IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2009-08-11

MaceN810	haha	00:00
MaceN810	there isnt a reset loop	00:00
MaceN810	yet?	00:00
Woolly	woglinde: you're a genius haha	00:00
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woglinde	Woolly nope I know the ceavats of sb	00:02
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MaceN810	grep works	00:07
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MaceN810	heh	00:07
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MaceN810	im on diffutils now	00:09
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Luke-Jr	MaceN810: you forgot Gentoo	00:15
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MaceN810	luke huh?	00:24
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MaceN810	i dont want gentoo	00:24
MaceN810	i want stock maemo with the ability to builc src and make deb pkgs	00:25
MaceN810	diffutils works ;)	00:25
RST38h	fries with that? =)	00:25
MaceN810	next...	00:25
MaceN810	rst, almost there	00:25
MaceN810	hehe	00:25
RST38h	heh	00:25
MaceN810	just testing with abiword for now	00:26
MaceN810	anything it fails to configure .. i build on the tablet	00:26
MaceN810	and install	00:26
MaceN810	or replace its bin	00:26
MaceN810	with a new one	00:26
MaceN810	so far so good	00:26
MaceN810	;)	00:26
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MaceN810	i dont see a need for gentoo	00:27
MaceN810	when you already have a debian base system	00:28
MaceN810	with the hardware working :)	00:28
johnsq	MaceN810: I have had debian before gentoo, i will never back.	00:29
Luke-Jr	MaceN810: stock maemo is not maintained by anyone	00:31
johnsq	MaceN810: but I'm developer, i can use the sources.	00:31
MaceN810	luke, doesnt need to be	00:32
MaceN810	the apps do	00:33
MaceN810	linux is only a kernel	00:33
MaceN810	if everything works	00:33
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MaceN810	there is no need for a new one	00:33
Luke-Jr	MaceN810: fail. Maemo is the OS-- not just the kernel, but the apps	00:33
RST38h	that is what linuxoids always claim once somebody starts complaining about userland	00:33
MaceN810	haha	00:33
MaceN810	luke, if you can build from src	00:34
MaceN810	then you can just update apps from src	00:34
johnsq	RST38h: yeah, but less people are working on apps, all are only packing and adapting.	00:34
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RST38h	adapting what? =)	00:34
MaceN810	john, because the apps work	00:34
MaceN810	heh	00:34
johnsq	RST38h: hildonizing	00:35
MaceN810	either way. i would rather work with maemo4	00:35
RST38h	ah, you mean maemo	00:35
MaceN810	i like sound	00:35
MaceN810	and the gpa	00:35
MaceN810	gps	00:35
MaceN810	and adhoc networking	00:35
MaceN810	to tether to my phone	00:36
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MaceN810	if the hardware works i think it is best to build on that	00:36
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Stskeeps	MaceN810: you really have no idea about the complexity of some of this stuff..	00:36
MaceN810	heh.. no i guess not	00:37
MaceN810	;)	00:37
MaceN810	im oversimplifying arent i?	00:37
Stskeeps	yes, you are	00:37
woglinde	lalalalaa	00:37
RST38h	btw, gps or no gps on n900?	00:40
Stskeeps	RST38h: liblocation-dev..	00:40
Stskeeps	would be insane not to have it	00:40
RST38h	hehe	00:40
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RST38h	you never know, Mako has no Wifi for example	00:40
Stskeeps	GPS as an example - on a N8x0, there's gpsdriver, a binary blob, which translates between the chipset and typical NMEA. this is in turn connected to gps. now, most maemo apps use a helper library called libgpsmgr, and libgpsbt. those are fairly simple libraries but they do stuff like turn on gpsd, handy helper functions, or setting up connections to bluetooth GPSes.	00:40
Stskeeps	-> MaceN810	00:41
Stskeeps	s/gps/gpsd	00:41
Stskeeps	those two helper libraries are also closed source which doesn't make it hell lot easier to get some sane usage of GPS out:)	00:41
MaceN810	heh	00:42
Stskeeps	along with this there's a wide range of pipelines between these things that has to be implemented	00:42
alterego	liblocation looks good.	00:42
Stskeeps	alterego: rather simplistic really.. i think they're lacking location modelling	00:42
MaceN810	sts, which are part of the 20%?	00:42
alterego	Only a first go :)	00:42
lcuk2	Stskeeps, you could just as well be talking about the move to qt lol	00:42
alterego	Submit a bu report/feature enhancement request :P	00:42
MaceN810	lcuk haha	00:43
Stskeeps	MaceN810: anyway, what it does take is someone in community to pick up the torch cos noone else is going to do it for you otherwise :P	00:43
lcuk2	MaceN810, i wish i was joking :)	00:43
Stskeeps	MaceN810: i can't personally touch liblocation, libgps and such for a while due to my previous work.	00:43
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lcuk2	but think of the ladies who will swoon around such a rockstar dev who reigns in gps	00:44
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Stskeeps	(i can actually easily reimplement liblocation, it's fairly easy.)	00:44
MaceN810	HAHAHA	00:44
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alterego	Previous work for a gps manufacturer? :)	00:45
lcuk2	lo lbt	00:45
lcuk2	professional stalker	00:45
Stskeeps	alterego: nah, research work, part uni part commercial company	00:45
Stskeeps	if i went ahead for a little while and did something like liblocation my uni could claim rights :)	00:45
lcuk2	technically they couldnt	00:46
lcuk2	if however you took the code you wrote whilst there they could	00:46
Stskeeps	lcuk2: danish law is a bit awkward in this manner	00:46
Stskeeps	lcuk2: and code in liblocation would be very similar as there's really only one way to do it :P	00:46
lcuk2	viva poland ftw :D	00:46
qwerty12_N810	Now we really know the reason for your move to Poland!	00:46
Stskeeps	exactly ;)	00:46
lcuk2	nahhh	00:47
lcuk2	theres many ways to get a list of cities	00:47
lcuk2	and show them on a map	00:47
lcuk2	and have a little database to read from	00:47
Stskeeps	that's libcityinfo :P	00:47
lcuk2	would make a great student project	00:47
lcuk2	damn	00:47
lcuk2	which is location then	00:47
Stskeeps	GPS, gsm cell id, etc..	00:48
lcuk2	fuck that then, thats hard	00:48
lcuk2	really would take a rockstar dev lol	00:48
Stskeeps	not really	00:48
javispedro	a only-GPS stub would do the job for now	00:48
lcuk2	gfi	00:48
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Stskeeps	lcuk2: most of the stuff is hooking into gpsd and just spitting out whatever it sends :P	00:50
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Stskeeps	and turn on GPS + driver	00:51
lcuk2	just a simple protocol then	00:51
lcuk2	streams of numbers	00:51
lcuk2	and a bit of post processing	00:51
lcuk2	or muchly?	00:51
Stskeeps	really no postprocessing	00:51
lcuk2	ive just been mucking about with the accelerometer on my x41	00:51
lcuk2	and that has similar	00:52
lcuk2	just a stream of data :)	00:52
lcuk2	its lovely	00:52
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Stskeeps	anyway i'm off to bed :P	00:52
* lcuk2 goes back to the batcave		00:54
Woolly	has anyone done swig stuff afore?	00:56
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alterego	I looked at it, it looks rubbish :P	00:58
Woolly	haha	00:58
alterego	At least for what I Wanted to do.	00:58
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lcuk2	qwerty12_N810, did you once say that the osso registration and service aspect can be defined within the .sh file i use to run	01:00
lcuk2	im not changing it now	01:00
lcuk2	but if it can i will make a note for later	01:00
alterego	I think there's some environment variables.	01:01
qwerty12_N810	No, I said that hildon-desktop won't kill a program ran from a script if you use X-Osso-Service and don't osso_initalize	01:01
alterego	Oh, I was thinking of something else ..	01:01
lcuk2	ahh, thats cool then. ill note that part. ta dude	01:01
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inz	qwerty, does it kil the script?	01:05
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inz	qwerty, (i thought it was dbus-daemon that did the killing)	01:06
qwerty12_N810	I'd assume not otherwise the application you were running would also be killed :)	01:06
qwerty12_N810	inz: probably right :)	01:06
MaceN810	configure: error: `png.h' not found, install libpng or specify CPPFLAGS to include custom locations	01:10
MaceN810	hm	01:10
MaceN810	is there a libpng pkg somewhere?	01:10
lcuk2	libpng12-dev	01:10
* lcuk2 just installed it earlier		01:10
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Woolly	me too	01:10
MaceN810	awesome	01:10
MaceN810	tnx	01:10
Woolly	:)	01:11
MaceN810	lcuk and woolly.. trying to native build and pkg in maemo too or something?	01:12
lcuk2	MaceN810,	01:12
MaceN810	heh	01:12
lcuk2	apt-cache search [key]	01:12
lcuk2	MaceN810, i have been native for ages	01:12
lcuk2	well before the last summit	01:12
Woolly	MaceN810: Nah, I'm reading from the framebuffer	01:12
lcuk2	i just reinstalled it cos i reflashed	01:12
MaceN810	really?	01:13
MaceN810	you are building and pkging on the tablet	01:13
lcuk2	no	01:13
MaceN810	er... were?	01:13
MaceN810	oh	01:13
lcuk2	i build on tablet	01:13
lcuk2	and test and run	01:13
lcuk2	and work on it	01:13
lcuk2	and save it to git	01:13
MaceN810	i see	01:13
lcuk2	and load scratchbox to make packages	01:13
lcuk2	which is why ive only ever made 2 packages lol	01:14
MaceN810	haha	01:14
MaceN810	well. im trying to make the pkgs	01:14
lcuk2	yeah	01:14
MaceN810	on the n810	01:14
lcuk2	i tried that too	01:14
lcuk2	good luck	01:14
lcuk2	its possible	01:14
MaceN810	hahaha	01:14
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lcuk2	but reproducability is what matters	01:14
MaceN810	gee thanks	01:14
Woolly	can I compile something including Python.h in SB? I've tried adding -I/usr/lib/python2.5 to my gcc line, but it doesn't seem to be working	01:14
lcuk2	i can now have my sdk up and running and me coding within 30 mins of choosing to reflash	01:15
MaceN810	you and sts are such downers	01:15
lcuk2	the only thing i cannot do is package	01:15
MaceN810	heh	01:15
lcuk2	i am happy with that compromise	01:15
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MaceN810	well. find out how to do it	01:15
lcuk2	it wont fit in a simple method	01:15
lcuk2	i can just apt-get install build-essential	01:15
MaceN810	pkging sounds like something that shouldnt be hard	01:15
lcuk2	vs what you are struggling with	01:15
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lcuk2	technically no	01:16
lcuk2	but mentally, yeah	01:16
MaceN810	i mean, compressing built bins?	01:16
lcuk2	choosing where to put them	01:16
MaceN810	and using dpkg on it	01:16
lcuk2	managing versions	01:16
MaceN810	ah	01:16
lcuk2	making sure you get the deps	01:16
MaceN810	didnt think about that	01:16
MaceN810	need to make my own repo	01:16
MaceN810	;)	01:17
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lcuk2	i managed to kill 3 installs tryign what you are doing	01:17
lcuk2	and even when it was done the packages still failed	01:17
MaceN810	lcuk heh	01:17
MaceN810	well. i backup to flash	01:17
MaceN810	at every step	01:17
lcuk2	when you make these new packaging tools	01:17
lcuk2	to make it reproducable	01:18
lcuk2	package them up	01:18
MaceN810	easiest way to snapshot	01:18
lcuk2	and push it to extras devel	01:18
lcuk2	macer-dpkgontablet	01:18
lcuk2	so others can use it	01:18
MaceN810	naw... i was going tgo call it merlin	01:18
MaceN810	just to piss off sts	01:18
MaceN810	;)	01:18
lcuk2	call it something sensible so hackers will find it	01:18
MaceN810	haha	01:19
MaceN810	i will, was joking	01:19
MaceN810	have to get it working first	01:19
lcuk2	cool	01:19
MaceN810	still working on deps	01:19
MaceN810	deps are a bitch	01:19
MaceN810	bbl	01:19
Woolly	lardman\|gone: ping	01:20
MaceN810	all this	01:20
MaceN810	just because i want an abiword with cups support	01:21
MaceN810	haha	01:21
Woolly	I swear every time i compile this thing, i get a different error appearing	01:21
MaceN810	lol	01:21
MaceN810	me too	01:21
MaceN810	checking jpeglib.h usability... no	01:22
lbt	hey lcuk2	01:22
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lcuk2	hi n bye david, im being drawn into code	01:23
lbt	np	01:23
lbt	have fn	01:23
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MaceN810	configure: error: The pkg-config script could not be found or is too old. Make sure it	01:27
MaceN810	weeeeeeeee!!!!	01:27
MaceN810	dear lord	01:28
woglinde	good nite	01:28
MaceN810	i am going to have to like	01:28
MaceN810	write stuff down	01:28
MaceN810	before i lose track of what im doing haha	01:28
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javispedro	why not a chroot? currently I run a lenny chroot on the tablet for when I feel that murderous need to build things on the tablet	01:35
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javispedro	works pretty well, only problem is that binaries built there may or may not work on Maemo due to binary compatibilities, but that could be fixed by using the SDK rootstrap instead of lenny	01:37
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MaceN810	javispedro, becaus the goal is to avoid a chroot	01:37
MaceN810	avoid a chroot, not use scratchbox, have a complete development enviroment on the tablet itself with the ability to build and package from src off the repos	01:38
MaceN810	if there is a binary incompatibility then i suppose i will just build a replacement bin and figure out how to pkg it where it will replace the stock bin	01:39
javispedro	well... I always dislike merging dev environment with deploying environment.	01:39
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MaceN810	javispedro, yeah i can see how that might not be cool. but it is somthing i would like to do	01:40
alterego	Why do you need to build anything on the device.	01:40
javispedro	go ahead then :) you know "because I can" is a good reason for me	01:40
MaceN810	plus. you can always just partition the external sd and clone to test	01:40
alterego	remote log ins are where it's at :)	01:40
MaceN810	javispedro, haha	01:40
MaceN810	well. not just because i can	01:40
MaceN810	but i want to use the tablet as a full fledged computer	01:40
MaceN810	if i can do it in debian i should be able to do it in maemo	01:41
alterego	Why?	01:41
alterego	Don't you have a proper machine?	01:41
MaceN810	alterego, sure but you cant fit a proper machine in your pocket	01:41
MaceN810	plus it would just be nice to not have to rely on another machine	01:41
alterego	Hence, remote connections :P	01:41
MaceN810	alterego, heh. and for the person who doesnt´have a proper machine?	01:42
MaceN810	;)	01:42
alterego	Well, obviously they don't need a computer :P	01:42
MaceN810	well.. doing it this way	01:42
MaceN810	then they wont ;)	01:42
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alterego	really ...	01:43
javispedro	a chroot will serve you... it's not any slower fwiw	01:43
javispedro	it just uses double the space	01:43
MaceN810	javispedro, yeah. you have to copy libs and create a whole seperate enviroment	01:43
MaceN810	when i use linux on x86	01:44
MaceN810	that isnt necessary	01:44
MaceN810	i just build and pkg	01:44
MaceN810	why cant the tablet be the same way?	01:44
MaceN810	the only answer i can think of is... because someone just hasnt´done it yet heh	01:44
MaceN810	or like most people here .. dont´see the need	01:44
alterego	It's not so much need, it's "don't see the use".	01:45
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MaceN810	alterego, to treat the table like an all out computer while still being able to use maemo and have all the hardware working	01:45
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johnsq	alterego: have you worked with crosscompiler and configure?	01:46
MaceN810	the use is simply use the tablet..like i would a debian install on an x86	01:46
MaceN810	where id ont´have to jump through hoops and install cross compilers.. i simply use it	01:46
MaceN810	if i want something built.. i just hop on it and just build it ..if i want to pkg it.. i shouldnt have to move everything somewhere else just to tar something up and run dpkg on it	01:47
alterego	johnsq: I have.	01:47
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johnsq	alterego: then you should see, why to compile on the target machine.	01:48
* javispedro has fallen in love with sb1, but seems nobody else has. better for him.		01:48
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MaceN810	but i need to stop trying for the moment	01:48
MaceN810	and blog what ive done so far so i dont´fall too far from the tree	01:48
alterego	Not withstanding very simple programs, I can't see the need to develop anything serious on an embedded device.	01:49
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alterego	Let alone build and package it.	01:49
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MaceN810	alterego, because you would rahter use a cross compiler and i woudl not .. just a difference of opinion	01:49
