IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2009-10-04

zerojayEspadaV8_L: Yes.00:00
fralsguess ill go to bed and sober up instead of reading more about mms right now... nite all o/00:01
EspadaV8_LJaffa and zerojay: thanks00:01
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woglindeoh rio made it not madrid00:12
lbtJaffa: zerojay: GeneralAntilles:
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javispedroRST38h: lol.00:15
Jaffalbt: ta00:15
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lbtI thought the colours were different...00:16
zerojaylbt: I was looking at it and thinking "why does he have a fuzzy picture of a shopping list in the background", lol.00:18
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lardmanRST38h: did it work?00:21
RST38hlardman: I do not know yet00:21
lardmanah ok, no worries00:22
RST38hjavispedro: And just in case the guy deletes all references to his post, here it is, at the bottom:
lbtJaffa: hold on - *much* better ones coming00:26
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lbtJaffa: zerojay: GeneralAntilles: There are 4 piccies in this set:
lbtThe text is a tad moody...00:36
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cvandonderenI get a segfault when trying to use CMake on the Fremantle_Armel target...00:37
cvandonderencheck for working C compiler: /scratchbox/compilers/bin/gcc qemu: uncaught target signal 1100:38
cvandonderenis this a known problem?00:38
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RST38hlardman: Error:00:40
RST38hOpening database... /root/.mbarcode/mbarcode.db00:40
RST38hError opening database: unable to open database file00:40
lbtJaffa: zerojay: GeneralAntilles: There are 4 piccies in this set:    (resend - lost connection)00:41
lardmanoh balls, thought I'd sorted that out00:41
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lardmanhmm, just got an interesting thing on my N800, plugged the charger in and it made a funny sound effect noise and said "Not charging"00:41
lardmanRST38h: I'll look at that tomorrow and post some updated binaries00:42
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lbtah, the N900 has launched and planned obsolesence happens..00:42
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hunter007Hi, somebody know if exists troubles installing maemo-dev toolkit, with nvidia drivers?00:43
lardmanshouldn't think so00:44
woglindegl stuff maybee?00:44
lardmanhmm, well it installed fine, I've not tried running the x86 stuff though00:45
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hunter007ok, thanks00:45
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lardmannight all00:53
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GeneralAntillesMan these guys can work themselves up over nothing.00:55
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lcukGeneralAntilles, you seen this?
woglindehe lcuk01:01
lcukhi woglinde \o01:01
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lcukJaffa, you too - that looks COOL01:01
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GeneralAntilleslcuk, yeah, what about it?01:10
* GeneralAntilles has been using C4D since version 4.01:10
CutMeOwnThroatah, a rich mans bender01:10
lbtmmm ... will it blender01:11
* lbt blendered a garage!!!01:12
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GeneralAntillesFocus bugs. :(01:13
till-nice :)01:14
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b-man16~seen xnt1401:30
infobotxnt14 <> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 2d 22h 50m 38s ago, saying: '~seen b-man16'.01:30
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Jaffazerojay: Missing icon image issue fixed in 0.0.4 :)02:09
lbtnight all02:09
lbtJaffa: did you see the 2nd batch ... much nicer02:09
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Jaffalbt: I did.02:10
JaffaBah. Extras won't let me upload02:11
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JaffaEspadaV8_L: ...of my new app, Hermes.02:17
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Jaffarcadden wrote some stuff about it: - it's not end-user ready yet, but it's getting there quite quickly02:18
EspadaV8_Lah, what's it do?02:18
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EspadaV8_Lah, cool02:19
EspadaV8_Lshall have to look at adding that :)02:20
`0660__Hermes is really cool02:20
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EspadaV8_L:( unable to load for me02:24
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t_s_owhat rss reader is people using these days?02:26
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GeneralAntillesJaffa, what, you _aren't_ selling contact information to DoubleClick?03:13
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GeneralAntillesSomebody wouldn't happen to have the Summit schedule in a calendar I could import somewhere, would they?03:38
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lcukhow would you split up the days03:39
lcukerrr tracks03:39
lcukGeneralAntilles, ^03:39
GeneralAntillesJust overlapping events.03:39
lcukdoes it look right?03:39
GeneralAntillesMost calendars should be able to handle it just fine.03:39
lcukbut could we filter to the track03:39
GeneralAntillesSure, you could have each track as a separate calendar.03:40
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lcuklooks like something i once wrote long ago in visual basic :)03:40
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lcukwhy not just take the page printed03:41
lcukor saved03:41
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GeneralAntilleslcuk, dunno, I feel like having a real calendar.03:49
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* lcuk nods03:50
BBNShi lcuk, nice to meet you. may i ask how you do the beat detection on "N900 liqflow music" video?03:50
BBNSi am so used to FMOD doing DSP for me and eager to find a replacement on Maemo.03:51
lcukBBNS, accelerometer - it detects the actual drumming on the tables03:51
BBNSlcuk: oh ok. o_o i though it's doing some FFT sampling in the backend.03:51
lcukno, much more natural and fluid03:51
lcukif you dont jam along, it just flows gently03:52
BBNSahh ... thanks for answering! it's really sick.03:52
BBNSi am trying to port some of my iPhone code (which does the similar thing in your video). but they relies on DSP. if there is any FMOD replacement on N900, i could share the beat detection code.03:54
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kynkythinking of getting a n900, what are any negatives? lack of mms, 3 row kb, youtube a bit skippy inside browser? cant really find any03:57
Proteousfor US cust only Tmobile 3g freqa04:03
kynkyuk here, tmobile and vodafone selling it04:03
felipeckynky: you get used to the 3 row keyboard, really04:04
kynkyfelipec, yeah not too bothered about that really, just wanting to know the bad stuff , so no nasty surprises, seems best phone to get, although it not a phone :)04:05
kynkygot a touch pro at mo, 5months lft on cobtract, thinking of sticking on ebay, wiv money , paying of remainder of contract, and getting a free n900 on contract for 18month with unlimited web and texts  +700mins/month04:06
kynkyandroid not doing movies was a shock to me (xvid) , only thing lacking i found is support for turn by turn sat nav04:08
felipeckynky: and actually youtube looks fine on mine... from my point of view the only bad stuff is some stupidities (IMO) in the UIs, but nothing a replacement from the community can't handle :)04:11
aSIMULAterexamples of stupidities in the UI?04:11
ShadowJKatleast on N8x0, the flash player is constantly increasing memory pressure, which seems to cause a swapin and swapout activity with very random I/O, which is extremely slow... Probably the memory it eats for precaching a movie.. If you pause and wait 'til it's done, and then unpause, it only jitters for a few moments at the start (and again if you touch any browser components).04:12
kynkyhaving to manually full screen browser all time ?04:12
GeneralAntillesAnywhere Nokia's overzealous UI department got overzealous. :P04:12
ShadowJKHopefully the 256M ram in N900 will help a bit, but flash has probably grown more adept at hogging system resources since N8x0 too. :P04:13
kynkyif winmo6.5 can use 256mb ram, im sure maemo5 can :)04:13
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* ShadowJK hopes the browser still has fast access to disabling flash :)04:17
ShadowJKMy wish would be for equally fast access to disable jabascript :(04:17
microlithShadowJK: which is why we need noscript!04:17
ShadowJKAmusingly javascript setting is pretty quick to access on S60 browser :)04:18
ShadowJKI'd rather have things that don't require javascript in order to work04:20
kynkyweb applications are hot at mo04:21
ShadowJKeven on my desktop q9550 I encounter sites that make firefox hang for several seconds until it asks if I want to stop a script04:21
ShadowJKit gets annoying trying to actively browse :/04:22
ShadowJKmaybe I need core i7 :(04:22
GeneralAntillesClearly you need at i9 at least.04:23
GeneralAntillesand then you'll maybe reduce those hangs by 50%. :P04:23
GeneralAntillesIt's amazing how the shittiest technologies seem to drive hardware advances.04:23
ShadowJKinfinite loops are still infinite04:23
felipecaSIMULAter: the media player switches off the shuffle mode each time you select a song from the main view04:23
lcukGeneralAntilles, i solved my calendar problem, are you still looking04:23
GeneralAntilleslcuk, still pecking them out by hand. :P04:24
lcukim just gonna have it using the liqbase map viewer04:24
GeneralAntillesGood practice. ;)04:24
GeneralAntillesThankfully the tracks aren't overlapping too much for me.04:24
* ShadowJK wishes for a media player that didn't make garbage out of id tags, or atleast gave up and displayed the filename instead04:25
GeneralAntillesTHough I'me going to have to bail on the UX panel early to get to Mer.04:25
lcukyeah its just remembering which track you are meant to be following04:25
lcukif its displayed as on the webpage, its easier in my mind :$04:25
ShadowJKheck I'd take a player capable of displaying filename, tags are extra bonus feature for the future when we have the technology of unicode :(04:25
GeneralAntilleslol, Jeremiah has a talk during the Extras roundtable.04:26
GeneralAntillesNot sure how that works.04:26
felipecShadowJK: the media player uses tracker, which defaults to the file name if it can't find any tags04:26
felipecand of course tracker is fully hackable :)04:26
GeneralAntillesMAFW should make life better04:27
GeneralAntillesHopefully people will get to hacking it soon.04:27
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ShadowJKdiablo media player displays "$sJ|S{8gs" :)04:29
ShadowJKid rather have the filename :)04:29
lcuki'd rather have english04:30
lcukhow do you pronounce that04:30
ShadowJKlcuk: "Inner Vision"04:33
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ShadowJKAn unnamed other player gave me the text representation of a python tuple filled with single unicode codepoints04:36
ShadowJKthat was rather impressive really :)04:37
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GeneralAntillesHrm, dunno what to go to in the 1800 to 1825 bracket on Saturday.04:46
GeneralAntillesPushing your software through, Maemo and oFono or The future of Hildon in Harmattan.04:48
* johnx checks the schedule04:48
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GeneralAntillesI need a team of people I can send to other sessions to report back to me. :P04:49
Firebirdfirst one04:49
johnxGeneralAntilles, I wanna see ofono. I think that's the most uhm "relevant to my interests"04:50
GeneralAntillesYeah, I kind of do, too.04:50
GeneralAntillesBut then again, everybody's going to want to see oFono04:50
GeneralAntillesso I can probably get a full report afterwards.04:50
johnxwell, if you take good notes on it, then I'll go see h4h04:50
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GeneralAntillesHrm, I need an EU plug adaptor.04:52
johnxbring that and a power strip04:52
GeneralAntillesI though I had one but I can't seem to find it.04:52
johnxalso, might want to be careful you have a "dumb" power strip, not some kind of "too smart for its own good" surge protector04:53
johnxthough admittedly, my surge protector didn't seem to care about being plugged into 220v/50Hz04:53
johnxkind of a crappy surge protector I guess :)04:53
GeneralAntillesMmm, this'll be fun:
johnxwe left it out and plugged in at danish weekend. I thought it made a really great trap for anyone silly enough to not check the label on their US plug :)04:54
johnxGeneralAntilles, yes04:55
johnxmy inet access is screwy :/04:55
johnxoh! from Igor. awesome!04:55
GeneralAntillesYeah. Definitely.04:56
pupnikn810 has godly speakers04:56
GeneralAntillesThat man knows what the fuck he's talking about.04:56
