IRC log of #maemo for Saturday, 2008-11-08

Stskeepslcuk: two floor apt00:01
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lcukheh Stskeeps then its not exactly a tower is it - or are your 2 floors 97 stories up?00:02
RST38hSts: A penthouse? =)00:03
Stskeepsnot a tower :P00:03
LinuxCodeprison ?00:04
Stskeepsnah, student housing, but close.00:05
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kuphi! how can i use an image on a button with pygtk? i have code that works on my desktop pc but not on the nit. there are no errors or warnings00:06
* Stskeeps continues getting m-r booting in n800-qemu00:06
lcukkup, what happens00:07
lcukand what desktop were you doing it in00:07
kupon ubuntu ... but on maemo there are no images, just the text on the button00:07
kupwanna see code?00:08
lcuknot really, was just curious00:08
lcukim not a pyman00:08
lcuksome folks come and try after using windows stuff00:08
lcukthere shoudl eb errors of some kind if its failing to load your assets, but then again can you disable errors (on error resume next)00:09
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kupman, this is an ubuntu bug!! i didn't set gtk-button-images so the images should be ignored, but ubuntu doesn't do it00:13
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lcukwell make sure when you complain to them, if they get stuck looking for a solution tell them the more advanced high tech maemo platform has the answer00:14
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LinuxCodelcuk, bahahah00:14
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Stskeeps(minimal ubuntu booting in qemu-arm n800 emulatiom.)00:15
Stskeepsfrom a jffs2 image on 37mb00:16
lcukStskeeps, how come at [    1.140624] it says "Help, STS has me locked inside a little machine"00:16
Stskeepslcuk: a midget turns the wheel00:17
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lcukStskeeps, you replaced the ferret?00:18
lcukthats where you got the speed from00:18
Stskeepsit's like where the 770s are running inside the wheels00:18
lcukyou should speak to hrw00:19
lcukhe has done lots of work towards this00:19
Stskeepsofcourse, it's his code i'm using00:19
Stskeepsqemu HEAD00:19
Stskeepsit's -very- impressive how much he's done00:19
lcukyeah, but not just using, speak to him and discuss how it could be improved00:20
lcukmost of all, get xv working in it ;)00:20
Stskeepsi'm not sure it would be such a fancy experience00:20
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lcukyeah i know theres a lot that the emu itself has to do and it could never really be made that slick00:21
lcukbut based on the reading of your sdk stuff and knowing you want emu system for it, it would help to do all you can00:21
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lcukim really looking forward to the new device00:22
lcuki cant wait to try building in c++00:22
Stskeepsis c++ support really that bad?00:22
Stskeepsi admit, i haven't compiled c++ on it00:22
lcukno, it just cant keep up with me00:22
lcukit works perfectly, but takes much longer per compiled file00:22
lcukmy frustration threshold is about 5-10 seconds from starting build to havin a running system00:23
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lcukits fine for c00:23
lcukand simpler on my mind with it on device00:23
lcukbut c++ and vala and other things are just too long00:23
RST38hall right, sleep!00:23
lcukok RST38h nice chattin with you00:24
RST38hlcuk: Hey, you can do the opposite crosscompilation!00:24
Stskeepsyeah, distcc to a cross compilation toolchain00:24
Stskeepsi did that00:24
RST38hlcuk: Use your tablet to ssh to a remote server with Maemo SDK installed, compiled there, transfer back and run00:24
Stskeeps.. or that00:24
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lcukno, (1) i hate scratchbox, (2) it would be slower scping files around (3) it has its own issues of latency (4) i cant use it when im just randomly out and about (5) i hate scratchbox00:25
lcukthe only real solution will come when i get a native linux desktop, but thats not going to happen until i find a way to afford an asus eee top00:26
Stskeepslcuk: tried sb2 yet?00:26
lcukliqbase needs a daddy :)00:26
Stskeepsit's actually a lot more saner00:26
RST38hlcuk: 1) use sb2, screw sb1 2) no, compilation time will be much shorter 3) dunno 4) use "screen" on the server 5) see 100:26
Stskeepsand that comes from a firm scratchbox hater00:26
RST38hlcuk: For sb2, you can make use of my makefiles (available from - they completely skip the autoconf process00:27
lcukRST38h, compilation NOW using device is FASTER than my old method of building in scratchbox inside vmware and scping to device and executing00:27
RST38hlcuk: oh, screw vmware00:27
lcukplease dont try to change my desktop :)00:27
RST38hlcuk: Just get a remote Linux account somewhere, install sb2 there, and ssh00:27
lcuk(4) falls down there00:27
RST38hyou do not really need a linux desktop, an account at any sshable system will suffice00:28
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RST38hok, really asleep now.00:29
lcukalright, gnite00:29
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lcukStskeeps, build time for liqbase has gone up to 3 minutes00:36
Stskeepsthe next firefox in terms of time to build soon? ;)00:38
lcukadded libraries and things to every file which could be altered dramatically00:38
Stskeepsokay, - does this return a blank page for the rest of you?00:39
lcuki do like the experience of having on device building o matter how inpractical for now, but it at least lets me feel the machine and understand its capabilities00:39
lcuknot this time, but randomly it does for any pages00:39
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lcukStskeeps, the mauku comment about deblet from quim,   get together with qole and others and strengthen core maemo.  "R" is worthwhile and your documenting the process is important and good00:41
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, the wiki fucks up from time to time. in firefox, press ctrl-shift-r to force it to reload w/out using cached stuff00:41
Stskeepslcuk: yeah, that was what i indicated in my answer too00:41
Stskeepsi wasn't offended or something, just giving my view :)00:41
lcukyes, and im indicating in my strongest terms that its good00:41
Stskeepsi like the attention :P00:42
lcukas you should00:42
lcukqwerty12_N800, do you have a paper round?00:42
qwerty12_N800lcuk, no00:43
* Stskeeps did when he was 13-18, then got so horridly tired of it00:43
Stskeepsafter realising i could spend two hours coding and get 250$ for it00:43
lcukthen you need to tell your dad "i dont want any spending money, i swore today on irc and im repaying the debt"00:43
qwerty12_N800don't think anyone gets papers delivered round here, tesco's is nearby :)00:43
qwerty12_N800hehe :p00:44
lcukmy luke has a paper round00:44
lcukhe just uses it as an excuse not to come home and to faff at mcdonalds and stop at grandmas for tea00:44
Stskeepslcuk: i managed to run up 1000 pound in dialup fees when i was 14, so i kinda had to pay it off..00:44
qwerty12_N800lcuk, lol :P00:45
lcuk£1000 :O thats a lotta money, what might i ask were u dialing up?00:45
Stskeepswait, no, that wasn't dialup00:45
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, ooh, bollocks >.<00:45
Stskeepsthat was me talking locally to a girl friend of mine00:45
lcuknaughty nurse hotline00:45
Stskeepshehe, :P00:45
lcuk0898 tits-out00:45
Stskeepsworst part was it was local area00:45
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, should have done a reverse call :p00:46
lcuktracy was in hospital once and they had a really expensive bedside phone service, i spoke for hours to her  :$00:46
lcukwe got cut off after that i believe00:46
lcukor just got off his lazy ass and gone round there00:46
lcuktheres more benefits actually being in the same room as a hot gal00:47
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* Stskeeps runs third mkfs.jffs2 tonight00:47
Stskeepstrying if i can make X run on the emulator00:48
Stskeepsthen next step is getting maemo GTK + hildon going00:48
Stskeepsand suddenly we have a interesting proof of concept.00:48
lcukyes should be able to00:49
lcuki think hrw had full thing on00:49
lcukinfact, yeah he did cos he installed liqbase into it00:49
lcukand also mplayer - to test the xv stuff00:49
lcukok, ive got something i need to build00:51
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Stskeepslcuk: and regarding qole, he'd be good to get in on how to integrate non-hildon apps into hildon, or reverse, his new stuff single-handed removed most reasons to boot into deblet ;)00:54
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lcukyes, you and qole have a lot of common ground - if i was running a company i would have you combining skills00:54
Stskeepshehe. think we both have some strong personalities though00:55
lcukyes undeniably - personality is a strength00:55
lcukbut thankfully there is a whole atlantic ocean between you two00:56
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Stskeepslast project i ran there was a similar seperation, and yet if the guy ever met me he would kick my ass so badly :>00:59
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lcukStskeeps, forgive me for being thick, were you actually at the summit01:03
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Stskeepsi had thought about it but then my gf's internship got moved a month01:03
Stskeepsmaybe next year01:03
lcuki have memories of talking to so many people and ive just tried to rack my brain to see whether you fit into any of them01:04
Stskeepsdoubt it01:04
lcukmaybe next year it wont matter - i hope to have liqbase getting all data in by then :)01:04
Stskeepsthe market next year will be really interesting, atleas01:05
lcukany idea on whether i can start a thread, but assign a priority to it, so instead of both threads going hell for leather the main thread continues at ~ 75% cpu but the other just trickles01:05
Stskeepsyeah, think pthread api has that01:06
Stskeepslemme just drag out my book01:06
lcukahhh cool, thx01:06
woglindelol someone wrote an android programm to sart busybox's telnet01:06
lcukheh woglinde i just go to a console, damn closed oses ;)01:06
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Stskeepslcuk: look into pthread_attr_setschedparam01:07
lcukyeah i will thanks01:07
Stskeepsoreilly's pthreads programming is a good buy01:07
Stskeeps.. or dl01:08
lcuki simply had one running at full belt and it threw out my kinetic01:08
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lcukif i ccan tell it to go slowly then i might return the code01:08
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lcuki dont think i would want an entire book on threads, i havent got enough time to do that in every library01:08
lcukthats always my problem actually, i like to see interfaces of all kinds move and work, but i dont want to get bogged down making the final app01:09
lcuk(apart from my sketching :))01:09
woglindehe books ruling01:09
woglindeI meant reading books is good01:10
lcukoh yes i agree01:10
lcuki read a lot of niven :)01:10
lcukand when i havent got a niven im investigating reading up on the doctor who 'verse01:11
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bef0rdhey Stskeeps, just wondering, what version of libgfs are you using on deblet?01:15
bef0rdlibgsf sorry01:16
Stskeepssame as debian lenny i gues01:16
bef0rdI see, have you got a package for gnumeric?01:17
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Stskeepsif it's in debian lenny, we do01:18
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bef0rdoh, I'm asking just to see if you've experienced this which is supposed to be fixed on SVN01:19
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StskeepsI'd appreciate it if someone could confirm that the problem as01:21
Stskeepsreported by Keith is no longer reproducible after updating libgsf to the svn01:21
Stskeepstrunk version.01:21
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Stskeepsaccording to that page01:21
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bef0rdyea, but it's not confirmed :P I'll try to install deblet later tonight. thanks01:24
