IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2007-11-27

GeneralAntillesAs I don't ever recall it being called that in the past.00:00
bill20r3altergeo, supposedly it's the day that retailers go 'into the black' for the year.00:00
GeneralAntillesEnd of first paragraph, alterego.00:00
GeneralAntillesSounds pretty stupid to me.00:00
* czr reminds himself why using 'user' for unix account name isn't the most brilliant thing to do: "Scratchbox user account for user user added"00:00
GeneralAntillesOr just plain wrong.00:00
alteregoczr, hahah00:01
czrit's too late to change now though. user user ftw.00:01
czrthe hostname is 'system' btw :-)00:01
alteregoczr, what are you running? Maemo or Mac OS X?00:01
alteregoNo-one should have a user user.00:01
czralterego, this is ubuntu for now :-)00:01
ajturner_it's also referenced "Black" b/c its such an insane day to work in a retail store00:01
czralterego, yeah, but when writing generic training material, it's not always obvious which names to use.00:01
czralterego, using czr@itchy for example doesn't make much sense.00:02
alteregoErm .. Okay.00:02
[pablo]_has anyone gotten media box to work on 2008?00:02
czralterego, people realize the amount of suffering and tears that goes into writing training material :-)00:02
GeneralAntillesWe should make a holiday.00:03
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alteregoAh, I get it now.00:03
captlloyd_I'm trying to get a copy of the latest OS2008 and its downloading SLOWWWW00:03
captlloyd_I had it on my desktop, but I'm not there right now, I'm kicking myself for not bringing a copy of the image with me00:04
alteregoczr, you could always do a global substitution of czr for user and @itchy to @hostname00:04
czralterego, I could, if I'd be using my own generator system00:04
alteregoYeah, everyone's having that problem.00:04
czrbut the crap that I'm using is really lame00:04
* konttori is testing xchat on n81000:04
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konttoriworks really well00:05
alteregoSomeone should ask for a Nokia BT tracker. It'd be most effective for these things.00:05
czrI'd need to unescape all the unnecessary escaping I'm doing in order to replace pretty much anything in the listings00:05
captlloyd_Anyone have a fastish place they could put up a copy of the image?00:05
* konttori has ported nuvopearl, so smallish fonts help apps like xchat00:05
czralterego, it's not going to happen. bt tracker that is00:05
K`zanIf I ever get it :)00:05
alteregoczr, It is if I do it ;)00:05
czralterego, also, I don't think releasing the image as bt would be possible because of legal issues00:05
K`zanOnly 6.75 hours left...00:05
* zeenix wonders where konttori gets all his energy from00:06
czralterego, it won't be a nokia bt tracker then :-)00:06
captlloyd_yeah, same thing here, 6+ hours00:06
K`zanNow 8 hours 15 minutes :-(00:06
czralterego, I'm not saying it would be impossible. just not going to happen.00:06
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GeneralAntillesJoin the fun:
alteregoczr, it seems quite trivial to me :/ I don't see why they wouldn't do it.00:07
czralterego, you haven't worked with nokia before :-)00:07
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alteregoczr, I dunno if you saw my idea earlier. About setting up a small section on my site that people entered their MAC's and it validated it with tablets-dev .. Then allowed them to download a .torrent file and become part of the swarm.00:07
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czralterego, that wouldn't stop anyone from joining into the swarm00:08
alteregoczr, that's _as_ secure as the current method :)00:08
czrwell. yeah. but not really :-)00:08
alteregoczr, how would they get the .torrent? You can't just "scan" for swarms.00:08
czrand the current system does suck, I know :-)00:08
czralterego, someone would publish a DHT point or two00:09
K`zanOK, I'll try the torrent thing again...00:09
alteregoAnd from that people could steal some random torrent?00:09
K`zanBUT leaving the other running since it is MUCH faster than the torrent already :)00:09
czralterego, the image.00:09
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alteregoInteresting. I didn't know :)00:09
elbyou can join a torrent without the tracker's involvement00:09
* czr nods at elb00:09
elball the tracker does is provide a convenient place to find it00:09
K`zanup and down 0 KB/s00:10
czrelb btw, the issue with libdbus is not going to be fixed. got shouted at by thiago for even raising the whole assert issue :-)00:10
elbwell, I think it does more than that, but it's not *required*00:10
elbczr: really?00:10
elbczr: that sucks00:10
czrelb, yup.00:10
elbthey have no plan for connecting without aborting?00:10
Jiten_is there some control on who can download those files? if not, I don't really see what's the difference with http link and a torrent.00:10
alteregoThere's an issue with dbus?00:10
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alteregoczr, oh. ke-recv is about automounting ..00:10
czrelb, the issue is (according to thiago) that not having uuid in place is a "failed install", and hence should abort the library00:10
konttorithe biggest reason why tacker is out of the question at  the moment is because of lwgal contracts between nokia and 3rd party component providers00:10
milhousebugger... download crapped out at 68% :( god help us if nokia tablets ever become really popular! ;)00:10
K`zanmilhouse: I said that earlier :)00:11
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czrelb, so it qualifies as "library internal assert". I don't agree but who am I to argue.00:11
K`zanNow the torrent is faster...00:11
elbczr: so ... because some library which an application uses which may not even be necessary for correct operation has a hissy, the appliction should abort with prejudice?00:11
alteregoThere's a torrent?00:11
czrelb, that seems his point.00:11
czrelb, in this case. the uuid mess.00:11
elbI would disagree, as well00:11
* czr nods00:11
czrI don't like libraries asserting internally00:12
elbneither do I00:12
czrunless it's about something internal in them. something not visible in the environment at all00:12
elblibraries should assert internally only when they identify a situation where they believe data may be corrupt, etc.00:12
K`zan2x the direct speed (9 KB/s)00:12
czrbut even then it's pita.00:12
konttoriwhat dbus assert issue?00:12
alteregoczr, otherwise they should probably propogate ;)00:12
elb*certainly* not because some file is missing00:12
elbor an environment variable, or any such thing00:12
czrkonttori, run any app that uses libosso without run-standalone and you'll see. dbus_bus_get will assert and abort.00:12
czrkonttori, or any libdbus client for that matter.00:13
czrkonttori, 3.2 handled this by returning NULL from that function. 4.0/1.0.2 asserts internally.00:13
derfCrashing your program makes people fix things.00:13
alteregoYeah, the machine uuid issue is very common though ..00:13
konttorican you please file a bug00:13
czrkonttori, the dbus people aren't going to fix it00:13
czrkonttori, but I can. later. will drop you a note with the number.00:14
konttorimy team handles dbus among other things00:14
geoffegI hope the tablets-dev download resumes when i get home00:14
konttoriso, i can promise a good evaluation at least00:14
czrkonttori, I did discuss this on #dbus yesterday. thiago said that it _should_ assert.00:15
czrimho it's not what it should do, but.. :-)00:15
czrbut I'll write a bug and we'll see what will happen.00:15
konttoriahh... yes, well, then i guess it's still better to file the bug. nagging tends to help00:16
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maddlergreat!!! Skype running on N800! :DDD00:16
* konttori goes to sleep00:16
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captlloyd_I've had no luck finding an N810 2008 torrent00:17
K`zanOk, maybe torrent is better - already up to 30 KB/S - direct still at 4.100:17
GeneralAntillesScroll up, captlloyd. :\00:18
GeneralAntillesStop stealing my bandwidth, K`zan. :P00:18
K`zanLOL, just hedging my bets :-)00:19
captlloyd_That's the version for N80000:19
K`zanGet the torrent - MUCH faster00:19
K`zan6x ATM...00:19
GeneralAntillesUh, why do you need an N810 OS2008 torrent?00:19
K`zanPassed what I got direct already.00:19
GeneralAntillesIt already has OS2008.00:19
captlloyd_They released an update00:20
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GeneralAntillesI'm running at 70-80KB on the torrent.00:20
alteregoGeneralAntilles, that's good :)00:20
K`zan20 KB/s ATM here.00:20
captlloyd_I'm also trying to figure out if I have something wrong with my tablet, some things aren't working00:20
alteregoSo some bad person has done a N800 OS2008 torrent?00:20
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captlloyd_I think its just buggy software00:20
K`zanMay need to do some rearrangement for torrent on the firewall.00:20
GeneralAntillesI need to get my mother to open this up at home and throw the massive pipe I have there behind it. :)00:20
* elb demands a tablet00:20
alteregocaptlloyd, what's not working?00:20
captlloyd_Just the google based voice chat00:21
K`zanYow, just jumped to 175 KB/s!00:21
captlloyd_Says its working fine00:21
captlloyd_but I hear nothing, and noone hears me00:21
alteregoI'd join in but I'm not sure how to integrate an already complete file.00:21
GeneralAntillesThat's a NAT issue, captlloyd_.00:21
GeneralAntillesJust select it when it asks where to download, alterego.00:21
captlloyd_I turned on DMZ and pointed it at my tablet00:21
captlloyd_and it did the same thing00:21
captlloyd_Maybe I'll try it again00:22
GeneralAntillesHow about on the other end?00:22
alteregoGeneralAntilles, seriously? :/00:22
GeneralAntillesOr, rather, select the folder that it resides in.00:22
K`zanNeed to replace that router with an access point :-/.00:22
GeneralAntillesIt'll check it against the torrent.00:22
alteregoWhere's the torrent?00:22
_Monkeythe torrent is slow shit00:22
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captlloyd_Yeah, it could have been the person on the other end too00:22
GeneralAntilles_Monkey, STFU00:22
_Monkeyyes sir00:22
alterego_monkey forget torrent00:22
_Monkeyalterego: I forgot torrent00:22
alterego_monkey torrent is <reply>00:22
_MonkeyOK, alterego.00:22
K`zan_Monkey: Just jumped here from 20 KB/s to almost 200.  Now at 150, patience I guess :).00:22
_MonkeyK`zan: huh?00:22
alterego_monkey the newb ..00:23
_Monkeyalterego: excuse me?00:23
K`zan_Monkey: huh? huh?00:23
_Monkeyk`zan: bugger all, i dunno00:23
K`zanMe either :)00:23
* alterego joins the torrent.00:23
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alteregoI'll superseed for a couple of hours.00:23
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K`zan24:52 on the torrent, 7:33 on the direct, gonna kill the direct.00:24
K`zanThanks to whomever put up the torrent!00:24
K`zan***Thanks*** to whomever put up the torrent! :-)00:24
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K`zanAnyone got an MD5SUM on that torrent?00:33
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jslegareHi all.00:34
_MonkeyHi all. is there a decent flickr mass uploader for the n800 ye?00:34
alteregoThat's what I've got.00:34
* elb passes out sha1sum00:34
alterego_Monkey forget Hi all.00:34
_Monkeyalterego, I didn't have anything matching hi all00:34
alterego_Monkey forget Hi all00:34
_Monkeyalterego, I didn't have anything matching hi all00:34
* czr just passes out00:34
alterego_Monkey forget Hi00:34
_Monkeyalterego: I forgot hi00:34
alterego_Monkey forget all00:34
_Monkeyalterego, I didn't have anything matching all00:34
alterego_Monkey Hi is <reply>00:35
_MonkeyOK, alterego.00:35
K`zanalterego: THanks, wll check when it finishes here and verify.00:35
alteregoDumb bot.00:35
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elboh good, more infobot spam00:35
alteregoMaybe it should only remember stuff over 4 characters ..00:35
alteregoAnd have a black list of common greetings O_O00:35
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elbI don't know if it's worse when they reply with irrelevancies, or when people twiddle with them in channel for a dozen lines00:35
elbreally, it should only reply to things which are prefixed with _Monkey:00:36
alteregoelb, I tried to get it over and done with quickly ;)00:36
* elb passes out the free /query to go with sha1sums00:36
GeneralAntillesHa, direct and torrent are neck and neck!00:36
milhouseyou can always chat with _monkey privately :)00:36
captlloyd_Ok, so I got someone else to turn on DMZ on their end too00:36
captlloyd_and still they can't hear me, and I can't hear them00:36
elbI do that when people I don't want to talk to call, sometimes00:37
GeneralAntillesStill doesn't eliminate network problem.00:37
elb"I can't hear you, you're breaking up"00:37
captlloyd_I wonder what I can try next00:37
jslegareI'm trying to port a firefox plugin to the N800. Is there a bora specific version of the Gecko-Sdk (the mozilla np-api header files) I can use ?00:37
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* alterego starts work on a theme.00:38
GeneralAntillesMake it as awesome as Plankton.00:38
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alteregoIt'll be awesomer.00:39
alteregoWhen you say plankton. Do you mean echo?00:39
K`zanConfirm md5sum here is same: 900353c77fc7357a8a6a40b0b9483c2c00:39
alterego(default OS2008)00:39
alteregoYes, they're the same.00:39
GeneralAntillesThat's the one I mean.00:40
alteregoWow .. I can really make it look different ..00:41
alteregoThe whole systemy.00:41
K`zancrap, blew away the torrent client, was going to leave it up and seeding :-/00:41
K`zanLets see if I can get it back.00:41
alteregoGeneralAntilles, the GIMP in scratchbox ;)00:41
czrhmm. weird. where is the devkit-debian-etch package for sbox?00:41
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czrhmm. maybe the automatic SDK installs script assumes that the sdk target have already been created00:42
alteregoczr, scratchbox-devkit-debian00:42
czralterego, I've got that installed.00:42
czrahh. I haven't00:43
alteregoscratchbox-devkit-maemo3 ?00:43
czrthat's installed.00:43
alteregoShould depend ..00:43
czrbleh. doesn't.00:43
alteregoWell .. That's obvious. I was just saying it should ;)00:43
* czr nods00:43
GeneralAntillesThe direct and the torrent finished within 2 seconds of eachother00:44
GeneralAntillesTime to flash.00:44
* alterego gets the N800 voodoo doll he made for GeneralAntilles and starts poking and proding it angryily00:44
czrheh. "dpkg - warning: ignoring request to remove remove which isn't installed."00:44
GeneralAntillesOh noes!00:44
alteregoOh crap .. That's _my_ N800!!00:44
* alterego 's plan backfires (again)00:45
alteregoI don't get any luck ..00:45
czralterego, no win available.00:45
alteregoOh .. That's what a breadcrumb is ..00:46
alteregoThose are neat ..00:46
milhousecool... with the torrent i'm pulling it down at 41kb/s :)00:46
milhousedirect is still going at a snails pace00:47
alteregoSweet .. I can even skin the clock applet ..00:47
alteregoThis is going to be fun ..00:48
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GeneralAntillesLooks like Backup doesn't remember your selected location for the restore applications procedure00:58
GeneralAntillesthat sucks.00:58
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alteregoLooks like the gtkrc theme file is generated from multiple files .. Interesting.01:02
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DrelHello -- is there a mirror available for OS2008 for N800?  The site is terribly slow (currently getting 4Kbps).01:03
alteregoDrel, there's a torrent on piratebay appearantly.01:03
milhousethe torrent is working well - i just downloaded it in about 20 minutes01:04
geoffegnokia needs to host their files on some porn site, faster downloads01:04
Drelheh, thanks for tips, I'll check piratebay.01:05
geoffegwhoo, i'm getting 5KB now!01:05
alteregoIt's going to take a long time for me to refactor all of this information into something I can use me thinks.01:05
milhousehere's the torrent link:
milhousei won here! :)01:06
GeneralAntillesWe need a neutral 3rd party!01:07
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DrelThanks guys, their search index seems out of date so the direct link was helpful.01:07
astro76GeneralAntilles by a nose01:07
gla55_on my screen too01:07
DrelI got milhouse slightly earlier...01:07
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GeneralAntillesOh noes!01:07
gla55_2vs1 for gen01:08
milhousei admit defeat! ;)01:08
GeneralAntillesA fine fight, sir!01:08
GeneralAntillesI need to get my home pipe involved01:09
GeneralAntilles2Mbps up01:09
DrelSweet, 300kB/sec is more like it.01:09
GeneralAntillesToo bad my server machine that would let me get in is dead. :(01:09
doc|workI got milhouse first too :)01:10
GeneralAntillesProbably North America guys got me and Euros got him.01:11
GeneralAntillesBut he already admitted defeat!01:11
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lophyteanyone know the standard currency in poland?01:13
GeneralAntillesI mean, for serious.01:13
GeneralAntillesWhat is wikipedia for?01:13
lophyteyeah I wasn't sure if it was zloty or euro01:14
DrelInteresting. I've never seen the l with a diagonal bar through it before.01:14
lophytebecause I found a couple of polish computer stores that listed prices in euro01:14
elbwikipedia is for finding articles which may or may not be at all correct, and then believing it as if it is and thus becoming dumber01:15
elbat least, that's what most people seem to do with it01:16
* GeneralAntilles rolls his eyes.01:16
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GeneralAntillesLooks like the Application Restore chokes on applications installed with .debs01:19
captlloyd_Well, didn't get the talk program to work, but Skype works great01:20
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alteregoYeah, wikipedia has an IQ of ~8001:21
alteregoSlightly below the average.01:21
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DrelHmm.  Skype failed to install. :-(  It wants me to install the latest software for my N810 device (even though I have a N800).01:24
Veggenuhuh. anyone got flasher-3.0 ?01:27
Veggen(seems I can't reach site right now - got the image per bittorent, but...hrmf)01:27
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Veggen(or, a direct lin to it. surfing for it is *slow*)01:28
milhouseskype installed fine on my n800/os2008 (-18) - no difference to Skype on OS2007 tbh01:29
GeneralAntillesYeah, the version check is stupid01:29
GeneralAntilles1 < 18 or 1901:29
GeneralAntillesso it fails01:29
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GeneralAntillesBut doesn't check the build week.01:29
kupesoftthe os2008 download is going *really* slow01:29
kupesoftanyone have a mirror?01:30
elbpeople sure do complain a lot about stolen software01:30
milhousei'll upload flasher to my server - gimme to ticks01:30
doc|workelb: random thought of the hour? :)01:30
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kupesoftGeneralAntilles: thanks01:31
Veggenelb: well. I *did* start download via official site, gave my WLAN id - so I don't feel guilty.01:31
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kupesoft_much better~ :)01:32
kupesoft_What a mirror for the flasher?01:32
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milhouseThat is the Linux Intel x86 (32-bit not 64-bit) version, dynamic linkage01:35
kupesoftThe md5sum checks out (:01:36
milhouseThe Nokia flasher page ( is slow but working OK here - I just downloaded flasher-3.0 from the Nokia site in under 10 seconds01:36 is borked,01:37
kupesoftmemcache handler: Failed to connect to localhost:11211.01:37
sp3000localhost:11211 is an awesome site01:37
elbVeggen: oh, most people here talking about os2008 used the instructions on the interweb to fetch it illicitly01:37
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alteregoInteresting ..01:42
alteregoI brokzored it :/01:43
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kupesoftIs the new firmware fast like the is2008 image meant for the n810?01:44
alteregokupesoft, why wouldn't it be?01:45
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kupesoftI dunno,01:45
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alteregoWell then ..01:45
kupesoftmaybe there's some n810 kernel-tweaking that sped everything up,01:45
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kupesoftbut not in the n800 image01:45
kupesoftc'est possible!01:45
alteregoWhy would they do that?01:45
alteregoThe N810 and N800 have almost identical hardware ..01:45
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alteregoSame CPU .. Same memory .. Same internal flash ..01:46
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kupesoftfair enough,01:47
kupesoftskype wouldn't install, says it wants the n810 firmware...01:47
alteregoIt is a beta.01:48
kupesoftfair enough,01:48
doc|workthat seems like an avoidable bug :/01:49
alteregoIt shouldn't even be available.01:49
GeneralAntillesThe Skype installer only checks the build number01:49
GeneralAntillesrather than the week01:50
GeneralAntillesas 1 is less than 18 or 1901:50
GeneralAntillesYou get a failure.01:50
alteregoYou could force it to install.01:50
Veggenok...where has the menu gone? ;)01:51
Veggenoh. there.01:52
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GeneralAntillesHow did Nokia manage to DOWNGRADE the functionality of xterm from OS2007? :\02:08
alteregoThey didn't.02:08
alteregoIt's just a bit different.02:08
GeneralAntillesDid too!02:08
alteregoIt's actually better in some ways.02:08
GeneralAntillesHitting control-c is, like, 5 steps02:09
GeneralAntillesversus 2 in the version I had before.02:09
alteregoDefine a CTRL-C button then :P02:09
derfPut a Ctrl key on your keyboard.02:09
GeneralAntillesOn the Vkb?02:09
alteregoYeah there are a few things that are very N810 oriented ..02:09
GeneralAntillesThe default one?02:09
derfI have no idea.02:10
derfI don't run the default one.02:10
GeneralAntillesWonder if this beta fixes the issues with text doubling that I was having in xterm.02:10
GeneralAntillesNope. . . .02:10
jumpulaczr: pong02:10
czrjumpula, hello :-)02:11
czryou have strange hours :-)02:11
jumpulaand you? :)02:11
czrjumpula, sbox_adduser doesn't seem to be documented anywhere where the 4.0 sdk install doc points to02:11
czrI'm always like this :-)02:11
czrthe install doc refers to sb1 docs, and sb-adduser is used there. sb-adduser is broken with apophis02:11
jumpulawhich version?02:12
czrat least when I did dpkg -i scratch*.deb style install of apophis02:12
jumpulaah, the latest, yeah02:12
czrknown issue?02:12
jumpulayeah, that's my fault.02:12
czrcomplains about not running /usr/ or similar02:12
jumpulafixed in the head, though02:12
czrah ok. I found a round-about way of doing it though02:12
czr /scratchbox/sbin/sbox_adduser02:12
jumpulashould do a new release, but want to have other stuff in it too.02:12
czris that ok?02:12
jumpulathat's the real one02:13
czrok. good.02:13
czrthat's what I thought, but wasn't 100% sure.02:13
jumpulathere's readlink -f missing from the script02:13
czrand it seems to work anyway :-)02:13
jumpulathe debian package contains symlinks and scripts get confused about that02:13
czrfor a moment there I didn't even remember why I wanted your help :-)02:13
jjo_come on, working all night?02:13
jumpulawhen you try the symlink02:13
jumpulajjo_: what about you? :)02:13
czrjjo_, you not? :-)02:13
czrwhat is WRONG with you? :-)02:13
jjo_well, not working that's for sure02:13
czrworking during the day is crap because of the emails flying here and there02:14
bilboedarrrgh, sloooow download :)02:14
jumpulahm. i thought maemo is distant relation to work? :)02:14
czrand bugzilla reports and such02:14
czrjumpula, no no, "working" not "work" ;-)02:14
czryou confused the words :-)02:14
jumpulaah, true02:14
czras in "works properly"02:14
czrjumpula, thanks for the ping though :-)02:15
GeneralAntillesShould xterm bugs go in Applications or System software?02:15
GeneralAntillesThose relating to the functionality of the app itself.02:15
jumpulayeah. time like 2h 25min02:15
jumpulai'd call that a lag02:15
czrthat's nothing :-)02:16
jumpula"wait until you see my lag!"02:16
czrneh. I'd call the delay between me reporting #95 and it getting fixed, a lag.02:16
czr(it's not fixed yet :-)02:17
GeneralAntillesSystem software (shoulda looked at the components :\)02:17
alterego#95? Wasn't that the bug you reported whilst flying close to a Black Hole?02:18
czrI always fly close to the black hole.02:18
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bilboedgrmbl, I always forget the flasher instructions :(02:18
jumpulafunny things in the event horizon02:18
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alteregobilboed, ./flasher-3.0 -F ./path/to/image -f02:19
alteregoThen turn on your device holding down the home key.02:19
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bilboedor use -FR :)02:20
doc|workman, my screen protector is scratched to shit, I wish boxwave would get their shit together :/02:20
kupesoftno pand in os2008! WTF02:21
kupesofthow to do ip over bluetooth tunneling?02:21
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* czr woots for chapter 0202:26
czrexcept for '.. listing cur for brevity ..'02:26
* czr wonders what cur means.02:26
* alterego woops for amateur theme makers.02:27
GeneralAntillesAnybody with OS2008 on an N800 want to test something for me?02:28
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alteregoI'm seriously considering writing some groovy scripts to aid in theme creation. Unfortunately it involves me analyising the process manually .02:28
hexahi, any mirror for the flash images ? , i'm d/ling a 4k/sec :(02:29
alteregoA process I like to call the "Identity Algorithm" (aka "Brute Force Strategy")02:29
GeneralAntillesWhy 2007?02:30
alteregoOh .. 200702:30
alteregoHe's probably unhappy with 200802:30
czralterego, identity algorithm would be O(1), not O(very large *N*N*N*N) :-)02:30
hexaI tought i'd wait for it to be a final release..02:30
hexajust got my n800...02:30
hexais 2008 usable?02:30
bilboedsweeeeeeeet :)02:30
