IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2009-05-11

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lcukb-man, which personality laughed and why?00:03
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lcukwhat is00:58
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Macergot my su8w to work with my g1 :)00:58
Macera2dp works on it now too00:59
Macerandroid seems to be really shaping up00:59
lcukwhat new things are available for it?01:00
lcuki havent heard of any specific apps01:00
Macerthere are a ton of apps for it01:01
Macerespecially since people can charge for apps nowadays01:01
lcukwhat stands out tho - shining beacons that make you want to get it01:01
Macermost of the stock stuff is nice01:01
Macerthey have documents to go which is an office suite01:01
Macerthe browser has gotten nicer. and it has a soft keyboard for the G1 now :)01:01
Macerso you don't have to keep flipping it open to type small things01:02
lcukcan i get DMA screen access?01:02
lcukor on the metal01:02
MacerDMA screen access?01:02
lcukor is it just java sdk or non visual libraries01:02
lcuki can open a raw bitmap here01:02
lcukand draw directly on it01:02
Macerheh.. couldn't tell you.. i'm not a dev01:03
Maceri was happy just because i was able to build hidd for it to use my bt keyboard01:03
lcukthat lots pretty much built into maemo by default aint it01:03
Macerhopefully it will have a menu option for the hid01:03
Macersure is ;)01:04
* lcuk hasnt used bt kb for ages01:04
Maceri used it with  the n800 i gave to Stskeeps01:04
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Macerbut after i got my G1 i stopped using the n800 for the most part but kept the keyboard in case the g1 would support it01:04
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lcukwill you be able to install mer on it eventually?01:04
Maceron my G1? :)01:05
lcukyeah reasonable consideration01:05
Macerno way... i'd rather use android01:05
Maceri like the android interface more01:05
lcuki wasnt asking for you01:05
Maceralthough mer was starting to look nice01:05
lcukyeah people get into things that work for them, im still an xp user01:05
Macerandroid was premature in its release01:06
lcukeverything is premature01:06
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lcuknowadays its now now now01:06
Macerbut it is doing a lot better after the cupcake release01:06
crashanddielcuk, tell that to torvalds01:06
Macersome of the little things they added to it really touched it up01:07
crashanddiehe's the one fueling the whole "release early, release often" moto01:07
lcukoutside of that01:07
lcukoutside computers01:07
Macerrelease early release often :)01:07
Macerlinux creed?01:07
lcukcustomers dont understand tho01:07
Maceryeah.. most customers don't... ther's probably a small percentage of G1 useres who have rooted their phones01:07
crashanddiethey shouldn't have to01:08
Macerthe rest just wait for ota updates01:08
lcuksorry maam, this car is a pre-release, you still have to climb out of the windows to exit and if you go over 40mph, make sure you hold onto the sunroof01:08
crashanddiethe problem comes when you have an easy distribution method, and post-promised earnings01:09
crashanddieif it's software, it doesn't cost you anything to release the beta version, as long as the full version will be worth the full amount of money01:10
crashanddieyou get user feedback which can be very important01:10
Macerwell.. i couldn't install win701:10
crashanddieon the other hand, you can't release a pre-prod car to a massive customer base for free, and just update it to the latest version as soon as it's available for purchase01:10
Macerdon't know why but it was asking for a driver disc01:10
Macerwtf? :)01:10
lcuki wouldnt install it on your computer either01:10
crashanddieMacer, windows 7 works beautifully under VMWare01:11
lcukthats an important distinction crashanddie :)01:11
Maceri wanted to try it on a toshiba laptop i have01:11
crashanddieI think that some PMs have come imbued with the success of certain software projects, and are hoping to apply the same rules to mass-consumer markets01:12
crashanddieand that's just something that's not going to fly in the long run01:12
crashanddiethe zune being one of those examples01:13
Maceri had a zune01:13
Macerit wasn't bad01:13
crashanddieoh, and btw, I've officially seen every single stargate episode and film01:13
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crashanddieI want to see a platform that basically has 10 SD slots01:14
luke-jr… they'd HAVE to eb MicroSD01:14
crashanddieeach slot can be used to plug in self-contained device, be it extension of RAM, wifi, gps, whatever they can come up with01:15
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luke-jrcrashanddie: I'd rather have legos, so they can be piggybacked XD01:15
luke-jrneed more power? snap on a new battery block and remove the old one01:15
crashanddieluke-jr, you would not want micro-sd01:16
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crashanddieor micro-lego for that matter :P01:16
luke-jror if it's already bulky, pull off the SD card block, add the new battery there, yank the old battery, and replace it with that SD card block ;)01:16
crashanddieremember how with the old laptops you could pull out the CD-drive and plug-in a floppy drive?01:17
crashanddiesame principle01:17
crashanddiegive people the possibility to make the device they need, instead of locking yourself in a position where you cut off possibilities01:17
crashanddiebasically: make a wii01:17
crashanddiethe wii is shit easy hardware, but you extend the basic functionality by making it pluggable, and extendible01:18
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crashanddielcuk, say I'm right01:19
luke-jris it possible to run Maemo in a chroot?01:20
lcukarghhh, im upto my armpits in coed, gimma a minute01:20
crashanddie!grab lcuk01:20
luke-jrif I bind-mount the dbus run dir, I get osso_initialize failed.01:20
lcukyou are right, you have seen every stargate01:20
lcuki like pluggable01:21
timeless_mbpcrashanddie: w7 is great in vbox too :)01:21
timeless_mbpcrashanddie: btw, are you sure you aren't asking for a ...01:22
* timeless_mbp blanks01:22
timeless_mbpbeagleboard? :)01:23
crashanddiebeagleboard is shit01:23
timeless_mbpotoh, you could try to find something which was basically a firewire bus :)01:23
luke-jror at least maemo mapper?01:23
timeless_mbpluke-jr: so... as a reminder, scratchbox is a chroot01:23
crashanddieas much as I praise the guys for creating a $150 device that runs beautifully01:23
luke-jrtimeless_mbp: no idea what scratchbox is ☺01:23
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* timeless_mbp wonders what character set that is01:24
crashanddieI've always been minutes away from buying a beagleboard that wasn't so limited...01:24
luke-jrtimeless_mbp: half the point of my using Gentoo is so I don't actually *boot* the Maemo stuff that interferes with WiFi monitor mode01:24
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luke-jrtimeless_mbp: Unicode01:24
crashanddieThe only way to get networking is through USB or an SDIO port? Excuse me? What is this? The 90s?01:25
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timeless_mbpluke-jr: ok, and what character? because my mac clearly doesn't have it01:25
timeless_mbpit renders it as a hollow square01:25
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crashanddieluke-jr, you do realise you could attain the exact same stuff by hacking at the startup scripts rather than basically going the LFS route...01:25
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luke-jrtimeless_mbp: a simple smiley face, actually chr(1) in the US DOS charset too01:25
luke-jrcrashanddie: that's ok, I don't like Maemo's design in general01:25
* timeless_mbp wonders if left beta01:26
timeless_mbphey, is there a bug about the fact that the text for <Cumulus 2.3.0> on is truncated?01:26
crashanddieluke-jr, you don't like debian/ubuntu more like it, Maemo didn't invent anything on the Linux side of things01:27
luke-jrso this "osso_initialize failed." ?01:27
luke-jrcrashanddie: uh, it is nothing like Debian01:27
crashanddietimeless_mbp, haven't been able to get a hold of a USB smartchip reader01:27
crashanddietimeless, depending on your needs I can ship you a USB smartcard reader though01:28
crashanddietimeless, a lot cheaper and people actually use them01:28
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timeless_mbpas long as it works as a PKCS11 provider thing01:28
mikkov_timeless_mbp: I don't see anything wrong with cumulus text01:28
andre__timeless_mbp, could not find a ticket about, please file one. and i can confirm here.01:28
andre__mikkov_, i can confirm it01:29
timeless_mbpandre__: can you deal w/ the picture for it?01:29
luke-jrcrashanddie: I know for a fact that none of this "osso_initialize" crap is in Debian ;)01:29
crashanddieluke-jr, read my words01:29
crashanddieluke-jr, never said it did01:29
crashanddietimeless_mbp, which OS are we talking about, and what kind of CP are we talking about here?01:30
luke-jrcrashanddie: I didn't complain about "the Linux side of things" by its literal meaning01:30
timeless_mbpcrashanddie: normally wXP/w701:30
timeless_mbpbut atm i'm on OSX01:30
timeless_mbpand the client library is NSS01:30
crashanddietimeless_mbp, and is this research for your work, or yourself?01:31
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timeless_mbpandre__: yeah, slightly different truncation here, but that'll do01:32
timeless_mbpcan you do the attachment after i file, or should i attach yours?01:32
andre__i will attach, just file01:32
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timeless_mbpandre__: 452201:36
timeless_mbpmother's calling me to dinner... today isn't a day to ignore her...01:36
timeless_mbpbye :)01:36
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GeneralAntillescrashanddie, SPI.02:02
GeneralAntilleslcuk, it was good.02:03
GeneralAntilleslcuk, I wasn't blown away, but it was a lot of fun.02:04
GeneralAntillesYou know how 300 loves to whore the slomo?02:04
GeneralAntillesStar Trek is that way with lens flares.02:04
GeneralAntilleslcuk, you're a fucking creeper.02:04
crashanddiesamples per inch?02:04
lcukyou are on the enterprise tho!02:05
