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| VDVsx | jeremiah, it won't work in the current state in fremantle, the bluez project broke the api between v3.xx and v4.xx, so some minor changes are required | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
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| mikkov_ | jeremiah: btw, xterm doens't work, but it didn't work in diablo either :) | 00:04 |
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| johnsq | Yea bluez 4.xx is chaos pur | 00:08 |
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| ThatOneGuy | can someone build a rtl8187 module for 2.6.16.27 for me? I've been trying to for about a year now without success | 00:10 |
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| johnsq | I have snd_pcm.ko and dependencies loaded any idea what I need more to get alsa working? | 00:32 |
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| jeremiah | VDVsx: Hmm. Bummer. :( I'll have to mention that on the wiki. | 00:35 |
| jeremiah | VDVsx: Thanks for letting me know. | 00:36 |
| jeremiah | mikkov_: Ah - you saw Ed's reply. | 00:37 |
| VDVsx | jeremiah, ok, thanks, I will try to build a new package for fremantle in the weekend | 00:37 |
| jeremiah | VDVsx: That would be great. :) | 00:38 |
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| DavidePalm | Michael Jackson has died! | 01:40 |
| Firebird | yea.. just heard that on every channel I'm on.. | 01:40 |
| Proteous | lol | 01:40 |
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| DavidePalm | sad | 01:40 |
| Firebird | now ticketmaster has to refund all of the soldout shows | 01:40 |
| Proteous | heh | 01:41 |
| Proteous | probable not | 01:41 |
| Proteous | knowing ticketmaster there is probable some fine text about death | 01:41 |
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| xnt14 | ~seen b-man16 | 02:22 |
| infobot | b-man16 <n=b-man@cpe-98-30-195-117.woh.res.rr.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 1d 10h 28m 54s ago, saying: '~seen xnt14'. | 02:22 |
| xnt14 | :P | 02:22 |
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| RST38h | moo all | 07:54 |
| RST38h | Hmm... -1 Michael Jackson | 08:01 |
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| DavidePalm | What does the maemo-cplusplus-device-env package provide? does anyone use it? | 08:13 |
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| RST38h | it lets you compile c++ programs on the device | 08:15 |
| DavidePalm | RST38h that's what I'm trying to do but how do you use it? | 08:15 |
| DavidePalm | through command line? | 08:16 |
| RST38h | yes | 08:16 |
| DavidePalm | what are the commands what's the editor etc... | 08:16 |
| RST38h | "Jonathan Heiliger, Facebook's VP of technical operations, told Om Malik that the latest generations of server processors from Intel and AMD don't deliver the performance gains that 'they're touting in the press." | 08:16 |
| derf | Marketing people exaggerate?! Shocking! | 08:17 |
| RST38h | derf: In this particular case, it looks like they have just got shitty programmers | 08:17 |
| DavidePalm | RST38h where can I find more info about that? what commands to use etc? | 08:17 |
| Pavlov | i for one am shocked | 08:17 |
| derf | I'd believe that, too. | 08:18 |
| RST38h | Davide: Google. | 08:18 |
| derf | But most programmers are shitty. | 08:18 |
| DavidePalm | :( search for what? been trying for a couple days | 08:18 |
| RST38h | derf: Still, if you are running a company of this size, you should at least be able to hire a few people who can profile code | 08:18 |
| RST38h | Davide: "how to use gcc" | 08:18 |
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| DavidePalm | but I dont get gcc with that | 08:19 |
| RST38h | You don't? | 08:19 |
| DavidePalm | no sigh | 08:19 |
| DavidePalm | I've been trying to install GC on my nit for a while... cant find it or install it... | 08:19 |
| rm_you | DavidePalm: it's really close to a standard debian system... install gcc/g++ or compile them for the device in scratchbox if the don't exist (but i know they do) | 08:20 |
| DavidePalm | can it be done on a regular installation of OS 2008? | 08:20 |
| rm_you | yes | 08:20 |
| DavidePalm | rm_you do you have that running? do you have gcc and g++? | 08:20 |
| rm_you | gcc | 08:20 |
| rm_you | sec | 08:20 |
| RST38h | rm_you: He says maemo-cplusplus-device-env does not include gcc executable | 08:20 |
| DavidePalm | RST38h maybe I just dont know how to use it... should the gcc command be available in the terminal or does it have to be typed a certain way? | 08:21 |
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| DavidePalm | I can use it on my ubuntu installation but not on maemo | 08:21 |
| DavidePalm | gcc that is | 08:21 |
| RST38h | Davide: gcc and g++ commands should be available in the terminal | 08:21 |
| DavidePalm | ubuntu on my desktop that is | 08:21 |
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| rm_you | gcc package is available at least in chinook repos... you can grab the deb from there | 08:21 |
| rm_you | should be in diablo too | 08:21 |
| DavidePalm | rm_you I tried, went directly to http://repository.meamo.org | 08:22 |
| DavidePalm | and followed through to gcc-3.4 | 08:22 |
| DavidePalm | or whatever the file is... | 08:22 |
| DavidePalm | and tried to install, and it says incompatible version | 08:22 |
| RST38h | What OS are you running? | 08:23 |
| RST38h | on the tablet that is | 08:23 |
| DavidePalm | OS 2008 | 08:23 |
| RST38h | ok | 08:23 |
| rm_you | these: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/g/gcc-3.4/ ? | 08:23 |
| DavidePalm | latest one I guess | 08:23 |
| DavidePalm | yup thats exactly where I went | 08:23 |
| DavidePalm | hang on let me try again | 08:23 |
| rm_you | just use apt-get | 08:23 |
| DavidePalm | and I'll tell you what it says... I"m rebooting just a sec | 08:23 |
| rm_you | apt-get install g++ | 08:23 |
| RST38h | gcc too | 08:24 |
| DavidePalm | wait so how do I add that repository before running apt-get? | 08:24 |
| DavidePalm | forgot the command | 08:24 |
| RST38h | yes. | 08:24 |
| RST38h | Go to app manager and add it there | 08:24 |
| rm_you | vim /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon something | 08:24 |
| DavidePalm | just add http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/g/gcc-3.4/ | 08:24 |
| rm_you | hit tab at the end | 08:24 |
| rm_you | no | 08:24 |
| DavidePalm | or just repository.maemo.org | 08:24 |
| rm_you | that's the base repo | 08:25 |
| rm_you | it's in there | 08:25 |
| rm_you | don't add it | 08:25 |
| DavidePalm | so just click to it and install? | 08:25 |
| rm_you | no | 08:25 |
| rm_you | open a terminal | 08:25 |
| rm_you | get root | 08:25 |
| DavidePalm | ok | 08:25 |
| rm_you | and then use apt-get | 08:25 |
| rm_you | apt-get install g++ | 08:25 |
| DavidePalm | "Couldn't find package g" | 08:26 |
| DavidePalm | rm_you do you have os 2008 as well? | 08:26 |
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| RST38h | Davide: apt-get install gcc | 08:29 |
| rm_you | ahh | 08:29 |
| rm_you | no it's in the sdk repo | 08:29 |
| rm_you | so you do need to add a line | 08:29 |
| rm_you | it's this: | 08:29 |
| rm_you | oh dear god | 08:30 |
| rm_you | well i was going to read you the line but my tablet appears to have morphed into a zebra >_> | 08:30 |
| rm_you | this can't be good | 08:30 |
| DavidePalm | lol | 08:30 |
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| rm_you | my screen is now a series of vertical thin black, grey and white lines | 08:31 |
| rm_you | time to pull the battery | 08:31 |
| DavidePalm | :( | 08:31 |
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| DavidePalm | gl | 08:31 |
| rm_you | ok well it appears to boot? | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | rm_you: mer on internal flash? | 08:32 |
| rm_you | sec and i'll get you that line | 08:32 |
| rm_you | yes | 08:32 |
| rm_you | err | 08:32 |
| rm_you | no | 08:32 |
| rm_you | well | 08:32 |
| rm_you | no | 08:32 |
| rm_you | sorry took me a sec to parse, it's late here :P | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | i've seen that problem on maemo too though | 08:32 |
| rm_you | internal SD on n800, not on flash :) | 08:32 |
| rm_you | this is maemo :( | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | i'd install bootmenu with usb telnet before your screen eventually dies :P | 08:33 |
| rm_you | deb http://repository.maemo.org/ diablo/sdk free non-free | 08:34 |
| rm_you | add that to the end of your /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildon-application-manager.list | 08:34 |
| rm_you | then apt-get update | 08:34 |
| rm_you | and apt-get install gcc | 08:34 |
| DavidePalm | wait ok I'm on the flash card right now I boot from internal flash | 08:34 |
| DavidePalm | is that the problem? | 08:34 |
| rm_you | well i gotta go to sleep so i can drive four three hours in the morning, but good luck | 08:35 |
| rm_you | err, no? | 08:35 |
| rm_you | just add that line to the sources.list file and update and install gcc | 08:35 |
| rm_you | you familiar with apt? | 08:35 |
| DavidePalm | so so | 08:35 |
| DavidePalm | kinda new | 08:35 |
| rm_you | well, you should be fine | 08:35 |
| rm_you | the important note is the repository | 08:36 |
| DavidePalm | apt-cache search does what? | 08:36 |
| rm_you | searches | 08:36 |
| rm_you | :) | 08:36 |
| DavidePalm | apt-cache search gcc gives me "gcc-3.4-base..." | 08:36 |
| DavidePalm | does that mean I have it? | 08:36 |
| rm_you | no | 08:36 |
| DavidePalm | ok | 08:36 |
| rm_you | it's searching the entire installable package database | 08:36 |
| DavidePalm | ah | 08:36 |
| rm_you | apt-cache policy | 08:36 |
| rm_you | is what you want | 08:36 |
| rm_you | will tell you if it is installed, if so what version, and from wherre | 08:36 |
| DavidePalm | Installed (none) | 08:37 |
| rm_you | anywho, good luck, people should be able to help you from here | 08:37 |
| rm_you | once you've added that line, just do this: | 08:37 |
| rm_you | apt-get update | 08:37 |
| rm_you | apt-get install gcc | 08:37 |
| rm_you | then gcc will be installed :) | 08:37 |
| DavidePalm | ok ty rm_you I'm gonna try right now | 08:38 |
| rm_you | kk | 08:38 |
| rm_you | be somewhat careful installing stuff from the sdk repo... it works, and a few people do it on device, but be prepared for possibly at some point something bad happening :P | 08:38 |
| rm_you | it's just not "recommended" | 08:38 |
| DavidePalm | ok | 08:39 |
| rm_you | but if all you want is gcc it should be fine | 08:39 |
| DavidePalm | ya thats all | 08:39 |
| rm_you | just don't go installing the whole thing :P | 08:39 |
| * rm_you sleeps | 08:39 | |
| DavidePalm | I'm taking an intro C class, and just want a simple compiler for small console apps | 08:39 |
| rm_you | last note: my intro C class was "we need an applet for our tablet that changes the backlight. make it work!" and it was far more effective than the class i had in college :P | 08:40 |
| DavidePalm | rm_you <3 <3 <3 | 08:40 |
| DavidePalm | you know I had tried that before... and the mistake I made was... I only kept putting "Diablo" in the distribution... never included the "sdk" | 08:41 |
| DavidePalm | I guess that made it inaccessible | 08:41 |
| DavidePalm | anyhow it works thanks so much rm_you it's installing right now :P | 08:41 |
| rm_you | :) | 08:41 |
| DavidePalm | heh I was so desperate, trying to get this for a few days now haha | 08:42 |
| rm_you | hey yeah, i made the same mistake at first, although it only took me about 30 seconds to figure out what went wrong... but i've been doing this for like 10 years, lol | 08:42 |
| DavidePalm | and it was such a stupid mistake | 08:42 |
| DavidePalm | yeah I'm just learning :P | 08:42 |
| rm_you | gotta start somewhere :) | 08:42 |
| DavidePalm | not a linux person | 08:42 |
| DavidePalm | ya | 08:42 |
| * rm_you really sleeps | 08:42 | |
| DavidePalm | so g++ is an IDE? | 08:43 |
| rm_you | no, it literally just compiles a .cpp file | 08:43 |
| * rm_you really will sleep eventually | 08:43 | |
| rm_you | you just use a text editor | 08:43 |
| DavidePalm | oh I downloade geany | 08:43 |
| rm_you | never heard of it | 08:43 |
| rm_you | might work | 08:43 |
| rm_you | no clue | 08:43 |
| DavidePalm | but on the N800 I use the matchbox keyboard for it which is kind of annoying... | 08:43 |
| DavidePalm | is there any editor other then regular notes or something? | 08:44 |
| rm_you | vim | 08:44 |
| DavidePalm | an C editor? | 08:44 |
| rm_you | vim? | 08:44 |
| DavidePalm | vim? just apt-get install vim? | 08:44 |
| rm_you | maybe | 08:44 |
| DavidePalm | ok i'll look into it | 08:44 |
| DavidePalm | go to sleep :P | 08:44 |
| DavidePalm | thanks | 08:44 |
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| rm_you | there's like three different versions of vim out there in a few repositories, with semi-broken versioning | 08:44 |
| rm_you | and some of them work right and some dont | 08:44 |
| DavidePalm | I've used pico before is it sorta like that? | 08:44 |
| rm_you | ViM is a standard editor... with lots of complicated-ness involved | 08:45 |