pupnikhow do they do it04:56
pupnikshould i click link?04:56
GeneralAntillespupnik, clearly.04:58
johnxpupnik, the n800 has even better speakers :)04:58
johnxthough I think the secret is that Nokia has experience (and patents) making really small speakers04:58
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pupniki want a n810 doorbell05:07
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lcukpupnik, make one05:10
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lcukgrab a picture, grab a sample of a doorbell, make it ding dong05:10
lcuk20 minutes?05:10
pupnikPush webcam to any phone otg also05:11
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lcukfeature creep!05:11
lcukkeep it simple :)05:11
lcuktheres a thread on tmo at the mo for widgets05:11
lcukask for a doorbell05:11
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lcukpupnik, posted for you05:13
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Firebirdoh. The panoramic desktop isn't one giant image...05:17
zerojayNo, it's not.05:18
zerojayAnd that's a good thing.05:18
Firebirdwell I assumed it was from the images people were distributing by was like "oh wait, wouldn't that be ultra CPU power usaging"05:19
zerojayFour separate images, 800x480.05:20
zerojaylcuk: Updated the widget list.05:26
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Macerdamn n810 was charging07:18
Macerand told me to charge the battery07:19
Macerand turned off07:19
Macerwasi using power that much?07:19
johnxcharger dead? unplugged? hi load?07:19
johnxyeah, that's the question07:19
Macerhigh load i'd guess07:20
johnxtechnically, I think the N8x0 can pull more power out of the battery than the charger can put in, under some circumstances07:20
johnxespecially if you were really low on juice07:20
Macertha's what i guess happened07:20
Macerit just died died07:20
Macerso i turned it on with the charger in it07:20
Macerwhat bullshit07:21
Macerwhy doesn't itjust pull power directly from the charger?07:21
johnxmost handheld things don't AFAIK07:21
johnxit's a question of complexity/cost/bulk07:21
Maceri'd say cost07:22
Macerthat parallel power would cost $0.05 per unit07:22
Macercheap bastards heh07:23
johnxto regulate it too?07:23
Macerwhich is odd because the n810 is extremely well built07:23
Macerwell. they could have added the regulation in the charger :)07:24
Macerthey charge too much for the $0.10 charger per unit anyways07:24
Macerwhy not make them WORTH the $10-$20 they are retail07:25
johnxdoesn't do anything to protect the device against 3rd party chargers07:25
johnxprobably the best momentary buffer they have is feeding power into the battery07:25
Macerbut yeah.. under a high load the charger only sometimes seems to break even07:26
GeneralAntillesHow are people getting from the airport to the hotel?07:26
Macerif i start with half a battery and have it charging while watching videos07:26
GeneralAntillesThis looks vaguely useful:
Macerit remains at half07:26
MacerGeneralAntilles: get a cab cheapo07:27
Maceror rent a car07:27
johnxis it really that far?07:27
GeneralAntillesjohnx, 16km07:27
Macern810 has a gps :-P07:27
GeneralAntillesMacer, cab is like €2 a km.07:28
johnxGeneralAntilles, that's long enough that xchat doesn't even understand it as one URL :P07:29
Macer32 euroes? :)07:29
GeneralAntillesPlus tip.07:29
GeneralAntillesand time07:29
Macertry not to go bankrupt07:29
GeneralAntillesYeah, that's exactly what I'm trying to do.07:29
GeneralAntillesMacer, college student with a new computer here.07:30
Macerok makes sense :)07:30
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johnxwe could always split a cab 4 ways07:31
GeneralAntillesjohnx, yeah, that's true.07:31
GeneralAntillesQuestion is, when are you arriving?07:31
johnxwhich is to say 7:40AM+/-40min07:32
GeneralAntillesYeah, I see it on the wiki.07:32
johnxisn't there like a train from the airport?07:32
GeneralAntillesYeah, I think it's €4.00 to get downtown.07:33
GeneralAntillesThen you need to catch a couple of buses from there.07:33
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Maceri didnt get my touchbook today07:34
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GeneralAntillesjohnx, what are our plans for Thursday morning? ;)07:38
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johnxGeneralAntilles, you getting in early too?07:39
johnxI didn't see you on the travel page07:39
GeneralAntillesJust added07:39
GeneralAntillesYou me and rm_you are one after another.07:39
johnxI think Adam and I were gonna do the tourist thing07:39
johnxwere we?07:39
rm_youwe can all meet up and figure out wtf07:39
rm_youif there's time07:39
rm_youtheres kinda a schedule isn't there? :P07:39
GeneralAntillesRegistration opens at 1700 and I've got a Nokia dinner at 1800, other than that the whole day is free.07:40
johnxrm_you, not thursday07:40
johnxwe're 24hours early for summit07:40
rm_youi thought there was something for thursday07:41
GeneralAntillesJust registration07:42
johnxmer drinking!07:42
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johnxis there a collaborative maemo summit map on google maps yet?07:52
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GAN800Don't think so.07:56
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disco_stuhey someone culd updaate canola?08:48
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GeneralAntillesdisco_stuN800, rephrase the question. :P08:50
disco_stuN800i tried to ask if someone was capable of updating canola08:51
disco_stuN800GeneralAntilles, did you?08:53
johnxxdisco_stuN800, update to the one in extras-devel that isn't released yet?08:53
disco_stuN800johnxx, yup08:54
johnxxdon't do that08:54
disco_stuN800johnxx, why not? i cant anyways.. been using the same release over a year is booring..08:55
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johnxxdisco_stu, because it's not finished yet. it's not installable09:04
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GeneralAntillesdisco_stu, yeah, bad plan. ;)09:12
johnxxGeneralAntilles, ubuntu 9.10 beta is working disturbingly well ... on a powerbook g409:15
johnxxtotally awesome out-of-box experience09:16
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GeneralAntillesjohnxx, whenever I've tried to install Linux on a Mac all it results in takeoff speed on the fans.09:23
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johnxxGeneralAntilles, it came up with the 3D enable, and the pad already set to do the "two finger tap for right click"09:33
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johnxxhi Stskeeps09:43
Stskeepsmorn keesj, johnxx09:44
johnxxI think xserver-xfbdev will make me crazy09:44
Stskeepslike you aren't already? ;)09:45
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johnxxmaybe it'll just move me from neurotic to psychotic09:46
Stskeepsscary, poland has a CDMA band09:47
johnxxmy condolences to them09:47
Stskeepsi am still contemplating switching provider.. this one even spams me09:48
johnxxyeah. mine did in Japan09:49
johnxxand the worst part was it wasn't immediately obvious whether I was being spammed by a pachinko parlor or being told my bill was overdue09:49
johnxxI had to sit down and really try to parse the message only to find out that i could "meet hot girls online" or similar09:50
Stskeepsi get my spam in polish too09:51
johnxxin terms of email spam, I get it in every language known to man09:52
cvandonderendoes anybody else experience gcc crashing when using cmake on the fremantle armel target?09:52
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StecchinoIt seems my name didn't end up on the participants list for the maemo summit next weekend. I remember putting my name in on a wiki page months ago. Could this be correct?11:14
StecchinoX-Fade: ^^11:15
StskeepsStecchino: you should have registered at the registration form?11:16
* Stecchino doesn't remember a registration form11:16
Stskeeps had a registration form in the bottom11:17
Stecchinodidn't even realize there was one. When I registered there was just a couple of wiki pages11:17
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Stskeepsunder "Registration"11:17
Stskeepsi think registration was open quite early on11:17
Stecchinocould it be that there was a wiki page before the registration form?11:17
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Stskeepssearch the wiki for your details?11:18
Stskeepsand not as i remember it, i was always using the form11:18
Stskeeps(fwiw, i have nothing to do with the summit except speaking there)11:18
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JaffaMorning, all11:39
Stskeepsmorning jaffa11:39
JaffaStecchino: I don't believe there was ever registration via a wiki page. The wiki page embedded the registration list; which was always done through a web-based form11:40
JaffaStecchino: I suggest you email and ask for them to help you out if you still want to attend11:40
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EspadaV8_LJaffa: how can i try to find out why hermes is 'unable to load'?11:54
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ShapeshifterIs there an SDK for maemo5, if yes, what does it include? Does it emulate an n900 including screen output etc?12:40
Shapeshifterincluding input on the screen?12:40
Shapeshifterand does it run on linux or do I need windows?12:40
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EspadaV8_Lyes, there is an sdk12:41
EspadaV8_Lyes it needs linux12:41
EspadaV8_Lyou can use the mouse and keyboard for the screen input12:41
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EspadaV8_Lwhen i tried my app in the emulator, it worked, but didn't reproduce the output the same12:42
EspadaV8_Lnot sure if that was my fault or not though12:42
Mekthere is a bug somewhere in xephyr/the sdk that sometimes swaps the green and blue channels (I think it were those)12:43
EspadaV8_Lcould also be because i'm writing a Qt4 app and not a GTK one12:43
Mekand you have to run stuff with to make it look correctly12:43
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EspadaV8_Lwhen i try and start with the Composite extention then i get no output from start12:44
JaffaEspadaV8_L: Open X Terminal and run /opt/hermes/bin/hermes12:44
JaffaEspadaV8_L: And then tell me what is says12:45
EspadaV8_LXephyr :2 -host-cursor -screen 800x480x16 -dpi 96 -ac -extension Composite12:45
EspadaV8_LJaffa: import error12:45
EspadaV8_Lno module named gnome.gconf12:46
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EspadaV8_LJaffa: apt-get install gnome-python-dev fixed the issue12:56
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Shapeshifterhuh but this is really cool that there is no sdk for windows13:03
Shapeshifterlinux development ftw, yay13:03
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* Shapeshifter is still running the scratchbox installer script13:04
Shapeshifterhuge download13:04
EspadaV8_Li think you can install it in Cygwin for windows devs13:04
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cvandonderenShapeshifter: I ran the linux VirtualBox image this morning, and that is slow.....13:06
cvandonderenEspadaV8_L: are there any instructions for the cygwin setup?13:06
cvandonderenI only need to compile something, no real development13:06
Shapeshifterwell, of course you need a native linux installation. why wouldn't you have one... ;)13:06
EspadaV8_Llol, everyone shold have linux ;-)13:06
EspadaV8_Lcvandonderen: no, i don't13:07
EspadaV8_Li just saw someone post it in the forums13:07
cvandonderenwell, I do KDE-Windows development.... so I need Windows, I have a full OpenSuSE install on my external HDD though, are there any instruciotns for the scratchbox installation for SuSE, because everybody runs Ubuntu...13:08
* EspadaV8_L runs Gentoo and Arch13:08
EspadaV8_Lbut no, i just ran the scripts13:08
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EspadaV8_Lwget 2 files, chmod +x them ./<script>13:09
ShapeshifterEspadaV8_L: arch!! <313:09
* Shapeshifter runs arch as well.13:09
EspadaV8_Llol :-)13:09
cvandonderenwhich scripts, the ones from the thingy?13:09
EspadaV8_Lgot arch on my laptop, gentoo on my desktop13:09
EspadaV8_Lthinking of switching to arch on the desktop too, it's getting too old now :(13:09
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EspadaV8_Lone sec, i'll dig them up cvandonderen13:10
EspadaV8_Lreally simple step-by-step setup13:10
EspadaV8_Lnot installed it on arch, since i went the 64 bit route and scratchbox isn't supported :(13:11
* EspadaV8_L needs a bigger desk too :(13:12
ShapeshifterEspadaV8_L: doesn't work for you?13:12
kynkyreally easy to have a 32bit chroot in 64bit machine and have the 32bit croot x app be displayed on 64bit x server, as X just uses tcp protocol for displaying stuff13:12
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EspadaV8_LShapeshifter: ah, never noticed that13:13