bilboedfasster :)02:30
alteregoIt's perfectly usable :)02:30
GeneralAntillesMost certainly02:31
hexa:) I'll try that then02:31
GeneralAntillesMinus a stupid bug with the thumbboard and xterm. :\02:31
alteregoIt's just not all the apps are currently available.02:31
alteregoGeneralAntilles, double pasting?02:31
GeneralAntillesAnything entered in the thumbboard appears twice in the prompt02:31
GeneralAntillesso: top becomes toptop02:31
alteregoI think "dual insertion" is a feature in osso-xterm (nokia edition)02:31
hexahehe k02:31
GeneralAntillesWhich has got to be the dumbest bug on the planet.02:32
alteregoIt is pretty dumb.02:32
bilboedeven the browser is faster02:32
alteregoYeah, it's all very nice.02:32
alteregoI get annoyed about browser start up times though ..02:32
alteregoOkay .. I just noticed a nice effect I'd not noticed before :)02:33
* alterego thinks tapping on an app in the task navigator should minimize it and goto the home view.02:33
bilboedcheck out the video :)02:34
alteregoThe Video is a joke.02:34
GeneralAntillesTime to open an enhancement bug, alterego. :)02:34
bilboedquality-wise I meant :)02:34
alteregoIt's just a crappy rehash of the N800 vid.02:34
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|tbb|anyone able to use a bt headset with n800 os8?02:35
alteregoGeneralAntilles, actually what it should _really_ do. Is switch back to whatever context you were at before you selected it. Kind of like the home hold feature but across all tasks.02:35
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alteregoBut you click on an item on a normal desktop and that happens. It just makes sense. And otherwise that entire icon in the task navigator is just wasting space doing nothing (except offering a kind of pointless tooltip)02:36
bilboedX terminal by default ? :)02:37
alteregobilboed, sweet isn't it ;)02:37
GeneralAntillesToo bad it SUCKS so much compared to the old one! :P02:38
alteregoI like it.02:38
bilboedbaaah, bed time02:38
alteregoIt does things the other didn't like you can tap and interact with programs like mutt and nano02:38
GeneralAntillesI liked being able to tap cntrl on the sidebar and then a key in the keyboard to send the cntrl-signal. <_<02:38
alteregoI actually don't know that the other version didn't do that I never tried .. So I could be wrong ;)02:38
alteregoI just accidentally found out on OS2008 ^_^02:39
bilboedSIP by default :)02:39
bilboedI need to stop02:39
alteregoGeneralAntilles, yeah. That was a good feature they've for some (stupid) reason removed.02:39
alteregoI like the fact they've used windows instead of tabs ..02:39
GeneralAntillesOpened a bug for thumbboard entry in xterm02:40
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alteregoSomeone else was complaining about that a while back.02:42
alteregoNot sure if it's already reported.02:43
alterego(He was using N810 OS2008 on N800 so I think he was a bit paranoid02:43
GeneralAntillesDidn't see it in search.02:43
doc|workwhat's the alternative to that now?02:44
GeneralAntillesI'm blaming timeless for recommending that I report N810 on N800 bugs. :D02:44
GeneralAntillesWhat's the guidlines for Target Milestone?02:48
K`zanWhat is the command to flash 2008 on the n800?02:49
K`zanOn Linux02:50
K`zanAlso, is Nokia going to sic hordes of lawyers on me if I put the update on my web site?02:51
GeneralAntilles[7:19pm] <alterego>bilboed, ./flasher-3.0 -F ./path/to/image -f02:52
GeneralAntillesProbably, K`zan. :P02:52
czrK`zan, if they will, they won't tell you about it here. you'll know when the black ninjas will come.02:52
GeneralAntillesThe torrent is working well enough02:52
K`zanThankee Sir.02:52
GeneralAntillesand tablets-dev will clear up soon enough.02:52
K`zanGetting tired of supporting organizations with more lawyers than engineers :-(.02:52
K`zantablets-dev ?02:52
_Monkeysomebody said tablets-dev was an akamai site02:52
GeneralAntillesThe server hosting the firmware image files.02:53
GeneralAntillesOpened a bug for the Control-prompt in xterm closing the vkb02:55
K`zanAnyone loudly complaining about problems with 2008 on the n800 before I scrap my whole 2007 install?02:57
K`zanWish I could back it up in toto just in case...02:57
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K`zanStart upload then turn n800 off, turn on while holding home key as before?02:57
GeneralAntillesTurn it off.02:57
GeneralAntillesStart the flasher02:57
GeneralAntillesplug it in02:58
GeneralAntillesturn it on while holding home key (press and hold the home key, press the powerkey)02:58
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GeneralAntillestimelyx, still here?02:59
Mmm810Hmm so i guess no password manager ported to os2008 yet or am I missing it02:59
soothsayerDoes anyone have (or can make) a good hash (e.g. SHA, Whirpool) of RX-34_2008SE_1.2007.44-4_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin?02:59
K`zanGeneralAntilles: Put it in a note file this time, thanks.03:00
GeneralAntillesYou'll know it by heart soon enough. ;)03:00
alteregosoothsayer, 900353c77fc7357a8a6a40b0b9483c2c03:01
K`zanmd5 is : 900353c77fc7357a8a6a40b0b9483c2c  RX-34_2008SE_1.2007.44-4_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin03:01
alteregoWell .. Ours match up :D03:01
K`zanGOOD! LOL!03:01
soothsayerI want something better than MD503:01
soothsayerI have the MD5SUM file03:02
K`zanBest U got, sorry,03:02
alteregosoothsayer, well that's all you're getting from ys.03:02
alteregoWhy don't you trust MD5?03:02
K`zanSheez, next week I learn to type.03:02
soothsayeralterego: It's pretty weak03:02
soothsayeralterego: Has been widely abandoned as secure.03:02
alteregoBy who?03:02
K`zanThen, if md5 from everyone isn't good enough, do your own and verify it :-).03:03
alteregoEverywhere I look it's still MD5 .. I've not come across anything else ..03:03
soothsayeralterego: NIST for one03:03
K`zansha is out there, but not on any machine I have...03:03
alteregoWhat's NIST?03:03
alteregoOh, national instit sci tech03:03
alterego8114ccc8404cf8e57e33edec311c85abddc6a5e255dad7581e5369b5e7345dc9eac5aafc36b049a7ade623909cfa17956c14177dc09e26b91ccda43cf65aa714  /home/tom/Desktop/RX-34_2008SE_1.2007.44-4_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin03:03
K`zanImpotant gov body :)03:03
alteregoThere's your sha51203:03
GeneralAntillesYou're not encrypting passwords03:04
GeneralAntillesyou're checking file integrity. :\03:04
alteregoGeneralAntilles, yeah .. I don't know what his problem is.03:04
soothsayerGeneralAntilles: I'm downloading from an untrusted source.03:04
GeneralAntillesYou don't understand what these checksums do, do you?03:04
alteregosoothsayer, take your sha512sum and use that :P03:04
GeneralAntillesThis has NOTHING to do with security. . . .03:04
soothsayerMD5 is good for detecting non-malicious corruption03:04
soothsayerGeneralAntilles: Yes it does.03:04
* alterego chuckles.03:05
K`zanStrangely, the md5 works :)03:05
alteregoThere are plenty of people here that will vouch for the image.03:05
soothsayeralterego: What image?03:05
_Monkeyimage is downloadable?03:05
alteregoI've also just pasted the sha512sum03:05
GeneralAntillesYes, like some super hacker is jumping into the bittorrent stream to upload his l33t hacked image that is going to brick your device. :\03:05
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alteregosoothsayer, presumable the one you downloaded via bittorrent.03:05
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K`zanAh, duhhh, I stand corrected, I have a whole pile of sha things...03:06
infobotalterego meant: soothsayer, presumably the one you downloaded via bittorrent.03:06
soothsayeralterego: The hash you generated was from the torrent download?03:06
alteregosoothsayer, no. It was from the Nokia downoad03:06
alteregoI didn't use bittorrent.03:06
K`zanWas thinking it would be nice if they posted the md5 rather than the size on the website03:06
K`zanBrick this beast over a bad download, I would NOT be happy.03:07
soothsayeralterego: Thanks for sha51203:07
K`zanIs there any point in doing a backup from 2007 before re-flashing?03:07
alteregoIf you're scared of bricking, don't flash the bootloader.03:07
K`zansoothsayer: FWIW, alterego's sha512 matches mine.03:07
alteregoIf you're not scared of bricking flash /dev/urandom.03:07
alteregoK`zan, you downloaded it via bittorrent though.03:08
K`zanI ain't scared of nothin!03:08
alteregoI was the original seed (honest) and I corrupted the image to install a viruz on it.03:08
K`zanalterego: But you didn't, right?03:08
soothsayerK`zan: Thanks, but if you downloaded from bittorrent it defeats the purpose.03:08
alteregoK`zan, not if they match it doesn't.03:08
K`zanI just know you did :)03:08
K`zanGads, the doomsayers...03:09
soothsayerK`zan: Although thanks, having someone to confirm would be nice.03:09
GeneralAntillesMake a backup, K`zan.03:09
GeneralAntillesActually, you could test something for me in the process.03:09
K`zanTHe one in the menu?  or dd something?03:09
GeneralAntillesOpen up control panel, hit the navigation item and move something around in the Applications menu.03:09
alteregoI actually didn't even seed on the torrent. I was going to but then people were complaining about getting too faster download speeds. So I didn't bother and just carried on with my themes.03:09
K`zanI can do that on 2007, couldn't often in 2008 for the n810...03:09
K`zanGeneralAntilles: ---^^^03:10
GeneralAntillesDo what?03:10
_MonkeyDo is probably click the Find button on the toolbar, Components, and then uncheck Flash)03:10
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GeneralAntillesMake backups or organize the menu?03:10
GeneralAntillesEither way: TEST MAH BUG!03:11
K`zanthat == drag an app to another folder - no problem on 2007.  Out of 150 drags and drops on 2008 for the 810, it might work once.03:11
alteregoOkay, from now on I'll train Monkey out of channel :)03:11
alteregoIf I knew you could do it via priv msg I would have always done it like that :)03:11
GeneralAntillesIt works fine for me.03:11
K`zanGeneralAntilles: It WORKS on 2007 Sir!03:11
GeneralAntillesOK, good03:11
GeneralAntillesnow make a backup.03:11
alteregoK`zan, try dropping it on the actual icon of the directory.03:12
alteregoOr text ..03:12
GeneralAntillesSome bots are per-channel, so I can't blame you alterego. ;)03:12
K`zanBacking up to removable.03:12
K`zanalterego: Tried ALL that :-).03:12
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alteregoWeird .. I don't have that problem.03:13
K`zanOn text and on icon - rarely did it work.03:13
K`zanVERY rarely - but NOTE that was with 2008 for the n810, so I don't know about 2008 for the n800, will get a chance to do that tonight :-).03:13
GeneralAntillesYeah, I'm dragging stuff around right now and it works GREAT! :P03:13
GeneralAntillesIt worked fine on the N810 firmware, too.03:13
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K`zanGeneralAntilles: OK, backed up, now what?03:14
GeneralAntillesTurn it off and flash away!03:14
K`zanNot here it didn't :-(03:14
K`zanGULP, Okdokee.03:14
K`zanSheez, 15M backup.03:14
GeneralAntillesMostly PDF manuals. ;)03:14
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K`zanGeneralAntilles: Deleted all but US one of those...03:15
K`zanInstalled too much crap I guess :).03:15
GeneralAntilles(I need to turn this rig off at some point to install my new drives and drop the old ones in mah new enclosure :D)03:15
GeneralAntillesMaybe the video/song(s), then.03:15
K`zanCharger out too IIRC.03:15
K`zan./flasher-3.0 -F RX-34_2008SE_1.2007.44-4_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f03:16
K`zanGeneralAntilles: /join #vmmst03:17
alteregoPDF, video and audio take ~40M03:19
alteregoI've been storing only the EN_GB PDF on my memory cards. So everytime I reflash I can delete every file under MyDocs03:20
* czr woots03:21
czr0.4 is now ready.03:21
alteregoThat and I like to keep archives of stuff like that ..03:21
czrwhich means that maybe sometime in the near future (this week maybe), I'll be done with this .. interesting stuff.03:21
* czr celebrates by line-dancing naked03:22
* alterego takes photo's and sends them to Santa ("You know what he needs for Christmas")03:22
czroddly enough, the package got smaller again :-)03:22
czrwas 3.5 MiB. is 3.3 MiB :-)03:22
alteregoWonder how that happened ;)03:22
czrreplaced some more content with "lorem ipsum", no one reads it anyway, and it compressed far better03:23
alteregoI thought you were throwing chunks of it out of the window ;)03:23
czrneh. basically replaced some more screenshots with 4.0 stuff03:23
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czrthe old ones didn't use the highly effective picture processing pipeline (*cough*)03:24
czrthe new ones end up being smaller in size.03:24
czranyhow, sleepytime for me03:24
czrnight alterego, night others too03:24
K`zanNight czr rest well!03:25
czrit's 3:25 AM here, so yes, I plan to :-)03:25
K`zanFound my backup files (from 2007) and wants so restore?!?03:25
alteregog'night czr03:25
K`zan1725 here :), got hours to play yet :-)03:25
czroh me too. on about 6 hours :-)03:26
czrin even..03:26
alteregoI'm gonna hit the hay soon. As soon as I've finished writing these notes.03:26
K`zanLets see what happens if I let it restore, have NONE of the same apps installed...03:26
K`zanczr: Hope to get to checking everything out while installing the sdk tonight if not tomorrow.03:26
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alteregoMy first theming task is to completely customise the home screen.03:28
K`zanSeems to be restoring intelligently so far...03:28
alteregoWhich actually includes making apps look nice when they're not fullscreened ..03:28
alteregoThink I'll write a couple of helper scripts now before I go to bed actually.03:29
GeneralAntillesJust cant' stop, can you alterego. :P03:29
alteregoIf I stopped I'd just be bored :P03:29
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zerojayalterego: Maemo Ruby doesn't have any mp3 libraries with it, does it?03:30
alteregoWhilst I have the motivation I best get as much done as possible too ;)03:30
K`zanHeaven forbid :-)03:30
alteregozerojay, no. What were you looking for tag reading?03:30
alteregoWould you like me to make a package for you?03:30
K`zanDo understand the motivation part though.03:30
zerojayI'm thinking about trying out an alternate way of doing scrobbling of tracks.03:30
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zerojayThat would work with Media Player and others.03:31
zerojayWithout needing them to support it.03:31
zerojayalterego: If you have the time.03:31
alteregozerojay, if you find a Ruby MP3 lib that suits you. I'll package it and stick it in the ruby-maemo deb repository.03:31
zerojayalterego: Okay, I'll let you know when I do.03:31
alteregoI've got loads of extensions I want to do .. RMagick for one.03:32
alteregozerojay, Any extensions you want done just ask and I'll do them for you ;)03:32
K`zanFirst thing I am going to try to port is jpilot...03:33
zerojayI figure that if you do "lsof | grep mp3" and then check the program running the mp3 and see if it's known... then get the tags for the mp3 being played. If you poll once every ten seconds and you've polled past what would be the midpoint of the song, submit it.03:33
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alteregoOoo, interesting.03:34
zerojayThat way, even Media Player tracks can be scrobbled.03:34
K`zanThen I won't have to lug the Z31 and the n800 :)03:34
* alterego wonders what jpilot is.03:35
GeneralAntillesYeah, me too.03:35
zerojayIt's a cell phone app, I believe.03:35
alteregoOh, is that the aviator app?03:35
alteregoOkay, I'm way off then :)03:35
zerojayDownloading and syncing data, I think.03:35
GeneralAntilles ?03:35
alterego"Pilot" .. "Plane" ..03:35
zerojayThat would be the one.03:36
alteregoWell, I knew it was a palm I didn't realise you had to have special syncing softare :P03:36
K`zanGreat, no FBReader for 2008 :-(03:36
GeneralAntillesCheck the site. ;)03:36
zerojayMight work.03:36
K`zanI want it more for the organizer than anything else.03:36
GeneralAntillesWill it work under the Garnet emulator, K`zan?03:36
K`zanDunno, I thought I had FBReader for 2008 before, searching.03:37
alteregozerojay, that API is ugly ..03:37
zerojayYeah, it looks like it. :)03:37
zerojayI'll keep looking.03:37
alterego"hastag1?" O_o03:37
alteregoThe ruby way would be "tag1?"03:38
GeneralAntillesAlso, K`zan:
zerojayalterego: This looks good..
zerojayAh.. requires id3lib as well.03:40
alteregoWhich I think is installed in maemo.03:40
alteregoThat's a good one :)03:40
zerojayHmmm.. :)03:40
alteregozerojay, yeah. That one okay?03:40
alteregoLooks like exactly what you're after. And it binds with a maemo library :)03:41
zerojayAny way to run ruby apps as daemon + control panel (like Maemoscrobbler?)03:41
alteregoI've not tested control panel applets yet.03:41
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alteregoErm. your best bet is write multiple apps and have them communicate via osso03:42
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alteregoControl panel applets should really only be about configuring an app. Most of which should be done in gconf which your app should auto detect and act accordingly. So there's another method.03:43
alteregoSaves wrestling with osso/dbus.03:43
K`zan  --- memcache handler: Failed to connect to localhost:11211.03:45
alteregoK`zan, don't expect to work very well. Try again later ;)03:45
K`zanIs there a point to claws mail over the built in?03:45
alteregoThe built in is sh*t03:46
alteregoThough, I've not used claws so I can't comment on whether that's an improvement or not :)03:46
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K`zanOK, built in is OK for now :-)03:47
K`zanHope someone ports that FM radio applet soon....03:48
halleyflasher-3.0 for linux doesn't seem to work on osxintel, is there a better osxintel choice for n810?03:48
halleyAnyone have the -19 version ROM?  It estimates 7hrs download.03:49
GeneralAntillesYou on an N810?03:49
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alteregoJeez, there's a lot of bitching on gnome mobile :/03:50
halleyTrying to do the gainroot shuffle.03:50 about gnome mobile (Jeff someone)03:50
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alteregoThere wasn't really any point in reading it now. It's all rubbish since the last read :/03:50
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alteregoWell, I'd like to say theming is easier in OS2008 but it kind of feels the same :)03:52
alteregoOf not more complicated from some of the transparency stuff.03:52
K`zanNo ssh for 2008 yet, gurgle.....03:53
alteregoK`zan, yes there is.03:53
alteregoK`zan, enable the extras repository.03:53
GeneralAntillesopenssh is in Extras03:53
K`zanOh Goodie! Thanks!03:54
K`zanNo life without ssh :)03:54
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kupesoftFlashed the new os2008, but where's pand?03:56
kupesoft(bluetooth over ip tunnelling)03:56
K`zanWonder if a BT headset will work with the SIP clients(s)?03:58
proctoK`zan: if you have any luck with it let me know03:59
proctoI haven't03:59
proctohad any03:59
K`zanI tried it here on 2007 with no luck either - those things really are problematical with linux :-(.04:00
alteregoMeh, bedtime. Goodnight folks.04:00
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halleyThe 'sudo gainroot' step gives an error: cal_read_block(r&d_mode): size zero, block not found?04:00
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halleyI've mounted the usb and saw the usb symbol on boot, etc.04:01
K`zanDinnertime, bbl.04:01
|Rprocto : on OS 2008 ?04:01
_Monkeyrumour has it OS2007 is soon to be obsolete, replaced by OS2008 on the N800 and N81004:02
zerojaySomeone on ITT said that they had gotten it to work on 2008.04:02
_Monkeyrumour has it orly is Ya rly04:02
|Ryeah, it's supposed to be supported04:02
zerojay_Monkey forget OS200704:03
_Monkeyzerojay: I forgot os200704:03
zerojay_Monkey forget orly?04:03
_Monkeyzerojay: I forgot orly04:03
GeneralAntillesBluetooth with SIP works perfectly over here.04:03
procto_Monkey is an infobot?04:03
zerojayprocto: Yes.04:03
|Ri hope, i called a blueant V12 :)04:03
zerojayThe most annoying kind.04:03
zerojayGeneralAntilles: Mono or stereo?04:03
|Rthere is a2dp support commented out in a default config too04:04
GeneralAntillesdon't have a stereo set04:04
|R(from what i heard)04:04
GeneralAntillesA2DP is, apparently, "coming".04:04
|Rbecause there wasn't DSP support and it would suck to much battery.. but it's there or something ;)04:04
GeneralAntillesThe pickup button even works to answer.04:04
zerojayWish they would fix the Skype package.04:04
GeneralAntillesI need some room on my desk to stick the N800 with this bluetooth keyboard, but there just isn't any. <_<04:07
zerojayWhy is it that Estonia has SkypeIn, but not Canada yet?04:08
halleyAh, second try on enable-rd-mode seems to have worked.04:09
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GeneralAntillesBecause Canada sucks, duh. :P04:09
zerojaypffffffft. :)04:10
l7why doesn't canada suck?04:10
derfBecause it blows.04:11
l7i rather like canada or  at least the idea of it04:11
|Rthe idea of it?04:11
zerojayThe reality of it is quite nice too.04:11
l7canada seems like a snowy alternative to the US04:12
l7like a cold beer04:12
zerojayCanada's like the US's more relaxed and polite brother.04:12
|Rand better beer ;)04:13
derfBeer is only better cold when it has no taste.04:13
|Ras explained in the bud commercials haha :)04:14
l7yeah relaxed and polite sounds good04:14
l7less gun violence04:14
l7maybe less road rage?04:14
zerojayI was in the US for five years. It was nice.. but there's a feeling that life down there is somewhat warped.04:15
l7what did you notice?04:15
zerojayWell, religion is such a huge deal down there. People are "warriors for God", for example.04:15
l7it's hard to notice certain things when you've been in one place too long04:15
l7oh yeah, that's the republicans04:16
zerojayIn Canada, there's religion here too.... a freaking church every other block it seems, but no one feels the need to convert or force you to theirs.04:16
elbholy crap, ignorance04:16
zerojayNo, I wouldn't say that's a republican thing.04:16
deejoewe are all individuals04:16
zerojayThat's a knee-jerk reaction.04:16
elbyes, it is04:16
zerojayI lived in a red state, so I knew plenty of those.04:16
zerojayBut you don't get people coming to your door trying to convert you in Canada.04:17
deejoewhere were you, zerojay?04:17
zerojaydeejoe: Kentucky.04:17
|Rwell, we still get mormons ;)04:17
elbI've seen Mormons in every country I've been in04:17
|Rbut maybe there a bit more rare :)04:17
deejoeyeah, like *that's* typical04:17
zerojaydeejoe: Tell me about it. ;)04:17
elbin fact, I saw *more* of them in Japan, a barely Christian country, than any other place I've lived04:17
GeneralAntillesKentucky is just  TOUCH backwater. :P04:17
deejoezerojay: you might want to dial back on the extrapolation, given that.04:17
derf"Barely" is being generous.04:17
zerojayI think entertainment's dulled the senses of the general public to the point that most of them just don't care what their country is really doing... or don't care enough to do something about it.04:18
zerojayOr maybe just aren't sure what to do.04:18
l7i get the feeling people here are more aggro, whether it's in the kentucky or the big cities04:18
elbin fact, I also was in Australia for only four days, and saw two different groups of Mormons04:18
l7if you can generalize anything about a country this big04:18
deejoewhere in KY, zerojay?  I have a friend in Lexington, I lived near Henderson, know someone from Possum Trot (<-- no, seriously)04:18
elbone of them tried to convert me, then found out I was American, and lost interest ;-)04:19
zerojaydeejoe: I was in Lagrange.04:19
soothsayerDid anybody have trouble with dpkg --(get|set)-packages to backup/restore packages when going from 2007 to 2008?04:19
zerojayThe people in the US are generally really good people that are willing to help you with anything, if they aren't afraid of you, anyways.04:20
deejoegoogle maps seems not to know it, zerojay04:20
elbthat's also a generalization, zerojay :-)04:20
deejoesoothsayer: interesting question.04:20
elbprobably from being in Kentucky04:20
elbthere are plenty of places in the US where people would just as soon step on your face, as help you04:20
l7zerojay: people aren't that open in canada?04:20
elbbut, I agree, the average location in the US is quite friendly04:20
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zerojayl7: They are even more so in Canada. My wife kept on laughing about the fact that people were just coming up to her and talking to her... people she didn't know whatsoever.04:21
|Rzerojay : have you been to other provinces in canada? (as we both are in quebec, it's a bit skewed ;)04:21
l7yeah that's a big unusual compared to the US04:21
elbagain, that depends on location04:22
elbin the rural midwest, it happens a LOT04:22
elbespecially old dudes04:22
zerojay|R: I've been to parts of Ontario and some of the maritimes.04:22
|Rok :)04:22
|Ri haven't :(04:22
halleyOkay, how does one add repositories for pulling other packages in app manager?04:23
elbheh lagrange is less than 100 miles from where I grew up04:23
zerojayelb: Where's that?04:23
elb(but I was in OH)04:23
GeneralAntillesJust use that, halley.04:23
elbjust north of Cincy04:23
elbMiddletown, OH04:24
zerojayI never did get to check out Cincy much... closest I've been to really being there was spending a day or so at the Newport Aquarium.04:24
halleyGeneralAntilles, found something like it; I think I'll tinyurl it first.04:24
elbI don't particularly care for Cincy04:24
elbI mean, it's all right, but nothing special04:24
halleyGeneralAntilles, if that's the best site, thanks.04:24
elbword up halley04:25
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* halley waves.04:25
zerojayI think the best thing about Cincy was that it usually signaled the fact that my 25 hour bus rides down to Louisville were nearly over.04:25
soothsayerWhat doesn't the 'backup tool' backup that I should be backing up?04:26
soothsayer(Besides sources.list)04:26
zerojayMight not backup GPE stuff.. at least some people have said that.04:26
