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| p| | what is the correct way to start a webserver as a user via sudoers ? | 00:08 |
|---|---|---|
| p| | if i try to start it i receive an error due to log file permission | 00:08 |
| ||cw | chown the log file | 00:11 |
| p| | thanks, i'll try :) | 00:12 |
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| p| | bed time, cu2morrow | 00:12 |
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| keith___ | w00t | 00:29 |
| *** keith___ is now known as FMZ | 00:29 | |
| *** FMZ is now known as FMZ2 | 00:29 | |
| FMZ2 | Sorry, apparently all the FMZs are taken | 00:29 |
| *** FMZ2 is now known as FMZKJ | 00:29 | |
| alterego | Heh | 00:29 |
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| FMZKJ | I saw on the application list for OS2007 that someone got PHP working... and to come here for more info | 00:30 |
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| ||cw | some one's a little jumpy | 00:33 |
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| alterego | I doubt it'd take any effort at all to get PHP working on the device. | 00:37 |
| FMZKJ | Oops... if anyone answered my question when I accidentally left, could you re-paste. | 00:37 |
| alterego | But what would you do with it? Build websites? | 00:37 |
| FMZKJ | Thanks Alter :) | 00:37 |
| FMZKJ | alterego: No... I find PHP very handy for small utilities... so I don't have to learn C again. heh | 00:38 |
| FMZKJ | i.e. I have a PHP script that pulls down all of my podcasts. | 00:38 |
| alterego | Ah, yes. | 00:38 |
| alterego | I can see it's use there. | 00:38 |
| javamaniac | FMZKJ, use python instead | 00:38 |
| alterego | If you don't want to spend time learning Ruby or Python | 00:39 |
| FMZKJ | If I had the time to re-learn C, I'd love to. Or learn Python from scratch. | 00:39 |
| alterego | Python is so 2005 | 00:39 |
| alterego | It's all about Ruby-Maemo now. | 00:39 |
| FMZKJ | Ruby is so 2007 :P | 00:39 |
| FMZKJ | Oh? | 00:39 |
| alterego | Ruby is 20XX | 00:40 |
| FMZKJ | Is it really the Next Big Thing (tm)? | 00:40 |
| alterego | No, that'd be Rails. | 00:40 |
| FMZKJ | I thought Ruby = Rails. | 00:40 |
| alterego | Ruby is just a great programming language. Though it's shadowed by it's child Rails. | 00:40 |
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| alterego | No, Rails is just a web development framework. | 00:41 |
| alterego | Written in Ruby | 00:41 |
| FMZKJ | Hmmm.. | 00:41 |
| FMZKJ | I shall have to look into it | 00:42 |
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| alterego | Good choice :) | 00:43 |
| alterego | But I'm not bias or anything .. | 00:43 |
| alterego | It's not like I'm the Ruby-Maemo dev or anything .. | 00:43 |
| * alterego looks around the room innocently. | 00:44 | |
| FMZKJ | Oh... | 00:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 00:44 |
| FMZKJ | I see how you are | 00:44 |
| FMZKJ | But for now... the Tested App page says: php-5.2.0.tgz compiled in scratchbox with PCRE, sqlite support. XML gave problems with build. | 00:45 |
| FMZKJ | Does that mean I can just download the tarball and try to compile it on the device? | 00:45 |
| alterego | Well, compile it in the SDK. | 00:46 |
| alterego | Compiling it on the device would be touch. | 00:46 |
| alterego | ~tough .. | 00:46 |
| FMZKJ | Ahh, interesting. | 00:46 |
| FMZKJ | I'm just getting to the "experienced" stage in Linux... so, this should be fun. My n800 arrives on Friday. | 00:47 |
| alterego | Cool, | 00:47 |
| alterego | It's a real nice device. | 00:47 |
| alterego | You'll wonder how you ever lived without it. | 00:47 |
| FMZKJ | I'm already beginning to think so. | 00:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 00:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's bad. | 00:48 |
| alterego | Then you might try mating with it. | 00:48 |
| alterego | But I wouldn't recommend that .. | 00:48 |
| FMZKJ | I've refreshed the shipping page every 20 minutes since I ordered it. | 00:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | It sorta becomes your prosthetic computer. | 00:48 |
| FMZKJ | That's kinda what I want it for... an extention of myself :P | 00:48 |
| alterego | Yeah, it's taken the place of my laptop for a lot of things when I'm out and about. | 00:48 |
| FMZKJ | Almost went for the n810, but... I couldn't justify $250 more bucks just for GPS and a keyboard. | 00:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | So not worth it. | 00:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Especially with the lack of real SD | 00:50 |
| alterego | Yeah, that is a bit of an annoyance. | 00:50 |
| alterego | Considering all the SD's I've got .. | 00:50 |
| FMZKJ | alterego: Wanna throw one my way? ;) | 00:51 |
| alterego | Hopefully the device program results will be out of the bag soon though. | 00:51 |
| * alterego crosses fingers. | 00:51 | |
| FMZKJ | Device program results? | 00:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | alterego is whoring himself to Nokia to get a cheaper N810. | 00:51 |
| * FMZKJ bends over in Nokia's general direction | 00:51 | |
| alterego | Nokia have been nice enough to give 500 N810's for 99 EUR | 00:51 |
| alterego | Well, one could say whoring. | 00:52 |
| alterego | Or you could say being indirectly paid for my work :) | 00:52 |
| FMZKJ | Oh, nice... so, they give you an n810 and ask you to make things work on it. | 00:53 |
| alterego | Though, the gratitude and apreciation people have been giving me makes it worth it. | 00:53 |
| FMZKJ | What is your biggest contrib to the project so far? | 00:53 |
| alterego | ruby-maemo | 00:53 |
| _Monkey | ruby-maemo is coming along really nicely. | 00:53 |
| alterego | That's pretty much my only contribution so far :D | 00:53 |
| FMZKJ | Ahh, nice. | 00:54 |
| alterego | I've only been developing maemo for ~3 months | 00:54 |
| alterego | Considering _real_ work I think I've made some pretty good progress. | 00:54 |
| alterego | I've been using a lot :D | 00:54 |
| FMZKJ | What kind of uses does Ruby have on Maemo? (Honest questions, hope I'm not asking too much... heh. Just want to know if it's something I should really get into) | 00:54 |
| alterego | Ruby like Python on maemo allows you to build full graphical apps which can intergrate with the operating system. | 00:55 |
| alterego | It's basically a nicer way of developing applications for Maemo. | 00:55 |
| alterego | Rather than programming in C. Python and Ruby are a lot like PHP. Though they're more flexible and are oriented at general purpose programming. | 00:56 |
| FMZKJ | Wow... On the Ruby page it says it's a scripting language... never seen a scripting language allow you to build GUIs (other than process HTML... heh)... but then I never got into Python either. | 00:56 |
| ||cw | FMZKJ: never seen php-gtk or perl-gtk? | 00:56 |
| FMZKJ | I'm beginning to like the idea of this | 00:56 |
| FMZKJ | o_O | 00:56 |
| alterego | Well, I don't totally agree with Ruby being a "scripting language". I think that term is over used :) | 00:56 |
| FMZKJ | php-gtk? Are you kidding me? | 00:57 |
| alterego | Nope. | 00:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or, hell, Pashua for perl + OS X | 00:57 |
| FMZKJ | Wow... I do believe a whole new world was just opened up to me. | 00:57 |
| ||cw | you might be surprized how many gnome utilities are perl-gtk | 00:57 |
| FMZKJ | Doesn't Maemo use gtk? | 00:57 |
| alterego | Just don't mention it too much or people will start writing php-maemo .. | 00:57 |
| * alterego shudders. | 00:57 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 00:57 |
| FMZKJ | lol | 00:57 |
| alterego | FMZKJ, indeed. but with a few tweaks and some extra widgets. | 00:57 |
| *** sladen_ is now known as sladen | 00:57 | |
| FMZKJ | I'm now intrigued. | 00:58 |
| alterego | So, out-of-the-box php-gtk wont really cut it. | 00:58 |
| ||cw | IMO php doens't do so well for long running apps, at least not the typical builds | 00:58 |
| FMZKJ | cw... I wrote an IRC bot in PHP once... it ran fine for months with no restart. But then, it's not exactly intensive. | 00:58 |
| FMZKJ | Any recommended "Learn Ruby in 24 hours" eBooks? | 00:59 |
| alterego | Though, the work to get it to intergrate with hildon in a very minimal way. would require only bindings to HildonProgram and HildonWindow. | 00:59 |
| ||cw | a lot of modules have memory leaks | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ruby has some pretty good tutorials online. | 00:59 |
| alterego | Yeah, good tutorials and there's a really good book "Programming Ruby" | 00:59 |
| alterego | Which you can buy in PDF format .. | 00:59 |
| suihkulokki | someon is extending pgp-gtk to php-hildon ? :) | 00:59 |
| alterego | suihkulokki, NO NO NO! | 00:59 |
| alterego | damnit .. | 01:00 |
| ||cw | FMZKJ: I did the basic online thing from ruby's site and managed to write a command line dvd-ripper in ruby that uses mplayer/mencoder and lsdvd | 01:00 |
| alterego | I've opened pandora's box here. | 01:00 |
| FMZKJ | Holy crap | 01:00 |
| FMZKJ | alterego: I smell burning... | 01:00 |
| suihkulokki | haha | 01:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Haha | 01:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | 6 months and maemo will be dead. | 01:00 |
| FMZKJ | o_O | 01:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | A wasteland of broken PHP programs. | 01:00 |
| FMZKJ | lmao | 01:00 |
| alterego | Heh | 01:00 |
| FMZKJ | a la Matrix real world | 01:00 |
| ||cw | php-gtk isn't very complete anyway | 01:01 |
| FMZKJ | It just surprised me was all. | 01:01 |
| ||cw | and php-gtk2 feels ike abandonware | 01:01 |
| alterego | Yeah, I heard it wasn't really that maintained. | 01:01 |
| alterego | ruby-gnome2 is absolutely stunning. | 01:01 |
| FMZKJ | I think I'm going to seriously have to look into this. | 01:01 |
| alterego | It's one of the best ruby extensions I've ever used. | 01:01 |
| FMZKJ | Well, I hate to say it guys, but I gotta go. My girlfriend is waiting for me. | 01:02 |
| alterego | The Japanese folk that do that project really know what they're doing .. | 01:02 |
| ||cw | a girl-what? | 01:02 |
| alterego | Hah | 01:02 |
| FMZKJ | Can I just say, you are the nicest bunch on an IRC channel (to a chan-newb) I've ever met. Kudos. | 01:02 |
| *** FMZKJ is now known as FMZ|away | 01:02 | |
| alterego | Do kudos add to my karma? | 01:03 |
| alterego | :( | 01:03 |
| * alterego thinks not. | 01:03 | |
| FMZ|away | alterego: Karma: positive | 01:03 |
| ||cw | we have karma here? | 01:03 |
| FMZ|away | Laters guys, I'll be back | 01:03 |
| alterego | ||cw, no. But it would be usefull. | 01:03 |
| Pio | anyone know any tricks to speed up gnugo in maemo? | 01:03 |
| alterego | Pio, use a lower level | 01:03 |
| alterego | :) | 01:03 |
| alterego | It's slow even on fast machines .. | 01:03 |
| Pio | its still a bit slow iirc | 01:04 |
| Pio | yeah i know.. a cpu vs cpu game on my amd64 3200 still takes several minutes heh | 01:04 |
| alterego | Your best bet is to use your tablet for what it's meant to do. //The Internet// | 01:04 |
| _Monkey | Hmm. No matches for that, alterego. | 01:04 |
| alterego | O_o | 01:04 |
| Pio | yep.. playing on IGS works nicely with cgoban | 01:04 |
| alterego | :) | 01:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Pfft, it's a pocket-computer. | 01:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | You should use it for whatever regular computers do. :P | 01:04 |
| Pio | at least, what slow computers do heh | 01:05 |
| alterego | I was tempted to port my raytracer to it ;) | 01:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | . . . in 1998. ;) | 01:05 |
| Pio | hehe | 01:05 |
| derf | It's actually faster than the computer I had in 1998. | 01:05 |
| alterego | Yeah | 01:06 |
| alterego | It's faster than a lot of computers people had in 1998 | 01:06 |
| derf | And 1999. | 01:06 |
| alterego | Back when PowerVR was popular. | 01:06 |
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| * alterego coughs **hint hint hint hint** | 01:06 | |
| r11t | hey everyone | 01:07 |
| _Monkey | i heard everyone was a critic :) | 01:07 |
| alterego | Heh | 01:07 |
| r11t | can anyone recommend the best deal for acquiring a n770? | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | Why bother? | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | The N800s are dirty cheap these days. | 01:07 |
| alterego | Yeah, N800's are pretty cheap now. | 01:07 |
| r11t | hmm | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | *dirt | 01:07 |
| alterego | And they're a _lot_ better. | 01:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | N800s are NOT hookers. ;) | 01:07 |
| r11t | haha | 01:08 |
| Pio | and n770s are umm cheaper than dirt | 01:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | 770* | 01:08 |
| Pio | yeah | 01:08 |
| alterego | The 770 will be usefull for one thing. | 01:08 |
| r11t | forgive my ignorance but what is the lowest price for a n800? | 01:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | $218 | 01:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | on buy.com | 01:08 |
| alterego | And that's _if_ ubuntu mobile ever gets off the ground. | 01:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | or it was | 01:08 |
| r11t | hmm.... | 01:08 |
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| alterego | I'm more into emdebian though ^_^ | 01:09 |