alterego	Just seems a bit silly.	01:49
javispedro	alterego, I know one person who developed _very big_ programs in his Palm handheld. Using OnBoardC, which is AFAIK a C compiler written from scratch	01:49
alterego	Yes, because it's a lot quicker.	01:50
MaceN810	if my proper machine broke? then what?	01:50
MaceN810	;)	01:50
alterego	Get a new machine :P	01:50
MaceN810	or if i lost the net connection?	01:50
alterego	Have a cup of tea and wait for it to come back :P	01:50
MaceN810	or if lioghtning hit my house and set it ablaze .. server and all?	01:50
MaceN810	heh	01:50
alterego	Then you've not got a decent off site backup strategy :P	01:50
MaceN810	the tablet should be independent of requiring anything	01:50
alterego	Hah,	01:51
alterego	Why?	01:51
javispedro	or if a meteorite hit the moon and made it fall to earth, making a bad movie plot in the process?	01:51
MaceN810	javispedro, exactly	01:51
alterego	The point of the tablet is to be an always connected device.	01:51
alterego	You should be coming up with better ways of making that a reality, rather than coming up with ways of segmenting it from it's nature :P	01:52
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MaceN810	haha	01:52
MaceN810	well.. to each their own ;)	01:52
MaceN810	i want my tablet to be independent	01:53
MaceN810	and act like a computer.. not just a gadget	01:53
* javispedro is trying to isolate which optimization is making super mario kart computer players suicidal.		01:53
alterego	It does act like a computer.	01:53
MaceN810	and a requirement is that all the hardware works	01:53
alterego	The hardware does work.	01:53
MaceN810	alterego, it acts like a psuedo computer	01:53
alterego	It's the software that's the problem :P	01:53
MaceN810	and the hardware works in maemo	01:53
MaceN810	heh	01:53
MaceN810	like i said	01:54
MaceN810	on my debian x86 box	01:54
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MaceN810	if i want to build and package something for x86 i just do it	01:54
alterego	So, your basic requirement is to have build-essential on the tablet?	01:54
alterego	Is that what you want?	01:54
MaceN810	build-essential on a tablet and dpkg working in maemo without a chroot	01:54
MaceN810	i want my tablet to work like i am on an x86 using hildon as a wm	01:55
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MaceN810	where i dont´have to do anything special just to build and pkg stuff	01:55
alterego	Well, you could make your own rootfs.	01:55
MaceN810	or require another computer to get this done	01:55
alterego	but the device is really under powered for compilation tasks.	01:56
MaceN810	alterego, 400Mhz isnt that bad for the types of apps you would put on it	01:56
lcuk2	MaceN810, switch cpu to performance mode	01:56
MaceN810	what is the largest app for maemo ?	01:56
johnsq	alterego: lol, just some years ago pc arn't faster	01:56
MaceN810	lcuk2, hit the turbo button? ;)	01:56
lcuk2	with the compiler, the processes technically start and finish before things have time to be boosted etc	01:57
javispedro	MaceN810, a wild guess: the browser engine	01:57
lcuk2	it takes quite a bit longer in ondemand	01:57
lcuk2	theres a defined noticable difference in build speed	01:57
alterego	Ooo, try compiling glibc on the device.	01:57
javispedro	alterego, true	01:57
MaceN810	alterego, i compiled glibc on my pentium 200	01:57
johnsq	alterego: only some hours, gcc and mozilla are bigger problems.	01:57
lcuk2	echo performance >/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor	01:58
MaceN810	iĺl just go to sleep	01:58
MaceN810	hhe	01:58
lcuk2	or	01:58
lcuk2	echo ondemand >/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor	01:58
lcuk2	to reset	01:58
javispedro	hmm..... building glibc took way, way, way more time than building the browser-engine on my pc	01:58
javispedro	(though probably because sb built it 3 o 4 times in a row)	01:58
MaceN810	javispedro, kde4?	01:58
MaceN810	heh	01:58
javispedro	you said "Maemo app" ;)	01:58
alterego	It's called bootstrapping,	01:58
MaceN810	wish there was a kde4mobile	01:59
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alterego	glibc took longer than gcc I believe for me.	01:59
alterego	Though they're usually done in combination to boostrap each other.	01:59
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* lcuk2 shakes head at the sheer magnitude of some projects		01:59
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alterego	lcuk2: the price of progress ;)	01:59
MaceN810	oops	01:59
lcuk2	progress is slower	02:00
javispedro	progress. suprises me when even the simples of binaries uses nearly 10 pages of runtime memory. I've come to understand it though...	02:00
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alterego	Not really, hardware is faster, a lot faster ;)	02:00
lcuk2	so why doesnt it feel it	02:00
lcuk2	i used to build and run apps for fun on amiga	02:00
alterego	Not enough wheel reinvention I'd imagine ^_^	02:00
lcuk2	indeed	02:01
Woolly	nice face alterego	02:02
alterego	On the other hand, I find myself getting bored watching autoconf garbage than gcc/make messages :P	02:02
alterego	I think MaceN810 should use gcc which is already available and write a smaller set of tools for building and packaging :)	02:03
lcuk2	you are like the guy out of the matrix	02:03
johnsq	alterego: that autoconfigure sucks is an other problem	02:03
* lcuk2 almost went blind watching streaming output		02:03
MaceN810	altereg, i am	02:03
MaceN810	using gcc now	02:03
alterego	Cool	02:03
MaceN810	damn n810 with no tab!	02:03
MaceN810	wtf	02:03
alterego	You can use dl instead of *-dev packages :)	02:03
alterego	Press 'chr'	02:03
alterego	The tab is there, you just need to know where to look ;)	02:04
lcuk2	you can just install the -dev packages	02:04
lcuk2	best to be booting from sd so you have space	02:04
lcuk2	but the entire sdk is there	02:04
MaceN810	no tab on the qwerty	02:04
alterego	MaceN810: that's what 'chr' is for.	02:04
MaceN810	lcuk2, i am already	02:04
lcuk2	that was back at alterego	02:05
javispedro	MaceN810, better get used to the Chr key if you plan to buy the N900 ;)	02:05
lcuk2	but yeah cool	02:05
lcuk2	first time i did it i was using onboard mem	02:05
MaceN810	heh	02:05
MaceN810	ouch	02:05
MaceN810	well... i need to stop	02:05
lcuk2	its not that bad	02:05
MaceN810	i have installed like 10 pkgs	02:05
MaceN810	and need to write down which ones	02:06
MaceN810	before i do any more	02:06
Woolly	is swig the only way of getting c-code into python?	02:06
alterego	Wolly, no, not at all.	02:06
johnsq	Woolly: you can write the api by hand.	02:06
alterego	You can write the bindings from scratch.	02:07
Woolly	johnsq: oh jings, I dont fancy that	02:07
alterego	It's not that hard, just a bit of boiler plate.	02:07
alterego	It's more flexible than swig, because you can make it more "python"-esque	02:07
Woolly	i suppose	02:08
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* Luke-Jr thinks *nix needs a standard for symbol information and type representations		02:11
johnsq	Luke-Jr: you want more this_is_a_pointer?	02:11
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Woolly	has anyone heard of an undefined symbol: __aeabi_fadd error?	02:13
alterego	Nice	02:14
Woolly	is it nice?	02:14
johnsq	Woolly: sounds like missing -lm	02:14
Woolly	johnsq: forgive me, but I'm not sure what that means!	02:15
johnsq	Woolly: fadd is a math symbol -lm is the math library.	02:15
Woolly	johnsq: ahhh, right	02:15
Woolly	johnsq: so does that go in my pkg-config bit?	02:16
johnsq	Woolly: I don't know, can also be a compiler option problem. soft-float ...	02:16
Woolly	I see	02:17
Luke-Jr	johnsq: wtf?	02:17
johnsq	Luke-Jr: I didn't understand your request for more standard.	02:19
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Woolly	man I'm getting myself in a pickle here	02:28
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javispedro	Woolly, are you mixing toolchains?	02:29
javispedro	or gcc versions?	02:30
Woolly	javispedro: I dont think so	02:30
Woolly	javispedro: I've used swig to create some bindings for python, used gcc to compile them into the object files, used ld to link them with the -lm argument.	02:31
javispedro	the python version in diablo?	02:31
Woolly	python2.5 yea	02:32
javispedro	it's thumb	02:32
Woolly	thumb?	02:32
javispedro	I mean, it's compiled to thumb	02:32
javispedro	you may need to pass -mthumb to gcc	02:32
Woolly	what does that do?	02:33
javispedro	generates thumb machine code	02:33
javispedro	instead of 32 bit arm	02:33
Woolly	ahh	02:33
javispedro	~thumb	02:33
infobot	Configurable image directory thumbnail viewer. URL: http://www.datrix.co.za/thumb/	02:33
Woolly	I'll try that	02:33
javispedro	(that didn't work)	02:33
Woolly	haha	02:34
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Woolly	okay, so I no longer have an fadd error, which is good! Now I have an __aeabi_dcmple error	02:34
javispedro	how are you calling the linker?	02:35
Woolly	ld -shared batoo.o batoo_wrap.o -lm -o _batoo.so	02:35
javispedro	try using gcc instead of ld (same arguments)	02:36
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pupnik	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSkAFGGv5nY Some video from the westergasfabriek location in amsterdam for the maemo 2009 summit	02:38
Woolly	javispedro: I could kiss you! haha	02:39
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javispedro	Woolly, wait until Python loads it...	02:40
javispedro	oh, hi pupnik	02:40
Woolly	>>> batoo	02:41
Woolly	<module 'batoo' from 'batoo.pyo'>	02:41
Woolly	:D	02:41
javispedro	Woolly, I don't know if that proves anything... try to invoke any function	02:42
Woolly	dir(batoo) gives me analyse_row, which is what I'm looking for	02:42
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javispedro	pupnik, how complete did you leave your drpocketsnes port? did it render frames?	02:48
pupnik	no	02:49
javispedro	ah	02:49
pupnik	it loaded a game without complaining though	02:49
javispedro	a straight make did not work so I started borking it	02:49
pupnik	i dropped the final drawing - afaict it was emulating	02:49
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javispedro	and though I breaked it	02:50
pupnik	yeah dude, borking.... is what i was doing	02:50
pupnik	you got something happening? :?!?!	02:50
javispedro	yep, with sdl though	02:50
javispedro	http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=310521&postcount=45	02:51
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Macer	http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/10/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-1-introduction/	02:51
Macer	there :) simple enough	02:51
Macer	haha	02:51
* Macer is going to be the lone wolf in this project		02:51
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javispedro	I've isolated the mario kart AI problem in the DSP1 emulation code	02:56
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Macer	heh	02:57
Macer	damn. johnx isn't around	02:58
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alterego	I think it's bed time, g'night folks.	03:01
Macer	good night	03:02
javispedro	gnite	03:02
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pupnik	AWESOME javispedro	03:06
* pupnik dances around wildly		03:06
javispedro	good to know :)	03:06
zerojay	What's the problem anyways?	03:06
javispedro	do you think using SDL may lower its max performance?	03:06
javispedro	I mean, vs XPutImage / XShm like you and the original snes9x did	03:07
pupnik	i have no expectation of getting more than 25-30fps on n8x0	03:07
pupnik	so performance will be just fiiiine	03:08
zerojay	Wouldn't be surprised if optimization is what iis causing the ai issue.	03:09
javispedro	ah, zerojay, you were asking about that	03:09
javispedro	yes it is	03:09
zerojay	Yeah, dsp code comes from zsnes originally, i think.	03:10
javispedro	problem is that the asm cpu passes unsigned chars with the upper 24 bits clobbered	03:10
javispedro	gcc with -O >= 1 does not clear the upper 24 bits in prologues	03:10
zerojay	And 25fps for snes is completely unplayable for anything but rpgs. ;)	03:10
javispedro	so chaos ensues in random points	03:10
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javispedro	zerojay, while I've not played it yet (no controls ;) ), it seems definitely playable	03:11
pupnik	dpad is unusable for anything but RPGs so it all fits nicely.	03:11
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zerojay	Agreed.	03:11
pupnik	this is great news javispedro ! so excited.	03:11
pupnik	coming to amsterdam javispedro ?	03:12
javispedro	nope :P	03:12
javispedro	I'd like to, but it's too early for me to tell	03:13
pupnik	ok	03:13
javispedro	haha, did you try it with mario kart rom?	03:14
javispedro	seeing all the computer characters randomly trying to hit themselves is funny	03:14
pupnik	256x224 should give very high reported fps	03:14
javispedro	most of them going reverse	03:14
pupnik	cool	03:15
javispedro	pupnik, while ingame, it's between 20-30 in mario kart	03:15
javispedro	sound on	03:15
javispedro	sound off is >30	03:16
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javispedro	i can build it without frameskip if you want	03:16
pupnik	eh i think fs=1 should be appropriate	03:22
pupnik	there be dragonz in getting synched 50 or 60hz screen updates	03:22
javispedro	:P	03:22
javispedro	currently it has no timing code at all. just render frame, skip, loop, render frame, skip, loop...	03:22
javispedro	(that's why it has a fixed 30/60 in fps counter)	03:23
pupnik	yeah they had some cycle counter on the arm920	03:23
Macer	http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/10/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-2-the-control-flash/	03:25
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javispedro	i'm surprised the audio works at all, cause it's rendered by a separate thread	03:25
Macer	can someone test the init flasher link and the pb console tools link?	03:25
javispedro	Macer, 392K initfs_flasher.tgz & 7,7M console-tools.deb	03:27
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zerojay	Same	03:27
Macer	ok	03:28
Macer	as long as the files work ;) i tend to screw that up	03:28
* Macer is going to use Merlin just to see if Stskeeps has hair fall out.. which he should have anyways considering the plunge is coming soon		03:28
Macer	they don't call it the plunge for nothing :)	03:29
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javispedro	dang it, seems the AI problem is going to be harder than I thought.	03:34
javispedro	well, leaving for tomorrow.	03:34
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wiretapped	ARE WE THERE YET ??	03:48
wiretapped	(any new info on the new device's eta?)	03:48
* wiretapped is ready		03:49
zerojay	Yes.	03:49
zerojay	"Soon"	03:49
zerojay	...Ish	03:49
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pupnik	the new device is coming very soon i think	03:54
pupnik	i mean, the SNES	03:54
pupnik	:)	03:54
* pupnik revels in 'Chrono Trigger'		03:54
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Proteous	would cronotrigger be easy to play one a no dpad device?	03:58
zerojay	I love CT, but i'd stab myself in the face before playing it on my n810.	03:59
* javispedro goes to bed		04:00
javispedro	gnite	04:00
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zerojay	30fps and no dpad?	04:01
GeneralAntilles	Hey, zerojay.	04:01
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zerojay	Gonna be hard to enter that L R and B code to enter that dome too.	04:01
zerojay	Hey.	04:02
zerojay	I know, I know... Long time, no see.	04:10
GeneralAntilles	;)	04:10
zerojay	My tablet battery resurrected itself somehow.	04:10
GeneralAntilles	I already gave you your greeting for this glorious return on Talk. :D	04:10
timeless_mbp	heh	04:10
zerojay	It took a year to get my developer discount n810.. And a month later, it was dead.	04:11
zerojay	The battery was fucked, wouldn't charge.	04:11
zerojay	Didn't have the cash for a new one.	04:12
pupnik	no problem mapping alphanumeric keys to dpad buttons	04:12
pupnik	sad	04:12
zerojay	Six months later, the tablet was sitting on my desk and just booted up on its own. Lol	04:12
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lcuk2	thats some lag	04:13
zerojay	Pupnik, can you press three keys at once?	04:13
zerojay	And have the keyboard read all three at once?	04:13
pupnik	if there are shoulder buttons in the right place, or adacent keys	04:13
GeneralAntilles	zerojay, somebody at Nokia has it out for you. ;)	04:13
zerojay	Lol	04:13
pupnik	yes kbd can read	04:13
zerojay	I felt guilty for harassing poor quim for months on end.	04:14
pupnik	about what	04:14
zerojay	Meaning one email a month.	04:14
GeneralAntilles	"This guy and his goddamn bugs. This'll shut him up. . . ."	04:14
zerojay	Hahaha	04:14
pupnik	:)	04:14
pupnik	it did	04:14
GeneralAntilles	"Who has more than 4 contacts?!"	04:14
zerojay	So much changed... And for the better in most ways.	04:15
GeneralAntilles	I just want a goddamn device.	04:15
GeneralAntilles	I've wanted an OMAP3 every since the N810 was announced.	04:16
