| zap | boo | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
| zap | RST38h: what CPU has a GB? | 00:01 |
| zap | msh: I'm running scratchbox in ubuntu 8.04 and have zero problems | 00:02 |
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| Hrw|n810 | ho | 00:03 |
| RST38h | zap: modified Z80 | 00:04 |
| RST38h | 3.57MHz | 00:04 |
| RST38h | GBC doubles the clock | 00:04 |
| Hrw|n810 | RST38h, z80 goes to over 20MHz iirc | 00:06 |
| Hrw|n810 | spectrum had 3.57 | 00:06 |
| RST38h | hrw: there are higher frequency parts now | 00:07 |
| RST38h | all compatible with z80 opcodes | 00:07 |
| RST38h | As to old z80 cpus, the highest was Z80H, 8MHz | 00:07 |
| Hrw|n810 | and z380 which is 32bit | 00:08 |
| Hrw|n810 | zilog ones, yes | 00:08 |
| RST38h | also clones | 00:08 |
| liri | qos: a repository missing? uhmm, what could it be? I have both diablo and chinook extras and the official nokia repos (2 of them) | 00:08 |
| RST38h | ZiLOG's fully pipelined Z80 compatible eZ80 with an 8/16/24-bit word length and a linear 16 MB address space was introduced in 2001. | 00:09 |
| RST38h | http://www.zilog.com/products/family.asp?fam=218 <-- up to 50MHz | 00:11 |
| pupnik | wow | 00:11 |
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| RST38h | they should really sell it as Verilog specification, like ARm does... | 00:11 |
| nomis | lcuk: ok, conclusion of the string representation for now: "v4l2src ! video/x-raw-rgb,width=320,height=240,framerate=15/1 ! ffmpegcolorspace ! tee name=csp csp. ! queue ! xvimagesink name=xvsink csp. ! queue ! ffmpegcolorspace ! video/x-raw-rgb,width=320,height=240,bpp=24,depth=24,framerate=15/1 ! fakesink name=imagesink signal-handoffs=true" | 00:11 |
| RST38h | nobody is interested in standalone Z80 CPU nowadays but it is nice to have inside a SoC | 00:11 |
| liri | I'm getting an apt-get error when trying to install a new pacakge - http://pastebin.ca/1093157 - I'm after a diablo reflash so maybe it concerns that... | 00:12 |
| Hrw|n810 | RST38h: ok. i am more familiar with mos 6502 family then z80. | 00:12 |
| liri | sorry about that, pidgin's right-click menu isn't very friendly | 00:12 |
| Hrw|n810 | but I was able to cpde in asm of both | 00:12 |
| liri | RST38h: could you look at that pastebin error? | 00:13 |
| lbt | lcuk: feature request | 00:13 |
| lcuk | you mean asise from image scaling and blitting? | 00:13 |
| lbt | yep :) | 00:13 |
| RST38h | liri: It is suggestion that you do apt-get install -f | 00:13 |
| RST38h | suggesting | 00:13 |
| RST38h | liri: have you done that? | 00:14 |
| lbt | you know your physics view... | 00:14 |
| lcuk | yes | 00:14 |
| lbt | Tag cloud widget | 00:14 |
| liri | RST38h: no because I know how bad that can turn out :) | 00:14 |
| liri | RST38h: I'm just no familiar with those packages it's offering | 00:14 |
| RST38h | hrw: I only met with 6502 when emulating NES | 00:14 |
| lbt | make sense? | 00:14 |
| lcuk | already in my head - thats how i plan to tag items without a keyboard :) | 00:15 |
| RST38h | hrw: The only two machines I have seen it being used in before were Agat and Pravetz8, both Apple][ clones | 00:15 |
| lbt | great | 00:15 |
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| lcuk | im currently working on the base stylable graphical widget and have done cliprect stuff :) its all coming together nicely | 00:16 |
| lbt | I want a tabbed view of tag clouds; each representing a group of attributes | 00:16 |
| lcuk | ie. a group of tags per category? (thats how im thinking anyway) | 00:16 |
| lbt | yes | 00:16 |
| lbt | in my case, extensible | 00:17 |
| lbt | both tags+tabs | 00:17 |
| lcuk | coding, home, work, dinner | 00:17 |
| lcuk | within each category as many tags as required | 00:17 |
| lbt | it's for organising a video clip collection | 00:17 |
| lbt | yep | 00:17 |
| liri | so apt-get -f install for that dependency error? | 00:17 |
| Hrw|n810 | RST38h: i again forgot about your russian roots... | 00:17 |
| lbt | not too many - 10-15 | 00:17 |
| lcuk | not sure how you are gonna do vid clips | 00:17 |
| lbt | just for UI reasons | 00:17 |
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| RST38h | hrw: Pravetz was Bulgarian | 00:18 |
| lcuk | well i hope to have enough together that you can feed it and prepare it how you like | 00:18 |
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| lbt | The tabbed, tag clouds act in 3 ways: input selector, output spec and overview | 00:18 |
| lcuk | older systems ive built have a text file containing basic class definitions and stuff | 00:18 |
| RST38h | hrw: But I had a Spectrum clone as well once, mainly used it for gaming | 00:18 |
| lbt | it'll only fill half the screen though | 00:18 |
| lcuk | name:super{properties}{groups}{actions} | 00:19 |
| chelli | X-Fade: are you there? | 00:19 |
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| lbt | really you need to blend it with Qt or gtkmm | 00:19 |
| lcuk | its a shame i cant share my sketches - once i add the server we can whiteboard this and ill show you what i have already planned for | 00:19 |
| lbt | sounds good | 00:20 |
| lcuk | i dont know enough about each widget set to slide it in - nor even if it will do all required features - it will be useful at some point to go through with some qt guru and see whether it can be done | 00:21 |
| lbt | you going to the summit? | 00:21 |
| lbt | <grin> | 00:21 |
| lcuk | yes if nokia payment for linuxtag clears in time | 00:22 |
| lcuk | i cant book anything until i clear of the last payment | 00:22 |
| Hrw|n810 | lcuk: kick quim | 00:26 |
| lcuk | i have | 00:26 |
| lcuk | multiple times | 00:26 |
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| lbt | Hmm, mass quim kicking? | 00:26 |
| lcuk | hang on | 00:26 |
| lcuk | tis ok | 00:26 |
| lcuk | :D | 00:26 |
| * lbt summons his red dgragon (*again*) | 00:26 | |
| lcuk | miscommunication - sorted over the weekend | 00:26 |
| * lbt clearly has a gnome dragon | 00:27 | |
| lcuk | all done - the missus didnt tell me it was sorted whilst i was away over the weekend | 00:27 |
| * lbt dismisses petulant dragon | 00:27 | |
| msh | zap: hm. perhaps I'll try a fresh install (in vmware). | 00:27 |
| blafasel | lcuk: Yay! | 00:27 |
| lcuk | :D yayyyy indeed | 00:27 |
| blafasel | So you'll come over? | 00:27 |
| msh | had upgraded from the chinook sdk, though shouldn't matter... | 00:27 |
| lcuk | right - ill b booking a hotel tomorrow :) | 00:28 |
| blafasel | No excuses left? | 00:28 |
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| lcuk | never has been - i was first to apply i think | 00:28 |
| blafasel | Heh - was kidding anyway. So it's fixed for you now? | 00:28 |
| * lcuk really enjoyed linuxtag and hopes talking about what hes passionate about will make for a better presentation | 00:28 | |
| lcuk | yes - ill be sorting everything | 00:28 |
| blafasel | Great | 00:29 |
| Hrw|n810 | i need to get clear 'ok to go' yet | 00:30 |
| blafasel | From? | 00:30 |
| lcuk | HRW, WE WONT GET ANY DINNER WITHOUT YOU | 00:30 |
| lcuk | HIS MUM | 00:30 |
| lcuk | :O caps | 00:30 |
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| Hrw|n810 | :) | 00:31 |
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| RST38h | read + sleep | 00:31 |
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| RST38h | + need to figure out why SlideRule crashes with division by zero (!) when I click on the menu bar | 00:32 |
| * lcuk is really happy | 00:32 | |
| lcuk | im gonna vanish now | 00:32 |
| lbt | 'night | 00:33 |
| Hrw|n810 | someone on summit will have 64bit laptop? | 00:36 |
| * lardman might have to find a laptop, not 64bit though | 00:38 | |
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| lardman | night all | 00:39 |
| blafasel | Hrw|n810: What for exactly? | 00:39 |
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| blafasel | 64bit laptop means 64bit OS? | 00:39 |
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| Hrw|n810 | yes, 64bit linux | 00:40 |
| zap | experiments show that thumb code is about 10% slower than pure 32-bit arm | 00:40 |
| zap | so take care, people | 00:40 |
| blafasel | Hrw|n810: What do you need it for, if I may ask? | 00:40 |
| Hrw|n810 | zap: but less space | 00:40 |
| zap | sure less | 00:40 |
| zap | but for zip this is an issue | 00:40 |
| Hrw|n810 | blafasel: qemu on 64bit is much faster on same machine then in 32bit | 00:41 |
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| blafasel | Hrw|n810: So? You want a 64bit buildmachine in Berlin? | 00:41 |
| zap | its faster on machines with hardware virtualisation | 00:41 |
| Hrw|n810 | zap: use vfp then | 00:41 |
| zap | hrw|gone: in zip? :) | 00:41 |
| Hrw|n810 | blafasel: no buildmachine but presentation machine | 00:41 |
| t_s_o | hmm, i wonder if there would be a easier way to do mark text for copy then the current double-tap and drag way. it seems i can never trigger it when i want to but always when i dont want to... | 00:42 |
| zap | the really fast qemu is qemu-kvm | 00:42 |
| Hrw|n810 | blafasel: my llaptop is 32BIT pentium-m | 00:42 |
| Hrw|n810 | zap: not for arm emulation | 00:42 |
| zap | for arm emulation it doesn't depend if its a new or old or 64-bit CPU | 00:42 |
| zap | the only thing that matters is raw speed | 00:43 |
| Hrw|n810 | 64BIT means nicer registers... thats what I got from one of qemu devels | 00:43 |
| blafasel | Hrw|n810: Stupid idea: Ask housetier or someone from those peoples in Berlin. | 00:44 |
| Hrw|n810 | and thats gives speedup | 00:44 |
| blafasel | I'm sure they have some good machines | 00:44 |
| Hrw|n810 | blafasel: will do later | 00:44 |
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| blafasel | I can only offer a resonable fast desktop, no laptop | 00:45 |
| zap | yes, registers will help indeed | 00:45 |
| zap | x86_64 has 16 64-bit registers while x86 has just 8 | 00:46 |
| Hrw|n810 | see you tomorrow guys | 00:46 |
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| liri | all applications are installed into internal flash memory (256). what do I do when that runs out of space? is it even possible to install them on the 2gb flash (n810)? | 00:48 |
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| jott | liri: i use the 2gb as my root partition. | 00:49 |
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| liri | jott: where do I set that? | 00:52 |
| terbo | liri: google nokia mmc root | 00:53 |
| lbt | did you mean https://wiki.maemo.org/Booting_from_a_flash_card | 00:53 |
| liri | thanks | 00:54 |
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| terbo | theres a few ways to do it, but soon its pretty simple and you can even script it / use it for backups | 01:12 |
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| pupnik | new dosbox for ARM perf gain.. 2-4% today | 01:30 |
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| Macer | ugh | 01:38 |
| Macer | i'm trying to find a player that supports whatever the hell this n800 is using for audio | 01:38 |
| Macer | it seems like alsa but i can't seem to get mplayer to play audio in debian | 01:38 |
| danilocesar | lcuk: ping | 01:44 |
| terbo | recorded with videorecorder? | 01:45 |
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| lcuk | pong who r u? | 01:48 |
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| pupnik | Macer: mplayer -ao help | 01:50 |
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| Macer | pupnik i already did that | 01:51 |
| Macer | Simple mixer control 'PCM',0 | 01:51 |
| Macer | Capabilities: pvolume pswitch cswitch cswitch-joined | 01:51 |
| Macer | Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right | 01:51 |
| Macer | amixer detects the pcm channel. don't know exactly what /dev it is making for it though | 01:52 |
| Macer | i've tried to install alsa-oss in order to get the oss modules in there which are usually picked up without problem.. but it is not creating a /dev/dsp | 01:52 |
| Macer | i figure it is a problem with my alsa.conf but i can't figure it out | 01:52 |
| pupnik | you're talking about your PC, yes? | 01:53 |
| pupnik | must sleep | 01:54 |
| jott | lcuk: he is one of the qedje guys. i pointed them in your direction regarding xv based rendering :) | 01:54 |
| lcuk | i just mailed him jott, thanks | 01:54 |
| Macer | no | 01:54 |
| lcuk | involved in mm | 01:54 |
| Macer | my n800 | 01:54 |
| lcuk | isnt he? | 01:54 |
| jott | mm? | 01:55 |
| lcuk | mapper | 01:55 |
| Macer | alsa is easy to set up on a pc ;) heh | 01:55 |
| jott | ah, dunno about that. but i think he is involved in qedje and canola :) | 01:56 |
| Macer | i'm doing it in debian not hildon | 01:56 |
| Macer | blah.. screw it. i'll fix the sound later.. i'll work on the bt for now | 01:56 |
| Luria | gah.... jsut got a cobalt qube off ebay, didnt realize it didnt come with a power supply cable | 01:57 |
| lcuk | jott, ahhh the top posts for his nick and maemo came up with mapper related things, i mailed him anyway | 01:58 |
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| elekt | also? | 02:02 |
| elekt | music making software? | 02:02 |
| elekt | alsa* | 02:02 |
| elekt | or playback? | 02:02 |
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| MoRpHeUz | jott: actually danilocesar is not directly (but indirectly) involved with qedje =) | 02:06 |
| MoRpHeUz | must go now... | 02:06 |
| MoRpHeUz | see you | 02:06 |
| jott | :) | 02:06 |
| jott | good to know ;) | 02:06 |
| jott | but canola? ;) | 02:06 |
| MoRpHeUz | jott: no...neither canola hehe =) | 02:07 |
| jott | ok :) | 02:07 |
| MoRpHeUz | let's say he want's to use qedje on his software =) | 02:07 |
| jott | but he has openbossa ip :P | 02:07 |
| MoRpHeUz | jott: yes hehe | 02:07 |
| MoRpHeUz | =) | 02:07 |
| MoRpHeUz | jott: I think that danilocesar confused lcuk with luck (that is a guy from openbossa) | 02:07 |
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| jott | ah | 02:07 |
| MoRpHeUz | ;-) | 02:08 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk, jott: danilocesar contributed some time ago to maemo mapper.... | 02:08 |
| lcuk | hence the google results | 02:08 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: please, forward this email to me also... | 02:09 |
| lcuk | err | 02:09 |
| jott | google makes average joe to a stalker :) | 02:09 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: (if it's about qedje) | 02:09 |
| lcuk | ummm it essentially said "pong" | 02:10 |
| lcuk | MoRpHeUz, i notice its c++ | 02:10 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: ow, ok then..... | 02:11 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: yes, it's c++ | 02:11 |
| lcuk | shame (at least for now) | 02:11 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: hehehe =) | 02:11 |
| lcuk | im just at the point of requiring exactly what qedje seems to advertise (in a very brief look anyway) | 02:11 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: so, try qedje ;-) | 02:12 |
| jott | better, make your xv renderer work with qedje :) | 02:12 |
| lcuk | qedje will not render fast enough | 02:12 |
| MoRpHeUz | some more "real examples" should be on plasma, by the end of akademy | 02:12 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: hhmm...probably not _right_ now....but look what we did with evas+edje ;-) | 02:13 |
| lcuk | how ingrained is rgb into it? | 02:13 |
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| lcuk | MoRpHeUz, have you seen my software? | 02:13 |
| jott | lcuk: not very deep as far as i can tell. | 02:13 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: I saw it sometime ago (not the code) and jott talked about it with us today | 02:13 |
| MoRpHeUz | jott: =) | 02:14 |
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| lcuk | what do i need to get it on my tablet? | 02:15 |
| jott | it does not look that hard to change the actual rendering core :) | 02:15 |
| jott | lcuk: qt :) | 02:15 |
| lcuk | jott, ? i thought qt renderers were something completely different | 02:15 |
| lcuk | does qegje sit ontop of qt and manage qt widgets? | 02:16 |
| lcuk | -typo | 02:16 |
| jott | lcuk: qedje is a qt widget | 02:16 |
| lcuk | does it need to be? | 02:16 |
| jott | yes, that's the whole point of it ;) | 02:16 |
| MoRpHeUz | =) | 02:16 |
| jott | though i would say it is not necessary to render using qt QPainter. | 02:16 |
| MoRpHeUz | jott: perfect | 02:17 |
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| MoRpHeUz | jott: I would say that you almost know more about qedje than me =P | 02:17 |
| MoRpHeUz | haha | 02:17 |
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| lcuk | im confused, so this isnt e17 edje, its a specific single qt port? | 02:18 |
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| jott | lcuk: edje is just a interface defintion. | 02:18 |
| jott | e17 renders edje through eva | 02:18 |
| MoRpHeUz | one important point is that there is libedje | 02:18 |
| MoRpHeUz | for e17 | 02:18 |
| MoRpHeUz | that renders edje files on top of evas | 02:19 |
| MoRpHeUz | (canvas) | 02:19 |
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| MoRpHeUz | now port this to qt world and change evas for "whatever canvas you want to use here" | 02:19 |
| lcuk | (so if i got it straight) and now a new port to qt has come along | 02:20 |
| jott | lcuk: right. to use edje interface within the qt framework. | 02:20 |
| MoRpHeUz | exactly...it can use a qtpainter based canvas, qgraphicsview, etc.. | 02:20 |
| jott | and for now it renders everything trough QPainter, which is not optimal. | 02:20 |
| lcuk | but with qt you cannot get to the metal can you? multiple layers of rendering and abstraction away from the core | 02:21 |
| jott | lcuk: you can (loosing platform independence) get access to X11 windows. | 02:22 |
| jott | hence you can create a xv window and put that in a qt widget | 02:22 |
| lcuk | what about xv overlays :) | 02:22 |
| lcuk | good | 02:22 |
| jott | there you have your viewport | 02:22 |
| MoRpHeUz | =) | 02:23 |
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| jott | lcuk: using http://doc.trolltech.com/4.4/qx11embedcontainer.html was my initial idea. | 02:23 |
| lcuk | wouldnt you be better ripping out the grounding from qt and replace it with something *all* widgets would gain from | 02:24 |
| lcuk | or is this closest to instant gratification | 02:24 |
| jott | lcuk: i think the whole point is having it in Qt (like qt signals and slots and more or less api consistency etc) | 02:25 |
| jott | and tbh, the actual rendering part is not that extensive :) | 02:25 |
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| jott | it's more about handling animations and events, etc. and there you can easily add some abstraction layer without really loosing performance. | 02:26 |
| lcuk | agreed on that part | 02:26 |
| lcuk | so edje itself doesnt need qt, it could just as easily have been in gtk or native x11 or something | 02:28 |
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| Trencher| | hello everyone | 02:28 |
| Trencher| | i have a question about the perl install in maemo | 02:29 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: edje just needs a canvas where it can paint everything... | 02:29 |
| jott | ... and most of the time it's just an instruction like "paint this transformed pixmap here" | 02:30 |
| MoRpHeUz | lcuk: for canola2 we choose evas because of it's performance (much better than any other canvas available right now) and edje was already written for it =) | 02:30 |
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| jott | and if we have an xv based edje canvas, this would be even faster :) | 02:30 |
| Trencher| | i am trying to compile a program with perl support in the armel target, but it keeps linking to the i686 perl | 02:31 |
| MoRpHeUz | (of course we did the 16bit engine for evas, but it was already fast) | 02:31 |
| lcuk | nice indeed :) | 02:31 |
| MoRpHeUz | jott: yeah, but it would be hell to implement the whole canvas (rectangle's merge algorithms, etc...) | 02:32 |
| jott | MoRpHeUz: that's why you could use that part from qt and handle the blitting via xv :) | 02:33 |
| MoRpHeUz | jott: ;-) | 02:33 |
| lcuk | but qt doesnt work in yuv/ | 02:33 |
| jott | lcuk: that's all an abstraction above :) | 02:33 |
| jott | only plain blitting (and some basic drawing) has to be done in yuv :) | 02:34 |
| lcuk | yes, but that level of abstraction involves an rgb->yuv conversion | 02:34 |
| jott | no | 02:34 |
| jott | not really | 02:34 |
| lcuk | which is why i want the IVA opening | 02:34 |
| jott | you have an xv viewport in a qt widget. | 02:34 |
| lcuk | once that happens we rock: its essentially free to work in RGB and get the IVA doing the heavy lifting on every frame | 02:34 |
| jott | let qt (in that case) handle all the intersection/moving/foo stuff. | 02:34 |
| jott | then you come to a point where you have to blit a subrect to antoher subrect. | 02:35 |
| jott | there you use xv/yuv | 02:35 |
| lcuk | ok, i think theres a slight overlap(heh) here. "merging algorithms" color merge or simple geometrics? | 02:36 |
| jott | simple geometrics i would say. | 02:37 |
| jott | and of course different blending functions. | 02:37 |
| lcuk | cos the geometrics is schoolyard stuff and should be inside the core library anyway - YUV color transformations and functions are a lot more indepth | 02:37 |
| lcuk | if an animation library has to use someone elses code to manage locations it sounds wrong - it should be dealing with keyframes and tweening and stuff and this sort of thing should be second nature | 02:38 |
| lcuk | alpha blending and aliasing and font weighing is what the canvas handles | 02:40 |
| jott | lcuk: if you re-implement stuff that is already usable in a framework that sounds wrong :) | 02:40 |
| ryoohki | is there any maemo activity at linux world expo? has the n810 wimax edition come out yet? | 02:40 |
| jott | yep. | 02:40 |
| jott | @lcuk :) | 02:40 |
| lcuk | jott, im building from the ground up because thats what i think i need to get the speed. its working for me, im havin a great time and finally putting onto a page what i have wanted to do for years | 02:41 |
| lcuk | its like books, theres many authors writing about similar topics | 02:41 |
| jott | lcuk: sure. if you have fun that's great. | 02:42 |
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| Trencher| | can anyone help me? please? | 02:43 |
| lcuk | i need to discuss with people however how to make use of this to improve lots of things, i want it underneath qt and (ideally) x11 itself so everything speeds up | 02:43 |
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| Trencher| | should i be asking this elsewhere? | 02:50 |
| nomis | Trencher|: you did not yet ask anything? | 02:52 |
| nomis | ah sorry. | 02:52 |
| nomis | did not scroll back enough. | 02:52 |
| nomis | (and I unfortunately have no clue about perl= | 02:53 |
| Mercury | lcuk: To do something like that 'under' X11 would basicly mean doing it in the X11 video driver. | 02:53 |
| lcuk | Mercury, yes | 02:53 |
| jott | Trencher|: there is an env var to set so that the arm perl is used. (can't remember it's name) | 02:54 |
| Mercury | lcuk: That's probably the best target, since that really does give a universal speedup if the approach works. | 02:54 |
| lcuk | Mercury, have you seen liqbase? | 02:54 |
| Mercury | No. | 02:54 |
| lcuk | then do :) | 02:54 |
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| Trencher| | :( sadly, all the docs for the scratchbox env are missing on maemo.org | 02:55 |
| Trencher| | i tried to rtfm ;) | 02:55 |
| lcuk | theres a youtube vid | 02:55 |
| Macer | wtf | 02:57 |
| Macer | my n800 crashed | 02:57 |
| Trencher| | :( | 02:57 |
| Macer | and when i had to yank the battery.. and put it bakc.. the screen is flickering like a tv with no reception | 02:57 |
| Trencher| | !! | 02:57 |
| lcuk | Trencher|, whats up with you? | 02:57 |
| Trencher| | that can't be good | 02:57 |