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| * alterego wonders what it is about GUI apps that produce so much spaghetti code. | 01:10 | |
| alterego | I used to like Gtk. | 01:10 |
| alterego | I'm not so sure now. | 01:10 |
| alterego | Though, my code is starting to look very pretty now. | 01:11 |
| sp3000 | N800s? | 01:12 |
| _Monkey | N800s are dirty cheap these days. | 01:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 01:12 |
| sp3000 | aww, it doesn't store negatives | 01:12 |
| sp3000 | or, more likely, doesn't overwrite implicitly | 01:12 |
| * sp3000 wanted the other one :P | 01:12 | |
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| alterego | I don't know what widget to use! ARGH! | 01:20 |
| alterego | This is infuriating. | 01:20 |
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| sp3000 | randomize it | 01:29 |
| sp3000 | then measure which one gets complained about more | 01:29 |
| alterego | Hah | 01:30 |
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| alterego | I have three options. Gtk::Table, Gtk::TreeView (List), Gtk::VBox of Gtk::HBox's | 01:32 |
| alterego | Using the MVC patter of the TreeView kind of breaks my own MVC like patter. | 01:32 |
| alterego | ~pattern | 01:33 |
| alterego | I'm gonna try the table. | 01:33 |
| alterego | But having to specify it's dimension on initialization is a pain. | 01:33 |
| * alterego sobs | 01:33 | |
| alterego | VBox of HBox would be okay. If I can create size groups for each column. I could implement my own, grovy, custom widget. | 01:34 |
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| alterego | Yeah, I can diggit. | 01:38 |
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| lopz | re | 02:25 |
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| shacka1 | anybody managed to profile code with gprof on chinhook ? | 03:23 |
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| Tb0n3 | http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16855101508R | 03:31 |
| Tb0n3 | wtf? | 03:31 |
| zerojay | heh | 03:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 03:33 |
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| Toma- | Is there a way to see logs from the FileManger in terms of bluetooth transfers? Im getting a "Operation Failed" when trying to move a pic from my 770 to the phone | 03:55 |
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| Lateralus | What do you guys use for screenshots on the 810? | 03:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | VNC | 03:59 |
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| skibur | hello | 04:01 |
| b0unc3 | Lateralus: mh-shot-tool on n800 | 04:01 |
| Lateralus | No, 810. | 04:03 |
| Lateralus | GeneralAntilles: I'm not finding any vnc server via google for the 810, do you have a link? | 04:04 |
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| GeneralAntilles | x11vnc | 04:04 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It's for the N800 | 04:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | No clue if it'll work on the N810 | 04:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Though I'd assume it will. | 04:04 |
| skibur | you have N810? | 04:05 |
| shacka1 | anybody managed to profile code with gprof on chinhook ? | 04:06 |
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| Lateralus | mh-shot-tool is working on the 810, thanks guys | 04:14 |
| skibur | ??? | 04:15 |
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| Lateralus | skibur: yes | 04:15 |
| skibur | N800 is underclocked at 330MHZ? | 04:15 |
| skibur | nice Lateralus | 04:15 |
| skibur | I didn't know the N800 was underclocked | 04:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, OS2008 is going to be shit-hot. | 04:19 |
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| skibur | lol what is the best way to remove a screen protector? | 04:53 |
| fysa | credit card | 04:54 |
| skibur | wow | 04:56 |
| skibur | it worked | 04:56 |
| skibur | :) | 04:56 |
| skibur | thanks | 04:56 |
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| skibur | the screen protector is yah thick and the credit card was able to work it out | 04:57 |
| skibur | by the corners | 04:57 |
| skibur | thanks again | 04:57 |
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| bgm | anyone working on porting gobby? | 05:01 |
| bgm | I might give it a try, altough I'm not quite sure to which extent it may work (many dependancies) | 05:01 |
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| skibur | just finished applying new screen protector | 05:20 |
| skibur | lol | 05:20 |
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| skibur | hum? any full functional keyboard for the N800? | 05:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | How do you mean? | 05:28 |
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| skibur | a keyboard that works completely with N800 | 05:30 |
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| lord_moonraker | Greetings and Salutations | 05:33 |
| skibur | hello | 05:34 |
| skibur | :) | 05:34 |
| lord_moonraker | hi skibur | 05:35 |
| skibur | What can be connected with the Nokia PC Tablet via miniUSB? | 05:36 |
| lord_moonraker | mini USB? u need to enable host mode | 05:37 |
| lord_moonraker | since miniUSB of tablet doesnt have enough juice, devices that doesnt use power from usb can be connected | 05:38 |
| lord_moonraker | what do u want to connect? | 05:38 |
| skibur | anything useful | 05:39 |
| skibur | keyboard, | 05:39 |
| lord_moonraker | hmm like a keyboard? | 05:39 |
| lord_moonraker | ya it can be done, with a hack, check this link http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186 | 05:39 |
| lord_moonraker | u need to do a --enable-usb-host-mode in the device | 05:40 |
| skibur | http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/maemo/users/30083?page=last | 05:40 |
| skibur | found some info | 05:41 |
| skibur | o cool, thanks :P | 05:41 |
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| Galoot | does anyone know if xsupplicantissupported on the nokia 770 yet? I've spent thebetterpart of the last week rummaging through google,and Ican't seem to find anything | 05:44 |
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| lord_moonraker | k | 05:49 |
| lord_moonraker | i have created a pygtk app, and created a deb, it seems to work fine when launched from commandline, but from the menu, after some time it just disappears | 05:51 |
| lord_moonraker | anyone know how I can see the error message somehow? | 05:52 |
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| skibur | what is empty slot next to the battery? | 05:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | SD | 05:56 |
| skibur | ? | 05:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's another SD card slot. | 05:57 |
| skibur | nice | 05:58 |
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| Galoot | Does anyone here know if there's a way to get xsupplicant working on a Nokia 770? | 06:13 |
| lord_moonraker | Greetings | 06:13 |
| skibur | hum... | 06:14 |
| skibur | xsupplicant? | 06:14 |
| Galoot | yeah. my college's wireless network uses dynampic WEP 802.1x encryption | 06:14 |
| Galoot | I've been googling this thing for the better part of the last week, but can't seem to find a solution | 06:14 |
| Galoot | I tried using wpa_supplicant, but that didn't work :( | 06:15 |
| skibur | I see | 06:15 |
| lord_moonraker | http://www.broadbandresource.net/?s=authentication | 06:16 |
| Galoot | the official wireless instruction page is here: http://www.slu.edu/x7032.xml | 06:17 |
| Galoot | moonraker, that link doesn't work for me | 06:17 |
| Galoot | as in, it takes me to a google page | 06:18 |
| fysa | is xchat it for irc? | 06:18 |
| Galoot | as far as clients go? no, there's a bajillion different ones out there | 06:18 |
| skibur | yes | 06:19 |
| skibur | xchat is for irc | 06:19 |
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| fysa | i mean are there real ui-based alternatives -- it doesn't feel 'quite' perfect | 06:22 |
| Galoot | hrm. I wonder if it would be possible to compile open1x for the tablet http://sourceforge.net/projects/open1x/ | 06:22 |
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| skibur | have you tried Galoot ---> http://www.penguintown.net/~gorlik/n770.html | 06:23 |
| Galoot | yeah, that's the wpa_supplicant I tried earlier | 06:23 |
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| skibur | no results? | 06:24 |
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| fysa | disabling quit/join would be nice. it's very usable with bitlbee and the side (thumb-accessible) tabs are nice. | 06:24 |
| skibur | you are root | 06:24 |
| Galoot | it'll give me a "connected with link-local ip address" message, with a question mark on the wireless icon | 06:24 |
| Galoot | yeah, it won't run otherwise | 06:25 |
| Galoot | and I try for a browser, and it doesn't work | 06:25 |
| skibur | wpa-supplicant | 06:25 |
| _Monkey | wpa-supplicant is not playing nice. | 06:25 |
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| Galoot | there is one thing, when I run his instructions as shown, it comes up with a couple errors. one sec, lemme run it again and tell you what they are | 06:27 |
| skibur | ok | 06:27 |
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| Galoot | ioctl[SIOCSIWPMKA]: No such device | 06:30 |
| skibur | hum.. | 06:30 |
| Galoot | ioctl[SIOCSIWAUTH]: Operation not supported | 06:30 |
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| skibur | might need new libs | 06:30 |
| Galoot | three instances of ioctl[SIOCSIWENCODEEXT]: Operation not supported | 06:31 |
| Galoot | and ioctl[SIOCSIWAUTH]: Operation not supported again | 06:31 |
| Galoot | I get that from running the /usr/sbin/wpa_supplicant -iwlan0 -c /etc/wpa_sup.conf -B command as root from the penguintown.net walkthrough | 06:32 |
| Galoot | I made sure to edit the config file, and put the certificate in the right place | 06:32 |
| Galoot | is there anything special I have to do to compile programs for the tablet? I've just been using downloadable package files so far | 06:34 |
| Galoot | if I can get open1x (http://open1x.sourceforge.net/) to work, that may help | 06:35 |
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| skibur | hum... | 06:36 |
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| skibur | honestly, I really can't think of anything on your issue | 06:37 |
| skibur | it should of just worked | 06:37 |
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| Galoot | yeah, I know. my campus wireless is really picky though :( | 06:38 |
| skibur | How long have you had a N770? | 06:38 |
| Galoot | I work for the IT department here and it took me two full weeks to get ubuntu to connect to it | 06:38 |
| Galoot | a few months | 06:38 |
| skibur | My opinion, get a N800 | 06:38 |
| Galoot | I just this week figured out how to access a root terminal | 06:38 |
| skibur | IT | 06:39 |
| skibur | Where at? | 06:39 |
| Galoot | saint louis university | 06:39 |
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| skibur | IT tech / Work Study Texas A&M University-Kingsville | 06:39 |
| skibur | slackware user | 06:40 |
| Galoot | sweet | 06:40 |
| skibur | So you also have Ticket Qs? | 06:40 |
| Galoot | how is slackware? I've heard good things about it | 06:40 |
| Galoot | ticket Qs? | 06:40 |
| Galoot | as in, IT support ticket requests? | 06:40 |
| skibur | Slackware is a "I keeping this S**t simple" distro. | 06:41 |
| skibur | its great | 06:41 |
| skibur | now with 2.6 kernel, it can now hang even better with the newest distro like Ubuntu | 06:41 |
| Galoot | I'm actually a big fan of ubuntu lately, especially with the new release | 06:41 |
| skibur | yeah | 06:41 |
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| Galoot | are there any other alternative OSes to put on the tablet? | 06:42 |
| Galoot | alternative distros, I should say | 06:42 |
| skibur | I think Wal-mart will be selling $200 PC with gOS (Ubuntu Based) installed on Black Friday sell | 06:42 |
| Galoot | linux is the only way to go ^_^ | 06:43 |
| skibur | you should take a look at it | 06:43 |
| Galoot | sadly, I'm sticking with winblows on my desktop for now | 06:43 |
| skibur | :) | 06:43 |
| Galoot | I play a ton of games | 06:43 |
| skibur | I C | 06:43 |
| Galoot | and the support just isn't there yet, especially for older ones | 06:43 |
| skibur | Windows is great for games | 06:43 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Hi galoot, did u get more info on the 802.1x? | 06:44 |
| Galoot | but I've got ubuntu on my laptop, had it that way for more than a year now and it still hasn't given me any lip | 06:44 |
| skibur | yeah | 06:44 |
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| skibur | cool | 06:44 |
| Galoot | moonrake: no :( | 06:44 |
| Galoot | I looked at the source files for open1x (http://open1x.sourceforge.net/), but I have no idea about how to go about compiling that for the nokia | 06:45 |
| lord_moonrake1 | K, is this a vpn to join into ur univ? | 06:46 |
| Galoot | no, it's a campus-wide wireless network | 06:46 |
| Galoot | linux config instructions here:http://www.slu.edu/x7032.xml | 06:46 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Can a router connect to it? | 06:46 |
| Galoot | if that gives any insight as to the setup of the network | 06:46 |
