IRC log of #maemo for Sunday, 2008-03-02

GeneralAntilles	Unfortunately only Windows users get the benefit of Nokia's cool high-bandwidth servers.	00:00
sbk	bah, windows :\	00:01
sbk	bsd/osx > *	00:01
sbk	I won't leave out my linux pals either	00:01
GeneralAntilles	I dunno why they can't load-balance tablets-dev. . . .	00:01
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sbk	that would require someone to learn something ...	00:02
GeneralAntilles	Well, the goodnews is that the *nix users get the cool flasher.	00:02
GeneralAntilles	The Windows flasher is lame and talentless.	00:03
sbk	haha as a;ways	00:03
sbk	always*	00:03
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pupnik	I started using BSD 20 years ago today...	00:06
pupnik	or .. somewhere around today	00:07
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dskippy_	Does anyone know how to make mDNS with avahi work on maemo. I installed it but I can't seem to ping my laptop using its hostname. Just IP.	00:22
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Yanker	just flashed the os2008 on my device, its rocking =)	00:38
Yanker	heh, well anyways - can the size of the left-panel menu items be set globally somwhere?	00:39
Yanker	there's only room for like 6 items and its kinda to little in my oppinion	00:39
GeneralAntilles	No.	00:39
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Yanker	arw..	00:41
Yanker	resizing the icons maybe?	00:41
fysa	nothing.	00:42
fysa	it's locked tight.	00:42
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GeneralAntilles	Who wants to code my awesome mockup? :P http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/appmenu-mockup.jpg	00:45
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unixSnob	What's a mockup? A gui layout?	00:58
GeneralAntilles	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mockup	00:58
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sbk	I'm getting 1500kb/s from that dev.tablet site	01:01
GeneralAntilles	You hit one of the akamai mirrors that doesn't blow. :P	01:02
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sbk	thats funny GeneralAntilles	01:07
sbk	my company	01:07
sbk	we host akamai	01:07
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GeneralAntilles	The broken akamai mirrors have been a large part of the bandwidth problems.	01:08
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Navi	GeneralAntilles, waving that thing around again, have you?	01:13
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cLin	anyone use iemapper before?	01:14
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lcdd	weird. running 'osso-xterm -x' brings up another toolbar in the current terminal	01:36
Tama^2	recursive terminals!	01:38
tank-man	heh	01:38
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Navi	lol	01:39
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mikedmann	high all	01:55
Tama^2	low none	01:56
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Navi	WOO	01:56
Tama^2	Û.u	01:56
* Navi shruggahs		01:56
Tama^2	I am driven by compulsion	01:57
Tama^2	it is my nature, I cannot help it	01:57
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Navi	Tama^2, to work on GeneralAntilles's menu mockup?	01:57
Tama^2	nice try Navi	01:57
* Navi snaps		01:57
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Tama^2	not becoming one of GA's code monkey anytime soon	01:59
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cLin	how do i start the openssh server?	02:05
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Tama^2	it is started automatically when you install it	02:06
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cLin	oh	02:06
cLin	hrm	02:06
cLin	i connected earlier to it using winscp, wonder why it won't work now	02:07
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unixSnob	Is the SDK 100% open source?	02:12
Tama^2	no	02:12
unixSnob	ok.. that means I have to use it on an x86 machine	02:13
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svu_	is there any way to make os2008 use ntp server provided by dhcp server?	02:14
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ustunozgur	cLin: try to ssh to itself in xterm	02:21
ustunozgur	ssh root@localhost	02:21
cLin	yea, i got it working, thanks :D	02:21
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sbk	so I updated the device..	03:21
sbk	it is incrediably faster	03:21
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Tama^2	faster and with a prettier (but clumsy) UI	03:24
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edistar	does anyone know the keycodes of the + and - buttons of the n770?	03:24
GeneralAntilles	F8/F9	03:25
edistar	GeneralAntilles: thx	03:25
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sbk	try Tama^2	03:28
sbk	true*	03:28
sbk	all the apps I wanted to install work now	03:28
sbk	so thats a +	03:28
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sbk	lol @ the mplayer package	03:30
sbk	this device owns	03:30
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* Tama^2 remebers how excited he was when he first used the tablet sigh		03:32
Tama^2	*remembers	03:32
sbk	heh	03:32
* Tama^2 shakes his raised fist in the air while howling "why Nokiaaaaa"		03:33
GeneralAntilles	Do enough rundown tests, Tama^2, and you'll get excited all over again once you can use it. :P	03:33
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Tama^2	I had enough	03:33
Tama^2	I gave up on it	03:33
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sbk	heh	03:35
Tama^2	I will reinstall OS2008 and use the tablet for other things than media consumption (read it will take dust until I leave on trips that will require me to leave my laptop behind)	03:35
sbk	what happened to yours Tama^2	03:35
Tama^2	nothing, it's more like what did I do to complicate my life ;)	03:35
sbk	ahh	03:36
Tama^2	it has some issues that piss me off	03:36
Tama^2	piss me off massively I should say	03:36
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sbk	whast the best mail app	03:36
sbk	and does it do pop & imap?	03:36
Tama^2	modest	03:36
Tama^2	it crashes once in a while but it is usable	03:36
sbk	does the notifier work with it?	03:37
Tama^2	yes	03:37
sbk	win win win win win	03:37
Tama^2	lol	03:37
sbk	this is going to the best handheld for work	03:37
sbk	I know it	03:37
sbk	usbcontroller is genius	03:37
sbk	I can put my contacts in, in a timely manor	03:38
sbk	Tama^2: GeneralAntilles: do you have any suggestions for sites aside from maemo.org to check out	03:38
Tama^2	there is a site with a list of repos but I cannot remember the address	03:39
GeneralAntilles	internettablettalk.com	03:39
sbk	nice!	03:39
sbk	thank you	03:39
GeneralAntilles	sbk, there's also a statusbar applet that accomplishes the same thing.	03:39
sbk	this site Tama^2 ?	03:39
sbk	http://www.gronmayer.com/it/	03:39
Tama^2	yes	03:39
Tama^2	:)	03:40
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sbk	I did a days worth of reasearch before purchasing it	03:40
Tama^2	me too	03:40
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Tama^2	I decided to not spend money on the ipod touch in the end because of apple's attitude towards software dev on those devices	03:40
sbk	well, I have a iphone already	03:41
sbk	but browsing on it is weak compared to the 810	03:41
Navi	Scrolls smoothly though :3	03:41
Tama^2	and a BT keyboard works on the N8x)	03:41
Navi	Tama^2, what kind of smiley is that O_o	03:41
Tama^2	it's the delayed finger lifting typo smiley	03:42
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Navi	:D	03:42
sbk	OH NO!!!!	03:42
Tama^2	re BT keyb... it kind of works	03:42
sbk	the rdp works great!!!	03:42
sbk	im logged into my rdp box	03:42
Tama^2	like everything else it kind of works	03:43
* Tama^2 is spoiled and pedantic ;_;		03:43
Navi	The N8X0 does many things, and it does none of them extraordinarily well	03:44
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sbk	wow this rdp is insane	03:44
sbk	it works perfectly	03:44
sbk	I can hit my core routers and everything	03:44
Navi	rdp is all right	03:44
Navi	x forwarding for the win, though.	03:44
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sbk	true that Navi	03:49
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sbk	Tama^2: is that mail client	03:50
sbk	the one thats built in?	03:50
Tama^2	no	03:50
sbk	im looking for itnow	03:50
Navi	modest isn't built in for chinook	03:50
Navi	it has it's own repo	03:50
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GeneralAntilles	Built-in is osso-email	03:51
sbk	ahhh ok	03:51
GeneralAntilles	Modest is set to replace it in either a future release of Chinook or Diablo.	03:51
sbk	i'm looking now	03:51
GeneralAntilles	http://modest.garage.maemo.org/	03:52
Tama^2	osso is such a lol word	03:53
Tama^2	xD	03:53
sbk	oh thanks GeneralAntilles	03:53
Navi	GeneralAntilles, wow, HOW DID U KNO TAT?	03:53
GeneralAntilles	irmagic	03:54
Navi	omg	03:54
sbk	googs is the win	03:54
sbk	can I remove osso	03:56
Navi	nah	03:56
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sbk	damn it	03:59
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Tama^2	sbk: osso is a prefix to lots of nokia components for the tablet platform	04:12
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Navi	Tama^2he was talking about the mail client	04:17
Navi	Reed teh contextz!	04:17
Tama^2	I know	04:18
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Tama^2	but if you scroll back you will see that I myself admitted I am pedantic	04:18
Tama^2	xD	04:18
Tama^2	he used it as a proper name in his sentence, so I had to rectify him	04:19
Tama^2	(if you scroll further back you will find I claim to be driven by compulsion, so it all makes sense you see)	04:19
Tama^2	>.>	04:19
* GeneralAntilles agrees with Tama^2. :P		04:20
Tama^2	on which particular point?	04:20
lcuk	if you scroll far enough back you see the discussion involving tama, a wild sheep and a traffic cone ;)	04:20
GeneralAntilles	That the correction was worthwhile.	04:21
Tama^2	or you agree with me on anything and everything I have ever said and will say? Please sign on the dotted line	04:21
GeneralAntilles	If you scroll far enough back, you'll see the beginning of time itself.	04:21
Tama^2	lcuk: I fail to see the connection between me the sheep and the traffic cone	04:21
Tama^2	>.<	04:21
GeneralAntilles	You were awfully drunk.	04:22
Tama^2	are you talking to me GA? :P	04:22
lcuk	the beginning of time: Started in 1983: GeneralAntilles stood in line waiting for the nokia a1 teletype luggable to come out ;)	04:22
GeneralAntilles	That's why you don't see the connection. :P	04:22
* GeneralAntilles has a time machine.		04:23
* Tama^2 has two		04:23
Tama^2	pffff	04:23
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Tama^2	I maybe drunk NOW	04:24
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Tama^2	..for all you know	04:24
inteliwasp	... drunk coders... might make intresting programs	04:25
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dmz	apparently you don't hang out on w/any defcon folks :)	04:26
sbk	haha I was @ defcon last yr	04:42
sbk	we were twisted	04:42
sbk	what size memory stick goes in this nokia	04:42
sbk	I bought a 8gig SD card	04:42
sbk	and it didnt fit	04:42
GeneralAntilles	N810?	04:43
sbk	yeah	04:43
GeneralAntilles	MiniSd	04:43
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sbk	sonofabitch	04:43
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sbk	cause I got this 1	04:43
sbk	http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148158	04:43
sbk	no good	04:43
sbk	so this, would have been a better bet?	04:44
sbk	http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820220295	04:44
GeneralAntilles	Yeah . . . little big. :P	04:44
sbk	just a little bit too!	04:44
GeneralAntilles	That would be THE bet. :P	04:44
sbk	cheaper too :\	04:44
GeneralAntilles	MicroSD is also an option with adaptor.	04:44
sbk	I have a microSD 2gig	04:45
sbk	but I think the adaptor is SD	04:45
sbk	:/	04:45
sbk	how do you feel about the GPS on this?	04:45
sbk	in LA it was pretty accurate	04:45
GeneralAntilles	I refuse to buy an N810.	04:46
GeneralAntilles	Waste of money for me.	04:46
sbk	ahh	04:46
sbk	everyone @ work had the 800	04:46
Navi	OMG	04:46
sbk	but I neeeeded a keyboard	04:46
Navi	sbk, bluetooth keyboard :P	04:46
sbk	I have a logitech dinovo edge	04:46
sbk	but I think its wifi :/	04:46
* GeneralAntilles does around 40-60wpm on the thumbboard.		04:46
Navi	the thumbpad is only a tad better than the vkb	04:46
GeneralAntilles	So it's not really an issue.	04:46
Navi	GeneralAntilles, you're a special case	04:46
Navi	>_>	04:47
GeneralAntilles	Wifi keyboard? <_<	04:47
sbk	I think so dude	04:47
GeneralAntilles	You mean Logitech's proprietary 2.4GHz, surely?	04:47
Navi	lol	04:47
sbk	http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/394/192&cl=us,en	04:47
sbk	see	04:47
sbk	I got it like last yr	04:47
sbk	yeah GeneralAntilles	04:47
GeneralAntilles	Thumb is a LOT better than vkb	04:47
Navi	plug it into an N800 via USB host	04:47
Navi	GeneralAntilles, says you	04:47
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GeneralAntilles	I can't believe the prices Logitech gets away with for that silicone nipple trash.	04:48
sbk	yeah, seriously	04:48
GeneralAntilles	Modern keyboard are all shit.	04:48
sbk	hey, I have a problem with my wrists	04:48
sbk	and typing	04:48
Navi	They should go bluetooth >_>	04:48
sbk	that thing worked out great for me	04:48
GeneralAntilles	Thank goodness Unicomp is around to bring some small sanity.	04:48
GeneralAntilles	They used to be BT, Navi, but they moved back to proprietary for some reason.	04:48
Navi	:o	04:48
Navi	Oh yeah	04:48
Navi	my friend has a logitech BT keyboard	04:49
GeneralAntilles	It's really hard to find BT mice these days.	04:49
sbk	I had the older version of the one I showed you	04:49
sbk	the "dinovo"	04:49
sbk	that was bluetooth	04:49
sbk	but I gave it away when I got my dinovo edge	04:49
sbk	brb gents	04:49
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sbk	btw	04:50
sbk	this site rocks	04:50
sbk	http://www.gronmayer.com/it/	04:50
GeneralAntilles	waste. of. money.	04:50
Navi	Unicomp's keyboards are so expensive :P	04:50
GeneralAntilles	Heckuva lot cheaper than that Dinovo. . . .	04:50
GeneralAntilles	Last 5x as long, too.	04:50
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dospod	spp	04:52
dospod	supp	04:52
Navi	http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/on10.html <- Sexy	04:52
Navi	hi dospod	04:52
GeneralAntilles	I want to order a custom Dvorak/Mac/USB one from them.	04:52
Navi	:P	04:53
dospod	hows everyone	04:53
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briand	iGo Stowaway for $37.99 ... that'd work.	05:01
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sbk	good dospod	05:11
sbk	How you doing	05:11
dospod	idk think i set up my browser right lol	05:11
dospod	im good	05:11
sbk	I just setup aircrack	05:11
sbk	hmm, my application manager is still out of date	05:13
sbk	what gives	05:13
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dospod	hey again	05:24
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sbk	these repositories own!	05:25
sbk	best purchase all yr	05:26
dospod	lol	05:27
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SDuensin	Anybody use the iGo Stowaway with an N800? It's not on their compatibility list.	05:34
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Tama^2	it works	05:36
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Tama^2	:)	05:36
SDuensin	Thanks, Tama^2. :-)	05:36
SDuensin	I need a keyboard, and that virtual laser one is just a tad too geeky for me. <G>	05:37
Tama^2	it's not too geeky for me!	05:37
Tama^2	I want it	05:37
Tama^2	xD	05:37
SDuensin	Hehehe	05:37
SDuensin	Me too, but I just can't see whippin' that out in the middle of a restaurant.	05:37
SDuensin	And I can get a Stowaway for a lot less.	05:38
SDuensin	And use it on the couch. :-)	05:38
Tama^2	any keyboard in a restaurant will make you look like an hopeless geek anyway :P	05:39
SDuensin	hehehe	05:39
SDuensin	Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.	05:39
sbk	heh	05:42
sbk	the keyboard on the N810 is adequate enough for me	05:42
sbk	I need a female/female usb adaptor to put my contacts in though :\	05:43
SDuensin	I bought an 800. The 810 was too much for my blood. At least until I prove I'm going to use the 800 enough to make it worth it.	05:43
sbk	I just got the 810 yesturday	05:44
sbk	worth every single penny	05:44
Navi	SDuensin, same here	05:44
SDuensin	Does anyone here actually use the handwriting recognition?	05:45