zerojay	I'm... drooling for it.	04:16
pupnik	will next tablet have a regular phone?	04:18
pupnik	or hsdpa data	04:18
zerojay	I think i won't buy another computer after the rx44.	04:18
zerojay	Ever.	04:18
GeneralAntilles	pupnik, phone.	04:19
GeneralAntilles	zerojay, I still need something to push big, heavy bits around.	04:19
GeneralAntilles	(3D, photos, movies, Photoshop, etc.)	04:19
zerojay	All i ever use my home pc for anymore is media sharing.	04:19
GeneralAntilles	But, yeah, I'm seeing a lot of my usage shift that way.	04:20
GeneralAntilles	s/seeing/picturing/	04:20
infobot	GeneralAntilles meant: But, yeah, I'm picturing a lot of my usage shift that way.	04:20
zerojay	Heh, forgot about the bot. ;)	04:20
GeneralAntilles	_Monkey is dead, though. :(	04:21
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zerojay	Hah... That was milhouse's, wasn't it?	04:22
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GeneralAntilles	Yeah	04:23
pupnik	it just kept interjecting without being activated by metacharacter	04:23
GeneralAntilles	Long dead because he couldn't be bothered to set up a trigger.	04:23
zerojay	What a pain that bot was.	04:23
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pupnik	had a pretty nice dataset of responses for a while	04:24
GeneralAntilles	and he was #maemo through and through	04:24
GeneralAntilles	As opposed to that whore, infobot.	04:24
GeneralAntilles	~$20	04:24
GeneralAntilles	What, too good for me now, infobot?	04:25
pupnik	~infobot	04:27
pupnik	~list	04:28
infobot	one warez list being sent	04:28
pupnik	hahahaha	04:28
zerojay	Hah	04:28
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FireFox16	~seen xnt14	05:56
infobot	xnt14 <n=xnt14@pool-96-232-136-95.nycmny.fios.verizon.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 6h 28m 32s ago, saying: 'oh :P :)'.	05:56
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b-man16	damn :P	05:56
* b-man16 is getting a Pandora as a replacement for his N800 :)		05:58
b-man16	http://openpandora.org/	05:58
zerojay	Hah	05:59
zerojay	Whenever it actually is released.	05:59
zerojay	It's been way too long already.	06:00
b-man16	it is avalable - but it requires you to do a special order	06:01
zerojay	Yeah, it's not available.	06:01
zerojay	It's too bad, really. Was looking forward to it.	06:02
b-man16	well, theay did say that theay are making a new batch for December, and there are still some left from last fall	06:03
* b-man16 will email them		06:04
zerojay	Must be developer boards only then.	06:04
b-man16	yup - but it's still a pretty nice device :)	06:05
zerojay	Yeah.	06:05
b-man16	perfect for what i do XD	06:05
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zerojay	If the rx51 didn't have similar abilities, i'd get one.	06:06
b-man16	:)	06:06
b-man16	it's a nice allternitive if you dont want to spend $400.00+ on rx-51 ;)	06:07
zerojay	If you don't care about the phone or maemo parts, maybe.	06:08
zerojay	It's what, $300?	06:08
b-man16	yup	06:09
b-man16	$330.00	06:09
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gogol	hi maemo	06:12
gogol	anyone not just idling?	06:12
zerojay	Meeeee	06:12
gogol	hey zerojay	06:12
zerojay	Hey	06:12
gogol	:)	06:12
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gogol	whatchoo up to this evenin	06:12
gogol	or morning depending on where the heck in the worl dyou are	06:13
zerojay	Wiki editing... Some ps3 soon.	06:13
gogol	nice	06:13
gogol	got my old 770 out and reinstalled latest OS...2006?! crazy	06:13
zerojay	Lol	06:13
gogol	...and i think THANK GOD i have an n810	06:14
gogol	no qwerty hurts BAD	06:14
gogol	:D	06:14
gogol	what pages on wiki you at?	06:14
zerojay	Maemo 5 dev guide.	06:15
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gogol	installing vagalume and plugging the 770 into the stereo made it useful enough	06:19
gogol	man im fuckn bored.	06:19
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gogol	well, Google Voice changed and broke Dialcentral / GV Notifier.	06:30
gogol	imagine that.	06:30
zerojay	I can't use it anyways.	06:32
gogol	y not?	06:34
gogol	short 1 GV invite perhaps. Or youre canadian.	06:35
zerojay	Canadian.	06:36
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gogol	Im wrong anyways, epage updated this afternoon. Maybe I can figure out how to stuff his new scraping into GV-Notifier	06:36
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gogol	well im certain google will eventually take over the entire universe. canada's probably next.	06:37
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zakkm	did anyone see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fglg-MptslA&feature=related ?	06:54
zakkm	Tilt sensor on n810?	06:54
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gogol	tiltstick?	07:08
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zakkm	gogol:	07:13
zakkm	yeah	07:13
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zerojay	Dont see a use for it.	07:20
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MaceN810	hello	07:55
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MaceN810	well. guess iĺl go ahead and kee working on this maemo stuff	07:55
MaceN810	heh	07:55
gogol	good idea	07:56
* MaceN810 has built and installed blackdown and is building openoffice now		07:56
* MaceN810 hooks up his charger		07:56
* gogol goes and fucks up python repeatedly until gv-notifier doesnt work at all		07:57
gogol	><	07:57
MaceN810	managed to pkg up new stuff too but have to work on how they actually install	07:58
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zakkm	MaceN810: how goes abiword with cups?	08:03
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MaceN810	zakkm, i have decided to turn my attention elsewhere	08:11
MaceN810	just because of that	08:11
MaceN810	http://tech.rancorous.net	08:11
MaceN810	should be the 2 latest ones	08:11
zakkm	? compile on nokia itself?	08:12
MaceN810	yeah	08:12
MaceN810	so far i have been building replacement bins for the stuff that won't run configure	08:12
MaceN810	but i have to log all the stuff i'm doing	08:13
zakkm	heh	08:13
zakkm	built anything successfully?	08:13
MaceN810	because i've done so much so far that i can't remember it all haha	08:13
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MaceN810	right now i think i'm on installing pkg-config	08:14
zakkm	compiled succesfuly so much stuff?	08:14
MaceN810	i'm using abiword as a base to how the pkgs are downloaded and built though because that is a pretty long configure it goes through for it with a lot of dependencies	08:14
MaceN810	so i want to start logging exactly what it needs. maybe even store the debs on my own repo	08:14
MaceN810	and turn maemo into a real computer heh	08:15
MaceN810	well.. turn the n810 into a real computer with maemo instead of a replacement OS	08:15
MaceN810	or a chroot	08:15
zakkm	dont like Mer?	08:16
MaceN810	i was in the middle of the 2nd article when i had to leave heh	08:16
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MaceN810	work emergency.. bastards... waah. we can't access our server.. .boohoo	08:16
MaceN810	lol	08:16
MaceN810	i couldn't get to it from work because some idiot turned off the wrong breaker	08:17
MaceN810	work/home	08:17
MaceN810	zakkm, oh i think mer is great for what it is trying to be	08:17
MaceN810	so far i've gotten smaller things to build	08:17
MaceN810	using abiword as a base because it has a lot of deps	08:17
zakkm	i was more referring to you supporting the project rather than focusing on maemo itself.	08:17
MaceN810	and seeing if i can build and pkg its deps	08:17
MaceN810	and use the tablet for making the actual pkgs too	08:18
MaceN810	zakkm, oh. i never really used mer much	08:18
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zakkm	fvwm is coming :P	08:18
MaceN810	it has a long way to go. and maemo works with all the hardware	08:18
MaceN810	i guess. but it doesn't look much better than hildon	08:19
MaceN810	i know it's immature but i like hildon more .. and i would really just rather try to figure out how to replace the wm in maemo4	08:19
MaceN810	than to try to use the mer base since .. the hardware works in maemo ;)	08:19
zakkm	can run xfce, fvwm, gnome and such in mer	08:20
zakkm	?	08:20
zakkm	simple xinitrc changing i think	08:20
MaceN810	bbl	08:20
MaceN810	waiting on something	08:20
MaceN810	blah	08:20
MaceN810	waiting sucks. i want to go home	08:20
Stskeeps	MaceN810: wtf do you mean by "the hardware works" anyway? :P	08:27
Stskeeps	wifi works, bluetooth works, GPS works (with hacks), sound works, battery monitoring works	08:27
MaceN810	oh im´sure.	08:28
MaceN810	heh	08:28
MaceN810	but why not just figure out a way to run that stuff in maemo?	08:28
MaceN810	where the hardware works	08:28
MaceN810	i remember being able to run kde 3.5 that pb built	08:29
MaceN810	worked great	08:29
gogol	i didn't know sound worked under mer.	08:29
zakkm	that was a chroot...	08:29
MaceN810	kind of sucked for screen real estate..	08:29
MaceN810	but worked nonetheless	08:29
zakkm	pb's kde3.5 was a chroot	08:29
zakkm	it wasnt maemo	08:29
Stskeeps	MaceN810: mer's goal isn't the UI, and we'd be beating a dead horse basing anything on top of Diablo.	08:29
MaceN810	he even built a shitload of kde apps and included it	08:29
MaceN810	so if that is possible then anything is heh	08:30
zakkm	macen810: he didnt build anything.	08:30
MaceN810	either way. i dont like the idea of having to use another system just to build and pkg	08:30
zakkm	it was "debian" running inside maemo in a chroot image	08:30
zakkm	it wasnt actually maemo at all , just maemo starting the chroot	08:30
MaceN810	and i simply cant grasp why i cant just do it on the tablet in maemo	08:30
MaceN810	when all the tools to do so are just sitting there waiting :)	08:31
Stskeeps	because you don't know enough about this area, really	08:31
MaceN810	bbl	08:31
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MaceN810	zakkm, yah but i bet it is possible to run it without the chroot by just putting the proper tools into maemo itself	08:35
MaceN810	Stskeeps, dont´get so defensive :)	08:36
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MaceN810	adhoc doesnt work	08:36
* MaceN810 hides		08:36
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zakkm	diablo sucks.	08:36
Stskeeps	MaceN810: adhoc works fine probably when not using networkmanager.	08:36
zakkm	it works yes cause its official	08:36
zakkm	but to base things off it , nah	08:36
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MaceN810	zakkm, a little work might do it justice ;)	08:37
zakkm	diablo is dead too.	08:37
MaceN810	ill see. you can say i told you so later	08:37
Stskeeps	and MaceN810 just volunteered for taking over the Diablo community SSU	08:37
Stskeeps	we'll see how he handles that :)	08:37
johnx	can I say it too? :D	08:37
zakkm	community SSU?	08:38
zakkm	is that what happening?	08:38
Stskeeps	just takes someone to take up the torch and get it implemented	08:38
zakkm	ahhh i want dragonplayer to work	08:38
zakkm	anyone know terminal command for it?	08:38
zakkm	oh nevermind its dragon	08:38
zakkm	mmap failed for "/var/tmp/kdecache-user/kpc/kde-icon-cache.index"	08:39
Stskeeps	ls -l /var \| grep tmp	08:40
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zakkm	drwxrwxrwt 3 root root 0 2009-08-11 22:35 tmp	08:41
Stskeeps	k	08:41
zakkm	same error trying from root :(	08:41
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zakkm	ohh its kde related	08:42
MaceN810	Stskeeps, why?	08:43
MaceN810	fuck the community	08:43
MaceN810	haha	08:43
MaceN810	if i can get it working then i can show people how to do it with a wordpress blog	08:43
zakkm	maemo is allcommunity.	08:43
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MaceN810	zakkm, i know. i was joking	08:44
MaceN810	but i guess i just dont understand it to tell you the truth. if you think of maemo as a hardware layer debian	08:44
zakkm	how is it i cant install anything kde? isnt ubuntu repository in mer?	08:44
MaceN810	you should be able to add the proper tools to it and update stuff from the debian repos	08:44
Stskeeps	maemo isn't a hardware layer and what's underneath is hardly debian	08:44
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MaceN810	to keep it up to date	08:45
Stskeeps	zakkm: qt for maemo probably	08:45
zakkm	its like amarok-engine-xine .. doesnt exist	08:45
zakkm	or libgpod3	08:45
zakkm	like normal ubuntu repo stuff.	08:45
MaceN810	Stskeeps, i just look at android as an example when ithink of maemo	08:45
zakkm	qt4 was fine	08:45
johnx	MaceN810, not really. a distro only works if you're constantly making sure that all the applications work with the newest libraries	08:45
MaceN810	maybe even osx heh	08:45
zakkm	osx pwns :)	08:45
Stskeeps	MaceN810: android is not a hardware layer either. what's underneath the UI is, sure, but rest is just apps and desktop like everything else	08:46
MaceN810	johnx, and why wouldnt this be possible oonce you have a good working base?	08:46
MaceN810	Stskeeps, the linux stuff is	08:46
Stskeeps	android's hardly a typical gnu userland :P	08:46
MaceN810	linux seems to only control running the java intepreter and hardware	08:46
MaceN810	other than that.. no typical user would even realize they were running a linux kernel or system on their phone	08:46
MaceN810	just like a lot of osx users have no idea what a mach kernel is	08:47
zakkm	i do! :)	08:47
johnx	MaceN810, because parts of maemo are closed source...	08:47
zakkm	(is running OSX right now)	08:47
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MaceN810	johnx, i know	08:47
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MaceN810	Stskeeps explained that	08:47
Stskeeps	anyway, i'm wasting too much time discussing this crap instead of actually doing something. good luck with molesting your maemo installation and don't come crying when it blows up in your face :)	08:47
* Stskeeps goes to work		08:48
MaceN810	Stskeeps, wow that was mean :-P	08:48
MaceN810	haha	08:48
* MaceN810 says the same about Stskeeps upcoming marriage haha		08:48
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MaceN810	:P)	08:49
zakkm	Stskeeps is getting married?	08:49
johnx	MaceN810, at one point a lot of people were saying exactly what you were saying: "why not just port projectfoo to maemo?"	08:49
MaceN810	johnx, but yeah. i understand about the closed src	08:49
MaceN810	Stskeeps said it was around 20%	08:49
zakkm	johnx: nice name :P projectfoo	08:49
MaceN810	so why not just use maemo with the closed src stuff to control the hardware ?	08:49
MaceN810	i mean there are plenty of people who used closed ati drivers	08:50
MaceN810	in debian .. and ubuntu	08:50
johnx	MaceN810, because the ati drivers are specifically designed to fit into an open debian distro	08:50
zakkm	ati wasnt totally closed too	08:51
zakkm	and its just a driver, and it worked	08:51
MaceN810	reinventing the wheel just doesnt´seem practical when all the tools are in maemo.. but yeah. let me work on it more so i can agree with Stskeeps later about how bad of an idea it was haha	08:51
zakkm	its not a whole OS or anything	08:51
zakkm	also maemo is slow :P	08:51
zakkm	its too much work :P	08:51
zakkm	what if you want to change Xorg? or update it?	08:51
zakkm	you couldnt	08:51
johnx	basically what it comes down to is library version mismatches and fighting against scratchbox	08:51
zakkm	or kernel	08:51
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johnx	MaceN810, at a concept level what you're saying makes some amount of sense	08:53
johnx	but when you actually dig into it you start to see how much work there is to do	08:53
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johnx	MaceN810, also a note: if you ever see me working on a project and it seems like I'm ignoring a simpler/easier alternative, realize that's probably not the case :P	08:53
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MaceN810	<johnx> basically what it comes down to is library version mismatches and fighting against scratchbox	09:29
MaceN810	<zakkm> or kernel	09:29
johnx	why yes, I do recall writing that :)	09:30
MaceN810	the lib mismatches i see	09:30
MaceN810	but the kernel...	09:30
MaceN810	the kernel and modules for the n810 shouldnt need much more	09:30
zakkm	lol im just saying, if you base it off maemo, it will give you a screwup point	09:30
MaceN810	sorry	09:31
MaceN810	was busy heh	09:31
zakkm	its 2;31am here, im tired.	09:31
johnx	gotta keep the maemo kernel unless you're a serious kernel hacker though	09:31
MaceN810	johnx i know, but why change it?	09:31
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zakkm	im just saying if you base off maemo it may work now just fine... but overtime your run into more and more problems	09:31
zakkm	that in the end its just easier to do like mer	09:31
MaceN810	if you just need it for a hardware layer?	09:32
MaceN810	and a few other layers too	09:32
zakkm	speed, support?	09:32
zakkm	drivers?	09:32
zakkm	xomap and such relies on kernel modules doesnt it?	09:32
zakkm	omg johnx: this is uber slow but works perfectly	09:32