| Galoot | I can get connected to it just fine with ubuntu | 06:47 |
| Galoot | I can't get the 770 to do it though, because it's a dynamic WEP encryption | 06:47 |
| Galoot | I tried the wpa-supplicant instructions at http://www.penguintown.net/~gorlik/n770.html | 06:48 |
| Galoot | but those didn't work | 06:48 |
| lord_moonrake1 | A workaround, Do u have a wifi router? Then u can connect ur machine to router & | 06:49 |
| lord_moonrake1 | N770 to the router | 06:49 |
| lord_moonrake1 | And ur pc can act as gateway. > | 06:49 |
| Galoot | no, I don't have one, but I do have a couple friends that do, and that works when I'm over at their place | 06:50 |
| Galoot | since the wireless is available anywhere on campus though, I'd like to be able to get it to access it | 06:50 |
| lord_moonrake1 | K. To compile u need to get scratchbox | 06:50 |
| Galoot | linux only, I assume? | 06:51 |
| Galoot | I'm running windoze on my desktop, but I've got ubuntu on my laptop | 06:51 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Yes, will work in ubuntu | 06:52 |
| Galoot | alrighty. I'll see if I can compile open1x to work with maemo | 06:52 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Scratchbox is a lil hard to install... | 06:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | The 770 is not an N-series device, therefore, there is no such thing as a "N770". ;) | 06:53 |
| Galoot | huh. didn't know that | 06:53 |
| Galoot | I'm pretty skilled when it comes to making things work, given the right tools | 06:54 |
| Galoot | I just can't find a version of xsupplicant that'll work with the 770 >.< | 06:54 |
| lord_moonrake1 | http://inz.fi/blog/2007/10/22/multi-target-development-for-maemo/ | 06:54 |
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| Galoot | hoo boy. this might have to wait till the weekend, it looks pretty involved | 06:55 |
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| Galoot | I'm amazed no one has come up with a solution to this yet, I've read about tons of people having the same problem | 06:58 |
| lord_moonrake1 | http://maemo.org/community/wiki/InstallVPNC | 06:58 |
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| Galoot | is that last one to put any concoctions I manage to come up with onto the nokia? | 06:59 |
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| * fysa test | 07:00 | |
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| lord_moonrake1 | I am not sure what u meant ,but i think it details on how to login to 802.1x | 07:01 |
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| Galoot | that one is about vpn connections from my nokia, doesn't say anything about connecting to 802.1x wireless :-/ | 07:02 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Well i got it from this thread http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1252 | 07:03 |
| Galoot | I'll have to ask if it's possible to connect to the wifi here with a vpn client | 07:03 |
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| Galoot | awesome find on that forum though, it sounds like that's a bunch of people having the same problem | 07:04 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | As i understand 802.1x is network access control | 07:06 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | & u need a vpnc like cisco, xsupplicant, open1x to do the auth | 07:07 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | i am creating an pygtk app. It works fine from the command line, but when launch ed from menu it just disappears | 07:14 |
| lord_moonrake1 | After some time.. | 07:14 |
| lord_moonrake1 | How can i watch error message s of gui apps? | 07:15 |
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| Galoot | is there a way I can access the file system from the file manager? | 07:18 |
| lord_moonrake1 | U mean / | 07:18 |
| Galoot | yeah | 07:18 |
| Galoot | not just the documents folder and stuff | 07:18 |
| lord_moonrake1 | I do it using xterminal | 07:18 |
| Galoot | yeah, but vi is damnably hard to use on the tablet | 07:19 |
| Galoot | what's the name of the default text editor then? | 07:19 |
| Galoot | so I can edit a config file | 07:19 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | There is a configuration editor | 07:21 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Gconf | 07:21 |
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| Galoot | oooh | 07:21 |
| Galoot | not found. is that an extra installation? | 07:22 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Let me check | 07:22 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Could u google it out? Very hard 2 search in n800 keyboard. >> | 07:27 |
| Galoot | yeah, I can have a look | 07:27 |
| Galoot | I actually just copied it over to my laptop to play with | 07:28 |
| Galoot | it's a .xml anyway | 07:28 |
| Galoot | gotta figure out how to change these settings | 07:28 |
| Galoot | http://62.61.85.167/platform/docs/howtos/howto_connectivity_guide.html | 07:28 |
| Galoot | under WLAN settings | 07:28 |
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| Galoot | if I can change some of those values, I may be able to make it work | 07:29 |
| lord_moonrake1 | K,I am trying to get my app to work from menu, but it just vanishes after a couple of seconds :( | 07:30 |
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| skibur | hello | 07:33 |
| skibur | is WiMax a Chip? | 07:33 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Ya i guess its hardware | 07:34 |
| skibur | I was reading the Wiki on N800, and under connectivity, WiMAX will be available 2008? If true, do I have to ve the WiMAX chip since my N800 is not WiMAx enabled? | 07:35 |
| skibur | s/ve/buy | 07:35 |
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| GeneralAntilles | You have to buy the WIMAX version. | 07:37 |
| Rask330 | Hi, maemo. ^^; Me again. Is there anything else that the N800 can use for videoconferencing besides "internet call"? For some reason it isn't working with GTalk. | 07:37 |
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| Robot101_ | skibur: I think it means a new product will be released that includes wimax | 07:37 |
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| GeneralAntilles | None of the currently available models have WIMAX | 07:37 |
| Robot101 | an N810++ or something :) | 07:37 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Oh can u give the LinK? | 07:37 |
| skibur | :( | 07:38 |
| |R | 8GB miniSD is too small :( | 07:38 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | U can use gizmo foor video | 07:38 |
| skibur | not even N810? | 07:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | To what? | 07:39 |
| lord_moonrake1 | U need beta version 4.0.306 | 07:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | [12:37am] <GeneralAntilles> None of the currently available models have WIMAX | 07:40 |
| Robot101 | Rask330: does google talk have video support? | 07:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | from N800 to N800 | 07:41 |
| Rask330 | Robot101: Does it? I thought it had to... | 07:41 |
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| Robot101 | I think the gtalk clients just do voice | 07:41 |
| Rask330 | I mean, given that it's built in. | 07:41 |
| Rask330 | hm. | 07:41 |
| Rask330 | What N800 protocols support video? | 07:41 |
| Robot101 | the N800 can do gtalk, and video between N800s (or other Jingle clients, of which I can't think of any) | 07:41 |
| Rask330 | Hm. | 07:42 |
| Rask330 | Skype video doesn't work either... | 07:42 |
| Robot101 | the SIP should be able to do video | 07:42 |
| Rask330 | SIP? | 07:42 |
| |R | yeah never got jingle working with a linux (PC) client :( | 07:42 |
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| Robot101 | |R: which ones did you try? | 07:42 |
| Robot101 | btw.. | 07:42 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Rask;I have tested gizzmo v4.0.0.82in n800 & 4.0.0.306 in windwos to use Vidoe chat | 07:42 |
| |R | empathy wouldn't start, and uhm, wait let me check :P | 07:43 |
| Rask330 | lord_moonrake1: What's the windows-side client, though? | 07:43 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Gizmo 306 | 07:43 |
| Robot101 | |R: video calling's not quite ready in empathy unfortunately :( | 07:43 |
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| Rask330 | Mmm... is there any way to get video on Skype on the N800? | 07:43 |
| |R | a gnome one and a kde one also (can't find name, keep searching... ;) | 07:43 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Rask; skype has launched linux vido | 07:44 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Maybe they will come oout for n800 too | 07:44 |
| Rask330 | Ah. | 07:44 |
| Rask330 | I guess skype's protocol is closed? | 07:44 |
| Robot101 | somewhat :D | 07:44 |
| |R | Robot101 : kopete for kde | 07:45 |
| * Rask330 hms. | 07:45 | |
| Rask330 | Is Gizmo the only option for video chat on the N800? | 07:45 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | For now, i believe that is the only opTion to video chat with non n800 | 07:46 |
| Rask330 | Mm.. that's kind of a downer. | 07:46 |
| lord_moonrake1 | There was a windows gtalk plugin | 07:47 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Called festoon | 07:47 |
| Robot101 | when OS2008 comes out, video calling to various SIP clients should work | 07:47 |
| Rask330 | I hope Skype gets it together with the N800. It could really make it a much hotter product. | 07:48 |
| |R | Robot101 : through which protocol? | 07:48 |
| * Robot101 would rather improve interoperability of the open protocols... | 07:48 | |
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| * |R agrees with Robot101 | 07:49 | |
| Robot101 | |R: well... SIP. :) | 07:49 |
| |R | SIP has a video standard? :) | 07:49 |
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| |R | well, RTP i should ask i guess ;) | 07:49 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Anyone know how to see messages given out bY apps in maemo? | 07:50 |
| Robot101 | |R: right, it just does RTP with video codecs | 07:50 |
| lord_moonrake1 | I am trying to get my pygtk app to work from menu, but it just vanishes after a couple of seconds | 07:50 |
| |R | Robot101 : is there already a widely deployed hardware base for that? (Like G729, G711 for voice, what would the video codec be?) | 07:51 |
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| |R | ah, gossip is the one i tried on the gnome front... | 07:51 |
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| Robot101 | |R: H263 and H263+ are reasonably common video codecs | 07:52 |
| |R | ok :) | 07:52 |
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| Robot101 | |R: H263 is what the N800 uses | 07:53 |
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| |R | it's net split galore tonight | 07:53 |
| |R | oh ok :) | 07:53 |
| Robot101 | it doesn't actually have enough CPU power to do H263 very well | 07:53 |
| Robot101 | iChat and friends use H264 which is like MPEG4 | 07:53 |
| |R | as long as we can mix :) | 07:53 |
| |R | just wondering if i'll be able to have video chat with my gf in mars ... ;) | 07:54 |
| lord_moonrake1 | It runs fine when launched from command line. Might be a libosso problem :( https://garage.maemo.org/projects/pyaxelwii | 07:55 |
| |R | now we need a shrinked down Wii controller that fits in the stylus :P | 07:55 |
| |R | is the n810 stylus the same? | 07:55 |
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| Robot101 | no it's not triangular like the N800, more rounded | 07:56 |
| * |R better not loose his stulus... | 07:56 | |
| Robot101 | anyway, its like 6am, time for me to sleep | 07:57 |
| |R | a+ :) | 07:57 |
| |R | erm, cya in english rather ;) | 07:57 |
| lord_moonrake1 | What is equivalent of Xwindows in maemo? | 07:59 |
| Rask330 | Hrm... in Gizmo, how do you get it to use video? | 08:00 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Do u have v82? | 08:01 |
| lord_moonrake1 | U just dial, it comes automatically | 08:02 |
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| Rask330 | V82? | 08:02 |
| Rask330 | What is V82? | 08:02 |
| Rask330 | I don't see any options here for video. | 08:02 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Gizmo v4.0.0.82 | 08:02 |
| lord_moonrake1 | For maemo | 08:02 |
| Rask330 | ..Nope, I have the one I downloaded off the link that came with it. X) Where do you get the later version? | 08:03 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Latest doesnt have video, they just got this particular version with video | 08:03 |
| Rask330 | Oh. | 08:03 |
| Rask330 | Where do you get the version with video? | 08:03 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | I had googlEd it out, not sure now,http://www.flickr.com/photos/dikstorm/1303912998/ | 08:06 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Some one had put it up on an online file sharing | 08:07 |
| R[a]sk | Mm, nevermind... it seems like it's a relatively unstable beta. | 08:07 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | Ya, well i do use it once in a while.. | 08:09 |
| R[a]sk | I'm just gonna wait for something stable to come out. | 08:10 |
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| lord_moonrake1 | :) | 08:10 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Do u have a wii controller? | 08:11 |
