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| lardman | evening all | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| javispedro | http://git.or.cz/course/svn.html this page is pure gold | 00:00 |
| woglinde | jo lardman | 00:02 |
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| divide_by_zero | Can I make Hildon start all applications maximized, and never bring a window to top without me asking for? | 00:20 |
| timeless_mbp | um | 00:21 |
| timeless_mbp | hildon is more of a toolkit | 00:21 |
| timeless_mbp | and less of a window manager | 00:21 |
| timeless_mbp | hildon-desktop / matchbox are more window managerish | 00:21 |
| timeless_mbp | in diablo, some applications didn't really have full screen modes | 00:21 |
| timeless_mbp | e.g. the game start screen | 00:21 |
| timeless_mbp | and some applications didn't have non full screen modes | 00:22 |
| timeless_mbp | e.g. the games themselves | 00:22 |
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| divide_by_zero | ok, i want the maximizable ones to start maximized by default | 00:24 |
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| johnsq | divide_by_zero: look if matchbox supports rules or config of apps | 00:34 |
| lardman | hey woglinde, sorry for the lag | 00:35 |
| divide_by_zero | ok... now i'm sitting here wondering would a matchbox hold my clothes? :] | 00:36 |
| divide_by_zero | i imagine it's possible because fremantle will be like this, right? | 00:37 |
| woglinde | lardman no prob | 00:38 |
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| lcuk2 | hello lardman \o woglinde | 00:41 |
| lardman | hi lcuk2 | 00:42 |
| woglinde | jo lcuk | 00:42 |
| lardman | well I've just booked my flights to Amsterdam | 00:43 |
| lardman | the wonders of air travel, have to fly from Berlin to Luton, then back to Amsterdam | 00:44 |
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| woglinde | lardman hehe | 00:46 |
| woglinde | we could met at the airport | 00:46 |
| lardman | what time do you get in? I think we get in at 21:00 | 00:46 |
| zerojay | As a north american, amsterdam is a fable that i'm not so sure exists. :P | 00:48 |
| lardman | because of the weed you mean? | 00:48 |
| lardman | or the English tourists? | 00:48 |
| zerojay | Yeah, it's that mythical weed place. | 00:49 |
| woglinde | lardman lol | 00:49 |
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| lardman | I'm not sure I met a single dutchman last time I was there, then again they all speak English better than the tourists that's for sure ;) | 00:49 |
| woglinde | I meant on the airport in berlin | 00:49 |
| woglinde | and I will stay in berlin | 00:49 |
| woglinde | I will not got to the summit | 00:49 |
| lardman | woglinde: ah ok, will be there for flight at 16:20 iirc | 00:49 |
| lardman | woglinde: why not? | 00:49 |
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| * lardman gives a small curse for having to debug a student's FDE code | 00:50 | |
| lardman | and goes to get another beer to help himself along | 00:50 |
| zerojay | Being drunk at work is nice | 00:51 |
| zerojay | Celebrating our boss going to a new office. | 00:51 |
| woglinde | lardman no time and family | 00:51 |
| lardman | ah, not at work, it's nearly 23:00 here | 00:52 |
| woglinde | zerojay lol | 00:52 |
| lardman | woglinde: am bringing mine (wife) | 00:52 |
| woglinde | whois the new boss? | 00:52 |
| zerojay | Dunno, i'll be following her there in a month or so. | 00:52 |
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| zerojay | Actually, a week after i get there, maemo summit. | 00:53 |
| zerojay | Two months then | 00:54 |
| lardman | mmmm, beer + nuts | 00:54 |
| zerojay | When i told my boss i need time off and she asked why | 00:54 |
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| zerojay | I said "to save the world, one tablet at a time" | 00:54 |
| zerojay | She just said "sounds important" and approved. | 00:55 |
| Luddek | hah | 00:55 |
| zerojay | Someone here at the office saw me using my tablet and told her i was playing ds games, lol | 00:56 |
| zerojay | So i showed her the tablet. | 00:56 |
| zerojay | She's buying rx-51 at launch now. | 00:56 |
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| divide_by_zero | then she saw you were jun on irc!... | 00:57 |
| divide_by_zero | just | 00:57 |
| zerojay | Hah | 00:57 |
| zerojay | No biggie. | 00:57 |
| woglinde | lol | 00:58 |
| Luddek | what do you work with? | 00:58 |
| zerojay | I make videogames | 00:58 |
| zerojay | We use scrum, just like maemo does | 00:58 |
| Luddek | ah ok | 00:59 |
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| divide_by_zero | is it? great!... | 00:59 |
| zerojay | My life is nothing but sprints now, lol | 01:00 |
| divide_by_zero | but ive heard they dont stimulate ppl to use scrumm itself, is it true? because of licensing... | 01:00 |
| zerojay | Scrum's a development methodology, nothing to do with licenses | 01:01 |
| divide_by_zero | oh sorry, i tought you ment scumm :D | 01:01 |
| zerojay | Hehe | 01:01 |
| Luddek | i also thought that at first but than i read quickly on wikipedia | 01:02 |
| divide_by_zero | a friend of mine uses that at his work... | 01:02 |
| zerojay | Maemo uses it in a looser sense. | 01:02 |
| divide_by_zero | there was an interview the other day at floss weekly with one of scummvm's developers. | 01:03 |
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| Macer | lol | 01:20 |
| woglinde | jo macer | 01:21 |
| Macer | "when people are called yellow, what are they?" "chinese" "wrong" "cowards" "correct" | 01:22 |
| Macer | cowards was the answer given by the chinese kid | 01:22 |
| zerojay | Lol | 01:22 |
| Macer | the white girl said chinese hahaha | 01:22 |
| zerojay | Wtf | 01:22 |
| Macer | i saw a video for some kids show | 01:22 |
| zerojay | Do i even wanna know? | 01:23 |
| Macer | and that is what the girl said | 01:23 |
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| Macer | hahahaha | 01:23 |
| Macer | ever see the south park where the dad is on wheel of fortune? | 01:23 |
| Macer | ;) | 01:23 |
| zerojay | Hah | 01:24 |
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| Macer | wow youtube sucks | 01:36 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Reading the comments? ;) | 01:38 |
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| lardman | qwerty12_N810: you don't read the articles do you...? ;) | 01:41 |
| zerojay | Hah | 01:43 |
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| Macer | qwerty12_N810: heh | 01:43 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | lardman: depends :> | 01:43 |
| Macer | search for stupid game show answers | 01:43 |
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| lardman | qwerty12_N810: :) | 01:44 |
| Macer | some of them had me dying laughing | 01:44 |
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| Macer | "something your husband will absolutely NOT let you put on his weiner" "ben-gay" | 01:48 |
| Macer | hahahahaha | 01:48 |
| * lardman worries a little for Macer's sanity ;) | 01:48 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | Wow. Modest really is whorish. I have no e-mail accounts, at all, configured but, yet, it still insists on loading at timed intervals. | 01:48 |
| lardman | and if you do have them, it still sucks any cpu power away as soon as you connect | 01:49 |
| lardman | ;) | 01:49 |
| lardman | qwerty12_N810: I ask again, are you sure you're not going to be able to make i tto the summit? | 01:49 |
| lardman | please | 01:49 |
| lardman | you know it will be fun | 01:50 |
| lardman | :) | 01:50 |
| qwerty12_N810 | lardman: it would be but I am certain that I won't be able to :) | 01:50 |
| lardman | ah go on, it's not far away | 01:50 |
| lardman | it'll be a good laugh | 01:50 |
| lardman | beer, women (well I have a wife, who will be with me), weed (I don't smoke); but there's still beer! | 01:51 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | However much I'd like to go, it's just not possible. I don't have a passport and college would find new ways of keeping me busy :> | 01:52 |
| lardman | well the passport can be sorted out with ~£80 and a few photos, what's your course? I'm sure we can all chip in and help with that :) | 01:53 |
| lardman | actually in the EU a driver's licence will do.... | 01:53 |
| lardman | though that might not help you | 01:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Nah, I get a provisionial next year | 01:53 |
| VDVsx | well, the national identification card, will do in EU | 01:54 |
| VDVsx | :) | 01:54 |
| lardman | pah, we don't do those! | 01:54 |
| VDVsx | no ? | 01:54 |
| lardman | thankfullly :) | 01:55 |
| lardman | no | 01:55 |
| VDVsx | oh | 01:55 |
| VDVsx | what do you got for ID ? | 01:55 |
| lardman | I just booked my flights today, am trying to think what forms of ID they will accept | 01:55 |
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| lardman | VDVsx: nothing | 01:55 |
| lardman | VDVsx: we don't have to carry ID at all | 01:55 |
| qwerty12_N810 | lardman: £20 ;) | 01:55 |
| lardman | qwerty12_N810: your customs officials are cheap! :) | 01:56 |
| VDVsx | lardman, but you have one right ? | 01:56 |
| Mace_N8x0 | blah | 01:56 |
| javispedro | qwerty12_N810, that's indeed what a friend of mine used as "ID" in some south african country :D | 01:56 |
| lardman | VDVsx: usually passport in the bank, drivers licence for everything else | 01:56 |
| Mace_N8x0 | going to order a pizza | 01:56 |
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| lardman | VDVsx: ID? No, passport & drivers' licence yes | 01:56 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: rofl | 01:56 |
| lardman | :D | 01:57 |
| lardman | Mace_N8x0: you're making me hungry and it's nearly midnight | 01:57 |
| VDVsx | lardman, and minors, what they have ? | 01:57 |
| lardman | nothing afaik | 01:57 |
| lardman | well petrol bombs and knives if you believe the news ;) | 01:58 |
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| VDVsx | lol | 01:58 |
| VDVsx | very strange for me :) | 01:58 |
| lardman | but you can get false IDs iirc, Eurocard or somesuch? | 01:58 |
| lardman | qwerty12_N810: you'll know more about that than I do, was a long time ago | 01:59 |
| lardman | ISIC card prrhaps? | 01:59 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Something like that, my friend got a fake one made with some French "agency" on it.. | 01:59 |
| qwerty12_N810 | It looked decent but it was made on some rubbish material that bent quite easily | 02:00 |
| lardman | all quite entertaining, as kids look like kids, and that's all there is to say about it :D | 02:00 |
| javispedro | fwiw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_ID#European_Union | 02:01 |
| lardman | yeah, I was once stopped in Germany and had to run away as I didn't have my passport on me | 02:01 |
| lardman | was a long time ago, and wasn't doing anything illegal at all, promise | 02:01 |
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| VDVsx | only foreigns got ID cards, lol | 02:03 |
| Mace_N8x0 | we need national id cards in the US | 02:06 |
| lardman | expensive | 02:07 |
| Mace_N8x0 | screw it | 02:07 |
| Mace_N8x0 | world IDs | 02:07 |
| lardman | and not proved to reduce fraud really | 02:07 |
| Mace_N8x0 | ! | 02:07 |
| Mace_N8x0 | lardman, I was joking | 02:07 |
| Mace_N8x0 | ;) | 02:08 |
| lardman | yeah no worries :) | 02:08 |
| Mace_N8x0 | although | 02:08 |
| * qwerty12_N810 wonders what the Nokla version of the N900 will look like | 02:08 | |
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| Mace_N8x0 | a national drivers lic would be nice | 02:08 |
| Mace_N8x0 | heh | 02:08 |
| lardman | they would be good, if the infrastructure that uses them is also good, but that;s not going to happen | 02:09 |
| lardman | ah right, you have per-state licences? | 02:09 |
| Mace_N8x0 | yes | 02:09 |
| Mace_N8x0 | so joe drunk driver | 02:09 |
| Mace_N8x0 | would get away with it in another state | 02:10 |
| Mace_N8x0 | there are all types of avoidable things that can be done by crossing states | 02:10 |
| lardman | no interstate reporting? | 02:10 |
| Mace_N8x0 | lardman, it is a joke | 02:11 |
| Mace_N8x0 | heh | 02:11 |
| Mace_N8x0 | probably running off a tethered phone | 02:11 |
| Mace_N8x0 | ;) | 02:11 |
| lardman | I understand we finally have cross-Europe reporting for vehicle stuff now | 02:11 |
| Mace_N8x0 | heh | 02:11 |
| lardman | I'm sure it works if you get nicked in France; I doubt it works if a Frenchman gets nicked over here though | 02:12 |
| Mace_N8x0 | well.. the rural areas would be too difficult | 02:12 |
| Mace_N8x0 | haha | 02:12 |
| zerojayPC | qwerty12_N810: Yeah, can't wait for the N900 to be revealed so that we can spend the next three months hearing complaints. ;) | 02:12 |
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| lardman | zerojayPC: c'est la vie | 02:12 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Heh | 02:12 |
| Mace_N8x0 | zerojayPC, touch books should have been shipping for 2 weeks now | 02:12 |
| zerojayPC | lardman: Yep, I know. | 02:13 |
| Mace_N8x0 | so far not a single person has received one | 02:13 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | At least "it's not a phone" will be a thing of the past | 02:13 |
| zerojayPC | I don't know what a touch book is. | 02:13 |
| Mace_N8x0 | qwerty, it isnt a phone i thought | 02:13 |
| Mace_N8x0 | just a tablet with hspda | 02:13 |
| Mace_N8x0 | zerojay, good | 02:14 |
| Mace_N8x0 | dont find out | 02:14 |
| zerojayPC | Well... I said it was a phone, but Qole said it wasn't announced as one... but all the FCC documents refer to it repeatedly as a phone... over and over. | 02:14 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Mace_N8x0: well, T-Mobile are gonna be carrying it... | 02:14 |
| Mace_N8x0 | it will suck you in and disappoint | 02:14 |
| Mace_N8x0 | wow really? | 02:14 |
| zerojayPC | I think it's safe to say it'll be a phone. | 02:14 |
| Mace_N8x0 | tmobile's nokia selection totally sucks | 02:14 |
| zerojayPC | And that the entire Maemo project was just a research mission really. | 02:15 |
| zerojayPC | To get us to this point. | 02:15 |
| Mace_N8x0 | zerojay, is a sidekick a phone? | 02:15 |
| zerojayPC | Yes. | 02:15 |
| lardman | I agree it will have to be a phone, certainly with the smaller screen size | 02:15 |
| Mace_N8x0 | ah | 02:15 |
| zerojayPC | How is it not a phone? | 02:15 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Maemo 5 is really Hildon running atop Symbian ;) | 02:15 |
| Mace_N8x0 | i think the n810 is a good phine size | 02:15 |
| Mace_N8x0 | haha | 02:15 |
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| Mace_N8x0 | hahaha | 02:16 |
| Mace_N8x0 | qwerty.. that would be awesome | 02:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | It would? | 02:16 |
| Mace_N8x0 | yes | 02:16 |
| zerojayPC | :/ | 02:16 |
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| Mace_N8x0 | hildon running on symbian using qt ftw | 02:17 |
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| Mace_N8x0 | with powervr support | 02:18 |
| javispedro | ot os a pme | 02:18 |
| lardman | hmm, I see the magic words | 02:18 |
| javispedro | arg | 02:18 |
| javispedro | it is a phone: http://i623.photobucket.com/albums/tt317/uthe_cute/SDC10929.jpg | 02:18 |
| javispedro | if that's not a speaker hole | 02:18 |
| javispedro | i don't what is. | 02:19 |
| javispedro | today's not my typing gay. | 02:19 |
| javispedro | dang it. | 02:19 |
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| lardman | lol | 02:19 |
| lardman | I have that too | 02:19 |
| qwerty12_N810 | A typing gay? ;P | 02:19 |
| javispedro | *day :( | 02:19 |
| lardman | not specifically the day/gay thing mind you :p | 02:19 |
| javispedro | also, damn snes9x disabled the key autorepeat if held down | 02:20 |
| lardman | my fingers do just type whatever they want though, once I've started the word | 02:20 |
| javispedro | (on my desktop) | 02:20 |
| javispedro | so deleting is a pain | 02:20 |
| lardman | I blame the wine/beer/time of night/government/USA | 02:20 |
| lardman | seems fair | 02:20 |
| javispedro | "xset r on" fixed it :) | 02:21 |
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| javispedro | so it is a phone. | 02:23 |
| lardman | which is good as my contract has just expired and I need a new one | 02:23 |
| lardman | :) | 02:23 |
| zerojayPC | What I don't understand is why "it is a phone" causes such a panic, like as if suddenly all the stuff that is in and being worked on for Maemo 5 was thrown out. | 02:24 |
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| javispedro | I personally fear two things: $$, and carriers. | 02:24 |
| zerojayPC | It's going to be a tablet... with phone capabilities. | 02:24 |
| zerojayPC | No different than the N810 and the other tablets. | 02:24 |
| javispedro | more expensive for a start. we'll see. | 02:25 |
| zerojayPC | We don't know that. :) | 02:25 |
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| zerojayPC | Good chance of it happening, though. | 02:26 |
| zerojayPC | But it's not the phone hardware causing that high price. | 02:26 |
| javispedro | just the fact that it can be used as a phone increases the price. if they have to keep adding hardware to justify the price so that it does not seem like a total ripoff they'll do it. | 02:27 |
| javispedro | i don't know why, but that happens. | 02:27 |
| javispedro | hum. this linus guy knows how to do scms. must be a good coder I guess ;) | 02:29 |
| jeremiah | Not too shabby eh? | 02:30 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I hear he's a git ;) | 02:30 |
| jeremiah | There is an O'Reilly webcast on git on the 20th | 02:30 |
| jeremiah | From the guy who wrote 'pro git' and works at Github | 02:30 |
| jeremiah | Shaun Chancon I think his name is | 02:30 |
| javispedro | i only "accidentally erased" around 1 hour of work while trying to setup everything so it must be good :) | 02:34 |
| derf | That sounds like git alright. | 02:34 |
| zerojayPC | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjCDLMtkNGc <-- best trick ever. | 02:36 |
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| * GeneralAntilles yawns. | 02:38 | |
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| GeneralAntilles | Awesome new mark against capacitive. | 03:09 |
| GeneralAntilles | You can't type with a Band-Aid on your thumb. | 03:09 |
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| javispedro | you can't type either if you're an undead. | 03:13 |
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| javispedro | "The science behind the touch-sensitive technology is known as capacitive sensing, which stores the energy created between users' fingers and the wheel itself. This technology dates back to 1919." lol. | 03:15 |
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| Macer | ok | 03:19 |
| Macer | back to this crap | 03:19 |
| Macer | heh | 03:19 |
| Macer | wtf | 03:20 |
| Macer | ./initfs_flash &> initfs_flash.log didn't work | 03:21 |
| Macer | i need to copy the output | 03:21 |
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| Macer | damn | 03:25 |
| Macer | bootmenu.conf was messed up | 03:25 |
| Macer | that sucks | 03:25 |
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| Macer | reasons like this are why everybody should always start from scratch when coding | 03:35 |
| Macer | haha | 03:35 |
| Macer | 3rd time's a charm :) | 03:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Here's a chilling thought: what the Health Department thought was MRSA-CA, the infectious disease doctor says is poison oak. | 03:37 |
| Macer | GeneralAntilles: fear sells | 03:37 |
| GeneralAntilles | Macer, the Health Department doesn't have anything to sell. | 03:38 |
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| Macer | wtf | 03:43 |
| Macer | GeneralAntilles: yeah. i'm sure the health department has a bunch of people that work for it with no stock in medical supplies and treatment somewhere :) | 03:43 |
| Macer | CRAP | 03:43 |
| Macer | wtf am i doing wrong with this bootmenu.conf | 03:43 |
| Macer | [ -d "/sys/block/${INT_CARD}/${MENU_2_DEVICE}" ] || MENU_2_NAME="(${MENU_2_NAME}) N/A" | 03:45 |
| Macer | that one works fien. the other menu is the same but i keep getting | 03:45 |
| Macer | (Maemo - EXT SD) N/A in teh actual menu | 03:46 |
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| Macer | http://pastebin.com/dd33afb3 | 03:46 |
| Macer | can someoen look at that and tell me why that 3rd menu is messed up? | 03:47 |
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| divide_by_zero | I was having a beer today and this laywer saw my N800 and was intrigued. I told him all about Maemo and nokia... One more suit has been informed! :) | 03:53 |
| Macer | oh | 03:53 |
| Macer | nm | 03:53 |
| Macer | divide_by_zero: oh lord | 03:54 |
| Macer | way to fuck it up for the rest of the world | 03:54 |
| Macer | haha | 03:54 |
| Macer | i think i am going to go ahead and install mer on the external Sd | 03:54 |
| Macer | SD | 03:54 |
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| Macer | hm | 04:03 |