| rm_you | sort of, except you'll be pulling out your hair for the first few months | 08:45 |
| DavidePalm | LOL | 08:45 |
| rm_you | but after that it's great :P | 08:45 |
| rm_you | go download and print the cheatsheat | 08:45 |
| rm_you | http://www.viemu.com/vi-vim-cheat-sheet.gif | 08:46 |
| rm_you | i' | 08:46 |
| oespirit | <3 vim | 08:46 |
| rm_you | i've been using ViM for about 7 years and i know just about what half of those keys do :P | 08:46 |
| rm_you | well maybe 3/4 | 08:46 |
| DavidePalm | I've used vi before and almost did hang myself.. I guess it comes from that? | 08:47 |
| rm_you | yes | 08:47 |
| rm_you | but better | 08:47 |
| DavidePalm | ew | 08:47 |
| DavidePalm | ok | 08:47 |
| DavidePalm | gotcha | 08:47 |
| rm_you | Vi iMproved | 08:47 |
| rm_you | or something like that | 08:47 |
| rm_you | anywho | 08:47 |
| DavidePalm | guess it'd be good to learn it :P | 08:47 |
| * rm_you really really sleeps for real | 08:47 | |
| * rm_you glares at a channel full of bad influences | 08:47 | |
| ShadowJK | quiver is awesome | 08:48 |
| DavidePalm | what's that Shadow_M? | 08:48 |
| DavidePalm | editor? | 08:48 |
| ShadowJK | no, image viewer | 08:48 |
| DavidePalm | oh | 08:49 |
| ShadowJK | like, I was looking at the list of image viewers wondering why there has to be so many | 08:49 |
| ShadowJK | and can't there be one that's, well tolerable | 08:50 |
| ukki | DavidePalm: there should be nano if you are used to pico | 08:50 |
| DavidePalm | ukki oh yeah? should be available through apt-get? | 08:50 |
| ukki | check with apt-cache search nano | 08:50 |
| DavidePalm | doesnt return anything | 08:51 |
| ShadowJK | I don't think I knew the concept of "good image viewer" before, it's like I had been searching for a new sharp chisel to go with my stone tablets and someone gave me a word processor | 08:52 |
| ShadowJK | it's so rare these days that I find software that truly impresses me I had to tell atleast this chan :) | 08:53 |
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| ShadowJK | it /feels/ faster on n8x0 than what I was using on core2quad :> | 08:54 |
| DavidePalm | lol | 08:55 |
| ukki | DavidePalm: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.1.1/free/n/nano/ | 08:56 |
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| DavidePalm | ah thanks ukki I'll check it out | 09:10 |
| DavidePalm | hey I was just trying to compile a "Hello world" but cpp cant find <stdio.h> | 09:10 |
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| DavidePalm | do I have dl libraries separately? | 09:10 |
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| thux | morning | 09:12 |
| DavidePalm | hi | 09:12 |
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| Stskeeps | DavidePalm: libc-dev | 09:13 |
| DavidePalm | I have to dl that? | 09:14 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 09:14 |
| DavidePalm | :) | 09:15 |
| DavidePalm | downloading | 09:15 |
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| waswas | Hi everyone | 09:42 |
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| waswas | Has anyone used Code::Blocks with maemo developing? | 09:59 |
| Stskeeps | Code::Blocks? | 10:04 |
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| waswas | http://www.codeblocks.org/ | 10:09 |
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| Stskeeps | ah, no idea | 10:10 |
| waswas | I'm still newbie, when it comes to linux | 10:10 |
| Stskeeps | people use eclipse for some things | 10:10 |
| waswas | I found that out, but i like code::blocks more :P | 10:11 |
| waswas | But maybe i need to test eclipse after all :> | 10:11 |
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| mavhc | why can't I see my shared smb folders in File Manager? I can see the computer | 10:23 |
| ukki | are they password protected? | 10:24 |
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| * RST38h cringes at the mention of Eclipse | 10:38 | |
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| mavhc | anonymous and everyone have access to them, so I'd assume not | 10:51 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:55 |
| Stskeeps | morning jaffa | 10:55 |
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| * Stskeeps has a fun morning with Intel bios SATA problems | 10:56 | |
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| wazd_n800 | long live the King :( | 11:36 |
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| X-Fade | wazd_n800: Yeah, pretty sad. | 11:38 |
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| X-Fade | Hmm were is that qwerty guy at? :) | 11:55 |
| RST38h | UK? | 11:56 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: yeah. I know, he just is not online. | 11:56 |
| wazd_n800 | A2DP became fine as suddenly as it broke... My tablet is living it's own life I suppose | 11:59 |
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| wazd_n800 | by the way, I've started to notive slight afterburn of the screen, what does it mean? | 12:00 |
| wazd_n800 | notice* | 12:01 |
| RST38h | moo wazd | 12:01 |
| AStorm | afterburn? | 12:01 |
| RST38h | permanent? | 12:01 |
| AStorm | moo guys | 12:01 |
| wazd_n800 | AStorm, RST38h, heya | 12:01 |
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| wazd_n800 | RST38h, well, it apears eventually, not every time, and acts like screen on cold | 12:02 |
| AStorm | hmmm faulty LCD maybe? | 12:03 |
| wazd_n800 | RST38h, I can see characters fading out slowly. | 12:03 |
| X-Fade | The missing base64 package is now available in the sdk repository: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/b/base64/ | 12:05 |
| wazd_n800 | astorm, dunno | 12:07 |
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| AStorm | hey, where is the file that mounts mmc in maemo? | 12:09 |
| Stskeeps | ke-recv | 12:09 |
| AStorm | ah, that's it | 12:10 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: Where are the download counter updates? :) | 12:11 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: The reporting tool keeps sending me empty logs. | 12:11 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: A ticket has been filed already. | 12:12 |
| andre__ | ~seen netblade | 12:13 |
| infobot | i haven't seen 'netblade', andre__ | 12:13 |
| andre__ | infobot, okay, go to sleep | 12:14 |
| * infobot falls to the floor where he's standing and goes into a deep sleep | 12:14 | |
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| AStorm | Stskeeps, but there was a file with mount insns | 12:18 |
| AStorm | and I can't find the name | 12:18 |
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| AStorm | blah | 12:21 |
| AStorm | obviously, /usr/sbin/mmc-mount | 12:21 |
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| AStorm | this needs a fix to check for 1) mounted fs 2) anything other than vfat | 12:24 |
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| lardman | morning | 12:35 |
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| VDVsx | morning lardman | 12:39 |
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| lardman | hi VDVsx | 12:40 |
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| cpm | Hi, I am using Qt4 under Maemo with Nokia N810. When I click a QLineEdit field, there comes up a field for handwriting input. How can I prevent this? It overlaps the actual QLineEdit, as this is quite on the lower part of the GUI. | 13:09 |
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| _mo | hi @all | 13:19 |
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| danielwilms | cpm, sorry for the late reply, trying to figure out what the problem is ;) | 13:24 |
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| _mo | i am trying to start bluez in scratchbox target x86 through /etc/init.d/bluez-utils and it fails | 13:39 |
| _mo | any suggestions? bluetooth stick is connected and showing up in hciconfig | 13:39 |
| VDVsx | _mo, hciconfig inside scratchbox ? | 13:40 |
| _mo | if I remove the line where the PATH variable is set from /etc/init.d/bluez-utils it works ... | 13:41 |
| VDVsx | _mo, the current path should be /etc/init.d/bluetooth start, I think | 13:42 |
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| _mo | yes running hciconfig inside scratchbox shows hci0 up running | 13:43 |
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| * lcuk deflates | 14:00 | |
| * RichiH blows up lcuk | 14:00 | |
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| * lardman supplies some TNT | 14:01 | |
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| lardman | perhaps a bicycle tyre repair kit would be better though ;) | 14:04 |
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| lcuk | RichiH, thats not the kind of boost i need | 14:10 |
| lcuk | :D and yeah lardman, that would prolly help | 14:10 |
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| * VDVsx sends a pack of beers to lcuk | 14:15 | |
| lcuk | :D that sounds like a plan | 14:15 |
| jeremiah | Where's my beer? | 14:22 |
| Jaffa | Beer. Hmm, interesting idea. | 14:25 |
| * Stskeeps will be getting beer at work | 14:25 | |
| * Jaffa 's having a bacon butty for lunch. Beer does go well with it | 14:25 | |
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| andre__ | jeremiah, still in the systembolaget? :-P | 14:27 |
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| jeremiah | andre__: Yes - I'm afraid so. :-/ | 14:30 |
| * Jaffa is having a Michael Jackson day from Spotify today. | 14:31 | |
| andre__ | hmm, now as complaints about broken icq and yahoo messenger get popular, does anybody plan to pack pidgin-2.5.7 for maemo? :-/ | 14:31 |
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| Stskeeps | think there was some discussion yesterday | 14:32 |
| jeremiah | Hmm. It would be cool if 'Request for Packaging' had an output list so people could see what packages people want | 14:35 |
| jeremiah | Then people new to the community can quickly get integrated by picking up on one of those packages | 14:35 |
| jeremiah | Get some karma points, package something, learn about the platform, etc. | 14:35 |
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| Jaffa | Something which it needs to make clear: is it expected you'd put a package name; upstream unix name; English description; general description. One thing we've seen before (and seen again in Brainstorm) is explaining to users why "port wine" won't solve the problem they think it does. | 14:37 |
| jeremiah | Good point. | 14:38 |
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| AStorm | and "port wine" is a huge task | 14:48 |
| AStorm | requiring CPU emulation | 14:49 |
| AStorm | and probably would work very slow | 14:49 |
| Jaffa | AStorm: indeed; that was kinda my point ;-) | 14:49 |
| cosmo | does wine support cpu emulation btw? | 14:50 |
| AStorm | now, 'update pidgin hildonization' is not | 14:50 |
| AchipA_away | cpm: are you using C++ or python ? | 14:51 |
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| Jaffa | cosmo: I believe you can get wine to run in conjunction with qemu, BICBW | 14:51 |
| AStorm | cosmo, €es, that's how wine runs on PPC | 14:52 |
| AStorm | *yes | 14:52 |
| cosmo | well, then it wouldn't be impossible | 14:52 |
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| AStorm | getting qemu to run here would be hard | 14:53 |
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| AStorm | getting it to run fast even harder | 14:53 |
| AchipA_away | cpm: if C++, take a look at http://wiki.maemo.org/Qt4Hildon#Maemo_Qt_API_Reference , check the Input section, you can play with how HIM works | 14:53 |
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| Jaffa | cosmo: No one said it was impossible; just mostly a lot of effort for very little, mostly impractical, gain | 14:54 |
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| AchipA_away | cpm: if python, you're out of luck, there are a foew known bugs regarding HIM that need fixing | 14:54 |
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| cosmo | i think speed would be enough for basic gui apps, but nothing very useful | 14:54 |
| Jaffa | cosmo: have you ever done x86 emulation on ARM? | 14:54 |
| AchipA_away | won't memory kill you before even you get to the point of being slow ? | 14:54 |
| Jaffa | Apart from the lack of memory, drawing the *GUI* will take minutes | 14:54 |
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| AStorm | nah, that part is done by Wine | 14:55 |
| AStorm | the emulation part is to execute the apps themselves | 14:56 |
| AStorm | any more intensive app will stall | 14:56 |
| cosmo | Jaffa: well, dosemu runs fine on maemo | 14:56 |
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| AStorm | also, wine+qemu is huge | 14:57 |
| Razumihin | It's pretty much impossible to do decent x86 emulation on ARM. | 14:57 |
| AStorm | Razumihin, wrong | 14:57 |
| AStorm | easier than you'd think | 14:58 |
| Razumihin | AStorm: At least on the older ones like nokia devices you don't even have native floating point numbers... | 14:58 |
| AStorm | offload to softfpu library | 14:58 |
| lcuk | native x86 doesnt have floats either | 14:59 |
| AStorm | they do have FPUs since Pentium | 14:59 |
