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| Doni^ | good evening | 00:03 |
|---|---|---|
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| smackpotato | any one find any undocumented hardware on the n810 | 00:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | No. | 00:08 |
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| db48x | powervr doesn't count? | 00:08 |
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| GeneralAntilles | No. | 00:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | We've known about that for forever. | 00:10 |
| Doni^ | does anyone have any stability problems after installing rtcomm (telepathy-haze? | 00:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Doni^, "stability problems" is pretty generic. | 00:13 |
| Doni^ | GeneralAntilles: :D | 00:13 |
| Doni^ | my n810 seems to reboot every now and then. | 00:13 |
| Doni^ | removing all that returns stability | 00:13 |
| Doni^ | i.e. no more reboots. | 00:14 |
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| * lcuk twiddles his thumbs whilst anjuta compiles | 00:30 | |
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| kupesoft | The wiki is broken, | 00:37 |
| kupesoft | wiki.maemo.org | 00:38 |
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| Blafasel | Hmm.. Shouldn't it be possible to use the camera with Gizmo? | 00:39 |
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| Blafasel | Ah.. Okay, have to get the beta version for windows.. | 00:45 |
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| kupesoft | What are the repos for the n800/chinook? | 00:50 |
| Blafasel | Check the topic, gronmayer.com/it | 00:52 |
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| fysa | do we have Lua for OS2008? | 00:55 |
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| unique311 | fysa, | 01:06 |
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| Doni^ | hey, btw: do we have cron or similar scheduler available? | 01:10 |
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| pupnik | i think so | 01:16 |
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| reinard | quite ironical: i was googling for info of why my n770 is so unstable it's far from usable. i wrote words "n770 opera crash boot" and pressed search. device hangs, and after few seconds of waiting nokia-logo appears | 01:19 |
| reinard | device booted again | 01:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | Are you running the default config? | 01:19 |
| reinard | this happen every few minutes. is this normal? | 01:19 |
| GeneralAntilles | No. | 01:19 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Have you done anything to the device? | 01:20 |
| reinard | yes default, now im runnin it2007he | 01:20 |
| reinard | nothing | 01:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | Restored a backup? | 01:20 |
| reinard | i have tried every os, mmchacks etc. | 01:20 |
| smackpotato | i can give you a trick for the 770 but it slows it down | 01:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Opening a lot of applications at once? | 01:21 |
| reinard | i have restored whole device several times, no luck | 01:21 |
| johnx | are you on the latest 2007HE? | 01:21 |
| GeneralAntilles | Restored backup? Or reflashed? | 01:21 |
| reinard | no, it hungs even with only one browser window open, no other apps | 01:21 |
| smackpotato | go to maemo garage and search for seatbelt | 01:22 |
| reinard | reflash, i don't have backups... this have been this bad for whole time since i bought it | 01:22 |
| lcuk | is there a possibility there is something on the website "770 crashing all the time" which is crashing it? however if you dont go onto that page it doesnt crash ;) | 01:22 |
| GeneralAntilles | fwiw, I have 2 770s and they rarely crash with the latest OS2007HE. | 01:23 |
| reinard | that crashes in no matter what page im in | 01:23 |
| reinard | could this be hw problem? | 01:24 |
| johnx | there is a known bug where using wifi causes memory corruption but there is a hotfix for the latest IT2006OS and the latest IT2007HE has that fix rolled in | 01:24 |
| smackpotato | i had 2006 and it rarly crashed | 01:24 |
| smackpotato | after changing swappiness | 01:24 |
| reinard | sounds possible cause because i have problems with wifi often | 01:24 |
| reinard | im browsing the web, and suddently pages doesn't load anymore. then i disconnect wlan, and reconnect.. after it i usually get local-link | 01:26 |
| reinard | after few reconnects i get it working again | 01:26 |
| reinard | this is too very annoying | 01:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Crappy router? | 01:27 |
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| reinard | no, every other devices i have always keeps connected. this happens everywhere | 01:27 |
| reinard | not only in my home | 01:27 |
| GeneralAntilles | Could be a bad unit. | 01:28 |
| reinard | i hope it's not, but definately looks like it | 01:29 |
| reinard | how i can get this replaced, no place has these n770s anymore | 01:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia if it's still under warranty. | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Where'd you buy it? | 01:30 |
| reinard | expansys | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | How long ago? | 01:30 |
| reinard | i bought it in summer, so it has warranty left | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Warranty it, then. | 01:30 |
| smackpotato | try searching for oom-killer | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | If they can't fix it, they usually do a payout. | 01:30 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then get yourself an N800. ;) | 01:31 |
| reinard | i would get n810 but i dont want to risk if its as unstable as this | 01:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | N810 is a waste of money | 01:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Get an N800. | 01:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | But, no, the stability issues you're describing are highly unusually for a normal 770. | 01:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | and the N800 and N810 are much, much better than the 770. | 01:32 |
| reinard | yes i know | 01:32 |
| smackpotato | the 810 is a big step up | 01:32 |
| reinard | but n800 costs quite much in finland where i live | 01:33 |
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| * Cymor is away: afk | 01:33 | |
| reinard | n800 sells with like 160usd in us, but customs+shipping would be high | 01:34 |
| reinard | which is the cheapest place in EU to get n800? | 01:34 |
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| lcuk | why are nokia devices more expensive in home country? | 01:38 |
| pupnik | almost all electronics are more expensive in europe | 01:39 |
| johnx | didn't you ever play "lemonade stand" on an Apple ][ ? | 01:39 |
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| pupnik | taipan! | 01:40 |
| smackpotato | the oom-killer uses seniority when not to kill a process if it decides to kill the browser the browser doesnt get seniority and continues to be a candidate to be killed | 01:40 |
| reinard | its because of high taxes and "suomilisä" (everything here is expensive, finland add) | 01:40 |
| proteous | according to the canola guys the 770 is better at displaying movement without tearing | 01:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes, but that doesn't make it a better device. | 01:40 |
| proteous | sure, but still worth noting | 01:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | Who cares about tearing when the whole device is stupid slow. | 01:41 |
| proteous | I use ssh a lot so an 810 is going to be me upgrade from my 770 when the time comes | 01:41 |
| proteous | just thought I'd mention that GeneralAntilles, didn't know you were going to get offended | 01:42 |
| proteous | maybe you should lighten up | 01:42 |
| pupnik | typing on the thinkoutside stowaway is still 3x better than on n810 thumbboard | 01:42 |
| pupnik | at least for shell stuff | 01:42 |
| reinard | addon, i crash my 770 in 99% of cases when downloading over ~10mb file with opera. not normal i guess? | 01:42 |
| smackpotato | i want to turn my 770 into a picture frame | 01:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | No, reinard. | 01:43 |
| proteous | did you install teh wifi patch? | 01:43 |
| reinard | does the newest os2007 have it? | 01:43 |
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| proteous | my 770 was a crashing machine untill I reflashed it and installed the patch | 01:43 |
| proteous | yeah, I belive it does reinard | 01:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Who said I was offended, proteus? | 01:44 |
| reinard | where can i get the patch? i have os2007he, but not the newest | 01:44 |
| reinard | newest from tablets-dev | 01:44 |
| proteous | it's already in the 2007he | 01:44 |
| proteous | was from the begining | 01:45 |
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| lcuk | does it crash when you are not online | 01:45 |
| reinard | well thats not the solution then | 01:45 |
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| reinard | lcuk, well have this always online and my problems usually happens when browsing or downloading | 01:46 |
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| proteous | reinard, have you enabled any virtual memory on your memory card? | 01:47 |
| lcuk | i realise that, but to diagnose problem, might be worth just trying to stay offline for a short duration. do some intensive memory/cpu stuff (play a game, compile something etc) and see if it crashes | 01:47 |
| reinard | but this also hangs and boots when trying to watch native video-files with mplayer... i open the file, wait minutes and boot (can't do anything) | 01:47 |
| reinard | i have virtual memory enabled yes | 01:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tried doing all this stuff without a card in the slot? | 01:48 |
| lcuk | have you considered a duff emmory card | 01:48 |
| reinard | but problem stays without it also | 01:48 |
| smackpotato | try this reinard | 01:48 |
| smackpotato | https://garage.maemo.org/projects/seatbelt/ | 01:48 |
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| smackpotato | but try the patch first | 01:49 |
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| smackpotato | try the wifi patch first | 01:49 |
| reinard | now i remember.. i have used this device offline for long times.. playing scummvm games and mahjong. no crashing | 01:50 |
| reinard | its always opera or mplayer | 01:50 |
| reinard | os2007 has that patch, no help | 01:50 |
| lcuk | reinard, are the movies you attempted been network playback, or were you downloading files in the background during playback | 01:50 |
| reinard | i chech that seatbelt | 01:50 |
| reinard | usually converted avi's directly from mmc | 01:51 |
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| reinard | not doing anything at the same time | 01:51 |
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| reinard | ok, i installed that seatbelt. what now? | 01:53 |
| micko_22 | Hello, how to flash the OS for N810? I have read about flasher utility, but it seems to be for N770/N800. Can I use it safely for N810 also? | 01:53 |
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| pupnik | flasher 3.0 yes | 01:53 |
| micko_22 | OK thanks! | 01:54 |
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| GeneralAntilles | or 2.0 on OS X. | 01:54 |
| reinard | or 1.0 on ms-dos 3.2 ;) | 01:55 |
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| GeneralAntilles | 1.0 doesn't run on DOS. | 01:55 |
| reinard | my bad | 01:55 |
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| lcuk | crash? | 01:57 |
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| reinard | :D guess what just happened? | 02:00 |
| crashanddie | lcuk, yeah ? | 02:00 |
| zerojay | You fell down some stairs? | 02:00 |
| smackpotato | what | 02:00 |
| crashanddie | lcuk, highlight me, works better | 02:00 |
| reinard | n770 rebooted by it self. | 02:00 |
| reinard | i love this stability | 02:00 |
| lcuk | lol crashanddie - i was remarking about reinard... | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | oh | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | right | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | well, you're always saying "crash", so... | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | :D | 02:01 |
| crashanddie | sorry | 02:01 |
| reinard | some of you said something about mmc, could it be that problem is with it? | 02:01 |
| reinard | like 770 lost connect with it and hangs | 02:02 |
| reinard | because it acts just the same way when using mmc and then taking it off > causes boot | 02:02 |
| proteous | I was just going to suggest turning on virtual memory if you hadn't | 02:03 |
| proteous | lots of things can cause a reboot | 02:03 |
| proteous | the hacker edition isn't exactly the most stable OS for the 770 | 02:03 |
| proteous | hence the name and the warnings | 02:03 |
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| proteous | although most people don't have too many problems with it | 02:03 |
| proteous | might be worth just trying a reflash with the newest version | 02:04 |
| reinard | yes but i have had these same probs with os2006 since beginninv | 02:04 |
| proteous | well, if you didn't install the wifi patch on os2006 then it's crashtastic | 02:04 |
| proteous | and you have to install it right after a reflash before you use the wifi | 02:04 |
| proteous | so the usualy precedure is to copy it to your memory card before you reflash | 02:05 |
| reinard | where to download newest os2007he? i think there is newer somewhere elsewhere than in tablets-dev.nokia.com? | 02:05 |
| reinard | i don't want to get back to 2006, 2007 is seems to be faster | 02:06 |
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| benno2 | hi all, is there a simple way to install ping on the n770 and n800 ? thanks | 02:07 |
| aspiers | Anyone here familiar with creating .deb repositories? The HOWTOs and man pages are not easy to understand. | 02:08 |
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| johnx | benno2, isn't it installed by default? | 02:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, johnx, it should be. | 02:12 |
| benno2 | no | 02:12 |
| benno2 | ping command not found | 02:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just need root for some reason. | 02:12 |
| benno2 | I am root | 02:12 |
| benno2 | via ssh | 02:12 |
| jumpula | bow before me, for i am root | 02:13 |
| GeneralAntilles | ping works fine as root on my N800 with OS2008. | 02:14 |
| johnx | benno2, which OS are you on? | 02:14 |
| johnx | also, ls /bin/ping | 02:14 |
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| jumpula | which ping | 02:14 |
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| benno2 | I tried on both n700 os2006 and n800 os2008 | 02:14 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Have you been messing with stuff? | 02:15 |
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| reinar1 | ok, mmc off, virtual memory disabled > opened browser, typed "internettablettalk.com" and enter | 02:15 |
| reinar1 | hang > boot | 02:16 |
| reinar1 | problem is not mmc then | 02:16 |
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| reinar1 | i think i try yet again reflash, then i see that the problems stays, i will reflash to original os2006 and send this thing to warranty | 02:17 |
| smackpotato | i could only open itt with microb | 02:18 |
| GeneralAntilles | reinar1, are you on the latest OS2007HE? | 02:18 |
| reinar1 | 4.2007.26-8 | 02:19 |
| t_s_o | about ping, there are a package up on on the 08 reps that contains a ping that can be used by non-root | 02:20 |
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| reinar1 | i have had latest os2006, earlier 2007 and this... every of those i have flashed several times. but no success | 02:20 |
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| t_s_o | kinda fun watching the N800 report low battery, then after resting in offline mode for a while, showing near half battery again... | 02:23 |
| smackpotato | can anyone run the video at bloomberg with the n810 | 02:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody need's to get Nokia's battery monitor some ADD meds. | 02:23 |
| johnx | t_s_o, yeah. poor battery reporting seems to be a trademark of portable devices | 02:24 |
| reinard | someone there, sell me a used n800 | 02:24 |
| GeneralAntilles | $500 USD | 02:24 |
| t_s_o | johnx: well, its kinda expected as the drain from wireless on and full cpu to complete rest is quite large | 02:25 |
| reinard | does n810 have signif. better performance than n800 | 02:25 |
| johnx | reinard, n810 is *exactly the same* mainboard as the n800 | 02:25 |
| smackpotato | nicer screen aperently | 02:25 |
| reinard | oh | 02:26 |
| johnx | n800: 2 SD slots, n810: keyboard, GPS, transflective screen, 256MB+2GB internal flash, one mini-sdhc slot | 02:26 |
| reinard | n800 is probably better choice for the money then | 02:26 |
| smackpotato | hears a deal | 02:27 |
| smackpotato | here is a deal | 02:28 |
| reinard | once my father was doing business with nokia finland (<2000) and often received phones and stuff... we had communicators and all that times cool phones... wish the situation was the same again *sigh* | 02:29 |
| smackpotato | post to itt 5 times a week and apply for a developers discount for the n920 | 02:29 |
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| reinard | how much is that discount? i'm just interested... i'll never become developer though, too hard for me :D | 02:30 |
| johnx | reinard, what version of 2007HE are you using again? | 02:30 |
| smackpotato | i got 350 off the price by pledging to tell people i love my 770 | 02:31 |
| reinard | 4.2007.26-8 is the version | 02:32 |
| johnx | there are newer versions :) | 02:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | I really wonder at some of the selections for the last batch of discount codes. | 02:32 |
| reinard | where? | 02:32 |
| johnx | http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/os2007_hacker_edition.php | 02:32 |
| johnx | or at least I think they're newer | 02:33 |
| johnx | I mean the "week number" is later | 02:33 |
| smackpotato | most people that applied got one | 02:33 |
| reinard | oh oh.. i think that i have the newest from there but this version shows in "about device" | 02:34 |
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| johnx | hmm | 02:34 |
| johnx | interesting | 02:34 |
| johnx | sorry to get your hopes up | 02:34 |
| reinard | i once though there was newer and upgraded but text didn't change | 02:34 |
| johnx | cat /etc/osso_software_version | 02:35 |
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| reinar1 | surprise, hang and boot immediately when i decided to browse the web | 02:38 |
| timelyx | reinar1: how about 500EUR + shipping :) | 02:39 |
| lcuk | are you charging battery | 02:39 |