EspadaV8_Ltbh, i'd rather work on the desktop for now, easier to work with13:15
EspadaV8_Lonly thing moving to the laptop would help is compile time13:15
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cvandonderenEspadaV8_L: but SuSE does not use deb, is that a problem?13:18
Shapeshiftercvandonderen: no, no problem.13:18
EspadaV8_Lcvandonderen: neither does gentoo13:18
EspadaV8_Lscratchbox has a debian 'system' in it that you use the apt-get commands in13:19
Shapeshiftercvandonderen: I'm on arch and there's no problem. there are no deb binaries involved. I don't even understand why it's called "debian installation". It should work on any linux really.13:19
ShapeshifterEspadaV8_L: ah...13:19
EspadaV8_Lthe scripts download .tar.gz files, iirc13:19
cvandonderenokay, in the script it says that it downloads the tar.gz files if deb is not supported13:19
EspadaV8_Land just extracts them13:20
cvandonderenEspadaV8_L: haha13:20
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EspadaV8_Lof course, scratchbox won't be known by your package manager (yast?) so it won't auto-update13:20
EspadaV8_Lwhich is probably a good thing in this case13:20
cvandonderenand then if a new SDK version comes I can just run the new installer script?13:21
cvandonderenor do I have to delete and reinstall?13:21
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EspadaV8_Lnot sure13:22
EspadaV8_Lnot had that happen yet13:22
* EspadaV8_L only installed yesterday13:22
Shapeshifterthere are chapters on updating on that same page13:22
cvandonderenShapeshifter: yeah, but there it says update the deb repo13:22
cvandonderenand that is not possible13:23
EspadaV8_Linstall didn't take long, so an rm -rf /scratchbox and a reinstall wouldn't be too bad13:23
Shapeshiftermh indeed..13:23
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cvandonderenokay, well, I'm rebooting into my Linux then ;-013:24
RST38hArgh...Extras-Devel uploads broken again =(13:24
ShapeshifterAm I guessing right that this circular zoom thing in the browser is only part of the browser but not the input driver?13:25
Stskeepsgesture recognition13:25
Shapeshifterso that e.g. the same circular motion does not work in a pdf viewer or docs or image viewer etc13:25
EspadaV8_Lyeah, i'm not sure i like it tbh13:25
Shapeshifterit's really daft imho.13:26
* Stskeeps doesn't like recognition too deep down. for instance, tap-to-hold in xorg.13:26
* qwerty12_N810 has trouble with the double-tap to zoom13:26
Shapeshifterany clues if the input driver is closed source?13:26
StskeepsShapeshifter: xorg? highly doubt it13:26
ShapeshifterThen I'll probably try to hack some really nice gestures in there that send additional events that work globally.13:27
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Shapeshiftersimilar to synaptics. I really like circular scrolling and zooming, but not in the way it's done in their browser, and not limited to one app.13:28
Shapeshifterit should be done in the driver, so that button4 and button5 are sent for scrolling. when one starts a circularmotion starting from a corner.13:29
jeremiahRST38h: What's broken? What specifically?13:29
jeremiahRST38h: Not sure if I can help but, I'll try13:30
RST38hjeremiah: Does not let me do dput into non-free.13:30
RST38hUploading to fremantle-extras-devel (via scp to
RST38hPermission denied (publickey,keyboard-interactive).13:30
RST38hlost connection13:30
jeremiahArg. That is annoying.13:30
RST38hHappened before, XFade says it is intermittent problem, but to me it looks like successfull upload is more intermittent nowadays13:30
lbtShapeshifter: it's not that easy though13:31
jeremiahRST38h: :-/ Sorry about that.13:31
lbtit needs to be done in the frameworks IMHO13:31
RST38hjeremiah: Just WHY? =) The key is apparently correct. It is Sunday. Why would it refuse connections? =)13:31
lbtso applications/widgets can register interest in gestures13:31
StskeepsRST38h: telling people to go to church!13:31
lbtfrankly I'd resent not being able to draw spirals in my sketch application ;)13:32
fralsits a day of rest, no work allowed RST38h ;)13:32
RST38hStskeeps: it least it does not enforce sabbath...or does it? =)13:32
jeremiahRST38h: Good question. I don't know.13:32
jeremiahI would have to do some diagnostics and dig a little13:33
lbtRST38h: it's not american...13:33
jeremiahBut at the moment I don't want to step on anyone's toes13:33
Shapeshifterlbt: no, if the driver simply sends button4 and button5, most applications should be able to recognize this as scrolling up and down. And the point is that it should only send these events if one starts the spiral motion from a specific corner, e.g. top left. Have you ever used circular scrolling on a synaptics touchpad?13:33
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cvandonderen_so, well13:33
qwerty12_N810RST38h: It wants you to upload to free instead, where the Extras Assistant is always available and working ;)13:33
RST38hqwerty: I can, but then it will not like binary packages13:34
lbtShapeshifter: a touchpad is different13:34
lbtit's relative13:34
lbtpoint of contact on tpad + delta -> mouse movement13:34
lbton a touch screen it's absolute13:34
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qwerty12_N810qwerty12: 1. Fremantle's libnotify: 0. Now Daniel Wilms will be wanting to behead me...13:37
Shapeshifterlbt: that doesn't really pose a problem. The driver would simply look for a sequence of events on pixels between x: 0-100 and y:0-20 with increasing x (a motion from the top left corner to the right), and then begin sending button5 instead of mouse move events continously while registering the circular motion. afaik, such a motion on the maemo5 ui has no real meaning in any of the apps, so it can be used for this.13:37
Shapeshifterwell I'll see what I can do. It's worth a try ;)13:38
lbtthat's a dreadful design :)         I don't see a need for it now so we'll put the logic in the driver?13:38
RST38hqwerty talking to himself, awaiting beheading by Wilms....13:39
RST38hWhat a sight!13:39
lbtit makes a lot more sense to have a more generic gesture recognition framework in the gui frameworks13:39
lbtthat way you get things like signal/slot handling in Qt13:40
Shapeshifterlbt: reasonable.13:40
lbtand you can define gestures on a per-widget basis13:40
lbt(My shopper app does this)13:40
lbtit allows a left-right gesture to mean select13:40
lbtactually simulates crossing an item off a list13:40
lbtthe issues are to do with grabbing all the mouse events13:41
lbtand then replaying them13:41
Shapeshifterlbt: but that would mean that every app needs to incorporate the scrolling gestures by itself. It's not global anymore13:41
lbtheh .. see The finger scroll I did in Qt13:41
Shapeshifterwhile I think that global circular scrolling should be possible to enable.13:41
lbtso the abstractscrollarea implements the gesture13:41
lbtand *every* scroll area has it13:42
lbtincluding popup menus etc13:42
lbtthere are overrides to disable13:42
RST38hPortrait-mode PDF reader with circular scrolling? Please?13:42
lbtthere are some gestures that make sense globally13:42
lbtand you may have hit upon one13:42
lbtbut I think that is the exception really13:43
Shapeshifterlbt: indeed13:43
lbtand as such it shouldn't be the one used to design the solution :)13:43
Shapeshifterwell, there's also zoominh13:43
Shapeshifterwhich I think should also be the same for all apps13:43
lbtI may want to zoom on an inner window13:43
lbtin my application13:44
lbtdouble-tap-hold-move zoom can be targeted13:44
lbtbut you get into issues that some apps may want to register or not for that gesture13:45
lbtand some gestures appear through the X-driver, others throught the framework....13:46
lbtanyhow, I find the whole area really interesting :)13:46
ShapeshifterI have a problem, just installed the SDK without any problems, enabled the closed source nokia things, and ran a Xephyr server. Did all this and now I'm stuck at '[sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] > start', as I don't have any
lbtdid you install the binaries for both arches ?13:48
qwerty12_N810Hint: "Before starting the UI framework, ensure that you have installed the following..."13:48
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JaffaEspadaV8_L: Hmm, what version of Hermes have you got installed? That should've been fixed in 0.0.213:49
Shapeshifterlbt: mhh, I think not, only X86. my bad, thanks :) installing them for ARMEL as well now.13:49
qwerty12_N810Jaffa: FWIW, I had the same error with 0.0.213:49
lbtdamn docs aren't a wiki....13:49
Jaffaqwerty12_N810: Hmm. Odd.13:49
EspadaV8_LJaffa: had 0.0.2 and updated to 0.0.413:50
EspadaV8_Lthat was run after the update13:50
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JaffaEspadaV8_L: qwerty12_N810: Thanks. I'll upload 0.0.5 which should help13:52
EspadaV8_Lalthough both 0.0.2 and 0.0.4 wouldn't load from the launcher, both just saying 'Unable to load'13:52
EspadaV8_Lnp Jaffa13:53
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JaffaRight, Hermes 0.0.5 on its way through the autobuilde.r13:56
EspadaV8_Lyay :-)13:56
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EspadaV8_Lalthough i couldn't get 0.0.4 to work when it loaded13:56
JaffaYou and qwerty12_N810 are credited in the changelog13:57
EspadaV8_Lhaven't played with it to see what it was doing13:57
JaffaEspadaV8_L: Hmm.13:57
* EspadaV8_L feels special13:57
EspadaV8_Li choose facebook, opened up the browser, signed in and then just got 'one unmatched contact'13:58
EspadaV8_Ltapped that and it gave me a blank popup13:58
JaffaEspadaV8_L: How many contacts have you got in Contacts?13:59
EspadaV8_Loh, tell a lie, one13:59
EspadaV8_Lan address i sent an email too14:00
EspadaV8_Lodd, i didn't add it14:00
EspadaV8_Li thought hermes downloaded the contact info from facebook and added them to the phone?14:01
JaffaEspadaV8_L: Ah, it doesn't add new contacts (yet, although it might. Maybe. One day); what it does is match your existing contacts against Facebook & Twitter to get photos for them (and, in future, birthdays, web sites, nicknames)14:01
EspadaV8_Lwhat does it try and match on? name? number? email? all of the above?14:02
JaffaEspadaV8_L: If it created new contacts from Facebook the only thing it could add would be website, name, photo, nickname and birthday14:02
JaffaFacebook won't let external applications see phone number or email address info.14:02
EspadaV8_Li thought facebook had phone numbers too?14:02
EspadaV8_Lthat kind sucks :(14:03
EspadaV8_Lalso, minor bug14:03
EspadaV8_Lnow i have no contacts at all14:03
EspadaV8_Lwhen i click 'retrieve' i get the popup "fetching ..."14:04
qwerty12_N810Jaffa: Thank you, 0.0.5 starts up fine :)14:04
EspadaV8_Lthat then hides, i get the summary ( 0, 0, 0 )14:04
EspadaV8_Lclick 'Done' and the "fetching ..." popup is still open14:04
lbtjeremiah: you about14:05
JaffaEspadaV8_L: Ah, yes - hehe. Assumptions that 0 => fetching and n => close.14:05
EspadaV8_Lis it just me, or is the app manager 'Update' not that great14:06
EspadaV8_Lor am i doing it wrong?14:06
EspadaV8_Lbecause whenever i click it, i always get 'no updates available'14:07
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jeremiahlbt: Yes. :)14:10
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lbtjeremiah: I was helping someon who's having a dh_gencontrol issue14:11
lbtlooking for the log14:12
jeremiahah, okay.14:12
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lbtjeremiah: dpkg-gencontrol: error: must specify package since control info has many ()14:24
lbtbuild log
jeremiahokay, I'll take a look  . . . .14:26
lbtv. quick... it's someone using OBS14:26
jeremiahJust to be explicit, in this case OBS == Open Build System?14:27
jeremiahThat is not the whole control file is it?14:29
jeremiahJust the Source package part.14:29
jeremiahIf it is the whole control file, he needs to specify a binary package part to build the deb14:29
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lbtof course  - I'm used to reading .dsc files14:33
kynkyhow do you select tab key on n900 ? (pipe key too)14:33
kynkyuse xmodmap ?14:33
qwerty12_N810kynky: Official way: Fn (Blue arrow) + Ctrl14:34
qwerty12_N810From the window that comes up, pipe is in the top-right corner and tab is under '<' (which is in the top-left corner)14:35
lbtthanks jeremiah :)14:35
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kynkyi guess tab completion a bit hard in a shell then ?14:40
EspadaV8the terminal has a 'Tab' button on the screen14:41
EspadaV8didn't notice it at first, took ages to type things in by hand14:42
kynkyonly negative fo me at mo i can find for me is lack of turn by turn sat nav software, but i guess that shouldnt be too far away14:43
EspadaV8does the maps app do that?14:44
kynkyovi maps on n900 only does route planning14:45