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| lardman|farcry2 | night all | 04:18 |
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| Macer | nobody in #mer heh | 04:25 |
| Macer | blah. i'll figure it out myself when i install the installer again | 04:25 |
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| fureddo | I'm trying to make a deb file for my application. How can I test it in the Hildon Application Framework? | 05:34 |
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| divide_b1_zero | Everybody I show my N800 asks if they can enlarge pictures the multi-touch way, like in the iPhone. Does that happen to you? | 05:38 |
| divide_b1_zero | It seems pinching is the fashion today. | 05:39 |
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| fureddo | In the Application Manager, there is an option to install from file. However, I don't know where to put the deb file so that it's accessible from the File Selector. | 05:41 |
| * b-man16 really wishes he had his tablet right now :P | 05:41 | |
| divide_b1_zero | fureddo: you just want to install the package, or test the GUI way to install? Because you can just use dpkg, I think... | 05:47 |
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| fureddo | I tried this : fakeroot dpkg -i deb_file | 05:48 |
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| fureddo | No errors is shown. | 05:49 |
| fureddo | But I don't see the application in the Hildon environment. | 05:49 |
| b-man16 | what was the application package? | 05:50 |
| fureddo | How can I answer that :-) ? | 05:51 |
| fureddo | Is there a command I can run to know that? | 05:51 |
| fureddo | The application package is my own application. | 05:52 |
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| b-man16 | did it have a desktop file? | 05:52 |
| fureddo | Oh! That's an interesting question!! | 05:53 |
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| b-man16 | you will need a desktop file in order to launch your application from hildon | 05:55 |
| fureddo | I think the .desktop file is not located in the right directory. I will move it manually and check if it works. | 05:55 |
| Macer | http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/10/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-2-the-control-flash/ | 05:56 |
| Macer | i think i am making that too long :) | 05:56 |
| fureddo | It works! | 05:57 |
| fureddo | Now.... I have another problem. When running the application in ARMEL target, I get many error messages that look like : | 05:58 |
| fureddo | Error: BadDrawable (invalid Pixmap or Window parameter) 9 Major opcode: 62 (X_CopyArea) | 05:59 |
| fureddo | Sounds familiair to anyone? | 05:59 |
| b-man16 | hmm | 05:59 |
| b-man16 | i have no idea :( | 06:02 |
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| fureddo | Is someone available to test my application for i386 architecture? | 06:22 |
| fureddo | Just for information, here is the website of the application: http://tomotko.sourceforge.net | 06:23 |
| Macer | i need to install mer | 06:23 |
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| fureddo | The deb file is accessible here: http://www.fbergeron.com/tmp/tomotko-0.11.2-1maemo1_i386.deb | 06:29 |
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| Macer | wtf | 06:37 |
| Macer | goddamnti | 06:37 |
| Macer | this damn initfs_flash is going to be the end of my sanity :) | 06:38 |
| Macer | "booting from mmc0 (mmcblk1p2) | 06:40 |
| Macer | where the hell is it getting that damn device name from | 06:40 |
| Macer | ARGh | 06:40 |
| Macer | it's the internal sd!!@# | 06:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~boot-sd | 06:42 |
| infobot | it has been said that boot-sd is https://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card | 06:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Describes the device names. | 06:42 |
| Macer | GeneralAntilles: that isn't the right device name though | 06:42 |
| Macer | it is booting | 06:42 |
| Macer | but it is telling me that it is booting the wrong device | 06:43 |
| Macer | the internal device is mmcblk0 | 06:43 |
| Macer | the maemo cline is p2 so it should say mmcblk0p2 | 06:43 |
| Macer | instead for some reason it is saying mmcblk1p2 when it boots | 06:43 |
| Macer | let me try to find out where it's messing up | 06:46 |
| Macer | it's just the booting msg but shit like that drives me nutty | 06:46 |
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| fureddo | I just made a armel deb file here: http://www.fbergeron.com/tmp/tomotko-0.11.2-1maemo1_armel.deb | 06:52 |
| fureddo | Anyone can test it? | 06:52 |
| Macer | what is tomotko? | 06:56 |
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| Macer | sorry. i'm trying to get my n810 right with the bootmenu otherwise i would | 06:56 |
| fureddo | For info: http://tomotko.sourceforge.net | 06:57 |
| fureddo | It's a flashcard application to learn vocabulary in a foreign language. | 06:57 |
| fureddo | I'm going out for lunch. I hope someone would have tested my little app when I'm back. | 06:59 |
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| Macer | omg | 07:01 |
| Macer | this shit is driving me up teh goddamn wall | 07:01 |
| Macer | is there somewhere else that maemo keeps its information that it writes from bootmenu.conf | 07:02 |
| Macer | i have no idea why it is showing this booting as mmcblk1p2 | 07:02 |
| Macer | instead of blk0 | 07:02 |
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| Macer | :( | 07:09 |
| Macer | ARGH | 07:11 |
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| jaem_N810 | hi, I'm trying to set up NAT on my N810, in order to share its wireless with my desktop over USBnet | 07:13 |
| jaem_N810 | I've been following this: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=26090 | 07:13 |
| jaem_N810 | at this point, I can ping my N810's USB interface (192.168.2.1), but not further | 07:14 |
| jaem_N810 | I'm not very savvy about networking, so I while I know the gist of what I'm doing, I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong | 07:15 |
| Macer | it uses iptables? | 07:15 |
| jaem_N810 | yes | 07:15 |
| jaem_N810 | using both sets of modules linked in that thread | 07:15 |
| Macer | can the n810 use the internet? | 07:15 |
| jaem_N810 | yep - I'm chatting on it | 07:15 |
| Macer | then teh problem is in your iptables routing | 07:15 |
| jaem_N810 | so I surmised | 07:16 |
| Macer | and also make sure the clients are using it correctly | 07:16 |
| Macer | and you also need masqing modules loaded | 07:16 |
| jaem_N810 | they're all loaded | 07:16 |
| Macer | i've never done it myself on an n810 | 07:16 |
| Macer | but i've done it on linux boxes before | 07:16 |
| Macer | make sure the clients are set up properly | 07:16 |
| jaem_N810 | is there anything I can check that might help you diagnose it? | 07:16 |
| Macer | and are using the n810 as a gateway | 07:16 |
| jaem_N810 | my desktop (Arch Linux) is as far as I can tell | 07:16 |
| jaem_N810 | I just can't ping past the N810 | 07:17 |
| Macer | they also need a dns (unless you are running some sort of dns stuff on the n810) | 07:17 |
| jaem_N810 | I have it configured statically | 07:17 |
| Macer | have you tried to ping by ip? | 07:17 |
| Macer | instead of name? | 07:17 |
| jaem_N810 | yes | 07:17 |
| jaem_N810 | DNS isn't the problem | 07:17 |
| Macer | the client can nslookup? | 07:17 |
| jaem_N810 | I just get a "network unreachable" outside of the 192.168.2.x subnet | 07:17 |
| jaem_N810 | so no, to you last question | 07:18 |
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| Macer | if it were me i'd leavec the thread | 07:18 |
| * timeless_mbp sighs | 07:18 | |
| Macer | and find a linux based nating website | 07:18 |
| Macer | you usually just need 2 iptables lines to get it going properly | 07:18 |
| jaem_N810 | there's one linked there - that's the instructions I used. | 07:18 |
| jaem_N810 | http://www.revsys.com/writings/quicktips/nat.html | 07:18 |
| Macer | :) | 07:19 |
| Macer | did you do that like | 07:19 |
| Macer | cut/pasting? | 07:19 |
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| jaem_N810 | yes, but replacing eth1 with usb0, and eth0 with wlan0 | 07:20 |
| Macer | i'm just asking .. you may want to double check to make sure your device names are correct | 07:20 |
| jaem_N810 | okay | 07:20 |
| Macer | and... | 07:20 |
| Macer | make sure they are in the right place | 07:20 |
| jaem_N810 | usb0 should correspond to eth1 in that article, right? | 07:20 |
| jaem_N810 | I'm not really confused? ;) | 07:20 |
| Macer | well | 07:21 |
| Macer | what are the clients connected to? | 07:21 |
| Macer | the wired connection i'm guessing | 07:21 |
| jaem_N810 | usb0 is the iface connected to my desktop | 07:21 |
| Macer | i doubt you can put the n810 in ap mode with the wifi | 07:21 |
| Macer | rewind | 07:22 |
| jaem_N810 | kk | 07:22 |
| Macer | i dunno. it's hard to visualize it without doing it | 07:22 |
| Macer | so you have a wired connection | 07:22 |
| jaem_N810 | N810's wifi is connected to router (too far for a cable to my desktop). | 07:22 |
| jaem_N810 | N810's USB port is connected to desktop | 07:22 |
| Macer | and clients are going through the desktop ? | 07:23 |
| Macer | to the n810 | 07:23 |
| Macer | out to the internets? | 07:23 |
| jaem_N810 | I want to connect my desktop to the internet through my N810 | 07:23 |
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| jaem_N810 | there are no other clients | 07:23 |
| Macer | so you are just setting up usb networking for 1 pc through the n810 | 07:23 |
| Macer | i'm guessing a pc that doesn't have a wifi card ;) | 07:23 |
| jaem_N810 | I'm just too cheap/poor to buy a wifi dongle for the desktop - so I'm using my N810 as a replacement | 07:24 |
| jaem_N810 | yeah | 07:24 |
| jaem_N810 | exactly | 07:24 |
| Macer | well.. i've never doen it before but that first line should be usb0 | 07:24 |
| Macer | /sbin/iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE | 07:24 |
| Macer | eth0/usb0 | 07:24 |
| jaem_N810 | that would explain it >_< | 07:24 |
| jaem_N810 | let me try that | 07:24 |
| Macer | since that is the local connection doing the masqing | 07:24 |
| jaem_N810 | do I have to flush my iptables configuration, or can I just change it? | 07:25 |
| Macer | iptables -A FORWARD -i eth0 -o eth1 -m state --state RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT | 07:25 |
| Macer | eth0/usb0 .. and eth1/wlan0 on the n810 | 07:25 |
| Macer | iptables -A FORWARD -i eth1 -o eth0 -j ACCEPT | 07:26 |
| Macer | eth1/wlan0 eth0/usb0 | 07:26 |
| Macer | that is the return | 07:26 |
| Macer | first line allows masqing | 07:26 |
| jaem_N810 | ah | 07:26 |
| Macer | 2nd sends it out .. 3rd brings it back | 07:26 |
| jaem_N810 | let me try that | 07:26 |
| Macer | at least i'm pretty sure that's right. haven't done it in a while :) | 07:27 |
| Macer | used to stay up entire nights with iptables sometimes | 07:27 |
| Macer | haha | 07:27 |
| jaem_N810 | heh | 07:27 |
| Macer | heh | 07:27 |
| Macer | you might also consider | 07:27 |
| Macer | just buying a $5 wifi card haha | 07:27 |
| Macer | or just getting a usb wifi | 07:28 |
| Macer | ok. i need to get back to this crap and find out where bootmenu.conf and initfs_flash went horribly wrong | 07:28 |
| Macer | well. not horribly.. it still boots.. but it's giving me the wrong damn device names | 07:29 |
| Macer | heh | 07:29 |
| jaem_N810 | thanks - it's still not working, though | 07:29 |
| jaem_N810 | I may have done something stupid | 07:29 |
| Macer | lol | 07:29 |
| Macer | you're almost going to get me to hook it up to find out | 07:30 |
| Macer | :) | 07:30 |
| jaem_N810 | should iptables -t nat -L show anything other than the masquerade line? | 07:30 |
| Macer | but i've never done the usb networking so i'm sorry | 07:30 |
| jaem_N810 | heh | 07:30 |
| Macer | honestly don't remember sorry | 07:30 |
| jaem_N810 | that part's working fine - I just don't know iptables | 07:30 |
| jaem_N810 | okay, don't worry about it ;) | 07:30 |
| Macer | and you can ping the n810 huh? | 07:30 |
| jaem_N810 | yep | 07:30 |
| fureddo | I'm back. Anyone has tried to install tomotko? | 07:30 |
| jaem_N810 | the desktop's default route is set to the N810's usb address, as gateway | 07:31 |
| Macer | what is the ip on the desktop? | 07:31 |
| jaem_N810 | 192.168.2.2 | 07:31 |
| Macer | and usb0 on the n810...? | 07:31 |
| jaem_N810 | 192.168.2.1 | 07:31 |
| Macer | hm | 07:31 |
| jaem_N810 | my router is 192.168.1.1 | 07:32 |
| Macer | well | 07:32 |
| Macer | hm.... | 07:32 |
| Macer | let me see if i can find the iptables rules on my router | 07:32 |
| Macer | and try to see if i can find anything that might help | 07:32 |
| jaem_N810 | the forwarding commands didn't have any visible effect, but neither did they throw up errors | 07:32 |
| Macer | uhm | 07:33 |
| Macer | before you switched the devices around | 07:33 |
| Macer | did you do | 07:33 |
| Macer | iptables -F | 07:33 |
| Macer | to flush the table? :) | 07:33 |
| Macer | i think you may have had to flush the nat table too but i can't remember how to do it | 07:33 |
| Macer | maybe iptables -nat -F | 07:33 |
| Macer | otherwise you're going to have everything in there | 07:34 |
| Macer | and have a bunch of confused pkts | 07:34 |
| jaem_N810 | yes, I flushed it | 07:34 |
| Macer | hm... try rebooting.... connect to your router with the n810.. and do the iptables commands like i said | 07:35 |
| Macer | actually | 07:35 |
| Macer | i don't thin that would matter | 07:35 |
| Macer | since you're on the n810 now | 07:35 |
| Macer | sorry. wish i could be more help but those lines are pretty straight forward | 07:36 |
| jaem_N810 | hrm | 07:36 |
| jaem_N810 | is there a way I can check that they took effect? | 07:36 |
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| Macer | one sec.... | 07:37 |
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| Macer | cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward | 07:37 |
| Macer | should say 1 | 07:37 |
| jaem_N810 | yes | 07:38 |
| Macer | /sbin/iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o usb0 -j MASQUERADE | 07:38 |
| Macer | (internal network goign out) | 07:38 |
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| Macer | ah crap wait | 07:39 |
| Macer | /sbin/iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o wlan0 -j MASQUERADE | 07:39 |
| jaem_N810 | k | 07:39 |
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| gogol | hi maemo | 07:40 |
| Macer | /sbin/iptables -A FORWARD -i wlan0 -o usb0 -m state --state RELATED,ESTABLISHED -j ACCEPT | 07:40 |
| gogol | anybody know a dbus signal that would bring up the onscreen thumb keyboard? or another way I could assign a keystroke ? | 07:40 |
| Macer | /sbin/iptables -A FORWARD -i usb0 -o wlan0 -j ACCEPT | 07:41 |
| tl | how to implement a transparent bubble in maemo ? | 07:41 |
| Macer | those 3 lines seem like they fit your situation | 07:42 |
| Macer | wlan0 is your external | 07:42 |
| Macer | usb0 is your internal | 07:42 |
| tl | Is there anyone who know of it ? | 07:42 |
| Macer | so in that example eth0 should be wlan0 | 07:42 |
| Macer | and eth1 should be wlan0 | 07:42 |
| Macer | argh | 07:43 |
| Macer | damnit | 07:43 |
| Macer | eth0 shoudl be wlan0 and eth1 should be usb0 | 07:43 |
| Macer | heh | 07:43 |
| tl | Lately,i am learning maemo,who can help me ? | 07:43 |
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| Macer | i honestly think the real problem may be that you are going through yet another router on a local subnet | 07:44 |
| Macer | a different subnet actually | 07:44 |
| Macer | you may need to bridge the subnets with iptables to get all the way out | 07:44 |
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| jaem_N810 | hrm | 07:45 |
| jaem_N810 | is that complicated? | 07:45 |
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| jaem_N810 | or is there an easier way to do this entirely? | 07:45 |
| Macer | it shouldn't be. but i only did it once like 4 years ago | 07:45 |
| Macer | haha | 07:45 |
| jaem_N810 | lol | 07:45 |
| Macer | well... if it were me | 07:45 |
| jaem_N810 | I'll look it up | 07:45 |
| Macer | i'd probably try to figure out how to bridge the 2 net connections | 07:46 |
| Macer | the usb0 and whatever is on the pc | 07:46 |
| Macer | and give them 1 ip | 07:46 |
| Macer | and try to get them on the same subnet as the 2nd card | 07:46 |
| Macer | whcih is wlan0 | 07:46 |
| jaem_N810 | usb0 on the N810? | 07:46 |
| Macer | i just think it's odd that you have 2 ips | 07:46 |
| Macer | i would figure that the pc would be the real ip | 07:46 |
| Macer | and the n810 would act as a usb nci | 07:47 |
| Macer | nic | 07:47 |
| jaem_N810 | hmm | 07:47 |
| Macer | that's why it's kind of odd to me you have 2 ips :) | 07:47 |
| Macer | but then again i'm nto sure exactly how the usb networking on an n810 works because i've never used it | 07:47 |
| Macer | and like i said. easy alternative is $5 usb wifi | 07:48 |
| Macer | heh | 07:48 |
| jaem_N810 | it works just like slapping a patch cable in between two desktops, as far as I know | 07:48 |
| Macer | ah ok | 07:48 |
| jaem_N810 | well, I would, but they aren't quite that cheap around here | 07:48 |
| Macer | THEN... | 07:48 |
| Macer | give me a second.. i'm trying to picture it.. :) | 07:49 |
| Macer | i think | 07:49 |
| Macer | your problem is the usb0 on the n810 | 07:50 |
| Macer | isn't routed properly to get out | 07:50 |
| jaem_N810 | yes | 07:50 |
| Luke-Jr | nyaa nyaa | 07:50 |
| Macer | you won't be able to ping the 2nd subnet without setting up rules to do so | 07:50 |
| jaem_N810 | right | 07:50 |
| Macer | google "sending pkts between subnets with iptables" | 07:51 |
| Macer | it's like 2 lines :) | 07:51 |
| Luke-Jr | uh | 07:51 |
| Luke-Jr | iptables doesn't do that | 07:51 |
| Luke-Jr | that's some /proc entry to enable forwarding/routing | 07:51 |
| Macer | Luke-Jr: i vaguely remember having to do that | 07:51 |
| Luke-Jr | I just use a bridge | 07:52 |
| Macer | that's what i said! :) | 07:52 |
| Macer | haha | 07:52 |
| Luke-Jr | make a bridge called lan0, and add eth0 and usb0 to it | 07:52 |
| Luke-Jr | ☺ | 07:52 |
| Macer | Luke-Jr: then tell him how to bridge it | 07:52 |
| Macer | :) | 07:52 |
| jaem_N810 | on my N810 | 07:52 |
| jaem_N810 | that is | 07:52 |
| Macer | he is using usb networking | 07:52 |
| Macer | and wants to use his n810 as a router | 07:52 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: what are you trying to do exactly? | 07:52 |
| Macer | for 1 pc | 07:52 |
| Luke-Jr | … | 07:52 |
| Macer | lol | 07:52 |
| Macer | i guess a cheap alternative to a usb wifi | 07:53 |
| Macer | well.. not really cheap | 07:53 |
| jaem_N810 | InterTubes->N810->USBnet->desktop | 07:53 |
| Macer | but no need for more hardare? | 07:53 |
| jaem_N810 | yep ;) | 07:53 |
| jaem_N810 | and this problem won't exist in a month when I move, so... | 07:53 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: yeah, you need a bridge for that.. not sure if diablo kernel has bridge support | 07:53 |
| jaem_N810 | I doubt it | 07:53 |
| Luke-Jr | if your second IP is static, you might get by with ARP proxy | 07:54 |
| Macer | why is it i remember using route or iptables to get 2 different subnets to talk to one another | 07:54 |
| Macer | ? | 07:55 |
| Luke-Jr | Macer: route, yes | 07:55 |
| Macer | ah | 07:55 |
| Macer | ok... :) | 07:55 |
| jaem_N810 | Luke-Jr: how? | 07:55 |
| Macer | so can't he jus tuse route to get x.x.1.x to talk to x.x.2.x ? | 07:55 |
| Luke-Jr | Macer: if each subnet has a different primary-router, they need to be configured to route to each other | 07:55 |
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| Luke-Jr | Macer: I doubt he has two subnets liek that anyway | 07:55 |
| Macer | he does | 07:56 |
| Macer | his wifi is on another local subnet | 07:56 |
| Luke-Jr | oh, local | 07:56 |
| Macer | yeah | 07:56 |
| Luke-Jr | he said internet :þ | 07:56 |
| jaem_N810 | Luke-Jr: USBnet is 192.168.2.x | 07:56 |
| Macer | haha | 07:56 |
| jaem_N810 | wireless is 1.x | 07:56 |
| Macer | his wifi is connected to a wifi router with a local subnet | 07:56 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: you'd need 192.168.1.x's router to be aware of that | 07:56 |
| Macer | so he'd have to set up a routing table on the router | 07:56 |
| Macer | hope you're not using the stock stuff on the router :) | 07:57 |
| jaem_N810 | heh - not a chance | 07:57 |
| Macer | although stock stuff might be able to do it nowadays | 07:57 |
| Luke-Jr | ip route add 192.168.2.0/24 via 192.168.1.x (N810) | 07:57 |
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| jaem_N810 | run that on the N810? | 07:57 |
| Luke-Jr | on the main router | 07:57 |
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| Macer | the router | 07:57 |
| jaem_N810 | okay... | 07:57 |
| * jaem_N810 hopes he forgot to turn on ssh management | 07:58 | |
| Macer | i'd hope you didn't | 07:58 |
| Macer | haha | 07:58 |
| Macer | anyways. i need to find out why this bootmenu isn't working | 07:58 |
| jaem_N810 | didn't forget* | 07:58 |