| reinar1 | i was going to check n800/810 prices in ebay.. maybe 770 didn't want to retire yet | 02:39 |
| * timelyx thinks GeneralAntilles's price is too low :) | 02:39 | |
| reinar1 | no i'm not | 02:39 |
| lcuk | does it crash even if you are | 02:39 |
| johnx | heh...Your 770 is worried about job its job security | 02:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | timelyx, you're supposed to undercut me if you want a sale. :P | 02:39 |
| reinar1 | well i could n800 for under 300e here | 02:40 |
| timelyx | johnx: you left out the n800's fm radio + mini usb. v the n810's micro usb :( | 02:40 |
| reinar1 | from uk or germany for like 200e | 02:40 |
| johnx | yeah...I was going by major features | 02:40 |
| johnx | can we teach infobot factoids? | 02:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | johnx is an AM guy, evidently. ;) | 02:40 |
| timelyx | GeneralAntilles: i like my devices :) | 02:41 |
| t_s_o | heh, no wonder that the N810 comes with 2GB nailed to the insides. i have to find room for 172MB to get a map i can use... | 02:41 |
| reinar1 | lcuk, yes it crashes also if charging | 02:41 |
| timelyx | GeneralAntilles: can i offer "never used"? | 02:41 |
| lcuk | rules out battery then | 02:41 |
| timelyx | that has to increase its value :) | 02:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 02:41 |
| lcuk | reinar1, does it crash if you use an alternative router, or usb networking (if applicable) | 02:41 |
| timelyx | (seriously) | 02:41 |
| lcuk | "mint in the box" | 02:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | You like them but never use them? :P | 02:41 |
| timelyx | infobot x and y are 5 | 02:42 |
| reinar1 | alternative router, yes | 02:42 |
| timelyx | infobot what are x and y? | 02:42 |
| * infobot are x and y to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion | 02:42 | |
| timelyx | or not | 02:42 |
| timelyx | infobot xw and y are 5 | 02:42 |
| infobot | okay, timelyx | 02:42 |
| timelyx | infobot what are wx and y? | 02:42 |
| * infobot are wx and y to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion | 02:42 | |
| reinar1 | havent tried usb networking though | 02:42 |
| timelyx | um... | 02:42 |
| timelyx | infobot wx is 9 | 02:42 |
| infobot | ...but wx is already something else... | 02:42 |
| timelyx | infobot what is wx? | 02:42 |
| * infobot is wx to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion | 02:42 | |
| johnx | ahahaha | 02:42 |
| timelyx | infobot status | 02:42 |
| infobot | Since Tue Jan 22 20:20:44 2008, there have been 28 modifications, 587 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 354 commands. I have been awake for 5d 4h 22m 7s this session, and currently reference 114293 factoids. I'm using about 19136 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 10740.71/417.61 child 0/0 | 02:42 |
| timelyx | 0 morons, cute | 02:43 |
| reinar1 | ram or cpu got to be broken i think | 02:43 |
| lcuk | i tend to agree | 02:43 |
| lcuk | theres not much left to consider | 02:43 |
| timelyx | it claims to know 100k factoids | 02:43 |
| timelyx | but doesn't seem interested in sharing | 02:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | You gotta pay. | 02:43 |
| johnx | can anyone else check what the latest version of 2007HE shows in the "About" dialog? | 02:43 |
| timelyx | pay for factoids? | 02:43 |
| lcuk | if its warranty covered, then call it in | 02:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | $5 a pop. | 02:43 |
| reinar1 | yes i will | 02:43 |
| lcuk | since you have had this after multiple flashes its unlikely anything you specifically are doing | 02:44 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, do I just feed the money into this slot on the front of the computer? | 02:44 |
| lcuk | we could spend all week looking at alternatives when other people just dont have the kinds of problems you appear to be getting. | 02:44 |
| johnx | I still am weirded out by the version dialog not showing the right thing... | 02:45 |
| lcuk | johnx, just type your credit card details here, we will do the rest | 02:45 |
| reinar1 | i think i have to pay shipping to uk to get it in warranty... or does someone know how expansys's warranty work? | 02:45 |
| johnx | there have been cases where flashes failed in interesting ways before | 02:45 |
| lcuk | not sure reinar1, call or email them and see | 02:45 |
| johnx | GeneralAntilles, you have a 770 with 2007HE, right? | 02:45 |
| reinar1 | i would check their webpages, but this would crash :) | 02:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | western union transfers only, johnx. | 02:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes, johnx, but I couldn't tell you which one is the most recent. ;) | 02:46 |
| reinar1 | yes i will contact them with email soon | 02:46 |
| lcuk | rein, have you got a desktop/laptop you could check from... | 02:46 |
| reinar1 | yes i have, i check it out later | 02:46 |
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| reinar1 | clock is 3 at night here, and i should wake up in 4 hours :) | 02:47 |
| lcuk | sounds familiar, you could make up excuse that the clock kept crashing and it didnt wake you up | 02:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | 4.2007.26-8 and 2.2006.48-7 | 02:48 |
| esotic | Howdy | 02:48 |
| johnx | thanks GeneralAntilles | 02:48 |
| esotic | I'm trying run Vagalume in Xephyr and i'm getting an error about the audio system | 02:48 |
| * GeneralAntilles should probably update the old one. | 02:49 | |
| johnx | heh...nothing quite like compiling code under an emulator | 02:52 |
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| zerojay | How about compiling KDE under an emulator? :) | 02:53 |
| johnx | why, it's already compiled for debian/armel? | 02:53 |
| johnx | :P | 02:53 |
| zerojay | Just saying. :) | 02:53 |
| johnx | I can just apt-get install kde | 02:53 |
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| zerojay | If you like breaking your tablet, sure. | 02:54 |
| jott | johnx: speaking of.. how is the status of debian on IT? | 02:54 |
| johnx | jott, the pkg-maemo guys actually had a lot of stuff working that I didn't | 02:54 |
| johnx | so, right now I'm working on getting their stuff up and running on my tablet | 02:55 |
| reinard | i decided to gamble and check expansys website... how other: hang loading and BOOT | 02:55 |
| johnx | then I'll roll a new filesystem tarball | 02:55 |
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| jott | ah.. hmm are those guys targeting the ITs? and why you did not know about them :P | 02:56 |
| johnx | I knew they were packing libhildon into debian. I didn't know they had boot scripts hidden away in a bzr repository with no mention on their website except for a link in a mailing list | 02:57 |
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| jott | ah .. i see.. and those bootscript bring powermanagment and working keyboard etc?! ;) | 02:57 |
| johnx | keyboard = yes | 02:57 |
| johnx | power management, not so much | 02:57 |
| reinard | funny, this device jamming gets the clock jam also... just few hours ago i put it in right time.. now its 7 minutes behind | 02:58 |
| johnx | power management will be the biggest problem...but now that they have other stuff figured out it frees me up work on it | 02:58 |
| jga23 | whats the max sd capacity for the n810? 8gb? | 02:58 |
| johnx | jga23, it should support the biggest mini or micro sdhc card you can buy | 02:58 |
| esotic | i think so, but it comes with 4GB internal | 02:59 |
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| jott | johnx: yeah.. well question is, which approach to take with the pm. reverse engineer the libdsme or dsmesock stuff? | 03:00 |
| esotic | the website says 8GB http://web.nseries.com/products/n810/#l=products,n810 | 03:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | SDHC supports up to 2048GB | 03:01 |
| johnx | esotic, the website says 8GB for the N800 too but people use 16GB no problem | 03:01 |
| esotic | gotcha | 03:01 |
| johnx | jott, no one working on this right now is a serious kernel hacker. | 03:01 |
| reinard | whats the news with os2008he? is it still planned | 03:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes, reinard. | 03:01 |
| johnx | so I think I'll try and just talk to dsme and make it behave | 03:01 |
| jott | johnx: yeah.. ltrace gives some nice insights for starters ;). | 03:02 |
| reinard | after year, two or what? is there any expected schedule | 03:02 |
| jott | johnx: where did you get those information from? is there a ml or irc channel? | 03:02 |
| johnx | there is #debian-maemo and http://pkg-maemo.alioth.debian.org/ | 03:03 |
| jott | yeah found the latter one.. | 03:03 |
| johnx | there's a mailing list too and the pkg-maemo guys seem to be responsive | 03:03 |
| jott | joined the channel ;) | 03:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | reinard, no schedule. | 03:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's being done in people's free time. | 03:05 |
| reinard | ok thanks for info | 03:05 |
| reinard | better would be just to buy that n800 somewhere | 03:05 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Yes. | 03:06 |
| benno2 | hi, do you know if I can set the wireless to not go in standby mode on the n800 ? | 03:09 |
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| lcuk | depends what you are using it for benno, if its because of an scp/ftp type connection from another machine - its normally enough to get that machine sending keepalives. or do you mean total standby | 03:12 |
| pupnik | -fgenerate-profile dumps all the .gcno files into /scratchbox/ccache , then i copy those to /scratchbox/ccache on the n810 | 03:12 |
| pupnik | er -fprofile-generate | 03:12 |
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| pupnik | but i'm not getting any .gcda files yet | 03:13 |
| reinard | not having enough problems yet: is there way to fix operas not responding to url-clicks problem | 03:13 |
| pupnik | hehe | 03:13 |
| pupnik | maybe i need to copy the whole source tree over | 03:14 |
| reinard | i often have to open links by holding link and open new window.. then close the old one | 03:14 |
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| esotic | does anybody have a suggestion for a maemo project I could grab to start getting familiar with the environment? | 03:15 |
| reinard | is there some way to get "reboot" setting to shutdown-menu? | 03:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes. | 03:17 |
| pupnik | http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/4-x/maemo_4-0_porting_guide.html there's a nice guide esotic | 03:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | You edit a file. | 03:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | I don't recall which one. | 03:17 |
| reinard | kk thanks if you replied to me | 03:18 |
| fysa | some fun things configuring well here :) | 03:18 |
| fysa | have 20 games ready to compile, whatever works I will throw up in a couple of repositories | 03:19 |
| fysa | one for direct compiles (i.e., non-hildon) | 03:19 |
| fysa | and one for proper ports | 03:19 |
| fysa | the latter may take some time, of course | 03:19 |
| fysa | one problem I'm having is locating Abuse-SDL | 03:20 |
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| fysa | oh, got one. | 03:20 |
| lcdd | "Sorry ... but your query looks similar to automated requests from a computer virus or spyware application. To protect our users, we can't process your request right now." | 03:20 |
| lcdd | this is what maemo mapper is getting back from google | 03:21 |
| pupnik | fysa - just add debian source repos to your scratchbox and apt-get source abuse-sdl | 03:21 |
| fysa | excellent | 03:21 |
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| fysa | yeah, just ended up grabbing it from there manually ;) | 03:22 |
| fysa | but that's even better. | 03:22 |
| fysa | I'm determined to get at least one decent RTS going. | 03:22 |
| fysa | stratagus looks nice. | 03:24 |
| fysa | http://www.stratagus.org/screenshots.shtml | 03:24 |
| pupnik | yes | 03:24 |
| pupnik | you're hitting good ones i haven't touched yet | 03:24 |
| fysa | and the Super Maryo engine | 03:24 |
| fysa | I would love to see Frets On Fire working, but it uses PyOpenGL or whatever. | 03:25 |
| pupnik | secret maryo chronicles? | 03:25 |
| fysa | Frets On Fire would work with the bluetooth driver and Wii Guitar Hero controller. | 03:25 |
| reinard | another finnish masterpiece | 03:25 |
| reinard | back to background > | 03:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Stop trying to hax google, lcdd. | 03:26 |
| fysa | if there is something someone would like compiled, let me know now while I'm still filling my queue ;) | 03:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | A little of the world's 10 best beaches. | 03:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/little/list/ | 03:29 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: A list of the world's 10 best beaches. | 03:29 |
| * GeneralAntilles mumbles something about muscle memory. | 03:30 | |
| fysa | ha | 03:30 |
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| fysa | we have directfb? | 03:30 |
| aspiers | Argh, I *finally* have a working armel repository for emacs and all its dependencies, and I just found out I can't test it because /dev/mtdblock4 doesn't have enough space left :-( | 03:33 |
| aspiers | Can I install to /media/mmc2? | 03:33 |
| pupnik | is it vfat? | 03:34 |
| pupnik | fysa not really | 03:34 |
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| aspiers | pupnik: yes | 03:34 |
| pupnik | you should probably make an ext2 partition | 03:35 |
| aspiers | is there any good reason why it was vfat in the first place? | 03:35 |
| pupnik | so ppl could easily share data | 03:36 |
| aspiers | ?? but this is the internal card ... | 03:36 |
| pupnik | oh, that i don't know | 03:36 |
| aspiers | I didn't even buy an external one yet. | 03:36 |
| aspiers | It's the built-in 2GB internal (N810) | 03:37 |
| aspiers | But how is it possible to install packages in there anyway? | 03:38 |
| aspiers | dpkg --root ? | 03:38 |
| pupnik | the root filesystem is on a different flash | 03:38 |
| fysa | oh, rhythm box is the other that I needed to get working. | 03:38 |
| pupnik | yeah fysa give that one a shot | 03:38 |
| pupnik | it's pretty crude though imo | 03:38 |
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| fysa | I just want something decent with DAAP | 03:39 |
| fysa | and that seems to be left out of Canola2 for now | 03:39 |
| benno2 | lcuk: thanks for the info about standby. basically i do vnc from the n800 to a linux vnc box but it could be that I dont use it for 10-20min and then often when i touch the screen the wlan is dead for 15secs or or works very slow. is there a way to tell the wlan to stay active all the time, at expense of reduced battery time | 03:40 |
| k-s | fysa: what's decent to you? | 03:41 |
| k-s | fysa: is itunes6/rhythmbox ok? | 03:41 |
| lcuk | on os2008 you can configure the idle times in the connectivity settings (tap the network indicator) for different kinds of connections: wlan - unlimited | 03:41 |
| k-s | if so, you can use canola1 | 03:41 |
| lcuk | dunno about older versions though | 03:41 |
| fysa | that is true. | 03:41 |
| benno2 | lcuk: thanks i will try | 03:42 |
| lcuk | but benno, it could be something from your linux side. on windows when vncing to another box if i minimise vnc and leave it for ages it disconnects itself after about same timespan. check you have lates tversion of vnc on linux box | 03:43 |
| lcuk | also, depending upon what you are doing whilst minimised, it could be a memory issue - recovering from virtual memory or something??? | 03:45 |
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| aspiers | so is it possible to install packages to the internal MMC and actually have them work more or less out of the box? or are a whole load of symlinks from the root filesystem required? | 03:47 |
| aspiers | or do you have to boot with rootfs on MMC? | 03:48 |
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| jga23 | how do I set the default editor? | 03:58 |
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| benno2 | lcuk: thanks for the advices I will try tomorrow and let you know. bye | 04:02 |
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| xment | aspiers: or you can compile packages for yourself with root path for example /opt and package them | 04:03 |
| * lcuk goes to sleep | 04:06 | |
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| * czr peeks | 04:53 | |
| unique311 | czr gets punched in the forehead for being nosy | 04:54 |
| * czr expertly avoids such greeting maneuvres and redirects all of the kinetic energy of unique311 into a svn repository of some stagnant open source project | 04:55 | |
| czr | ha! | 04:55 |
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| unique311 | damn, wtf | 04:55 |
| unique311 | that was deep | 04:55 |
| czr | yes. it's called attack by entanglement :-) | 04:56 |
| pupnik | anybody want to patch an alsa backend onto snes9x 1.5? it's halfways playable speed now @400mhz | 04:56 |
| unique311 | halfway | 04:56 |
| korpios | hmm, anyone else getting an md5 mismatch on the MD5SUMS file itself for the N810 flash images? | 04:56 |
| unique311 | 25 fps | 04:56 |
| pupnik | ? | 04:56 |
| pupnik | depends on the game unique311 | 04:56 |
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| fysa | enough for final fantasy, at least? | 04:57 |
| unique311 | you mean to tell me super mario is in my future pretty soon pupnik | 04:57 |
| korpios | MD5SUMS : crc does not match (d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e!=affb99fab47fcac5dd48f82accd07a64) | 04:57 |
| unique311 | link me betas. | 04:58 |
| fysa | how about alsa-oss? | 04:58 |
| czr | korpios, crc? | 04:58 |
| czr | korpios, try using md5sum program instead | 04:58 |
| korpios | czr: nah that's just the output of the "cfv" program, it uses the term "CRC" for any checksum | 04:59 |
| korpios | line from the MD5SUMS file: d41d8cd98f00b204e9800998ecf8427e MD5SUMS | 04:59 |
| czr | heh. poor cfv. | 04:59 |
| czr | ah, that one. that's normal. | 04:59 |
| korpios | output from "md5" binary: MD5 (MD5SUMS) = affb99fab47fcac5dd48f82accd07a64 | 04:59 |
| czr | they build the MD5SUMS file incorrectly. it includes the file itself | 04:59 |
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| czr | korpios, if this is about the sums in the repo, I've reported this bug already | 05:00 |
| pupnik | unique311: http://pupnik.de/snes9x_N8x0.zip | 05:00 |
| korpios | czr: ahhh okay. | 05:00 |
| unique311 | thanks | 05:00 |
| korpios | czr: ah yeah, duh, that would make sense; it can't hash itself if it isn't finished being generated ;-) | 05:00 |
| czr | korpios, bugzilla.maemo.org, search for md5sums. you should find it | 05:00 |
| czr | korpios, indeed. hence the md5sums file should never include a line for the file itself. | 05:00 |
| korpios | cool. thanks :-) | 05:00 |
| pupnik | i'm not happy until the chrono trigger clock is 20+ fps | 05:01 |