| lord_moonrake1 | I am creating an app too connect to wii remote & plot the accelaration data | 08:14 |
| lord_moonrake1 | Any willing beta testers...? | 08:16 |
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| Vanya | Hi everyone! Could you help me? I've installed perl with apt-get, but there's no perl in /usr/bin . Whar is the path to perl in maemo? | 09:00 |
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| tigert__ | morning | 09:36 |
| _Monkey | aloha | 09:36 |
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| lopz | bye | 09:45 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 10:37 |
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| Gubbe | hello | 10:59 |
| _Monkey | hi, Gubbe | 10:59 |
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| Gubbe | thought I'd drop by to absorb the atmosphere. I just started working on hacking someone else's maemo-based app and the effort is already making my hair fall off. | 11:02 |
| Jaffa | Oh? | 11:02 |
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| Gubbe | It's just that I know so little of the platform or linux coding in general. Trying to implement signal handlers for conicconnection seems surprisingly challenging for me. =) | 11:05 |
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| Gubbe | Keeping in mind that I first heard of Gobjects, etc yesterday, I'm trying to use g_signal_connect to set the handler. The first parameter it takes is a gpointer to an "instance," but I haven't been able to decipher what that instance is supposed to be. In a #maemo log excerpt I found, someone used ctx.conic as the instance, which seems to refer to some sort of "context" that presumably needs to be initialized beforehand. So far I haven't figured out what i | 11:20 |
| murrayc | Gubbe: It's not very easy. You could look at TnyMaemoConicDevice in tinymail for an example. | 11:21 |
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| Gubbe | eerily I just found that very .c file via google simultaneously with your response. I'll have to scan through it. | 11:22 |
| nomis | Gubbe: an instance is for example any gobject. | 11:23 |
| nomis | Gubbe: however it needs to have the signal you're connecting to. | 11:23 |
| inz | Gubbe, in this case the instance should be what con_ic_connection_new() returned | 11:23 |
| Gubbe | hmm. I have actually tried to use the ConIcConnection* connection, which contains exactly what con_ic_connection_new() returned, but I got an error from that at runtime. | 11:24 |
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| Gubbe | let's see what it was again... | 11:25 |
| florian | hi all | 11:26 |
| AD-N770 | bon dia / good morning | 11:27 |
| Gubbe | hm hm hmm... allow me to ponder this for a moment, I may have discovered something... | 11:27 |
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| Gubbe | It seems that I'm actually using the correct instance and everything, but the code craps out at runtime. This could even be a binary incompatibility issue I'm fighting with. | 11:35 |
| Gubbe | Oh well, perhaps having some lunch will help. Thanks for the assistance, everyone! | 11:37 |
| Gubbe | ---> | 11:37 |
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| murrayc | Gubbe: Do try gdb or valgrind. | 11:38 |
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| rothiel | Hi | 11:45 |
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| bilboed | is there some plans to have a 2008OS for the n770 ? | 12:17 |
| rothiel | Hi... I have to code a game for N800 | 12:22 |
| rothiel | Can I use the GTK button as a sprite ? | 12:22 |
| rothiel | or perhaps I need to use an other library ? | 12:23 |
| rothiel | (GTK newbie ^^) | 12:23 |
| flip^ | bilboed: i believe the 770's hacker edition of the OS is going to be updated to bring it in line with OS2008, but they've said that's not the same as releasing OS2008 for the 770 | 12:26 |
| bilboed | flip^, ok. It's just that the 2008/os is really much faster... | 12:27 |
| flip^ | that's because of the faster cpu though... they won't be speeding up the cpu on the 770 like they are the 800 | 12:28 |
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| bilboed | flip^, not only, the actual software is faster and more memory efficient | 12:29 |
| flip^ | well, yes, that is true... but i dunno if you'd see that much improvement on a 770... but as i say, they do plan to update the HE... but it could take a while | 12:30 |
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| rothiel | Nobody to answer me ? | 12:45 |
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| mgedmin | rothiel: SDL is the usual choice for games | 12:48 |
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| mgedmin | when you want something full-screen, graphics intensive (well, as much as the under-powered Nokias can provide) | 12:48 |
| mgedmin | there are downsides, e.g. no virtual keyboard input | 12:48 |
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| Gubbe | right then. con_ic_connection_new() gives: GLIB CRITICAL ** GLib-GObject - gtype.c:2242: initialization assertion failed, use IA__g_type_init() prior to this function | 12:49 |
| Gubbe | followed by: GLIB CRITICAL ** GLib-GObject - g_object_new: assertion `G_TYPE_IS_OBJECT (object_type)' failed | 12:49 |
| rothiel | Hi... I have to code a game for N800 | 12:51 |
| rothiel | Can I use the GTK button as a sprite ? | 12:51 |
| rothiel | or perhaps I need to use an other library ? | 12:51 |
| rothiel | mgedmin > I don't need virtual keyboard | 12:55 |
| rothiel | so I can use SDL | 12:55 |
| rothiel | great :) | 12:55 |
| rothiel | thx to u | 12:56 |
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| rothiel | Hi all :) | 13:04 |
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| workingplayya | hi everybody | 13:07 |
| workingplayya | are there any ffmpeg packages in the cosmos | 13:08 |
| workingplayya | i have buid one in scratchbox but the binaries arent included | 13:09 |
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| tigert | what binaries? | 13:40 |
| _Monkey | binaries are usually in /usr/bin | 13:40 |
| tigert | _Monkey: forget binaries | 13:40 |
| _Monkey | tigert: I forgot binaries | 13:40 |
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| Toma- | Im trying to figure out why my phone wont accept files from my 770. is there a way to see some output form the filemanager? | 13:44 |
| workingplayya | which program? | 13:47 |
| workingplayya | try to start it in xterm | 13:47 |
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| Toma- | ahh the builtin fm | 13:48 |
| Toma- | and it seg faults form the CLI | 13:49 |
| Gubbe | Aiiieeee! Epic humiliation! Incredibly enough, running g_type_init() before con_ic_connection_new() worked! Just like the error message instructed. Why I failed to heed that earlier goes beyond my understanding. | 13:49 |
| Gubbe | Another three hours well spent. | 13:49 |
| Gubbe | Now where's that donkey-hat again... | 13:50 |
| murrayc | Gubbe: Well done. I guess most people don't notice that because they are using it in a GTK+ program anyway. | 13:52 |
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| Toma- | No other ideas? does ossofilemanager log anywhere? | 13:56 |
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| Gubbe | murray: yea, thanks for the help though. I have a feeling that this wasn't the last time I need to pick someone else's brain to make this thing work. =) | 14:04 |
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| lardman | Toma-: syslog | 14:05 |
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| Toma- | theres nothing in /var/log... | 14:07 |
| Toma- | i removed ~/.osso | 14:08 |
| Toma- | seemed to work | 14:08 |
| Toma- | totally trashed my menus tho | 14:08 |
| lardman | you need to install syslogd | 14:08 |
| lardman | or at least run it | 14:08 |
| Toma- | ahh ok | 14:08 |
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| lardman | anyway, it may not provide much output, but there's certainly some stuff in it | 14:08 |
| murrayc | Gubbe: And don't forget that libconic does nothing in scratchbox. It only works on the device. | 14:09 |
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| Richard | Hi, How to build a SDK from source? | 14:17 |
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| Gubbe | murray: Naturally. This is something I'm only testing on the device anyway. | 14:24 |
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| workingplayya | Richard: why dont use the rfs from maemo.org? | 14:33 |
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| lardman | when are core dumps generated? Any exception (as long as ulimit is set appropriately)? | 14:47 |
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| Mikho | does anybody know a good network traffic monitoring tool for linux? | 14:48 |
| Mikho | tcpdump seems to do something, but I'd like a graphical one | 14:48 |
| lardman | driftnet? | 14:48 |
| lardman | ;) | 14:48 |
| lcdd | Mikho: http://www.wireshark.org/ | 14:49 |
| Mikho | ah, wireshark | 14:50 |
| Mikho | thought it was for windows | 14:50 |
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| Mikho | this will do, thanks | 14:52 |
| alterego | Heh, my karma is growing daily. | 14:53 |
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| alterego | Anyhow .. On a serious note .. Would the maemo wiki be a good place to do documentation for ruby-maemo? | 14:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | The maemo wiki doesn't seem to be a good place for anything. | 14:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hard to navigate | 14:54 |
| alterego | Sure, but if the pages are tagged ruby-maemo they're directly added to the garage page. | 14:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Then, sure, add the documentation to the wiki. ;) | 14:55 |
| alterego | I'll have to contemplate the benifits/drawbacks I think for a while. | 14:55 |
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| Mikho | ok, the next question: does somebody know a good C/C++ framework I could implement http connection with? | 15:02 |
| alterego | Server or client? | 15:02 |
| alterego | I think libcurl does client side stuff .. | 15:02 |
| alterego | And I believe it's a part of maemo. | 15:03 |
| Mikho | client | 15:04 |
| alterego | Then libcurl is probably the way to go. | 15:04 |
| keesj | What are you trying? | 15:05 |
| Mikho | ok, libcurl seems appropriate | 15:07 |
| Mikho | thanks | 15:07 |
| alterego | No problem :) | 15:07 |
| Mikho | never had good answers to specific questions this fast :) | 15:07 |
| alterego | Well, it's the specific questions that should be answered quickly :) | 15:08 |
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| Mikho | let's try again: | 15:10 |
| Mikho | in vanilla scratchbox installation, I have maemo installed and target set up. But apt-get does not seem to be able to connect to maemo repositories. What was the file I was supposed to edit to enable internet connection? | 15:11 |
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| alterego | I've never had an issue with internet connection in scratchbox. | 15:12 |
| alterego | Though, quite a few people seem to have. | 15:12 |
| alterego | I bl | 15:12 |
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| alterego | I think there's some information about it on the wiki somewhere. | 15:13 |
| b0unc3 | Mikho: check the resolv.conf | 15:13 |
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| Tak | alterego: aha, so you got a garage project set up? | 15:13 |
| Mikho | and google, but this seems to be a good day for #maemo :) | 15:13 |
| alterego | Tak, yeah. You found it? :) | 15:13 |
| keesj | /scratchbox/etc/nsswitch.conf but with recent sboxes I had not problem | 15:14 |
| Mikho | yes! The problem was with resolv.conf :) | 15:14 |
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| alterego | Tak, actually. It might not be a "garage" project. It's just a project page in the download section. | 15:14 |
| alterego | The maemo project management stuff confuses me. | 15:15 |
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| Tak | I saw it poking around ohloh yesterday, but didn't know if it was that | 15:17 |
| alterego | I've heard about this ohloh .. Not really any idea what it is though. | 15:18 |
| alterego | Would it be advantagous to register and use it? | 15:19 |
| * Tak shrugs | 15:19 | |
| Tak | I don't really have a handle on it either | 15:20 |
| alterego | It says I've enlisted in the garage but I've not :/ | 15:20 |
| Tak | it seems to be some kind of meta-social-networking framework | 15:20 |
| alterego | Which could possibly damage my rating as the project will always have zero activity >:( | 15:20 |
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| Mikho | ok, let's try it again | 15:24 |
| Mikho | In my host environment, when I write sudo apt-get install libcur, and then press tab, it gives me all the possible choices for the packages, but inside scratchbox it does nothing. Currently it's a bit tricky to find out the exact package name every time I want to install something | 15:25 |
| alterego | Mikho, apt-cache search 'libcurl' | 15:26 |
| alterego | Without the quotes. I don't know why I put those there .. | 15:26 |
| Mikho | ok, that works | 15:26 |
| Mikho | but how can I enable tab? | 15:27 |
| alterego | I don't know. | 15:27 |
| alterego | Tab completion is part of Bash | 15:27 |