MaceN810	zakkm, fight with the 20% that is closed?	09:32
johnx	ahaha	09:33
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johnx	I wonder what slows it down so much	09:33
MaceN810	mario kart?	09:33
zakkm	all the services probaly go into virtual memory.	09:33
zakkm	cause it has to start kde4 too mostly	09:33
MaceN810	heh	09:33
zakkm	along with the already hildon-desktop and all	09:33
zakkm	pushing in virtual memory, my idea anyways	09:33
MaceN810	well. have to work on this stuff some more.	09:34
MaceN810	macer vs the world	09:34
MaceN810	haha	09:34
zakkm	johnx: did you find out why it failed?	09:35
zakkm	lol now kmail wont open:P	09:36
johnx	the reason to update the kernel is to have a newer kernel with better performance, newer drivers	09:37
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zakkm	johnx: its way too slow to be usable lol,	09:38
johnx	bummer :/	09:38
johnx	thanks for testing	09:38
zakkm	well i dont know	09:38
zakkm	im running in easy-mer too	09:39
johnx	aaah	09:39
zakkm	if that would affect it alot	09:39
johnx	well that's a little different :)	09:39
zakkm	is it?	09:39
zakkm	ram wise perhaps, but not so much harddrive speed + cpu ?	09:39
johnx	I'd bet RAM is the limiting factor here	09:40
zakkm	i need thumb keyboard :)	09:40
zakkm	yeah	09:40
zakkm	i gotta say it is nice though	09:40
zakkm	fits screen and all fine	09:40
zakkm	setting up kmail :D	09:40
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zakkm	johnx: looking at processes and kmail and contact are 23mb / 22mb ram each :P	09:41
Stskeeps	once we have maemo-launcher for qt it should help :P	09:42
johnx	and mer vs easy mer :)	09:42
zakkm	is that for preloading	09:42
zakkm	i need thumb keyboard :P you know that :)	09:42
zakkm	thumb keyboard comes to mer .. no more easymer	09:42
MaceN810	well	09:43
MaceN810	that was odd	09:43
zakkm	?	09:43
MaceN810	i hope tear is still going well	09:44
MaceN810	that is an awesome browser	09:44
zakkm	still alive isnt i?	09:45
zakkm	at 0.3.5	09:45
MaceN810	im sure	09:45
zakkm	even in mer as default i believe	09:45
zakkm	johnx: anything else you think would be cool to try?	09:46
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MaceN810	damn	09:51
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MaceN810	forgot to put the qole repo on the flash	09:52
zakkm	lol	09:52
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zakkm	MaceN810: qole has newest tear :P	09:53
MaceN810	iyah	09:53
MaceN810	i reflashed the n810 a while back to start from scratch	09:54
MaceN810	didnt realize there was a tear bookmarks pkg	09:55
MaceN810	is there a pw one?	09:55
zakkm	pw one?	09:56
zakkm	just tear and tear bookmarks	09:56
zakkm	tear bookmarks has the thing for top left of maemo .. to replace microb's one	09:56
zakkm	so you can use top left.. and it will launch tear.. as opposed to having to goto apps - internet - tear	09:56
zakkm	heh i love xcompmgr in mer :D	09:57
Stskeeps	well, it seems like i'll be presenting on the Friday on Maemo Summit :) (see http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Summit_2009/Schedule#Friday_9 )	10:02
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zakkm	nice	10:03
zakkm	going to bed guys, night night	10:03
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MaceN810	zakkm, tear doesnt store passwords tho does it?	10:04
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MaceN810	damn i love arm battery life	10:05
MaceN810	wonder if i can get an augmented battery	10:05
MaceN810	:)	10:05
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MaceN810	zakkm, where is the option to replace the microb icon?	10:08
johnx	settings -> control panel -> panels	10:10
MaceN810	oh	10:13
MaceN810	it is just a panel	10:14
MaceN810	neet	10:14
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MaceN810	yeah	10:16
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MaceN810	but it doesnt seem to integrate with tear	10:16
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johnx	hmm?	10:16
MaceN810	adding a bookmark in tear	10:16
MaceN810	doesnt seem to add it to the bookmark icin	10:17
MaceN810	icon	10:17
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johnx	works here	10:17
MaceN810	oh	10:17
MaceN810	odd, it just worked	10:17
MaceN810	let me try again	10:18
johnx	it might not sync-up instantly	10:18
johnx	I think they're both pulling from the same database	10:18
MaceN810	yah	10:18
MaceN810	it just started working... odd... but awesome heh	10:18
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MaceN810	how do i add a bookmark folder?	10:28
eichi_PDA	hello, i have a big problem with my n 800. in the left area of the screen, i have to press on the s letter to get an a and an the r to get an e	10:28
timeless_mbp	ouch	10:29
ukki	eichi_PDA: tried to recalibrate the screen?	10:30
MaceN810	oh. guess no folder support yet	10:30
MaceN810	and it uses python heh	10:30
Stskeeps	eichi_PDA: probably a dustcorn or something stuck on the edge of the screen	10:31
eichi_PDA	oh lol yea cleaning the displaay and recalibrate worked	10:32
eichi_PDA	theree was a hair unter the transparency	10:33
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MaceN810	hm	10:35
MaceN810	says you can use folders	10:35
MaceN810	wtf	10:35
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qwerty12_N810	The panel has bookmark support; Tear, itself, does not	10:36
qwerty12_N810	s/bookmark/folder/	10:36
infobot	qwerty12_N810 meant: The panel has folder support; Tear, itself, does not	10:36
woglinde	hi	10:37
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timeless_mbp	qwerty12_N810: cute	10:37
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Jaffa	Morning, all	10:48
Stskeeps	morning jaffa	10:49
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Stskeeps	jaffa, will be doing a talk on mer (suggested by quim & peter) in the expert streams friday	10:49
MaceN810	blah	10:49
Stskeeps	on maemo summit	10:50
MaceN810	heh. whatever. going to work on cups abiword some more	10:50
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Andy80	hi all	10:51
MaceN810	hm	10:52
MaceN810	# fribidi --version	10:53
MaceN810	fribidi 0.10.9	10:53
MaceN810	No package 'fribidi' found	10:54
woglinde	macer jupps	10:55
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MaceN810	weird	10:55
Jaffa	Stskeeps: cool	10:55
Woolly	MaceN810: you still hackin away?! do you not sleep? :P	10:55
qwerty12_N810	Sleepless nights is common when setting up on-device compiling...	10:56
Woolly	haha	10:56
Stskeeps	and trauma the rest of your life	10:56
LinuxCode	and premature death	10:57
MaceN810	haha	10:57
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MaceN810	sleep is a crutch	10:57
MaceN810	im on a job site	10:57
MaceN810	someone broke something	10:58
MaceN810	have to wait around	10:58
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MaceN810	i usually work at night anyways	10:58
MaceN810	less traffic and get to spend the day with my son	10:58
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MaceN810	http://lasziv.reprehensible.net/~ acer/Me_and_Littleman/	11:00
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MaceN810	that is like a yr old pic now tho. he is a lot bigger heh	11:01
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Woolly	links broke :(	11:01
MaceN810	~macer	11:02
MaceN810	not acer... frigging cut paste	11:03
MaceN810	is there like a kb shortcut for this?	11:03
qwerty12_N810	Ctrl+V? =)	11:03
MaceN810	¥	11:04
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MaceN810	http://lasziv.reprehensible.net/~ acer/Me_and_Littleman/	11:04
MaceN810	wtf	11:04
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MaceN810	http://lasziv.reprehensible.net/~macer/Me_and_Littleman/	11:05
MaceN810	there it is.. manual ftw	11:06
pupnik_	ahh macer not acert	11:06
MaceN810	xchat pasting seems broken	11:06
Woolly	hah cool	11:06
MaceN810	yah	11:06
pupnik_	hehe @ shhh! sw	11:06
MaceN810	bbl	11:06
pupnik_	good success with your job	11:07
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tomaterr	has any1 gotten httrack working on their n810?	11:38
tomaterr	I can't seem to make it work	11:38
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wazd	hello everybody	12:11
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RST38h	hello wazd	12:13
wazd	t.m.o is under DDoS again? :)	12:13
wazd	RST38h: heya	12:14
RST38h	wazd: They angered the Symbian Gods! =)	12:18
RST38h	Nordic Symbian Gods	12:19
MaceN810	haha	12:22
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MaceN810	Setting up libglib2.0-dev (2.12.12-1osso13) ...	12:26
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MaceN810	No package 'fribidi' found	12:29
MaceN810	i dont understand why it isnt finding the dep	12:29
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xnt14	morning everyone ;)	12:50
slonopotamus	can anyone explain me how 'PulseAudio will help "clearing up" sound area from obstacles to open development'?	12:50
xnt14	last night, a powersurge killed my switch	12:50
slonopotamus	quote from Quim Gil, bug 1584	12:51
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Stskeeps	slonopotamus: you never had to deal with osso-multimediad and other evil things	13:00
Stskeeps	and trust me, pulseaudio is a magnificent open replacement compared to that	13:00
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wazd	"You last visited: 03-29-2006 at 07:27 AM" - ah, youth	13:07
Stskeeps	youporn.com?	13:07
Stskeeps	:P	13:07
wazd	Stskeeps: nah, seriouszone.com :)	13:08
wazd	Join Date: May 2003	13:08
slonopotamus	Stskeeps, why not just use gstreamer/phonon/alsa directly?	13:08
wazd	I was pretty big fan of this game :)	13:08
alterego	I think I might ln fakeroot sudo	13:08
alterego	Because I'm just too used to that ^_^	13:08
Stskeeps	slonopotamus: gstreamer and alsa is not in same league	13:09
Stskeeps	slonopotamus: that bug report is interesting	13:09
slonopotamus	Stskeeps, i know. ok, alsa	13:09
wazd	damn, I was talking with foreign communities since 2003 :)	13:10
* Stskeeps was talking since '97		13:10
Stskeeps	:P	13:10
slonopotamus	all those pulseaudio/esd... i don't understand what value they add	13:10
wazd	Stskeeps: I was talking since 88 :D	13:10
Stskeeps	slonopotamus: i enjoyed being able to switch my audio output stream to my media center	13:11
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RST38h	Youngsters, hehe	13:15
* RST38h has been trolling since 93		13:16
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RST38h	Sts: BTW, is there anything new known about RX-71, based on the latest SDK sources?	13:17
Stskeeps	RST38h: not really	13:18
mikkov_	X-Fade: I'm trying to promote solarwolf, but it doesn't seem to do anything	13:18
wazd	http://forums.seriouszone.com/showpost.php?p=550810&postcount=1681 <- my post! :D	13:18
X-Fade	mikkov_: You'd better wait until I can finally promote packages.	13:19
X-Fade	mikkov_: It is calculating reverse dependencies for python etc, that tree is huge ;)	13:19
RST38h	oh, vegetation in quake!	13:19
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RST38h	BGR fanboys seem to like the Rover	13:34
RST38h	(aside from the usual "want capacitive!" bunch)	13:34
Stskeeps	i think the two touch may be useful	13:35
aol	heh lets hope RX-71 is touch only with capacitive :)	13:35
* RST38h does not mind single touch resistive		13:35
* RST38h does mind the lack of a proper painting app though		13:36
Stskeeps	RST38h: fremante ui uses two-touch based on resistive	13:36
Stskeeps	like lcuk's demo	13:36
RST38h	In how many places? And in what context?	13:36
aol	two-touch?? really ... nice	13:36
RST38h	I mean, the only thing that comes to mind is zooming, and I can really do zooming without two touch	13:36
aol	multitouch is great for games and soft keyboards	13:37
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aol	zooming etc extra gestures are useless imho	13:37
aol	gimmick	13:37
Stskeeps	RST38h: it says so in HIG somewhere	13:38
timeless_mbp	RST38h: why not write a proper painting app?	13:38
timeless_mbp	you know that we wouldn't get it right if we tried	13:38
timeless_mbp	we've talked about it	13:38
timeless_mbp	i suggested that someone should port gimp shop	13:38
timeless_mbp	although porting Tux Paint might be easier	13:38
Stskeeps	RST38h: fremantle xournal might be useful at least	13:38
RST38h	Sts: I am thinking more in terms of MyPaint, but written in C/C++, with proper UI	13:39
Stskeeps	nod	13:39
RST38h	Sts: Yea, Xournal looks better and better	13:39
Stskeeps	http://wiki.maemo.org/Image:H22-Modest-Accounts-view.png	13:40
Stskeeps	interesting	13:40
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RST38h	Sts: Useless until it is made to properly check mail in BOTH IMAP and POP3 accounts, on ANY connection	13:41
Stskeeps	RST38h: nono, i don't care about Modest	13:41
Stskeeps	look at the bar	13:41
RST38h	ah thaat ;)	13:41
Stskeeps	the unit must definately have a battery!	13:42
Stskeeps	:P	13:42
RST38h	Sts: Well, I see that they combined batter, volume, and presense in a single icon	13:42
Stskeeps	RST38h: no, it's the status area, it's smaller icons	13:42
RST38h	sorry, not volume, wifi	13:42
Stskeeps	and not directly clickable afaik	13:42
Stskeeps	either way that interface looks nice	13:43
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RST38h	you mean each of these tiny icons is created separately?	13:43
Stskeeps	yeah	13:43
RST38h	It is not a single app?	13:43
Stskeeps	AFAIK	13:43
RST38h	Hmm...Probably makes sense under certain conditions but still sounds kludgey	13:43
Stskeeps	you click it and status area appears which then can be used	13:44
Stskeeps	i think	13:44
qwerty12_N810	RST38h: seen how easily hildon-desktop crashes? :)	13:44
wazd	Stskeeps: icons are not 18x18? :)	13:44
Stskeeps	wazd: that one i'm wondering a bit about too	13:44
Stskeeps	wazd: some of them are 18x18 though? :P	13:44
RST38h	qwerty: More than once	13:44
wazd	Stskeeps: well, that's not new in maemo world :D	13:45
RST38h	Sts: They may have fixed height to fill the whole bar but variable width	13:45
javispedro	tonight my tablet was dead in the morning again. had been a few months since it last happened.... :(	13:45
wazd	also, gradients are fine	13:45
RST38h	BTW, the tiny icons thing is present in Symbian/S60 AFAIK	13:45
RST38h	Sts: Another weird thing: why is the status area on the left?	13:46
wazd	connectivity icon is awful, I guess it's temporary :)	13:46
Stskeeps	RST38h: no clue	13:46
javispedro	it sucks. i am home due to that. I'll end up buying a second battery just for that..	13:46
Stskeeps	hmm	13:46
Stskeeps	anyone had that 'Harmattan' screenshot?	13:46
RST38h	Sts: I mean, in terms of UI it does not make much difference, left or right. But if it is on the left, the app title loses fixed placement and starts shifting to the right	13:46
qwerty12_N810	They're being sympathetic to the lefties with this release ;)	13:46
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RST38h	Sts: the huge fake one?	13:46
Stskeeps	yeah	13:46
wazd	RST38h: well, it goes like this "let's make something different! Statusbar on the left, awesome!"	13:47
* RST38h is a lefty, and for the record, he does not care where status area is =)		13:47
Stskeeps	RST38h: right, yeah, it does look fake	13:47
RST38h	Sts: But eyecandyish =)	13:47
Stskeeps	some parts are correct though	13:47
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lcuk	Stskeeps, i keep playing with fakeymultitouch to allow grid resizing and selection of views within the list	13:55
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lcuk	but i still cant get it "right" i know what i want it to do lol	13:56
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VDVsx	Anyone with a maemo5 sbox that can help me test/confirm a issue ? :)	13:58
Stskeeps	wazd: i'll need some help with graphics up to summit, to make a convincing Mer presentation for the first day :P	13:58
javispedro	VDVsx, if it's short, shoot	13:59
wazd	Stskeeps: oh, sure :)	14:00
VDVsx	javispedro, yes, is related to one of the gsoc projects, thanks :)	14:00
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Stskeeps	wazd: http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo_Summit_2009/Schedule#Friday_9 kinda explains why i need it :)	14:00
VDVsx	javispedro, check you this project: https://garage.maemo.org/scm/?group_id=972	14:01
VDVsx	you will need python2.5 in the sbox	14:01
VDVsx	python2.5-sdk will install everthing	14:01
javispedro	armel or x86?	14:01
VDVsx	x86	14:01
VDVsx	you need to start hildon-desktop	14:01
Stskeeps	VDVsx: i might have to do minor changes to the description of my talk saturday as i'll pull in material from it, for the one the day before	14:02
VDVsx	Stskeeps, feel free to edit the info in the wiki :)	14:03
Stskeeps	k	14:03
javispedro	E: Couldn't find package python2.5-sdk -- it's on extras-devel?	14:03
VDVsx	javispedro, sorry -> python-sdk	14:04
VDVsx	python2.5-sdk in diablo :P	14:04
javispedro	can't find it either	14:05
VDVsx	javispedro, probably you don't have extras-devel enabled ?	14:05
VDVsx	mine shows: python-sdk - Developer-oriented versions of python runtime environment packages.	14:06
