y)02:33
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DocScrutinizerin German you might have that meaning on a construct like "[some might]..., BUT all are not"02:36
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Justusnope02:37
Justus"Es werden nicht alle Möglichkeiten des Mikroprozessors genutzt"02:37
JustusNot all features of the microprocessor are used"02:38
DocScrutinizeraber alle werden (trotzdem) nicht genutzt02:38
Justusthere's no "but" in the original sentence02:38
DocScrutinizerexactly02:38
Justusyup, so no need for a but on the german sentence ^^02:38
ham5boogabooga02:38
DocScrutinizerthat's why I say false friend02:38
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Justushuh? I still can't see the problem, there is a direct translation without any boobytraps02:39
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DocScrutinizerJustus: I was just explaining there - very rarely - actually are cases where we got same upside down meaning in german. But usually translating that sentence from english will make you think the opposite of what it seems to mean in English. Due to german 'false friend' semantics02:40
Justusyou mean "all but" combinations e.g.?02:41
DocScrutinizernevermind, it's fixed in wiki since an hour02:41
Justusuhm, ok, allthough you left me more confused than I was before ^^02:42
DocScrutinizerI guess that's a local dialect of Scotland ;-)02:45
DocScrutinizerhuh SpeedEvil ? XD02:45
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mc_teocan some one have a look at this process list02:47
mc_teohttp://paste.pocoo.org/show/24203402:47
SpeedEvilsorry - where02:47
DocScrutinizerto do what?02:47
DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: lol02:47
mc_teomy n900 is laggy, so is there any memory whore among this list02:47
DocScrutinizerhttp://wiki.maemo.org/N900_CPU02:47
SpeedEvilDocScrutinizer: hmm - it is ambigous.02:48
DocScrutinizeryep02:48
DocScrutinizerexactly02:48
SpeedEvilI think I meant 'Some features'02:48
DocScrutinizersome of the features are not exploited02:48
mc_teolike surely there shouldnt be like 10 skyhost processes running?02:49
DocScrutinizerskyhost? WTF02:49
DocScrutinizerkillall -9 skyhost02:49
mc_teothats what i thought02:49
mc_teoare you sure?02:49
mc_teowhats it for?02:50
DocScrutinizernever heard of02:50
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DocScrutinizermc_teo: for your reference: http://paste.debian.net/81480/02:52
DocScrutinizerwtf is sapwood-server??02:53
ham5lmfgtfy02:54
DocScrutinizeryesyesyes02:54
DocScrutinizer*yawn*02:54
mc_teoDocScrutinizer: it wont die02:54
DocScrutinizerrather kill it and see what's going to stall02:54
mc_teojust says it cant be killed02:55
ham5Sapwood is a pixbuf-based 'theme' that allows you to configure the look of. GTK-using programs. .02:55
DocScrutinizerburrrp02:55
DocScrutinizerthanks02:55
mc_teoand then the pids are changed02:55
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DocScrutinizeryou got a friggin sky virus02:55
DocScrutinizer:-P02:56
DocScrutinizerI know skyhook wireless - they do the location shit for apple02:56
DocScrutinizerbut skyhost, no idea02:56
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DocScrutinizerjoghurt sport? maemohotspot?02:58
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logix2beat the fucking chess on n90002:59
logix2i cant do it on easy either02:59
mc_teoDocScrutinizer: googles first result was a talk.maemo page02:59
DocScrutinizerhttp://merusers.de/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=31&start=1003:00
mc_teoit has something to do with skype03:00
DocScrutinizerblargh, skype03:00
DocScrutinizerisn't it interesting that it appears in a thread about short battry life? :-P03:01
DocScrutinizerrunning skype on a mobile device is daft03:01
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DocScrutinizerskype - by definition - is a peer to peer network for VoIP. It - also by definition - is consequently designed to exploit *your* hardware, cpu time, bandwidth, and battery, for forwarding data between other people you don't have any relation to03:04
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DocScrutinizeryou'd be better off running a filesharing server on your N90003:05