GeneralAntillesSeriously, if this turns into some sort of new meme I'm hanging myself on IRC. :P02:05
GeneralAntillescrashanddie, 300 the movie.02:05
Maceri don't think win7 is working on this toshiba laptop02:05
Macerit is asking for drivers for something02:05
Macerwhich i guess it needs just to install . what kind of crap is that? :)02:05
crashanddieGeneralAntilles, just asking about the SPI shit02:05
GeneralAntillescrashanddie, oh, sorry.02:06
GeneralAntillesYou know all those internal serial, etc. buses that mobile devices use to hook up accessories? All of them are available on the Beagle02:07
GeneralAntillesSo you could just build yourself a little WiFi daughterboard02:07
GeneralAntillesSub-optimal, yes, but it is a 3rd option. ;)02:07
crashanddieyeah I know02:07
crashanddiebut not what I want02:07
crashanddiehave you seen the speed of SPI?02:07
crashanddieand sorry, SPI is supposed to be there for low level debugging, it's like I2C02:07
GeneralAntillesTheir stated goal was to keep it cheap, but when you start adding integrated WiFi/Bluetooth/whatever, you end up with their $1100 dev kit device. ;)02:08
crashanddienot actual communication or device connectivity02:08
crashanddieGeneralAntilles, not necessarily02:09
GeneralAntillesSomething like:
crashanddieGeneralAntilles, the whatsitsname device, pickit or bigprick, can't remember, they just start out as very simple devices, but you can add shit to the motherboard02:09
GeneralAntillesBug Labs?02:09
crashanddiehang on, I'm on the wrong wifi networks02:09
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GeneralAntillesOh, lcuk, Tim was looking at the t-shirts02:10
GeneralAntillesI don't think he's made any progress, though.02:10
crashanddie_fast interwebs nao :)02:10
crashanddie_well, to be honest02:11
crashanddie_I believe BlueTooth should die02:11
crashanddie_dayum, I was hoping that would've been a bit more of flamebait02:12
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GeneralAntillesI think we need a short-range wireless standard like that02:15
GeneralAntillesI don't have a strong opinion abou the candidates for that.02:15
crashanddie_we have a short range wireless standard, wifi02:15
GeneralAntillesPower hungry02:15
crashanddie_more than wifi + bluetooth?02:15
GeneralAntillesTCP/IP seems a little slow for HID stuff, too.02:15
crashanddie_you don't want TCP for that02:16
crashanddie_UDP at the very least02:16
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GeneralAntillesWhat about wireless USB?02:18
crashanddie_how about wireless cables/02:18
GAN8001I want Tesla back02:18
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crashanddie_Wireless Cables Inc. ! The first company to offer Bluetooth devices with up to 30km range!02:19
GAN8001I think we need some magic02:19
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GAN8001They screwed us on the flying cars, so I want magic.02:19
crashanddie_I want to meet Daniel Jackson and Jack Sparrow02:20
crashanddie_just to go to Daniel Shanks and go "Dude, you managed to marry Lexa Doig. You fucking lucky bastard"02:20
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infobotcrashanddie_ meant: just to go to Michael Shanks and go "Dude, you managed to marry Lexa Doig. You fucking lucky bastard"02:20
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GeneralAntillesInteresting, Engadget is capitalizing Internet Tablet on the Q&02:27
infobotGeneralAntilles meant: Interesting, Engadget is capitalizing Internet Tablet on the Q702:27
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GeneralAntillesBye, qgil02:28
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Macerholy shit win7 sucks04:36
tank-manwhy do you say that04:39
xnt14Macer: yup, its still bad, but better than vista04:42
Macerit IS vista04:45
Maceri seriously can't find any major difference04:45
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xnt14well, it is the same code base, but I ill take it over vista any day04:47
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SurtseyIs there any debian-ports repo for maemo?  I find it hard to believe I'm the only one who needs gnu screen.05:07
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Macerwindows 7 is vista with a new taskbar05:55
Macerif people pay for this shit they are stupid :)05:55
Macerthat is all it is05:56
Maceri have read articles.. and been looking for differences05:57
Macerand there are almost none other than the taskbar05:57
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Macerand no more sidebar.. instead you pu thte "gadgets" wherever you want05:57
timeless_mbpMacer: w7 is actually quite nice05:57
Macertimeless_mbp: it is vista!05:57
timeless_mbpit performs better05:57
Macerwith a different taskbar05:57
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Macerhow so? it's not necessarily going faster for me than vista does05:58
Z357765413591701it has a slightly different base architecture05:58
Macersame kernel as vista05:58
Macerit is something they could have live updated with a service pack but instead they are going to release it and charge people $500 for it :)05:59
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timeless_mbpMacer: an upgrade price is unclear06:02
timeless_mbpunless they've announced something...06:03
Maceri'm sorry but it is garbage06:03
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* johnx goes and falls asleep after 1,247 miles of driving in two days07:35
ds3where did you go?07:35
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johnxds3, la to seattle07:36
ds3Oh fun drive :D liked the 5?07:36
johnxyeah. I want to do it again with less of a time constraint :)07:37
ds3this wasn't  for pleasure?07:37
johnxnot really, co-driving with my little sister back from her college to our parents' house07:38
johnxI mean, we had fun, but the time limit was strictly by today as I have work monday ;)07:38
johnxI think we did better than google's time prediction actually...even with gas stops and all that07:40
johnxexcluding the ~7 hours rest in motel in Dunsmuir, CA07:40
ds3that's the CA side of the OR-CA border, rightt?07:40
johnxhence the CA :)07:41
johnxnorth of Redding and south of Mt. Shasta07:41
ds3wasn't completely sure it was right on the border or not07:41
johnxit's a good 60 miles south of OR I think07:42
ds3Oh... it isn't on the border07:42
ds3Good choice.... doing the Sisko(sp?) in the dark can get exciting07:42
johnxmaemo mapper rocked my world. I need to get a bt gps to use with it next time07:42
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johnxdriving in the dark I'm ok with, driving in the dark while my passenger sleeps and I start to hit sleep deprivation is not cool though07:43
ds3is this the 800 or 810?07:43
johnxmakes me want an n810 for car purposes :/07:44
ds3I get annoying at not being able to see maemo mapper during the day07:44
johnxyeah, the screen was totally washed out in the sun and the lack of GPS hurts07:44
johnxI can do something about the GPS with a cheapo bt gps, but the screen ...07:45
ds3which map repo did you use?07:46
johnxgoogle street maps07:46
johnxI didn't want to mess around with anything else07:46
johnxI'd like to switch to OSM for most things and start contributing when I can, but not this trip ;)07:46
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ds3heh.... the OSM stuff works ok on the 5. the 10 has some issues07:47
johnxaaah. we were on that for a bit07:48
ds3some parts of it are off by 500-1000ft07:48
johnxdarn. I should have recorded a new track for it :)07:49
ds3I can't tell if it was the construction deviating and not reporting back or a genuine error07:50
johnxthe other thing we needed though was maps of side streets in towns we pulled off in. I asked maemo mapper for coffee in dunsmuir and it led me to a great little place with spot on location07:50
ds3how do you ask maemo mapper for things like that?07:50
johnxmenu -> POI -> download07:51
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ds3and that pops up a box to search or?07:51
ds3oh... I must try that07:51
ds3been having to run googlemaps in GVM for purely that use07:52
johnxit's backed by google's search results, so it tends to be pretty relevant07:52
ds3that is saying nothing07:52
ds3Google's results are rediculous 50-80% of the time07:52
johnxIME, it was pretty relevant07:52
ds3I had googlemaps centered within 1-2 miles of aplacethat I knew by name. Ask googlemaps to find it - it finds an unrelated place in another state07:53
johnxer, yeah. it seems to do better finding businesses it seems07:53
ds3had stuff like that happen too many times. googlemaps is too polluted07:53
ds3That WAS a business07:53
johnxno idea then07:54
ds3I asked for it by name07:54
ds3if I timed in the full exact name, it finds it07:54
johnxanyways, I'm off to sleep. 'night07:55
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RST38hheya johnx08:59
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lbtmorning all09:19
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|dl9pf|moin moin09:40
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* kbalazs wants to know how can an application getting to know about the system goes to hibernate? is there any signal/dbus-message for it?11:37
Stskeepskbalazs: libosso may know, but it's sent out with a systeminactivity thing11:37
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kbalazsStskeeps: is there any way to listen for it? expecially we want to purge out our memory caches in this situation11:41
Stskeepskbalazs: well, there's no such thing as "hibernate", the screen just turns off :)11:41
Stskeepsit doesn't s2ram11:41
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Stskeepsand it sets a different PSM timeout11:42
kbalazsStskeeps: it doesn't really matter from our point of view that how does the system going to be inactive11:44
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Stskeepskbalazs: i can't recall the exact signal but there's definately one :)11:45
Stskeepssignal sender=:1.9 -> dest=(null destination) serial=74 path=/com/nokia/mce/signal;; member=system_inactivity_ind11:45
kbalazsStskeeps: thanks, this would be helpful11:47
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Stskeepswhat are you making, - out of curiousity?11:47
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kbalazsStskeeps: we have a project what's goal is to optimize WebKit for embedded systems11:49