| Mikho | tab is the thing that makes unix worth using | 15:27 |
| Veggen | Mikho: mmh, not sure I agree :) there's a whole lot more :) | 15:28 |
| Veggen | but it makes much difference when it comes to shell usage. | 15:28 |
| keesj | vi makes the world go round | 15:28 |
| alterego | vi is for hippies :P | 15:29 |
| Veggen | (I'm a vi-user myself :) | 15:29 |
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| Mikho | There's probably more, but I really can't imagine using the command shell without previous command scrollbacks and autocompletion | 15:31 |
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| thomasvm | i don't know if this is the good place to ask, but i'll try anyway: | 15:32 |
| thomasvm | run-standalone.sh python2.5 -c "import gnome" | 15:32 |
| fysa | is there anyway to get larger scrollbars? | 15:32 |
| thomasvm | fails with "ImportError: No module named gnome" | 15:32 |
| thomasvm | though python2.5-gnome is installed | 15:32 |
| thomasvm | i'm on chinook beta | 15:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | fysa, no. | 15:38 |
| fysa | a little small for thumb use | 15:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's a bug | 15:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | but they're pretty much refusing to fix. | 15:39 |
| Tak | so is vim for full-blown socialists then? | 15:40 |
| alterego | Hippies | 15:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | No good dirty damn hippies . . . | 15:40 |
| alterego | Real coders use emacs. | 15:40 |
| alterego | emacs and knives | 15:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hooray knives. | 15:42 |
| Tak | I don't have enough fingers to use emacs | 15:42 |
| sp3000 | it's the fastest thing I know that has incremental search | 15:42 |
| Tak | probably because of the knives | 15:42 |
| alterego | Wow, some one gave ruby-maemo a 5 star rating. | 15:42 |
| alterego | That's pretty bold. | 15:42 |
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| alterego | I'd give it 3.5/4 | 15:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Want me to go offset it with a 1 star rating? :P | 15:43 |
| alterego | Any rating is a good rating imo | 15:43 |
| alterego | The more feedback the better. | 15:43 |
| sp3000 | (as with all editor wars, now all the three dozen editors that fit that criterion jump out from the woordworks, plus a hack for the main contender to do that) | 15:43 |
| sp3000 | and knives | 15:43 |
| alterego | Personally I'd rather people give me real feedback. Features/Libraries they want and maybe API changes. | 15:44 |
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| sp3000 | they're good for the inevitable goat blood sacrifices | 15:44 |
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| alterego | Or ViM hippie sacrifices :P | 15:45 |
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| alterego | vIm | 15:45 |
| sp3000 | and defensive programming | 15:45 |
| alterego | Hah | 15:45 |
| sp3000 | not to mention offensive programming | 15:45 |
| Tak | btw, what should I do to get the rubygame deb up on ruby-maemo? | 15:46 |
| alterego | Good question. | 15:46 |
| alterego | How big is the package? | 15:46 |
| Tak | 65k | 15:47 |
| alterego | Heh, email it to me :) | 15:47 |
| alterego | tom at rubyx.co.uk | 15:47 |
| Tak | oh - what section are you putting all the ruby packages in? | 15:47 |
| alterego | I'll just check. | 15:47 |
| alterego | It'll be under the 'ext' directory for arch/dist | 15:48 |
| Tak | rubygame should probably be in the same section as ruby1.8-sdl | 15:48 |
| alterego | Yeah | 15:48 |
| Tak | no, I mean the debian-package section | 15:48 |
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| alterego | Ah | 15:48 |
| alterego | I put them all under the same. | 15:48 |
| alterego | Except the dev packages which are under 'devel' | 15:49 |
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| Tak | so, user/programming ? | 15:49 |
| alterego | Yeah, | 15:49 |
| alterego | If the files are to be used in an SDK then stick them under 'devel' if they're extensions for ruby and will be installed on device (or SDK) then stick them in user/programming | 15:50 |
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| Tak | do you want all the source package detritus as well? (orig.tgz, diff.gz, ...) ? | 15:50 |
| alterego | Neah, just binary packages. | 15:51 |
| alterego | I just do: dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -b | 15:51 |
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| Tak | sendified | 15:54 |
| alterego | Nice. | 15:54 |
| alterego | Hah, nice email address ^_^ | 15:55 |
| timeless | ? | 15:55 |
| alterego | taktaktaktaktaktaktaktaktaktak ... | 15:56 |
| anothy_x | is there a scratchbox root image with X11 pre-installed? | 15:56 |
| alterego | emdebian has those kinds of images anothy_x | 15:57 |
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| anothy_x | and the embedian ones will work with the 770/n800? (just building apps, not kernels) | 15:59 |
| alterego | Tak, uploaded | 15:59 |
| Tak | cool | 15:59 |
| Tak | heh, I was annoyed with gmail's 6-character minimum | 16:00 |
| alterego | Heh | 16:00 |
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| sp3000 | did you find their maximum? :) | 16:07 |
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| sp3000 | 64 per 2821, but... | 16:10 |
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| Tak | sp3000: it was 30 at the time | 16:13 |
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| anothy_x | it looks like emdebian doesn't have pre-built rootfs's, rather tools for building. is that correct? | 16:21 |
| alterego | I thought they had a few minimal bootstraps. I maybe wrong. | 16:23 |
| czr | alterego, where's the task app? :-) | 16:25 |
| *** koen_ is now known as koen | 16:25 | |
| alterego | Under the rug. | 16:25 |
| alterego | No, it;s getting there. | 16:25 |
| ||cw | top | 16:25 |
| alterego | I did some serious restructuring of the GUI | 16:25 |
| ||cw | opps | 16:25 |
| czr | alterego, told you you should've thrown it out of the window long ago :-) | 16:26 |
| alterego | :) | 16:26 |
| czr | it's it wants to be rescued, it will fly back! | 16:26 |
| alterego | Well, I quite want this app. Even if other people don't use it :) | 16:26 |
| * czr nods | 16:26 | |
| * ||cw sighs | 16:26 | |
| ||cw | i have to reboot a server that has 454 days uptime | 16:26 |
| GeneralAntilles | Had to happen some time. :P | 16:27 |
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| mgedmin | either it's not running linux, or you're ignoring kernel security updates | 16:30 |
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| alterego | Or it's a VPS ;) | 16:30 |
| czr | Very Panicky System | 16:31 |
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| ||cw | mgedmin: it has the latest debian sarge kernel | 16:31 |
| ||cw | I do apt-get dist-upgrade regularly | 16:32 |
| ||cw | did have to happen sooner or later as sarge will no longer get updates in april | 16:32 |
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| FMZ|away | Any ideas on a release date for OS2008 yet? | 16:38 |
| *** FMZ|away is now known as FMz | 16:38 | |
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| alterego | ~2 weeks | 16:38 |
| FMz | Awesome. | 16:38 |
| FMz | Also.... hi. | 16:38 |
| Tak | sometime between now and 2009 ;-) | 16:38 |
| alterego | Hah | 16:38 |
| alterego | Yeah, there may be delays. | 16:38 |
| alterego | I remember there were delays back in 2005 with the 770 | 16:39 |
| alterego | Too much demand and also issues with the software I believe. | 16:39 |
| FMz | Today my avoidance of work at my place of employment will take the form of learning Ruby. Every bit of it. | 16:39 |
| alterego | FMz, good for you :D | 16:39 |
| alterego | If you have any questions I'm here ;) | 16:39 |
| FMz | Awesome, thanks bud. | 16:39 |
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| czr | more sw for me to throw out of the window, yay :-) | 16:40 |
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| L0cutus_ | vim = 19mb :-O | 16:44 |
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| alterego | Oh, don't tell me you want to install VIm on your device .. | 16:45 |
| FMz | What's wrong with Vim? | 16:45 |
| alterego | It's okay. | 16:45 |
| alterego | What's wrong with vi? | 16:46 |
| L0cutus_ | i've foun vi is better than vim on n800 | 16:46 |
| L0cutus_ | found* | 16:46 |
| L0cutus_ | at least with my bt keyboard | 16:46 |
| FMz | I've never used it. So I assume Vi comes standard on the 800... | 16:46 |
| L0cutus_ | yes FMz | 16:47 |
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| FMz | Cool | 16:47 |
| alterego | Well, it comes standard on all Linux systems | 16:47 |
| alterego | I guess all UNIXish systems too. | 16:47 |
| FMz | My fellow webdev here at our company always uninstalls Vi and installs Nano. I hate him. | 16:47 |
| alterego | I mainly use vi to edit /etc/apt/sources.list so I can then apt-get install emacs-nox | 16:47 |
| Mikho | has anyone run into this error message: | 16:48 |
| Mikho | configure.ac:78: error: possibly undefined macro: AC_MSG_ERROR | 16:48 |
| L0cutus | don't know why with vim arrow key on my bt keyb bombs | 16:48 |
| alterego | Eesh, nano isn't very useful :) | 16:48 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha, I can understand installing nano, but why UNinstall vi? :\ | 16:48 |
| FMz | "Security reasons" he says. | 16:49 |
| FMz | I guess not too many people would think of trying nano when Vi/m doesn't work. | 16:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ha | 16:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | What? | 16:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | That sounds like incredibly horrible security right tehre. | 16:50 |
| FMz | Thus my hate for him ;) | 16:50 |
| derf | You've gotta watch out for those user-mode text editors. | 16:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | You should get yourself a sockful of oranges and beat him about the head and shoulders. | 16:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | That'll teach him. ;) | 16:50 |
| czr | GeneralAntilles, yes but what is the sockful of oranges for? snack after the beatup? | 16:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | For the beating | 16:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | No broken bones. | 16:53 |
| * czr sighs | 16:53 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Sorta like a sockful of batteries | 16:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | but cheaper | 16:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | and less cruel. | 16:54 |
| FMz | A winsock full of Vim sessions. | 16:54 |
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| * czr takes the winsock and rises with a trumpet | 16:57 | |
| czr | always thought the icon in trumpet was cheerful. | 16:57 |
| czr | albeit slightly swedish. | 16:58 |
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| suihkulokki | czr: http://www.arouse.net/despair-linux/slackware.jpg | 16:58 |
| czr | suihkulokki, that's evil :-) | 16:59 |
| * czr started with slack | 16:59 | |
| * suihkulokki too | 16:59 | |
| czr | damn I forgot how sucky the GUI stuff looked in win3. | 16:59 |
| czr | hmm. maybe a win3 theme for n800/n810? | 17:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | >_> | 17:00 |
| czr | 'd be very retro. in a perverse way. | 17:00 |
| FMz | lawlfirewall: Your page is blocked due to a security policy that prohibits access to category | 17:01 |
| FMz | Adult/Sexually Explicit. | 17:01 |
| czr | suihkulokki, the other distros don't fare much better though ;-) | 17:01 |
| czr | suihkulokki, esp the gentoo one | 17:02 |
| * czr rofls in shame. | 17:02 | |
| L0cutus | hum, unable to install pimlico packages... | 17:03 |
| L0cutus | they require evolution-data-server | 17:03 |
| L0cutus | if i try to install with apt-get, it say it's already here :-? | 17:04 |
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| L0cutus | seems there are problem with libebook | 17:10 |
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| alterego | http://alterego.freeshell.org/rx_task_004.png | 17:16 |
| alterego | That's the new GUI :) | 17:16 |
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| timeless | fwiw... | 17:16 |
| timeless | maemo style says that a button either has text, or it has a picture | 17:17 |
| timeless | never boht | 17:17 |
| Tak | shiny | 17:17 |
| Tak | what about a picture of text? | 17:17 |
| timeless | also, you shouldn't use access keys when there's a vkb :) | 17:17 |
| alterego | Tell that to stock button thingies. | 17:17 |
| timeless | tak: um, | 17:17 |
| alterego | timeless, access keys? | 17:18 |
| timeless | alterego: yeah um.... maemo clearly wants you to waste lots of time "porting" to hildon | 17:18 |
| timeless | + _Add | 17:18 |
| timeless | instead of + Add | 17:18 |
| alterego | Oh | 17:18 |
| alterego | Like I said. That's Gtk Stock ID | 17:18 |
| timeless | there's a "proper" way to detect ... | 17:18 |
| alterego | I didn't define the text or icon. I just said Gtk::Stock::ADD | 17:18 |
| timeless | sorry, i'm not a gnome developer | 17:18 |
| timeless | and i don't know why the ui people didn't ask the desktop people to fix this | 17:19 |
| timeless | i think it basically goes like this: | 17:19 |