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* mortini makes a cluster of n900's03:06
mvahi there03:06
DocScrutinizerat least you are ure then the people using your resources are doing that because they want and they know what they do, and maybe even say thanks to you03:06
mc_teoi turned off my skype account, and they all disappeared03:07
logix2running skype on n900 with wireless conn is just another not understandable conversation where u can hardly pickup couple of words and still without video03:07
mvadoes amybody plays in Abuse?03:07
logix2guess i would go even further from the ap it would suck even more03:07
logix2sheet is only good for chat03:07
logix2even on msn i miss out parts of the conversation lulz03:07
mc_teologix2: i had a full 18 minute call today03:07
DocScrutinizer51use xchat, noob!03:08
mc_teoonly went funny for a minutek but that was his side03:08
DocScrutinizer51(sent from N900 xchat)03:08
prontoxchat on my n900 crashes anymore when i try to connecto my znc ;_;03:09
DocScrutinizerand also SIP works great, and is integrated into dialer et al framework03:09
DocScrutinizerDocScrutinizer51 is ZNC bouncer03:10
DocScrutinizerno issues with xchat, but ZNC recently segfaults03:10
mc_teoim using n900 atm03:10
mc_teoand i use Rizons ZNC bouncer on there whole time03:11
mc_teoand never had any problem with it03:11
DocScrutinizerwell I guess it won't segfault any more, as I run it under strace now. Using Murphy to fix things03:14
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logix2and u had ur phone on wireless?03:21
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logix2mine is like from 2m from the ap03:21
logix2skype still crap03:21
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logix2just calling skype users not to mention using their skype out03:22
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GAN900timeless_mbp, ping?03:24
DocScrutinizer51GAN900: moo03:24
GAN900DocScrutinizer51, hey-ho.03:24
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ech0Asussup04:00
mortininyet.04:00
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* DocScrutinizer wonders what a crap that gaia TWL4030 chip must be, so Nokia decided not to use the PHY for USB, the audio amplifiers, the battery charging, SmartReflex (as for switching the regulators)...04:02
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DocScrutinizeror is it cargo cult EE? Seen that on 'other devices' :-P where they added a mono amp for absolutely nothing, just because they didn't realize it's not needed anymore when switching from stereo in the predecessor device to mono in gta02. Wolfson codec 8753 had a even better amp builtin04:05
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ds3GAIA?04:10
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ech0Asusit didn't happen like that04:18
ech0Asusyou know damn well what i'm talking about mr.. dude!04:18
ech0Asusthats right.. take the silent position..04:20
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DrGeekg'day all04:30
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DrGeekI have an n900 and I cannot type to X applications in a debian chroot.  Any idea what might cause this?04:50
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Paulyhey any1 use fcamera?05:00
Paulyim using gimp with ubuntu  and cant open the Adobe DNG raw images?05:01
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ham5on the same xserver drgeek?05:10
DrGeekham5, yeah.05:11
DrGeekham5, the same one that comes with the maemo install05:11
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DrGeekham5, xev reports no keypress/releases too05:11
ham5no idea then sorry05:11
ham5thought debian chroot ran its own x05:12
DrGeekhmm, maybe it does?  my chroot is /media/mmc3 and I'm bind-mounting /tmp to /media/mmc3/tmp to re-use the existing X server05:13
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Macerwow05:49
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Macergoing to take this macbook 8 hours to encode a video for the n900 from a hgih def mkv05:49
Maceri'm encoding the 5th element05:49
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Osamahey05:50