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| Razumihin | Yes. Okay, you could have emulation on modern arm, but i don't really see the point in emulating at least on maemo. | 15:00 |
| AStorm | wine would give us some apps | 15:00 |
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| lcuk | what stops us getting windows mobile on device | 15:00 |
| AStorm | but not the useful mobile ones | 15:00 |
| Razumihin | With really crappy UIs | 15:01 |
| lcuk | or at least or wine for mobile rather | 15:01 |
| AStorm | because it doesn't support most of winmob and .net | 15:01 |
| AStorm | Razumihin, better than none | 15:01 |
| lcuk | .net compact doesnt support most of .net ;) | 15:01 |
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| AStorm | but it's still .net 3 | 15:01 |
| AStorm | which mono doesn't support | 15:01 |
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| Razumihin | AStorm: Yes but i don't see the point. Tablet is just not suited to that kind of applications :) I would rather bring atom laptop. | 15:01 |
| AStorm | you'd also have to port mono | 15:01 |
| AStorm | :P | 15:01 |
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| lcuk | done isnt it | 15:02 |
| AStorm | Razumihin, for windows mobile apps? | 15:02 |
| Razumihin | AStorm: Isn't winmo ARM? | 15:02 |
| AStorm | no, it isn't | 15:02 |
| Razumihin | Oh. Then i agree:) | 15:02 |
| Razumihin | Sorry for the fuzz i remember them being ARM based devices. | 15:03 |
| lcuk | ? | 15:03 |
| AStorm | well | 15:03 |
| AStorm | no, there are 2 variants of winmo | 15:03 |
| lcuk | there was a vmware demo showing wimo or something | 15:03 |
| AStorm | but that's winmo x86 | 15:03 |
| lcuk | some virtualized thing switching between linux and winmo | 15:04 |
| * lcuk cant remember | 15:04 | |
| AStorm | bah | 15:04 |
| AStorm | winmo does have an arm version | 15:04 |
| lcuk | winmo isnt for x86 tho | 15:05 |
| lcuk | there are no x86 winmo parts? | 15:05 |
| AStorm | there is winmo for x86 | 15:05 |
| lcuk | the arm version is the default isnt it? | 15:05 |
| AStorm | it is | 15:05 |
| lcuk | its been running on xscales and things for years | 15:05 |
| AStorm | so, we still get some stuff running | 15:05 |
| Razumihin | Yeah... i remember it so in the beginning of 2000 | 15:05 |
| AStorm | but until someone improves mono to run .net compact... | 15:05 |
| lcuk | someone built mono for maemo didnt they | 15:06 |
| AStorm | building is ok | 15:06 |
| AStorm | but not enough | 15:06 |
| AStorm | it doesn't support net 3 which compact has parts of | 15:06 |
| lcuk | its a start tho | 15:07 |
| lcuk | its not like you have to write the whole .net framework from scratch | 15:07 |
| lcuk | and im sure there are mono guys aiming towards getting everything required in | 15:07 |
| lcuk | and then its plain sailing | 15:07 |
| lcuk | *for varying amounts of plain | 15:08 |
| lcuk | anyway, the whole start of this convo, someone mentioned that wine has an x86->arm emulator? | 15:09 |
| lcuk | i thought wine mean "wine is not an emulator" | 15:09 |
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| AStorm | no, it can use qemu | 15:09 |
| lcuk | ahh | 15:10 |
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| cpm | danielwilm: thanks! could you please use my email address mayer@tm.uka.de as correspondance for this. thanks a lot! | 15:17 |
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| danielwilms | cpm I will do this, no problem | 15:23 |
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| RST38h | EHLO | 15:30 |
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| AchipA_away | 501 Syntactically invalid EHLO argument(s) | 15:32 |
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| lcuk | RST38h, \o ack! | 15:35 |
| * RST38h suddenly remembers he promised fMSX-Maemo sources to qwerty | 15:38 | |
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| andre__ | timeless, what is "DUPEME" in the status whiteboard? | 15:42 |
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| timeless_mbp | "it is believed that this is a duplicate of an existing bug, would a qa please find that bug and resolve one of them as a duplicate of the other" | 15:43 |
| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: if i locate the old engineering english desktop strings that match mer hildon-desktop would you be interested in making US versions of them? then our set should be fairly complete? | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | you might have to do some merging into maemo-af-desktop-l10n | 15:46 |
| timeless_mbp | Stskeeps: you can pull them from my diablo strings :) | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | hmm true | 15:46 |
| timeless_mbp | my licenses says "you're free to take them" :) | 15:47 |
| timeless_mbp | s/es/e/ | 15:47 |
| infobot | timeless_mbp meant: my license says "you're free to take them" :) | 15:47 |
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| Stskeeps | i just might | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | then we have a full set i guess | 15:50 |
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| Macer | la la la | 15:51 |
| Stskeeps | not entirely sure where claudius disappeared off to, so i'm pushing a bit on this work as it's a showstopper for 0.15 if it doesn't have strings :P | 15:51 |
| suihkulokki | engineering engrish | 15:51 |
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| Stskeeps | indeed | 15:52 |
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| andre__ | timeless, in the long run i can add a "probabledup" keyword as in gnome, but i don't think it's a dup :) | 15:56 |
| * timeless_mbp shrugs | 15:57 | |
| timeless_mbp | we've been using DUPEME in sw in gecko for nearly a decade | 15:57 |
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| andre__ | ah | 15:57 |
| andre__ | also nice | 15:57 |
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| fiferboy | lbt: Hey | 16:13 |
| fiferboy | I see your OBS Qt build going, it's made it to examples | 16:14 |
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| * man_in_shack waves | 16:23 | |
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| man_in_shack | anyone here know much about harmattan? :) | 16:26 |
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| GAN800 | Apparently the Rays had a good game last night. . . . | 16:29 |
| GAN800 | man_in_shack, official Qt support. | 16:30 |
| fiferboy | GAN800: Anyone can beat the Phillies these days. | 16:30 |
| fiferboy | The Jays just swept them in Phillie | 16:30 |
| GAN800 | man_in_shack, that's mostly the extent of what we're sure about although there should be a bit more info on the roadmap on the wiki. | 16:31 |
| GAN800 | fiferboy, well, there're broken beer bottles all over the sidewalk out front. ;) | 16:31 |
| fiferboy | Ah, that's how you can tell! | 16:31 |
| fiferboy | I guess it is good revenge, after losing the World Series to them last year | 16:32 |
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| Jaffa | man_in_shack: some mockups of an integrated widget-oriented; scrollable home screen. | 16:33 |
| oespirit | ~seen vimzard | 16:34 |
| infobot | vimzard is currently on #gsoc (8h 27m 27s), last said: 'sid0: :-P'. | 16:34 |
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| man_in_shack | well, apparently a wireless network feature i want has been planned for harmattan | 16:36 |
| man_in_shack | so ... i'm wondering what devices it will be released for | 16:37 |
| Jaffa | Oh? | 16:37 |
| man_in_shack | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1635 | 16:37 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: We've no idea on that :( | 16:37 |
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| Jaffa | man_in_shack: Oh, if yours is the final comment: no, it won't be available for existing devices | 16:38 |
| man_in_shack | so that's yet another slap in the goddamn face | 16:38 |
| Jaffa | Fremantle (due out at some point this year) isn't even being released for N8x0s; but portions of it are being backported to N8x0 and 770 devices in Mer | 16:38 |
| man_in_shack | how about they actually do something sensible and backport the wireless improvements to diablo? | 16:39 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: Err, Harmattan is roadmapped for release either late *next* year or the year after (my guess). The N810 is over two years old; running a cutting edge mobile OS on (at least) 4 year old hardware seems pretty unreasonable as an expectation. | 16:39 |
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| man_in_shack | one little feature is all i ask | 16:39 |
| man_in_shack | it's not like it's difficult | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: Who's "they"? They might be available via Mer (or Mer might already have it via its Ubuntu base) | 16:40 |
| man_in_shack | f*** mer | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: Ah, you're a coder? | 16:40 |
| man_in_shack | unstable crap | 16:40 |
| man_in_shack | Jaffa, the wpa-supplicant support for that particular type of network is something like 20 lines of code | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: If you know it's not difficult, I assume you're familiar with the innards of Linux network stacks & Maemo's UI code; so if it's not hard you can add it yourself. | 16:40 |
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| man_in_shack | last i heard maemo's networking system was closed source | 16:41 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: Mer's under development, and its developers are some of the most committed and dedicated volunteers in the community. Calling its in-development releases "unstable crap" is just plain trolling. | 16:41 |
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| man_in_shack | Jaffa, mer is unsuited to my needs | 16:41 |
| Jaffa | *Now*, perhaps. The aim long term is for it not to be unsuited to your needs. And if it includes whatever wifi protocols you require, that's a win. | 16:42 |
| man_in_shack | i need something that, e.g., doesn't continuously assume i'm hitting Enter when trying to put the cursor in a text field | 16:43 |
| * Myrtti smells love in the air | 16:43 | |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: If you do not like Mer, use OS2008. | 16:45 |
| man_in_shack | os2008 doesn't have the wifi support i need | 16:45 |
| Myrtti | RST38h: but but but it doesn't have the wifi! | 16:45 |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: If you do not like OS2008, put together your own distro | 16:45 |
| RST38h | Myrtti: Wait, we are slowly getting to that ;) | 16:46 |
| man_in_shack | and to be perfectly honest, nokia has just been sitting around on their butts since they first released os2007 when it comes to this particular configuration of wireless network | 16:46 |
| man_in_shack | now they finally say they are PLANNING to support it, and it's only for new devices | 16:46 |
| Myrtti | man_in_shack: here, have a lollipop | 16:46 |
| man_in_shack | which is just a money making scheme | 16:46 |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: I am sure you can pay someone to implement what you want | 16:47 |
| man_in_shack | any suggestions on who? | 16:47 |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: There are guys from Openismus and other embedded Linux companies in the Nokia community | 16:48 |
| qwerty12_N810 | man_in_shack: bothered to read #43? | 16:48 |
| Stskeeps | did you try to get the wpasupplicant ICD plugin? :P | 16:48 |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: I suggest you post your request (with bounty amount) on talk.maemo.org or one of the mailing lists | 16:48 |
| man_in_shack | qwerty12_N810, could not get it to work | 16:48 |
| *** luck has quit IRC | 16:48 | |
| man_in_shack | in fact, could not even find a correct driver to install | 16:49 |
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| RST38h | and nokia or mer are somehow guilty of it? | 16:53 |
| man_in_shack | for failing to support this network type from the very start? yes | 16:53 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: You think Nokia is intentionally introducing new OSes which try to compete with the Androids, webOSes and iPhones of this world to gouge money out of existing customers by prematurely obsoleting hardware? Or were you (correctly) just saying that by constantly pushing forward the OS, they're trying to entice in new customers and increase market share in an increasingly competitive market? | 16:54 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: Yeah, but a) it was never advertised as supporting it; b) moaning about the past seems pretty unproductive. | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: heads up btw, tear will break with 0.7 | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | (vala) | 16:54 |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: well, Nokia does not support my 802.11a and TokenRing installations. Should I blame Nokia for that too? | 16:55 |
| man_in_shack | Jaffa, was it ever advertised as supporting MSCHAPv2? | 16:55 |