Stskeepsinteresting :)11:49
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StskeepsTear's author bundyo is doing some fixes to webkit for maemo as well - with hildon input method and such working now11:50
kbalazsStskeeps: you can get some sense about our work from here:
Stskeepsinteresting :)11:53
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aquatixwhat's the latest version of tear?12:07
aquatix0.3 still?12:07
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X-FadeHi Jaffa, back from your trip?13:08
keesjCoucou, ca va?13:08
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JaffaX-Fade: Nope, not yet. In the (closed) bar on 4eur/hr wifi13:09
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X-FadeJaffa: Ah!13:09
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JaffaJust downloading mail to my tablet, ordering a new monitor etc13:09
lardmanmorning chaps13:09
floriangood morning13:09
lardmanhey florian13:10
StskeepieJaffa: you can definately enjoy the vacation, you're avoiding the iTT flamefests ;)13:11
JaffaStskeepie: enough of them before I left meant I didn't read ITT for two days. Usually, I read it every couple of hours - and I'm much more relaxed for it.13:12
Stskeepiei've gone as far as to ignore some people's posts, it has reduced my blood pressure considerably :P13:12
JaffaIf it hasn't calmed down by the time I get back, I'll do similar.13:13
lbtJaffa :
JaffaGoing cider/calvados/pommeau tasting this afternoon13:14
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lbtmuch more positive....13:15
Jaffalbt: Nope, I won't be tricked13:15
JaffaIt's probably worse than goatse13:15
lbtit has room for a cider tasting application13:15
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Jaffalbt: cool post13:18
Jaffalbt: just recompiled, or needed patching?13:18
Stskeepiethere's a lot of scratchboxisms at some places13:19
Stskeepiewhich kinda sucks13:19
Stskeepiei hope we can encourage not having sb-isms through the extras-testing procedure and maemian13:21
* Jaffa nods13:21
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* Jaffa assumes he hasn't missed a new device announcement, btw13:23
X-FadeStskeepie: It might be a good idea to record test cases in the wiki.13:23
X-FadeStskeepie: Whenever you bump into one..13:23
Stskeepieyeah, we are13:23
X-FadeStskeepie: So when we actually create a test script, we have test cases ;)13:24
lbtI've submitted a couple of ant-sb guards to maemo-Qt and they've been accepted in13:26
lbtsimple things like if [ -d /scratchbox/ ]; do silly things; done13:26
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lbtalso OBS has found some build errors.. missing dependencies, failure to run dh_ things...13:27
Stskeepiemissing dependancies is a sbism too, assuming packages are there that isn't traditionally in bare build environments :P13:28
Stskeepiewe have many gcc4isms too but i guess that will show in Fremantle too13:28
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dl9pfthe sb-isms should just be guarded by ifs ... in case the're really needed13:41
Stskeepiein scratchbox they probably are :P13:42
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GAN800People apparently don't get what commercial developers are.13:48
Myrttithere's people who don't get what developers are, period13:49
Stskeepie'lo Myrtti13:49
aquatixhey Myrtti13:49
aquatixet al13:49
GAN800Myrtti, it's sad when these people are developers.13:49
MyrttiGAN800: yeah...13:49
* Myrtti is "Software Developer" herself13:49
StskeepieGAN800: well, imho should be open to commercial developers too - it's a great way to shape up things and gain more backing13:50
aquatixhow in flux is Mer nowadays? is it able to fully replace os2008?13:50
GAN800It is13:50
GAN800But commercial developers clearly have a separate support structure in place for them.13:50
Stskeepie(disclaimer: i didn't read all the thread since i'm ignoring some of the participants.)13:50
Stskeepiebut if we take it on a limb, it's a service nokia offers13:50
GAN800With access to very different levels of information.13:51
GAN800The argument is that knowing whether Maps or Navicore was bundled was relevant to commercial developers.13:51
Stskeepiewell that makes more sense then13:53
GAN800I don't believe it's important to community developers, and commercial ones clearly have their own channel to that information.13:54
Stskeepieit's not, nokia bundles what they want13:54
Stskeepiemaemo mapper lives as a alternative no matter if maps or navicore is there13:54
GAN800Which is why the whole thread is silly. ;)13:55
* Stskeepie wonders if the financial crisis is a good time to start projects like mer and such. lot of people out of work and looking for ways to improve their CV.13:55
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Stskeepieif you don't use your coding abilities you slowly lose them13:55
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* lbt .... never ;)13:57
Stskeepiemy reason for working on mer is simple: make myself visible to land myself a good job after graduation13:58
lbtit's not what you know, it's who you know.... and who knows you.13:59
Stskeepie.. and because it's fun.13:59
glasswho knows that you know13:59
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lcuksince gtk is an essential part of the maemo os and the user always has a theme in use, what is the issue of using the glyphs from the current in use theme?14:14
Stskeepieyou can maybe use sapwood protocol to get pixmaps?14:14
lcukyeah whichever method i use14:16
lcukare those glyphs considered fair game to use in a none gtk app14:16
lcuki would aim to not send media out and just use whats there you see14:16
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* xnt14 is awake14:28
* Myrtti is infinitely intrested14:28
* lcuk shows xnt14 a swirly hypnotic pattern14:28
* xnt14 stares14:29
* JamieBennett is refactoring code and not liking it14:29
* xnt14 checks lifehacker/gizmodo/etc...14:29
* lcuk is bugfixing a bug thats unreproducable :|14:29
xnt14: |14:29
lcuki did my refactoring at weekend :D14:29
JamieBennettlcuk Story of my life !14:29
JamieBennettBugs, bugs and more bugs14:30
lcukJamieBennett, ive got exactly 2 known bugs with a specific firm14:30
lcukand neither of them are reproducable on our systems14:30
JamieBennettlcuk blame the hardware14:30
lcukbut thanfully one of them is reproducably reproducable14:30
lcukthe other just randomly happens like an accidental fart14:30
roopewhat would macgyver do.14:31
lcukapt-get install chewing gum, paperclip14:31
Stskeepiea rx-51 and a picoprojector14:31
lcukbut i cant do that with this lol14:31
aquatixlcuk: blame it on cosmic rays or the position of the moon?14:32
lcukJamieBennett, no can do, the one i am tracking today happens on multiple machines with multiple user accounts, its dpi resolution scaling issue14:32
aquatixor the occassional rain14:32
lcukaquarius-, ive already put a bug report in with god about those14:32
lcukthey didnt believe me14:33
aquatixah, god is a debian developer?14:33
lcukyeah, but he codes in lisp14:33
aquatixwell, actually he hacks it all together in perl14:33
aquatixbut does it depend on the application, those dpi issues?14:34
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lcukthat does yeah, its stupid complex code sat around and returning different values and erroring, tisnt complex, but frustrating14:36
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lardmanlcuk: dpi resolution scaling graphical thingymawatchit errors?14:42
lardmanlcuk: easy solution to that you know?14:42
lardmanlcuk: write command line programs only!14:42
timeless_mbpoh how nice14:44
* timeless_mbp can't run update nokia phone software from OS X14:44
* timeless_mbp feels like a second class citizen14:45
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GAN800timeless_mbp, you just wish you were a second class citizen. ;)14:49
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timeless_mbpGAN800: you sure i don't want to be a second class citiSen?14:49
timeless_mbpGAN800: anyway, i'm tempted to try software update from w714:50
* timeless_mbp wonders what the odds are that it works there! :)14:50
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lcuk"im sorry timeless, you cannot run the update software in a VM, please use a correctly license retail version of w7 " :P14:53
lcuklardman, agreed most certainly14:53
lcukthese graphics are a bit hairy at the best of times ;)14:53
timeless_mbpdid i mention that w7vXP requires hardware acceleration and therefore I can't use it in virtualbox on my mac? :(14:53
lcukits prolly cos win7 has a short neck and looks dodgy in a turtleneck14:54
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GAN800I keep wondering what's happening in week 7. . . .14:56
aquatixrelease of symbian^2? :P14:57
GAN8001I'm really interested to see what Nokia's software landscape is going to look like when Harmattan rolls around.14:57
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* GAN8001 notes the G4 is "dead" again.14:58
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* aquatix wonders whether to get an N97 or a simpler phone and an RX5114:59
lcukgan did you ever actually say what the problem was14:59
aquatixor maybe even wait till symbian^214:59
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GeneralAntilleslcuk, G4.14:59
lcuki personally wonder whether you can root the n97 and put mer on it14:59
aquatixGeneralAntilles: what's the G4?14:59
aquatixlcuk: heh :)14:59
GeneralAntilleslcuk, not G4. The 2001 Quicksilver I have sitting in the family room with a hard drive that "dies" every once and a while.14:59
aquatixlcuk: and if it's usable then14:59
GeneralAntilleslcuk, well, can you root an N95 or N96?15:00
aquatixGeneralAntilles: oh, a dead apple?15:00
lcukyou know what i mean15:00
GeneralAntillesaquatix, playing possum anyway.15:00
lcukdiablo even15:00
lcukor fremantle if the n97 can handle the power15:00
GeneralAntillesaquatix, I've also got a leaking G5 that's in the shop at the moment that lcuk was referring to.15:00
lcukahhh i thought you were joking about your g5 pissin all over the place15:01
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GeneralAntilleslcuk, no, the liquid cooling leaked and took out most of the component in the case (and rusted the case itself).15:01