Osamaany1 here?05:52
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Osamanokia called some stupid camera app "exciting news"??? LOLZ05:53
ham5omweather or foreca05:53
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Osamawhats next for maemo?05:53
asjOsama: you refereing to fcamera?05:53
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Osamayes fcamera05:53
Osamalolz05:54
asjOsama: try it, it's pretty damn cool05:54
Osamasounfs gimmicky05:54
Osamasounds05:54
asjOsama: it's anything but, more of an engineering project looking for a better ui05:55
* SpeedEvil1 holds up his multipass.05:57
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Osamathats the problem with linux.... buncha geeks running around showing windowz 95 on their phones...lolz....who cares???05:58
ham5?05:58
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asjOsama: so if it's gimmicky you bitch, if it's too techy you bitch, do you have anything to contribute?05:58
Osamachill buddy05:59
Osamadidnt know expressing an opinion was a criminal offence lolz06:00
ham5go rant some where else osama06:00
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MacerSpeedEvil1: haha06:01
MacerSpeedEvil1: best character is zorg :) he is my hero06:02
lpotterwhat does fcam have to do with windows95 running on a linux phone?06:02
Macerjean baptiste emanuelle zorg06:02
Osamalpotter: i was just trying to say that all this linux talk is full of unpractical shit06:02
Macerexagerated maybe. unpractical not so much.06:03
lpotterwell, climbing Mt Danali is unpractical too06:03
Osamaunfinished or abandoned apps....poorly coded apps....et06:03
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Maceri can understand what you mean by calling a camera app exciting news is odd though... it was like when the iphone had "now with videos" commercials for the newer iphone like they crached the technology :)06:04
OsamaMacer: exactly06:04
Osamaunfortunately mameo can only hope in their dreams to be like apple and android06:05
lpotteri dunno, fcam is more innovative than most apps06:05
MacerOsama: well. i believe it can be on par or better .. well. probably not maemo so much now as meego can be06:06
Osamalpotter: i fail to see fcam innovative... it's gimmick06:06
ham5rant rannnnnnnt06:06
lpotteri guess you did not read the pdf paper on it then06:06
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Osamawhut?06:06
Macerbut apple and google have 2 things going for them... apple and google ;)06:06
lpotterand no, maemo does not want to be like ios or android06:07
Macernokia doesn't seem to know what direction it wants to go with its operating systems06:07
lpotteryes we do06:07
lpotterwhen you have only one phone, you only have one os06:07
Osamalpotter: actually , maemo is dead so it doesnt matter what it wants to be...it's dead. simple, aint it?06:07
Macerlpotter: android runs on multiple phones and platforms though06:07
lpotterMacer: os doesnt matter with Qt06:07
lpotterI am fairly sure maemo isnt dead06:08
Macerlpotter: i suppose that is a valid point but just because it is qt doesn't mean that is all their is to it06:08
Osamalpotter: read the news lately?06:08
lpotternews schmews06:08
Macersome might argue it wouldn't matter with gtk either. which is what maemo was using wasn't it?06:08
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ham5distros come and go06:08
lpotterI also read pigs can fly in some cercumstances06:08
ham5simpley06:08
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OsamaOS does matter.... Qt is secondary06:09
ham5mabey if u knew 2 shits about linux06:09
ham5unix is ios droid uses linux too06:09
Macerandroid uses it as a hal06:09
lpotterya, I dont know about linux06:09
ham5lpotter talkin to osama06:10
lpotterahh ok06:10
Macerother than that i don't think the linux part of it really does much06:10
ham5he wants to rant and hes dum06:10
ham5;)06:10
lpotterandroid is not linux06:10
OsamaLinux may be great but it aint nothing more than os for geeks06:10
Macerlpotter: linux is a kernel ;)06:10
ham5uses a linux kernel..06:10
Macerjust because it doesn't have a gnu base doesn't mean it isn't linux06:10
lpotterno, it uses a fork of linux06:10