* qwerty12_N810 grins at HildonControlbar being marked as depreciated14:45
kynkythink it does turn by turn on symbian14:45
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kynkyuse tomtom on my htc touch pro, but would be selling that to get an n90014:46
jeremiahlbt: My pleasure!14:47
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EspadaV8oh yeah, so it doesn't14:47
EspadaV8that kinda sucks14:47
EspadaV8although it does track you14:47
EspadaV8so i guess it's almost there, just needs voice over14:47
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Stskeepswb wazd15:19
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waz1Heya world15:27
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Stskeepswb waz115:29
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lardmanRST38h: have uploaded a fixed version, I hope15:45
lardmanRST38h: in the ./other/ directory is a version with Amazon webscraping too, but it may well segfault15:45
MaceN8x0my 3 yr old son's understanding of inuyasha is amazing15:46
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waz1RST38h: I've stolen my granddad's phone, menu is out)15:49
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RST38hwazd: Yea, I see it =)15:51
RST38hwazd: But the TI73 is at the wrong place =( Should be between 86 and 82 =(15:52
RST38hOn the ther hand, let me see if this can be worked around in the code...15:52
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RST38hYea, I guess it can be assumed to be TI83+15:56
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waz1I thought they can be anywhere I want :D16:00
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RST38hwaz: not exactly, but thanks to this arrangement I have found a problem in the code =)16:06
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RST38hwazd: Done. I think the new package should work properly now16:18
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* lcuk has sore fingers16:33
pupniktear browser needs paste-into-url fieüd16:34
lardmanlcuk: changing weather?16:35
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VDVsxanyone with a BT keyboard and a linux machine willing to do a small test for me ? :)16:35
lcuksomething like that, its been cold last few days.16:36
* lcuk is trying to make something work16:36
lcukhows barcode coming, i notice you patched it16:37
lcukwould it run on my 900 if i wanted to test it?16:37
lardmanyeah, web scraping still broken, opening urls seems a bit broken too16:37
lcukweb stuff is always broken16:37
lcuksimplicity :)16:37
lardmanbut that's it, have a flight to catch in a couple of hours, so off to the airport soon16:37
lcukhave you dragged in the 40mb code database we found aw hile ago16:37
lcukto at least identify products by name16:38
lardmanpretty big too, would be better as a web lookup16:38
lardmanbut I've run out of time debugging the scrapers16:38
qwerty12_N810lardman: broken as in they won't open, or the dialog thing?16:38
lardmanthey work for some things, but for others they run off and segfault, so not ideal16:38
lcukwould be better of course, but even 3g doesnt always get a signal16:38
lcukespecially near the freezer section of our asda16:39
lardmanwell the dialog is still broken, even after removing that flag, and now the browser will open, but just the start page16:39
lardmanmy tablet may need a reboot as it was working properly earlier16:39
lcukhey simon, qwerty is getting extremely good at nice simple gtk ui16:39
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lardmanwhere is my bloody bt gps16:40
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lcuklardman, there should be some way to connect to these kinds of devices and ask them their location16:44
lcukdevelopers should get cracking16:44
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lopzgm ;)16:48
lardmanlcuk: battery will be flat by now anyway16:49
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lardmanright, offski17:02
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lardmansee you chaps on Thursday in the bar17:02
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derflcuk: I'm pretty sure there is a way to connect to a BT GPS and ask it its location.17:04
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lcukderf, really!17:04
lcukhi gnuton \o17:04
derfOne would hope.17:04
* lcuk has to move several tonnes of code from this side of the yard to the other17:05
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lcukgnuton, how is it going in the trenches17:07
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gnutonHi lcuk! :D17:11
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lcuki notice you were looking at qt widgets on the desktop17:12
lcukdid you get any further looking or just moved onto something else17:12
EspadaV8mmm, qt17:13
gnutonI had look... and Kate wrote some proof-of-concept code17:13
EspadaV8and my god i have some awful music in my collection17:13
gnutonesaym153: Qt17:13
* lcuk hopes theres lots of qties at the summit17:13
VDVsxQT, hihiihih :P17:13
* lcuk slaps VDVsx 17:14
lcukqT on mAEmo17:14
EspadaV8are most people using Qt now?17:14
VDVsxqwerty12_N810, that's new ;)17:14
qwerty12_N810VDVsx: Yes, yes, it is; and for the light sum of £10,000, it can be yours!17:15
gnutonEspadaV8: there are a lot of people interested in...17:15
wazdCuetea :)17:15
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cvandonderenQt is amazing :-)17:15
gnutoncvandonderen: I agree...17:15
* EspadaV8 is glad he started learning Qt and not Gtk a year back now17:15
ShapeshifterQueue tea?17:15
VDVsxqwerty12_N810, I don't deal in £17:15
lcukspeaking of which - coffee break time17:16
EspadaV8Shapeshifter: no need to queue, i have tea :-D17:16
qwerty12_N810VDVsx: GTFO, then17:16
lcukkick his ass qwerty12_N81017:16
cvandonderenhaha, well, if you develop for KDE you have to do Qt ;-)17:16
lcuksurely not!17:16
lcukyou HAVE to?17:16
EspadaV8cvandonderen: lol, true17:16
gnutonEspadaV8: I started learning Gtk.. and after I passed to Qt in order to write code for KDE.17:16
gnutonlcuk: btw any chance to see you at the MAemo summit? I read you had some issue witu your job..17:17
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lcukyes gnuton, damned principles.  i'd love to get together and have a chat17:17
cvandonderenlcuk: sure you have to do Qt17:17
EspadaV8i just wanted something to learn, i use KDE, but everyone else at the office uses Gnome (those that use Linux), so i was a bit torn17:17
cvandonderennah, okay, or platform specific API17:17
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lcukim rooming with mek too, so hopefully he will show me some of the qt stuff and i can get upto speed a bit17:18
cvandonderenlcuk: maybe meet you there then!17:18
gnutonhey for people interested in a Job, FN is looking for an engineer to hire with permament position.17:18
cvandonderen(at least, I think I'll meet up with mek)17:18
lcukcvandonderen, i dont do qt or gtk at the moment17:18
lcuki just make things run well :)17:19
cvandonderengnuton: FN?17:19
gnutonFN= Forum Nokia17:19
cvandonderenhmmm, I just need an internship...17:19
lcukcvandonderen, gnuton presentation i did on n900
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lcukthankfully most also runs damned well on n810 too :)17:19
* EspadaV8 cranks the volume up to 1117:20
lcukyeah not my fault17:20
lcuki like the flickering colors btw, it gives it a pirate broadcast feel17:20
cvandonderenlcuk: neat :-)17:20
lcukcvandonderen, only a fraction :) i try lots of things17:21
lcukbut never get time to dive further in17:21
* qwerty12_N810 mutters things about Northerners and their accents17:22
EspadaV8lol lcuk17:22
cvandonderenI know the feeling17:22
cvandonderendoes anybody know of companies still doing interns with the crisis BTW?17:22
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lcukcvandonderen, the one thing i have found in the last week:  there are good jobs all over the maemo sphere17:23
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lcuklots of good jobs17:23
EspadaV8you should poke nokia about a job lcuk, get some of that added/ported to Qt :-D17:23
lcukEspadaV8, i have made applications to nokia - i am waiting to hear back17:23
cvandonderenlcuk: yeah, but they do not know if they do interns17:24
cvandonderenotherwise I can't graduate...17:24
* EspadaV8 would love to work on Qt17:24
lcukcvandonderen, ask17:24
lcuksend in cv17:24
lcuktheres lists of companies relating to maemo on the wiki somewhere17:24
lcukummm where is it ...17:24
gnutonThere are several open position in Nokia for Qt people.. take a look to for them17:25
cvandonderenbut then I'm in the graphics department with Qt stuff, I don't really like web development...17:25
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lcukcvandonderen, get yourself active in talk.maemo.org17:25
lcukshow people your work and see if you can help with their projects17:25
lcukif you are graphics, you are toolkit agnostic17:25
cvandonderenlcuk: yeah, well not design17:26
cvandonderenOpenGL and stuff17:26
lcukthen same, show some examples17:27
wazdwho said opengl?) Let's make games!17:27
cvandonderenwazd: haha, yes17:27
lcukand most of all - try to emphasise how you optimize and make things work on the embedded platform17:27
cvandonderenlcuk: I never did embedded17:27
cvandonderenthat is the problem17:27
cvandonderenit is not like I have 20 years of experience17:27
EspadaV8i'm no way near good enough to apply to Nokia yet17:28
EspadaV8still a lot to learn17:28
lcukthere is a hacker here called javispedro.  he has started along a path towards opengles goodness17:28
EspadaV8and the one example I do have, isn't really that good :(17:28
* javispedro hides17:28
lcuki was soooooooo impressed when i saw he had created a single triangle17:28
lcukwhat could YOU do with that triangle17:28
cvandonderenjavispedro: :-P17:28
lcukhow could you make it work..17:28
wazdI want multitask game on n900! arr!17:28
javispedrothere are now quite a few ogles projects ongoing17:29
lcukor just multitask?17:29
javispedronot mine of course :P17:29
EspadaV8someone should port Wine to the n900, then we could run WoW17:29
* EspadaV8 hides17:29
cvandonderenjavispedro: we are trying to get Gluon (the new Qt/KDE Game engine) to work on OGLES too17:29
lcukyeah, we try, everytime it ripens lardman drinks the whole barrrel17:29
SpeedEvilwine in qemu should work17:29
SpeedEvilnot gonna be fast though17:29
qwerty12_N810EspadaV8: WoW? Really? C'mon, everyone wants GTA!17:30
lcukstop porting then17:30
wazdLcuk: uhh, not again :D I've showed that flash game before17:30
EspadaV8oooh, gta17:30
* EspadaV8 doesn't actually play WoW btw17:30
javispedroSpeedEvil: "wine under qemu" would be slow, but what about "qemu-user under wine"?17:30
cvandonderenlcuk: but where should I show stuff then? It's not like I can but my Java OpenGL stuff on the maemo boards :-P17:30
lcukjust run Wow on your desktop and vnc it across17:31
lcukthen play anywhere in your house17:31
* SpeedEvil ponders VNC over GPRS.17:32
wazd0.5 fps :)17:32
lcukflogging a dead horse lol17:32
EspadaV8oh... while i remember, is there an IRC client in the repo?17:32
RST38hJust get yourself a freaking Windows PC.17:32
cvandonderenRST38h: haha, well, Win7 is not that bad ;-)17:32
SpeedEvilI want a dual-core laptop17:32
* wazd wants a dual laptop core :P17:33
SpeedEvilOne core a nice low-power ARM, one a x8617:33
cvandonderenSpeedEvil: tehy are starting to sell those now17:33
lcukjust have multi arm cores17:33
SpeedEvilcvandonderen: yeah17:33
EspadaV8like those new dells SpeedEvil?17:33
wazdSpeedEvil: htc shift?17:33
RST38hWhy do you need multiple cores anyway?17:33
SpeedEvildell is multicore atom isn't it?17:34
cvandonderenSpeedEvil: no, ARM + x86_6417:34
SpeedEvilRST38h: I don't - what Iw as really saying is Is that I want a CPU that powersaves greatly.17:34
javispedrowazd, ah, the shift. what a piece of overpriced hardware.17:34
javispedrothey're still selling that here by... $800 ?17:34
cvandonderenthe ARM even has its own WiFi adapter17:34
SpeedEvilRST38h: but - getting a x86 to sip on the power is damn hard17:34
wazdjavispedro: well, it has 2 cores :)17:35
ShapeshifterSpeedEvil: huh. when you have two cores, arm and x86, you'll have to compile everything for two different architectures, no?17:35
Shapeshifterand nothing will run really parallel17:35
ShapeshifterI mean, there's no connection between the two17:36
cvandonderenShapeshifter: that is the idea on those Dell's yes17:36
javispedrothey act more like independent computers sharing display on current implementations.17:36
wazdjavispedro: since it is a unique device - it can have any price17:36
Shapeshifterbut that's a bit daft.17:36
javispedrowazd: yeah. dell has introduced one of those now, only bigger.17:37