* lardman imagines the General rolling in after a hard night drinking and forgetting where the bathroom is15:01
* lcuk is liquidcoooled15:02
GeneralAntilleslardman, I don't really drink. ;)15:02
lcukstorm surge?15:02
lardmanwell in that case it needn't have been a hard night then! :)15:02
lcukdid you forget and lob that in the pool too?15:02
GeneralAntilleslardman, my nihilistic tendencies are strong. ;)15:02
lardmanmine are too after this weekend15:02
lcukwhens stag do?15:03
lcukor are you still chained to a lamppost now>15:03
lardmandone, had a few drinks with some friends a few weekends ago15:03
lardmannah, was just dressed as a lady, so were the rest of them mind you15:03
lcuk?? i thought you were meant to do something different for stag do?15:04
GeneralAntillesThe ladies? ;)15:04
lardmanwe decided we wanted a quiet stag+hen do all together15:04
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lardmancan you see this?:
lcukyou have uni mates who would chain you up dont you15:05
lardmanthey might try, but I said I'd break arms15:05
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lcuknooooo, you cant break arms, break intels15:05
lardmanSpanish class, back later on15:06
lcukThis content is currently unavailable15:06
lcukThe page you requested cannot be displayed at the moment.  Please wait for your friend to be less pissed and try again15:06
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xnt14lcuk: xD15:07
lardman|learningah, well you'll have to join Facebook and become my friend then, or I can just stick the photo up on my webpage when I come back15:07
xnt14web page please15:07
* lcuk might get a facebook account when hell freezes over15:07
xnt14or I can host it on dreamhost, I have plenty of extra bandwidth15:08
aquatixlcuk: that soon?15:08
lcuki was planning on waiting till a blue moon, but i figured ive gotta have one achievable goal15:08
lbt<shock>you're not on facebook?</shock>15:08
* aquatix isn't on twitter15:08
xnt14twitter ftw!15:08
lbtwhat's twitter?15:09
lcuktwitter wins15:09
aquatixlbt: web-based irc15:09
lcukbut its a bit short for what im thinking15:09
lbt.log twitter15:09
lbt.log wins15:09
* xnt14 randomly googles for merbot15:10
lcukGeneralAntilles, you might know this (anyone else might as well) - if i started posting text based sketch files to t.m.o is there any way to make the text of the comment invisible and not displayed to a regular browser - but something that i could readback and convert back to sketches by browsing15:10
lcukxnt14, dont15:10
lcuki tried it - it leads to something about a hot karl15:10
xnt14lcuk: to late :(15:10
timeless_mbpGAN800: my sister asked me for help upgrading Firefox to Firefox 3 on her G415:10
lardman|learning should do it, I'm the one with pigtails, have to run now almost late15:11
timeless_mbpshe knew Firefox 3 was "available" because her start page offered it15:11
timeless_mbpbut check for updates didn't offer it15:11
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lcuksome user on urban dictionary thing is called merbot and his offered thing isnt great :|15:11
timeless_mbpbecause she's running 10.3.9 (just like my G5 back home)15:11
lbtI know the guy on the right!15:11
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lcuklbt, thats not a guy!15:13
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xnt14timeless_mbp: xD, just dl ff3 off of mozilla .com15:13
xnt14* -[space]15:14
timeless_mbpxnt14: pointless15:14
timeless_mbpit doesn't run on 10.3.915:14
xnt14oh ok15:14
xnt14upgrade to tiger?15:14
xnt14or leopard15:14
aquatixzomg @ lardman|learning's pic15:14
timeless_mbpbuy her a license and i'll help her upgrade15:14
xnt14sadly15:14 is giving me a license this week15:14
* xnt14 is broke15:14
timeless_mbpyeah, see...15:14
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lardmanah, class cancelled15:15
GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, Leopard time.15:15
GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, you can at least upgrade your sister. :P15:15
xnt14panther it too old15:16
timeless_mbpi didn't even upgrade myself!15:16
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timeless_mbpi'm only upgrading because someone else is giving me the license15:16
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xnt14plus its better, timemachine, spaces, etc15:16
xnt14StsN802: New Tablet xD15:16
GeneralAntillesMy sister has totally switched over to using her iPhone as her primary computer.15:16
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lardmanlbt: you really know him?15:17
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xnt14GeneralAntilles: Never, Cydia crashes too much to be a good package manager, and safari is good , but still crashy, and the appstore crashes randomly15:18
xnt14GA: apt-get ftw15:18
lardman_whoa, wierd, a message I sent before my disconnect just arrived after I reconnected15:18
xnt14timeless_mbp: fios?15:18
GeneralAntillesxnt14, huh?15:19
xnt14GA: is her iphone jailbroken or not?15:19
GeneralAntillesxnt14, no.15:20
timeless_mbpxnt14: yes15:20
timeless_mbpmy parents are lucky15:20
xnt14andrewfblack: hello15:20
GeneralAntillesFiOS is so awful15:20
xnt14timeless_mbp, same here15:20
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xnt14GA: oh ok xD15:20
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timeless_mbpGeneralAntilles: iPhone as primary computer? wow15:20
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* timeless_mbp ponders15:20
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GeneralAntillesFriend of mine got the 20/20 connection which they kill every 15 minutes.15:20
timeless_mbpwell, she could "run facebook on that"15:20
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timeless_mbpand gmail...15:21
GeneralAntillestimeless_mbp, she uses her laptop for typing up papers and some of the bulkier research, but the iPhone has displaced it for almost everything.15:21
timeless_mbpyeah, that'd probably work, it's probably cheaper than upgrading her mac15:21
xnt14timeless_mbp: what speed do you have? I have 5mb up ,a and 20mb down15:21
AndrewfblackGeneralAntilles: yeah I never understood that whats the use if I can't do anything on it really15:21
AndrewfblackGeneralAntilles: I know they don't want people running servers on it which is why but you can't even play an online game15:21
GeneralAntillesI've got Brighthouse here and love it. 20/215:21
timeless_mbpxnt14: dunno, i'm sharing it w/ my dad, so i'm not going to run a speed test15:22
aquatixGeneralAntilles: my girlfriend uses a Palm T|X most of the time at home15:22
xnt14oh ok :P15:22
GeneralAntillesaquatix, for browsing?15:23
Andrewfblackmy boss is so cheap at work we only have 1.5mb down and .5mb up for about 12 people to share15:23
GeneralAntillesSounds fun15:23
aquatixGeneralAntilles: yep, and reading mail15:23
GeneralAntillesaquatix, sounds painful15:24
* StsN802 bangs head into table15:24
aquatixGeneralAntilles: well, she only checks some news sites15:24
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GeneralAntillesStsN802, should we buy you a pad for your desk? :)15:24
aquatixher primary pc at home is a Samsung NC10 (10" netbook)15:24
aquatixGeneralAntilles: it's not like she doesn't use a pc at work :)15:24
StsN802GeneralAntilles, more like protection from chinese mafia15:25
GeneralAntillesWe're gonna have to send in the Maemo Squad to save StsN802.15:25
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StsN802it's leaked -all over-15:25
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lbtlardman probably not... fuzzy but looks like Andrew G15:26
GeneralAntillesPleading the fifth seems releveant. :P15:26
GeneralAntillesAhaha: "english language firmware by maemo"15:28
lbthave you guys any idea how much companies pay for marketing like this :D15:29
lbtStsN802... I can't see them being at all unhappy15:29
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xnt14ok guys I have to go to school15:32
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timeless_mbpxnt[at_school]: 15up, 2 down15:48
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toggles_wanyone have a pointer for n810 + maemo-pan + ubuntu 9.04? i can pair the two but cannot seem to get an ip and there doesn't seem to be a 'dummy connection' in the select connection box. tia.15:50
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Stskeepsi have a full appreciation for Nokia being able to run a open source project without product details leaking out all the time now. :>16:02
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timeless_mbpStskeeps: what happened?16:07
timeless_mbpactually, i can't stick around to find out... bye :)16:07
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xnt[school]hello world!16:21
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lardmanlbt: no, his name is Jon16:35
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lardmanhola que tal?16:36
* lardman tries to get at least a bit of Spanish practise in today16:36
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* lardman thinks that perhaps his Spanish wasn't too great16:40
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X-FadeGeneralAntilles: ping?16:41
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_berto_lardman: well, it was ;)16:42
lardmanyay! :)16:42
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VDVsxlardman, are you practising your Spanish for you honeymoon in Mexico :P16:49
* VDVsx is kidding16:49
fiferboylbt: Have you made many changes to your finger scrolling code since the lbt-qt branch was created?16:50
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lardmanVDVsx: we were thinking about going there, glad we didn't choose that now!16:51
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X-FadeStskeeps, lbt: How hard is it to submit packages to the Mer builder?16:52
lardmanVDVsx: nah, just thought I'd use the facilities at the uni and learn another language16:52
StskeepsX-Fade: login, new package, write description, upload .dsc .tar.gz, done16:52
X-FadeI'm thinking of adding it to the Extras Assitant.16:52
X-FadeSo you can submit it to Extras and Mer at the same time.16:52
Stskeepsprobably even easier with osc16:52
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* lardman goes to get cold caffeine16:52