| jaem_N810 | thanks, Macer | 07:58 |
| Luke-Jr | Macer: because 1+3 != 3 | 07:59 |
| jaem_N810 | oh great... >_< | 07:59 |
| jaem_N810 | I didn't | 08:00 |
| Macer | :-P | 08:00 |
| Macer | Luke-Jr: you know why initfs is showing the wrong device on boot | 08:00 |
| Macer | in the ()'s | 08:00 |
| Macer | like Booting "Maemo Internal SDP2" (mmcblk1p2) | 08:00 |
| Luke-Jr | Macer: cuz 4-23 < 0 | 08:00 |
| Macer | :-P | 08:01 |
| jaem_N810 | Luke-Jr: why does my router need to know/care about the subnet that's behind my N810? | 08:01 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: so it can route to it, of course | 08:01 |
| Macer | is that your way of saying no? | 08:01 |
| Macer | :-P | 08:01 |
| Macer | fine then.. i'll try something else | 08:01 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: personally I'd just use ARP proxy | 08:01 |
| jaem_N810 | does that not involve messing with my router? | 08:02 |
| Macer | Luke-Jr: sound doesn't work in embedded gentoo right? | 08:02 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: in theory | 08:02 |
| Macer | (yet?) | 08:02 |
| jaem_N810 | Macer: should I even ask? XD | 08:02 |
| Luke-Jr | Macer: it does on N810 with a modern kernel | 08:02 |
| Macer | oh wow | 08:03 |
| Macer | ok so then.. what doesn't work? | 08:03 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: set a static 192.168.1.x IP on the machine behind your N810 and, on your N810, echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/conf/all/proxy_arp | 08:03 |
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| Luke-Jr | Macer: GPS mainly | 08:03 |
| sarower | hello all, Good morning!!! | 08:04 |
| Luke-Jr | Macer: oh, and wifi | 08:04 |
| jaem_N810 | Luke-Jr: what should the desktop's gw be set to? | 08:04 |
| Macer | wifi?! haha | 08:04 |
| Luke-Jr | wifi might work in 2.6.31 tho | 08:04 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: 192.168.1.1? | 08:04 |
| jaem_N810 | >_< | 08:04 |
| jaem_N810 | haha | 08:04 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: proxy ARP is like a bridge, but only works for IP | 08:04 |
| sarower | I want to listen the applet on D-bus. How i can do that...? Any body? | 08:04 |
| jaem_N810 | it's stupid-O-clock for me right now | 08:04 |
| Macer | ok. if this thing shows me mmcblk1p2 | 08:06 |
| Macer | i'm going to throw it | 08:06 |
| Macer | this is like the 10th time i've had to reboot it to try to fix this crap and i have no idea where it is getting this device name from | 08:06 |
| * Luke-Jr makes it show Macer mmcblk783p384 | 08:06 | |
| Macer | :-P | 08:06 |
| jaem_N810 | Luke-Jr: is that all it needs? | 08:07 |
| Macer | GRRR | 08:07 |
| Macer | WHAT.. THE..FUCK | 08:07 |
| Macer | where the hell is it getting this wrong dev name from?!Q231 | 08:07 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: DNS too | 08:10 |
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| jaem_N810 | okay, so... desktop's usb0 iface is 192.168.1.2, gw 192.168.1.1... | 08:12 |
| jaem_N810 | N810's usb0 iface is? | 08:12 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Macer: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2747 | 08:13 |
| Luke-Jr | jaem_N810: proxy ARP requires desktop to be on the same subnet | 08:13 |
| jaem_N810 | yes | 08:13 |
| Luke-Jr | oh, misread | 08:13 |
| Luke-Jr | N810's usb0 is the same as N810's wlan0 | 08:14 |
| jaem_N810 | ohh | 08:14 |
| jaem_N810 | okay | 08:14 |
| jaem_N810 | and the desktop's usb0 iface can be anything on that subnet? | 08:16 |
| Luke-Jr | anything available on that subnet | 08:17 |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: i have to install a new kernel to fix it? :) | 08:17 |
| Macer | haha | 08:17 |
| qwerty12_N810 | In this case, just check you're using '${INT_CARD}p2' | 08:18 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | (in your bootmenu.conf instead of directly pointing at the partition) | 08:19 |
| Macer | i am | 08:20 |
| jaem_N810 | WOOT! | 08:20 |
| Macer | but still | 08:20 |
| Macer | the boot menu says it wrong | 08:20 |
| Macer | and it's erking the hell out of me heh | 08:20 |
| jaem_N810 | *sigh*... thank you very much | 08:20 |
| jaem_N810 | it works | 08:20 |
| Macer | it will boot | 08:21 |
| Macer | but the (mmcblk1p2) part is driving me nuts a | 08:21 |
| Macer | and it just started doing it for some reason. i didn't remove the sd or anything | 08:21 |
| Macer | i just don't get it | 08:21 |
| jaem_N810 | my laptop's in the shop, and I really needed my desktop on the net | 08:21 |
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| jaem_N810 | thanks to both of you, and goodnight! | 08:21 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | Macer: Flash a kernel with the fix then if you want it gone for cosmetic reasons | 08:22 |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: i do ;) | 08:23 |
| Macer | i've just never flashed a kernel to this thing before | 08:23 |
| Macer | you have an instruction site that explains how to do that? | 08:24 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Oh, flashing is easy (on the device): fiasco-flasher -f -k <path to zImage> | 08:25 |
| qwerty12_N810 | But you'll have to find a kernel with that fix applied. Look through fanoush's posts at talk.maemo.org; he has a kernel with the fix applied and the resultant zImage attached | 08:26 |
| Macer | they have one on there | 08:26 |
| qwerty12_N810 | That's a patch which applies to the kernel sources | 08:26 |
| Macer | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2747#c8 | 08:26 |
| Macer | oh .. is it | 08:27 |
| Macer | damn | 08:27 |
| qwerty12_N810 | No, you're right, sorry, that is a zImage | 08:27 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I thought you meant the attachment :) | 08:27 |
| Macer | heh.. well.. hopefully this does the trick because this is driving me nuts | 08:27 |
| Stskeeps | so far i'm winning the bet? ;) | 08:28 |
| Macer | lol | 08:28 |
| Macer | no.. but that wasn't really a maemo problem | 08:28 |
| Macer | ;) | 08:28 |
| Macer | wow.. that's it? | 08:28 |
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| Macer | wow .. that's it? | 08:29 |
| Macer | it can't be that easy | 08:29 |
| Macer | wow | 08:30 |
| Macer | that is not cool on so many levels | 08:30 |
| Macer | should my n810 be flashing over and over like this? | 08:30 |
| Macer | wow | 08:30 |
| Macer | is this thing bricked? | 08:30 |
| Macer | oh that's just great | 08:31 |
| Macer | that kernel flashing just did something to my n810 | 08:31 |
| Macer | and i don't even know what :) | 08:31 |
| Macer | it is just sitting there flashing over and over when i turn it on | 08:31 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: ok. i think that just did it | 08:31 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Flash the original one then from the desktop. http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/ | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | flashing over and over? booting you mean | 08:32 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: it looks like it is trying to when it boots | 08:32 |
| Macer | right when i turn it on | 08:32 |
| Macer | it flashes over and over :) | 08:32 |
| Macer | wtf? | 08:33 |
| Macer | i sure hope this thing isn't bricked | 08:33 |
| Macer | let me find my usb cable | 08:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Unpack the bin using flasher-3.0 (flasher-3.0 -F -u <bin file>) and flash the kernel from it (flasher-3.0 -f -k zImage) | 08:33 |
| Stskeeps | does it show nokia logo? | 08:33 |
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| Macer | yes | 08:34 |
| Macer | that is what is flashing over and over ;) | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | not bricked then | 08:34 |
| Macer | how do i get into recovery mode? | 08:34 |
| Macer | i know i added ssh support for it :) | 08:34 |
| zakkm | n8x0 / | 08:35 |
| zakkm | ? | 08:35 |
| zakkm | hey you know theres a flasher-3.5 out? | 08:35 |
| Macer | omg | 08:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Macer: You don't need it. Just connect it to USB, like you would when flashing | 08:35 |
| zakkm | for mac, linux and windows? | 08:35 |
| Macer | i am! | 08:35 |
| Macer | it's doing it with the usb symbol popping up! | 08:35 |
| Macer | oh what the fuck?@!# | 08:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Hold home? | 08:36 |
| Macer | menu? | 08:36 |
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| Macer | on the n810 isn't it menu? :) | 08:36 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Nah, the button above the back key | 08:36 |
| Macer | i ok | 08:36 |
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| Macer | damn that was kind of scary | 08:37 |
| Macer | haha | 08:37 |
| Macer | someone should seriously get that damn zImage file off that bug report | 08:37 |
| Macer | :) | 08:37 |
| zakkm | Macer: what were you doing to do | 08:38 |
| zakkm | i missed beginning | 08:38 |
| Macer | i was trying to fix the bug where initfs_flash shows the wrong device when booting | 08:38 |
| Macer | they have a link to a kernel there that says "the bug is fixed in this kernel" | 08:39 |
| Macer | after flashing it.. my device just kept rebooting | 08:39 |
| zakkm | mmcblk0 vs mmcblk1 ? | 08:39 |
| Macer | over and over really fast | 08:39 |
| Macer | zakkm: yes | 08:39 |
| Macer | my internal was showing as mmcblk1 | 08:39 |
| Macer | it would still boot the proper partition but that is silly looking :) | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | normal bug | 08:39 |
| Macer | but now i'm probably going to have to start over since i flashed the kernel on the bug page | 08:40 |
| zakkm | its alwys been like that | 08:40 |
| Stskeeps | that's why you use INT_CARD | 08:40 |
| zakkm | Macer: can use --flash-only=kernel ? | 08:40 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: lol. well.. now i'm kind of screwed | 08:40 |
| Macer | zakkm: i can't get anywhere with it | 08:40 |
| zakkm | initfs too? | 08:40 |
| Macer | initfs doesn't even start anymore | 08:40 |
| Macer | once i turn the device on the nokia screen flashes over and over | 08:40 |
| zakkm | --flash-only=initfs. . and then reinstall bootloader | 08:40 |
| Stskeeps | reflash initfs too then | 08:41 |
| Macer | how? | 08:41 |
| zakkm | normal flasher command | 08:41 |
| Macer | i'm hooked up with teh usb cable at the nokia/usb symbol screen | 08:41 |
| zakkm | but add --flash-only=initfs | 08:41 |
| zakkm | before -R | 08:41 |
| zakkm | waitt | 08:41 |
| Macer | i can't get into the recovery for initfs | 08:41 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | Macer: did you even follow: "Unpack the bin using flasher-3.0 (flasher-3.0 -F -u <bin file>) and flash the kernel from it (flasher-3.0 -f -k zImage)" | 08:42 |
| zakkm | ./flasher-3.0 -F <FIASCO image> -f --flash-only=initfs -R | 08:42 |
| zakkm | qwerty12_N810: you know flasher 3.5 is out? for all OS's ? | 08:43 |
| zakkm | came in dmg form for mac | 08:43 |
| zakkm | worked fine for flashing | 08:43 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Yes, I'm using it in Windows :) | 08:43 |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: huh? | 08:43 |
| Macer | fiasco-flasher -f -k <path to zImage> | 08:44 |
| Macer | that is what i did | 08:44 |
| Macer | :) | 08:44 |
| Macer | was there more to it or something? | 08:44 |
| Macer | evidently so haha | 08:44 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Yes, and now, I'm talking of flashing the original kernel from the desktop | 08:44 |
| zakkm | wooh | 08:44 |
| zakkm | device memory - 2.79 GB avaliable | 08:44 |
| * Stskeeps passes qwerty12_N810 some breakfast for giving advice so early in the morning | 08:45 | |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: well.. i'm on my xp netbook.. do they even have flasher for it? | 08:45 |
| zakkm | what time is it for you guys? | 08:45 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Thanks Stskeeps | 08:46 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Macer: yes, like zakkm says, flasher-3.5 | 08:46 |
| qwerty12_N810 | zakkm: 06:46 here | 08:46 |
| zakkm | wow | 08:46 |
| zakkm | its 1;46 here ( Toronto ,Canada ) and i still didnt sleep yet ;p | 08:46 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | I went to sleep about that time :P | 08:47 |
| zakkm | is there a list of safe to remove maemo services? | 08:47 |
| zakkm | i just reflashed OS2008 | 08:47 |
| zakkm | and so its distracting me from sleeping :p | 08:47 |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: ok i'm downloading it | 08:48 |
| Macer | ironically enough. i called the kernel.... "Fixed Kernel" | 08:48 |
| Macer | haha | 08:48 |
| sarower | I want to listen the applet on D-bus. How i can do that...? Any body? | 08:49 |
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| Macer | suitable usb device not found waiting... | 08:53 |
| Macer | well | 08:55 |
| Macer | that worked heh | 08:55 |
| zakkm | plug it in? | 08:55 |
| zakkm | turn on tablet and hold home key | 08:55 |
| Macer | had to unplug it | 08:55 |
| Macer | and plug it back in while holding the home key | 08:55 |
| Macer | same kernel | 08:55 |
| Macer | it boots now | 08:55 |
| Macer | odd | 08:55 |
| Macer | flashing it from the pc worked.. but flashing it from the tablet didn't? :) | 08:56 |
| zakkm | heyyy is 48mhz kernel still used for os2008? | 08:56 |
| Macer | awesome | 08:57 |
| Macer | that fixed it :) | 08:57 |
| Macer | haha | 08:57 |
| Macer | SDs are reading the right way now | 08:57 |
| Macer | but i wonder why flashing the kernel from th device caused that | 08:58 |
| zakkm | probably cause it was running from kernel | 08:58 |
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| zakkm | replacing itself | 08:58 |
| zakkm | guess :P | 08:58 |
| Macer | isn't it always ? ;) | 08:59 |
| zakkm | no? | 08:59 |
| zakkm | you dont do that on the PC | 08:59 |
| zakkm | do you? | 08:59 |
| zakkm | i come from gentoo and it goes by kernel version | 08:59 |
| zakkm | and adds kernel version to grub.. then you delete older one | 08:59 |
| zakkm | you dont replace. | 08:59 |
| Macer | ah | 08:59 |
| Macer | but the kernel you're runnin gshould be loaded into mem shouldn't it? | 08:59 |
| zakkm | true | 09:00 |
| zakkm | it was just a crazy guess lol | 09:00 |
| Macer | :) | 09:00 |
| Macer | ah well. flashin git from the pc worked | 09:00 |
| Macer | it boots again and the cards are reading right when initfs starts | 09:00 |
| zakkm | what tablet do you have? | 09:00 |
| Macer | i know it was cosmetic but it was driving me nuts haha | 09:00 |
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| Macer | i'd have wiped everything on it to fix it anyways :) | 09:00 |
| Macer | n810 | 09:00 |
| Macer | i gave Stskeeps my n800 :-P | 09:01 |
| zakkm | wanna trade it for my n800 + cash? :P | 09:01 |
| Macer | so mer better get better! | 09:01 |
| Macer | lol | 09:01 |
| Macer | no | 09:01 |
| Macer | i gave my n800 away | 09:01 |
| zakkm | :( | 09:01 |
| Macer | why would i want another one? :) | 09:01 |
| zakkm | i want n810 :) | 09:01 |
| Macer | i just got the n810 | 09:01 |
| Macer | i got it for my car actually | 09:01 |
| zakkm | or smartq acutally | 09:01 |
| zakkm | smartq5 are sick | 09:01 |
| Macer | my older car | 09:01 |
| zakkm | heh doesnt the map app suck? | 09:01 |
| Macer | before i realized the obd port was obd1 | 09:01 |
| Macer | and tehre aren't any bt obd1 scanners | 09:01 |
| Macer | :) | 09:01 |
| Macer | but i love the tablet anyways | 09:02 |
| Macer | so i'm not too pissed | 09:02 |
| Macer | but i am about that obd2 bt scanner i bought for carman | 09:02 |
| zakkm | heh | 09:02 |
| Macer | i guess if my 2009 tahoe has a check engine light | 09:02 |
| Macer | i can at least know what it is before i take it in for warranty repair? :) | 09:02 |
| fureddo | Hi again, anyone can try to install my application: http://www.fbergeron.com/tmp/tomotko-0.11.2-1maemo1_armel.deb | 09:02 |
| zakkm | it works in carmen? | 09:02 |
| Macer | i have a 94 caprice classic | 09:02 |
| zakkm | does carmen require just bluetooth | 09:03 |
| Macer | that i do most of my day to day driving and rush hour stuff in | 09:03 |
| Macer | afaik yes | 09:03 |
| zakkm | fureddo: if you give me like 5min i can test it | 09:03 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Cool | 09:03 |
| Macer | i don't think you can hook a usb2serial connector up to the tablet | 09:03 |
| Macer | but i'm not positive | 09:03 |
| Macer | maybe you can | 09:03 |
| zakkm | no i mean | 09:03 |
| zakkm | can i install carmen, go into a friends car | 09:03 |
| zakkm | and it connect to car ? | 09:03 |
| zakkm | just be like yo check this out? :D | 09:03 |
| zakkm | or is it more complex | 09:03 |
| Macer | if it has an obd2 port yes | 09:03 |
| Macer | no | 09:03 |
| Macer | it's not complicated at all | 09:04 |
| Macer | it gives check engine codes | 09:04 |
| Macer | not sure if it gives you what it actually means though | 09:04 |
| Macer | but you can probably google the code | 09:04 |
| Macer | or find it in a repair manual | 09:04 |
| Macer | so i got this bt scantool | 09:04 |
| zakkm | dont know cars, but if a car supports a GPS, does it support tablet + carmen? | 09:04 |
| zakkm | like real gps ? | 09:05 |
| Macer | it does gps + obd2 + driving sats + | 09:05 |
| Macer | uhm.... | 09:05 |
| Macer | trip stats? and buddy tracking | 09:05 |
| Macer | if your friend has an n810 too | 09:05 |
| Macer | or an n800 with bt gps? | 09:05 |
| zakkm | no he does | 09:05 |
| Macer | you can see where each other are on the road | 09:05 |
| Macer | if you both have it.. that doesn't require the obd2 port | 09:05 |
| Macer | it does a lot without the port | 09:06 |
| zakkm | i wsa just planning to go into his car, and be like yo check this out :P | 09:06 |
| Macer | but without it.. it's not nearly as cool :) | 09:06 |
| Macer | i was trying to tech up the caprice a bit | 09:06 |
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| Macer | but the damn thing has some proprietary shit port | 09:06 |
| Macer | they didn't start obd2 til 1996 and i have a 94 | 09:06 |
| Macer | it was mandated by 95 | 09:06 |
| Macer | damnit | 09:06 |
| Macer | heh | 09:06 |
| Macer | i take good care of that car though. it's the car if i totalled it i wouldn't care as much as my truck | 09:07 |
| Macer | plus.. the thing would require a bus smashing into it at full speed to do any real damage to it haha | 09:07 |
| zakkm | fureddo: would you like me to dpkg -i it, to give you a log? | 09:07 |
| Macer | ok. now that i solved teh case of the screwed up device name | 09:07 |
| Macer | i think i'll move on to finishing the last section of my attempt to be able to build and pkg on the tablet haha | 09:08 |
| zakkm | heh | 09:08 |
| Macer | in maemo | 09:08 |
| Macer | without chrooting | 09:08 |
| Macer | :) | 09:08 |
| Macer | my son is leaving to go with his mother in a month.. and i broke up with my gf like a month ago.. so this will give me something to do between masturbations i guess | 09:09 |
| zakkm | fureddo: you require qt4 repository for it you know? | 09:09 |
| zakkm | omgg | 09:09 |
| zakkm | everyone here is old :D | 09:10 |
| zakkm | mostly | 09:10 |
| Macer | :-P i just turned 30 | 09:10 |
| Macer | 30 is the new ....er... 30 | 09:10 |
| qwerty12_N810 | OLD | 09:10 |
| qwerty12_N810 | :p | 09:10 |
| zakkm | qwerty12_N810: how old are you | 09:10 |
| fureddo | fureddo, Yes it requires qt4. | 09:10 |
| Macer | i don't care.. my first born was a son.. so i've succeeded | 09:10 |
| Macer | lol | 09:10 |
| qwerty12_N810 | zakkm: 16 | 09:10 |
| zakkm | fureddo: it intalled, icon shows up in extras, but i dont have qt4 repo at the moment to test it to run | 09:10 |
| zakkm | if you will wait some more ill add it | 09:11 |
| zakkm | ah man :( | 09:11 |
| fureddo | zakkm, *waiting* | 09:11 |
| zakkm | im 18. | 09:11 |
| zakkm | sorry fureddo :( i just reinstalled OS2008 | 09:11 |
| zakkm | ohh | 09:12 |
| zakkm | qt4 is in extras-devel | 09:12 |
| fureddo | zakkm, yes | 09:12 |
| zakkm | when you made deb, you didnt add dependencies? | 09:13 |
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| fureddo | zakkm, Well, it's my first deb on maemo. Maybe it's not perfect. | 09:13 |
| zakkm | really, wow | 09:13 |
| zakkm | i should learn myself lol | 09:13 |
| zakkm | was it hard? | 09:13 |
| zakkm | fureddo: congratss... 100% perfect | 09:14 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Really? | 09:14 |
| zakkm | adds to extras ( i chose it ) , icon shows in menu | 09:14 |
| zakkm | i opened it.. it opens | 09:14 |
| zakkm | hildonization and all | 09:14 |
| zakkm | nicely fit on screen | 09:15 |
| zakkm | fullscreen works | 09:15 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Wow, thanks. Is it the armel deb or the i386 deb you used? | 09:15 |
| zakkm | its on my n800 | 09:15 |
| zakkm | so armel .. i386 is for PC? | 09:15 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Ok. | 09:15 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Yes, I think so. | 09:15 |
| fureddo | zakkm, I have no phone so I could not test it myself. | 09:16 |