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benno2hi, I am looking for the libpq5 .deb for Diablo on . any idea where I can find it ? in ?01:26
woglindewnat to run postgres ?01:27
woglindemaybe it is in extras-devel01:27
benno2no i want only to use a postgres client01:27
benno2apt-get does not work because I have installed sliderotate und it causes a package conflict when I try  apt-get install libpq501:28
benno2this is why I try to install the .deb directly but cannot find it. can I read the exact http location in some file somewhere ?01:29
woglindethen you will have conflicts too01:29
woglindethere is no differences, you install with dpkg --force-all01:30
benno2mikkov_: thanks , trying now01:30
woglindebut nextttime you use apt you will have problems01:30
benno2woglinde: yes I know this apt-problem . its due sliderrotate (allows 90deg screen rotation) that installed a new kernel01:30
woglindenew kernel?01:31
mikkov_could you give the exact error message from apt?01:31
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benno2mikkov_:  sorry its in german but its basically due to a missing dependency. if I do apt-get install -f   it asks me if I want to uninstall lots of packages (probably becaue they depend on the kernel)01:34
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benno2woglinde: strange the dpkg cmd works without --force-all  : dpkg -i libpq5_8.3.3-0maemo1_armel.deb01:35
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woglindebenno2 will look at your pastebin now01:36
woglindebut my connection now isnt really fast01:36
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mikkov_it's not about kernel but xserver01:37
lcukquestion re: liqbase - if i allow sketches to be automatically placed in archive and limit the graffiti wall to most recent month or something is it a problem?01:38
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mikkov_benno2: I think that is better supported. seems to be down, so look from google cache01:43
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mikkov_benno2: ok, is not down ;)01:44
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benno2mikkov_: thanks for the infos. I began with the nokia 770 , have the n800 and now the n810. nokia and the open source community did really a nice job. now if only the n900 with umts came out :)01:45
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Stskeeps <- woo :P01:48
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Stskeeps(87m flash though, with all X libs and such, and two-three X serveC[C[C[C[C[C[C)rs..01:49
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lcukoh ballsack!02:21
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lcukStskeeps, you know before when i said it took 3 minutes to build02:22
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ryoohkianyone have video skype working on the n810 wimax?02:25
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ryoohkiin fact, it works without effort on my n800 and here's a video of it working on a n810
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bef0rdinvalid url ryoohki02:36
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andre___remove the c at the end and it works02:38
bef0rdI see, but that's not skype video, that's the built in chat client02:40
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* Mousey discovers a new lcars theme (okuda), decides it's time to switch back to LCARS for a while03:07
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lcuki use slashdot as my blog, can i get it linked somehow to come onto planet?03:21
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Proteouspeer is powning Grackle03:23
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* Mousey is reflexively underwhelmed03:36
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GAN800lcuk, the /. journal?03:45
GAN800If it has an rss feed.03:45
lcuki dunno lol03:46
lcukive never configured or needed one03:46
lcukbut i have posted a few things there, it seems where i am most comfortable03:46
lcukthings get lost in the forum03:47
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lcukGAN800, right, now what03:53
lcuki have rss03:53
* lcuk feels like a ninja for some reason03:54
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GAN800lcuk, submit it to planet.03:59
GAN800There's a link somewhere03:59
GAN800or poke X-Fade about it.04:00
lcukive just submitted my mail in application04:00
lcukX-Fade, wakey wakey, sent a mail to planet at maemo, ive got an rss feed to my slashdot journal ( )04:01
lcukplease add it to planet :$04:01
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johnxrm_you, hey :D04:39
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zakkmAnyone know why i get continuous Call disconnected, while trying to internet call a friend?05:05
zakkmlatest Diablo.05:05
l7has anyone else noticed that mplayer doesn't seek through ogg video properly?05:09
l7mp4 works fine though05:09
derfSeeking in Ogg in mplayer is completely broken.05:09
derfThey don't accept patches.05:09
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l7oh that's too bad.  have you noticed issues with youtube flvs too?05:11
l7they play fine, but also seek badly05:12
derfNo. I volunteer for Xiph.Org.05:12
derfI don't care about patent-encumbered formats.05:12
johnxI think the version of mplayer for the NITs might not support seeking in FLVs. I thought I heard it was fixed in the latest upstream version, but don't quote me :)05:13
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derfReally, if you told me "X is broken in mplayer", I would not doubt you, for any value of X.05:14
l7so it's j05:15
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l7ust full of bugs i take it05:15
derfFor your own sanity, I would suggest never looking at the code.05:16
johnxI have heard that before :)05:16
derfI've looked at the code. I won't make that mistake again.05:16
l7it so bad?05:16
johnxthe only problem is it's just about the best working video player on ARM :/05:17
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l7osso media works well at times, not so well at others05:19
l7i wonder which one is more energy effiient during playback though05:22
GAN800This hard drive has been dying for a year now.05:23
GAN800I should probably replace it before PATA drives under 120GB start getting expensive.05:24
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l7how can you tell it's dying?05:28
l7also why do you want such a small drive? is it for a tivo?05:29
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zakkmisnt vlc better for playback than mplayer? cpu-wise ?05:31
l7i havent seen a maemo version05:33
zakkmi saw a port on the forum05:33
zakkmlike last week05:33
l7oh cool05:34
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l7i'm still picking gradually through the exxtras repo05:35
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braddHi, does anyone develop in scratchbox using Xephyr on a remote host? Any tips on setting this up?05:55
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GAN800l7, file randomly disappear, stuff gies read-only, SMART status is "FAILING". ;)05:59
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GAN800lol, the wiki just says 'crap..'06:10
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jagernothello i am using the raw mode to read touchscreen data. can somebody tell me the mapping of x,y from raw data to 800/480 of touchscreen?10:17
GNUtonjagernot: Why you are not using XInput instead?10:29
jagernothi GNU can i get pressure info there?10:32
GNUtonjagernot: of course10:34
jagernotcool i was using xsp code on the wiki and playing with it10:36
jagernotdo you know of any example code new to X programming.10:36
GNUtonjagernot: apt-get souce XInput10:38
GNUtonI think that it's a good example application10:39
GNUtonIt's quite easy to understand.10:39
GNUtonjagernot: are you using Qt or GTK?10:39
GNUtonboth are able to get those kind of information without using so low level API10:40
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jagernotactually i started out with a console trying to do a synth..10:41
jagernotgot a tone going10:41
jagernotwith esd10:41
jagernotnow i want to control volume with pressure10:41
jagernotso i used that example on the wiki to read pressure info10:41
johnxI know maemopad+ reads pressure data10:41
GNUtonIt's quite old10:42
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jagernoti found this example here:10:42
jagernotmaybe suitable..what do u think?10:43
* Stskeeps stretches10:43
GNUtonjagernot: anyway I suggest to you to compile XInput for armel in order to understand how it works.10:44
GNUtonjagernot: you can test everything with that application and it print the value (coordinates and pressure value) on the screen10:44
jagernotis it possible to read pressure info in gtk?10:44
GNUtonjagernot: of cource10:45
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jagernothmm can you please take a look at that scribble-xinput example and let me know if that is the way10:45
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GNUtonjagernot: in that code this is the line that get the pressure data gdk_event_get_axis ((GdkEvent *)event, GDK_AXIS_PRESSURE, &pressure);10:48
jagernotyes it is and it compiles and works woo hoo10:49
GNUtonThat's great!10:49
jagernotthanks for your help10:49
jagernotback to work now!10:49
GNUtonhave a fun!10:49
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Stskeepsmorning qwerty1211:02
qwerty12hey Stskeeps11:03
Stskeepsqwerty12: <- woo :P though seems like xorg omapfb driver doesn't work on the emulator just yet, just good old Xomap11:04
Stskeeps(i know it says debian armel but that's just the hostname. it's a ubuntu base jffs2 image booting in qemu-n800)11:04
qwerty12Haha, brilliant :). How much space is it currently taking?11:05
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Stskeepsthat's with X, 67m flash11:05
Stskeepsand a lot of libraries11:05
qwerty12Very impressive :)11:05
Stskeepswe'll see.. still need to prod a hildon desktop on top11:05
Stskeepsjohnx's compiling maemo gtk which would be first step11:05
johnxyeah, taking another stab at it :)11:06
Stskeepsi guess the goal / attempt will be trying to take applications that are notoriously difficult to get working on Maemo, and show how easy it works with this one ;)11:07
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Stskeepsworking/compiling/slammed into existance11:07
johnxand taking apps that work well in maemo and *hopefully* just tweaking some packaging details to make them work here11:08
Stskeepsand ofcourse showing there's practically no difference in boot time and such11:09
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Stskeepsbut we'll see at what point we get there11:15
hahlobithelo, can i copy rootfs to memory card and boot from there?11:16
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johnxinfobot, boot-from-sd is
infobotokay, johnx11:17
johnxah, umh11:18
johnxhmm, hang on a sec11:18
hahlobitthanks this flash chipdisk seems so small11:18
johnxsomething up with the wiki or did I just pick the wrong link?11:18
Stskeepsjohnx: blank page syndrome?11:19
johnxit seems that way, but it's not too bad if you don't install every app available11:19
johnxthe page said "crap..." on it11:19
johnxI kid you not11:19
Stskeepswithout layout?11:19
Stskeepsi had blank white page syndrome earlier, which proves it's 770s running maemo.org11:20
johnxyeah, just the word "crap.."11:20
Stskeepsbut yeah, now i get the word "crap.." too11:20
johnxI used to run a wiki on an old zaurus, much more reliable than this but it was also a little smaller...11:20
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hahlobitcan i use as big sdcard i can buy? any size limit like symbian has11:21
johnxno size limit11:21
johnxanything that physically fits is fair game11:21
johnxin the mean time while the wiki gets fixed, there's a google cache here:
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Stskeepshahlobit: 770, n800 or n810?11:26
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* Stskeeps builds fifth jffs2 image..11:35
Stskeepsqemu n800 really needs a simple network card or something like on versatilepb11:36