zerojayActually, it does back that up now.04:26
zerojayrdesktop.. is it client and server or just client?04:27
soothsayerzerojay: I imagine just the client.04:28
soothsayerIs there even an rdesktop server for Linux?04:29
derfsoothsayer: It doesn't back up the contents of your home directory.04:31
derfJust the stuff in MyDocs (I think).04:32
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soothsayerderf: Thanks04:32
gnuiteAre any devs here developing for both OS2006/2007 _and_ OS2008?04:32
gnuitePerhaps a better question is, "Are any devs here?" :)04:33
GeneralAntillesWell, hello, gnuite. I was just going to complain that there wasn't an official port of maemo mapper for OS2008. :P04:33
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derfgnuite: I will be after you work out all the problems for me.04:34
soothsayerWhat does 'flasher -k zImage -f' do?04:34
srwalteris the source to the wireless connection manager not available?04:35
zerojayFlashes the kernel only to the tablet.04:35
gnuiteYeah, well, I'm trying to work on it, but juggling OS2006 and OS2007 in the same scratchbox was hard enough, which is why I went to great lengths to keep my single codebase both OS2006- and OS2007-compatible.  Why did they have to go and make OS2008 binary-incompatible?  Grumble...04:35
soothsayerzerojay: In what instance would I do that?04:35
GeneralAntillesIt'll be better in the long run. :)04:35
derfgnuite: Progress!04:35
_Monkeyi think progress is incredible04:35
GeneralAntillesJust look at the 5-minute Transmission port.04:35
zerojayIf you wanted to update the kernel.04:35
halleyOkay, just adding "Maemo Chinook" and "Maemo Extras" for now.  Any other must-haves?  I want python.04:36
zerojaysoothsayer: I assume you are wanting to update to the 2008 beta for N800?04:36
gnuiteOh, I have no doubt that OS2008 is better.  I cursed the gtk 2.6 choice in OS2006/2007 - so many great things in gtk 2.10 that I wanted to be able to use....04:36
GeneralAntillesmaemo bora, halley.04:36
derfNot to mention the half-implemented dbus libs...04:36
soothsayerzerojay: I have the non-beta and want to upgrade to that, but was looking at instructions for the beta and can't make sense of them04:37
derf(the glib bindings for which are totally broken)04:37
zerojaysoothsayer: There is no non-beta.04:37
halleyGeneralAntilles, thanks.04:37
gnuitederf: dbus-glib works fine for Maemo Mapper.04:37
soothsayerzerojay: Alright, the beta then.04:37
halleyBora is N800?04:37
zerojaysoothsayer: You should be able to flash it with just the regular Nokia flasher programs. Are you using Linux?04:37
GeneralAntillesBora is OS200704:38
soothsayerzerojay: Yup04:38
gnuiteMixing non-glib with dbus-glib was a hazard, though.  libgpsbt kept borking my entire dbus connection.04:38
soothsayerzerojay: So no need to use the '-k,-n,-r' flags?04:38
zerojaysoothsayer: That was only done with the N810 firmware when attempting to flash to the N800.04:39
zerojaysoothsayer: ./flasher-3.0 -F RX-34_2007SE_4.2007.38-2_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R04:39
derfgnuite: Try adding signal handlers.04:39
zerojaysoothsayer: Use that, replace the filename.04:39
soothsayerzerojay: Okay thanks04:39
zerojaysoothsayer: Let us know if you have any problems.04:39
derfThere are a bunch of NULL pointer exceptions that get triggered because no one had obviously ever run the code before.04:39
gnuitederf: Ah... I haven't tried dbus handlers with dbus-glib... Glad I didn't. :)04:39
derfThat was in fact the only thing I wanted to do with it.04:40
soothsayerOne last question. Does anyone have a solution to how to, as automatically as possible, restore applications? Just getting dropbear-server installed is painful.04:40
derfI wound up using just enough of the bindings to get it into the glib main loop, and doing everything else directly with dbus.04:40
zerojayDamn.. 205 users. X_x04:41
GeneralAntillesThat we'll have from OS2008 forward, soothsayer.04:41
GeneralAntillesOpenSSH is in Chinook Extras04:41
GeneralAntillesso it's not a problem.04:41
doc|homezerojay: it probably helps that skype are based in estonia (or were) :)04:41
doc|homeanyone got the torrent link?04:41
GeneralAntillesWonder if that thread from yesterday helped at all, zerojay. :)04:41
* doc|home ponders being adventurous04:41
soothsayerGeneralAntilles: Do I need to add a repo manually?04:42
zerojayGeneralAntilles: I'd imagine it had.04:42
doc|homeor is the official server usable again?04:42
srwalteris the source to the wireless connection manager not available?04:42
zerojaydoc|home: Ah, didn't know that.04:42
GeneralAntillesI'm going to end up pasting that link a hundred thousand times before the night is over. :\04:42
doc|homethanks GeneralAntilles04:42
GeneralAntillesJust uncheck disabled, soothsayer.04:42
doc|homeGeneralAntilles: you could optic it04:42
soothsayerWhy not put it in the topic?04:42
doc|homeor topic is another idea04:43
soothsayerGeneralAntilles: Thanks04:43
doc|homeway better than optic :/04:43
zerojayI was able to pull it down at about 1MB/sec earlier today.. kind of shocked to see so many people struggling to get it.04:43
zerojayIf I had known, I would have thrown it on Jablet.04:43
halleyGeneralAntilles, is that torrent the same file as N810?  Different filename than I found.04:43
GeneralAntillesIt's the N800 beta04:43
GeneralAntillesNot for N810.04:43
zerojayMore advanced, more N800 specific bug fixes, apparently.04:44
halleyAnyone have a torrent for the N810?  Their server is giving me 5hrs download.04:44
GeneralAntillesI'd just wait until tomorrow, halley.04:44
GeneralAntilles-19 isn't much of an upgrade over -18, anyway.04:44
zerojayNo, it's not.04:44
halleyYeah, that's what I'm expecting.04:44
GeneralAntillestimeless said that there's no difference in packages, so who knows.04:44
doc|homeanyone got links on how to flash this thing under linux? I'm expecting to suck too given earlier performance04:45
doc|homew00t, 550K04:45
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doc|home3 mins to completion :)04:45
GeneralAntilles[7:52pm] <GeneralAntilles>[7:19pm] <alterego>bilboed, ./flasher-3.0 -F ./path/to/image -f04:46
GeneralAntillesas root04:46
doc|homethanks zerojay04:46
zerojaynp, but it amounts to what GA just posted.04:47
halleyopenssh installing...04:47
doc|homeaye, but I'd have to have flasher first :)04:47
GeneralAntillesHow in the world can you not have that? :P04:48
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halleyIs it just me, or is it weird that a device with a webcam would ship with no webcam app?04:49
doc|homebecause I only bought my n800 last wednesday :)04:49
srwalterthey want to community to contribute it :)04:49
doc|homehalley: personally I think the whole concept of webcams is weird :)04:49
GeneralAntillesI agree, doc|home.04:50
doc|homethere are webcam apps already04:50
GeneralAntillesand I see. :)04:50
srwalterpersonally, I want to contribute TTLS/PAP support.  but without the source, that's hard.04:50
halleydoc|home, a name?04:50
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doc|homehalley: erm, sorry, I can't remember :/04:50
halleyIt's weird, sure, but I'm thinking more of like "Photo Booth" on a mac.04:50
halleyJust a snapshot maker.04:50
GeneralAntillesCamera, but I don't think it's been ported to OS2008.04:51
* doc|home has wet pants :o04:51
doc|homestupid rain04:51
halleyThese repo installers are dependency-aware like regular apt-get, right?04:51
GeneralAntillesThe rain scared you silly? :P04:51
doc|homehalley: yep, but you have to have repos for dependencies (obviously) :)04:51
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doc|homeGeneralAntilles: no, that was the snow :(04:53
doc|homeit's somewhat disconcerting that such things as Fiasco images exist :|04:53
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halleyI walked through the "sudo ; passwd user ; echo>>sudoers ; passwd -l root" shuffle, but it said App Manager will be goofed up by this if I don't cache a sudo.  Anyone fixing App Manager to do a sudo gui passwd?04:54
halleyOh, the sample videos and music songs didn't seem to play on stock N810 either.04:58
zerojayI'm kind of surprised no one's started a tablet podcast yet.04:59
zerojayI'd do it myself, but I don't think anyone would listen and I don't think I'd get enough alone time to record anyways.05:00
oilgreat, os2008 for n800 is out05:01
deejoeout, out, or out as beta?05:02
zerojayOut as in beta.05:02
zerojayFinal = December.05:02
GeneralAntillesbeta, smeta it works great.05:02
zerojayIndeed, it does.05:02
oiluh. with this speed (2.5KB/s) I'll get the whole package after 14 hours of downloading. something wrong with the server?05:03
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soothsayerIs there an easy way to replace the ultra-bright splash images? I nearly go blind when turning the device on in the dark05:04
zerojayThat's your problem.05:04
zerojayDon't turn it off.05:04
GeneralAntillesRelated question, is there a way to make the lowest software brightness setting the same as the lowest hardware setting?05:05
zerojayBut yes, there is a way to replace the image.. I believe in the rootfs.05:05
GeneralAntillesSeriously, soothsayer, there's no reason to turn these things off.05:05
zerojayProbably can through gconf.05:05
soothsayerzerojay: Which image? The blue Nokia on white or the holding hands?05:05
zerojayBoth should be in the rootfs.05:06
zerojayI just don't ever turn the thing off.05:07
zerojayAt home, I plug it in before bed.05:07
zerojayAt work, I've got a ton of Nokia chargers everywhere.05:07
halleyzerojay, you work at Nokia?05:08
zerojayhalley: No no no.05:08
zerojayhalley: I work for a cell phone gaming company.05:08
zerojaySo we've got about 350 phones from all around the world.05:09
zerojayAbout half are Nokias.05:09
soothsayerSometimes my battery runs out but in any case I will eventually boot it in the dark and will curse those splash screens05:09
halleyGaming gambling, or gaming bejeweled?05:10
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zerojayGaming as in videogames running on cell phones.05:10
zerojayThe one and only reason I want to have Java on my N800. ;P05:10
zerojayShow off my work to my parents.05:11
halleyPygame not good enough?05:11
oilzerojay: did you see the wii-remote controlled 'game' for n95 yet?05:11
GeneralAntillesHa, don't get him started on the Wii. :P05:11
zerojayhalley: Games on cell phones are usually written for BREW or Java.. not python.05:11
oilheh. it's simply great demo :)05:11
zerojayoil: I don't see anything practical coming out of it.05:11
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zerojaySo while that sort of thing was interesting (the first 2000 times it was done), it's just old now.05:12
zerojayWiimote uses Bluetooth... we get it.05:12
K`zanLoad Aoolet in the 2008 system stuff says it is an incompatible package FWIW.05:12
zerojayoil: But I haven't seen this particular one yet, no.05:12
K`zanLoad applet05:13
_Monkeyrumour has it Load applet is an application that provides a status bar plugin that shows the CPU load and memory usage. It has a small menu that allows for easy screen-shot taking.
GeneralAntillesHa . . . look what you've done.05:13
K`zanJust tried to install that :-(.05:13
zerojaychange die bot die?05:13
_Monkeyzerojay: that doesn't look right05:13
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oilwell I saw the thing for the first time 2 days ago and tought it was neat.05:13
halleyWell, the toy worked okay.05:13
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zerojayhalley: Which one is that?05:13
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K`zanUnable to install (null) - Incompatible application package.05:14
halleyA python script using the camera api to show a live view from the webcam.  No saving video, just proof of hardware really.05:14
halleyA scary-bad low-light pinhole camera, as expected.05:14
zerojayhalley: Is it really unstable and crashy?05:14
halleyWhat, python?  Or the camera api?05:14
halleyDidn't crash in the 10sec I was running it.  ;)05:15
elbheh when I was at Hotnets in 2006, some dude was wearing an N95 around his neck, taking a photo ever 30 seconds or something and uploading it to a web server05:15
zerojayBecause almost every cam app dies repeatedly or is reallly slow.05:15
halleyIt was slow framerate.05:15
srwalterdoes the N810 camera implement V4L(2) ?05:15
srwalterI see /dev/video0, so I'll assume so :)05:15
halleySo, dumb question, how do I put app shortcuts on the "desktop"?05:16
zerojayHmm.. attempting to download maps for the Map program killed my tablet. Heh.05:16
GeneralAntillesGot twice the SD space available?05:17
halleyHm, I wish the "lock" slider would shut down wifi and screen, as well as keyboard and touch.05:17
oilzerojay: try to get gps location first and then update the maps. might work.05:17
GeneralAntillesYou could setup the powerbutton for soft power off.05:18
zerojayoil: There's no GPS. :)05:18
srwalterjust so I'm sure:  other people /can/ see these messages, right?05:18
zerojaysrwalter: Yes.05:18
oilzerojay: bluetooth05:18
srwalterhaha, success.05:18
halleyGeneralAntilles, where do I config that?05:18
GeneralAntilles /etc/mce/mce.ini05:18
zerojayoil: Yes, I know, but it just simply crashed downloading map packs.05:18
zerojayNot the maps for wherever I was.05:19
oilzerojay: I know. it did the same for me as well with another package.05:19
zerojayARgh.. for some reason, my tablet is taking contacts assigned to my Jablet account and assigns them to Google talk..05:20
zerojayEven after I changed it.05:20
zerojaySo those people just don't show up as online anymore.05:21
oilhm.. to get the WLAN AP MAC address. I can get it after I install wireless-tools and then with iwconfig. BUT is there a way to get the wlan mac addr without installing extra packages to n800?05:21
zerojayAbout device in Control Panel.05:21
GeneralAntillesEven better!05:22
halleyGeneralAntilles, any sighup or do I have to reboot?05:22
GeneralAntillesOpen the back panel. ;)05:22
halleyoil, it's printed in the battery bay; jot it down.05:22
oilaccesspoint MAC address, not the device itself05:22
oilWLAN0=`ifconfig wlan0 | grep wlan0 | grep HWaddr | cut -d\r -f3`05:23
oilAP=`iwconfig wlan0 | grep 'Access Point:' | cut -d\: -f 4-`05:23
srwalterdoes the N800 have the same wifi chip as the N810/05:23
oilbut this needs wireless-tools and I'd like to get the AP MAC without installing extra programs05:23
WillySillysrwalter: afaik the 800 and 810 do have the same05:25
halleyGeneralAntilles, thanks.  Seems to come back from softpoweroff with wifi disabled.  Looking back at that config file.05:26
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GeneralAntillesIt's further down05:26
GeneralAntillesChange the exit setting to restore05:26
_MonkeyGeneralAntilles: that doesn't look right05:26
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GeneralAntillesShut up, _Monkey, you bitch!05:27
doc|homeso, erm, how do you backup your stuff?05:28
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doc|homeman, that's way easier than it should be05:31
doc|homeare we really using linux? :)05:32
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halleyGeneralAntilles, the "connectivity policy when running on battery" refers to what to do when ENTERING softpoweroff mode, right?05:33
GeneralAntillesI've got an empty drive enclosure.05:33
GeneralAntillesNow I need some drives. :\05:33
GeneralAntillesDon't think so, halley.05:34
GeneralAntillesLet me check it05:34
halleyThere's one for power, one for battery, then the one you were talking about for LEAVING softpoweroff mode.05:34
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GeneralAntillesYes, you're correct05:35
* doc|home giggles a little :o05:35
halleyAnd "tklock" refers to the touch/key lock slider?05:35
GeneralAntillesthe first is entering soft poweroff when charger is connected and the second is on battery.05:35
GeneralAntillesMust be.05:35
halleyHeh, the "camera popout" is irrelevant on N810.05:36
GeneralAntillesYeah, no kidding.05:38
halleyHm, there's no .bashrc equivalent for busybox is there?05:39
halleyGots ta have me 'll' and 'dir'.05:40
GeneralAntilles(stab in the dark)05:40
halleyGoogle agrees.05:40
doc|homehmmm, I'm also getting massive-menuitis, can that be changed?05:41
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srwalteris the wireless connection manager on the N810 open source?05:43
matt_cman I was hoping that the poor download server would have had a chance to breathe by now.05:44
halleyGeneralAntilles, it liked .profile05:45
GeneralAntillesDoubtful, srwalter.05:46
GeneralAntillescheck maemo.org05:46
srwalterI have, and haven't seen it there05:46
srwalterbah.  it seems like it'd be so easy to add TTLS/PAP support to it05:46
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srwalterthey support TTLS/MSv2CHAP already, and PAP is way simpler.  is plaintext!05:46
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WillySillysrwalter: I think they use NetworkManager for that, which is under the GPL or LGPL05:47
srwalterif that's true, where does nokia typically publish their sources?05:49
WillySillysrwalter:  afaik05:50
Mmm810Ne1 know if the wifi drivers 810 use are open source, is it atheros chipset also05:50
halleyHm, I wonder if I want to adjust the LED options; it "snores" in blue whether wifi is enabled or not.05:51
zerojayDon't believe it is open source.05:51
WillySillyMmm810: Its not an atheros05:51
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WillySillyMmm810: and some of the driver is open source, the rest is binary05:51
GeneralAntillesYou can turn that off in control panel, halley.05:52
srwaltercx3110x is the chip05:52
halleyI don't mind snoring, if it's informative.05:52
GeneralAntillesThe wifi drivers are closed.05:52
srwalterreally?  I'm looking at some of the source05:52
GeneralAntillesI'm 90% certain.05:53
WillySillysrwalter: the part were it interfaces with the kernel is the only part thats open05:53
srwalterI see05:53
GeneralAntillesIf they were open, then wouldn't we have packet injection?05:53
WillySillyrest is binary05:53
srwalterso umac is binary?05:53
srwalterahh, indeed:05:53
srwaltercx3110x 56200 0 - Live 0xbf04100005:53
srwalterumac 258788 1 cx3110x, Live 0xbf000000 (P)05:53
doc|homehow do you accept the layout in the 2008? it's annoying on the rss reader, it keeps moving :/05:53
srwalter(P) means proprietary05:53
zerojayYou can disable that, doc|home05:53
srwalterwoohoo, there is source to osso-wlan!  Thanks again, WillySilly05:54
zerojayOh, you're talking about the locking home apps.05:54
zerojayThey don't lock in place like the older versions used to.05:54
WillySillysrwalter: no problem, glad I could help05:54
doc|homezerojay: yep, I want it, I just don't want it moving :)05:54
zerojayIt doesn't move so long as you don't drag it.05:54
WillySillyTrying to upgrade libglib2.0-0 with 2007HE, but when I do, it bricks it05:54
doc|homeand which seems to be every time I try to scroll :/05:55
zerojayThen you need to recalibrate. :)05:55
Mmm810Ohhh really osso-wlan awesome, yes bring on the packet injection05:55
srwalterwhat is this packet injection and why does everyone want it?05:55
doc|homeI think it's my hands which need calibration :) still, locking was useful, the scrollbar is narrow05:55
zerojayI just leave it there autoscrolling and when I see something, I use the RSS feed reader.05:56
GeneralAntillesRSS applet is useless05:56
GeneralAntillesCPU hog and space in-efficient.05:56
zerojayDisagree about it being useless.05:56
zerojayWhen I'm working, I just leave it up with that.. use it as sort of an informative tiny 3rd screen.05:57
GeneralAntillesWhat's with the LEDs on drive enclosures being so ridiculously bright these days?05:57
GeneralAntillesI swear they're using 1-watters.05:57
hexalanyone having problems with os2008 and kagu.. missing libbz2 and libgdbm3 ? .. weird thing is I cat /etc/apt/sources.list.. and there's nothing there.. I wonder where the reps are :(05:58
doc|homeok, this applet's way too annoying, it's gone05:58
GeneralAntillesls /etc/apt05:59
GeneralAntillesit's got another extension05:59
hexalGeneralAntilles, ho k I see in .d05:59
WillySillyanyone using 2007HE?06:01
WillySillypupnik: do you have gps-saver installed?06:03
Mmm810I cant believe on 810 there's no keyboard shortcut for the app menu, you have to tap to bring up06:04
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zerojayI thought there was the menu button for that?06:05
pupnikhow is the gps working for you Mmm81006:05
doc|homeyou flash bastards with your n810s :(06:06
doc|home2008 is much faster :)06:06
Mmm810It brings up the home panel applet menu, not the main app menu06:06
zerojayThat's the application menu. :)06:06
halleyThere.  My power button does nothing on shortpress, does softpoweroff on longpress, and does menu on doublepress.06:07
Mmm810Um seems not so powerful on gps took while to find sats one time i tried in back yard in so cal06:08
halleyAnd my tklock shuts off screen immediately.06:08
halleyMmm810, any gps will take 40sec to lock ephemeris.06:08
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halleyI haven't tried the n810 gps yet.06:08
K`zanJust tried to install that garnet-vm thing and it is missing apps it requires (don't ya love complete packages)?06:09
pumpkinI'm having trouble with libcurl on my scratchbox :-/06:09
K`zanAnyone got an idea where jildon-fm1, hildon-libs0 and libdbus-1-2 might be found?06:09
Mmm810Hmm well whatever correct name for menu, i mean main app menu three green one blue square no key for it have to tap06:10
zerojayMaybe.. but it's not like that's hard to do. :)06:10
K`zanAnyone got an idea where hildon-fm1, hildon-libs0 and libdbus-1-2 might be found?06:10
K`zanoops, ww06:10
pumpkinanyone know what might be causing errors like ?06:11
Mmm810Cool on gps maybe normal strength then i didn't buy for that only used once so far06:11
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pumpkinit doesn't explain how my libs are incompatible06:11
halleyHm, what repo to try pygame?06:11
zerojayI thought python was in the extras?06:11
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Prez__anyone else downloading n800 it2008 beta?06:11
halleyNot python, pygame.06:11
zerojayhalley: Yes, it's included.06:12
doc|homeyou know how the wifi seems to be uberpowerful? is it possible tp underclock it to conserve power?06:12
halleyOh!  Didn't expect that.06:12
zerojayI think it is, anyways.06:12
Mmm810Not  hard for app menu but when you need it all the time it sucks no key slows you down06:12
K`zanPrez__: Got it earlier and already installed :-), so far so good other than a lot of apps not ported yet.06:12
pumpkinanyone have any dev help?06:12
elbPrez__: people have been complaining about that all day06:13
Prez__K`zan: cool... it is downloading incredibly slow..06:13
Prez__7 hours to go..06:13
K`zanPrez try the torrent:  Yes, that's the one :-) Thanks doc|home06:14
K`zanAnyone got an idea where hildon-fm1, hildon-libs0 and libdbus-1-2 might be found?06:14
_Monkeyit has been said that Extras is (distribution: "bora" for n800, "gregale" for n770) (components="free non-free")06:14
K`zanAnyone got an idea where hildon-fm1, hildon-libs0 and libdbus-1-2 might be found?  For the garnet-vm thingie...06:15
_MonkeyExtras is (distribution: "bora" for n800, "gregale" for n770) (components="free non-free")06:15
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Prez__much better, thanks06:15
Mmm810How do you get like pipe symbol on term toolbar.  Tried entering pipe worked until i exited then no more...06:15
skiburrWhere can I download OS2008 bin file?  The one on is very slow.06:16
K`zanNope, got extras enabled, not there :-(.06:16
halleyMmm810, hit Chr button, scroll around in the thing that pops up.06:17
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K`zantorrent - MUCH faster06:17
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skiburro ok06:17
K`zanI started downloading it about noon here and I'd still be downloading it from the maemo site...06:18
skiburrthanks for the link06:18
K`zannp, enjoy!06:18
Mmm810Thanks i can put it on toolbar that way but doesn't keep working, perhaps bug06:18
skiburrwhy don't you download it via torrent?06:18
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K`zanI did :-)06:18
skiburro ok06:18
K`zanHours ago now :-) Already installed and running.06:19
doc|homehmmm, openssh ?06:20
_Monkeyhmmm... openssh is there hmm.06:20
*** doc|home changes topic to "maemo - development platform for Nokia Internet Tablets | | | |"06:21
doc|homenobody saw me put that there, ok? :o06:21
Mmm810Man no tab key either i hate tapping toolbar hehe06:21
skiburrcan I flash via windows xp?06:24
skiburror must be linux?06:24
doc|homeopenssh anyone?06:24
zerojayWindows is fine as well if you use the Nokia flasher.06:24
doc|homeah, nm, found it06:25
halleydoc|home, openssh is in the maemo extras repo06:25
halleyMy pygame script works.  Now to bang it into shape for use.06:25
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halleyThe device is 800x480, but if I don't go fullscreen, what window size should I ask for, to fit nicely in maemo?06:26
pumpkin_I hate scratchbox06:26
K`zanWell, that is a bit disappointing, the missing stuff for garnet :-(.06:27
pumpkin_I ****ING HATE SCRATCHBOX06:30
pumpkin_okay, I'm done :)06:30
skiburrthe win flasher is the 2007 version?06:30
zerojayDownload the bin file you need, then point the flasher to the bin file.06:31
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skiburro ok06:32
skiburr770 version?06:32
K`zanI think I may be going back to 2007 again, sigh.06:33
zerojayK`zan: Why?06:33
K`zanMissing libs on stuff I really COULD use...06:33
K`zanIn this case garnet-vm (palm stuff).06:33
Prez__is anyone booting n800 from SD?06:34
Prez__read it's supposed to be faster, worth it?06:34
K`zanNext time I do this, I think there will have to be 150+ apps avail :).06:34
zerojayMuch rather have 2008 than sitting behind waiting on a few apps that may never be ported.06:34
Mmm810I gather the tablet screens are made with touch by finger in mind, not just stylus.  If you add screen protecter does it interfere with tap by finger...06:35
K`zanzerojay: Apparently: hildon-fm1, hildon-libs0 and libdbus-1-2 are not available for this one...06:35