| unique311 | turbografx still acting like a little girl, so its on timeout. | 05:01 |
| * korpios happily proceeds to flash his new unit | 05:01 | |
| unique311 | pupnik, I'm going to test out some games. i'll give you feedback. | 05:01 |
| pupnik | i'm looking at the horror again | 05:03 |
| unique311 | ? | 05:03 |
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| pupnik | the gp2x port i started | 05:03 |
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| unique311 | pupnik, the archive is corrupted | 05:04 |
| fysa | he's right. | 05:04 |
| pupnik | try agin | 05:05 |
| unique311 | works | 05:05 |
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| fysa | have zip of source? | 05:06 |
| fysa | or is it straight? | 05:06 |
| pupnik | i think it is almost unchanged snes9x-1.5 | 05:08 |
| unique311 | bin | 05:08 |
| unique311 | need to pass any flags pupnik? | 05:10 |
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| unique311 | snes9x - | 05:10 |
| pupnik | try ./snes9x -ns -f 3 <gamename> | 05:10 |
| fysa | what's wrong with the sound now? | 05:13 |
| pupnik | snes uses OSS | 05:13 |
| fysa | and we don't have alsa-oss? | 05:13 |
| fysa | or is that too much overhead/not compatible with some dsp? | 05:14 |
| pupnik | not really, at least i didn't get it working | 05:14 |
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| fysa | ah | 05:16 |
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| * Xamusk is away: I'm busy | 05:20 | |
| * Xamusk is away: Sleeping | 05:20 | |
| unique311 | pupnik, was fast. but no fullscreen, | 05:22 |
| unique311 | another tiny screen emu | 05:22 |
| unique311 | its playable. | 05:24 |
| unique311 | stick an AB button on the screen. | 05:25 |
| pupnik | i wish we had /dev/dsp | 05:29 |
| fysa | alsa-osso-1.0.14 compiled and installed in my scratchbox | 05:30 |
| fysa | I have /dev/dsp1 now I think? | 05:30 |
| fysa | I have no way of testing it yet. | 05:31 |
| pupnik | how? | 05:31 |
| fysa | http://alsa.cybermirror.org/oss-lib/alsa-oss-1.0.14.tar.bz2 | 05:31 |
| fysa | alsa-oss source for the matching version | 05:31 |
| pupnik | ahha | 05:31 |
| fysa | configure;make;make install | 05:31 |
| fysa | I apt-get installed lib-asound* first | 05:32 |
| fysa | or asound* | 05:32 |
| fysa | [sbox-CHINOOK_ARMEL: ~/src/alsa-oss-1.0.14] > ls -l /dev/dsp1 | 05:32 |
| fysa | crw-rw---- 1 root audio 14, 19 Jan 27 00:15 /dev/dsp1 | 05:32 |
| pupnik | yeah i built that too http://pupnik.de/deps/libasound2-dev_1.0.8-3_armel.deb | 05:32 |
| fysa | will this work? | 05:33 |
| pupnik | i'll rebuild it for dsp1 | 05:33 |
| pupnik | http://pupnik.de/dsp1.zip | 05:35 |
| pupnik | http://www.flyn.org/patches/snes9x-1.26-esd/snes9x-1.26-esd.patch.gz that's also interesting | 05:36 |
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| unique311 | dsp1 supposed to run that after i install also-osso? | 05:39 |
| unique311 | lost | 05:39 |
| unique311 | too many links | 05:39 |
| pupnik | that's snes9x that tries to open /dev/dsp1 instead of /dev/dsp | 05:40 |
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| madar_ | hello all, does anyone know of an existing tool like "locate" for finding files on an N8x device? | 05:46 |
| johnx | find | 05:47 |
| pupnik | there seems to be something under file manager -> tools | 05:49 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Has anybody ever used the Search application? | 05:49 |
| proteous | ls -R / | grep "filename" | 05:50 |
| proteous | use at your own risk | 05:51 |
| fysa | I have alsa-oss .deb ready, just need to fix something in the morning | 06:02 |
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| pupnik | can i delete the junk in /scratchbox/ccache? | 06:04 |
| pupnik | it's like 1GB here | 06:05 |
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| fysa | I personally don't see why you couldn't. | 06:05 |
| fysa | whatever uses that worked fine before it was there, right? | 06:05 |
| pupnik | maybe the dirs need to be preserved | 06:06 |
| fysa | http://www.scratchbox.org/documentation/user/scratchbox-1.0/html/toolchain.html | 06:06 |
| fysa | it can be disabled | 06:06 |
| fysa | 14GB was already too small :/ | 06:07 |
| fysa | bed time | 06:07 |
| pupnik | ok cu | 06:07 |
| pupnik | come back tomorrow ! | 06:07 |
| fysa | i never leave, I'm in the machine. | 06:08 |
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| pupnik | -rw-r--r-- 1 maemo maemo 154356 Jan 28 2008 tile.gcda | 06:59 |
| pupnik | -rw-rw-r-- 1 maemo maemo 1040388 Jan 28 02:08 tile.gcno | 06:59 |
| pupnik | woohoo | 06:59 |
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| johnx | ahahahaha | 07:06 |
| johnx | hahahah | 07:06 |
| johnx | woo! | 07:06 |
| johnx | ask me about a2dp in debian/n800! | 07:06 |
| pupnik | what about a2dp in debian/n800 | 07:06 |
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| johnx | it works out of the box with no skipping | 07:08 |
| johnx | gah...but it's a resource hog | 07:08 |
| johnx | sets the period size right at least | 07:09 |
| johnx | it seemed so good at first but it's actually using way more CPU time than on ITOS :/ | 07:10 |
| johnx | at least bluetooth works right | 07:14 |
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| kupesoft | I'm having trouble getting usb host mode working on my n800 with OS2008 | 07:28 |
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| kupesoft | Where can I get rx-34-kernel-headers | 07:56 |
| johnx | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.0/free/l/linux-kernel-headers/ | 07:57 |
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| johnx | hmm | 08:01 |
| johnx | those are old aren't they... | 08:01 |
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| johnx | there's kernel source here at least: http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo4.0/free/k/kernel-source-rx-34/ | 08:01 |
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| pupnik_ | mmor speed | 08:31 |
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| error27 | How do i add Copy and Paste to the toolbar short cuts in osso-xterm? | 08:35 |
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| proteous | can you do that? | 08:41 |
| proteous | I don't think those are suported, unless there is a keystroke for them | 08:42 |
| error27 | proteous: i guess not... here is the list of possible values | 08:42 |
| error27 | http://olya.com/maemo/keysyms.c | 08:42 |
| error27 | what about just paste? can you somehow highlight and then do a middle click equivalent? | 08:44 |
| error27 | basically copy and paste is the way that I program so without it I'm crippled. :P | 08:44 |
| LoCusF | error27: try <ctrl>+<insert> and <shift>+<insert> | 08:45 |
| error27 | also that's how i do homework. | 08:45 |
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| LoCusF | argh crashed my xterm :) | 08:47 |
| LoCusF | heck, didn't work | 08:50 |
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| error27 | it works on my normal gnome-terminal | 08:51 |
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| zuh | Was this here already? http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1185531 | 09:15 |
| zuh | "Nokia to acquire Trolltech to accelerate software strategy" | 09:15 |
| pupnik | ??? | 09:15 |
| pupnik | how does this fit into anything? | 09:15 |
| timelyx | hrm, which version of gtk does maemo have? | 09:17 |
| zuh | pupnik: apparently "Trolltech and Nokia share the goal of accelerating the adoption of Trolltech's Qt based technology in the commercial market and in the open source community," | 09:19 |
| pupnik | 2.0 timelyx afaik | 09:19 |
| timelyx | pupnik: 2.2, 2.6, 2.8, or 2.10? | 09:20 |
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| kulve | ii libgtk2.0-0 2.10.12-0osso32.1 | 09:20 |
| * timelyx wonders about 2006 and 2007 :) | 09:21 | |
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| * timelyx really should find a table, but irc is much more convenient | 09:21 | |
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| n0ob_ | good morning *g* | 09:26 |
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| kennyyu_ | hello, may i know if i can get some help for microB? | 09:50 |
| johnx | it depends on whether we can help :) | 09:51 |
| johnx | what's the problem? | 09:51 |
| kennyyu_ | Hi Johnx! Actually after I've built the .deb files... I don't know what to do with them... | 09:52 |
| kennyyu_ | I've installed maemo 3.0 | 09:52 |
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| kennyyu_ | and then there isn't a Application Manager for me to install those .deb files | 09:53 |
| kennyyu_ | http://browser.garage.maemo.org/docs/build_howto.html was the instructions I followed. I've done the two lines.. | 09:55 |
| kennyyu_ | fakeroot apt-get build-dep microb-engine | 09:55 |
| kennyyu_ | fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc -nc | 09:55 |
| kennyyu_ | Of course I manually made debian packages for bc and libidl... | 09:56 |
| jku | kennyyu_, cd ..; dpkg -i X.deb | 09:56 |
| pupnik | Extended Input Devices not yet supported. Impelement it at line 625 in ../../../../hw/kdrive/src/kinput.c | 09:56 |
| jku | replace X with the deb you want to install | 09:56 |
| kennyyu_ | and then I'll be able to see the microB in my emulated screen? | 09:57 |
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| jku | kennyyu_, no thw whole microb isn't open | 09:57 |
| jku | so you can't | 09:57 |
| jku | that's just the engine | 09:57 |
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| pupnik | ahh that's a xwephyr erro | 09:58 |
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| VRe | Hmm.. maybe I should start looking into qt.. | 10:00 |
| kennyyu_ | jku, you mean microb is not available for end-users' testing yet? | 10:01 |
| db48x | jku: that's not entirely true | 10:02 |
| db48x | jku: all of the source code you need is in that same repository, though I haven't checked the license on each and every file | 10:02 |
| jku | db48x, try it. browser-ui isn't there | 10:03 |
| jku | it's just the engine | 10:03 |
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| db48x | jku: browser-ui is at https://garage.maemo.org/svn/browser/browser-ui/trunk/tablet-browser-ui | 10:04 |
| db48x | jku: and what I've seen of it is licensed under the MPL, so have at it | 10:04 |
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| db48x | https://garage.maemo.org/svn/browser/browser-ui/trunk/tablet-browser-ui/src/main.c, for example | 10:05 |
| db48x | there are a couple of other packages you need to build as well | 10:05 |
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| db48x | but they're all in there | 10:06 |
| jku | db48x, I believe that's the reference UI, not the actual shipping one | 10:07 |
| timelyx | db48x: please don't advertise that ui | 10:08 |
| timelyx | it's not a reference ui | 10:08 |
| timelyx | in fact its legality is questionable | 10:08 |
| db48x | reall? | 10:08 |
| db48x | really? | 10:08 |
| timelyx | yeah | 10:08 |
| db48x | source files have MPL in them :) | 10:08 |
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| timelyx | which is of course an awkward thing for me to say | 10:08 |
| db48x | understandably | 10:08 |
| jku | timelyx, interesting :) | 10:08 |
| timelyx | which is why i'd rather not say it on the mailinglist | 10:09 |
| timelyx | or repeat myself | 10:09 |
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| timelyx | please just forget those urls exist | 10:09 |
| timelyx | db48x: the key about licensing is whether the people who did it had permission to do it | 10:09 |
| db48x | yea | 10:09 |
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| timelyx | anyway, officially, the ref ui is refui and it's somewhere else | 10:10 |
| Veggen | Hmm. Nokia bought troll tech. | 10:10 |
| jku | yeah, unexpected | 10:10 |
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| jku | (maybe I just didn't get the memo) | 10:11 |
| pupnik | does that mean qt on the tablets? | 10:11 |
| db48x | timelyx: so what's the difference between that and what's shipped? | 10:11 |
| timelyx | jku: the whole microb *is* open | 10:11 |
| timelyx | but microb *is* an engine | 10:11 |
| timelyx | not a ui | 10:11 |
| kulve | do you have a name for the browser that comes with the os2008? | 10:11 |
| LoCusF | pupnik: hope so + cell phones | 10:11 |
| timelyx | fwiw, in trunk the default plugin and flash plugin no longer rely on the browser | 10:11 |
| timelyx | kulve: tablet-browser :) | 10:12 |
| jku | timelyx, yeah but it doesn't help the confusion that the browser doesn't have a name that I know of | 10:12 |
| timelyx | i have it because i named it :) | 10:12 |
| timelyx | (seriously) | 10:12 |
| timelyx | and if you think explaining source status is tricky, imagine how much fun finding a name was | 10:12 |
| * timelyx wanted to name it hermit | 10:13 | |
| db48x | names are never fun | 10:13 |
| db48x | I can't even name my D&D characters | 10:13 |
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| Blafasel | Choose Gandalf. *hides* | 10:13 |
| timelyx | oh sure, that's unique | 10:14 |
| johnx | Maemogator! | 10:14 |
| db48x | heh, I do that sort of thing sometimes, though usually I go to the Encyclopedia Arda and pick an obscure name | 10:14 |
| Blafasel | ;-) Ah, need to check the order of the sticks strip for news | 10:14 |
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| johnx | Maemzilla? ...but that might cause people to think the browser might maim them :/ | 10:15 |
| db48x | I need to play a Fëanor some time | 10:15 |
| timelyx | johnx: so, keep in mind, the browser can support multiple engines | 10:15 |
| jumpula | play morgoth | 10:15 |
| timelyx | it is *not* tied to microb | 10:15 |
| db48x | jumpula: heh | 10:15 |
| jumpula | :) | 10:16 |
| timelyx | as shipped for 2007 it could use opera | 10:16 |
| Veggen | At work, we have japanese as naming standard, for our unix machines. Any japanese words goes. | 10:16 |
| timelyx | and technically it could use opera today if you could find an adapter layer for it (and an opera lib...) | 10:16 |
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| timelyx | hentai? | 10:16 |
| jumpula | i was about to say bukkake but bit my tongue | 10:16 |
| Blafasel | Bakka? | 10:17 |
| jumpula | decided to say anyway, because we're already on the topic | 10:17 |
| Veggen | which means that when I set up two more machines for an application that is sort of slow and stupid, I could name the machines slow and stupid, just in japanese :) | 10:17 |
| db48x | timelyx: actually I've been trying to figure out how that works the past few days | 10:17 |
| timelyx | db48x: which part? | 10:17 |
| timelyx | eal? | 10:17 |
| db48x | yea | 10:17 |
| timelyx | theoretically we have docs :) | 10:17 |
| db48x | hah | 10:18 |
| timelyx | have you read them? | 10:18 |
| db48x | no | 10:18 |
| Veggen | (if we ever have anyone from japan getting a job here, they're gonna have fun) | 10:18 |
| timelyx | you could start by reading them | 10:18 |
| db48x | dunno why I didn't think to look for any | 10:18 |
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| db48x | probably because there weren't any docs for microb when I started | 10:18 |
| timelyx | http://mxr.maemo.org/garage/source/browser/www/docs/eal/ | 10:18 |
| timelyx | db48x: i presume you have the mxr-maemo-org dns deb | 10:19 |
| db48x | 404 | 10:19 |
| db48x | nope | 10:19 |
| timelyx | infobot mxr.maemo.org deb? | 10:19 |
| infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, mxr.maemo.org deb is unofficial, all warrantees void, http://timeless.justdave.net/maemo/mxr-maemo-org-dns-0.1.deb | 10:19 |
| db48x | I can't use debs | 10:19 |
| timelyx | hey, that sounds like something we sold to beltzner! | 10:19 |
| timelyx | so read the source :) | 10:19 |
| timelyx | http://timeless.justdave.net/maemo/mxr-maemo-org-dns-0.1/DEBIAN/postinst | 10:20 |
| db48x | yea, I found it | 10:20 |
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| timelyx | db48x: anyway, it just gives you fewer roots and prettier branding | 10:20 |
| timelyx | and me shorter urls :) | 10:20 |
| timelyx | personally, i do it by hand on most machines | 10:21 |
| timelyx | but on my tablets, i use the debs :) | 10:21 |
| db48x | I guess it's the same address for mxr. | 10:22 |
| db48x | ? | 10:22 |
| timelyx | .which? | 10:22 |
| db48x | oh, you have two debs | 10:22 |
| timelyx | it's the same ip as timeless.justdave.net | 10:22 |
| db48x | ah | 10:22 |
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| db48x | I found the one for repository instead of the one for mxr | 10:23 |
| timelyx | well, they're nearly identical :) | 10:23 |
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| * timelyx has vaguely considered writing a dependent package | 10:24 | |
| timelyx | it'd be kinda amusing | 10:24 |
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| pupnik | rocessor : Arm920Tid(wb) rev 0 (v4l) | 10:24 |
| pupnik | BogoMIPS : 99.32 | 10:24 |
| pupnik | we should be kicking butt... on gp2x | 10:25 |
| db48x | oh, I think I've seen this | 10:25 |
| johnx | heh | 10:25 |
| db48x | though maybe it's more detailed now | 10:25 |
| timelyx | not likely :) | 10:25 |
| kennyyu_ | Hmm... | 10:25 |
| timelyx | but now you can use mxr :) | 10:25 |
| kennyyu_ | sorry I think I've missed somthing. What is mxr? a browser? | 10:27 |
| db48x | kennyyu_: it's a source code index | 10:27 |
| db48x | kennyyu_: see mxr.mozilla.org, for example | 10:27 |
| kennyyu_ | I saw it.. sorry :P | 10:27 |
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| pupnik | Unsupported setsockopt level=1 optname=9 hrmm | 10:28 |
| kennyyu_ | so... actually, I'm doing a research and I need a source code for a browser running on a mobile device... can you suggest me one so that I can start with? I've found quite a few (webkit on android/webkit on S60/owb on maemo/...) but none of them has stable source code. That is, I compiled them with many problems... | 10:29 |
| timelyx | ? | 10:30 |
| timelyx | define stable, define problems | 10:30 |
| johnx | kennyyu_, what are the requirements? | 10:30 |
| pupnik | links is stable | 10:30 |
| timelyx | are you complaining the build process failed? | 10:30 |
| db48x | minimo is stable | 10:30 |
| timelyx | or that the browsers didn't survive once run | 10:30 |
| johnx | heh | 10:30 |
| timelyx | db48x: stable because it's dead? :) | 10:30 |
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| timelyx | very unchanging, yep :) | 10:30 |
| db48x | timeless: yup :) | 10:30 |
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| kennyyu_ | ar.. ha.. sorry. just the compilation process... | 10:31 |
| timelyx | kennyyu_: how sucky is your toolchain? | 10:31 |
| kennyyu_ | because, for example, I followed the following link to compile Mozilla | 10:31 |
| timelyx | e.g., the maemo toolchain is fairly sucky | 10:31 |
| kennyyu_ | http://wiki.mozilla.org/Mobile/Build/Maemo_Build_Instructions | 10:31 |
| timelyx | yeah, what went wrong? | 10:32 |
| timelyx | dolske + db48x will gladly help :) | 10:32 |