| zakkm | i386 = x86 architecture.. its not for tablet. | 09:16 |
| zakkm | phone? | 09:16 |
| fureddo | zakkm, I'm glad to know that it works. Does it look good? | 09:16 |
| zakkm | nokia tablets arent phones? | 09:16 |
| zakkm | yeah | 09:16 |
| zakkm | well it follows nokia skin mostly, so the one i have installed looks nice | 09:16 |
| zakkm | but yeah fits on screen well, and all | 09:16 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Anyway, I have no maemo devices. I developed the application originally for a Zaurus SL-C1000. | 09:16 |
| zakkm | i couldnt see a ebtter port | 09:17 |
| zakkm | yeah i saw the forum post earlier | 09:17 |
| zakkm | the only thing your missing is adding dependency to deb file | 09:17 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Ok, I will do that. | 09:17 |
| zakkm | cause ppl without qt4 will get the incompatible w.e | 09:17 |
| zakkm | do you know how? | 09:17 |
| zakkm | i can help with that? | 09:17 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Yeah, I think I know how, somehow. I have another application that have similar dependencies, I will take a look to its control file and compare. | 09:18 |
| zakkm | instead the deb file is a text file | 09:18 |
| zakkm | with name of package version number and such | 09:18 |
| zakkm | and list of depedencies | 09:18 |
| zakkm | add "libaudio2 libqt4-xml libqtcore4 libqtgui4" to that list.. all of those | 09:19 |
| fureddo | I don't think I need audio though. | 09:19 |
| zakkm | but it requires it | 09:19 |
| fureddo | Ok | 09:19 |
| fureddo | I will add it then. | 09:19 |
| zakkm | even if you dont want sound | 09:19 |
| zakkm | its still a dependency | 09:20 |
| fureddo | Actually, in my control file, i have the following line: | 09:20 |
| fureddo | Depends: libqtcore4, libqtgui4, libqt4-xml, libc6 (>= 2.4) | 09:20 |
| fureddo | So I will add other stuff. | 09:20 |
| zakkm | then add libaudio2 | 09:20 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Leaving ${shlibs:Depends} there is usually quicker :P | 09:20 |
| fureddo | Well, as you seem to know a lot about that. Maybe you could tell me what I should write in the Depends line :-) | 09:21 |
| zakkm | idunno i installed in application manager it installed wouldnt open i did dpkg way it said it was missing those | 09:21 |
| zakkm | i installed them | 09:21 |
| zakkm | then tried again, it opened perfect | 09:21 |
| fureddo | ok | 09:21 |
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| zakkm | how hard is it btw? to "port" ? | 09:22 |
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| fureddo | zakkm, I didn't modify the code at all really. | 09:22 |
| zakkm | i know but also package to deb ? | 09:23 |
| zakkm | i always either use binary, or use gentoo as my OS, which compiles for me pretty much , it doesnt package it | 09:23 |
| fureddo | zakkm, I already had a script to make a deb file for Debian. So I modified it a bit to adapt it for maemo. | 09:23 |
| zakkm | oh really | 09:23 |
| zakkm | and it worked? | 09:23 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Ah, you're doing this using dpkg-deb? | 09:23 |
| zakkm | whered you run this script? | 09:23 |
| zakkm | qwerty12_N810: it succeded perfectly. | 09:24 |
| fureddo | You can see the script here: | 09:24 |
| qwerty12_N810 | ${shlibs:Depends} wouldn't make sense then, ignore me... | 09:24 |
| fureddo | http://tomotko.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/tomotko/qt4/trunk/bin/makeMaemoDebFile.rb?revision=861&view=markup | 09:25 |
| zakkm | then what do i do with that? | 09:26 |
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| zakkm | ohhhhh | 09:26 |
| zakkm | thats tomotko itself | 09:26 |
| fureddo | It's just to show you that yes, it uses dpkg-deb. | 09:26 |
| fureddo | On line 75 | 09:26 |
| zakkm | dpkg-deb = compiles and creates deb? | 09:26 |
| fureddo | Yeah. | 09:27 |
| zakkm | not much a debian user | 09:27 |
| Macer | hm | 09:27 |
| Macer | how do i install these modules that are with this kernel? | 09:27 |
| zakkm | oh doesnt look that bad then | 09:27 |
| Macer | just stick them in the modules dir? | 09:27 |
| zakkm | Macer: just use modprobe? :P | 09:27 |
| zakkm | add to startup :P | 09:27 |
| zakkm | would that work? | 09:27 |
| Macer | zakkm: i mean the ones that come with the new kernel i flashed? | 09:27 |
| zakkm | fureddo: should see about adding to extras repository | 09:28 |
| zakkm | ppl will use | 09:28 |
| Macer | this kernel seems to be acting odd | 09:29 |
| zakkm | so dont use it :P | 09:29 |
| Macer | i have to | 09:29 |
| Macer | :) | 09:29 |
| zakkm | why? | 09:29 |
| Macer | to fix the names of the SDs | 09:29 |
| zakkm | do what Stskeeps said and use INT_CARD AND EXT_CARD | 09:29 |
| Macer | i am | 09:30 |
| zakkm | as opposed to mmcblk | 09:30 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Yes, I know. That's the next step. I already have the privileges to upload there. Before doing so though, I wanted to test at least with someone else. | 09:30 |
| Macer | heh | 09:30 |
| zakkm | oh | 09:30 |
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| Macer | but that's not really a fix | 09:30 |
| Macer | i "fixed" it | 09:30 |
| Macer | heh | 09:30 |
| zakkm | fureddo: you dont have a tablet, howd you find maemo forum ? | 09:30 |
| zakkm | Macer: variable vs string .. is always a fix :D | 09:30 |
| zakkm | you did a workaround, not a fix ;p | 09:31 |
| zakkm | ahh i wnat fremantle :) | 09:31 |
| arquebus | does maemo have its own repos? | 09:31 |
| zakkm | of course? | 09:32 |
| Macer | oh ok.. nm | 09:32 |
| Macer | i just didn't have some of the older modules loaded | 09:32 |
| Macer | they work anywyas. i don't see why they wouldn't since it is the same kernel | 09:32 |
| Macer | awesome | 09:33 |
| Macer | heh | 09:33 |
| zakkm | Macer: is that a 48mhz kernel? | 09:33 |
| Macer | wtf is a 48mhz kernel? | 09:33 |
| zakkm | qwerty12_N810: you know if 48mhz kernel exist for OS2008, is it still useful? | 09:33 |
| zakkm | maemo used to underclock sd card speeds | 09:33 |
| zakkm | 48mhz kernel = "stops the underclock" | 09:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | It still exists (fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/) should have one IIRC | 09:33 |
| zakkm | still useful? | 09:34 |
| Macer | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2747 | 09:34 |
| Macer | that is the kernel i am using | 09:34 |
| Macer | so who knows :) | 09:34 |
| Macer | is there a way to check? | 09:34 |
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| Macer | why do they underclock the sd? | 09:34 |
| qwerty12_N810 | zakkm: dunno... I ran into problems with some older cards and it is an unsupported mode after all | 09:34 |
| zakkm | i got some sickass fast sd cards | 09:34 |
| zakkm | and booting off sd | 09:34 |
| zakkm | seems like it will give a nice boost in "harddrive" speed | 09:35 |
| Macer | a class 10 or something? | 09:35 |
| Macer | haha | 09:35 |
| zakkm | no | 09:35 |
| Macer | i just got a class 6 and a mini adapter | 09:35 |
| zakkm | a nice class 6 | 09:35 |
| Macer | i think sandisk came out with a 32G c10 | 09:35 |
| Macer | normal sd tho.. wtf is up with the n810 and the mini stuff? like the only device on the planet that uses it | 09:36 |
| zakkm | :D | 09:36 |
| zakkm | what you on about | 09:36 |
| zakkm | R4's for DS's? :P | 09:36 |
| zakkm | i think | 09:36 |
| Macer | oh yeah | 09:36 |
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| Macer | one of the only 2 devices that uses it | 09:36 |
| Macer | haha | 09:36 |
| zakkm | they arent that much expensive | 09:36 |
| zakkm | and theres minisd to sd adapters | 09:36 |
| zakkm | where you just put it in | 09:36 |
| zakkm | and its SD? | 09:36 |
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| Macer | yeah. that's what i'm using now | 09:36 |
| Macer | a microsd with a mini adapter | 09:37 |
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| Macer | is 4GB good enough for Mer? | 09:37 |
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| Macer | i guess i can keep it on there even though i can't really use it as a mobile OS yet | 09:37 |
| Macer | oh wait.. Stskeeps said it was a problem with the network manager they were using .. whcih is why the adhoc wouldn't work | 09:38 |
| zakkm | yeah | 09:38 |
| zakkm | they're switching i think | 09:38 |
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| zakkm | i was going to test it but i didnt have mer installed | 09:38 |
| Macer | that would be awesome | 09:38 |
| zakkm | only easy-mer | 09:38 |
| zakkm | http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=023713&cid=MTR.863 honest opinion guys, should i buy it? | 09:39 |
| Macer | oh yeah | 09:39 |
| Macer | booting from the sd now :) | 09:39 |
| zakkm | 2048x1152 :P | 09:39 |
| Macer | well. the internal sd i guess | 09:39 |
| zakkm | XD | 09:39 |
| Macer | and it actually calls it by its actual name in initfs | 09:39 |
| Macer | :) | 09:39 |
| zakkm | what theme you use? | 09:39 |
| Macer | that was driving me crazy | 09:39 |
| zakkm | mine does too? | 09:39 |
| Macer | lol | 09:40 |
| zakkm | it says Internal card on p3 | 09:40 |
| Macer | hehe | 09:40 |
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| Macer | well.. mine was calling the internal mmcblk1p2 | 09:40 |
| Macer | instead of blk0 | 09:40 |
| Macer | now it doesn't do that anymore | 09:40 |
| Macer | :) | 09:40 |
| Macer | i use felicia | 09:40 |
| zakkm | penguinbaits console-tools clone to sd... it adds INT_CARD/ EXT_CARD to bootmenu.conf | 09:40 |
| zakkm | so it says internal card on p3 :P | 09:41 |
| zakkm | felicia ahh | 09:41 |
| zakkm | i love the thumb keyboard look all black and such | 09:41 |
| Macer | http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/10/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-2-the-control-flash/ | 09:41 |
| zakkm | but when you click and its this ugly blue | 09:41 |
| Macer | zakkm: i only used the console tools to clone | 09:41 |
| Macer | there was a page that showed you how to do it manually | 09:41 |
| Macer | i sure wish i could find that page again :) | 09:41 |
| zakkm | yeah its like a ugly blue and grey | 09:41 |
| Macer | ugly blue and grey? :) | 09:42 |
| Macer | that link is my maemo setup now at the top | 09:42 |
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| zakkm | yeah ugly blue and grey | 09:42 |
| zakkm | isnt it? | 09:42 |
| Macer | :-P | 09:42 |
| zakkm | wooh i know your internal ip! :D | 09:42 |
| Macer | yeah i guess but... there aren't many themes out there to choose from | 09:42 |
| Macer | uh oh | 09:42 |
| zakkm | wtf | 09:42 |
| Macer | don't hax0r me | 09:42 |
| Macer | haha | 09:42 |
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| zakkm | External SD 15.1GB | 09:43 |
| zakkm | wooww | 09:43 |
| zakkm | i only got 2x4gb cards | 09:43 |
| Macer | yeah | 09:43 |
| Macer | that's the microsd i bought | 09:43 |
| Macer | for $50 | 09:43 |
| Macer | with the mini adapter | 09:43 |
| zakkm | i want a 8gb card, so i can put on wikipedia on it :D | 09:43 |
| fureddo | zakkm, About the maemo forum... Well, I think the forum is very good. | 09:43 |
| zakkm | cause its like 5-6 gb | 09:43 |
| Macer | i bought a 4G just because it had the mini adapter | 09:43 |
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| Macer | $11 | 09:43 |
| zakkm | fureddo: i mean without a tablet, howd you discover maemo? | 09:43 |
| Macer | for 4G c6 microsd | 09:43 |
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| Macer | zakkm: he was looking for android advise :) | 09:44 |
| Macer | haha | 09:44 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Someone asked me to port the application for its N810. So I googled and found it. | 09:44 |
| zakkm | oh | 09:44 |
| zakkm | fureddo: you own the app? | 09:44 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Yes, I'm the main developer. | 09:44 |
| zakkm | ohhhhhh that makes way more sense | 09:44 |
| zakkm | nice app :) | 09:44 |
| zakkm | what does it do exactly? | 09:45 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Thanks. I find it very useful. I use it daily. It's a flashcard application to learn vocabulary for a foreign language. | 09:45 |
| zakkm | does it come with the flashcards? | 09:46 |
| zakkm | i always remember the kde language learning app or something or kde test? or something but never resources for it lol | 09:46 |
| fureddo | zakkm, There are some available here: http://tomotko.sourceforge.net/en/glossaries.shtml | 09:46 |
| zakkm | oh thats nice | 09:47 |
| fureddo | zakkm, I would appreciate it if you could try the import feature. | 09:47 |
| zakkm | kk gimme a sec | 09:48 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Like choose any glossary file and import it in tomotko. | 09:48 |
| fureddo | zakkm, I suspect that some problems will occur regarding fonts. For example, for Japanese or Thai glossaries... But for Spanish and German ones, it should be not too bad, I think. | 09:49 |
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| zakkm | import zip file or the xml's? | 09:49 |
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| Macer | i'm making a 12G maemo partition now haha | 09:50 |
| fureddo | zakkm, The zip file. | 09:50 |
| Macer | and a 4G mer one | 09:50 |
| Macer | :) | 09:50 |
| Macer | hopefully this class6 card is a little more zippy than the internal stuff | 09:50 |
| Macer | which i might wipe later anyways | 09:50 |
| Macer | actually. i think i will just put mer on the internal | 09:50 |
| zakkm | fureddo : import worked fine for JNL .. a second to import ? | 09:51 |
| Macer | 2G should be enough for mer | 09:51 |
| zakkm | how do i uhh start the learning though? | 09:51 |
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| fureddo | zakkm, Before starting a test, you must check the glossaries (red book on the left) that you want to learn (just pick 1). | 09:51 |
| zakkm | Macer: hah, dont forget a swap partition | 09:51 |
| Macer | zakkm: oh goddamnit | 09:52 |
| Macer | that's right :) | 09:52 |
| Macer | shit | 09:52 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Then. you must also check a few words in the right tab. | 09:52 |
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| Macer | how big of one do i need? | 09:52 |
| Macer | like will 256MB do? | 09:52 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Then, in the menu, you select Start Quiz. | 09:52 |
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| Macer | maemo uses a swap file | 09:52 |
| Macer | blah | 09:52 |
| Macer | how windowslike | 09:52 |
| Macer | :) | 09:52 |
| zakkm | fureddo: for "Word/exp" it shows japanese perfectly | 09:53 |
| zakkm | but for buttons, it shows ??? | 09:53 |
| fureddo | zakkm, That's normal | 09:53 |
| zakkm | k then it worked perfectly | 09:53 |
| fureddo | zakkm, It's hidden so it's still a mystery ??? But if you click on the buttons or the Eye button, it should reveal the info. | 09:53 |
| zakkm | Macer: you can make maemo use swap partition. | 09:53 |
| zakkm | it would detect on its own, if not do swapon /dev/mmc____ ... and then add to fstab for maemo | 09:54 |
| fureddo | zakkm, To signify to tomotko that you know a word, you click the green circle. The red cross otherwise. | 09:54 |
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| Macer | zakkm: is spreading over the sd controlled by the sd controller? | 09:54 |
| fureddo | zakkm, This way, tomotko will ask you the words that you had not right. | 09:54 |
| Macer | or the OS? | 09:54 |
| zakkm | spreading? | 09:55 |
| Macer | yeah | 09:55 |
| Macer | so the sd doesn't burn out | 09:55 |
| zakkm | sds can burn? | 09:55 |
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| Macer | lol | 09:55 |
| Macer | yes? | 09:55 |
| zakkm | really? | 09:55 |
| zakkm | no like phyiscal burn | 09:55 |
| Macer | seriously | 09:55 |
| Macer | no | 09:55 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Could you try a Thai glossary after that? | 09:55 |
| zakkm | fureddo: i did the test? | 09:55 |
| Macer | like... can't r/w in a section burn | 09:55 |
| zakkm | Macer: ohh i have no idea | 09:56 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Could you try to import a Thai glossary? | 09:56 |
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| Macer | i'm wondering how much swap space i should give maemo | 09:57 |
| zakkm | yeah , by the way, last was japanese | 09:57 |
| Macer | you think 256 is enough? | 09:57 |
| Macer | i mean does maemo really need more than that? | 09:57 |
| Macer | heh | 09:57 |
| zakkm | Macer: you will use the same swap parititon for all OS's | 09:57 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Thanks. That was a good test. I'm surprised that it works. | 09:57 |
| Macer | ah.. i'll give it 512MB then just to be sure | 09:57 |
| Macer | Mer should be ok with 512MB you think? | 09:57 |
| zakkm | Macer: also mer will use it too, and mer you might want to try kde4 apps and such | 09:58 |
| zakkm | or gnome or something | 09:58 |
| Macer | kde4? haha | 09:58 |
| Macer | ok then | 09:58 |
| Macer | 2048MB | 09:58 |
| Macer | lol | 09:58 |
| zakkm | I tried kontact the other day | 09:58 |
| zakkm | noo | 09:58 |
| zakkm | not desktop, just a app | 09:58 |
| Macer | so 1GB ;) | 09:58 |
| zakkm | fureddo: thai works just fine.... just cant read it | 09:59 |
| zakkm | its all black squares | 09:59 |
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| fureddo | zakkm, If you see squares, it's probably because you are not using the right font. But it's ok. That's expected. | 10:01 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Fonts can be changed in the Preferences. | 10:01 |
| fureddo | zakkm, But it's a good enough test so far. | 10:02 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Thanks a lot for your time. | 10:02 |
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| fureddo | zakkm, I checked my deb's control file and the dependencies were right except for the audio thingie. | 10:02 |
| zakkm | fureddo: anytime, sorry ididnt have the stuff already installed, so it took awhile | 10:03 |
| fureddo | zakkm, No, that's better like that actually. | 10:03 |
| fureddo | zakkm, It's a better test IMHO. | 10:03 |
| fureddo | zakkm, When you started the application and the dependencies were not installed, you received an error message? | 10:04 |
| zakkm | no the way maemo works, nothing happens | 10:04 |
| zakkm | you click , nothing happens | 10:04 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Ok | 10:04 |
| zakkm | the only reason i knew it wasnt going to work, was cause i waited too long | 10:04 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Because the dependencies with Qt was declared. | 10:04 |
| fureddo | zakkm, I guess it's because that you installed it using dpkg -i | 10:05 |
| Macer | i suppose it takes a long time to format 15GB on an SD | 10:05 |
| Macer | i'm just going to put mer on the internal 2G and use the entire other SD for my little maemo project | 10:05 |
| fureddo | zakkm, If you had installed it using apt-get, it would have resolved the dependencies by itself and install other packages. | 10:05 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Of course, you could not install it with apt-get because the package is not in a repository. | 10:06 |
| zakkm | yeah but because its not in repo and i downloaded the deb | 10:06 |
| zakkm | well | 10:06 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Ok, it makes sense. | 10:06 |
| zakkm | theres maemo application manager | 10:06 |
| zakkm | which i installed it with | 10:06 |
| zakkm | but for some oddd reason it didnt get dependencies | 10:06 |
| zakkm | maemo has a uhh "gdeb" ? | 10:07 |
| fureddo | zakkm, gdeb??? | 10:07 |
| Macer | ouch | 10:07 |
| zakkm | ahh gdebi | 10:07 |
| zakkm | nooo | 10:07 |
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| zakkm | i intsalled with app manager, it didnt even try to get dependencies | 10:07 |
| Macer | my damn tablet reboot itself while formatting the SD | 10:07 |
| Macer | wtf? :) | 10:07 |
| qwerty12_N810 | gdebi? No, and it's pretty slow on a tablet anyway... | 10:07 |
| zakkm | it installed but wouldnt run | 10:07 |
| zakkm | qwerty12_N810: i was trying to explain app manager, to fureddo who doesnt have a tablet. | 10:07 |
| zakkm | -.- | 10:07 |
| qwerty12_N810 | :) | 10:08 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Ok, anyway, I will upload it to extras-devel repo and see what happens. | 10:08 |
| zakkm | ahh maybe synaptic is better | 10:08 |
| fureddo | zakkm, How did you find out that you needed the libaudio thingie? When did you see the error message?? | 10:09 |
| zakkm | i figured it failed to install cauase when i clicked it from menu it didnt run | 10:09 |
| zakkm | and rather than trying from terminal | 10:09 |
| zakkm | i tried dpkg-i'ing it | 10:09 |
| Macer | wtf | 10:09 |
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| zakkm | and it pulled libaudio in | 10:10 |
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| zakkm | after apt-get'ing the other stuff | 10:10 |
| zakkm | fureddo: ill show you , onesec | 10:10 |
| wazd_n800 | heya all | 10:11 |
| zakkm | hey wazd_n800 | 10:11 |