| Trencher| | i am attempting to build something for my nokia tablet using scratchbox | 02:57 |
| lcuk | Macer, ooooer | 02:57 |
| Macer | wow.. that was extremely odd | 02:58 |
| lcuk | "something" as in helloworld, or have you confirmed all that works? | 02:58 |
| Macer | all i want to do is get this damn bt connection going in nit-debian | 02:58 |
| Trencher| | something as in irssi | 02:58 |
| Mercury | lcuk: The overview? Just watched it, quite interesting. | 02:58 |
| Macer | and every time i'm close.. someething breaks haha | 02:58 |
| Trencher| | and i have built it | 02:58 |
| Trencher| | and it works on the target and the tablet | 02:58 |
| Trencher| | but i want to build it with perl support | 02:58 |
| Mercury | lcuk: Not an interface that I'd use much, though, the ability to underclock the unit at will is something that I would find exceedingly handy. | 02:58 |
| Trencher| | but libperl-dev is not present on device or scratchbox. also not available as a deb | 02:59 |
| lcuk | Mercury, yes - it uses an alternative graphics mode which is better suited to fast graphics (mainly because its onee the hardware can push to the lcd controller in time) | 02:59 |
| Trencher| | so i built perl | 02:59 |
| Trencher| | but | 02:59 |
| Trencher| | irssi is trying to link to the i686 perl | 02:59 |
| Trencher| | instead of the armel one | 02:59 |
| lcuk | whats actually drawn there isnt important to some eyes - its the fact its fast and tearfree and scalable | 02:59 |
| Trencher| | when i run configure | 03:00 |
| Trencher| | as in: Perl library directory ........... : (site default - /scratchbox/tools/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.4/i686-linux-thread-multi) | 03:01 |
| Mercury | lcuk: Is that bypassing X right now, or? | 03:01 |
| lcuk | its using xv, so yes but no because its a standard interface | 03:01 |
| Mercury | lcuk: Or are you just dropping X into a lower resolution mode and scaling up? | 03:01 |
| lcuk | xv is the video overlay portion. it uses YUV color mode and has a selectable arbitary resolution that is scaled up to full screen by the hardware | 03:02 |
| lcuk | Trencher|, i dunno, it sounds odd that you have to build perl before one normal app | 03:03 |
| Mercury | Ahh, interesting trick. | 03:03 |
| jott | basically it's about dropping colors (16/24 bit down to 12 bit) to gain performance :) | 03:03 |
| Trencher| | i had to build perl to get libperl-dev | 03:04 |
| lcuk | i get full 24 bit color tyvm jott :P i drop color resolution (like a jpeg image) | 03:04 |
| Trencher| | but that's not the point | 03:04 |
| Trencher| | the point is that when i build irssi it points to the wrong perl | 03:04 |
| Trencher| | someone said there's a env var | 03:04 |
| Trencher| | but i don't know it | 03:04 |
| Mercury | Trencher|: If you built perl only for i686, then you only have an i686 libperl-dev, so of _course_ that's what it will link to. | 03:04 |
| Mercury | Trencher|: If you built perl for armel, then that's a different story, but. | 03:05 |
| Mercury | lcuk: I'm not sure how well that would scale for all of X, but I like the general idea for some applications. | 03:05 |
| Trencher| | i built perl for armel | 03:05 |
| Trencher| | for the libperl-dev package | 03:06 |
| * Mercury nods. | 03:06 | |
| Trencher| | which i got | 03:06 |
| Trencher| | now i need to get irssi to compile with the armel perl | 03:06 |
| Trencher| | which it didn't do whether i built perl or not | 03:06 |
| Trencher| | in scratchbox, a fresh install | 03:06 |
| Trencher| | perl -v returns a i686 build | 03:07 |
| Trencher| | a fresh maemo install that is | 03:07 |
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| Trencher| | which doesn't seem right | 03:10 |
| lcuk | are you in scratchbox | 03:11 |
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| jott | Trencher|: /scratchbox/doc/variables.txt => SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE | 03:13 |
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| brontide | anyone know why noatime is not set by default on /media/mmc[12] mount points? | 03:15 |
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| Mercury | brontide: It may be the default for vfat. | 03:16 |
| jott | brontide: because that would increase level wearing ALOT :) | 03:16 |
| jott | oh NOT set? | 03:16 |
| brontide | yeah | 03:16 |
| * jott scratches his head | 03:16 | |
| jott | atleast the internal flash is set to noatime when booting from it with the default nokia initfs :) | 03:17 |
| brontide | this whole though process started when I installed the highspeed kernel only to find out that media player was stuttering on occasion, that can be fixed by renice 0 `pidof mmsqd`, but then I was thinking... I'm only reading.... why should the mmcqd be active. That's when I set the noatime and nodiratime on /media/mmc[12] and it got much faster | 03:18 |
| brontide | subjectivly at least. Fast enough that reading was now no longer stable | 03:18 |
| Macer | anybody here know what exactly maemo uses to tether the bt? | 03:18 |
| brontide | Macer: DUN prifile | 03:19 |
| brontide | profile even | 03:19 |
| Macer | yeah but i mean how it does it exactly | 03:19 |
| Macer | does it use a bnep module? | 03:19 |
| Macer | or does it do it by some other means? | 03:19 |
| jott | brontide: sounds broken either way. noatime should really be set for any flash device when not *really* needed. | 03:19 |
| brontide | yeah... I went back to the stock kernel with noatime and nodirtime set and it still seems peppier ( /usr/sbin/mmc-mount script edit ) | 03:20 |
| Macer | i am trying to connect to att 3G in nit-debian and so far anything i've found requires a bnep connection | 03:20 |
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| brontide | jott: Really I was making sure I wasn't missing something before I filed a bug report. Just like laptop systems all mount points should be noatime, nodiratime unless it's a necessity because of the IO penalty | 03:22 |
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| Trencher| | SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=perl did not work | 03:24 |
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| jott | Trencher|: also check $PATH :P (or call directly /usr/bin/perl) | 03:28 |
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| Trencher| | still nothing.. | 03:34 |
| Trencher| | will be back later to try more | 03:34 |
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| brontide | anyone got 1 minute to confirm this bug? All you need is a terminal prompt and an umolested system ( no crazy mods like me ) | 03:37 |
| jott | are there unmolested systems? :O | 03:38 |
| brontide | :-P | 03:38 |
| brontide | It's ok to love you NIT, just not LOVE you NIT | 03:39 |
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| brontide | ok... anyone who hasn't messed with their mount points? http://pastebin.com/m520f3f6e | 03:39 |
| brontide | grr... replace prefs.js with stat_me | 03:40 |
| * brontide shoots secratary | 03:40 | |
| jott | brontide: changes here at least. | 03:50 |
| rm_you | n800 is apparently also handy as a recorder :P | 03:51 |
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| brontide | Thanks, that's what I though... I'll open a bug report. It's a 5 second fix to /usr/sbin/mmc-mount | 03:51 |
| rm_you | been recording D&D sessions by sitting it in the middle of the table and hitting record on maemo-recorder | 03:51 |
| jott | (i boot from internal 2gb card but i have a mmc mounted as vfat) | 03:51 |
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| rm_you | works very well (though I have to boost the gain in Audacity later to hear anything, but it is still very good quality surprisingly) | 03:51 |
| jott | brontide: 5 second fix + 2 month discussion and regression testing ;) | 03:51 |
| jott | s/2 month/14 month/ | 03:52 |
| infobot | jott meant: brontide: 5 second fix + 14 month discussion and regression testing ;) | 03:52 |
| brontide | So I should expect offical support about the time browserd get upgraded | 03:53 |
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| Macer | yeah. i give up on nit-debian | 03:58 |
| Macer | it is too difficult to fix the sound and to bt tether | 03:58 |
| * Macer is going to swap back to kde | 03:58 | |
| johnx | rm_you, well you'd hope that Nokia would know how to make a decent mic given how many phones they make... | 03:59 |
| Macer | i wonder how hard it would be to make my own kde install without all the stuff pb has in his... it's way too large and filled with a lot of things i'd probably never use | 03:59 |
| rm_you | johnx: true | 03:59 |
| rm_you | johnx: what is the state of a2dp in debian? (NIT) | 03:59 |
| Macer | johnx - nit debian doesn't have a dnep module? | 04:00 |
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| Macer | what would you use to connect to 3G? | 04:00 |
| johnx | dnep? | 04:00 |
| johnx | a2dp support is the same as in any other debian install | 04:00 |
| rm_you | "Portable Document Format" is currently seeming annoyingly unportable | 04:00 |
| johnx | rm_you, how so? | 04:01 |
| rm_you | eh, having to jump through a ton of hoops to get it to become a jpg :P | 04:01 |
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| rm_you | not too bad tho since i can just turn it to postscript | 04:01 |
| Macer | johnx - i don't understand what you would do in debian in order to connect to a 3G network with bluez ... i figured once you pair you could just use dhclient and run it through dnep0 | 04:01 |
| Macer | but there's no module for it in nit-debian :) | 04:02 |
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| Macer | what does maemo use for the bt 3G stuff? | 04:02 |
| johnx | Macer, by default it uses dun I believe | 04:02 |
| johnx | Sorry, but the only wireless hookup my phone supports is IR, so I really have no idea about this kind of stuff ;) | 04:03 |
| Macer | heh | 04:03 |
| Macer | well.. it uses the dun profile for the bt connection.. but what tools does it use in order to actually establish the connection | 04:03 |
| Macer | ah.... ok then :) well... then do you know what you have to do for oss support in nit-debian ? | 04:04 |
| johnx | aaah | 04:04 |
| Macer | heh | 04:04 |
| johnx | oss sound support? | 04:04 |
| Macer | so that mplayer will play audio.. it doesn't seem to be able to detect the alsa stuff | 04:04 |
| Macer | yeah | 04:04 |
| Macer | alsamixer sees all the channels | 04:04 |
| Macer | i have a pcm0... but for some reason mplayer and any other audio app i have tried doesn't seem to want to work | 04:05 |
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| Macer | i've been searching for hours for these 2 problems.. if i could get all the hardware working like it should then nit-debian would be great ;) | 04:05 |
| johnx | Macer, Stskeeps has been doing most of the nit-debian stuff. I've been so busy I don't even have a booting nit-debian install right now | 04:05 |
| Macer | ah... i see.. he's been concentrating on his installer.. which works perfect with lenny instead of sid | 04:06 |
| Macer | sid is picky | 04:06 |
| johnx | yeah, he's doing a lot of incredible work :) | 04:06 |
| Macer | but the hardware ;) | 04:07 |
| Macer | i wish i knew how to code so i could make something for him | 04:07 |
| Macer | that would allow easy tethering / 3G connections | 04:07 |
| Macer | because right now i was happy that i was able to pair... after that i don't know exactly which route i should take for it | 04:07 |
| Macer | i suppose for the time being i could get a usb cable and use acm for it | 04:07 |
| johnx | what I did with beta3 was just copy the packages for the dsp tasks, the gstreamer stuff related to dsp audio and some alsa libs | 04:07 |
| Macer | but i don't think there's an acm module eitehr :) | 04:08 |
| Macer | i was trying to do that | 04:08 |
| johnx | it was somewhat tricky | 04:08 |
| Macer | didn't seem to work so well :) | 04:08 |
| Macer | yeah.. i figured as much.. i was trying to rip stuff off the maemo partition | 04:08 |
| johnx | something about the dsp tasks wanting to be started early in the boot sequence I think | 04:08 |
| Macer | i wish alsa would just detect it and use oss emulation for it :) can't go wrong with /dev/dsp | 04:09 |
| Macer | ah well.. i guess i'll go back to the kde route i was taking earlier | 04:09 |
| Macer | i wonder if pb could make a bare kde install and just the debian mirrors to download armel bins/libs | 04:10 |
| rm_you | lcuk: ok got it | 04:10 |
| Macer | i don't see why something like that wouldn't work :) | 04:10 |
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| Macer | use like the kde package manager for everything... maybe i'll see about doing something like that when i get the chance | 04:11 |
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| johnx | Macer, debian != maemo | 04:13 |
| johnx | different lib versions, different config locations, different package names | 04:13 |
| johnx | as for sound the "DSP tasks" aren't really related to the OSS /dev/dsp | 04:14 |
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| Macer | johnx - i see hm | 04:27 |
| Macer | well.. i'll figure something out.. tnx | 04:28 |
| johnx | good luck :) | 04:28 |
| Macer | hm.. kde looks like the best route... so i'm guessing you would have to build all the apps in scratchbox for maemo? | 04:30 |
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| johnx | you could try just unpacking .debs from debian for armel | 04:30 |
| johnx | the biggest problem is different package naming conventions I think | 04:31 |
| Macer | i would bet the best way to do it is how pb has kde starting from hildon with all maemo's services running with full sound support | 04:31 |
| johnx | so if you just satisfy deps yourself and put the files in place it'll likely work, at least for smaller CLI programs | 04:31 |
| Macer | if i could get it bare.. i can set up my own repository and work on building apps for it | 04:31 |
| Macer | that could be installed from hildon or from apt-get itself | 04:32 |
| brontide | jott: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3543 | 04:32 |
| Macer | the only thing that drove me up the wall about pb's kde install was kopete didn't have ssl support because i don't think he was able to build the qt qcatls plugin | 04:32 |
| Macer | either that or the one for kopete in order to get on gtalk :) ... plus he had kopete and svirc on it.... i know these are things that are probably easy to get rid of but .... :) | 04:33 |
| Macer | ok.. i gotta go.. i'll look into it when i get home again | 04:33 |
| jott | brontide: looks good to me. | 04:34 |
| brontide | I don't think bug reports get any easier than that... complete with test script and fix | 04:34 |
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| lcuk | gnite chan | 05:08 |
| rm_you | lcuk: noooo | 05:08 |
| lcuk | rm_you, ill look tomorrow, sorry just seen | 05:08 |
| rm_you | lol | 05:08 |
| rm_you | kk | 05:08 |
| rm_you | l8r | 05:08 |
| lcuk | gnite | 05:08 |
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| mranostay | hello | 05:42 |
| mranostay | quick question, why doesn't their seem to be i386 mplayer package in the extras/ repo? | 05:42 |
| rm_you | erk | 05:42 |
| rm_you | dunno, it may just need to pass through the autobuilder again | 05:43 |
| rm_you | or else the maintainer marked it armel only | 05:43 |
| mranostay | well that is annoying | 05:45 |
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| mranostay | rm_you: autobuilder? you mean scratchbox | 05:50 |
| bef0rd | I think he indeed means autobuilder | 05:55 |
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| rm_you | mranostay: autobuilder is the extras upload/promotion interface | 06:17 |
| rm_you | ~autobuilder | 06:17 |
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| rm_you | hrm | 06:17 |
| rm_you | i'll have X-Fade set that later ;P | 06:17 |
| rm_you | I just cleaned so many dishes that we ran out of hot water <_< | 06:18 |
| rm_you | and my hands feel funny O_o | 06:18 |
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| brontide | Sweet... only 2 grey hairs from trying to get this working. http://www.rit.albany.edu/~ew2193/bookmarklets/ | 07:21 |
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| bef0rd | bookmarlets ftw | 08:20 |
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| teamcobra | hey all | 08:23 |
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| bef0rd | hi | 08:27 |
| teamcobra | how's it going, bef0rd | 08:30 |
| bef0rd | great, trying to get a friend register a couple of domains for me :P | 08:31 |
| * bef0rd doesn't have credit card .. nor money | 08:31 | |
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| teamcobra | ahh | 08:34 |
| * teamcobra has 1 left, paying it all off, not using it again ;p | 08:34 | |
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| RST38h | KILL KILL DESTROY | 09:15 |
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| bef0rd | Hi! | 09:19 |
| RST38h | hello zap | 09:22 |
| bef0rd | Buenas, ¿cuantos usuarios de maemo son hispanohablantes? | 09:23 |
| RST38h | no hispanohablantes here, sorry | 09:24 |
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| bef0rd | I are the only one :| | 09:43 |
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| bef0rd | I'm the one :o | 09:43 |
| Addison | Good evening gentlemen! | 09:43 |
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| Addison | Hey, I'm trying to install python2.5 from the instructions I'm reading. Does that mean python2.5-sdk in red pill mode? | 09:45 |
| bef0rd | what instructions are you reading? | 09:46 |
| Addison | http://mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/kciconsbox/readme.txt | 09:46 |
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| bef0rd | eh, that's the script you are trying to run, isn't it? | 09:47 |
| Addison | I'm just trying to run wmctrl, I could care less about anything else but it seems like I need that as well. | 09:48 |
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| Addison | I've done everything except for the requirements... the python2.5 and the pygtk thingie. | 09:49 |
| Addison | So when it says requirements python2.5, does that mean python2.5-sdk? | 09:50 |
| Addison | There's like so many to choose from in red pill mode. | 09:51 |
| bef0rd | do you see python2.5-runtime? | 09:52 |
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| Addison | No, it goes from python2.5-pyrex to python2.5-sdk. I'm using a clean Diablo flash by the way. | 09:53 |
| Addison | I found python-launcher which has an icon next to it. Is that the junk needed? | 09:55 |
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| solmumaha | Addison: try installing some python app from chinook extras | 09:58 |
| XTLi | hmm | 09:58 |
| XTLi | bank works again. | 09:58 |
| solmumaha | that should get you a working python | 09:58 |
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| terbo | "there was a nokia 7710 taken from the car. we have its tracking numbers." | 10:02 |
| Addison | Okay, working on it somumaha... | 10:02 |
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| solmumaha | Addison: i'm not sure if python has made it's way to diablo yet but chinook should work just fine | 10:05 |
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| Addison | I'm not finding "Chinook Extras" over at gronmayer. If even typed it in the search field and it said "nothing was found for "chinook extras" in OS 2008. | 10:08 |
| bef0rd | ~wiki | 10:08 |
| * bef0rd slaps infobot | 10:08 | |
| bef0rd | Addison, wiki.maemo.org | 10:08 |
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| bef0rd | search there for 'extras' | 10:08 |
| bef0rd | it tells you how to enable it | 10:08 |
| Addison | Okay, will do. Thanks! | 10:09 |
| chelli | X-Fade: are you there? | 10:09 |
| bef0rd | infobot, learn wiki as http://wiki.maemo.org/ | 10:09 |
| bef0rd | erhm well, I tried. | 10:09 |
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| Addison | I already have maemo Extras and Maemo Extras Develpoment available as catalogues. | 10:14 |
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| Addison | I'll be right back. As always, trying to use this tablet forces me to take a break and have a smoke outside. I'm really beginning to hate this piece. :) | 10:15 |
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| liri | I think I'm gonna get that maemo vmware image | 10:15 |
| liri | seems like I need to compile from source the roadmap application in CVS | 10:15 |
| *** hrw|gone is now known as hrw | 10:20 | |
| hrw | mogning | 10:20 |
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| trickie|work | morning | 10:21 |
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| aquatix | good moaning | 10:23 |
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| hrw | alsa mixers are too complicated | 10:25 |
| hrw | to make last.fm louder I have to operate last.fm player volume + pcm volume + master volume + front volume | 10:26 |
| hrw | 4 sliders just to make it louder.. | 10:26 |
| hrw | and I do not count volume slider on speakers.. | 10:27 |
| * aquatix just uses the volume slider on his speakers | 10:27 | |
| aquatix | easier :) | 10:27 |
| hrw | not here - it is not easily reachable | 10:29 |
| aquatix | ah | 10:30 |
| *** Trencher| has joined #maemo | 10:30 | |
| * aquatix has a wired remote with a conveniently large round volume slider | 10:30 | |
| Trencher| | hello everyone | 10:30 |
| Trencher| | how are we this fine morning? | 10:31 |
| aquatix | sleepy | 10:31 |
| Trencher| | :( | 10:31 |
| *** Binky has joined #maemo | 10:31 | |
| bef0rd | hungry | 10:31 |
| aquatix | Trencher|: i might benefit from going to sleep earlier ;) | 10:32 |
| Trencher| | maybe lol | 10:32 |
| Trencher| | so | 10:32 |
| Trencher| | i still can't fix the broken perl support in scratchbox | 10:33 |
| Binky | It's cool. Here is 9am ^^ | 10:33 |
| Trencher| | lol | 10:33 |
| Trencher| | 12:34 am here | 10:33 |
| Trencher| | just got off work | 10:33 |
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| bef0rd | 2:34 am | 10:34 |
| bef0rd | here | 10:34 |
| Binky | Where are you from...? Ukraine, Kenya? | 10:35 |
| aquatix | 9:34 am | 10:35 |
| bef0rd | ~maemowiki | 10:35 |
| bef0rd | infobot, learn maemowiki as http://wiki.maemo.org | 10:35 |
| bef0rd | .. | 10:35 |
| Binky | LOL! | 10:36 |
| bef0rd | infobot me odia. | 10:36 |
| infobot | moi? | 10:36 |
| hrw | http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3010/2722501352_09d5e4f567_o.jpg | 10:36 |
| bef0rd | oui | 10:36 |
| Trencher| | can someone help me with perl in scratchbox? | 10:36 |
| wiza | has modest development stopped? | 10:37 |
| aquatix | wiza: yeah, was wondering that too | 10:37 |
| wiza | it's not working very well and there hasn't been many updates to diablo at all | 10:37 |
| Trencher| | is the wiki supposed to be broken in firefox? | 10:38 |
| wiza | for any software that matter... | 10:38 |
| Trencher| | o, ok | 10:38 |
| Trencher| | lol | 10:38 |
| aquatix | wiza: yeah :( | 10:38 |
| aquatix | wiza: maybe people *do* have real vacations :) | 10:38 |
| Stskeeps | vacations are just so you can code through the night without having to go to work next day | 10:39 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:39 |
| Binky | bef0rd, lol, are you spanish? | 10:39 |
| Trencher| | srs | 10:39 |
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| wiza | aquatix: I was thinking about that | 10:39 |
| bef0rd | not from spain, but my native language is spanish indeed. | 10:39 |
| aquatix | Stskeeps: yeah, i'd say so, but maybe people beg to differ | 10:39 |
| wiza | I already spent my 4 weeks summer vacation | 10:41 |
| Binky | bef0rd, tus padres eran españoles? o en algunas partes en el sur de USA también se habla | 10:41 |