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johnxvirtual wireless isn't working?11:37
Stskeepsthere's virtual wireless? :P11:37
johnxi dunno. I just liked the idea11:37
Stskeepsthat's kinda frightening but cool11:37
johnxI should have added a <sarcastic> at the beginning11:37
Stskeepsi actually think hrw worked on something alike that11:38
Stskeepsi mean, when he emulates menelaus and such, there is probably other wacky things :P11:40
Stskeepsah. usb ethernet11:48
* Stskeeps notes docpurge isn't that clever11:54
Stskeepsdpkg-divert acts horridly when docpurge is in place11:54
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hahlobitStskeeps: n80012:01
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Stskeepshahlobit: k12:02
Stskeepsjohnx: saw ?12:02
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Stskeepsi think that's vnc into a chroot though12:06
johnxI tried to piece it together once with chunks of ibex source compiled on hasty12:07
johnxdidn't quite get as far as him though12:07
Stskeepsdecent for a guy who claimed he never compiled something before12:08
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johnxI must be losing it these days12:09
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Stskeepsi question my own sanity at times12:10
aspiershi all, anyone know how to use maemo-pan?12:11
hahlobiti copied my mmc cards to pc before i do partitions and noticed that mmc2 was last used 1.1.1970 wonder why system wrote epoch time there..12:12
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johnxmaybe because noatime was enabled all the time12:12
aspiersI have it installed and have paired with my desktop, but nothing obvious has changed in either the connection manager or the phone control module12:12
hahlobitah ok.12:13
Stskeepsmm. my dorm gateway is getting beat heavily. 350ms latency12:15
* Stskeeps sighs and hates laggy mp3s12:15
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hahlobitsomething makes sd card busy, umount: cannot umount /media/mmc2: Device or resource busy12:23
johnxgrab a copy of lsof and try running it12:24
Stskeepsor there was another one.. fuser -m /media/mmc212:25
johnxor another one: ls -l /proc/*/fd/ | less12:25
johnxthen search in less for mmc212:25
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Stskeeps"It turns out the bug in Android I wrote about yesterday was worse than we thought. When the phone booted it started up a command shell as root and sent every keystroke you ever typed on the keyboard from then on to that shell. Thus every word you typed, in addition to going to the foreground application would be silently and invisibly interpreted as a command and executed with superuser privileges. Wow!"12:33
Stskeepsoh boy.12:33
johnxuhm wow12:34
johnxfrom where?12:34
Stskeeps as well12:34
Stskeepsbut yes, that's possibly the worst bug, -ever-12:35
qwerty12_N800F*** android if it's going in the same s***ty way as the iphone12:35
Stskeepsi would be thrilled to send rm -rf / to someone12:35
Stskeepsqwerty12_N800: atleast it seems like it starts out just as open as maemo12:35
Stskeepsjust type on your keyboard and you've jailbreaked it!12:36
qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, heh :P12:36
johnxopen software, closed devices is kind of the polar opposite to maemo12:36
hahlobitjohnx: found cover switch12:37
aspiersStskeeps: that is just HILARIOUS12:37
Stskeepsyeah, i got a good laugh out of it too :)12:38
Stskeepsbut i must admit i wonder something12:38
Stskeeps.. nm12:39
Stskeepswouldn't happen on deblet12:39
aspierswhichever developer left that in must be feeling pretty embarrassed right now12:40
aspiersalso wondering if they still have a job12:40
qwerty12_N800Here's my latest apt prefs file : :p12:40
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vincenzo88Hello all!12:44
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GNUtonciao vincenzo8812:45
GNUtonDo somebody of you know why the package builder is so slow?12:46
Stskeepsoh, -that's- what texrats name was12:47
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Stskeepsjohnx: how's maemo gtk going then? just taking ages to compile?13:10
johnxit failed and I'm actually giving stage's glib a try first, then I'll install it and try gtk again13:11
johnxstill fighting with getting ubuntu working on the n800 :/13:11
Stskeepsyou using sdk or chroot for compilation?13:11
Stskeeps(i had difficultiies with sdk for now myself)13:12
johnxnative on the zaurus13:12
johnxi googled the error but didn't pick up much. I suspected that a certain version of gtk+ might want to be compiled against a certain version of glib13:12
Stskeepsnot impossible i guess13:13
Stskeepsi guess i can work on m-r on tablet and getting it bootin13:14
Stskeepsemulator has to come later cos xserver-xorg-video-omapfb doesn't work on it13:15
Stskeepsor atleast what i managed to compile13:15
johnxwell, that's a pain13:15
johnxmaybe the plain xfbdev server would be an ok fit?13:15
johnxs/xfbdev/xorg's fbdev/13:15
infobotjohnx meant: maybe the plain xorg's fbdev server would be an ok fit?13:15
Stskeepsjohnx: didn't work in emulator, something about blanking13:16
Stskeepsxomap did work though13:16
* Stskeeps glances at the beagleboard next to him13:17
johnxyou know you want to compile native :)13:17
suihkulokkiemulator? as in qemu?13:17
Stskeepsyeah, qemu's n800 emulation13:18
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suihkulokkiwell if it doesn't work omapfb (if that works on the device), fixing qemu shouldn't be that hard13:18
Stskeeps*nod* i'll try to check that out13:19
johnxwell glib is happily compiling at least13:19
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tekojohi all13:26 just came back on-line13:26
Stskeepsafter saying "crap.." when trying to access pages? ;)13:26
johnxthe wiki is still "crap..."ed out13:26
tekojoyes, that's the squid on wiki13:27
tekojouse https, (I don't have root to restart squid)13:27
johnxgood deal13:27
johnxthanks for the update :)13:27
tekojoI know, we need to get rid of squid on wiki, but everything else taking up time, and crap is occational.13:28
tekojohopefully during december13:28
tekojojohnx: no problem, now there's about 26 hours till the next down13:29
johnxprojects underway?13:31
hahlobitis this error? home/user/bin/tar: .: implausibly old time stamp 1970-01-01 02:00:0013:32
tekojojohnx: what?13:32
johnxI mean is it a planned outage necessary for some ongoing upgrade? or what?13:33
johnxhahlobit, if the command didn't fail that means it's a warning13:33
tekojoThe ISP is moving to a new location, so every machine is unplugged and carried to a new server room13:34
tekojothey ran out of power and cooling13:35
hahlobitjohnx: ok thanx13:38
hahlobitnow when i'm booting from sdcard, can i format and mount flashdisk?13:38
johnxformat the internal flash where the OS is installed?13:40
johnxno, that's not really recommended13:40
Stskeepsunless you're as insane as me and johnx13:41
johnxI'm not that insane yet13:41
johnxand that's saying something13:41
hahlobitcould use it as swap13:41
hahlobitif possible13:41
johnxagain, not really recommended13:42
johnxit's like 256MB of space. just think of it as your emergency backup system and don't worry about it13:43
hahlobitcan i make swap from control panel like before?13:44
hahlobitor should i use mkswap /dev/something now?13:45
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johnxmkswap is probably the best bet13:46
Stskeepsjffs2 take 10.. *yawns'13:57
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Stskeeps <- heh, that's amazing14:01
johnxthe solar panel charging could probably be improved a lot with a higher efficiency voltage converter14:03
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Stskeepsjohnx: should i work on ubuntu minbase + omapfb xorg + usbnet booting on n800?14:56
Stskeepssince i can't get the non-kdrive driver working on emu14:56
johnxyeah, somehow I'm having a mental block on getting mine booting14:56
johnxoh irony of ironies :/14:56
Stskeepsusing deblet boot basics package?14:58
johnxnah, I just did it by hand...I guess I should just use boot-basis huh?14:58
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Stskeepsyeah, it helps a lot of things, especially the linuxrc part :P14:58
johnxwell, that I disabled...14:59
Stskeepsah, then you're in for a world of trouble ;)14:59
johnxI was being dumb, wasn't I?14:59
johnxyes, yes you were john :)14:59
Stskeepsbtw the 12 second boot i did initially, think that was with bash instead of dash15:01
johnxvery impressive15:01
Stskeepsbut then again.15:01
Stskeepsnot much to boot15:01
johnxw00! glib finished compiling. just waiting for it to package up the docs15:02
Stskeepswhich ironically takes the longest15:02
johnxit's been going for more than an hour now O_o15:02
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Stskeepsi'll whoop up a simple on-tablet debootstrap for this i guess15:03
johnxcan't seem to reach right now ...15:04
Stskeepsick, thanks for the notice15:04
Stskeepsi'm using the machine as a ssh tunnel for some work stuff too15:04
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Khertan_n810Hi !15:05
Khertan_n810wie geht's ?15:05
johnxsorry, that was just a mispronounced hello :)15:06
Khertan_n810so ... how do you do ?15:06
johnxI do pretty good, when I'm not waiting for glib to compile15:06
Khertan_n810waiting my wife doing scrapbooking15:08
woglindejohnx hm glib is really fast15:09
woglindewaiting for qt is another story15:09
johnxI'm compiling on a pxa270 with 64MB of RAM15:09
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woglindejohnx hahah okay15:11
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johnxand distcc won't speed up documentation generation / packaging15:12
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Khertan_n810sorry doing stupid thing resulting in kp15:14
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Khertan_n810someone have try the new homeip15:16
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Stskeepsjohnx: should work now15:17
johnxyup. already grabbed a bunch from it15:17
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Khertan_n810bunch ?15:17
johnxs/bunch/small number of things/15:18
infobotjohnx meant: yup. already grabbed a small number of things from it15:18
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aspiersI've almost got my bluetooth PAN working now, but struggling with networking15:20
Stskeepsjohnx: boot basics script would probably have to be edited to insist it's linuxrc it's booted fro15:20
Stskeepsas the env variables from linuxrc disappear15:20
aspiersmy N810 can ping the pan0 bridge on my desktop, and it's getting an IP address via DHCP15:20
aspiersbut I can't get masquerading working15:21
johnxdid you look at the really simple masq script from the ip masq howto?15:21
aspiersjohnx: I just used the Fedora system-config-firewall which gives:15:22
aspiers    2   113 MASQUERADE  all  --  *      bnep0  
aspiersin the POSTROUTING table15:22
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johnxI know nothing about fedora's firewall setup15:22
aspiersip_forward is enabled15:23
* Stskeeps ponders a small experiment15:24
aspiersif I sniff traffic on the pan0 bridge, I see arp requests from N810 for the MAC of the gateway going unanswered15:24
johnxwhat dhcp server is it getting an address from? your desktop or your router?15:25
aspiersmy desktop15:25
aspiersI configured dhcpd to listen only on pan015:25
johnxok good, just checking :)15:25
aspiersand give out addresses in a private range15:25
aspiersthat bit works fine15:25
aspiersbut like I said, the N810 can't ping the router because the router doesn't respond to its ARP requests15:25
aspiersmaybe it never sees them15:26
aspiersI added eth0 to the pan0 bridge though15:26
johnxif you're just going to bridge, then why are you using masquerading?15:26
aspiersI'm using the bridge to support multiple bnep interfaces15:26
aspiersso bnep0 is still on a private PAN network of
aspierswhereas my home network is 10.x.x.x15:27
johnxmy instinct is usually to get the basics working first, but that aside, why is eth0 on the bridge as well?15:27
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aspiersbecause said to put it on there15:28