doc|homeMmm810: it's bound to :/06:35
K`zanPerhaps I should have downloaded the one for the n81006:35
K`zanLemme try that.06:35
zerojaylibdbus-1-2 should be part of the firmware already, I believe.06:36
zerojayActually, all of that should be.06:36
Mmm810Ahh okay thanks im new to tablets so still getting used to idea it's actually ok to touch screen06:37
K`zanzerojay: Apparently not here :-(.06:37
zerojayLet me see what I have installed.06:37
K`zanMissing those is why it barfed...06:37
zerojayor better yet, where you installed garnet from.06:37
K`zanHave to download the deb from them and install from file.06:38
K`zanGuess I need to turn on red pill to see the nuts and bolts of what is installed here.06:38
zerojayYes, but which one did you take?06:38
K`zanGoing for the n810 one now.06:39
zerojayThat's probably your error right there.06:39
K`zanGot it, will let you know in a sec...06:39
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doc|homehmmm, I can't seem to ssh into my n800. neither rootme nor the password I set before flashing work06:42
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halleyK`zan, you have an n810?06:43
K`zanNo, n80006:43
K`zanSeem unable to copy from the system here to the SD card on the n800, wtf?!?06:44
doc|homesuggestions anynone?06:44
halleydoc|home, if you reflash, you have no openssh.06:45
halleydoc|home, if you installed openssh, you may need to reboot?06:45
doc|homehalley: I've installed it since06:45
doc|homehmmm, ok, will try that, although sshd is responding as I'd expet06:45
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halleyOh, responding but not allowing login?06:46
Mmm810Well on 810 u can get becomeroot here if u need root
Prez__or set to r&d mode and easy to get to root06:46
Mmm810Rootme didn't work on my 81006:46
halleyHas anyone used the maemo cjk support?06:47
K`zanzerojay: OK, the n810 one worked on the n800.  Safe to assume at this point I want n810 apps and not n800?06:48
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halleywb, GeneralAntilles.06:48
zerojayK`zan: Until the final update is out, I would imagine.06:48
GeneralAntillesThanks, swapping drives around06:48
GeneralAntillesJust added another TB06:49
halleyGeneralAntilles, played with ?06:49
K`zanzerojay: OK, thanks.  This is kind of confusing ATM :)06:49
GeneralAntillesNope, halley.06:49
doc|homeok, reboot, still giving me permission denied :/06:49
zerojayMight be interesting to some of you.06:50
halleydoc|home, you are trying to log in as user@ or root@ ?06:50
skiburris OS2008 beta working ok?06:50
doc|homehalley: root06:50
Mmm810Install Becomeroot changepass?06:50
halleydoc|home, may not be allowed; try user@06:50
halleydoc|home, by default, openssh on other platforms has config that disallows root@06:50
doc|homeMmm810: would rather not install r&d stuff if possible but will remember that as a last resort, thanks06:51
doc|homehalley: thanks, will try that06:51
K`zanThis thing may only work with the wincrap version of palm desktop :-(.06:51
Mmm810Openssh allows it by default i installed yesterday had to change to no in config myself06:51
doc|homeno luck06:52
|Rhalley : I'm installing it for Gjiten right now... damn it's big ;)06:53
halley|R, on n810 rom?06:53
|Rah uh non...06:54
halley|R, what repo is Gjiten?06:54
halleyYeah, n810 just refused the n800 single-click.06:55
* halley sighs.06:55
pumpkin_what does it mean when apt-get says 89 not upgraded06:56
skiburrAnybody have problems with OS2008 N800?06:56
pumpkin_why isn't it upgrading stuff?06:56
GeneralAntillesNope, skiburr.06:56
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|Rhalley : of gjiten or cjk ?06:56
skiburrI just flashed my N80006:57
skiburrlooking good06:57
|Ryeah, well the install references a non existing package06:57
|Rit tries to install maemo-japanese-support instead of maemo-japanese-support-n800 in my case06:57
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Mmm810Is anyone using claws-mail, is it buggy..06:58
K`zanGreat gotta run wincrap to sync garnet.06:59
pumpkin_why is it easier for me to develop on a closed, undocumented platform like the iphone than it is on maemo :(06:59
pupniktrollish comment06:59
pumpkin_sorry, but I'm really frustrated with it right now07:00
K`zanWelcome to my world pumpkin_ :-), this too shall pass.07:00
pupnikpumpkin_: you are unable to apt-get update?07:00
K`zanmethinketh garnet goes in the crapper, NOTHING is worth running wincrap for.07:00
pumpkin_I'm unable to get libcurl working, which led to me deleting stuff, which led to a load of packages being removed, and so on :)07:01
pumpkin_so I restored my snapshot of my vm07:01
pupniki have a libcurl built07:01
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pupniki think07:01
pumpkin_and in doing so lost a day of work07:01
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pumpkin_there's a libcurl in apt07:01
K`zanNo, they just couldn't use the USB port...07:01
Mmm810Thanks hmm maybe ill see if full source for oss-email is available. I want some changes07:01
K`zanGrowl, snarl, grumble...07:02
K`zanBack to having to port jpilot...07:02
pumpkin_what's the point of having both SDK_x86 and SDK_ARMEL?07:03
pumpkin_my main issue was that the libcurl I had installed x8607:03
pumpkin_and my armel linker refused to touch it07:03
pumpkin_X86 is just for testing locally?07:04
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pupnikand profiling07:04
_Monkeysomebody said profiling was generating statistics about how much time a program spends in different routines07:04
pumpkin_ah well, a long night awaits me :P07:05
doc|homeman, why can't libgdbm just be part of the normal install? :/07:07
doc|homeor repo rather07:07
pumpkin_is it just me, or is really slow right now?07:09
pumpkin_I'm getting a few kbps out of it :-/07:09
milhousenot just you07:09
doc|home* have been kinda sucky today :/07:10
milhousewhole of is on a go slow - the servers must be based in France07:10
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infobotmilhouse meant: whole of is on a go slow - the server must be based in France07:10
pumpkin_lol, that bot actually performs the replacement for you?07:10
infobotpumpkin_ meant: s/replace/replace07:11
milhousebut not if you forget the trailing slash :)07:11
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doc|homegoddamn it, I have an n800! stop asking me if I want to enable ggps07:14
halleyGee, I'm 50% on the -19 rom download.07:17
GeneralAntillesProbably not a worthwhile upgrade, anyway. ;)07:17
halleyI know, but I have to work through the process once and put down my notes.  The instructions all over the web are so scattered!07:18
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GeneralAntillesFor flashing?07:18
GeneralAntillesIt's super easy. :\07:18
oilanyone know how to pass gps information to the maemo-mapper from the command line?07:18
halleyFor the whole "box to usable" sequence.07:19
GeneralAntillesThat's even easier with OS200807:19
GeneralAntillesJust make a backup and let it do it for you.07:19
halleySo the new backup will backup stuff like mce.ini?07:19
halleyNot just ~/ ?07:19
GeneralAntillesNot mce.ini07:20
pumpkinso I can't seem to get 3.2 upgraded07:20
halleySee, "box to usable"  ;)07:20
halleyI also have to figure out the Japanese input methods, etc.07:20
pumpkinnihongo wa muzukashii07:21
pumpkinhanasanai hoo ga ii :P07:22
halleyWell anyone could do romaji.07:22
pumpkinI can do kotoeri on my mac, too07:22
pumpkinnever tried on the n800 though07:23
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GeneralAntillesCould wikipedia maybe find a less horrifying picture?
* GeneralAntilles pukes.07:24
halleyIn terms of the bloody scalp bits in the keyboard, or just the keyboard layout itself?07:25
K`zanProibably, but they would have to work at it :)07:25
astro76is that blood?07:25
unique311so it looks like its going to take 5 hours to dl the firmware for the n80007:25
unique311guess alot of people must be dl it right now07:25
doc|homeunique311: see topic07:25
K`zanunique311: That and the site sucks anyway :-(.07:25
GeneralAntilles :P07:26
unique311got it07:26
halleyAnyway, sleepy time.07:26
unique311so nokia don't mind the torrent?07:26
doc|homedoes mplayer work on the n810?07:26
doc|homeer, sorry, 200807:26
GeneralAntillesI doubt they know about it.07:26
halleyunique311, whether they mind or not, the md5sums are listed.07:26
GeneralAntillesBut if they didn't want people mirroring it, they should probably have a less-shitty server. ;)07:27
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unique311don't understand, speed has always been great on the past firmware dls.07:27
GeneralAntillesThey're getting smashed and their servers suck. :P07:28
GeneralAntillesMostly, their servers suck.07:28
halleyHave we mentioned that their servers suck?07:28
GeneralAntillesOh, yeah, and their servers suck.07:28
GeneralAntillesIt's not that hard to put together servers that don't suck.07:29
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|Ranyone tried n800-2007 -> n800-2008b video chat? it fails with a friend here...07:29
GeneralAntillesIt's as easy as throwing dollars at it until capacity is meets demand.07:29
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Prez__K`zan: how did restore of settings work with it2008 beta?07:30
unique311GeneralAntilles, u lucky the die hard nokia employees are not in here to defend nokia07:30
GeneralAntillesIt's even more baffling that they do their site testing on the live site. :\07:30
unique311if this update is screwed, i'll just go back to n810's firmware.07:31
pupnik_i figure they're kind of relaxed about it all07:31
pupnik_which i like07:31
unique311both of my cards got picked up on the latest n81007:31
pupnik_oh server's slow?  oh well07:31
unique311so that made me happy07:31
pupnik_you got one?07:31
GeneralAntillesWell, it doesn't get more authoritative than that.07:32
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GeneralAntillesStill, you gotta dig Nokia and maemo, despite their shitty servers. :p07:32
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doc|homeyoutube is only jsut watcheable07:32
GeneralAntillesStill helps to let it load.07:33
GeneralAntillesThen it's fine.07:33
doc|homeso, er, then should we be posting that torrent link to people?07:33
doc|homethey could have an eula for the .torrent07:33
|R"do you agree to d/l a torrent from approved by nokia?"07:34
*** doc|home changes topic to "maemo - development platform for Nokia Internet Tablets | | |"07:34
|Rthat would rock :)07:34
* doc|home whistles innocently07:34
doc|home|R: heh, why not? :)07:34
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unique311so youtube playback on the new beta firmware for the n800 still suck?07:34
GeneralAntillesStop making my job harder. :P07:34
GeneralAntillesWorks fine over here.07:34
doc|homeunique311: nope, it's watchable07:34
doc|homebetter than it was, skips a little sometimes07:34
unique311watchable, don't like that07:34
unique311is is on the n810's level.07:35
doc|homeyeah, that's youtube though :)07:35
pumpkin[sbox-SDK_ARMEL: ~] > file /scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/lib/
pumpkin /scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/lib/ ELF 32-bit LSB shared object, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV), not stripped07:35
unique311i already see 2 flashes in my future07:35
pumpkinanyone know what to do about that?07:35
GeneralAntilles"not stripped"07:36
GeneralAntillesMay it wants you to run it naked?07:36
pumpkinnah, the fact that it's Intel 80386 and not arm07:36
unique311maybe nokia should have a private tracker, like most linux distro's do for those dvd image downlaods.07:37
unique311and place the torrent link after the eula check.07:37
unique311that would work out, and be completely legal.07:38
pumpkinanyone have any idea?07:38
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unique311anyways just dl that torrent in less than 5 minutes.07:40
unique311much faster than the 5 hours showing on the regular dl07:40
pupnik_"Ever since I quit running from girls I've understood that the world is a very subjective place." - Texrat07:40
pumpkinmy curl libs are the wrong arch07:41
pupnik_pumpkin: yes07:41
pupnik_yeah you want arm stuff in armel sbox target :)07:41
unique311pupnik, you related to pumpkin by any chance?07:41
pupnik_surely yes07:42
pumpkinpupnik_: how can I get arm stuff in my armel sbox target? :) :) :)07:42
pumpkinthat underscore at the end of his name07:42
pumpkinis my missing m07:42
pupnik_set up a new target with the menu07:42
pumpkinand then he's my anagram07:42
konttoriI'm going to meet some nokia legal (very much related to todays discussion). I will ask whether torrent could be an option in the future.07:42
unique311when i first saw the nick in here. i thought pupnik had a nick change.07:42
pupnik_then install an armel rootstrap and choose your cpu transparency07:42
Prez__anyone restored backup settings from IT2007 into new IT2008?07:42
pumpkinwhat devkits should I put on?07:43
pupnik_konttori: posisbly but then anyone can share the torrent file and bypass the ID check07:43
unique311konttori, it should, especiall if the torrent is hosted after the eula check.07:43
pupnik_pumpkin: i have older one here not 3.x07:43
unique311private trackers.07:43
pumpkinah ok07:43
konttorianyone can share it on their ftp site http site or whatnot now. I don't see the difference07:43
pupnik_pumpkin: debian, cputransp07:44
pumpkinyeah, done those07:44
skiburrhum.. on the beta version, OS2008 can someone access the "Download" page on  N800 - OS200807:44
pumpkinnow trying to navigate the curses menu to tell it where to grab the rootstrap07:44
pupnik_pumpkin: then you must have gotten the wrong root filesystem unpacked into it07:44
unique311should be a way to keep people who do the eula check to dl only07:44
pumpkinhmm, I just used the 3.1 installer followed by the 3.2 installer07:44
pumpkinhaven't done anything myself yet07:45
konttoriI suppose if you don't register to tracker, nokia servers wouldn't send you any packages, so the result should be same legal wise.07:45
pumpkinjust the automated scripts07:45
GeneralAntillesPrez__, yes, works fine. The only stumbling point would be if you've messed with the prefs.js for MicroB.07:45
unique311konttori, they can share it, but certain private trackers don't alllow dl, even if you dl the torrent file.07:45
Prez__GeneralAntilles: nope, so here I go, time to flash to IT200807:46
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pumpkinpupnik_: the install script claims I don't need to do the rootstrap myself07:47
pumpkinbut I guess it's wrong07:47
unique311konttori, bring up the money nokia would save on bandwidth cost, they will look into it.. ;)07:47
pumpkinor it messed up somehow07:47
|Ris there something that is known to conflict with rtcomm beta? i just realised that i couldn't hear what the other was saying even though i can hear sounds from the OS and he can hear me...07:48
pupnik_pumpkin: ok i don't think i've used that script - you should be able to set up another target without reinstalling scratchbox07:48
pumpkinpupnik_: nope, re-extracted the armel rootstrap07:49
|R(it was wokring well 2 weeks ago last time i checked..)07:49
skiburrI can't access "Download" page on OS2008.  Browser just exits.07:49
pumpkinand I still have x86 libcurl :-/07:49
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oilkonttori: do you take bug reports for ukmp in this channel as well ;)07:49
pupnik_pumpkin: only x86 libcurl?  the rest of the libs are armel?07:49
pumpkinhaven't checked07:49
pumpkinit's just the one that fails in my make07:50
konttorialthough there is a bugzilla for ukmp in here:
oilkonttori: I wrote this one, but to wrong forum. I guess, I should change it to the bugzilla07:50
GeneralAntilleskonttori, flew out to California and back for Thanksgiving with UKMP. It was a pleasure, thanks. :)07:51
konttorihey, if anyone has a fresh install of n800 firmware, could you try to install ukmp:
konttorithere was a problem with missing dependencies some time ago.07:51
GeneralAntillesI believe I had to enable Bora Extras.07:51
konttoriGeneralAntilles: Good to hear that you enjoyed it.07:52
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konttoriahh. I had to enable (not extras). Ahh.. I'll just then work out the .install to contain the
GeneralAntillesYeah, actually, it wasn't extras.07:53
GeneralAntillesBut, Bora, yes.07:53
GeneralAntilleslibgdbm3, I think.07:53
konttorioil: ahh.. you have the depth issue. I recently lowered the depth. I guess I should raise it back to the previous depth.07:53
konttoriyou can do so from the python code easily as well if you are interested in fixing it immediately07:53
pumpkinthis is effing annoying :(07:54
oilkonttori: which file?07:54
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konttoriI think that library exists in many places BUT extras ;)07:54
konttorijust edit /usr/bin/ukmp07:54
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konttoriahh.. no. edit /usr/bin/MediaCenter.py07:55
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oilok. ukmp file was kind of a short :)07:55
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Prez__flash went well07:55
* doc|home just got imap working for the first time :D07:56
oilah. there is also the definition of the memory-card used. I'm having normally mmc2 installed and mmc1 missing.07:56
doc|homeflashing button is a great idea07:56
skiburryoutube is much faster07:58
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Prez__IT2008 looks great!07:58
doc|homeif I use server.domain.tld:543 for example for outgoing smtp server, is there any reason it shouldn't work (given that the connection works from another computer)?07:59
Prez__facebook still looks screwy... doesn't fit08:00
* |R thinks gjiden+cjk is unusable :|08:00
konttorioil: do you have the 1.70 version of ukmp?08:00
oilkonttori: depth is definen on class songProcessor if (test and depth<5): ?08:00
oilkonttori: yes.08:00
konttoriThen just by increasing that to 7 should fix your problem08:01
oilkonttori: thanks. and done. now testing08:01
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Prez__gmail looks better08:02
K`zanNight folks...08:02
Prez__is this thing faster? seems faster08:02
GeneralAntilles'night, K`zan.08:02
skiburrPrez___ do me a favor.  check if you can view the "Download" page on because on my N800 - OS2008 Beta, it exits.08:03
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Segnale007Hi there08:03
_Monkeyhey, Segnale00708:03
skiburrBrowser just exits08:03
Segnale007heya <_Monkey>08:03
Prez__i´m there08:04
konttorioil: did it fix the issue you had?08:04
Prez__no crash so far08:04
oilkonttori: I need a bit more time to do testing. I have managed to remove all the files on the memorycard.08:05
konttoriahh... ok. no probs.08:06
* konttori leaves08:06
Prez__is the n800 supposed to be faster? seems quite a bit snappier..08:07
Prez__using it200808:08
skiburrI noticed it08:09
skiburrhumm.... my browser still crashing08:09
doc|homePrez__: it is faster08:13
doc|homethe new image supports cpu throttling so they throttle to 190Mhz and then it can bump up to 400Mhz instead of just running at 300 all the time08:14
GeneralAntilles165 and 33008:15
Segnale007I have just pay my new N800 on ebat08:15
Segnale007I have take it in the States08:16
Segnale007pay 220$08:16
Segnale007it's nothing08:16
Prez__is there an xterm fro IT2008?08:16
GeneralAntillesWhy, Segnale007?08:16
Segnale007in italy it cost 260?08:16
Segnale007why what ?08:17
Segnale007wht I have take it in States ?08:17
Segnale007because it coast nothing there08:17
Segnale007in Italy cost 260 ?08:17
Segnale007aroud 400$08:18
Segnale007and it is brand now08:18
oilkonttori: ukmp can find now all the files. thanks!08:18
pumpkinche dit'ar culo08:18
Segnale007with 1 year of warranty Nokia08:18
Segnale007sei italiano ?08:18
Segnale007ops ..08:18
pumpkinmore or less :)08:19
Segnale007but .. now .. I have to wait around 10 days08:19
Segnale007for get it in Italy08:19
Segnale007it is in Florida right now08:19
oilwith what speed are you able to download the os2008 and where? I'm getting 3KB/s to Thailand.. it did speedup from 2.5 :)08:19
Segnale007I'm Italian08:20
Segnale007but between08:20
Segnale0071 month08:20
Segnale007I come back to Toronto08:20
Segnale007fuck Italy08:20
pumpkinah :)08:20
pumpkinI'm not italian but I've lived in rome most of my life08:20
Segnale007I have lived for 7 months in Toronto08:20
pumpkinand as I'm sure you've determined, I'm slightly annoyed08:21
Segnale007I like Canada08:21
Segnale007and all conuntry in North America08:21
oilGeneralAntilles: thanks. I'll try that one (but first need to learn how to download my first torrent :)08:21
Segnale007too States08:21
[pablo]_anyone else unable to watch youtube videos on the latest os2008 for n810? it's telling me that i dont have flash08:22
Segnale007but I think .. the country's in the States is so big for me08:23
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Segnale007just I lose myself in Toronto08:23
Segnale007and isn't big08:23
Prez__what repositories do u guys recommend for it2008 on n800?08:26
Segnale007but the default os running on n800 is it2007 ?08:27
Segnale007I don't know more about it ..08:27
toresbeSegnale007: IIRC, N800s ship with 2006, actually08:28
toresbe(mine did, at least)08:28
Segnale007ah .. I see08:28
GeneralAntillesErm, wtf are you talking about, toresbe?08:28
Segnale007ty man ..08:29
GeneralAntillesOS2006 is 770 only.08:29
toresbeGeneralAntilles: *shrug* I can only tell you what mine shipped with08:29
GeneralAntillesN800's currently and have always shipped with OS200708:29
GeneralAntillesTrust me, it didn't ship with OS2006.08:29
GeneralAntillesOS2006 WILL NOT WORK on an N800.08:29
toresbeTrust me, it did.08:29
GeneralAntillesTrust me, it wont work.08:29
toresbeLook, it's my bloody N800, I know what it ran.08:29
Prez__GeneralAntilles: thanks... just jabbered link to n800 :-)08:30
GeneralAntillesUnless you happen to work for Nokia and have access to very early prototypes.08:30
GeneralAntillesIt ran OS200708:30
toresbemight have been something internal to Nokia, though, since I got my N800 through my cousin who works there08:30
milhouseComment from Quim about the speed/performance problems today (in case you haven't seen it yet):
Segnale007it internal hd is 4gb right ?08:32
oilbittorrent does work well. (I always tought it was slow). 200KB/s. nice.08:32
Segnale007it's enough 4gb for ur sw ?08:32
GeneralAntillesThere aren't any internal HDs in Internet Tablet devices, Segnale007.08:32
|Ranyone had rtcomm not being able to play sound comming from the other end?08:33
skiburrAm I the only one that has Browser crashing on "Download" page on  N800 - OS200808:33
GeneralAntillesIt's a NAT issue, |R.08:33
|RGeneralAntilles : well, it worked before through nat... but even now i do n800 -> local gw asterisk -> local sip phone and it's the same :(08:34
|Rmaybe i'm crazy uhm...08:34
milhouseskiburr - did you restore your backup from OS2007?08:36
|Rno known conflicts were ever found between rtcomm and some other application?08:36
skiburrflashing and not restoring 2007 to 2008 settings08:36
skiburr now...08:37
GeneralAntillesMaybe Gizmo or Skype, |R.08:37
milhouseSomeone on IIT is saying they had the same problem when they restored their OS2007 backup - they suggest not restoring your backup08:37
milhouseHere's their post:
milhouseMight be an idea to open a bug and attach your backup...08:38
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* |R is wondering what he has changed recently, if any, that could affect this :|08:38
Prez__love this IT2008, seems like a big step up from IT2007...08:39
Prez__look/feel plus speed..08:39
Segnale007how have u upgrade it OS ?08:40
Segnale007have u some link about ?08:40
skiburrMilhouse, it works fine now08:41
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skiburrhum... That is going to be a big problem for users that have many changes they wish to restore on OS200808:42
unique311skype is available...cool08:43
unique311scratch that ,ol08:43
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unique311no skype for 2008 yet?08:45
Prez__is mplayer out for it2008?08:45
milhouseyes - check garage08:46
milhouseunique311 - yes... :)08:46
Segnale007it working good with wpa2 ?08:46
unique311so what am i doing wrong.08:46
unique311it won't install.08:46
unique311and its not telling me why in the app manager08:47
unique311but i didn't try command line.08:47
unique311let me try that and then complain08:47
unique311sorry for being impatient08:47
milhousewhich version N800 OS2008 or N810 OS2008?08:47
milhouseit doesn't install on N800 OS2008 - Skype do a brain dead version check and get it wrong08:48
milhouseinstalls fine on N810 OS2008 on N80008:48
unique311i just flashed the beta08:48
GeneralAntillesThe version check is broken08:49
GeneralAntillesit checks the build number and ignores the build week.08:49
GeneralAntillesas 1 < 1908:49
GeneralAntillesIt wont install08:49
milhousenah, doesn't work because Skype check the build week and build number, and have some code like "don't install if <build-week> lt 42 or <build-num> lt 19" and it's the last bit that's not very clever (-4 being less than 19)... :)08:49
unique311so just wait, for a fix08:50
milhousereport it in the Skype defect tracking system :)08:50
milhouse(just for a laugh, that's all it's good for) ;)08:50
GeneralAntillesWhat ever, it's broken. :P08:50
unique311do a dpkg install08:50
unique311should work?08:51
milhousemight do - think it was suggested on itt but can't recall if it worked or not08:51
milhouseanyway... it's the same Skype as on OS2007 so unless you desperately need it you ain't missing much08:51
toresbewhat is actually new with OS2007 anyway?08:52
unique311i purchased that unlimited 3 month deal08:52
toresbeApart from a superficial makeover?08:52
unique311so it would come in handy.08:52
unique311but i'll just use gizmo08:52
GeneralAntillesOS2008, you mean, toresbe?08:53
toresbeuh, yeah, heh08:53
GeneralAntillesA whole big heaping shitload. :)08:54
toresbeis there a site saying what somewhere?08:54
GeneralAntillesIt's on maemo.org08:54
GeneralAntillesGoogle it.08:54
GeneralAntillesOr I'll google it for you.