| man_in_shack | it was advertised as supporting WPA-EAP | 16:55 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: Didn't Bundyo say he was updating it to support the required changes? (in the tear thread after I said 0.7.3 was now in extras) | 16:55 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: oh, possibly - the source i had wasn't fixed yet | 16:55 |
| man_in_shack | which it does not because it does not support this ONE configuration of WPA-EAP | 16:55 |
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| Myrtti | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNC0kIzM1Fo Love is in the air! | 16:55 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: If the device doesn't do as it was advertised: send it back and/or take Nokia to court for fale advertising. | 16:55 |
| man_in_shack | which is a common configuration for a variety of businesses and educational institutes world-wide | 16:55 |
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| RST38h | how common? | 16:56 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: IIRC he said he *would* update, not that he had - so it might still not be done ;-) | 16:56 |
| man_in_shack | vast majority of eduroam systems | 16:56 |
| RST38h | My university does not use it. My employer does not use it. WiFi APs across the city do not use it. My home AP does not use it. | 16:56 |
| Stskeeps | eduroam should work fine if you add the certificate | 16:56 |
| Stskeeps | several guides for it | 16:56 |
| man_in_shack | no | 16:56 |
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| man_in_shack | eduroam comes in two varieties | 16:57 |
| man_in_shack | one is supported, one is not | 16:57 |
| man_in_shack | guess which one i have to work with | 16:57 |
| RST38h | tough luck. | 16:57 |
| man_in_shack | it's not the fucking microsoft one that nokia DOES support | 16:57 |
| * VDVsx is glad that the n8x0 wifi works very well in the eduroam network in his country :P | 16:57 | |
| RST38h | VDVsx: It IS the fucking microsoft one! =) | 16:58 |
| Myrtti | I guess it makes him happier to rant about it | 16:58 |
| * GAN800 joins the whine tasting. | 16:58 | |
| RST38h | Myrtti: maybe we should channel him toward OGG support? =) | 16:58 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, don't care, it works :P | 16:58 |
| Myrtti | RST38h: OH BOY! | 16:58 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: It is because of people like you Bill Gates is growing his 5th chin right now! | 16:59 |
| Myrtti | let's start with that! | 16:59 |
| man_in_shack | how the HELL is announcing support for this in harmattan meant to help anyone who's "stuck" with their older devices? | 16:59 |
| Myrtti | man_in_shack: would you rather not to have it in Harmattan? | 16:59 |
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| man_in_shack | Myrtti, i don't give a flying fuck about harmattan if i can't use it | 16:59 |
| RST38h | moo pupnik | 16:59 |
| RST38h | Myrtti: He does have a point, about Harmattan =) | 17:00 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, nah, the university paid Cisco for the work and material :P, and the servers run debian :) (at least in my university) | 17:01 |
| Myrtti | RST38h: good entertainment is what I call him | 17:01 |
| Stskeeps | if you have wpa supplicant working, http://74.125.77.132/search?q=cache:xZT6Jw6lA5wJ:eduroam.metu.edu.tr/wpa_supplicant.conf+eduroam+wpa+supplicant+EAP-TTLS+%2B+PAP&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=dk looks fairly trivial. | 17:01 |
| RST38h | VDVsx: Oh, the horror! Debian is supporting the world evil (tm)! | 17:01 |
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| Stskeeps | er, http://eduroam.metu.edu.tr/wpa_supplicant.conf | 17:01 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: If you want to whine and moan that Nokia isn't going to support it on your device; tough - go somewhere else, we can't help. If you're having problems getting the community-provided solutions working, it seems people are trying to help. | 17:02 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, lol | 17:02 |
| man_in_shack | Stskeeps, that's a pretty damn big "if" | 17:03 |
| man_in_shack | as nokia's drivers don't even support wext | 17:03 |
| Stskeeps | they do, with a fairly easy patch | 17:03 |
| Stskeeps | grab mer's cx3110x.ko | 17:03 |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: If it is any consolation, Nokia does not support SIP through NAT on my cell phone | 17:04 |
| RST38h | man_in_shack: So, should I start attacking Nokia stores with Molotov coctails because of that? =) | 17:04 |
| Stskeeps | RST38h: i had you suspected of having such plans! | 17:04 |
| VDVsx | RST38h, yes, please, lolol | 17:04 |
| Myrtti | as long as you keep out of Finland | 17:05 |
| AStorm | man_in_shack, there is an open driver by Nokia that does support wext | 17:05 |
| AStorm | so stfu | 17:05 |
| AStorm | :) | 17:05 |
| man_in_shack | AStorm, where? | 17:05 |
| man_in_shack | RST38h, STFU | 17:05 |
| AStorm | they don't use it yet in maemo | 17:05 |
| AStorm | cx3310~ | 17:05 |
| AStorm | cx3310x google it | 17:05 |
| RST38h | <another successfully phallomorphed target> | 17:05 |
| Myrtti | comic relief ♥ | 17:05 |
| AStorm | as Stskeeps "aid | 17:05 |
| Myrtti | can see it's Friday | 17:06 |
| * Stskeeps passes Myrtti beer from the #maemo friday bar | 17:06 | |
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| Myrtti | wohoo! \o/ | 17:06 |
| * RST38h paints another star on his keyboard | 17:06 | |
| AStorm | man_in_shack, 9h btw, it won't work on the old kernel Maemo uses | 17:06 |
| AStorm | only on a new one (like Mer has) | 17:06 |
| Stskeeps | nah | 17:07 |
| Stskeeps | will work on same kernel. | 17:07 |
| Stskeeps | Mer doesn't have a new kernel, only patches | 17:07 |
| AStorm | and all the Nokia custom apps, that is IPA, don't know about wext | 17:07 |
| man_in_shack | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/cx3110x/ | 17:07 |
| AStorm | yeah that | 17:07 |
| man_in_shack | i think i tried this and couldn't find a sensible download | 17:07 |
| man_in_shack | there was some other driver that was meant to replace it or something | 17:07 |
| AStorm | because it isn't built | 17:07 |
| GAN800 | man_in_shack, you want to complain, call up Nokia Care. | 17:07 |
| AStorm | grab the module from Mer | 17:08 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: grab a mer tar.gz, extract cx3110x.ko from it, mount initfs rw, copy it in there.. | 17:08 |
| RST38h | GAN: Now, *that( is sadistic. | 17:08 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Why would you want to build that oldass version? | 17:08 |
| AStorm | also, again, connection manager won't work with it | 17:08 |
| AStorm | have fun installing a replacement | 17:08 |
| AStorm | I recommend wicd | 17:08 |
| Stskeeps | mer module will work fine with connection manager | 17:08 |
| Stskeeps | we don't fuck around that much.. | 17:08 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:08 |
| AStorm | it will? | 17:08 |
| AStorm | haha | 17:08 |
| AStorm | I suppose it didn't last time | 17:09 |
| Myrtti | Daddy, did the scary monster go away now? | 17:09 |
| Stskeeps | well honestly i didn't try but it would surprise me if it doesn't | 17:09 |
| Stskeeps | Myrtti: mention of "wicd"? :P | 17:09 |
| *** tbf is now known as tbf|afk | 17:10 | |
| Myrtti | Stskeeps: the musky smelling hairy beast that lives in a cave | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | what, me? | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:10 |
| *** hugopl has quit IRC | 17:10 | |
| * Stskeeps goes track down a crashing bug in mer hildon desktop | 17:10 | |
| man_in_shack | Stskeeps, btw, even if this doesn't work out, thanks for TRYING to help without being deliberately exacerbating like some of the other people here | 17:10 |
| * lardman notes lots of expletives in the channel | 17:11 | |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: all that info is in the exact same bug you pointed to, AFAIK | 17:11 |
| RST38h | heya lardman | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: also, keep in my mind you just badmouthed my baby and i'm -still- helping you - you get very far with being kind and asking out of the blue if anyone can help you with X because you're stuck at Y | 17:12 |
| lardman | and on that note, the beer, not the swearing, I'm heading for home | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | beer! | 17:13 |
| lardman | cu all later | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | the solution to all problems | 17:13 |
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| lardman|gone | :) | 17:13 |
| GAN800 | RST38h, well, they're the only people that can help him. | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | (i can agree mer is sometimes unstable crap, though, hence why i'm doing an effort to fix things :) | 17:13 |
| RST38h | GAN: I haven't seen anyone helped by Nokia Care. Ever. | 17:14 |
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| man_in_shack | i wish i knew what happened to my old mer install | 17:14 |
| GAN800 | RST38h, complaining here only serves to irritate people who MIGHT be willing to try helpingz you otherwise. If you want to express your displeasure with Nokia then you need to talk TO Nokia | 17:15 |
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| RST38h | GAN: That goes without argument, of course. | 17:15 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: ran off after knocking up an iphone.. | 17:16 |
| GAN800 | man_in_shack, just, fyi, first warning here, next time you coming in flinging around insults, don't expect to last long. :) | 17:16 |
| Stskeeps | ah, he's been in here before and been cheerful | 17:17 |
| Stskeeps | (no sarcasm in that sentence) | 17:17 |
| man_in_shack | GAN800, i don't expect to be treated like crap because i want a SIMPLE feature that should have been implemented long ago | 17:17 |
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| AStorm | not so simple | 17:17 |
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| AStorm | thanks to TI being asses | 17:17 |
| man_in_shack | i don't expect to be treated like crap because i refuse to waste money buying something that will run harmattan when it's released | 17:18 |
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| suihkulokki | you should expected to be treated like creap if you enter a irc channel ranting | 17:18 |
| VDVsx | man_in_shack, blame nokia, not the maemo community ;) | 17:18 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: we can agree on that the whole fixed in fremantle/harmattan thing is crap, but it's just because we as community haven't been strong enough to create pipelines for delivering these fixes, or organising people in a manner so it gets done.. | 17:18 |
| AStorm | that's why there'll be mer | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: which is really what we're doing with mer and eventually the diablo community variants | 17:19 |
| AStorm | and that's why there have been hacker editions for 770 | 17:19 |
| man_in_shack | and i don't expect to be treated like crap because i want the solution now, when it's actually relevant, not in 12 months when i might not even have access to this particular netowkr | 17:19 |
| wazd_n800 | ohohoh, scandal!) | 17:19 |
| wazd_n800 | I came just in time) | 17:20 |
| GAN800 | man_in_shack, nobody here wants to be treated like crap because you're having a bad morning either. :) | 17:20 |
| AStorm | man_in_shack, hire a nokia dev or someone like that to do it... | 17:20 |
| AStorm | actually, workaround is now possible thanks to mer | 17:21 |
| AStorm | but this isn't integrated in diablo right now, for obvious reasons | 17:21 |
| AStorm | btw, what kind of feature is that? | 17:21 |
| man_in_shack | what obvious reasons? | 17:21 |
| wazd_n800 | what's the theme of current speculation?) | 17:22 |
| wazd_n800 | I want to participate!) | 17:22 |
| AStorm | man_in_shack, all workforce moved to fremantle | 17:22 |
| AStorm | and current driver being stable and tested | 17:23 |
| man_in_shack | that's not an obvious reason for why it wasn't done in the first place | 17:23 |
| VDVsx | wazd_n800, not a speculation, just ranting :P | 17:23 |
| Jaffa | man_in_shack: The main point is that this channel is a community channel, not a Nokia support channel. And we're focused on trynig to solve problems: we've done our sitting around in a moaning circle-jerk before and moved on. More productive times. | 17:23 |
| AStorm | it wasn't done, because there was no driver | 17:24 |
| AStorm | duh | 17:24 |
| AStorm | it's fairly new | 17:24 |
| AStorm | good that they made it | 17:24 |
| Stskeeps | cx3110x? released long ago :P | 17:24 |
| man_in_shack | https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=12&release_id=1012 << FEBURARY 2007 | 17:25 |
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| *** Zhilin_n800 is now known as wazd_n801 | 17:25 | |
| wazd_n801 | I don't know why everybody call TI asses and stuff | 17:26 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Look in the diablo sdk repo | 17:26 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, but wasn't stable | 17:26 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Much newer than the one listed on the garage page | 17:26 |