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aspiersoh, I see what I've done wrong15:29
aspiersthe N810 has the wrong gateway!15:29
aspiersit should have the desktop as gateway15:29
aspiersnot my home router15:30
johnxwell that's a start :)15:30
lcukjohnx, thats a good instinct to have15:31
woglindemorning lcuk15:31
lcukhiya woglinde15:31
lcukdid you get your assignment in15:31
woglindeyes yes15:31
johnxlcuk, a couple years of being a sys admin will cultivate that instinct, right quick :)15:32
Khertan_n810hi lcuk15:32
lcukjohnx, 100% agree, users/customers do stuff in strange ways15:32
lcukhi there Khertan_n810 are you at home15:33
lcukheh, out on a shopping trip and hiding in internet cafe?15:33
Khertan_n810i m waiting my wife in something like a art decoration summit15:33
johnxI've heard it's also a good strategy for car repair...but that with that strategy I never ended up getting past the basics15:33
Stskeepsjohnx: insane experiment of the day.. starting hildon-desktop (ubuntu) in qemu15:33
johnxmadness :)15:34
woglindeno my fight with apache2 should be over15:34
Khertan_n810is there a way to capture screen easily15:34
lcukKhertan_n810, sneaky! is she taking part or just spectator?15:34
Khertan_n810nope spectators :)15:35
woglindeKhertan_n810 install gpe-scap15:35
lcukjohnx, i use the learn to walk principle - cover the base features first and grow from good stable components15:35
lcukdoesnt that power mon thing have screenshot capability?15:36
Khertan_n810woglinde > i mean in a programming way15:36
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Khertan_n810but looking at source will usefull :)15:36
* Stskeeps uses his mental model of computers from high level (language) to low level (assembly/microcode) :P15:36
woglindeKhertan_n810 gpe-scap is opensource you know15:36
lcukKhertan_n810, in liqbase i have EVERY screen configured to allow [FULLSCREEN] to take a screenshot15:36
johnxxwd might be the simplest example15:36
Khertan_n810xwd ?15:36
johnxyes, from any standard distro15:37
lcukStskeeps, task oriented15:37
Khertan_n810so not maemo15:37
johnxdebian package name is x11-apps15:37
lcuka friend sent me this yesterday, its outside a pub15:38
aspiersjohnx: ugh, I must still be doing something braindead15:40
qwerty12_N800Khertan_n810, there are a few ways in maemo. i use load-applet but it can be done remotely via vnc/rdesktop, via the command  line (osso-screenshot-tool) or via the framebuffer (fb_update_mode & fbgrab)15:40
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Khertan_n810via the framebuffer ...15:41
Khertan_n810should be fast ...15:42
qwerty12_N800yeah, it's how I got : :)15:42
qwerty12_N800load-applet can also grab from the framebuffer too15:42
lcukgrabbing a bitmap isn't slow, its compressing it and turning it into a png or bmp thats slow - what do you need em for from code?15:42
Khertan_n810i need raw bitmap15:43
Khertan_n810maybe some compress15:43
Khertan_n810will depends on result15:43
lcukin gtk python on a pixbuf?15:43
Khertan_n810not in python15:43
Khertan_n810will be too slo15:43
Khertan_n810slow for what i m trying to do15:44
lcukdepends, the pixbuf functions are native arent they?15:44
Khertan_n810it should15:44
lcukthen what language/library do you need them in15:44
lcukie gtk pixbuf or ximage or something15:45
aspiersjohnx: sniffing eth0 (on home network) I see -> ICMP Echo (ping) request15:45
Khertan_n810at this time there isn t any lib or anything code15:45
aspiersjohnx: but .108 doesn't reply15:45
Khertan_n810just thinking of something to export video15:45
lcukvideo? -> you mean record a screencast from your machine as a video15:46
lcukx11vnc -> vnctoswf or something15:46
Khertan_n810but not record it ... just transfert it by usb15:46
johnxaspiers, my only thought is to double check all of your masquerading setup.15:47
lcukpush raw rframes  into gstreamer and use the video stream things there15:47
Khertan_n810and do the electronique things to handle it and convert it to rgb rca15:47
Khertan_n810hum ... know how to do ?15:48
lcukfor the usb video out?15:48
Khertan_n810for the screen <-> gstreamer15:48
Khertan_n810-> video15:48
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lcukno unfortunately, i know its possible though, look around debian as a whole for examples and see if they build on maemo15:49
Khertan_n810hum ...15:49
Khertan_n810i ll look at home15:50
lcukgstreamer has sources and sinks - ive only used the sink to grab frames from the camera, but it can be reversed and anything can be a source and then use the gstreamer stuff for making it a video15:50
Khertan_n810search web with a slow connection is a real pain15:50
Khertan_n810yep i ve try some thing with cam at this time15:51
lcukread that khertan15:51
lcukgstreamer has a plugin which can capture the contents of the currently running desktop. The capture results can be passed through pipelines which can process, encode and write the results out to video files.15:51
lcuknot sure of performance level or even if its feasible on this machine, but its worth a go15:52
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Khertan_n810ERROR: pipeline could not be constructed: no element "ximagesrc".15:52
aspiersjohnx: if my masq setup was correct, the src IP in the ping request seen on eth0 should be the IP of the masquerader (desktop), not the N810, right?15:52
aspierssince the N810 is not routable from 10.10.10.x15:53
lcukKhertan_n810, you might have to install the extra gstreamer plugins, or even build some additional ones15:53
Khertan_n810build is the answer15:53
aspiersso the masquerader should rewrite the outgoing source IP and rewrite the incoming dest IP of the reply?15:53
Khertan_n810i have already install all15:53
aspierslooks like that's not happening15:53
johnxmy theory is that your packets are getting routed by your desktop, but the packets aren't being modifying and your ping target can't find a route back so it drops the requests15:53
aspiersjohnx: I agree15:54
aspiersjohnx: in fact my home router will presumably ignore the requests since they are from an unknown 192.168 network15:55
johnxdrop, ignore, whatever. :) I remember the concepts, not the terminology :P15:56
Khertan_n810hum xvimagesink exist but not the src one15:58
Khertan_n810i ll see at home15:58
Khertan_n810thx for tips lcuk15:58
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lcuknp khertan :)15:58
aspiersjohnx: I think it might be due to the fact that I gave both the bridge and pan0 192.168 IPs15:59
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woglindehi lardmann16:09
lardmanhey woglinde16:09
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lardman~lart uni wifi connection problems16:21
* infobot takes out a cattle prod and gives uni wifi connection problems a good jolt16:21
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lcukhi there lardman16:27
lardmanhi lcuk16:27
lcukare you having a lazy afternoon, or runnin around like a headless chicken?16:27
lardmanat work16:27
qwerty12_N800It's Saturday, what are you doing working!?! :)16:28
lardmangot work that needs to be done for next week16:29
johnxqwerty12_N800, you too may have to work on saturdays one day :P16:30
lcukbleugh, working weekends is tiring (i should know ive done enough of them)16:30
qwerty12_N800johnx, noooooo!!!!! :P16:30
lardmanyeah, feels like I'm doing my PhD again16:30
lcukheh johnx its worse, imagine the shock when he realises hes gotta work on weekdays as well16:31
qwerty12_N800johnx, Are you purposively trying to get me depressed? :P16:31
johnxqwerty12_N800, that's what us old people do. we just hang around and make younger people miserable. :D16:31
* lcuk should really get scrum ui builder coded up today16:31
johnxthat's the only thing you'll find fun eventually16:32
lcuknahhh johnx, theres other things to do when you get old16:32
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lcukpick at the fluff on your cardigan16:32
johnxssshh. don't tell him all the secrets16:32
lcukfeed the ducks16:32
johnx...feed young hooligans to the ducks16:33
* lcuk has an open sourcem ind16:33
* lcuk waves his walking stick menacingly at the young rebels16:33
qwerty12_N800infobot, make lcuk's brain16:33
infobotmake: *** No rule to make target `lcuk's brain'.  Stop.16:33
johnx...and cut your hair!16:33
lardmanfinally, managed to get some images off my camera, via N810 + crappy wifi connection + sftp16:33
lardmans/camera/camera phone16:34
lcukyour camera lardman? you mean the 810 one?16:34
lardmanno way, that's even worse than the one on my camera ;)16:34
johnxha... my phone has IR. I used that to get exactly one picture off of it. never. again.16:34
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* Stskeeps used to use his old nokia for data connectivity16:35
Stskeepsthat really sucked16:35
Stskeepsthen i started to appreciate bluetooth16:35
lcukthe amount of data im creating in liqbase is growing quickly, can i utilise the RAM inside my casio to store more?16:35
ShadowJK_joikuspot is king :)16:36
lardmanlcuk: yeah should be enough bytes to store M-O-R-E, don;t use unicode though16:36
lcukno hassles there16:37
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* aspiers finally got his N810 connected to a masqueraded BT PAN16:59
aspiersman that was not easy :-/17:00
johnxI think involving bridging and masq made it more difficult than it needed to be17:00
aspiersnow I can watch streaming TV shows from bed ;-)17:00
aspiersjohnx: I had to masq17:00
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aspiersI could have avoided a bridge, yes17:01
GAN800Why not wifi?17:01
aspiersGAN800: too unreliable at this distance17:01
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johnxI guess my and was ambiguous :)17:01
GAN800Buy another AP17:01
aspiersGAN800: since I have ~70 wifi networks in my neighbourhood17:01
aspiersGAN800: I already bought several17:01
GAN800Then go AP smashing17:01
aspiersGAN800: they all suck when there are that many networks around17:01
aspiers802.11 basically sucks17:02
GAN800Or hack everybody else and move them to channel 1. ;)17:02
johnxdoes bt cope better?17:02
johnxthat would be kind of interesting17:02
aspiersit's so bad that I have to use ethernet over power in my 2-bed flat17:02
aspierswireless is ok within the lounge17:02
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aspiersand that's about it17:02
aspiers(AP is in the lounge)17:03
aspiersjohnx: BT seems good so far17:03
johnxthat's strange. I wonder if they use different parts of the 2.4GHz band17:04
jaskabt is a frequency hopper, 802.11b and later are direct-spread-spectrum17:04
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johnxI assume you've already tried to find a wifi channel that no one else was using?17:05
Stskeepsmm. one thing hildon really needs to do, seperate hildon-desktop and the /etc/hildon files17:06
Stskeepsthey are like hildon themes17:06
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johnxactually most of hildon desktop seems kind of crazy to me17:06
johnxwell at least the layout and theming17:07
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Stskeepswell my biggest complaint is that hildon-desktop for ubuntu has to have u-m specific layout, while there's a perfectly sane theme system17:09
johnxmy biggest issue is resolution dependence17:09
RST38hjohnx: it is S9017:10
johnxdid S60 have issues too?17:10
RST38hYes, it is also resolution-dependent17:10
RST38hThat was the reason why they jumped from 208x176 to 416x35217:11
RST38hSee here for details on S90:
qwerty12_N800I thought it was 176x208? (on 6630/6680 etc anyway)17:11
RST38hThe funny part is that the current Hildon is no longer resolution-dependent (see how it reacts to rotation)17:12
RST38hqwerty: either way17:12
johnxwell the apps aren't, but the task panels are17:12
RST38hqwerty: My E70 is rotatable, so to me it makes no difference17:12
RST38hjohnx: easy to fix and is probably being fixed as we speak17:13
johnxyeah, I have a feeling hildon desktop's current implementation will be taking a long walk off the proverbial short pier17:13
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jaskamass driver-assisted long walk17:15
johnxthat's a nice thought :)17:16
RST38hthere is nothing wrong with the current implementation in general17:17
RST38hit does what it is supposed to do17:17