cvandonderenShapeshifter: well, the idea is an instant-on OS for email and the x86 for the normal work17:37
Shapeshifterx86 is almost instant on from s2ram17:38
Shapeshifteror, instant if configured properly17:38
javispedrohow's battery life in s2ram?17:38
Shapeshifter like this, it's kinda interesting but still pretty daft.17:38
lcukjust make a laptop with a neat little recess just the right size for an n900 :)17:39
* javispedro wants x86-system-on-pci-card ;)17:39
Shapeshifterjavispedro: not brilliant on my regular dell lap top, but I guess there's lots of room for optimization if needed17:39
javispedroShapeshifter: the problem is 2GiB, 4GiB RAM. Having to keep a 256MiB chip powered on only is easier.17:40
Jaffajavispedro: There was an x86-system-on-pci-card for Acorn's RiscPC17:40
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EspadaV8Sun sell those javispedro17:40
EspadaV8for their servers17:41
JaffaIBM too. You can get an x86 add in for an iSeries17:41
EspadaV8oooooh... Acorn17:41
* EspadaV8 's heart melts17:41
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: I personally would want it configured like a thin client. The arm is a thin client, it has a desktop of its own, with limited functionality. But you power on the 'server' - and you've got access to the full suite of apps.17:43
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: Add something to - for example - share open tabs in a browser between them, and if you're just reading a page, you can suspend the high power system17:44
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ShapeshifterI'm not convinced. >.>17:45
lcukSpeedEvil, that doesnt ahve to be in the same shell17:45
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ShapeshifterBy the way, with DDR3, power consumtion drops another 17-30% from ddr217:45
Shapeshifterruns at 1.5V17:45
lcukyour handheld and desktop pc should be in perfect harmony17:45
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Shapeshifterand if you put two systems in any device, that generally do the same, but one's a bit slower and has less features, you're really just wasting space.17:46
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: Right.17:46
lcukyeah i know17:46
javispedrowell, I like the idea.17:46
lcukbut i can walk out with my n900 in pocket17:46
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: now - show me the x86 system that can use under a watt running.17:46
lcukand still have a link to desktop17:46
SpeedEvillcuk: that kind of ties you to the house though.17:46
lcukits what i want for my wallmount display17:46
lcukSpeedEvil, not at all17:46
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lcukit ties me to wherever i am17:46
ShapeshifterIf it's done properly, the system should be able to switch off unneeded parts of the systems, but switch them one and use them in the same system if needed. Think of it as an engine with 8 cylinders running on 4 if not so much power is needed17:46
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: Sure.17:47
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SpeedEvilShapeshifter: Currently available chips don't however do this well, for a number of reasons.17:47
lcukShapeshifter, that happens anyway17:47
javispedroAnd that's what putting an slower secondary system does.17:47
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: at least x8617:47
lcukdesktop pcs have speedstep type things17:47
javispedroonly you require user intervention for the switch "to happen".17:47
lcukscreens go dark17:47
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lcukharddrives shut off17:47
ShapeshifterSpeedEvil: well... at least the 500mhz model uses only 1W17:48
lcukhell, even the mouse curls up and has a nap17:48
SpeedEvilThis is clearly a broken solution. The right solution is clearly to have a main processor that can throttle right back, and use milliwatts.17:48
SpeedEvilBut they don't really exist at the moment.17:48
SpeedEvil(by processor, I mean a fully active system not in suspend mode)17:48
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: Sure - and you'd be happy to use that as your main processor?17:49
Shapeshifterthe via chipset that goes with that cpu uses 3.5W, and supports all kinds of media stuff and all that17:49
EspadaV8heard about the upto 8 core arm cpus?17:49
EspadaV8at 2ghz17:49
lcukwhich hw are they in to play17:50
SpeedEvilShapeshifter: 4W is a _lot_ of power.17:50
ShapeshifterSpeedEvil: yeah I know...17:50
ShapeshifterI give up17:50
SpeedEvilI'm not saying what you want should not be available.17:50
SpeedEvilI'm saying it's not.17:50
EspadaV8they were saying it could take on the atom in performance, but use a lot less power17:50
SpeedEvilRapid suspend would be _almost_ as good for some things.17:51
SpeedEvilIf you can push it to 0.5s, and get it so that you can setup the software and hardware to queue packets and stuff for 30s or so17:51
* suihkulokki points Shapeshifter to:
EspadaV8"ARM states that a single core occupies less than 1.5 mm^2 ... can be clocked at speeds over 1GHz and consumes less than 250mW per core"17:52
EspadaV81.5mm^2, that's bloody tiny17:53
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SpeedEvilthat's the core17:53
SpeedEvilYou can't make an actual processor that small - you need external connections f17:53
SpeedEvilthe memory controller and external bus drivers and shit.17:54
SpeedEvilProbably cache is excluded in that too17:54
Shapeshiftersuihkulokki: impressive little power consumption.17:54
SpeedEvilsame caveats apply17:54
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RST38hVideo output: dual LCDsor LCD and TV out18:03
RST38hGentlemen, it MAY be possible after all to show different images on the LCD and TV18:03
cvandonderenis the SGX in the N900 a 530 or 535?18:03
gnutonjavispedro: hola!18:03
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gnutonjavispedro: I've seen the Video on youtube about your SNES emulator.. it's amazing..18:04
gnutonjavispedro: I was looking for deb packages.. but I didn't find them.. are they available somewhere?18:05
cvandonderenblegh, it's a 530, so slower than iPhone...18:05
javispedro:) quite a lot of people to thank for that.18:05
javispedrognuton: extras-devel currently.18:05
javispedrowell, and diablo extras too.18:05
RST38hgnuton: Extras :)18:05
javispedrocvandonderen: true. even though i've yet to see a definite confirmation about iphone's one.18:05
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javispedroyes, I know the kext is called SGX535 but then again that proves nothing18:06
cvandonderenjavispedro: but it should be as fast as the one in the DreamCast?18:07
javispedrocvandonderen: I dunno, I havent benchmarked either.18:08
cvandonderenhmmm, okay, that would mean ioquake3 on the n90018:08
javispedroit's been said nokians are already playing with quake3.18:09
wjtaiming a railgun with an accelerometer would be interesting:)18:09
VDVsxcvandonderen, AFAIK ioquake3 runs on the pandora (same chip as the n900)18:09
cvandonderenhmm, neat18:10
cvandonderenI played some Quake2 on my N8218:10
lcukwjt, getting force feedback when you fire it too ;)18:10
cvandonderenaaah, that brings me to a question18:10
lcukoh cripes18:10
cvandonderenis there a vibrate function in the n900?18:10
cvandonderenbecause the reviewers say ther ei sonly a on and silent mode18:11
cvandonderenand no vibrate only18:11
lcukdunno about that18:11
* cvandonderen can not put spaces in the correct places18:11
lcukbut this thing shakes when i get a call/text18:11
qwerty12_N810cvandonderen: There's a vibration function, and an API somewhere to control it :)18:11
javispedro awww18:11
EspadaV8i surprise myself all the time18:11
lcukjavispedro, my mate made one of those seats for his degree18:13
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cvandonderenqwerty12_N810: okay, neat, is that API open from Qt, or does that involve strange whings with pointers to things?18:14
lcukthere should be a bacon factory class in qt18:14
lcukit would help the rest of the system run smoothly18:15
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qwerty12_N810cvandonderen: A DBus call AFAIK; dunno how Qt and DBus go together18:16
cvandonderenqwerty12_N810: dbus and Qt are the combination made n heaven :-)18:16
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javispedrolcuk: Everything is happening exactly as I have foreseen!18:18
* lcuk nods18:18
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* lcuk goes n gives #liqbase some text18:19
lcuklookin a bit empty!18:19
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EspadaV8bah, i need a script to copy, compile and scp my code and bins18:26
javispedroor use nfs, sshfs, ...18:26
EspadaV8nah, it's the 'make changes on desktop', check it works, copy the files into scratchbox, login to scratch, switch target, compile, scp files to n900, run on n90018:28
EspadaV8also, scp doesn't copy the symlink, it copies the whole file instead :(18:29
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javispedroyet another conspirator?18:30
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RST38hShould it copy the symlink though? =)18:34
RST38hzap_: Moo?18:34
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EspadaV8i'd like it to18:36
EspadaV8since when it doesn't, it's coping the same lib 4 times18:37
EspadaV8are there any docs for the changes in Qt Hildon?18:41
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EspadaV8pressing the enter key gives me a value of 1677722118:41
lcukbe thankful, in my day all keypresses were ASCII18:42
EspadaV8which isn't the same as Qt::Key_Return or Qt::Key_Enter :(18:42
javispedromaybe Keypad enter18:42
lcukcan you do runtime introspection of a qt handle?18:43
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lcukand call methods and properties based on it18:44
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EspadaV8it says that it should be Key_Enter18:46
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* EspadaV8 wonders it the #ifdef Q_WS_HILDON isn't working18:46
lcukperhaps it has been ORed with something, what code is Key_Enter18:47
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* lcuk thinks 16777216 is a likely culprit18:47
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EspadaV8Qt::Key_Enter0x01000005Typically located on the keypad.18:48
EspadaV8Qt::Key_Enter - 0x0100000518:48
EspadaV8yet i have that18:49
EspadaV8and it's not being caught18:49
lcukso the code is correct for Key_enter18:50
lcukthen looking at the fragment, chec kthe value of modifiers()18:50
lcukand see what its being muddled with18:51
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EspadaV8rather odd though18:52
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EspadaV8i just realised, hopefully soon i'll be running this on 4 different platforms :-)18:55
* EspadaV8 hugs Qt18:55
lcukwhat app you writing?18:56
lcukwhich encompasses such differing landscapes18:57
lcuka blank page18:58
EspadaV8my palringo client18:58
EspadaV8:-S shouldn't be blank18:58
EspadaV8isn't for me18:58
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EspadaV8should compile on win and mac too19:00
EspadaV8not tried it yet though19:00
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RST38hEspadeV8: What is the point in having palringo on N900?19:00
EspadaV8it's a multi IM app19:00
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EspadaV8talk to people on MSN etc19:01
EspadaV8like pidgin19:01
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EspadaV8hmm. odd, it thinks the shift key is pressed19:02
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lcukEspadaV8, the content is down below, but
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EspadaV8lcuk: wow, now that is impressive19:05
EspadaV8never seen that happen before19:05
lcukfirefox 3.0.5 on winxp19:06
lcuki have fonts set with a minimum size which might be throwing off your layout19:06
EspadaV8ahhh, could be 3.0.5 too19:06
lcukdunno i rarely see web hiccups19:06
EspadaV8shall have to check when i'm in the office tomorrow19:07
* lcuk nods19:07
EspadaV8and yay me19:07
EspadaV8i've just found a new key code19:07
lcuksame with all your postings under that layout from what i can see19:07
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* EspadaV8 blames wordpress19:08
lcuki wonder if its fixed on fremantle :D19:11
javispedrono, in harmattan.19:12
EspadaV8looks fine on the 900 here19:12
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lcukbah flickr is coming up with some rubbish login thingy19:16
EspadaV8not sure if anyone answered and i missed it, but is there an irc client for maemo?19:17
lcuki thought flickr was public access19:17
wazdStskeeps: ping?19:17
javispedrowow, I see the packages interface now shows package icons too. Very cool!19:17
EspadaV8try now lcuk19:17
EspadaV8i had it as private19:17