| AStorm | ah right | 17:26 |
| AStorm | another obstacle | 17:26 |
| AStorm | :P | 17:26 |
| AStorm | it's.... somewhere :P | 17:26 |
| AStorm | wazd_n800, because TI NDAs are evil | 17:27 |
| wazd_n801 | They had a price list for OMAP2 platform, Nokia decided not to y for video driver. Now TI decided to present our community those drivers for free and you call'em asses | 17:27 |
| wazd_n801 | not to pay* | 17:27 |
| AStorm | s/those drivers/binaries/ | 17:28 |
| AStorm | that's a difference | 17:28 |
| * oespirit blinks in disbelief after scrolling down more than a dozen screenfuls of rant-ish channel logs | 17:28 | |
| wazd_n801 | not binaries! Fresh opened drivers with sources | 17:28 |
| AStorm | btw, gimme a link to them | 17:28 |
| qwerty12_N810 | AStorm: no, there's talk of a open source powervr driver. it does have some bugs compared to the binary only ones | 17:28 |
| AStorm | link or it didn't happen | 17:28 |
| wazd_n801 | have you read a thread? | 17:28 |
| AStorm | no | 17:29 |
| rm_you | i thought the problem was that the built-in video chip on the OMAP2 wasn't actually part of the video pipeline because it was too low resolution so there is a different LCD controller powering the screen | 17:29 |
| wazd_n801 | AStorm: It's in the same place as the whole gasping | 17:29 |
| rm_you | did I just pull that out of nowhere, or does someone else know what i'm referring to? | 17:30 |
| AStorm | yeah, that is mostly OMAP2 designed for other stuff than a 800x480 tablet | 17:30 |
| Jaffa | AStorm: qgil's 9.06-14 task in http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/June_09 - being tracked in the "N800 has a 3D accelerator?" thread on tmo | 17:30 |
| Stskeeps | rm_you: no, i've heard that before | 17:30 |
| Stskeeps | rm_you: but it doesn't mean that it isn't useful | 17:30 |
| qwerty12_N810 | rm_you: it's true | 17:30 |
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| wazd_n801 | rm_you: well, this is a secondary problem | 17:30 |
| rm_you | lol alright | 17:30 |
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| Stskeeps | rm_you: how's cross platform backlight coming? :P | 17:31 |
| wazd_n801 | rm_you: you can do cool thing with pixel doubling for example | 17:31 |
| rm_you | lol, i've been working and driving and working and driving >_< | 17:31 |
| GAN800 | rm_you, memory is system | 17:31 |
| GAN800 | the framebuffer isn't any issue | 17:31 |
| rm_you | i thought it already did hardware pixel doubling | 17:31 |
| man_in_shack | oh just thought of something else | 17:32 |
| GAN800 | The Epspn chip does free arbitrary scaling | 17:32 |
| wazd_n801 | run thru power vr at 400x240 and then double it with Epson | 17:32 |
| man_in_shack | is it possible to disable esd on diablo, preferably temporarily so i can test what i suspect to be a latency issue with some apps? | 17:32 |
| AStorm | wazd_n800, or 640x480 | 17:32 |
| AStorm | and add bars | 17:32 |
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| wazd_n801 | astorm, well, there are a lot of tricks) | 17:33 |
| * rm_you feels guilty for looking quite hungrily at the Archos 7 | 17:33 | |
| suihkulokki | man_in_shack: iirc /etc/init.d/esd (?) stop | 17:33 |
| wazd_n801 | Anyway, they are making pure opened driver for community, so the community can improve it later | 17:34 |
| man_in_shack | suihkulokki, i tried that, but it seems it autostarted when the app started | 17:34 |
| AStorm | wazd_n800, goodie | 17:34 |
| Stskeeps | wazd_n801: yeah.. i think people are just bitter :P | 17:34 |
| Jaffa | wazd_n801: nothing's confirmed yet - still time for it to go fubar | 17:34 |
| man_in_shack | Stskeeps, i can't find maemo's initrd | 17:34 |
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| AStorm | pity we can't run compiz on top of that at 800x480 | 17:34 |
| AStorm | :/ | 17:34 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: we don't have one, /lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1/ somewhere | 17:34 |
| AStorm | guess we'll have to settle for Xv | 17:35 |
| rm_you | lol, compix on tablet? rofl | 17:35 |
| man_in_shack | someone said initrd | 17:35 |
| suihkulokki | man_in_shack: hrmh, that might be, I guess you'll need to chmod -x the binary then | 17:35 |
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| rm_you | s/compix/compiz/ | 17:35 |
| infobot | rm_you meant: lol, compiz on tablet? rofl | 17:35 |
| AStorm | rm_you, why not, w/o effects | 17:35 |
| man_in_shack | there's no /lib/modules :| | 17:36 |
| AStorm | still, 3D is overrated | 17:36 |
| rm_you | i mean don't get me wrong, i love compiz... i worked a bit on the project when it was forked to beryl... | 17:36 |
| rm_you | but i don | 17:36 |
| AStorm | man_in_shack, it's in initramfs | 17:36 |
| rm_you | but i don't see the point on the tablet :P | 17:36 |
| GAN800 | 800x480 at 12bpp should work | 17:36 |
| AStorm | that was tongue in cheek | 17:36 |
| AStorm | GAN800, hmm, low color? interesting | 17:36 |
| rm_you | that | 17:37 |
| man_in_shack | AStorm, it's in where? | 17:37 |
| AStorm | does the screen have any more? | 17:37 |
| rm_you | hrm | 17:37 |
| wazd_n801 | GAN800, well, 12bpp really suxx ( | 17:37 |
| rm_you | ack gotta go | 17:37 |
| AStorm | wazd_n800, you do | 17:37 |
| rm_you | back to idling for a few days :P | 17:37 |
| wazd_n801 | Even 16 is not very cool, 12 is uber lame) | 17:37 |
| AStorm | the LCD doesn't have any more than this | 17:37 |
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| wazd_n801 | but you can run blackberry UI with this mode :P | 17:38 |
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| man_in_shack | Stskeeps, i can't work out where to put this kernel module | 17:39 |
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| man_in_shack | there's no /lib/modules, apparently no initrd file ... | 17:39 |
| AStorm | man_in_shack, it's a separate partition | 17:40 |
| AStorm | accessible via /initrd (but readonly) | 17:40 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: mount -o remount,rw /mnt/initfs , put it in /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/somewhere-where-cx3110x.ko is | 17:40 |
| qwerty12_N810 | /mnt/initfs/lib/modules/2.6.21-omap1 | 17:40 |
| Stskeeps | AStorm: no initrd on maemo or mer | 17:40 |
| AStorm | yeah, that | 17:40 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, initramfs, yep | 17:40 |
| AStorm | whatever | 17:40 |
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| AStorm | or maybe even not ram :P | 17:40 |
| AStorm | initfs | 17:40 |
| man_in_shack | AStorm, /initrd is not in fstab | 17:41 |
| AStorm | ... | 17:41 |
| AStorm | it's not | 17:41 |
| AStorm | /mnt/initfs is already mounte | 17:41 |
| AStorm | d | 17:41 |
| man_in_shack | ah, /dev/root == /mnt/initfs in mtab | 17:41 |
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| AStorm | (by the boot loader) | 17:41 |
| man_in_shack | i see | 17:41 |
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| AStorm | (then pivot_rooted) | 17:41 |
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| man_in_shack | now i see a file cx3110x_mt.ko | 17:43 |
| man_in_shack | what's that? | 17:43 |
| GAN800 | 400x240 at 16bpp | 17:43 |
| AStorm | a variant | 17:43 |
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| AStorm | using different firmware | 17:43 |
| man_in_shack | hm ok | 17:44 |
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| man_in_shack | so first step is to confirm that the WPA-PSK wireless at home works :D | 17:44 |
| AStorm | it didn't? | 17:45 |
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| man_in_shack | it did | 17:45 |
| AStorm | that should work | 17:45 |
| man_in_shack | now it has a new module | 17:45 |
| AStorm | ah, yep | 17:45 |
| AStorm | still, why do you need the new driver? | 17:45 |
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| man_in_shack | you don't want to live long do you? | 17:45 |
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| AStorm | what will I die from laughter? | 17:46 |
| AStorm | :P | 17:46 |
| * RST38h slaughters AStorm to save Darwin some work | 17:46 | |
| man_in_shack | ok, home's wireless is being detected but it's not connecting | 17:47 |
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| AStorm | did I mention the conn manager doesn't work with it? | 17:47 |
| RST38h | (before AStorm cuts another power supply open and electrocutes himself that is :)) | 17:47 |
| AStorm | try iwconfig | 17:47 |
| AStorm | RST38h, I'm not stupid | 17:47 |
| man_in_shack | AStorm, Stskeeps mentioned that it did | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | well | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | i'm obviously wrong | 17:48 |
| man_in_shack | fuck | 17:48 |
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| AStorm | wpa_supplicant is available | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | lsmod and see if cx3110x is there | 17:48 |
| RST38h | AStorm: don't have to be, "careless" is sufficient | 17:48 |
| AStorm | idk if wicd is too | 17:48 |
| man_in_shack | Stskeeps, it is, hence the successful scan | 17:48 |
| AStorm | RST38h, not *that* careless | 17:48 |
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| RST38h | hehe | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: anyway, the wpa extension thingie should work now | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | funny normal osso-wlan doesn't work with it | 17:49 |
| man_in_shack | wicd would be fine | 17:49 |
| man_in_shack | if it was available | 17:49 |
| RST38h | Creepy stuff: http://gizmodo.com/5302856/anti+abuse-bus-stop-ad-only-batters-women-when-nobodys-looking | 17:49 |
| man_in_shack | so anyone know if network-manager, wicd, etc are packaged for maemo anywhere? | 17:52 |
| AStorm | nm is unlikely, it pulls gnome | 17:52 |
| man_in_shack | indeed | 17:52 |
| man_in_shack | wicd then :P | 17:52 |
| AStorm | but wicd... someone could do it | 17:52 |
| man_in_shack | and wpa-supplicant | 17:52 |
| AStorm | Stskeeps, maybe you have them? | 17:53 |
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| AStorm | mer 100% has wpa-supplicant | 17:54 |
| AStorm | not sure about wicd | 17:54 |
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| AStorm | (it uses nm) | 17:55 |
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| man_in_shack | well right now i either need a link to a package for at least wpa-supplicant or preferably something with a gui too :P | 17:59 |
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| man_in_shack | screw it ... maybe someone will be nice enough to send me the maemo cx3110x module so i can at least get my home internet back | 18:11 |
| Stskeeps | you can always reflash initfs specifically | 18:12 |
| Stskeeps | --flash-only | 18:12 |
| man_in_shack | hmm? | 18:12 |
| man_in_shack | what command exactly? | 18:12 |
| * man_in_shack pokes Stskeeps | 18:14 | |
| Stskeeps | ./flasher-3.0 -F fiasco-image --flash-only=initfs or something | 18:15 |
| man_in_shack | hmm | 18:16 |
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| man_in_shack | seem to be missing a few things there | 18:16 |
| Stskeeps | hence the "or something" | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | there's a guide on how to get rid of bootmenu, same trick | 18:17 |
| man_in_shack | link? | 18:18 |
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| Stskeeps | http://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card#Remove_the_menu | 18:19 |
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| Macer | where was all this love for michael jackson when the world thought he was a pervert? | 18:22 |
| RST38h | There is love for michael jackson? | 18:24 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: well he was innocent according to the verdict, so | 18:24 |
| RST38h | Sts: Just loved children sooooo much, didn't he? =) | 18:24 |
| man_in_shack | is fiasco-flasher sufficient or do i need flasher-3.0? | 18:24 |
| Macer | heh | 18:25 |
| Macer | i know | 18:25 |
| Macer | i dont think he was a pervert | 18:25 |
| Macer | maybe nuts | 18:25 |
| Macer | if one of the parents said... dont give us a cent. we dont want it. just send him to jail | 18:25 |
| Macer | then i would have believed him to be a pervert | 18:25 |
| * RST38h wonders if wherever Michael Jackson went now he is kept in a jar filled with formaldehyde | 18:25 | |
| man_in_shack | wait a sec | 18:26 |
| man_in_shack | does the mer installer flash its own initfs? | 18:26 |
| Macer | RST38h: heh. well. i dont think his chemically altered skin decomposes | 18:27 |
| Macer | i bet all his sorry ass family members are going to be clawing at his money | 18:28 |
| Macer | except janet (the only other successful one) | 18:28 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: bootmenu installer does yeah | 18:28 |
| man_in_shack | and maybe jesse | 18:28 |
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| Stskeeps | Macer: what money? | 18:28 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 18:28 |