aspiersjohnx: you assumed correct, believe me I tried EVERYTHING before resorting to ethernet over power17:19
aspiersI even bought a WiSPY17:19
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johnxRST38h, doesn't do what I want = broken, end of story :D17:20
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RST38hjohnx: and what do you want it to do?17:20
johnxdo something reasonable on screens of different resolutions -or- failing that be relatively easy to modify17:21
johnxaspiers, I think the next few years will pretty interesting in terms of the unlicensed bands getting saturated17:21
GAN800Maemo is moving to resolution independence, so I'm sure that'll be improved.17:21
RST38hjohnx: reasonable on screen of different resolutions => really easy to do with the current desktop, just requires some minor fixes17:22
GAN800johnx, I'm wondering if cellular broadband is going to become cheaper and more ubiquitous first.17:22
RST38hcheaper? never17:22
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johnxGAN800, that's just a different problem :)17:22
RST38hAll those AT&T execs have to have their caviar sandwiches17:23
ShadowJK_heh, I have no other wifi networks in range, yet I find usable range to, at most, extend into neighbouring room from AP...17:23
johnxactually I should say, the same problem wearing a different shirt17:23
RST38hAnd they continue making sure that no independent WiFi providers will ever rise up17:23
johnxmaybe you guys just have neighbors with crappy cordless phones or poorly shielded microwaves17:23
pupnik810hi guys17:24
pupnik810hmf,  can i recover a wep key from os2008?17:24
pupnik810spose its crypt'd17:24
johnxwell, boingo is starting to look better in the states17:24
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RST38hjohnx: Dunno, the only access points I have seen while in the States were Sprint and TMobile17:24
RST38h[and of course unsecured residential APs =)]17:25
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johnxat&t bought out t-mobile's starbucks contract. wayport has APs in mcdonalds, and I believe a boingo subscription gets you access to both17:25
johnxor maybe I'm horribly confused17:25
derfpupnik810: Not crypted. Stored in plaintext in gconf.17:27
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RST38hyes, boingo says it supports at&t hotspots17:27
RST38hBut it is $10/mo for patchy internet access17:28
RST38hAnd after 3 months, it is $22/mo for the same patchy access17:28
RST38hI.e. more than I pay for 100Mbd wired residential access17:29
derfThat's actually fairly cheap compared to most public WiFi access.17:29
derfIt's _all_ a total ripoff.17:29
RST38hBut the prices above are still a total ripoff, given how rarely you will use it17:29
johnxit does depend on your usage patterns17:30
RST38hjohnx: It depends on how ubiqitous it is, and it is not17:30
johnxit depends on if you're at or near a starbucks everyday17:30
johnxor *gag* a mcdonalds17:30
RST38hI use GPRS on daily basis, it works everywhere (slowly) and costs me less than above quotes17:30
johnxthat's nice. are you in the country we're talking about?17:31
RST38hjohnx: I am near corporate network every day =)17:31
RST38hjohnx: No =)17:31
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johnxneither am I. you don't hear me talking about ubiquitous 3G and opera on every phone :P17:31
RST38hjohnx: Well, GPRS is also ubiquitous in the US17:31
johnxbut not for less than $20/month17:32
RST38hjohnx: And I heard 3G is there as well.17:32
RST38hjohnx: Well, back to my original point: cheap mobile internet access is not gonna happen in the US any time soon17:35
johnxyeah, compromises to be had everywhere17:36
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johnxit will still be interesting to see what the government does as the narrow bands available for wireless networking fill up17:36
RST38hauction another band or two17:37
GAN800Politics and itT just don't mix.17:39
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StskeepsGAN800: fight to the death with 770s?17:43
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RST38hjohnx: I don't think anything will fill up any time soon17:48
RST38hjohnx: you have got overpriced service, soft initial demand and an economic crisis to boot17:49
johnxit'll happen pretty quick when people take their youtube habbit on the road17:49
johnxit might not happen soon, but when it takes off I think it's going to cause some problems in the short term17:50
RST38h+ the size and characters of current licensees makes me believe they will not let anyone else use that spectrum at reasonable terms17:50
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RST38hso those bands will become an "asset" :)17:51
RST38hass-set =)17:51
johnxit'll just be interesting to see how they cope, that's all. :)17:52
RST38hjohnx: you want to know hoe they cope, you look at current broadband17:52
johnxbandwidth caps, sure17:52
infobotjohnx meant: transfer caps, sure17:52
RST38hjohnx: Bandwidth caps, filters for certain services, possible pay-per-bandwidth17:52
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lardmandamn media meta crawler thingy17:53
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lardmanIt's found qwerty's lethal bizzle17:54
johnxbut broadband ISPs can add more bandwidth on the backend relatively easily compared to trying to buy new spectrum, build out towers, sell handsets, etc17:54
lardmanI'm bleeding from the ears17:54
lardmanpupnik: some garage (?) group or something17:54
qwerty12_N800lardman, lol, you still have that? I'm starting to suspect you like it ;P17:54
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lardmanI had a few copies of it on the device, obviously left one behind! :)17:55
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RST38hjohnx: the measures will still be the same17:55
johnxbut it's gonna be a lot rougher for them I think17:56
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johnxand, well, I look forward to seeing them squirm17:56
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pupniki nwant a low-cpu, low-bandwidth connection quality indicator on the statusbar17:58
lardmanconnection strength in the icon would be good17:58
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pupnikgood lord the connection is ssslllow18:02
Stskeepsjohnx: Mem:    126796k total,    19516k used,   107280k free,        0k buffers18:03
StskeepsSwap:        0k total,        0k used,        0k free,     6892k cached18:03
Stskeepson  minimal ubuntu bootup btw18:03
Stskeepsand this is with tty1-9 open18:04
Stskeeps.. and bash, which takes up 1.7% mem :P18:05
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Stskeepsupstart/init, 1.3%, udev 0.5%, and that's it of processes running.. so the busybox argument is definately not about memory18:06
Stskeeps(there's gettys and login, but they arent relevant in our end use case)18:07
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Stskeepsjohnx: .. so looking forward to maemo-gtk,hildon packages. the ubuntu ones are a nightmare to get to work sanely in this one18:09
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johnxissues with ARM or something else?18:10
emma_goldsteinwhere can i find a telepathy-silc plugin or purple with silc for pidgin?18:10
emma_goldstein.deb preferred18:11
Stskeepsjohnx: when moving to UM they wrecked plankton theme totally18:11
johnxyay for burnt bridges!18:11
Stskeepsand the hasty version requires flash and doesn't work well when moblin-media isn't existing (so ubuntu-mobile metapackage isn't installable)18:11
Stskeepsi should ask meiz wtf he did18:12
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emma_goldsteinburning down the house - dumdidumm.. yes ;)18:12
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* qwerty12 must have the most fucked up intrepid install ever. But at least my internet is working :)18:14
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johnxactually it kept deleting my wired ethernet connection at first, but seems ok now18:14
* johnx makes mental note to throw away his useless usb-a -> mini-b cable18:15
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pupnikqwerty12, what is intrepid?18:17
lcuknew ubuntu i believe18:17
lcukintrepid ibis or something18:17
qwerty12_N800pupnik, latest ubuntu release18:17
qwerty12_N800lcuk, ibex :P18:17
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pupnikis the wlan scan in connection manager passive?18:18
lcukStskeeps, :) you are emerging from the dark - i am loving seeing the progress you are making18:18
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johnxStskeeps, impressive, that looks more mangled than beta2 :)18:19
RST38hSts: Is it gonna be better than plain sb2? =)18:19
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qwerty12w00t! ndiswrapper working with 2.6.27-7-generic kernel :). Just had to stick with hardy's networkmanager and compile ndiswrapper trunk. "*** WARNING: This kernel lacks wireless extensions. Wireless drivers will not work properly." - that alarms me but so far it's working and if not, I can just boot from hardy's kernel :)18:22
StskeepsRST38h: well we're trying to build a new maemo too at the same time18:22
qwerty12hi woglinde18:23
Stskeepsand this is just craptacular18:23
woglindeqwerty12 buy a better wlan card18:23
qwerty12woglinde, I'm too cheap to do that :P18:23
* w00t really regrets his nick sometimes..18:23
woglindeqwerty12 sell your old card18:24
Stskeepsokay.. more from my dorm network admin experiences: guy emailing about that his torrents are now going at 220kb/s, and in the past it was much higher! and everyone at my dorm has the same problem!18:24
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qwerty12woglinde, I'd get £5 for it :P18:24
Stskeeps.. because the bloody line specs are 2mbit/1mbit per user.18:24
emma_goldsteinintrepid is burning beta, network manager is evil now and all bluetooth-services are fucked up18:24
qwerty12emma_goldstein, I *hate* the new network manager. I ended up reformatting hardy last time when I tried network manager svn in it... This time, I did an upgrade while holding back gnome-system-tools & network manager18:25
emma_goldsteindon't even try 64bit - maemo crosscompile won't work :-X18:26
lardmaneven with 32bit libs?18:26
woglindeqwerty12 really try if/updown with guessnet ifplug and wpa_supplicant18:27
woglindeyour life will be easier18:27
emma_goldsteinqwerty12: network-manager is for laptop-babies, crippling down  used behaviour - no network-aliases and dbus-renewed announce of networks - so coming home after work is realizint network-manager has cut all connections 15 minutes after i left18:28
qwerty12woglinde, all I have to do is remove and reinsert my wifi dongle and ndiswrapper module automatically gets inserted :)18:28
Stskeepsthere are times when i deal with NM, that i absolutely love nokia's stuff18:28
Stskeepseven though it is broken in some places.18:28
woglindeqwerty12 that has nothing to do with network manager18:28
woglindethats udev magic18:28
woglindeqwerty12 networkmanager can't do what guessnet can to18:29
qwerty12emma_goldstein, yeah... Stupid network-manager in intrepid cuts off my connections after a while...18:29
pupniklike 2 minutes lag here18:29
pupnikchat coming through in 20-line chunks18:29
emma_goldsteinturn it off and forget it for a while - maybe it will grow up the next five years18:29
qwerty12woglinde, I don't think it's udev... I ran ndiswrapper -m, ndiswrapper -ma, ndiswrapper -mi last time which adds config to /etc/modprobe.d18:29
qwerty12woglinde, atm, I'm glad it's working like this, I don't want to add another factor :)18:30
woglindeqwerty12 yeah but how should modprobe work when udev isnt notice18:30
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emma_goldsteinno, it's definitely not udev18:30
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woglindeI said udev is for inserting the ndis modules18:30
woglindeI didnt say udev cuts your network connection18:30
emma_goldsteinnetwork-manager ties 1 (!) IP to 1 hardware-interface, everything else is forbidden18:30
Stskeepsi think this comic strip defines me.18:32
emma_goldsteinanyone knows anything about silc on maemo?18:32