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| wiza | but since I'm changing jobs I spend my 1 week winter vacation last week of august, also changing city so not really vacation :p | 10:42 |
| bef0rd | not from states either ( o se dice neither? ) | 10:42 |
| bef0rd | I'm from Colombia. | 10:42 |
| Binky | Creo que significan lo mismo, como til' y until. | 10:42 |
| Binky | I'm surprised by amount of people at ITt speaking spanish | 10:43 |
| bef0rd | yea, only you and me | 10:43 |
| Trencher| | :( | 10:43 |
| bef0rd | oh, the forums you mean? I'm not registered there | 10:43 |
| Trencher| | noone? | 10:43 |
| Binky | lol | 10:43 |
| Binky | crashandie does too | 10:44 |
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| bef0rd | oh, I've seen him/her here too, didn't know it | 10:44 |
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| bef0rd | Trencher|, what are you trying to get? additional modules? | 10:45 |
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| Binky | I know people from there, bef0rd , but in spain people are eaten by stereotypes. They think colombians are all drug trafficants. How sad... | 10:46 |
| aquatix | aren't they? | 10:46 |
| * aquatix runs | 10:46 | |
| Binky | lol | 10:46 |
| wiza | :p | 10:46 |
| bef0rd | yea, I don't really plan to travel to spain anyway :P | 10:47 |
| Trencher| | i am trying to build programs with perl support | 10:47 |
| Trencher| | but | 10:47 |
| liri | is that maemo vmware image really 10gb big? | 10:47 |
| Trencher| | if perl is called in scratchbox, it pulls the i686 build, not the armel build | 10:47 |
| Binky | I'd be a guide 8-) | 10:47 |
| Trencher| | liri: i know i downloaded at least 3gb installing scratchbox... | 10:47 |
| bef0rd | I've a half brother there, thanks anyway :P | 10:47 |
| liri | Trencher|: so it's that big eh? | 10:48 |
| XTLi | Spanish is the new italian | 10:48 |
| bef0rd | (se dira asi, medio hermano? o pensaran que es un hermano partido por la mitad?) | 10:48 |
| Trencher| | liri: and that's not including debian | 10:48 |
| liri | Trencher|: I'm low on space on this desktop machine so I guess I'll have to put it somewhere else | 10:48 |
| liri | Trencher|: yickes | 10:48 |
| liri | Trencher|: have you got it already up and running? | 10:48 |
| Trencher| | liri: this isn't vm. had debian, installed scratchbox. Works fine. I believe the vm is linux + scratchbox preconfiged | 10:49 |
| Binky | bef0rd, looooool. Se dice asi, te referiras a hermanastro.. | 10:49 |
| bef0rd | sep, aca es mas común el termino 'medio hermano' | 10:50 |
| Trencher| | bef0rd: if perl is called in scratchbox, it pulls the i686 build, not the armel build | 10:50 |
| liri | Trencher|: ahh | 10:50 |
| bef0rd | Trencher|, I read that but I dont know what you mean heh | 10:50 |
| * bef0rd checks | 10:50 | |
| liri | Trencher|: is there a wiki page on getting a plain debian install with scratchbox? | 10:51 |
| bef0rd | o i c | 10:51 |
| Trencher| | bef0rd: when i login to scratchbox (ARMEL target) it's supposed to be a ARMEL system so i can build for ARMEL, right? | 10:51 |
| bef0rd | [sbox-DIABLO_ARMEL: ~] > perl -v | 10:51 |
| bef0rd | This is perl, v5.8.4 built for i686-linux-thread-multi | 10:51 |
| Trencher| | yes. | 10:51 |
| Trencher| | i want.. | 10:51 |
| bef0rd | armel perl | 10:51 |
| Trencher| | let me ssh into 770 | 10:51 |
| Trencher| | lol | 10:51 |
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| Trencher| | [root@nokia ~]# perl -v | 10:52 |
| Trencher| | This is perl, v5.8.3 built for arm-linux-gnueabi-thread-multi | 10:52 |
| Trencher| | i can get that in the scratchbox | 10:52 |
| Trencher| | it's in /usr/bin | 10:52 |
| wiza | my spanish is pretty much only "una grande cerveza por favor" | 10:52 |
| bef0rd | perl is supposed to be crossplatform, why do you *really* need the arm bin? | 10:52 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /usr/bin] > perl5.8.3 -v | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | This is perl, v5.8.3 built for arm-linux-gnueabi-thread-multi | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | because | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | if i build something in ARMEL | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | and it calls the i686 perl | 10:53 |
| bef0rd | build as in? | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | it doesn't build | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | irssi | 10:53 |
| Binky | wiza, cerveza grande instead please lol | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | i might try something different... | 10:53 |
| wiza | Binky: whups :) | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | see, the perl built in maemo and the devices | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | doesn't have libperl-devb | 10:53 |
| Trencher| | doesn't have libperl-dev | 10:53 |
| Binky | Oh, btw, i downloaed windows flasher for ITs and wants to install Diablo on my ITs | 10:54 |
| Trencher| | and it's not available in repos | 10:54 |
| Trencher| | so i built | 10:54 |
| Trencher| | perl | 10:54 |
| Trencher| | and got libperl-dev | 10:54 |
| bef0rd | ok let me check something | 10:54 |
| Trencher| | but that may have broken my perl | 10:54 |
| Trencher| | so let me try in a different target.. | 10:54 |
| wiza | Binky: been meaning to start learning spanish when I have time | 10:54 |
| Binky | I know, win sucks, but my pc is broken, i use one of a friend | 10:54 |
| wiza | Binky: surprise your friend and install linux :D | 10:55 |
| bef0rd | when in doubt, put linux on it | 10:55 |
| * Binky wants to learn playing banjo | 10:55 | |
| bef0rd | put linux on that banjo too | 10:55 |
| RST38h | and put yourself in a bigger doubt | 10:55 |
| Trencher| | liri: what do you mean? a vm or installing scratchbox onto debian? | 10:55 |
| Binky | I'll present him a friend called Knoppix | 10:56 |
| bef0rd | Binky, el instalador de windows es mas facil | 10:56 |
| Trencher| | lol | 10:56 |
| liri | linux on the banjo would rock | 10:56 |
| X-Fade | chelli: pong | 10:56 |
| Binky | bef0rd, si, pero me quiere instalar diablo , que solo va para n8x0 y yo tengo la 770 | 10:57 |
| bef0rd | Os deseo suerte | 10:57 |
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| bef0rd | descarga de tablets-dev.nokia.com the hacker edition | 10:58 |
| Binky | liri, would be funnier than the instructions to install linux on a dead badger | 10:58 |
| Trencher| | i'm gonna reset the targer | 10:58 |
| Trencher| | *target | 10:58 |
| Trencher| | and try again | 10:58 |
| XTLi | "You're just like my brother. When he borrows a computer, this mysterious black window appears and he uses that. I never see it when I use it" | 10:58 |
| X-Fade | mranostay: Still there? | 10:58 |
| Binky | bef0rd, i prefer os2006 | 10:58 |
| Trencher| | LOL | 10:58 |
| Trencher| | that is a awesome quote | 10:58 |
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| bef0rd | haha, Y eso que me lo dijiste en español, y lo entendi mal :) | 10:59 |
| Binky | Lol | 10:59 |
| bef0rd | entendi que *querias* instalar diablo en el 770 | 10:59 |
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| bef0rd | http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/nokia_770.php | 11:00 |
| Binky | Eso es lo que quiere el flasheador | 11:00 |
| bef0rd | Yeah, I got it. The deal is, I dont know if the current Windows flashers supports flashing 770, or only n8x0 | 11:00 |
| Binky | Yes, eso baje, la imagen, pero ese flasher me baja automticamente Diablo | 11:01 |
| bef0rd | there is an option there to select the firmware rom | 11:01 |
| Binky | That's it | 11:01 |
| Binky | But it says the .bin is not valid | 11:01 |
| bef0rd | ok, that probably means that its not compatible | 11:01 |
| Macor | hi | 11:01 |
| bef0rd | or the rom is corrupted | 11:02 |
| bef0rd | did you check md5sums? | 11:02 |
| Binky | Macor, hi...! | 11:02 |
| Binky | bef0rd, i never knew the use of that file, lol | 11:02 |
| bef0rd | :P | 11:03 |
| Macor | i had to go the kde route instead of nit-debian | 11:04 |
| Binky | What should i check | 11:04 |
| Macor | debian is very nice but it needs the hw support | 11:04 |
| * bef0rd busca la ayuda divina | 11:04 | |
| *** mardi__ has left #maemo | 11:04 | |
| * Binky gives bef0rd ilumination | 11:05 | |
| Macor | if it had the hardware working as well as maemo then it would be an easy replacement | 11:05 |
| Macor | alsa and bt tethering don't easily work :) | 11:06 |
| Binky | Macor KDE works better? | 11:06 |
| Macor | once they get those working i would use nit-debian and never look back | 11:06 |
| bef0rd | Binky, did you get the software from here http://europe.nokia.com/770/support ? | 11:06 |
| Macor | yes | 11:06 |
| Macor | mostly because it uses maemo | 11:07 |
| Macor | so the hardware works properly | 11:07 |
| Macor | it just replaces hildon with itself | 11:07 |
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| bef0rd | that's what I was wondering, proper wifi, bt, hw support | 11:08 |
| Macor | printing.. bt tethering.. sound.. all work | 11:08 |
| bef0rd | I mean, with nit-debian | 11:08 |
| Macor | you can print from koffice | 11:08 |
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| Binky | bef0rd, 404 | 11:09 |
| bef0rd | http://europe.nokia.com/A4144790 | 11:10 |
| Binky | I did, yes | 11:11 |
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| Macor | bef0rd ... nit is great except the bt is a bith | 11:11 |
| rm_you | err | 11:11 |
| rm_you | really quick, what is "United States of America" in Spanish? | 11:11 |
| Macor | and the alsa config is screwed and i couldnt figure out why | 11:11 |
| rm_you | I'm trying to buy something from a website in Uruguay >_> | 11:12 |
| bef0rd | Estados Unidos de America | 11:12 |
| rm_you | ah k | 11:12 |
| rm_you | I know ZERO spanish | 11:12 |
| rm_you | this is interesting | 11:12 |
| Binky | Spanish is amusing | 11:12 |
| bef0rd | although USA gets used alot too | 11:12 |
| Trencher| | meh | 11:12 |
| rm_you | in this case it was just Estados Unidos | 11:12 |
| Binky | bef0rd, que demonios significa amusing? Lol | 11:13 |
| *** sp3000 has joined #maemo | 11:13 | |
| rm_you | bah i dont know which fields to put my address in >_> | 11:13 |
| Trencher| | bef0rd: i'm going to reinstall scratchbox and see if that fixes it | 11:13 |
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| Binky | rm_you, there are another united states? | 11:13 |
| rm_you | I may need to wait till I go back to Texas and get one of my friends that speaks spanish to order this for me | 11:13 |
| Trencher| | when running ./configure, it crashes on trying to compile something using the dynaloader, saying something about symbols | 11:13 |
| bef0rd | Estados unidos arabes creo | 11:13 |
| *** florian_ is now known as florian | 11:13 | |
| rm_you | hrm | 11:13 |
| Binky | bef0rd, you win... | 11:13 |
| rm_you | is that united arab emirates (UAE)? | 11:14 |
| Binky | But it is United EMIRATES | 11:14 |
| Binky | Yes, it is | 11:14 |
| rm_you | heh | 11:14 |
| bef0rd | I are the win | 11:14 |
| Binky | LOL | 11:14 |
| rm_you | I was on a forum yesterday that banned the word "Arab" as hate-speech >_< | 11:14 |
| Trencher| | how can i tell what version of os i have on my tablet from the prompt | 11:15 |
| Trencher| | ? | 11:15 |
| rm_you | I was under the impression that "Arab" is the actual word for someone from that region <_< | 11:15 |
| rm_you | Trencher|: well | 11:16 |
| rm_you | Trencher|: apt-cache policy osso-software-version-rx34 | 11:16 |
| Trencher| | cuz device info has none none none lol | 11:16 |
| rm_you | if that comes up No Package Found, it is Chinook? | 11:16 |
| rm_you | else Diablo? | 11:16 |
| rm_you | <_< | 11:16 |
| Binky | rm_you , isn't it? | 11:16 |
| XTLi | Maybe they're jealous to african americans change of name every two days | 11:16 |
| rm_you | well... i guess that only helps with 2008 | 11:16 |
| bef0rd | uname -a ? | 11:16 |
| rm_you | Binky: yes, i still think so | 11:16 |
| rm_you | Binky: i think they are just strange, or someone didnt think that policy through much | 11:17 |
| bef0rd | I think nokia upgraded kernels on every version | 11:17 |
| Trencher| | unable to locate package | 11:17 |
| Trencher| | so chinook? | 11:17 |
| Trencher| | ok | 11:17 |
| Trencher| | then i was building for the right platform | 11:17 |
| Trencher| | lol | 11:17 |
| Binky | In spanish, sometimes is used as a despective, arabe/moro arab/nigger | 11:18 |
| rm_you | hrm | 11:18 |
| rm_you | well, it is a US website | 11:18 |
| rm_you | but maybe the person that wrote the rule spoke spanish <_< | 11:18 |
| *** jpuderer has quit IRC | 11:19 | |
| Binky | Or maybe their server is revealing against themselves and killing them | 11:19 |
| Trencher| | time to open my time wasting program | 11:20 |
| Trencher| | while i wait for install | 11:20 |
| RST38h | rm_you: more likely the person was stupid | 11:20 |
| Trencher| | :) Cortex Command | 11:20 |
| bef0rd | internet explorer! | 11:20 |
| *** guardian has quit IRC | 11:20 | |
| Trencher| | no, 4chan is down | 11:20 |
| rm_you | lol x 3 | 11:20 |
| Trencher| | so nothing to do there | 11:20 |
| RST38h | rm_you: is "towelhead" banned as well? =) | 11:20 |
| bef0rd | I cried when 4chan was haxed | 11:21 |
| Binky | Man, i just saw an ad of That 70's Show with a Van Halen song | 11:21 |
| rm_you | RST38h: not in the list <_< | 11:21 |
| bef0rd | (just kidding) | 11:21 |
| RST38h | rm_you: See? They are basically encouraging you to use towelhead instead of arab | 11:21 |
| rm_you | lol | 11:21 |
| bef0rd | Binky, descaro el update wizard que segun esa pagina es compatible con el n770? ( y los firmware supongo) | 11:21 |
| bef0rd | descargo | 11:21 |
| bef0rd | * | 11:21 |
| rm_you | ah! what is "descargo"? i see that a lot | 11:21 |
| RST38h | and even if they ban that, there is a whole Cyrillic charset with As and Bs... ;))) | 11:21 |
| Binky | Downlod | 11:21 |
| rm_you | ah :P | 11:22 |
| RST38h | rm_you: BTW, try it - see how pissed moderators will become ;) | 11:22 |
| rm_you | i'd rather not be banned :P | 11:22 |
| bef0rd | try it | 11:22 |
| Binky | Erm.. Do you have 770? I don't want to bother =) | 11:22 |
| bef0rd | no I don't | 11:22 |
| RST38h | rm_you: Well, you are not doing anything prohibited by forum rules, right? | 11:22 |
| rm_you | RST38h: it says "no hatespeech" and has a list... i assume the list is not inclusive | 11:23 |
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| samppa | hello | 11:24 |
| Binky | bef0rd, y porque lo descargarias entonces? | 11:24 |
| Binky | samppa, hi! | 11:24 |
| bef0rd | eh? | 11:24 |
| bef0rd | le pregunte si usted lo descargo | 11:24 |
| Binky | Ahhhhhh | 11:24 |
| bef0rd | tal vez no use los acentos adecuados | 11:24 |
| samppa | im trying to build a package for diablo with autobuilder but i keep getting errors like: Failed to fetch http://osso.stage.dmz/pool/maemo4.1/free/libx/libxrender/libxrender-dev_0.9.2-1osso1_armel.deb 401 Authorization Required | 11:24 |
| samppa | and so on | 11:25 |
| X-Fade | Binky, bef0rd: Please try to keep conversations in english. | 11:25 |
| samppa | there is no bug reported on this one | 11:25 |
| Binky | X-Fade, i'll do | 11:25 |
| RST38h | rm_you: So, the goal is to word things in a way that does not formally represent hate speech but is =) | 11:25 |
| rm_you | X-Fade: can you set ~autobuilder? :P | 11:25 |
| X-Fade | samppa: Let me look what is going on.. | 11:25 |
| samppa | okey | 11:25 |
| samppa | thanx | 11:25 |
| rm_you | also, who was it that was in charge of the wiki account thing? (his nick here) | 11:25 |
| Binky | bef0rd, i'm not (acostumbrado) to people talk me of (usted). But yes, i downloaded that one | 11:26 |
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| bef0rd | X-Fade, ok, sorry, no problem | 11:26 |
| Binky | X-Fade, i didn't know how to translate those words | 11:27 |
| X-Fade | bef0rd: It is no problem ;) It is just nice for everybody to be able to learn from what you discuss. | 11:27 |
| bef0rd | Binky, well, it *should* work then | 11:28 |
| *** Jo2006 has left #maemo | 11:28 | |
| samppa | X-Fade: sometimes i get size mismatch error which should be under fixing but now im gettin that authorization required error... | 11:29 |
| bef0rd | Binky, download md5sum.exe for windows, and check the file | 11:29 |
| X-Fade | samppa: They are 2 different problems. | 11:29 |
| Binky | Ok | 11:29 |
| samppa | X-Fade: yep but those both still occur | 11:29 |
| Binky | Btw, what is 770 battery model (same as N800) | 11:30 |
| samppa | bp-5l | 11:30 |
| X-Fade | samppa: Size mismatch is because someone uploaded the same package twice without changing the version number. | 11:31 |
| Binky | samppa, thank you | 11:31 |
| X-Fade | samppa: The 401 is because of a problem in the export control of the repository server. | 11:31 |
| samppa | X-Fade: anyways, idea of autobuilder is good but it should be working before it is the only way to upload to diablo extras | 11:32 |
| X-Fade | samppa: Well, it was ;) But since there wasn't any large scale testing by the community, we find these problems now. | 11:33 |
| X-Fade | samppa: Remember it is a community effort. | 11:34 |
| samppa | X-Fade: yeah i try to keep that in my mind :) | 11:34 |
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| samppa | X-Fade: should we fill a bug of this ? | 11:36 |
| X-Fade | samppa: I'm going to resubmit your package to the builder to see if I can reproduce it. | 11:36 |
| bef0rd | Binky, http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howto_flashlatestnokiaimagewithwindows/ that's what I was reading, all the links seem to work from here | 11:36 |
| Binky | Taking a look... | 11:37 |
| samppa | X-Fade: ok, im not sure if it will build ok now but it would be nice to get atleast to the compiling phase to see what is it still missing.. :) | 11:38 |
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| Binky | bef0rd, that's what i did | 11:41 |
| bef0rd | that's what she said | 11:41 |
| bef0rd | Binky, did you check md5sums? | 11:42 |
| Binky | I can not a this moment, i am not able to use the computer | 11:42 |
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| *** Italodance has joined #maemo | 11:43 | |
| Binky | But i have not the original nokia usb cable | 11:43 |
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| bef0rd | I could be wrong, but I think its a generic usb cable | 11:44 |
| hrw | Binky: any miniusb cable is ok | 11:44 |
| *** lardman_ is now known as lardman | 11:44 | |
| hrw | I do not even know where I have original 770 cable | 11:44 |
| lardman | hallo | 11:44 |
| Binky | This will install the update wizard and the Nokia USB cable driver if needed | 11:45 |
| Binky | If it needs a driver... | 11:45 |
| Binky | lardman, hiii | 11:45 |
| bef0rd | Binky, the windows way is clicking, next, next, next :P | 11:45 |
| bef0rd | hrw, he is trying to flash a 770 with windows, but he is having problems loading the firmware on the nokia software updater, have you had any experience doing it? | 11:46 |
| Binky | Yeez | 11:46 |
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| Binky | hrw had enough with my troubles a few days ago... | 11:47 |
| hrw | bef0rd: never used windows to flash tablet | 11:47 |
| lardman | I've never got it to work | 11:48 |
| * qwerty12 has used flasher-3.0, 0xFFFF & the windows flasher fine to flash 'is N800 :/ | 11:49 | |
| Binky | Wtf is 0xFFFF? | 11:49 |
| bef0rd | I believe its a mac flasher | 11:50 |
| bef0rd | mac based flasher tool | 11:50 |
| lardman | open source flasher, check Garage | 11:50 |
| hrw | 0xffff is not mac | 11:50 |
| bef0rd | ah ok | 11:50 |
| hrw | it is opensourced nokia flasher | 11:50 |
| lardman | reverse engineered isn't it? | 11:50 |
| hrw | but cannot use fiasco images iirc | 11:50 |
| lardman | hrw: yep | 11:50 |
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| X-Fade | hrw: I thought it can flash FIASCO. | 11:52 |
| X-Fade | hrw: It can even build them. | 11:52 |
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| *** hellwolf-n800 has joined #maemo | 11:54 | |
| bef0rd | Binky, http://www.cduv.org/2006/06/10/actualizando-el-so-del-nokia-770-a-la-nueva-beta-2006-desde-windows/ | 11:55 |
| hrw | X-Fade: o.. I did not followed it too much. nice to know | 11:56 |
| X-Fade | hrw: He even seems to have created a gui for it. ;) | 11:59 |
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| Trencher| | no still doesn't work | 12:09 |
| Trencher| | /scratchbox/tools/lib/perl5/5.8.4/i686-linux-thread-multi/auto/DynaLoader/DynaLoader.a: could not read symbols: File in wrong format | 12:09 |
| Trencher| | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status | 12:09 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 12:10 |
| lardman | nice, looks like those TomTom RDS receivers are simply serial devices | 12:10 |
| lardman | hi Jaffa | 12:10 |
| lardman | I wonder if the headphone jack could be driven as a serial port | 12:10 |
| *** atul has quit IRC | 12:10 | |
| lardman | might be easier to do some soldering and use a usb-serial converter | 12:10 |
| *** Italodance has joined #maemo | 12:10 | |
| X-Fade | lardman: Well, TV-out is possible via the jack. | 12:11 |
| lardman | really?! | 12:11 |
| X-Fade | Sure. | 12:11 |
| *** atul has joined #maemo | 12:11 | |
| lardman | :) do you have a link to some discussion/etc? | 12:11 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Same 4 pole jack as N95, same cpu. Support in kernel is only for a smaller framebuffer IIRC. | 12:12 |
| lardman | X-Fade: cool | 12:12 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Check the omap sources ;) | 12:13 |
| lardman | X-Fade: will do :) | 12:13 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Although I don't want to put you on yet another project. | 12:13 |
| lardman | ah, that's made my morning far nicer :) | 12:13 |
| lardman | X-Fade: I think there will be enough other people interested in getting it done | 12:14 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: We've discussed this on #maemo before? | 12:14 |
| nomis | X-Fade: wow, sounds cool. | 12:14 |
| lardman | I don't think so, at least I don't remember | 12:14 |
| lcuk | tv-out via headphones...hmmm . o O ( ??? ) | 12:15 |
| lcuk | mornin folks | 12:15 |
| nomis | X-Fade: so the mic input can be switched to TV out or something? | 12:15 |
| lardman | lcuk: sounds like it will output your internal framebuffer | 12:15 |
| lardman | lcuk: which is available as a framebuffer already iirc? | 12:15 |
| rm_you | that sounds neat | 12:16 |
| rm_you | morning lcuk | 12:16 |
| lcuk | NOOOO my internal framebuffer dances to its own tune. my thoughts are private etc. | 12:16 |
| lardman | X-Fade: you've opened a can or worms now ;) :) | 12:16 |
| lcuk | ooooooh, you meant the framebuffer on my nokia | 12:16 |
| lardman | lcuk: yeah, the other would be 18 rated | 12:16 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Really, this has all been discussed before. | 12:16 |
| XTLi | Hmm | 12:16 |
| X-Fade | lardman: It was even in the leaked omap hardware diagram iirc? | 12:16 |
| lardman | X-Fade: oh well, I must have missed it | 12:17 |
| lcuk | lardman, the other one has been censored and is not up for sale any more :( | 12:17 |
| lardman | X-Fade: what I assumed, from the various emails, etc., was that some hardware solder point was missing | 12:17 |
| lcuk | yes i thought so as well | 12:17 |
| X-Fade | I seem to recall that someone measured it? | 12:19 |
| lardman | http://linux.omap.com/pipermail/linux-omap-open-source/2007-April/009599.html slightly different chip, but presumably there's the logic in this source, if it's not in the Nokia source already | 12:20 |
| lcuk | thats certainly very interesting if possible. but was certain all the outputs were boarded up. where does the audio output come from - is it directly from the omap package or is it another discrete amp? | 12:21 |
| lardman | qwerty12: ping | 12:21 |
| lardman | lcuk: I assumed it was directly wired to the hardware codec, but that was an assumption | 12:22 |