SDuensin	I loved Graffiti on the Palm, but I can't get anything meaningful out of the 800.	05:46
Navi	SDuensin, I use it from time to time	05:48
Navi	recognizes my stuff fine	05:48
Navi	I'm still trying to get my accuracy down with the thumb board >_>	05:49
Navi	missing letters suck	05:49
sbk	haha	05:49
sbk	yeah	05:49
SDuensin	I gotta use the thumb board. The handwriting recognizer kjadslkta asnq eufak wfd for me.	05:52
sbk	haha	05:52
sbk	I havent even tried that before	05:52
Navi	Handwriting works for M e!	05:53
Navi	well, with a hitch.	05:53
Navi	:P	05:54
SDuensin	Someone insane needs to port Graffiti.	05:54
Navi	I have the speed on highest	05:55
Navi	and it recognizes most of my letters	05:55
Navi	the only letters I have trouble with are y/u and k	05:55
SDuensin	Maybe I just need to tweak it.	05:55
Navi	teach it your handwriting.	05:55
SDuensin	It's sad, but 99% of my use of the 800 so far has been reading books.	05:55
Navi	the default handwriting set almost matches up with mine.	05:56
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SDuensin	Maybe I'll teach it Graffiti.	05:56
sbk	this 810 is totally louder than my macbook when using xmms	05:57
SDuensin	hehehe	05:57
sbk	battery is almost toast tho, from installing OS08 and all the apps I need :P	05:57
SDuensin	Yea - WTF is up with the flash tool telling you to UNPLUG the device? Everyone else demands AC power during a flash!	05:58
* Navi makes a video of him writing awesomeness		05:58
Navi	on windows?	05:58
sbk	yah!	05:58
sbk	nah mac	05:59
Navi	flasher doesn't tell you to unplug the device, only to do it so it gets all the way off	05:59
SDuensin	Kinda both. I use the Windows flasher in VMware on a Mac.	05:59
sbk	ahh	05:59
Navi	you just plug in the USB cable while it's off, run the flasher tool so it waits, and then plug in the power	05:59
sbk	I used the 770Flasher.app	05:59
Navi	then it flashes	05:59
sbk	thats exactly what I did Navi	05:59
sbk	worked flawlessly	05:59
SDuensin	Then to make it even weirder, I have andLinux installed in Windows in the VM on the Mac. Whew.	06:00
sbk	haha	06:00
sbk	hey on the N810	06:00
sbk	right above the webcam, is that a light?!	06:00
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Navi	:P	06:21
cLin	is there anyway to get an applet so i can type in the url box right there instead of opening a new browser then typing it in. i know google search is there but it searches for it instead go to it	06:24
sbk	on the 810 it already has an applet like that	06:26
sbk	"web shortcut"	06:26
cLin	our web shortcut shoes a button to OS2008 user site	06:27
sbk	thats weak	06:28
cLin	anyway to have n810 work on n800s?	06:28
sbk	oh oh oh	06:28
sbk	"internet search"	06:28
sbk	app	06:28
sbk	I heard you can use OS08 on the 800	06:28
sbk	but I'm new to this, just got mine yesturday	06:29
cLin	the internet search app is what i meant about google	06:29
cLin	its a search, not a goto	06:29
sbk	oh I see what you mean	06:30
sbk	not positive bro	06:30
sbk	you search all the repositories?	06:30
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Navi	Apple overdid it with the iPhone's durability ^^;	06:58
Tama^2	you mean they are too sturdy?	06:58
Navi	Yessir	06:58
sbk	its awesome	06:59
Tama^2	anyone else getting a warning about a bad certificate when connecting to google via imap with Modest?	06:59
sbk	ive dropped mine mad times lol	06:59
Navi	I do	06:59
sbk	I did Tama^2	06:59
Navi	It's okay though	06:59
Navi	just accept :P	06:59
Tama^2	-_-	06:59
Tama^2	well thank you very much	06:59
Tama^2	:P	06:59
Tama^2	something is wrong with the certificate	07:00
Navi	annoy google about it	07:00
Navi	They'll get back to you in 4-6 months	07:00
Tama^2	well I am assuming it's not a google problem	07:00
Tama^2	unlikely they have a broken cert	07:01
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K-Fox	http://www.seeqpod.com <----- is it possible to listen music on n800(os2007?	07:03
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Tama^2	suggestions to manage podcasts?	07:44
pupnik	hmm -ao sdl runs at 48khz and -ao esd runs at 44.1khz but internally the mp3 seems to always be decoded at 48khz	07:48
KotCzarny	yawn	07:49
KotCzarny	mp3decsink	07:49
KotCzarny	:)	07:49
KotCzarny	just get that working and forget about that	07:49
pupnik	i made a vid that's just at the border of playability with mp3 playback either with dsp or libmad	07:50
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jayholler	join #maemo	07:51
jayholler	hello	07:52
jayholler	exit	07:52
KotCzarny	lame	07:52
pupnik	KotCzarny: morning... http://pupnik.de/Amazon_306.avi	07:52
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oilinki	Tama^2: I'm using canola2 for podcasts	07:53
KotCzarny	pupnik, it had to play without any reencoding	07:53
KotCzarny	otherwise it's too much hassle	07:53
pupnik	not gonna happen for the general case	07:54
Navi	KotCzarny, I'll say it again, I'd hate to have your sleeping habits	07:54
KotCzarny	navi, good thing you aren't me then	07:54
KotCzarny	:)	07:54
Navi	:D	07:54
KotCzarny	pupnik, it WILL happen	07:54
KotCzarny	not for HD of course	07:54
Navi	It has to happen.	07:54
KotCzarny	but for mp4, yes	07:54
KotCzarny	:)	07:54
Tama^2	thanks oilinki	07:55
KotCzarny	hmm	07:56
KotCzarny	if i clone whole /dev/mtdblock4	07:56
KotCzarny	i can restore it later?	07:56
pupnik	yes assuming you're not booted on it or mounting it	07:58
Navi	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toROK6C5U-Q&	07:58
Navi	lol	07:58
KotCzarny	does flasher restore it in whole or just partially?	07:58
pupnik	how about trying codecs mpeg2video, msmpeg4, wmv1 libtheora etc?	07:58
KotCzarny	pupnik, wmvs are usually low res	07:59
KotCzarny	at least those from web	07:59
KotCzarny	mpeg2 is intensive i guess	07:59
KotCzarny	msmpeg4 is mpeg4	07:59
KotCzarny	and my guess it will have similiar performance to xvid	08:00
pupnik	msmpeg's 'divx 3' according to mencoder	08:00
pupnik	well i can benchmark with -vo null to see codec overhead	08:01
KotCzarny	they can have different drawing patterns	08:02
KotCzarny	so it's better to benchmark them in the way you will use them later	08:02
KotCzarny	also -benchmark shows you codec overhead too	08:02
pupnik	yes i'll try both	08:02
sbk	havi	08:04
sbk	Navi: **	08:04
sbk	thats old	08:04
sbk	you ever see the beer 1?	08:04
Navi	:P	08:05
Navi	yes	08:05
sbk	those same out the same day	08:05
sbk	as the iphoone	08:05
sbk	I was searching like a motherfucker for that	08:05
sbk	haha	08:05
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pupnik	KotCzarny: you need to disable -vo to see effect of codec load	08:21
pupnik	mpeg2 ran 1000 frames @ 25fps in 18.386 seconds, wmv1 ran in 27.684 seconds	08:22
KotCzarny	but you won't know how much will they actually draw on screen	08:23
KotCzarny	but it's nice to know that mpeg2 is faster	08:23
KotCzarny	:)	08:23
pupnik	screen is bandwidth limited anyway	08:23
KotCzarny	yes	08:24
KotCzarny	that's why it's important too	08:24
pupnik	how fast do you think mplayer can draw yuv video to 800x480 screen without codec cpu load	08:25
KotCzarny	it doesn't draw whole frame at a time	08:26
KotCzarny	it can be enough to update only part of it	08:26
KotCzarny	i guess	08:26
KotCzarny	that's why it can matter	08:26
KotCzarny	they say bandwidth is 18M	08:26
KotCzarny	echo $[8004802*25/1024]	08:27
KotCzarny	18750	08:27
KotCzarny	that'w 25fps	08:27
KotCzarny	in 16bpp	08:27
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pupnik	ok well i now have 800x480 video that decodes at ~30fps without sound	08:30
KotCzarny	echo $[8004802*30/1024]	08:30
KotCzarny	22500	08:30
pupnik	with -vo null	08:30
pupnik	with xv it gets 25.589 fps @400mhz	08:31
KotCzarny	w/o sound	08:31
KotCzarny	;)	08:31
pupnik	so mpeg2 could do fullscreen video	08:32
pupnik	full-res that is	08:32
pupnik	with dspmp3 if we could keep 400mhz	08:32
KotCzarny	in sync	08:32
KotCzarny	:)	08:32
KotCzarny	that would be the problem	08:32
pupnik	however at 333mhz	08:32
pupnik	it only gets 16.54 fps	08:34
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pupnik	plus it doesn't look very good	08:34
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Tama^2	hi again	08:36
pupnik	hello	08:36
pupnik	however with my bordercase amazon video it always looks smoother with gstreamer than with libmad	08:37
KotCzarny	:)	08:37
cLin	is therea button that works like the enter button?	08:41
KotCzarny	dpad	08:41
cLin	like one of the directions on the dpad?	08:41
pupnik	400x240 mp4 benchmarks at 43.40 fps	08:41
cLin	whenever i press the middle one it opens the keyboard	08:41
KotCzarny	400x240 if pff	08:41
christefano	is there an IRC client for maemo?	08:41
cLin	christefano, xchat	08:41
pupnik	yes	08:41
KotCzarny	clin: change that in prefs	08:41
christefano	thanks	08:41
pupnik	xchat, pidgin, irssi	08:41
pupnik	but even 400x240 gets jerky playback with libmad here	08:42
christefano	I just ordered an n810 and am gathering a few programs	08:42
KotCzarny	chrinsefano: in short, every linux program should work	08:43
KotCzarny	after compiling	08:43
pupnik	that is false	08:43
KotCzarny	'should'	08:43
KotCzarny	;)	08:43
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KotCzarny	most of the software i have tried compiled without a problem	08:44
KotCzarny	and ran fine too	08:44
Tama^2	liar ! xD	08:44
christefano	that's exactly what draws me to it :)	08:44
KotCzarny	i haven't tried compiling firefox, though ;)	08:44
christefano	is there a minimo for maemo yet?	08:45
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Tama^2	HANDWRITlNG Test	08:46
KotCzarny	you have done well, padawan	08:47
KotCzarny	now try this backwards	08:47
KotCzarny	;)	08:47
kikka	Heya!	08:47
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KotCzarny	http://wiki.mozilla.org/Mobile/Build/Maemo_Build_Instructions	08:59
KotCzarny	o.o	08:59
KotCzarny	anyone has spare cpu power?	08:59
KotCzarny	:)	08:59
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Tama^2	GooDNight Computer	09:05
KotCzarny	go go	09:05
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Tama^2	is aircrack available for chinook?	09:09
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Jaffa	Morning, all	09:46
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n800music	is there a xchat .deb for os2008?	09:49
KotCzarny	probably	09:49
rm_you	yes	09:49
n800music	can't find it :/	09:50
rm_you	http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/	09:50
KotCzarny	isn't that rm -rf ?	09:50
rm_you	?	09:50
rm_you	no	09:50
KotCzarny	in all *nic books it's -rf	09:51
KotCzarny	;)	09:51
rm_you	though i hadn't actually looked at the domain name like that before :P lol	09:51
KotCzarny	*nix	09:51
rm_you	yes, usually	09:51
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Tama^3	rm-rf was already taken probably	09:52
n800music	sahweeet.	09:52
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n800music	thanksies	09:55
n800music	pidgin hogs the whole screen	09:55
n800music	you see 3.5 lines	09:56
Navi	pidgin sucks.	09:56
KotCzarny	:)	09:56
n800music	i think it's decent	09:56
cLin	hrm, i used canola cleanup cause it had a problem detecting files but now i can't download	09:56
n800music	but not on maemo	09:56
cLin	everything fails in application manager even though the internet works	09:57
KotCzarny	:>	09:57
KotCzarny	canola sucka?	09:57
KotCzarny	sucks	09:57
KotCzarny	:)	09:57
cLin	well, obviously now i know	09:57
cLin	i cant install any applications	09:57
cLin	>:(	09:57
KotCzarny	run terminal and then apt-get something	09:57
KotCzarny	at least it will show you what's wrong	09:58
KotCzarny	or see the logs option in app-manager	09:58
cLin	ok	09:58
cLin	man, this thing is annoyin. sometimes the key responds slow or the dpadjams and goes down a lot	09:59
cLin	says fail to fetch, something about a read only file system	09:59
cLin	how did that happen	09:59
KotCzarny	corruption	10:00
KotCzarny	:>	10:00
KotCzarny	reboot	10:00
cLin	not using locking for read only lock file filepatch	10:00
KotCzarny	if that won't help connect via usb and chkdsk	10:00
KotCzarny	:)	10:00
cLin	reboot? turn off and turn on?	10:00
cLin	i did that already	10:00
cLin	ok, guess i need tochkdsk	10:00
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rm_you	how do I exit UKMP!? >_>	10:05
KotCzarny	killall ?	10:05
KotCzarny	:)	10:05
KotCzarny	try clicking menu button	10:05
rm_you	i can hit the home button and close it with the X button, or kill via terminal... but it doesn't properly close >_>	10:05
KotCzarny	kill -9 ?	10:06
KotCzarny	:>	10:06
rm_you	it leaves music playing in the background <_<	10:06
KotCzarny	probably more to it	10:06
rm_you	yeah.	10:06
KotCzarny	ps ax\|grep -i okmp	10:06
KotCzarny	ps ax\|grep -i ukmp	10:06
rm_you	i was more hoping that there was an actual exit feature somewhere	10:07
rm_you	and i just failed at finding it	10:07
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KotCzarny	last time i used it it closed properly	10:07
KotCzarny	but it's medialibrarized	10:07
rm_you	was there a button or something?	10:07
KotCzarny	sucks	10:07
rm_you	>_>	10:07
KotCzarny	i don't know, i have uninstalled it	10:07
KotCzarny	:)	10:07
n800music	is opera for 2008 available?	10:08
KotCzarny	probably	10:08
rm_you	i wish >_>	10:08
rm_you	havent seen it	10:08
KotCzarny	os2k7 wersion doesn't work?	10:08
cLin	whattt, how is my memory card in use if nothing is open	10:09
n800music	i don't think so	10:09
KotCzarny	clin, swap?	10:09
n800music	i think mozilla's is too memory hungry, i'd like to try opera	10:09
cLin	how can i check	10:09
KotCzarny	type free in terminal	10:10
KotCzarny	and see if it's enabled	10:10
cLin	oh man this thing is lagging like crazy, but when i hook it up via usb to my computer, it speeds up	10:10
cLin	says swap : 0 0 0	10:10
KotCzarny	clin: media-crawler	10:10
KotCzarny	:>	10:10
cLin	whats that	10:10
KotCzarny	hog.	10:10
KotCzarny	;)	10:10
KotCzarny	i have disabled it altogether	10:11
KotCzarny	i don't use media libraries	10:11
cLin	how do i know if thats the source?	10:11
svu_	anyone managed to make os2008 use ntp server provided by dhcp?	10:11
KotCzarny	run terminal	10:11
KotCzarny	and type: top	10:11
cLin	i mean, i just rebooted so idont know why its like this	10:11
KotCzarny	then: shift-p	10:11
KotCzarny	media-crawler crawls your data files ALL the time	10:11
rm_you	how did you disable media-crawler?	10:11
KotCzarny	rm_you: /etc/rc2.d/	10:12
rm_you	k	10:12
KotCzarny	and remove or rename Scosmethingmedia-crawler	10:12
cLin	holy shit	10:12
KotCzarny	to Ksomething	10:12
cLin	metalayer-crawl	10:12
cLin	96% cpu	10:12
KotCzarny	ah, yes, metalayer-crawl	10:12
cLin	FUCK THAT	10:12
cLin	what is it and can i get rid of it	10:12
KotCzarny	just wait it off	10:12
cLin	mmcqd is 35%	10:12
KotCzarny	after a while it will get down to reasonable cpu usage	10:12
cLin	metalayer went down to 1	10:13
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cLin	i dont see media crawler though	10:13
KotCzarny	it crawls EVERYTHING after you connect via usb or reboot the device	10:13
cLin	there's only 6 processes	10:13
KotCzarny	when i was saying media-crawler i meant metalayer-crawl	10:13
cLin	oh	10:13
cLin	how long will it take?	10:14
KotCzarny	if you want to know more about it just google	10:14
KotCzarny	that depends on how many files you have	10:14
KotCzarny	:>	10:14
cLin	cani disable it without any consequences?	10:14
KotCzarny	for me it was 10-120 seconds	10:14
cLin	do large files slow it down? i just put in my music which was around 2 gigs	10:15
KotCzarny	if you want to have all your mp3/videos/images automatically added to your media library then you have to keep it running	10:15
KotCzarny	just google about it	10:15
KotCzarny	:)	10:15
KotCzarny	i can be wrong	10:16
cLin	well i mean in programslike canola don't they have that refreshoption that does it for you? and i am, im reading some thread on ITT	10:16
KotCzarny	i'm not an expert	10:16
KotCzarny	:)	10:16
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rm_you	yeah i dont use any of the builtin media stuff	10:18
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rm_you	so the crawler is kind of useless	10:18
KotCzarny	more than that	10:18
KotCzarny	it's a hog.	10:18
KotCzarny	;)	10:18
cLin	oh man	10:19
cLin	im disabling it	10:19
cLin	i cant even type root	10:19
cLin	it goes rooooott	10:19
cLin	or rottttttt	10:19
cLin	or rrroootttt	10:19
KotCzarny	use ssh	10:19
KotCzarny	:)	10:19
cLin	oh yea	10:20
cLin	when i type kill metalayer-crawl is says bad pid	10:21
KotCzarny	use killall	10:21
KotCzarny	kill needs numerical pid	10:21
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cLin	wouldnt that kill all processes?	10:21