X-FadeStskeeps: Does OBS have an API for that?16:53
StskeepsX-Fade: yeah - poke lbt, i'm sure he'll help :)16:53
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X-FadeIt can be as easy as just creating a maemoextras account for your builder and use that to pass all packages to the builder.16:54
Stskeepsbut anyway, lbt is the local expert on this, and i'm sure he'll help :)16:55
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X-FadeHeh, ok :)16:55
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X-Fademikkov_: Lol, really?16:58
X-Fademikkov_: Weird.16:58
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mikkov_X-Fade: I can send screenshot if it works differently for you :)16:59
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X-Fademikkov_: I have un-prived accounts too ;)16:59
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X-Fademikkov_: Ah, yeah. you need to add authors somewhere else.17:00
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X-Fademikkov_: You need to Edit metadata for that.17:01
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mikkov_X-Fade: That's changed then. And not documented anywhere17:01
X-Fademikkov_: Hmm no, you are right.17:01
X-Fademikkov_: You _can_ edit it there.17:02
X-Fademikkov_: But it should work in the edit form too ;)17:02
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X-Fademikkov_: Hmm and it does for me too.17:04
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mikkov_X-Fade: adding authors in edit view is not possible for me17:05
mikkov_X-Fade: I can only remove17:05
X-Fademikkov_: Does it lookup the user when you add the username in the box?17:05
mikkov_X-Fade: problem is that there is no box :)17:05
mikkov_X-Fade: edit metadata works17:06
X-Fademikkov_: Go to the edit form and shift-reload the page.17:06
X-Fademikkov_: I think you saw the names with a checkbox in front of them?17:07
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mikkov_X-Fade: reloading doesn't help17:08
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mikkov_X-Fade: yes, if there is a author I can see that with checkbox17:08
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mikkov_X-Fade: if there is no author then there is nothing17:08
mikkov_except the texts17:09
X-Fademikkov_: That gets replaced with javascript.17:09
mikkov_X-Fade: I have Javascript17:09
X-Fademikkov_: Can you try logging out and then login again?17:10
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mikkov_X-Fade: doesn't help17:11
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X-Fademikkov_: Any script errors?17:12
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mikkov_X-Fade: where would I see those?17:14
X-Fademikkov_: depends on which browser you use..17:14
mikkov_X-Fade: look from from bugzilla17:15
X-Fademikkov_: ctrl-shift-j ;)17:15
mikkov_Error: $(this).parents is not a function17:17
mikkov_Source File:
mikkov_Line: 3217:17
X-Fademikkov_: Ok, I see it too.17:18
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lcuki officially hate gmail17:24
Andrewfblackwhy hate gmail?17:25
aquatixwhy use gmail?17:25
aquatixlcuk: but what's wrong?17:25
lcukeverytime i send a mail to/from the mailing list i fill in the lovely automatically prepared reply box17:26
lcukand every time i do it its set to the individual who sent the mail and excludes the mailing list itself17:26
* lcuk never checks, im replying to a mail i got just like every other17:26
slonopotamususe reply-to-all, luke17:26
X-Fademikkov_: The script that resets the default values in the login and search boxes is messing up.17:27
infobotslonopotamus meant: use reply-to-all, lcuk17:27
lcukthats the thing i never click reply to anyone,  theres a reply box already that i use 100 times a day17:27
X-Fademikkov_: So we need to fix that one.17:27
aquatixlcuk: ah, joy17:27
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aquatixlcuk: i guess the list has ML headers?17:28
mikkov_X-Fade: k17:28
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lardmanhmm, nice to see details of how to access the encryption engines on that Samsung chip17:30
* Stskeeps just hopes the cooperation with the company is not damaged.17:31
lardmanwell they didn't leak it17:31
lardmancame from Russia17:31
slonopotamuslcuk, then tell ml owners to properly set reply-to header :)17:32
Stskeepswell, this was something else :) less than 12 hours that i put the firmware image on mer-chatter it ended up on obviously, and then on to , lardman17:32
Stskeepsand it was just supposed to be an internal image.17:32
lardmanah yes, I saw your post about that17:32
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Stskeepsi like the publicity but i hope the company understands that open source means everyone can get it17:33
GeneralAntillesX-Fade, what do you want?17:33
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lardmanStskeeps: does it have a video out on that device?17:33
Stskeepsi think it does.17:33
Stskeepsi need a cable for it though17:33
lardmangood stuff17:33
Stskeepsit has a tv on the headphone plug17:34
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lardmancool, just reading details on how to format TV output17:34
crashanddie__technically so did the OMAP2 device, it just wasn't connected :)17:34
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lardmanplus we didn't have any decent docs for it17:35
crashanddie__which device is this you're talking about?17:35
lardmanwell this doc gives the register offsets and how to write to them for everything I've looked at so far, looks promising17:35
AStormundercutting nokia share with #maemo... brilliant!17:35
AStormexcept it doesn't have a phone17:35
crashanddie__where can I get one?17:36
lbtX-Fade: it's trivial ... eg I ran : bin/ --project Maemo:Mer:Devel:Extras:Testing --obsdir /home/lbt/data/obs
lardmanthough I'd go for the smartQ 7 I think17:37
lbtback now :)17:37
lbtfiferboy: no, no changed... all Mer :)    :(17:37
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fiferboylbt: I was just looking through the code in the repository17:38
* lbt nods17:38
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X-Fademikkov_: better now?17:38
fiferboyHow did you come up with the constants you use?17:38
fiferboy100 ms refresh, etc?17:39
lbtfiferboy: which? timings?17:39
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lbtthey seem to work... I may have tweaked them17:39
X-Fadelbt: Ok, so we would need to come up with a way to signal your builder with a pointer to the location of the package?17:39
lardmanStskeeps: is the multi-format codec firmware included in anything you have?17:39
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crashanddie__stskeepdo you have a smartq5?17:40
lbtX-Fade: well, that's my script and it looks inside the dsc and pulls the orig.tar.gz and diff.gz17:40
lbtand ups them to OBS17:40
lbtso what is the objective? :)17:40
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X-Fadelbt: Well we can run that too.17:41
lbtrecently I decided a simple way to think of OBS is as a version control system for source tarballs and .dsc files and whenever you commit a tarball the build farm compiles it for you17:41
lbtso the script simplifies the process... but it's just a hack for 1st time uploads...17:42
X-Fadelbt: I just want to add Mer here:
fiferboylbt: I wonder if tinkering with them would help improve smoothness at all, although I think only KINETIC_REFRESH would have any effect.17:42
Stskeepslardman: i saw some .so's but i dont think so17:42
X-FadeAnd whatever work needs to be done in the background, needs to be done ;)17:42
Stskeepslardman: i am not sure though17:42
lbtcool... OK17:42
lardmanStskeeps: shame, but not a biggie, looks like that's only needed for the encoder dsp17:42
X-Fadelbt: Since the user then only needs to upload once.17:42
lbtosc has a couple of commands17:43
lbtosc addremove17:43
lbtosc commit -m "message"17:43
crashanddie__stskeep: do you have a smartq5?17:43
lardmandamn, I'm wrong, need the firmware to access the hw accel parts too17:44
X-Fadelbt: 'automated build from Maemo Extras' ;)17:44
infobotcrashanddie__ meant: stskeeps: do you have a smartq5?17:44
lbtso if you checkout the osc project, delete the files in the wd, replace them, run addremove, run commit.... you're done17:44
lbtX-Fade: yep, I get it.... very nice :)17:44
Stskeepscrashanddie__: yes17:45
lbtX-Fade: have you read
crashanddie__Stskeeps: I want one, how much for shipping one to me? :P17:45
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Stskeepscrashanddie__: hehe. if the chinese haven't fucked everything up for me, i should get a vendor list..17:45
lbtI am going to extend it to 'creating + maintaining a package in extras'17:45
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lbtfiferboy: seems reasonable17:46
X-Fadelbt: Nice, looks great.17:46
lbtbut my shopper scrolling is very smooth17:46
lbtso it could be Qt not being happy?17:46
Andrewfblackwhat are hardware stats compaired to a N8x0 on the Smartq5?17:46
GAN800Andrewfblack, slightly faster ARM1117:47
X-Fadelbt: Can it query if the package is already known?17:47
crashanddie__667Mhz ARM1117:47
fiferboylbt: Is it okay if I send you a screenshot of what I am trying to scroll?  Maybe you will have an idea17:47
Andrewfblackfor the price would be cool to get one17:47
crashanddie__Edge/GPRS support17:47
lbtX-Fade: yes17:47
lbtfiferboy: yes17:47
lardmanthough atm I think it runs at ~550MHz or so17:48
crashanddie__(with USB dongle)17:48
crashanddie__same root file system (256Mb)17:48
lbtX-Fade: have you got osc installed?17:48
X-Fadelbt: No, I'd have to set that up first.17:48
lbtdo you have an OBS account?17:49
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X-Fadelbt: Not that either. I guess I'll have to setup 2 of those ;)17:49
lbtalso X-Fade
lardmanfinally, found the section about 3D accel17:50
lbtcan you read that w/o an account?17:50
X-Fadelbt: yep17:50
lbtdocuments all the http xml api calls :)17:50
lbtwhich is what osc does for you17:50
X-Fadelbt: Ok, looks pretty nice. Now to find time to create a script that only takes a few params and uploads the local files ;)17:51
lbtnow most of the time, running something like : osc ls Maemo:Mer:Devel17:51
lbtis a *lot* easier17:52