| XTLi | Didn't anyone write a wiki page? | 12:22 |
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| nomis | lardman: do these TMC receivers also spit out the other RDS data? | 12:23 |
| X-Fade | The needed cable is the CA-75U btw. | 12:23 |
| lardman | is that standard? I've got one with a PMP | 12:24 |
| lardman | at least it's 3.5mm to video out | 12:24 |
| X-Fade | lardman: 4 pole? | 12:24 |
| lcuk | plug the bugger in then lardman | 12:24 |
| lardman | nomis: no idea, but probably not | 12:24 |
| lardman | lcuk: when I get home | 12:24 |
| nomis | lardman: seems that some of the models are actually quite cheap. | 12:24 |
| lardman | X-Fade: yes | 12:24 |
| lardman | nomis: yeah, ~£20, I thought I might get one and do some hacking | 12:24 |
| RST38h | lardman: any progress on a2dp? =) | 12:25 |
| X-Fade | http://www.anythingbutipod.com/archives/2006/04/zen-vision-m-video-cable-other-4pole-35mm-pinouts.php | 12:25 |
| lardman | nomis: will have to work out the data format, and the location codes are still somewhat unknown | 12:25 |
| X-Fade | It seems that it has the same pinout as the Creative Zen Vision. | 12:25 |
| lardman | X-Fade: cool, that's the sort of thing | 12:25 |
| X-Fade | And otherwise you need to cut and rewire ;) | 12:26 |
| lardman | ah, I see | 12:26 |
| X-Fade | lardman: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Genuine-Nokia-Cable-CA-75U-N958GB/dp/B000ZOBR58 :) | 12:27 |
| X-Fade | 3.75 ukp, free shipping. | 12:27 |
| nomis | I wonder if there is any cable coding going on to be able to detect if there is a headset or a tv cable connected. | 12:28 |
| X-Fade | nomis: There is probably a resistance difference. | 12:28 |
| lardman | I'll see if I can nick one from a friend who had an N82 (or whichever was also omap2420) | 12:28 |
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| lardman | X-Fade: I;'ve added video out to http://wiki.maemo.org/Questions_for_Nokia#Hardware_support_questions | 12:32 |
| lcuk | :D | 12:32 |
| X-Fade | lardman: ;) | 12:32 |
| lardman | lcuk: well we do seem to be getting anwers, so it's working as hoped :) | 12:32 |
| lardman | nomis: http://www.phrack.org/issues.html?issue=64&id=5#article | 12:33 |
| lcuk | yer 100% agree | 12:33 |
| rm_you | lcuk: so anyway, i found some decent ghostscript packages for chinook that work in diablo (compiling it was dependency hell, so i gave up), and i have a commandline that does a decent job of jpegizing a pdf | 12:34 |
| rm_you | still working on getting it formatted perfectly, and optimizing the size (large...) | 12:34 |
| lardman | nomis: and this regarding those 3.5mm TomTom devices: http://www.opentom.org/Hardware_TMC | 12:34 |
| *** lardman is now known as lardman|coffee | 12:35 | |
| lcuk | rm_you, nows not really the best time to run over this - im at work and cant really go over anything major. do you wanna mail me with info and a binary and ill see if i can get it picking stuff up for you | 12:36 |
| lcuk | what res is it btw? cos ive been stretchblitting 4096*4096 quite rapidly | 12:36 |
| rm_you | lcuk: eh its fine i can talk to you when you get home | 12:36 |
| rm_you | lcuk: i set the res in the comandline | 12:36 |
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| rm_you | 200ppi seems to be legible | 12:37 |
| rm_you | the images end up being... | 12:37 |
| * rm_you checks | 12:37 | |
| nomis | lardman|coffee: thanks. | 12:37 |
| lardman|coffee | wow 2MB/s from maemo.org | 12:37 |
| lcuk | mmmmmm coffee | 12:37 |
| qwerty12 | lardman|coffee, pong | 12:38 |
| lardman|coffee | qwerty12: could you look at your n810 diagram and tell us what the headphone jack is attached to, I don't have one handy | 12:38 |
| qwerty12 | searching... | 12:39 |
| rm_you | lcuk: 1700x2200 per page | 12:39 |
| rm_you | lcuk: at this res | 12:39 |
| lardman|coffee | thanks, will bbiab | 12:39 |
| Trencher| | ok | 12:39 |
| Trencher| | this is making no sense.. | 12:39 |
| Trencher| | perl: /usr/bin/perl /etc/perl /usr/lib/perl /usr/X11R6/bin/perl /usr/bin/X11/perl /usr/share/perl /usr/share/man/man1/perl.1.gz | 12:39 |
| rm_you | lcuk: 1700x2200 pixels at 200x200ppi | 12:39 |
| Trencher| | err | 12:40 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /] > whereis perl | 12:40 |
| Trencher| | perl: /usr/bin/perl /etc/perl /usr/lib/perl /usr/X11R6/bin/perl /usr/bin/X11/perl /usr/share/perl /usr/share/man/man1/perl.1.gz | 12:40 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: since you're doing a lot of kernel stuffs - did anyone succeed with kexec? | 12:40 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /usr/bin] > perl -v | 12:40 |
| Trencher| | This is perl, v5.8.4 built for i686-linux-thread-multi | 12:40 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /usr/bin] > ./perl -v | 12:40 |
| Trencher| | This is perl, v5.8.3 built for arm-linux-gnueabi-thread-multi | 12:40 |
| Trencher| | wat | 12:40 |
| lcuk | rm_you, the only problem with that i see is loading time perpage | 12:40 |
| rm_you | lcuk: yeah i'm working on it... | 12:40 |
| qwerty12 | Stskeeps, No, fanoush is working on it though from what I read last time | 12:40 |
| bef0rd | Trencher|, check PATH? | 12:40 |
| lcuk | not your fault though | 12:40 |
| rm_you | lcuk: need to figure out how to optimize this so that i can produce readable text at much lower ppi | 12:40 |
| bef0rd | I was actually checking that there is indeed an arm binary | 12:40 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: alright.. it could be really interesting from POV of booting | 12:41 |
| qwerty12 | I can't for the life of me, make out this diagram >.< | 12:41 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, which perl | 12:41 |
| rm_you | lcuk: or else, i look into including some of the ghostscript code to allow your program to DIRECTLY read the pdf data | 12:41 |
| rm_you | lcuk: which is actually a much better solution | 12:41 |
| qwerty12 | Internal perl can mess with a installed perl in scratchbox | 12:41 |
| Trencher| | crashanddie: i am trying to build irssi w/perl support. and i'm having that problem | 12:41 |
| lcuk | which is what i suggested at first - pdf isnt actually that complex aformat once you remove the filesystem from around it | 12:41 |
| Trencher| | there is a conflice | 12:41 |
| Trencher| | *conflict | 12:42 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, which perl | 12:42 |
| Trencher| | what do you mean "which perl"? | 12:42 |
| crashanddie | TYPE IT IN A CONSOLE | 12:42 |
| crashanddie | :D | 12:42 |
| Trencher| | lol | 12:42 |
| XTLi | :D | 12:42 |
| Trencher| | see above? | 12:42 |
| lcuk | mornin crashandgrumpysod | 12:42 |
| Trencher| | it seems i have 2 | 12:43 |
| Trencher| | lol | 12:43 |
| crashanddie | hey lcuk :) | 12:43 |
| Trencher| | and i have no clue where the 5.8.4 is | 12:43 |
| Trencher| | because i took it out of path | 12:43 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, "which perl" will tell you that, ffs | 12:43 |
| *** zap has joined #maemo | 12:43 | |
| crashanddie | Why do people ignore what I say ? | 12:43 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /usr/bin] > which perl | 12:43 |
| Trencher| | /usr/bin/perl | 12:43 |
| Trencher| | lol | 12:43 |
| Trencher| | which conflicts with what i posted above | 12:44 |
| lcuk | which which | 12:44 |
| Trencher| | wat | 12:44 |
| Trencher| | lol | 12:44 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /usr/bin] > which which | 12:44 |
| Trencher| | /scratchbox/devkits/debian-etch/bin/which | 12:44 |
| lcuk | :D | 12:44 |
| Trencher| | :( | 12:44 |
| crashanddie | which `which which` | 12:44 |
| bef0rd | we wich you a merry.. oh no | 12:44 |
| Trencher| | same | 12:44 |
| RST38h | crash: next! | 12:45 |
| Trencher| | plz dont forkbomb me lol | 12:45 |
| XTLi | There you go | 12:45 |
| lcuk | hang on "debian-etch" isn't it meant to be a different target (ie one for diablo?) | 12:45 |
| lcuk | or is that the host mother os? | 12:46 |
| crashanddie | nope | 12:46 |
| bef0rd | PATH=/scratchbox/devkits/cputransp/bin:/scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/bin:/scratchbox/devkits/debian-etch/bin:/scratchbox/devkits/perl/bin:/scratchbox/tools/bin:/targets/links/arch_tools/bin:/host_usr/bin:/scratchbox/compilers/bin:/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/X11R6/bin:/sbin:/usr/sbin | 12:46 |
| crashanddie | the target is CHINOOK_ARMEL | 12:46 |
| crashanddie | which should be fine | 12:46 |
| Trencher| | hmmm | 12:46 |
| Trencher| | how to fix... | 12:46 |
| crashanddie | well | 12:46 |
| crashanddie | what I don't understand | 12:46 |
| crashanddie | is that you have a different version in /usr/bin and /usr/bin | 12:46 |
| crashanddie | xD | 12:46 |
| qwerty12 | Trencher|, try this, wait | 12:46 |
| lcuk | bbbl | 12:47 |
| Trencher| | exactly | 12:47 |
| Trencher| | my point | 12:47 |
| crashanddie | lcuk, aaye ccya | 12:47 |
| qwerty12 | go to \scratchbox\users\$USER\targets | 12:47 |
| crashanddie | wtf ? | 12:47 |
| crashanddie | BACKSLASHES ? | 12:47 |
| crashanddie | what country are you from ? Wales ? | 12:47 |
| qwerty12 | I'm in windows, ext2ifs | 12:47 |
| Trencher| | there | 12:47 |
| qwerty12 | Open DIABLO_ARMEL.config | 12:47 |
| qwerty12 | And remove perl: | 12:48 |
| Trencher| | CHINOOK_ARMEL, even | 12:48 |
| qwerty12 | Oh. I'm using latest sdk. | 12:48 |
| Trencher| | lol i'm not using latest os | 12:48 |
| XTLi | To escape escape, use \\ | 12:48 |
| crashanddie | I thought we were supposed to use the red door ? | 12:48 |
| Trencher| | in DEVKIT_NAMES? | 12:48 |
| qwerty12 | Yes | 12:49 |
| Trencher| | \\ SBOX_DEVKIT_NAMES=perl:debian-etch:maemo3-tools:cputransp | 12:49 |
| Trencher| | SBOX_DEVKIT_NAMES=debian-etch:maemo3-tools:cputransp | 12:49 |
| Trencher| | good? | 12:49 |
| qwerty12 | yep | 12:49 |
| Trencher| | written | 12:49 |
| qwerty12 | Change targets and change back to CHINOOK_ARMEL | 12:49 |
| Veggen | Hmm. Mauku, is that open source/with developers you can talk with? | 12:49 |
| Trencher| | Shell restarting... | 12:50 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: ~] > perl -v | 12:50 |
| Trencher| | This is perl, v5.8.4 built for i686-linux-thread-multi | 12:50 |
| qwerty12 | shit | 12:50 |
| Trencher| | lol | 12:50 |
| qwerty12 | crashanddie, if you use rapidshare, are your speeds going really slow? | 12:51 |
| hrw | sbox.. | 12:51 |
| crashanddie | qwerty12, Erhm... I've noticed that sometimes there are very, extreme slowdowns on the network yes | 12:52 |
| Trencher| | any other options? | 12:52 |
| qwerty12 | crashanddie, thanks :). I thought it was my ISP capping me :(. I only get 48K when downloading off any server. | 12:52 |
| Trencher| | rapidshare is capping? | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | wow | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | time to move on | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | first that capcha stuff | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | then premium accts | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | now capping? | 12:53 |
| qwerty12 | Yeah, those cats annoyed the hell out of me | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | mediafire | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | for now | 12:53 |
| qwerty12 | My sister who has a premium account though, says her speeds are slow though too | 12:53 |
| crashanddie | the irony | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | is still free and anticapcha | 12:53 |
| Trencher| | stupid perl | 12:54 |
| Trencher| | :( | 12:54 |
| XTLi | It's always been useless | 12:54 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, which version of perl do you need ? | 12:54 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, just alias and force the version you need | 12:55 |
| Trencher| | i need the 5.8.3 | 12:55 |
| Trencher| | for building | 12:55 |
| Trencher| | and wat | 12:55 |
| crashanddie | OOOOOOOHHHH I smell coffee | 12:55 |
| Trencher| | oic | 12:55 |
| crashanddie | brb | 12:55 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, just alias the 5.8.3 version as the default one | 12:56 |
| Trencher| | ok | 12:56 |
| Trencher| | now i'm confused | 12:56 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /] > alias perl=/usr/bin/perl | 12:56 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: /] > perl -v | 12:56 |
| Trencher| | This is perl, v5.8.4 built for i686-linux-thread-multi | 12:56 |
| crashanddie | because it is | 12:56 |
| crashanddie | btw, have you rebooted scratchbox since you changed it ? | 12:57 |
| Veggen | btw. os2008/nit is kind of hard to troubleshoot bluetooth-network-wise. There *should* be a log. And my die-hard Unix habits doesn't like the "if it don't work, reboot"-strategy. | 12:57 |
| Trencher| | changed what | 12:57 |
| Veggen | I was configuring networking through a new phone yesterday. | 12:57 |
| Trencher| | the sbox_devkit_names? | 12:57 |
| crashanddie | aye | 12:57 |
| Veggen | I tried everything, for hours. Until I remembered that last time, it didn't work before I rebooted either. So I did, and it worked. *grmf* | 12:57 |
| Trencher| | yes | 12:57 |
| X-Fade | lardman|coffee: There you have your anwser from qgil already ;) | 12:58 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, I meant like, rebooted the SB services ? | 12:58 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, not just the console | 12:59 |
| Trencher| | o, no. i switched targets and back | 12:59 |
| Trencher| | does that reboot them? | 12:59 |
| crashanddie | no | 12:59 |
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| crashanddie | /etc/init.d/scratchbox-core restart | 12:59 |
| rm_you | X-Fade: he didnt ask the question properly >_> | 12:59 |
| rm_you | lardman|coffee: you need to rephrase the question specific to the 3.5 jack | 12:59 |
| X-Fade | rm_you: Ah, you think it would be an external device? | 13:00 |
| Trencher| | no dice | 13:00 |
| rm_you | X-Fade: the thing quim is talking about is the USB video out thing | 13:01 |
| Trencher| | :) alias works | 13:01 |
| crashanddie | Trencher|, :) | 13:02 |
| crashanddie | told you to listen to me from the start | 13:02 |
| Trencher| | break for food | 13:05 |
| Trencher| | then i'll try to make the program | 13:05 |
| qwerty12 | lardman|coffee, ping | 13:08 |
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| RST38h | qwerty | 13:10 |
| RST38h | uiop | 13:10 |
| qwerty12_games | RST38h | 13:10 |
| qwerty12_games | jkl | 13:11 |
| rm_you | RST38hjkl? | 13:13 |
| rm_you | damn | 13:13 |
| rm_you | beat to it | 13:13 |
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| * qwerty12_games SO wants UT99 on the tablet but it uses i386 asm :( | 13:16 | |
| *** qwerty12_games is now known as qwerty12 | 13:16 | |
| lcuk | X-Fade, rm_you : no, he said devices supporting video out - thats not quite the same really is it - especially since the usb video out is a different framebuffer and may not actually support all the current modes or mannerisms expected by the epson lcd chip | 13:17 |
| lcuk | we cant expect to turn up and run our software on untested devices - can we? | 13:18 |
| * lcuk will be taking videos at any rate | 13:19 | |
| *** lardman|coffee is now known as lardman | 13:21 | |
| lardman | hello | 13:21 |
| qwerty12 | ello | 13:21 |
| lardman | rm_you, X-Fade: Am I to take it that's a "yes it works, ask them how"? | 13:22 |
| RST38h | Gentlemen, lemme bring to your attention the fact that Epson chip does not have video output | 13:22 |
| lardman | RST38h: it does support it, whether it's attached is a different question, but we're talking about omap output | 13:23 |
| RST38h | So whatever video you are gonna get (unlikely) will have to come from the internal 640x480 buffer | 13:23 |
| lardman | indeed | 13:23 |
| lardman | qwerty12: what did you find? | 13:23 |
| qwerty12 | lardman, pm | 13:23 |
| X-Fade | lardman: It can't hurt to be specific and ask for the jack port.. | 13:23 |
| lardman | ah, cheers :) | 13:23 |
| lardman | X-Fade: ok | 13:23 |
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| RST38h | lardman: doesn't OMAP require some extra components to have a real video out? | 13:25 |
| RST38h | or can you really plug directly TV directly into chip pins? | 13:26 |
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| lardman | that's the question of course | 13:27 |
| lardman | well there the gpio_ape going in from the LED controller | 13:29 |
| lardman | so I'd guess there's no reason why that shouldn't be wired up | 13:29 |
| lardman | time to look at the kernel code | 13:29 |
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| lardman | Well that kernel source has definite references to tv out in it | 13:32 |
| lardman | search for "OMAP2_OUTPUT_TV" for example | 13:32 |
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| X-Fade | lardman: Check the frame buffer size. There was a problem with that IIRC. | 13:33 |
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| lardman | X-Fade: iirc the on-chip and epson fb sizes are different, I was just thinking about writing to the on-chip one directly and outputting that | 13:34 |
| lardman | assuming it's, iirc, 640x480 | 13:34 |
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| lardman | lcuk: I seem to remember you had an email discussion about whether the onchip one was mapped, and the conclusuion was that it's one of the 3 framebuffers? | 13:37 |
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| Trencher| | ok | 13:41 |
| Trencher| | here i go | 13:41 |
| Trencher| | no dice | 13:42 |
| Trencher| | still building with 5.8.4 | 13:42 |
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| lcuk | lardman, it wasnt email, it was in the justification discussion. yes it appears that one of the older os's (bora?) attempted to use and map this memory area | 13:43 |
| lcuk | but this appears to have been removed (that was why i spotted one thing and fanoush saw another) | 13:44 |
| lardman | That "OMAP2_OUTPUT_TV" isn't in the maemo kernel code, so will have to see what other differences there are between the two | 13:44 |
| jott | Trencher|: i told you already yesterday. set SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=/usr/bin/perl and make sure /usr/bin is before the /scratchbox/tools/bin | 13:45 |
| lardman | lcuk: hmm, I wonder why, and what needs to be done to put it back | 13:45 |
| lardman | bbiab | 13:45 |
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| lcuk | no, it wasnt used as a native framebuffer - i think it was wanted to be used, but the practicalities must have turned them off | 13:45 |
| lardman|meeting | it wasn't used, but was available to be written to... | 13:46 |
| lcuk | as we know its the wrong size and just causes extra complications for epson for not much benefit on its own (ie without iva) | 13:46 |
| lardman|meeting | except for video output! | 13:46 |
| jott | is the video out really connected?! | 13:46 |
| lcuk | on the justificaiton page fanoush mentioned another place within the kernel where it becomes available (at least i think) | 13:46 |
| lcuk | it might be, but theres no data going to it | 13:47 |
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| jott | "it might be"? | 13:47 |
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| jott | i mean before putting effort in it, it should be 100% sure that it is connected ;) | 13:48 |
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| lcuk | well im at work - im not putting the effort in :) its x-fade thats sparked this off | 13:49 |
| lcuk | anyway, back later | 13:50 |
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| Trencher| | jott: "make sure /usr/bin is before the /scratchbox/tools/bin" in path? | 13:59 |
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| jott | Trencher|: ah yes. | 14:01 |
| Trencher| | jott: also, do i need to restart scratchbox after setting SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=/usr/bin/perl | 14:02 |
| Trencher| | no. trying configure | 14:06 |
| jott | no | 14:06 |
| jott | it is an environment variable. | 14:06 |
| Trencher| | now... checking for working Perl support... not found, building without Perl | 14:06 |
| jott | have you done export SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=/usr/bin/perl ?! | 14:07 |
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| Trencher| | yes | 14:07 |
| Trencher| | PATH=/usr/bin:/scratchbox/devkits/cputransp/bin:/scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/bin:/scratchbox...... | 14:08 |
| jott | and perl -v says arm? | 14:08 |
| Trencher| | SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=/usr/bin/perl | 14:08 |
| Trencher| | from env | 14:08 |
| Trencher| | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: ~/irssi-0.8.12] > perl -v | 14:08 |
| Trencher| | This is perl, v5.8.3 built for arm-linux-gnueabi-thread-multi | 14:08 |
| jott | then you have to fix the package ;) | 14:08 |
| jott | ~lart sbox for being broken by design :P | 14:09 |
| * infobot dumps 42 tons of dirt, manure, and fish heads on sbox for being broken by design :P | 14:09 | |
| Trencher| | :( | 14:09 |
| Trencher| | fix which package? perl or irssi? | 14:09 |
| Trencher| | lol | 14:09 |
| jott | irssi | 14:10 |
| jott | you know how you get your native perl. | 14:11 |
| qwerty12 | irssi is segfault prone on the tablets anyway | 14:11 |
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| jott | qwerty12: uh why should it?! | 14:11 |
| jott | (or why does it :) | 14:11 |
| qwerty12 | jott, no idea :(. I've tried many builds, stable and svn. I think for chat it works ok, but some commands segfault it. Sometimes, /nick works, sometimes it doesn't :/ | 14:12 |
| qwerty12 | BitchX and weechat work ok though | 14:12 |
| qwerty12 | but irssi is king | 14:13 |
| jott | qwerty12: ever tried to get a backtrace? ;) | 14:15 |
| * aquatix just uses irssi over ssh | 14:16 | |
| aquatix | 24/7 online too ;) | 14:16 |
| * aquatix wanders off | 14:16 | |
| qwerty12 | jott, nah. I'm a n00b so I don't understand *trace's output. | 14:16 |
| qwerty12 | Why do nokia carry kernel headers for 2.6.16 when the kernel is 2.6.21? http://repository.maemo.org/pool/diablo/free/l/linux-kernel-headers/ | 14:17 |
| jott | qwerty12: there is kernel-diablo-headers, but i agree that this package seems to be deprecated ;) | 14:19 |
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| qwerty12 | jott, ah, didn't see that one. Yes, no idea why nokia still carry it in the diablo repo. Maybe a Replaces and provides tag on kernel-diablo-headers would be better. | 14:20 |
| jott | probably just forgotten that it is still there ;> | 14:21 |
| jott | file a bug report against it, if it annoys you :> | 14:22 |
| qwerty12 | Heh, on second thoughts, I'm not that annoyed by it | 14:22 |
| Trencher| | join #irssi | 14:26 |
| Trencher| | rofl | 14:26 |
| Trencher| | sry | 14:26 |
| Trencher| | needs more / | 14:27 |
| qwerty12 | I joined, now where's my free spam! | 14:27 |
| Trencher| | :( | 14:29 |
| sp3000 | someone(TM) should probably update the logo contest page linked in topic | 14:29 |
| jott | qwerty12: it's more of a religion thing. you have to spread the word and troll for irssi now! | 14:29 |
| jott | sp3000: feel free to do so ;) | 14:29 |
| qwerty12 | Not fair, I want the spam first | 14:30 |
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| Macor | hm | 14:47 |
| Macor | is there a pkg to install scratchbox on the actual n800 ? :) | 14:47 |
| Veggen | Macor: why on earth would you? ;P | 14:48 |
| jott | Macor: that would make no sense :P | 14:48 |
| qwerty12 | Nay. You can install gcc and the like straight onto the device though. | 14:48 |
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| qwerty12 | That would be jokes actually, open osso-xterm and use only the DIABLO_ARMEL target :D | 14:48 |
| Macor | so you need a pc running an i386 os? | 14:48 |
| jott | Macor: no. you can compile on the device (remember it only has 128mb ram). | 14:49 |