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| zakkm | fureddo: http://pastebin.com/m5b1b68eb | 10:12 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Ok thanks. I think that I don't need to put libaudio2 in the dependencies. apt-get will manage to find out by itself. | 10:13 |
| zakkm | oh okay sorry :( | 10:14 |
| fureddo | zakkm, Don't be sorry. You're very helpful. | 10:14 |
| Macer | seems like this sd is going slow as shit | 10:14 |
| Macer | heh | 10:14 |
| Macer | bbl | 10:14 |
| Macer | formatting it again | 10:15 |
| zakkm | Macer: lol | 10:15 |
| fureddo | zakkm, I will upload tomotko in the repo this week-end. | 10:15 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:15 |
| zakkm | morning Jaffa | 10:15 |
| fureddo | Thank you all for your help. | 10:15 |
| Macer | zakkm: no big deal | 10:16 |
| Macer | as long as it says the proper device name when it boots haha | 10:16 |
| zakkm | anyone have solution for hex a hop | 10:16 |
| zakkm | this game is driving me crazy | 10:16 |
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| Macer | now you have me wondering if it will go faster with the SD as opposed to the internal sd stuff they use | 10:19 |
| Macer | i wonder what class the itnernal stuff is | 10:19 |
| Macer | probably 2 | 10:19 |
| zakkm | ? | 10:20 |
| zakkm | internal sd stuff | 10:20 |
| zakkm | NAND isnt it? | 10:20 |
| Macer | is it? | 10:20 |
| zakkm | and also it uses jffs2 | 10:20 |
| Macer | i just thought it was a hardwired sd | 10:20 |
| zakkm | it uses a compressed filesystem | 10:20 |
| Macer | the internal 2GB in an n810? | 10:20 |
| zakkm | not 100% | 10:20 |
| zakkm | but its jffs2 | 10:20 |
| zakkm | yeah its nand | 10:21 |
| zakkm | Flash filesystem specialist Datalight Inc. will soon release a commercial Linux FFS claimed to provide 400 percent the write performance and 500 percent the mount speed of JFFS2. The company's new commercial FFS will target Linux-based mobile phones, set-top boxes, and other embedded devices. | 10:21 |
| zakkm | lol goes to show jffs2 (internal filesystem )is slow :D | 10:22 |
| zakkm | jan 2008 post | 10:22 |
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| Macer | ah well.. i'll be working off the external anyways | 10:28 |
| Macer | it's all set up and booting maemo with "12.2GB internal" | 10:28 |
| Macer | :) | 10:28 |
| `0660 | i wonder what license they were planning for this "commercial" filesystem for linux | 10:28 |
| Macer | `0660: pay to use | 10:28 |
| Macer | heh | 10:28 |
| zakkm | Macer: did you see "macuco" ? | 10:29 |
| Macer | no | 10:29 |
| zakkm | the greatest new tablet app? | 10:29 |
| `0660 | i don't think gpl allows it | 10:29 |
| zakkm | gmail app with kinetic scrolling | 10:29 |
| zakkm | to mimic ipods "mail" ? | 10:29 |
| zakkm | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbgPHc3VfgQ&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fpuelocesar%2Ewordpress%2Ecom%2F&feature=player_embedded | 10:29 |
| Macer | i'm working on the last part of that section of my blog | 10:29 |
| Macer | on how to clone it over | 10:29 |
| Macer | i sure wish that i knew where that old page was that showed you how to do it manually | 10:30 |
| Macer | i'm not a big fan of using stuff like console-tools | 10:30 |
| zakkm | ? | 10:30 |
| zakkm | you use pb and pbeasy? | 10:30 |
| Macer | i'm using pb right now | 10:30 |
| zakkm | whats wrong with it? | 10:30 |
| Macer | nothing | 10:30 |
| Macer | but using it doesn't teach you what happens in the background ;) | 10:30 |
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| zakkm | woww | 10:31 |
| zakkm | macuco is aesomee | 10:31 |
| chx | url please | 10:33 |
| zakkm | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbgPHc3VfgQ&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fpuelocesar%2Ewordpress%2Ecom%2F&feature=player_embedded <--- youtube vid but its in extras-devel | 10:33 |
| chx | if i use this how can i switch off the original mailer? | 10:34 |
| chx | also, how can i switch the web browser from microb to tear? | 10:35 |
| zakkm | you cant its still beta, it just came out? | 10:35 |
| zakkm | original mailer, tihs is just a app? | 10:35 |
| Corsac | gmail only? | 10:36 |
| gogol | yu install tear-bookmarks | 10:36 |
| zakkm | yeah | 10:37 |
| Macer | tear doesn't save passwords | 10:37 |
| gogol | cant change file associations though, that i know of :/ | 10:37 |
| Macer | and i couldn't figure out how to make folders in tearbookmarks heh | 10:37 |
| zakkm | it just runs microb opens gmail site with mobile scripts and adds kinetic scorlling | 10:37 |
| gogol | tear saves pws on mine, and auto logs me in to sites. | 10:37 |
| Macer | does it? | 10:37 |
| zakkm | Macer: what version did you use? :P | 10:37 |
| Macer | hm | 10:37 |
| Macer | zakkm: whatever was on the qole repo? | 10:38 |
| zakkm | oh | 10:38 |
| zakkm | qole keeps it very up to date | 10:38 |
| Macer | i will try again when i get the chance | 10:38 |
| Macer | maybe i just missed something | 10:38 |
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| gogol | i didnt set anything up, it just started doing that :) | 10:38 |
| zakkm | does anyone still use mediabox? | 10:38 |
| gogol | ive been using it recently | 10:39 |
| zakkm | is there still development? | 10:39 |
| gogol | think so... | 10:39 |
| gogol | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=29298 looks like release just a few months ago | 10:41 |
| zakkm | anyone know why when i added account-plugins-haze well installed, and i put my msn id and pass, it doesnt do anything when press finish? | 10:42 |
| zakkm | like it didnt install "accouth" | 10:42 |
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| zakkm | gogol: cool, ill install :D | 10:43 |
| gogol | i like it | 10:47 |
| zakkm | does youtube plugin work? | 10:47 |
| gogol | 's interface but it's a bit clunky at times. | 10:47 |
| gogol | never tried it. i use mytube, its nice and lightweight. | 10:47 |
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| zakkm | ah me too | 10:47 |
| zakkm | but to have one app fo rall would be nice | 10:47 |
| Andy80 | hi all | 10:48 |
| gogol | you'd like canola then. | 10:48 |
| zakkm | hey Andy80 | 10:48 |
| zakkm | used to use canola | 10:48 |
| zakkm | dont like it anymore | 10:48 |
| zakkm | im not a new tablet user. | 10:48 |
| gogol | what's wrong with canola? | 10:48 |
| zakkm | takes ages to startup | 10:49 |
| zakkm | and youtube doesnt work anymore | 10:49 |
| gogol | on what? a 770? seems to start up quick on an n810 | 10:49 |
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| zakkm | n800 | 10:51 |
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| zakkm | my n770 wsod about two years ago | 10:51 |
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| gogol | ouch. i still have mine but the touchscreen has a big dead zone. you have to really pound on it. | 10:52 |
| zakkm | ibought it on ebay too | 10:52 |
| zakkm | without warranty | 10:52 |
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| Macer | crap | 10:56 |
| Macer | i think i'm done with that section | 10:56 |
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| Macer | http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/10/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-2-the-control-flash/ | 10:57 |
| Macer | :) | 10:57 |
| Macer | now onto the part where i really start to pull my hair out. | 10:57 |
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| gogol | wow, you really dont want to use console-tools eh Macer | 11:04 |
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| timeless_mbp | Macer: ping | 11:06 |
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| timeless_mbp | can you please fix your web page to have a left margin? | 11:06 |
| timeless_mbp | it's really mean not to have one | 11:06 |
| timeless_mbp | 2. are you changing hildon-application-manager.list or just reviewing it? | 11:08 |
| timeless_mbp | because it's "not a file your own", you don't have the right to make changes to it (it's auto generated and will be destroyed whenever things feel like it) | 11:09 |
| timeless_mbp | if you want to add your own repositories manually you should use my-name.list | 11:09 |
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| timeless_mbp | where my-name is whatever | 11:09 |
| timeless_mbp | 3. don't suggest using /etc/apt/sources.list at all | 11:09 |
| timeless_mbp | just use my-name in sources.list.d | 11:09 |
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| timeless_mbp | 4. please change the font face for your terminal text, for me, i get a really awful font | 11:10 |
| timeless_mbp | (os x, safari) | 11:10 |
| timeless_mbp | partly because the font size is too small, but probably also because you asked for something screwy | 11:11 |
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| timeless_mbp | 5. please use a spell checker "unatteded" isn't a word (even my irc client knows that!) | 11:11 |
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| Macer | lol | 11:12 |
| `0660 | this photo of may looks quite similar to the ones releaved lately: http://www.mobilewhack.com/nokia-reveals-a-new-tablet-the-n900/ | 11:12 |
| `0660 | revealed | 11:12 |
| Macer | timeless_mbp: you could have added that as a comment ;) | 11:13 |
| Jaffa | `0660: Ye-sss. Except where it doesn't ;-) | 11:13 |
| timeless_mbp | you don't want this as a comment | 11:13 |
| timeless_mbp | you want to silently fix them :) | 11:13 |
| Razumihin | engadget had real photos couple of days ago. | 11:13 |
| Macer | lol | 11:13 |
| Macer | well. the border is there in ff | 11:13 |
| Macer | margin actually | 11:13 |
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| Macer | the font can be adjusted | 11:13 |
| timeless_mbp | it isn't in safari... not sure what you did | 11:13 |
| Macer | by hitting the large/small font icon on the top right | 11:13 |
| lbt | N810 £130 at play.com | 11:14 |
| Macer | timeless_mbp: it's a wordpress site | 11:14 |
| Macer | i'm sure it's safari anyways :-P | 11:14 |
| Macer | sorry about the spelling but that was just as a reference | 11:14 |
| Macer | the real stuff comes afterwards | 11:14 |
| Razumihin | http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/08/nokia-rx-51-tablet-captured-in-the-wild/ | 11:14 |
| Macer | so i was kind of rushing through it | 11:14 |
| timeless_mbp | Macer: using cmd-+ once in safari causes the tt area to be readable | 11:14 |
| timeless_mbp | but the rest of the text is too big then | 11:14 |
| Macer | at the top there is a font changer | 11:15 |
| Macer | like i said. it's just wordpress with a theme ;) | 11:15 |
| Razumihin | Keyboard looks better than n97 but i'm not entirely convinced about the slider. | 11:15 |
| timeless_mbp | so wordpress sucks | 11:15 |
| timeless_mbp | good to know | 11:15 |
| Macer | haha | 11:15 |
| Macer | well.. yeah i guess | 11:15 |
| Macer | but it's easy to set up in apache ;) | 11:15 |
| * RST38h moos | 11:15 | |
| Macer | i wasn't planning on making money off it with its adsense plugin | 11:15 |
| Macer | haha | 11:15 |
| Macer | but then again | 11:16 |
| Macer | one might use the argument that safari sucks :) | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | `0660: note that the link you provided claimed something would be released the month following may | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | last i checked, that was june | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | and we're in august | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | i haven't seen any releases/announcements yet | 11:16 |
| `0660 | there are differences, but in the other hand i think there are enough similarities to warrant an assumption that the photo from May was not only speculation | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | the bible suggests a way to recognize a false prophet: | 11:16 |
| Macer | lol | 11:16 |
| RST38h | the keyboard is better than n97 | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | wait and see if his predictions come true | 11:16 |
| timeless_mbp | if they don't, he's obviously false | 11:17 |
| RST38h | it is not possible to be worse than n97 | 11:17 |
| `0660 | i'm not commenting on the text of the post :) | 11:17 |
| timeless_mbp | `0660: people who work for nokia (such as myself) aren't allowed to comment on such things | 11:18 |
| Macer | and timeless_mbp | 11:18 |
| timeless_mbp | but that specific item has a picture of a diablo ui | 11:18 |
| Macer | that section where the word is mispelled | 11:18 |
| Macer | that was Fanoush .. not me :) | 11:18 |
| `0660 | i was just surprised that there was a such good photo of the device in circulation already in May | 11:18 |
| Macer | haha | 11:18 |
| timeless_mbp | Macer: file a bug :) | 11:18 |
| Macer | i didn't write that.. i just copy and pasted it | 11:18 |
| timeless_mbp | the fremantle sdk was released ages ago | 11:18 |
| Macer | lol | 11:18 |
| Macer | i should | 11:18 |
| Macer | hahaha | 11:18 |
| timeless_mbp | please do | 11:18 |
| `0660 | timeless_mbp :) | 11:18 |
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| Macer | "word mispelled in conf example" | 11:18 |
| timeless_mbp | which means they didn't even try to get the ui right | 11:18 |
| Macer | maybe i should sic it | 11:19 |
| Macer | # set to -1 for no timeout (not recommended, can drain battery when device reboots unatteded) | 11:19 |
| Jaffa | `0660: Apart from showing a Diablo screenshot, it *was* discussed at the time - but it's not a photo; it's a render AFAICT | 11:20 |
| `0660 | do you think that the render is pure speculation? | 11:21 |
| Jaffa | I have no idea. I guess it could have come from some internal briefing doc or marketing positioning presentation | 11:21 |
| Macer | `0660: everything is speculation | 11:21 |
| Macer | no point in speculating when you can just wait it out | 11:21 |
| Macer | :) and just wait for the real thing | 11:21 |
| Jaffa | Macer: +1 | 11:21 |
| Macer | when it's out it's out | 11:22 |
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| Macer | might be just another vaporware product and nokia might not even release anything | 11:22 |
| Macer | they might use maemo for some other device | 11:22 |
| Macer | who knows until the chickens hatch ;) | 11:22 |
| `0660 | i | 11:22 |
| Mek | they shold just drop fremantle and go straight to harmatan :P | 11:22 |
| timeless_mbp | oh | 11:23 |
| timeless_mbp | the other thing is that nokia announced we wouldn't be launching a tablet | 11:23 |
| `0660 | :P | 11:23 |
| Macer | they should just make fremantle for an n810 | 11:23 |
| Macer | haha | 11:23 |
| Macer | a stock nokia version running hildon with all working hardware | 11:23 |
| * Macer hides under a rock after that one | 11:23 | |
| timeless_mbp | Macer: Mer :) | 11:23 |
| `0660 | i | 11:23 |
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| `0660 | heh | 11:23 |
| * Macer hides even more | 11:23 | |
| Macer | that was me talking about mer ;) | 11:24 |
| Macer | haha | 11:24 |
| `0660 | i i i... i do hope they will release rx-51 soon :) | 11:24 |
| Macer | i just like messing with Stskeeps | 11:24 |
| Macer | `0660: i had hopes with this touch book | 11:24 |
| Macer | at least it's next gen arm stuff | 11:24 |
| Macer | but it's just vaporware ;) | 11:24 |
| Macer | like the year late pandora | 11:24 |
| Macer | ah well. bbl | 11:24 |
| qwerty12_N810 | The wrath of Stskeeps is not a force to be reckoned with in the morning. | 11:25 |
| `0660 | touch book? from apple? | 11:25 |
| `0660 | i would think that maemo team at nokia would release something pretty soon. they have spent enough time with no product releases already | 11:26 |
| RST38h | they are behind schedule according to assorted rumors | 11:28 |
| RST38h | and the schedule slipped more than once | 11:28 |
| lcuk | macer, how is dpkg coming on :P | 11:29 |
| `0660 | so it's likely that it won't be here in early september? | 11:29 |
| Stskeeps | macer, so far you owe me a beer :P | 11:29 |
| Mek | even if it is announces in early september that won't mean that it is available in early september | 11:29 |
| RST38h | 060: according to summit schedule they plan for fremantle experience areas | 11:30 |
| `0660 | :/ | 11:30 |
| RST38h | this may mean that the real thing wont be out by the summit | 11:30 |
| lcuk | RST38h, every summit held in amsterdam has fremantle experience areas | 11:30 |
| X-Fade | Mek: Well the release strategy has been mentioned a lot before. This time it is announce, available soon after that. | 11:30 |
| `0660 | well, i have time :) currently i only use my n800 at saturday and sunday mornings :) | 11:30 |
| RST38h | lcuk: you mean it is a sort of weed?:) | 11:31 |
| `0660 | it's nice to start surfing first thing after waking up :) | 11:31 |
| lcuk | heh | 11:31 |
| RST38h | anyways this experience area thing is suspicious =) | 11:32 |
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| lcuk | timeless_mbp, announced no tablet? where when? | 11:40 |
| timeless_mbp | someone at some point said that our next product was not going to be a tablet | 11:40 |
| timeless_mbp | i don't remember when, but it was ages ago | 11:40 |
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| timeless_mbp | i'm not quite sure what it means to not be a tablet | 11:40 |
| timeless_mbp | and having last night read something that talks about the fremantle device as being a tablet, or needing a tablet or something | 11:41 |
| lcuk | well i can assume that means it wont have a childproof lid | 11:41 |
| timeless_mbp | it seems clear that the message wasn't well shared internally :) | 11:41 |
| * timeless_mbp hasn't decided whether to file a bug about that | 11:41 | |
| timeless_mbp | "dear sirs, you seem to have missed a management memo" | 11:42 |
| Jaffa | timeless_mbp: Not going to be *called* an "internet tablet" | 11:42 |
| timeless_mbp | Jaffa: right | 11:42 |
| timeless_mbp | that was the thing i meant | 11:42 |
| timeless_mbp | and yet this thing i read last night calls it that :) | 11:42 |
| X-Fade | timeless_mbp: "Multimedia computer" :) | 11:42 |
| lcuk | nokia n900: now in beige | 11:43 |
| X-Fade | Isn't that what the N97 has on it's back? | 11:43 |
| timeless_mbp | the last multimedia computer i used wouldn't let me mute my computer if it didn't have a sim inserted | 11:43 |
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| Mace_N8x0 | hello | 11:45 |
| timeless_mbp | actually, i'm still using it, but to make it happy, i had to give it a sim | 11:46 |
| lcuk | shift in topic - anyone with technical info on next device - specifically cpufreq stuff. will i need my performance mode hack on the next one, or does it run at a single speed | 11:46 |
| lcuk | or should i be asking this in like #beagle or something | 11:46 |
| Mace_N8x0 | heh | 11:46 |
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| Mace_N8x0 | i wanted to try a beagleboard out as a pc | 11:47 |
| lcuk | macer, i dont care what speed its running at, as long as its stable | 11:47 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: you mean fremantle? | 11:47 |
| timeless_mbp | cpu frequency scaling is part of power management | 11:47 |
| timeless_mbp | the slower the cpu runs the less power it consumes | 11:47 |
| lcuk | ahhh it does scaling too | 11:47 |
| lcuk | yeah, same on diablo | 11:47 |
| Mace_N8x0 | do they make beagleboard cases? | 11:48 |
| timeless_mbp | that's a hardware improvement | 11:48 |
| lcuk | not really | 11:48 |
| Mace_N8x0 | now that is something i would run mer on | 11:48 |
| timeless_mbp | and it's one which anyone using a battery and having a demanding consumer wants | 11:48 |
| Mace_N8x0 | ;) | 11:48 |
| timeless_mbp | silly consumers want things to be fast | 11:48 |
| timeless_mbp | and last for a "long time" | 11:48 |
| timeless_mbp | oh, and they should be cheap! | 11:48 |
| timeless_mbp | oh and pretty, and ... | 11:48 |
| lcuk | timeless_mbp, if i have code that wants to go fast and have no latency it needs to open all the ports | 11:49 |
| timeless_mbp | they should also clean my apartment :( | 11:49 |
| lcuk | and on 810 its selectable | 11:49 |
| Mace_N8x0 | hahaha | 11:49 |
| lcuk | should i choose to run in 5th gear at home with my charger in | 11:49 |
| timeless_mbp | for some reason, i don't think the next device will clean my apartment | 11:49 |
| Mace_N8x0 | depends on ones definition of fast | 11:49 |
| lcuk | timess, you havent read all your mails then lol | 11:49 |
| timeless_mbp | Mace_N8x0: sadly most customers have a definition of "not fast enough" | 11:49 |
| Mace_N8x0 | i think my 400Mhz n810 is pretty zippy | 11:49 |
| lcuk | nokia announced n900 cleaning services | 11:50 |
| * lcuk agrees with macer | 11:50 | |
| timeless_mbp | some people complain that the browser isn't fast enough | 11:50 |
| Mace_N8x0 | amazingly fast for 400MHz | 11:50 |
| sarower | Is it possible to listening an applet with d-bus service? i.e sending message from application to applet!!! | 11:50 |
| lcuk | timeless, doing an awful lot | 11:50 |
| `0660 | i'm not buying anything if it doesn't help me with cleaning! | 11:50 |
| * timeless_mbp typically discovers these people have asked the browser to manage 200mb of data | 11:50 | |