OsamaGUYS....who gives a fuck?06:10
lpotterwe do, obviously06:11
asjOsama: we do06:11
ham5LETS RANT OSAMA06:11
Osamaasj: right... the all 4 of you on earth care...LOLZ06:11
Macerbut i am in disagreement with you lpotter as far as only worrying about one phone in regards to the iphone06:11
Macern900 is the only phone thus far running maemo5 and probably the last06:11
OsamaMacer: probably???? its a fucken done deal mate06:12
lpotterbut maemo is not nokia's only phone os06:12
OsamaN900 is as dead as it can be06:12
Macerand android runs across multiple platforms and has taken a farily straightforward development path... for some reason though nokia seems to have pretty much released an OS with a short life and then swapped over to meego with intel06:12
lpotterwow, I am pretty sure my n900 still works fine06:13
Macerlpotter: oh I understand that.. but which OSes does nokia have? maemo/meego and symbian06:13
OsamaLOLZ... right and next year Nokia will come up with yet another OS....called fuckgo06:13
Macerwith meego being for their smartphones and symbian moving over to the lower/middle end phones06:13
asjMacer: s40 and s3006:14
lpotterMacer: symbian^3, s60, s40, maemo, and in the future, meego too06:14
ham5GUYS....who gives a fuck?06:14
lpotterwe do06:14
ham5lol06:14
Osamatoo many damn OS nokia has...LOLZ06:14
ham5they dont have any os06:14
ham5the own ovi... right06:14
Osamaovi is shit too06:14
ham5own that06:15
lpottermy grandma used to say, dont keep all your eggs in one basket06:15
Macerlpotter: i honestly think that maemo is dead.. or at the very least on its way06:15
asjOsama: I don't see andriod running on a $20 throwaway phone in papa new guinea...do you?06:15
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ieatlintlpotter: android is linux -- linux being a kernel, which android uses06:15
Osamaasj: who gives a fuck?06:15
ieatlintwoo, pedantic fight06:15
Macerieatlint: :) haha06:15
lpotterMacer: I dont. but what would I know about maemo06:15
asjOsama: if I lived there, I would :)06:15
ham5as long as they keep putting cocaine in the screens idk06:15
ieatlintandroid is not gnu, etc06:15
Osamaasj: they can have their cheap s40 fones....fuck developing countries06:16
Macerieatlint: heh. well. it isn't. i suppose you can build gnu apps for it.. which would actually be awesome06:16
Macerandroid is a pretty good OS and would be great if it had apt :)06:16
lpotterit's spelled, phones, not fones06:16
Macerwith a gnu based repo for it06:16
Osamalpotter: who gives a fuck about spelling? u a teacher or somethin?06:17
lpottermaybe06:17
ieatlintMacer: yeah, but that would defeat the reasons they chose their sandboxed java system06:17
Macerieatlint: not really. that can still be used for the ui end of it06:17
ieatlintmaemo's lack of sandboxing has a real risk of coming around to bite its ass in the future06:17
Osamawhen is the 1st mego fone comin out?06:18
lpotterOsama: knowledge is power06:18
Macerieatlint: i disagree ;)06:18
Maceri love the fact that maemo has stuff i can use in a term06:18
Macersomething that i always thought was lacking in android06:18
Macerandroid had pico tho.. i can give it that much .. but that was a cyanogen rom06:18
Macerso i suppose it is possible but nobody has taken that path06:19
OsamaMacer: 99.99% of population dont give a flying fuck about terminal06:19
MacerOsama: then they can use winmob ;)06:19
Maceror get an iphone06:19
OsamaMacer: nah.... winmob is shit06:19
ieatlinti could put an app promoted to extras that was not malicious, then push out an update that did things like take all the photos off your phone, or start reporting your geo location to me06:19
Osamamaemo is full of security holes....scary06:19
ieatlintyes, the peer-review is meant to prevent this06:19
Macerieatlint: fair point06:20
ieatlintbut i'm somehow not too trusting that a bunch of other geeks sit around reading other's code06:20
microlithtechnically you could do that with any platform, so long as it's hidden well enough06:20
Macerieatlint: who is to say they're not in on it too ? ;)06:20
Osamahow can an OS thats run by a bunch of pimple faced geeks be taken seriously?06:20
microlithOsama: leave, please06:20