| alterego | I do get your point though and I will remove that. | 17:19 |
| timeless | 1. ui people design somehting "shiny" | 17:19 |
| timeless | 2. ui people force desktop people to spend all their time making "shiny" which requires inventing new widgets | 17:19 |
| ||cw | woulnd' that be don't use access keys UNLESS there's a vkb? if you don't have the kb, you can't use an access key anyway | 17:19 |
| alterego | (I had to invent a new widget for my UI too) | 17:20 |
| timeless | 3. desktop people have no time left to try to adapt gnome widgets to match ui design theory | 17:20 |
| timeless | 4. ui people didn't bother explicitly explaining theory to desktop people | 17:20 |
| alterego | ||cw, vkb is the virtual keyboard. Kind of hard without an ALT key ;) | 17:20 |
| timeless | 5. no tester is truly aware of theory | 17:20 |
| ||cw | alterego: alt key is in the menu isn't it? | 17:20 |
| timeless | 6. no one is responsible for testing pored apps | 17:20 |
| timeless | menu?? | 17:21 |
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| timeless | you can't trigger alt w/ vkb or fkb <period> | 17:21 |
| timeless | or ctrl for that matter | 17:21 |
| timeless | xterm cheats by offering a menu item "send control+" or something | 17:21 |
| timeless | and as hacks go, it sucks | 17:21 |
| alterego | Sure, but it doesn't make accelerators usable in maemo. | 17:21 |
| alterego | They're not. | 17:21 |
| timeless | because if you use screen, the display resizes | 17:21 |
| timeless | note: w/ itos2008, hildon apps will show accelerators | 17:22 |
| timeless | but only when the "Real" keyboard is open | 17:22 |
| alterego | Right | 17:22 |
| * alterego wonders how to do that. | 17:22 | |
| timeless | (or maybe if a bluetooth keyboard is active and paired, not sure how tested that is) | 17:22 |
| timeless | iirc it's a HALism | 17:22 |
| alterego | Though, the 'Add' button in question is activated by hitting enter on the V/KB anyway .. | 17:23 |
| timeless | there's public code that should be in gnome upstream for it iirc | 17:23 |
| timeless | use the standard browser Arrow button instead | 17:23 |
| timeless | the green one | 17:23 |
| alterego | For what? | 17:23 |
| timeless | instead of add | 17:23 |
| alterego | Oh, next? | 17:23 |
| timeless | no, the green check like one | 17:23 |
| timeless | (the other green one!) | 17:24 |
| alterego | ;) | 17:24 |
| * timeless kicks someone in UI L&F | 17:24 | |
| alterego | I don't know anyting about UI design. | 17:24 |
| timeless | that green thing if placed immediately to the right of the text field.. | 17:24 |
| alterego | I work on aesthetics and functionality. | 17:24 |
| derf | It's actually pretty easy to add shift/alt/ctrl keys to a matchbox keyboard. | 17:24 |
| timeless | should at least give users a clue of a tie in w/ browser behavior | 17:24 |
| Tak | hmm, garage tracker could really use a preview button | 17:24 |
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| derf | I don't use the vkb that ships with the device, but I did so on my maemocjk keyboard. | 17:25 |
| timeless | i think it's reasonably safe to assume your users will have met the browser a bit | 17:25 |
| alterego | derf, they're still pointless when the button is a couple of CM's away from the keyboard :P | 17:25 |
| alterego | Oh, you mean the refresh button? | 17:25 |
| FMz | CMs... alterego must be British / Aussie. | 17:25 |
| timeless | yeah | 17:25 |
| derf | alterego: I don't use it for "keyboard shortcuts", obviously. | 17:25 |
| derf | But timeless is right, that xterm hack is truly horrible. | 17:25 |
| timeless | note that refresh is echnically the circle one | 17:25 |
| alterego | That's the only green arrow I have in my browser .. | 17:26 |
| timeless | in newer versions (not sure how old) the browser only shows reload/refresh if you tap and hold | 17:26 |
| timeless | the check thing isn't refresh, it's go | 17:26 |
| timeless | tap and hold it :) | 17:26 |
| timeless | (scary that i remembered it was go) | 17:26 |
| alterego | Ah | 17:26 |
| alterego | That's odd. | 17:26 |
| timeless | sorry for calling it a check instead of "right turn"? | 17:26 |
| * timeless clearly has mapped it to a standard green checkmark :) | 17:27 | |
| alterego | ;) | 17:27 |
| bedboi | damn DNS resolving does not work in my dusty scratchbox | 17:28 |
| * alterego rearranges his UI because of timeless' remarks :P | 17:28 | |
| alterego | I was happy with my design too :( | 17:28 |
| bedboi | i hacked the /scratchbox/etc/nsswitch.conf but nothing changed | 17:28 |
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| mgedmin | does /scratchbox/etc/resolv.conf look sane? | 17:29 |
| * alterego attempts to hunt down this "GO" button | 17:30 | |
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| alterego | I don't think it's Gtk stock. | 17:31 |
| timeless | qgn_oolb_browser_gobutton.png | 17:31 |
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| timeless | icons-default/ 26x26/ qgn_toolb_browser_gobutton.png | 17:32 |
| alterego | Yeah | 17:32 |
| alterego | Thanks | 17:32 |
| * timeless shouldn't try typing | 17:32 | |
| alterego | :) | 17:32 |
| alterego | I was hoping for a stock ID | 17:32 |
| lopz | hola | 17:32 |
| * alterego creates a new stock id ;) | 17:32 | |
| timeless | oh! | 17:33 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/sardine-20071025/source/sdk-default-icons-2.0/icons/26x26/ | 17:33 |
| timeless | it's in sardine! | 17:33 |
| timeless | it's also in chinook | 17:33 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook-20071107/source/sdk-default-icons-2.0/icons/26x26/ | 17:33 |
| alterego | That's great. | 17:34 |
| alterego | Though, I don't use either of those !!! | 17:34 |
| timeless | fwiw, the way i found the icon was: | 17:34 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/sardine-20071025/find?string=png$ | 17:34 |
| alterego | That's pretty useful. Thanks :) | 17:34 |
| timeless | (i started by using an internal equivalent of the real sources, but that's just a detail) | 17:34 |
| timeless | note that the icons are just sdk icons, there's no guarantee that they'll resemble anything else | 17:35 |
| timeless | although they are designed to be remotely pretty | 17:35 |
| alterego | I think I'll make a note to make all those icons maemo stock icons in ruby-maemo. | 17:35 |
| alterego | Should be easy to auto generate the code to do it. | 17:36 |
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| alterego | What does qgn stand for by-the-way? | 17:36 |
| alterego | * graphics nokia? | 17:36 |
| timeless | anyway, *please* take advantage of the cross references on timeless.justdave.net | 17:36 |
| timeless | they're here for you (#maemo) | 17:37 |
| timeless | at some point, maybe even this year, that'll start being mxr.maemo.org, we'll see | 17:37 |
| alterego | That's really cool. I'll be using it a lot timeless. | 17:37 |
| timeless | my officemate doesn't know :) | 17:38 |
| alterego | That's really helpful. I need a way of finding out the differences to keep ruby-maemo up-to-date. | 17:40 |
| alterego | That's exactly what I need :) | 17:40 |
| timeless | the two specific indices here are not going to change | 17:41 |
| timeless | hence the -{datestamp} | 17:41 |
| timeless | i'll eventually add /chinook and /sardine which will | 17:41 |
| timeless | (probably next week) | 17:41 |
| alterego | They'll be SVN? | 17:42 |
| timeless | oh, no | 17:42 |
| alterego | How do you mean change then? | 17:42 |
| timeless | these are generated from .deb sources | 17:42 |
| alterego | Ah | 17:42 |
| timeless | i just run the script again | 17:42 |
| alterego | Okay | 17:42 |
| alterego | Will you be making a profile for SVN HEAD? | 17:42 |
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| FMz | Pardon my newbness... what are chinook and sardine? | 17:44 |
| timeless | it's kinda hard | 17:44 |
| timeless | the garage tree is against svn head | 17:44 |
| alterego | Chinook is the tag name for OS2008 | 17:44 |
| timeless | if it includes what you need, then you're fine | 17:45 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/find | 17:45 |
| alterego | I can't remember what Sardine is ^_^ | 17:45 |
| FMz | That's what I thought. I assume sardine is OS2007? | 17:45 |
| timeless | sardine continuously changes\ | 17:45 |
| FMz | Ahh... | 17:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | sardine is the bleeding edge development release. | 17:45 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/find?string=sardine | 17:45 |
| alterego | Cool. | 17:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | bora is 2007 | 17:45 |
| FMz | So... sardine is like the cutting edge | 17:45 |
| FMz | Ahh, k :) | 17:45 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/sardine/www/index.html | 17:46 |
| alterego | gregale too .. | 17:46 |
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| GeneralAntilles | system | 17:46 |
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| timeless | hold | 17:47 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/search?find=%2Fbrowser%2Fwww%2Fnews%2F&string=gregale | 17:47 |
| L0cutus | what about this: http://intr.overt.org/4.2007.38-mmc-kernel/ ? | 17:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ignore that, was meant for Quicksilver. :P | 17:47 |
| timeless | http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/browser/www/news/8/index.html | 17:47 |
| timeless | that last hit shows what gregale "seems" to be | 17:47 |
| timeless | i.e., it's a release (2.2) | 17:47 |
| timeless | brb | 17:48 |
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| timeless | ok, qgn_ is legacy, it's an identifier prefix | 17:52 |
| timeless | a bit of a short history: | 17:52 |
| timeless | osso imported its specifications/style/layout from "s90" (series 90) | 17:52 |
| timeless | qgn_ is one of those imports | 17:52 |
| alterego | Ah | 17:52 |
| timeless | and no one i could find here has any idea what it means :) | 17:52 |
| alterego | Heh | 17:52 |
| timeless | mind you, the finns leave at 5pm prompt and it's nearly 6pm, so i was lucky to find 2 finns... but stil | 17:53 |
| timeless | finding someone who knows is basically a matter of finding someone who worked in s90 not osso | 17:53 |
| timeless | (probably) | 17:53 |
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| timeless | http://allaboutsymbian.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31140&page=38 | 17:54 |
| timeless | shows it was used there... | 17:54 |
| timeless | so it's clearly a symbian ism :) | 17:54 |
| timeless | http://discussion.forum.nokia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=67614 | 17:54 |
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| Spakman | hello. Anyone know much about ruby-maemo? | 17:58 |
| czr | Spakman, ask alterego | 17:58 |
| Spakman | specifically, how to trap a full-screen keypress | 17:58 |
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| Spakman | thanks czr | 17:58 |
| alterego | Spakman, Sure thing | 17:58 |
| alterego | Hang on I'll upload an example. | 17:58 |
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| greedo__ | hello | 17:59 |
| greedo__ | i installed chinook beta sdk but it seems it lacks a lot of packages | 17:59 |
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| greedo__ | is there another repository that should be used ? | 17:59 |
| Spakman | thanks a lot alterego, appreciate it | 17:59 |
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| timeless | greedo: the sdk is an sdk | 18:01 |
| timeless | it's not an os | 18:01 |
| timeless | (not that "os" is really defined) | 18:01 |
| timeless | what do you want? | 18:01 |
| timeless | greedo: you can compare http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/sardine-20071025/source/ to http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook-20071107/source/ if you feel like it | 18:02 |
| timeless | i have no idea how they differ | 18:02 |
| alterego | Spakman, http://maemo.rubyx.co.uk/ruby-maemo/CURRENT/Examples/fullscreen_example.rb.txt | 18:05 |
| alterego | Spakman, that's the kind of code I use. | 18:05 |
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| Khertan | Hi ! | 18:05 |
| alterego | Spakman, I'll probably be adding the fullscreen? and fullscreen_toggle methods into a future release of ruby-maemo | 18:06 |
| Khertan | Someone have already try to compile tinymail pre release 0.0.4 on scratchbox ? | 18:06 |
| alterego | So you wont have to create and override those methods for long and just worry about the key-press-event signal handler. | 18:06 |
| Khertan | it s seems that some file are missing for the maemo target | 18:06 |
| timeless | khertan: care to be less vague? | 18:08 |
| timeless | it's obviosly built by its devs... | 18:08 |
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| Spakman | alterego - excellent! Thanks a lot. I'm so glad ruby-maemo is out there :) | 18:10 |
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| alterego | Spakman, well I'm glad you're enjoying it :) | 18:10 |
| Khertan | timeless > i can compile it for default target | 18:11 |
| alterego | What's default target? | 18:12 |
| alterego | Are you crosscompiling out of scratchbox? | 18:12 |
| Khertan | but for the maemo target i get an tny-maemo-device-priv.h : No such file | 18:12 |
| Khertan | i'm compiling in scratchbox | 18:12 |
| alterego | Have you installed the required dependencies in both targets? | 18:12 |