lcukgood that it works19:18
lcukyour title header is like mine :)19:19
wazdWas there a request to make presentations 16:9?19:19
EspadaV8the "Coming soon..." ?19:20
EspadaV8getting a coredump on key presses now19:20
lcukwazd i believe the projector is 16919:20
lcukbut will work in std def19:20
lcukjust with borders19:21
lcukbest had to - its gotta project 800*480 well19:21
* lcuk is busy making his presentations19:21
lcukVDVsx, are you doing your homework19:21
VDVsxlcuk, not yet19:22
* lcuk is19:22
RST38hEspadaV8: Mameo5 has multi IM app builtin19:22
EspadaV8RST38h: it does?19:22
RST38hEspadaV8: It is called Nokia Conversations19:22
lcukkicks ass as well19:22
EspadaV8skype, jabber and sip19:22
lcukits got me using sms for the first time19:22
RST38hYes it will do all three and more19:22
VDVsxlcuk, I've to finish a few things in BlueMaemo first ;)19:23
wazdVDVsx: cool, thanks19:23
EspadaV8and besides, Conversations wasn't coded by me ;-)19:23
lcukVDVsx, good good good good good19:23
EspadaV8(so it's not likely to crash all the time)19:23
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lcukif its an app with parallel similar features it might be a good idea to talk with the conversations people :)19:24
lcuksince yours is qt19:24
EspadaV8not really, palringo stores all the IM services on our servers, so you can sign in to pal from another computer/device and have the mall there with you19:25
EspadaV8i only started coding it because i needed a linux client since using Wine was/is a pain19:25
Shapeshifterbut the n900 has it's own IM messenger, and it would also run pidgin, wouldn't it.19:25
EspadaV8and to learn Qt/C++19:25
lcukhas it worked?19:26
EspadaV8Shapeshifter: yeah, think i saw pidgin there19:26
EspadaV8lcuk: still a work in progress19:26
lcuki mean you learning :P19:26
EspadaV8lcuk: still a work in progress19:26
lcukor is that the same answer lol19:26
lcukthe day we stop learning is the day we die19:26
EspadaV8i've been doing it no and off for the last year-ish19:26
EspadaV8not got as far as i was hoping19:26
EspadaV8but i've mostly been 'off' it19:27
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EspadaV8woohoo :-D19:33
EspadaV8it works19:33
EspadaV8i can send messages :-)19:33
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EspadaV8thank you :)19:34
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kr1shnakI need to get started on some maemo coding at some point19:35
kr1shnakI have an old N800 sitting in my drawer19:35
kr1shnakI have no idea if I can install the latest OS on it though19:36
Shapeshifterkr1shnak: maemo5 does not run on older devices afaik.19:36
kr1shnakI guess I will have to rely on emulator only then19:37
ShapeshifterEspadaV8: does palringo have a web interface?19:37
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DocScrutinizerSpeedEvil: any news with hostmode?19:38
EspadaV8Shapeshifter: not at the moment, but once we've got a few other things sorted, we'll be working on one19:39
ShapeshifterEspadaV8: do you use libpurple?19:39
EspadaV8i don't19:39
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EspadaV8not sure what the server uses (i'm a web developer)19:40
EspadaV8qpalringo just talks to the server using libQPalringo (that i wrote)19:40
ShapeshifterEspadaV8: well, any client can also use libpurple... Point being that also uses libpurple, just like piding or finch. It would be sane to use it as well instead of your own implementation ;)19:40
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EspadaV8the server handles all that stuff19:41
EspadaV8i just send messages to the server19:41
Shapeshifterah I see19:41
EspadaV8(the palringo server, not the MSN servers)19:41
Shapeshiftermh. well, centralized. you take all the load ^^19:41
EspadaV8palringo kind of acts like a proxy19:41
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EspadaV8like i mentioned, it's so you can go from your WinMob phone, to the Mac client, to a Symbian phone with the same account, and always have your other services with you19:42
Shapeshiftermakes sense.19:42
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EspadaV8yay, i think i'm pretty much done with the move to a plugin system19:44
EspadaV8not i need to add a nice UI that doesn't kill the system19:45
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EspadaV8any git users around?20:09
waz1Stskeeps: ping?20:09
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RST38hwazd: How are things?20:24
* RST38h moos lazily20:24
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* GeneralAntilles tests.20:25
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Stskeepswaz1: pong20:27
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* EspadaV8 stabs git20:40
kr1shnakwhats the problem EspadaV8? Its probably highly unlikely I will be able to help though20:41
kr1shnakI only use the basics of git20:41
EspadaV8i think i've foobared something20:42
EspadaV8i've got 2 branches20:42
EspadaV8master and ui-plugins20:42
EspadaV8i've finished with ui-plugins and was trying to merge it to master20:42
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kr1shnaksounds like it should be straight forward enough20:43
EspadaV8had a few conflicts, fixed them, commit20:43
kr1shnakwhat is it complaining about?20:43
EspadaV8well... i tried 'git pull'20:43
EspadaV8that failed20:43
EspadaV8git status said...20:43
EspadaV8Your branch is ahead of 'origin/master' by 1 commit.20:43
EspadaV8and now git pull is erroring20:44
ShapeshifterEspadaV8: btw, what happens when you connect your n900 to a PC, is it simply an external storage device or does it need any fancy software?20:44
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Shapeshifterand do you see the directory tree of its linux and all that?20:44
SpeedEvilThe PC explodes.20:44
SpeedEvilIt's hoped that this will be fixed by release date.20:44
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Shapeshifterright ;)20:44
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EspadaV8Shapeshifter: there is a 'PC Suite' mode20:45
EspadaV8mounting as storage just gives you the ~ folder20:45
EspadaV8i might just rm -rf and git checkout20:46
EspadaV8and start again20:46
Shapeshifterso maemo isn't multiuser at all?20:46
GeneralAntillesShapeshifter, no, not really.20:46
Shapeshifterif it gives ~ that implies there's only one suer20:46
EspadaV8there's 'root' and 'user'20:46
GeneralAntillesMultiple users for a mobile device doesn't really make much sense.20:46
ShapeshifterGeneralAntilles: yeah.20:47
RST38hOne phone per family!20:47
SpeedEvilGeneralAntilles: It can.20:47
RST38hDeveloping country, you know...20:47
kr1shnakwhen I run into git troubles I usually end up hitting:
EspadaV8 - git remote show origin - kr1shnak20:47
lcuktablet sharing20:47
SpeedEvilGeneralAntilles: for example - I want to hand my phone to my brother/... - I don't want him getting any of the content20:47
GeneralAntillesRST38h, does that extreme niche justify the extra development and testing effort?20:47
lcukdamn! the only use case for multitouch20:47
Shapeshifterthe sdk has useradd20:47
SpeedEvilAnd yes - it's clearly a last proirity after getting the FM transmitter and reciever working20:48
kr1shnaksometimes I think git is more hassle than its worth20:48
Shapeshifterlcuk: split-screen-touch-gaming >.>20:48
Shapeshifterup to 8 players XD20:48
lcukpair them with bluetooth20:48
lcukits not like we can share the accelerometer20:49
EspadaV8kr1shnak: me too20:49
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lcukor use OSC20:49
SpeedEvilOne axis per player20:49
EspadaV8but i do like local commits20:49
RST38hGeneral: No idea, I have been taking random thoughts out of my brain20:49
lcukand allow as many on the subnet as needed20:49
kr1shnakyeah local commits are cool20:49
kr1shnakI used to use darcs20:49
kr1shnakwhich was pretty nice20:49
kr1shnakthen people were saying it was horribly broken or something20:49
kr1shnakand the git bandwagon started out in force20:50
kr1shnakso I started to use git20:50
kr1shnaknow... I think there has to be a better way20:50
Shapeshifter[sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] > sb-conf se FREMANTLE_ARMEL20:51
Shapeshiftersb-conf: You must close your other Scratchbox sessions first20:51
SpeedEvilClearly you need to write your own revision control system kr1shnak.20:51
ShapeshifterI don't have any other session. do I need to delete some lock file?20:51
kr1shnakno way!20:52
EspadaV8Shapeshifter: stop20:52
EspadaV8or whatever that command is20:52
kr1shnakanyone tried mercurial?20:52
lcukjavispedro, was it you that installed vb6 into wine20:53
javispedrobut i don't see why it wouldn't work with plain wine.20:53
lcukso it worked20:53
javispedrowell, it boots. :)20:53
ShapeshifterEspadaV8: thanks20:53
lcukis it still installed?20:54
javispedroand i can compile and run things20:54
EspadaV8Shapeshifter: np, i had that problem a few times20:54
lcukgood - so the baseline ide sits together and can produce ui layouts20:54
Shapeshifterso, what uname -a returns is some sort of hybrid between the host os and the scratchbox?20:54
ShapeshifterLinux Tachychineta 2.6.30-ARCH #1 SMP PREEMPT Wed Sep 9 12:37:32 UTC 2009 arm GNU/Linux20:54
* lcuk smiles20:54
javispedrohehe :)20:54
EspadaV8Shapeshifter: Linux pinecone 2.6.27-gentoo-r3 #5 PREEMPT Sat Apr 25 10:11:50 BST 2009 arm GNU/Linux20:54
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ShapeshifterI see20:55
javispedrolcuk: well, the GUI does weird things if you try to resize a form by dragging. fortunately, you can still do that by just typing a width.20:55
lcuki load a template project and tend to not resize forms...20:55
lcuki have a nice one setup which produces a liq* layout at 800*48020:56
warp10I have read that N900 will not support Java. I was wondering why, given that a lot of webpages host java applets. Any better news or idea about that?20:56
Stskeepswarp10: i think there's some misinformation out about that..20:56
ShadowJKI think more people want java midp than java se web applets20:57
Stskeepsoh, will not20:57
warp10Stskeeps: really? I have read a very extensive review (linked on Planet Maemo too) stating that Java isn't supported at all.20:57
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Stskeepswarp10: nm ;020:58
ShadowJK there is no j2se, applet or midp suport. Also no WAP and MMS support.20:58
javispedroSun offers a payware ARM J2SE JVM.20:58
Shapeshifterah, is it because there's no open java for ARM?20:58
javispedrothere's now, Zero iirc.20:59
ShadowJKWell there is, but it's nt entirely complete, and it's seriously painful to install21:00
Shapeshifteralso, icedtea21:00
ShapeshifterI thought.21:00
javispedroShadowJK: well, I'd consider J2SE support good enough. The missing part is Applets.21:01
Tadthebuilderam I the only one that doesnt miss any java support on the tablets? I guess it would be nice but it does not seem essential.21:01
GeneralAntillesTadthebuilder, no.21:01
SpeedEvilyou mean java in-web?21:01
* RST38h also does not miss java support21:01
javispedroTadthebuilder: there are java haters here.21:01
ShapeshifterI don't miss java either21:01
ShadowJKI'd like midp2 support for opera mini :-)21:01
waz1Summon stskeeps21:02
RST38hyea, midp2 would be nice in general21:02
RST38hbut I do not miss it21:02
SpeedEvilthat would be nice, it's not something that would more than slightly annoy me.21:02
Stskeepswarp10: yes?21:02
Stskeepswaz1: yes?21:02
SpeedEvilAnyway, you can clearly implement a java engine in javascript.21:02
SpeedEvilSee for an example21:02
fralsi miss mms more than java support... ;)21:02
warp10Tadthebuilder: me neither, especially given that My N97 hasn't Java (and I happily live with that) and I dislike Java too. I was just surprised that such a high-level device wouldn't support Java :)21:03
lcuksending pictures of cats is a high priority21:03
waz1Stskeeps: I've made a background)21:03
fralslcuk: and beer. dont forget beer! :)21:03
Tadthebuilderis not worth the cost unless you have an unlimited plan21:03
* lcuk raises a glass of water21:03
Stskeepswaz1: :) how can i see it?21:03
* SpeedEvil raises the titanic.21:03
fralsright, water then! dont forget the water! ;)21:03
lcukTadthebuilder, depends how much you REALLY like the girl21:03
TadthebuilderI can wait until I get home and email them...21:03
Tadthebuilderand if you ahve a device like n900 you can just email them from the device21:04
fralsi got 3000 free MMS, not gone over 100 in a single month yet ;D21:04
karbashmm.. what it needs to create mms support to n900?21:04
karbasi use quite much mms:s21:04
* lcuk just wants to send postcards :)21:04
karbasabout as much as sms's21:04
lcukif they go via the mms backend, all the better21:04
* Shapeshifter has never seen the point of mms21:04
SpeedEvilAre there printer  -> postal gateways?21:04
javispedrothere are MMS hates here too :D21:05