ieatlintmicrolith: typically there's a security system involved -- although you could argue that users will just blindly click through it06:20
Osamahuh?06:21
microlithieatlint: in the same way Apple missed the tethering app they posted on their store?06:21
ieatlintbut you'd get enough going "hey! why does this text editor want to access my gps?" that it could get reported06:21
microlithOsama: you're here to troll, obviously.06:21
ham5called that like an hour ago06:21
lpotterOsama: same way major corporations take linux seriously06:21
ieatlinteh, i was referring more to android.. i'm less familiar with iphone out of wilful/blissful ignorance06:22
Osamamicrolith: everybody that has a different opinion from yours is a troll ?06:22
Macermicrolith: haha. it's nice to have a troll every now and then :) gets everybody all riled up06:22
microlithOsama: if you had a valid point, no. but insulting people for no apparent reason, aside from 4chan level OS hate?06:22
* ieatlint backtraces Osama and calls the cyber police06:23
Macerlpotter: honestly he did have a point in the fact that there are a LOT of abandoned/unfinished apps for linux06:23
lpotterMacer: just like any other os06:23
Macerbut unfortunately i suppose that is the way of the "openness" of it all :)06:23
microlithMacer: but that has no impact on -Linux- itself06:23
Osamalook....im not trying to cause shit06:23
Macerlpotter: oh i understand that.06:23
Osamajust pointing out weaknesses06:23
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microlithOsama: that's not pointing out a weakness, at best it's a strawman. at worst, it's a pointless ad-hominem against a rather large group of people.06:24
lpotterwell, I dont see how having abandonded/unfinished apps is a weakness06:24
Macerlpotter: only if you are one of the people who can't code and really want the app ;)06:24
Osamacan we all agree that maemo is dead?06:24
lpotterjust like having junk car lots is not a weakness06:24
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Macerbad similie06:25
lpotterOsama: no, because maemo is not dead06:25
DocScrutinizercan we all agree we're playing nice in this chan?06:25
ieatlintMacer: just befriend more people who can code06:25
Osamalpotter: do explain06:25
ieatlintand then encourage them (not nag), and provide positive feedback and suggestions06:25
lpotterOsama: ok. maemo is not dead.06:25
Osamalpotter: very deep mate06:26
Macerieatlint: haha. hi... hey.. you want to come over and watch this game with me and some friends and sift through 10,000 lines of code and fix this for me?06:26
lpotterthanks, I try to be06:26
Macerieatlint: don't think that would work out :)06:26
ieatlintwtf app are you using that's 10k lines?06:26
Osamalpotter: but maemo is dead.... read the news06:26
Macerieatlint: just an example06:26
ieatlintand provide some good booze, and we'll talk06:26
lpotterthe "news" does not know06:26
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Macerieatlint: hahahha06:26
Osamalpotter: official nokia peole know06:26
ieatlintyeah, if the news reported maemo was dead, people would just ask wtf maemo was06:26
lpotterthe 'news' also gets excited because ios joined 199506:27
lpotterOsama: I would assume we would know06:27
Osamai was talking to some higher ups at nokia and they said nobody is working on maemo no more...its all mego from now on06:27
ieatlintlpotter: i'm hoping we get some reporter who confuses iphones with the real ios06:27
Macermaemo is like the canadian prime minister.. if he were shot to death it would be in the news for a day or two.. maybe later on too for the funeral and after that the world wouldn't care. if the president of the united states was shot then it would be in the news for months06:27
lpotterOsama: and you think management really knows?06:28
Macer:)06:28
DocScrutinizerOsama: please stop generalizing and stating stereotypes06:28
Osamalpotter: some do...the ones i was talkin to06:28
Macerbut i'm sure people in canada like their PM for the most part06:28
ieatlintlpotter: dude, give it up.. you're talking to a wall06:28
lpotterOsama: riiight06:28
Osamawhy are you guys so mean spirited can i ask?06:28
Osamawhat have i done to yous?06:29
lpotterieatlint: but I miss having troll fights on ./06:29