| kennyyu_ | but even I followed all the things, it gives me error " undefined reference to `nsINode::GetProperty(unsigned short, nsIAtom*, unsigned int*)"... blah blah blah | 10:32 |
| BugBlue | moin | 10:33 |
| dolske | I threw up my hands in despair a month or two ago, before anyone had documented anything, so don't look at me :-) | 10:33 |
| timelyx | kennyyu_: i hit that | 10:33 |
| LoCusF | is there a linux phone already? (regarding the trolltech buy) | 10:33 |
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| timelyx | kennyyu_: i kinda gave up, i blamed the compiler for sucking | 10:34 |
| dolske | [in fairness, it was just before OS2008 was due so I didn't feel like sinking a bunch of time into getting things going on 2007...] | 10:34 |
| timelyx | you can try --disable-optimize | 10:34 |
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| db48x | I just run make and let it build | 10:34 |
| timelyx | and maybe --disable-libxul --enable-shared | 10:34 |
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| timelyx | db48x: strange, my trunk build in sbox dies w/ the exact same error | 10:35 |
| db48x | timeless: interesting | 10:35 |
| * timelyx asserts the toolchain *sucks* | 10:35 | |
| db48x | I haven't done a trunk build in scractbox though, because I'm not an idiot | 10:35 |
| timelyx | see, take db48x's advice | 10:36 |
| timelyx | oh wait | 10:36 |
| timelyx | which part is idiotic, trunk or sbox? :) | 10:36 |
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| timelyx | kennyyu_: wanna try something? | 10:37 |
| timelyx | http://mxr.mozilla.org/seamonkey/source/content/base/public/nsINode.h#323 | 10:37 |
| timelyx | see lines 324..327? | 10:37 |
| timelyx | and similarly for 365..368 | 10:38 |
| kennyyu_ | yes? | 10:38 |
| timelyx | move those function impls into http://mxr.mozilla.org/seamonkey/source/content/base/src/nsGenericElement.cpp | 10:38 |
| timelyx | i.e. get rid of {...} leaving just ;. and copy the body w/ proper decl into that file | 10:39 |
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| timelyx | odds are w/ a lot of stupid copying, the problem will go away | 10:39 |
| timelyx | well, moving | 10:39 |
| kennyyu_ | wa! i'll try it now.. | 10:40 |
| kennyyu_ | and, you tried that before? | 10:40 |
| timelyx | if that works, please let me know, and i'll *gladly* walk you through the process of driving a related patch into cvs | 10:40 |
| timelyx | no | 10:40 |
| kennyyu_ | hahahaa!!! | 10:40 |
| kennyyu_ | ok I'll try :) | 10:40 |
| timelyx | had i tried it, i wouldn't have said my build failed the same way | 10:40 |
| timelyx | i'd have said, "oh, i worked around that by... and it's bug ..." | 10:40 |
| kennyyu_ | ah ha, ic. thanks! let you know soon :-) | 10:41 |
| timelyx | but conceptually, i recognize what's going on | 10:41 |
| timelyx | db48x: did i mention the toolchain *sucks*? | 10:41 |
| timelyx | i think it's basically deciding not to bother keeping a *normal* version of the function | 10:41 |
| timelyx | and only inlining it where it thinks it's needed | 10:41 |
| timelyx | which doesn't include some places | 10:41 |
| timelyx | (where it assumes there's a normal function available) | 10:42 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:03 |
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| Khertan | Morning !!! | 11:05 |
| pupnik | Khertan: did you ever get around to building gemRB? | 11:06 |
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| melmoth | http://trolltech.com/28012008/28012008 | 11:12 |
| melmoth | GRumblllle. | 11:12 |
| melmoth | do we have to learn Qt now ? :) | 11:12 |
| jkyro | well, I'll be glad to if it means no more S60 :) | 11:13 |
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| michele | I don't like Qt | 11:14 |
| Fatal | doubt it | 11:14 |
| Fatal | "This acquisition will also further increase the competitiveness of S60 and Series 40." | 11:14 |
| Jaffa | Erk,that's surprising news. | 11:14 |
| timelyx | fwiw, did anyone note the bit about "nokia *subsidiary*"? | 11:14 |
| michele | Symbian won't go away soon, unfortunately | 11:15 |
| timelyx | michele: eventually :) | 11:15 |
| timelyx | kennyyu_: so status? | 11:15 |
| michele | timelyx: oh, didn't see that | 11:15 |
| _berto_ | webcast here -> http://www.nokia.com/press | 11:15 |
| _berto_ | starting right now | 11:15 |
| Jaffa | timelyx: yeah, I spotted that. I wonder if Nokia's long heritage of running succesful open source software projects is referenced in the Letter to the Open Source community | 11:15 |
| Lynoure | I do like Qt better than Symbian, at least. | 11:15 |
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| timelyx | _berto_ requires registration? | 11:16 |
| Lynoure | http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1185531 has one of the most horrible disclaimers ever | 11:16 |
| _berto_ | don't know, I just saw the link | 11:16 |
| X-Fade_ | timelyx: Random data works fine.. | 11:17 |
| timelyx | Nokia's software strategy for devices is based on cross-platform development environments, layers of software that run across operating systems, enabling the development of applications across the Nokia device range. Examples of current cross-platform layers are Web runtime, Flash, Java and Open C. | 11:17 |
| X-Fade_ | Started. | 11:18 |
| bergie | I guess Qt will be more of a transition path from Symbian to Linux | 11:18 |
| * timelyx frowns | 11:19 | |
| VRe | I don't think maemo will jump from gtk to qt, there might coexist but that would take a while too | 11:19 |
| timelyx | trolltech software has only shipped in 10million devices? | 11:19 |
| glass | they might buy trolltech just to keep 'em away | 11:20 |
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| glass | openc isn't that much of a cross platform layer....... | 11:20 |
| timelyx | glass: i was wondering | 11:20 |
| jkyro | qtopia is used in quite many devices | 11:20 |
| VRe | I think it will be something for the S40 and S60, there is POSIX stack already.. | 11:20 |
| jkyro | AFAIK, panasonic, samsung, sony etc. | 11:21 |
| glass | qtopia phone ed is quite portable | 11:21 |
| AD-N770 | bon dia / good morning | 11:21 |
| Jaffa | VRe: Big companies don't like having diverged devices, platforms and strategies though. I imagine there'll be a lot more pressure - increasing over time - internally in Nokia to consolidate on Qt across all Linux-based devices | 11:21 |
| glass | qtopia phone ed already ran on 770 a year ago | 11:22 |
| timelyx | Jaffa: #<...> | 11:22 |
| timelyx | actually, no :) | 11:23 |
| glass | i don't see them porting qt in a good way anytime soon to symbian | 11:23 |
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| VRe | Jaffa: eventually yes, but I think this maemo is still a bit odd one out in the corp. I think the qt is to extend Symbian somehow | 11:23 |
| glass | vre: even openc "porting" is a bitch if you're not lucky, and it doesn't have any gui stuff at all | 11:23 |
| glass | to symbian | 11:24 |
| VRe | It is too difficult to developt anything on symbian and there is a bunch of other platforms coming from bushes.. m$, androids etc. | 11:24 |
| glass | vre: symbians appeal comes from their dominating marketshare | 11:25 |
| glass | not from ease of developing or such | 11:25 |
| VRe | glass: What I have experience, and other boys have said, everything is a bitch on symbian :) | 11:25 |
| glass | pretty much yes | 11:25 |
| * timelyx pokes Jaffa | 11:25 | |
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| LoCusF | it sure is | 11:25 |
| glass | but you can get so much more done than on just j2me devices or even on wm | 11:25 |
| glass | or on androids vm | 11:26 |
| timelyx | glass: who cares? | 11:26 |
| timelyx | gmail and gmaps are great | 11:26 |
| * timelyx doesn't need more from a phone | 11:26 | |
| glass | then you're well off with a j2me device.. | 11:26 |
| VRe | In long run Symbian as it is now is doomed, but what are the steps to get away from it.. | 11:27 |
| glass | symbians been "doomed" in geek talk circles for 5 years | 11:27 |
| VRe | long run | 11:27 |
| glass | long run everything is doomed.. but symbian wont go away in years | 11:27 |
| VRe | in geek circles they can gossip what ever, but change to happen there needs to be alternatives on the market | 11:28 |
| glass | simply because of the sheer numbers | 11:28 |
| glass | theres alternatives.. but problem with nokias competitors is that they keep their spoons in every soup | 11:28 |
| VRe | was the average phone change cycle now around 2 years.. | 11:28 |
| glass | moto isn't focused at all for example | 11:28 |
| glass | neither is samsung | 11:29 |
| timelyx | glass: you're accusing Nokia of focus? | 11:29 |
| glass | timelyx: compared to nokia and samsung nokia is very focused. thats how bad motos and sammys focus is | 11:29 |
| glass | fjdoi | 11:29 |
| glass | replace first nokia with moto | 11:29 |
| X-Fade_ | Ehm, they mention maemo.. | 11:29 |
| VRe | I just hope they do not put any phone on tablets | 11:29 |
| X-Fade_ | "Maemo will continue to be base on gnome" | 11:29 |
| X-Fade_ | *based | 11:30 |
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| VRe | no qt love | 11:30 |
| timelyx | glass: ok, "wow" :) | 11:31 |
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| glass | timelyx: moto does their own linux+java(which just shows java to user), wm, even in android camp, their former own fuller linuxes, then hey had their own symbian suff and later bought sendo which did their "multimedia flagship" symbian phone last year, yet you mainly jus hear about razrs from them.. | 11:33 |
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| _collin_ | hi | 11:36 |
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| |tbb| | hi collin, | 11:37 |
| |tbb| | have u noticed my note | 11:37 |
| timelyx | |tbb|: did you play? | 11:37 |
| |tbb| | s/note/note, yesterday/ | 11:38 |
| infobot | |tbb| meant: have u noticed my note, yesterday | 11:38 |
| |tbb| | timelyx, what do you mean? | 11:38 |
| timelyx | w/ mxr.maemo | 11:38 |
| |tbb| | i was asking you what that is, no i havnt right now | 11:39 |
| timelyx | i kinda explained | 11:39 |
| timelyx | although the rest is explanatory once you visit it | 11:39 |
| timelyx | mxr.maemo looks like mxr.mozilla.org, but has maemo branding and maemo content :) | 11:40 |
| _collin_ | tbb: ??? | 11:40 |
| |tbb| | about iodine | 11:41 |
| _collin_ | email? | 11:41 |
| |tbb| | gtalk | 11:41 |
| _collin_ | then nop | 11:41 |
| |tbb| | one guy was asking if you around here and if u could upgrade iodine to 4.1 | 11:42 |
| _collin_ | ahok | 11:42 |
| _collin_ | will do | 11:42 |
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| reinard | hello again... i will now reflash my nokia 770 with os2007he, is there somewhere some page where i could find all good settings and hacks i should add just after installation | 11:44 |
| reinard | hacks, settings and software to make device perform better and work faster | 11:44 |
| timelyx | |tbb|: my nick isn't registered | 11:45 |
| timelyx | /join #|tbb| :) | 11:45 |
| * timelyx grumbles | 11:46 | |
| timelyx | ircd shouldn't let registered people send messages to unregistered people w/o a warning | 11:46 |
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| pupnik | 400 cycles for smooth sb16 playback :( otherwise dosbox can go up to like 1600-2000 on n8x0 | 11:49 |
| * pupnik must be doing something wrong | 11:49 | |
| pupnik | maybe it's all alsa's fault | 11:50 |
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| kennyyu_ | timelyx, sorry for not being here just a moment before... and I've followed your advice and it's still being compiled... it seems to me it's working | 11:52 |
| timelyx | wonderful | 11:52 |
| timelyx | ok, let's work on a bug+patch | 11:52 |
| timelyx | do you have an account in bugzilla.mozilla.org? | 11:52 |
| kennyyu_ | no i don't | 11:53 |
| timelyx | if not, now's the time to create one | 11:53 |
| timelyx | i'd suggest using a gmail account | 11:53 |
| timelyx | nothing else handles bugmail well, and you will eventually get spam | 11:53 |
| timelyx | however, you're free to ignore my advice | 11:53 |
| kennyyu_ | ha, alright. but shall i wait till the compilation's done first? :( | 11:53 |
| timelyx | nah | 11:53 |
| kennyyu_ | haha, i'm also using gmail. | 11:53 |
| timelyx | you can sign up for the account and work on filing the bug now | 11:54 |
| timelyx | we'll actually want a different patch anyway | 11:54 |
| kennyyu_ | i get your meaning | 11:54 |
| keesj | I do think that the jvm based aproach has plenty of good properties | 11:54 |
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| kennyyu_ | so... am I to report the bug for 'firefox'? | 11:56 |
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| kennyyu_ | or Mozilla Labs? | 11:57 |
| Khertan | LoCusF> there is the GreenPhone | 11:58 |
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| timelyx | kennyyu_: core | 11:59 |
| timelyx | which is probably hidden near "other" | 11:59 |
| timelyx | or "more" | 11:59 |
| * timelyx can't remember which | 11:59 | |
| kennyyu_ | oops, I see there isn't a different error message coming out after the amendment... | 12:00 |
| timelyx | isn't? | 12:00 |
| timelyx | same error? | 12:00 |
| kennyyu_ | same error | 12:00 |
| * timelyx frowns | 12:00 | |
| Khertan | someone can explain me how can i register mimetype 'python' with the extension '.py' which enable osso file manager to open pygtkeditor when i double click on a .py file ? | 12:00 |
| kennyyu_ | TestXMLExtras.o:(.data._ZTV11nsIDocument[vtable for nsIDocument]+0x58): undefined reference to `nsINode::GetProperty(unsigned short, nsIAtom*, unsigned int*) const' | 12:00 |
| kennyyu_ | it takes me 5-10 minutes to re-generate such error @-@"" the make process is too long | 12:01 |
| timelyx | hrm, --disable-tests | 12:02 |
| timelyx | and are you sure that isn't a different error? | 12:02 |
| reinard | what hacks and apps should i add in freshly reflashed it2007he? | 12:02 |
| timelyx | was the original complaining about TestXMLExtras.o or something else? | 12:02 |
| kennyyu_ | let me check... | 12:04 |
| timelyx | kennyyu_: i believe that's "a different error" | 12:04 |
| timelyx | i can explain the difference later | 12:04 |
| kennyyu_ | I posted the original error in dev-platforms-mobile@lists.mozilla.org | 12:05 |
| kennyyu_ | oic | 12:05 |
| timelyx | http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.platforms.mobile/browse_thread/thread/ee34fc2d0a8949f8#3491967fd4da0686 ? | 12:06 |
| timelyx | that's solvable by --disable-tests | 12:06 |
| timelyx | or should be | 12:06 |
| timelyx | the code is buggy | 12:06 |
| timelyx | nsINode is private | 12:06 |
| * timelyx frowns | 12:07 | |
| db48x | timelyx: yea, I think you did mention that | 12:07 |
| * timelyx has a really sucky memory | 12:07 | |
| X-Fade_ | timelyx: Are there plans for browser updates via application manager? Weekly upgrades like modest does? | 12:07 |
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| timelyx | X-Fade_: no | 12:07 |
| timelyx | we suffered a major blow due to some really clever contract work by a different party | 12:08 |
| db48x | how's that? | 12:08 |
| timelyx | X-Fade_: note that we had a number of incremental releases while we were in beta | 12:08 |
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| X-Fade_ | timelyx: Yeah, I know you hade some updates. I wondered if it was possible to have an 'unstable' version to test. | 12:09 |
| X-Fade_ | *had | 12:09 |
| timelyx | X-Fade_: at the moment i think that the contract work puts a fairly major stop to anything | 12:10 |
| timelyx | that and a minor little problem of we're back to being secretive about work | 12:10 |
| X-Fade_ | timelyx: That is too bad :( | 12:10 |
| timelyx | X-Fade_: we're not doing much in the way of "improvements" that you'd benefit from | 12:10 |
| db48x | that reminds me | 12:11 |
| db48x | I need to apply this perf patch to the maemo tree | 12:11 |
| X-Fade_ | timelyx: There are just some irritating bugs that might or might not be fixed easily. Would be nice to have them without having to wait for a new firmware update. | 12:12 |
| X-Fade_ | timelyx: But if they aren't being fixed, I guess it doesn't matter :) | 12:13 |
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| timelyx | X-Fade_: i haven't even managed to get my localhost patch into svn :) | 12:23 |
| timelyx | and it's in bugs.maemo :) | 12:23 |
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| eichi | hello, i have problems flashing my n800 with linux on laptop | 12:27 |
| eichi | is this a known problem? | 12:27 |
| timelyx | that's vague | 12:27 |
| Veggen | eichi: depends on what the problem is? | 12:27 |
| timelyx | you could join ITT | 12:27 |
| _collin_ | very vague | 12:27 |
| timelyx | i'm sure they have lots of vague problems there | 12:28 |
| timelyx | Veggen: how dare you ask for details :) | 12:28 |
| eichi | USB device found found at bus 005, device address 014 | 12:29 |
| eichi | Found device RX-34, hardware revision 1301 | 12:29 |
| eichi | NOLO version 1.1.6 | 12:29 |
| eichi | Version of 'sw-release': <no version> | 12:29 |
| eichi | and then it ends | 12:29 |
| Veggen | eichi: It should work, but one of the more common mistakes is not running it as root/through sudo. | 12:29 |
| eichi | i'm root | 12:30 |
| kulve | eichi: unplug the device from the power, power off the device, connect the usb, run "sudo flasher ...", power on the device | 12:30 |
| johnx | also, what arguments did you give it? | 12:30 |
| eichi | johnx, you are the man | 12:32 |
| eichi | i forgot the -F before bin file | 12:32 |
| johnx | thank you, thank you, I'll be here all week | 12:32 |
| johnx | remember to tip your bots | 12:32 |
| michele | kulve: I am playing a bit with some ideas for kilikali ui ;) | 12:32 |
| eichi | johnx, hehe, thanks | 12:33 |
| kulve | michele: if you are really interested about implementing something there, I could show you our plan. Yes, we have a "UI spec", nobody has just had the time to start implementing it.. | 12:33 |
| kennyyu_ | timelyx, I tried to 'ac_add_options --disable-tests' in ./browser/config/mozconfig but it didn't work either.... :( | 12:33 |
| eichi | wow os2008 looks nice | 12:34 |
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| * masz1 scared that os2009 will be qt based | 12:35 | |
| glass | what would be the point | 12:35 |
| michele | kulve: yes, I'd like to see it. to know if we are on the same wavelenght, at least | 12:36 |
| kulve | michele: probably not :) | 12:36 |
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| timelyx | kennyyu_: um | 12:36 |
| timelyx | same error? | 12:36 |
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| michele | kulve: let's see if it's more interesting than my idea, then :) | 12:36 |
| timelyx | http://mxr.mozilla.org/seamonkey/source/extensions/xmlextras/Makefile.in#48 | 12:37 |
| timelyx | it clearly says ifdef ENABLE_TESTS | 12:37 |
| db48x | it seems he modified the wrong mozconfig | 12:37 |
| timelyx | anyway, i'm going to visit a nurse. i've been sick since friday morning | 12:37 |