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crashanddie__lardman: 3d accel on the sq5?17:52
lbtwhen you start I'll work through it with you if you like... it's useful just to get pointers to what it _can_ do17:52
lardmancrashanddie_: yep17:53
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GeneralAntillesI can't wait for 3D on the RX-5117:53
lardmanI just want some new hw to hack on17:53
lbtX-Fade: you a perl hacker?17:53
fiferboylbt: I sent you an email.17:54
GeneralAntilleslardman, don't we all17:54
X-Fadelbt: Not really, but reading/editing those should be ok.17:54
lardmanof course17:54
lbtmost of osc is python ... ^^ is my hacking ;)17:54
GeneralAntillesX-Fade, "Maemo" Extras? :P17:55
lbtfiferboy: thanks very much but I don't need to extend anything...17:55
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Yep, I've decided not to care anymore ;)17:55
lbthmm that may not have been your email...17:55
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Everything is Maemo from now on :D17:55
fiferboylbt: Well, then get off my mailing list :)17:55
GeneralAntilles"Extras" is less than half the letters, though!17:55
X-FadeGeneralAntilles: Hmm you've got a point there.17:56
X-FadeThink of the time I will save..17:56
GeneralAntillesJust drop Maemo everywhere17:56
GeneralAntillesCall the next one "5"17:56
crashanddie__GeneralAntilles: you done anything interesting with your beagleboard ever since you got it?17:56
GeneralAntillescrashanddie__, fuck no!17:56
* GeneralAntilles <- lazy bastard17:57
crashanddie__so why the fuck do you want new hardware?17:57
X-Fadelbt: Thanks, that doesn't look half bad ;)17:57
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crashanddie__GeneralAntilles applies Reisner's Rule of Conceptual Inertia as a life-objective17:57
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lbtgives you an idea...17:58
crashanddie__"If you think big enough, you'll never have to do it."17:58
X-Fadelbt: Yeah, I can manage from there probably.17:58
toggles_wanyone have a pointer for n810 + maemo-pan + ubuntu 9.04? i can pair the two but cannot seem to get an ip and there doesn't seem to be a 'dummy connection' in the select connection box. tia.17:58
GeneralAntillescrashanddie__, because an RX-51 comes with everything it needs to work.17:58
crashanddie__(copyright xkcd)17:59
lbtfiferboy: ducks!!!17:59
GeneralAntillesThe Beagle Board requires too much extra shit to be convenient.17:59
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fiferboylbt: Theres lots of them here17:59
irgsomethinghey guys17:59
* Andrewfblack will never speak bad of wayfinder cracking again, just please stop PMing me hate mail about it lol17:59
GeneralAntillesAndrewfblack, yarrrr!17:59
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AStormcrashanddie_, like any rule, taken too far is crippling18:00
X-Fadelbt: What should we do with bugowner and maintainer?18:00
crashanddie__kill them18:01
lbtideally they should have an obs account :(18:01
X-Fadelbt: Point that to the generic build user if the user is not found?18:01
X-Fadelbt: We can query if the user has an account, right?18:01
lbtnot tried that...18:01
X-Fadelbt: says so ..18:01
lardmanStskeeps: looks like the JPEG accel is all memory mapped register based, which is why I'm guessing it's used18:02
lbtGET /person/<userid>18:02
X-Fadeyeah, where userid is not really an id ;)18:02
X-FadeBut username18:02
lbtyeah, the docs are light18:02
lardmanStskeeps: the 2D accel stuff is similar though, but I read somewhere that no 2D accel was performed; perhaps the hassle of hacking the X-server?18:03
X-FadeWell, we know the username at garage. So it can do a lookup.18:03
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lbtyes... that's a more complex problem though18:03
RST38hmoo all18:03
lbtthere will be collisions18:03
lbtwe'll need a mapping table18:03
RST38hwhat 2d accel? nobody does 2d accel any more.18:04
X-FadeThe email is in there too18:04
RST38hso stupid, really18:04
lbtcan you query on it though?18:04
lcukno it isnt#18:04
lardmanRST38h: faie enough18:04
X-Fadelbt: No, just search for the username and see if the email matches?18:04
* RST38h suspects it was "fail enough" =)18:04
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lbtyes... but a table/mapping is more reliable18:05
lardmanRST38h: true :)18:05
X-Fadelbt: I can just ask for their OBS account name.18:05
lbtand store in the maemo profile?18:06
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lardmancu later18:06
X-Fadelbt: Yeah, need to see where I store it. But that should no be a problem.18:06
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lbtfiferboy: is that OSS ? if so send me the code / git repo:)18:06
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Maceri didn't know that reiser pled to 2nd degree murder and showed them where he hid the body18:07
Macerso he was guilty as sin huh? :)18:07
lbtVFS layer I think18:07
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fiferboylbt: I can send you a tarball if you like18:07
RST38hMacer: you have been out of the loop then18:07
Maceri guess so18:08
Maceri know he was convicted but i didn't know he took a plea and showed the authorities whrere he hid the body18:08
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Macerwhat did he do? stab her to death in the car seat then replace the seat?18:08
fiferboyIt has a scratchbox variable detection in the file18:08
RST38hMacer: it wasn't like he had a choice, after all the evidence18:08
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RST38hMacer: who knows? who cares?18:09
lbtfiferboy: ugh... I'll fix it up...18:09
Macerwell.. i just thought it was interesting18:09
fiferboyI'll change it to the hildon detect that Antonio has added to the latest version when it is available18:09
RST38hThe guy is just a crazy geek whose autism made the worst of him18:09
penguinbaitstop talking about me ;)18:10
RST38hOh, no penguinbait, we all hope you have not got to this stage ye =)18:10
* lbt wonders how to set his username to orange...18:10
Macerabandoned by the open source community after his conviction18:10
RST38hAbandoned by WHOM???18:11
penguinbaitlike this /nick orange18:11
* RST38h likes it when people believe in oxymorons, makes them so much more entertaining to watch18:11
lbtfiferboy: I just sent the fremantle Qt to OBS this morning18:11
fiferboyI saw that you had cleaned up some scratchbox detections.18:12
Macershe was a mail order bride!18:12
Macerok.. i'm sorry :) i'll stop now18:12
lbtyeah Qt is very clean though.... but the diablo/fremantle split is a bit messy...changelogs don't match etc.18:13
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RST38hMacer: but of course!18:13
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lbtdoes anyone know the syntax of a debian blah.lintian file in debian/ ?18:15
fiferboyAre there any big changes in the fremantle version that you know of?18:16
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lbtinput changes by the look of it18:16
lbtgrep OS_FREMANTLE I think (there's a debian.fremantle/patches/ file )18:17
fiferboyWere there any scratchbox-isms in it?18:17
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lbt1 sec18:18
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fiferboyThat's good news18:18
lbtall openGL related and a build-depend on nokia-binaries18:18
lbt(which is GL too )18:18
fiferboyAh, right.  I saw that thread too18:19
Macerhe had 2 books in the murder car about homocide investigation :) what did he have.. murder for dummies?18:19
Andrewfblackany final comments or concerns before I PM Reggie to change minimalist over to minimalist 2.0?18:19
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RST38hAndrew: None of us have seen Minimalist2 yet, haven't we? =)18:20
RST38hSo, yea, change it by all means and let complaints come as they always do18:21
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AndrewfblackI've posted some screenshots and I've had a lot of people recommend changes off of it.18:22
RST38hSeen the screenshots18:22
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RST38hoh yesss18:27
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StskeepsRST38h: hah18:28
RST38hthey say it mostly occurs due to external causes18:28
Stskeeps"user on fire"18:28
lbtI thought it was "/dev/lp on fire"18:29
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fiferboyWhy am I not tempted to visit that URL?18:44
RST38hyou ain't?18:44
fiferboylbt: I sent you the code.  Any insight you have would be much appreciated.18:45
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lbtsure... been keeping an eye out18:45
lbtis a big data file included .. or is that personal data?18:45
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fiferboyIt is included18:45
fiferboyI'm afk for a few hours, but I'll be back this afternoon (EST)18:46
lbtgot it18:46
AStormRST38h, like, outside temperature being >= 25°C? ;P18:46
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RST38hAStorm: more like direct sunlight thing18:48
AStormah, you say 35°C? :P18:48
AStormstill not that hot18:48
RST38hAStorm: a black item placed in direct sunlight without wind can get much hotter than that18:49
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lcukRST38h, u frying ants again18:55
RST38hno no18:57
* RST38h has nothing against the animal world and tries never offending it18:57
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RST38h(humans are obviously not included)18:57
lcukhas the volcano in mt doom been extenguished yet?18:58
lcuk+spelling ffs18:58
RST38hlcuk: Yea, wasn't there last night18:58
lcukdid you look around to see if it had moved :|18:59
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RST38hlcuk: it hasn't, or I would know =)18:59
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RST38hfunny thing is, people living around the spot bought whole boxes of beer to last them through the night of watching the show =)19:00
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lcukfire has that effect19:01
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RST38hfire, water, men working19:03
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lcuklol - basically any excuse for a piss up19:03
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StskeepsRST38h: our first blurry picture saga of mer..