DocScrutinizerwhy are you so blockheaded?06:29
ieatlintOsama: we're bitter because we're stuck on a dead platform06:29
Macerbut realistically. whether he is trolling or not... i still agree with osama and consider maemo to be on its way out as nokia has honstly pulled most of its support in order to pursue meego with intel & co06:29
ieatlintoh, and we're on irc.. it's implicit that we're angry06:29
microlithOsama: well for one you insulted a lot of people that I work with, if indirectly06:29
Osamamicrolith: not intnetionally06:29
ieatlintif you're on irc, you're either angry, looking for warez/credit card numbers, or idling06:29
* luke-jr is idling.06:30
microlithOsama: you don't call a bunch of developers "pimply faced geeks" unintentionally06:30
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asjieatlint: I beg to differ06:30
Macerluke-jr: haha06:30
ieatlintasj: you sound angry06:30
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luke-jrmicrolith: you clearly haven't read BOFH06:30
Macerieatlint: you forgot sex with the underaged06:30
Osamamicrolith: thats the peception out there mate06:30
lpotterieatlint: oh he is angry. I can see it from here06:30
asjlpotter: ;p~06:30
microlithOsama: maybe amongst the ignorant06:30
DocScrutinizerOsama: go read http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=45213 for example. Please come back *after* you did06:31
OsamaDocScrutinizer: i did06:31
luke-jrI'll prepare the stake…06:31
DocScrutinizerieatlint: I'm definitely angry06:31
luke-jrwho wants to get the gasoline?06:31
MacerDocScrutinizer: :) i don't understand why you always post that link as though it is something that says "maemo isn't dead"06:31
ieatlinti'm always angry or drunk06:32
ieatlintat the moment, the former -- perhaps because not the latter06:32
Macerrealistically all it is saying is that apps written in qt for meego are able to be back ported to maemo06:32
* lpotter goes back to work on something for maemo06:32
Osamathere was another question i had....where can i download a crack for the navigation app for n900? can you point me?06:32
microlithOsama: gtfo06:32
luke-jryou want news? positive news?06:33
luke-jrhow about this then:06:33
* Macer drum roll06:33
luke-jrI actually spoke only positively about N900 to someone today06:33
ieatlintmaemo is dead, but meego is not, and meego is aiming to provide backwards compatibility with maemo while maemo is providing forwards-compatibility with meego (qt support)06:33
DocScrutinizerMacer: maemo are 5 chars, or an operating system. Tell me what's the exact meaning of 'dead' for a lifeless object, or stfu06:33
Osamathere used to be a vibrant warez community on symbian....06:33
luke-jrzomg… ovi maps warez plz06:33
lpotteri am _pretty sure_ someone is still working on things for maemo06:34
Osamalpotter: no06:34
lpotterreally06:34
luke-jrlpotter: who?06:34
lpottergofigure06:34
ieatlintlpotter: bugfixes i hope/suspect, but expanding capability... i'd speculate that to be unlikely06:34
MacerDocScrutinizer: you can run a lot of w32 apps in windows 2000.. but does that mean you stick with an OS that was released 10 years ago simply because you can run a game in it? the majority of people wish to have a new OS that exploits the capabilities of their hardware. otherwise the world would have stuck with DOS06:34
lpotterya, well. how would I know06:34
GAN900lpotter, maybe all of 5 people.06:34
lpottermaybe 5 people within 15 meters of me06:35
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Osamanokia fucked up with n90006:35
Macerdead means that maemo will not truly realize the potential of the hardware because the support for it (official support as well as developers crossing the line) is fading06:35
ieatlintMacer: interesting analogy, because anything you wrote for win2k would work fine in win706:35
GAN900Jumping to Nokia's defense with regards to their treatment of N900 users is, perhaps, a bit blinder-induced.06:35
lpotterOsama: care to clarify?06:35
Macerieatlint: but not the other way around for some things ;)06:36
Osamalpotter: they introduce it to the market and 6 months later say "see u later suckers mego is coming"06:36