Shapeshifterthen again, I never had a phone that supported mms...21:05
Tadthebuilderthat postcard thing you have worked out is really cool21:05
Shapeshifterso I wouldn't know.21:05
Tadthebuilder(then again I love practically everything about your liqbase setup.21:05
* lcuk smiles muchly21:05
karbasShadowJK, well.. one example.. you sit in bar in front of beer.. if you just send picture of beer and in background the bar.. your friend will appear in front of you quite soon21:05
lcukhopefully it will expand beyond what i can make for it soon21:05
karbasShapeshifter,   well.. one example.. you sit in bar in front of beer.. if you just send picture of beer and in background the bar.. your friend will appear in front of you quite soon21:05
karbasShadowJK, not for you that21:05
lcukits been hard work this year trying out everything21:05
Shapeshifterkarbas: makes sense.21:06
Tadthebuilderjust dont make it expand past my n800 to much....21:06
Tadthebuilderwell yo ucan21:06
TadthebuilderI just want to be able to use it for the most part on my n80021:06
waz1Stskeeps: wait a bit21:07
ShadowJKHonestly I think it's just because implementing WAP and MMS is a huge task, and it's kinda hard to justify spending so much time on a dying technology21:07
SpeedEvilmms isn't dying21:07
Tadthebuildermms will die as mobile web gets faster and better21:07
SpeedEvilOr rather - it's gonna be a hell of a long time before it's unused21:07
Tadthebuilderand more used21:07
SpeedEvilregrettably in many places, data is still expensive.21:08
fralsShadowJK: from what ive seen, it *seems* like its doable without most of the wap crap, and rely on operators having http frontends21:08
Tadthebuilderwell yes21:08
fralsfrom what ive gathered thats what android does21:08
Tadthebuilderhaha I cant afford a data plan21:08
Tadthebuilderbut I also cannot afford mms :)21:08
SpeedEvilSome stupid places allow mms's, but not data21:09
SpeedEvilor charge more for data21:09
andre__i've never used mms and i've never seen a usecase for it21:09
SpeedEvilSending pictures of drunk people is basically the whole use-case.21:09
Tadthebuilderor cute kittnes21:09
jaskaso it would seem21:09
Tadthebuilderor a kid under a sign that says dip21:09
fralsmy gf uses it to send cute "love you pics" she draws on her 5800 :p21:10
TadthebuilderI think that was on a commercial for a phone or service that allowed mms21:10
Tadthebuilderalong time ago21:10
ShadowJKandre: MMS is like email, but it works with a wider range of devices and operators :)21:10
TadthebuilderI did not quite understand it21:10
ShadowJKor like SMS with pictures, that works with wide range of devices21:10
fralsi mostly use it to send pictures of what im drinking at the pub to friends to make em get there faster ;)21:10
andre__ShadowJK, as neither my current mobile phone nor my computer support MMS: no ;-))21:10
Stskeepswaz1: and it's 16:9?21:10
ShadowJKandre__, your computer supports mms fine, if the sender enters your email address instead of a phone number ;-)21:11
andre__hmm. that's "email" to me. heh21:11
waz1Stskeeps: yep21:11
Stskeepswaz1: ta21:11
fralsto the sender its MMS, id say ^^21:11
Stskeepslbt: ^21:11
ShadowJKBut for example at nokia there's a whole huge range of S40 and S60 devices that support mms and mostly just crash trying to do email :)21:11
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karbasis see point with mms because ppl around be uses those a lot21:13
wazdStskeeps: Anything else I can help with?21:13
karbasevery ones mobile support it21:13
Shapeshifteris there a listing somewhere of what the nokia binary packages do?21:13
Tadthebuildercould you email an mms to someone phone number from like gmail?21:13
Tadthebuilderand it show up as an mms?21:13
ShadowJKTadthebuilder, not universally21:13
Stskeepswazd: at this particular moment i can't think of anything, i still need to write my slides..21:13
Shapeshifterand huh there's no "man"21:13
fralsTadthebuilder: depends on the operator, some does provide this service21:13
Tadthebuilderah okay21:13
ShadowJKTadthebuilder, for example when I MMS to an email address, sender email shows up as <phonenumber>@operator, and that's a valid email mailbox, but my phone isn't setup to check it21:14
ShadowJKThe operator does MMS->email translation but not the other way around :(21:14
Tadthebuilderah I see21:14
fralsgotta try and see if my operator supports that...21:14
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wazdStskeeps: ok)21:14
Tadthebuilderokay, I thought maybe that was expected workaround since it seems internet phones (n900, iphone) dont have mms support21:15
Tadthebuilder(I realize newest iphones do have support)21:15
ShadowJKI've been too scared to setup email on my S60 device. there's the whole email settings wizard scandal, and the whole nokia messaging fubar mess to work around, and I haven't had the motivation :/21:15
wazdVDVsx: now it's time to make stuff for you :)21:15
karbasi don't have friends with iphones nor n900:s :)21:15
Stskeepswazd: any recommended colors of text?21:16
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wazdStskeeps: emm, white?)21:16
Stskeepswazd: alright21:16
Stskeepswazd: and you think this will look good on a big screen with projector?21:17
Tadthebuilderwell there are only so many n900's in the wild at this point...not suprising you dont have any friends with one21:17
wazdStskeeps: you don't?)21:17
karbasTadthebuilder, yes.. but point for that mms thing21:17
Tadthebuilderah oh I see21:18
Stskeepswazd: i'm artistically blind ;)21:18
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karbasand i think that n900 will still be quite marginal phone within non-nerd people21:18
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Tadthebuilderwell and rich nerds at that :)21:19
javispedroevil, rich nerds specially.21:19
TadthebuilderI dont know why they would be evil....21:19
javispedrothe devil himself chose the n900, didn't you get the memo? ;)21:20
wazdStskeeps: well, since it was said bout 16x9 ratio then projector will have good image quality. Black template proves that too. So we can make something more sophisticated than black on white)21:20
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Tadthebuildernope, missed that memo, must of got over looked21:20
Tadthebuilderyou are referring to bill gates right?21:21
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EspadaV8:-S git gives me a headache21:32
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konttori__by the way, is anybody working on the screenlets port?21:37
dottedmagEspadaV8: it's the side-effect of hardwiring git-gui(1) into your brain. :) Process should end in a few weeks.21:38
dottedmagEh. git-gui(1) actually exists, so let's call it git-brain-interface(1).21:38
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EspadaV8dottedmag: oooh... so i guess you know a bit about git then :-D21:40
EspadaV8oh... wait...21:40
EspadaV8misread that :(21:40
dottedmagEspadaV8: a bit, not a wizard21:41
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EspadaV8do you know if there's a way to see what i've commited locally but not pushed?21:41
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dottedmagEspadaV8: I usually run gitk and see the branches' locations21:41
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EspadaV8ah :(21:42
dottedmagEspadaV8: And IIRC git status gives helpful 'branch is N commits ahead of origin/branch'21:42
EspadaV8because git status says i'm up-to-date and nothing to commit, yet i have folders locally that don't exist on the server21:42
RST38hkonttori: This reminds me of someone from Nokia working on Google widgets...21:43
dottedmagEspadaV8: it's perfectly fine: you've commited everything, so there's nothing to commit.21:43
Stskeepsdidn't kate do that at some point?21:43
dottedmagEspadaV8: but you did not push the changes to remote server, which is completely unrelated activity.21:43
EspadaV8yeah... but i don't want to push them, i want to revert everything to the state it is on the server21:43
dottedmagEspadaV8: it's easy21:44
RST38hSts: I think she did21:44
dottedmagEspadaV8: git reset --hard origin/master (or other branch you want to use)21:44
RST38hSts: But I have not seen the final version21:44
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dottedmagEspadaV8: note it will completely remove everything which is not on server21:44
EspadaV8mhmm, that's what i want21:44
EspadaV8i was trying git reset --hard HEAD21:45
dottedmagEspadaV8: I see.21:45
* EspadaV8 tries git merge again21:45
dottedmagEspadaV8: you've mixed local and remote branches.21:45
dottedmagEspadaV8: HEAD is your local current branch. origin/master is a local representation of branch you've fetched.21:45
EspadaV8i see21:45
EspadaV8thank you dottedmag21:45
EspadaV8grrr, getting conflicts now21:46
dottedmaggit branches are alien at ferst, but quite powerful.21:46
dottedmag*at first21:46
javispedronever clone a git newbie's repo ;)21:46
EspadaV8something isn't right with the merge21:47
EspadaV8git merge origin/ui-plugins21:47
EspadaV8that'll merge the remote branch, yes?21:47
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EspadaV8because origin/ui-plugins doesn't have a 'tags' folder (i deleted it) but after the merge, master still has it21:49
dottedmagit might be the conflict21:49
dottedmaglook for change/delete conflict in merge output21:49
EspadaV8it's deleting all the files/folders in the tags folder, just not the folder itself21:50
EspadaV8can't see any conflicts about it21:50
dottedmagwhat does git status say about it?21:50
EspadaV8renamed:    tags/0.1.1/src/signinwindow.cpp -> trunk/uiPlugins/qpDefaultUi/signinwindow.cpp21:51
EspadaV8:-S that never happened21:51
dottedmagEspadaV8: just a false positive, never mind21:51
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EspadaV8i moved trunk/src/signinwindow.cpp21:51
EspadaV8that not going to matter then?21:52
EspadaV8one sec, just got to make a call21:52
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EspadaV8dottedmag: - git status21:59
dottedmagEspadaV8: is anything left in tags dir?22:00
timelessanyone know why openssh client/server was updated for maemo5?22:01
qwerty12_N810Looked at its debian/changelog?22:02
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Proteoustimeless new version of ssh came out22:02
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Proteoussome sort of anniversary edition...22:03
EspadaV8dottedmag: all the folders22:06
EspadaV8and a load of sub=folders22:06
dottedmagEspadaV8: any files?22:06
EspadaV8not that i can see22:06
dottedmagdo not worry then, git does not track directories separately22:06
EspadaV8no, no files22:06
dottedmagSo the tags/ will go out after resolving conflicts and commit.22:06
lcuksimplest way to play a wav file in c?22:07
EspadaV8can i get a list of conflicts without doing git status?22:07
lcukand NEVER search google image for dingdong22:08
* lcuk needs to erase22:08
Tadthebuilderoh wow22:08
Tadthebuilderbad idea lcuk22:08
Tadthebuilderwhat were you looking for?22:08
lcukdingdong door bell22:08
Proteousa tasty pastry22:09
lcukfound it in original google page lol22:09
qwerty12_N810lcuk: doorbell widget?22:09
Tadthebuilderah okay22:09
lcukqwerty12_N810 yeah22:10
konttori__Stskeeps: RST38h : Hmm... I think she was. Also, she had the qt widgets running on n810.22:10
TadthebuilderI think a widget that is recursive would be pretty cool22:10
Tadthebuilderand confuse the mess out of people22:10
konttori__or were those google widgets running from the qt?22:10
lcukqwerty12_N810, would be a nice simple effective one for people to use a template :)22:11
lcuklike liqtorch :P22:11
Firebirdhanging your tablet outside?22:11
qwerty12_N810lcuk: Since you're just playing a sound, and appear not to be doing anything special with the sound: ...22:11
lcuk"dong dong, maemo calling"22:11
lcukthanks qwerty12_N810, i shall see if i have dev headers to link that22:12
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qwerty12_N810Firebird: Yeah, lcuk will be hanging his N900 outside at 21:00 for anyone to take22:14
lcukFirebird, i have my n900 on me all the time22:14
lcukwe need a daemon that just sits listening for network doorbells22:15
lcukand if it detects someone else runnin the same one it goes wild22:15
qwerty12_N810I want an electric-shock doorbell for those people who feel like playing knockdown ginger22:16
rm_youi needs me a n90022:16
Stskeepsi needs me a minisd22:17
kynkyi need n900 too, just trying to find way to get ut of my contract first22:17
Tadthebuilderyou both need training in English grammer.22:17
FirebirdI can has need me a moneys?22:18
kynkylol, @ grammer, even though i cant spell22:18
qwerty12_N810I need a TV-out cable22:18
zap_I can email you one22:19
kynkyonly because you went to the trouble of the correct capital E22:19
Tadthebuilderwalmart sells tv-out cables22:19