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| jott | or you have to build your own toolchain. | 14:49 |
| Macor | hm... | 14:49 |
| Macor | where can i get the gcc pkgs? | 14:50 |
| Trencher| | :) maybe fixed | 14:50 |
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| Trencher| | now here's the fun part | 14:50 |
| Trencher| | how do i make a deb out of it if i get it working? | 14:51 |
| Trencher| | maybe stick it in extras | 14:51 |
| qwerty12 | dh_make. I recommend reading articles on the wiki and the guides nokia put out too though. | 14:51 |
| qwerty12 | And the maemo-policy is a good thing to read if you want to upload to extras. | 14:51 |
| hrw | guys: is there some docs how to make usb networking acceptable by libconic? so when I have usbnet working browser/h-a-m will not try to connect to wifi | 14:52 |
| Macor | hm.. i actually wanted to try to build my own bins for the n800 just to see if they would work | 14:52 |
| Trencher| | :( most of the wiki is 404 | 14:52 |
| Trencher| | from where i've tried reading up | 14:52 |
| Trencher| | i've found too many dead links | 14:52 |
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| qwerty12 | hrw, usbnet package from the "official" maemo integration uses a DUMMY connection. Unfortunatly, nokia broke them in diablo. | 14:53 |
| Macor | i wonder if i could get my gentoo box to use the portage tree in order to build apps for an armel :) | 14:53 |
| jott | Macor: gcc for the device is in the sdk repository. | 14:53 |
| hrw | qwerty12: shit | 14:53 |
| qwerty12 | yeah :( | 14:53 |
| jott | all hail to closed source components that break stuff! | 14:54 |
| Trencher| | :) | 14:54 |
| X-Fade | jott: Any idea why this qt build fails? https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/qt4-x11_4.4.0-2maemo0/armel.build.log.FAILED.txt | 14:54 |
| qwerty12 | Nokia's open source policy is bullshit. The tossers close source to non-trivial things like the memory applet. I'm still pissed off about that because when I asked on -developers, the wankers blank me. | 14:54 |
| X-Fade | jott: Seems that gnuton's lastest change broke something. | 14:55 |
| jott | X-Fade: looks like broken configure arguments | 14:55 |
| hrw | qwerty12: where I can find that package for chinook then? | 14:55 |
| jott | -platform is missing an argument | 14:55 |
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| jott | should be linux-g++ | 14:56 |
| qwerty12 | hrw, http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/chinook/free/m/maemo-control/ | 14:56 |
| qwerty12 | alternativly, just make an dummy connection yourself: gconftool -s -t string /system/osso/connectivity/IAP/DEFAULT/type DUMMY | 14:56 |
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| qwerty12 | *alternatively | 14:57 |
| hrw | thx | 14:57 |
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| jott | X-Fade: indeed, he broke the package :P | 14:57 |
| X-Fade | jott: Care to fix it? :) | 14:58 |
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| crashanddie | anyone knows peter schneider's email address/irc nickname ? | 14:59 |
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| crashanddie | working from home? http://img387.imageshack.us/img387/5060/picturetopicworkingfromkr4.jpg | 15:01 |
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| qwerty12 | OMG. What a fashion disaster. | 15:02 |
| Macor | does scratchbox have make? | 15:03 |
| jott | X-Fade: svn commit pending :) | 15:03 |
| qwerty12 | Macor, naturally | 15:03 |
| * jott twists his fingers | 15:03 | |
| Macor | just making sure ;) i'm downloading the vm now | 15:03 |
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| RST38h | crash: It's a DELL! | 15:03 |
| Macor | figured it'd just be easier to run the vm | 15:03 |
| * RST38h wonders why it is not an Apple, with all the hype... | 15:04 | |
| hrw | old photo | 15:04 |
| jott | RST38h: it's just an average linux nerd :p | 15:04 |
| crashanddie | RST38h, IT'S GOING TO EXPLODE | 15:05 |
| crashanddie | He'll be able to pass himself off as a war vet, no legs, and all that | 15:05 |
| jott | X-Fade: are those www exports running again? ;) | 15:05 |
| X-Fade | jott: commit it, package it, sign it and upload .dsc and diff to extras-devel ;) | 15:05 |
| X-Fade | jott: Yes, it is exporting the qt4 www dir ;) | 15:06 |
| jott | haha :) | 15:06 |
| X-Fade | jott: I hope we can this beast in extras-devel soon, so we can remove the repo from svn. | 15:07 |
| jott | storing binary blobs in svn is a bad idea on rather slow machines :> | 15:07 |
| jott | yeah | 15:07 |
| X-Fade | jott: Well, at least I have an armel build on stand-by which I can put in -devel :) | 15:08 |
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| X-Fade | jott: So it will be in -devel before aKademy.. | 15:08 |
| jott | aye so this 100 kde guys can start developing right away ;) | 15:09 |
| crashanddie | why the hell do we always need to be in finland in order to work for Nokia | 15:09 |
| crashanddie | any of you know if they offer good relocation bonuses ? | 15:10 |
| qwerty12 | crashanddie, the sauna! | 15:10 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: They must do that, there are a lot of expats there ;) | 15:10 |
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| lardman | lcuk: ping | 15:11 |
| crashanddie | Quite frankly, I'd be bummed if after moving to the UK, I'd be moving to Finland just to get a job I like :P | 15:11 |
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| qwerty12 | Haha. Finland is lovely but I dunno if I could move there. Much more quiet than London :/ | 15:11 |
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| crashanddie | of course you couldn't move there | 15:13 |
| crashanddie | you mum don't even let you go to berlin for a weekend, imagine what she'd say if you said you were moving permanently to Finland | 15:13 |
| lcuk | lardman, pong | 15:13 |
| qwerty12 | crashanddie, :P. I don't think Nokia would employ a 15 year old anyway so... :D | 15:14 |
| lardman | lcuk: where was that discussion about framebuffers? | 15:14 |
| crashanddie | I'm sure you'd find something to do | 15:14 |
| lcuk | https://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Drivers_justification#SRAM_notes.2Fdiscussion | 15:14 |
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| lardman | ah, thanks :) | 15:15 |
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| Daz | hi | 15:16 |
| lardman | ok, so it should be in chinook then - I wanted as new a kernel as possible | 15:16 |
| jott | lardman: btw i am almost 99% sure the tv out is not connected.. | 15:16 |
| lardman | jott: how come? | 15:17 |
| jott | look at the leaked schematics .. | 15:17 |
| lcuk | lardman, even displaying nothingness black screen should have sync signals etc that you can check with a scope? | 15:18 |
| lardman | jott: yes, there appears to be a link | 15:18 |
| lardman | lcuk: you have to enable it though | 15:18 |
| lcuk | ahhh.. | 15:18 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: My N95 doesn't show anything by default, I have to enable the output. | 15:19 |
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| lcuk | so it requires a software switch (which doesnt exist?) | 15:19 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: There is support for it in the kernel. | 15:20 |
| lcuk | and then a way to fill the omap2420 native framebuffer | 15:20 |
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| X-Fade | lcuk: So initializing should be possible. | 15:20 |
| lardman | lcuk: the software switch is in the kernel source I gave the url for | 15:20 |
| lardman | filling the buffer should be as simple as writing to the dev entry | 15:20 |
| X-Fade | It would display crap because of framebuffer mismatch.. | 15:20 |
| lcuk | ive been working for much of this morning so have only been glancing in | 15:21 |
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| lcuk | lardman, initially you dont need anything, switching it on or off should show an effect on tv | 15:21 |
| lcuk | as a first primary step that would confirm if its wired | 15:22 |
| crashanddie | what are you guys talking about ? | 15:22 |
| jott | lardman: query :) | 15:22 |
| X-Fade | lcuk: Yes, you should be able to nice that. | 15:22 |
| X-Fade | s/nice/notice/ ;) | 15:22 |
| lcuk | yer X-Fade depending upon the tv/video device you are plugging into it should change from nosignal to randomness | 15:23 |
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| lcuk | crashanddie, apparantl the 810 has a 4pin headphone socket - same as the n95. one of those pins is actually a tv out | 15:23 |
| crashanddie | oh | 15:24 |
| lcuk | whether it works is a different issue - especially since the tv out displays data from the omap2420 internal framebuffer (which we arent using) | 15:24 |
| zap | X-Fade: I have again problems with the builder :) | 15:24 |
| X-Fade | zap: Tell me ;) | 15:25 |
| lcuk | must dash again | 15:25 |
| lcuk | back later | 15:25 |
| zap | X-Fade: unrar 3.8.2 has been compiled at 01:26 and still is not in extras | 15:25 |
| zap | https://garage.maemo.org/builder/diablo/unrar-nonfree_3.8.2-1maemo1/ | 15:25 |
| X-Fade | zap: extras-devel you mean? | 15:25 |
| zap | yes | 15:25 |
| crashanddie | lcuk, but the headphones that are delivered with the n810 have 4 pins, right ? | 15:25 |
| jott | a 4 pin jacket does not mean it's connected :P | 15:25 |
| crashanddie | fair enough | 15:26 |
| crashanddie | but what I meant it | 15:26 |
| crashanddie | has anyone checked all the wires ? | 15:26 |
| X-Fade | crashanddie: You can't check it if it isn't enabled in software. | 15:26 |
| zap | X-Fade: same about unzip 5.52-14-maemo3 | 15:27 |
| zap | and zip and zip3 :) | 15:27 |
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| zap | and tar :-D | 15:28 |
| zap | uh-oh, it seems I do something fundamentally wrong | 15:28 |
| X-Fade | zap: I'm checking unzip and it has been accepted and moved into extras-devel. (diablo) | 15:29 |
| zap | thats 5.52-14-maemo2 | 15:29 |
| X-Fade | no 3 | 15:29 |
| jitu3485 | Hi, I am able to access internet from command line in scratchbox ,but not in an application on Xephyr. | 15:30 |
| zap | X-Fade: but it's not in Packages file | 15:30 |
| crashanddie | "Bring the buckets by the dozens, bring your nieces and your cousins, come and put the fire out" | 15:30 |
| X-Fade | zap: So there is a problem there. But the files are in the repo. | 15:30 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: I need pathcutils from diablo extras-devel to chinook extras-devel. Can I just download sources from diablo and upload to chinook unchanged? | 15:30 |
| lardman | X-Fade: do you know why the 3rd framebuffer's size has been changed? | 15:31 |
| zap | X-Fade: ah ok, so problem is not where I thought | 15:31 |
| X-Fade | zap: I'll check the Packages. | 15:31 |
| X-Fade | WOW... question overload... | 15:31 |
| crashanddie | wow, Niels just got pwned | 15:31 |
| lardman | ;) | 15:31 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Just try? :) Should work. | 15:31 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Make sure the .dsc is signed and all md5sums match. | 15:32 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: but I don't need to sign it? | 15:32 |
| lardman | 2nd framebuffer even, region 1 | 15:32 |
| X-Fade | lardman: I'm no kernel hacker and don't have contacts with the Nokia kernel guys.. | 15:32 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: I think it is signed. | 15:32 |
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| lardman | X-Fade: who can I ask? | 15:32 |
| lardman | X-Fade: or on list? | 15:32 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Try on list. Igor or Eero might answer/know. | 15:33 |
| lardman | ok, thanks | 15:34 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Or mail the kernel package maintainer ;) | 15:34 |
| X-Fade | lardman: I guess there is a reason why they put their email there? | 15:34 |
| lardman | ah, good idea | 15:34 |
| X-Fade | And the linux-omap mailinglist might also be an option.. | 15:35 |
| lardman | well this is sort of specific to the ITs | 15:36 |
| lardman | in Chinook the on-board memory was apparently used, in diablo it isn't | 15:36 |
| lardman | https://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Drivers_justification#SRAM_notes.2Fdiscussion | 15:36 |
| lardman | end of that section | 15:36 |
| X-Fade | lardman: Yes, I read that. | 15:36 |
| X-Fade | But I really have no idea why. | 15:36 |
| X-Fade | My guess is speed or powersaving? | 15:37 |
| lardman | no probs, will email people :) | 15:37 |
| lardman | I just don't want to break anything | 15:37 |
| lardman | sw no hw | 15:37 |
| lardman | sw not hw | 15:37 |
| X-Fade | I don't think there is much harm in changing these offsets in the kernel. Well, it might break, but flashing another kernel will fix it. | 15:38 |
| lardman | yeah of course, just wondering if it's been changed to do something specific though - just interested really | 15:38 |
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| mikkov_ | X-Fade: btw I hope that this https://garage.maemo.org/pipermail/extras-cauldron-builds/2008q3/thread.html could be divided to page per month ;) | 15:39 |
| jott | isn't there a commit message? :) | 15:39 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Yeah, it is starting to get long ;) | 15:40 |
| lardman | I didn't know we had svn access to the kernel source | 15:40 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: that's my primary place to check build messsages ;) | 15:40 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Mine too :) | 15:40 |
| X-Fade | zap: I can confirm that it is not in Packages, now I have to find out why.. | 15:44 |
| lardman | only thing I see is "* Added support for USB-VGA adapter" | 15:46 |
| lardman | not sure if that would require 2 planes and the onboard framebuffer was replaced by that | 15:46 |
| lardman | not to worry | 15:47 |
| hrw | lardman: usb-vga adapters have own fb | 15:47 |
| lardman | hrw: yeah, that's what I'd expect | 15:47 |
| jott | i think fb1 is used for the camera | 15:48 |
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| lardman | ah wait, looks like I need to go back further | 15:51 |
| lcuk | lardman, it was 2007 that it was used, but chinook/diablo both not used | 15:51 |
| lardman | yep, just saw that | 15:51 |
| lcuk | i think with the location of the epson it just didnt gain the performance benefits expected for the code complexity required | 15:52 |
| lardman | why change the code though unless it's being used? | 15:52 |
| lardman | as jott says perhaps for the camera? | 15:52 |
| Macor | well.. lets see what i have to do to build stuff in scratchbox from src | 15:53 |
| Macor | :) | 15:53 |
| jott | fb1 atleast is allocated when the camera is started | 15:53 |
| jott | Address : 0x80700000 | 15:53 |
| jott | Size : 430080 | 15:53 |
| jott | when "camera" is started, 0 otherwise :) | 15:53 |
| lcuk | what about when "barcode" is started ;) | 15:53 |
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| X-Fade | zap: Weird, it seems that other packages are all updated in Packages. But yours aren't. Khertan's py2deb from this morning is in there for example. | 15:54 |
| jott | lcuk: Size : 155648 :) | 15:54 |
| kpel | is there a way to update the package list in diablo using the application manager? | 15:54 |
| kpel | i know it was possible with earlier releases but diablo doesn't seem to have such an option | 15:55 |
| lcuk | jott, so it allocates depending upon the cam spec requested.. | 15:55 |
| X-Fade | kpel: Use the icon, bottom right? | 15:55 |
| lardman | jott: is this bora? | 15:55 |
| jott | lardman: uh? no diablo ;) | 15:55 |
| lardman | ah, ok, was wondering about the size | 15:55 |
| jott | lcuk: yes. that very much seems so :) | 15:56 |
| lcuk | superjott to the rescue (just make sure the camera is disabled before you put your underpants and cape on | 15:56 |
| jott | ooops | 15:56 |
| jott | forgot the backdoor in maemo-barcode :P | 15:56 |
| jott | livestream to pron.lcuk.tv :) | 15:57 |
| lardman | Tue, 04 Sep 2007 19:34:02 +0300 ARM: OMAP2: Nokia 2420: Increase fb reserved regions again | 15:57 |
| * lcuk has to start thinking about backdoors, im very tempted to allow camera uploading | 15:57 | |
| lcuk | i crash liqbase when i pump the camera to 640*480 :( | 15:58 |
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| kpel | X-Fade: yes, the bottom right icon checks for updates. i don't know if it fetches new package lists though. | 15:59 |
| X-Fade | kpel: How would it check for updates without that? :) | 15:59 |
| lcuk | one would imagine to check for updates it has to know which are updated - and the best way to do that is to.... | 15:59 |
| kpel | by the way, apt-get shows some initfs related packages which cannot be installed because of dependency problems. the -f parameter fixed that but i wonder if this could be a problem | 16:00 |
| kpel | X-Fade: i suppose it's the difference between apt-get update and apt-get upgrade. no? | 16:00 |
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| X-Fade | kpel: The icon is the apt-get update equivalent. | 16:01 |
| X-Fade | kpel: Check the log.. | 16:01 |
| kpel | yeah, it fetches lists according to the log. but if that icon is only the equivalent of apt-get update what is the equivalent of apt-get upgrade ? | 16:04 |
| X-Fade | kpel: The check for updates section. | 16:04 |
| X-Fade | kpel: Although that triggers a reload after one day too. | 16:04 |
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| kpel | i see | 16:05 |
| kpel | thanks X-Fade | 16:05 |
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| lardman | * ARM: OMAP: FB sync with N800 tree (support for dynamic SRAM allocations); Sync framebuffer headers with N800 tree | 16:07 |
| lardman | Tue, 8 May 2007 16:59:49 +0300 | 16:07 |
| lardman | very big one that | 16:07 |
| lardman | so presumably the move to allocating all framebuffers from SDRAM removed the need/ability to have it in SRAM | 16:11 |
| Macor | blah | 16:14 |
| Macor | have to re-install cups | 16:14 |
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| lcuk | lardman, if the primary framebuffer was in SRAM and the omap framebuffer itself was being used then it makes sense to use the SRAM, but with the epson lcd drive method used (carry over from omap1/770 design - the older chips had no gfx at all) it just makes it more complex to utulise and manage (i would predict anyway) | 16:17 |
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| lardman | I'm just looking at the Ti TV output driver, we may need to do something with the audio codec hardware to enable it | 16:20 |
| lardman | I've not found the framebuffer locations yet | 16:21 |
| jott | this whole omapfb/blizzard driver thing is a big mess :) | 16:21 |
| lcuk | it looks like leading up to 800 release the designers knew there was a framebuffer on omap2420. they tried to use it as much as possible, but because the primary resolution wont support 800 they had to backpeddle, but still wanted to use the memory. | 16:22 |
| zap | X-Fade: my packages are cursed :) | 16:22 |
| X-Fade | zap: Yeah, but why? :) | 16:23 |
| lcuk | after the 800 came out it was decided to simplify the whole thing and cleanup as much as possible | 16:23 |
| zap | because I'm naughty? :) | 16:23 |
| X-Fade | zap: You used mub-builder, right? | 16:23 |
| zap | for some, yes | 16:23 |
| zap | for zip/unzip/zip3 no | 16:23 |
| lardman | lcuk: looks like there was a kernel change that allowed dynamic framebuffer allocation, before they they tried to save main memory by using SRAM, after that there;s no point in using a hack | 16:23 |
| X-Fade | Hmmm there goes my idea ;) | 16:23 |
| zap | its my tallent to step on problems in other's software | 16:24 |
| zap | I must be a tester, not a programmer | 16:24 |
| lcuk | lardman, is that allocation all kernel side, or can userspace apps make direct use of the sram (i couldnt find or use it when i played) | 16:25 |
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| zap | lcuk: is SRAM any faster than normal SDRAM? | 16:27 |
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| X-Fade | zap: I'm manually reindexing the repository. Let's see if your packages show up. | 16:28 |
| lcuk | zap, its internal to the omap2420 and used for multimedia operations :) you can bet your dogs bollocks its faster | 16:28 |
| lardman | lcuk: kernel side | 16:28 |
| lardman | zap: no test data to prove it though | 16:29 |
| zap | I must port haret to linux | 16:29 |
| zap | should help with picking various hardware | 16:29 |
| * lcuk wonders how it could be slower | 16:29 | |
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| zap | lcuk: doesn't SRAM mean "single-port RAM"? | 16:30 |
| zap | or it's just Static | 16:30 |
| kpel | does anyone know if there is an xchat package for diablo available? | 16:30 |
| zap | wikipedia says SRAM is either Static or Shadow | 16:31 |
| lcuk | static ram | 16:31 |
| zap | kpel: it is, in extras | 16:31 |
| lcuk | "SRAM is a little more expensive, but faster and significantly less power hungry (especially idle) than DRAM. It is therefore used where either speed or low power, or both, are principle considerations." | 16:31 |
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| zap | and it has LOTS of translation packages, damnit | 16:31 |
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| lcuk | would seem to be a reasonable aim | 16:32 |
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| X-Fade | zap: They are there now. | 16:33 |
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| zap | X-Fade: no idea why they weren't? | 16:33 |
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| lcuk | back in a bit | 16:33 |
| X-Fade | zap: That is step 2. :) | 16:33 |
| zap | it was the same with my previous packages, which you pushed manually | 16:33 |
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| zap | they weren't in Packages too, stayed so for a long time | 16:34 |
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| kpel | zap: the one package i found is for chinnok. will that work without problems on diablo? | 16:34 |
| zap | kpel: they will work, but there's xchat for diablo | 16:34 |
| zap | kpel: just enable maemo Extras repository in app manager and it'll show up | 16:34 |
| lardman | urgh, I wonder if we'd need to startup the inbuilt omap display controller to be able to do TV output | 16:35 |
| trickie|work | lardman: there is a svn log for the maemo kernel sources? | 16:36 |
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| zap | kpel: I was wrong, it is in extras-devel | 16:36 |
| lardman | trickie|work: no, I just looked through debian/Changelog from the diablo kernel source | 16:36 |
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| zap | kpel: here: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/diablo/free/x/xchat/ | 16:36 |
| trickie|work | lardman: ah ha | 16:36 |
| zap | lardman: where are you going to connect the video output? | 16:37 |
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| zap | are there any checkpoints on the board at least? | 16:37 |
| lardman | 3.5mm jack plug | 16:37 |
| zap | ? | 16:37 |
| zap | thats audio output | 16:38 |
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| zap | the worst of it is that omap2420 is fully undocumented | 16:38 |
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| zap | you don't even know to which pins the video output goes | 16:38 |
| lardman | zap: I have kernel code in front of me | 16:39 |
| zap | so? you have to know where physically the video signal is located | 16:39 |
| zap | the leaked n800 schematics is damn blurry and unreadable | 16:39 |
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| lardman | yes, I have the addresses of the TV output hardware | 16:40 |