ieatlintMacer: true, but my point is that developing for maemo is not a dead end, which is the only concern i'd have with a dead os06:36
MacerDocScrutinizer: my definition of a dead OS is an OS that no longer receives official support from the company that released it06:36
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DocScrutinizerwtf support?06:36
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ieatlintOsama: iphone and android are the same way06:37
Macerespecially for a mobile OS06:37
DocScrutinizersupport as in "how do I find which crappy app eats my cpu and bat"?06:37
ieatlintit's the way of mobile computing right now06:37
Osamaieatlint: no....wrong....wrong wrong...not after 5 months06:37
MacerDocScrutinizer: no. support as in "how can we write code to make the gles work smoother"06:38
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: cellmo drivers06:38
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: switch to Offline Mode06:38
DocScrutinizerthis is digital - not a car that needs oil change every 10.00006:38
Osamanokia is laughing right now....got all the suckers to buy n900 and now kaboom06:38
MacerDocScrutinizer: you would think. but an OS finds its refinement with time06:38
DocScrutinizerorly06:38
Macermaemo's refinement from nokia's perspective seems to be meego06:39
luke-jrOsama: if that were true, Nokia wouldn't have sent me one free of charge06:39
lpotterwhat?06:39
luke-jrOsama: so at least I am pretty sure Nokia isn't intentionally trying to screw people here06:39
Osamaluke-jr: lucky u mate06:39
luke-jrand seeing as I'm not alone, I think everyone can rest assured that is true06:39
DocScrutinizerso you bought a device with a OS that doesn't perform up to your expectations, and you claim Nokia is obliged to deliver now for, how long did you say?06:39
* lpotter sends luke-jr a bill on Nokia's boards' behalf06:40
luke-jrlpotter: I wouldn't have bought one, either. :p06:40
Osama1 year minimum06:40
DocScrutinizerMacer: that sounds rather daft06:40
lpotterOsama: and what makes you so sure Nokia isn't officailly supporting meamo still?06:41
MacerDocScrutinizer: the problem is that it met expectations but even more fine tuning and refinement was expected .. new features and innovations that would allow maemo to jump out06:41
luke-jrOsama: one thing I've noticed since buying my N810… is that Nokia never actually seems to advertise anything much for their tablets06:41
Osamalpotter: all nokias resources are into meego now....maemo is a dead horse mate06:41
Macerand nokia wants to do that in the form of meego06:41
luke-jrI thought they claimed Linux, but I don't see that word anywhere either06:41
luke-jrexcept in the community06:41
ham5distro06:41
Macerwhich imho is just trying to follow the android example of creating a multi platform mobile OS06:42
lpotterOsama: really.06:42
Macerthat is successful and gathers hype :)06:42
Osamalpotter: take off the fanboy blinders06:42
lpotterheh06:42
asjOsama: so where do you get your info?06:42
* lpotter is not a blind nokia fanboi06:43
Osamaasj: www.meego.com.... are u living on a deserted island mate?06:43
lpotteryep. its called australia06:43
Macerhahaha06:43
cherifflol06:43
asjlpotter: ouch06:43
DocScrutinizerOsama: either you go read that thread to understand maemo/meego compatibility, and you stop stating that "dead horse" shit, or I start getting angry, and you don't want me getting angry06:43
Maceryeah that was rough06:43
OsamaDocScrutinizer: why be mad?06:44
luke-jrOsama is riding a dead horse.06:44
luke-jr:D06:44
asjlpotter: it's not like it's new zealand...06:44
* microlith doesn't want DocScrutinizer turning big and green...06:44
lpotterasj: or even Gilligans Island06:44
luke-jrJust sit right back and you'll hear a tale…06:44
asjlpotter: how do you know it's not...I was promised a 2 hour boat ride...06:45
lpotterdang it, now I lost all todays code mojo06:45
luke-jrlol06:46
Macerlpotter: it's ok. acceptance is one of the final stages06:46
Macer:)06:46
OsamaDocScutinizer: you talk a big game about all this "compatibility" shit lemme ask you a simple question: it's a known fact that all future meego fones will have multitouch capacitive screens and hence apps will not be backwars compatible. your little compatibility shit is out the window mate.06:46