Firebirdoh right, can the tablphone900 be on without a battery?22:19
Tadthebuilderhaha, yeah I need training in English spelling.22:19
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qwerty12_N810zap_: Thanks! In return, I can get the Prince of Nigeria in touch with you. He has lost a son and it turns out that he left some money to you...22:20
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RST38hzap: Hey, have been trying to find you...22:20
RST38hzap: MC postinst has got one non-fatal but unpleasant problem22:21
lcukqwerty12_N810, bug fiferboy tonight to do the gtk widget. i asked him last week to make me a simple one with just a picture and a click event.  add the wav and make it ring.22:21
lcuklet everyone know we are here :)22:21
qwerty12_N810lcuk: What GTK+ widget? :)22:21
lcuka desktop one22:21
RST38hzap: The folder selection utility is not in Fremantle, so the postinst fails, although the package still registers as "installed" (just broken) and works22:21
RST38hzap: To fix this, use the following safety check:22:21
qwerty12_N810lcuk: I don't have a need for one :)22:22
lcukyou dont, but about half those widgets in the list do22:22
RST38hif [ -x /usr/bin/maemo-select-menu-location ]; then22:22
RST38h  maemo-select-menu-location vgba.desktop22:22
qwerty12_N810lcuk: so... you get in touch with him :p22:22
lcukim goin offline, ive got some work to do (as always..)22:22
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zap_RST38h: thats because there's no menu in fremantle?22:23
RST38hzap: Yep, just one large bucket of stuff22:23
lcukthat user interactive portion of the installer kills apt and ssh22:23
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RST38hzap: But the above piece will work on both Diablo and Fremantle, tested it22:23
zap_RST38h: will fix that tomorrow22:24
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zap_I understand22:24
* lcuk vanishes22:24
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qwerty12_N810lcuk: odds are that I won't catch him, either22:24
RST38hlcuk: You have your tablet hidden behind some drywall or what? =)22:24
lcukcyas later \o RST38h qwerty12_N81022:24
qwerty12_N810bye, lcuk22:24
RST38hg'night lcuk22:24
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keesj first working setup for push_nbutton22:35
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Proteousworst driving ever22:37
Proteousyou'll never win that way22:38
Tadthebuilderim very confused by that video22:38
Proteousthat will clear it up22:38
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Tadthebuilderthere is a very nice keyboard which i cannot see because this is a fake model22:39
Tadthebuilderawesome line22:39
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Proteouslego FTW22:40
keesjyes, but if I want to make thing without errors I will spend days creating videos22:40
TadthebuilderI wasnt trying to make fun of you22:41
TadthebuilderI really liked that line22:41
Tadthebuilderand I like what your trying to do22:41
Proteousyeah, me too22:41
ProteousI will buy one...22:41
GeneralAntilleskeesj, nice.22:41
* qwerty12_N810 is envious of keesj's ability to keep his N800 in a good condition22:43
Tadthebuilderyoud be envious of me too22:43
GeneralAntillesMy battery latch has come full circle to plastic.22:43
RST38hwazd: BTW, have you got TI73 faceplate picture?22:43
TadthebuilderI have an n800 is good condition22:43
Tadthebuilderthough my battery is getting a little short :(22:44
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Tadthebuilderthough I know you can buy one for like thirty dollars...22:46
EspadaV8oooh, lego @:-)22:46
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keesjProteous: I hope to be able to replace the hammer with a avr using the IR transcievers that should bring the cost down22:48
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GAN800irreco is cool but damn is it a pain to create layouts.22:51
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GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N810, ping?22:52
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qwerty12_N810GeneralAntilles: Yessir?22:52
qwerty12_N810Hiya, timsamoff22:52
GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N810, thanks for the brightness applet.22:52
GeneralAntillesNow I feel slightly less like killing myself when using FBReader. ;)22:53
qwerty12_N810np :)22:53
GeneralAntillesrm_you, ping?22:53
timsamoffHi. Just checking out Xchat in Fremantle.22:53
rm_youGeneralAntilles: pong22:53
GeneralAntillesrm_you, did you see qwerty12's new applet in Extras-devel?22:53
GeneralAntillestimsamoff, lern2idle.22:53
rm_youdid he do my job for me? :P22:53
Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: time to promote it to extras so it can become the most popular down ;)22:54
qwerty12_N810It only does a range of 1-5, remember...22:54
Tadthebuilderim hearing report of youtube stuttering on the n900 any word on this?22:54
rm_youoh you did that22:54
qwerty12_N810I'm still awaiting ABL :)22:54
GeneralAntillesrm_you, just tear out his logic.22:54
rm_youGeneralAntilles: it isn't what i need22:54
rm_youI know how to do that22:54
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rm_youit was the same in Diablo22:54
GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N810, what are you interfacing with?22:54
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rm_youthe same as the official brightness applet22:54
GeneralAntillesAh, hrm.22:54
* timsamoff must go. Ta.22:55
GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N810, we need at application shortcut applet.22:55
rm_youI need a device in front of me to figure out how to REALLY change the brightness22:56
rm_youalso i need to beat up someone at Nokia22:56
GeneralAntillesqwerty12_N810, shift-fn-1/2/3/4 to switch to/open an application.22:56
GeneralAntillesrm_you, 4 days!22:56
qwerty12_N810I hazored hildon-desktop to do that in Diablo...22:56
qwerty12_N810Ugly hack...22:56
Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: fremantle desktop has fairly easy key shortcuts.. src/main.c22:57
lcukGeneralAntilles, theres a shortcut in the top left of the screen in n90022:57
lcuk2 clicks to any running app22:57
GeneralAntilleslcuk, 2 taps minimum.22:57
GeneralAntillesThis is 1 shortcut to get exactly where I need to be.22:58
GeneralAntilleslcuk, saving taps for something you do this often is always useful.22:58
Stskeepsisn't there app widgets?22:58
lcukhow many keypresses?22:58
GeneralAntillesSo, two.22:58
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GeneralAntillesSince shift/fn can be pressed as one.22:58
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lcukwhat about smartq5 that has no keys? or n80022:59
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GeneralAntilleslcuk, they don't install the applet.22:59
lcukthe fremantle method works22:59
GeneralAntillesWhere does the statusbar CPU store screenshots?22:59
lcukprobably live from the compositor memory22:59
GeneralAntilleslcuk, why am I justifying this to you? :P23:00
GeneralAntilleslcuk, are you gonna write it? :P23:00
lcuk:D because its something you believe in23:00
lcuki dont know about lowlevel x stuff23:00
Tadthebuilderi thought you left lcuk23:00
lcuki have23:00
Tadthebuilderyou have skills to both have left and still be here23:01
qwerty12_N810lcuk: Yeah, GTFO23:01
Tadthebuilderthats is not very nice...I think that you are welcome to stay if you so choose23:01
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lcukim actually trying to find a parser i wrote23:01
TadthebuilderI dont know what that is23:03
Tadthebuilderbut good luck23:03
Tadthebuilder(I know what it means to parse greek verbs...)23:03
Tadthebuilder(and to a lesser extent english verbs....)23:04
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Stskeepswhat? :P23:08
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* qwerty12_N810 imagines Stskeeps getting the duct-tape ready23:09
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Stskeepsqwerty12_N810: i'm actually ~30 cm from duct-tape.23:10
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Tadthebuilderare their any extended life batteries for an n800?23:10
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Firebirddoes the wall count?23:16
Tadthebuilderha funny23:17
TadthebuilderI am actually very paranoid of buying a new battery23:18
TadthebuilderI have heard horror stories23:18
Stskeepsmugen is n800 isn't it?23:18
GeneralAntillesMugen's is same capacity as Nokia's23:18
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Stskeepsjust looks bigger?23:19
FirebirdI thought mugen's was N81023:19
GeneralAntillesThe N800 doesn't have an extended one.23:19
GeneralAntillesand the one they advertise as higher capacity is actually the same as Nokia's23:19
Tadthebuildercan I buy one directly from nokia though?23:19
Tadthebuilderthat would be awesome23:19
kr1shnakI think I am going to use my old N800 as my alarm clock23:20
TadthebuilderI dont trust most of those other providors, explosions and such.23:20
GeneralAntillesSure, you can get from Nokia.23:20
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zeevHi, is the release date of N900 already known ( in USA)?23:20
Tadthebuilderthe exact date is not known23:21
Tadthebuilderits supposed to be soon?23:21
TadthebuilderGeneral: have you used any other battery than the standard?23:21
bigbrovarzeev: the exact day is not known (.)23:21
zeevok, thanks... will wait...23:22
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Tadthebuilderjust did a search for a battery and prices range from ten dollars to about 50 dollars23:22
GeneralAntillesTadthebuilder, I only use Nokia, but I've seen people use other battiers.23:23
Tadthebuilderkk thanks man23:23
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Tadthebuilderfound one that claims its nokia battery for 30 dollars.23:23
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crashanddie_Tadthebuilder, LMAO23:30
crashanddie_Tadthebuilder, "List price: $25, You save: $-5: You pay: $30"23:31
TadthebuilderI did not see that23:31
Tadthebuilder...makes me now want to buy it from them23:31
Firebirdlooks like some failblog material23:32
Tadthebuilderim just looking for an legitamate n800 battery..that costs 30 bucks max23:32
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Shapeshifterlol that is brilliant23:37
Tadthebuilderwhat is really funny23:38
Tadthebuilderabout that23:38
Tadthebuilderis the minus sign23:38
Tadthebuilderall of the rest of them do not have that, when they are actually saving23:38
Tadthebuilderits must of either been done completely on purpose to try to trick unsuspecting people (aka me) or a program/script set to automatically do that.23:38
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ShadowJKCheck the price of the mugen battery23:48
ShadowJKAfaik nobody has reported explosions yet23:49
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* ShadowJK of course recomends original nokia if you've got extra 10 bucks23:50
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crashanddie__Tadthebuilder, no, it's just stupid coding23:52
crashanddie__Tadthebuilder, it's a common wording mistake in a lot of different languages actually23:52
Tadthebuilderah okay23:52
Tadthebuilderah that would make sense23:52
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crashanddie__Tadthebuilder, a lot of business say, "-60% off" for example23:53
Tadthebuilderit says negative on that one23:53
lcukcrashanddie_, look again. thats ripping off23:53
crashanddie__but "off" already implies a reduction, so the - is unneeded23:53
Tadthebuilderbut it is actually correct23:53
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Tadthebuilderon the ones where it is actually subtracting the price23:53
Tadthebuilderthere is no negative sign23:53
lcukwhat it is saying is correct23:53
lcukthey are asking you to pay $5 MORE than the list price23:53
Tadthebuilderyour getting negative five dollars off23:53
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crashanddie__lcuk, that's what we're discussing, you are correct23:54
crashanddie__so my guess is, they actually didn't mean to do something stupid, some idiot just entered -5 instead of 523:54
TadthebuilderI just want a new battery haha23:54
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Tadthebuilderid also spend the same amount on an n900 instead23:55
crashanddie__is an aptitude score of -811 good?23:57
Tadthebuilderaptitude for what?23:57
javispedrofor installing debian packages, of course!23:57
Tadthebuilderoh...I was thinking a military aptitude test...I was wondering why you were asking that here...23:58
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yekcimmikkov_: hello23:59
yekcimi was loonking for you23:59
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