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GeneralAntillesMostly there.08:54
GeneralAntillesThe big stuff, anyway.08:55
GeneralAntillesIt's basically the biggest overall of ITOS yet.08:56
toresbeGeneralAntilles: anything visible to the user?08:57
GeneralAntillesA ton.08:58
GeneralAntillesThere isn't a single part of the system that hasn't been upgraded in some manner.08:58
toresbeGeneralAntilles: i mean, anything visible to the user as a new feature?08:58
GeneralAntillesYes, a shitton.08:59
GeneralAntillesAs I've already said a number of times. :)08:59
toresbelike? :)08:59
GeneralAntillesInstall it and find out?09:00
toresbeI gave it a cursory glance and apart from the apps launcher couldn't really find anything09:00
GeneralAntillesWhole new desktop arrangement, shiny new app manager, much improved SIP and Jabber, new Map application, new Media player, final release of MicroB.09:01
GeneralAntillesThere's a ton09:02
GeneralAntillesDid you install it?09:02
GeneralAntillesAlso, the ability to clock to 400MHz under load.09:02
toresbeadmittedly didn't test the media player09:03
GeneralAntillesLike I've said, there's pretty much nothing that hasn't been updated and improved.09:03
toresbecontacts, my pet peeve :)09:03
GeneralAntillesWhat's the problem there?09:03
toresbeI had been running osso-rtcomm-beta, so... :)09:04
GeneralAntillesThey work great for me.09:04
toresbeGeneralAntilles: I want the ability to store information like address09:04
GeneralAntillesTry GPE?09:04
toresbeI don't want to have to use third-party applications with incompatible address lists to store a home address.. :)09:05
GeneralAntillesSo you downgraded to OS2007?09:05
toresbenah, I'm not a terribly active user of my N80009:06
GeneralAntillesHow is the world could you not be?09:06
GeneralAntillesThe NIT have been the greatest mobile devices I've ever owned.09:06
toresbewell, it lacks elementary PDA functionality09:07
GeneralAntillesThere's always the Garnet emulator09:07
toresbeGarnet emulator?09:07
Prez__someone said garage had mplayer for n800/it2008?  just tried to install latest .18 mplayer, got failed deps, hildon, dbus09:07
GeneralAntillesI don't need PDA functionality, so that's never bothered me.09:07
GeneralAntillesYou need to add the Maemo Chinook devel repo.09:07
trulsMost essential pda functionality i need is a todo09:08
trulsbut right now i just use a bullet-list in notes09:08
toresbeoh, a Trondheimite. Howdy.09:08
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GeneralAntillesTry duemonday, truls?09:08
trulsGeneralAntilles: no, it's good?09:09
GeneralAntillesSeemed ok when I glanced over it.09:09
GeneralAntillesalterego is also working on a Ruby todo app09:09
_Monkeyokay, GeneralAntilles.09:09
trulsi tried gpe, but didn't fit my usage09:09
trulsi might just port my own todo-app09:09
GeneralAntillesGPE has a bit of feature bloat.09:09
GeneralAntillesTalk to alterego about his if you see him about09:09
GeneralAntillesit's looking quite nice.09:09
trulsi might try making a linkable todo-thing09:10
trulsallowing a primary todo together with todo's for each "project"09:10
trulsand you can link in stuff from projects to your main todo-list09:10
GeneralAntillesMight be better talking to alterego about it as a feature, rather than trying to reinvent the wheel. :)09:10
trulshaving a list of entries isn't really reinventing the wheel though :)09:11
trulsa todo-list is pretty basic09:11
keesjtruls did you looks a maemopad+++++09:11
keesjI would like some mindmap stuff09:12
trulstoo many gripes with maemopad09:12
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trulsyou always have to have the root node, you can't rename nodes, deleting is kinda buggy, can't reorganize structure...09:13
keesjyes, I understand09:13
trulsi like the concept of it though09:14
trulsright now i try to organize stuff a bit in the GettingThingsDone-way....09:14
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trulsone directory for active Projects, one for Archive, one for Tickler (future stuff)09:15
trulsinside there you either have a text-file for a project, or a directory if the project warrants it09:15
trulsand projects can be moved between those three locations09:15
trulsin addition you have a list of current TODO-items and current Waiting-items, for stuff you are waiting for someone else's feedback/action etc.09:16
trulsso if I can link in items from the TODO of a specific project into the current TODO, i'm pretty much set ;)09:16
[pablo]_anyone else unable to watch youtube videos on the latest os2008 for n810? it's telling me that i dont have flash09:17
Matt-WI just flashed my n800 with os200809:20
Matt-Wit's pretty!09:20
timelyxit's a beta09:20
Matt-WI know09:21
Matt-WIt's still pretty09:21
VReDoes somebody know what to do to get the menu smaller?09:21
* timelyx sighs09:21
timelyxpeople are idiots09:21
Prez__with the cpu throttling on it2008 on n800, should battery last longer?09:22
timelyxunder what conditions?09:23
timelyxif the device manages to stay in a *lower* speed than normal, maybe09:23
Prez__timelyx: yes, assuming it is idling...09:24
timelyxmaybe :), but i'm a browser dev, i wouldn't know :)09:24
Prez__and I agree with Matt-W, IT2008 is pretty on n800, very nice...09:24
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[pablo]_can someone try youtube on thier tablet and tell me if it works?09:27
timelyxdefine youtube09:28
timelyxflash-camera doesn't, that's a reported bug, you could find it yourself by searching bugs.maemo.org09:28
timelyxplayback generally does work09:28
* timelyx hates users09:28
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[pablo]_watching videos09:31
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[pablo]_timelyx: here look
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timelyxsee the magnifying glass in the bottom right of the screen?09:40
timelyxclick it, click components09:40
timelyxis flash checked?09:40
oilwith linux flasher it's possible to toggle between usb-host and usb-client modes. is it possible to do with command line on the n800 as well?09:43
[pablo]_it wasn't, weird, thank you. perhaps it was the reflash09:43
timelyxthanks for playing, do figure out how to break the picture so people don't reach the conclusion you had09:43
timelyxperhaps that site allows comments?09:43
timelyxnote: per spec, when we run out of memory, we're not allowed to tell the user09:44
timelyxbut we are required to react (including disabling things, like js and flash)09:44
timelyxif you don't think that's fun, you're annoying :)09:44
[pablo]_umm ok. why be so rude?09:45
timelyxwhich part of that is rude?09:45
timelyxpersonally, i deal with lots of "users" all of which make rude and annoying statements09:46
timelyx"x is broken"09:46
timelyxwhen in fact, on average "x is working as [poorly] designed"09:46
timelyxit's not my fault.09:46
timelyxbut you can't think i'm happy hearing people whine that "x is broken"09:46
timelyxthey don't say "could someone please help me get X to do Y at site Z"09:46
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timelyxthey also clearly don't read the help09:47
timelyx(there's not much help, but there's enough help to document enabling and disabling plugins)09:47
timelyx(and yes, i've read it and complained about it)09:47
timelyx(and no, you haven't.)09:47
[pablo]_it seemed pretty condescending, i've owned a tablet for all of 4 days and have been learning as much as i can09:47
timelyxwhich part?09:48
[pablo]_"i hate users" .. "thanks for playing" .. implying i'm annoying for asking a question09:49
timelyxoh, only that part?09:49
[pablo]_thanks for the help09:50
timelyxthe thanks for playing is meant in a friendly manner09:50
timelyxit's thanks for playing along09:50
vegaideveloping on maemo is rather irritating, I understand timelyx's sentiments pretty well09:50
timelyx(following a set of steps for which you have no idea what they'd do)09:50
timelyxfor all you know, i could be giving you instructions to reformat your device09:50
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timelyxthere's a significant amount of trust that you're giving09:51
vegaiI don't know if any other mobile platform is any better, though.09:51
timelyxi suspect palm is better09:51
vegaiPalm seemed nice09:51
timelyxthey're more serious (business users)09:51
[pablo]_i'm not a typical user, i would know better than that i would hope09:51
timelyx[pablo]_: our device is "quirky" at best09:51
timelyxthere could *easily* be a bug in browser that causes your device to brick, or reformat09:52
* timelyx frowns09:52
[pablo]_yes i'm aware of that, but i think i would have run into that as much as i have read09:53
mariorzas long as im on topic is there a way to get flash 9 to work in os 2007?09:54
timelyxthe most recent version includes it09:54
timelyxjust flash to it09:54
timelyxthat's 3.2 aka -- no clue actually09:54
timelyxor 3.2 w/ the mmc fix09:55
mariorzhow can i check what verion im running?09:55
mariorzjust flashed like 2 weeks ago?09:55
_Monkeywell, - is there any reason why elf executables from os2006 would absolutely refuse to run on os 2005?09:55
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milhouseseems like restoring an os2007 backup causes browser instability in os2008... fingers crossed someone is about to file a bug with a backup for an attachment. :)09:55
timelyxin your browser should work09:55
timelyxmilhouse: we have internal bugs, yes, please file09:55
milhousetimelyx: i owe you an email reply :)09:56
pumpkintimelyx: have a moment for help?09:56
timelyxyeah, but one of you owes me some help too09:56
milhousehope it's not me :D09:56
* timelyx is having a conversation w/ someone who insists on being right09:56
timelyxmilhouse: what's your email name? :)09:56
milhousefck is my brother on this channel???09:56
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milhouseneil macleod09:57
timelyxyeah, not you :)09:57
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pumpkintimelyx: so I'm trying to compile my program that uses libcurl09:57
milhousehurrah! need sleep...09:57
pumpkinI need it on the n800, so I'm compiling it for armel09:57
pumpkinbut the libcurl on scratchbox09:57
pumpkinregardless of whether I'm on armel target, is compiled for intel09:57
mariorzerr sorry i meant for os2007 HE09:57
timelyxum, i'd suggest you look into proper cross compilng09:57
timelyxor alternatively, use --target=09:58
timelyxfor configure09:58
timelyxinstead of relying on autoconf09:58
pumpkinoh, the compiler and linker are fine09:58
timelyxdepending on how a build system works, it can do the target detection on the wrong side of scratchbox09:58
pumpkinit's not a build system, it's my own program09:58
pumpkinall I'm using is curl-config --libs09:58
pumpkinwhich returns the path to the libs09:58
pumpkinit's returning a path in /scratchbox09:59
timelyxah yes09:59
pumpkinbut if I run file on the libs, it's for x8609:59
timelyxright, um09:59
timelyxdo which curl-config09:59
timelyxgo to the non scratchbox side and move that out of the way09:59
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* timelyx frowns09:59
pumpkin /scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/bin/curl-config09:59
timelyxhaving a curl-config in path seems kinda stupid10:00
pumpkinthat's what it is now10:00
timelyxmove that out of the way :)10:00
timelyxmv /scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/bin/curl-config /scratchbox/devkits/maemo3-tools/bin/curl-config.stupid10:00
timelyxor .broken or .intel whatever10:00
pumpkinso now it's /usr/bin/curl-config10:00
timelyx[pablo]_: sorry, if you don't think that polluting an armel env path with an intel script is stupid, ...10:01
pumpkinhe's pming you?10:01
pumpkinit works :)10:01
pumpkinis this chrooted?10:01
timelyxfile a bug against the sdk10:01
timelyxthat sounds broken10:01
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pumpkinI'm not even positive I'm on 3.210:02
pumpkinit's a pain to install10:02
pumpkinI had a nice installation then dumbly reverted my vm to a snapshot10:02
pumpkinand lost all my stuff10:02
timelyxpumpkin: create a new test sdk install before filing :)10:02
pumpkintimelyx: this is completely clean10:02
timelyxbut it sure sounds like a bug10:02
pumpkinI've redone the whole thing several times10:02
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timelyxok, file, be sure to include the url from which you got the installer and the steps you used to get the installer10:02
timelyxinclude the output of which curl-config and the output of curl-config --libs10:03
timelyxs/get the/run the/10:03
pumpkinI'll do that when I don't have a big project to compile10:03
pumpkinbut that gets me past this hump, thanks10:03
timelyxfile early10:03
pumpkinI have a deadline tomorrow :-/10:03
timelyxthe longer you wait the more unfortunate souls get stuck w/ the same incromprehensible bugs10:03
pumpkinand it's 3 am10:03
* timelyx curses deadlines10:04
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pumpkinyeah, same10:04
pumpkinbut I promise I'll file tomorrow after I'm done10:04
timelyxyou're on the record, this channel is logged :)10:04
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timelyxactually, that only has part of it10:10
timelyxhas the full version10:11
timelyxIt is very important that you understand that these binaries are not complete programs. They might crash on startup. They might delete all your files and cause your computer to burst into flames.10:11
timelyxfwiw, we actually did *ship* versions that would delete all your files :)10:12
timelyxi can't remember if that notice was still live by the time that happens10:12
timelyxi suspect the notice was unfortunately replaced w/ the tamer one10:12
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timelyxMozilla might crash on startup. It might delete all your files and cause your computer to burst into flames.10:13
timelyxbut thankfully, that notice is sufficient.10:13
gomiamtimelyx: at least it won't mistakenly start a nuclear war, right? :-D10:13
[pablo]_timelyx: what's that link for?10:13
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timelyxgomiam: sadly, i don't think we have the proper disclaimer for that10:13
gomiamah, then it's a feature, not a bug,10:14
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GeneralAntillestimelyx, any words on the proper usage of Target Milestone?10:14
timelyx. (j)10:15
timelyxSoftware is not designed, licensed or intended for use in the design,10:15
timelyxconstruction, operation or maintenance of any nuclear facility10:15
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timelyxgomiam: as you can see, sun properly covers the nuclear cases10:15
timelyxand in java's case it merely says, you shouldn't let java start a nuclear war10:16
timelyxit doesn't say that it won't10:16
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timelyxGeneralAntilles: if the bug is resolved fixed, pick the smallest version in which it's fixed10:16
timelyxif the bug is something you're working on and you can predict better than Next/Future, fill it in10:17
timelyxGeneralAntilles: is that sufficient ?10:17
GeneralAntillesYessir, thankee. :)10:17
timelyxthanks for asking10:17
timelyxand especially thanks for doing the bookkeeping10:17
timelyx[pablo]_: i do have a sense of humor, it's just quite pained10:18
timelyxit's not entirely users' faults10:18
timelyxblame can be distributed among most sectors, and fairly evenly10:18
timelyxbut usually devs will sympathize with me10:19
gomiamtimelyx: of course Sun would put that. The Sun is a nuclear engine, so people might be misled.10:19
timelyxand the more you get to know me, the more you will sympathize10:19
timelyxgomiam =)10:19
infobotgomiam meant: timelyx: of course Sun would put that. The Sun is a nuclear reaction, so people might be misled.10:19
* timelyx doesn't actually mind engine10:19
pumpkinID ftw10:20
pumpkin"intelligent design"10:20
timelyxnot duke nukem?10:20
gomiamintelligent design? That is when you think about all the corner cases before starting to code, right?10:21
pumpkinI wish10:21
timelyxintelligent design is where you consider all cases and decide not to implement10:21
timelyxbecause you recognize all the disasters that would happen10:21
gomiamthat's lazy design: "corner cases? We don't need no stinkin' corner cases, we have exceptions for that!"10:22
timelyxbtw, in case people are curious, i'm leaving that lesson learned for _Monkey10:22
timelyxi hope no one truly objects10:22
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GeneralAntillesI object!10:27
* GeneralAntilles throws a fit.10:27
gomiamI subject!10:27
timelyx} catch (e instanceof fit) { /* ignore it */ }10:27
timelyxgomiam: 2> /dev/null :)10:28
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GeneralAntillesI wish bugzilla had an overview page.10:30
timelyxhrm, who reported 2398?10:30
timelyxthey didn't fill in the URL field10:30
timelyxwhich is kinda sad10:30
timelyxbtw: to all10:31
timelyxyou're supposed to remove the parenthetical :)10:31
timelyxit's a suggestion...10:31
GeneralAntillesDamn users!10:31
timelyxwhat kind of overview?10:31
GeneralAntillesAll bugs10:32
GeneralAntilles50-100 per page10:32
timelyxthere are 240010:32
GeneralAntillescolumns sortable10:32
timelyxyou can easily get most of them10:32
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GeneralAntillesYeah, I created a search.10:33
timelyxyou also can click on one column to sort10:35
timelyxand technically if you're feeling clever, there's a way to sort by more than one10:35
doc|home <- is that accurate?10:37
timelyxmost likely anyone who knows would have a lawyer who would object to commenting10:38
astro76doc|home, yes absolutely10:38
astro76I'm an engineer, f the lawyers :p10:38
doc|homeso it's actually best to keep it charged?10:38
doc|homei.e. while using it10:38
astro76doc|home, yes as much as possible10:38
timelyxnote that there's a funny tradeoff10:38
doc|homenice! :) I'd been trying to limit charging10:38
timelyxthe user guide for 2008 probably says something about not keeping the charger constantly plugged in10:39
timelyxbecause the environmentalists or maybe uk gov complain you're wasting power10:39
astro76doc|home, basically try not to deeply discharge them, and not to get them hot10:39
doc|hometimelyx: any more than if I just used battery power?10:39
* GeneralAntilles pimps his bug:
doc|homehmmm, it charges pretty warm10:39
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timelyxdoc|home: my understanding is that you're spending power while the charger is plugged into a socket, whether or not there's a device corded10:40
timelyxand they don't like that10:40
astro76I wonder what is worse environmentally, leakage current on chargers, or extra Lion in landfills10:40
timelyxsimilarly, if the device is fully charged and the charger is plugged into the socket and device10:40
timelyxyou're still wasting power at the charger10:40
doc|homeah, right10:40
timelyxnote: i'm not a lawyer, nor am i really an environmentalist10:40
* doc|home nods10:41
timelyxbut i did get to sit in on the change review for the "please unplug" message that came w/ 200810:41
GeneralAntillesSo, really, the best plan is to just kill yourself right now and stop destroying the planet. :)10:41
timelyxwe didn't add it just because we like more chances for typos10:41
doc|homeGeneralAntilles: want to add that?10:41
timelyxnote: i don't think we added any typos there either, but hey... all changes incur some risk10:41
doc|homehmmm, user manual, must read that :)10:42
GeneralAntillesI don't get where an OS gets off telling me how to use my electricity. :P10:42
timelyxGeneralAntilles: the os doesn't get it either10:42
doc|homehey, there has to be some give and take :)10:42
timelyxit's some government lawyer/legistlator who went off and told some company10:42
timelyxwho told some engineer, who added it10:42
timelyxas for the trade off at the landfill... dunno. most likely this stuff hasn't been properly studied10:43
timelyxi offer the effort to change DST10:43
timelyxsomeone thought it looked good on paper10:43
doc|homethere are facilities for battery disposal10:43
GeneralAntillesHow many people actually use them?10:44
astro76well really you want people to unplug chargers when it is *not* powering a device... and the device can't warn about that10:44
doc|home4132 per 100,00010:44
GeneralAntillesI say we change the notice to "And remember to recycle your batteries!"10:44
timelyxastro76: right10:44
* doc|home nods authoritively10:44
timelyxthe info banner tries to be clear about where to unplug10:44
timelyxand the quick start and user guide also try10:44
timelyxnot sure how good the English/translations are10:45
timelyxbut they exist10:45
doc|homeso, any reason why, given that, they didn't usb power the n8x0? :/10:45
timelyxhey, i misspelled once in my latest bug comment10:46
GeneralAntillesSlow charging?10:46
doc|homethat's probably my one niggle, the battery life is shortish so you need to carry a charger10:46
GeneralAntillesMore complicated circuitry?10:46
timelyxthe vendor group making the tablets mostly reuses parts from other mobile phones10:46
doc|homeGeneralAntilles: I've got usb charging in my mobile10:46
timelyxGeneralAntilles: it's actually fairly trivial from what i've seen/heard10:46
doc|homeand the mobile is far thinner than the n80010:46
timelyxmy belief is that usb charging wasn't yet in the cards for the components they were offered when the design was frozen10:47
doc|homefair enough10:47
timelyxno idea if/when that might change10:47
timelyxfor the n810, the big change was adding proper usb otg10:47
timelyxnot sure how engineering effort can be split, but my guess is the people who could do usb otg would also be the people who could do usb pwr10:48
timelyxso it's also possible that they ran out of engineering resources :)10:48
timelyx(this is 100% speculation)10:48
_Monkeywell, google is my friend and you should make it your friend too10:48
timelyxfeel free to teach monkey when you're done :)10:49
timelyxnothing wrong w/ it having a proper answer for that one :)10:49
doc|homesure, if you'll tell me how :)10:49
timelyxfoo .i.s. bar10:49
timelyxit'll learn foo10:49
GeneralAntillesHmm . . . softpower off seems to have stopped working under the N800 OS2008 beta. :\10:51
timelyxthat's kinda surprising10:52
timelyxdo you get the power menu?10:52
timelyxi.e. please explain steps/expected results10:52
gomiamerm... what is the current 2008 for N800 version?10:52
GeneralAntillesLet me test it a second.10:52
timelyx44-4 "beta"10:52
gomiamIs it a production version? a beta?10:52
doc|homeotg is a supplement to the USB 2.0 specification which allows USB devices to be hosts as well as slaves, controlling power, data and master/slave negotiation10:52
timelyxit's a beta10:52
_Monkeyotg is a supplement to the USB 2.0 specification which allows USB devices to be hosts as well as slaves, controlling power, data and master/slave negotiation10:52
JaffaMorning, all10:53
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* doc|home pats the _monkey10:53
GeneralAntillesOK, longpress turns off the screen10:53
GeneralAntillesbut the touchscreen is still active, and any taps will reactivate the screen10:53
* timelyx punches the _Monkey10:53
doc|homehmmm, mine switched off fine10:53
GeneralAntillesa shortpress will NOT bring up the power menu at this point10:53
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timelyxGeneralAntilles: what's running?10:53
GeneralAntillesanother longpress to bring it back out of the broken soft poweroff with allow the menu to function again10:53
GeneralAntillesbrowser only10:53
Xtrophysweet to see many ppl intrested with it :P10:54
doc|homewe're the nerds :/10:54
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Xtrophythere is nothing wrong with being clueless :P10:54
GeneralAntillesSame behavior at boot with no connection.10:55
* GeneralAntilles rechecks /etc/mce/mce.ini10:55
timelyx"no connection"?10:56
GeneralAntillesNo wifi connection.10:56
timelyxbrowser not yet running?10:56
GeneralAntillesBrowser not yet running.10:56
timelyxclose your home applets and reboot ;-)10:57
Xtrophycould i bother u all with questions that been asked thousand times before10:57
timelyxXtrophy: google first?10:57
timelyxXtrophy: note that this channel is logged10:57
timelyxso if a question was asked here, you could read the log for the answer10:57
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timelyxcould? yes. should? not really :)10:58
Xtrophyow sweet u mean 24 hour logs10:58
timelyxminus time off for bad bot behavior :)10:58
timelyxand net splits10:58
GeneralAntillesNo change with applets off.10:58
Xtrophyanyway its still not same as change that u can suprise me with ur answers :P10:59
Xtrophyis there a maemo wiki gives detailed information10:59
timelyxnot sure what it gives10:59
timelyxprobably bad info :)10:59
Xtrophyis maemo a regular linux kernel with a new x11 desktop for tablet pcs11:00
timelyxit's an omap kernel11:00
timelyxand defining 'new' is hard11:00
timelyxbut otherwise, "kinda' :)11:01
timelyxactually, defining "regular" is pointless11:01
* timelyx pokes Jaffa11:01
timelyxhurry up11:01
Xtrophyso could i use every linuxx program on it11:02
Xtrophyat least dosent wants special runtimes11:02
timelyxum. no no11:02
Xtrophyidk kde based or gtk11:02
timelyxit's gtk based11:02
timelyxif you want your app to look right, it needs to be rewritten to use hildon11:03
Xtrophyso i can use gtk based applications?11:03
timelyxyou could xdisplay qt apps too11:03
timelyxbut you probably wouldn't get a keyboard :)11:03
Xtrophylike if i want a mame emu i need to find rewriten version11:03
timelyxemulators generally don't care about platform look and feel11:03
timelyxl&f only matters for normal things11:04
GeneralAntillesI suppose it's time to open a bug on this.11:04
Xtrophyis there a console application in mameo like bash11:04
GeneralAntillesAny more ideas, timelyx? ;)11:04
timelyxIRC log of #maemo for Saturday, 2007-07-2811:04
timelyxN800: port MAME, 20:27. frob, N800: you need to eat pills while walking back and forth? 20:27. NeoStrider, wel...actually..there is already mame for maemo ...11:04
Xtrophyand regular directories11:04
GeneralAntillesash, Xtrophy.11:05
_Monkeybusybox is weak by default11:05
timelyxit's a normal whatever, 2008 includes xterminal11:05
timelyxprevious versions required you find one of two competing xterminals11:05
Xtrophyis answering nonsence pointless questions gives u braindamage11:05
timelyxall versions allow you to install one of two competing ssh(d)s11:05
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timelyxit gives me headaches11:05
timelyxbut not as much as other things i do11:06
timelyxthink of maemo as a hacked version of debian11:06
timelyxit has a hacked linux omap kernel w/ a hacked version of gnome11:06
timelyxsome versions include more hacks than others11:06
timelyxsome versions include worse hacks than others11:06
timelyxnot all hacks are created equal, some hacks are more equal than others11:07
timelyxthere is a /home/user directory that has some other directories, like a MyDocs11:07
Xtrophythanks its dosent looks an hopeless rom operation system to me now11:07
timelyxbut for most apps you want, someone may have already ported11:07
timelyxand clearly google would have saved me effort11:07
timelyxwhy do people refuse to use google?11:08
Xtrophyits evil11:08
GeneralAntillesExcellent question.11:08
GeneralAntillesPerhaps you should file a bug?11:08
timelyxGeneralAntilles: sadly, we already include a google search applet on our device11:08
timelyxpeople refuse to use that too11:08
timelyxheck, in 2008, the home page is a google gateway11:08
doc|hometimelyx: because they censor results.11:08
doc|homeby the way, can you change that?11:09
timelyxdoc: so my uncensored (in|re)sults are better? :)11:09
GeneralAntillesThe only way to make them learn is to have a team of Googleteers that repeatedly beat people who don't google first about the head and shoulders with sockfuls of super rubber balls.11:09
timelyxchange the source ip :)11:09
_Monkeytimelyx: that doesn't look right11:09
doc|hometimelyx: I get perfectly good results from a search engine that isn't google and isn't censoring results11:09
* timelyx waves googbye11:09
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doc|homedid you crash monkey? :)11:10
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timelyxi think it's for a currency converter11:10
GeneralAntillesdoc|home, this isn't really a political discussion, it's more of a "Why do people ask stupid questions to which the answers are already readily available?"-discussion. :)11:10
doc|homeah, ok :)11:10
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GeneralAntillesHalo, czr.11:12
Xtrophycould u think ppl never asks questions that answers given somewhere somehow before11:12
Xtrophyomg how many new question u can find11:12
GeneralAntillesThere are no new questions. :)11:13
timelyxthere are no new answers either :)11:13
Xtrophydont say that11:13
Xtrophywith every new answer ur whine ability increasing slightly11:14
timelyxtrade off sucks11:14
GeneralAntillesWe need a well organized wiki to point new users to.11:14
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timelyxgoogle doesn't count? :)11:14
GeneralAntillesSeemingly no.11:15
czr<miyagi>trade on, trade off</miyagi>11:15
* timelyx chuckles11:15
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GeneralAntillesThe internet tablet school is a nice idea, but it doesn't cover enough subjects, is only maintained by a single person and is poorly organized.11:15
* czr wakes up to smell the bonsai trees11:15
GeneralAntillesmaemo wiki is just gross11:15
GeneralAntillesand the ITT wiki seems to be full of garbage/very broken.11:16
czrtimelyx, it is done. bad grammar, evil content, but it IS done :-)11:16
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czralthough I'm still waiting for feedback and will be fixing things for the rest of the week, but in theory, it is done.11:16
* czr jumps around in joy11:16
timelyxsounds like us11:17
czryup :-)11:17
timelyxpoke me tonight11:17
czrI might. need to go through all the bug reports now.11:17
czroo. my "dangerous symlink" has now "high priority"11:18
GeneralAntillesTest and vote.