GAN900Osama, I wouldn't call it a "fact"06:46
lpotterheh06:46
luke-jrOsama: capacitive sucks. we can implement resistive multitouch06:46
Macerhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C3%BCbler-Ross_model06:46
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o DocScrutinizer06:47
ham5wheres the sms html?06:47
GAN900Nokia seems to be headed that direction themselves, unfortunately06:47
asjOsama: that's like saying you can't use a trackball since it's not a mouse06:47
*** Osama was kicked by DocScrutinizer (WTF?!)06:47
ham5THANK YOU06:47
*** ChanServ sets mode: -o DocScrutinizer06:47
DocScrutinizernight, fellas06:47
MacerHAHAHAHAH06:47
GAN900But that doesn't precluded other manufacturers from offering something different06:47
GAN900Or Nokia to shift direction06:47
lpotterhmmpf. now what I am gonna do06:47
ham5lol06:47
ham5develop06:47
ham5e06:47
Macerlpotter: yeah. :/06:47
luke-jrDocScrutinizer: what if he returns?06:48
Macerguess i'll go finish this fedora install or something06:48
GAN900Still, once bitten, twice shy, three times still naive and four times just damn tired of the bullshit.06:48
asjlpotter: I got a problem you could fix for me :)06:48
lpotterasj: go ask the Professor06:48
Macerawesome. vbox didn't boot this fedora install06:49
Macermeh. i'll work on it later or something :)06:49
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* GAN900 will just continue to con free devices out of Nokia for as long as possible and move on to a company that doesn't hate him as a customer when the opportunity arises.06:49
microliththat's not a bad plan06:49
yigalopportunist and yet understandably so06:50
lpotterya, nokia hates the n900 users so much.. thats why it released PR1.206:50
GAN900Clearly they're not interested in my money (although apparently they like the thousands of ours I've invested in the platform)06:50
GAN900lpotter, Nokia hates me as a customer.06:50
lpotterbad credit?06:50
GAN900Short, half-assed support, continued drift in both hardware and software away from something I want to own.06:51
GAN900Plus I live in the US.06:51
yigalIt's the idea that an a half OS project doesn't deserve support, it's very funny06:51
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GAN900Clearly there's a problem when droves of your core contributors are burnt out and tired of your platform and your company.06:53
yigalnow Meego will be powering automobile computers, lol06:53
asjGAN900: developers always change06:54
microlithmeego is not nokia, however, though I don't expect you'll see -any- support beyond dealer service for those06:54
lpotterfine. I'll work on meego stuff now then06:54
microlith"I rooted my car!"06:54
yigalI still like the community base of Maemo, however scarred it is from Nokia's (lack of) involvement06:55
lpotterheh06:55
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lpotterya,because nokia is not involved at all06:55
ham5make some pretty good hardware :)06:55
lpottermicrolith: if you only knew what that means in Australian06:56
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microlithlpotter: I'll assume it's vulgar and be happy06:56
GAN900asj, so we don't care?06:56
GAN900asj, good to know.06:56
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yigalinsults flung at Nokia, hmm don't really believe in Karma, but in this case ...07:01
ieatlintcould be worse, could be openmoko07:01
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lpotterthat kharma07:01
lpotterthat's07:01
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* peb_ is gone. Gone since Wed Jul 21 19:58:59 201007:02
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yigalwhat ever, it's all Hindi too me07:02
yigalor Sanskrit07:02
yigalhowever you take it07:02
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yigalha, I had such hopes in that project07:02
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asjoof07:02
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yigallotsa netsplit07:02
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luke-jrMaemo #1 feature: post pics to facebook within seconds07:03
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