| Mace_N8x0 | i think it is the cpu clock speed marketing | 11:50 |
| lcuk | timeless, i thought stress was your homepage! | 11:51 |
| lcuk | 200mb should be a light breakfast :p | 11:51 |
| Mace_N8x0 | they want to see 5GHz in big numbers | 11:51 |
| timeless_mbp | lcuk: stress settles down to less than 200 mb when it's done :) | 11:51 |
| * suihkulokki .oO( turbo button like on old pc's ) | 11:51 | |
| lcuk | heh yeah | 11:51 |
| lcuk | anyway, cyas | 11:51 |
| timeless_mbp | have a good weekend | 11:51 |
| lcuk | suihkulokki, liqbase had one | 11:51 |
| Mace_N8x0 | when most consumers can make due with 1GHz | 11:52 |
| Mace_N8x0 | haha | 11:52 |
| timeless_mbp | Mace_N8x0: s/due/do/ | 11:52 |
| lcuk | and acmonitor was hacked to do it for me when i plugged/unplugged | 11:52 |
| timeless_mbp | (s/make due/make do/g) | 11:52 |
| Mace_N8x0 | lol | 11:52 |
| Mace_N8x0 | ok capt mensa :-P | 11:52 |
| sarower | qwerty12_N810: Is it possible to listening an applet with d-bus service? i.e sending message from application to applet!!! | 11:52 |
| timeless_mbp | http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081025211232AAlHB7Z | 11:52 |
| timeless_mbp | Mace_N8x0: sorry, you're the second person to make that error in one week | 11:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | sarower: I've told you before: My programming knowledge is very shit :) | 11:53 |
| Mace_N8x0 | i dont even know why | 11:53 |
| Mace_N8x0 | i knew it was wrong | 11:53 |
| Mace_N8x0 | but before i knew it the gun went off | 11:53 |
| lcuk | sarower, don't believe him | 11:54 |
| lcuk | qwerty knows everything :) and if not, he knows a guy who knows a guy who can get you one cheap | 11:54 |
| * lcuk goes anyway | 11:55 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | Yes, that "guy" would be lcuk :) | 11:55 |
| sarower | qwerty12_N810: luck is saying what/ | 11:55 |
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| sarower | luck: oh....then please help me..please | 11:56 |
| lcuk | sarower, i dont know specifically, what you are asking should be possible easily though. go and look at the intro docs for dbus | 11:57 |
| lcuk | the examples will work on maemo i believe just normally | 11:57 |
| lcuk | so you can test yourself | 11:57 |
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| lcuk | but im gona! | 11:58 |
| sarower | luck: i did everything with dbus for a application! | 11:58 |
| lcuk | gone even | 11:58 |
| sarower | But cam do anything in applet! | 11:58 |
| sarower | can* | 11:58 |
| sarower | can not | 11:58 |
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| sarower | luck: which examples? | 12:03 |
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| Passeli | i am getting following error -> "QGtkStyle cannot be used together with the GTK_Qt engine." when trying to run ARMEL binary at scratchbox | 12:25 |
| Mek | you get that when you have some packages missing... but I don't think those packages are part of the sdk... | 12:26 |
| Mek | (some package missing and not using run-standalone.sh and/or a full environment) | 12:26 |
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| Mace_N8x0 | wow. someone replied to a zimbra bug from like a year ago haha | 12:28 |
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| Mace_N8x0 | that was odd | 12:29 |
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| Macer | omfg my son is watching yo gabba gabba | 12:39 |
| Macer | and the marketing is in full effect | 12:39 |
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| Passeli | hmm, i cannot start hildon framework at X86 target, ARMEL works fine | 12:41 |
| Macer | hm. i'm sure there is screen on the tablet | 12:41 |
| Passeli | talking about scratchbox | 12:43 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: #4912 updated. Get to coding! :) | 12:43 |
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| Macer | is there like.. no screen | 12:56 |
| florian | good morning | 12:56 |
| Macer | am i missing something here? i remember there being screen for maemo :) | 12:56 |
| Myrtti | Painkillers <3 | 12:57 |
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| Macer | heh | 13:03 |
| Macer | well. i'm going off on the tangent now | 13:03 |
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| Macer | trying to get packaging and building working on the tablet in maemo | 13:03 |
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| Passeli | had to reboot pc to get hildon framework running in X86 target at scratchbox | 13:05 |
| Passeli | strange | 13:05 |
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| Macer | well. qt isn't realistic | 13:08 |
| Macer | i'll work on abiword first :) | 13:08 |
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| wazd_n800 | hello everyone | 13:30 |
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| lcuk | hello Doctor Nick! | 13:32 |
| javispedro | lol even spambots are happy than the h-a-m ban on = was lifted | 13:32 |
| roadies | hello all, I'm trying to port sofiasip_cli to a 810, glib2 is required and a major problem. Has anyone ported glib2 to the maemo OS? | 13:33 |
| javispedro | er.... nearly the whole of maemo is using glib2 | 13:34 |
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| roadies | javispedro: sorry very new to maemo, where can I pull the tree for glib2? | 13:36 |
| wazd_n800 | has anybody seen detailed rx-51 spexs? it says bout 16 bit screen :( | 13:36 |
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| javispedro | apt-get source libglib2.0? | 13:36 |
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| timeless_mbp | javispedro: spam bots? | 13:36 |
| javispedro | timeless, yep, was subscribed to the tmo topic about it and have got some notifications | 13:37 |
| javispedro | one of them said something along the lines of "oh, good news. let's celebrate! <pr0n links>" | 13:38 |
| timeless_mbp | lol | 13:39 |
| timeless_mbp | context aware spam | 13:40 |
| timeless_mbp | the future is now | 13:40 |
| X-Fade | Well, it seems that there are just real persons answering these posts. | 13:40 |
| X-Fade | I guess labour is cheap there. | 13:40 |
| qwerty12_N810 | They've even got spambots where one'll make a fake question and it'll be replied with spam one hour later :\ | 13:41 |
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| aol | I really cant believe 16bit screen | 13:47 |
| aol | maybe a mistake? | 13:47 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Xephyr still has to be ran 800x480x16... | 13:48 |
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| aol | why? | 13:48 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | Maybe to match the device? =) | 13:50 |
| aol | 2^5 == 32 shades of gray | 13:50 |
| aol | pretty impossible to do alphablending etc | 13:50 |
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| zerojayPC | gotta be a mistake. | 13:52 |
| zerojayPC | like the 128mb of RAM. | 13:52 |
| javispedro | you expect a 18bit screen? | 13:52 |
| X-Fade | zerojayPC: No, it is all over the code also. | 13:52 |
| aol | 18bit would be already better, but not good | 13:52 |
| javispedro | well. Probably having better depth than what my current desktop screen has would contribute to the insane price. | 13:53 |
| zerojayPC | So what was the screen in the n810 then? | 13:53 |
| X-Fade | 16bit | 13:53 |
| zerojayPC | ok, I misunderstood then. | 13:53 |
| aol | hmmm, really? | 13:53 |
| aol | only 65k shades of color? | 13:54 |
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| X-Fade | aol: Create a gradient background and see for yourself. | 13:54 |
| wazd_n800 | wrong, ask lcuk :) | 13:54 |
| aol | the frame buffer is still 32/24bit? | 13:55 |
| wazd_n800 | X-Fade: it's not the screen, it's buffer | 13:55 |
| javispedro | the framebuffer is 16 bit and trying to create a 24 bit surface results in crash. | 13:55 |
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| X-Fade | wazd_n800: Well, weakest link ;) | 13:55 |
| wazd_n800 | x-fade: you can notice that screenshots are with messed gradients too | 13:55 |
| Jaffa | aol: 2^5 is a 5-bit screen. 2^16 = 65,536 | 13:56 |
| wazd_n800 | x-fade: and liqbase looks fine | 13:56 |
| aol | Jaffa: but 16 bit screen does not mean 65k shades of grey, right? | 13:57 |
| javispedro | word of god: the epson lcd controller supports up to 18 bit. | 13:57 |
| Jaffa | aol: I dunno what the colour gamut of the LCD part is. | 13:57 |
| lcuk | afaik, the x11 default stuff uses a 16bit graphics mode to lower bandwidth around the system. however YUV graphics modes are fully 24bit :) | 13:58 |
| javispedro | aka RGB 6:6:6 | 13:58 |
| lcuk | so your videos are fullcolor | 13:58 |
| lcuk | and liqbase :D | 13:58 |
| aol | Jaffa: well what I mean you'd have 5 bits for each color in 16bit frame buffer | 13:58 |
| javispedro | btw, the screen may actually be 18 bits since the lcd controller says it does 16bit->18bit transparent conversion | 13:59 |
| javispedro | but I'm not sure how to confirm. | 13:59 |
| aol | I'll be very disappointed if we see frame buffer any less than 24bits as the gfx is hw accelerated.... | 13:59 |
| lcuk | how many "bits" does *spit* iphone have? | 14:00 |
| Jaffa | aol: Ah, I see. | 14:00 |
| javispedro | probably 16. | 14:00 |
| javispedro | also, powervr is probably 16. | 14:00 |
| aol | symbian phones have 24bit frame buffers | 14:00 |
| aol | I don't know what the screens can handle tough | 14:00 |
| lcuk | aol, internal framebuffers != what goes over the wire into the LCD controller | 14:00 |
| aol | supposed to be transparent anyways | 14:00 |
| aol | lcuk: I do understand that! | 14:01 |
| zerojayPC | I'll be happy with it if it's as good as the screen on the current tablets. | 14:01 |
| lcuk | though for the lesser graphics modes phones use, they might be one and the same part | 14:01 |
| lcuk | and may infact be wholy 24bit around | 14:01 |
| lcuk | zerojayPC, if the screens we messed with in copenhagen are anything to go by, the quality will be outstanding | 14:02 |
| lcuk | everything looks crisp and clear | 14:02 |
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| aol | well, that is comforting to hear | 14:02 |
| lcuk | and ohhhh so sensitive | 14:02 |
| X-Fade | And transflective! | 14:02 |
| aol | transflective resistive? | 14:02 |
| lcuk | nokia should supply bibs with the devices | 14:02 |
| aol | that I havent seen before | 14:02 |
| lcuk | so people dont drool on them | 14:03 |
| X-Fade | aol: n810 ;) | 14:03 |
| lcuk | the 810 has that | 14:03 |
| aol | oh | 14:03 |
| aol | I dont have 810 | 14:03 |
| aol | 800 only :) | 14:03 |
| X-Fade | Helps a lot when outside in the sun. | 14:03 |
| lcuk | second class citizen ;) | 14:03 |
| javispedro | http://www.meritweb.com/color-test.htm | 14:03 |
| javispedro | does anyone know a better test? | 14:03 |
| aol | yeah nokia did not want to give me n810 for free :) | 14:03 |
| wazd_n800 | aol: transflective screens are here for about 7 years | 14:03 |
| lcuk | heh, liqflow does a full color rainbow | 14:03 |
| javispedro | yes but my eyes lie to me. | 14:04 |
| javispedro | my tft is 18 bit but I see that perfectly fine. | 14:04 |
| aol | wazd_n800: I know, but somehow for example Nokia 5800 screen is not transflective | 14:04 |
| aol | wazd_n800: they say it's because of the resistive layer on the screen | 14:04 |
| * lcuk goes again | 14:04 | |
| aol | same applies to all windows mobile phones I've seen | 14:04 |
| Macer | wow | 14:04 |
| zerojayPC | aol: Nokia wanted to give me a developer discount... but they gave me one that didn't work and it took about 10 months of emailing Quim before he just gave up and shipped me a free N810 himself. | 14:06 |
| zerojayPC | "gave me one that didn't work" = developer discount code | 14:06 |
| Macer | http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/14/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-3-the-tangent/ | 14:06 |
| javispedro | the iphone has a 18 bit depth lcd | 14:07 |
| javispedro | so my guess is 16 bit framebuffer too. | 14:07 |
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| zerojayPC | Lemme ask a coworker. | 14:07 |
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| wazd_n800 | zerojayPC, lol) | 14:08 |
| wazd_n800 | zerojayPC, I wonder how discounts work in russia | 14:08 |
| zerojayPC | Very simple. | 14:08 |
| zerojayPC | I hold gun, you give me discount. | 14:08 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Free AK-47 with each purchase of the N900 | 14:09 |
| aol | Looking at the iphone screenshots, my guess would be 24bit frame buffer | 14:09 |
| wazd_n800 | I think I'll have to pay the full price :) | 14:09 |
| * javispedro wonders why PowerVR Technology Overview manual uses "Escape from Monkey Island" screenshots as samples. | 14:09 | |
| javispedro | theoretically seems powervr can do 24 bpp. I am yet to see it clearly specified though. | 14:12 |
| javispedro | aol: 24 bit framebuffer clipped to 18bit ? :P | 14:13 |
| aol | javispedro: yeah | 14:14 |
| javispedro | well. I don't have it so I can tell. | 14:14 |
| aol | I'm not really interested on the how the HW deals with it :) | 14:14 |
| javispedro | s/can/can't/ | 14:14 |
| infobot | javispedro meant: well. I don't have it so I can't tell. | 14:14 |
| aol | but how the bitmaps are created and handled | 14:15 |
| aol | it's up to the HW to deal with it then | 14:15 |
| aol | why 24 bit (or 32bit bitmaps) are so interesting, is that they are really really easy to manipulate | 14:15 |
| javispedro | aol, seems you're right. ogles uses 32bit RGBA at least by default. | 14:18 |
| javispedro | (in the iphone) | 14:18 |
| javispedro | http://michaeln.wordpress.com/2009/05/06/hello-world/ | 14:18 |
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| Macer | wow. it is going to take me 10 years to install all the dependencies | 14:21 |
| javispedro | makes sense to expect that rover will at least allow to create rgba textures. | 14:21 |
| javispedro | but I do not expect a > 18 bits LCD. | 14:21 |
| lcuk | macer GO GO GO! | 14:23 |
| aol | javispedro: thats totally fine. | 14:23 |
| aol | 18bits is reasonable, 15bit would not | 14:24 |
| javispedro | hope the omap lcd controller sorts that. | 14:24 |
| Macer | http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/14/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-3-the-tangent/ | 14:25 |
| Macer | lcuk: i got stuck there | 14:25 |
| Macer | something about pkg-config not being able to find packages | 14:25 |
| Macer | at the bottom of that page is where i'm stuck right now looking for a solution | 14:26 |
| javispedro | two problems: you said you didn't installed pkg-config, AND, you're missing -dev packages for all those libraries. | 14:27 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Why not just do "apt-get build-dep abiword"? | 14:27 |
| Macer | because i didn't know i could do that? ;) | 14:28 |
| Macer | The following packages will be REMOVED: osso-software-version-rx44 | 14:28 |
| Macer | because of stuff like that heh | 14:28 |
| Macer | i don't know what osso-software-version-rx44 is but it seems important | 14:29 |
| Macer | ;) | 14:29 |
| X-Fade | Macer: Start with installing the unlocked version of that package. | 14:29 |
| qwerty12_N810 | At the least, you will have a list of packages needed like, say, libgtk2.0-dev | 14:29 |
| javispedro | install pkg-config first | 14:29 |
| Macer | javispedro: i already did | 14:29 |
| javispedro | ah, ok. | 14:29 |
| Macer | qwerty12_N810: ah. good point. | 14:30 |
| Macer | thanks | 14:30 |
| Macer | i wonder what is conflicting with osso-software-version-rx44 | 14:30 |
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| talig | Anyone around here who's had the pleasure of working with Cairo? I'm kind or tired of going over tutorials that don't work :( | 14:31 |
| Macer | build-essential removes it | 14:31 |
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| lcuk | macer you sound more and more like me :) | 14:33 |
| aol | maybe stupid/n00b question: is the maemo5 being ported to n800? n810? how far is it? | 14:34 |
| javispedro | ~mer | 14:34 |
| infobot | i heard mer is http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer, or on #mer | 14:34 |
| javispedro | lol first post :) | 14:34 |
| lcuk | macer pkg config is a path thing | 14:35 |
| lcuk | gimma a mo | 14:35 |
| lcuk | i had exactly this | 14:35 |
| aol | ok, so it's not really maemo anymore | 14:36 |
| lcuk | export PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/usr/lib/pkgconfig:$PKG_CONFIG_PATH | 14:36 |
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| Macer | oh | 14:36 |
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| lcuk | building from source i think it looks somewhere else by default | 14:37 |
| VDVsx | ouch, simple raycasting demo (Qt) only runs at 4fps on the n810 :) | 14:37 |
| lcuk | or your source packages put their config somewhere else | 14:37 |
| lcuk | but either way, that fixed it for me | 14:37 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, ouch indeed | 14:37 |
| Macer | i'm running it again | 14:37 |
| Macer | although i'm missing a long of pkgs that abiword requires | 14:38 |
| Macer | dependencies from the pkg | 14:38 |
| javispedro | VDVsx, that's a lot. | 14:38 |
| lcuk | abiword is not required for dpkg on device :P | 14:38 |
| javispedro | more than what I achieved with glxgears on my Palm TX :P | 14:38 |
| Macer | lcuk: nope | 14:38 |
| Macer | lcuk: yeah but i want to make sure i will be able to build things from src | 14:39 |
| Macer | abiword requires a lot of libs | 14:39 |
| Macer | ;) | 14:39 |
| Macer | and configurations | 14:39 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, javispedro , is a very simple example, only math, runs very well in my 5800 :) | 14:39 |
| Macer | lcuk: what are the dpkg commands to download src, build and pkg? | 14:39 |
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| lcuk | VDVsx, yeah but your 5800 has a baby screen | 14:39 |
| javispedro | there's something fishy with the qt-diablo in extras-devel. feels a bit slow. | 14:39 |
| lcuk | macer, i used wget and grabbed from gnu | 14:40 |
| lcuk | running code, or the repo? | 14:40 |
| javispedro | lcuk, ^^^ you are asking me? | 14:40 |
| lcuk | yeah | 14:41 |
| ShadowJK | aol: yeah. The new Maemo 5, as it will be on the new device, would be way too slow on N800/N810 | 14:41 |
| javispedro | running. | 14:41 |
| javispedro | the sudoku app has quite a bit of lag | 14:41 |
| lcuk | aol, fremantle requires the powervr | 14:41 |
| lcuk | and since no powervr drivers for 8x0 are forthcoming | 14:41 |
| lcuk | javispedro, :) on diablo | 14:41 |
| lcuk | echo performance >/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor | 14:42 |
| lcuk | to switch back to default | 14:42 |
| lcuk | echo ondemand >/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor | 14:42 |
| javispedro | with an older version they didn't lag so often. | 14:42 |
| lcuk | it has noticable differences in liqbase | 14:42 |
| lcuk | try it | 14:42 |
| * javispedro this reminds me to port some day cpufreq-utils | 14:42 | |
| ShadowJK | I wonder if the ondemand scaler could be convinced to scale up faster | 14:43 |
| lcuk | yeah ShadowJK i considered that at the start | 14:43 |
| lcuk | but a well behaved system doesnt care and can run at performance all day long | 14:43 |
| lcuk | its only when bad processes are dribbling stuff | 14:43 |
| lcuk | that it drains faster | 14:43 |
| javispedro | I'm used to ondemand; I use it daily on my desktop where (according to some) is horrible cause the athlon takes a lot to switch freqs | 14:43 |
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| lcuk | desktop is a completely different ballgame | 14:44 |
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| aol | ShadowJK/lcuk: yeah that's the answer I got from Nokia when I asked this question in Nokia Summit in the spring... or basically it was generally the differences between OMAP2x and 3x | 14:44 |
| lcuk | it changes gcc compilation speeds noticable | 14:44 |
| lcuk | there is no latency | 14:44 |
| aol | nokia developer summit i mean | 14:44 |
| javispedro | what about conservative? | 14:44 |
| ShadowJK | I think conservative has even worse "interactive" feel | 14:44 |
| javispedro | probably. | 14:45 |
| aol | I'm pretty disappointed ofcourse that it will render my N800 useless in doing software for Maemo5 | 14:45 |
| aol | anyone know how many N770-N810 were sold? | 14:46 |
| aol | millions ? | 14:46 |
| lcuk | javispedro, the 2 extremes i found were: | 14:46 |
| lcuk | powersave - runs always at slowest speed | 14:46 |
| lcuk | ondemand is default and switched between | 14:46 |
| lcuk | performance == top speed | 14:47 |
| Macer | lcuk: but what do you use to pkg ? ;) i've never used dpkg to pkg debs before | 14:47 |
| lcuk | the others just do variations | 14:47 |
| Macer | i want to try to test it out | 14:47 |
| lcuk | i have a NEED to package stand alone liq* apps | 14:47 |
| javispedro | maybe someone should try an usermode governor which is ondemand to "get faster" but conservative to slow down. | 14:47 |
| lcuk | the problem with these threshholds | 14:48 |
| lcuk | is not how fast it scales up | 14:48 |