| lardman | the TV signal should go into the 3.5mm AV jack plug | 16:40 |
| glass | n95/93 does video output from the audio plug, but on n800 it's not probably connected same way | 16:40 |
| lardman | that's the assumption anyway | 16:40 |
| lardman | glass: why not? | 16:40 |
| glass | easy enough to check | 16:40 |
| glass | lardman: if it were never intention to use the tvout | 16:40 |
| zap | oh my | 16:40 |
| lardman | we're talking tv output from the omap, not the lcd controller here | 16:41 |
| zap | that would be megacool then, no need to solder anything | 16:41 |
| glass | lardman: yes, but why would nokia engineers have put the extra wire from the omap to the audio output | 16:41 |
| lardman | glass: it;s built into the chip which controls the lines connected to the 3.5mm jack | 16:41 |
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| glass | i don't see why they'd connect the wire for video as well | 16:41 |
| X-Fade | glass: It are the same lines that the mic uses. | 16:41 |
| glass | ah then | 16:42 |
| lardman | there is no extra wire, audio & video (presumably) data are routed though the same chip | 16:42 |
| X-Fade | glass: So rounting is done inside the chip. | 16:42 |
| glass | didn't know it had mic line as well | 16:42 |
| X-Fade | glass: Well, how does the headset work then ;) | 16:42 |
| lardman | interesting, this kernel source also allocates 3 framebuffers, then switches where they are output to | 16:43 |
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| lardman | how large was the SRAM? | 16:43 |
| lardman | 3* 640*480 * 16bits? | 16:43 |
| glass | X-Fade: well, i'm not too up to date with n800/810 peripheals | 16:43 |
| glass | X-Fade: the headset plug looks like n95 or ipod av cable plug? | 16:44 |
| zap | lardman: <6>SRAM: Mapped pa 0x40200000 to va 0xd0000000 size: 0xa0000 | 16:44 |
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| X-Fade | glass: 4 pole jack. | 16:45 |
| glass | yeh then | 16:45 |
| zap | lardman: 640k, and everybody knows that 640k will be enough for everyone | 16:45 |
| lardman | not enough for 3 framebuffers | 16:45 |
| zap | lardman: that's what bill gates said in the dawn of the PC era :) | 16:45 |
| lardman | which is good, as perhaps the SRAM is not necessary | 16:46 |
| lardman | zap: :) | 16:46 |
| lardman | oh dear, better head back to work | 16:46 |
| zap | as far as I understand, the purpose of SRAM is to allow dual access | 16:46 |
| zap | (maybe it's dual port, that is) | 16:46 |
| lardman | take a look at: display.c, omap2_disp_out.c, venc.h, display.h, omapfb_main.c, omap24xxfb.c | 16:47 |
| lardman | bbiab | 16:47 |
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| zap | lardman|lunch: >Boot the system, then do a | 16:48 |
| zap | >echo "tv" > /sys/class/omap_disp/display_control/graphics, You should see | 16:48 |
| zap | >the penguin on TV out. | 16:48 |
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| mikkov_ | packages are flowing way too unpredictably from builder to extras-devel | 16:50 |
| mikkov_ | sometimes it takes only couple of minutes and other times it could take hours | 16:51 |
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| kpel | zap: thanks for the url | 16:51 |
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| X-Fade | zap: There is no omap_disp entry in /sys/ | 17:01 |
| zap | I see :) looks like things have changed since 2.6.14 | 17:01 |
| zap | but anyways, looks like TV support is there, just waiting to be used :) | 17:01 |
| X-Fade | zap: I have the cable here ;) Now we need the software part.. | 17:02 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: I got from maemo.org "Permission denied (publickey,keyboard-interactive)." | 17:02 |
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| lardman | re | 17:02 |
| zap | oh my... I was going to look for a cable this evening :) | 17:02 |
| zap | the cable is from N95? | 17:02 |
| lardman | jott: yeah aic23 iirc is the audio codec, the technical sheet is avaialble from Ti, not sure if it needs to be twiddled though | 17:03 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: It looks like you hit the connect rate.. | 17:03 |
| zap | I hit that often :) | 17:04 |
| zap | mikkov_: wait ~10 minutes and try again | 17:04 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: Can you try again? | 17:04 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: in 3 seconds | 17:05 |
| mikkov_ | X-Fade: same | 17:05 |
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| X-Fade | mikkov_: Yeah, I see the incoming connection. | 17:05 |
| X-Fade | mikkov_: But nothing happens after that. | 17:05 |
| lardman | zap: yeah, the sysfs entry driver is in omap2_disp_out.c | 17:05 |
| zap | lardman: what driver is used in n810? | 17:06 |
| lardman | zap: n8x0 is a bit complicated, the omap display hw is bypassed and an external Epson LCD controller is used | 17:06 |
| zap | aha | 17:06 |
| zap | so we'll have to use both drivers at once | 17:06 |
| zap | oh cool! | 17:06 |
| zap | we can have two displays in X11 | 17:07 |
| lardman | I didn't look enough to see if the TV output stuff requires the omap display controller to be used in some form | 17:07 |
| kpel | the latest unzip package (devel-extras) seems to be corrupted according to app manager and apt-get | 17:07 |
| zap | :1 to TV and :0 to Epson | 17:07 |
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| lardman | zap: you could probably already do that as there are 3 framebuffers atm | 17:07 |
| zap | I think we can arrange so that omap2_disp_out.c will use the SRAM as the ramebuffer | 17:07 |
| zap | these 3 framebuffers are all related to the Epson chip | 17:07 |
| lardman | no, all the framebuffers are in SDRAM, and they are copied to the Epson chip for display | 17:08 |
| zap | we'll have the fourth framebuffer which will use the OMAP video encoder, which can be hard-coded for TV output | 17:08 |
| zap | right | 17:08 |
| lardman | well perhaps, I don't know how much hassle it would be to hard code another framebuffer | 17:08 |
| zap | they are in SDRAM, but we can use the SRAM for omap2_disp | 17:08 |
| zap | it's limited to 640x480 anyways | 17:08 |
| lardman | it might be easier to use the existing one with x/yoffset so we only show 640x480 of it | 17:08 |
| zap | I think it will be enough to load the omap_disp driver | 17:08 |
| lardman | give it a go, but I doubt it | 17:09 |
| zap | I'll try as soon as I'll finish current things | 17:09 |
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| zap | this cable will do ? http://www.ubex.ru/bin/image?id=REFA2433 | 17:13 |
| lardman | one for an n95 | 17:14 |
| X-Fade | zap: Looks like it. You might need to change the order of the pins. I don't know ;) | 17:14 |
| zap | I hope it's standard :) | 17:14 |
| X-Fade | zap: CA-75U | 17:15 |
| zap | well my wife's father has a N95, I can hijack him | 17:16 |
| zap | in the case I won't find one easily | 17:16 |
| zap | okay, going home, will try to get one by the way | 17:16 |
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| lardman | I wonder what the SRAM is for then | 17:17 |
| X-Fade | lardman: I think that getting the screen to init would be the first test. If that doesn't work, you can forget about the rest ;) | 17:18 |
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| lcuk | proper ondevice framebuffer. other omap2420 devices dont have this epson halfling attached nor expect to output 800*480 | 17:18 |
| lardman | X-Fade: yeah, just wondering | 17:18 |
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| lardman | lcuk: read the source, that code also uses 3 framebuffers, they won't fit in the SRAM | 17:19 |
| lcuk | define "fit" - sure at max resolution they wont, but arent most phone devices using this using much lower resolutions | 17:19 |
| glass | e90 does 800x352 | 17:19 |
| lardman | lcuk: no it's an omap test board | 17:20 |
| crashanddie | http://www.sourcingmap.com/ca75u-video-cable-for-nokia-n95-p-10522.html | 17:20 |
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| lcuk | lardman, the testboard would be geared towards testing the device for intended use wouldnt it - does it say anywhere that its 3 buffers each of 640*480, or just 3 buffers | 17:21 |
| lardman | yes, 3x640x480 | 17:22 |
| lardman | x16/8 bytes to be exact | 17:22 |
| lcuk | but there is not physically enough memory for this is there? | 17:23 |
| lcuk | 5mbit is a single 640*480*16 | 17:24 |
| lardman | exactly | 17:24 |
| lcuk | is this a comment or actual code that runs thats telling you this? | 17:24 |
| lardman | it's code, I presume it runs | 17:25 |
| * lcuk recompiles | 17:25 | |
| lcuk | and it allocates the planes from sram and not sdram? | 17:25 |
| lcuk | cos the 800 os2007 did something similar with its 3 planes, but used a mix of locations | 17:26 |
| lardman | no sure where they come from | 17:26 |
| lardman | I've not found that code yet | 17:26 |
| lcuk | tfanoush left a pointer to the file i think | 17:27 |
| * lcuk compiles agian | 17:27 | |
| lcuk | (incase you are wondering: http://xkcd.com/303/) | 17:27 |
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| jott | "If TV_OUT is not used connect AD22 (VDDADAC) to ground." | 17:31 |
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| lardman | jott: where's that? | 17:34 |
| jott | the n95 also uses a opa361 to amplify the video out | 17:34 |
| jott | n95 schematics | 17:35 |
| jott | and on the n8x0 the AD22 is grounded afaics :( | 17:35 |
| jott | (and no connection is drawn on AC23/AD23 | 17:37 |
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| lardman | hmm | 17:37 |
| jott | and i can't see how the jack would get video in another way. | 17:38 |
| lardman | well it doesn't mean it can't be connected to ground and it still work, possibly | 17:38 |
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| jott | i really don't see the point why nokia engineers should have done this :p | 17:39 |
| jott | and still they need a connection to the AC23/AD23 pins. | 17:40 |
| jott | of course the schematics could be wrong but i actually doubt this. | 17:41 |
| jott | (like not printing connections, missing the amplifier, etc) | 17:41 |
| jott | grounding a pin that supposed to disable to tv out | 17:41 |
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| lardman | dunno, bit busy atm though | 17:42 |
| lardman | I'll take a look later on | 17:42 |
| kpel | the schematics of n95 ar available online? | 17:43 |
| mbuf | what is the TTFF in the N810? | 17:43 |
| trickie|work | time to first fix | 17:43 |
| trickie|work | for gps | 17:43 |
| trickie|work | i guess | 17:43 |
| lardman | about 10min | 17:44 |
| lardman | depends on lots of factors | 17:44 |
| lardman | look at the Ti spec sheet for the time it's supposed to manage | 17:44 |
| mbuf | lardman, thanks | 17:44 |
| jott | kpel: google :) | 17:45 |
| trickie|work | mbuf: ah, i thought you meant what did it mean | 17:46 |
| trickie|work | :) | 17:46 |
| jott | actually the only sane way would have been to connect the epson tv out. | 17:46 |
| lardman | jott: what page are we talking here? | 17:46 |
| jott | search for AC23 | 17:47 |
| jott | and AD22 | 17:47 |
| lardman | ah, pg3 | 17:47 |
| mbuf | trickie|work, tricky questions ;) | 17:49 |
| lardman | that may just be because it feeds the amplifier | 17:49 |
| jott | hum?! | 17:50 |
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| jott | what actually speaks *for* a connection? | 17:50 |
| lardman | bbiab | 17:50 |
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| jott | drivers in the *generic* omap2420 branch? :/ | 17:50 |
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| lardman | I thought one of those ape lines went into the av codec on the n810 diagram? | 18:00 |
| lardman | left it at home of course | 18:00 |
| b0unc3 | guys, there is a cifs module avaiable for diablo? | 18:00 |
| qwerty12 | b0unc3, use the chinook one. same kernel version. look in fanoush's module pack | 18:00 |
| b0unc3 | ah ok, thanks qwerty12 | 18:01 |
| jott | lardman: i can't see any connection on AC23 and AD23. | 18:01 |
| lardman | jott: I'll have to have a look when I get home | 18:01 |
| jott | (which seem to be the pins going to tv out on the n95) | 18:02 |
| lardman | well their audio codec is different | 18:02 |
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| jott | but the omap is the same. | 18:02 |
| jott | or not?! :) | 18:02 |
| lardman | dunno | 18:03 |
| jott | and i still can't see how and foremost WHY they should have connected it. | 18:03 |
| mgedmin | cool, the image viewer in diablo also got nice full-screen ui improvements | 18:03 |
| qwerty12 | After reading the maemo irc logs, i'm tempted to sell my phones for any price and hustle for the rest to get an N95 8gb :P | 18:09 |
| lardman | jott: the question is really why not attach it | 18:10 |
| jott | n95 does not even have i toch screen :) | 18:11 |
| kpel | who needs a touch screen? | 18:11 |
| * jott <- | 18:11 | |
| kpel | i'd rather have a qwerty keyboard any day | 18:11 |
| * lcuk <- | 18:11 | |
| qwerty12 | jott, yeah, but after using an N800 for so long, I've been missing hardware keys :) | 18:11 |
| crashanddie | HALLELUIA | 18:11 |
| kpel | oh yes | 18:11 |
| jott | qwerty12: aaah, well i have a n810 and i could not live without keyboard :) | 18:11 |
| qwerty12 | jott, yeah, I'm a tramp and keep putting off the purchase of a usb adapter and a usb keyboard :) | 18:12 |
| jott | lardman: costs, extra lines on the pcb to consider, use, having an LCD with tv-out which would make much more sense.... | 18:12 |
| lardman | yeah | 18:13 |
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| qwerty12 | The definitive answer is that the hardware design team for the tablets are retarded. | 18:13 |
| kpel | lol | 18:13 |
| kpel | i'll drink to that | 18:13 |
| kpel | actually, let us hpe they are | 18:14 |
| qwerty12 | Seriously though, they carry on using the same crap lcd controller from the 770 when it was apparent it had problems in the N800. They then put a crap GPS chipset in the N810 :( | 18:14 |
| mgedmin | I take it back, the images app is stupid | 18:14 |
| lcuk | not retarded, they gave us the best evolution on the n770 that they could. the design choices made for 770 set a path which meant that even with the higher spec omsp2420 they couldnt use the internal framebuffer at expected high resolution | 18:14 |
| kpel | because if they aren't then there is something nasty going on | 18:14 |
| lcuk | lol mgedmin | 18:14 |
| jott | qwerty12: all quite obvious design decisions. | 18:14 |
| kpel | i don't think they understand what tech users want | 18:15 |
| kpel | and they surely don't seem to design for a massive user base | 18:15 |
| qwerty12 | bad ones though :(. To me, it does look like Nokia (company wise. you know the company that does the schematics, service manuals etc) put a hell of a more effort into their phones. The maemo.org community is great though. | 18:15 |
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| qwerty12 | Anyway, I look forward to leaking more Nokia stuff as I find it. | 18:16 |
| jott | kpel: it's all about costs. it's not like the n810 gets the same resources as n95 and even the n95 has the same problems with the gps ;) | 18:16 |
| kpel | jott: it's ont only about costs. it's also about using what you have. the n95 has an accelerometer. did nokia take advantage of it? NO! | 18:16 |
| kpel | why? good question! | 18:17 |
| lcuk | nokia have a linux based tablet distro under their hat. i, for one, welcome our linux loving finnish overlords | 18:17 |
| jott | kpel: resources. | 18:17 |
| jott | kpel: hardware on the one side. software on the other. | 18:17 |
| kpel | jott: i don't believe that a company like nokia doesn't have the resources to even write a toy app for the accelerometer, and some lone coder does | 18:18 |
| kpel | i'm talking about that bouncing ball demo | 18:18 |
| qwerty12 | lcuk, I don't. They close the source to stuff that really doesn't need to be closed and things that don't even reveal how the internals of the nokia work. | 18:18 |
| jott | kpel: they most likely have a toy app in their labs. | 18:18 |
| kpel | jott: in the labs they have a lot of things. but what does the user get? | 18:19 |
| jott | kpel: things that marketing signed | 18:19 |
| lcuk | qwerty12, the closed stuff is not important to me: as long as its in active development and fixes come for things it doesnt bother me. what riles me is underutilised hardware | 18:19 |
| lardman | we have an accelerometer? | 18:19 |
| kpel | don't get me wrong, i like nokia. it's not easy to become a comms giant when your background is in toilet paper and plastic boots | 18:19 |
| jott | lardman: n95 has | 18:19 |
| lardman | ah, ok | 18:19 |
| kpel | jott: now you said it. marketing. | 18:20 |
| * kpel starts foaming | 18:20 | |
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| qwerty12 | lcuk, it is to me. the mce bullshit is a good example. They have a fix for the softpoweroff which they can't release (I don't believe David's BS about waiting for a good time). The bug was fixed before diablo. They manage to ship a newer version of mce without the fix with the diablo release. Bullshit. | 18:20 |
| * lcuk will google softpoweroff | 18:21 | |
| qwerty12 | You can find the chinook source of mce here for fun : source | 18:22 |
| qwerty12 | http://repository.maemo.org/rtcomm/pool/chinook/free/source/m/ | 18:22 |
| qwerty12 | rather | 18:22 |
| qwerty12 | needs libdsme to build which unfortunatly isn't leaked | 18:22 |
| jott | not only libdsme. | 18:23 |
| qwerty12 | What else isn't leaked? | 18:23 |
| jott | libdsme headers should be trivial. | 18:23 |
| lcuk | is this similar to me sliding my lock button? | 18:23 |
| glass | kpel: well, at least they released the api for the accel stuff | 18:23 |
| glass | kpel: on symbian | 18:23 |
| qwerty12 | The rest of the stuff from what I can tell is available. Except for the systemui stuff come think of it. | 18:23 |
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| jott | qwerty12: should be really easy to rebuild the dsme headers. | 18:24 |
| qwerty12 | I'd like to see that :). I know the powerlaunch guy has dsme reversed (mostly?). | 18:25 |
| * qwerty12 is still interested in editing CAL which is controlled by dsme | 18:25 | |
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| * qwerty12 lols at cloned n95's | 18:26 | |
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| lardman | jott: there are two lines which are not mentioned: AC23 and AD23 | 18:34 |
| lardman | as you said | 18:34 |
| lardman | presumably these would go to GND rather than be left floating? | 18:34 |
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| kpel | glass: yeah, but as i said the customer doesn't benefit directly from that | 18:37 |
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| * Jaffa yawns as his Windows laptop reboots and it takes ages to get back up to speed and start all the apps | 18:38 | |
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| qwerty12 | Jaffa, At least your laptop doesn't go weird when using a OpenGL app in Linux and Windows :( | 18:44 |
| crashanddie | btw, did you guys see the videos for Aurora ? | 18:45 |
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| kpel | which aurora? | 18:49 |
| kpel | not the borealis one, right? :) | 18:49 |
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| brontide | qwerty12: you home... got a stupid question. I installed your high speed kernel .deb with dpkg.... is that all I need to do or do I need to run some sort of script as well | 18:53 |
| qwerty12 | brontide, sorry, please leave your message after the beep. Just run flash-and-reboot. If it says it is going to flash the initfs too, just rm the initfs file. | 18:54 |
| brontide | zImage-diablo-200823 | 18:55 |
| brontide | sound right? | 18:55 |
| qwerty12 | yeah | 18:55 |
| brontide | thanks as always | 18:55 |
| qwerty12 | np | 18:55 |
| brontide | can't wait to see if high speed and noatime can really be made to behave together as that would be a sweet upgrade | 18:56 |
| qwerty12 | Yep, I'm itching to apply your noatime fix and fanoush's line but my tablet is dead atm :( | 18:57 |
| crashanddie | kpel, http://labs.mozilla.com/2008/08/introducing-the-concept-series-call-for-participation/ | 18:57 |
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| brontide | Hmmm... Is there an easy way to check to see if I'm running the high-speed kernel? | 18:59 |
| qwerty12 | If you cat /proc/version, you should see my name... | 19:00 |
| hrw | bye | 19:00 |
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| qwerty12 | brontide, in your bug, do you mean /usr/sbin/osso-mmc-mount.sh instead of /usr/sbin/mmc-mount | 19:04 |
| qwerty12 | ? | 19:04 |
| qwerty12 | voted btw | 19:04 |
| brontide | qwerty12: yep... there you are. testing speed and then testing canola. 3.5MB/s writes 5MB/s rewites.... sure looks like it's enabled ;-) now on to canola ... woot seems to work. | 19:04 |
| brontide | Nope mmc-mount appears to hold the mount string | 19:04 |
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| qwerty12 | Ok, I think that file is part of ke-recv which is opensource now. I'll see if I can put out a modified, packaged version for test purposes | 19:05 |
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| brontide | wholy speed boost batman. Full screen images in canola used to be annoyingly slow to use the d-pad to load the next one, now it's almost instantanious | 19:06 |
| qwerty12 | I've never used Canola for images. I've watched the Tokyo at night photostream but that's it :/ | 19:06 |
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| GreyFoxx | Where does one find this "high speed" kernel package ? :) I'm not having any troubles but wouldn't mind checking it out anyway :) | 19:07 |
| qwerty12 | GreyFoxx, http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=202849&postcount=19 | 19:07 |
| qwerty12 | yay, a plug to my own post :P | 19:08 |
| GreyFoxx | hehe thanks :) | 19:08 |
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| brontide | I'm sure other parts of the system will show similar boosts when dealing with the mmc card | 19:08 |
| lardman | nomis: http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=54933 | 19:09 |
| qwerty12 | brontide, Is it worth trying something like this : http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8947 ? | 19:09 |
| GreyFoxx | so far most of my reading from the internal card is for video playback in mplayer or the built in media player. Haven't looked at Canola yet | 19:09 |
| brontide | qwerty12: not really since we already know the highspeed kernel improves the bare speed, but compbined with the noatime the improvement will be a subjective one, more like how long does it take to ls -alR /media/mmc1 | 19:10 |
| GreyFoxx | What I need to do is setup a development VM so I can start working on a mythtv remote control | 19:11 |
| qwerty12 | brontide, Ah, I see. Think it's still worth me packaging ke-recv with the fix already in it? | 19:11 |
| crashanddie | anyone looking for a good programmer in London ? Mobile computing industry would be a plus, anything challenging is accepted | 19:11 |
| qwerty12 | I'd have to repack the deb mind you, as stage doesn't carry the diablo one. | 19:11 |
| crashanddie | (lol at turning the recruiting process on its head) | 19:12 |
| lbt | GreyFoxx: something wrong with scratchbox? | 19:12 |
| qwerty12 | crashanddie, I'll employ you. You have to wear chains and I'll pay you from the piggy bank :P | 19:12 |
| brontide | qwerty12: that's up to you. I'm hoping that this will get through Nokia quickly, and it's not like it's a hard fix to do by hand | 19:12 |
| crashanddie | qwerty12, sure, benefits ? | 19:12 |
| crashanddie | :D | 19:12 |
| GreyFoxx | lbt: At this point I haven't touched it. I just mean install ubuntu/debian/whatever is preferred and easiest for the sdk into a VM | 19:13 |