| zoran | so, you don't have header file? | 18:12 |
| timeless | libtinymail-maemo/tny-maemo-device-priv.h | 18:12 |
| * timeless tries to figure out where that is | 18:13 | |
| * alterego takes a guess at libtinymail-dev .. | 18:13 | |
| alterego | maybe libtinymail-maemo-dev .. | 18:13 |
| Khertan | default target is DEMOUI. | 18:13 |
| alterego | O_o | 18:14 |
| alterego | Right | 18:14 |
| Khertan | so in default target some dependancy is unmeet | 18:14 |
| alterego | Sure, if you've not installed libtinymail * -dev | 18:14 |
| Khertan | libtinymail * -dev ? | 18:15 |
| Khertan | it s the prerelease of libtinymail that i try to compile | 18:16 |
| timeless | API reference manual per API version: http://tinymail.org/API/ | 18:16 |
| timeless | Development website and info: http://tinymail.org/trac/tinymail | 18:16 |
| timeless | Marketing documentation & contact: http://tinymail.org | 18:16 |
| Khertan | :) | 18:16 |
| alterego | Heh | 18:16 |
| Khertan | maybe i should try from the svn | 18:16 |
| alterego | I thought you were building a IO | 18:16 |
| alterego | ~UI .. | 18:16 |
| Khertan | building an UI should be the next things :) | 18:17 |
| timeless | ok, got it | 18:17 |
| timeless | http://swift/world/source/external/tinymail/trunk/.svn/ | 18:17 |
| timeless | url="https://svn.tinymail.org/svn/tinymail/trunk" | 18:17 |
| timeless | that's what they told me to index | 18:17 |
| timeless | so that's what you want :) | 18:17 |
| alterego | timeless, http://alterego.freeshell.org/rx_task_004.png | 18:18 |
| timeless | yeah, that's better | 18:18 |
| timeless | the date thing should probably be replaced by whatever calendar widget maemo uses | 18:18 |
| timeless | i can look it up i suppose | 18:18 |
| alterego | Yeah, I was thinking about using that calendar button .. | 18:18 |
| alterego | Couldn't find the icon in stock icons though ;) | 18:19 |
| Spakman | alterego - any chance you can host the .install file in your repos too? The maemo site seems pretty broken whenever I try it. | 18:19 |
| alterego | Now I have your link ... | 18:19 |
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| alterego | Spakman, there is no install file :) | 18:19 |
| timeless | qgn_list_cp_datetime.png ? | 18:19 |
| alterego | Spakman, I'll work on making on though. | 18:19 |
| timeless | hrm, no, that's control panel | 18:19 |
| timeless | qgn_widg_datedit.png ? | 18:19 |
| timeless | yeah, that and the _pr variant sound good | 18:20 |
| Spakman | ah, OK :) | 18:20 |
| Spakman | thanks again, see ya. | 18:20 |
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| Khertan | alterego > nice ui for a task manager for a small screen | 18:20 |
| timeless | note: i'm using the sardine link (no cheaing :) | 18:20 |
| alterego | :) | 18:21 |
| timeless | fwow. tje stu;e fpr |add| ote,s c;ear;u see,s tp be a _plus_ overlayed on a htingy | 18:21 |
| timeless | see qgn_toolb_im_invite.png qgn_widg_mplayer_add.png qgn_toolb_gene_bookmark_add.png | 18:21 |
| timeless | ok, that's not readable :( | 18:21 |
| alterego | O_O | 18:22 |
| Khertan | compil seem to work for libtinymail from the svn :) | 18:22 |
| timeless | fwiw, the style for |addd| ???? clearly seems to be a _plus_ overlayed on a thingy | 18:22 |
| timeless | anyway, that's close enough to English :) | 18:22 |
| alterego | You mean the add group? | 18:22 |
| timeless | yeah | 18:23 |
| alterego | Are you saying you want me to remove all the button background graphics? :) | 18:23 |
| timeless | ? probably :) | 18:23 |
| timeless | qgn_list_sort.png fwiw | 18:23 |
| alterego | Even the order orientation? | 18:23 |
| timeless | that's the only sort like thing i can find | 18:23 |
| timeless | it's probably not necessarily right | 18:23 |
| alterego | Yeah bustin' my ballz here :P | 18:23 |
| timeless | that depends on what you're trying to do | 18:24 |
| timeless | maemo style is a tree widget | 18:24 |
| timeless | w/ sortable column indicators in the tree heads | 18:24 |
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| timeless | maemo/osso/whatever | 18:24 |
| alterego | Sure, that'd work. If priority was a column | 18:24 |
| alterego | But priority is indicated by colour. | 18:24 |
| * timeless puts on color blinding glasses | 18:25 | |
| * timeless waves sec508 @alterego | 18:25 | |
| Khertan | lol | 18:25 |
| timeless | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/describekeywords.cgi#sec508 | 18:25 |
| alterego | http://alterego.freeshell.org/rx_task_003.png | 18:25 |
| alterego | See, colours. :) | 18:25 |
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| Khertan | an hidden column ? | 18:25 |
| * timeless has no idea what those mean | 18:26 | |
| alterego | It's not a column at all. | 18:26 |
| timeless | in mail apps, you get a column chooser | 18:26 |
| timeless | and you could not have that column if you didn't want/need it | 18:26 |
| timeless | i have no idea which is more important | 18:26 |
| timeless | personally, for done, i'd use <strike> or <em> | 18:26 |
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| alterego | Red is high priority, green is low priority | 18:26 |
| timeless | well, i'd use <i> not <em>, but css is stupid | 18:26 |
| alterego | timeless, yes. That was the plan. | 18:27 |
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| timeless | can you have a high priority done task v. low priority done task? | 18:27 |
| alterego | I don't get you, what? | 18:28 |
| timeless | the red item, when it's done, is it still red, if so, why, if not, do you care? | 18:28 |
| timeless | similar for green | 18:28 |
| alterego | No, | 18:28 |
| alterego | They all grey out. | 18:28 |
| alterego | To the same grey. | 18:29 |
| timeless | in that case you could replace the check widget with some more magical widget | 18:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | Poor colorblind people. | 18:29 |
| timeless | that shows a number normally | 18:29 |
| timeless | and when simply clicked becomes a check | 18:29 |
| timeless | and when click-held, you get a menu to change priority | 18:29 |
| timeless | that's not necessarily in maemo style, but it'd solve all the problems i see | 18:30 |
| alterego | Ah, so you think I should put the priority in numerical form there. But when the item is crossed out it turns into a fancy tick image? | 18:30 |
| alterego | That's a nice idea. | 18:30 |
| timeless | :) | 18:30 |
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| alterego | Yeah, the context menu displays fancy options. | 18:30 |
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| alterego | You can edit the text in place and change all the other details. | 18:31 |
| timeless | qgn_list_messaging_high.png qgn_list_messaging_low.png | 18:31 |
| timeless | are the two obvious ones i can find in mail | 18:31 |
| * timeless is looking for numbers | 18:31 | |
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| Khertan | *** No rule to make target xml/tree_index.sgml', needed by distdir .... | 18:31 |
| timeless | oh, fwiw, qgn_indi_gene_plus.png | 18:31 |
| timeless | so it seems they do have a plus :( | 18:32 |
| Khertan | grr ... i ll wait until someone make a package ... | 18:32 |
| alterego | That's a horrible plus .. | 18:34 |
| alterego | That's for the media player I believe. | 18:34 |
| timeless | ooh cool | 18:34 |
| timeless | yeah, hence hte :( | 18:34 |
| timeless | anyway, check this out | 18:34 |
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| timeless | javascript:styles='table,tr,td{display:inline}';%20newSS%20=%20document.createElement('link');%20newSS.rel%20=%20'stylesheet';%20newSS.href%20=%20'data:text/css,'%20+%20escape(styles);%20document.documentElement.childNodes[0].appendChild(newSS);%20void%200 | 18:34 |
| zoran | I'd buy some usb bluetooth dongle; opinions whatto get? | 18:34 |
| |R | zoran : give me 2 sec | 18:35 |
| timeless | if you have the sardine 26x26 page open | 18:35 |
| timeless | [in firefox] | 18:35 |
| timeless | load that url into that window | 18:35 |
| timeless | and you should get results that are slightly more easy to scan :) | 18:35 |
| workingplayya | anyone here who hast kagu with working remote? | 18:36 |
| timeless | javascript:styles='table,tr,td{display:inline}%20font{display:none}';%20newSS%20=%20document.createElement('link');%20newSS.rel%20=%20'stylesheet';%20newSS.href%20=%20'data:text/css,'%20+%20escape(styles);%20document.documentElement.childNodes[0].appendChild(newSS);%20void%200 | 18:36 |
| timeless | is even better :) | 18:36 |
| alterego | How do you mean load it into firefox? | 18:38 |
| alterego | Append it on a query string? | 18:39 |
| timeless | no, just enter it in the urlbar | 18:39 |
| timeless | it's a url | 18:39 |
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| timeless | javascript: is a protocol, like http: | 18:39 |
| alterego | Weird | 18:39 |
| alterego | Had no idea. | 18:39 |
| alterego | I don't know how you think that's easier .. | 18:40 |
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| workingplayya | new protocol js? | 18:40 |
| alterego | I have no pgup or pgdn .. | 18:40 |
| Khertan | i must go on ... bye | 18:41 |
| workingplayya | i think it just changes things in the style settins of the page | 18:41 |
| Khertan | and thanks foor help | 18:41 |
| workingplayya | siju | 18:41 |
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| timeless | workingplayya: right | 18:41 |
| L0cutus | alterego: point me to a good tutorial ruby+gtk(+maemo?) :) | 18:41 |
| timeless | it's designed to be loaded in the sardine 26x26 page | 18:41 |
| alterego | http://ruby-gnome2.sourceforge.jp | 18:41 |
| alterego | There's a good tutorial there. | 18:42 |
| alterego | Maemo, just look at my examples on the website. | 18:42 |
| workingplayya | but maybe wrong charset | 18:42 |
| alterego | L0cutus, ^^^ | 18:43 |
| L0cutus | http://ruby-gnome2.sourceforge.jp/it/index.html | 18:45 |
| L0cutus | thanks :) | 18:45 |
| czr | alterego, who is Maemo? | 18:45 |
| alterego | It wasn't an address :P | 18:46 |
| czr | :-) | 18:46 |
| timeless | s/^M/for m/ ? | 18:49 |
| timeless | or wrt | 18:49 |
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| zoran | opinions on usb bluetooth dongle to buy? | 18:56 |
| alterego | csr | 18:56 |
| alterego | 2.1 | 18:56 |
| alterego | Flashing blue LED | 18:56 |
| alterego | sorted .. | 18:56 |
| zoran | in stores in my area I could find gigabyte bt03d and canyon btu4 | 18:57 |
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| alterego | timeless, http://alterego.freeshell.org/rx_task_004.png | 19:00 |
| L0cutus | mmm seems window.border_width API is changed from tutorial ;) | 19:00 |
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| rubiks | hello | 19:01 |
| _Monkey | niihau, rubiks | 19:01 |
| alterego | L0cutus, if you're doing this on the device or in the SDK then there will be differences. The current Gtk version is old in maemo. | 19:01 |
| rubiks | anything new on OS2008? | 19:01 |
| L0cutus | ops | 19:01 |
| alterego | rubiks, when it gets released it'll be the newest IT OS. | 19:01 |
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| alterego | Right, I'm gonna get food and have a break. bbiab | 19:04 |
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| czr | until the italians come up with a newer version | 19:08 |
| L0cutus | czr: hohoho :D | 19:10 |
| czr | it's christmas already? | 19:10 |
| t_s_o | grumble, wsod, grumble. heh, i should have gone directly to nokia on day one. not do some silly run around with expansys... | 19:11 |
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| trunneml_ | hi | 19:12 |
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| timeless | ok, fwiw, http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook/ and http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/sardine/ now exist | 19:17 |
| timeless | i make no guarantees about freshness :) | 19:17 |
| timeless | they're currently just pointers to the other two | 19:17 |
| trunneml_ | someone know where to find the pkg_config file for expat | 19:18 |
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| lopz | re | 19:30 |
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| timeless | learningsolaris.com/archives/2006/03/10/mdb-tutorial-by-mcdougall-mauro/ | 19:30 |
| timeless | maybe www.opensolaris.org/os/community/mdb/ | 19:31 |
| timeless | oops | 19:31 |
| shackan | timeless: you nokians are able to use gprof in sb? because I'm not, and it breaks even for a simple hello world | 19:32 |
| timeless | i can' remember which ones they use | 19:33 |
| timeless | it might be jprof | 19:33 |
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| shackan | I would not care and just try the executable on the device itself which is what interests me, if it wasn't that the gprof breakage kills every configure script (ie: you get C compiler is unable to execute etc if you turn profiling on) | 19:34 |
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| shackan | timeless: thanks, will try | 19:34 |
| shackan | timeless: is it restricted to moz ? | 19:36 |
| timeless | maybe i'm confusing tools, i suppose i could check a mailinglist | 19:37 |
| shackan | np | 19:37 |
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| timeless | oprofile | 19:39 |
| timeless | sorry, there are way too many profiling tools w/ similar names :) | 19:40 |
| shackan | okay! | 19:40 |