| lcuk | i have processes that dont consume too much cpu (maybe 20-30%) | 14:48 |
| lcuk | but they need to be responsive | 14:48 |
| lcuk | the scheduler slows it down | 14:48 |
| ShadowJK | performance isn't always top speed, it switches to 330 if DSP is in use, to put DSP at highest speed :) | 14:48 |
| lcuk | latency increases | 14:48 |
| lcuk | and lage results | 14:48 |
| lcuk | ShadowJK, assuming you are running audio apps | 14:49 |
| ShadowJK | yeah | 14:49 |
| lcuk | and lag results * | 14:49 |
| lcuk | drastic lag in some situations | 14:49 |
| lcuk | javispedro, the only solution i could find last year that kept me in ondemand and also gave good results was rendering the scene TWICE! | 14:50 |
| javispedro | doesn't the thing switch to max freq when user input? | 14:50 |
| lcuk | which is counter intuitive to both battery life and everything | 14:50 |
| lcuk | but it made the program run faster | 14:50 |
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| lcuk | fuck user input, i want it fast now | 14:50 |
| lcuk | i might be showing an anim | 14:50 |
| lcuk | or scrolling a big list | 14:50 |
| lcuk | you have input at first, but then kinetics are going for +5seconds | 14:50 |
| lcuk | it judders to a halt | 14:50 |
| lcuk | and looks like pigshit | 14:51 |
| lcuk | excuse my french lol | 14:51 |
| lcuk | what if i have a nice animated background | 14:51 |
| lcuk | that would look wrong if it judders to life every few seconds | 14:52 |
| * lcuk looks at qwerty12_N810 | 14:52 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | Dunno, a simple one works quite well too ;) | 14:53 |
| lcuk | heh yeah | 14:53 |
| lcuk | you mean one that just kinda meanders around | 14:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | yeah | 14:53 |
| * lcuk huggles lissajous functions | 14:54 | |
| lcuk | javispedro, the point is - performance mode might make you more responsive | 14:55 |
| lcuk | it worked on 810 | 14:55 |
| javispedro | it definitely does. | 14:55 |
| * lcuk hopes it will still work/not be needed on next device | 14:55 | |
| lcuk | :D excellent | 14:55 |
| Macer | hm | 14:55 |
| Macer | it has to be the way pkg-tool was built | 14:55 |
| ShadowJK | lcuk, tried turning any of the ondemand settings? | 14:55 |
| Macer | i bet some sort of prefix crap | 14:56 |
| lcuk | i didnt play once i got what i wanted | 14:56 |
| lcuk | feel free though shadowjk | 14:56 |
| javispedro | only a perfect ondemand governor would not decrease responsiveness, and that's improbable. | 14:56 |
| Macer | i just allowed it to overwrite oss-software-rx44 | 14:56 |
| Macer | well.. rm it | 14:56 |
| Macer | can't wait to find out what doesn't work :) | 14:56 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | SSUs? (Although, truth be told, you're not in danger of that...) | 14:57 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, you wont get it | 14:57 |
| lcuk | like i said, i broke its principle | 14:58 |
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| lcuk | because i had a process that was running <20% cpu | 14:58 |
| lcuk | but needing fullspeed | 14:58 |
| lcuk | i optimized it so much! | 14:58 |
| lcuk | http://liquid.googlepages.com/linuxtag_notes | 14:59 |
| lcuk | theres my notes about it | 14:59 |
| lcuk | anyway, must dash | 14:59 |
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| javispedro | yep, it's ver improbable. | 14:59 |
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| Macer | yeah i don't get why pkg-config isn't working heh | 14:59 |
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| wazd | http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=2019&view=1&c=nokia_n900_internet_tablet_nokia_rover <- kinda leaked specs | 15:07 |
| javispedro | wazd, GUESS NOT: RAM+capacity: 128 MiB | 15:09 |
| javispedro | oops. | 15:09 |
| javispedro | caps lock, sorry ;) | 15:09 |
| zerojayPC | Macer: osso-software-version-rx44 is basically a dummy file that locks down certain packages from being upgraded so that only SSU will update them from my understanding. | 15:09 |
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| Macer | zerojayPC: well. i just got rid of it | 15:10 |
| zerojayPC | Before an SSU can be applied, that has to be installed and found. | 15:10 |
| Macer | haha | 15:10 |
| Macer | oh. well. taht can't be good later on | 15:10 |
| Macer | SSU? | 15:10 |
| zerojayPC | Guess it doesn't matter since we probably won't get anymore SSUs anyways. | 15:10 |
| zerojayPC | Updating without reflashing. | 15:10 |
| Macer | an update i'm guessing? | 15:10 |
| Macer | ah | 15:10 |
| Macer | ok | 15:10 |
| Macer | yeah i doubt it too :) | 15:10 |
| Macer | i'm trying to build pkg-config now | 15:11 |
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| zerojayPC | Who knows... maybe the community will take over SSUs for Diablo.. hard to say. | 15:11 |
| Macer | doubt it | 15:12 |
| Macer | they seem rather focused on mer ;) | 15:12 |
| zerojayPC | true | 15:13 |
| Macer | so hopefully nokia will stop being so damn anal and open up the remaining hardware related stuff | 15:13 |
| Macer | greedy bastards :) | 15:13 |
| Macer | pkg-config is taking like a year to build on this tablet haha | 15:13 |
| Macer | i honestly didn't think it was that much src | 15:14 |
| Macer | just for an app that just does pkg stuff | 15:14 |
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| zerojayPC | Blogs karma... that's just for blog posts that appear in Planet Maemo, right? | 15:16 |
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| zerojayPC | I guess it's easy to see that I didn't have much to do at work the last two days. My karma jumped from 400 to 460. lol | 15:18 |
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| Macer | wtf | 16:03 |
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| zerojayPC | ? | 16:06 |
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| Macer | zerojayPC: hey | 16:34 |
| Macer | blah.. never mind i will just let mer install the damn bootmenu and see where i am going wrong | 16:35 |
| Macer | i am getting incompatible bootmenu | 16:35 |
| Macer | maybe it is the initfs_flash i am using | 16:35 |
| Macer | http://pastebin.com/d7ac923b1 | 16:35 |
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| GAN800 | lcuk, cpufreq stuff was improved for Fremantle. | 16:47 |
| javispedro | hope so, cause he is absolutely right. | 16:47 |
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| javispedro | just tried it. | 16:47 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, in fremantle? | 16:47 |
| GAN800 | Also: you've got a shitton more HP at 200-someodd MHz on Cortex A8 than you do on ARM11's 166MHz. | 16:48 |
| javispedro | no, you lcuk are right :) | 16:48 |
| javispedro | ondemand sucks on n8x0 | 16:48 |
| lcuk | heh! | 16:48 |
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| javispedro | you warned me not to sleep so much not to annoy the ondemand governor | 16:48 |
| javispedro | I get way, way higher framerates not sleeping between frames | 16:49 |
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| javispedro | I mean, not letting the autoframe rate thingie sleep even if it says so. | 16:49 |
| javispedro | probably busylooping would fix it, but kill the battery I guess. | 16:50 |
| javispedro | so we need to agree into a common standard to enable performance in n8x0 ;) maybe a "performanced" daemon listening for performance requests and returning to ondemand when all pids having requested performance die? | 16:51 |
| lcuk | :) cool | 16:51 |
| lcuk | the closest to good i came was just adding it to liqbase | 16:52 |
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| lcuk | and let the user choose | 16:52 |
| lcuk | but ive removed that as well now | 16:52 |
| javispedro | i trhink the daemon thing is not a bad idea | 16:52 |
| javispedro | in the future if someone has the time it could be extended to be a proper userspace governor | 16:52 |
| lcuk | acmonitor is another place where i did it | 16:53 |
| lcuk | it upgraded to performance when on a wallwart | 16:53 |
| lcuk | otherwise stayed in ondemand | 16:53 |
| lcuk | but there was no ui | 16:53 |
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| lcuk | and we really need proper profiles | 16:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | gconf-editor not good enough? :p | 16:53 |
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| javispedro | lol I was wondering why the FPS indicator was telling me 10 when the same game in "turbo" mode (aka no-sleep, fixed framerate 30fps) is playable | 16:55 |
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| lcuk | you get 30fps? what res are you runnin | 16:56 |
| javispedro | very little | 16:56 |
| * javispedro looking | 16:56 | |
| lcuk | and what graphics mode are you using to change | 16:56 |
| lcuk | most rgb modes are unchangable | 16:57 |
| lcuk | the closest you can usually do is xsp | 16:57 |
| lcuk | tho the lcd controller supports arbritary res | 16:57 |
| javispedro | I'm already doing xsp :) | 16:57 |
| javispedro | wxh = 256x224 | 16:57 |
| javispedro | rgb565 | 16:57 |
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| lcuk | what are you driving it with | 16:58 |
| lcuk | errr setting it with | 16:58 |
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| javispedro | sdl_updaterect... | 16:58 |
| javispedro | ah, sdl_setvideomode | 16:58 |
| lcuk | didnt know sdl let you choose resolutions | 16:58 |
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| javispedro | it does not :P | 16:58 |
| javispedro | it just does boxing | 16:58 |
| lcuk | ahhh so its not fullscreen | 16:58 |
| javispedro | yep, but It does not draw the border at least. | 16:59 |
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| javispedro | aka either I clear it manually or shit appears all over the margin | 16:59 |
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| lcuk | youin windowed mode? | 17:02 |
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| javispedro | nope, I am passing SDL_FULLSCREEN, but it does not do anything noticeable other than opening a "full screen" window | 17:02 |
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| lcuk | fair enough | 17:03 |
| javispedro | it does not seem to configure the lcd controller in any way if that's what you're interested in | 17:03 |
| javispedro | in fact, setting 8 bpp is slower than 16bpp, and my guess is because sdl is converting on-the-fly | 17:03 |
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| javispedro | yuv is out of the question for me, cause that would mean rewriting parts of the rasterizer | 17:05 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, yeah, 8bit is software based | 17:11 |
| lcuk | i looked into all that at the start :) | 17:12 |
| lcuk | finding yuv planar mode was great for me tho - greyscale 8bit chunky surface | 17:12 |
| lcuk | bliss! | 17:12 |
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| lcuk | all the code for working it is like working on old vga modex | 17:13 |
| * lcuk understands one byte per pixel | 17:13 | |
| javispedro | hw paletted 8 bit would be nice since some games in the snes (without transparency, blending, etc.) could be rendered that way | 17:14 |
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| aol | apparently iPhone supports only RGBA8 (32bit) and RGB565 (16bit) | 17:18 |
| aol | bitmaps | 17:18 |
| javispedro | what else you want ;) | 17:18 |
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| javispedro | paletted 8 bit like me? :D | 17:18 |
| aol | it may mean the lcd controller does only 16bit | 17:18 |
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| javispedro | it would be pretty stupid to have 32bpp bitmaps, 18bpp lcd, and 16bpp lcd controller | 17:19 |
| lopz | hi | 17:19 |
| aol | so is iPhone screen 18bit then ? | 17:19 |
| aol | the lcd | 17:20 |
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| javispedro | that's what wikipedia and apple say. | 17:20 |
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| javispedro | 160,000 colors | 17:20 |
| aol | ah ok then | 17:20 |
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| aol | then you might loose two bits with the non alpha bitmaps | 17:20 |
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| aol | javispedro: you mean 262k | 17:22 |
| aol | ? | 17:22 |
| javispedro | aol: 262,144 | 17:23 |
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| aol | fair enough | 17:25 |
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| VDVsx | humm, maemo or Maemo for the TM name ? | 17:46 |
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| VDVsx | GAN800, around ? | 17:47 |
| Jaffa | VDVsx: Context? | 17:50 |
| VDVsx | Jaffa, "Be part of three exciting days of all things maemo™ " | 17:50 |
| Jaffa | "Maemo" is the name of Nokia's platform. There is a "Maemo community" which uses "maemo.org" to discuss "Maemo Devices"' software and hardware. | 17:50 |
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| Jaffa | VDVsx: Definitely "Maemo" | 17:50 |
| VDVsx | lol | 17:51 |
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| VDVsx | source: http://www.forum.nokia.com/info/sw.nokia.com/id/049a76eb-1a69-436d-af98-c26e05af8e6a/maemo_summit_2009.html | 17:51 |
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| Jaffa | And, if you're being accurate, according to the trademark policy, it should be "Be part of three exciting days of all things *Maemo*[TM]" (emphasis intended) | 17:51 |
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| Jaffa | And the "Learn more & register" goes to the day 1 schedule. FFS. | 17:51 |
| VDVsx | yup, I will report that | 17:52 |
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| * Jaffa wonders if anyone wants to hack mediawiki to do cool things (like I did for http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer) for the summit page. | 17:55 | |
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| VDVsx | Jaffa, ask Tim, wazd :) | 18:10 |
| GAN800 | VDVsx, Maemo is only ever lowercase if it's attached to a .org. | 18:10 |
| Jaffa | VDVsx: Neither are here, and Tim's busy doing good work on the summit proper | 18:11 |
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| VDVsx | GAN800, thanks, as I thought :) | 18:12 |
| VDVsx | Jaffa, can't help, I'm very bad in that area :) | 18:12 |
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| * lbt goes to debian-legal for some light relief | 18:12 | |
| Jaffa | VDVsx: Tsk. Practice makes perfect (or, at least, better ;-) | 18:12 |
| VDVsx | Jaffa, well, I have practice criticizing the designs of others :) | 18:14 |
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| lcuk | VDVsx, did you have a peek at that package i dropped on #liqbase | 18:24 |
| VDVsx | nop | 18:24 |
| VDVsx | zach's ? | 18:24 |
| lcuk | no, i pasted it about dinner time, ill be pasting more updates there as the other elements come into place | 18:25 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, sorry but I don't have a proto :P | 18:25 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, gonna try :) | 18:25 |
| lcuk | its built for n810 you numpty | 18:25 |
| lcuk | i use diablo scratchbox :) | 18:25 |
| VDVsx | eheh, you asked for someone with the new device :) | 18:26 |
| lcuk | yeah cos i want to know if it works there | 18:26 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, ask a nokian :) | 18:27 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, you are in the future, lol | 18:31 |
| VDVsx | Nokia-N810-23-14:~# dpkg -i libliqbase1_0.3.23_armel.deb | 18:31 |
| VDVsx | tar: ./md5sums: time stamp 2009-08-14 01:00:02 is 2712288.023010254 s in the future | 18:31 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, humm, the app with the silly name, made my screen flick all over, closed it and now seems fine :) | 18:35 |
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| Jaffa | VDVsx: First start issue apparently. | 18:36 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, Jaffa what is the SCS server in the twitter conf ? | 18:41 |
| Jaffa | Not sre | 18:42 |
| VDVsx | humm ? | 18:42 |
| Jaffa | Not sure | 18:43 |
| VDVsx | :) | 18:43 |
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| VDVsx | don't seems to work, at least nothing shown up in my twitter :( | 18:44 |
| Jaffa | No, me neither. | 18:44 |
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| lcuk | VDVsx, it does work, but its finicky - i havent looked beyond a cursory glance (twitter.com/liqbase) | 18:50 |
| lcuk | the scs server is an ip to send the strokes to, unset - its just a test as i said | 18:51 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, humm ok, but can I tweet from it :P ? | 18:52 |
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| lcuk | i have | 18:52 |
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| lcuk | read from the console and see why it fails | 18:52 |
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| lcuk | or does it just lock | 18:53 |
| VDVsx | let me see | 18:53 |
| lcuk | mmm hang on, maybe yours is still just trying to send to 10.0.0.1 | 18:53 |
| lcuk | not that it matters, its just a quick overview | 18:53 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, http://pastebin.ca/1529597 | 18:56 |
| javispedro | "The client sent Expect: 100-continue but we only allow the 100-continue expectation." looks like a sane curl error to me ;) | 18:58 |
| VDVsx | eheh | 18:58 |
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| Jaffa | I've just come up with a monetization framework and plan for Maemo which'd be simple to implement and give app authors a way of earning some micro-payment income. | 19:04 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, jaffa, duno - but the fact it got a response meant it spoke to the server | 19:04 |
| lcuk | -jaffa | 19:04 |
| javispedro | so it is a server problem :P | 19:05 |
| Jaffa | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=311721#post311721 | 19:05 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I wouldn't want a reminder outside of the program | 19:06 |
| aol | but wouldnt it be logical for nokia to introduce Ovi Store for Maemo? | 19:06 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, are you fooling us, and getting our twitter pwd ? :P | 19:06 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12_N810: You could make the payment system manage/intercept the DBUS startup signals for a paid for app which needs paying for? | 19:07 |
| lcuk | ewwwwww | 19:07 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Jaffa: That sounds fair | 19:07 |
| Jaffa | aol: It could. But we've already got the on-board App Manager (which is finally getting into shape) and a good QA process around Extras dropping into place. | 19:07 |
| lcuk | honour system please - give each app the standard ability to show help page with author information and easy donate button | 19:07 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I was thinking of WGA notifications... | 19:08 |
| * javispedro is already visualizing "moneycollectord" | 19:08 | |
| * Jaffa 's not seen them. | 19:08 | |
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| Jaffa | javispedro: "taxd" ;-) | 19:08 |
| lcuk | i actually think starting "the game" with initial credit of "£10" and let people just give thanks in a tip jar is good | 19:08 |
| lcuk | when they run out, they topup credit | 19:08 |
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| lcuk | if they dont want to give thanks, they dont have to | 19:09 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I was, er, seeing them for a while due to certain circumstances but (oddly :() I'm legal now | 19:09 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Propose it on the thread. I think we may have to contemplate *some* form of monetisation to get the mass develoeprs the iPhone is seeing. | 19:09 |
| lcuk | btw, jaffa, you noticed the nobble in top right of all liqbase screens | 19:09 |
| lcuk | i cant im busy lol | 19:09 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: I have: it pops up a little side menu (where 'help' didn't work ;-0) | 19:09 |
| aol | I don't see ovi store as app manager, but just shop interface that interacts with the actual app manager... just like in symbian | 19:10 |
| lcuk | thats cos i havent wired everything in yet, but thats the framework im moving towards | 19:10 |
| lcuk | cos all liq* things can be integrated into the playground (even this standalone app) | 19:10 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: looks good. | 19:10 |
| lcuk | the game score and credit can be managed easily with a standard interface | 19:10 |
| Jaffa | aol: Is there a series of screenshots/simple doc explaining it/the workflow? | 19:11 |
| Jaffa | From what I've seen of Ovi, the web UI is 'orrid :-( | 19:11 |
| aol | Jaffa: probably one can be found somewhere | 19:11 |
| aol | but I don't know of one | 19:11 |
| aol | well Ovi Store looks crap but it works | 19:11 |
| aol | I mean you can purchase, download and install | 19:11 |
| Jaffa | It may work, but it's not attracted the devs yet has it? | 19:11 |
| VDVsx | I like ovi store :) | 19:11 |