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lardmanStskeeps: did you happen to grab a ps output on the original firmware with the image view running?19:27
RST38hSts: =)19:27
* lardman is wondering how the image view accesses the JPEG acceleration, assuming it does19:27
* lardman is also being ordered to go to the shops. bbiab19:27
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Stskeepslardman|afk: no sorry19:30
* oscarx is away: almorzando19:36
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AStormpublic away is evil!19:37
AStormunpacking mer 0.13testing1, I hope the touchscreen bug is fixed :)19:38
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* RST38h hasn't done any development of his own stuff for a month or so now =(19:41
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oscarxAStorm, sorry, you'r right.. I'm going to disable it..19:42
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lardmanStskeeps: no worries19:43
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lardmanjust looking at the screenshots on, I see a camera icon on the device, it doesn't have one does it?19:51
Stskeepsno camera19:52
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lardmanI wonder why the icon19:53
RST38hcoming in q7?19:53
lardmanperhaps it's actually supposed to look like something else19:53
pupnikwhat screenshot is this lardman ? (hi all)19:53
lardmannah, Q7 doesn't look like it has one either19:53
lcukRST38h, octal years19:53
RST38hq11 next then? =)19:54
lardmanlol yeah, give it a couple of weeks :)19:54
pupnikoh yeah smartq19:55
pupnikgetting one lardman ?19:55
lardmanyeah, just wondering how to go about it19:55
lardmanI'd prefer the big screen one I think, but not sure if they are available yet19:56
pupnikthe 7"  what is your reason for buying?19:56
lardmanhw acceleration hacking, and can use it to watch videos19:56
lardmanonce I hack the hw that is19:56
pupnik7" would be great for older folks at home, imo19:56
* lardman raises hand :D19:56
RST38hwould be great for me too19:56
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GAN800Something is taking a lot of time to load on Talk at the very end of the rendering.19:58
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GAN800I think it may be js19:58
GAN800The little page number selector at the top appears after the delay.19:58
andre__hmm, looks like the first people come up that don't know the difference between bugtrackers and forums/mailinglists :-/20:00
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RST38hno surprise there20:04
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andre__like 4526.20:09
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RST38h"Decapitation seems to be the best solution, but unpredictable regeneration of the brain stem continues to cause difficulties."20:11
lcuksometimes RST38h i think you are a bot20:11
RST38hThat is because I am.20:12
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crashanddie__Stskeeps: got reseller information for the sq5?20:14
Stskeepscrashanddie__: .. well i had a minor problem earlier with some very efficient chinese, but i'm waiting for a list provided the relationship to the company isn't forever destroyed..20:15
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lcukoh shit Stskeeps, what did you intend to say, and how did it come out? :D20:16
lcukdid it involve their parents lol20:17
RST38hSts: so, who efficionalized whom?20:17
GAN800RST38h, got a profiler somewhere that could help see what's taking forever to render?20:17
RST38h(and no, when giving something to a random Chinese or Russian guy, you can't hope to keep it confidential, don't expect it)20:17
RST38hGAN: On desktop Linux yes, but not on the tablet - OProfile requires a speial kernel afaik20:18
GAN800Stskeeps, I like that I keep seeing it commented as some sort of official Maemo port. :P20:18
StskeepsGAN800: they refer to in the posts though20:18
lcukexcited that a "big" distro has noticed them :)20:19
RST38hGAN: Is desktop ok?20:19
lcukit shows how right your approach is :)20:19
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GAN800RST38h, I see the same delay on FF3 on my Mini 9, so, yes20:21
RST38hall right, what URL?20:21
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lcukGAN800, is it like the google urchin locking up20:22
lcukor a *shock* virus20:22
RST38hwill see20:23
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* lcuk might try typing naked fingered tonight20:26
GAN800RST38h, pick any Talk thread.20:26
RST38hok, will do in a second (have to reboot to Linux)20:27
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RST38hGAN: Ok, the total page isze is 226kB20:36
RST38hthere is 32kB CSS and 114kB JS20:37
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RST38has to what the hell happens on load, I will tell you in a moment after finding and installing JS debug extension20:38
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GeneralAntillesRST38h, I'm thinking the js menus should be replaced by CSS ones.20:38
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RST38hI would remove both and just have a menu bar with keywords in plain HTML20:39
GeneralAntillesYeah, or that.20:39
RST38hthis css/js stuff is just plain silly20:39
RST38hAndrew is actually doing it for Minimalist220:40
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GeneralAntillesI might think about mocking up something for that.20:40
RST38hit isn't even worth a mockup - <a ...>&nbsp;|&nbsp;<a ...>&nbsp;|...20:40
GeneralAntillesThere's way too much stuff for that.20:41
RST38hwell some of it will have to get hidden, unfortunately20:41
RST38hor appear in the second menubar underneath, in smaller font20:41
RST38hwhich of course require a bit of js, but not nearly as much as menu does20:42
fiferboylbt: How's it look?20:42
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kruqt minus 8 minutes20:52
GeneralAntillesI thought about driving over to the other coast today but I'm just too damn lazy.20:53
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RST38hNo airplanes?20:54
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GeneralAntillesRST38h, erm, ~$300 a person for 3 people for a day trip to the the spaceport?20:54
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GeneralAntillesPlus rental car, since I'm not sure how close you'd actually be able to get.20:55
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RST38hGAN: Talk does not appear to run any JS on load20:56
lbtfiferboy: just hangs when I run it unde x8620:56
RST38hAt least profiler does not see any20:57
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GeneralAntillesRST38h, something's still rending stuff after the progress bar is finished.20:57
fiferboylbt: Did you compile in a regular gcc environment20:57
RST38hit does send a google analytics request20:57
RST38hbut wait, I have got some js data in20:57
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RST38hGAN: Ok, the first spot is taken by anonymous functions inside ga.js :)20:59
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RST38hGAN: The second spot is taken by vbmenu_register()20:59
RST38hThird spot is taken by vBulletin_init()20:59
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fiferboylbt: Is a ".birdlist" directory created in your home directory?21:02
lbtlemme see21:02
lbt0 size .db21:02
fiferboyAny journal file?21:03
lbtnot in there21:03
RST38hGAN: I think it is vbmenu_register(). The ga.js stuff appears to be something else21:03
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lbtQMetaObject::connectSlotsByName: No matching signal for on_sortCheck_toggled(bool)21:04
fiferboyOh, I know why.  Try copying the "src/data/tables" directory to "~/.birdlist"21:04
GeneralAntillesToo much haze to see outside.21:04
lbtQMetaObject::connectSlotsByName: No matching signal for on_sortCombo_currentIndexChanged(int)21:04
RST38hGAN: Ok, the data is in. Ready?21:05
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fiferboyThat doesn't actually stop it from running.  It happens everytime, I have to figure out where that is happening (from an old ui file)21:06
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GeneralAntillesRST38h, want to CC it to
RST38hGAN: Well, I will tell you and you do what you want with it21:07
RST38hFor a variety of reasons I would like to abstain from that discussion, not my fight21:07
GeneralAntillesBundyo gathered some:
GeneralAntillesWell, I don't think it's a fight.21:08
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RST38hGAN: Anyways, the first spot is taken by Google Analytics with 1 call taking 381 units21:08
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RST38hGAN: The second spot is taken by vbmenu_register() that gets called 16 times on each page load and takes 226 units total for 16 calls21:08
RST38hGAN: The third spot is vBulletin_init() with one call per page load, taking 193 units21:09
RST38hGAN: The forth spot is Google Analytics AGAIN, with 1 call of 141 units21:10
RST38hThis is it, the rest is insignificant. You can refer to me when posting this stuff to the thread.21:10
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GeneralAntillesThe menu should be easy to fix.21:10
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GeneralAntillesAs most of those are pretty redundant or can be made redundant.21:10
lbtfiferboy: feature request from the wife... ID the bird from the piccy21:10
fiferboyI'll gladly take feature requests, but image recognition is going to take me a long time to implement.21:11
lcukfake it then!21:11
lbtOK, lets hit armel then... you OK if I push it to public OBS?21:12
RST38hGAN: Google Analytics eats a lot though21:13
fiferboylbt: Where does it show up?21:13
lbtit's public ... Mer...21:13
lbt:Extras:Devel for now21:14
RST38hGAN: I am also using Google Analytics on my page, going to profile it for comparison21:14
lbtif you'd rather not then that's OK21:14
fiferboyI'd prefer to clean it up a bit before it hits any public repos.21:14
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fiferboyI can send you a binary if you want to try it out.21:15
RST38hGAN: Absolutely no hits from Google Analytics on my page21:15
lbtthat's OK... I'll try it in my shopper chroot21:15
GeneralAntillesI wish my 5800 would ship21:16