KotCzarny	read what killall does	10:22
rm_you	killing it wont help, it autorestarts	10:22
rm_you	you need to run:	10:22
rm_you	/etc/init.d/metalayer-crawler0 stop	10:22
cLin	wouldnt it just start up again when i reboot?	10:22
rm_you	yes	10:22
cLin	i just followed some guys advice and renamed it	10:23
rm_you	you'd need to remove it from the default runlevel	10:23
cLin	added .deactivate at the end	10:23
KotCzarny	canola-conf is metalayer-crawler's cousin done by canola team. It is a bit funny, they are from Nokia too but instead of making one good media scanning daemon together, they chose to make two (less good) ones.	10:25
KotCzarny	eheheh	10:25
KotCzarny	canola sucks.	10:25
KotCzarny	;)	10:25
cLin	what do u use for media?	10:26
KotCzarny	mplayer and playfilelist	10:26
KotCzarny	;)	10:26
cLin	playfilelist?	10:26
KotCzarny	it's my ncurses ui to mplayer	10:26
cLin	oh	10:26
KotCzarny	a hacked version of playmp3list	10:26
KotCzarny	ncurses ui is the best	10:27
cLin	got a link?	10:27
KotCzarny	one can run it on a 'screen' and log out	10:27
KotCzarny	erm	10:27
KotCzarny	i'm still developing it	10:27
KotCzarny	if you like i can give you a source/binary	10:28
cLin	speaking of screen, when i ssh into my n800, i cant use screen	10:28
cLin	says its not found	10:28
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KotCzarny	install it, doh.	10:28
cLin	oh, thought it came installed	10:28
KotCzarny	most of good *nix stuff is optional	10:28
Navi	luls	10:28
KotCzarny	but available fortunately	10:28
KotCzarny	:)	10:28
KotCzarny	http://madabar.com/exailemaemo/	10:31
KotCzarny	YES!	10:31
KotCzarny	:>	10:31
KotCzarny	files tag looks promising from screenshot	10:32
n800music	is there a way to change fot size?	10:32
n800music	font	10:32
n800music	or type?	10:32
KotCzarny	probably	10:32
n800music	hehe	10:33
KotCzarny	via gtk-themes i guess	10:33
cLin	haha, i was just looking at that after you said canola sucks	10:33
cLin	saw it in some thread on itt	10:33
KotCzarny	yes	10:33
cLin	does look nice though	10:33
cLin	reminds me of foobar	10:33
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K-Fox	http://www.seeqpod.com <----- is it possible to listen music on n800(os2007?	10:42
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KotCzarny	does that site works anyway?	10:43
n800music	i tried,no go	10:43
KotCzarny	looks broken in my firefox	10:43
n800music	its great on standard comouters	10:44
KotCzarny	doesn't work on mine	10:44
KotCzarny	:)	10:44
n800music	also woonz.com	10:44
n800music	same thing	10:44
KotCzarny	it's a flash	10:44
KotCzarny	probably badly written	10:45
KotCzarny	:>	10:45
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dookdook	ssvb, you around?	11:15
ssvb	dookdook: yes	11:15
dookdook	i'm having some more compile errors...i'm sorry, i'm still a little fuzzy on what exactly is going on	11:16
dookdook	Error: selected processor does not support `usat lr,#8,lr'	11:16
dookdook	compiled with: -mcpu=arm926ej-s -g3 -mtune=arm1136j-s	11:16
ssvb	dookdook: nokia 770 does not support usat instruction	11:18
dookdook	i've got a nokia n800	11:18
dookdook	thats what i'm trying to compile for	11:18
KotCzarny	leave out -mcpu and mtune ?	11:18
ssvb	dookdook: but you are compiling code compatible with 770	11:19
ssvb	just set -mcpu=arm1136jf-s	11:19
ssvb	you can 'man gcc'	11:20
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dookdook	ach, yes, thank you...	11:20
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pupnik	ssvb: pls see http://pupnik.de/Amazon_240.avi - i can not get smooth playback with libmad but i can running nosound and a dspmp3 task in the background	11:27
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pupnik	600kb/s 400x240 xvid mpeg4 with vbr mp3	11:29
pupnik	using .24	11:29
KotCzarny	use .25	11:29
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KotCzarny	.24 has a bug with slow xvid decoding	11:29
pupnik	mm? thanks	11:30
pupnik	http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/chinook/free/m/mplayer/mplayer_1.0rc1-maemo.25.n8x0_armel.deb	11:31
* BTobotras uses multimedia player out of the box -- does he loose something exciting w/mplayer?		11:32
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KotCzarny	as long as it suits you, no	11:32
KotCzarny	:)	11:32
pupnik	hey it's noticeably better	11:32
KotCzarny	http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16986	11:32
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KotCzarny	here you have changes since .24	11:33
pupnik	wrong link	11:33
pupnik	oh bad paste	11:34
pupnik	sorry	11:34
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ssvb	pupnik: the difference is in "Fixed issue #2091 ('nokia770 video driver does not get enabled on N810')", xv video output is still slow	11:39
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KotCzarny	what about: * Fixed issue #1962 ('mp4(divx) playing VERY slowly with MPlayer 1.0rc1-maemo.24.n8x0') ?	11:39
KotCzarny	:)	11:39
ssvb	KotCzarny: that is a bugfix for proper mp4 container files support, it has nothing to do with avi files	11:40
KotCzarny	then description is misleading	11:41
KotCzarny	:)	11:41
ssvb	the description is fine, it mentions mp4 container format with divx encoded data in it	11:42
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ssvb	anyway, that's the summary of the following bugreport: https://garage.maemo.org/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1962&group_id=54&atid=269	11:43
KotCzarny	one usually thinks avi is just a header and index for encoded data	11:43
cLin	hey KotCzarny i asked you earlier about the enter button, where is it in the prefernce? only option i find is having dpad open the finder keyboard	11:44
KotCzarny	text input -> launch inger keyboard with []:	11:45
cLin	thats what i found. if i unselect it, does it act as enter?	11:45
KotCzarny	probably	11:46
pupnik	does libmad always render audio to 48khz? i speficied -af resample=22050:2 in mencoder (mplayer reports AUDIO: 48000 Hz, 2 ch, s16le, 80.0 kbit/)	11:49
KotCzarny	thst's a source file format	11:50
KotCzarny	not what is ctually rendered by mplayer	11:50
pupnik	how do i force a lower mp3 encoder rate with mencoder? i'm trying	11:51
pupnik	mencoder Amazon_720.wmv -o Amazion_400b.avi -af volnorm -af resample=22050:2 -af channels=2 -oac mp3lame -lameopts lowpassfreq=11025:vbr=2:q=8 -vf-add scale=520:312 -ovc xvid -xvidencopts bitrate=800:me_quality=6:vhq=4:lumi_mask:gmc:pass=2 -ofps 25 -force-avi-aspect 800/480	11:51
KotCzarny	hmm, or i may be wrong	11:51
KotCzarny	:)	11:51
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KotCzarny	add -srate 22050	11:52
pupnik	mplayer on PC also says the audio is 48khz	11:52
KotCzarny	after -af	11:52
KotCzarny	-af resample=22050 -srate 22050	11:52
pupnik	ok	11:53
KotCzarny	but 22khz sucks.	11:53
KotCzarny	don't go lower than 32khz	11:53
pupnik	also i noticed that the -ao sdl runs at 48khz but -ao esd runs at 44100 khz on the backend	11:54
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pupnik	for some things, low fi audio is ok if it buys me better performance	11:55
KotCzarny	you will have to reencode when that mp3decsink will be fixed	11:56
pupnik	thanks for the -srate tip - that worked	11:56
pupnik	funny now i'm getting crazy bitrates reported	11:56
pupnik	VIDEO: [XVID] 520x312 12bpp 25.000 fps 42469.7 kbps (5184.3 kbyte/s)	11:56
KotCzarny	:)	11:57
KotCzarny	but it plays ok?	11:57
pupnik	yes on PC it reports	11:57
pupnik	VIDEO: [XVID] 520x312 12bpp 25.000 fps -17179870.0 kbps (-2097152.0 kbyte/s)	11:57
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pupnik	i was changing the xvid bitrate - i think I specified 800	11:57
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pupnik	argh it was just because the file was incomplete that the br was reported wrong	12:12
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KotCzarny	#	12:16
KotCzarny	It appears that regardless of the memory cards being unused (or even umounted), they do not enter low power mode. Is this a problem with the cards, with the OS or just an unfortunate combination of card model+OS?	12:16
KotCzarny	http://www.drlinux.it/maemo/battery_consumption.html	12:16
KotCzarny	can anyone comment on that?	12:16
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`0660_	well, when i removed the memory card that came with the device from the external slot my battery seems to have lasted a lot longer	12:20
lcuk2	yes, the font is too small ;) as for the situation itself i am unhappy with how quickly the 810 drains	12:20
`0660_	a lot more longer in fact, but in the other hand that's just a gut feeling :)	12:20
KotCzarny	hum	12:20
* KotCzarny has 2sd cards inserted into n800		12:21
KotCzarny	i should do some battery tests	12:21
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`0660_	would be nice to have more tests written about that topic	12:22
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KotCzarny	at least someone hacked a battery meter tool	12:23
KotCzarny	:)	12:23
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Veggen	people - the problem with the long version number - is there any workaround? besides disabling repository.maemo.org chinook free ?	12:25
lcuk2	ll i know about the battery is that i have returned to my device far too oten to find it totally dead	12:25
KotCzarny	veggen: file a bug report	12:25
KotCzarny	or just hack /var/lib/dpkg/	12:25
Tama^2	naaa	12:26
Tama^2	battery tests are for losers	12:26
Tama^2	xD	12:26
KotCzarny	there's only 2 files that have insane version string	12:26
Veggen	libfaad2 and faad2, yes.	12:26
Tama^2	KotCzarny, battery tests make you hate your N800	12:26
Tama^2	believe me	12:26
KotCzarny	hehe	12:27
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KotCzarny	i've read that n810 is even worse	12:27
KotCzarny	in that matter	12:27
KotCzarny	(or was it other way around?)	12:27
lcuk2	i know the 810 is bad, and i cant even unplug a memory card to test if its that	12:28
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Tama^2	How does one disable the word completition bar when using a BT keyboard?	12:29
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lcuk2	tama, its in the control panel quite well buried away, if you start messing about in control panel tho you will hate your n8x0 ;)	12:30
KotCzarny	nah	12:31
KotCzarny	it's only first time	12:31
Tama^2	Without any memory card inserted my N800 battery lasts almost 9 days	12:31
KotCzarny	then your setup will be optimal	12:31
Tama^2	buried where?	12:31
KotCzarny	:)	12:31
Tama^2	O.o	12:31
KotCzarny	hmm	12:31
Tama^2	please help me	12:31
KotCzarny	but without any memory card it's no fun	12:31
KotCzarny	:)	12:31
KotCzarny	though i can consider 1gb vs 12gb	12:31
KotCzarny	(:	12:31
KotCzarny	if that would mean better times	12:32
Tama^2	btw it is creepy to see ppl quoting me in chan, I will have to pull that webpage xD	12:32
KotCzarny	;)	12:32
lcuk2	control panel/ text input settings / language tab/ settings button. but its for always - you cant decide sometimes with, and sometimes without	12:32
KotCzarny	tama: then add info about you on the page	12:32
Tama^2	ah, I see	12:33
KotCzarny	nick@irc-net	12:33
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Tama^2	KotCzarny, I am shy ;_;	12:33
Tama^2	thanks lcuk2	12:34
KotCzarny	shy, but you have a google accessible website?	12:34
KotCzarny	:)	12:34
Tama^2	I was looking for a way to disable it only for the keyboard, I guess that will have to do	12:34
Tama^2	well I am not really shy ;)	12:35
KotCzarny	hmm	12:36
KotCzarny	looks like n800 is superior to n810	12:36
KotCzarny	:>	12:36
KotCzarny	http://beans.seartipy.com/2007/10/19/n800-vs-n810-or-who-should-consider-buying-nokia-n810/	12:37
* KotCzarny happy		12:37
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lcuk2	nahhh, 800 is great if you can cope with covering the screen or want diff mem cards, but the 810 is more rounded and accessible to a none tablet person. i looked and thought @hmmm@ at 800, but just drooled at 810 and had to get it	12:38
Jaffa	N810's styling is very drool worthy	12:38
KotCzarny	hum	12:39
lcuk2	even tho now i am typing with an apple keyboard i prefer having a full board for when i am away from my pit	12:39
Jaffa	Here's hoping OS2009 is a big jump in shiny s/w	12:39
lcuk2	it cant be that big a jump really else they will lose compatability	12:39
KotCzarny	if you don't mind hildonization most of apps can be recompiled	12:40
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KotCzarny	so it's not a problem	12:40
johnx	you can make pretty big changes without breaking API compatibility, especially in the user facing apps	12:40
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Jaffa	lcuk2: I reckon they can sort many of the UI issues without changing the API (if not the ABI)	12:40
lcuk2	yer but if they up the shinyness the 8x0 will struggle to cope cpu power wise, not api compatability	12:41
Jaffa	True	12:41
lcuk2	its already at limits for most things now	12:41
Jaffa	Damn the real world	12:41
KotCzarny	:)	12:41
KotCzarny	upgradeable cpu would be nice	12:41
Jaffa	Yeah, whomever thought auto-scrolling on the RSS applet was a good idea on a battery, CPU and GPU-constrained device needs to be shot.	12:41
lcuk2	well, we could have a free upgrade if we could get it pointed in the right direction	12:42
Tama^2	autoscrolling can be disabled	12:42
lcuk2	we have coprocessors just lying idle right now ;(	12:42
Tama^2	and it does not scroll when it is not exposed	12:43
lcuk2	i disabled the rss applet but osso rss reader still runs - how can i kill it	12:43
lcuk2	for all time	12:43
Tama^2	do you have it on auto refresh feeds?	12:44
lcuk2	i never configured it - it had what it came with - i just removed it from desktop	12:44
aquatix	morning	12:45
Tama^2	let me check I have a fresh install too	12:45
lcuk2	thanks tho, i just re-enabled it, configured and found it was set - why should it update if its not in use?	12:46
KotCzarny	no rss threads in my ps ax	12:46
KotCzarny	lcuk: for faster access?	12:46
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lcuk2	they update whenever i reconnected to wifi	12:46
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lcuk2	so i got a cpu spike of about 50% for about a minute	12:47
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KotCzarny	maemo-launcher uses 3% cpu constantly, i wonder what is it doing	12:48
lcuk2	i noticed it because i would reconnect and instantly try to test my program it would go slow	12:49
lcuk2	launching things obviously	12:49
lcuk2	;)	12:49
KotCzarny	obviously not	12:49
KotCzarny	pids are not increasing	12:49
lcuk2	i noticed xomap was taking lots	12:50
Tama^2	reading dbus noise maybe	12:50
KotCzarny	hmm	12:50
KotCzarny	let's strace it	12:50
KotCzarny	grin	12:50
Tama^2	also consider that 3% when idle is 3% @ 165MHz	12:50
Tama^2	not much	12:50
lcuk2	thats #% more than it should be for an idle device	12:51
lcuk2	3 even	12:51
KotCzarny	still, 3% @ 165 is more than 0	12:51
KotCzarny	:)	12:51
KotCzarny	yes, it's polling constantly	12:51
Tama^2	It's interesting, I have flashed OS2007 and went back to OS2008 and now touchscreen pressure works (before it would not)	12:53
Tama^2	polling what?	12:53
pupnik	how do you measure pressure?	12:53
KotCzarny	how can i ask strace to report fd names?	12:53
lcuk2	does anyone know about x11 xevents? - i have been attempting to slow my program down when no events occur (i call into xnextevent) but i am constantly getting an event type of 65 but cant seem to identify it from the event mask or anywhere in the headers. any ideas?	12:54
Tama^2	maemopad plus would not detect any difference in the stylus pressure	12:54
Tama^2	now it does	12:54
lcuk2	if you reflashed perhaps it reset the maemopad+ setting for @pressure sensitive@ ;)	12:54
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KotCzarny	lcuk: you can set a mask what events you want to receive	12:54
lcuk2	yes i know and i masked it to only keypress and release	12:55
lcuk2	but this ev 65 still occured	12:55
Tama^2	nah I checked that before and it was already set to be pressure sensitive	12:55
KotCzarny	lcuk: maybe some emulated key event?	12:55
Tama^2	;)	12:55
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lcuk2	i got rid of everything i could, im tempted to think its a screen finished updating event but i dont like assumptions	12:56
KotCzarny	tama: http://pastebin.com/mddc3b44	12:56
johnx	woo! cheap usb keyboard is go!	12:56
KotCzarny	that's the part repeated ~2 times per second	12:57
* aquatix really should get a usb host cable		12:57
johnx	aquatix, I just got a usb female-female	12:57