javispedro	ah, sorry, was looking at the repo pool but it lists source package names instead	14:06
alterego	I think this time I'm going to create an archive of my scratchbox targets so I don't have to keep regenerating them everytime I want to test my packaging. Downloading maemo-sdk-dev takes fucking ages for me.	14:06
javispedro	VDVsx, ok, trunk checked out and python-sdk installled	14:09
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VDVsx	javispedro, go to src and the execute barcamera.py	14:09
VDVsx	run-standalone python2.5 barcamera.py	14:10
VDVsx	init hildon-desktop first :)	14:10
javispedro	no pygst	14:10
VDVsx	bahh	14:10
javispedro	python-gst0.10 , I guess	14:11
VDVsx	yes	14:11
javispedro	no gpsbt..................... damn	14:11
Stskeeps	fremantle has no gpsbt, it uses something else	14:11
VDVsx	lol, please comment this line: import locationfinder	14:11
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alterego	liblocation	14:11
VDVsx	in barcamera.py	14:11
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javispedro	zbar...	14:12
VDVsx	javispedro, humm, 1 min please	14:13
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lardman	pupnik_: sorry for missing your question the other day	14:13
lardman	pupnik_: and no but thanks as my wife will be coming and we were going to stay in a hotel	14:14
lardman	pupnik_: thanks though :)	14:14
pupnik_	ohhh	14:14
lardman	morning everyone too :)	14:14
ukki	morning	14:15
* lcuk waves		14:15
* javispedro idly plays around the fremantle interface		14:15
VDVsx	javispedro, please comment line 15, 209, 214, sorry forget about zbar and it takes some time to install :)	14:15
VDVsx	morning lardman :)	14:16
lardman	hi VDVsx	14:16
javispedro	VDVsx, seen line 210?	14:16
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lardman	hacking on barcodes?	14:16
lcuk	whatever you do, don't touch line 210	14:16
javispedro	i'm commenting that line too	14:16
VDVsx	lardman, some problems with Amit work	14:17
javispedro	unless python magically allows calling methods on null objects	14:17
VDVsx	javispedro, eheh	14:17
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lardman	VDVsx: is the project finished now?	14:17
javispedro	ok, it boots, and I see what seems to be analog noise	14:17
VDVsx	lardman, have UI issues here, and he claims that it works fine for him	14:18
VDVsx	lardman, no	14:18
lardman	ah ok	14:18
lcuk	VDVsx, what hardware is he testing on	14:18
lardman	I might have some time this evening, can have a look see	14:18
lcuk	and is it being run in emulated	14:18
lardman	is trunk uptodate?	14:18
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lcuk	or native	14:18
VDVsx	lcuk, sbox	14:18
qwerty12_N810	lardman: line 210!! How can it be finished :P	14:18
lardman	ah that post to maemo-devel...	14:18
VDVsx	lardman, yes	14:18
lcuk	what ui issues are you having	14:18
lardman	qwerty12_N810: the efficiency of python ;)	14:18
VDVsx	hildon issues	14:19
VDVsx	javispedro, any luck ?	14:19
lcuk	VDVsx, install things, or interactions in hildon itself	14:19
javispedro	yes, i'm on the main dialog	14:19
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javispedro	what you want?	14:19
lcuk	ie is it possible most dev/testing was done just natively	14:19
VDVsx	javispedro, type "simpsons" and then accept, please	14:19
lardman	mostly done in scratchbox targeting x86	14:19
VDVsx	lcuk, problems with hildon treviews :)	14:20
javispedro	done	14:20
lcuk	furry muff	14:20
lardman	I also hate treeviews	14:20
VDVsx	javispedro, click in one of the item and them get reviews	14:20
VDVsx	javispedro, send the the console output and you are done :)	14:21
javispedro	there's a TypeError in there	14:21
javispedro	thank god the entire output was in gnome-terminal cache	14:21
VDVsx	javispedro, beta 2 ?	14:22
javispedro	yep	14:22
javispedro	mostly fresh as you can guess	14:22
wazd	VDVsx: I'm gonna finish main menu iconsnow :)	14:22
VDVsx	ok, same here, and the same issue :)	14:22
VDVsx	wazd, cool :)	14:22
javispedro	VDVsx, http://pastebin.com/m7c042379	14:23
VDVsx	wazd, already made a Fremantle package with the mixed UI :P, waiting for feedback	14:23
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VDVsx	javispedro, many thanks :)	14:23
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javispedro	never mind. looks like an interesting application.	14:24
wazd	VDVsx: yeah, saw that post	14:24
javispedro	hum... the album covers seem to be affected by the blue/red channels swapped bug	14:24
javispedro	that does not happen on the device, fwiw	14:25
Stskeeps	how do you know? ;)	14:25
lcuk	cos quim said as much in tmo i believe	14:25
javispedro	this prototype kickstand is much squiggy, i tell you ;)	14:26
lcuk	or someone did when the color swapping was mentioned	14:26
lcuk	javispedro, are you nokia employee then?	14:26
lcuk	or are you the guy selling a prototype from the fareast? lol	14:26
lcuk	(or the buyer o_O	14:26
VDVsx	javispedro, if that bug happen in the device, will be one of the major FAILS in history, lol	14:27
Stskeeps	or someone assuming the bug will be there	14:27
qwerty12_N810	I thought that was the 770 with its WSOD ;)	14:27
javispedro	i'm the buyer. want my icbm address? :)	14:27
VDVsx	Stskeeps, true,lolol	14:27
lcuk	VDVsx, what would be worse is if people start working round the issue in their sdk and nokia have to put a cludge fix in hardware to follow the software mods ;)	14:28
javispedro	here it was confirmed https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4870	14:28
VDVsx	lcuk, oh my	14:29
javispedro	the subject is now wrong since it does not happen only in sdl ...	14:29
VDVsx	happens everyhere in my sbox, just passing the mouse under the icons	14:30
javispedro	VDVsx, kill the compositor	14:31
javispedro	the bug must be in cairo or clutter	14:31
javispedro	(or xephyr)	14:31
Mek	I;m only having the color swapping bug in sratchbox, not in the device	14:31
VDVsx	javispedro, my bet too (compositor)	14:32
Woolly	lardman: ping	14:32
javispedro	well, gotta go. gbye	14:32
lardman	Woolly: pong	14:32
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lcuk	is it going to be easier to ask people to put hands up who HASNT got a device?	14:32
Woolly	lardman: did you receive my FYI the other day?	14:32
lardman	Woolly: no I don't think so	14:32
* lcuk wants hardware		14:32
Woolly	lardman: did you try that zbar sample code?	14:33
lardman	no, been pretty busy	14:33
Woolly	lardman: the API has changed slightly with the move from zebra to zbar	14:33
lardman	yes, different import	14:33
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Woolly	lardman: I tried it a few times, on a JPEG that I took with the camera, but I was repeatedly unsucessful	14:34
Woolly	lardman: at decoding the right barcode, I mean	14:35
lcuk	mek, hows your qt stuff comin along	14:35
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lardman	Woolly: I'll try to have a look at it this evening	14:35
lardman	Woolly: take a look at the code VDVsx is talking about, it decodes correctly using zbar afaik	14:36
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Woolly	lardman: I've used swig to create some python bindings for batoo	14:36
lardman	ah ok	14:36
Woolly	VDVsx: can you hit me a link?	14:36
lardman	does that work better then?	14:36
Woolly	lardman: it took me that long to compile the bindings that I didn't have time to test :D	14:38
lcuk	woolly, python bindings from a c library?	14:38
Woolly	lcuk: yeah	14:39
lcuk	:) nice	14:39
Woolly	lcuk: sorry not a library, just a file :D	14:39
Woolly	start simple :D	14:39
Woolly	I didn't have a scratchbox installation until last night, which was a pain	14:40
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pupnik_	the scratchbox vmware images are still broken	14:42
pupnik_	that is inexcusable	14:42
pupnik_	i call for flogging	14:42
lcuk	well since its open source, you are developer noticing bug, its your responsibility to fix it (and flog yourself lol)	14:43
pupnik_	exactly the right answer lcuk	14:43
pupnik_	:/	14:43
lcuk	hahah	14:44
pupnik_	i'm just below the threshold of ... preparing my own food	14:44
pupnik_	ok what is mnost profitable use of time nao	14:45
lcuk	i suggest 5 minutes of ball scratching followed by making dinner (after washing hands)	14:45
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pupnik_	good general advice	14:46
lardman	hmm, lowering the tone a bit too much at this time of day	14:46
lcuk	agreed	14:46
pupnik_	in my case i need to arrange therapy for back. and i delayed that too long	14:46
lcuk	pupnik, dont mention making your own food again	14:46
pupnik_	i've made great meals!	14:46
lcuk	uh huh :D	14:47
pupnik_	turkish girlfriend who studied to be chef in thailand	14:47
pupnik_	lived there and in khabul	14:47
pupnik_	afghanistan	14:47
pupnik_	taught me some stuff	14:47
lcuk	cool	14:47
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RST38h	wow	14:48
lcuk	\o vanishing, bbiab	14:48
lardman	right, work to be done, see you all later	14:49
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pupnik_	cu lardman\|afk	14:49
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mandara	omg, n810 is 117£ at expansys. So tempting...	15:01
VDVsx	Woolly, https://garage.maemo.org/scm/?group_id=972 (the UI has some problems atm)	15:02
Woolly	thanks VDVsx	15:03
wazd	I got a ing sound when someone mentions UI and problems in the same sentence :)	15:04
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VDVsx	Woolly, and for simple python bindings, you should take a look to cython	15:04
VDVsx	wazd, lol	15:04
VDVsx	this is code from one of the GSoC projects, not mine :P	15:05
Woolly	VDVsx: will do	15:05
VDVsx	Woolly, is much more simple IMO :)	15:05
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VDVsx	humm, don't think so: http://uk.techcrunch.com/2009/08/11/nokia-ditching-symbian-for-maemo-german-ft-reports/	15:15
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X-Fade	VDVsx: I'm sure that they have done some nice investigation into the issue. _not_ ;)	15:17
VDVsx	X-Fade, well, at least they refer the maemo summit :)	15:18
Stskeeps	VDVsx: how many people did you budget with would attend the summit?	15:18
X-Fade	VDVsx: Hmm indeed.	15:18
X-Fade	Stskeeps: 300-ish	15:18
VDVsx	yup	15:19
VDVsx	max 350, afaik	15:19
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Stskeeps	VDVsx: i personally wouldn't discount the rumours entirely	15:19
X-Fade	Otherwise we would have to switch to the location shows in wazd's banner ;)	15:19
qwerty12_N810	VDVsx: They're probably still mad over Bochum ;)	15:19
VDVsx	X-Fade, arena ?	15:20
X-Fade	That location could host a few thousand ;)	15:20
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VDVsx	qwerty12_N810, humm, Bochum, factory closed, isn't it ?	15:21
qwerty12_N810	yep	15:21
X-Fade	Well, whatever happens, I don't think 'ditching' will be it.	15:22
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VDVsx	remembered the history, politics told people to throw away their nokia devices :P	15:23
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MaceN810	i need to start from scratch	15:34
MaceN810	heh	15:34
Stskeeps	that'll be a sweet beer.	15:35
MaceN810	heh	15:36
MaceN810	not because things are going bad	15:36
MaceN810	but because i underestimated how much space i need	15:36
pupnik_	doc\|home: coming to amsterdam?	15:36
pupnik_	want to have a chat?	15:36
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MaceN810	my internal sd is going to run out of space	15:37
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MaceN810	the openoffice build itself will run out soon	15:38
MaceN810	blah... bbl. let me do this	15:38
pupnik_	i met one of the openoffice guys at linuxtag	15:38
pupnik_	are you having some success?	15:38
MaceN810	let alone when i try to build kde4 on the tablet in maemo	15:38
pupnik_	:/	15:38
pupnik_	128MB is so 1997	15:39
VDVsx	humm, more changes in Qt SW	15:39
slonopotamus	MaceN810, don't even try	15:39
MaceN810	doing it on the internal 2G	15:39
slonopotamus	MaceN810, not enough ram to compile cpp	15:39
slonopotamus	MaceN810, _ram_	15:39
MaceN810	slonopotamus, heh	15:39
MaceN810	even with the swap in maemo?	15:40
MaceN810	thats 256	15:40
Mek	as long as you don't compile qt-webkit it should be fin eI think...	15:40
slonopotamus	MaceN810, wd reboots when >~100mb swap used	15:41
qwerty12_N810	MaceN810: you do know that KDE4 packages already exist for Diablo, right?	15:41
ShadowJK	When swapping becomes so slow that the wd kicker doesn't run often enough :)	15:41
MaceN810	qwerty12_N810, was using it as the tester	15:42
MaceN810	for the building enviroment	15:42
MaceN810	heh	15:42
slonopotamus	brb	15:42
MaceN810	the sdk repo is awesome	15:42
qwerty12_N810	It'll be enough to prove that you should install the SDK on a computer :P	15:42
MaceN810	they have put a LOT of dev libs etc	15:43
MaceN810	hahaha	15:43
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MaceN810	qwerty12_N810, i am	15:43
MaceN810	my n810 is a computer	15:43
slonopotamus_	MaceN810, either use crosscompiler or qemu for kde (luke built it in qemu)	15:44
MaceN810	i remember Stskeeps saying that at his mer thing on the video	15:44
qwerty12_N810	Just with lower RAM right? :)	15:44
MaceN810	and cpu speed ;)	15:44
MaceN810	the whole proof of concept is that someone can treat an n810 as a computer	15:45
qwerty12_N810	You seem to have a computer always-on (no, I'm not talking about the N810), so just install scratchbox on that and ssh in from the N810 and use something like sshfs to shift your files about	15:46
MaceN810	what if there was a nuclear war and you only have your nokia tablet and need to dev something to stop the war?	15:46
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MaceN810	hehe	15:46
Stskeeps	MaceN810: you write a turing machine in busybox	15:47
Stskeeps	:P	15:47
qwerty12_N810	I wouldn't place faith in my tablet then :)	15:47
MaceN810	hahhaaha	15:47
Stskeeps	yeah, a gun would be immensely more useful	15:47
Stskeeps	:P	15:47
MaceN810	qwerty12_N810, i will get this going	15:48
qwerty12_N810	It could a plot for yet-another-cheesy-we're-all-gonna-die film	15:48
qwerty12_N810	+be	15:48
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MaceN810	hahahaaha	15:48
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MaceN810	wow	15:48
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Stskeeps	murrayc: any luck with getting the example keyboard to show yet?	15:51
Stskeeps	(i follow the svn repo so)	15:51
MaceN810	qwerty12_N810, i have ocd when it comes to this	15:51
MaceN810	;)	15:51
qwerty12_N810	hehe	15:51
MaceN810	i cant stop til it works	15:51
slonopotamus_	btw. is there vkb working with qt?	15:51
Stskeeps	qt-maemo has HIM support afaik	15:51
MaceN810	bbl	15:51
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pupnik_	qwerty12_N810: how is nokia marketing connecting with the FOSS community to help us decide what are the things that are important?	15:52
slonopotamus_	Stskeeps, patching again? :(	15:52
pupnik_	or is nokia trying to create a 'surprise' effect from internal developments	15:52
pupnik_	sorry for the vague question	15:52
qwerty12_N810	pupnik_: that question would be better asked to someone more active with community stuff, sorry :)	15:52
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pupnik_	i just feel so far away from the typical consumer of a cell phone	15:53
pupnik_	never bought one myself	15:53
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zerojay	I only bought one for tethering.	15:54
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zerojay	$80 for an N95.	15:54
pupnik_	well the meta-description of a cell phone is "access to the information you want"	15:54
zerojay	Why not?	15:54
pupnik_	$80?!?!	15:54
Stskeeps	zerojay: good job on the proof reading btw	15:54
timeless_mbp	proofing what?	15:54
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zerojay	I work for a game company and we did cell phone games. When we switched to console stuff, we sold off the used phones so i grabbed the n95.	15:55
pupnik_	ah ok	15:56
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zerojay	Timeless: hig, maemo 5 dev manual.. Other stuff.	15:56
zerojay	Thanks whomever said that.	15:56
timeless_mbp	which reminds me	15:56
timeless_mbp	i should look at the fremantle doc	15:56
zerojay	N810 doesn't show your name for some reason, lol	15:56
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zerojay	Working on mafw now.	15:57
Stskeeps	timeless_mbp: zerojay's a probable partner in crime in your mission to have better language in maemo ;)	15:57
zerojay	Yes, definitely.	15:58
qwerty12_N810	Timeless and zerojay Vs. Finglish	15:58
pupnik_	i am registrant #100	15:58
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zerojay	Hah.	15:58
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pupnik_	i suggest nokia reverse payment to airsoft shop gmbh butzbach	15:59
pupnik_	now, publically, before the year is up	15:59
pupnik_	oh maybe it is up	15:59
* RST38h wonders what Finglish looks like		16:00
Macer	RST38h: same as spanglish	16:00
zerojay	Better than Frenglish.	16:00