* GeneralAntilles needs sleep.11:19
czrsoftpower off?11:20
timelyxGeneralAntilles: hey, you got bug 2400 :)11:20
_MonkeyBug 2400 might be found at
GeneralAntillesYeah, kinda messed up that space, didn't I?11:21
timelyxwait, what is soft  power off?11:21
timelyxis that some unsupported feature?11:21
czrthat's what my question was too11:21
czrlooks like it11:21
GeneralAntillesHow can you use these devices and not know what soft poweroff is?11:21
* timelyx looks around11:22
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czruse? who told you we use them?11:22
timelyxwe leave our devices plugged in? :)11:22
* doc|home doesn't either :|11:22
GeneralAntillesYou use that entirely too cumbersome keylocking procedure?11:22
doc|homeI was complaining about that today, anything to do with the power key is annoying11:22
doc|homeexplain oh wise one :)11:23
GeneralAntilles /etc/mce/mce.ini11:23
GeneralAntillesIt's like magic (well, it WAS in OS2007 <_<)11:23
czrediting mce.ini is unsupported afaik11:23
GeneralAntillesWell, good.11:23
GeneralAntillesI'd still like it fixed. :)11:23
czrGeneralAntilles, if you'd post a link to some page explaining what it was, people might vote for it :-)11:24
timelyxGeneralAntilles: it'd be good if you included /etc/osso_software_version11:24
timelyxor the url from which you retrieved the image11:24
czrand a fix! :-)11:24
czrand cookies.11:24
_Monkeycookies are delicious delicacies11:24
doc|homebrownies > cookies11:24
timelyxthat's intentional11:24
doc|homeof course11:24
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GeneralAntillesStick this: in the URL field, timelyx?11:25
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timelyxburst into flames is It is very important that you understand that these binaries are not complete programs. They might crash on startup. They might delete all your files and cause your computer to burst into flames.
timelyxburst into flames?11:27
_Monkeyburst into flames is It is very important that you understand that these binaries are not complete programs. They might crash on startup. They might delete all my files and cause my computer to burst into flames.
Xtrophyanybody knows an i386 dos emulation with sb default11:27
timelyxGeneralAntilles: that'd be fine11:27
* czr turns _Monkey into a harmless trout11:27
Xtrophyso i can play estatica again11:27
czrseriously though, does anyone know who controls _monkey?11:27
timelyxXtrophy: id you consider google: maemo dosbox?11:27
* czr is thinking packing some trouts in his travelling bag and taking a road trip to wherever _monkey originates from11:28
czrtravel bag even11:28
Xtrophyomg omg /cheer11:28
timelyxczr: the log repeatedly lists who owns the bot11:28
timelyxbut i don't try to remember :)11:28
czrtimelyx, hmm. should prolly take a look at it then. mine is kind of stupid. since I've disabled join/parts, they're not stored into the log either. bleh.11:29
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GeneralAntillessoft poweroff replaces my much missed 770 cover for my N800.11:30
timelyxyeah, i remember people mentioning it from back then11:30
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jumpulaczr: can't they be enabled separately for logs?11:30
jumpulai think in irssi one can11:30
jumpulanot sure, though11:30
czrjumpula, I guess so, but I haven't bothered before this really11:30
czrand I don't use irssi.11:30
jumpulaat least rawlog displays everything11:30
jumpulaok :)11:31
czrhmm. no separate option to log join/parts. /me kicks his legacy version of xchat11:31
Xtrophyis playing old hentai dos games under illegal emulations ( and sure games are copy too ) is a sin11:32
Xtrophyis there a chance for me to burn in hell?11:32
czrXtrophy, yes11:32
Xtrophyits os of satan :(11:32
* czr believes in the "garbage in, garbage out" process11:32
* jumpula sees a chance of Xtrophy burning his games to a cd11:32
Xtrophyjust seduces me i cant resist11:32
timelyxjumpula: =)11:33
* timelyx sighs11:33
timelyxstupid users11:33
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GeneralAntillesSomebody needs to resolve this as fixed.
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timelyxGeneralAntilles: do you not have editbugs?11:39
timelyxbugmail address?11:40
GeneralAntillesrabelg5 at gmail dot com11:40
timelyxgo forth and resolve11:40
timelyx(set tm of course!)11:41
GeneralAntillesDanke, sir. :)11:41
timelyxbiette shen?11:41
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czrbleh. /me gets slightly irritated11:43
timelyxczr: only slightly?11:44
czrbug 238311:44
_MonkeyBug 2383 might be found at
* timelyx just sent a nasty gram11:44
czronly slightly :-)11:44
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czrcomment #7 = caused irritation.11:44
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czrconsidering the triviality of the bug, yes, I agree :-)11:46
timelyxi don't think i have a cross reference of a recent ubuntu11:46
czrwhat kind of cross ref?11:46
timelyxbut i'm fairly certain that modern debian's don't use apt.conf at all11:46
timelyx(source, or installed)11:46
czrah, true11:46
czrbut I can check this quickly enough11:46
timelyxi.e., i can't give you a good ref for it11:47
* timelyx nods :)11:47
czrI don't need a ref!11:47
czrdamn it. modular configuration has been with us ever since redhat ditched inetd for xinetd.11:47
* czr growls11:47
czrand that happened _ages_ ago.11:47
timelyxi don't have growl installed here11:47
* czr installs growl on timelyxes equipment11:47
czrit has broadcast control. whenever I growl, they will now growl too.11:48
czrsurround growl.11:48
GeneralAntilles<3 Growl11:48
timelyxhave you seen/heard growl?11:48
Xtrophywhy the damn doom impossible to complete alive11:48
czrtimeless, no apt.conf11:48
Xtrophywtf why im need to die after all11:48
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czrtimeless, in feisty at least. just /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/11:48
timelyx for everyone too lazy to use google: growl11:48
timelyxbut comment :)11:49
czrcomment where?11:49
timelyxin the bug of course :)11:49
czryou think I should moan some more?11:49
czrby the bug severety / amount of bitching ratio is already fairly bad for that one.11:50
Xtrophyi will change to my nickname to noobsaibot11:50
timelyxi don't think they get that key point11:50
czrtimelyx, ah. ok11:50
timelyxthat normal debians don't have anyone touching that file11:50
timelyxbtw, my karma jumped a bit11:50
timelyxit used to be around 8 iirc11:50
czrooh. /me runs to check his11:50
czrerr. where's the profile page?11:51
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timelyxis the easiest one11:51
timelyxis yours11:52
czrI get the bugzilla ones finally.11:52
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timelyxhow do i get a karma list?11:56
timelyxi know i've seen one somewhere11:56
timelyxmuch better, i'm on the first page11:56
timelyxooh, and i can file another bug11:56
timelyxactually, i think i already filed that bug11:56
timelyxbut about some other page :)11:57
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czrwhee. I'm (just) on the first page :-)11:58
czrI trail you by 37 points timeless!11:58
czror should I say, Mr '-' :-)11:59
timelyxwe'll see?12:00
czrexcept the typos and crap, but I can't really be bothered about those.12:00
timelyxi thought something simpler would work12:00
timelyx"ubuntu X has an /etc/apt/sources.list.d/whatever_its_name.list"12:00
timelyxor only has12:01
czrthe irony is that the directory does exist in ubuntu, but is not actively used in feisty at least12:01
timelyxoh, it isn't actively used?12:01
timelyxstupid stupid :)12:01
czrit's an empty directory. yeah.12:01
timelyxanyway, i've used it for a year12:01
timelyxat least12:01
czrnot sure whether the graphical tools use it.12:02
timelyxi remember using it when i first (second?) setup ubuntu here @n12:02
* czr nods12:02
czrit was news to me. I blame sp300012:02
timelyxiiirc when i used it, the documentation for it was scant :)12:02
czrbut I really like the modular config thingies12:02
timelyxsounds like they're detonating somewhere nearby12:02
czrthe way things should've been always12:02
czrespecially with crappy package management systems12:02
timelyxgiven the stupid way application manager works12:02
timelyxbtw, is there a bug filed for that? :)12:03
timelyxyou can get karma for reporting it :)12:03
czrheh. I'd better do a proper bug report instead12:03
czrat least I have one to do still.12:04
timelyxwow, qgim has way too much karma for blogging12:04
czrbut been lazy/not sure how to put it into words12:04
czrtimelyx, should we reopen the karma bug (now that it's closed) to moan about weighting between the categories? you think that'd fly well? ;-)12:05
czr"we the undersigned demand a larger cut of the karma-pie"12:05
timelyxyou could file a bug asking for irc karma12:05
czr"P.S., Bloggers are weenies!"12:05
czr_monkey would take first position probably12:06
_Monkeyczr: i'm not following you...12:06
timelyxnot necessarily12:06
czrI'd rather have qim at the pole12:06
czrneh. irc is transient.12:06
czrprefer it this way12:06
RussBHello all...12:07
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timelyxfor comparison12:07
timelyxnote slot 7 is the bot12:07
RussBI just update my N800 to OS2008 Beta. Is it just me, or does the browser crash when visiting for everyone?12:07
czrtimelyx, scary :-)12:07
timelyxRussB: someone filed a bug for that12:07
timelyxRussB: did you restore from backup?12:08
timelyx(are you someone?)12:08
RussBI did restore from backup... is it some sort of cache thing?12:08
timelyxdunno, please read the bug and follow the requested steps12:08
timelyx(finding the bug is left as an exercise)12:08
timelyxczr: note: i'm not #1 in all those channels :)12:09
timelyxBig numbers12:09
timelyxIs firebot stupid or just asking too many questions? 39.7% lines contained a question!12:09
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timelyxThe loudest one was foxbot, who yelled 19.5% of the time!12:09
czrtimelyx, the scary part was related to the all too even distribution between different times for you. very 24/7 of you :-)12:09
timelyxyeah, i like that12:10
timelyxnokia helped a lot12:10
timelyxbut even before nokia i had fairly good distribution12:10
Xtrophywhen i push to ctrl+f my computer threathen me for scary things12:10
timelyxi think db48x might actually have a better distribution12:10
timelyxhe's on here too12:10
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RussBAhh, here it is:
RussBOkay, thanks12:11
timelyx:), please help, steps should be fairly self explanatory12:11
timelyxpreferably do the analysis/reduction before attaching12:12
timelyxczr: i think what i like better is that my distribution is better than the bot's :)12:12
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czrtimelyx, clearly you are more botish than it is :-)12:16
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timelyxthere are discussions about that12:16
timelyx(ask sp3000 or db48x)12:16
czrI don't I want/need to know :-)12:17
czrI'll file a new bug instead12:17
timelyxgood choice12:17
timelyxjust do it :)12:17
czryou know. I feel kind of weird. this is the first time that I don't have anything to do (maemo-related) for a long time.12:18
* czr is floating in emptyness12:18
timelyxhey. don't forget to verify reso fixe bugs you reported12:22
timelyxe.g., 233812:22
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unique311blutooth headset works12:26
czr"This file does not exist". Don't you think that error output from mxr is slightly misleading? :-)12:26
czrIt's like the "this page has intentionally been left blank" :-)12:27
czrtimelyx, good point. I didn't know that I'm supposed to verify them. Just adding a comment or changing the state from FIXED -> FERIVIED?12:27
czrferified even12:27
unique311very nice add on the new os200812:28
unique311bluetooth headset works with skype12:28
timelyxczr: well, verifying is nice12:28
timelyxif you have a comment, include one12:28
timelyxif you don't need one, don't12:28
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czrright. it wasn't clear to me what the VERIFIED really meant. either "Yes, this bug exists" or "Yes, this fix works".12:29
timelyxverified is for verifying resolved (whichever)12:30
timelyxyou confirm bugs exist12:30
timelyx2067 could use /someone/ to verify12:30
timelyxin that case it'd be best if the someone actually included steps that were tested12:30
timelyx(rubber stamp not appreciated there)12:31
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_Monkeysomebody said timelyx was timelyx's mac, it has scrollback12:33
Xtrophyi want a windows 95 with directx 10 complitable12:33
timelyxwhy ask me?12:34
* timelyx looks at mac12:34
timelyxmy mac is pretty12:34
Xtrophymacs arent pretty12:34
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Xtrophythey r like man12:34
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Xtrophyunlike pcs always gives u headache like girls12:34
Xtrophythats why ppl lvoes their pc12:35
Xtrophysure i cant comment about ur sexual decitions12:35
Xtrophymac is fine i guess12:35
Xtrophyanyway im so much sad that i cant run windows games something else then an amulator in linuxx neither windows dosent helps me. Even yea i have tons of memory and clock speed12:37
czrbleh. konttori isn't around12:37
Xtrophybut i still want windws 95 back i dont know how they able to to put in my memory 500 mb data with what12:37
Xtrophyhave vista :(12:37
Xtrophyhate bill gates12:38
timelyxyou realize this is #maemo, no?12:38
timelyxwe don't really care12:38
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timelyxor rather, we really really don't care12:38
Xtrophysee u r evil too12:38
Xtrophy:( is anybody up there is anybody really cares12:38
Xtrophyever listen ke? it will fit to u12:38
czrelb, I documented the libdbus abort thingy now: bug 240112:38
_MonkeyBug 2401 might be found at
czrXtrophy, does your ISP charge you by the number of characters you type?12:39
GeneralAntillesI was just going to say.12:39
GeneralAntillesLearn to spell . . .12:39
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czrI tried to remain silent about it for a long time, but "growl".12:39
Xtrophyi have many things to learn ^_^12:40
czrtimelyx, hmm. how can I see if a bug has been verified from a bug search list?12:40
czrtimelyx, or it will change "Resolution"?12:40
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czrah. it's the "status" that gets updated.12:41
unique311ok, this sucks, when i paired the bluetooth headset the first time.12:42
unique311it worked.12:42
unique311now it doesn't want to work....12:42
unique311its connects but no sound.12:42
unique311was this a fluke12:42
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timelyxis that patch related to that bug?12:43
czryes and no12:44
czrI don't think that fixes the bug12:44
czrrelated somehow maybe yes12:44
czrit just changes the bug to another one I think12:44
* timelyx rotfl12:45
czrbut I'm not sure12:45
czrat least to me it doesn't look like a fix12:45
czrhmm. but they use KOI8-R12:46
czrwhich is not UTF-8 at all12:46
timelyxlooks like they've tried a number of times to get it right12:46
timelyxlines: 3, 66, 104, 17412:46
czrKOI8-R is the russian (original) version of KOI8, which is a pure 8-bit encoding. similar but different from 885912:46
czrKOI8s are incompatible with other encodings, including UTF-812:47
czralso 6412:47
timelyxthat's a great url :)12:48
czrthe one that's referred in that one?12:48
czrah. this one. yeah12:48
czrseems pretty broken too. evil :-)12:48
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czrtimelyx, the patch you referred to fixes 10412:49
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czrbut again, I'm not sure it is related to the maemo bug12:49
czrhmm. actually it does12:50
czrI could test if I'd have a BT keyboard12:50
unique311i had to remove the device from the bluetooth settings, turn of the n800, remove the battery, turn on the device, re-add the bluetooth headset.12:51
unique311to get it working.12:51
unique311but it works with kagu.12:51
czrunique311, see if you can repeat it12:51
czrthe problem. if you can, file a bug with details12:51
timelyxczr: does an n800 w/ bthid count?12:51
czrtimelyx, I don't know. never used BT much12:51
GeneralAntillesRemove the battery? Was that really necessary?12:52
unique311i think its cause i turned off the bluetooth headset a certain way i wasn't suppose to.12:52
unique311not sure..but going to test it out again GeneralAntilles12:52
unique311figured it out..12:53
unique311i didn't disconnect the bluetooth headset from the n800.12:54
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timelyxczr: that bug rocks12:55
timelyxI wrote that header file was written before there was a C standard; to12:55
timelyxmy knowledge, this is the first instance of this behavior I've seen.12:55
timelyx(That data structure was added somewhere around 1986 or 1987, IIRC).12:55
czrtimelyx, which one?12:55
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czrah. that one. yeah :-)12:56
unique311i just disconnected it the same way i didn before, disconnected it from the device also.  then i turned on the headset and did the connect from the device, and it worked12:56
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unique311hope that made sense12:56
czrtimelyx, not too many bugs that I can verify actually.12:57
czrtimelyx, but thanks for the tip, will try to verify from now on whenever they're fixed12:58
timelyxczr: you can make a whine, actually you probably can't12:58
czrbtw, does anyone know whether 'konttori' = "Urho Konttori" (bugzilla)12:59
timelyxbut i could let you make a whine12:59
czrhe's not around and I want to tell him about a bug12:59
GeneralAntillesafaik, yes, czr.12:59
czrGeneralAntilles, ok, thanks13:00
timelyxok, i give up13:04
timelyxi can not figure out which stupid change fixed the russian bug13:04
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czrtimelyx, interesting. once I verified a bug, it was now switched to closed. so I guess verification is something that is done :-)13:05
czr(by someone, not automatically)13:05
czror maybe automatically by someone13:05
timelyxthere's a "view bug activity" link13:06
timelyxok, this is confusing:
czrno news content13:07
timelyxczr, 2075 is yours13:07
czrtimeless, I know. can't verify it13:08
czrdon't have OS2007 running13:08
czrtried to use that url with OS2008 and was redirected into a completely different place13:09
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timelyxi included steps for verifying :)13:09
czrand yes, I know I could change the identification but bleh..13:09
czrso you think verifying without the original sw version is verifying? ;-)13:09
timelyx is fun13:09
czrthat's cheating :-)13:09
timelyxwell um...13:10
timelyxwhat are we verifying?13:10
timelyxin this case, we're verifying that the page (reached however) is not broken13:10
timelyxas such, i sanction all efforts to extract the page13:10
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timelyxas long as you have faith that such efforts will not result in the wrong page13:10
czrah. true13:11
* czr mumbles something about "it's still cheating".13:11
czrI'll have a smoke and verify13:11
RussBI'm back... another question: I can't seem to sudo gainroot...13:15
RussBOn OS2008 on the N800...13:15
czrRussB, enable R&D mode with the flasher13:16
RussBAhhh... k13:16
timelyxtry this url:13:16
czrfatal parsin error13:17
czr"The index may not be ready. Try again in a minute."13:18
czr(at the end of the url)13:18
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timelyxoh brother13:25
timelyxcan you verify 2154? add as the url field value and use it for testing13:26
* timelyx can't because the stupid banner bar doesn't work right13:26
czradd where?13:26
timelyxthe bug's url field of course :)13:27
timelyxthe field you keep forgetting to fill in13:27
timelyxsomeday i'll have banged that into a couple of you maemo reporters13:27
timelyxmaybe 313:27
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czrI fill the url field nowadays13:28
czrwhen possible/makes sense13:28
pupnik_18 days to N81013:28
czrtimelyx, I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be seeing btw13:28
czrtimelyx, url opens just fine here13:29
czralthough mind you, my account works now.13:29
timelyxthere should be a toolbar13:29
L0cutusi'll buy the n810 display on ebay and put it on my n800 , the perfect solution :)13:29
timelyxthe toolbar should have some menu that would let you try to subscribe to be informed about changes to the page13:29
timelyx(read bug)13:29
czrthere's none, but I'm using a legacy version of the browser. plus my account has super-privs anyway ;-)13:29
czrlet me try in firefox13:30
czrno probs. But, as I said, my account has superpowers13:31
czrso I'm not sure I'm the correct person trying thing13:31
czrthis even13:31
* timelyx ponders13:32
timelyxfair enough, bug Jaffa :)13:32
czrI can't change the URL btw13:32
czr"You tried to change the URL field to , but only the assignee or reporter of the bug, or a sufficiently empowered user may change that field."13:32
czrwhy should I bug jaffa? you bug him :-)13:32
timelyxoh brother13:32
timelyxtry again13:33
pupnik_the community should keep up with the blogs from maemo people13:34
czrtimelyx, added13:34
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pupnik_    for e.g. -- and the rest13:35
czrpupnik_, why?13:35
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timelyxpupnik_: i'd bury his article right away13:36
timelyxfirst he again fails to market to americans13:36
czrbury it "straight and deep"13:36
* Jaffa sees his name whilst waiting for an svn commit hook to complete13:36
timelyxyes yes13:36
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Jaffatimelyx/czr: what do you want me to do?13:38
pupnik_i didn't keep up with the nokia developer blogs, but now i find them revealing andn interesting13:38
timelyxis he syndicated by planet?13:38
czrJaffa, blame timelyx, I'm innocent13:38
timelyxczr: did you punt on verifying that bug?13:38
czrtimelyx, no. I didn't see why I should :-)13:39
czrI try to steer away from webish things, unless there's something broken with the content.13:39
Jaffapupnik_: which community *isn't* keeping up with "the blogs from maemo people"? I read pmo several times a day13:39
* Jaffa has a wry grin at the first two sentences on ;-)13:41
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timelyxczr: can you give the bug # to jaffa :)13:41
czrtimelyx, why are you being such a difficult person/bot now? :-)13:41
timelyxvery short term memory :)13:42
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czrheh jaffa at url13:42
timelyxok, i said i woudl, and i did. bury :)13:43
RussBczr: that worked, thanks!13:43
czrRussB, np. I'll send the invoice tomorrow.13:43
Jaffatimelyx/czr: so I should try subscribing to that page and see if it works?13:44
* czr has no idea13:45
czrsubbing worked for me13:45
czrtry subbing13:45
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JaffaDidn't give me an error, but I can't find a way of seeing what I'm actually subscribed to.13:45
czrtimelyx, err. my about:config does not have useragent.override.13:45
czrJaffa, same here13:45
czrbut I guess people were having more of an issue with their accounts than subbing to the page per se13:46
czrthe bug report isn't very clear on what the issue was13:46
timelyxyou just have to create it13:46
timelyxit doesn't exist by default...13:46
timelyxthe picture had a red link instead of black13:47
timelyxmy guess is that it wasn't clickable13:47
timelyxdunno :)13:47
timelyxi never figured out what it did either :)13:47
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* db48x works on his irc activity distribution some more13:49
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czrtimelyx, bleh, I fail at verying 207513:52
czr"Your browser sent a request that this server could not understand." & "Request header field is missing ':' separator."13:52
czrprobably a newline hidden in the field now13:53
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gokrMay I ask about the calendar app(s) on maemo? I am thinking of getting an n810.14:15
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halley"may I ask" is useless on IRC, just ask.14:21
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gokrOf course.14:23
gokrWell, just wondering how it stacks up - and which calendar app people use.14:23
srwalterwhat replaced gdbm in chinook?14:24
lardmangokr: there's gpe-calendar and something from poky14:25
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rothielHi guys :)14:52
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maddlermorning all...15:33
Takbuon giorno15:33
maddlerTak: a te! :D15:33
maddler_Monkey: aloha kahua! :D15:34
_Monkeymaddler: excuse me?15:34
maddler_Monkey: yep....15:34
_Monkeymaddler: i'm not following you...15:34
maddler_Monkey: ?15:34
_Monkeyi haven't a clue, maddler15:34
maddlerme neither... what are we talking bout? it could help... ;)15:34
Jaffalo maddler15:35
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maddlerJaffa: heya!15:38
maddlerdoh! Just realized _Monkey is a bot! :D15:40
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Jaffamaddler: heh, it's because he makes the same amount of sense as Darius\d+ on ITT.15:41
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timelessthat's scary15:44
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Xtrophytimelyx dont u ever sleep15:45
timelesswhile you aren't watching :)15:45
Xtrophydoes he do bad things while he sleeping15:47
Takhe doesn't know about the live webcam yet15:47
trulsspeaking of cams, anything fun you can do with the camera on the n800, anyone written any fun apps for it?15:48
trulslike print-club stuff, or something?15:48
Xtrophytimelyx they r asking o u :P15:49
Takactually, I was wondering if anybody had gotten around to writing an app that averaged N frames from the camera for a better-quality still15:49
XtrophyN X Y theese are serious variables... Its looks hard idk.15:50