lcuk2	johnx, i tried that before i got this apple board	12:57
Tama^3	poll instead of select, mmmm	12:57
lcuk2	but i didnt like the fiddly wires	12:57
johnx	the female to female isn't a wire, neither is the mini-b to A-male	12:58
johnx	they're both short adapters	12:58
lcuk2	and on 810 i cant plug it in with the kickstand closed	12:58
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johnx	lcuk2 same with N800	12:58
KotCzarny	wireless kbd ftw!	12:58
KotCzarny	:)	12:58
lcuk2	so i cant use my cradle with it	12:58
kikka	Wow, the app-manager hate me. doesn't start. so, I will only use apt	12:58
johnx	that's not so great, but I won't use the keyboard unless I'm at a flat surface anyways, so I don't see the point in wireless	12:59
johnx	kikka, the app manager hates everyone	12:59
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KotCzarny	mine, works	12:59
KotCzarny	:)	12:59
lcuk2	mmmmmmmmy wireless is working for a distanceeeeee of about 2 inches, but its a very important distance that no wire can cross cleanly	12:59
KotCzarny	but i have broken apt-get	12:59
KotCzarny	;)	12:59
lcuk2	ooooh, this stutter is bad occasionally	12:59
aquatix	KotCzarny: i have an iGo and i'm loving it :)	12:59
aquatix	but usb host for card reader or something may be cool	12:59
KotCzarny	i will have to buy one	13:00
aquatix	or portable hdd	13:00
KotCzarny	sooner or later	13:00
KotCzarny	for now i'm loving wlan and ssh	13:00
KotCzarny	:)	13:00
aquatix	iGo stopped making them :(	13:00
johnx	I'll probably hack up an ugly stand to attach my N800 to the keyboard...next stop: hardware store, but not today	13:00
pupnik	duct tape...	13:01
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johnx	I'm thinking maybe a door mounting plate type thing	13:01
KotCzarny	:)	13:01
johnx	dunno what it's called	13:01
spirytusick	johnx: a hinge ?	13:01
KotCzarny	vesa mount?	13:01
johnx	not a hinge though	13:01
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lcuk2	lol @ getting a tilt n swivel bracket for your 810	13:02
* johnx is tired, probably isn't making much sense		13:02
spirytusick	lcuk2: yep, flexibility and durability, stainless steel!! just fantastic :)	13:02
KotCzarny	it's a pity n8x0 doesn't have four button on the right side too	13:02
johnx	I'm just happy that my keyboard works	13:02
KotCzarny	(like in psp)	13:02
KotCzarny	:)	13:02
lcuk2	aaaaaaaactually, its a shame they didnt include a camera tripod mounting screw to the base	13:03
lcuk2	ffffs @ stutter	13:03
johnx	that would have been really nice	13:03
kikka	johnx: Thanks :)	13:03
spirytusick	lcuk2: I'll grab by mate's n810 and see if it can be drilled. I am sure he wouldn't mind :)	13:03
lcuk2	lol spiry	13:04
KotCzarny	hmm	13:04
lcuk2	does anyone else have bt keyboard stutter like i appear to be having	13:04
KotCzarny	just break old dig-cam and superglue the part	13:04
KotCzarny	:)	13:04
megabyte405	lcuk2: with high cpu usage or long holds on the keys, yeah	13:04
spirytusick	KotCzarny: might work, but it will look ugly as hell :)	13:04
megabyte405	press quicker or run less stuff	13:04
lcuk2	thats just the sensible approach, best go with the drilling "its the only way to be sure"	13:04
KotCzarny	make it cute then!	13:05
KotCzarny	:)	13:05
KotCzarny	yesh..	13:05
KotCzarny	right through the lcd	13:05
KotCzarny	;)	13:05
lcuk2	i have xchat open and a webpage from a while ago with pastebin on	13:05
spirytusick	KotCzarny: a cute birck ? :) heh, I give up :)	13:05
johnx	very odd, the keyboard works but the caps lock/num lock/scroll lock lights don't come on O_o	13:05
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lcuk2	you could drill straight through the ambient sensor, its useless anyway, and it might also go through the gps antenna, which may actually make that work as well, so in the end its a plus	13:06
lcuk2	johnx, power considerations, you might find if you press keys from all quadrants of the keyboard it may reboot	13:06
johnx	well that's awesome	13:07
johnx	I'll do a sync and try right now	13:07
spirytusick	lcuk2: maybe a shock therapy with an explosive stuck to the device will help ? I've heard it works wonders with people!	13:07
lcuk2	you only have 100ma, so no keypounding	13:07
lcuk2	i know a lot of people want an exploded view of 810 but thats pushing the envelope a bit far	13:08
pupnik	will it blend?	13:08
lcuk2	very likely, dont breathe this in - its nokia smoke	13:08
spirytusick	lcuk2: what does the nokia smoke do to you ?	13:09
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johnx	lcuk2, I thought it was more like 200mA?	13:09
lcuk2	try it and see	13:09
johnx	also I just pressed all the keys at once	13:09
johnx	no effect :)	13:09
johnx	except lots of letters showing up in "Notes"	13:09
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johnx	and the N810 text prediction bar even shows up. Cute :D	13:10
lcuk2	no john, usb OTG is 100ma. Thats because a normal usb device is given 100 to init itself and send over its spec. the otg device is not expecting any more tho	13:10
lcuk2	john, diff keyboards have diff power requirements, mine must have been a fatty	13:10
johnx	this one is quite small	13:11
lcuk2	power consumption wise	13:11
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lcuk2	:O youngest is singing	13:11
johnx	ahahaha! it lists the power consumption on the box	13:12
johnx	I didn't even notice	13:12
lcuk2	on which box? kb?	13:12
johnx	yeah	13:12
johnx	20mA	13:12
lcuk2	cool	13:12
lcuk2	then that explains why yours works nicely :)	13:12
johnx	it might take a bit to get used to this key size, but I learned the Zaurus...This shouldn't be too hard	13:13
lcuk2	this logitech deluve has 5v100ma on the back	13:13
johnx	the key-pitch and layout might drive some people nuts, but that just means no one will borrow it from me. :D	13:15
KotCzarny	if you don't want to borrow, just say no	13:16
KotCzarny	should work most of the time	13:16
KotCzarny	:)	13:16
johnx	yeah, but this way no one will even ask :)	13:16
Tama^2	The PluThon thingy for Eclipse works	13:17
Tama^2	It can start python apps on the tablet remotely for testing	13:18
Tama^2	cute	13:18
KotCzarny	so does vnc and ssh	13:18
KotCzarny	:)	13:18
Tama^2	I'd rather use ssh myself	13:19
Tama^2	it's quicker	13:19
KotCzarny	;)	13:19
KotCzarny	and more convenient/safe	13:19
lcuk2	ive got a nice little script setup to make/copy/run/killall an app i am testing	13:22
KotCzarny	use nfs/sshfs	13:22
KotCzarny	just mount you devel dir and run directly	13:22
lcuk2	i use scp to do the copy	13:22
KotCzarny	:)	13:22
KotCzarny	*your	13:22
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lcuk2	it does its job as it stands but that sounds like i would need to put code on the device aswell, or just build it into a mounted dir?	13:23
KotCzarny	just imagine it as a local dir on you nokia	13:24
KotCzarny	even if it's on pc	13:24
KotCzarny	really	13:24
lcuk2	ahhh do it that way round, thats a possibility, but since its through a vmware box and not available all the time its not that simple	13:25
lcuk2	i want to push the exe for testing but then run again when i am offline	13:25
lcuk2	i dont want to have to keep wifi enabled just to read a book	13:26
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KotCzarny	it is available	13:26
KotCzarny	you vmware box has net access	13:26
KotCzarny	so it can be done	13:27
lcuk2	yes, it does, but not all the time, it might do whilst i am sat developing, but i want to carry on testing offline - its a book reader and the best way to test it is to sit back and read and i dont want to drain battery with wifi	13:27
kikka	Nokia770-49:~# evince	13:28
kikka	evince[1179]: GLIB CRITICAL ** Gtk - gtk_widget_set_sensitive: assertion `GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed	13:28
kikka	Segmentation fault	13:28
KotCzarny	but when you're done developing you can copy it finally	13:28
kikka	What the hell?	13:28
KotCzarny	and you can even do it from nokia itself	13:28
KotCzarny	because it's mounted on it	13:29
lcuk2	but the way i am doing it, i get best of both worlds, i test directly on device and can control it and start/stop when i like and i also get to walk away with the latest version, even if vmware shut off or wifi off	13:29
KotCzarny	nah	13:29
KotCzarny	you're stressing your flash	13:29
KotCzarny	;)	13:29
KotCzarny	over and over	13:29
KotCzarny	the best way is: develop on pc, mount dir via nfs on nokia, test it on nokia, when done, run script to copy to the /usr/local	13:30
KotCzarny	:)	13:30
lcuk2	i stress my flash every time i do anything with the filesystem, i hardly think a single file update will make matters worse - the 128mb of swap is doing tonnes more damage	13:30
KotCzarny	swap ? rarely	13:31
lcuk2	but how do i know when i am done?little things l	13:31
KotCzarny	journal wears the flash a lot more	13:31
lcuk2	ike irc get in the way and family	13:31
KotCzarny	lcuk, you will know when you're done because you will be quitting vmware	13:31
KotCzarny	:)	13:31
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lcuk2	not really, vm is still running this time, but little things stop me getting anything done - fact is at the moment im happy with how im doing it and it works well for me :)	13:35
KotCzarny	sure	13:36
KotCzarny	though i prefer mounting	13:36
KotCzarny	:)	13:36
johnx	I really doubt anyone will find a way to kill their flash except through very heavy swapping	13:36
KotCzarny	that way i can browse other files too	13:36
KotCzarny	johnx: heavy swapping isn't that bad as you think	13:37
KotCzarny	journal is a lot worse	13:37
KotCzarny	but jffs2 and vfat are ok	13:37
johnx	how is journal worse? it's one extra write for every realy write to a file...correct?	13:37
KotCzarny	:>	13:37
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Tama^3	it all depends on the how the card handles wear leveling, but considering the cost per MB I would not worry honestly	13:38
KotCzarny	tama: data loss	13:38
KotCzarny	money is not a problem	13:38
jaska_	ext2 with noatime might work	13:38
KotCzarny	but data loss happen at the worst moment	13:38
KotCzarny	usually	13:38
Tama^3	data loss is not happening within the lifetime of the card	13:38
johnx	Tama^2, a broken internal flash on the N810 would be no fun	13:38
Tama^3	roughly 5 years?	13:38
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* KotCzarny runs ibm x32 on 4gb compact flash		13:39
KotCzarny	:)	13:39
KotCzarny	~2 years by now	13:39
lcuk2	john, it wouldnt break totally, the available space will just start to drop as more secotrs are marked bad	13:39
johnx	KotCzarny, if you're swapping you're potentially reading and writing in small chunks as fast as the card can be written to	13:39
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KotCzarny	johnx: but in different places	13:39
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KotCzarny	journal is usually 4-32mb	13:39
johnx	wear leveling...	13:40
KotCzarny	wear levelling is usually divided in sectors	13:40
KotCzarny	sandisk used 4mb sectors	13:40
KotCzarny	so it's not move this block to anywhere on card	13:40
KotCzarny	but move this block anywhere on 4mb-sector	13:41
johnx	aaah...ok, I could never get a definitive answer on that	13:41
johnx	can you direct me to some in-depth reading?	13:41
KotCzarny	i have seen a white-paper for a wear levelling v1.0	13:41
KotCzarny	from sandisk	13:41
lcuk2	i would like to see a memory module with standard ddr a cap and a baseline of flash so when the power goes out it has enough internal power to copy everything onto flash	13:41
Tama^2	I think you can read patents about it	13:42
KotCzarny	lcuk: that's called system cache	13:42
KotCzarny	;)	13:42
lcuk2	im on about a proper drop in replacement, so the issue of writeeeeee times never comes up	13:42
KotCzarny	johnx: http://www.sandisk.com/Assets/File/OEM/WhitePapersAndBrochures/RS-MMC/WPaperWearLevelv1.0.pdf	13:43
Tama^2	but if you read the implementation of jffs2 it's pretty much the same concept implemented on the host	13:43
johnx	cool, I'll add that to my list of bedtime reading... :)	13:43
KotCzarny	but it's old	13:43
KotCzarny	and may be outdated	13:43
KotCzarny	:)	13:43
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lcuk2	right, family time - cyas later	13:45
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Tama^2	see ya lck2	13:46
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aquatix	Tama^2: Too much? :)	13:48
Tama^2	there is no such thing	13:49
KotCzarny	there is	13:50
Tama^2	but I saw that joke on IRC ages ago	13:50
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aquatix	heheh	13:52
aquatix	KotCzarny: myeah, if it's starting to hurt and eat all your time, maybe ;)	13:52
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KotCzarny	:)	13:53
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jaska_	guess my n810 is cursed, reflashed and gets stuck installing the 'maemo-pc-connectivity' :)	13:58
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jku	that's a bad name for that package btw	14:03
jaska_	indeed	14:03
jku	I wonder how many people will install it expecting sync software or somthing	14:03
KotCzarny	:)	14:03
jaska_	hah	14:03
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pupnik_	yrgh omap3530 has 430-MHz TMS320C64x DSP Core	14:08
KotCzarny	?	14:08
pupnik_	fast	14:09
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KotCzarny	and?	14:10
pupnik_	http://www.gp32x.com/board/index.php?showtopic=40795&st=135	14:10
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pupnik_	http://youtube.com/watch?v=4Y1PwLM8SKI ti making open source push for OMAP3530	14:13
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jku	pupnik, you are familiar with pandora? is the "April/may" release date something that can actually happen?	14:14
pupnik	yes according to the public/private info I have	14:15
KotCzarny	hmm	14:17
KotCzarny	that omap has 3 sdio interfaces	14:17
KotCzarny	:>	14:17
aquatix	ooooh	14:17
aquatix	3x 32GB SDHC ftw :)	14:18
KotCzarny	money money money	14:18
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aquatix	sorry, had to say that ;)	14:18
pupnik	it will have 2 full size SD slots	14:18
KotCzarny	one 32gb sdhc would be ok	14:18
KotCzarny	for a start	14:18
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aquatix	very true	14:18
KotCzarny	:)	14:18
KotCzarny	but i'm not complaining	14:18
KotCzarny	8gb is fine too	14:18
KotCzarny	:)	14:18
johnx	I really can't believe that SDHC spec only supports up to 32GB :/	14:19
* aquatix currently has 4GB minisd		14:19
johnx	in its current version at least	14:19
aquatix	but my microsd -> minisd adapters should come in soonish	14:19
pupnik	so buy 10 cards and have 320GB on the go	14:20
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* aquatix drools a bit		14:21
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pupnik	with tv-out you can have a nice little media player	14:21
KotCzarny	swapping card sucks	14:21
aquatix	yeah	14:21
spirytusick	KotCzarny: still one big card can store much more than one dvd	14:21
pupnik	then get a battery pack and a 1TB drive on usb	14:22
KotCzarny	:)	14:22
spirytusick	KotCzarny: you will not have to swap too often if you know what you want to watch	14:22
johnx	I read the SDHC spec, from what it looks like they just need to flip a couple bits in software to support arbitrarily large sizes	14:22
KotCzarny	i'm not a divx maniac	14:22
KotCzarny	so 8gb is fine for me	14:22
* aquatix already has 2.5GB of music on it		14:23
aquatix	and some Futurama	14:23
johnx	really, 640KB ought to be enough...	14:23
spirytusick	KotCzarny: my only concern would be not loosing the cards, it was hard enought sometimes to find a 5.25"" floppy, looking for an sd or microcd would be a nightmare	14:23
KotCzarny	yes	14:23
aquatix	johnx: that's working mem ;)	14:23
KotCzarny	that's why swapping cards suck	14:23
KotCzarny	:)	14:23
johnx	but it's the principal	14:23
KotCzarny	johnx: ever seen vista?	14:24
KotCzarny	:)	14:24
spirytusick	KotCzarny: and worse, under certain circumstances and a reasonable intoxication level swallowing an microsd card becomes a possibility...	14:24
aquatix	ew	14:24
aquatix	spirytusick: hahaha	14:24
aquatix	myeah	14:24
lcuk	"keep this safe, its listers mind"	14:24
spirytusick	KotCzarny: gives new meaning to the expression "gone to shit"	14:24
KotCzarny	:)	14:24
aquatix	i already almost lost such a card in the train	14:24
johnx	KotCzarny, I really haven't played with it except at a store...	14:24
aquatix	johnx: it sucks	14:25
KotCzarny	johnx, i guess it's bootloader is bigger than 640kb	14:25
KotCzarny	;)	14:25