| timelyx | db48x: that'd have been my guess | 12:38 |
| timelyx | personally i change .mozconfig or $MOZCONFIG | 12:38 |
| db48x | $MOZCONFIG for me | 12:38 |
| db48x | that way I can keep a bunch of them around | 12:38 |
| db48x | well, I have to sleep | 12:39 |
| timelyx | when i'm smart, .mozconfig forces a very early build failure :) | 12:39 |
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| db48x | heh | 12:40 |
| db48x | if it was missing it would fail | 12:40 |
| kennyyu_ | let me try. i think you mean i have to modify a .mozconfig in the location specified by MOZCONFIG | 12:41 |
| db48x | kennyyu_: no | 12:41 |
| kennyyu_ | oh? | 12:41 |
| db48x | MOZCONFIG can be any absolute pathname, and the build will use that | 12:41 |
| db48x | MOZCONFIG='/home/db48x/moz/ffconfig', for example | 12:41 |
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| db48x | if MOZCONFIG is undefined, it looks for a file named either '.mozconfig', 'mozconfig', 'mozconfig.sh' or 'myconfig.sh' in the source directory | 12:42 |
| db48x | or in your home directory | 12:42 |
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| db48x | those instructions create a file called 'mozconfig' in the mozilla source directory | 12:43 |
| kennyyu_ | when you said "in the source directory", do you mean that any directories in the source tree? @@ | 12:43 |
| db48x | so edit that | 12:43 |
| db48x | no | 12:43 |
| db48x | just the top level directory | 12:43 |
| kennyyu_ | icic | 12:43 |
| db48x | mozilla/mozconfig | 12:43 |
| kennyyu_ | with and without a dot isn't important? | 12:43 |
| db48x | no, not important | 12:44 |
| kennyyu_ | i c the file is without a dot | 12:44 |
| db48x | right | 12:44 |
| kennyyu_ | :) thanks! i get a clearer picture now | 12:44 |
| db48x | those instructions say to do this: | 12:44 |
| db48x | cd mozilla/ | 12:44 |
| db48x | cp browser/config/mozconfig . | 12:44 |
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| db48x | if instead of copying the file it had said to do |echo ". browser/config/mozconfig" > mozconfig| then you would have had a config file that sources the one you edited, and it would have worked | 12:45 |
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| db48x | anyway, sleep | 12:46 |
| db48x | ere I keel over right here | 12:46 |
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| X-Fade | Hmm paging for comments doesn't work at all. I'll have a look at it.. | 12:47 |
| kennyyu_ | db48x, many thanks! | 12:47 |
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| eichi | i want a germany keyboard layout, but i made maemo englisch (UK) is there a way to change tastaturlayout only? | 12:50 |
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| reinard | hey, why i'm unable to use mmc in my n770... statusbar has usb-connection icon, but usb isn't even unplugged | 12:58 |
| reinard | i have rebooted this many times | 12:58 |
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| maddler | hi all | 13:07 |
| kennyyu_ | hi maddler | 13:07 |
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| michele | I really don't get why people insist on mplayer (for audio)... it jumps the first time you try to use the cpu for something else, it's not convenient at all | 13:47 |
| johnx | michele, this is 2008OS? | 13:49 |
| michele | yes | 13:49 |
| alterego | I like the inbuilt player just fine for audio | 13:49 |
| johnx | mplayer has unresolved issues with audio in 2008OS...but hopefully it will improve | 13:49 |
| michele | alterego: I do too. unfortunately it's ssslllooowww | 13:49 |
| alterego | How do you mean slow? | 13:50 |
| alterego | I just have it running on random all the time :) | 13:50 |
| reinard | does n800 or n810 play 800x480 video smoothly with good bitrates? | 13:50 |
| alterego | The delay between tracks has been reduced to an acceptable level. So I don't mind much. | 13:50 |
| reinard | or at all? | 13:51 |
| pupnik | no | 13:51 |
| johnx | reinard, because the bus to the LCD controller is slow 800x480@25+fps is impossible | 13:51 |
| johnx | besides the CPU requirements | 13:51 |
| glass | if he video contains mostly a static picture.. | 13:52 |
| glass | +t | 13:52 |
| reinard | :D static video, sounds good | 13:52 |
| pupnik | http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/engine?do=post_view_printable;post=19711;list=maemo | 13:52 |
| glass | there's going to be an audiocast about the TT buy | 13:52 |
| reinard | very practical | 13:52 |
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| johnx | middle management loves static videos...they call them slideshows... | 13:53 |
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| pupnik | dilbert. powerpoint | 13:53 |
| reinard | someone please invent pocketsized, reasonably priced, powerful device with a >800x480 lcd capable to play videos natively | 13:54 |
| johnx | reinard, see what the sony mylo2 has to offer | 13:54 |
| johnx | it has the right sized screen | 13:54 |
| johnx | I know *nothing* about it though | 13:54 |
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| pupnik | how much money do you want to spend? | 13:55 |
| reinard | 500eur | 13:55 |
| reinard | wow that mylo2 got to be the ugliest device i have seen in long time | 13:56 |
| aspiers | What's the recommended way of handling "big" apps (e.g. 10s of MB) on OS2008? I'm kind of surprised that the out-of-the-box partitioning results in rootfs filling up so quickly - didn't they expect people to install more than 256MB of apps? | 13:56 |
| pupnik | boot from sd partition | 13:57 |
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| aspiers | pupnik: Is there a doc more uptodate than http://maemo.org/community/wiki/howto_easily_boot_from_mmc_card/ ? | 13:58 |
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| VRe | Maybe the next tablet, when ever it comes, will have good capabilities for video playback.. but it seems that it is always a trade-off.. n800 2xsd -> n810 -> keyboard and 1xminisd (or whatever) | 13:58 |
| aspiers | pupnik: I don't want to risk bricking my N810. | 13:58 |
| b0unc3 | good morning | 13:58 |
| michele | alterego: the UI is slow, when I want to switch to another artist/album (I have an ipod shuffle, if that's all I need :) | 13:59 |
| VRe | aspiers: there is no way you can really brick your device with bootfd on card | 13:59 |
| pupnik | aspiers: another workaround is, if you just have a couple of big apps with much data in /usr/share, you can usually move their shared data to sd and symlink to it | 14:00 |
| johnx | actually, the "brickage" rate of the N8x0s seems really low | 14:01 |
| alterego | Meh | 14:02 |
| johnx | except for the guy on ITT who wrote random stuff to /dev/mtdblock[01] I don't think I've heard of one tablet bricked by a user with only software | 14:02 |
| aspiers | VRe: I guess part of the problem is that I have yet to discover a good page explaining the whole boot process: how the bootloader and initfs works, where the kernel lives etc. | 14:02 |
| zaheerm | has anyone got a micro sdhc card working in a microsd -> mini adapter? | 14:03 |
| zaheerm | in the n810? | 14:03 |
| alterego | aspiers, magic. It's all voodoo. | 14:03 |
| aspiers | pupnik: true - since they're .deb based I'd have to symlink /usr/share itself. | 14:03 |
| aspiers | alterego: thanks, very useful :) | 14:03 |
| johnx | zaheerm, yes, people do | 14:03 |
| kulve | Zenton_: yes | 14:03 |
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| kulve | hups | 14:03 |
| kulve | zaheerm: yes | 14:03 |
| zaheerm | mine doesn't but works with a 1GB microsd | 14:03 |
| zaheerm | and my 8GB microsdhc works with my n95 | 14:03 |
| aspiers | btw http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ appears to be broken | 14:04 |
| zaheerm | are there extra pins in a sdhc compared to an sd? | 14:04 |
| alterego | aspiers, the boot loader is closed, it boots the kernel from the a dedicated mtd location/partition. And passes in command line arguments that can be changed using the flasher utility. | 14:04 |
| johnx | zaheerm, no extra pins | 14:04 |
| zaheerm | so wonder why the adapter works with the 1GB and not the 8GB | 14:05 |
| zaheerm | kulve, anything special you had to do? | 14:05 |
| aspiers | alterego: so kernel lives in one of the /dev/mtdblock? then | 14:05 |
| kulve | aspiers: I recommed this: http://fanoush.wz.cz/maemo/#initfs | 14:05 |
| kulve | no need to know the "magic" | 14:05 |
| alterego | aspiers, yes. The second one I think. | 14:05 |
| aspiers | kulve: yes I was looking at it, thanks for the recommendation | 14:06 |
| kulve | zaheerm: no. First I inserted it only half way and the device got confused, but properly inserted everything worked ok | 14:06 |
| keesj | those are the same pins , but the access method is different | 14:06 |
| aspiers | I still don't understand why isn't rootfs on the N810 internal SD by default though... | 14:06 |
| zaheerm | kulve, which microsdhc do you have? | 14:06 |
| alterego | Actually, it's mtdblock2 | 14:06 |
| alterego | Not sure what mtdblock1 is .. | 14:07 |
| aspiers | mtdblock0 or 1 is the bootloader? | 14:07 |
| kulve | aspiers: "cat /proc/mtd" to see the partitions | 14:07 |
| alterego | aspiers, yes. | 14:07 |
| aspiers | kulve: ahah! nice | 14:07 |
| kulve | zaheerm: kinsgston | 14:07 |
| kulve | -s | 14:07 |
| aspiers | mtd1 == config | 14:07 |
| zaheerm | aaah it worked now! | 14:07 |
| * aspiers runs strings on mtdblock1 | 14:07 | |
| alterego | Ah yes. | 14:08 |
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| zaheerm | that must be the 8th time i've tried to insert it :) | 14:08 |
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| aspiers | maybe Nokia never expected the community to develop enough apps to fill the default rootfs? though there was already a huge user/app base by the time N810 came out | 14:11 |
| keesj | can we create new mtd partitions on the internal storage(to have two root partitions?) | 14:11 |
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| alterego | keesj, mtd is the internal system flash. It's 256M | 14:12 |
| johnx | keesj, do you mean the 2GB on the N810? | 14:12 |
| pupnik | aspiers: most apps designed specifically for the tablets can be very small | 14:12 |
| alterego | keesj, if you make a partition on the internal memory card, then the partition isn't mtd it's mmc | 14:13 |
| keesj | yes the 2g | 14:13 |
| keesj | or is that movinand? | 14:13 |
| Khertan | someone can explain me how can i register mimetype 'python' with the extension '.py' which enable osso file manager to open pygtkeditor when i double click on a .py file ? | 14:13 |
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| alterego | Double click? | 14:13 |
| johnx | keesj, my initial thought would be yes...but that's just a hunch | 14:14 |
| johnx | standard disclaimers apply and all that | 14:14 |
| keesj | I understand. | 14:14 |
| keesj | I had my share of paint the first day I had the 810 , and I am ready for some new ones :) | 14:15 |
| keesj | http://dev.openbossa.org/trac/mamona/wiki/RecoverBrokenDevice | 14:16 |
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| Khertan | alterego> double thumb touch if u prefer :) | 14:17 |
| alterego | Khertan, what uses a double click? | 14:18 |
| alterego | I've never double clicked in the file manager. | 14:18 |
| Khertan | alterego > double click or whateverelse to open a file | 14:19 |
| alterego | You mean single press? | 14:19 |
| Khertan | if u want ... | 14:20 |
| alterego | Well, that's how it works .. | 14:20 |
| Khertan | alterego> maybe, i mainly use ok dpad button ... same things :) | 14:20 |
| alterego | Yeah, you only press that once too :P | 14:21 |
| Khertan | what i mean is that when i try to open a file with the filemanager, actually they display me a message that it can found application to open python file (.py) and let s me choose in a list | 14:21 |
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| Khertan | what i want is add ".py" extension and python mime type to bypass this dialog to open file directly in pygkteditor | 14:22 |
| alterego | Sure, mime type association is pretty simple and is in the maemo documentation | 14:22 |
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| Khertan | oh ... i ve just found a interesting thing in documentation about ogg vorbis ... http://maemo.org/development/documentation/how-tos/4-x/getting_started_with_multimedia.html | 14:24 |
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| henrique | is there any python binding for maemo certificates API? | 14:29 |
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| Khertan | henrique > there is one is the svn nammed "python-certman" | 14:33 |
| henrique | Khertan, do you know if there is packages? | 14:34 |
| Khertan | https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/packages/python-certman/trunk/src/certman.h?view=log&root=pymaemo&pathrev=151 | 14:35 |
| luck^ | henrique, Khertan, this is an initial/incomplete binding | 14:35 |
| Khertan | Added Tue Apr 24 15:03:50 2007 UTC (9 months ago) by dandrader | 14:35 |
| Khertan | File length: 2386 byte(s) | 14:35 |
| Khertan | Added python-certman to the repository. It's still in its early development stages. | 14:35 |
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| Khertan | it s in dev processus | 14:35 |
| Khertan | not complete | 14:35 |
| Khertan | and none package seems available | 14:36 |
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| luck^ | please file a request at https://garage.maemo.org/tracker/?atid=229&group_id=40&func=browse | 14:36 |
| henrique | Khertan, luck^ ok thank you | 14:36 |
| henrique | I'll take a look | 14:36 |
| luck^ | ok! | 14:37 |
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| |tbb| | http://easytag.sourceforge.net/ <- is this hard to port it for maemo | 14:47 |
| Tak | shouldn't be too difficult | 14:47 |
| johnx | I have a feeling it already compiles for ARM | 14:48 |
| Tak | the most difficult part will be modifying the UI | 14:48 |
| johnx | you planning to hildonize it? | 14:48 |
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| Tak | me? no. | 14:52 |
| johnx | I meant |tbb| | 14:52 |
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| |tbb| | no i dont it was just a question, but it where nice someone do it ;) | 15:01 |
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| Tak | there have been several requests for a tagging application | 15:03 |
| Tak | but their UIs are necessarily complex, and nobody seems to want to put in the work | 15:04 |
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| |tbb| | seems to be much work. | 15:05 |
| alterego | DIY weekend, made a neoprene pouch for my N810, much nicer than the standard one :) And just made a USB Nokia charger on my lunch break. | 15:06 |
| alterego | Good times | 15:06 |
| Luria | what did you use for the usb charger? | 15:06 |
| |tbb| | alterego got pics? | 15:07 |
| Luria | cut, wire, heat shrink? | 15:07 |
| alterego | Luria, yeah. | 15:07 |
| alterego | Had a broken charger and a spare USB lead. | 15:07 |
| Luria | i was going to do that but its such a waste | 15:07 |
| alterego | Waste of what? | 15:07 |
| Luria | the chargers are so expensive | 15:07 |
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| alterego | The charger was broken :P | 15:08 |
| Luria | i dont have a broken charger | 15:08 |
| Luria | :-) | 15:08 |
| solmumaha | alterego: you have a detailed howto? :) | 15:08 |
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| solmumaha | i have a broken charger too | 15:08 |
| alterego | I'm going to wire a more standard connector to the actual charger. And use it as a switch mode power supply for my USB hub that I use with my tablets. | 15:08 |
| alterego | So no waste at all :) | 15:08 |
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| alterego | solmumaha, not really rocket science :) Just wire up USB black to connector black and USB red to the other connector wire. | 15:09 |
| alterego | connector black is the outside, red is the inside. | 15:09 |
| Luria | i would love a auto sensing usb port... usb host gives power, usb target draws | 15:10 |
| alterego | Though it's wize to do a check on the USB connector, by plugging it into a computer and reading the output with a multimeter. | 15:10 |
| Luria | i was about to say that | 15:10 |
| Luria | you dont want to have two stripped wires touching each other | 15:10 |
| alterego | Oh look, there's a video on youtube :) | 15:11 |
| Luria | link? | 15:11 |
| alterego | http://youtube.com/watch?v=SfjeD9TIvLc | 15:11 |
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| Tak | there's a video? on youtube? | 15:12 |
| alterego | Yes, a video on youtube! | 15:12 |
| * Tak head explodes | 15:12 | |
| alterego | Hahah: This is in American English: http://youtube.com/watch?v=SjEuwrPx-gQ&feature=related | 15:13 |
| Luria | yeah tak, but did you film it? and put the video on youtube? on youtube!? | 15:13 |
| alterego | Exactly how I did it, except the voice was English :) | 15:13 |
| alterego | Sowder? | 15:14 |
| alterego | Doesn't he mean solder? | 15:14 |
| Luria | l is not pronounced in NA | 15:14 |
| Luria | in line with the ME roots, actually | 15:14 |
| alterego | Oh, | 15:15 |
| alterego | Weird. | 15:15 |
| alterego | He sounds kind of like kermit the frog. | 15:15 |
| Luria | solder, with the l is common everywhere else | 15:15 |
| Tak | yeah, we pronounce "solder" "sodder" | 15:15 |
| alterego | Was Kermit from NA? :) | 15:15 |
| Luria | grrr why wont this firefox process die die die | 15:16 |
| n0ob_ | nice work @ video ;-) | 15:16 |
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| alterego | Luria, it doesn't want to die!!! | 15:16 |
| Luria | no shit. kill -9 did nothing, repeatedly | 15:17 |
| alterego | Is it zombied? | 15:17 |
| Luria | one sec | 15:18 |
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| Luria | btw, the latin source for solder has the l pronounced. i have a nagging suspicion that the NA version maintains an older english pronunciation an the GB version is a hypercorrection of sorts | 15:20 |
| Luria | these things happen. | 15:21 |
| Luria | *shrug* | 15:21 |
| alterego | Yeah | 15:22 |
| alterego | I heard that American English is more how we (English Puplic) would have spoke it back in the day. | 15:23 |
| Luria | mostly from french influence in the prestige (read royal) dialect | 15:23 |
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| Luria | in some respects. | 15:23 |
| alterego | I think we've had this conversation before :P | 15:23 |
| Luria | possibly. | 15:24 |
| Luria | i wouldnt go that far tho, saying its more like back in the day. | 15:24 |
| * Luria loves the oed. | 15:24 | |
| k-s[WORK] | would you like a Kanola? | 15:29 |
| michele | ok, anybody knows how to dump the rom from a newton? | 15:29 |
| * michele googles | 15:29 | |
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| Luria | well, the world looks better in lynx | 15:30 |
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| michele | argh... looks like I need 1. a db8-serial cable and 2. a usb-to-serial | 15:32 |