trulsack, i just need a spreadsheet to enter some dates and times and descriptions into...15:52
* truls is billing hours, and paper is soo 9s15:52
rghoshTak: not sure if that wouldn't just make a blurry image?15:52
rghoshodd that camera stuff that works on the n800 with os2007 doesn't with os200815:53
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trulsrghosh: i'd hope you'd place the n800 on a stable surface first15:53
db48xyou don't even have to do that15:53
timelesstruls: :)15:53
trulstimeless: hm... actually that might work, but would prefer to have my data local15:54
db48xit's not hard to compose several images from an uncalibrated and unstable camera, you can download software to do it15:54
* truls didn't realize15:54
rghoshi would have thought even initiating the task through touch screen or built-in button would impart a small amount of motion to the camera15:55
rghoshi don't see the point in doing it remotely15:55
rghoshcan't be that hard up for a digital camera?15:55
rghoshcurious that this video recording gstreamer pipeline command (runnable from the command line) works in os2007 but not os2008 (same device):  19:2415:57
rghoshgst-launch-0.10 gconfv4l2src ! video/x-raw-yuv,width=176,height=144 ! tee name=tee ! hantro4200enc ! avimux name=mux ! filesink location=test.avi { dsppcmsrc ! queue ! audio/x-raw-int,channels=1,rate=8000 !audioconvert ! mux. } { tee. ! video/x-raw-yuv ! xvimagesink sync=false } 19:2415:57
rghoshif i change "video/x-raw-yuv,width=176,height=144" to "video/x-raw-yuv,width=176,height=144,framerate=\(fraction\)8/1", it doesn't crash, but it still doesn't work15:57
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trulsah, got gnumeric set up on the n80015:58
db48xscroll down to the image15:58
db48xtruls: I just use a text file to keep track of hours15:58
db48xforget giant spreadsheet programs15:58
rghoshso they have tripods for n800s? :)15:58
rghoshstill don't see the point, frankly15:58
db48xrghosh: tripods?15:58
rghoshum yeah15:58
rghoshfor a stable shot15:59
rghoshwithout a tripod,15:59
rghoshyou wouldn't get that shot in the example15:59
db48xwhich example?15:59
rghoshout of sequential shots15:59
rghoshthe "plurality of images"15:59
rghoshwithout a tripod, the "plurality of images" would not exactly coincide16:00
db48xoh, those were just sequential video frames from a hand held camera16:00
db48xthat's the point16:00
db48xthey don't have to exactly coincide16:00
db48xthe same software can handle any motion the camera makes, even if it results in a non-affine transformation of the image16:01
db48x(such as rotation of the camera, as in that example)16:01
rghoshthat was my next question16:01
rghoshvery good then16:01
trulsdb48x: i don't need a giant thing, but i want tables16:02
db48xplus you can take multiple shots without moving the camera, varying the exposure instead16:02
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trulsi could have just made something with a gtk-table widget though, but...16:02
XtrophyDont click16:02
db48xand combine them into a single image with a greater dynamic range16:02
Xtrophyits keylogger16:02
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db48xtruls: what kind of a table?16:03
rghoshanyone here actually use that software?16:03
rghoshcorrection from non-affine transformations could possibly suck on the n800's processor16:03
trulsdb48x: like a grid16:03
db48xtruls: I just do "foo | 1200 | 1500 | blah blah blah" :)16:03
db48xrghosh: possibly, possibly :)16:03
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trulsdb48x: well, that works, but if i can, i'd rather use a real tabke16:04
db48xrghosh: I think that guy was using a P4 in his wearable computer, and it can do it in real time16:04
db48xtruls: yea16:04
rghoshlol nice16:04
db48xthere are some cool videos on that site16:04
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Xtrophydont be sick16:05
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* alterego writes a script to poll the product list.16:08
trulsalterego: you working on a todo-app now?16:09
* db48x yawns16:09
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alteregotruls, no. Doing real work ;)16:09
db48xI should just turn around and go right back to bed16:09
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trulsalterego: heh, right16:09
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trulsack, seems the gnumeric doesn't register any filetypes with hildon..16:14
trulsand can't even use it to open up an unregistered file16:14
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unique311flash for the device is not picking up that i have a camera on the device.  Is it possible to make it pick up that the device has a camera?16:14
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unique311or is this linux in general.16:15
unique311flash for linux limitation.16:15
unique311can someone running linux on a desktop see if flash pick up the webcam16:16
sp3000truls: how is a script to poll the product list not a todo-app ;)16:17
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* sp3000 dives back into the magical world of sql16:18
czrsp3000, pronounced: squeeel16:20
* sp3000 squeeels16:20
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czrthe sound that server makes16:20
trulsodd, gnumeric opens my document fine from commandline, both if i pass the filename as regular path and as URI16:21
* czr needs to get some food and sleep16:21
sp3000hrm, I was hoping I could run this query in less than an hour :\16:21
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czrsp3000, no indices?16:21
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trulsbut will not open it if i doubleclick my document, then select gnumeric to run it16:21
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sp3000it's a bit convoluted16:21
* truls wonders what parameters is sent to the application from the hildon manager16:21
czrsp3000, I can imagine. has to do something with maemo, right? would explain :-)16:22
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czrwas talking with some admins from "slightly larger" environment. they're using rrdtool a lot16:23
czronly rrdtool is crap. when you have a lot of rrds16:23
czrso they ended up buying 32 GiB RAM to the host that updates the rrds and keep all of the rrds on ramfs16:23
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czrand then once a night sync them onto the disk. that's pretty convoluted :-)16:23
czrso you could solve your problem like that as well :-). Just buy enough RAM to fit all of the DB into RAM. easypeasy.16:24
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Jaffaalterego: something like wget -qO- '' | grep N810 && echo 'Bingo!' - you mean?16:24
alteregoJaffa, yeah. Something like that ;)16:25
czrecho Bingo would be easier though16:25
* czr hides & runs away16:25
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trulshm, ah, so when filemanager opens a program to run a file, it doesn't pass the filename as a parameter?16:26
alteregoGood afternoon czr.16:26
alteregotruls, it doesn't?16:26
czrhey alterego16:27
_Monkeyor working on a Ruby todo app16:27
czrmonkey recognizes you :-)16:27
alteregoWhy is my name associated with a Ruby todo app :P16:27
* Jaffa slaps czr16:29
czruh.. what.. where..16:30
trulsalterego: well, my app didn't receive anything in sys.argv (python-app) when choosing it as a runner for an unregistered file16:30
* czr puts a trout into jaffas pocket16:30
Khertan_TheRealalterego > lol16:30
trulsor do you have to register how it runs files somehow?16:30
unique311Only ALSA is supported for microphone input and speaker output, and only Video4Linux v1 is supported for camera input.16:31
unique311camera on the n800 should work then?16:31
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pupnik_so how are sales of N810s doing in USA?  sold out?16:33
unique311n800 vl42, should i write to the flash guys, and tell them to up the support to version 216:33
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* alterego doesn't get this we want flash video webcam fad.16:35
unique311ustreamtv and blogtv16:35
alteregoSounds rubbish :P16:36
alteregoWho'd want to see your ugly face talking on a blog :P16:36
unique311you are a crack baby.16:36
alteregoI think it was LSD actually16:37
unique311same difference16:37
db48xyea, I don't want to have to deal with real content in video form until videos are as easily searchable as text16:37
db48xfunny youtube videos are different though16:38
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unique311i know thoughtfix blogged on this once.  I guess it would only benefit those who video blog.16:39
unique311but thats open source, you want a feature, better hope a developer wants that feature also, or you are SOL16:40
unique311a linux thang16:41
derfNo, you can pay for a feature to be developed.16:42
derfJust like you do for any proprietary software.16:42
unique311isn't flash free.16:42
derfExcept you wind up with much more at the end.16:42
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db48xflash isn't free16:43
unique311why would i need to pay for the feature to be added, which might be working, but just not on the n800 mind you.16:43
db48xzero monetary cost to the consumer, maybe16:43
derfI think you are very confused.16:43
unique311i might be, so enlighten me.16:44
unique311so who needs to pay who in order to get that flash camera feature to work on the N800?16:44
timelessunique311: the flash team couldn't manage to get camera working. they know, there's a bug. i bug them quarterly.16:45
unique311thanks timeless.16:45
timelessunique311: out of curiosity, did you find the report?16:45
Jaffaunique311: why, in open source, do I need a developer to need it too? This is exactly the case with closed source software too: if you can't develop it yourself, someone needs to do it for you.16:45
unique311i just google, adobe flash linux camera support16:45
unique311didn't bother with the bugs16:46
timelessas for whom to bribe, it's basically either adobe or unmentionables16:46
* timeless considers bugging them now16:46
derfJaffa: That was exactly my point.16:46
db48xJaffa: yea, but flash isn't open source, so none of that helps him16:46
derfdb48x: Well, he was criticizing open source.16:46
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db48xah, I missed that16:47
derf09:40:00 < unique311> but thats open source, you want a feature, better hope a developer wants that feature also, or you are SOL16:47
db48xunique311: yea, you can't blame this bug on the open source development process, since flash isn't open source16:47
unique311hey don't copy and paste me.16:47
derfI have no advice for his specific situation.16:47
db48xI do. don't use flash. :)16:47
derfOther than bug timeless, which seems to be working.16:47
* timeless slaps unique311 w/ a bug database16:47
timelessplease learn to search the bug database16:48
timelessyou do get points for using google16:48
unique311would saying LINUX be better than saying open source?16:48
timelessbut you get a few more points for also checking the  bug database :)16:48
derfunique311: No. Linux is open source.16:48
db48xunique311: no, because flash isn't part of linux16:48
timelesslinux is a mess :)16:48
czrlinux is a kernel!16:48
unique311i suck then, is that cool with ya'll16:48
czrthe kernel is a mess though, but that's different.16:48
db48xtimeless: it's our mess though16:48
derfYou might be able to say, "It's a software thing."16:48
czror "It's not hardware. kind of"16:49
derfFlash is, in fact, software.16:49
unique311derf, i'll take it.16:49
czrseeing as most hardware works via firmware anyway16:49
derfAnd you have the same problem with _all_ software features.16:49
db48xunique311: no, you don't suck. you merely haven't learned all that you need to learn yet16:50
czrdb48x, does one ever actually reach that point?16:50
* Jaffa wishes he had time to learn all the things he *knows* he needs to learn; let alone relearn all the stuff I've forgotten, or find out what I don't currently know I need to learn :-(16:50
JaffaHmm, personal pronoun mixage.16:51
derfJaffa: Join the club.16:51
* czr gives a book on visual basic to jaffa16:51
unique311Jaffa, that confused me.16:51
raflwhat's a sensible value for /system/osso/connectivity/IAP/wlan_sleep_timeout if you're having problems with the default (200)?16:51
unique311also am confused for being addressed about making that open source statement.16:51
unique311and then addressed in saying i sucked for doing so.16:51
Jaffaczr: Fortunately, I've both learnt and forgotten enough of that to be useful enough in it to know to not do it again (unless in specific rare circumstances)16:51
czrunique311, take it like a man :-)16:52
Jaffarafl: I've heard 1000 mentioned16:52
derfunique311: The idea is very important. You do _not_ have to be a developer to take advantage of the source code available with open source.16:52
czrJaffa, I know the feeling too well :-)16:52
derfAnd I don't recall saying anyone sucked.16:52
czrJaffa, but you can use the book to light a fire when in dire straits16:52
* Jaffa ponders trying to get an Eee whilst waiting for an N81016:52
Jaffaczr: ah, good plan :)16:52
unique311well i said i sucked, but then was told i don't.16:53
czrJaffa, I keep all my MS techrefs still handly. 1 meter of microsoft manuals can't be bad when the nuclear winter hits.16:53
unique311and needed to learn.16:53
raflJaffa: will I need to restart after changing that value?16:53
Jaffarafl: given it's a /sys value, I assume not (it'd reset on boot AIUI)16:54
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derfunique311: Well, I'll just say your hopes have a much better chance of being fulfilled when you hand a developer money.16:54
derfIt's amazing how that can align someone else's interests with your own.16:55
czrderf, so true.16:55
unique311guess labor is not part of the free16:56
unique311I didn't think of that.16:56
derfFree means freedom.16:56
derfYou are free to pay anyone you want to do the development.16:56
czrunique311, it is sometimes, but it's up to the one doing the labor. you can't demand anyone to do anything for free. or rather you can, but it'll be fruitless.16:56
derfWhich is _not_ true with closed source.16:56
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unique311no demanding here, What about asking really nicely.16:57
unique311and pointing out all the individuals that would be happy in the developers accomplishments.16:57
derfFor some people that's enough.16:58
unique311hope is still alive.16:58
derfFinding a few dozen like-minded users willing to chip in a few bucks for a bounty might be more successful.16:59
timelessopensource means money can talk16:59
timelessclosedsource sometimes means you need to hire a lawyer to find someone who will listen16:59
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unique311derf, SOL with that one.17:01
unique311thoughtfix besides me, is the only other individual i know of that brung up that issue.17:02
unique311and he's probably over it.17:02
derfWell, it's really hard to get anything done in the software world without economies of scale.17:02
JaffaBut it's irrelevant anyway, since a bounty won't work as it's closed source :)17:02
derfIf you're not leveraging the fact that the marginal cost of each additional unit is near-zero, the fixed costs will kill you.17:03
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unique311thanks everybody, i'll make sure next time i check maemo bugs, before i come in here starting S!$@17:04
WillySillywhat gtk version does 2007HE use?17:04
unique311but i did learn alot.17:05
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alteregoIt's all about the layerz17:06
alteregoGod damnit, I don't like how xchat fixes my purposeful typos.17:06
* sp3000 finds his giant sql doh17:06
derfWillySilly: I would assume 2.6, like the others, but I haven't used 2007HE specifically.17:07
* sp3000 finds himself having engaged in rampant muppetry17:08
red-zacki want to code some python things with my 770, are the packages for available?17:13
fysawhere is xchat for OS2K8?17:14
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_Monkeyi heard repositories was  and a searchable index at
fysaI should have known to check 'Maemo hakers' ;)17:16
Takalterego: Settings-Advanced-AutoReplace17:17
Takyou don't want the Maemo-hackers one17:17
alteregoThis is XChat on my workstation not tablet ;)17:17
red-zackpython support for 770?17:17
alteregoBut thanks for the tip17:17
ajennaI wanna use internet via bluetooth on my Nokia n7317:18
ajennabut I do not know how17:18
ajennan somebody help here17:18
Takalterego: same menus17:18
Takthe second comment was to fysa actually17:18
red-zackajenna: bloetooth connection to your "modem"17:18
alteregoHas no one done internet connectivity how tos?17:18
red-zackajenna: you need to configure it before17:19
fysado I need libdbus hackery for that to work?17:19
alteregoPeople coming here and asking is getting old fast ..17:19
* Tak shrugs17:20
ajennahow can I configure it ?17:20
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fysawish there was an easy way to copy from desktop and paste to maemo17:21
fysaactually.  I think it's time to try to get synergy working.17:22
fysaI'm pretty sure it supports copy/paste.17:23
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WillySillyderf: so 2007 or 2008 dont use 2.8 or 2.10?17:23
derfWillySilly: 2008 uses 2.10, I believe.17:23
WillySillyderf: ah17:24
Khertan_TheReal2007 use 2.617:24
WillySillyderf: I only ask because Metasploit's gtk gui wants 2.10, I was pretty sure 2007 didnt use it, but I wasnt sure17:24
sp3000red-zack: ooi, where's it say modem?17:25
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* sp3000 doesn't reacall seeing that term in the ui17:28
sp3000then again I haven't seen os2007 in english lately17:28
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sp3000oh, left17:30
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* sp3000 would have pointed at the manual, it probably covers things like that17:30
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fysaahh, glorious xchat17:34
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pupnikthank god music isn't totally dead-ended.  DubStep is a pretty nice new style17:51
pupnikoop wrong chan17:51
jumpulano problem. it was nice to know this :)17:51
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* jumpula = wicked17:52
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zoranpupnik, close to portishead?17:53
pupnikzoran: portishead was like 10 years ago - popularized 'trip hop'17:55
pupnikdubstep is a bit of that, a bit of dub, a bit of breakbeat in there17:55
zoranI prefer Jefferson Airplane or Grateful Dead17:55
zoranor Nick Cave last grindermen17:56
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_Monkeyhello, roue17:57
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rouequick, stupid question for a new n800 own (OS2008).  How do I put this thing to sleep without shutting it down?17:58
Jaffaroue: 1) you don't; 2) you just lock the screen; 3) in OS2007 you could enable a "soft power-off" mode-  this is currently broken in OS2008 AIUI17:59
zoransounds strange17:59
roueJaffa -- lock the screen and then the display stays on till it times out (1 minute currently) ?18:00
roueis there a way to lock the screen without hitting the tiny recessed power button?18:00
roue(I'm having a little trouble hitting the button -- fingers too big)18:01
proctoroue: just enable offline mode, and then lock the screen18:01
proctoenabling offline mode is going to save you a lot of battery18:01
roueokay, thanks. I think I see how to do both of those things.18:02
zoranif I get it correctly, no "shutdown -h now" ?18:03
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|tbb|anyone knows if maemomapper runs stable with detail mode 3 enabled?18:08
oilis there an collection of apt-sources.lists which would be good to use with os2008?18:09
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geoffegok, yea, i can see how the new firmware rocks.. but.. Dear God, Nokia, include a "mark all feeds as read" in the RSS reader18:10
geoffegwith 50 feeds i don't always want to read them all18:10
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geoffegIs the RSS reader open source too?18:11
niteOwl2Good Q. Anyone know?18:11
geoffegCause I need to add that.18:11
proctogeoffeg: what's in the new firmware?18:13
proctoI'm resisting upgrading18:13
geoffegprocto: First off everything just feels snappier.. it also just looks so much better from an appearance point of view. The UI feels like it was made to be used with your finger more than the stylus.18:14
geoffegprocto: A version of what I assume to be navicore is included.. I need to get my SDHC card back from Kingston because the US maps are a 733 MB download.18:14
proctooh, cool18:15
proctocan it run os2007 soft?18:15
proctospecifically, I want mplayer18:15
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geoffegprocto: It's the first version of the firmware that's strarting to really feel polished and smooth.18:15
geoffegprocto: All software written for OS2007 needs to be ported (recompiled mostly) for OS200818:16
proctoI don't have a linux machine at home right now18:16
proctoso I'm going to hold off on upgrading for a bit longer18:16
Jaffaprocto: you shouldn't need to go into offline mode unless you have something which is keeping connections active and doing regular pings18:17
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geoffegprocto: Most of the important apps (Pidgin, FBReader, etc) are already ported.18:17
proctoJaffa: oh, I do :>18:17
sKaBoygeoffeg, there are sources for osso-rss-feed-reader (and applet) on
proctoJaffa: I don't usually bother. I'm connected most of the time.18:18
geoffegsKaBoy: great, i might hack that to improve the RSS reader and make it more NetNewsWire like18:18
proctoJaffa: but when I want to save some battery while I'm doing something else, I go offline18:18
proctoah, LXDoom is ported to os200818:19
proctomost important app :>18:19
geoffeg the main app menu just feels so fast!18:19
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|tbb|no1 using maemo-mapper ?18:24
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unique311hey who was around for my little flash rant earlier18:25
unique311timeless, BUSY?18:25
pupnikflash is like dog farts :)18:26
unique311i think i have some good info on why the camera is not being picked up.18:26
unique311i browsed to barcodepedia and when i clicked on allow flash to access whatever it wants to.18:27
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unique311the message i get back states Access to webcam is disallowed by user.18:27
Khertan_TheReal<procto> most important app :> > pfffff nawak ! the most important is Quake !18:28
unique311but then, how does the user have access to webcam when the gmail chat program is being used.18:28
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unique311also gizmo18:29
geoffegWould anyone find a desktop widget that allows you to track packages  (fedex, UPS, etc) usefull?18:29
Khertan_TheRealgeoffeg > useless for me ... their tracking are always 3 or 4 day late18:30
roueunique311 maybe check to find the /dev entry for the camera. It may be that the read/write permissions need to be changed.18:30
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geoffegKhertan_TheReal: USPS's tracking sucks but Fedex and UPS seem fairly up-to-date18:30
Khertan_TheRealfor example my n800 was tracking as registered :) and i ve it in my hand :)18:30
roueprobably /dev/video0 if it's anything like a desktop linux v4l device.18:30
bill20r3geoffeg, that'd be neat.18:30
unique311let me check18:30
bill20r3save me the constant reloading.18:31
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Khertan_TheRealgeoffeg > not a lot in france :) it s depends mainly on locals succursales18:31
unique311i see video018:31
geoffegKhertan_TheReal: Does France have their own private package delivery companies that are similar to UPS and Fedex?18:32
Khertan_TheRealgeoffeg > their is a public too ... nammed 'laposte' or 'chronopost'... but it worse :)18:32
Khertan_TheRealit s worse18:32
unique311roue user has access to the dev, gizmo and the chat app that comes installed with the device is started by user18:32
geoffegKhertan_TheReal: ok.. well.. a package tracking app for Real Countries :)18:32
oilgeoffeg: ask the companies to suppor rss-feed18:33
Jaffaunique311: the error reporting could well be very broken and/or related to the bug which timeless mentioned18:33
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Khertan_TheRealgeoffeg> for infos if you want to add it :
roueunique311 yep, that looks to be the case on mine too.18:34
geoffegKhertan_TheReal: The most likely way I'd do it is to have a server-side component I run and then have the applet pull from a simple interface on that server.18:35
geoffegKhertan_TheReal: to keep the applet as simple as possible18:35
timelessok, so um18:35
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timelessunique311: as it happens18:35
timelesscamera support can be done by someone other than us18:35
timelessit's in a library which theoretically is open source18:36
unique311but it looks like support is there already.18:36
unique311timeless, browse to this url with the tablet18:36
timelessif i were to place a guess, i'd say it's probably
timelessunique: sorry, i have a headache18:37
unique311i just check the bugs on maemo, looks more like a request from thoughtfix18:37
timelessi just spent an hour collecting people to translate 1 sentence18:37
Khertan_TheRealgeoffeg > it s the best way18:37
timelessand then notepad ate my translation18:37
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unique3111889 is a request.18:40
geoffegso who wants to buy me an N95?18:40
geoffegGIVE ME18:40
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timelessgeoffeg: send me 1kEUR via paypal and i'll buy you an n9518:41
unique311so yeah, jaffa no bug just a request and the other bug that showed up on the search doesn't deal with flash.18:42