aquatix	i had to fix things on it for family, and it's a purely annoying OS	14:25
aquatix	anyways	14:25
aquatix	storage and working mem are two things	14:25
johnx	I was making a point though	14:25
KotCzarny	what would be nice are a pockets INSIDE the device	14:25
aquatix	why wouldn't you be able to have high quality media [movies, music]?	14:25
K-Fox	is it possible to see comic?	14:26
aquatix	KotCzarny: like... an extra SD slot? ;)	14:26
johnx	K-Fox, yes	14:26
spirytusick	I currently have 2 8gb sd cards	14:26
KotCzarny	aquatix, even not connected electrically	14:26
KotCzarny	:)	14:26
spirytusick	12 gb is for storage and 4 gb for my / filesystem	14:26
K-Fox	what is a name of application?	14:26
johnx	K-Fox, google for comic viewer maemo	14:26
K-Fox	thanks..	14:26
aquatix	or put the rss feeds in google reader or something ;)	14:27
KotCzarny	quiver would work too	14:27
spirytusick	so far I have enought space for everything, some pictures, some movies, and plenty of scummvm games, jagged alliance and a full copy of bg2, still a lot of space leftr	14:27
KotCzarny	:>	14:27
KotCzarny	jagged alliance?	14:27
spirytusick	jagged alliance 2 to be exact	14:27
KotCzarny	only storage or it runs on maemo too?	14:28
spirytusick	KotCzarny: Check the itt forums in the software/gaming section	14:28
johnx	honestly though, why did they stop at 32GB? I thought one compatibility break would be enough to get them to fix things for real	14:28
KotCzarny	o.o	14:28
KotCzarny	johnx, money money money	14:28
johnx	I guess...I tried to play "follow the money" but I just didn't see it	14:29
KotCzarny	new standard, new license?	14:29
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KotCzarny	old device gone ?	14:29
johnx	I thought the people who made the sd spec were representatives of the people who implemented it...maybe I assumed incorrectly	14:30
KotCzarny	johnx, it's the sales of cards that generates money	14:31
KotCzarny	i think	14:31
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spirytusick	johnx: having a standard wich does not require changes for long time is not exactly profitable nowadays	14:31
johnx	right, so "joe has a camera that takes SDHC cards, he wants to buy a new bigger card, but he can't because it won't work in his camera"	14:31
spirytusick	johnx: they can always charge you for a new upgraded capability	14:31
spirytusick	johnx: it's not technical limitation, sadly only marketing...	14:31
KotCzarny	but by that time joe's camera would be outdated	14:31
johnx	spirytusick, I came to the same conclusion after about 10 minutes with the spec	14:32
KotCzarny	but i guess laziness also plays some part	14:32
michele_	I bet they've just been dumb and did it wrong again	14:32
spirytusick	johnx: this is what is built in in everything nowadays	14:32
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spirytusick	johnx: I wouldn't be suprised if our n8x0 lcd controller and lack of 3d accelleration was not a design flaw but a required element of the marketing plot	14:33
johnx	spirytusick, that's a little paranoid. :) I think Nokia is just as pissed to be saddled with this design	14:33
lcuk	they could upgrade the bandwidth to the lcd without compromising the major design	14:34
johnx	"Don't attribute to malice what can be equally explained by stupidity."	14:34
KotCzarny	:)	14:34
johnx	lcuk, the interface becomes unstable when run at higher speeds	14:34
michele_	or by currently available hardware and prices	14:34
spirytusick	lcuk: but then they would not be able to sell you the new tablet summetime ? :)	14:34
KotCzarny	http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14317	14:34
KotCzarny	:)	14:34
lcuk	for this specific lcd model, but there must be others which operate well at higher frequencies	14:35
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KotCzarny	overclocking would be nice	14:35
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johnx	KotCzarny, overclocking the LCD interface?	14:36
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johnx	apparently 10% is the most you could get without risking damage	14:36
KotCzarny	:)	14:37
KotCzarny	could be enough for some people to be happy	14:37
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johnx	<10% and you only end up with display glitches and instability :P	14:37
KotCzarny	i'm happy for now	14:38
KotCzarny	and waiting for the mp3decsink fix	14:38
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johnx	for mplayer?	14:39
KotCzarny	yes	14:39
johnx	libmad should end up faster anyways	14:39
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spirytusick	KotCzarny: what is it fixing? dsp decoding ?	14:40
KotCzarny	spirytusick: right now mplayer has sync problems in 2008, so they disabled gst support	14:40
KotCzarny	if they fix it think of it as a free cpu cycles	14:41
lcuk	technically, the lcd can handle > 25fps 800*480 YUV frames (i know because i am getting 27fps using only the greyscale channel but its refreshing everything)	14:41
johnx	as long as libmad takes up less than 70MHz worth of CPU time it should be faster than doing it on the dsp	14:41
spirytusick	KotCzarny: yep, slight delay in sound playback vs video	14:41
KotCzarny	libmad is ok	14:41
lcuk	sdl uses an unoptimum path to get its data	14:41
KotCzarny	but esd sucks big time	14:41
johnx	it used to use ALSA, iirc	14:42
johnx	but something is up with alsa in OS2008 I think	14:42
KotCzarny	johnx: cpu can be stuck to 400/133 mode	14:42
KotCzarny	then you get 400mhz AND free 133 of dsp	14:42
johnx	is that enough for mp3 decoding though?	14:42
KotCzarny	(or is it 400/110)	14:42
spirytusick	johnx: true, I have tried to compile a few module players in scratchbox, half of them did not work, a one of them had a weird speedup issue	14:43
johnx	133 sounds right	14:43
KotCzarny	johnx: yes, more than enough	14:43
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johnx	spirytusick, and I've had nothing but pain from something they did to part of the path for a2dp	14:43
spirytusick	johnx: let	14:45
spirytusick	let	14:45
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spirytusick	let's hope the next os release will fix some of those bugs	14:45
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johnx	I hope so...	14:46
KotCzarny	don't hope. hack.	14:46
KotCzarny	:>	14:46
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johnx	I have been	14:46
johnx	I've been hacking Debian, but I'm tired of running into stupid things that trip me up :\|	14:46
KotCzarny	:)	14:47
GeneralAntilles	I dunno what Python installation tutorial told this poor dude to go to xterm, but he sent me 3 PMs begging me to help him last night. <_<	14:48
lcuk	is there any documentation on what triggers the cpu speedups	14:48
johnx	the random chunks of ITOS thar are closed just put me in a stabbin' mood	14:48
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johnx	GeneralAntilles, if you look on the official site that's how it tells you to install it	14:48
GeneralAntilles	johnx, you should start filing bugs on bugzilla about pieces not having source. :P	14:49
johnx	might want to drop them an email telling them to fix it	14:49
GeneralAntilles	Does it really?	14:49
johnx	pretty sure	14:49
GeneralAntilles	Why in the world. . . .	14:49
johnx	GeneralAntilles, http://pymaemo.garage.maemo.org/installation.html	14:49
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, I see it.	14:50
johnx	lunacy, no?	14:50
Tama^2	yes	14:50
GeneralAntilles	I'd expect better from INdT. . . .	14:50
aquatix	that's how i installed python2.5-runtime too	14:50
aquatix	not sure what's difficult on that though :)	14:51
* KotCzarny never installed python by himself		14:51
KotCzarny	app-manager took care of it	14:51
johnx	aquatix, hang out on itt for 20 minutes...	14:51
KotCzarny	:)	14:51
aquatix	johnx: yeah, really should be more on the forums i guess	14:52
aquatix	don't have time though :(	14:52
KotCzarny	make some dummy package that requires apt-get to fetch what they need	14:52
* aquatix wonders what he's doing on irc at all :D		14:52
KotCzarny	and post .install somewhere	14:52
KotCzarny	:)	14:52
aquatix	KotCzarny: true	14:52
aquatix	sounds easy	14:52
aquatix	just some meta-package	14:52
GeneralAntilles	If Extras is enabled, anything that needs Python will install it.	14:52
KotCzarny	yup	14:52
johnx	er...what I mean is the average itt user is fresh out of windows xp, never used the CLI, wants things to "just work"	14:52
aquatix	or even just a .install for python2.5-runtime	14:52
* KotCzarny never used cli to install apps		14:53
aquatix	johnx: yeah	14:53
johnx	there is one, but it apparently doesn't work intermittently	14:53
aquatix	johnx: i meant more like `i only see itt threads when googling on issues/things instead of even browsing it decently'	14:53
aquatix	oh well	14:53
jku	johnx, the solution for them is for the apps to depend on the runtime, right?	14:53
jku	not another package to install...	14:54
aquatix	jku: yeah	14:54
aquatix	and several apps don't :/	14:54
johnx	there are just a few that fall through the cracks and get in over their heads...	14:54
GeneralAntilles	jku, they do.	14:54
aquatix	that's stupid	14:54
GeneralAntilles	'least, all the ones that I've seen do.	14:54
KotCzarny	:)	14:54
KotCzarny	life	14:54
aquatix	oh wait yeah	14:54
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aquatix	but they say 'uninstallable', because they miss the runtime	14:54
KotCzarny	uninstallable means it can be uninstalled	14:55
KotCzarny	;)	14:55
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aquatix	meh	14:55
aquatix	`not installable'	14:55
KotCzarny	;)	14:55
* aquatix is not that awake		14:55
aquatix	was some dutch-english fsckup :)	14:56
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KotCzarny	Rendering is currently a scanline 2x scaler. Running lemmings about 5 fps.	14:57
KotCzarny	:/	14:57
KotCzarny	pity	14:57
KotCzarny	playing lemmings with a stylus would be great :>	14:57
* johnx remembers lemmings for the SNES		14:58
* KotCzarny remembers lemmings on the amiga		14:58
johnx	gah...the snes controller was not the best thing ever for that game	14:58
KotCzarny	superior sound	14:58
KotCzarny	:)	14:58
glass	isn't there a lemmings clone port already	14:58
johnx	pingus	14:58
johnx	I think it's playable but somewhat crashy?	14:58
GeneralAntilles	Ah, it seems they got rid of the /user meta package for Python-runtime.	14:58
johnx	really?	14:59
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GeneralAntilles	Evidently	14:59
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johnx	wow...well that's ... awesome	14:59
KotCzarny	:)	14:59
GeneralAntilles	So you either need redpill or root to install it without installing something that depends on it.	14:59
GeneralAntilles	. . . and if some things don't depend on it properly. :\	14:59
johnx	wonderful	15:00
KotCzarny	life	15:00
GeneralAntilles	'least we don't have to deal with the 2.4/2.5 nonsense anymore. :D	15:00
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* aquatix has even played lemmings on his old palm		15:02
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arif_endro	hello all :)	15:26
johnx	hello	15:27
arif_endro	It's true that N830 is equiped with WiMAX device?	15:28
KotCzarny	yes	15:28
KotCzarny	but it's not released yet	15:28
KotCzarny	so it can be reverted	15:28
KotCzarny	for any reason	15:28
KotCzarny	:)	15:28
johnx	KotCzarny, do you know something we don't or are you just playing around? :P	15:29
KotCzarny	johnx: google for it	15:29
johnx	yeah, I see the bestbuy ad that TexRat pretty much refuted	15:29
GeneralAntilles	There's no N830.	15:29
KotCzarny	:)	15:29
GeneralAntilles	There WILL be a WiMAX tablet, but it's not the one pictured in the Best Buy ad.	15:29
johnx	KotCzarny, alright, stop playin' with the newbs :P	15:30
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KotCzarny	:)	15:30
arif_endro	So it's still in question..? btw when will Nokia announce about this things..	15:31
KotCzarny	i don't know why wimax would be such a feature	15:31
johnx	yes. only Nokia knows	15:31
KotCzarny	even now i'm setting rate to 2mbit	15:32
KotCzarny	(power, range etc)	15:32
arif_endro	2 mbit? it's for WiMAX or Wifi	15:32
aquatix	KotCzarny: well, because you will have wireless everywhere then?	15:32
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johnx	my guesses? maybe at cebit, maybe when sprint's xohm network launches, maybe if you ask them really, really nice. :)	15:32
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aquatix	wimax is for outside	15:32
KotCzarny	so wimax isn't wifi compatible?	15:32
aquatix	no	15:32
aquatix	google it :)	15:33
KotCzarny	i thought it's simply another speed upgrade	15:33
KotCzarny	:)	15:33
aquatix	no, it's some 4G thing	15:33
Fang64	wimax is a different standard all together, folks seem to keep confusing it	15:33
Fang64	just because of the "Wi" part	15:33
johnx	KotCzarny, I don't know when you're playing and when you honestly don't know...	15:33
aquatix	Fang64: well, the name is confusing indeed	15:33
johnx	802.16	15:33
arif_endro	I thinks WiMAX is still considered 3G by ITU	15:33
Fang64	yup IEEE 802.16	15:33
aquatix	and it's based loosely on wifi, but it's a different thing altogether	15:33
KotCzarny	nice	15:34
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Fang64	It operates at different frequencies from WiFi as well	15:34
arif_endro	what's frequency they use in WiMAX	15:34
Fang64	depends on region	15:34
aquatix	Fang64: thankfully, otherwise it'd push our networks from the air :)	15:34
johnx	er...it's frequency agnostic last time I checked	15:34
KotCzarny	hehe	15:35
Fang64	aquatix: we already have alot of trash on 2.4 microwave as it is, I can barely operate a AP where I am at due to trash	15:35
johnx	you could implement it on unlicensed bands, but there wouldn't be much point	15:35
arif_endro	frequency agnostic? what it's	15:35
KotCzarny	but it's microwave access	15:35
KotCzarny	so it's 2.4g + i guess	15:35
Fang64	well depends on the implementation	15:35
Fang64	some operate on multiple bands	15:35
johnx	arif_endro, the wimax specification doesn't specify a frequency	15:35
Fang64	which is quite annoying at least when designing the antenna for those client s	15:36
arif_endro	any info on the WiMAX chipset being used on N830?	15:36
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johnx	there's not much (any?) reliable info	15:38
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johnx	and it probably won't be N830	15:38
johnx	that "leak" was apparently a false alarm	15:38
KotCzarny	attention catcher	15:38
KotCzarny	:)	15:38
* michele_ wonders if KotCzarny has the smiley embedded in the return key		15:39
Fang64	indeed, plus we have competition with other types of services like EVDO, HSDPA, and EDGE which offer similar speeds comparable to WiMax	15:39
Fang64	Nokia can choose what they are going to implement yawns and who knows if the N830 has any of those capabilities or if we'll get it XD	15:40
KotCzarny	btw. what happened to n820?	15:40
KotCzarny	anyone knows?	15:40
Fang64	lol, sometimes model numbers don't make sense lol	15:41
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KotCzarny	;)	15:41
aquatix	free slot for n810 update?	15:41
KotCzarny	yeah, and n7[89]0	15:41
johnx	the same thing that happened to the 780 and 790?	15:41
Fang64	lol	15:41
johnx	beat me to it :P	15:41
KotCzarny	not to mention lower models	15:41
KotCzarny	;)	15:41
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* aquatix never `got' the nokia numbering		15:41
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* KotCzarny had nokina 5510		15:42
KotCzarny	nokia	15:42
aquatix	n810 is my first nokia	15:43
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aquatix	i prefer SE	15:43
arif_endro	when did Nokia start using Linux for their device?	15:43
Fang64	when they developed the tablets?	15:43
johnx	the 770 was the first	15:43
aquatix	770 was mainly an underground project iirc	15:44
Fang64	just a guess, really don't know myself, my N800 was my first, but this was after viewing a N770 a while back	15:44
michele_	I am with aquatix	15:44
michele_	nokia UI was sensible until they introduced color screens	15:44
KotCzarny	i don't like sony part in se	15:44
KotCzarny	otherwise it's ok	15:44
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aquatix	KotCzarny: agreed; i'd rather see them use SD and such, but i love their phones	15:45
michele_	I still have the T39 :)	15:45
* KotCzarny too		15:45
michele_	without the sony part	15:45
KotCzarny	t39m to be exact	15:45
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KotCzarny	bah. i've got two of them	15:45