| qwerty12 | lol | 19:13 |
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| qwerty12 | brontide, true. I'll leave it as it means me rebooting into linux | 19:13 |
| lbt | scratchbox is so isolated you don't need a VM (unless you're running the other OS...) | 19:13 |
| GreyFoxx | Really? In that case sweet | 19:13 |
| lbt | yep - it basically is a chroot VM | 19:14 |
| lbt | I run it off Debian testing with no issues | 19:14 |
| lbt | (very few issues ;) ) | 19:14 |
| GreyFoxx | Well, guess I'll be seeing how well it like Slackware :) | 19:14 |
| lbt | ah | 19:14 |
| brontide | Improvements with media player: No more annoying pause when opening "songs", it's a much more reasonable second or so to open 700+ songs | 19:14 |
| lbt | I think the scratchbox has maemo extras so prefers a .deb based host | 19:15 |
| GreyFoxx | So looks likke I'll be doing a vm then :) | 19:15 |
| lbt | yup - guess so :) | 19:15 |
| qwerty12 | brontide, arrgh, your improvements are depressing me. I'll steal my sisters charger :D | 19:16 |
| lbt | do you have the CPU hw to do it proper virt stuff? | 19:16 |
| lbt | I run Xen but it needs a 2.6.18 base kernel :( | 19:16 |
| brontide | Now I just need a "beater" n810 for my screencasting stuff | 19:16 |
| GreyFoxx | lbt: vmware is my friend :) | 19:16 |
| lbt | I didn't think you could make new images - or do you have a license? | 19:17 |
| GreyFoxx | vmware server is free | 19:17 |
| GreyFoxx | and so are the licenses | 19:17 |
| GreyFoxx | has been for a couple years now | 19:17 |
| lbt | oh - I thought there were limitations on creating images... | 19:18 |
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| glass | i thought just the player was free? | 19:18 |
| glass | but nice then.. | 19:18 |
| GreyFoxx | vmplayer use to be free with no ability to create images (which was a simplefilecopy) but they released server freely long ago now | 19:18 |
| liran_ | I'm getting an "unmet dependencies" error when trying to install a package, apt-get telling me that: osso-software-version-rx44: Depends: flash-and-reboot (= 3) but it is not going to be installed (and same for initfs-flasher and kernel-diablo-flasher) | 19:18 |
| GreyFoxx | just fill out a little form and they give you like 5 licenses | 19:18 |
| lbt | I'm waiting for Xen0 to hit upstream in 2.6.28/9 | 19:19 |
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| GreyFoxx | And I still have a work paid for copy from before then :) | 19:19 |
| liran_ | if I do apt-get -f install it wants to install these 3 packages but says "WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated!" | 19:19 |
| GreyFoxx | I do a lot of my mythtv coding in a vm | 19:19 |
| GreyFoxx | I've yet to even look at Xen :) | 19:19 |
| lbt | I only got Xen up a few months back - it's really pretty sweet. OTOH I've not seen VMWare and I only care about headless | 19:20 |
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| GreyFoxx | Using the vmware client you can do headless | 19:21 |
| GreyFoxx | I just use the client to access the vmware server on various machines | 19:21 |
| lbt | yeah - I just didn't want to claim that Xen was superior to anything. | 19:21 |
| GreyFoxx | If it gives you direct access to PCI devices that would be pretty sweet | 19:22 |
| timely | kpel: the n800 had an fm radio, you can't say we took advantage of that | 19:22 |
| GreyFoxx | but I've never looked at it so I have no idea if it does | 19:22 |
| timely | it's about resources | 19:22 |
| lbt | I wonder why you care about that ;) | 19:22 |
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| lbt | yes, I think it does | 19:22 |
| timely | nokia has spare hardware which is mostly what was used for 770/n800/n810 | 19:22 |
| lbt | there's some PCI passthru stuff which I don't really use | 19:22 |
| qwerty12 | it shows | 19:22 |
| timely | but developing drivers and stuff for a new platform requires people resources | 19:22 |
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| timely | kpel: eventually nokia labs did ship a toy app for the n95 accelerometer... | 19:23 |
| liran_ | ahh it's a known problem I see | 19:23 |
| timely | crashanddie: keep in mind it's basically a group prototyping their own ui | 19:24 |
| timely | it's not really related to mozilla | 19:24 |
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| timely | otoh, as splash/flash go, it's not a bad start | 19:25 |
| timely | if it brings more attn to labs.mozilla.com, then it really served a purpose | 19:25 |
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| crashanddie | eh ? | 19:26 |
| crashanddie | when did I say "omg 11!!1!1!!!3 mozilla are teh c0ol, with new interfac3s" | 19:26 |
| crashanddie | I just said aurora :P | 19:26 |
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| timely | i'm not saying it's cool, i'm not really a fan of it | 19:27 |
| timely | otoh, it's not really so different from how maemo works | 19:27 |
| crashanddie | so ? | 19:27 |
| crashanddie | isn't that a good thing ? | 19:27 |
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| timely | we have this stupid tap+hold thing which brings up an awkward context menu | 19:28 |
| timely | they have tap which brings up a managable albeit too small to read pie like widget | 19:28 |
| liran_ | I just noticed that when I booted up the device it didn't show the blue progress bar in the bottom of the screen (underneath nokia's logo) | 19:29 |
| liran_ | this happend a couple of times straight... does this mean anything? | 19:29 |
| timely | did it finish booting? | 19:29 |
| crashanddie | timely, watch the firefox mobile idea bouncer | 19:29 |
| timely | which one's that | 19:29 |
| crashanddie | timely, the third one on that page IIRC | 19:29 |
| liran_ | timely: yeah it got to the GUI | 19:29 |
| liran_ | timely: it's a diablo n810 | 19:30 |
| timely | afaik that's wrong... um... | 19:30 |
| timely | ask sp3000 ? | 19:30 |
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| liran_ | timely: that's plain odd. I installed bunch of software last night but I didn't reboot it, just shut it down so I don't know if that caused it, cause I also put a screen protector now and I'm wondering if the guy screwed something up by pressing the screen protector too much down on the LCD | 19:31 |
| brontide | does media player always peg the cpu at 330000 when playing? | 19:31 |
| qwerty12 | brontide, it uses the dsp which can only be ran at CPU/DSP 330/200 by default. With kernel mods, it can be ran at 400/166 | 19:32 |
| brontide | ok, that's not a power drain on it? | 19:33 |
| timely | the power's equivalent | 19:33 |
| timely | it's a matter of balancing what's using it | 19:33 |
| timely | the 200 for dsp was seen as more important for your video | 19:33 |
| brontide | gotcha | 19:33 |
| brontide | i just figured why not 166/200 or it more of a bus limitation | 19:33 |
| qwerty12 | Nokia should integrate the patch by default that lets you choose the op_mode of the dsp. I have it in one of my kernels and I can switch between 330/200 and 400/166 when I want | 19:34 |
| kpel | timeless: exactly. eventually... it would be so much nicer if the accelerometer was a feature that could be presented during the release | 19:34 |
| timely | kpel: the same applies to the radio | 19:34 |
| timely | but again, there's a limit to the amount of man power + testing | 19:34 |
| timely | kpel: i know of a couple of things which are probably going to not be present in the next release | 19:34 |
| kpel | true. but if you see you cannot afford resources to use component X, why use it and make the cost go up? | 19:35 |
| timely | that's not how things work | 19:35 |
| timely | and i'm already starting to bug people about trying to have some path for some third party to work on it so that if all the stars align perhaps some third party can ship on day 0 | 19:35 |
| kpel | tigert: do you work for nokia? | 19:35 |
| timely | nokia buys most components in bulk | 19:35 |
| kpel | sorry, i meant timeless | 19:35 |
| timely | and a component may have 5 functions | 19:35 |
| kpel | duh | 19:35 |
| timely | yes. | 19:35 |
| timely | if you use 4/5 functions | 19:35 |
| timely | then it's probably still cheaper than 2 other components that do just those 4 functions | 19:36 |
| timely | especially if that component is shared w/ nokia phones | 19:36 |
| brontide | timely: with autobuilder won't extras have the ability to be ready day 0 next time? | 19:36 |
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| brontide | assuming the SDK can be seeded | 19:36 |
| timely | brontide: the SDK is key here | 19:36 |
| qwerty12 | brontide, http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-developers/2007-December/013555.html | 19:36 |
| timely | that and seeding the idea | 19:36 |
| timely | my poor memory shows no sign of anyone jumping on the missing component | 19:37 |
| timely | which means while in theory it could work, in practice it won't | 19:37 |
| brontide | maybe a clue x4 at the summit can help | 19:39 |
| kpel | timely: yes, i understand economies of scale but still, i think that there is a lot of untapped potential on the hardware nokia ships to the market. e.g. i'd love to see some good nokis app for my n95 that uses the accelerometer. nokia has the potential to boost symbian applications with that ovi portal. it's s shame not to take that extra step. | 19:39 |
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| timely | kpel: you won't here me arguing against that | 19:40 |
| timely | believe me, no one was happy that we didn't ship an fm radio app for the n800 | 19:40 |
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| Khertan_n810 | Hi ! | 19:40 |
| kpel | timeless: where is the internet tablet team bsed? finland? | 19:40 |
| kpel | that %$£&^%£^£"^ nick completion | 19:40 |
| Khertan_n810 | lol | 19:41 |
| * timely is timeless | 19:41 | |
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| qwerty12 | How can you be timely in a timeless world? | 19:41 |
| timely | depends on how i'm feeling | 19:42 |
| Khertan_n810 | lol | 19:42 |
| qwerty12 | hehe | 19:42 |
| crashanddie | kpel, seeing that most job offers (if not all) are for finland, yeah | 19:42 |
| crashanddie | kpel, which majorly sucks :D | 19:43 |
| kpel | "it's a quantum thing" | 19:43 |
| timely | to answer your question, helsinki | 19:43 |
| timely | crashanddie: hey, in the summer you can play volleyball on the beach at midnight as the sun sets | 19:43 |
| kpel | well, at least it's not oulu :P | 19:43 |
| crashanddie | timely, I wouldn't mind living in Finland | 19:43 |
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| timely | yeah, we've severed nearly all of our ties w/ oulu (cheers!) | 19:43 |
| crashanddie | timely, but it sucks that I just moved to London, and not Helsinki :P | 19:43 |
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| kpel | in london you can't play voleyball even at midday :P | 19:44 |
| qwerty12 | I want to live inside Utsjoki. Non stop sunlight and coldness. | 19:45 |
| Khertan_n810 | come in Paris | 19:45 |
| qwerty12 | :P | 19:45 |
| crashanddie | Khertan_n810, no thank you | 19:45 |
| Khertan_n810 | try and u will due to pollution | 19:45 |
| kpel | i'd rather go to south france | 19:45 |
| kpel | blue coast | 19:45 |
| Khertan_n810 | kpel > bof bof | 19:45 |
| brontide | I was going to take my wife to paris this spring, but then I got sick for a *month* | 19:46 |
| kpel | :( | 19:46 |
| Khertan_n810 | overpriced and too many people | 19:46 |
| qwerty12 | Bet your wife wasn't too happy :p | 19:46 |
| Khertan_n810 | no place to play volley | 19:46 |
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| kpel | then let's all go to oulu | 19:46 |
| brontide | not as unhappy as when she found out I was going to germany | 19:46 |
| brontide | :-P | 19:46 |
| kpel | it will be just us, the locals and the polar bears | 19:46 |
| kpel | actually i might have to go to oulu one day | 19:47 |
| kpel | i hope it will be late spring | 19:47 |
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| kpel | has anyone had a problem with n800 where files appear to occupy more space than their actual size? | 19:50 |
| qwerty12 | ~lart garage. slow again. | 19:51 |
| * infobot stabs garage. slow again. | 19:51 | |
| qwerty12 | infobot, nice, you are learning east london methods | 19:51 |
| infobot | I think you lost me on that one, qwerty12 | 19:51 |
| * qwerty12 stabs infobot | 19:52 | |
| kpel | east london? with no knives involved? | 19:52 |
| kpel | hehe | 19:52 |
| qwerty12 | http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/7545002.stm 0_o | 19:54 |
| kpel | is there an fsck tool for jffs partitions, for diablo? | 19:54 |
| qwerty12 | No, jffs2 does its own checks on startup. Hence the tablet rebooting sometimes while booting. | 19:55 |
| timely | kpel: the internal jffs2? | 19:55 |
| kpel | omg, poor guy | 19:55 |
| kpel | timely: yes, i want to check the internal partition | 19:55 |
| qwerty12 | It's almost a stupid cause of death as the guy peeing on the train track though :/ | 19:55 |
| pupnik | um | 19:56 |
| pupnik | isn't the track at earth potential? | 19:56 |
| penguinbait | Chinese immigrant who stabbed, gutted and beheaded a fellow passenger on a bus traveling across Canada last week also cannibalized the victim and pocketed his nose, lips and ear, | 19:56 |
| pupnik | or what country is dumb enough to make train tracks hot? qwerty12 | 19:56 |
| jaska | strange loot | 19:56 |
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| qwerty12 | pupnik, http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article1453527.ece | 19:57 |
| kpel | ... | 19:57 |
| kpel | so he did all those things to the victim, on a bus, and noone noticed? | 19:58 |
| qwerty12 | penguinbait, yeah, heard about that one. the killer sounded retarded | 19:58 |
| penguinbait | freaking wierdo | 19:59 |
| qwerty12 | after killing him, he holds the head and shows it to the passengers like its a f***** prize | 19:59 |
| qwerty12 | *it's | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | chinese immigrant, sounds like what a crazy ninja would do :P | 20:00 |
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| mange | hey! any news on Diablo power usage problems? | 20:01 |
| Khertan_n810 | power usage problem ? | 20:03 |
| timely | is there a bug? | 20:03 |
| Khertan_n810 | i ve anyone ... | 20:03 |
| timely | the only power usage problems i know of are iPod Touch/Phone 2.0 related :) | 20:03 |
| Khertan_n810 | lol | 20:03 |
| qwerty12 | kill off modest. I'd say browserd too but alas we need it. | 20:03 |
| Khertan_n810 | it s the only one i know too | 20:03 |
| timely | you can of course try disabling meta crawler | 20:03 |
| brontide | I've run into a number of battery draining loops since upgrading to Diablo... modest and icd do it to me | 20:05 |
| timely | um, icd typically means your router is programmed to kill your device dead | 20:05 |
| timely | blame your router vendor | 20:05 |
| qwerty12 | modest is a pita. despite having no accounts and automatic updating disabled, it still runs. I can't see what init script starts it up too. | 20:05 |
| qwerty12 | Or what it is scheduled by. | 20:05 |
| timely | hrm | 20:05 |
| timely | mxr.maemo.org/diablo didn't help? | 20:05 |
| timely | that seems like something you could trivially discover | 20:06 |
| qwerty12 | Haven't tried that, thanks | 20:06 |
| zap | mange: there are no diablo power usage problems | 20:06 |
| zap | mange: your problem is most likely caused by an application eating CPU | 20:06 |
| mange | well, ever since i upgraded from chinook to diablo, my n810 has had significantly worse battery time | 20:07 |
| zap | I don't have this | 20:07 |
| mange | and every time ive stopped by here to discuss, people have agreed that something is fishy :) | 20:07 |
| timely | mange: you can try top, or htop, or the cpu meter applet | 20:07 |
| * qwerty12 prefers htop over busybox top | 20:08 | |
| mange | is there a way to reflash to chinook easily? | 20:08 |
| mange | that would solve all my problems :) | 20:08 |
| qwerty12 | The same way you upgraded | 20:08 |
| timely | mange: flashing today doesn't care which way you go | 20:09 |
| timely | you give it a flash file, it'll take it and destroy whatever is on the device | 20:09 |
| zap | I would recomend against it | 20:09 |
| * timely reads http://mxr.maemo.org/diablo/source/modest-1.0-2008.23/debian/modest.install | 20:09 | |
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| lcuk | zap? whats up with chinook - its stable for lots of people | 20:09 |
| zap | I don't see a single reason for it | 20:10 |
| lcuk | diablo is just an incremental upgrade to it - the core stuff works doesnt it? | 20:10 |
| qwerty12 | More like a bugfix release. Shame they introduced a few bugs though. | 20:11 |
| zap | it's a useless operation, that is. If you install chinook and install same progs, it will be the same | 20:11 |
| crashanddie | [rant]People are never happy, no matter how hard others try[/rant] | 20:11 |
| lcuk | not really zap, he was obviously happy with it - usage profiles vary between users | 20:12 |
| mange | i was very happy with chinook, the only reason to why i got diablo was to run agps util, but that didn't improve time-to-fix for gps much (at least not for me ..), so now i have bought a BT gps instead, which works fine | 20:12 |
| timely | offhand, my guess is that modest is being triggered via dbus | 20:13 |
| qwerty12 | timely, yeah, i'd have to agree with you. There is no cron daemon by default and I don't see any entries in alarmd last time I looked | 20:14 |
| timely | if i'm right, i suspect deleting the .desktop or similar files would cause it to stop being annoying | 20:14 |
| qwerty12 | I should just rename the binary | 20:14 |
| mange | can i shut down modest completely? i really dont need the auto-check-for-email thingie, i just want it to check whenever i launch the mail program manually | 20:14 |
| timely | oh sure... be cruel | 20:14 |
| lcuk | or downgrade to chinook | 20:14 |
| lcuk | :P | 20:14 |
| qwerty12 | nah, my diablo is too pimped out now :P | 20:14 |
| * johnx installed the chinook version of modest on diablo with good results | 20:15 | |
| timely | heh | 20:15 |
| johnx | at the time the chinook version was newer, IIRC | 20:15 |
| * lcuk installs modest | 20:15 | |
| qwerty12 | I need to set up mmc boot so I can use mtd-utils to dump my rootfs | 20:15 |
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| johnx | lcuk, if you're installing the chinook version on diablo be prepared to handle some conflicting deps... | 20:17 |
| lcuk | i meant installing modest y to my own head - i keep having trouble fitting through doors at times | 20:17 |
| timely | oops | 20:17 |
| * timely has firebug enabled | 20:17 | |
| qwerty12 | lcuk, I think you should add brain as a dependency :P | 20:18 |
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| qwerty12 | Hmm, that seemed uncalled for, sorry. | 20:19 |
| lcuk | >cp /qwerty12/head/brain /head/brain | 20:19 |
| lcuk | 0 bytes copied. | 20:19 |
| lcuk | > | 20:19 |
| qwerty12 | My brain is on protected storage :P | 20:20 |
| Khertan_n810 | package not found | 20:20 |
| * qwerty12 seems to remember saying this about lcuk last time :P | 20:21 | |
| * lcuk takes a pinch of salt | 20:21 | |
| Khertan_n810 | you have lost they password ? | 20:21 |
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| Khertan_n810 | sx/thay/the | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | my brain is an entire system installed with random selection of packages and dpkg -i --force-depends. | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:22 |
| Khertan_n810 | some timely to port pycrypto on diablo ? | 20:22 |
| qwerty12 | Why not go for it all and use --force-all :P | 20:22 |
| Khertan_n810 | someone enough timely to port pycrypto on diablo ? | 20:23 |
| Stskeeps | qwerty12: that's pure insanity | 20:23 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:23 |
| qwerty12 | I know, that's why I'm insane, MUAHAHAHAHAHA | 20:23 |
| mange | btw, whats the type of memory card i should get if i want to use in my n810? micro-SD? | 20:24 |
| qwerty12 | Khertan_n810, Come on, you are the resident python expert here | 20:24 |
| Khertan_n810 | lol | 20:24 |
| Khertan_n810 | but gcc don t work on my nit | 20:24 |
| lcuk | pycrypto? why would you want to disguise a pie? | 20:24 |
| lcuk | yes it does | 20:24 |
| lcuk | its configure and stuff that doesnt | 20:25 |
| Khertan_n810 | just need to be compiled from debian | 20:25 |
| qwerty12 | Would you really want that? I'm reading dates like 6 years from their cvs | 20:25 |
| qwerty12 | lcuk, get a proper shell and coreutils :P | 20:25 |
| Khertan_n810 | and dpkg ... and autothings | 20:25 |
| Khertan_n810 | :) | 20:25 |
| qwerty12 | should pass configure tests then... | 20:25 |
| mange | also, what kind of speed should I get if i buy a memory card for the N810? I see there are cards that are capable of 20 MB/s, but i guess the unit itself cant write that fast anyway.. right? | 20:26 |
| lcuk | dpkg works - i can build packages from nit | 20:26 |
| lcuk | took superjott's help mind you | 20:26 |
| lcuk | and i think i broke the furry dice on my mirror | 20:26 |
| Khertan_n810 | luck depends on rules file | 20:27 |
| Khertan_n810 | many need to be rewrited to avoid things like 'bad signal 's'' | 20:27 |
| * qwerty12 prefers fuzzy dice even :P | 20:27 | |
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| * timely pokes Khertan_n810 | 20:28 | |
| qwerty12 | Why rewrite the rules file? Just replace the busybox version of the corrosponding app. | 20:28 |
| * timely doesn't touch python | 20:28 | |
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| qwerty12 | s/corrosponding/corresponding/ | 20:28 |
| infobot | qwerty12 meant: Why rewrite the rules file? Just replace the busybox version of the corresponding app. | 20:28 |
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| Khertan_n810 | timely>peek ? | 20:31 |
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| ywwg | Can anyone help me debug a DNS resolution problem in scratchbox? I seem to have a problem that's not the usual "you have mdns in your nsswitch.conf file" | 20:31 |
| ywwg | I can resolve fine outside scratchbox, but no program inside scratchbox can resolve -- *sometimes*. It comes and goes | 20:32 |
| zap | ywwg: installed dnsmasq? | 20:34 |
| zap | (on host os) | 20:34 |
| zap | (not in scratchbox) | 20:34 |
| ywwg | zap: dunno, let me check | 20:35 |
| ywwg | zap: no | 20:35 |
| zap | scratchbox resolves through 127.0.0.1 | 20:35 |
| zap | so you have either to change /etc/resolv.conf in scratchbox | 20:35 |
| zap | (in every configuration) | 20:36 |
| zap | or install dnsmasq and forget about it | 20:36 |
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| zap | here's Echelon, spying on us | 20:39 |
| ywwg | zap: do I have to restart anything in scratchbox for dnsmasq to start working?? | 20:40 |
| zap | no | 20:40 |
| zap | afair dnsmasq starts working immediately after you install it | 20:41 |
| ywwg | zap: hm, no change | 20:43 |
| zap | ywwg: try "dig @127.0.0.1 google.com" | 20:44 |
| zap | outside of scratchbox | 20:44 |
| ywwg | do you want me to paste the whole thing? | 20:44 |
| zap | no | 20:44 |
| ywwg | (it works) | 20:44 |
| zap | it works? | 20:44 |
| zap | ok | 20:44 |
| zap | now try cat /etc/resolv.conf in scratchbox | 20:44 |
| ywwg | nameserver 127.0.0.1 | 20:45 |
| zap | hm | 20:45 |
| zap | and ping 127.0.0.1 works from scratchbox? | 20:45 |
| ywwg | command not found :P | 20:46 |
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| ywwg | which I would apt-get if I could... maybe I should just download the package manually | 20:46 |
| zap | ugh | 20:46 |
| zap | um | 20:46 |
| zap | it doesn't work from a user account anyway | 20:47 |
| ywwg | do you know of any conflicts with networkmanager? it seems to die if I switch from wired to wireless connection | 20:47 |