| alterego | Heh | 15:32 |
| alterego | Don't you mean DB9? | 15:32 |
| Luria | was wondering that myself | 15:32 |
| aspiers | does dpkg have an equivalent of rpm -qa --last ? | 15:32 |
| alterego | What does rpm -qa --last do? | 15:33 |
| johnx | aspiers, what does that rpm command do? | 15:33 |
| Luria | man, i havent used rpm since the 90s | 15:33 |
| aspiers | it shows you all installed rpms in chronological order | 15:34 |
| michele | yes, DB9 | 15:34 |
| aspiers | so you can see what you layered on top of the base install, for example | 15:34 |
| aspiers | looks like /var/log/dpkg* is the best I found so far | 15:34 |
| alterego | Why chronological? | 15:34 |
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| michele | ops | 15:35 |
| aspiers | I'm considering reflashing, so I want to capture which extra .debs I have installed first | 15:35 |
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| Luria | ah | 15:35 |
| *** michele changes topic to "development platform for Nokia Internet Tablets | http://freedesktop.org/Software/sbox2/Maemo | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | http://www.gronmayer.com/it | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook" | 15:36 | |
| aspiers | It doesn't have to be chronological - is there a better way? | 15:36 |
| Luria | i would dpkg --get-selections now | 15:36 |
| Luria | then later,then diff the file output | 15:36 |
| alterego | dpkg --list ? | 15:36 |
| aspiers | Luria: it's a bit late for that - I've already installed loads | 15:36 |
| alterego | aspiers, does it matter? You can diff after you reflash | 15:37 |
| Luria | right, but if you diff it to a post install list, you should have a manageable number | 15:37 |
| aspiers | alterego: doh! good point :) | 15:37 |
| alterego | ;) | 15:37 |
| Luria | ummmm.... didnt i just say that? | 15:37 |
| alterego | I think we both did :P | 15:38 |
| aspiers | Luria: yeah, but I thought you thought I currently had a vanilla install | 15:38 |
| aspiers | Luria: thought you were suggesting a diff forwards not in reverse | 15:38 |
| Luria | well, then diff wouldnt be helpful :-) | 15:38 |
| Luria | np :-) | 15:38 |
| aspiers | :-) | 15:39 |
| aspiers | Still need to check my understanding of a few points first ... | 15:39 |
| Luria | i would use get selections over list tho | 15:39 |
| Luria | so you can use it with apt get | 15:39 |
| aspiers | Luria: good point | 15:40 |
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| aspiers | http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux will flash all of mtdblock[0-4] right? | 15:40 |
| alterego | Yeah, use Luria's method. It's a lot cleaner output. | 15:40 |
| aspiers | So only SD and some locking codes are preserved? | 15:40 |
| Luria | tho >'ing both could be handy in figuring out if you want the pacakge installed | 15:41 |
| Luria | after reflash | 15:41 |
| alterego | aspiers, are you backing up repository locations too? | 15:42 |
| aspiers | hmm, I'm currently on RX-34+RX-44_2008SE_1.2007.42-18_PR_MR0 | 15:42 |
| aspiers | alterego: yes, was planning to - just sources.list right? | 15:42 |
| Luria | doh, yeah, keep sources.list | 15:42 |
| alterego | aspiers, no. You need to backup the directory. | 15:42 |
| aspiers | the whole of /etc/apt to be safe | 15:42 |
| aspiers | keys etc. | 15:42 |
| alterego | Yes, sources.list is normally empty .. | 15:42 |
| aspiers | ah, it's in sources.list.d | 15:42 |
| aspiers | ok | 15:43 |
| alterego | Yes | 15:43 |
| Luria | i meant .d, yes | 15:43 |
| alterego | I think that's actually generated from an XML file though .. | 15:43 |
| aspiers | is 2007.42-18 still the latest? | 15:43 |
| alterego | No, I'm on 50-2 | 15:44 |
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| Luria | rx-34+rx-44 is clearly not a production release :-) | 15:44 |
| michele | any kmplayer developers here? | 15:44 |
| alterego | It is. | 15:45 |
| alterego | It's the N810 image. | 15:45 |
| aspiers | Luria: alterego is right, it came with the image (UK model) | 15:45 |
| Luria | sorry, what i meant to say is | 15:45 |
| Luria | rx-34+rx-44 is clearly not a production release for the n800 :-) | 15:45 |
| alterego | :) | 15:45 |
| alterego | Heh | 15:45 |
| alterego | Luria, it is. | 15:45 |
| aspiers | Am wondering whether to use fanoush's stuff or not | 15:45 |
| Luria | but i havent switched, cause i like my sd slots | 15:45 |
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| Luria | really? | 15:46 |
| alterego | The value in /etc/osso_software_version is not identical to the image name that you download. | 15:46 |
| alterego | So it's confusing. | 15:46 |
| aspiers | Mine's an N810 | 15:46 |
| Luria | i had no idea. | 15:46 |
| alterego | aspiers, yeah. Not sure about the N800, I'd have to power it up and check. | 15:46 |
| Luria | sigh, 3:30 left on this smb transfer. | 15:47 |
| alterego | hours or minutes? :D | 15:47 |
| Luria | you'd think moving 40gb 15 feet would be quicker | 15:47 |
| Luria | hours:minutes | 15:47 |
| alterego | Eesh | 15:47 |
| alterego | Samba is slow. | 15:47 |
| Luria | its better than ssh | 15:47 |
| alterego | Yes, it is. | 15:47 |
| aspiers | ok, now I'm confused. /mnt/initfs/linuxrc has code for a boot menu - so why is fanoush's modified initfs needed? | 15:47 |
| alterego | You should just use netcat :P | 15:47 |
| robtaylor | Luria: netcat | 15:48 |
| Luria | from windows to linux? | 15:48 |
| * aspiers read about socat yesterday - "netcat++" | 15:48 | |
| michele | Luria: the fastest way is put them in a usb hd, move 15 feet | 15:48 |
| alterego | Hahah | 15:48 |
| alterego | Luria, wireless or wired? | 15:48 |
| Luria | station wagon bandwidth | 15:48 |
| Luria | wired | 15:48 |
| alterego | Crazy. | 15:49 |
| Luria | i suspect the problem is the tons of tiny files | 15:49 |
| Luria | its my ebooks | 15:49 |
| alterego | Yeah, I'd tar gzip it and transfer that .. | 15:49 |
| Luria | i need some good management software for all these books | 15:50 |
| alterego | 'rm -rf' ? | 15:50 |
| Luria | textbooktorrents is evil | 15:50 |
| Luria | should i type that in a shell now? | 15:50 |
| robtaylor | Luria: "tar cz MyFiles | netcat $IP 1234" and "netcat -l -p 1234 -q0 | tar xz" on the other side | 15:51 |
| Luria | that would work if both sides were linux | 15:51 |
| Veggen | robtaylor: scp -r is slow, tar cz piped to ssh isn't that slow,. | 15:51 |
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| robtaylor | Luria: install cygwin?maybe the moving usb harddrive is the best option ;) | 15:52 |
| Veggen | I hardly use scp -r anymore, unless I know that it's few and large files. | 15:52 |
| Luria | my god, the whole channel woke up | 15:52 |
| aspiers | I wonder where the overhead is with scp -r | 15:52 |
| robtaylor | Veggen: good point | 15:52 |
| inz | Has there been any discussion on Nokia's acquisition of Trolltech? | 15:52 |
| Luria | actually started with winscp | 15:53 |
| Luria | that was abysmal | 15:53 |
| Veggen | Luria: cygwin isn't a bad idea. | 15:53 |
| Luria | nokia bought trolltech? | 15:53 |
| inz | Luria, "yes" | 15:53 |
| jacques | I just read that too | 15:53 |
| Luria | wow | 15:53 |
| jacques | what does that mean for maemo? | 15:53 |
| robtaylor | aspiers: interesting point. I first though tcp window size, but that shouldn't be a problem unless scp -r is really stupid | 15:53 |
| Luria | another gui change coming.... | 15:54 |
| Tak | nobody knows | 15:54 |
| jacques | :-\ | 15:54 |
| inz | http://trolltech.no/company/newsroom/announcements/press.2008-01-28.4605718236 | 15:54 |
| robtaylor | jacques: for now, i'd guess absolutely nothing | 15:54 |
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| johnx | it seems like no one has any idea what they intend to do with trolltech/qt | 15:54 |
| Veggen | robtaylor: it's a fact that scp -r is slow. | 15:54 |
| Luria | well, i did buy a n800 over a zaurus 3200 | 15:54 |
| Tak | most of the speculation seems to be that nokia wanted qtopia for phones, and hadn't even though about the possible maemo angle | 15:54 |
| johnx | some speculate it's to keep other phone companies from using Qt on phones | 15:54 |
| robtaylor | Veggen: i accept the fact,just wonder why ;) | 15:54 |
| Luria | now i can have both :-) | 15:54 |
| Luria | i suspect nothing will happen to maemo | 15:55 |
| Luria | until kubuntu mobile:-) | 15:55 |
| Veggen | robtaylor: I think it has to do with how it manages to utilize the tcp pipe. That it does it one file at a time. | 15:55 |
| robtaylor | jacques: guessing a bit, I'd guess nokia has spent more on maemo than it will in buying trolltech | 15:55 |
| jacques | robtaylor, wow | 15:55 |
| Jaffa | robtaylor: incl. h/w development costs, perhaps. On software, I'd be surprised (but I dunno how much they're buying Trolltech for) | 15:56 |
| alterego | I wonder what that means for the future of the tablets. | 15:56 |
| alterego | I guess it depends on how gtk+/gnome and Qt evolve. | 15:57 |
| robtaylor | Jaffa: its only 100 million euro | 15:57 |
| Veggen | alterego: remains to be seen. Whether or not they intend Qt phone to be their long-time phone strategy, and that it's totally unrelated to maemo, or.... | 15:57 |
| Veggen | alterego: How commited is Nokia to Symbian, really? Is that something they'd rather want to get rid of? | 15:58 |
| johnx | I still bet it's to keep it out of other people's hands and that they really have no idea how to integrate it right now with anything | 15:58 |
| alterego | Veggen, cost wise, sure/. | 15:58 |
| _berto_ | nokia owns almost 50% of Symbian afaik | 15:58 |
| alterego | It still costs them money to use Symbian I believe. | 15:58 |
| robtaylor | Jaffa: though yeah, mameo probably hasn't cost quite that much so far | 15:59 |
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| aspiers | Veggen: I heard rumours that Symbian was nicknamed POS (Piece Of Shit OS - not quite a recursive acronym like GNU ;-) by its developers but not sure if that is true or not | 15:59 |
| michele | Veggen: I doubt they are going to ditch symbian anytime soon, they have lots of business over there, lots of 3rd parties developing on it | 15:59 |
| inz | _berto_, 47,9 % | 15:59 |
| alterego | aspiers, it has evolved into something quite messy. | 15:59 |
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| michele | symbian is horrible | 16:00 |
| michele | from every possible point of view | 16:00 |
| aspiers | michele: :) | 16:00 |
| Veggen | Linux on the cell phone makes sense. really. | 16:00 |
| _berto_ | and in their press release some hours ago they said that maemo wasn't going to be affected by this purchase | 16:00 |
| alterego | I don't like developing much for Symbian, mainly because I'm not a massive fan of C++ | 16:00 |
| michele | who is? | 16:00 |
| keesj | I like the idea that something can run on different devices, that is not the idea I currently get from maemo/hildon | 16:00 |
| alterego | _berto_, got a link? | 16:00 |
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| michele | yes, the press release says that | 16:00 |
| alterego | keesj, Hildon, yes. Maemo, no :) | 16:01 |
| _berto_ | http://www.nokia.com/press | 16:01 |
| alterego | Well, HildonDesktop no :) | 16:01 |
| johnx | the smart phone OS market seems competitive right now only because all the choices are bad | 16:01 |
| _berto_ | http://www.nokia.com/A4813580 | 16:01 |
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| michele | I think Nokia is mainly interested in TT's x-platform expertise | 16:01 |
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| keesj | alterego: I am talking about feeling here not reality :p | 16:01 |
| _berto_ | there's a link to the webcast there | 16:01 |
| alterego | Hah | 16:01 |
| michele | johnx: yeah | 16:01 |
| glass | or they're concerned with who tt does business with | 16:02 |
| michele | johnx: if by "bad" you mean "painful" | 16:02 |
| glass | which so far was about everybody BUT nokia? | 16:02 |
| robtaylor | johnx++ | 16:02 |
| michele | glass: that would be the cynical view, but isn't that a wild shot even | 16:02 |
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| alterego | Chief Troll? :D | 16:03 |
| jacques | yeah and their ticker symbol os TROLL | 16:03 |
| kimrhh | hi... anyone else here which has to deal with proxy to install maemo-sdk? | 16:03 |
| michele | I love how HTC managed to sell the Touch as an iPhone killer just by putting a dark home view and am ugly fake rotating cube to switch tasks over WM | 16:03 |
| * Tak wait for r.m.o to refresh | 16:04 | |
| kimrhh | apt-upgrade fails for me, with 403 forbidden (using the maemo SDK installer script) | 16:04 |
| Luria | hmmm... is there anything stronger than kill -9 that wont end my session? | 16:05 |
| alterego | Luria, kill -15 ? | 16:05 |
| Luria | tried that through htop | 16:06 |
| michele | no, 15 is weaker than 9 | 16:06 |
| alterego | -6 ? | 16:06 |
| alterego | -3? | 16:06 |
| Luria | damn, firefox just wont go | 16:06 |
| jacques | $153 million doesn't sound like much (for trolltech) | 16:06 |
| michele | is it zombie? | 16:06 |
| Luria | i dont think so | 16:06 |
| johnx | kimrhh, have you tried setting $http_proxy and/or $HTTP_PROXY? | 16:06 |
| lcdd | Luria: can't stop processes in D state | 16:07 |
| robtaylor | Luria: whats does ps say for STAT ? | 16:07 |
| keesj | for i in `seq -15 0` ; do kill $i 1234; done | 16:07 |
| alterego | Heh | 16:07 |
| Luria | no Zs if that's what you mean | 16:08 |
| kimrhh | johnx: tried setting it with the -A option | 16:08 |
| kimrhh | and also as env. var. | 16:08 |
| kimrhh | only lowercase though | 16:08 |
| aspiers | anyone know who to report brokenness of http://maemo.org/community/wiki/ to? | 16:08 |
| kimrhh | the script tells me it passes the proxy value to apt | 16:09 |
| johnx | kimrhh, it's just a guess | 16:09 |
| kimrhh | johnx: :) | 16:09 |
| kimrhh | johnx: I think i should just try a manual install | 16:09 |
| kimrhh | I hate this damn proxy... | 16:09 |
| johnx | yeah...I could see that | 16:09 |
| kimrhh | aspiers: he, yeah I was also puzzled that I should login to CMS | 16:10 |
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| robtaylor | Luria: zombie, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zombie_process. kill -9 the parent process | 16:10 |
| jacques | unless it's init ;-) | 16:11 |
| * Tak bets the parent process is something important like init | 16:11 | |
| aspiers | orphans are adopted by init when the parent dies | 16:11 |
| aspiers | D state is different to Z (zombie) state | 16:11 |
| robtaylor | actually, kill -CHLD the parent process | 16:12 |
| aspiers | D is uninterruptible sleep, i.e. it's blocking on something in the kernel | 16:12 |
| aspiers | if you had a decent (non-busybox) ps you could see what the WCHAN state is | 16:12 |
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| robtaylor | aspiers: yep, things talking to the dsp can often be seen in 'D' ;) | 16:12 |
| aspiers | or echo t > /proc/sysrq-trigger but I don't know if that works on maemo | 16:12 |
| ||cw | hm, so nokia is buying trolltech, wonder what this means for maemo... | 16:13 |
| aspiers | with GNU ps, ps -O wchan:25 -p $pid works nicely | 16:13 |
| keesj | aspiers: broken witk already was commited in bugzilla (bugs.maemo.org) | 16:13 |
| inz | ||cw, I would guess everything, something, nothing or something in between | 16:13 |
| alterego | ||cw, seems they just plan on using it for S40 and S60 based devices. | 16:14 |
| ||cw | Jaffa: $153 million was mentioned... | 16:14 |
| alterego | Still bloody C++ though :D | 16:14 |
| * aspiers finally spots the rd_mode check in /mnt/initfs/linuxrc | 16:15 | |
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| aspiers | so actually there's no need to modify initfs to be able to boot off MMC, right? | 16:15 |
| aspiers | the code is already there in linuxrc | 16:15 |
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| kimrhh | johnx: oh well, it worked when I manually exported the http_proxy env. var inside scratchbox | 16:16 |
| johnx | :D | 16:16 |
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| * Luria got tired of waiting | 16:16 | |
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| alterego | Hahah | 16:16 |
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| alterego | No mention of series 90 ... | 16:21 |
| alterego | Are they dropping the communicator line? | 16:22 |
| Okko | series 90? | 16:23 |
| Dasajev | the latest communicator is series 60 | 16:23 |
| alterego | Really? Oh, okay :) | 16:23 |
| Okko | Series 90 was used only in one phone that had touch-screen | 16:23 |
| fatal- | 7710 | 16:23 |
| Okko | Series 80 was in communicators but has now been replaced with S60 | 16:23 |
| glass | 7700 too though that was never sold | 16:23 |
| alterego | Ah | 16:24 |
| glass | new communicators are s60 | 16:24 |
| glass | the long term thing is to put everything in s60 | 16:24 |
| alterego | Meh, I don't even like the communicator line :) | 16:24 |
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| glass | it's just more choice | 16:25 |
| alterego | Who needs choice, just give us the best :D | 16:25 |
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| glass | people prefer different form factors :) | 16:29 |
| inz | maemo is kind of successor of S90 | 16:29 |
| inz | At least the name "hildon" was inherited from there ;) | 16:30 |
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| michele | inz: was it? | 16:32 |
| michele | glass: people should just shut up and accept what I decide to be the best | 16:32 |
| michele | well, me and alterego | 16:33 |
| alterego | :) | 16:33 |
| inz | michele, try googling for s90 hildon | 16:34 |
| * johnx sleeps | 16:34 | |
| kala | when I can successfully do rfcomm bind /dev/rfcomm0 00:01:53:02:DF:A5 | 16:35 |
| kala | and cat /dev/rfcomm0, but the maemo-mapper doesn't find GPS, whats wrong with maemo-mapper? | 16:36 |
| alterego | Use GPSd | 16:36 |
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| kala | alterego: gpsd should be configured and running before I try maemo-mapper? | 16:37 |
| alterego | Yes, | 16:37 |
| kala | ok, will try that | 16:37 |
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| kala | gpsd -D 9 -N /dev/rfcomm0 gives " ... gpsd: speed 9600, 8N1\nIllegal instruction | 16:40 |
| timelyx | inz: how dare you torture anyone like that? :) | 16:40 |
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| alterego | kala, why are you using the command line? Use another program, like gps-saver or the Nokia Map program to start the GPS connection and initialize gpsd. | 16:41 |
| alterego | Then start maemo-mapper and it should start working., | 16:41 |
| kala | well, I don't know the correct way. and I don't have any Nokia map software and apt-cache search gps-saver doesn't find anything | 16:43 |
| alterego | Why are you using the command line? | 16:43 |
| alterego | Why don't you install software and look for it how you're supposed to. | 16:43 |
| alterego | Go to downloads.maemo.org .. | 16:44 |
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| alterego | gps_saver anyhow .. | 16:44 |