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KotCzarny	one white and one black	15:45
arif_endro	I guess you like it alot.. :)	15:46
KotCzarny	yes	15:46
aquatix	ah yeah, that one	15:47
KotCzarny	it's a very nice phone	15:47
KotCzarny	keyboard is sick though	15:47
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lopz	hi	16:08
johnx	hello	16:09
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KotCzarny	v0.8 - 2008-02-20 - Lemon	16:31
KotCzarny	(r3064) Add support for Maemo, so the menu button acts as modifier key to perform right clicks.	16:31
KotCzarny	mmm	16:31
KotCzarny	jagged alliance	16:31
KotCzarny	mmMm	16:31
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freelikegnu	has someone been able to get wpa_supplicant to work in os2008?	16:37
GeneralAntilles	http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12738	16:38
GeneralAntilles	It's on the front page. . . .	16:38
johnx	I'm not sure how much of it works without wext but it's worth a try if you need it	16:39
freelikegnu	I was getting errors about unsupported functions	16:39
johnx	sounds like you need the wext patch I mention at the end of the thread	16:39
johnx	no guarantees though	16:40
freelikegnu	trying to connect to TTLS with PAP phase 2	16:40
freelikegnu	aye	16:40
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KotCzarny	hmm	16:40
johnx	All I can tell you is that it "worked for me" for psk but I got an error or two	16:40
johnx	I guess it turned out not to be important	16:40
* johnx shrugs		16:40
KotCzarny	isn't there an oss project for a wifi driver for a n8x0 ?	16:41
johnx	nope	16:41
johnx	not as far as I know	16:41
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freelikegnu	hmm is this something I could compile on the nokia itself or do I need a development environment on another computer	16:43
KotCzarny	both true	16:43
michele_	there was a posting about an in progress driver on the linux-wireless ML	16:43
johnx	freelikegnu, if you trust kernel modules from random people you meet on IRC I can put up the copy I have on my web server. interested? :)	16:44
johnx	you'd need scratchbox setup, otherwise	16:44
johnx	michele_, well that's nice to hear :D	16:44
KotCzarny	johnx: isn't that true for repository.maemo.org ?	16:45
KotCzarny	;)	16:45
freelikegnu	I would very much like to try your module	16:45
johnx	KotCzarny, heh...but people trusted when it's all nice and official looking :)	16:45
KotCzarny	yes, like microsoft.com	16:46
KotCzarny	;)	16:46
freelikegnu	10	16:46
freelikegnu	-10	16:46
michele_	johnx: I'm trying to dig it out, but I don't remember if I read about it here or on ITT	16:47
johnx	don't worry about it	16:47
KotCzarny	n800 has a line in?	16:47
KotCzarny	o.O	16:47
johnx	I'll look it up later	16:47
johnx	about to go to bed	16:47
michele_	ok	16:47
michele_	'nite	16:48
freelikegnu	thanks again johnx	16:48
johnx	freelikegnu, did you get the URL?	16:48
GeneralAntilles	It was on here, michele_.	16:49
GeneralAntilles	For the N810 chipset.	16:49
GeneralAntilles	dragorn noticed it.	16:49
KotCzarny	n810 has different wifi chip than n800?	16:49
freelikegnu	yes thanks :	16:50
freelikegnu	:D	16:50
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freelikegnu	I'll have to get scratchbox going too	16:50
KotCzarny	unless you have fast net connection it will take some time	16:51
KotCzarny	it downloads ~300-400mb	16:51
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KotCzarny	but overall it does it automatically	16:52
KotCzarny	so user interaction is minimal	16:52
michele_	gotta love krisse's new tutorial "how to find themes"... he might as well have listed all of them :)	16:52
johnx	freelikegnu, see the end of this thread for info on what to do after loading the module: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8791	16:52
johnx	and I need some sleep O_o up waaaay too late	16:52
johnx	'night all	16:53
freelikegnu	gnite johnx	16:53
KotCzarny	http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13739	16:53
KotCzarny	oh, innards!	16:53
KotCzarny	IT pr0n	16:53
KotCzarny	;)	16:53
pupnik	and i think of the first time i saw an opened IBM PC	16:57
KotCzarny	;)	16:57
KotCzarny	yeah, /me started getting in early	16:57
KotCzarny	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_N800	17:00
KotCzarny	WiMAX Available through Sprint Nextel in '08	17:00
KotCzarny	o.O	17:00
freelikegnu	I think I corrupted my 16gb sd hehe	17:02
KotCzarny	life	17:02
KotCzarny	fortunatelly it's not unrecoverable	17:03
KotCzarny	:)	17:03
freelikegnu	I think it can be fixed to	17:03
freelikegnu	tho	17:03
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KotCzarny	[ 19.046875] hub 1-0:1.0: 200mA bus power budget for each child	17:05
KotCzarny	i guess n800 has 200mA for usb	17:05
freelikegnu	I'd like to hack mine to draw 5v from usb (instead of mini plug) ..though it might screw up host mode	17:06
KotCzarny	just add battery pack	17:06
KotCzarny	:>	17:06
KotCzarny	ie. 4xaa	17:06
KotCzarny	that will double as externall battery too	17:06
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freelikegnu	I mean so I can charge with usb from another machine, seems odd that it was not designed that way	17:07
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freelikegnu	is there knowledge about what the little pads on the n800 circuit board go to?	17:13
KotCzarny	?	17:13
kikka	Oh, hey freelikegnu.	17:14
GeneralAntilles	freelikegnu, I'm going to say it was a combination of things. A. no other Nokia device uses USB for power, B. the device is OTG, and C. USB doesn't really provide enough juice to charge the thing well.	17:14
GeneralAntilles	So, really, it's not odd.	17:14
GeneralAntilles	It makes perfect sense.	17:14
GeneralAntilles	Plus, the circuitry is a lot simpler if you don't have to consider the possibility of power coming from two places at once.	17:14
glass	GeneralAntilles: theres one new nokia that uses microusb for charging	17:15
truls	well, if usb were added you'd remove the other connector though	17:15
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glass	but it doesn't have a normal charger plug	17:15
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KotCzarny	motorola razor uses miniusb style plug too	17:16
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GeneralAntilles	glass, ok, but did it exist back in 2006?	17:16
GeneralAntilles	We're not talking about motos. ;)	17:16
GeneralAntilles	truls, USB doesn't provide enough juice to charge the device well, though.	17:17
KotCzarny	but i was positively amazed	17:17
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glass	GeneralAntilles: nah, 2007	17:17
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GeneralAntilles	Then my point still stands.	17:17
KotCzarny	that they didn't invent wheel again	17:17
KotCzarny	general: ever seen charger rating?	17:17
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GeneralAntilles	890mA	17:18
KotCzarny	yeah	17:18
GeneralAntilles	USB is 500mA	17:18
KotCzarny	officially	17:18
KotCzarny	:>	17:18
freelikegnu	ah	17:18
GeneralAntilles	You expect them to make their charger decisions on out-of-spec power requirements? :P	17:18
KotCzarny	i have been connecting 1A hdds to my thinkpad	17:19
KotCzarny	though	17:19
KotCzarny	but i guess 500mA is enough for charging too	17:19
GeneralAntilles	Sorta	17:19
KotCzarny	it only takes a little longer	17:19
GeneralAntilles	But it'll be slow.	17:19
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GeneralAntilles	and it may actually discharge during heavy use.	17:19
freelikegnu	I'm just upset that I left my chager at work for the w/e	17:20
freelikegnu	charger	17:20
GeneralAntilles	Buy yourself a couple extras	17:20
GeneralAntilles	Amazon or eBay	17:20
KotCzarny	:)	17:20
freelikegnu	and I dont have any plugs that fit the n800 lying around	17:20
GeneralAntilles	They're like $2 a piece.	17:20
KotCzarny	pity they changed the connector again	17:20
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freelikegnu	yeah extra charger is a good idea, I just got my n800 this wekk	17:21
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michele_	$2 for a charger... I just paid €12 for one...	17:21
KotCzarny	:>	17:21
KotCzarny	there are chargers and chargers	17:21
freelikegnu	last week I busted open two laptop charger to solder new cables to them	17:21
GeneralAntilles	The connector got smaller	17:22
GeneralAntilles	A LOT smaller.	17:22
GeneralAntilles	Makes perfect sense that they changed it.	17:22
GeneralAntilles	The old one was BIG.	17:22
michele_	I hate nokia's tiny connector	17:22
KotCzarny	not that big	17:22
aquatix	michele_: i paid 19.99 EUR for mine :(	17:22
GeneralAntilles	Big on a mobile device scale, KotCzarny.	17:22
KotCzarny	still not that big.	17:22
glass	the smaller nokia plug is much more prone to breaking than the old one	17:22
KotCzarny	even smaller phones used it	17:22
michele_	exactly	17:22
GeneralAntilles	I got four from Amazon for $15	17:22
freelikegnu	if I get one on ebay, I'm gonna test with a multimeter first! :D	17:22
GeneralAntilles	Mostly shipping cost.	17:23
GeneralAntilles	All Nokia-branded.	17:23
KotCzarny	that way you could have one charger for phone/n800	17:23
aquatix	GeneralAntilles: i got an official nokia from a store	17:23
aquatix	but i really needed one	17:23
KotCzarny	:>	17:23
aquatix	i only had a US charger	17:23
KotCzarny	us charger would be fine	17:23
aquatix	and that's useless here in the netherlands ;)	17:23
KotCzarny	i guess	17:23
KotCzarny	they are 100-240	17:23
KotCzarny	usually	17:23
aquatix	so?	17:23
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freelikegnu	I think when I buy a house, I'm gonna have it wired with DC as well as AC	17:23
aquatix	pins don't fit in the wall	17:23
michele_	aquatix: same here in Italy :)	17:23
glass	plug converters arent free	17:23
glass	pretty cheap though	17:24
aquatix	myeah	17:24
KotCzarny	yeah. like 0.20$	17:24
freelikegnu	with 12v, +5 and -5	17:24
KotCzarny	:)	17:24
aquatix	and harder to find than a normal charger	17:24
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aquatix	i just wanted a charger ;)	17:24
michele_	freelikegnu: when you buy a house, you'll have enough expenses to think before coming to an AC plug...	17:24
aquatix	and now i want alsa working on my freaking laptop :/	17:24
aquatix	why does it break with newer kernels	17:24
KotCzarny	hmm?	17:25
aquatix	freelikegnu: when you buy a house, induction mats to charge devices have actually appeared ;)	17:25
KotCzarny	works fine on mine	17:25
freelikegnu	I will probably just be a desktop PSU in the attic	17:25
aquatix	it worked fine on my 2.6.18.3 kernel, but not on the stock 2.6.24-4 debian kernel :/	17:25
aquatix	grmbl	17:25
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aquatix	freelikegnu: like it can sustain the power through the whole house	17:26
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aquatix	you'll get a lot of loss	17:26
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freelikegnu	induction could be pulled from AC wiring I suppose hmm?	17:26
michele_	we have an induction charger box at work... nobody uses it	17:26
KotCzarny	:>	17:26
aquatix	michele_: because no devices use it? :)	17:26
michele_	aquatix: no, you can charge whatever you want with that	17:27
freelikegnu	wrap a coil around a device that is plugged in and on all the time anyways	17:27
michele_	I can't remember the name, it was one that made a lot of noise some months agoo	17:27
freelikegnu	er a divces ac cable	17:27
aquatix	hm	17:28
freelikegnu	maybe a coil taped to a wall wart or laptop psu	17:28
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KotCzarny	hmm	17:33
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KotCzarny	when trying to do a make menuconfig it apparently doesn't link to ncurses	17:33
KotCzarny	anyone noticed?	17:33
KotCzarny	or i am doing something wrong..	17:33
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KotCzarny	hah.	17:56
KotCzarny	did it.	17:56
KotCzarny	make menuconfig works :)	17:56
freelikegnu	:D	17:57
kikka	irc on my n770 works ;)	17:57
KotCzarny	but doesn't build	17:59
KotCzarny	huh.	17:59
KotCzarny	arch/arm/mach-omap2/board-n800-camera.c:204: error: `tcm825x_regs_rx44' undeclared (first use in this function)	17:59
KotCzarny	do i have to download something?	18:00
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fysa	http://www.pokylinux.org/images/sato/web-1.png	18:08
fysa	anyone here mess with PokyLinux on an N800?	18:08
KotCzarny	whoooo	18:08
KotCzarny	tabs	18:08
KotCzarny	:>	18:08
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KotCzarny	this is a screen from n800?	18:08
fysa	no :)	18:09
KotCzarny	huh	18:09
fysa	but it could be.	18:09
fysa	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uob6NOwkFY0	18:09
fysa	http://www.intomobile.com/2007/08/09/video-poky-linux-30-running-on-nokia-n800.html	18:09
KotCzarny	we can use their browser, probably	18:09
fysa	it uses WebKit.	18:10
KotCzarny	oh	18:10
fysa	I believe it's Gtk based also though..	18:10
KotCzarny	read 2. comment on the last page	18:11
KotCzarny	:)	18:11
aquatix	fysa: it is	18:11
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GeneralAntilles	I wonder if I can just dump it on an SD partition.	18:14
K-Fox	what is Pokylinux?	18:14
KotCzarny	it apparently is missing spport for usb and other	18:15
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pupnik	watch ya ccache	18:16
GeneralAntilles	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiDLjILuhec	18:16
GeneralAntilles	1:50	18:16
GeneralAntilles	That's want I want for ITOS. :<	18:16
KotCzarny	pupnik: ?	18:17
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KotCzarny	it loads slooow	18:20
KotCzarny	much slower than os2008	18:20
GeneralAntilles	Looks like it's just the kernel and rootfs.	18:21
KotCzarny	why the heck n800_defconfig isn't compiling :/	18:22
lcdd	it would be cool if all this tablet hacking resulted in something useful :)	18:22
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KotCzarny	someone b0rken the 2.6.21.0-osso71	18:26
KotCzarny	i guess they do configuration/testing on 810	18:26
KotCzarny	removing one #ifdef helped :)	18:27
pH5	KotCzarny: I think nokia_2420_defconfig should be used for both n8x0	18:27
KotCzarny	ph5: huh?	18:27
KotCzarny	then update this site someone: http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/3-x/howto_kernel_guide_bora.html	18:28
KotCzarny	oh. bora.	18:28
KotCzarny	hate long links :/	18:28
pH5	KotCzarny: http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/4-x/kernel_guide_for_maemo.html	18:28
pH5	ah :)	18:28
KotCzarny	thanks :)	18:29
KotCzarny	is creAting maemokernel target necessary?	18:29
pH5	no, compiling in the ARMEL one should work just fine.	18:30
KotCzarny	hum, ok	18:30
KotCzarny	though it's strange someone adds instructions for it	18:30
KotCzarny	It is not mandatory to set up a separate target for kernel compilation, but this example does it in case the default armel target has been modified in some special way.	18:31
KotCzarny	o.O	18:31
youam	is there some changelog for the OS2008 releases? i just saw that my n800 is still running 2.2007.50-2, but there is a 2.2007.51-3 version available. i know the difference between .51-2 and .51-3 is only some bootloader fix, but what's the diff between .50-2 and .51-3?	18:31
GeneralAntilles	Er, there is no external .51-2	18:32
GeneralAntilles	The only difference between 50-2 and 51-3 is the NOLO bootloader.	18:32
GeneralAntilles	So, secondary, 2nd, and xloader.	18:33
youam	okay. so there's no need to reflash my device at all, if it's working now	18:33
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GeneralAntilles	Right.	18:33
youam	great. thanks!	18:33
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KotCzarny	hmm	18:36
Proteous	morrrrrrrnnniiiinnnnnn	18:36
KotCzarny	is there a size limit for a kernel?	18:36
Proteous	how big is your harddrive?	18:37
KotCzarny	i'm asking about n800	18:37
Proteous	:P	18:37
KotCzarny	it doesn't have a harddrive	18:37
kikka	Proteous: Morning?! It's 17:37 ;-)	18:37
Proteous	it's all relative	18:37
Proteous	8:38am here :)	18:38
K-Fox	it's here 01:38am	18:38
KotCzarny	i'm not looking for a relative answer then	18:38
K-Fox	i am tired	18:38
KotCzarny	Mon Mar 3 11:38:15 EST 2008	18:38
K-Fox	gogo to the bed	18:38
KotCzarny	:)	18:38
Navi	KotCzarny is a vampire.	18:39
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KotCzarny	hehehe	18:40
KotCzarny	irony. life.	18:40
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youam	how robust is the screen of the n800? should i use some screen protectors?	19:01
GeneralAntilles	I would.	19:01