| * zap wonders what's wrong with diablo ping | 20:47 | |
| ywwg | (ubuntu hardy) | 20:47 |
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| zap | ywwg: I don't have netmanager running | 20:47 |
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| zap | but it shouldn't be a problem, because netmanager doesn't touch localhost | 20:48 |
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| zap | try netcat package | 20:48 |
| zap | it will work from a user account | 20:48 |
| zap | and ping doesn't, for some jerky reason | 20:48 |
| ywwg | I don't know how to use netcat, what to type? | 20:49 |
| Khertan_n810 | netcat --help | 20:49 |
| Khertan_n810 | :) | 20:50 |
| ywwg | heh | 20:50 |
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| zap | ywwg: type 'netcat -l -p 1234' on host | 20:51 |
| zap | and 'netcat 127.0.0.1 1234' in sb | 20:51 |
| ywwg | no output | 20:51 |
| zap | if it connects, try entering something from one side | 20:52 |
| zap | and from another | 20:52 |
| ywwg | oh | 20:52 |
| ywwg | that works | 20:52 |
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| zap | hm ok, so network works within sb | 20:52 |
| liran_ | an IR transceiver requires LOS right? | 20:52 |
| zap | and you say 'dig @127.0.0.1' works outside sb? | 20:52 |
| zap | and doesn't inside? | 20:52 |
| zap | liran_: what's LOS? | 20:52 |
| zap | line of sight? yes | 20:52 |
| liran_ | sorry, that's an RF term | 20:53 |
| liran_ | yeap, line of sight. | 20:53 |
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| ywwg | zap: I haven't tried the dig from inside | 20:53 |
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| zap | ywwg: theres no dig for sb, alas | 20:53 |
| liran_ | I wonder how far I can put an IR transceiver from actual appliances. like say if it would work from 4-5 meters long with LOS but about 60 degrees off | 20:53 |
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| ywwg | zap: ah well | 20:54 |
| zap | ywwg: try nc 127.0.0.1 53 | 20:54 |
| zap | that should connect to dnsmasq tcp socket | 20:54 |
| zap | but you won't be able to enter a binary record anyway | 20:54 |
| zap | you'll at least see if it's possible to connect to it | 20:54 |
| ywwg | it does connect | 20:54 |
| zap | very strange them | 20:55 |
| zap | try to exit sb | 20:55 |
| zap | and open it again | 20:55 |
| zap | should work | 20:55 |
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| zap | you don't have a firewall, do you? | 20:55 |
| ywwg | zap: I just did an strace wget google.com, and it's not trying to hit 127.0.0.1 for dns | 20:55 |
| mange | anyone have experience with Kingston microSD + Kingston microSD to miniSD adapters? I read on the forum that some adapters doesn't work well with n810 | 20:56 |
| ywwg | it's trying 68.87.73.242 | 20:56 |
| zap | have you edited nsswitch.conf? | 20:56 |
| ywwg | no | 20:56 |
| zap | I'm out of ideas then | 20:57 |
| ywwg | hmph | 20:57 |
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| ywwg | well thanks for the help, I have some tools I can use now | 20:57 |
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| ywwg | zap: aha, that ip address is a comcast DNS router | 21:07 |
| ywwg | zap: so it's got something cached where it's trying to use that server instead of my one here at work | 21:07 |
| zap | um, maybe it advertises himself somehow? and your linux kernel is picking it up? | 21:07 |
| ywwg | I think it's a scratchbox issue, since everything works fine outside it | 21:07 |
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| irq | hello everyone | 21:12 |
| irq | i'm having an issue right now where mysql is ignoring the error-log parameter, prefering to put all logging stuff into /var/log/messages. any suggestions? | 21:13 |
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| Stskeeps | uhm, what does that have to do with Maemo? :) | 21:14 |
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| irq | lol | 21:14 |
| irq | thought i was in #mysql | 21:14 |
| irq | sorry guys! | 21:14 |
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| Khertan_n810 | lol | 21:16 |
| brontide | Doh, no qwerty | 21:17 |
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| ywwg | zap: ok I got it | 21:21 |
| ywwg | zap: in scratchbox there's /etc/resolv.conf, but it's actually looking in /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf | 21:21 |
| ywwg | which has the wrong info | 21:21 |
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| zap | why? | 21:22 |
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| forge | chroot wrongly? | 21:22 |
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| zap | oh | 21:22 |
| zap | I have it modified by NetworkManager too | 21:22 |
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| zap | looks like scratchbox is copying over your host's resolv.conf | 21:22 |
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| ywwg | zap: no it's not touching the system resolv.conf, just this weird alternate-location one | 21:23 |
| ywwg | strange | 21:23 |
| zap | I have /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf identic to my host's /etc/resolv.conf | 21:23 |
| zap | which is set by dhcp client | 21:24 |
| Khertan_n810 | timely > why microb is so slow when 20 windows is open with flash content ? is | 21:24 |
| Khertan_n810 | :) | 21:24 |
| ywwg | zap: mine isn't. maybe it should be a symlink | 21:24 |
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| zap | ywwg: and what's even more strange, if I stop dnsmasq on host, apt-get update still works and downloads | 21:25 |
| zap | no, it shouldn't be a symlink | 21:25 |
| zap | but I believe it's copied with sbox_ctl start or something | 21:25 |
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| zap | but nc cannot resolve addresses when dnsmasq is stopped, so it uses /etc/resolv.conf | 21:25 |
| zap | so in fact it looks like some apps use /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf while others use /etc/resolv.conf | 21:26 |
| zap | oh my | 21:26 |
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| kpel | who cares about standards, eh? | 21:27 |
| ywwg | zap: awesome | 21:27 |
| ywwg | maybe it's bug-filing time | 21:27 |
| kpel | i'm sure all these glitches will be ironed out once a formal process (liek a maemo-devel-HOWTO) is in place | 21:28 |
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| mange | hmm, zap, still here? now my n810 is in that power drain mode again | 22:07 |
| mange | and if i check with "top", there is a maemo-launcher taking 98% cpu all the time | 22:07 |
| mange | what is maemo launcher? | 22:08 |
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| johnx | modest is launched from maemo-launcher | 22:09 |
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| johnx | install htop to get a better idea | 22:09 |
| johnx | to fix it temporarily run, killall modest | 22:09 |
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| johnx | it will respawn later, but maybe it won't soak up 100% CPU for a while | 22:10 |
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| lcuk | /o\ camera broked my nokia | 22:11 |
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| lardman | lcuk: how'd you do that? | 22:12 |
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| lardman | hi johnx | 22:12 |
| lcuk | i dunno but it just locked and shutdown | 22:12 |
| johnx | hi lardman | 22:12 |
| johnx | anyways, got to be headed out to work in a couple hours, so off to get some sleep O_o | 22:13 |
| lardman | I wonder if we can find a connection diagram for an H3 board? | 22:13 |
| lardman | night night then | 22:14 |
| lcuk | even after restarting the problem persists... | 22:14 |
| lcuk | ive just popped the battery | 22:14 |
| lcuk | h3? omap test board? | 22:14 |
| lardman | yeah | 22:14 |
| lcuk | cool | 22:14 |
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| lcuk | i see your lifelong dream of video out (well, daylong) is in pieces after superjott found a disconnected wire | 22:15 |
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| lardman | yeah, well I live in hope that there are other ways of doing it ;) | 22:16 |
| lcuk | damn x-fade for mentioning it | 22:16 |
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| lardman | and X-Fade seemed to think it would work | 22:16 |
| lcuk | yer, would be good | 22:16 |
| jott | wow, nokia takes qt really serious :) http://browser.garage.maemo.org/news/10/ http://blog.vlad1.com/2008/05/06/well-isnt-that-qt | 22:16 |
| lcuk | ooops, after popping the battery its still not working, must be something idid | 22:17 |
| lpotter | yep. they do | 22:17 |
| lcuk | you would take something seriously if you paid over 100million for it | 22:17 |
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| jott | still quite unexpected news :) | 22:18 |
| lpotter | thats pocket change for nokia | 22:18 |
| lardman | off to the pub, bbl | 22:18 |
| lcuk | cya later lard | 22:18 |
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| JamieBennett | I think its pretty clear that QT is Nokia's main focus for the future | 22:18 |
| jott | yep. | 22:18 |
| lardman|pub | I'm sure looking at kernel code after a few beers will be easier ;) | 22:18 |
| lpotter | not main focus | 22:18 |
| lcuk | heh | 22:19 |
| JamieBennett | lpotter: Main as in gtk vs QT | 22:19 |
| lpotter | its like glue that will pull all parts together | 22:19 |
| jott | lpotter: well as toolkit :) | 22:19 |
| lpotter | maemo/S60 are still relevant | 22:19 |
| lpotter | or, rather hildon | 22:20 |
| lcuk | i hope to god we dont see one size fits all apps - desktop and mobile apps with identical interfaces would suck | 22:20 |
| JamieBennett | whos to say QT doesn't pop up on S60 in the future? | 22:20 |
| lcuk | it isnt already? | 22:20 |
| lpotter | JamieBennett: I think there has already been an announcement such as that | 22:20 |
| JamieBennett | Ah must of missed that | 22:20 |
| jott | and qt on hildon is also getting along nicely :) | 22:21 |
| lpotter | it was in the 'takeover of Trolltech' announcement, I think | 22:21 |
| JamieBennett | It makes a lot of sence | 22:21 |
| lcuk | at linuxtag i was mentally playing a drinking game, every time a nokian mentioned qt i had a shot. i think by about 10 minutes into it i was wasted | 22:21 |
| lpotter | heh | 22:22 |
| JamieBennett | Same for the Summit then? | 22:22 |
| lcuk | nahhh qt is old hat and coming | 22:22 |
| lcuk | need new games | 22:22 |
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| JamieBennett | the fremantle drinking game? | 22:26 |
| lcuk | but thats expected isnt it? | 22:27 |
| JamieBennett | lots of drinks though ;) | 22:27 |
| lcuk | heh | 22:28 |
| mikkov_ | I think we have bug in gcc (or g++). This program http://pastebin.com/m6a53a271 works if compiled with gcc, but when compiled with g++ it crashes every time when thread exits :( | 22:29 |
| mikkov_ | some games are hitting this problem hard | 22:29 |
| mikkov_ | if somebody can make this work, that would be great :) | 22:30 |
| lcuk | g++ is the c++ compiler | 22:31 |
| lcuk | that is c code | 22:31 |
| nomis | mikkov_: the underlying assumption that C and C++ are compatible is bogus - not that I'd be very enthusiastic to debug this... :) | 22:31 |
| lcuk | theres nothing wrong here :) | 22:31 |
| nomis | also using threads almost always makes code more complicated... | 22:32 |
| mikkov_ | yes that's c code, but there are programs written with C++ which are doing the same thing. and that program works if compiled for x86 | 22:32 |
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| lcuk | mikkov_, different issue then - show us the c++ code which breaks | 22:32 |
| mikkov_ | openlierox svn ;) | 22:33 |
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| nomis | mikkov_: I am no expert on sdl, but an example on SDL_CreateThread() I found online used a different signature for the thread callback. | 22:35 |
| nomis | wait, bogus example. | 22:35 |
| nomis | ignore me. | 22:36 |
| lcuk | /ignore nomis | 22:36 |
| lcuk | :P | 22:36 |
| lcuk | nomis, threads are fun anywa | 22:37 |
| nomis | lcuk: I try to avoid them whenever possible. | 22:37 |
| lcuk | obviously good practice, but sometimes you cannot avoid them | 22:37 |
| nomis | yeah. | 22:38 |
| lcuk | im just having to use a thread for the camera (infact gstreamer itself does it for me) | 22:39 |
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| nomis | yeah. you cannot avoid them with gstreamer. | 22:39 |
| lcuk | not that it matters, im gonna have to do similar with my networking code | 22:40 |
| mikkov_ | maybe openlierox coding style isn't very good. Is there somewhere proper c++ example with sdl threads? (looking) | 22:40 |
| nomis | for a project at work the guy implementing the most important app used them for everything. The code ended up to be infected with all kinds of mutexes and locks - it was pure horror. | 22:40 |
| lcuk | nomis, ewwwww keep things linear and simple. that way when you realise you cannot work without threads you can transfer | 22:41 |
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| nomis | (that project also reinforced my distaste for C++) | 22:42 |
| lcuk | we have a vb.shit application at work which is similar - the worst part is coding bugs exist which he shrugs shoulders at and has no knowedge of how to debug or see what the issue is | 22:42 |
| lcuk | c++ can work nicely, im happy with c for the time being but think i need some templates to assist me | 22:43 |
| nomis | lcuk: if you want to read a quite biased explantation why c++ is bad: http://yosefk.com/c++fqa/ :) | 22:44 |
| lcuk | i know it can be abused (badly) | 22:45 |
| nomis | lcuk: well, C can be abused as well. | 22:45 |
| lcuk | but not quite so badly - operator overloading is the main culprit | 22:46 |
| nomis | lcuk: there are huge design flaws in C++ that make the language hard to use properly. | 22:46 |
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| lpotter | well, c is just plain hard to use properly | 22:59 |
| JamieBennett | lpotter: Not really | 22:59 |
| lcuk | lpotter, nahhhh, c is a dream. its logical and concise | 22:59 |
| chelli | hi, has anyone else seen problems with the autobuilder in the last days? (i uploaded my new package, canola-flickr-plugin yesterday, builds for chinook and diablo went fine, but the package does not appear in the repository) | 22:59 |
| lcuk | nomis, :) im readin that c++ thing and agreeing with most of it | 23:00 |
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| XTL | C is nice for what it does (which is a lot) | 23:00 |
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| GreyFoxx | Can anyone tell me where I would find the "flash-and-reboot" package ?:) | 23:00 |
| XTL | libc's and cc's otoh... | 23:00 |
| JamieBennett | C is gods own language ;) | 23:01 |
| lcuk | c gets tedious though when implimenting a set of classes | 23:01 |
| GAN800 | Anybody have a link to the revised logo? Modest is being lame at the moment. | 23:01 |
| lpotter | c is tedious | 23:01 |
| XTL | extending the language is one of those things that C doesn't do too well | 23:01 |
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| lcuk | lpotter, hence me wanting my own templates | 23:01 |
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| brontide | https://wiki.maemo.org/Image:Maemo.org_logo_contest_glaoliver_1.png | 23:02 |
| nomis | lcuk: wait till you get to the part about templates :) | 23:02 |
| XTL | You end up with preprocessors, interpreters or something else | 23:02 |
| JamieBennett | after 16 years of C programming I can personally say C has been by far the most effective language I have used | 23:02 |
| lcuk | i already know the problems with ++ templates | 23:02 |
| lcuk | i mean IDE templates - quick code insertion with params | 23:03 |
| crashanddie_ | I wanted to go for a smoke, but when I got outside, I noticed the rain and lightning... Guess what I'm doing... | 23:03 |
| lcuk | smoking inside? | 23:03 |
| crashanddie_ | nope | 23:03 |
| forge | covering in a corner? | 23:03 |
| crashanddie_ | Getting wet | 23:03 |
| lcuk | heh | 23:03 |
| lcuk | get used to it | 23:03 |
| lcuk | oh, and welcome to england | 23:04 |
| crashanddie_ | Or quit smoking | 23:04 |
| jott | or stop smoking :) | 23:04 |
| * GAN800 can't wait to be back to a real connection. | 23:04 | |
| * lcuk is too tired to actually do anything tonight | 23:04 | |
| crashanddie_ | Oh btw Maemo. Andy says hi | 23:05 |
| RST38h | lcuk: real programmers do not use IDE (tm) | 23:05 |
| GAN800 | brontide, that's not the revised logo. | 23:05 |
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| lcuk | RST38h, "syntax highlighting text editor" and shell :) | 23:05 |
| lbt | RST38h: they do, they use EMACS | 23:05 |
| crashanddie_ | Real programmers pipe cat directly into gcc | 23:05 |
| RST38h | lbt: urgh | 23:05 |
| RST38h | oh yes | 23:05 |
| lcuk | real programmers enter binary directly onto the switches on the front of the altair | 23:06 |
| brontide | GAN800: that's the logo winner, were you looking for something else? | 23:06 |
| GAN800 | dneary just posted a revision of the winner to maemo-community. | 23:06 |
| crashanddie_ | the revised version | 23:07 |
| brontide | https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_logo_contest this one? | 23:07 |
| GAN800 | I wasn't sure if there were | 23:07 |
| JamieBennett | lcuk :P I did 6 years commerically with z80 assembler :D | 23:07 |
| GAN800 | a real link to that available. | 23:07 |
| lcuk | JamieBennett, i did about the same typing in hex randomly into my spectrum | 23:07 |
| RST38h | at least it wasn't 8051... | 23:07 |
| crashanddie_ | GAN800, haven't seen the revised one yet | 23:07 |
| JamieBennett | lcuk for a job? | 23:08 |
| JamieBennett | :D | 23:08 |
| GAN800 | Just hit maemo-community I guess | 23:08 |
| dneary | GAN800: I did? | 23:08 |
| GAN800 | Which you should all be subscribed to. :) | 23:08 |
| lcuk | errrr | 23:08 |
| GAN800 | lol | 23:08 |
| dneary | Yes, I did! | 23:08 |
| GAN800 | Maybe I misread | 23:08 |
| dneary | I also put it in the weekee | 23:08 |
| * GAN800 I mobile and tired. | 23:08 | |
| jott | it looks much better without the gradient. | 23:09 |
| brontide | http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/attachments/20080806/7ad48e2c/attachment.png | 23:09 |
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| lbt | I thought https://wiki.maemo.org/Image:Maemo.org_logo_contest_glaoliver_1.png was going to be updated to always point to the latest version... | 23:09 |
| brontide | I guess not ( yet ) | 23:09 |
| GAN800 | Gradient gone, thank god. | 23:09 |
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| brontide | the contest page has the up-to-date one | 23:09 |
| JamieBennett | lbt: I noticed that as my blog points to that image | 23:10 |
| lbt | brontide: well since dneary is here I guess it won't be long... | 23:10 |
| crashanddie_ | I just noticed something... To the uneducated mind, lcuk mind sound like "el cuk" | 23:10 |
| lbt | he's a chef | 23:10 |
| nomis | mhm, the "R" in the ".ORG" bugs me a bit. It is either too small or sitting too low. | 23:10 |
| brontide | This link will probably be the up-to-date one https://wiki.maemo.org/images/8/8f/Maemo_org_logo.png | 23:10 |
| * lcuk wont explain his none typo temporary nick | 23:10 | |
| crashanddie_ | yeah... or something more male focused | 23:10 |
| lcuk | nomis, prob an optimcal illusion | 23:11 |
| lbt | I'm going to watch TV in the bath - l8r... | 23:11 |
| dneary | lbt: We did ask that the glaoliver1 be updated as modifications were made, but that didn't happen | 23:11 |
| * lcuk wonders how the m got in there | 23:11 | |
| brontide | I see the optical delusion as well | 23:11 |
| dneary | I think I'm going to leave that version there for posteriors | 23:11 |
| dneary | I mean posterity | 23:11 |
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| jott | it is NO optical illusion :) | 23:12 |
| dneary | Isn't lcuk pronounced "luck" in the same way as fcuk is pronounced "french connection UK"? | 23:12 |
| lcuk | :D heh no but i like your thinking | 23:12 |
| nomis | someone probably aligned the R on the baseline with the O and G, ignoring that the latter both extend a bit below the designed baseline to compensate for optical effects. | 23:13 |
| jott | the R is a bit smaller. | 23:13 |
| nomis | In the logo the horizontal bar of the R is 1.x pixels lower than the bar of the G. | 23:13 |
| lcuk | w000t, ibm open sourced supercomputer code | 23:13 |
| lcuk | now everyone can use their supercomputers without paying a license fee \o/ | 23:14 |
| nomis | plus the letters need a bit more spacing around the R | 23:14 |
| Stskeeps | woo, time to run the nuclear tests i've been waiting for | 23:14 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:14 |
| Stskeeps | / simulations | 23:14 |
| lcuk | maybe not, dont know the license yet | 23:15 |
| Stskeeps | "You may not use this for constructing doomsday devices" | 23:15 |
| JamieBennett | Stskeeps: or just transcode all my bloody AVCHD video files to something more reasonable like a .mov | 23:15 |
| JamieBennett | royal pain in the bottom | 23:16 |
| ShadowJK | I believe you can mux avc into mov without transcoding | 23:16 |
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| ShadowJK | Not that it would reduce CPU requirements one bit | 23:16 |
| lcuk | back later | 23:17 |
| JamieBennett | ShadowJK if you have suggestions on how to transform a HD AVCHD file into a .mov then I'm all ear's, it really is a pain and I haven't got it working 100% yet | 23:17 |
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| GAN800 | wonderful spotty california cellular coverage | 23:18 |
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| brontide | california isn't perfect? ;-) | 23:19 |
| GAN800 | Ha, that's what I said! | 23:19 |
| RST38h | Hoho, TV is showing a movie made from Lovecraft novels | 23:20 |
| RST38h | Cthulhu will eat 'em allllll! | 23:20 |
| GAN800 | The People's Republik just aint all it's cracked up to be. | 23:20 |
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| brontide | Maybe you can help them with their accounting system there | 23:21 |
| RST38h | GAN: I am sure Verizon is never spotty =) | 23:21 |
| GAN800 | Nah, my dad's phone is bad too. ;) | 23:22 |
| sp3000 | liran_: well, one way is to have the charger connected, in which case you're not really shutting down, and don't get a progress bar | 23:22 |
| sp3000 | or, to be more precise, that's the only way I can think of :) | 23:23 |
| * brontide is signing off for a few hours... family time | 23:23 | |
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| sp3000 | Stskeeps: ohhh dfsg 6 | 23:24 |
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| Macor | i love eureka :) | 23:28 |
| Stskeeps | sp3000: eh? | 23:29 |
| sp3000 | why, http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines of course | 23:29 |
| Stskeeps | sp3000: yes, obviously, but not sure what it was in context of :) my "you may not use this for constructing doomsday devices", or? :P | 23:31 |
| sp3000 | right, your anti-software-freedom doomsday shunning! :P | 23:32 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 23:32 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, that'd violate 6) :P | 23:32 |
| RST38h | No doomsday devices? Where is fun then? | 23:34 |
| liran_ | sp3000: nope, the charger wasn't connected to it. | 23:36 |
| * RST38h warms up vacuum tubes in his doomsday device | 23:37 | |
| liran_ | sp3000: I now reset like 2 times and I got the progress bar, though there were at least 2-3 other times where I shutdown and turned on again (no charger) and no progress bar was shown | 23:37 |
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| penguinbait | viva la community | 23:48 |
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