| Macer | like the mlk jr family who sue people for using their uncle's picture on a t shirt | 18:28 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: dont believe what tyou hear | 18:29 |
| Macer | he had a ton of money | 18:29 |
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| Macer | even more so now that he died | 18:29 |
| man_in_shack | Stskeeps, so running the bootmenu installer again should restore my wireless driver? :) | 18:29 |
| Macer | i bet millions flocked to buy michael jackson crap | 18:29 |
| Macer | like elvis | 18:29 |
| Stskeeps | man_in_shack: we only modify initfs, not overwrite it | 18:29 |
| man_in_shack | oh | 18:29 |
| lcuk | is the comeback tour still on? | 18:29 |
| man_in_shack | too smart for my own good | 18:30 |
| Macer | lol | 18:30 |
| man_in_shack | lcuk, of course it is | 18:30 |
| Stskeeps | lcuk: MJ as one of the zombies? | 18:30 |
| Macer | lcuk: yeah! | 18:30 |
| man_in_shack | lcuk, first ever musician to do a "comeback from the dead" tour | 18:30 |
| Macer | now they can have the jackson 5 reunion too.. where all of his brothers can exploit his death | 18:30 |
| lcuk | if he can pull that one off, he deserves his title | 18:30 |
| Macer | =) | 18:30 |
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| Macer | sing all their bullshit songs about how they loved michael | 18:31 |
| Macer | show his pictures on a giant imax sized screen while murdering his songs with their own voices | 18:32 |
| Stskeeps | gah.. i so understand why they dropped hildon-desktop like it's hot | 18:32 |
| Stskeeps | as in, 2.0 | 18:32 |
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| Macer | Stskeeps: they dropped it? | 18:32 |
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| Stskeeps | as in remade it for clutter | 18:32 |
| Macer | no more hildon? | 18:32 |
| Macer | oh | 18:32 |
| Macer | could be worse. it could have the symbian gui | 18:33 |
| man_in_shack | <Macer> sing all their bullshit songs about how they loved michael << incest | 18:33 |
| Jaffa | Stskeeps: is it cos it's a painful sack of shit? | 18:33 |
| Macer | hilson is ugly | 18:34 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: very unstable | 18:34 |
| * Stskeeps can crash it pretty decently atm | 18:34 | |
| Macer | but i suppose necessary for the screen space | 18:34 |
| man_in_shack | well this download is going to take longer than i can stay awake | 18:34 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: make a qt based env | 18:34 |
| man_in_shack | Stskeeps, thanks for your help so far | 18:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: X-Osso-Service=com.nokia.whatever-the-fuck will segfault it :\ | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: the thought has crossed my mind. | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | did you see Qtablet? | 18:35 |
| man_in_shack | some time soon i'll try compiling wpa-supplicant and wicd for maemo | 18:35 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: no | 18:35 |
| Macer | i dont have my n800 anymore ;) | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | Macer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAwmW6_G0TM | 18:35 |
| Macer | ok | 18:36 |
| Macer | will check it out | 18:36 |
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| Macer | omfg | 18:40 |
| Macer | Stskeeps: that is awesome! | 18:40 |
| Macer | lol | 18:40 |
| Macer | use that! | 18:40 |
| Macer | haha | 18:40 |
| Stskeeps | except development kinda stalled | 18:41 |
| Macer | then unstall it | 18:41 |
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| * Stskeeps wonders what on earth libiphb is for | 18:49 | |
| Stskeeps | besides heartbeat stuff | 18:49 |
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| oespirit | Stskeeps: to render yet another package out-of-reach and unbuildable | 18:57 |
| Stskeeps | oespirit: ah, but easily hackable | 18:57 |
| Stskeeps | i just built hildon-home | 18:57 |
| Stskeeps | with a bit of good old fashioned delete everything that moves | 18:57 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 18:57 |
| oespirit | Stskeeps: that applies to many of the things in the UI. wonder if they thought nobody would bother hacking | 18:57 |
| oespirit | Stskeeps: keeping icons closed for instance, is just too much | 18:58 |
| Stskeeps | ah, but that's sortof replacable | 18:58 |
| oespirit | Stskeeps: precisely my point. Why keep things closed if you know people will get to them anyways | 19:00 |
| Stskeeps | in this particular fashion i would say because of competition :P | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | it would have been a very possible thing that some random chinese manufactorer had fremantle beta and published before nokia's first device with it | 19:02 |
| oespirit | Stskeeps: they can do that now with mer :P | 19:03 |
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| Stskeeps | nah, hardly as much as with a full fremantle :P | 19:04 |
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| GAN800 | Stskeeps, can you imagine if the SmartQ shipped with Fremantle? ;) | 19:23 |
| Stskeeps | i suspect that would single-handedly kill nokia involvement in open source | 19:24 |
| Stskeeps | (there's a reason why we try to differentiate mer ui, really) | 19:24 |
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| lopz | hola | 20:02 |
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| Macer | Stskeeps: screw hildon.. use qtablet :-P | 20:11 |
| Macer | lol | 20:12 |
| Macer | it's so pretty | 20:12 |
| Macer | it is going to make me buy an n810 | 20:12 |
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| AStorm | Macer, linky? | 20:16 |
| AStorm | why would it require n810? | 20:17 |
| Macer | well. i gave Stskeeps my n800 | 20:17 |
| Macer | so why would i get another one when n810s are so cheap? | 20:17 |
| Macer | :) | 20:17 |
| AStorm | heh | 20:18 |
| * GAN800 throws up a little in his mouth at Nokia Android netbooks. | 20:18 | |
| AStorm | link to qtablet please? | 20:18 |
| Stskeeps | GAN800: url? | 20:18 |
| Macer | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAwmW6_G0TM | 20:18 |
| AStorm | lol | 20:18 |
| Macer | android netbooks? | 20:18 |
| GAN800 | Somebody needs to hand Android the smackdown. I'm more tired of it than I am of the iPhone. | 20:19 |
| AStorm | Macer, nonyoutube plz? | 20:19 |
| Macer | android would kind of suck on something that can run xp | 20:19 |
| GAN800 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=300049 | 20:19 |
| Macer | hey | 20:19 |
| Macer | i have an n800 | 20:19 |
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| Macer | er | 20:19 |
| GAN800 | Android kind of sucks period | 20:19 |
| Macer | g1 | 20:19 |
| Macer | lol | 20:19 |
| RST38h | GAN: Any particular reasons? | 20:19 |
| Macer | it is better than most phone operating systems | 20:20 |
| RST38h | (other than the ones I know about =)) | 20:20 |
| Stskeeps | GAN800: analyst.. | 20:20 |
| Macer | i couldnt see it on a netbook tho | 20:20 |
| GAN800 | RST38h, didn't care for the G1 or the software, Google, Java, open source bs. | 20:20 |
| Macer | but my g1 is great | 20:20 |
| GAN800 | (in no particular order) | 20:20 |
| RST38h | Aha | 20:20 |
| GAN800 | RST38h, Android is like tegra | 20:20 |
| Firebird | well isn't maemo turning into a phone os similar to android and iphoneos | 20:20 |
| RST38h | Tegra is actually hardware though =) | 20:21 |
| Macer | heh | 20:21 |
| GAN800 | Every fanboi gets wrongful feelings when they hear about it, but it's largely just hype. | 20:21 |
| RST38h | Firebird: Maemo is turning into S60 replacement on high end Nokia phones | 20:21 |
| RST38h | Whether you like this fact or not is completely up to you | 20:21 |
| Macer | GAN800: ive been using android. it is good | 20:21 |
| GAN800 | Firebird, way more powerful than any of those. | 20:21 |
| Macer | minus the lack of bt stuff | 20:21 |
| GAN800 | No manufacturer/carrier/developer impossed insanity. | 20:22 |
| GAN800 | Java, AppStore, whatever. | 20:22 |
| Macer | like file xfering and i had to build it myself | 20:22 |
| Macer | GAN800: you dont know that yet | 20:22 |
| Firebird | yea, it may be coming soon | 20:22 |
| Macer | it has a built in hspda modem | 20:22 |
| GAN800 | Who wants to bet there'll be absolutely zero issue tethering to an N900? :) | 20:22 |
| Macer | why tether? | 20:22 |
| Macer | :) | 20:22 |
| Macer | the modem is built in | 20:23 |
| GAN800 | Because Comcast sucks ass | 20:23 |
| GAN800 | Macer, tether TO. | 20:23 |
| AStorm | aaaah :) | 20:23 |
| Macer | and i dont have much of an issue tethering my g1 to anything | 20:23 |
| AStorm | yeah, that better work | 20:23 |
| AStorm | see, bluez can tether | 20:23 |
| AStorm | as long as tthere's a nice ui | 20:23 |
| Macer | so can adhoc wifi | 20:24 |
| Macer | with some iptables rules | 20:24 |
| AStorm | that's not effortless | 20:24 |
| Macer | and probably works more efficiently than bt tethering | 20:24 |
| AStorm | that's true, though not power efficiently | 20:24 |
| GAN800 | adhoc eats power | 20:24 |
| Macer | AStorm: it is when you have an app that has a "start tether" button | 20:24 |
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| Macer | not too badly | 20:25 |
| AStorm | GAN800, that's why bt pan is better | 20:25 |
| Macer | you could always get the larger g1 battery | 20:25 |
| Macer | :) | 20:25 |
| AStorm | and even bt dun - but I've no idea how to set that up w/ bluez | 20:26 |
| Macer | if my g1 had printing support it would own all | 20:26 |
| AStorm | nope | 20:26 |
| AStorm | try to play a movie | 20:26 |
| * mgedmin had figured out once how to setup bt dun, but never had any success with pan | 20:26 | |
| AStorm | mgedmin, howto plz | 20:26 |
| AStorm | pan is easy, just enable and route | 20:27 |
| * mgedmin sighs | 20:27 | |
| mgedmin | both are damn too hard | 20:27 |
| RST38h | mgdemin: that is because os2008 does not support it out of the box | 20:27 |
| * mgedmin notices distinct deterioration in his grammar | 20:27 | |
| AStorm | mgedmin, yeah, a good UI would be much better | 20:27 |
| Macer | i still cant see android on a ntbook | 20:27 |
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| Macer | netbook | 20:27 |
| Macer | it would be rather pointless | 20:27 |
| AStorm | nitbook? ;) | 20:28 |
| mgedmin | fwiw the bt dun I'd set up was to get my palm tx to sync via bluetooth (using network sync) with my laptop; and it was some time ago | 20:28 |
| Macer | no offense but i cant see mer on one either | 20:28 |
| Macer | when you can just put debian or even better..opensolaris on it :) | 20:28 |
| Macer | those types of operating systems are meant for the underpowered portable market | 20:29 |
| Firebird | bleh, solaris | 20:29 |
| AStorm | slowlaris would choke | 20:29 |
| Macer | if you cant fit it in a pocket.. android and mer shouldnt be on it | 20:30 |
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| Macer | AStorm: i use opensolaris and it is great | 20:30 |
| AStorm | debian with tuned set of apps is better | 20:30 |
| RST38h | AStorm: Solaris adepts are saying they have fixed the PCI problem | 20:30 |
| Macer | for what i do it is better than linux | 20:30 |
| AStorm | Macer, 9n a netbook? | 20:30 |
| RST38h | So it is fast now | 20:30 |
| Macer | on a server and desktop | 20:30 |
| AStorm | RST38h, finally! | 20:30 |
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| Macer | RST38h: they seem to have gotten stronger support from sun | 20:31 |
| Macer | their pkging system is getting better | 20:31 |
| Macer | hardware support is getting better | 20:31 |
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| Macer | and to top it off... it has zfs. that alone makes it better than anything else :) | 20:32 |
| AStorm | not than btrfs | 20:33 |
| AStorm | haha | 20:33 |
| Macer | er | 20:33 |
| AStorm | both are oracle's now | 20:33 |
| Macer | unstable not released unusable in a stable enviroment btrfs? :) | 20:33 |
| AStorm | define stable environment | 20:33 |
| Macer | uhm | 20:34 |
| Macer | i think that one is self defined | 20:34 |
| AStorm | and btrfs is near 1.0 | 20:34 |
| AStorm | (though not feature complete yet, but the basics are covered) | 20:34 |
| AStorm | (basics include RAID 0 and 1) | 20:35 |
| Macer | Btrfs is under heavy development, and is not suitable for any uses other than benchmarking and review. The Btrfs disk format is not yet finalized, but it will only be changed if a critical bug is found and no workarounds are possible | 20:36 |
| AStorm | blah blah | 20:36 |
| AStorm | I haven't seen any important bugs recently | 20:37 |
| Macer | lol. sorry buddy but zfs is tested and true | 20:37 |
| AStorm | that is right | 20:37 |
| AStorm | but it doesn't make it better :P | 20:37 |
| Macer | sure it does | 20:37 |
| AStorm | what makes is the raid-z and online fsck | 20:37 |
| Macer | :) | 20:37 |
| AStorm | (the performance otherwise is not that great) | 20:37 |
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| AStorm | (but not lousy either) | 20:38 |
| Macer | i dunno. i get about 300MB/s | 20:38 |
| AStorm | on what hardware :P | 20:38 |
| Macer | but that is on an 8 port raid 5 | 20:38 |
| Macer | :) | 20:39 |
| AStorm | and workload :P | 20:39 |