RST38h	Macer: Really? The languages are so much different	16:00
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pupnik_	no comment doc\|home ?	16:01
Macer	butchered english is always the same	16:01
Macer	i saw an italian and a chinese guy with horrible accents	16:01
RST38h	No, you can butcher it in different ways	16:01
Macer	speaking chinglish... and italianglish	16:02
Macer	understood each other	16:02
Macer	it was weird	16:02
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RST38h	Besides, I do not mean the pronounciation, mine isn't very good either	16:02
zerojay	Gotta love when indian guys who can barely speak the language telling me i don't know my own language.	16:02
RST38h	Just the grammar	16:02
zerojay	an are is needed in there somewhere.	16:03
* RST38h remembers a German-written AmigaOS Bible book that had 700+ pages written in Germanglish		16:03
RST38h	You could almost see them mentally capitalizing every noun =)	16:03
Macer	shit	16:03
Macer	going to have to take a ton of screen shots	16:03
Macer	blah	16:03
* Macer gets teh charger		16:04
zerojay	Most of the problem with the stuff on twiki is just that it often sounds awkward.	16:04
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RST38h	Meanwhile: Nintendo Patents Inflatable Horse Controller	16:05
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X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: I'm sorry for the other errors you saw, should now _really_ be fixed ;)	16:09
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qwerty12_N810	My fault, anyway, I didn't know Fremantle didn't have librsvg available :)	16:11
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qwerty12_N810	I guess I have a reason to install the SDK now...	16:11
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: yeah, but those error running xxxx didn't help :)	16:11
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X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: Shall I try to see if the diablo version builds?	16:13
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: librsvg_2.18.2	16:13
qwerty12_N810	That'd save time. Thanks :)	16:13
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X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: Building now.	16:14
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chx	is Jason Carter here?	16:21
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/librsvg_2.18.2-1terje2/armel.build.log.FAILED.txt	16:21
zerojay	That's me.	16:22
zerojay	Scary.	16:22
qwerty12_N810	X-Fade: grumble, thanks for uploading anyway	16:22
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: I can try the lenny version..	16:22
zerojay	What's up and how much do I owe you? lol	16:22
chx	zerojay: hi.	16:22
chx	zerojay: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4636	16:22
VDVsx	zerojay, you got busted, you are the guy with the n900 proto :P	16:23
qwerty12_N810	X-Fade: if it wouldn't be any trouble, then, yes please	16:23
chx	zerojay: so how did you install this so that it works?	16:23
zerojay	Lol, i fucking wish!	16:23
qwerty12_N810	hehe	16:23
zerojay	Chx: install rtcomm.	16:23
chx	zerojay: hmmm	16:25
zerojay	I have a very basic set of apps installed. More vanilla than most.	16:25
chx	you mean http://rtcomm.garage.maemo.org/ this?	16:25
zerojay	It just works for me and i'm typing this from my n810.	16:26
zerojay	Yeah.	16:26
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chx	and then?	16:28
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zerojay	And then reboot and use it.	16:29
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: Ok, more missing deps: https://garage.maemo.org/builder/fremantle/librsvg_2.22.2-2lenny1/armel.root.log.FAILED.txt	16:35
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qwerty12_N810	Heh, fun. I'll get the SDK installed today and go through them :)	16:37
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X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: I'll try the libgsf one and if that fails, I'll stop ;)	16:37
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qwerty12_N810	Fair enough ;)	16:37
TheFatal	can any1 help me ??	16:38
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TheFatal	i have a problem whit user passwd	16:38
zerojay	I don't know, can we?	16:38
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TheFatal	:S	16:39
zerojay	What's the issue?	16:39
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X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: Ok, stopping now: E: Couldn't find package libbonobo2-dev	16:40
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: I'm guessing that is going to pull in the whole of gnome.	16:40
qwerty12_N810	:\	16:40
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: So your best bet is using the 2.18 one from diabo. I think terje did some hacking there already.	16:41
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TheFatal	as root i type echo 'user ALL=(ALL) ALL' >> /etc/sudoers	16:43
TheFatal	and now all actions needs passwd	16:44
Mek	wont libosso-gsf-1-dev be enough perhaps?	16:44
TheFatal	:S	16:44
Mek	(instead of libgsf-1-dev)	16:44
fiferboy	lbt: Ping?	16:44
X-Fade	Mek: Sounds plausible.	16:44
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Macer	well	16:46
Macer	just added another couple pages to the "BLOG" heh	16:47
chx	zerojay: among the accounts , now I see an IRC setup, that's better! how do i connect...?	16:47
Macer	need to start from scratch to log everythign i am doing because i really went off on a tagent trying to get it all working quickly haha	16:47
Macer	lost track of my progress	16:47
X-Fade	qwerty12_N810: The 2.18 version doesn't seem to use libgsf at all.	16:48
GAN800	chx, you'll need the Collabora repo from gronmayer too.	16:48
zerojay	Chx create an account, type in a server.	16:48
qwerty12_N810	X-Fade: noted. Thanks for the help.	16:48
chx	zerojay: thats done	16:48
chx	zerojay: the screen i see says "add contact" "no contacts found"	16:49
zerojay	Then open contacts, choose open chatroom, select your irc account and the put #chatroom, hit enter.	16:49
lcuk	macer, link	16:49
zerojay	Add account not contact	16:49
talig1	GTK question no. 10203052: Anyone here using Pidgin?	16:49
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chx	zerojay: the account is there. when i open the chat menu it's all greyed out.	16:50
chx	oh doh	16:50
zerojay	Got it?	16:51
chx	it says network error	16:51
GAN800	chx, also: XChat is better.	16:52
zerojay	Xchat's terrible.	16:52
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zerojay	Rather not use irc at all than use xchat, lol	16:52
chx	irc.freenode.net	16:52
zerojay	Yep	16:53
chx	from phone and from wifi both 'network error'	16:53
zerojay	No idea, works for me.	16:53
zerojay	Both wifi and cell which i'm on now.	16:54
chx	running host irc.freenode.net from terminal returns a bazillion of IPs :/	16:54
chx	so the network connection is fine	16:54
zerojay	Maybe you have something installed or tweaked causing it.	16:55
zerojay	Rtcomm installed after flash... It's all good.	16:55
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GAN800	zerojay, rtcomm is hell on a tablet compared to XChat.	16:57
GAN800	Doesn't even have nick coloring.	16:57
zerojay	I turn that shit off right away, lol	16:57
GAN800	I can't function without it.	16:58
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zerojay	I've been on irc for 11 years or so. Met my wife on it. Never ever used nick coloring. Just annoys me.	16:59
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zerojay	Like i cant be trusted to read and recognise a nick.	16:59
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Macer	lcuk: ?	17:02
Myrtti	I can do both - but colours just make the association a bit quicker	17:02
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Macer	http://tech.rancorous.net/2009/08/10/maemo-project-dev-and-pkg-sytem-in-maemo-2-the-control-flash/	17:02
Macer	working on that section now	17:02
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talig	Unbelievably enough, I'm writing some sort of a chatroom for the N810... Does anyone know if to list the people in the room the widget I should use is list/tree view?	17:10
talig	[in order for a person to be selectable, and therefore possible to send private messages]	17:11
mgedmin	why not?	17:11
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talig	brb	17:12
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lcuk	Macer, link to your blog	17:15
alterego	That kind of depends on whether your contact list is heirarchical or not.	17:15
Macer	tech.rancorous.net	17:16
Macer	well. http://tech.rancorous.net	17:17
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lopz	hola	17:19
Macer	hola tu	17:19
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talig1	Sorry if anyone answered while I was gone... ideas?	17:24
chx	so which daemon serves chat in case i want to try restrating it	17:25
zerojay	There isn't, i don't think.	17:25
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chx	well surely there is	17:25
chx	i mean, you need to reboot to see the online marker in the status bar	17:25
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chx	see AIM connects	17:27
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chx	MSN fails	17:28
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zerojay	Works for me.	17:29
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chx	is there a system level log?	17:31
chx	so i can see mor ethan "network error"?	17:31
chx	/var/log is empty	17:31
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zerojay	Maybe /var/log/messages	17:34
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chx	the whol e/var/log dir is empty	17:34
xnt14[work]	musicbot: mizuki nana: Eternal Blaze	17:34
chx	gtalk works	17:35
chx	this is weird...	17:35
xnt14[work]	musicbot: ayumi hamasaki: Thousand Arms	17:35
xnt14[work]	hmm	17:35
xnt14[work]	my win32 port of musicbot work :)	17:35
GAN800	zerojay, well, I can too, but coloring makes it a lot faster.	17:36
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mgedmin	chx: dmesg	17:36
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mgedmin	or you could install sysklogd	17:36
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mgedmin	don't keep it; constantly writing to flash memory is bad for its life expectancy	17:36
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chx	mgedmin: dmesg \|tail only has EAC mode: play enabled, rec enabled and EAC mode: play disabled, rec disabled alternating. lots.	17:39
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lbt	fiferboy: pong	17:43
fiferboy	lbt: Hey. Are you still working on OBS?	17:44
lbt	not 100% - still using it and what have you	17:44
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lbt	what were you wondering?	17:45
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fiferboy	lbt: Have you looked at the finger scrolling changes at all?	17:45
lbt	not recently... not compiled Qt since starting the OBS thing...	17:47
lbt	hmm	17:47
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lbt	OK, I'll pull it into git locally and review	17:48
fiferboy	Cool	17:49
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lbt	yep, for sure that needs pulling into Mer	17:50
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coldboot	fiferboy: I found a bug.	18:19
fiferboy	coldboot: A bug in what?	18:19
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coldboot	The flashing fix.	18:20
fiferboy	How big of a bug?	18:21
coldboot	Small and rare.	18:21
coldboot	Remember when I tried your quick fix.	18:21
fiferboy	Yes	18:21
coldboot	The one where we didn't bother sending a Hildon Command if the widget wasn't HIM capable?	18:21
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coldboot	And in our application, when you did that, entering text in that place caused events to drop through the popup window, hitting the widget below.	18:22
fiferboy	Yes, and you had a problem in your program that I couldn't find in any I had installed	18:22
coldboot	Yeah.	18:22
fiferboy	Okay	18:22
coldboot	Well that seems to come up now, sometimes, if you get suggested words as you're typing in that same LineEdit.	18:23
fiferboy	You have a line edit with a completer on it, and clicking on a suggestion in the completer drops through?	18:24
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coldboot	Not clicking on the suggestion, clicking on some other dropdown widget while a suggested word is present.	18:26
coldboot	If you keep typing gibberish, and make the suggested word go away, then it's safe to click on something else.	18:26
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fiferboy	coldboot: Is your line edit in a QDialog?	18:26
coldboot	Not sure, let me check.	18:27
coldboot	Ah, it's a bug with my code.	18:27
coldboot	Oh wait, maybe not.	18:27
fiferboy	I have several lineEdits with completers, but none of them popup the list automatically so I can't test	18:28
coldboot	Can you turn off completers per Qt widget, or is a global HIM setting?	18:31
coldboot	Okay it's not necessarily something with suggested words.	18:32
coldboot	I'll test this for a while to find the exact cause.	18:32
fiferboy	completers are controlled per widget	18:33
coldboot	How do you turn it off?	18:33
fiferboy	You could try: lineEdit->setCompleter(NULL)	18:34
fiferboy	s/(NULL)/()/	18:34
infobot	fiferboy meant: You could try: lineEdit->setCompleter()	18:34
fiferboy	Hmm, it looks like NULL was correct, at least for setCompleter(QCompleter *c), c has to be zero to clear it	18:35
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coldboot	fiferboy: I don't think it's a bug in the flicker fix anymore.	18:58
coldboot	fiferboy: It turns out our popup dialogues are widgets and make their own loops.	18:59
coldboot	There's some problem with the loop exiting prematurely.	18:59
coldboot	Hence the events going through it into the widgets below.	19:00
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GAN800	Stskeeps, karma whore 2,508, karma whore. :P	19:08
alterego	Yeah, my karma is like .. 4	19:08
Stskeeps	GAN800: 2508? :P	19:09
GAN800	Thanks	19:09
alterego	I must have done something bad in a previous life, or this one.	19:09
Stskeeps	i have 2508 thanks? thought it was 1000	19:09
* alterego can think of a few bad things he's done in this life actually.		19:09
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GAN800	Stskeeps, no, I do. ;)	19:11
* qwerty12_N810 is waiting for his Thanks! count to be recalculated again. maemo.org's forgotten that I have an Talk amount, and quite a bit of thanks to go with, and has lowered my karma count :(. Remember, kids: I'm the true karma whore.		19:11
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coldboot	fiferboy: Still there? I have more info.	19:11
Stskeeps	qwerty12_N810: report it :) you deserve your karma for certain	19:11
qwerty12_N810	Just waiting another day; X-Fade said that talk karma is calculated every two days or so :)	19:12
Jaffa	qwerty12_N810: tmo's downtime at the weekend obviously coincided with a karma recount	19:16
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zerojay	I was shocked to see how much i had even though i haven't been around much. Was right around when thanks got implemented that i stopped, i think.	19:17
Jaffa	qwerty12_N810: s/talk karma/karma/	19:17
qwerty12_N810	:)	19:17
lcuk	zerojay, it was your post offering instructions on picking up hot chix with your tablet that did the job	19:17
zerojay	Yeah, i know :)	19:18
Jaffa	X-Fade and I have also been working on 9.08-05 and linking tmo accounts where email addresses match; and highlighting ones which are invalid and identifying people who should create/link to get voting rights	19:19
zerojay	Someone took a pic of me using the n810 on the bus and was flipping out thinking it was an n900 proto, lol	19:19
javispedro	heh :)	19:19
Andy80	LOL :D	19:19
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lcuk	wait	19:19
lcuk	you actually had someone in the street recognise your nokia tablet?	19:20
zerojay	Yes.	19:20
zerojay	Surprise, surprise.	19:20
lcuk	most folks who see mine ask "is it a phone"	19:20
lcuk	and dont get its a tablet	19:20
zerojay	Usually i got "is that an iphone?"	19:20
Andy80	aome of my friends ask "oh! is it the iPhone?" O_o	19:20
zerojay	"Fuck no!"	19:21
Andy80	:D	19:21
Andy80	me too!	19:21
Andy80	ahahah	19:21
lcuk	iphone is for babies	19:21
lcuk	this is a grown up toy	19:21
lcuk	linux: serious business	19:21
Andy80	lot of people don't understand what a tablet is :)	19:21
zerojay	I'm just waiting to see a blog post pics of me with my n900 proto. Can't wait.	19:22
javispedro	they'll do starting this year: "that apple thing".	19:22
lcuk	they do when i say moses wrote his commandments with one	19:22
zerojay	Lol	19:22
lcuk	the true nokia prototype	19:22
qwerty12_N810	zerojay: you should change address or something - you'll get people breaking into your house thinking you've have the N900 proto :P	19:22
zerojay	nXX at the top of the stones	19:22