RST38hGAN: Please notice that I am using urchin.js (old style) but talk uses ga.js (new style?)21:16
GeneralAntillesRST38h, wonder what's slowing it down on Talk21:16
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RST38hGAN: Here is what Google says about the difference:21:17
Stskeepsga.js? ;p21:17
GeneralAntillesBe back later. Thanks for investigating, RST38h. I'll see what we can do with Reggie to improve it.21:17
GeneralAntillesStskeepie, MUHAHAHA!21:17
RST38hYes, Sts, our good general is solely responsible for wasting CPU cycles on talk.maemo.org21:17
StskeepsRST38h: yeah.. :P21:17
RST38hGAN: "Although your existing urchin.js page tags will continue to work, you may wish to update them to ga.js anyway. This will allow you to take advantage of the most up-to-date tracking functionality as it is added to Google Analytics. An immediate benefit you'll notice is that the ga.js tags allow you to track ecommerce transactions in a more readable way. And, we've created a special resource on the ga.js javascript for power users who want mor21:18
RST38he options"21:18
RST38hIn other words, my guess is that if Reggie changes 'em back to urchin.js, neither he not anyone else will notice21:18
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mmatth1i'm wondering if anybody knows how to reset the dns cache... i've found misc sites that all mention restarting the nscd daemon.  is that what needs to be done on maemo?21:20
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Stskeepsi think it's dnsmasq based there21:21
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mmatth1thanks.  i tried a dnsmasq restart but no luck.  i'm switching from a wlan connection to gprs.  the wlan connection resolves the name to its local/internal address.  the gprs connection should resolve to an external address...21:34
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mmatth1so when i'm on the wlan connection, i open a socket & connect.  read & write.  then when i see the gprs switch i shut down the socket and do the gethostbyname to get the ip address.  however, i'm getting the internal address which of course i can't connect to21:38
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fiferboylbt: Did you manage to get it built for ARMEL?21:43
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cyrus_mcI have an N810, and when I connect to my computer only the external memory card is availble, not the internal.21:51
locutuscan be because files on the internal card are locked21:51
locutusif thats the case, the kernel cant unmount the internal mmc, and thus not export it as a USB MSD21:52
locutusyou can see if this is so by using lsof in a terminal21:52
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lardmancyrus_mc: make sure you don't have a file open on the internal card, or the xterm or the filemanager, etc22:04
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lbtfiferboy: not yet22:25
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* lbt found something shiny22:26
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lcukinteresting mail from the dev ml :)22:33
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lcuk"Intel and Nokia are pleased to jointly announce the oFono project22:33
lcuk(, an open source project for developing an open source22:33
lcuktelephony solution."22:33
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RST38hThis is most likely ia32 based though22:35
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keesjare there ia32 based phones out there?22:37
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suihkulokkikeesj: nokia 9000i22:38
RST38hsuihkulokki: no way?!?22:38
suihkulokkiRST38h: at 24MHz 38622:39
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keesjevent then , it uses dbus and such so it's more about linux based system then the instruction set used22:45
RST38hsuihkulokki: please, please, please tell me it ran MSDOS =)22:45
RST38h"But being linked wirelessly to a massive library of legal downloads, bestselling books, magazines and newspapers, is what will make a reader great. For now, the only mainstream reader that can claim such a feature is the Kindle, and the only country that can claim the Kindle is the US."22:47
suihkulokkiRST38h: it ran GEOS on top DOS22:47
RST38hsuih: even better! geos was running on top of msdos anyway22:48
suihkulokkisome info in fi_FI
RST38hpoor non-americans not having access to massive library of legal downloads....22:49
* RST38h feels so sorry for them!22:49
suihkulokkisome people put even linux on it, but they had to use asmutils since busybox was too big :)22:49
RST38hderf: who? =)22:49
derfRST38h: The non-Americans.22:49
RST38hderf: sure ot os not the vice versa?22:50
derfWell, I am sure I don't have a Kindle.22:50
RST38hderf: that is unamerican.22:51
derfOh. I guess I'll go move, then.22:51
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RST38htoo late you are already unamerican.22:52
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derfMaybe New Zealand. It's cheap down there.22:52
RST38hderf: 50% of skin cancer over the average lifespan22:52
RST38hthat is probability, not the percentage of your skin affected =)22:52
derfRST38h: Only if you go outside!22:53
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derfI also don't except the cheapness to last.22:53
derfThey've just done a better job of devaluing their currency than most.22:53
derfBut, ceteris paribus, I consider myself pretty lucky to have been born American. There's lots worse places to have wound up in this world.22:55
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RST38hDefinitely true22:55
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RST38hAlthough the restriction of your behavioral choices to making money and buying stuff is somewhat frightening22:57
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derfI don't buy much stuff.22:57
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RST38hderf: We have already determined that you are unamerican =)22:58
derfI don't deny it.22:58
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derfI don't watch TV, either.22:59
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* RST38h usually limits himself to History Channel when in US23:00
RST38hMost other channels cause involuntary "what the fuck?" response23:00
derfMost of the Discovery Channel-related offerings are decent.23:01
derfGod forbid you ever watch network news.23:01
GeneralAntillesHistory Channel is usually worse than Discovery.23:01
* timeless_mbp shrugs23:02
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timeless_mbpbuying stuff is fun23:02
timeless_mbpi might have spent 2000USD for the past week or so23:02
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Stskeepswell eur > usd these days isn't it?23:03
timeless_mbphas been for ages23:03
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timeless_mbpand since it's really EURs that i'm losing, it's not bad23:03
RST38hGAN: That probably depends on personal preferences but I agree that both HC and Discovery stuff are watchable23:04
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GeneralAntillesRST38h, History Channel gets a little Hitler insane.23:05
Stskeepsww2 coverage constantly? :P23:05
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derfGA: Wikipedia tells me that's changed since they started a separate Military History Channel.23:06
RST38hGAN: I am suuuure it is seasonal :)23:06
* xnt[at_school] is back from school23:07
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RST38hSpeaking of the above:
lizardofremantle autobuilder has gone crazy :(23:08
RST38hSpecies specifically endangered by the nazi wannabes23:08
RST38hlizardo: Catch X-Fade and interrogate!23:08
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qgi1jeremiah_: ping?23:08
lizardo[extras-builds] [fremantle]: unknown unknown UNKNOWN  ... [2009-05-11 23:05:07] No .dsc files found in '/var/www/extras-devel/incoming-builder/diablo'  ???23:08
qgi1ah lizardo, this is related to a question I had for jeremiah_ :)23:09
lizardoqgi1: no problem hehe23:09
qgi1 says23:09
qgi1Run a test build of all Diablo Extras packages on Fremantle . Could . Jeremiah23:09
qgi1"The fact that developers are porting packages themselves somewhat obviates the need to me to do a lot of this. "23:10
qgi1I'll ask in the list or something but... wouldn't this be the other way around?23:10
lizardoqgi1: at least for PyMaemo packages that's true23:10
fiferboylbt: Got to go now.  Email me if you have any questions about the code23:10
qgi1developers have to port themselves because there is no automatic move from Diablo?23:10
lizardoqgi1: pretty much all packages were uploaded already to fremantle23:10
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qgi1really? wow23:11
lizardoqgi1: pymaemo packages I mean :)23:11
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qgi1ahm  :)23:11
* lcuk gets qgil a towel to mop up the coke he splurted out23:12
qgi1"Reducing number of external repositories - contact outstanding owners" appears as "should", which looks more like a Could compared to the other task23:12
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qgi1same for - appears as should. anyway I better tell thise where he can readi it  ;)23:13
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|RIs Fremantle using core utils or busybox still? :)23:15
Stskeepsi think busybox, but i actually didn't check23:15
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mmatth1Stkskeeps - actually /etc/init.d/dnsmasq restart" is working for me... but only if i type it into the command-line myself.  if i try to call system("/etc/init.d/dnsmasq restart") then it doesn't seem to work.  any hints?23:34
StskeepsyouÃ're running as a user vs root23:34
mmatth1(to clarify, in the former case i'm running my daemon and open a terminal & type the command myself.  in the other case, i'm making the "system" call from my daemon)23:34
mmatth1as a user23:34
Stskeepsyes, but you did it as root otherwise :)23:35
mmatth1right, daemon is running as a user.  from the terminal i was root23:35
Stskeepsthat's why :)23:36
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Stskeepsevening rkirti23:53
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rkirtiStskeeps : evening :)23:54
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