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johnxdoes that make you Calvin or Hobbes?18:34
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Stskeepsthink calvin18:34
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Stskeepsbut a bit of personality split, both18:34
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emma_goldsteineven where i can get a compiled version of this svn-tree?18:36
jagernothello i have a synth test ...its the very beginning but if anyone would like to run it and play with it18:36
jagernotwill be happy to post a link18:36
emma_goldsteinpost it18:37
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Stskeepsjohnx: still building?18:37
qwerty12_N800emma_goldstein, I'd offer but formatting ubuntu means i'm scratchbox less :(. if noone else offers, i'll see if i can compile it when i reinstall sbox18:37
johnxStskeeps, yes O_o18:37
Stskeepsjohnx: btw when we compile hildon i presume we will enable maemo gtk extensions?18:37
Stskeepsjohnx: doc part took about half a night for me18:38
johnxhalf a night! O_o18:38
Stskeeps.. on qemu18:38
johnxif you have a faster way to do this, and this is blocking you, then go ahead if you want18:38
emma_goldsteini'm just downloading the maemo-sdk-vmware18:38
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emma_goldsteinintrepid and scratchbox2 is well prepared for maemo-sdk, but not fot 64bit18:39
jagernotsynth test: left of the screen low pitch, right high volume control yet ..hoping to make it pressure sensitive; link:
jagernotits called 'h' easy to type from xterm.18:39
jagernotuse stylus or fingers18:40
pupnikjagernot cool!18:40
Stskeepsjohnx: i'm not sure i do O_o18:40
Stskeepsexcept getting the beagle up and running..18:40
Stskeepsthink i'll do that past dinner18:41
jagernotpupnik: it runs?18:41
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emma_goldsteinjagenot: "syntax error"18:42
johnxI'm just hoping glib finishes before I go to sleep so I can start gtk and leave it all night18:42
qwerty12_N800jagernot, runs here, it's good, but effin loud! :D18:42
jagernotyeah u may want to reduce ur volume :)18:43
jagernotits all integers so i had kept the short int to max ie 32767 so yeah loud!18:43
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emma_goldsteinh: 1: Syntax error: word unexpected (expecting *)*)18:45
Stskeepschmod +x? :P18:45
Stskeepson tablet18:45
qwerty12_N800emma_goldstein, are you running it on  tablet?18:45
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pupnikyes jagernot18:47
pupnikok too tired     gtg   cheers!18:47
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gnutonZZHey guys, does the builder server work?18:48
jagernotare you guys able to make music with it :)18:48
* aantn notices the topic about gold on friday and can't help but think about fight club18:48
Stskeeps3192B/s.. jesus, mojo is slower than maemo.org18:48
gnutonZZI upladed a package at 11 o'clock. and there are no results yet18:49
emma_goldsteinjagernot: what dependencies do i need?18:52
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lcukgnutonZZ, its not finished yet, something is up18:52
lcuklook atr your results thing and then look at mine18:52
johnxqwerty12_N800, something about that kernel you gave me is ... very strange18:52
jagernotemma_goldstein: not sure...i use the n810 as i bought it18:52
qwerty12_N800johnx, hmm?18:52
jagernotemma: chinook 4.0.x sdk18:53
emma_goldsteinjaggernot: did you update?18:53
johnxit has some compatibility issues with modules compiled for the normal diablo kernel...or something18:53
emma_goldsteini'm running fresh diablo here - with auto-upgrade - welcome to the nokia-update-crashworld18:54
qwerty12_N800johnx, it shouldn't do. all the modules i compile against the standard kernel insmod in mine. plus, nokia's modules from initfs insmod fine18:54
johnxstuff insmods fine, but I was getting some really weird usb and wlan issues while using it18:55
emma_goldsteinchmod +x = permission denied18:55
johnxflashing back to diablo's kernel seems to have solved it18:55
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qwerty12_N800hrm, sorry to hear that. i'll check it because i know wlan works fine for me. with usb, maybe some patch is conflicting18:56
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johnxit's the cx3110x.ko that stskeeps built that seems to have problems18:57
johnxanyways, I'm not complaining. :) I just wanted to give you a heads up in case you run into weird problems18:57
emma_goldsteinme too :-D18:57
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hahlobitwhen i boot sdcard version, i got permission problems and example any bookmarks doesn't work i see my bookmarks but browser goes homepage?19:04
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Stskeepsjohnx: think i'll target having a beagleboard buildbox for now, can't get SB2 to act sanely enough for my taste19:08
johnxdarn :(19:08
Stskeepsor i need to extend the rootstrap with a hell lot of packages19:08
johnxI had the same experience months back, but I figured it must be a lot better by now19:08
Stskeepsit is, but hmm19:09
Stskeepsi don't get why it tries to rm /tmp/.X11-unix for instance, from the root system19:09
Stskeepswhen in emulated mode19:09
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johnxthat's not kosher19:09
Stskeepswell i wasn't running as root, so19:09
Stskeepsi think there would be need for a sb2 expert to look at that point instead really19:09
emma_goldsteinsure, they emerged devil directly from /dev/null19:10
qwerty12heh, permissions on my /tmp got fcuked once, a pita to sort out...19:10
johnxthe guys on #scratchbox (?) were pretty helpful last time I talked to them19:10
* Stskeeps ponders idly19:10
neilliehi anybody here who knows how to have root permissions through popen without using sudo?19:11
Stskeepsthink i'll spend some time next week with beagleboard buildboxes that distcc to a crosscompiler19:11
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Stskeepsneillie: setuid? but maybe receipe for disaser..19:11
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neillietried them all setuid, setreuid. did not work19:11
Stskeepssetuid on the target? :P19:12
neillietargets are insmod and rmmod19:12
qwerty12neillie, also, are you calling setuid(0); from your application?19:12
Stskeepsneillie: why not use sudo though?19:12
neillie(am trying to extend usb-otg-plugin to load and remove modules)19:12
Stskeepsand add to sudoers.d with a NOPASSWD19:12
neillieI want to have the plugin work without having sudo installed19:13
Stskeepssudo is always installed in maemo though19:13
neillieand always setup correctly?19:13
neilliethen I am done19:13
Stskeepsthe system breaks down horridly without sudo19:13
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neilliethat is a big relieve. thanks19:13
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Stskeepsjohnx: found a qemu-arm chroot patch, this will be interesting..19:21
Stskeepslogic dictates binary emulation should be faster than system emulation19:21
Stskeepsas it translates to the kernel19:21
Stskeepsand if qemu arm binary emulation is more sane now..19:21
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Stskeepscombining that with distcc..19:22
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hahlobitseems that inner sdcard is read-only how can  i fix it correctly? chmod ?19:23
johnxyou should probably fsck it or select repair from file manager19:24
johnxfile systems usually get remounted read-only because of errors19:25
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johnxinfobot, rotation is
johnxtry it again19:36
disco_stunot that page19:36
disco_stui'm looking for one that GeneralAntilles pointed out19:36
disco_stuthat one19:37
johnxinfobot, no rotation is
infobotokay, johnx19:37
johnxyou're right, that one looks better19:38
hahlobitdid fsck still read only, broken card?19:39
johnxrun "dmesg" and see if there's anything interesting in it19:40
* qwerty12 sticks with 2.6.24-21-generic until the tossers at ubuntu can put out an decent intrepid kernel19:40
GAN800johnx, probably leave it on the wiki19:41
GAN800The .install doesn't actually work.19:41
johnxah, really?19:42
johnxthat's unfortunate19:42
johnxinfobot, rotation is
GAN800Application manager wont let you replace system packages from a 3rd party repo.19:42
johnxinfobot, no rotation is
infobotjohnx: okay19:42
qwerty12GAN800, Hopefully, the sooner the better that a new h-a-m is shipped via SSU. Because with 2.1.20, that install does work :/19:42
GAN800osv-c is still the best short-term bet.19:42
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GAN800qwerty12, really? huh19:43
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qwerty12GAN800, Yep, tried it, it got treated like a proper ssu update19:43
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qwerty12Kernel was flashed automatically and everything19:43
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ProteousMmmmm, ham19:49
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johnxglib finished!19:54
johnxit's armv5el though19:54
Stskeepsthat's fine19:54
johnxI'll see if this allows gtk to build19:54
qwerty12johnx, you really should hack debian/rules next time to not build docs :P19:54
johnxqwerty12, next build I'll sleep through :)19:55
qwerty12hehe :)19:55
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Stskeepsjohnx: scp packages somewhere?19:58
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johnxah...I don't actually have any host right now :/19:59
johnxI can put them on rapid share, or send them directly somewhere19:59
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Stskeepsthink you have a scp account on trac.. sec19:59
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johnxglib even built without any hacks to rules or control. I'm quite impressed20:01
Stskeepsmm, there's a small quirk to gtk as far as i can recall, it doesn't like debian packages make the libgtk2.0.0-bin package or something20:03
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Stskeepsor provides or whatever20:03
johnxdoes it just need a quick tweak to the provides so that libgtk2.0-0 provides libgtk2.0-0-bin?20:04
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Stskeepsyeah, that's possible20:05
johnxwell is there some case in which we want lib but not bin?20:05
disco_stuis with me the problem, infobot ?20:07
disco_stui gues i dont have clearance..20:07
Stskeepsjohnx: test if there's a libgtk2.0-bin mentioned i guess, but yeah, provides would be it20:09
Stskeepsi think some gtk packages in debian depend on it20:09
Stskeeps(.. or something)b20:09
Stskeepsbrb cooking20:10
johnxthere is :)20:10
johnxlooks like they cleaned up their packages a lot20:10
koosanyone knows who put librsvg in diablo/extras-devel? (it's in there since 27/06)20:10
GAN800koos, check the maintainer field?20:11
GAN800Or did they not change it!20:12
infobotGAN800 meant: Or did they not change it?20:12
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koosGAN800:how? (the -dev package doesn't contain a changelog file)20:13
GAN800apt-cache show librsvg2-220:13
qwerty12koos, Terje Bergstrom <> is the maintainer20:13
GAN800For Tear?20:13
qwerty12shit, should have removed the @20:13
koosthanks, I'll send him a mail20:14
GAN800You did it on purpose you evil person. :P20:14
qwerty12Yes, I am in a spamming ring :P. You can find me chilling out in Nigeria sometimes :P :D20:14
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qwerty12Time to see if the xchat hildonisation patches will apply to 2.8.6...20:15
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pupnik810idea: irssi built for extras...20:21
qwerty12pupnik810, easily done, just I dunno if it would segfault...20:22
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Stskeepscos of the non-standard perl? :P20:22
pupnik810xchat begins to annoy... not remembering network config (channel autojoin)20:22
derfBut everyone who uses irssi also uses screen.20:23
disco_stupupnik810: it bothers me the same20:23
pupnik810come back, qwerty12!20:23
derfAnd thus there's no real reason to run it on the device.20:23
disco_stui use pidgin now20:23
Stskeepsderf: yeah, except it's more responsive locally than over gprs ssh..20:23