| AStorm | haha. | 20:39 |
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| AStorm | well, I was able to max my SSD w/ btrfs | 20:39 |
| AStorm | but not with ext4 or zfs or ufs2 | 20:39 |
| AStorm | guess why | 20:39 |
| Stskeeps | zfs is more suited for multiple devices really | 20:40 |
| AStorm | true | 20:40 |
| AStorm | it's its aim | 20:40 |
| ShadowJK | I am guessing you don't have a Intel SSD, or a OCZ Vertex | 20:40 |
| Macer | because btrfs is great? | 20:40 |
| ShadowJK | They're about the only non-crap SSD | 20:40 |
| Macer | :) | 20:40 |
| AStorm | ShadowJK, uhm, not only | 20:40 |
| AStorm | but they are the best | 20:40 |
| ShadowJK | The rest behave like an extreme case of harddrive, fast sequential speeds, brutally slow seeks | 20:40 |
| Macer | i figured ssd was more about access | 20:41 |
| Macer | than speed | 20:41 |
| AStorm | slow seeks? why? | 20:41 |
| Macer | no. fast seeks | 20:41 |
| AStorm | there's no seek time on flashn | 20:41 |
| AStorm | or almost none | 20:41 |
| ShadowJK | Macer, yeah people think that, but it's only the intel and vertex series that actually have fast seeks | 20:41 |
| AStorm | how do you measure seek time on ssd? :P | 20:41 |
| Macer | ShadowJK: thought it was due to faulty controllers | 20:42 |
| AStorm | there's no seek | 20:42 |
| ShadowJK | Macer, nah, it's more to it than that | 20:42 |
| AStorm | if you're talking random write, then yes, many ssds fail | 20:42 |
| mgedmin | random write latencies in thousand of milliseconds may not be "seeks", but they suck | 20:42 |
| AStorm | thanks to block sizes | 20:42 |
| AStorm | and too small cache | 20:42 |
| mgedmin | I've got an asus eeepc 900 with two ssd, both are horribly slow | 20:42 |
| RST38h | <get a real laptop> | 20:43 |
| AStorm | it has cheap ssd with no cache | 20:43 |
| Macer | well. i am sure in an actual work env... the faster seeks are awesome | 20:43 |
| * mgedmin taps his thinkpad t61 on the side | 20:43 | |
| AStorm | and small block size | 20:43 |
| mgedmin | there's that classical anandtech article about SSDs | 20:43 |
| RST38h | T61.... <well, you know> | 20:43 |
| mgedmin | recommended reading | 20:43 |
| AStorm | also, ext3 is not optimized for ssd | 20:43 |
| RST38h | URL? | 20:43 |
| mgedmin | http://www.anandtech.com/printarticle.aspx?i=3531 | 20:43 |
| AStorm | for blocks larger than its cluster size | 20:43 |
| VDVsx | GAN800, android development isn't restricted to java anymore | 20:44 |
| AStorm | and it doesn't spread metadata | 20:44 |
| mgedmin | ext3 + asus eee 900's SSD's ("ASUS PHISON" something or other) + 3 months == dead SSD | 20:44 |
| Macer | VDVsx: lol | 20:44 |
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| Macer | lag? =) | 20:44 |
| mgedmin | unreadable blocks where the ext3 journal used to live | 20:44 |
| RST38h | mgedmin: thanks | 20:44 |
| AStorm | true | 20:44 |
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| AStorm | that's why btrfs -o ssd wins | 20:44 |
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| AStorm | it spreads metadata | 20:44 |
| AStorm | is copy-on-write | 20:44 |
| GAN800 | VDVsx, yeah, but it still sucks. | 20:45 |
| Macer | i was waiting on more bullet points :) | 20:45 |
| Macer | well... bbl | 20:45 |
| VDVsx | GAN800, sure, but you can now use python, lua, C, C++ at least :P | 20:45 |
| ShadowJK | The real issue is that SSDs have native sector size of a megabyte or so. Harddrives have 512 byte sectors. So in the worst case if you just want to change 512 bytes on the SSD, the SSD itself will read a megabyte and write back a megabyte. In worst worst case, it will read back, erase original, write new modified megabyte. This slows it down | 20:46 |
| ShadowJK | If you just write sequentially it's fine and fast :P | 20:46 |
| Macer | VDVsx: and install mer? | 20:46 |
| Macer | :) | 20:46 |
| GAN800 | and Maemo still utterly kicks its ass | 20:46 |
| AStorm | ShadowJK, wrong | 20:46 |
| AStorm | you write it antisequentially | 20:46 |
| Macer | GAN800: but maemo isnt as pretty | 20:46 |
| AStorm | that is, split across as many eraseblocks as possible | 20:47 |
| Macer | with accel docs | 20:47 |
| Macer | lol | 20:47 |
| VDVsx | Macer, mer is like java *runs anywhere* :P | 20:47 |
| Macer | bbl | 20:47 |
| Macer | hahaha | 20:47 |
| Macer | VDVsx: so they say | 20:47 |
| ShadowJK | AStorm, ah but most all SSDs are optimized for the sequential case, because that's the only thing that stupid reviewers and benchmarkers cared about | 20:47 |
| AStorm | then still | 20:47 |
| Macer | gotta go | 20:47 |
| AStorm | it won't matter | 20:47 |
| VDVsx | Macer, we can say the same about Mer :P, lol | 20:47 |
| ShadowJK | The anandtech article is required reading :) | 20:47 |
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| GAN800 | Macer, that statement is about as subjective as it gets. | 20:48 |
| AStorm | the whole trick is to not rewrite same block all the time | 20:49 |
| ShadowJK | btw, it's highly unlikely ext3 or any other fs will gain any meaningful SSD optimizations... Linus basically said SSD manufacturers have to stop being asshats and Get it Right(TM), like Intel did. | 20:49 |
| GAN800 | Jaffa, ping? | 20:49 |
| AStorm | if the blocks are simply interleaved | 20:49 |
| AStorm | it should be fast | 20:49 |
| AStorm | say, every 8K gets to another block | 20:49 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: wtf does that mean? | 20:50 |
| AStorm | then you'd know where to place file data to only touch a single block at a time | 20:50 |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, read the anandtech article :P | 20:50 |
| Luke-Jr | … | 20:50 |
| ShadowJK | But basically, Sandisk and other "shut up we're the big corporation here and WE will tell YOU how to work around our piece of shit hardware"-companies said that operating systems must learn how to deal with flash storage efficiently | 20:51 |
| Luke-Jr | my only problem is lack of a direct MTD interface | 20:52 |
| ShadowJK | well you wont be getting it on SSDs :) | 20:53 |
| AStorm | why not | 20:53 |
| ShadowJK | The best you'll get is trim | 20:53 |
| AStorm | some SATA extended command? | 20:53 |
| ShadowJK | AStorm, because people want them to be bootable in PCs and to act like SATA harddrives? | 20:53 |
| AStorm | duhduh | 20:53 |
| ShadowJK | and because the Big Other operating system has no clue about raw flash? | 20:54 |
| AStorm | add a new command | 20:54 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: and they can't provide both interfaces? | 20:54 |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, no | 20:54 |
| AStorm | to address the flash linearly w/o ftl | 20:54 |
| AStorm | sure they can | 20:54 |
| AStorm | but it costs | 20:54 |
| ShadowJK | AStorm, the linear flash makes no sense to you | 20:54 |
| ShadowJK | because a stream of random writes will be written linearly to the flash :) | 20:54 |
| AStorm | and certain important OSes don't support anything | 20:54 |
| ShadowJK | by the smart firmware | 20:54 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: you use either or | 20:55 |
| AStorm | no no | 20:55 |
| AStorm | you don't get it | 20:55 |
| AStorm | I said an extended command to bypass FTL | 20:55 |
| Luke-Jr | heck, it'd be acceptable to have a replacement firmware | 20:55 |
| AStorm | and have blocks in orde | 20:55 |
| AStorm | r | 20:55 |
| Luke-Jr | flash that firmware and you get MTD only | 20:55 |
| AStorm | much like "disable ftl" command | 20:55 |
| AStorm | another to get the block size | 20:55 |
| ShadowJK | AStorm, yeah but you'd have to make a choice to always use either, you couldn't change between the two wihout a complete reformat | 20:56 |
| AStorm | and then the OS can work with it | 20:56 |
| AStorm | true | 20:56 |
| AStorm | but the FS would be flash-based | 20:56 |
| AStorm | with its own update layer | 20:56 |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, only place you'd want it is on the cheap SSDs, but the're too cheap to innovate anyway.. :( | 20:56 |
| AStorm | so not vfat | 20:57 |
| AStorm | :P | 20:57 |
| ShadowJK | Dude, the cheap SSDs were designed for VFAT :-) | 20:57 |
| AStorm | the problem is... partitioning | 20:57 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: why the cheap SSDs only? | 20:57 |
| AStorm | but unless the block is huge, the extended command could accept a range of values | 20:57 |
| Luke-Jr | the filesystem layer is smarter than FTL | 20:58 |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, because VFAT is in the spec for MMC, SD and such, and cheap SSDs are, internally, basically a big array of MMC/SD chips in raid-0 configuration | 20:58 |
| Luke-Jr | AStorm: I think UBD makes partitioning MTD ok? | 20:58 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: [12:56:56] <ShadowJK> Luke-Jr, only place you'd want it is on the cheap SSDs, but the're too cheap to innovate anyway.. ☹ | 20:59 |
| Stskeeps | interesting, fremantle home has different views | 20:59 |
| ShadowJK | Anyway... on the cheap SSDs their performance is so predictable/measurable that you can experimentally trivially determine the erase block size and other parameters that matter, and optimize your fs for that | 21:00 |
| ShadowJK | there's, however, no fs suitable for it... and likely there wont be any either, as newer SSDs wont be as crippled, hopefully. | 21:01 |
| ShadowJK | nilfs2 and LogFS might come close to running nicely | 21:01 |
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| ShadowJK | And it would be interesting if someone compared this on maemo with boot from SD, compared ext2/3 vs LogFS, for example :) | 21:01 |
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| ShadowJK | http://mirror.linux.org.au/pub/linux.conf.au/2007/video/talks/91.ogg <- this is a nice presentation on LogFS and the author touches on some of the "issues" and structures of flash storage :) | 21:03 |
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| AStorm | Luke-Jr, I | 21:08 |
| Luke-Jr | AStorm: You | 21:09 |
| AStorm | was talking about the SATA ranged switch | 21:09 |
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| AStorm | to disable some blocks from being FTLed | 21:09 |
| johnsq | Hi | 21:09 |
| johnsq | slonopotamus: do you need my patches for evtouch? | 21:09 |
| pupnik_ | any of you run ethernet over isdn telco cabling? | 21:10 |
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| AStorm | actually, copy-on-write is excellent on pure flash | 21:13 |
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| AStorm | a good flash controller would do garbage collection from time to time | 21:16 |
| AStorm | have a separate block of NOR flash to store data about pages marked as free | 21:17 |
| AStorm | and consolidate | 21:17 |
| Luke-Jr | … | 21:17 |
| Luke-Jr | why not just free them ASAP? | 21:17 |
| AStorm | because you can't | 21:17 |
| AStorm | thnatg requires rewriting a whole block | 21:18 |
| AStorm | which is slow | 21:18 |
| AStorm | so hide it from the user | 21:18 |
| AStorm | do it on idle | 21:18 |
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| AStorm | this is where the TRIM comes in | 21:20 |
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| AStorm | to inform the drive about emptied pages | 21:20 |
| * Luke-Jr notices this is the same "problem" that originated with CD-RWs | 21:21 | |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, oh, yeah, CD-RW is kinda similar :) | 21:22 |
| ShadowJK | Though these days you could actually run ext2 on DVD+RW :P | 21:22 |
| Jaffa | GAN800: pong | 21:23 |
| ShadowJK | hm | 21:23 |
| * ShadowJK wonders how LogFS on DVD+RW would perform :-) | 21:23 | |
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| Luke-Jr | you can run ext2 on raw flash too | 21:23 |
| Luke-Jr | but it's not the best idea | 21:24 |
| ShadowJK | slow :P | 21:24 |
| Luke-Jr | and DVD+RW isn't slow? :þ | 21:24 |
| ShadowJK | sure | 21:24 |
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| ShadowJK | So if you make a fs that runs fast on DVD+RW, it'll be fast on cheap SSD and on SD/MMC too :) | 21:26 |
| Luke-Jr | exactly | 21:26 |
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| AStorm | ShadowJK, or btrfs | 21:27 |
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| AStorm | btrfs is copy-on-write, so should be fast | 21:27 |
| Luke-Jr | is it? | 21:27 |
| Luke-Jr | to what degree? ☺ | 21:27 |
| Luke-Jr | I think Subversion would make for an excellent FS | 21:28 |
| AStorm | I think this includes metadata | 21:28 |
| AStorm | no, it's read-only metadata | 21:28 |
| Luke-Jr | … | 21:28 |
| AStorm | so you'd lose space | 21:28 |
| AStorm | that's why git can't be used as a fs | 21:28 |
| Luke-Jr | ⁇? | 21:28 |
| AStorm | unless you garbage collect old metadata | 21:29 |
| AStorm | (and commits) | 21:29 |
| Luke-Jr | why? | 21:29 |
| AStorm | you'll run out of space | 21:29 |
| Luke-Jr | eventually | 21:29 |
| AStorm | on updates | 21:29 |
| Luke-Jr | but I don't really want my FS deleting data on me anyway | 21:29 |
| AStorm | even if you delete a file | 21:29 |
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| Luke-Jr | maybe if I tell it explicitly | 21:30 |