| alterego | Oh, the packages are gps-saver and gps-saver-ui | 16:45 |
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| Kekcuk | http://lostworlds.lv/go.php?1139657817 Please Come And Vote For Me!!! (When you enter page, you auto... vote for me) (Thanks to all who voted!!) | 16:45 |
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| Tak | wow, r.m.o finally propagated | 16:47 |
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| michele | why the hell didn't they use gtk stock icons instead of new random names... | 16:49 |
| Sho_ | the maemo platform propably predates the icon naming spec | 16:50 |
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| lardman | afternoon all | 16:50 |
| kala | alterego: the gps_saver application seems to be ITOS2008 specific? | 16:50 |
| alterego | Oh, you're on a 770? | 16:50 |
| * lardman curses GPS, can't seem to get a fix | 16:50 | |
| kala | alterego: yep. N770, running ITOS2007HE | 16:51 |
| kala | bluetooth Hlux M-100 GPS | 16:51 |
| kala | HOLUX | 16:51 |
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| kala | on the internettablettalk, there seems to be positive reports about that model | 16:52 |
| Juhaz | those apps have been compiled for the N800 CPU, which is not 100% compatible with the 770 | 16:52 |
| kulve | lardman: the n810 needs good conditions to get a fix in decent time. | 16:52 |
| inz | timelyx, like what, I'm not torturing anyone | 16:52 |
| Tak | does gpsd really require hardware vfp? | 16:53 |
| lardman | kulve: I must have just been lucky the first and only time I tried - facing out of my balcony window | 16:53 |
| _berto_ | "I want also to make clear that the key driver for nokia doing this acquisition is not to develop a linux-based mobile device. this acquisition is really enhancing and making even more competitive S40, S60 and Maemo platforms [...] Maemo will continue to be based on Gnome [...] and S40 and S60 will evolve with Qt" | 16:53 |
| alterego | Hmm, I need a USB ethernet dongle. | 16:53 |
| lardman | kulve: Now I'm doing likewise at work, but with probably a better view of the sky | 16:53 |
| kulve | Tak: depends how it's compiled? | 16:53 |
| kulve | _berto_: from where? | 16:54 |
| lardman | Tak: But otherwise no | 16:54 |
| Tak | s/require/require to be compiled with/ | 16:54 |
| Tak | eh, did somebody turn off infobot? | 16:54 |
| lardman | I'm a bit suprised they are compiled using vfp to tell the truth, that's a definite decision when compiling | 16:55 |
| _berto_ | from the mp3 here -> http://www.nokia.com/A4813580 | 16:55 |
| _berto_ | minute 9 | 16:55 |
| kala | lardman: are you suggesting that the gpsd package might not be compiled for N770 hardware? | 16:55 |
| Tak | indeed | 16:55 |
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| lardman | kala: I'm suggesting that if it's compiled using vfp then someone's consciously made that decision | 16:56 |
| lardman | Juhaz: what do you mean by "compiled for the N800 CPU"? | 16:57 |
| kala | strace gives write(2, "gpsd: speed 9600, 8N1\n", 22)=22, gettimeofday({1201532146, 184662}, NULL) = 0, --- SIGILL (Illegal instruction) @ 0 (0) --- | 16:58 |
| kulve | kala: but it doesn't mean that it couldn't be compiled for 770 without the vfp | 16:58 |
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| lardman | hmm, sounds like vfp in that case | 16:59 |
| kala | ok, so I'll just have to install the cross-compile toolset and compile it myself? | 16:59 |
| lardman | yep | 16:59 |
| kala | sounds like complicated :) | 16:59 |
| lardman | nah | 16:59 |
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| lardman | the compilation should be easy as the debian source should be in the repo; just follow the tutorial to setup the toolchain, then you're away | 17:00 |
| kala | ok, I'll try that. | 17:00 |
| lardman | Does the N810/N800 produce enough power over the usb connection to run a keyboard? | 17:01 |
| lardman | or a barcode scanner...:) | 17:01 |
| _collin_ | nop | 17:02 |
| _collin_ | usb does not have power | 17:02 |
| Tak | nobody's written a camera-based scanner yet, eh? | 17:02 |
| _collin_ | Tak: I've tried | 17:02 |
| kulve | _collin_: yes it does | 17:02 |
| lardman | Tak: I've written one in MATLAB, but with the front facing camera on the N810 it's not ideal | 17:03 |
| _collin_ | kulve: really??? | 17:03 |
| kulve | _collin_: so it seems. At least I've used stuff with n810 without any powered usb hubs/etc | 17:03 |
| Tak | hmm...I guess the camera-based dvd reader is out, then... | 17:03 |
| lardman | Tak: I suppose I could just wave it about and make it beep when if sees something it recognises, but thought I'd get a barcode scanner to do the bulk of the book scanning first | 17:03 |
| _collin_ | why do I find many references about people building power injectors? | 17:03 |
| kulve | I think the same goes for n800 too | 17:03 |
| Jaffa | lardman: keyboard yes, it should. | 17:03 |
| _collin_ | kulve: ok | 17:03 |
| lardman | _collin_: 770 | 17:03 |
| kulve | _collin_: because it didn't work in 2007 | 17:03 |
| lardman | Jaffa: cool | 17:04 |
| * Jaffa dunnos about scanners. | 17:04 | |
| Tak | waving it about and making it beep when something happens is generally my first step in any software project | 17:04 |
| lardman | :) | 17:04 |
| _collin_ | there are some pretty cool OCR/barcode scanner libraries for linux | 17:04 |
| _collin_ | which just work on images | 17:05 |
| lardman | hmm, I could only find one that was open source, and that didn't do the type of bar codes I need | 17:05 |
| _collin_ | lardman: I think I have some bookmarks @home | 17:05 |
| lardman | _collin_: I'd be interested to see | 17:06 |
| lardman | _collin_: I'm not sure my MATLAB code is all that robust, and I need to port it to Python (not a big issue) | 17:06 |
| _collin_ | lardman: I haven't wrote any code yet | 17:06 |
| _collin_ | I just wondered what to do with the camera | 17:06 |
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| lardman | I'd be interested to see the bookmarks that is, the code I've already written | 17:06 |
| _collin_ | so I googled for OCR stuff | 17:06 |
| _collin_ | kulve: do you know how many miliWatts the USB connector supplys? | 17:07 |
| kulve | nope :/ | 17:08 |
| kulve | not much I could guess.. | 17:08 |
| lardman | iirc 500mA | 17:08 |
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| lardman | does that sound about right? | 17:08 |
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| kulve | that's the maximun a device can get according to the spec | 17:08 |
| _collin_ | lardman: that is what your PC gives you not your N8x0 | 17:08 |
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| Tak | I thought that the ITs only supplied a fraction of the spec max, like 100mA | 17:09 |
| lardman | I thought to be an otg device it had to do that | 17:09 |
| lardman | ah, I may well be wrong | 17:09 |
| lardman | _collin_: This is the only lib I could find for barcode decoding, the rest are endoders (or not free): http://www.libdmtx.org/ | 17:09 |
| _collin_ | lardman: mmh will look for bookmarks later @home | 17:09 |
| lardman | cheers | 17:10 |
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| cosmo | is there a way to see track you've made with maemo mapper in google maps or other map web application? | 17:12 |
| lardman | _collin_AFK_: wrt the mA, I think it was in the kernel code - there was a message that would be printed out if the device requested too much current | 17:12 |
| Tak | xmaeme 0.13 released: adds support for gnuboy and handy, fixes the issue with hildon + gngeo bios selection, complete rewrite in vala | 17:12 |
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| cosmo | Tak: how do you feel about vala? is it any good? | 17:15 |
| Tak | I really like it - the only real drawback is its immaturity | 17:15 |
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| dragorn | Yeah the IT has a low-power USB. It's also low-voltage, which I didn't believe until I slapped a multimeter on it. | 17:17 |
| Tak | the xmaeme code is quite a bit cleaner now, and will become more so in the future | 17:17 |
| dragorn | All the barcode stuff I've seen just injects keyboard events. It was kind of oldschool though. | 17:18 |
| lardman | that's the way the scanners work, fine by me as long as it works | 17:20 |
| ||cw | cosmo: yes, I think the track is saved as a gpx file | 17:20 |
| lardman | though I suppose just continually running the image processing until it finds something it likes it similar | 17:20 |
| ||cw | cosmo: I've done it before, but I don't recall what i had to do, maybe even just open it | 17:20 |
| fysa | testing alsa-oss .. | 17:20 |
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| dragorn | Are you trying to scan using the camera or something? | 17:21 |
| lardman | dragorn: yes | 17:21 |
| dragorn | Ah. Fun. | 17:21 |
| fysa | Tak: pupnik had SNES emulator running at a decent speed last night | 17:22 |
| dragorn | Might work on those 2d barcodes - Q codes are they? Nokia seems to like those on other platforms. | 17:22 |
| lardman | dragorn: I've written some code that works in MATLAB. It works on clean images at least, I need to see if the grainy and dark images from the N8x0 work with it | 17:22 |
| Tak | fysa: no shit? | 17:22 |
| fysa | it needs OSS or converstion to ALSA, so I'm trying to make an alsa-oss .deb now | 17:22 |
| lardman | dragorn: http://www.libdmtx.org/ | 17:22 |
| fysa | conversion, rather | 17:22 |
| Tak | hmm | 17:22 |
| dragorn | lardman: yeah the camera is such poo you'll have a hard time, plus you're blocking the light w/ the unit | 17:22 |
| cosmo | ||cw: ok, gpx file gives a lot of google hits.. thanks | 17:22 |
| dragorn | lardman: maybe do some hack that paints the screen white and max brightness while scanning? | 17:23 |
| fysa | but he said fps was reasonable (much better than before anyway) | 17:23 |
| Tak | would be easier to write an esd backend than an alsa one | 17:23 |
| lardman | dragorn: yeah | 17:23 |
| fysa | there is an esd patch for it already | 17:23 |
| dragorn | lardman: ghetto flashlight mode | 17:23 |
| lardman | dragorn: good idea | 17:23 |
| fysa | it may be slightly outdated | 17:23 |
| Tak | if there's an esd patch, you're ready to rock | 17:23 |
| fysa | esd is preinstalled? | 17:23 |
| fysa | oh, one sec- | 17:23 |
| Tak | it's either preinstalled or in one of the default repos | 17:23 |
| dragorn | lardman: theres a LOT of research into CCD noise reduction, but I don't know offhand how much is OSS. Check the photography apps. | 17:24 |
| lardman | dragorn: I could probably do with using a proper scanner to scan all my books at home, the camera stuff can be a bit more hit and miss as it won't be used too often | 17:24 |
| Tak | os2006 *only* had esd and gstreamer | 17:24 |
| lardman | dragorn: yeah, I do image processing work as part of the day job (using MATLAB) so it might be useful | 17:24 |
| dragorn | lardman: I picked up the phidgets rfid kit, at some point I'll try to get that working, though I have some real fears about it | 17:24 |
| lardman | will need to be ported to C or Python though | 17:24 |
| dragorn | lardman: since the rfid reader is a HID device which gets twiddled from libusb, and my experience with that has been that the OTG drivers have serious issues with iread and dma | 17:25 |
| dragorn | lardman: mentioned as an alternate method for tagging books, anyhow. | 17:25 |
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| Tak | pupnik: you really need to start doing proper deb releases :-P | 17:26 |
| lardman | dragorn: My problem is that I have lots and when I'm out and about can't remember if I've read one, so was going to use the isbn (in the barcode) to check, etc. | 17:26 |
| fysa | http://www.flyn.org/patches/snes9x-1.26-esd/snes9x-1.26-esd.patch.gz | 17:26 |
| lardman | dragorn: when they start tagging books with rfid, and there are nice portable scanners, that would make life easier :) | 17:27 |
| dragorn | lardman: re: image processing - cool. I only come at it from a photo point of view, so you're ahead there. Heh, matlab-to-c - that's going to suck badly. | 17:27 |
| fysa | Tak: he said it was mostly unmodified. | 17:27 |
| Tak | there has to be some modification; it was dog-slow before | 17:27 |
| fysa | Tak: new release maybe? | 17:27 |
| Tak | like VBA-slow | 17:28 |
| fysa | mentioned something about GP32X | 17:28 |
| lardman | dragorn: yeah, it's a pita. I think python should be easier and hopefully fast enough + I'll write the GUI in python | 17:28 |
| Tak | hmph | 17:28 |
| Tak | lardman: ruby? ;-) | 17:28 |
| fysa | or maybe not. | 17:28 |
| Tak | or vala | 17:28 |
| fysa | <pupnik> i think it is almost unchanged snes9x-1.5 | 17:29 |
| dragorn | lardman: Without a JIT I think both would be horrible (ruby and python) | 17:29 |
| michele | Tak: you really should write something about vala and maemo | 17:29 |
| lardman | I was just about getting to grips with Python, not sure I want to learn yet another lang | 17:29 |
| Tak | "something" ? | 17:29 |
| michele | some tutorial, docs | 17:29 |
| lardman | dragorn: It's only 1D processing, so hopefully I'll avoid full image manipulations | 17:29 |
| fysa | I have Yabouse (Saturn emulator) compiling cleanly, but haven't tested anything. not really expecting much. | 17:30 |
| lardman | dragorn: so hopefully (lots of those in these sentances ;) ) it will be fast enough | 17:30 |
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| michele | dragorn: does psyco work on armel? :) | 17:30 |
| lardman | fysa: Do the Ti calcs use Saturn, or have I got my wires crossed? | 17:30 |
| dragorn | michele: I thought it didn't | 17:31 |
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| michele | dragorn: I don't think either | 17:31 |
| dragorn | michele/lardman: w/out psycho/JIT even your pure math will be interpreted. Might want to bench before sinking a ton of time - and maybe the python JIT is ported by now | 17:31 |
| michele | dragorn: but numeric is ported I think | 17:32 |
| Tak | michele: http://live.gnome.org/Vala/HildonSample | 17:32 |
| dragorn | (well, obviously, the add/mul instructions will happen native at some level, but all the processing will be interpreted) | 17:32 |
| michele | Tak: yes, I know that | 17:32 |
| Tak | what [cw]ould I add to that? | 17:32 |
| lardman | dragorn: thanks, will do | 17:32 |
| michele | eh, maybe you are right after all.. | 17:33 |
| Tak | I'm all for howtos and things as well; I just don't know what else there is... | 17:34 |
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| hrw | hi | 17:38 |
| hrw | does maemo binaries are compiled for armv5te or armv6? | 17:38 |
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| lardman | hi hrw | 17:41 |
| lardman | arm5 in general | 17:41 |
| lardman | he says... | 17:41 |
| hrw | thx lardman | 17:41 |
| lardman | hmm, you might want to check that actually | 17:41 |
| hrw | lardman: sooner or later I will probably do that | 17:41 |
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| lardman | certainly not much is compiled with vfp enabled, but I can't remember exactly what the defaults are for the code sourcery toolchain | 17:42 |
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| Tak | hmm, the "Wiki" link ( http://maemo.org/community/wiki ) on maemo frontpage is broken | 17:43 |
| Tak | vfp is certainly not default | 17:43 |
| lardman | sorry, bit of a rubbish repsonse | 17:43 |
| hrw | Tak: I wonder why | 17:43 |
| lardman | code size | 17:43 |
| lardman | thumb | 17:43 |
| hrw | ah right.. famous "speed or codesize" | 17:44 |
| lardman | yep :) | 17:44 |
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| darkip | hey all | 17:44 |
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| kala | which toolchain compiler is the correct one for N770? arm-linux-something, but which? | 17:47 |
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| lardman | kala: arm-linux-gcc? | 17:49 |
| kala | scratchbox-toolchain-arm-gcc3.4-uclibc0.9.28 or scratchbox-toolchain-arm-gcc4.1-uclibc20061004 ? | 17:49 |
| hrw | kala: none of them | 17:49 |
| lardman | not uclibc | 17:49 |
| darkip | btw, for anyone interested, i'm working on a port of navit for OS2008 | 17:49 |
| lardman | yes, I'm interested | 17:50 |
| michele | yay darkip | 17:50 |
| hrw | kala: you need gcc-csl 3.4 for glibc/eabi | 17:50 |
| michele | be sure to port the garmin driver :) | 17:50 |
| darkip | I've got libgarmin already ported | 17:50 |
| michele | great | 17:50 |
| hrw | btw - how reliable is n810 gps? | 17:50 |
| darkip | pretty shite | 17:50 |
| darkip | takes ages to get a lock | 17:51 |
| hrw | if at all | 17:51 |
| hrw | cool | 17:51 |
| michele | once it got the fix, it works fine | 17:51 |
| kala | hrw: huh, I must be reading the wrong doc. let me try to find something else. | 17:51 |
| hrw | I heard about 50m errors for whole time | 17:51 |
| hrw | kala: read maemo ones not scratchbox ones | 17:52 |
| michele | hrw: I noticed it depends a lot on how many satellites it's using | 17:52 |
| Tak | gngeo 0.7-maemo2 released: bugfix for installation issues | 17:52 |
| michele | hrw: with 4 you are screwed, with 5 it starts to be reasonable | 17:52 |
| michele | 6 it's fine | 17:52 |
| darkip | is there a difference between the garmin driver and libgarmin? | 17:53 |
| darkip | libgarmin is just for reading garmin map files right? | 17:53 |
| Veggen | darkip: navit? | 17:53 |
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| darkip | well i've compiled libgarmin in scratchbox | 17:53 |
| michele | darkip: http://wiki.navit-project.org/index.php/Garmin_maps | 17:53 |
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| Veggen | Hmm. Will it use garmin maps that have this device lock code-drm-thingy? | 17:55 |
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| lardman | oops, what does enabling monitoring on a release do? | 17:57 |
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| lardman | Anyway, dsp ogg vorbis code is finally up, apologies for the delay | 17:58 |
| lardman | doesn't decode I should hasten to add | 17:59 |
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| lardman | for those interested, even those without a DSP toolchain, the functions which are in the .asm files are almost certainly why it doesn't identify the stream as being vorbis | 17:59 |
| lardman | these are now implemented in c rather than asm, and need to be tweaked | 18:00 |
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| Tak | lardman: killer | 18:01 |
| michele | lardman: (asking because I don't know anything about dsp programming) if it doesn't decode what is it doing? | 18:02 |
| dragorn | In theory you can extract the precision from the nmea steam if you use the debug command to get the raw stream out of gpsd. I haven't checked to see if the 810 reports that though. | 18:02 |
| hrw | bye | 18:02 |
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| lardman | well it does decode, but there's still things to be tweaked in the code to make sure it decodes properly | 18:03 |
| michele | that's nice | 18:03 |