qwerty12_N800pupnik810, hmm? xchat remembers my settings here? is ~/.xchat2 owned by user?20:23
Stskeepsand on a n800 word prediction isn't a bad thing..20:23
qwerty12_N800pupnik810, qwerty12 v2 :)20:23
pupnik810i check20:23
derfWord prediction doesn't work in ssh?20:24
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Stskeepsin osso-xterm atleast not20:24
GAN800xchat remembers stuff fine here.20:25
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, one liner change to make word prediction work in osso-xterm but it was a bleeding nightmare...20:25
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pupnik810qwerty12_N800, yeah it is... comma seperated, the chanlist?20:25
johnxha! finally have my n800 booting and behaving20:25
qwerty12_N800pupnik810, i only keep one chan there (guess which... :))20:26
pupnik810i need to spend less time in irc anyway20:29
pupnik810but it is more fun chatting with you than the barmaid20:29
johnxand drinking at home is cheaper anyways :D20:29
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pupnik810<- picked up a Thinkpad T42p for the next round of scratchbox hacking20:30
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* Stskeeps needs to know some sb2 experts20:30
disco_stusomeone saw hoy cool looks pidgin with the screen rotated ?20:30
infobotdisco_stu meant: someone saw how cool looks pidgin with the screen rotated ?20:31
pupnik810no kidding  - 9 euro in coffee tonight20:31
pupnik810love thinkpads.... cept the price20:31
pupnik810not i disco_stu20:32
* RST38h yawns widely20:33
RST38hSts: So, I am still not getting it: how is your stuff different from the plain sb2?20:33
StskeepsRST38h: it's not20:34
StskeepsRST38h: i'm taking a non maemo sdk+ rootstrap, a rootstrap from ubuntu/mojo instead and trying to make it work sanely20:34
disco_stumedia player;
StskeepsRST38h: the emu stuff earlier is simply building a system and having a reference emulator/device to scp things to and run on20:35
crashanddiedisco_stu, the media player looks wrong, pidgin does look slick, agreed20:35
disco_stui like the media player that way..20:35
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disco_stupkg manager:
StskeepsRST38h: and sb2 is a bit annoying when it comes to dealing with stuff like apt-get for some reason (sb2 -e apt-get bunchofdevpackages), cos of the packages doing things like rm /tmp/.X11-unix or deleting outside-rootstrap stuff..20:36
RST38hSts: yes, ti just does not work there20:36
Stskeepsokay, :P20:36
Stskeepsdisco_stu: pidgin looks neat, yea20:37
StskeepsRST38h: okay - and that's a bit of a blocker.. also i had weird issues with autoconf and such20:37
Stskeepsbut that might just be because i don't know enough about sb220:38
pupnik810good lord, 5 minute lag20:38
johnxis it on your side or freenode's side, pupnik810 ?20:39
lcukjohnx, if hes got 5 minute lag we can call him names and manage to run far enough awa y before he notices ;)20:39
pupnik810freenode it seems - pings elsewhere 80ms20:40
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qwerty12_N800liqbase sucks balls!20:41
qwerty12_N800oh shit, it's pupnik with the lag20:41
Stskeepsjohnx: i think i'll start on some of the long hanging fruit, like debootstrap + udev + hal etc20:41
Stskeepsget the base system running20:41
Stskeepsas in the proposal20:42
lcukqwerty12_N800, that module hasnt been written yet :P20:42
johnxok, then I'll try and get more stuff built from trunk and see where things blow up20:42
zakkmliqbase is awesome :)20:42
johnxI think gtk+ will build this time20:42
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lcukheh zakkm flattery will get you far20:42
johnxbut I'll go to sleep for now and let it do its thing20:43
qwerty12_N800lcuk, :P. i'll check if infobot has that problem20:43
qwerty12_N800infobot, suck balls20:43
* infobot sucks balls's lips20:43
zakkmno it is, only thing i dont like about it is no pdf reading so i have to convert to txt20:43
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lcukwell if you happen to know where there is a basic pdf library ill be happy to get something in - i have the format docs and a parser in visual basic  for older type pdfs, but have no time myself to put stuff like that in20:44
t_s_ohmm, whos the crazy german in a eeepc gathering with a N800 and a apple keyboard?20:45
zakkmno i don't. Its just i use my nokia for pdf reading and i just love the black background white text of liqbase :P20:45
* lcuk has an apple keyboard and a maemo laptop mode and im in #eeepc20:45
t_s_ofigures :P20:46
zakkmhow much was the apple keyboard?20:46
lcuklol tso20:46
Stskeepslcuk: or look into a pdf->text converter? :P20:46
lcuki dunno, ask my missus she bought it for me20:46
lcukStskeeps, problem there isnt so much pdf-> text its the image pdfs people seem to abuse20:47
t_s_oi was just watching the video chippy posted here:
zakkmStskeeps: pdf to text converter app on liqbase?20:47
zakkmmine just has text, the pdfs i use20:47
zakkmbook pdf's .20:47
lcukdirect flat pdf documents are technically simple, i might start the ball rolling and put the basic parser in - it might give someone enough to build up from20:48
lcukbut i dont want to get bogged down by liqbase becoming known as just a book reader20:48
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* lcuk uses it to read his books often tho20:48
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zakkmso add pdf and dont tell anyone but us :D20:49
lcuklol zakkm, thats the same with lots of things20:50
t_s_owhats why trying to build this swiss army knife programs?20:50
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lcuktheres a lot of code inside liqbase for use later on20:50
t_s_oerr, with20:50
lcukt_s_o, i think about interfaces a lot and have hundreds of different programs around which are geared towards my thinking about how to use a touch device20:51
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lcukt_s_o, are you in windows20:52
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zakkmanyone know a theme "link" for NITs??20:52
t_s_ofor the moment, yes. gaming addiction :P20:52
lcukheh - this is the sort of thing ive built in the past:
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GAN800Consoles are useful for breaking the Windows gaming cycle. :P20:56
NaviWhat morons play PC games?20:56
pupnik810what game(s) t_s_o20:57
GAN800Don't lie, Navi.20:58
GAN800I was there. I SAW you. :P20:58
NaviYou call that playing?20:58
NaviI call that moving my mouse back and forth, clicking every so often.20:58
GAN800Tell yourself whatever lies you need to to get by. :P20:59
t_s_opupnik810: mmo's mostly, altho i had a fallout 3 binge the other day...20:59
pupnik810btw i am confident the powervr sgx can render scorched3d acceptably20:59
pupnik810ick... megalagagain20:59
NaviGAN800: they are truths.20:59
GAN800I'm waiting for ioq320:59
GAN800Tabler deathmatches should be fun.21:00
infobotGAN800 meant: Tablet deathmatches should be fun.21:00
t_s_oheh, kinda like that networked driving game for C64? ;)21:00
Navibuilds on top of the quake3 source21:01
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* qwerty12_N800 would also like to see openut21:01
zakkmIs there 3d acceleration on the nokia?21:01
zakkmhardware. N80021:01
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zakkmlike on the gpu itself21:02
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crashanddiezakkm, the hardware is there, no support for it though21:05
zakkmso its just a matter of time for someone to make a driver?21:05
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pupnik810hehe dont hold yer breath for that21:07
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l7heh, tablet deathmatch21:07
zakkmbut it just sounds like it would help so much21:07
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GAN800Eh, not without a lot of work on the drivers21:09
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t_s_onot a desktop gpu, less developers, less chance of someone having the knowledge and time to make a driver...21:11
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qwerty12_N800heh, the old dreamcast in the attic has the sane gpu :p21:12
qwerty12_N800*same rather21:12
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zakkmthe exact same?21:13
zakkmor you talking how powerful21:13
qwerty12_N800the same, powervr. dunno about *exact* but the n800 + dreamcast both have a powervr21:14
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pupnik810pfsh.  leave something for the next tablet21:16
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qwerty12_N800the best work done on it was by pH5 who was at least able to turn it on but it wasn't functional21:17
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pupnik810eh i dont think the dreamcast had shaders21:19
derfI didn't think this one did, either.21:20
NaviPowerVRs didn't get shaders 'til the series 5 cips21:21
qwerty12_N800no idea... it's been a looong time since i used mine. my dvd burner can't burn to cd-r well enough as my old computer so the dc wont read my burnt games21:21
lcukstop burning them then and just write normal cdrs :P21:21
qwerty12_N800unfortunately I didn't salvage the old cd-r burner or i'd have connected it to my new comp :p21:22
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lcukthe powervr chip on the dreamcast is a standalone gpu and had its roots in the desktop standard agp card (this is also what the old linux driver is for).  afterwards the powervr library was burned into the omap chips, but theres no knowledge of whether its the same or not21:23
lcuk(*public knowledge)21:23
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Stskeepslcuk: you went to linuxtag yet or?21:25
lcuki was there earlier this year21:25
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, s/linuxtag/leenuckstag/ :p21:26
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Stskeeps'lo Meizirkki21:31
StskeepsMeizirkki: basically we're trying based on the proposal on to make a proof of concept on how a future maemo OS could look, - Nokia seems interested in it, and if it doesn't end up being a future maemo, it will be a good alternative mobile platform21:33
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Stskeepswhere we right now are working on bootable images based on a minimal ubuntu, targeting n800 emulation in qemu, putting fremantle hildon and such on top, - but also making it possible to easily have both xfce/lxde/ubuntu mobile/etc on same device21:34
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Meizirkkiif someone builds armv6 kernel, i will surely start playing with qemu21:35
Stskeepsyou have seen that qemu emulation exists in latest qemu?21:35
Stskeepsn800 emulation21:35
lcukqemu vanishes up its own backside ;)21:35
Stskeepsqemu inside qemu can exist :P21:36
Meizirkkiok :)21:36
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Stskeepsso what you've done is getting UM going inside a chroot or?21:37
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Meizirkkiwell, ubuntu mobile starts and at least the top panel works21:37
Stskeepsyeah.. in their latest packages from u-m they switched to a python thing instead of flash21:38
MeizirkkiWill that work better?21:38
Meizirkkior wokr anyway21:38
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Stskeepswell, flash on gecko vs python on gtk.. i think python on gtk wins21:39
Meizirkkiok, I tried some maemo apps on UM interface, everything seems to work quite well21:40
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Stskeepsby re-targeting their DISPLAY or?21:40
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Stskeepsor like qole's stuff21:40
Meizirkkii closed maemos hildon, and started ubuntus one21:40
Meizirkkibut i had to keep terminal open all the time, because there is no menu to select apps21:41
Stskeepsyou said you had screenshots from that?21:41
Meizirkkiit works also in xephyr21:41
MeizirkkiNo screenshots, but ybad quality photos21:42
Meizirkkithose screenshots are when running in xephyr21:43
Stskeepsvery impressive though21:43
Meizirkkibut even if i set export to display :1 microb starts inside maemo21:43
Meizirkkithats why i had to close maemos UI21:43
Stskeeps <- neat21:43
Stskeepsyeah there's a browserd or something21:44