geoffegtimeless: no no, you've got it all wrong.. you want to give me one.. for free18:42
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chxanyone compared the N810 to the E90? I know , E90 is not Linux but functionality-wise (keyboard, gps...) looks similar?18:43
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timelesschx: i tried selling an n810 to someone planning to buy an e90 :)18:43
timelessstill not sure which way the guy is going :)18:43
CosmicRayhi folks.  I've got an N810 here, OS2008.  I've installed openssh-server and am trying to figure out how to set a password for the user or root account to log in.  The info on the wiki (root password "rootme") doesn't seem to work.  And all the other info I've found is for the 770.  What's the curren't best way to get root?18:43
Robot101currenot? :)18:44
inzCosmic, enable r&d mode18:44
shackanthe password is "rootme", just don't forget to enable R&D mode18:44
CosmicRayah, ok.18:44
* timeless frowns18:44
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timelessssh doesn't require r&d mode18:44
* timeless never enables r&d mode18:44
CosmicRayso can I enable R&D mode, change the password, then disable it again?18:44
CosmicRaytimeless: how have you done it then?18:44
mgedmintimeless: do you have a n810, and if so, what's the default root password?18:45
_Monkeyrootme is probably the default pw?18:45
mgedminpeople keep saying that it doesn't work for them18:45
CosmicRaytimeless: I just tried it again, and it does not work.  openssh-client here.18:45
CosmicRayerr, s/client/server/18:45
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zoranCosmicRay, ssh first to localhost18:46
trenkaroot is disabled in production mode now18:46
timelesshrm, indeed18:46
* timeless frowns18:46
timelesstrenka: why?!18:46
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CosmicRayzoran: to what user?18:46
timelessyeah, it doesn't work18:46
zoranroot, why not this time18:46
* timeless grumbles18:46
unique311timeless you are the developer for microb?18:46
timelessnot "the", just "one of"18:46
chx look at this. I am _totally_ torn.18:46
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unique311how do i start it from the command line?18:47
trenkatimeless: why it should be enabled&18:47
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unique311this in in os2008, btw18:47
timelesstrenka: so that people can get work done?18:47
CosmicRayzoran: ssh root@localhost, password rootme, still does not work.18:47
trenkatimeless: why?18:47
geoffegbecause i bought the device, i own it, it's mine, so i can do whatever i want with it18:47
pupnikwhat is your use-case for PAMP chx?18:47
timelesschx: that's about s60, no?18:47
zoranCosmicRay, you get pass prompt?18:48
* chx thinks his nick name needs more pimping.18:48
CosmicRayzoran: yess18:48
chxpupnik: slide 13 on maintaining-your-own-branch-of-drupal-core18:48
chxpupnik: slide 13 on
timelesstrenka: if i have a user toor w/ uid 0 can i log in using that18:48
timelessor do i need to enable r&d mode?18:48
zoranCosmicRay, it means app is working correctly18:48
CosmicRayzoran: blink?  which app?18:48
zoranif the root login was not disabled18:49
CosmicRayI already know openssh-server is working because I get the password prompt from another machine18:49
trulsany chance of programatically (shell or otherwise) opening the filemanager to a certain path?18:49
trenkatimeless: yes you can18:49
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zoranCosmicRay, could you go as "user"18:49
chxpupnik: I *need* a device that I can pocket and whenever and wherever I have the urge, I can bang out some Drupal patch.18:49
timelesstrenka: so it's still root only protection, strange18:49
CosmicRaybtw is there any source for the 42.19 2008 firmware update other than  It is downloading at 4.8KB/s and crashed after about 50% of the download yesterday18:50
timelessok, so i should just make a very broken package that "fixes" this18:50
* timeless sighs18:50
timelesscosmicray: it's just a kernel update18:50
zoranCosmicRay, could you reboot?18:50
chxpupnik: N810 and E90 are the candidates, at this moment. nothing else is pocketable. All those flasy Sony UX , OQO whatever are bricks.18:50
CosmicRaywhat is the user password?18:50
pupnikah chx - gotcha18:50
timelessfind someone who has the whole thing and ask them to split the pieces :)18:50
henriquewhats the problem with maemo repository?18:50
mgedmintrenka: is it that the root account is locked, or is it that openssh-server has PermitRootLogin no?18:50
pupnikchx - come on over to the maemo world and make cool stuff with us18:50
CosmicRaytimeless: well I have had some trouble with the device not powering on properly18:50
CosmicRaytimeless: I could press and hold the power button all I like and nothing happens.  20 minutes later it works fine.18:51
trenkamgedmin: easy to check :)18:51
mgedminif you have a n810, yes :-)18:51
CosmicRayi thought if there was some weird power management trouble going on, might not hurt to try it.18:51
* mgedmin should make a backup and flash os2008 on his n800 some time soon18:51
chxpupnik: not an effective use of my resources. I am on "wizard" level in Drupal/PHP. It'd be a waste to try to code something else.18:51
CosmicRaythe update, that is.18:51
CosmicRayzoran: you want me to reboot into r&d mode?18:51
zoranno, just reboot, if you did something strange on the command prompt18:52
CosmicRayI didn't.18:52
zoranrecently installed openssh?18:53
pupnikchx: so do the drupal on N81018:53
CosmicRayall I tried was "passwd user", which told me it wasn't allowed18:53
CosmicRayerr, make that "passwd"18:53
chxpupnik: could be. but. isn't the E90 a better choice...18:53
mgedminCosmicRay: looks like you'll need to enable r&d mode then use sudo gainroot before you can set root's or user's passwords18:53
mgedminCosmicRay: or you could try the becomeroot package, if it's still availabl18:54
chxpupnik: I just do not know.18:54
zorancosmicRay, better to try user pass user, if you did it from user space18:54
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pupnikchx i duno - i am a biased advocate of linux and the tablets18:54
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mgedminzoran: CosmicRay: you can't set your own password if the account is locked; only root can18:54
chxpupnik: I only use Linux since 1993 september18:55
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chxpupnik: So it's not like I am against it.18:55
zoranmgedmin, k, I did it as root on 77018:55
chxok, so N810 owners, how pocketable it is?18:56
zoranbut the very first thing would be to go to root18:56
fysais it possible to add custom elements to the hildon 'Open file' browser dialog?18:56
mgedminn800 is reasonanbly pocketable; n810 is a bit smaller18:56
CosmicRayalso, is there any point to adding to my application manager, if I already have the nokia catalogs and the maemo extras enabled?18:56
fysaI'd like to add my nfs mount to the list.18:56
CosmicRaymgedmin: fits in my khakis pocket just fine18:56
CosmicRayeven in the carrying case18:56
chxsounds promising18:56
* mgedmin uses his shirt pocket18:56
fysalittle heavy for my shirt pocket18:56
fysalooks like I have a single fat tit18:57
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zoranget 218:57
fysaor droopy tit rather18:57
chxwhat? shirt pocket?18:57
chxthis sings fits into a shirt pocket??18:57
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CosmicRaychx: yes18:57
fysawhich case do you use, cosmic?18:57
CosmicRayprobably without a lot of room to spare, but it would18:57
CosmicRayfysa: just the standard fake-leather one that came with it so far18:58
CosmicRayfysa: I just got the device yesterday18:58
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zorancosmic, make a review18:58
chxbefore biting the $500 bullet I would like to run a round with my employer18:58
chxthat's why i do not yet have one18:58
CosmicRayzoran: already writing one18:58
CosmicRayI am so happy this thing runs Linux.  this is what the Zaurus should have been18:59
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chxMy usual q. Any tried a full LAMP stack already?18:59
db48xchx: on an n800/n810?19:00
* chx nods19:00
db48xwhy, if I may ask?19:00
chxsee above19:00
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chxI am a Drupal coder, through and through19:00
db48xa web server on an n800 isn't going to do much19:00
raflany idea what to change when I still have wifi connection problems after trying lots of different values between 0 and 5000 for /system/osso/connectivity/IPA/wlan_sleep_timeout?19:00
chxI do not need it to do much.19:00
zoranchx, you already have parts of it on device19:01
chxI won't run the next google off my tablet :P19:01
chxzoran: mysql-server ?19:01
zoranon one plain text file19:01
_Monkeysqlite is not interesting because of sql, but because it has figured out transactions, etc.  Wouldn't want to reimplement all of that just to avoid sql. :)19:01
db48xthat said, there's no reason why apache, mysql and perl would fail to work on the n800/n81019:02
zoranI saw little http daemon in catalog19:02
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db48xpython is already available, if that's your poison19:02
philnhi there19:02
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proctoI want lighttpd19:02
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proctofor fileserving19:02
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zorandb48x, python makes me life easier on 77019:03
db48xyea, I bet19:03
db48xanything is better than C19:03
db48xor even C++19:03
chxI know sqlite is available19:03
chxbut mysql-server is in ARM Debian19:03
chxso compilation  is at least possible19:04
zorancould be overkill19:04
chxit is overkill , so what?19:04
db48xyou'll probably have to compile apache your self as well19:04
db48xbut there are no signifigant hurdles, I imagine19:04
zoran770 cannot handle that kind of fun19:04
db48xother than the fact that you're going to be running it on a 400Mhz arm cpu19:05
zorannot so bad19:05
chxI am fine whatever webserver if it runs php.19:05
chxoh come on they run mysql-server on an nslu219:05
chxi can't believe it'll be worse :P19:05
trulsI am fine whatever webserver as long as php is disabled.19:05
zoranthat linksys is known to be slow19:06
* truls dreams of the day he can retire the php-enabled webserver at his work and feel safe again.19:06
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chxso who is into getting into an N810 :)19:06
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db48xtruls: nuke it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure19:06
zoransome people sursed php for good19:06
trulsdb48x: very true19:07
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pupnikk! s! ... at work!19:10
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KirG0FFHi. I've just re-flashed my N800 with the OS2008. Looks great. However, I found that most of the applications i used with the OS2007 haven't been ported to the OS2008 yet. What's the major problem porting an app to OS2008? Is it just about recompiling and the app for the new OS, or does it imply actual rewriting some parts of the code?19:24
fysaeh.  streaming from nfs causes too much of a performance hit .. (13%)19:25
geoffegKirG0FF: Mostly recompiling the app for the new versions of the libs.. Some apps may require slight rewriting19:25
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KirG0FFShall I switch to the new SDK along with the OS update in order to build apps for OS2008?19:26
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geoffegKirG0FF: I believe so.19:26
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trenkaKirG0FF: such thing clever guys check before flashing19:27
KirG0FFI just couldn't wait any longer :)19:27
geoffegtrenka: Most people have come to expect that OS upgrades/updates won't break their existing apps. :)19:27
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KirG0FFI knew I could expect all of my apps to be ported to the new OS. I think I'll recompile the apps I need myself before they appear in the repository.19:29
mgedmingeoffeg: then they're not users of nokia internet tablets19:29
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geoffegmgedmin: Apparently :)19:30
timelessgeoffeg: people are silly19:30
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geoffegtimeless: humans.. so stupid! :)19:30
mgedminunreasonable expectations all the time :-)19:30
* mgedmin predicts that the situation will improve19:31
geoffegWhere would this world be without us?... Hmm.. probably not as polluted, etc :)19:31
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timelessgeoffeg: much better19:31
pupnikhelp free software spread to mobile devices.  that's a good deed for the world.19:32
pupnikit is something you can do19:32
db48xno, the world would be a lot worse without us19:36
db48xit would be so boring19:36
timelesshow so?19:36
timelessyou'd have lions and tigers and bears oh my19:36
timelesschasing everything19:36
timelesssome hyenas and leopards and ...19:36
db48xonly the interactions of sentient beings can have any real meaning19:36
timelessplenty of excitement19:36
db48xlions and tigers and bears don't compose sonets19:36
timelessmonkeys might19:37
db48xor woo a girl by moonlight19:37
geoffegawesome, my replacement 8GB SD card will be here tomorrow.. Kingston rocks19:37
unique311do ya'll really think the world would be much better without us here?19:37
timelessThe infinite monkey theorem states that a monkey hitting keys at random on a typewriter keyboard for an infinite amount of time will almost surely type a particular chosen text, such as the complete works of William Shakespeare.19:37
db48xthat has a neccessary precondition that would never be met19:37
timelessunique311: yes19:37
db48xsince obviously there will never be an infinite number of monkeys19:37
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db48xmuch easier to simply have a few humans around to do the interesting things instead19:38
unique311timeless, please tell me you not working on a way to make this a reality.19:38
alteregoJust because something is infinite doesn't mean that the probility of a very unlikely event is going to happen. It probably wont.19:38
timelessno, too busy poisoning the world w/ hardware19:39
doc|workwhat about if an infinite number of monkeys evolved?19:39
alterego~propability ..19:39
* doc|work hands alterego another b19:39
alteregoThere are a lot of factors against a monkey writing anything, let alone any shakespear ;)19:39
db48xalterego: indeed19:39
db48x(unless you count humans as monkeys, which would be odd)19:40
db48xodd but not unheard of19:40
bill20r3I count a few of them.19:40
alteregoYou'd need a parallel dimension like "The Planet of the Apes" or something.19:40
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pupnikwb lardman19:40
lardmanhi pupnik19:40
alteregoRight, that's enough work for me. Not to move on to other things.19:41
alteregoNamely OS2008 theming :)19:41
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killfilljust updated my n800 to os2008.. :)19:42
alteregokillfill, like it?19:42
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* lardman crosses fingers that poky image will get further this time19:43
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killfillits feels very good.. :=19:43
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alteregolardman, poky?19:44
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alteregolardman, how's PowerVR?19:44
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lardmanthat's what I want the poky image for, matching oabi & gcc versions19:44
oilhmm. the os2008 seems to loose my internal sd-card. only boot helps to find it back19:44
TakEven better, there exists some algorithm that translates any work created by a finite number of monkeys into a work that has meaning to humans (e.g. The Complete Works of Shakespeare)19:44
LinuxApeIs there an n800 specific channel?19:45
TakThis is the primate literature channel19:45
pupnikwell there is #n80019:45
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LinuxApeokay -- when will os2008 be available for download by n800 users?19:46
db48xheh, it already is, after a fashion19:46
bill20r3a beta version is now.19:46
alteregoYeah, we should move to #N8X0 and leave those old folks to it.19:46
* Tak indicates the topic19:46
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* Tak sees the future and joins #N200019:46
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alteregoVery star trek.19:47
* alterego gets back to his theming.19:47
alteregoAnd no .. I'm not going to do a damn "LARS" theme :P19:48
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TakThe N2000 will be a time-traveling IT made of liquid metal.  Still with no hardware 3d accel.19:48
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Takthere's already an LCARS theme19:48
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db48xTak: haha19:49
TakI wish the doom3 theme project on garage would do a release already19:49
alteregoTak, for OS2008? :P19:50
Takfor any OS19:50
alteregoBesides, I've seen it. It's not that great ^_^19:50
LinuxApeOne more question - how stable is the beta os2008?19:50
alteregoLinuxApe, it's perfectly stable. I've not had a single problem with it.19:51
killfillthere is something with the application manager.. its so slow to download things..19:51
killfilli guess it becouse hight traffic mameo is getting?..19:51 login broken *again*?19:51
alteregokillfill, that was just yesterday after everyone getting the new image. It was being slow not the OS19:51
alteregokillfill, exactly. Nothing to do with the application manager.19:52
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kulvealterego: it's still slow19:52
alteregoIt's always slow.19:52
alteregoBut last night it was barely working :P19:52
killfillyup.. :(19:52
kulvewell, now it's *slow*19:52
killfillwant to install ukmp.. python an all that stuf.. big fishes.. :P19:52
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timelessok, help19:53
killfilli had to actually download the image from bitorrent..:P19:53
timelessi need people who speak languages19:53
db48xwhat's different between the beta os2008 for the n800 and the os2008 for the n810?19:53
db48xtimeless: I speak a language!19:53
lardmanAny Nokians about who can give us a clue about N800 hardware revisions?:
unique311i also speak languages19:53
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timelesslardman: there's an internal table that documented a couple of those19:54
killfilli hate gcompris.. why does it has so many packages.. ?19:54
lardmantimeless: 1301 and 1302 have been seen in the wild, but I was just wondering what the later numbers are19:54
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alteregoMore bugs ..19:56
timelesslardman: help me find translations for this string and i'll look into it19:56
lardmantimeless: that google spreadsheet doesn't work for me19:56
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timelessthe sad thing is that i was 15/16 done19:57
timelessbut i made the mistake of trying to save my work19:57
timelesslardman: eh?19:57
timelesshow not?19:57
lardmanI can't load that page for some reason19:57
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lardmanmight just be my ancient version of Firfox actually....19:58
kulvethat requires login too..19:59
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* lardman has been told to go and buy wine, back in a bit19:59
timelessdb48x: any idea how to promote viewers to editors?19:59
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db48xfirst time I've ever used google docs, actually20:00
db48xpretty darn nifty though20:00
timelesswhat's your account?20:00
doc|workI'm really liking os2008, much faster, bootup and use, and mail actually works for me20:00
db48xI guess you figured it out :)20:01
Guy810Ello there doesn't seem to be any password manager app for maemo or am i missing it thx20:01
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timelessok, help, anyone here speak a language other than english?20:05
derfDoes Japanese count?20:05
doc|workwhat language do you want?20:05
timelessspanish counts20:05
timelessany langauge supported by os 2007/200820:06
E78C8EE4BABAdoes that include the CJK project?20:06
timelessyou'll need to give me a google docs account so i can make you an editor20:06
timeless(you can also give it to db48x while i'm sleeping)20:06
Takcan I fix the english ones?20:06
timelesstak: please don't20:06
timelesstak: if you object to the english ones, stick a comment in the comment field20:07
db48xhe needs da, es-ES, es-MX, fi, fr, fr-CA, it, nl, no-NO, pt-BR, pt-PT, ru and se-SV20:07
Takcomment field?  is that column d?20:07
timelessno, click "Discuss"20:07
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timelesshi keesj :(20:08
timelessoh, you're adding the ,?20:08
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db48xthe google docs chat log desperately needs a scrollbar20:11
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timelessi cna't find the input field20:12
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timelessfind the td parent of div imMsgsd20:13
timelesschange its style to height: 400px20:13
_Monkeytimeless: that doesn't look right20:13
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timelessthen you get a scrollbar20:13
timelessand can continue chatting20:13
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doc|workhmmm, is there anyway to set claws to flash the cursor key the same way the standard mail app does, then disable the standard mail app?20:14
db48xtimeless: heh20:14
db48xtimeless: I've just been tabbing down to the input box20:15
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pupnikif anyone is bored, do some docu for oprofile usage and examples kthxbai20:19
fysaexpect spam, db48x20:21
fysaI believe this channel is logged and indexed by google20:21
timelessit is20:21
db48xI get a lot of spam as it is, I won't notice any more20:22
doc|workyou know what would be handy, if anyone was bored enough. Profiles based on wifi connection. For example, at work there's the n800 uses a specific wifi connection and there's no need to have it lock the screen, while when I'm on the bus without a wifi connection it would be nice if it would lock the screen after a minute.20:22
* mgedmin would prefer ubuntu packages of the various maemo sdk versions20:23
doc|works/work there's/work20:23
kaltsipupnik: ?20:26
* alterego wonders who develops the TN20:27
fysamuch better.20:27
alteregodoc|home, I don't see the benifit in that,20:27
fysavolume=10.1:1, cache=4096, framedrop in /home/user/.mplayer/config helps a good deal.20:28
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alteregoThe map server is still slow as hell >:(20:29
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timelessda es-ES fr fr-CA it no-NO pt-BR pt-PT ru20:32
timelessneed translations for htose20:32
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TakI'll do the es-ES if cbiesinger isn't20:33
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* Tak can't tell20:34
timelessbiesi's german20:34
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alteregoI'm useless at any other language :)20:34
_berto_what do you need to translate?20:35
timelessbasically one sentence20:35
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_berto_column C?20:37
db48x_berto_: yes20:37
lardmanWhere is the qemu installed that scratchbox uses?20:38
_berto_for pt-PT you can use the same as pt-BR20:39
lardmanah, it's in one of the devkits, good good20:39
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_berto_maybe change 'esperando' for 'a esperar'20:39
_berto_which is more common in Portugal20:39
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db48x_berto_: go ahead and make that change :)20:40
timelessdb48x: they need invites, which is painful20:40
* timeless doens't hav ea way to auto auth people20:40
milhouse_monkey translate to portuguese what do you need translated?20:40
_Monkeymilhouse: que você necessita traduzido?20:40
milhouseMarks out of 10 for _Monkey? :)20:40
db48xah, I guess timeless already did it20:40
_berto_it's already translated for portuguese :)20:41
_berto_já está feito ;)20:41
timelessok, that leaves da fr fr-CA it no-NO ru se-SV20:41
milhouse_monkey translate from portuguese jà està feito20:41
_Monkeymilhouse: jà està made20:41
_berto_it's already done20:41
timelesssorry, i really don't trust bots20:42
fysaoddly, -vo xv is faster than -vo n770 on OS2008 for me.20:42
lardmanmilhouse: I'm getting funny symbols in that, perhaps _Monkey  is too20:42
fysaperhaps not faster, but more likeable.20:42
* timeless gets ? marks :)20:42
_berto_it's probably utf-820:42
timelessit probably *was* utf-8 :)20:42
sp3000at some point20:42
_berto_yes :D20:42
milhouselardman yeah the accents threw him a bit :)20:43
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timelessbtw, who speaks spanish here?20:43
milhouse_monkey :)20:43
_Monkeymilhouse: excuse me?20:43
timelessthe es-ES original text was broken20:43
milhouseshut up _monkey20:43
timelesswe noticed that the first time around20:43
killfillwhats the default password for root?20:43
_Monkeyrootme is the default pw?20:43
killfill(for sshing)20:43
derf_Monkey: translate from Portuguese já está feito20:43
_Monkeyderf: jáestámade20:43
derfWell, that didn't work, either.20:43
timelesskillfill: it seems in 2008 you might need to enable r&d mode first20:43
killfillPermission denied, please try again.20:43
timelessderf: looks better :)20:44
killfillr&d mode20:44
derfIt has nice accents in it, but it's not actually, you know, a translation.20:44
killfilli never did that before.. any tips? (i.e. url)20:44
timelessgoogle :(20:44
derf_Monkey probably isn't running UTF-8, either.20:44
_Monkeyderf: what?20:44
derfLike a fool.20:44
sp3000_Monkey: translate from Portuguese ja esta feito20:44
_Monkeysp3000: ja this fact20:44
_berto_not, 'esta' is different from 'está'20:45
* sp3000 expected it to fuzz around the accents, but, meh