| michele | great job :) | 18:03 |
| lardman | i.e. atm it doesn't correctly recognise the vorbis headers | 18:03 |
| lardman | well it's not finished, but I am busy and thought some help would be useful | 18:03 |
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| lardman | dhd: long time coming, but I've put the code up on the Garage site | 18:19 |
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| kimrhh | hmm, how can I debug the networking of a specific target in scratchbox? I have two working targets, just added a new one to do kernel development, but the network doesn't work in that one | 18:27 |
| kimrhh | qemu: uncaught target signal 2 (Interrupt) - exiting | 18:27 |
| kimrhh | Temporary failure resolving 'foo | 18:27 |
| kimrhh | on an apt-get update | 18:27 |
| lardman | resolv.conf? | 18:28 |
| kimrhh | lardman: sound likely | 18:28 |
| kimrhh | I just thought these things was copied automagically | 18:29 |
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| lardman | I seem to remember that for the older scratchbox toolchains it used to not get set and that would cause the resolve error | 18:29 |
| lardman | not sure about the uncaught signal though | 18:29 |
| kimrhh | hmm, but that would give the same error for all targets | 18:30 |
| lardman | is resolv.conf shared? | 18:30 |
| lardman | for all scratchbox targets that is | 18:30 |
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| kimrhh | mmm, I'm not sure | 18:30 |
| kimrhh | anyway, it has the same setting for both targets | 18:30 |
| kimrhh | just checked | 18:30 |
| kimrhh | oh well, have to look at it later | 18:30 |
| lardman | hmm, I don't know then, sorry | 18:30 |
| kimrhh | he, np thx anyway | 18:31 |
| kimrhh | have to go | 18:31 |
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| Jaffa | Can anyone recommend a USB Ethernet (Realtek-based) dongle for use with OS2008? | 18:45 |
| hugolp | Jaffa: use the wifi | 18:45 |
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| Jaffa | hugolp: doesn't help when, say last weekend, I'm in a hotel with free Internet access over a cable; but no wifi provision | 18:49 |
| zaheerm | yah sucks...i usually take my airport express when in that situation | 18:49 |
| Jon | frustrating | 18:49 |
| hugolp | Jaffa: get a cheap and small wifi router | 18:50 |
| Jon | I own only one usb ethernet adaptor and it doesnt' work in linux (there's a driver which doesn't work, I'm halfway through fixing it) | 18:50 |
| hugolp | Jaffa: its the easier solution | 18:51 |
| glass | Jaffa: carry around an ap | 18:51 |
| glass | pocket ap's are quite small | 18:51 |
| glass | not much extra to throw into luggage | 18:51 |
| Tak | ...and a power supply, and a cable, ... | 18:51 |
| glass | well they're smaller than a phone charger | 18:52 |
| glass | and the ap itself was about phone size that i had | 18:52 |
| hugolp | yeah, those things doesnt consume much | 18:52 |
| kala | http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=103930&postcount=49 actually helped with the crashing gpsd and I didn't have to install maemo SDK :) | 18:52 |
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| lmoura | alterego, is there any problem with ruby-maemo site? Since thursday I can't access it. | 18:58 |
| alterego | lmoura, lots of problems. Should be fixed Wednesday. | 18:58 |
| lmoura | thanks | 18:59 |
| Jaffa | OK, recommendations for a small travel AP? ;-) Although there's posts on p.m.o which suggest Realtek-based ones should work out of the box | 19:01 |
| aspiers | is there a difference between maemo.org wiki and garage.maemo.org logins? | 19:01 |
| aspiers | I can log into garage but not edit the wiki | 19:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tak, most travel chargers are wallwarts. :P | 19:01 |
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| Jaffa | http://www.memory-express.co.uk/index.aspx?pageid=17&id=523724&utm_campaign=froogle&utm_source=Froogle&utm_medium=lead&utm_content=Linksys+Wireless-G+Travel+Router+with+SpeedBooster&utm_name=Linksys+Wireless-G+Travel+Router+with+SpeedBooster - for example - is quite pricey at $120 | 19:03 |
| Tak | what? | 19:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tak, http://c1.neweggimages.com/NeweggImage/productimage/33-124-181-02.jpg | 19:04 |
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| Tak | ohh | 19:05 |
| Tak | s/chargers/routers/ then :-P | 19:06 |
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| n0ob_ | re | 19:37 |
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| _collin_ | iodine-0.4.1 is now available in the MUlliNER.ORG repo for those who asked me earlier today | 20:56 |
| Tak | _collin_: why not use garage extras? | 20:57 |
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| _collin_ | cause I don't have upload rights there yet (also I didn't ask yet) | 20:58 |
| Tak | would you consider doing so? | 20:59 |
| _collin_ | also the maemo infrastructure is kinda slow and unreliable (sorry guys!) | 20:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | _collin_, you're just now figuring this out? | 21:00 |
| _collin_ | Tak: I followed the discussion on the devel-list ... and I would prefer people collect stuff from my site ... test it ... upload | 21:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Don't apologize to us, go bitch at Nokia. ;) | 21:00 |
| _collin_ | GeneralAntilles: no | 21:00 |
| Tak | _collin_: I understand; however, we the users would generally prefer to not have to maintain a list of 50 repos | 21:00 |
| _collin_ | Tak: I like to know where I get my stuff from | 21:00 |
| _collin_ | Tak: but I can understand the USERs | 21:01 |
| Tak | what does that have to do with anything? | 21:01 |
| _collin_ | Tak: what? | 21:01 |
| Tak | eh, never mind | 21:01 |
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| _collin_ | Tak: I just didn't get your question | 21:02 |
| Tak | one possibility is to host development versions at mulliner.org, and also upload release versions to garage extras | 21:02 |
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| _collin_ | Tak: if I don't have to use a slow website to upload ... the Download section of Maemo.org is so bad that I only upload my own apps and don't bother uploading anything I just ported | 21:03 |
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| Tak | the good news is that uploading has nothing to do with the website :-) | 21:04 |
| darkip | hey all | 21:04 |
| Tak | I agree that d.m.o is horrifically slow | 21:04 |
| _collin_ | I think the best solution would be a automatic mirror known repositories | 21:05 |
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| Tak | there is no need with an alternative solution when garage extras is available to anyone capable of sending an email | 21:08 |
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| mariorz | so whats up with the trolltech purchase? | 21:11 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia is gonna purchase trolltech. | 21:11 |
| mariorz | i tought nokia <3 gtk | 21:11 |
| Tak | s/with/for/ | 21:11 |
| infobot | Tak meant: there is no need for an alternative solution when garage extras is available to anyone capable of sending an email | 21:11 |
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| Blafasel | Hooray for this community. Mulliner.org just updated iodine, before I even could start mz new and shiny maemo dev vmware. | 21:18 |
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| * elb detects a qwertz keyboard ;-) | 21:23 | |
| collin_DINNER | Blafasel: are you serious? | 21:23 |
| Blafasel | collin_DINNER: Sure | 21:25 |
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| collin_DINNER | Blafasel: Benjamin? | 21:25 |
| Blafasel | I was preparing to do the update on my own (with a lot of fooling around, probably), but the nice guy over at mullins.org did it already. | 21:25 |
| Blafasel | Uhm? | 21:26 |
| Blafasel | Ah. ;) | 21:26 |
| collin_DINNER | Blafasel: some guy worte me an email | 21:26 |
| Blafasel | Thanks a lot for this update | 21:26 |
| Blafasel | Yep. Me. | 21:26 |
| collin_DINNER | :) | 21:26 |
| Blafasel | Just needed the /whois to understand what you mean.. | 21:26 |
| Blafasel | So - thanks a lot again | 21:26 |
| collin_DINNER | sure | 21:26 |
| collin_DINNER | I just didn't see that there was a new version | 21:27 |
| Blafasel | Well, and my distribution onlz supported the last one as package (Sure, I could have built it on the server manuelly as well).. | 21:27 |
| collin_DINNER | ah | 21:28 |
| Blafasel | Btw: Quite an interesting website. Read about your ccc projects. Nice. | 21:28 |
| collin_DINNER | where are you using it? t-mobile hotspot? | 21:28 |
| Blafasel | swisscom, most of the time. I'm in Bern, CH regularly. | 21:28 |
| collin_DINNER | ah | 21:28 |
| Blafasel | But yes, T-Mobile is a target as well :) | 21:29 |
| collin_DINNER | german universitys work well too, if you don't happen to have an account | 21:29 |
| Blafasel | Nice idea.. | 21:30 |
| collin_DINNER | ? | 21:30 |
| Blafasel | It would be a lot neater with better support for aircrack, though | 21:30 |
| Blafasel | Well, I'm not a student, but it's good to know that. | 21:30 |
| collin_DINNER | sure but as long as we dont have raw 802.11 injection ... | 21:31 |
| Blafasel | Yep =( | 21:31 |
| Blafasel | To be honest: I'm completely clueless there. I don't even know if that is a pure software problem, a hardware issue or both. | 21:32 |
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| collin_DINNER | Blafasel: software (99% sure) | 21:32 |
| Blafasel | And that's an issue because the docs are missing? Or noone cares? | 21:33 |
| collin_DINNER | Nokia doesn't care | 21:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Driver. | 21:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Closed source. | 21:33 |
| elb | first and foremost, it's a missing documentation problem | 21:34 |
| Blafasel | Hmm. So what's this project here about: https://garage.maemo.org/projects/cx3110x/ | 21:35 |
| collin_DINNER | yes nokia is not allowed to release the driver since its not theirs | 21:36 |
| Blafasel | Is that only for 770/800 devices? Because it looks like an open source project for the wlan driver? I mean, I still don't have a clue if it depends on a binary firmware blob of some sort. | 21:36 |
| wumpus | Blafasel: yes, it depends on a binary blob | 21:40 |
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| wumpus | it's only a thin layer | 21:40 |
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| reinard | hello, is there some video capture software for maemo? | 21:41 |
| reinard | desktop capture, no camera | 21:41 |
| Blafasel | wumpus: Thanks for pointing that out | 21:41 |
| * nelson hugs his n810 | 21:45 | |
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| Blafasel | Gaah. Get a gf. ;) | 21:47 |
| sxpert | nsfw : ;-) http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=SnsxFvCaZJ8 | 21:47 |
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| elb | hooah, the 810 has arrived | 22:08 |
| elb | and, by the way, regarding power consumption and someone in here who mentioned that Nokia chargers are generally very power-efficient -- I hope they're better than my wife's phone charger, because it gets hot hot hot when charging :-P | 22:08 |
| elb | (Nokia, that is) | 22:08 |
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| Blafasel | Enjoy your N810! | 22:08 |
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| elb | I'm pumped | 22:09 |
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| lardman | evening all | 22:18 |
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| darkip | evening | 22:18 |
| darkip | navit has WAY too many dependencies | 22:19 |
| lardman | how's your porting of navit going? | 22:19 |
| darkip | it's taking me longer to get them all compiled than navit itself | 22:19 |
| lardman | :) | 22:19 |
| darkip | which is GTK+ based so fairly easy | 22:19 |
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| lardman | libdevil | 22:20 |
| darkip | eh? | 22:20 |
| lardman | supposed to be a dep | 22:21 |
| darkip | hmm | 22:21 |
| lardman | http://wiki.navit-project.org/index.php/Dependencies | 22:21 |
| darkip | well, i'm just trying to get all the stuff compiled for speech support | 22:21 |
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| lardman | hmm, it reckons that glut is a dep | 22:22 |
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| lardman | that sounds painful | 22:22 |
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| darkip | well, it didn't have any compile problems compiling without speech support in scratchbox X86 | 22:23 |
| lardman | darkip: someone's already packaged flite, aren't the dev packages available there too? | 22:23 |
| darkip | maybe it's going to blow up in my face when i come to compile for ARM | 22:23 |
| lardman | :) | 22:24 |
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| lardman | I guess there may be multiple output options | 22:24 |
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| darkip | well, this is my first port so i'm learning as i go allow | 22:25 |
| darkip | i'm sure there are many tears to be shed before i get a working copy :P | 22:25 |
| lardman | :) it's all a learning experience, or something like that :D | 22:26 |
| darkip | hehe | 22:27 |
| darkip | it's all fun and games until i accidently rm -rf my drive | 22:27 |
| elb | holy crap, does this display rule | 22:27 |
| darkip | ? | 22:27 |
| pupnik | hi lardman | 22:27 |
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| lardman | hey pupnik, how are you? | 22:28 |
| pupnik | oh somethings working somethings not | 22:28 |
| lardman | I hear you got some or other game emu working at super speed? | 22:28 |
| pupnik | no just better than horrible | 22:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | elb, the N810 is your first tablet, right? | 22:28 |
| pupnik | lest we forget, omap2420 registers 388 bogomips and gp2x 98 bogomips | 22:29 |
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| Tak | pupnik: morning | 22:29 |
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| lardman | and even 2x98 bogomips is less than 388 | 22:30 |
| lardman | does the gp2x do hw graphics accel though? | 22:31 |
| dphil9000 | package just delivered | 22:31 |
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| dphil9000 | i need to leave work RIGHT NOW to get it! | 22:31 |
| pupnik | huhu | 22:31 |
| lardman | dphil9000: GO! | 22:32 |
| lardman | Any Python gurus about? | 22:33 |
| lardman | or even people who have a vague working knowledge of using pyGTK | 22:33 |
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| lmoura | lardman, go ahead | 22:34 |
| lardman | well, if I want to display multiple views, how should I do it, clear the same main window and display the different data, or create multiple windows (but then they will all show up on the 'taskbar')? | 22:35 |
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| lardman | i.e. I want a couple of buttons to do different things, search page, list page, etc, etc. | 22:35 |
| lardman | should each subpage redraw the main window? | 22:35 |
| keesj | use tabs? | 22:35 |
| lardman | hmm, good suggestion | 22:36 |
| lardman | but if I didn't, do I need to unregister my buttons for one view when I create the next/an other? | 22:36 |
| Tak | generally there would be different buttons on each page | 22:37 |
| melmoth | you could i guess put button in a vbar cell that would always be there, and destroy (unpack ?? if this is possible), and repack what s on the other cell of the vbar ? | 22:37 |
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| melmoth | but the tabs sounds like a better way | 22:38 |
| darkip | argh, why is flite such a MISSION to compile into libraries | 22:38 |
| lardman | so what would one do, keep the buttons bound but hide the page (or similar)? | 22:38 |
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| lardman | darkip: I'm pretty sure it's been done, reinventing the wheel, etc. ;) | 22:38 |
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| darkip | yeah i know, | 22:39 |
| lardman | but yes, tabs do sound like they would be a good way | 22:39 |
| darkip | any idea on which rep? | 22:39 |
| lardman | http://users.tkk.fi/~tnikkila/maemo/flite/ but for the 770 | 22:40 |
| lardman | so perhaps not as useful as I thought | 22:40 |
| darkip | ah, i'm going the OS2008 route so unfortunately not so useful... | 22:41 |
| lardman | I thought I had it running on OS2007 with maemo-mapper | 22:41 |
| lardman | hmm, try maemo-extras | 22:43 |
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| darkip | hmm, i'm thinking of just forgetting about speech for the moment and getting the core bit running | 22:43 |
| darkip | then i'll come back... | 22:43 |
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| keesj | I melmoth what do you mean with "compile into library" ? | 22:45 |
| darkip | well i was under the impression i needed the library to compile support into navit | 22:46 |
| melmoth | hmm ? | 22:46 |
| lardman | it may just pipe the output | 22:50 |
| lardman | but I'd be tempted to get the program working before worrying about the speech output | 22:50 |
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| darkip | indeed | 22:51 |
| darkip | anyways, must dash, some trumpet practice is needed | 22:51 |
| darkip | navit's on hold for 20 mins ;) | 22:52 |
| lardman | :) | 22:52 |
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| jott | lardman: what's your latest status on the powervr front? | 22:52 |
| lardman | It's been on hold for a while | 22:52 |
| lardman | before xmas I was looking at the execution flow (or whatever it would be called) through the kernel module to try to work out why the dev and proc entries didn't get created | 22:53 |
| lardman | I started looking but didn't finish | 22:53 |
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| jott | hmm..k.. which module did you try? it seems ti took the gaming sdks from theier public site :( | 22:54 |
| lardman | oh, that's a shame | 22:54 |
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| lardman | it was the omap2430 sdk, as the 2420 was redirected there | 22:55 |
| lardman | pvr.ko | 22:55 |
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| darkip | back | 23:17 |
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| konttori | Hi everyone. In case anyone uses ukmp, I just uploaded 1.72 to garage. | 23:22 |
| konttori | https://garage.maemo.org/frs/download.php/3262/ukmp-1.72_all.deb | 23:22 |
| konttori | Includes volume fix and progress bar update fix | 23:22 |
| konttori | Oh, and 'ball' is nicer also. (although it will disappear soon altogether) | 23:23 |
| konttori | I may blog about it tomorrow a bit | 23:23 |
| konttori | anyway, good night all | 23:24 |
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| halley | Pretty quiet. Everyone all chatted out about Nokia/Qt already? | 23:44 |
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| glass | yeah | 23:48 |
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