qwerty12_N810	-have	19:23
lcuk	you didnt see him using his finger	19:23
lcuk	he had a stylus errrr chisel	19:23
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zerojay	These tablets aren't conductive?!	19:23
javispedro	heh, Maemo Mistral did sound prehistoric but I couldn't imagine how much	19:23
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lcuk	zerojay, capacitive is nice, but its very low resolution	19:25
javispedro	and Moses said "thou shalt not turn your tablet on with USB connected"	19:26
lcuk	hah	19:26
lcuk	:D make a proper list of thoe	19:26
zerojay	I was talking about the stone tablets ;)	19:26
lcuk	and post on tmo	19:26
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qwerty12_N810	He must've been using a 770 ;)	19:26
lcuk	lol zerojay - i suppose they will conduct lightening	19:27
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javispedro	aha... finally, the kamikaze ai bug fixed	19:28
javispedro	serves me right for believing an updated gcc version whould fix what I should've workarounded in the first place	19:28
woglinde	kamikaze ai?	19:29
javispedro	random breakage in mario kart in the snes emu port	19:29
woglinde	ah	19:30
javispedro	also, a note to those adventurous who try a newer toolchain for diablo: if you're using pthreads and g++, use static libgcc	19:30
woglinde	javis the if's?	19:30
javispedro	woglinde, yep. the code seemed right at first glance with the updated gcc, but a closer look revealed it was not doing the right thing either	19:31
javispedro	so I just swapped around the ifs	19:31
javispedro	and now it works in all gcc versions	19:31
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woglinde	hehe	19:32
woglinde	wonders of optimazations	19:32
fiferboy	coldboot: I'm back	19:33
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woglinde	jo fiferboy	19:35
fiferboy	Hey woglinde	19:35
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* GAN800 wonders if people who write "Freemantle" feel embarrassed.		19:42
zerojay	Nope. :)	19:42
qwerty12_N810	Freemantle.	19:42
qwerty12_N810	Nope.	19:42
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coldboot	What stuff do you guys remove to make more space on your device?	19:47
woglinde	install on the sd card	19:48
qwerty12_N810	I remove the tutorial and I install localepurge. Also, I get rid of the video that comes with it	19:48
woglinde	there is enough space	19:48
coldboot	What do you mean you install "localpurge"?	19:48
GAN800	qwerty12_N810, I'll feel embarrassed for you, then.	19:49
woglinde	apt-cache show localepurge	19:50
qwerty12_N810	GAN800: That's generous of you. :)	19:50
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GAN800	Hey, I'm always happy to help. :P	19:50
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qwerty12_N810	:D	19:50
coldboot	woglinde: What repo is it in? I don't have in my apt-cache.	19:51
qwerty12_N810	coldboot: I put out a deb on Talk somewhere. It'll zap all locales that aren't English everytime you install something	19:51
coldboot	ah cool	19:51
woglinde	coldboot ask qwerty	19:51
coldboot	Automatically?	19:51
qwerty12_N810	Yep	19:51
woglinde	coldboot you can configure it	19:51
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woglinde	on my debian I delete all stuff which is not german	19:51
qwerty12_N810	It needs cleaning up though, I could remove its dependency on color-ls easily	19:52
woglinde	why its depend on color-ls?=	19:52
woglinde	and why didnt you put in extras?	19:52
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qwerty12_N810	Because it was a package done by dpkg-deb and its defaults is to nuke everything that is not en, en-US, or en-GB (real English) and I doubt it'd go down well with people not using English...	19:53
coldboot	qwerty12_N810: Is it not in the apt repo?	19:53
qwerty12_N810	Nope	19:53
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woglinde	qwerty12_N810 hm istn maemo using debconf?	19:54
qwerty12_N810	Nope	19:54
woglinde	hm thats a pity	19:54
woglinde	and design error	19:54
woglinde	hahaha	19:54
qwerty12_N810	We have "fakedebconf". Yay!	19:54
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coldboot	qwerty12_N810: Thanks, lots of free space now.	19:58
zerojay	How much more?	19:58
coldboot	zerojay: About 40mb.	19:58
zerojay	Nice.	19:59
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woglinde	hm vmware buys springsource	19:59
woglinde	intressting	19:59
Jaffa	Very odd	19:59
Jaffa	Haven't checked the PR yet. Any reason given?	19:59
woglinde	hm platform as service	20:00
woglinde	and cloud stuff	20:00
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mlpug	cloud makes people panic and they just buy something	20:02
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woglinde	mlpug vmware is the cloud	20:02
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coldboot	fiferboy: I think it's because I'm setting the him proxy to null if they keyboard is being hidden.	20:06
fiferboy	coldboot: What is the alternative?	20:07
coldboot	fiferboy: I'm not sure.	20:07
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coldboot	fiferboy: I'm going to just never set it to null and see what happens.	20:07
fiferboy	coldboot: Ok. Make sure to try hiding the OSK and typing with the hardware keyboard and see where the input goes	20:08
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Khertan_n810	Hi all !	20:20
zerojay	Hey	20:20
caotic	I think this is more like a cellphone than a tablet http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/08/nokia-rx-51-tablet-captured-in-the-wild	20:20
zerojay	Yes.	20:20
Khertan_n810	qwerty12 : i ve tryed to use hippo on my n810	20:20
Khertan_n810	qwerty12: but it s really too slow to be useable :(	20:21
qwerty12_N810	:(	20:21
Khertan_n810	caotic : nokia said that isn t a smartphone :)	20:21
Khertan_n810	qwerty12 : 10s to draw a month view, 10s to manage where a clic happen	20:22
caotic	Khertan_n810: but the Sym key ( top left) makes me wonder if it stands for Symbian, wich will totaly suck	20:22
lcuk	:( Khertan_n810	20:22
lcuk	caotic, more likely it would be for symbol	20:23
Khertan_n810	i ll come back to a gtk.drawarea custom view	20:23
javispedro	http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2009/08/090811-ent-02.jpg	20:23
javispedro	ugly, but a proper keyboard :)	20:23
Khertan_n810	caotic it s more sym like the chr key	20:23
lcuk	javispedro, whats dat	20:24
javispedro	http://www.engadget.com/2009/08/11/android-turns-up-on-mids-from-eston-sfr/	20:24
lcuk	looks like a MACK phone	20:24
caotic	I guess, but wha happa, what about the tasks controlling keys, am not that into soft buttons	20:24
lcuk	eh?	20:25
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Khertan_n810	caotic ... it could be a soft button or a shortcut	20:25
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lcuk	it looks hard in the picture	20:25
RST38h	moo, javis	20:26
lcuk	do you think its a holo projection?	20:26
Khertan_n810	javispedro : proper if you ar 12 years old ... key is too small	20:26
RST38h	javis: this is a seriously ugly device	20:26
lcuk	we have Fn Shift Chr and Ctrl on n810 dont we	20:26
Khertan_n810	keys are too small	20:26
Khertan_n810	:)	20:26
javispedro	looks like you're gonna end up with dirty hands if you just touch it	20:26
lcuk	oil from the rig	20:27
RST38h	javis: it will end up with your dirty prints rather	20:27
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lcuk	booo my tablet is dead	20:27
lcuk	it was alive when i left	20:27
lcuk	it	20:27
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caotic	it suppose to run on ompa3, wonder if the cpu will be jucier.	20:27
Khertan_n810	import gtknimport caironimport pangonimport pangocaironimport hildonnimport datetimenimport dateutilnnclass AgView(gtk.DrawingArea):nn def __init__(self):n gtk.DrawingArea.__init__(self)n self.eventsList = []n self.current_date = datetime.date(2009,3,1)n self.start_hour = 9n self.end_hour = 19n self.mode = 2n self.callback= Nonen #0 -> Dayn #1 -> Weekn #2 -> Monthn self.c	20:27
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Khertan_n810	oups sorry ... dirty copy/paste	20:27
lcuk	====SEPTEMBER==	20:28
lcuk	Arrive at summit	20:28
coldboot	fiferboy: The hardware keyboard is sending events directly to the widget...	20:28
lcuk	Get drunk	20:28
qwerty12_N810	Smoke weed	20:28
fiferboy	coldboot: Ah, right	20:28
qwerty12_N810	Smoke weed	20:28
RST38h	when is the summit, again?	20:28
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Khertan_n810	lol	20:28
lcuk	lol	20:28
coldboot	fiferboy: Which also sometimes happens with the stylus keyboard...	20:28
lcuk	you forgot black jack	20:28
Khertan_n810	still no news about sponsoring ?	20:28
coldboot	fiferboy: Always happens with hardware keyboard, sometimes with stylus keyboard, to be clear.	20:28
RST38h	qwerty: 1. Find out that N900 is not coming until Christmas 2. Smoke weed. 3. Goto 2.	20:28
fiferboy	coldboot: So, the problem always happens with the hardware keyborad or never?	20:29
Khertan_n810	RST38h : syntax error label N900 unknow	20:29
coldboot	fiferboy: I don't know what you mean. My last sentence should be unambiguous.	20:29
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fiferboy	coldboot: "Always happens" is the problem always happens, the the key stroke gets sent to the widget?	20:30
coldboot	fiferboy: As soon as I press a single hardware key with the LineEdit having focus, QApplication::x11ProcessEvent() executes where keywidget = LineEdit. And the keystroke gets sent to the widget.	20:30
coldboot	fiferboy: I also see a flash, so it's getting converted to a native X-Window.	20:30
wazd	RST38h: maybe devs can order one earlier	20:30
RST38h	wazd: Yea, right	20:31
RST38h	wazd: Last time, it was rather kafkian experience	20:31
Khertan_n810	wazd : it s not 1st april ?	20:31
lcuk	coldboot, fiferboy i was peeking in qt keyboard code, its very well formatted, but its still a bit of a rats nest in there aint it	20:31
wazd	Khertan_n810: I suppose not :)	20:31
coldboot	lcuk: Why would XEvents be getting sent directly to the widget from the hardware keyboard?	20:32
lcuk	isnt that the normal expected flow of things	20:32
coldboot	lcuk: fiferboy: I think I'll retrofit the proxy code to be used all the time.	20:32
lcuk	key event occurs	20:32
lcuk	widget handles	20:32
RST38h	wazd: I guess, if the Nokia's official USA reseller could subject me to an anal probe over the phone, they would	20:32
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Khertan_n810	so about the summit someone know if there is news about sponsord travel ?	20:32
wazd	RST38h: :D	20:32
RST38h	wazd: Fortunately, they had to satisfy themselves by asking about pretty much all my relatives having US bank accounts	20:33
lcuk	Khertan_n810, i think we will hear soon	20:33
Khertan_n810	ah ok	20:33
lcuk	we have to lol	20:33
lcuk	those that plan on going have to finalize work holiday bookings	20:33
lcuk	no point in arranging time off if cant go etc	20:33
wazd	I think Fremantle Star devs would be given with new devices, then the ones who submitted to the dev program	20:34
wazd	So I think we'll terrorizing lcuk very soon :D	20:34
lcuk	i'd give my right hand to get a device	20:34
qwerty12_N810	They may be happy with just a finger ;)	20:35
lcuk	:O	20:35
Khertan_n810	wazd > i hope that they will not be the only one	20:35
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javispedro	lcuk, and both kidneys. that or a life contract with t-mobila	20:35
lcuk	:(	20:35
lcuk	but i already gave both kidneys	20:35
Khertan_n810	a question about fremantle how they have been choosen ?	20:35
RST38h	that AND the life contract	20:35
Khertan_n810	s/fremantle/fremantle stars	20:36
wazd	Khertan_n810: well, htey were chosen long ago, don't exactly remember how	20:36
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Khertan_n810	as i don t see any usefull things except liqbase :)	20:36
Khertan_n810	s/any/anything	20:36
coldboot	fiferboy: lcuk: It also seems that "nativeParentWidget()" doesn't always return the actual nativeParentWidget...	20:36
Khertan_n810	ah and mauku	20:36
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wazd	Khertan_n810: have you seen the list?	20:36
lcuk	Khertan_n810, you havent looked at ecoach?	20:37
Khertan_n810	wazd ... yep i ve seen the list	20:37
lcuk	or osm2go	20:37
Khertan_n810	the one on the wiki	20:37
lcuk	ecoach is spectacular in both implementation and what it can expand to :)	20:37
Khertan_n810	maybe not up to date	20:37
wazd	Khertan_n810: well, you're the first person that calls OMWeather useless :D	20:37
lcuk	and osm2go gives gps fiddlers something to play with	20:38
wazd	Other apps are pretty handy too	20:38
lbt	coldboot: !	20:38
Khertan_n810	wazd ... yep maybe because meteo prevision is always wrong	20:38
lcuk	i actually think omweather is useless	20:38
RST38h	ehehe	20:38
lcuk	how many times do you look at your weather, look out of the window and say "WRONG!"	20:38
javispedro	everyday	20:38
coldboot	lbt: What?	20:38
lcuk	not the fault of a technically amazing app	20:38
lcuk	javispedro, now, what if you could correct it..	20:39
RST38h	lcuk: You should turn off the internal NIT sensor temperatrue display	20:39
Khertan_n810	yep ...	20:39
wazd	lcuk: well, my forecasts are pretty accurate	20:39
lcuk	wazd, read that	20:39
lcuk	same app	20:39
javispedro	it's fun how they say "this weekend it's gonna rain A LOT" on monday	20:39
lcuk	but allow you to put it right	20:39
qwerty12_N810	lcuk: what's there to be wrong about in the north? Monday: Raining, Tuesday: Raining, etc.	20:39
lcuk	like you do with a barometer thing	20:39
lbt	It also seems that "nativeParentWidget()" doesn't always return the actual nativeParentWidget...	20:39
javispedro	"it's gonna rain a bit" on wednesday	20:39
lcuk	you fiddle and twiddle the dial	20:39
RST38h	wazd: In here, I do not need omweather to forecast stuff =)	20:39
Khertan_n810	except <the design	20:39
javispedro	then "100% sunny" on friday	20:39
javispedro	every week	20:39
RST38h	wazd: "Same as yesterday, a bit colder if clouds, a bit warmer otherwise"	20:39
wazd	RST38h: Well, I check crrent weather everytime I go out :)	20:40
lcuk	then link it with an online service and show what your friends around you think the weather is doing	20:40
wazd	RST38h: just to be safe :)	20:40
javispedro	hm... weather in the cloud service...	20:40
RST38h	wazd: You mean, you never tried looking out of the window? =)	20:40
lcuk	http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1273083&cid=28372117	20:40
lcuk	we are data producers	20:41
wazd	RST38h: I don't have built-in lazer to measure temperature just by looking :)	20:41
lcuk	i hate being simply a consumer :)	20:41
lcuk	imrprovize	20:41
lcuk	improvise even	20:41
RST38h	lcuk: fertilizer producers too	20:41
lcuk	like my spelling	20:41
lcuk	yeah	20:41
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lcuk	that /. link is me incase anyone didnt realise	20:42
wazd	anyway, hope Vlad will get the device asap	20:42
lcuk	yeah hopefully	20:42
lcuk	hes comin to summit isnt he?	20:42
lcuk	we missed him in cph	20:42
wazd	yep	20:43
lcuk	good	20:43
lcuk	you found a way out yet?	20:43
lcuk	are you goin in his suitcase?	20:43
RST38h	lcuk: Ah, sneaky	20:43
wazd	very small chance	20:43
lcuk	RST38h, ?	20:43
RST38h	lcuk: I would never guess it was you at /.	20:43
coldboot	lcuk: lbt: fiferboy: In this form: https://dl.getdropbox.com/u/17699/addBookViewForm.ui titleLineEdit.nativeParentWidget() returns widget_2 ...	20:43
wazd	almost no	20:43
lcuk	hopefully :)	20:43
lcuk	RST38h, :O nahh	20:44
coldboot	lcuk: lbt: fiferboy: Wait, not in every situation, don't bother downloading the form.	20:44
lcuk	was it my northernisms that copped you, or the sig	20:44
lbt	ok	20:44
coldboot	Something happens that converts widget_2 into a native widget, I guess.	20:44
lcuk	anyway, must dash	20:45
lcuk	\o ttyl	20:45
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coldboot	lcuk: one sec	20:46
coldboot	lcuk: Where is the keyboard code?	20:46
lcuk	wazd, when you are looking at omweather, just have a ponder about how a user might interact to correct it	20:46
lcuk	errr in qt	20:46
lcuk	i did a google for it	20:46
lcuk	i wasnt technically interested in qt itself	20:46
lcuk	i needed to know how to use Fn and shift keys in liqbase	20:46
wazd	lcuk: there's absolutely no way to correct weather forecast	20:47
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wazd	lcuk: unless you run your own station	20:47
lcuk	wazd, pie in the sky	20:47
coldboot	lcuk: Is there any special qt-maemo code that gets executed when you press the hardware keys in a Qt app?	20:47
lcuk	how would a user drag/move stuff	20:47
lcuk	forget implementations etc	20:47
wazd	lcuk: it's not in the sky, its far from our galaxy :)	20:47
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lcuk	of course its POSSIBLE to do anything coding wise	20:47
lcuk	im just trying to see if theres a way to make omweather interactive	20:47
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lcuk	thought experiment	20:48
wazd	lcuk: no need in doing OMW interactive	20:48