KotCzarny	not really	19:01
KotCzarny	but boost resell value	19:01
KotCzarny	eventually	19:02
KotCzarny	:)	19:02
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GeneralAntilles	If you take care of it, it's not REALLY an issue.	19:02
GeneralAntilles	But there will be wear.	19:02
GeneralAntilles	KotCzarny, how long have you had your N800 again? ;)	19:02
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sxpert	and tear(s)	19:02
KotCzarny	general: i have read someones review that it's quite durable	19:02
KotCzarny	:)	19:02
KotCzarny	and i have bought mine with screen protector already installed	19:03
KotCzarny	;)	19:03
GeneralAntilles	Yeah, I have 2 years of hands-on experience. :)	19:03
Proteous	if you are one of those people who use the stylus like you were writing with a rock on a cement wall the definetly get a protector	19:03
GeneralAntilles	Really, though, even if if you factor out protection the improvements in visibility from an anti-glare protector and the much better texture are still worth it.	19:03
youam	actually, i have two n800, one for me, which still has the sheet from nokia, and a second for my girlfriend, but on her's, the sheet from nokia had a sticker on it which i couldn't remove, so her device is unprotected right now	19:03
* sxpert has noticed scratches on the locations of solitaire cards on his N810		19:04
KotCzarny	:>	19:04
* KotCzarny noticed dust under the protector		19:04
KotCzarny	when device is hot it tends to bubble	19:04
KotCzarny	a little	19:04
GeneralAntilles	Crappy protector	19:04
sxpert	(guess I play too much solitaire on that thing)	19:04
youam	sxpert: one can definitelly tell that i play to much maemosweeper by looking on my n800's screen	19:04
GeneralAntilles	I'd buy the Boxwave anti-glare.	19:04
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sxpert	youam, haha	19:05
KotCzarny	is there any way to fill scratches ?	19:05
sxpert	youam, I noticed a bug on that btw, it doesn't hide the cursor properly, leading to flickering	19:05
youam	oh, and the position of the soft-keyboard	19:05
youam	sxpert: yes	19:05
youam	and it states "you loose" instead of "you lose"	19:06
pupnik	cripes, transcoding 1st pass with mencoder with -o /dev/null is eating up disk space on /, but i can't find an output file, nothing is in /tmp.. and the .log file is going on another drive	19:06
pupnik	crazy	19:06
KotCzarny	:)	19:06
KotCzarny	ls -l /dev/null ?	19:06
* GeneralAntilles whistles quietly and throttles back the porn download to pupnik's machine a bit.		19:07
pupnik	good call, but it's a valid device	19:07
Proteous	lol	19:07
sxpert	GeneralAntilles, rotfl	19:07
KotCzarny	pupnik: when have you checked?	19:07
pupnik	just now, and du /dev shows 136 blocks used	19:07
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KotCzarny	then do du -sx /*	19:08
KotCzarny	and find what takes space	19:08
youam	pupnik: look into /proc/`pidof mencoder`/fd	19:08
youam	pupnik: there you see all files opened by that process, including already deleted files which are still opened, so that they take place but aren't visible in the directory listing	19:09
pupnik	thanks, that's a useful piece of info	19:09
pupnik	there/s 3 entries for /dev/pts/4, one read-only for the source movie (on nfs mount) and a write opened on the /dev/null and a write opened on /media/sda7/divx2pass.log	19:10
pupnik	oh well freed up enough space	19:12
lcuk	GeneralAntilles, midget porn doesn't take up THAT much space does it?	19:12
GeneralAntilles	1080p :P	19:12
KotCzarny	default kernel is zImage?	19:12
lcuk	cool, might actually be able to see the people	19:12
GeneralAntilles	Yes, KotCzarny.	19:13
KotCzarny	then why howto says: make bzImage ?	19:13
KotCzarny	http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/4-x/kernel_guide_for_maemo.html	19:13
lcuk	does anyone know anything about vmware? if my computer loses power but i already have documents saved inside editor in linux image is there any chance i will lose them by the image becoming corrupt, or once saved is the image as stable as a regular hard drive?	19:15
KotCzarny	you always risk loosing data on power loss	19:15
KotCzarny	use laptop	19:15
KotCzarny	:)	19:15
lcuk	but data already saved	19:15
GeneralAntilles	lcuk, just buy yourself an cheap UPS.	19:16
lcuk	ie i clicked save 5 minutes before but still had everything open	19:16
KotCzarny	it all depends on buffering policy	19:16
GeneralAntilles	$50, it'll give you enough time to close whatever you're using.	19:16
lcuk	depends how cheap it is ;)	19:16
lcuk	your right of course, and so it kot, i might just get myself an eee or something similar	19:16
lcuk	is^	19:17
Navi	I never save my documents from within the image	19:18
Navi	s/from/to/	19:18
infobot	Navi meant: I never save my documents to within the image	19:18
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lcuk	shared folder on main machine?	19:19
GeneralAntilles	Haha . . . oops, set the boot menu selection time to 0 seconds. <_<	19:19
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KotCzarny	0xFFFF to the rescue?	19:19
KotCzarny	;)	19:19
KotCzarny	or hold shift?	19:20
GeneralAntilles	It's not an issue	19:20
GeneralAntilles	It auto-boots to internal flash	19:20
GeneralAntilles	Just means I can't select anything else.	19:20
Navi	samba shares	19:20
lcuk	fair enough navi :) thx all, i might just adjust my system to acocunt	19:21
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pupnik	hah it's the nfs log filling up my drive - must have started it with debug a few days ago :P	19:25
KotCzarny	:)	19:25
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KotCzarny	This cpufreq governor tries hard not to change the frequency.	19:28
KotCzarny	lol	19:28
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KotCzarny	CONFIG_CPU_FREQ_GOV_NULL	19:28
KotCzarny	;)	19:28
youam	is there some tool i can use to automate setting up an maemo device?	19:28
KotCzarny	dd ?	19:28
KotCzarny	:)	19:28
lcuk	youam, yes, the human brain. failing that, the backup/restore cycle takes care of most things.	19:29
Proteous	Mmmmm, brains	19:30
Proteous	I should go eat something	19:30
lcuk	computer software cannot read minds and your configuration is not the same as mine	19:30
lcuk	lol @ procto	19:30
lcuk	gr	19:30
youam	lcuk: to much manual work. as said, i do have two n800 here, and i want to be able to clone networking settings and so on without entering stuff myself	19:30
lcuk	Proteous even	19:30
KotCzarny	proctoleus	19:31
lcuk	take a backup on one machine and copy the file to the other	19:31
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lcuk	i think that would work, but since im not posh you might be better asking GeneralAntilles, hes got about 20 and must have tried something like this	19:32
pupnik	df	19:32
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youam	pupnik: Password:	19:32
pupnik	m1dg3ts4all	19:33
lcuk	lol	19:33
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GeneralAntilles	Poky's not very exciting at the moment.	19:39
KotCzarny	:)	19:39
GeneralAntilles	Need an external keyboard of some sort since there's no toggle for the matchbox keyboard.	19:40
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muu	re	19:42
muu	when irb for maemo ? :)	19:42
KotCzarny	echo > /sys/class/leds/keypad/brightness 120	19:42
KotCzarny	:>	19:42
lcuk	:O	19:43
lcuk	does that actually control the keypad light?	19:43
KotCzarny	yes	19:43
KotCzarny	:)	19:43
KotCzarny	values are 0-255	19:43
lcuk	:D yayy i can read at night with my slot open (use thumb pad for next prev) and hate the light	19:43
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michele_	lcuk: fbreader? you know you can change page with the zoom button?	19:45
* lcuk will have to read current value at startup, set it to zero and reset it back at shutdown. (unless a user specifies they dont want it touching)		19:45
lcuk	zoom button is tucked away inside my cradle	19:45
lcuk	my nokia basically lives now inside a neat little easy grip base	19:45
pupnik	echo 120 > /sys/class/leds/keyboard/brightness	19:46
lcuk	http://img522.imageshack.us/my.php?image=810crateinkx8.jpg	19:46
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KotCzarny	cd /sys/class/leds/keypad; echo > trigger timer ; echo > delay_on 10 ; echo > delay_off 10	19:47
KotCzarny	;)	19:47
michele_	lcuk: O_O	19:47
lcuk	so, i almost never get at the back buttons. now only one thing remaining before i never have to pull it out: a way to LOCK device (do same as the slide switch at the back)	19:47
lcuk	but i want it programmatically	19:48
lcuk	it unlocks nicely by closing and opening keyboard	19:48
* pupnik ponders the purpose		19:48
lcuk	easy to hold	19:48
lcuk	and when flipped around it rests on my chest at the right height to read from when in bed without having to wedge a pillow or something under it	19:49
lcuk	nop arm ache = hours of reading	19:49
lcuk	-p	19:49
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KotCzarny	echo > /sys/class/leds/keypad/trigger heartbeat	19:49
KotCzarny	;)	19:49
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lcuk	oh, one other thing, when i am drawing on it with the screen open it doesnt tip backwards because of the step	19:51
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lcuk	http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/1256/810crateemptyhm3.jpg	19:51
KotCzarny	lol	19:51
lcuk	little things piss me off...	19:52
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KotCzarny	The flash frequency is a hyperbolic function of the 1-minute load average.	19:52
lcuk	but now arm is perfectly comfortable because my wrist is resting at same height as screen	19:52
KotCzarny	hearbtbeat trigger can be useful	19:52
KotCzarny	:)	19:52
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freelikegnu	wow debian-armel looks intrigueing	19:55
KotCzarny	you already have debian-armel..	19:55
KotCzarny	:)	19:55
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freelikegnu	the one nokia provides does not feel very debian	19:56
michele_	freelikegnu: http://internettablettalk.com/wiki/index.php?title=Debian	19:56
freelikegnu	like if I want to apt-get remove hildon ?	19:56
KotCzarny	i guess you can modify startup scripts	19:56
michele_	(ask johnx for details)	19:56
freelikegnu	michele_: thats whatI'm looking at :D	19:56
KotCzarny	after it boots it's up to you	19:57
KotCzarny	:)	19:57
freelikegnu	I'd like to try to get OLPC's sugar running on the n800	19:57
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GeneralAntilles	Sugar needs OpenGL.	19:59
GeneralAntilles	Er, rather	19:59
GeneralAntilles	no	19:59
GeneralAntilles	Other sucrose thing in Ubuntu Mobile needs OpenGL.	19:59
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freelikegnu	sugar does not need opengl,	20:06
freelikegnu	though it makes use of svg, which might be slow on the nokia?	20:07
freelikegnu	also python	20:07
freelikegnu	matchbox WM, with pygtk	20:08
freelikegnu	http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Understanding_sugar_code	20:08
pupnik	i think nokia would do well to consider what can be done for a more flashy UI	20:09
pupnik	but... then again i like 'simple' personally	20:09
lcuk	ie, push them towards implimenting a more flashy graphics chip	20:09
KotCzarny	yes, shiny is nice	20:09
lcuk	perhaps some sort of powervr implimentation ;)	20:09
KotCzarny	but after a while you prefer speedy	20:09
KotCzarny	:)	20:09
pupnik	yeah i think 'shiny' sells	20:09
pupnik	iphone is mostly selling on 'shiny'	20:10
lcuk	what res is iphone	20:10
pupnik	320x480 i think	20:10
freelikegnu	sugar is far more suitable for a small touchscreen than what comes with maemo, imho	20:10
lcuk	cos if i knocked nokia res down to that i bet i could get responsive fast data	20:10
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freelikegnu	you can get some gl like effects from svg	20:11
freelikegnu	a friend of mine is working on a python script to make dynamic svgs for webpages	20:12
lcuk	arent people happy using gif anims?	20:14
lcuk	or spit flash	20:14
KotCzarny	or javascript	20:15
KotCzarny	;)	20:15
lcuk	i think server side <BLINK> is the best thing to come recently. very web 2.0	20:15
KotCzarny	yes, and <MARQUEE>	20:16
KotCzarny	definitely.	20:17
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KotCzarny	and i have heard ie doesn't support <blink>	20:17
KotCzarny	what a limited browser	20:17
freelikegnu	not much in svg support	20:18
czr	marquee brings some memories	20:18
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kpel	hi all	20:20
KotCzarny	all left	20:20
kpel	any idea why mplayer,unzip and the cpu load applet cannot be updated but they appear in the list of available updates?	20:22
KotCzarny	check logs in app-manager	20:22
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freelikegnu	svg support would be very appealing	20:26
freelikegnu	http://faemalia.net/ArtWorx/SVG/A-Time-For-Sleeping--A-Time-For-Loving.svgz	20:26
freelikegnu	NSFW	20:26
kpel	404 - not found. The packages are missing	20:26
freelikegnu	packages?	20:27
KotCzarny	and challenging	20:27
lcuk	freelikegnu, i thought the idea was resizable? but apart from that it looks like a slow picture. what is the benefit to a web user?	20:27
KotCzarny	it scrolls slowly on 600mhz pentium-m	20:27
freelikegnu	its a compressed svg	20:27
KotCzarny	also is drawn badly	20:28
freelikegnu	heh	20:28
lcuk	lol, look in the source <nipple placement='left'>	20:28
lcuk	;)	20:28
KotCzarny	what would you expect	20:29
KotCzarny	latin?	20:29
KotCzarny	obj342 ?	20:29
freelikegnu	I was looking for some svgz that were served via http	20:29
KotCzarny	i wonder how long it will take for them to add 'textures'	20:30
KotCzarny	;)	20:30
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KotCzarny	seriously, it will be fpp+web	20:31
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freelikegnu	building sugar on debian: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Sugar_on_Debian	20:36
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* freelikegnu installs scratchbox		20:47
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KotCzarny	what are suggested gcc flags for n800 ?	20:48
ssvb	does anybody have N800 with OS2007 installed to run a quick test?	20:49
KotCzarny	navi downgraded to 2k7 yesterday	20:49
KotCzarny	afair	20:49
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KotCzarny	hah.	20:56
KotCzarny	having sshfs on n800 roolez.	20:56
KotCzarny	:)	20:56
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lcuk	supposing i managed to get the flash, could me as an 810 user attempt to flash 2007?	21:01
freelikegnu	KotCzarny: nice	21:01
freelikegnu	fuse just kicks ass all around	21:01
KotCzarny	yeah	21:01
KotCzarny	good thing it compiles flawlessly	21:01
freelikegnu	fuseiso9660 is one I use alot	21:02
GeneralAntilles	lcuk, sure.	21:04
GeneralAntilles	Just gotta unpack it and flash individually.	21:04
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GeneralAntilles	No guarantees that wifi will work, though.	21:04
KotCzarny	insmod -f ?	21:05
KotCzarny	:)	21:05
KotCzarny	flg: why do you prefer it over iso9660.ko ?	21:07
lcuk	hmmm too much trouble	21:08
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Spork	Hello	21:10
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freelikegnu	KotCzarny: no need for sudo to mount .iso images	21:18
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KotCzarny	ah.	21:19
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KotCzarny	but isn't -o user for that?	21:20
KotCzarny	in fstab?	21:20
freelikegnu	no need to mess with fstab either	21:20
KotCzarny	but you mess with /usr/bin	21:21
KotCzarny	:)	21:21
freelikegnu	$ fuseiso9660 my.iso ./here	21:21
KotCzarny	:)	21:21
freelikegnu	it can be mounted to any folder quickly	21:21
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freelikegnu	would be nice to make a script for context menu that will make a folder named from the selected iso and mount the iso to it	21:23
KotCzarny	simple	21:23
freelikegnu	yep	21:24
KotCzarny	but the one who needs it, writes it	21:24
KotCzarny	;)	21:24
freelikegnu	I can do that	21:24
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freelikegnu	in xfce/thunar its v.easy: Custom Actions => mkdir %f.mount & fuseiso9660 %f %f.mount	21:33
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KotCzarny	install xfce on maemo?	21:37
KotCzarny	:)	21:37
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KotCzarny	wwwwooow	21:47
KotCzarny	links on n800 rocks	21:47
KotCzarny	:>	21:47
pupnik	you got the mouse working?	21:51
KotCzarny	?	21:52
pupnik	just needs vkbd support	21:52