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Stskeeps looks quite neat21:45
Meizirkkijust playing..21:45
Meizirkkiat least i got something to launch apps21:45
Stskeepswell that's what is good, i'm doing the same with deblet and this thing21:45
Stskeepsand if it actually ends up changing something, then there's a bonus to it21:45
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MeizirkkiWhere are the python+gtk UI pckages?21:46
Stskeepsthink they're in launchpad, sec21:47
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Stskeepsor look for the hildon-desktop in intrepid (, think they're there21:48
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Meizirkkii'll install UM to my ubuntu box.21:49
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Meizirkkii installed tablet-hw-n8x0-nonfree from deblet repos, and installed deblet flashplayer, flash interface still does not work21:50
Meizirkki*reasing that maemo page*21:51
Stskeepsyeah, did you run the nonfree script too? ;)21:51
Meizirkkiscript? /usr/libexec/something/make-repo? if so: yes21:52
Stskeepsk - and is adobe-flashplayer there?21:53
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MeizirkkiBTW it downloaded adobe flashplayer and i installed it21:53
Stskeepsu-m did that?21:53
Meizirkkijust --force-architecture21:53
Stskeepsof both deblet flashplayer (which is a wrapper) and adobe-flashplayer?21:54
Meizirkkithen i made symbolic link from /usr/lib/ to /root/.mozilla/plugins/21:54
Meizirkkias the UM page said21:54
Meizirkkii installed deblet flashplayer too21:55
Meizirkkiit was tricky, and firefox still refuses to show flash pages :(21:56
Stskeepsyeah, well, deblet flashplayer is the .so you need to ln -s to plugins21:56
Stskeepsit won't load normally else21:56
Stskeepsit needs maemo GTK things so21:56
Meizirkkithats jus what i did21:56
Stskeepswell i didn't test it under u-m so21:57
Stskeepsjust in epiphany and such21:57
Meizirkki*trying some tricks with it*21:58
Stskeepscheck if it's in about:plugins atleast21:58
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MeizirkkiLoadPlugin: failed to initialize shared library [ cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory]22:04
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MeizirkkiLoadPlugin: failed to initialize shared library /usr/lib/firefox-addons/plugins/ [ cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory]22:04
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Stskeepsand libflashplayer is the
Stskeepsor whatever the name was again22:05
Meizirkkii have in /usr/lib/22:06
Meizirkkii made symbolic link to /usr/lib/firefox-addons/plugins/22:06
Meizirkkinow it does not show error22:07
Meizirkkibut flash still does not work :(22:07
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Stskeepsokay, where is the
Stskeepsshould be in usr/lib/browser/plugins22:10
Meizirkkii don't know22:10
Stskeepstake that and ln it into plugins instead of libflashplayer (libflashplayer should not be in plugins/22:10
Meizirkkithe file is called libflashplayer.so22:11
Meizirkkino deblet anywhere22:11
Stskeepswell then you didn't install debletflashplayer package :P22:11
Stskeepsdeblet-flashplayer, that is22:12
Meizirkkii did install deblet-flashplayes22:13
Stskeepsthen there should be a in /usr/lib/browser/plugins :P dpkg -L deblet-flashplayer?22:14
Stskeepsin any case, this is a hack and it's wonderful if it works and if it doesn't it doesn't :P22:14
Stskeepsit adds stubs of maemo gtk api extensions so22:14
Meizirkki[root@Debian: /usr/lib/browser/plugins]dpkg -L deblet-flashplayer22:14
Meizirkkii cant paste it here :(22:15
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Stskeepsjust copy-paste it on :)22:17
Stskeepsand give the url here it answers with when answered22:17
Stskeepsif you aren't reading this off a screen..22:18
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Meizirkkithere you go22:19
Meizirkkiwhat? :)22:20
Stskeepsmy fault22:20
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lcukbb whenever22:25
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Stskeepsget that and put it in /usr/lib/browser/plugins22:27
Meizirkkiok, thanks!22:28
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Meizirkkistill wont work :(22:33
Stskeepswhat errors?22:34
Stskeepslibcurl and libxt?22:34
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Meizirkkino errors this time, it does not show on plugins22:35
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Meizirkki --  why you should move hardy to hasty in scripts, since mojos debootstrap .deb gives all needed scripts?22:36
Stskeepsit doesn't support minbase22:36
Stskeepswhich is silly actually, cos minbase actually does run :P22:37
Meizirkkiwhat is minbase?22:37
Stskeepsminbase is a very minimal subset of ubuntu22:37
Meizirkkiis it needed for booting system22:37
Stskeepsok - when you debootstrap you normally get the whole ubuntu base system, minbase is a variant of this22:38
Stskeepswhere it is "just enough" to get the system running22:39
Stskeepsour system has to be able to fit in 250m flash, so22:39
Stskeepswhich a user can then clone or whatever to larger space22:39
Stskeepsit may sound small but actually a lot can fit in there22:39
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Stskeeps is the packages in minbase (+ apt-utils and wget i think)22:39
Stskeepsand some scripts to boot it22:39
Stskeepsbooted in 12 seconds on my n80022:40
Stskeepscounting from when it started to mount (ext3)22:40
Stskeepsand would probably be quicker if it wasn't framebuffer console22:41
Stskeepsbut anyway, does this sound interesting to experiment with?22:41
Meizirkkii love to try out diffrent things on my n810 :)22:42
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Meizirkkihow can i install minimum rootfs, do i need to mess with the debootstrap scripts22:47
Stskeepsi basically just took hardy script and copied it to hasty, didn't edit it, debootstrap --arch=arm --variant=minbase hasty /target
Stskeeps(i debootstrap on my tablet, so)22:49
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guysoft42hey , i am getting a nokia n810 soon, is there a good page you recommend to get started with advanced things? (i am a linux developer, but i would like to tap in to advanced user stuff)22:53
Stskeepsguysoft42: sitting in here is a good way to be dragged into dark alleys of the tablet22:54
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guysoft42Stskeeps, i can see. i hope to start bugging with questions once i get it..22:54
Stskeepsjust ask lcuk, :P22:54
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guysoft42Stskeeps, is there a community news site? i am trying to find an rss feed to replace 1src22:54
Stskeepsguysoft42: is for better or worse the forums, and there's planet maemo on maemo.org22:55
GAN800itT isn't the hacker's paradise it used to be22:57 is the community news agreggator22:57
GAN800Subscribe to maemo-developers and, maybe, maemo-community (if community stuff interests you).22:58
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Stskeepsis it just me or is there an insane amount of finnish tablet developers? :P22:59
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qwerty12_N800Stskeeps, go on, get more Danish devs to develop for the tablet :p23:01
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Stskeepsthink i only know two.. sec23:02
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Stskeepsthis one might be interesting to some of you: (see the video)23:03
Stskeepsquite interesting research project done at my uni23:03
Stskeeps(the really interesting part is in the end)23:05
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Meizirkkican you give me the address again Stskeeps?23:06
Meizirkkii just booted to flash23:07
Stskeepsfor which again?23:07
Meizirkkilink to the maemo page23:07
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Meizirkkii think armv6el-vfp release is best choise, since n8x0 cpu is arm v6?23:13
lcukStskeeps, OI! i don't go down dark alleyways with my tablet23:13
LiraNunaanyone here got their hands on an N810 WiMAX yet?23:15
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lcukyeah i held one in may i think23:15
lcukdidnt get to keep it though23:15
LiraNunaI meant was able to buy one23:15
StskeepsMeizirkki: yeah, well, i took armv5 for now as armv6 wasn't properly done yet23:15
Stskeepsand if we can show nice properties for 770s too .. ;)23:16
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Stskeepsbut that only has 128mb flash so that's more tight than a camel's ass23:16
Meizirkkioh, my internet is awfully slow!!! :(23:17
Meizirkkidl speed is max 60kb/s23:17
Meizirkkii am living in the middle of nowhere...23:18
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lcukMeizirkki, i can sell you blocks of my fast internet if you want23:19
lcukif you pay me, ill download them to my computer really quickly for you23:20
Stskeepslcuk: saw the video i linked to?23:20
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Stskeepsthe interesting part comes in the last 2/3rd23:21
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lcukStskeeps, ouch at the need to offload processing for such simple things23:23
lcukvery good principle for larger details23:23
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lcukbut simple image processing like this has never been really slow - i remember using my amiga in realtimish23:24
lcukextremely nice app though23:24
Stskeepsye, design is quite good23:24
Stskeepsdesigned in python afaik :P23:24
lcukheh - that explains it23:25
lcukwhy optimize code wheni can just throw another computer at it ;)23:25
lcuki do realtime alphablending, its not so far off from convulsions and stuff already ;)23:25
lcuksurely as the images get bigger the network time will deteriorate as well23:26
Stskeepswell it's a interesting thought, why shouldn't my tablet be as powerful as the environment it is in23:26
Stskeepsyeah - but there's also interesting things involved with file surrogates and such23:26
lcukyes, network grid processing is a very powerful concept23:27
lcukdistcc is one example close to home23:27
lcukoptimum grid processing comes with low data transfer overheads and high cpu cost23:28
lcukie, send fractal formula + coord range and get the big rig to calculate a whole tile of results23:28
* lcuk should really do mandelbrot on tablet - its a really good system to test pan and zoom23:29
lcuki keep thinking i need it23:29
lcukinfact, i will now23:29
woglindeplease not with vb23:30
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lcukwoglinde, i havent used vb since I refound my first love (c), it will be in native c and should use kinetics and hopefully be as fluid as usual23:34
* Stskeeps continues pimping his minimal ubuntu.23:35
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lcukStskeeps, go go go, pimp all you like, minimalistic is logical for this platform23:40
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* Stskeeps waits for the judgement of mkfs.jffs223:47
Meizirkkiwohoo! finally installed23:50
Meizirkkiwhat should i install next ;)23:50
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Stskeepsaaand. 107 mb flash: ubuntu minbase, upstart, gnu tools+dash/bash, no man pages&doc, d-bus, hal, GUPnP, some X libs + GTK, udev, gconf2, glib, gstreamer with plugins, pulseaudio, tracker, samba client, python2.523:52
Stskeepssqlite as well23:52
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Stskeepsoh, and perl too23:53
Stskeepsand vim-tiny23:53
Stskeepsthat's impressive, isn't it?23:53
whodati get a bunch of prompts when running maemo mapper saying that the sql database is corrupted or missing file.. just started happening today, any ideas?23:55
lcuksqlite3 as well i hope :P thats mroe compatible with my desktop23:55
lcukwhodat, you probably corrupted your sql database file23:55
lcukexcellent sts23:56
whodatlcuk: how do i repair it23:56
lcuki dunno23:56
lcukrestore from backup23:56
Stskeeps (dpkg -l of the 107mb system.)23:56
lcukheh Stskeeps i notice a distinct lack of liqbase in there :P23:57
lcukthats an impressive list though23:58
Stskeepswith this, porting an app from ubuntu or debian is a matter of hildonizing it.23:59

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