* javispedro sees qt-him discussion and remembers something		20:48
javispedro	https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4768	20:48
lcuk	ok dont worry	20:48
zerojay	I wonder why shopper is 7mb.	20:48
javispedro	do you know what Antonio meant when he closed/fixed that bug?	20:48
wazd	lcuk: it's only goal is to show the weather forecast the way you want	20:48
lbt	zerojay: ?	20:48
lbt	it's not	20:48
lcuk	wazd, i know, and it does that well	20:48
lbt	it's a few hundred kb	20:48
lbt	Qt on the other hand :)	20:49
lcuk	im merely trying to move to next thing	20:49
lcuk	we have gps	20:49
javispedro	I guess it's fixed as in "fixed in fremantle"	20:49
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lcuk	we know where and when it is	20:49
lcuk	it might be fun to have user reports	20:49
lcuk	thats all	20:49
fiferboy	I think programs in the h-a-m show the total "installed" size with dependencies	20:49
zerojay	Ah, ok	20:49
lbt	yeah, that's misleading... but understandable	20:49
Stskeeps	zerojay: re community translations we do part of it in Mer already - tomaszd is working on it mostly, but no transifex instance yet	20:50
wazd	lcuk: whats the purpose of that expensive thing? :)	20:50
lcuk	what expensive thing	20:50
Stskeeps	zerojay: if you want to team up with him to get some experiments going, feel welcome (#mer)	20:50
wazd	lcuk: user reports	20:50
lcuk	im talking about just having fun, you know "what if.."	20:50
lcuk	if you dont want to ask the question thats cool	20:50
Stskeeps	zerojay: you'll probably need to push some stuff through maemo.org process	20:50
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lcuk	wazd, i am english, discussing the weather is as important as watching the reports	20:51
zerojay	Yeah, that's why i'm asking.	20:51
wazd	lcuk: Maybe that's just me, I always trying to suggest something available	20:51
lcuk	if i could move a slider between sunny and rainy with slick anims it would be fun	20:51
lcuk	it would be something i would want to show my friends	20:51
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wazd	lcuk: I don't understand why people should care bout the weather in other cities :)	20:53
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lcuk	wazd	20:53
lcuk	between myselef and girlfriend we have different weather	20:53
lcuk	i just drove 2 miles and went from totally dry to wet	20:53
wazd	lcuk: use Twitter then :D	20:54
wazd	lcuk: or IM or something :)	20:54
RST38h	lcuk: Run two copies of omweather	20:54
lcuk	:) i will use something	20:54
RST38h	wazd: I suspect the cities where he lives and works have different weather =)	20:54
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lcuk	but not the right weather	20:54
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lcuk	rarely the right weather	20:54
RST38h	The only place with the right weather is California	20:54
lcuk	it can say "rainy patches"	20:55
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RST38h	It is said to eventually drive people mad, too	20:55
lcuk	but the rain might be on off	20:55
lcuk	or not hit at all	20:55
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wazd	lcuk: seriously, the complains about "OMW doesn't show right weather" are fun :) What the hell can we do with that? :)	20:55
lcuk	:) anyway, ill put it in the melting pot	20:55
lcuk	let them change it!	20:55
lcuk	people dont like it when something is wrong	20:55
lcuk	if they could click and make it sunny	20:56
lcuk	they would smile	20:56
RST38h	Meanwhile: US Cell Phone Plans Among World's Most Expensive	20:56
lcuk	"hah, beat the bastard forecast!	20:56
wazd	I already let God to change weather. See what happened :D	20:56
* Jaffa is prepping the election announcement.		20:56
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lcuk	RST38h, you say theres a thermometer in device?	20:57
lcuk	can it get actual ambient temp or just cpu?	20:57
wazd	lcuk: yes, and OMWeather can show it's temp	20:57
javispedro	mine's always at 33ºC so I guess CPU	20:57
wazd	lcuk: I guess cpu	20:57
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lcuk	heh	20:58
lcuk	right, must code anyway	20:58
* lcuk watches the rain falling		20:58
javispedro	I want to code some auto-framerate thingie	20:58
javispedro	SDL	20:58
RST38h	lcuk: yep	20:58
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wazd	ok, gotta go get something to eat	21:00
wazd	I forgot that I eat sometimes )	21:00
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javispedro	pupnik_, you mentioned something about an arm cycle counter? is there more info about that?	21:08
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GAN800	wazd, you're gonna go into a diabetic coma one day and really regret that. :P ;)	21:14
X-Fade	lcuk: It is the temperature of the touch screen.	21:14
lcuk	X-Fade, o'rly	21:14
X-Fade	lcuk: Probably needed as the touch screen is reacting differently when hot/cold.	21:14
lcuk	so i could technically detect if someone is giving it a high 5?	21:14
X-Fade	lcuk: Depends on the energy emitted from your hand and the ambient temp ;)	21:15
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lcuk	heh	21:16
lcuk	"nb, only works in finland"	21:16
X-Fade	lcuk: well the term resistive screen gives you a hint.	21:17
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X-Fade	lcuk: Resistance probably differs with temperature.	21:17
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lcuk	everything differs with temp	21:18
lcuk	GeneralAntilles smiles when its sunny and is a grump when it rains	21:18
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lcuk	X-Fade that does explain why touchscreens alter their sensitivity in different temps	21:19
lcuk	and why some poeple can work on a cold tablet	21:19
X-Fade	lcuk: But who knows, maybe you can measure difference between a stylus and a living finger by the touchscreen values.	21:19
lcuk	oi! go look back into os2006 code	21:20
X-Fade	Not only the area, but also the real values.	21:20
lcuk	its like moon missions, you need some space cowboys	21:20
javispedro	just electrocute the finger with the "conductive" tablet previously described here, if the pressure disappears it was a living finger. if it does not it was a dead finger.	21:20
lcuk	would be simpler takin a pic and counting the fingers lol	21:20
lcuk	can we stop with the attacks on fingers	21:21
VDVsx	ok, my tablet just gone wild, it boots, turn the camera light for a second and than reboots :(	21:21
javispedro	the camera as in, the red light?	21:21
aol	tablets gone wild 4	21:21
javispedro	s/light/led/	21:21
infobot	javispedro meant: the camera as in, the red led?	21:21
lcuk	lol VDVsx put some clothes on	21:21
lcuk	"eeek, vdvsx has no clothes on"	21:22
lcuk	SHUTDOWNSHUTDOWNSHUTDOWN	21:22
X-Fade	When I left my laptop in the my car while it was freezing, it took an hour orso for the touchpad to come back again ;)	21:22
VDVsx	javispedro, blue	21:22
X-Fade	Frozen touchpad, not good.	21:22
javispedro	ah, n800	21:22
lcuk	NO, NOT REALLY	21:22
VDVsx	javispedro, n810	21:22
lcuk	ahem	21:23
javispedro	the camera light is blue?	21:23
lcuk	X-Fade, what range does the 810 have? would that have survived	21:23
lcuk	no, red	21:23
VDVsx	mine is blue,lol	21:23
X-Fade	lcuk: I have no idea, but probably yes.	21:23
lcuk	i know survived isnt the right word	21:23
X-Fade	lcuk: My N95 survived skiing trips just fine.	21:23
javispedro	VDVsx, did you try if the red led is working?	21:23
lcuk	i remember qole taking his with kids in snow on a bike	21:24
lcuk	(mightv been someone else)	21:24
javispedro	maybe it's trying to light "white" (happens to me when wd reboots)	21:24
VDVsx	javispedro, can't do anything :(	21:24
javispedro	reflash time :P	21:25
VDVsx	bahh	21:25
X-Fade	javispedro: There is this color led app which lets you set any color.	21:25
javispedro	aa	21:25
lcuk	X-Fade, cheap laptop then :P	21:25
X-Fade	lcuk: Well touchpad uses IR.	21:25
X-Fade	lcuk: It was just too cold to register the warmth of my fingers.	21:26
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VDVsx	ok, boot Mer, than os2008, and It's working again :)	21:26
VDVsx	I even removed the battery earlier, strange thing	21:27
javispedro	a dirty filesystem	21:27
javispedro	(wild guess)	21:28
VDVsx	probably, it happened after install last mer release	21:28
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johnsq	Hi	21:30
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sh0gun5	hello	21:37
sh0gun5	anyone tried android on n810?	21:37
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johnsq	sh0gun5: why should I run java on a machine, where I can native applications?	21:43
Jaffa	Anyone spot any typos or msitakes before I publish on maemo.org/news/ and talk.maemo.org? http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/2009-August/002665.html	21:45
Jaffa	johnsq: If there's an app you want to run that requires Java, or you want to develop cross-platform applications	21:46
johnsq	Jaffa: yeah, than i use the android emulator.	21:47
konttori__	hmm... is there a java vm that would actually be fast on arm?	21:47
javispedro	cacao works pretty well.	21:48
zerojay	Looks all good here	21:49
javispedro	Jaffa, (of particular interest to	21:49
javispedro	about 1,600 talk.maemo.org account users who are are eliglbe	21:49
Jaffa	konttori__: OpenJDK's just had a new ASM interpreter	21:49
javispedro	^^^ see last word	21:49
Jaffa	javispedro: typo. doh	21:49
Jaffa	javispedro: ta. zerojay: ta	21:49
konttori__	nice. is that fast?	21:49
X-Fade	Jaffa: mornth?	21:50
Jaffa	konttori__: Supposed to be fast. Hang on, let me find the URL: http://lists.evolvis.org/pipermail/jalimo-info/2009-July/000361.html	21:50
Jaffa	X-Fade: Ta.	21:50
javispedro	a, the BIG	21:50
X-Fade	Jaffa: it might be a good idea for canditates to specify what they are going to work on in their term.	21:51
X-Fade	Jaffa: And being able to evaluate that at the end of the term?	21:51
Jaffa	X-Fade: Indeed; I'm imagining more detail in the call-for-nominations	21:51
Jaffa	X-Fade: However, I'm still keen for it to be primarily a facilitation role so that doing isn't viewed as something only the council can do.	21:52
X-Fade	Jaffa: That would make the work of the council more clear for people who are not hardcore tracking the community.	21:52
X-Fade	Yes, true facilitating is hard to measure.	21:52
sh0gun5	hmm, and what do you think about upcoming maemo 5 on nokia n900?	21:53
sh0gun5	are u gonna buy this phone?	21:53
X-Fade	Jaffa: I for example know that you guys are doing things behind the scenes, because I'm sometimes in CC. But that is hard to follow for the public.	21:54
zerojay	Will if i can.	21:54
X-Fade	It might be good to know for candidates what they can expect.	21:54
X-Fade	If we take Qole as an example, he was asking what he was supposed to do _after_ he was elected.	21:54
X-Fade	That means that the role isn't very clear.	21:55
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Stskeeps	oh boy, election time again	22:11
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qwerty12_N810	In related news: penguinbait and Darius are reportedly forming a coalition	22:11
alterego	NOOOO!	22:12
zerojay	Of the willing?	22:12
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Stskeeps	i vote qwerty12_N810!	22:12
qwerty12_N810	Haha, I'm not cut out for work like that anyway. I can't even get my homework done on time...	22:13
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Jaffa	X-Fade: I think a lot of that "not knowing what the role entails" is because they've never done a facilitation role.	22:20
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VDVsx	qwerty12_N810, gerbick is joining too :P	22:25
Jaffa	Maemo's dead ;-)	22:27
Stskeeps	i'd vote in some trolls just to be able to watch ;)	22:27
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Stskeeps	qole ended up being all behaved after getting into council, :P	22:27
qwerty12_N810	VDVsx: ohshit	22:27
Stskeeps	(apologies to qole if he's watching)	22:27
Jaffa	Stskeeps: Tr...ue.	22:27
qwerty12_N810	Stskeeps: "I read the logs."	22:27
qwerty12_N810	Joking, he's an awesome guy	22:28
Stskeeps	Jaffa: no announcement of voting on talk.? or did i miss it	22:28
Jaffa	Stskeeps: Was going to proof-read that a bit more; then a council news article; then a wiki page (with screenshots) on linking your account; then an announcement on talk	22:28
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Jaffa	Fun-filled evening for me. Somewhere in there I've got to pack for Stockholm	22:28
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Stskeeps	ah, sounds fun	22:29
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Jaffa	Oh yeah	22:32
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coldboot	Has anyone ever got this in sb1? Don't know how to run. Try "help target".	22:35
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coldboot	While using gdb, that is.	22:35
Stskeeps	what's going to be most interesting about council is how many tries to get elected again	22:36
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coldboot	What did the computer scientist say to his friend when he asked if he had solved The Two Generals Problem?	22:40
coldboot	Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes.	22:41
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coldboot	Can you simulate using the physical maemo keyboard in scratchbox?	23:00
woglinde	????	23:00
woglinde	you can you use your pc-keyboard in xephyr	23:00
coldboot	Yeah I know, but it won't reproduce the bug properly.	23:00
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Jaffa	Is http://wiki.maemo.org/Link_talk.maemo.org_account_with_maemo.org_profile too stupid a wiki page name?	23:02
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Stskeeps	Get_Karma?	23:07
Stskeeps	:P	23:07
Jaffa	heh	23:07
Jaffa	It can always be renamed.	23:07
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Jaffa	Created.	23:17
lbt	zerojay: I'll take a look at the Meta theme issue -- I never thought to test it with another theme :)	23:18
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zerojay	No problem. :)	23:22
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coldboot	Why did someone make a QETWidget that's just a bunch of added member functions, instead of extending QWidget?	23:34
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woglinde	hm Qt Development Framework	23:41
woglinde	new name	23:41
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michaelm	hello	23:50
michaelm	i have a quick question	23:50
michaelm	maybe someone can assit me?	23:50
lcuk	you can assit yourself	23:50
michaelm	I am trying to set my channel for my 810 to channel 14	23:50
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lcuk	wat?	23:51
zerojay	Your router need to change channel, not the tablet i don't think.	23:51
michaelm	my n810, the wifi I would like to change it to channel 14 using the following command: iwpriv wlan0 set CountryRegion = 5	23:52
zerojay	I assume you're not in the us?	23:52
michaelm	and I am geting an error	23:52
* lcuk thought for a moment you were trying to watch television on tablet		23:52
michaelm	lol	23:53
michaelm	nice one :-)	23:53
michaelm	i get invalid command : set	23:53
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zerojay	Aren't the channels hardcoded by region?	23:53
johnsq	i think the driver didn't support iwpriv.	23:54
michaelm	correct, which is why i would like to change my region code to 5 which is channel 14	23:54
michaelm	it does, but with certain commands	23:54
michaelm	which is why I am trying to figure this out	23:54
lcuk	iwpriv -help	23:55
javispedro	isn't that set by wlancal?	23:56
qwerty12_N810	wlan-cal (in initfs) sets the channel information based on information stored in the config area in /dev/mtd2	23:56
lcuk	Usage: iwpriv interface [private-command [private-arguments]]	23:56
lcuk	interface [roam {on\|off}]	23:56
lcuk	interface [port {ad-hoc\|managed\|N}]	23:56
lcuk	set not required?	23:56
lcuk	im reading a foreign page of someone with same problem, different pooter	23:56
michaelm	so how would i do it	23:56
lcuk	so im just guessing	23:56
lcuk	iwpriv wlan0 CountryRegion = 5	23:56
lcuk	try it	23:56
michaelm	i dont know what the private-comman [private-arguments] are	23:57
michaelm	invalid command : CountryRegion	23:57
qwerty12_N810	michaelm: at this moment in time, you'd be better served changing the frequency on your router to one used in the US	23:57
lcuk	sounds reasonable	23:57
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qwerty12_N810	*channel	23:57
lcuk	and then of course you can pickup bbc1	23:57
michaelm	yes i know but thats really not an option. I am using the n810 as a pen test tool and it has to work on 14	23:58
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lcuk	no, you want to use it as a pen test tool	23:58
lcuk	or has it suddenly stopped working	23:58
lcuk	when it did before	23:59
michaelm	i have a program that scans all channels and also u can scan an individual channel. I can do channels 1-13 but not 14	23:59

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