KotCzarny	works out of the box	21:52
pupnik	ok	21:52
freelikegnu	if only it were "Links" the old golf game :D	21:52
KotCzarny	hmm	21:52
KotCzarny	keyboard, hehe	21:52
KotCzarny	i wonder how to call it	21:52
KotCzarny	there was xvkbd	21:53
KotCzarny	i wonder if it will work	21:53
KotCzarny	(standard x app to send key press events to any fg window)	21:53
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KotCzarny	http://homepage3.nifty.com/tsato/xvkbd/	22:00
KotCzarny	:)	22:00
KotCzarny	here	22:00
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mb___	I thought it was probably useful to publish information on the n810 serial console on my homepage. So here we go: http://bu3sch.de/n810.php Dunno if something like that doea already exist somewhere on the web, but google didn't find anything. Have fun anyway.	22:12
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cy3o3	So what's the OS 2008 xterm package?	22:23
cy3o3	I'm not seeing one on maemo.org	22:23
KotCzarny	osso-xterm	22:23
KotCzarny	or something	22:23
GeneralAntilles	It's included by default.	22:23
cy3o3	I see, it comes with it now	22:24
cy3o3	Nice	22:24
cy3o3	Well, that's cool ;)	22:24
GeneralAntilles	Unfortunately it's also a downgrade from the maemo-hackers version for 2007. :\	22:24
GeneralAntilles	Seems like the worst thing that can happen to a piece of software is for it to become bundled.	22:24
rm_you	yeah, I wish they'd make another	22:24
GeneralAntilles	Then Nokia does their damndest to make it as shitty as you can possibly imagine.	22:25
KotCzarny	what's the problem to recompile?	22:25
rm_you	the hacker version was awesome	22:25
GeneralAntilles	Howdy, rm_you. :)	22:25
freelikegnu	I put up a little Ubuntu/Debian XFCE fuseiso tute here: http://www.freelikegnu.org/?p=44	22:25
rm_you	:P	22:25
GeneralAntilles	I've got another project for you. :D	22:25
rm_you	lol	22:25
GeneralAntilles	http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/appmenu-mockup.jpg	22:25
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rm_you	?	22:25
rm_you	lolwtf	22:26
GeneralAntilles	Well, the idea is to replace the contacts Navigator plugin with a "My Selection" menu.	22:26
GeneralAntilles	Thus freeing up an extra folder in the Application Menu.	22:26
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GeneralAntilles	Working: http://www.legacyoflies.com/devuploads/general_antilles/appmenu-duped.jpg	22:26
rm_you	GeneralAntilles: I just delete the "My Selection" folder and reorganize everything into my own folders >_>	22:27
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GeneralAntilles	That's not the point.	22:27
rm_you	lol	22:27
GeneralAntilles	The point is that you get 12 extra spaces. :P	22:27
freelikegnu	something like XFCE panels "genmon" would be a nice applet, something that can take the generic stdout of a command or script and display in an applet box	22:28
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rm_you	hrm well, i'm late for a software development meeting	22:28
rm_you	so i gotta run >_>	22:28
KotCzarny	general: get simple launcher	22:29
KotCzarny	your menu looks fugly	22:29
KotCzarny	:>	22:29
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rm_you	bbl	22:29
KotCzarny	better way would be thinner rows	22:29
GeneralAntilles	KotCzarny, you still don't get it.	22:29
KotCzarny	i simply don't like it :)	22:29
GeneralAntilles	Good for you.	22:29
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GeneralAntilles	Anyway, there's nothing saying that the row size can't be customizable.	22:31
KotCzarny	hmm	22:31
KotCzarny	but there's no exposed config either	22:31
KotCzarny	xvkbd works, kinda	22:32
KotCzarny	why wm ignores -geometry?	22:32
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jku	KotCzarny, matchbox?	22:35
KotCzarny	yes, apparently	22:35
jku	because it's maximized only	22:35
KotCzarny	yes, i noticed that	22:35
jku	that's kind of the point	22:35
KotCzarny	and i guess it need some fluxboxing.	22:36
KotCzarny	but then again would text services work?	22:36
KotCzarny	hmm	22:38
KotCzarny	maximization button could be using to call xvkbd	22:38
KotCzarny	if nokia's panel refuses to work in other wm	22:39
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KotCzarny	and making xvkbd transluecent and full screen would rock	22:41
freelikegnu	finger kb is pretty close to that	22:42
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KotCzarny	transluecent?	22:42
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freelikegnu	I said "pretty close"	22:42
KotCzarny	nah	22:42
freelikegnu	as it is nearly full screen too	22:43
KotCzarny	then xvkbd is at the same stage	22:43
KotCzarny	:)	22:43
KotCzarny	http://homepage3.nifty.com/tsato/xvkbd/#download	22:43
freelikegnu	have you seen cell-writer?	22:43
KotCzarny	nope, i haven't played with tablets before (too much)	22:43
freelikegnu	this is a nice input app: http://risujin.org/cellwriter/	22:43
freelikegnu	very good recognition too	22:44
KotCzarny	i would like thumb keyboard more	22:44
freelikegnu	you can train it very quickly	22:44
freelikegnu	it has two modes	22:44
freelikegnu	writing and virtual kb	22:44
KotCzarny	no screenshot of vkb	22:45
Tama^3	Goodday	22:45
Tama^3	yawn	22:45
freelikegnu	it's there, I swear!	22:46
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KotCzarny	http://mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/xvkbd.png	22:46
KotCzarny	:)	22:46
KotCzarny	and i mind you it's configurable	22:47
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KotCzarny	and stretchable	22:47
KotCzarny	and sends keystrokes to last active/pre selected window	22:48
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Tama^3	and fugly	22:52
Tama^3	xD	22:52
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KotCzarny	yeah, it's old	22:53
KotCzarny	but imagine it transparent	22:53
KotCzarny	and you will actually see what you're typing	22:53
KotCzarny	without reducing other app window	22:53
Tama^3	that would be cool	22:54
KotCzarny	yes	22:54
KotCzarny	:)	22:54
KotCzarny	and it shouldn't be too hard to implement	22:54
Tama^3	without the numeric pad	22:54
KotCzarny	it's configurable	22:54
KotCzarny	you can enable numpad too	22:54
KotCzarny	but you can enter numbers already	22:54
KotCzarny	so i prefer having bigger 'keys'	22:54
Tama^3	exactly	22:54
KotCzarny	on the screen shot numpad is enabled	22:55
KotCzarny	:)	22:55
Tama^3	yes and it takes up too much space	22:55
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KotCzarny	http://mrrau.dyndns.org:23280/n800/xvkbd-nonumpad.png	22:57
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KotCzarny	i should let it use some nicer font	22:58
KotCzarny	to make it appealing	22:58
KotCzarny	:>	22:58
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KotCzarny	i think compose and up-arrow should be swapped	23:03
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KotCzarny	on that shot	23:03
freelikegnu	wow is that an actual screen cap?	23:06
KotCzarny	yes	23:06
KotCzarny	and it's working	23:06
freelikegnu	nice	23:06
KotCzarny	fe. i can send keys to left side of the screen	23:06
KotCzarny	i can't move it to let some other app focus	23:06
freelikegnu	I wonder how it could be made to see through..	23:06
KotCzarny	easy	23:06
KotCzarny	just do screenshot	23:07
KotCzarny	mix it	23:07
KotCzarny	and show it	23:07
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KotCzarny	or simply use xshape	23:07
KotCzarny	but that would also send clicks to window below	23:07
KotCzarny	i guess	23:07
freelikegnu	the font would have to be larger to be clear and no look like text below	23:07
KotCzarny	it's configurable	23:07
KotCzarny	i just run it as it is	23:07
KotCzarny	:)	23:07
freelikegnu	its nice to have the f-keys handy	23:08
KotCzarny	yes	23:08
KotCzarny	they can be hidden too	23:08
KotCzarny	as you see on the screenshot with menu	23:08
KotCzarny	btw. font shouldn't be larger	23:09
KotCzarny	if the window gets transparent	23:09
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KotCzarny	you wouldn't want to let it obscure too much	23:09
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KotCzarny	(key names and borders should be still visible)	23:10
KotCzarny	also, keys can be programmed	23:10
KotCzarny	:)	23:10
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freelikegnu	KotCzarny: here is cell-writer kb mode btw: http://herenaforge.org/random/cellwriter.png	23:15
KotCzarny	:)	23:15
spirytusick	see you tommorow guys. Time to power off for tonight...	23:15
Tama^3	is matchbox in OS2008 compiled with composting?	23:16
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KotCzarny	composting, lol	23:16
Tama^3	?	23:16
Tama^3	xD	23:16
freelikegnu	will it blend?	23:16
KotCzarny	compost (kmmpost)	23:17
KotCzarny	n.	23:17
KotCzarny	1. A mixture of decaying organic matter, as from leaves and manure, used to improve soil structu	23:17
KotCzarny	re and provide nutrients.	23:17
KotCzarny	;)	23:17
Tama^3	it's written like that all the intertubes	23:17
KotCzarny	oh	23:17
KotCzarny	but isn't it 'composing' ?	23:17
KotCzarny	:)	23:17
Tama^3	it sounded fishy to me too but...	23:17
freelikegnu	com pos it ing	23:17
KotCzarny	oh	23:17
KotCzarny	yes	23:17
KotCzarny	:)	23:18
Tama^3	my bad	23:19
Tama^3	I cannot read properly	23:19
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dskippy	I am trying to get mDNS working on my N800. I've installed avahi on the N800 but have not been able to ping my laptop with it's hostname.local	23:30
dskippy	My laptop and other machines on the network are running avahi and can ping each other with their hostnames.	23:31
Tama^3	probably not exactly what you want but...	23:31
KotCzarny	cat /etc/resolv.conf ?	23:31
dskippy	It's just nameserver 127.0.0.1	23:31
Tama^3	what I do is hack /sbin/udhcpc	23:31
KotCzarny	what's mdns?	23:32
dskippy	The laptop has 192.168.1.1	23:32
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dskippy	And also "search home"	23:32
KotCzarny	search should be local	23:32
Tama^3	I move the executable to /sbin/udhcpc_old and put a script in its place calling the exec with the -H hostname flag	23:32
KotCzarny	then	23:32
dskippy	I tried addingthat and "search local" with no luck.	23:32
dskippy	KotCzarny, I thought so but the laptop does fine with search home.	23:33
dskippy	Shouldn't avahi be writing to that file?	23:33
KotCzarny	probably has other config	23:33
KotCzarny	i use pdnsd anyway	23:33
KotCzarny	:)	23:33
dskippy	What's that?	23:33
dskippy	You use it on maemo?	23:33
KotCzarny	it's a dns cache + mini dns server	23:33
KotCzarny	nope, on my laptop, but i will install it on maemo too	23:33
dskippy	hm. I could use that.	23:34
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dskippy	I'd have to set up a mini dns server on a server on the network and then tell the mameo to look there?	23:34
KotCzarny	huh	23:34
KotCzarny	you can install it anywhere	23:34
KotCzarny	even on maemo	23:34
KotCzarny	think of it as a caching proxy	23:35
KotCzarny	for dns	23:35
KotCzarny	:)	23:35
dskippy	Do I need a centralized server for the DNS or is it like mDNS?	23:35
KotCzarny	it can be told to use any server you like	23:35
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dskippy	I copied my laptop's resolv.conf exactly to the nokia but it's still not working.	23:37
KotCzarny	what's in it?	23:37
dskippy	# generated by NetworkManager, do not edit!	23:38
dskippy	search home	23:38
dskippy	nameserver 192.168.1.1	23:38
dskippy	I am assuming that it will not need a daemo restarted inorder to work.	23:38
KotCzarny	nope	23:38
KotCzarny	grep dns /etc/nsswitch.conf	23:39
dskippy	On the lap top:	23:39
dskippy	hosts: files mdns4_minimal [NOTFOUND=return] dns mdns4	23:39
dskippy	On the nokia:	23:40
dskippy	hosts: files dns	23:40
KotCzarny	try nslookup hostname.local 192.168.1.1	23:41
KotCzarny	substitute hostname for the name you need	23:41
dskippy	"Can't resolve ..."	23:42
KotCzarny	then yout 192.168.1.1 server isn't working	23:42
KotCzarny	:)	23:42
KotCzarny	or at least doesn't know about .local domains	23:42
dskippy	Hmm, without the local the info is very interesting.	23:43
dskippy	Nokia-N800-50-2:~# nslookup dskippy-laptop 192.168.1.1	23:43
dskippy	Server: 192.168.1.1	23:43
dskippy	Address 1: 192.168.1.1 Wireless_Broadband_Router.home	23:43
dskippy	Name: dskippy-laptop	23:43
dskippy	Address 1: 192.168.1.12 dskippy-laptop.home	23:43
KotCzarny	then you domain is .home	23:43
KotCzarny	not .local	23:43
KotCzarny	:)	23:43
dskippy	Weird. It works at .local for everyone else. Why is that?	23:43
KotCzarny	it's probably some dsl/cable router	23:43
KotCzarny	maybe everyone else uses local hosts?	23:44
dskippy	But the other machines use home.	23:44
KotCzarny	or just send queries without .local ?	23:44
dskippy	Possible. Doesn't work for the other machines.	23:44
KotCzarny	try nslookup dskippy-laptop.home	23:44
KotCzarny	though it will simply use /etc/hosts for it	23:45
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dskippy	Same output	23:45
dskippy	I guess I just have to use .home for it.	23:46
KotCzarny	:)	23:46
dskippy	I need to go log on to the other network to try it out though.	23:46
KotCzarny	you can set .local on your router	23:46
dskippy	I'm seeing inconsisancies.	23:46
KotCzarny	incosistencies	23:46
dskippy	:)	23:46
KotCzarny	:)	23:46
GeneralAntilles	You're both wrong. :\	23:47
KotCzarny	:)	23:47
KotCzarny	probably	23:47
KotCzarny	inconsistencies	23:47
GeneralAntilles	No, not probably, you are.	23:47
KotCzarny	probably == 'yes, but i don't care'	23:47
KotCzarny	:)	23:47
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GeneralAntilles	Then why did you try to correct skippy?	23:48
KotCzarny	i'm sleepy => prone to errors	23:48
KotCzarny	because i like to be correct?	23:48
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KotCzarny	and mine was a typo	23:48
GeneralAntilles	So was his.	23:48
Proteous	and mine was inconsistant	23:48
dskippy	On the other router it doesn't work at all.	23:48
KotCzarny	:)	23:48
Proteous	or was it inconsistent?	23:49
Proteous	duke it out!	23:49
KotCzarny	;)	23:49
Tama^3	GA, help me! KotCzarny made fun of me! I need vengeance	23:49
KotCzarny	did i?	23:49
Tama^3	xD	23:49
KotCzarny	who cares	23:49
KotCzarny	;)	23:49
GeneralAntilles	Only if you become my code monkey.	23:49
Tama^3	you shall pay dearly for it	23:50
KotCzarny	i'm nobodys monkey	23:50
KotCzarny	i'm a cat	23:50
Tama^3	GA's code monkey? NOOOOOooooooo.....	23:50
Proteous	I'm gonna eat you little fisshhy	23:50
KotCzarny	fishty?	23:50
KotCzarny	m-i-t-a	23:50
KotCzarny	;)	23:50
lcuk	Proteous, careful or you will break a tooth. those are robot fish	23:50
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Proteous	:P	23:50
* GeneralAntilles starts the Godfather speech.		23:51
* KotCzarny yawns		23:51
KotCzarny	;)	23:51
dskippy	KotCzarny, I can't resolve anything using 192.168.1.1 on the other network.	23:51
KotCzarny	life	23:51
KotCzarny	it's #maemo, not #internet	23:52
KotCzarny	:>	23:52
dskippy	It's a linksys wireless-n router. The one that's working that you helped me debug moments ago is a verizon fios router/modem.	23:52
czr	it's closer to #monkeys than #internet.	23:52
lcuk	life: no route to host	23:52
* lcuk must be dead		23:52
KotCzarny	no	23:52
Proteous	life: connection reset by pheer	23:52
KotCzarny	just a unlucky parasite	23:52
dskippy	But still they work on all other machines other than the maemo.	23:52
GeneralAntilles	Zombie!	23:52
KotCzarny	dskippy, just use opendns	23:52
KotCzarny	:)	23:52
KotCzarny	and forget abot the rest	23:53
KotCzarny	about	23:53
KotCzarny	208.67.220.220, 208.67.222.222	23:53
KotCzarny	those are ips	23:53
KotCzarny	btw. what gcc flags are usefull on n800?	23:54
KotCzarny	right now i'm using: -Os -s -fomit-frame-pointer -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing	23:54
* lcuk watches, i tried configuring optimisations with gcc but ended up slowing code down		23:55
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dskippy	KotCzarny, Maybe I will.	23:55
dskippy	When I do nslookup dskippy-laptop.local on the other network I get "no authoritative answer"	23:56
dskippy	But I can ping it.	23:56
Proteous	-fomit-frame-fpointer	23:56
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KotCzarny	One of the options that affect decoding performance is idct implemntation. It can be specified by using -lavdopts idct=# where # is some decimal number. MPlayer man contains the following information:	23:59
KotCzarny	http://www.oesf.org/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t22280.html	23:59

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