| AStorm | btw, logfs is exactly what you describe | 21:30 |
| Luke-Jr | perhaps an automatic cleanup that retains tags | 21:30 |
| AStorm | plus grbage collection (very old versions are dropped) | 21:30 |
| ShadowJK | nilfs2 retains data... or rather, it retains snapshots :) | 21:31 |
| AStorm | yes | 21:31 |
| AStorm | same idea | 21:31 |
| ShadowJK | And there are tools so you can get it back too | 21:31 |
| ShadowJK | I don't think logfs has this yet | 21:31 |
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| Luke-Jr | but do either have cheap copies? | 21:31 |
| AStorm | sure yes | 21:32 |
| AStorm | overwrite is same as copy | 21:32 |
| ShadowJK | you mean cp -a sourcetree1 sourcetree2 resulting in near-zero space used until you go changing files in sourcetree2? | 21:32 |
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| AStorm | that's the cost | 21:32 |
| AStorm | well, almost | 21:33 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: yeah | 21:33 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: and *fast* | 21:33 |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, I don't think so | 21:33 |
| AStorm | overwrite also stores the modified blocks | 21:33 |
| AStorm | much like git's deltas | 21:33 |
| AStorm | this is ln | 21:34 |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, astorm is talking about what happens physically when you modify a single file | 21:34 |
| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: also, Subversion's format makes for simple backups | 21:34 |
| AStorm | hardlink | 21:34 |
| Luke-Jr | AStorm: hardlink + CoW is what I mean | 21:34 |
| AStorm | hmm | 21:34 |
| AStorm | I'd have to checl | 21:35 |
| AStorm | *check | 21:35 |
| AStorm | note that new metadata has to be added | 21:35 |
| AStorm | a bit funny in extent-based system | 21:35 |
| AStorm | but not impossible | 21:36 |
| AStorm | btrfs has bcp to do this afaik | 21:37 |
| AStorm | normal cp still does a full copy | 21:37 |
| AStorm | snapshots can be CoW | 21:37 |
| AStorm | I suspect they may switch all copies to this scheme | 21:37 |
| AStorm | or provide an option | 21:38 |
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| Stskeeps | timeless_mbp: what was your l10n url again for the mer packages? | 21:50 |
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| Stskeeps | nm, found it | 21:53 |
| Stskeeps | arh. | 21:53 |
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| infobot | I herald you, my supreme master! Lead us into the light of your wisdom and power | 22:57 |
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| VDVsx | infobot, wtf | 23:05 |
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| RST38h | "A company called PolyPlus has developed lithium metal-air batteries that have 10 times the energy density of regular lithium-ion batteries." | 23:16 |
| RST38h | Anyone else sees TROUBLE there? | 23:17 |
| Stskeeps | boom? | 23:17 |
| Luke-Jr | why? | 23:17 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, is that a news article that has been rewritten and quoted 10 times so that "power density" has turned into "energy density", or is it straight from sauce? | 23:18 |
| RST38h | Shadow: If you can call Slashdot "the source"... | 23:18 |
| Luke-Jr | LOL | 23:18 |
| RST38h | But yes, it just has "kaboom" written all over | 23:19 |
| ShadowJK | Ah, the company claims theoretical energy density is similar to that of gasoline | 23:20 |
| Luke-Jr | how about replacing the battery with a wireless energy collector? ;) | 23:20 |
| Luke-Jr | use the ambient energy in the area | 23:20 |
| pupnik | kookery on youtube | 23:21 |
| RST38h | Yea, right | 23:21 |
| RST38h | Beam it from orbit | 23:21 |
| pupnik | zero-point energy | 23:21 |
| ShadowJK | Luke-Jr, you know, energy companies have actually successfully sued people who wirelessly leeched off of their transmission lines | 23:21 |
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| Luke-Jr | ShadowJK: uh... I didn't say off lines ;) | 23:22 |
| Luke-Jr | just ambient energy in the air | 23:22 |
| ShadowJK | Yes but that energy is radiated from something :) | 23:22 |
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| ShadowJK | anyway, that approach has the same problem as using existing Zinc-air batteries, which have superior energy density... no power :) | 23:22 |
| ShadowJK | or insufficient power | 23:23 |
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| RST38h | zinc batteries are pretty good, for watches | 23:23 |
| _Mayito_ | hi all | 23:23 |
| ShadowJK | for low power drain | 23:23 |
| _Mayito_ | someone can help me to flash my nokia n810 please?\ | 23:24 |
| ShadowJK | This is also the thing about Nokia's "ambient energy collection" device... the power it can provide is barely sufficient to keep the phone idling | 23:24 |
| ShadowJK | ~flashing | 23:24 |
| infobot | i guess flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 23:24 |
| suihkulokki | ShadowJK: I was told someone in .fi dug a coil under a transmission line and used it to power his garden lights | 23:24 |
| RST38h | Ambient energy stuff is mostly fake | 23:24 |
| ShadowJK | suihkulokki, yeah :-) | 23:24 |
| RST38h | But wireless power transmission is not | 23:24 |
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| RST38h | suihkulokki: Sometimes you do not even need a coil | 23:25 |
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| pupnik | highlighting text in browser is broken for me | 23:25 |
| pupnik | sometimes i hilight. sometimes i pan | 23:25 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, well it's a zero-sum game.. you're leeching off of someone else :-) | 23:25 |
| pupnik | impossible. | 23:25 |
| RST38h | pupnik: tell us something new =) | 23:25 |
| RST38h | Shadow: That I have no personal problem with | 23:25 |
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| suihkulokki | according to the story, they couldn't find a way to sue him, but they guy worked for a company owned by the power grid company which then promptly fired him :P | 23:26 |
| ShadowJK | Like those "kinetic plates" that some supermarket in the UK was going to install in the parking lot to "go green and renewable". Cars and people moving over the kinetic plating generate electricity | 23:26 |
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| RST38h | Shadow: Nevertheless, unless you have a really powerful source there is nothing to leech | 23:26 |
| pupnik | RST38h, if device had shoulder buttons, one could be used to toggle pan/hilight | 23:26 |
| ShadowJK | BUT, that energy comes from the people (who in turn get it through this expensive sun -> plant -> animal -> processing -> processing -> processing -> microwave -> food chain), or from gasoline in the case of cars :P | 23:26 |
| ShadowJK | so the supermarket essentially leeches energy from its customers :) | 23:27 |
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| RST38h | pupnik: you can do it with multitoch or limited multitouch | 23:27 |
| ShadowJK | and it's not at all "renewable" or green until everyone is driving on green/renewable energy | 23:27 |
| pupnik | k. it needs fixing | 23:27 |
| RST38h | pupnik: i.e. holding left bottom screen corner and selecting text with the second finger | 23:27 |
| ShadowJK | frankly I wish the touchscreen would just emulate a laptop touchpad.. would work fine :P | 23:27 |
| pupnik | hmm | 23:27 |
| lcuk | pupnik, the multitouch example i give would allow that - but selecting text would be hard | 23:28 |
| lcuk | it should be used on large ui elements really ;) | 23:28 |
| RST38h | Shadow: You ever use laptop touchpad for mouse clicks? | 23:28 |
| ShadowJK | and if you hold bottom left screen corner... why not have a button slightly below bottom left screen corner so you don't cover content on the screen :P | 23:28 |
| lcuk | ShadowJK, because existing devices dont | 23:28 |
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| lcuk | twotouch works | 23:28 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, yes. And click+drag. Without the physical buttons | 23:28 |
| RST38h | Shadow: Because n8x0 do not have such a button | 23:28 |
| lcuk | the bottom corner can theoretically and practically act as a CTRL key modifyer | 23:28 |
| ShadowJK | I can use it fine and I don't even have a laptop, heh | 23:29 |
| RST38h | Shadow: You are abnormal then :) | 23:29 |
| * RST38h never uses touchpads for clicks | 23:29 | |
| ThatOneGuy | does anyone know how I can compile some code on my n770? I keep getting errors like "make: arm-linux-gcc: Command not found" | 23:29 |
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| ShadowJK | the touchpad click-hold-and-drag tap-sequence on touchpads is easier to accomplish than tap-and-hold on N8x0.. | 23:29 |
| RST38h | That: Maybe you do not have gcc installed? =) | 23:29 |
| ShadowJK | I guess mostly because of lacking sensitivity on the touchscreen :) | 23:29 |
| lcuk | ThatOneGuy, thar be dragons, but clean off your respositories to only standard nokia ones, then find the SDK repository on maemo.org respositories for your OS | 23:30 |
| lcuk | and add that to apt | 23:30 |
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| _Mayito_ | someone can help me to flash my nokia n810 please? | 23:30 |
| pupnik | also need to have your dev filesystem on sd ThatOneGuy | 23:30 |
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| ThatOneGuy | pupnik: can I not put it on a usb drive? | 23:31 |
| pupnik | _Mayito_, maemo.org has howto | 23:31 |
| lcuk | pupnik, only if no freespace left | 23:31 |
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| lcuk | ThatOneGuy, no | 23:31 |
| ThatOneGuy | lcuk, really? I guess Im stuck using scratchbox... | 23:32 |
| _Mayito_ | pupnik: Thank you I've already read it, but still I have some questions | 23:32 |
| lcuk | such hardships | 23:32 |
| lcuk | having a whole sdk available | 23:32 |
| ThatOneGuy | well it'd be ok if I could get my kernel module to compile properly | 23:33 |
| lcuk | you oculd probably never get a kernel built on device anyway | 23:33 |
| lcuk | even with an updated device | 23:33 |
| lcuk | it needs more than just gcc | 23:33 |
| lcuk | and make | 23:33 |
| ThatOneGuy | awe lame | 23:33 |
| RST38h | suihkulokki,ShadowJK: Here, enjoy: http://hacknmod.com/hack/field-of-fluorescent-tubes-powered-by-ambient-current/ | 23:33 |
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| lcuk | ThatOneGuy, whats lame about it? | 23:34 |
| lcuk | and why do you need a new kernel? | 23:34 |
| ThatOneGuy | I dont. I need to compile an external kernel module | 23:34 |
| pupnik | _Mayito_, feel free to ask, man | 23:34 |
| RST38h | Ehheheheheheheee | 23:35 |
| RST38h | Ok, guys, you will absolutely love it: | 23:36 |
| RST38h | "Android developers can now slip native code into apps written for Android-based devices using Google's new native development kit (NDK)." | 23:36 |
| pupnik | ... | 23:36 |
| _Mayito_ | pupnik: I decided to flash the OS to the internal memory card, I think there is plenty space to hold the OS and all the software I need, so I just followed the little tutorial up to the partitioning part ... I did even already partitioned my internal flash card | 23:36 |
| pupnik | k | 23:37 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, but do they get root access? :) | 23:37 |
| lcuk | they will soon | 23:37 |
| RST38h | Shadow: No idea, although you are welcome to try | 23:37 |
| lcuk | activex here we come! | 23:37 |
| _Mayito_ | pupnik: although, my question is, the little tutorial asks you to format those two new partitions, which I did it | 23:38 |
| ShadowJK | eh don't want to, maemo already gives me access :P | 23:38 |
| * ShadowJK isn't that keen on fighting with tivo-ized devices | 23:38 | |
| _Mayito_ | my question is, which partition should I have mounted before the flashing ? | 23:38 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, yeah that guy is leeching power from the power company :) | 23:38 |
| RST38h | Shadow: For artistic purposes, no more no less =) | 23:39 |
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| pupnik | _Mayito_, i dont know | 23:41 |
| pupnik | i did not "flash" to my new partition, i copied the filetree | 23:42 |
| pupnik | then flashed a new bootloader | 23:43 |
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| pupnik | _Mayito_, can you paste the url of the howto you are using, and tell us which step you are at? | 23:45 |
| ThatOneGuy | so... file returns '...version 1 (ARM)..' for the modules that work, but returns '...version 1 (SYSV)..' for the one I've compiled. Anyone know why? | 23:46 |
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| pupnik | heh | 23:46 |
| pupnik | at&t strikes | 23:46 |
| ThatOneGuy | oh no | 23:47 |
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| pupnik | i think fanoush compiled some kernels/modules | 23:48 |
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| ThatOneGuy | err, I don't know who that is | 23:49 |
| pupnik | noob | 23:52 |
| pupnik | sorry, just wasting your time - google | 23:52 |
| ThatOneGuy | looks like all the modules he compiled are for 800/810 | 23:54 |
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