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| Jaffa | Working and attractive aren't the same ;-) | 19:12 |
| aol | Jaffa: why do you say so ? | 19:12 |
| VDVsx | at least in my phone looks good :) | 19:12 |
| Jaffa | Of course, having a legacy platform like Symbian doesn't help | 19:12 |
| aol | Jaffa: not attracting developers? | 19:12 |
| Jaffa | aol: Just what I've heard. Entirely hearsay, of course. | 19:12 |
| aol | I have very very niche app in Ovi Store and so far 85000 downloads | 19:12 |
| aol | I would not write off Ovi Store as being a failure | 19:13 |
| Jaffa | Fair enough. | 19:13 |
| aol | I mean I never could imagine getting 15k downloads / week from my own web site | 19:13 |
| lcuk | how much does app cost tho | 19:13 |
| aol | its free | 19:13 |
| lcuk | how many downloads would you get if it was paid tho | 19:13 |
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| aol | but I mean pizza hut app (Free) was a hit in iTunes App Store and it got like 100k downloads in two weeks | 19:14 |
| Jaffa | We don't need Ovi Store for free stuff: we've got downloads.maemo.org and the App Manager and a push for Extras to have more stuff, be enabled by default and be high quality. | 19:14 |
| aol | I got almost 100k in two months for niche app | 19:14 |
| lcuk | and 85k downloads from a possible userbase in the millions is expected | 19:14 |
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| lcuk | look at omweather - that has over 100k | 19:14 |
| lcuk | on a smaller system | 19:14 |
| aol | so ? | 19:14 |
| lcuk | so numbers arent really useful without context | 19:14 |
| Jaffa | The question is, if we need a monetisation framework, is Ovi "it" or is there something a bit more "Maemo" possible, leveraging what we've already got. | 19:15 |
| aol | well I mean I got 100k downloads in two years before ovi store. Now with ovi store I got 100k MORE within 2 months | 19:15 |
| aol | is it useful - YES IT IS | 19:15 |
| Jaffa | aol: Right, but that's an argument for a centralised application delivery system. Which Maemo already has. | 19:15 |
| aol | also Ovi Store downloads mainly come from phones that ship with ovi store pre-installed | 19:15 |
| aol | 40% of downloads come from N97 which is not selling very well | 19:16 |
| VDVsx | Jaffa, downloads.maemo counts the updates, so if you have a user base of 5k and you deliver a lot of updates is easy to reach a big number | 19:16 |
| Jaffa | VDVsx: I think you want s/Jaffa/lcuk/ | 19:16 |
| aol | Jaffa: well, yes, but you just argued Ovi Store does not attract developers | 19:16 |
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| Jaffa | OK, I did. And you've corrected me. Thanks. | 19:17 |
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| VDVsx | yup, sorry Jaffa :) | 19:17 |
| aol | anyway back to the point, I would give Ovi Store coming to Maemo phones 95% probability | 19:18 |
| javispedro | I have to agree with aol. | 19:18 |
| aol | it is a big part of nokia brand | 19:18 |
| VDVsx | same bet here :) | 19:18 |
| javispedro | it's unfortunately even a better known brand that "Maemo" itself. | 19:18 |
| aol | I appreciate the fact you guys are planning something similar to the app manager, and it might be a very good alternative who just want donationware etc | 19:19 |
| javispedro | at least for now, and since I don't know Nokia's plans for the future I have to guess it will remain so for the foreseable future. | 19:19 |
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| * Jaffa wouldn't bet against Ovi coming to Maemo either. But that doesn't mean it'll help ;-) | 19:21 | |
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| * javispedro is already deleting the whole git repo | 19:22 | |
| javispedro | the problem with having a windows upstream is CRLF. | 19:22 |
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| Khertan_n810 | Hello All ! | 20:06 |
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| woglinde | hi khertan | 20:07 |
| Khertan_n810 | hi woglinde | 20:07 |
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| Khertan_n810 | Am i the only one to found the interface of Fremantle with the existing theme in the sdk ugly ? | 20:10 |
| woglinde | I never looked at fremantle yet | 20:11 |
| Khertan_n810 | maybe it s better to wait :) | 20:11 |
| Khertan_n810 | i ven t look at the sdk too, but i ve take a look at the many screenshots available ... | 20:12 |
| VDVsx | Khertan_n810, it's a dev theme, so must be ugly :P | 20:12 |
| Khertan_n810 | vdvsx : i hope | 20:13 |
| Khertan_n810 | and i hope the RX-51 screen will not be to small too :) | 20:14 |
| Jaffa | Khertan_n810: I'm aware of one screenshot from the running device, but I imagine Quim may have shifted back to a publicly acceptable theme, or the final theme is not yet deployed: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=30493 | 20:14 |
| javispedro | with the enlarged font size, I guess it's going to be small. or at least, smaller. | 20:14 |
| Khertan_n810 | for me the actual one has a perfect size | 20:14 |
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| Khertan_n810 | we see so few things from this screenshots of the theme :( | 20:19 |
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| lcuk | which screenie are we discussin | 20:19 |
| lcuk | hi Khertan_n810 \o | 20:19 |
| Khertan_n810 | hi lcuk | 20:19 |
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| Khertan_n810 | the one given by qgil in the post pointed by Jaffa | 20:20 |
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| * Khertan_n810 is trying to install edge (the palm game) in the garnet vm ... | 20:21 | |
| javispedro | ah, the good side of palmos diying is that some games are now free | 20:21 |
| Khertan_n810 | lol | 20:22 |
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| Khertan_n810 | this one isn t free yet :) | 20:22 |
| Khertan_n810 | but i ve a licence for it | 20:22 |
| Khertan_n810 | :) | 20:22 |
| zerojayPC | I haven't really seen enough of the UI to really comment. I do like the black... I just hope that more apps will be aware of theme colors this time around so that you don't get spots where important stuff is unreadable. | 20:24 |
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| zerojayPC | Was there a lot of good games for palmos? Never really got into that area at all. | 20:31 |
| zerojayPC | Were there... | 20:31 |
| javispedro | palmos used to win in the "number of apps" competitions we do today | 20:32 |
| javispedro | by a margin. | 20:32 |
| javispedro | (that's the reason today I know that metric is nearly useless ;) ) | 20:33 |
| zerojayPC | I remember playing a few Gameboy RPGs through an emulator on my old Handspring. | 20:34 |
| javispedro | so yes, there were a few games. e.g. Tradewinds | 20:34 |
| javispedro | zerojay, Liberty. | 20:35 |
| zerojayPC | Handspring was Palmos, right? | 20:35 |
| javispedro | yep. | 20:35 |
| zerojayPC | I didn't play with it much. I got it as a gift from my mother-in-law who was working at a Handspring repair facility. | 20:36 |
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| zerojayPC | I thought it was a pretty cool gift... until I noticed the box had an RMA number written across the top of it. | 20:36 |
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| javispedro | :) | 20:37 |
| zerojayPC | So, about a week later, Mr. Joel Freemont living in St. Louis got a package back with his Handspring. | 20:37 |
| zerojayPC | She simply stole it. | 20:38 |
| zerojayPC | I turned it on... found all his data on it, shipped it to him with an explanation. | 20:38 |
| javispedro | i still remember their rma guidelines. Remove the battery cover if you can. If you ship anything removable you're no going to see it again. | 20:38 |
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| zerojayPC | She got fired... thankfully. | 20:39 |
| javispedro | (stylus, hard covers, battery covers... everything would end up in ebay) | 20:39 |
| zerojayPC | Yeah, it's true. | 20:39 |
| javispedro | the other day I saw some of the Pre source code. They're still using the same coding style they used back in the Pilot days :P | 20:40 |
| javispedro | StructTypeNames like this, kConstantNames, UInt32, Bool. | 20:40 |
| zerojayPC | Oh yeah, they did just release the source, didn't they? | 20:40 |
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| johnsq | Hi | 20:41 |
| zerojayPC | Hi. | 20:41 |
| javispedro | yep, they released the source, most of them are just patches to upstream | 20:41 |
| javispedro | but there are some "wrappers" around some of their palmone libraries | 20:41 |
| javispedro | (instantly recognizable by the Pm prefix) | 20:42 |
| javispedro | like a gstreamer element wrapper around the Palm Media library | 20:42 |
| javispedro | it's fun to see them keeping the same coding style; since I basically learned C coding PalmOS it is my favourite coding style too :D | 20:43 |
| javispedro | *coding _for_ PalmOS :P | 20:44 |
| zerojayPC | Heh.. I remember cutting my teeth on the Mac toolbox years ago. My mom paid something like $500 for a copy of Think C, Symantec's dev environment. I must have been 13 or 14. | 20:45 |
| zerojayPC | Back in ye days of System 7. | 20:45 |
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| johnsq | And there was already gcc | 20:49 |
| zerojayPC | Which I had no idea about at the time. | 20:49 |
| zerojayPC | Can't imagine paying that much for an IDE these days. | 20:49 |
| woglinde | hi javis | 20:50 |
| woglinde | hi zerojay | 20:50 |
| zerojayPC | Hey. | 20:50 |
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| javispedro | hi :) | 20:53 |
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| javispedro | I just crashed sb's version of gnu make. with a Makefile mixing CRLF & LF terminators | 20:53 |
| woglinde | evil evil javis | 20:54 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, :O you cruel git | 20:57 |
| javispedro | git is the cause of all this. with his hatred of CRLF terminators. | 20:58 |
| lcuk | hah | 20:59 |
| johnsq | javispedro: let some one work with macs, than you get even more mixed | 20:59 |
| johnsq | two evil companies meet the standard | 20:59 |
| javispedro | heh, today's the application request day :) | 21:01 |
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| javispedro | qgil wants an ocarina app ;) http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=311734&postcount=11 | 21:01 |
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| javispedro | what a weird request considering the iphone ocarina app uses multitouch. | 21:03 |
| VDVsx | eheh | 21:03 |
| wiretapped | hopefully qgil is hinting we're getting multitouch, and didn't just miss that detail of the ocarina app | 21:04 |
| VDVsx | let me see what I want :P | 21:04 |
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| javispedro | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhCJq7EAJJA&fmt=18 | 21:04 |
| javispedro | ^^^ ocarina app in action | 21:04 |
| wiretapped | has there been any mention of developer discounts for the next device? | 21:04 |
| johnsq | wiretapped: you can use the camera to get the finger position | 21:04 |
| wiretapped | johnsq: interesting idea | 21:05 |
| VDVsx | why not: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXcqbAedxfs | 21:06 |
| VDVsx | only requires a accelerometer :P | 21:06 |
| javispedro | ah yes, that's what the other 30,000 iphone applications are about :P | 21:07 |
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| Stskeeps | javispedro: two-touch is technically some degree of multitouch ;p | 21:09 |
| javispedro | yep, was thinking that | 21:09 |
| javispedro | but that app requires true multitouch | 21:09 |
| javispedro | to distinguish between 3 presses and 1 | 21:09 |
| javispedro | we could "3 holes only" ocarina app and say we got 75% of the app ;P | 21:12 |
| javispedro | qgil mentioning the ocarina app again: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=311751&postcount=22 | 21:13 |
| javispedro | maybe wiretapped is true and his proto device is multitouch :P | 21:14 |
| javispedro | s/true/right/ | 21:14 |
| infobot | javispedro meant: maybe wiretapped is right and his proto device is multitouch :P | 21:14 |
| javispedro | s/his/qgil's/ | 21:14 |
| infobot | javispedro meant: maybe wiretapped is true and qgil's proto device is multitouch :P | 21:14 |
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| johnsq | slonopotamus: lua didn't build with gentoo on n810 -ldl is missing. | 21:17 |
| VDVsx | javispedro, probably Quim didn't realized yet that multitouch is needed for Ocarina :P | 21:17 |
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| javispedro | or he has solved the geometrical problem of arranging the 4 holes so that no 2 combination of finger presses have the same center point. | 21:18 |
| VDVsx | lol | 21:19 |
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| Luke-Jr | johnsq: why? | 21:20 |
| johnsq | Luke-Jr: i tried to build and got missing dlopen .. | 21:21 |
| Luke-Jr | … | 21:21 |
| Luke-Jr | ls -lh /usr/lib/libdl.so | 21:22 |
| johnsq | Luke-Jr: its there lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 20 Aug 9 12:16 /usr/lib/libdl.so -> ../../lib/libdl.so.2 | 21:22 |
| johnsq | Luke-Jr: bug is somewhere in the build system, i added | 21:22 |
| johnsq | Luke-Jr: mylibs="-ldl" in /usr/portage/dev-lang/lua/lua-5.1.4-r2.ebuild, but don't know if it is a bug somewhere in libtool or other autoconf | 21:23 |
| Luke-Jr | I'd report a generic Gentoo ARM bug | 21:24 |
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| johnsq | Luke-Jr: I know too less of the gentoo build system to track it down. | 21:25 |
| Luke-Jr | johnsq: it's just a BASH script | 21:25 |
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| johnsq | Luke-Jr: right, but no "bock" to trace it. just fixed the quick and dirty way. | 21:26 |
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| Luke-Jr | … | 21:31 |
| Luke-Jr | johnsq: Ctrl-Z emerge, cd /var/tmp/portage/…/work/… | 21:31 |
| Luke-Jr | make it work, fg | 21:31 |
| johnsq | Luke-Jr: I edited .ebuild and ebuild digest and ready | 21:32 |
| Luke-Jr | lulz | 21:32 |
| Luke-Jr | report a Gentoo ARM bug -.- | 21:32 |
| johnsq | Luke-Jr: good I have no gentoo account, to report bugs | 21:33 |
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| Luke-Jr | so get one | 21:36 |
| Luke-Jr | -.- | 21:36 |
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| slonopotamus | <.< | 21:37 |
| johnsq | enough todo, to fix my own bugs | 21:39 |
| Luke-Jr | johnsq: I said report, not fix. | 21:41 |
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| johnsq | Luke-Jr: I know, but also reporting needs some time. | 21:44 |
| florian | re | 21:45 |
| Luke-Jr | it's a florian! | 21:47 |
| Luke-Jr | wandering outside of OpenWrt | 21:48 |
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| florian | Luke-Jr: hehe... no, that's [florian] :-) | 21:49 |
| Luke-Jr | O.o | 21:49 |
| Luke-Jr | there's a difference? | 21:49 |
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| florian | Luke-Jr: yep | 21:52 |
| Luke-Jr | is Florian an actual name in some country? O.o | 21:53 |
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| slonopotamus | ... | 21:54 |
| slonopotamus | Luke-Jr, nicknames aren't expected to be actual names | 21:54 |
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| Luke-Jr | slonopotamus: I'm aware. ☺ | 21:55 |
| slonopotamus | oh | 21:56 |
| slonopotamus | Luke-Jr, bme!!! | 21:56 |
| Luke-Jr | bme | 21:56 |
| slonopotamus | not 'bme' but 'bme!!!' | 21:57 |
| Luke-Jr | BEEP ME!!! | 21:57 |
| Luke-Jr | <.< | 21:57 |
| florian | Luke-Jr: Yes there are quite a few here... not really many but its not uncommon. | 21:58 |
| slonopotamus | ~beep Luke-Jr | 22:01 |
| zerojayPC | By the way, good luck getting a bug fixed in Gentoo. I don't know what the hell they're doing over there. The entire project's been falling apart the last two years. | 22:01 |
| * infobot informs Luke-Jr that the beeper is no longer in service | 22:01 | |
| Luke-Jr | zerojayPC: two? try 5 | 22:01 |
| zerojayPC | Well, I didn't really notice anything too bad going on until about two years ago, with all the flames on planet. | 22:02 |
| Luke-Jr | lol | 22:02 |
| zerojayPC | And it's because of that shit going on that I just dumped Gentoo a few months ago after... maybe 5 or 6 years. | 22:03 |
| Luke-Jr | zerojayPC: I used to be a developer, so it was a bit more noticable. | 22:03 |
| zerojayPC | Yeah, I bet it would be. | 22:03 |
| Luke-Jr | I'd dump Gentoo, if there was anything better | 22:03 |
| zerojayPC | I was pretty much just a user there so I wasn't privy. | 22:03 |
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| zerojayPC | I switched to ArchLinux and I'm happy with it. A lot more than I thought I would have been. | 22:04 |
| zerojayPC | I tried a ton of distros before and always went back to Gentoo after a week or so. | 22:04 |
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| Luke-Jr | zerojayPC: my long term plan is to replace Gentoo with something more flexible | 22:06 |
| Luke-Jr | I doubt Arch is flexible? | 22:06 |
| Luke-Jr | IIRC it's binary | 22:06 |
| johnsq | i tried it and got nothing configured :( | 22:06 |
| zerojayPC | Depends on what "flexible" means to you. | 22:08 |
| zerojayPC | It's a mix of binary and source. | 22:08 |
| zerojayPC | All the main stuff in the distro is binary and there's a secondary user submitted archive with something along the lines of ebuilds. | 22:08 |
| zerojayPC | Don't go installing Arch with the mindset of emerge --newuse world, in other words. ;) | 22:09 |
| zerojayPC | What kind of flexibility are you looking for? | 22:09 |
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| slonopotamus_ | even more flexible than gentoo? | 22:10 |
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| Luke-Jr | zerojayPC: USE flags | 22:11 |
| zerojayPC | Well look... that's kind of unfair to expect that out of a mostly binary distro. | 22:11 |
| Luke-Jr | zerojayPC: hence why I won't switch | 22:11 |
| Luke-Jr | ☺ | 22:11 |
| zerojayPC | USE flags were nice... | 22:11 |
| zerojayPC | Until everything was getting broken left, right and center. | 22:11 |
| johnsq | zerojayPC: they can build apps in all possible configurations. | 22:11 |
| zerojayPC | I used to see the point of bothering with USE flags and CFLAGS...but these days.. not really. | 22:12 |
| zerojayPC | A few extra packages installed... maybe 800k each... meh. | 22:12 |
| zerojayPC | The only real downside is security, especially if you don't want those libraries installed or they're problematic. | 22:13 |
| johnsq | and buy every 6 month a new computer | 22:13 |
| zerojayPC | johnsq: Bull. I'm on the same one for the past 5 years. | 22:13 |
| zerojayPC | And let me tell ya... compiling KDE on it was hell. lol | 22:13 |
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| zerojayPC | 40+ hours. | 22:16 |
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| esaym153 | meh, I stick with debian testing unstable | 22:20 |
| zerojayPC | Egad. | 22:20 |
| johnsq | zerojayPC: I don't like to have things installed, i never use. like gvim. | 22:21 |
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| * mgedmin wants to quote that selectively as "I [...] like [...] gvim." | 22:27 | |
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| zerojayPC | johnsq: In general, I don't either. | 22:30 |
| zerojayPC | But it wouldn't be installed unless there's a dependency upon it anyways... so...? | 22:30 |
| * rkirti <3 gvim. Life without it would be terrible | 22:31 | |
| zerojayPC | Unless your distro of choice decides to package up all of GNOME or KDE in one monolithic package. | 22:31 |
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| zerojayPC | And whenever they do, they add too much crap to it. | 22:34 |
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| * lcuk is churning through bugs tonight | 23:00 | |
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| * zerojayPC sigh | 23:08 | |
| zerojayPC | I gotta file a few bugs myself... just not really feeling it right now with this terrible head cold. | 23:08 |
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| lcuk | zerojayPC, swine flu? | 23:11 |
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| * zerojayPC oink. | 23:11 | |
| lcuk | /quarantine zerojayPC anyway | 23:11 |
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| lbt | irc stag party in #mer | 23:30 |
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| lbt | Jaffa: attitude .... Build-Depends: gnupg it needs debhelper too | 23:44 |
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| javispedro | are you sure about Build-Depends gnupg? | 23:46 |
| javispedro | nearly every package says so, but that's AFAIK because it tries to sign it | 23:46 |
| javispedro | it should be preinstalled as much as "dpkg" is. | 23:46 |
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| VDVsx | lcuk, my region (Algarve) just entered in a pre-epidemic state with swine flu, I'm a luck guy ;) | 23:51 |
| lcuk | /quarantine VDVsx | 23:51 |
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