| timeless | and i've been around/seen most of them used in /some/ context, which makes my brain mush | 19:40 |
| shackan | uh? | 19:41 |
| shackan | like what? | 19:41 |
| shackan | anyway, if I remember correctly oprofile is linux only and depends on a kernel module, which means it won't work in sb, but anyway, as long as it works on the metal :) | 19:42 |
| timeless | cachegrind/quantify/jprof/.... | 19:42 |
| shackan | ugh, anything else? :D | 19:43 |
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| timeless | yes, but i need to finish release notes, not dig through cobwebs | 19:43 |
| L0cutus | is possible to start a servce from osso-statusbar-cpu command list ? and if yes, how ? | 19:43 |
| L0cutus | i've put a commandline on sudoers | 19:43 |
| L0cutus | service* | 19:43 |
| L0cutus | i've tryed "/etc/init.d/servicename start" | 19:44 |
| L0cutus | but doesn't work | 19:44 |
| L0cutus | from osso-xterm it work ok | 19:44 |
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| alterego | Wouldn't you need to do 'sudo /etc/init.d/servicename start' ? | 19:50 |
| alterego | That's what I do for my enable BT script. | 19:50 |
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| ||cw | yeah, sudoers isn't magic, you still need to sue the sudo command | 19:54 |
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| L0cutus | wow | 20:00 |
| L0cutus | it work now :D | 20:00 |
| L0cutus | thanks | 20:00 |
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| lopz | bye | 20:09 |
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| L0cutus | <alterego> That's what I do for my enable BT script. | 20:12 |
| L0cutus | can you post here or query ? | 20:12 |
| L0cutus | does it enable bt also if disabled from ctrl panel ? | 20:12 |
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| lardman | evening | 20:20 |
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| lardman | Does maemo-af-desktop include the launcher, etc.? | 20:23 |
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| lardman | hmm, maemo-launcher, I should learn to read better | 20:23 |
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| Robot101 | lardman: yes, but also to avoid the initialisation time, and share data which is initialised once by the libraries | 20:36 |
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| lardman | It looks like it's a bit like busybox, depending on what it's called as it starts something else | 20:37 |
| lardman | or rather its first argument (I think) | 20:38 |
| lardman | I'm just wondering whether there's any error reporting functionality - people always complain that such a such doens't work, it would be nice to tell them why | 20:38 |
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| straind | |R: My price was $52.47 after s+h. | 21:06 |
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| |R | straind : ok, i'm bidding there right now | 21:08 |
| |R | 25$ shipping to canada... | 21:09 |
| |R | si i won't bid over 30 i think... | 21:09 |
| |R | so | 21:09 |
| straind | I used a sniping program and waited a few days to get my price. | 21:09 |
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| |R | straind : i guess i could try jbidwatcher :) | 21:10 |
| straind | That's what I used. | 21:10 |
| |R | can it do inter-bid things? | 21:11 |
| |R | let's say: bid this on that item, if it fails try on that one | 21:11 |
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| |R | and what sniping delay did you use? (15 sec here) | 21:13 |
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| straind | Yeah. Multi-snipe or something like that. That's what I used, but it didn't work properly. It won, but wasn't sure about it. It didn't bid on any more though. YMMV | 21:14 |
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| |R | haha ok :) | 21:14 |
| |R | i'll end up buying 10 GPS ;) | 21:14 |
| straind | I had a 30 sec delay, but I did get outbid once. | 21:15 |
| |R | I'll sync 2 minutes before it ends | 21:16 |
| |R | we'll see :P | 21:16 |
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| * fysa test | 21:35 | |
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| bstock | real quick, if i have SU-18_2006SE_3.2006.49-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin and the flasher app, which flags do i use? | 21:35 |
| bstock | is that a kernel image, jffs2 image, initfs image? | 21:36 |
| robtaylor | bstock: fiasco | 21:36 |
| robtaylor | bstock: -F <path> -b -f | 21:37 |
| bstock | k thx | 21:37 |
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| lardman | robtaylor: -b? | 21:39 |
| lardman | robtaylor: -f -R | 21:39 |
| alterego | CTCP? Is that Russian? | 21:40 |
| lardman | bstock: http://maemo.org/community/wiki/HOWTO_FlashLatestNokiaImageWithLinux | 21:40 |
| lardman | alterego: where's that from? | 21:40 |
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| Tak | yeah, freenode-connect can stop ping-flooding me anytime now | 21:40 |
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| alterego | IRC doesn't half have some insane characteristics. | 21:43 |
| lardman | it's a script kiddie - did you see the announcemet earlier? | 21:44 |
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| ||cw | no | 21:45 |
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| lardman | it just said sorry for the issues & they are working on blocking it | 21:45 |
| robtaylor | lardman: -b = boot | 21:45 |
| lardman | robtaylor: ah, okay, I'd not seen that one used before | 21:46 |
| Tak | ah | 21:46 |
| alterego | Neah, I don't read IRC announcements. | 21:46 |
| * Tak CTCP flood the ircops to hurry them along | 21:46 | |
| robtaylor | lardman: though i guess it makes sense to reboot after a full fiasco flash | 21:46 |
| alterego | I just hide in my channels. | 21:46 |
| alterego | Hahah | 21:47 |
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| alterego | Why wouldn't you reboot? | 21:47 |
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| robtaylor | alterego: reboot versus boot. boot being quicker. | 21:48 |
| alterego | Ah | 21:49 |
| alterego | I find flashing doesn't really take that long. | 21:50 |
| alterego | How often do you do it? :D | 21:53 |
| robtaylor | alterego: about 5 times a day at the moment | 21:54 |
| robtaylor | >< | 21:54 |
| alterego | Jeez. | 21:54 |
| alterego | What device? | 21:54 |
| alterego | And any particular reason? | 21:54 |
| robtaylor | alterego: RX34, optimising HAL | 21:54 |
| alterego | Or are you stress testing the flash so you can tell us how many times it's safe to flash them ;) | 21:54 |
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| alterego | That reminds me. | 21:54 |
| alterego | I must bind HAL .. | 21:54 |
| robtaylor | alterego: to what? | 21:54 |
| alterego | ruby | 21:54 |
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| lardman | anyone happen to know where the function die() is defined? | 21:54 |
| alterego | At the end of life.c lardman | 21:54 |
| * alterego contemplates applying for extras uploading privs. | 21:54 | |
| lardman | isn't that a switch(goodness), case(good) goto heaven; case(bad) goto hell; ? | 21:54 |
| alterego | I'll probably get denied again until I get the other ruby project destroyed. | 21:54 |
| robtaylor | alterego: there's already ruby dbus bindings, thats all you need | 21:54 |
| alterego | Those bindings are rubbish. | 21:54 |
| alterego | In fact. They're not bindings. | 21:54 |
| alterego | They wrap dbus-send etc. | 21:54 |
| robtaylor | oh god | 21:54 |
| alterego | Which reminds me. I should really work on ruby-dbus .. | 21:54 |
| alterego | ;) | 21:54 |
| robtaylor | alterego: +! for that! | 21:54 |
| robtaylor | +1, even | 21:54 |
| alterego | That was going to be my Christmas of Code project. ;) | 21:54 |
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| alterego | I started looking into it. | 21:55 |
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| alterego | With the current ruby-libosso bindings I've done you can make a working dbus service and client. | 21:55 |
| alterego | So it wasn't really much of an emergency. | 21:55 |
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| ZenGeist | hi all | 21:56 |
| ZenGeist | I have a problem | 21:56 |
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| ZenGeist | I can not update Pidgin :( | 21:56 |
| alterego | Is it contagious? | 21:56 |
| alterego | ZenGeist, have you tried uninstalling the previous version first? | 21:56 |
| ZenGeist | alterego, no | 21:56 |
| alterego | What device/OS are you using? | 21:57 |
| ZenGeist | n800 | 21:57 |
| ZenGeist | os2007 | 21:57 |
| _Monkey | i guess os2007 is better but needs more memory | 21:57 |
| alterego | Okay, I'll try updating myself hang on. | 21:57 |
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| Tak | alterego: you should be able to get extras permission regardless of whether you have / are eligible for a garage project | 21:59 |
| alterego | Yeah, you're probably right, | 22:00 |
| alterego | Still, I think it would be wise getting that ruby project removed. | 22:00 |
| alterego | There can be only one >:( | 22:00 |
| alterego | ^_^ | 22:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Especially if it's dead. | 22:01 |
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| alterego | Yeah, you'd think that'd make it easier .. | 22:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Are they having a drunken party at freenode or something? | 22:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Somebody's doing it on kubrick | 22:02 |
| alterego | I dunno. But it's very annoying .. | 22:02 |
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| alterego | ZenGeist, that release looks like it's for OS2008 | 22:03 |
| ZenGeist | hmmm... | 22:04 |
| alterego | There's no 2.2 in my repository .. | 22:04 |
| ZenGeist | alterego, but i set distribution to bora | 22:04 |
| alterego | ZenGeist, bora isn't 2008 .. | 22:04 |
| alterego | 2008 isn't even out yet .. | 22:04 |
| ZenGeist | yes | 22:04 |
| ZenGeist | alterego, visit http://pidgin.garage.maemo.org/ | 22:05 |
| ZenGeist | there are new repo setings | 22:05 |
| alterego | Ah | 22:06 |
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| alterego | Well, that was pretty easy to fix. | 22:39 |
| alterego | Change a 1 to a -1 | 22:39 |
| _Monkey | alterego: that doesn't look right | 22:39 |
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| alterego | :) | 22:39 |
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| alterego | Well it is right _Monkey | 22:39 |
| FMz | Fix'd. That should look better. | 22:40 |
| FMz | alterego: In a couple of sentences, how would you decribe the process of porting an app to Maemo? | 22:41 |
| alterego | Erm | 22:41 |
| alterego | I wouldn't know. I've not really ported an app. | 22:41 |
| alterego | I wouldn't call ruby-maemo a port. | 22:43 |
| FMz | Hmm... so it would be more like... erm... building an interaction layer. | 22:44 |
| alterego | Yes, exactly. | 22:44 |
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| FMz | Tutorials on the Ruby site, and a couple of other small ones. | 22:50 |
| alterego | It's like a Lisp/Perl/Python/Smalltalk hybrid | 22:50 |
| FMz | I've never used any of them... lol | 22:50 |
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| alterego | What power of C? | 22:50 |
| alterego | See is only really good at interfacing with hardware. | 22:51 |
| alterego | s/See/C/ | 22:51 |
| infobot | alterego meant: C is only really good at interfacing with hardware. | 22:51 |
| FMz | PHP, C, C++, SQL, HTML, Java, and basic is all I've done... heh | 22:51 |
| alterego | ;) | 22:51 |
| FMz | Hmm... | 22:51 |
| alterego | Ah, I can see why you think Ruby is different. | 22:51 |
| FMz | :) | 22:51 |
| alterego | It's the only good language you've come across ^_^ | 22:51 |
| FMz | Ohhh, SNAP | 22:52 |
| FMz | lol | 22:52 |
| Tak | C is good at everything; it just takes a lot of carefully planned code. | 22:52 |
| alterego | C is adequate | 22:52 |
| alterego | Sure, | 22:52 |
| alterego | I prefer a more agile approach. | 22:52 |
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| alterego | C involves a lot of mud wrestling. | 22:52 |
| alterego | And not with chicks. | 22:53 |
| Tak | mmm, wrestling with muddy bytes | 22:56 |
| FMz | Ruby just doesn't feel structured enough.. | 22:58 |
| alterego | Languages like Ruby and Python offer a very nice abstraction toolbox which makes programming come a lot more natural. | 22:58 |
| alterego | FMz, we call that flexibility ;) | 22:58 |
| alterego | The structure should come from you. Not the programming language. | 22:58 |
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| * FMz mentally battles with himself between C and Ruby. | 22:58 | |
| alterego | I think people are scared of dynamic langauges like Ruby and Python, because they're used to getting hundreds of compiler errors. Which makes them feel like bad programmers. The majority of compilation errors are typos and other really small silly mistakes. All of which are made appearant when a program is run in a dynamic language aswell. | 22:58 |
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| alterego | The advantages C have over these other languages. Speed, low-level hardware interaction etc. Can all be done in these high level languages by making small C extensions to do the low level task and abstract to a nice high level interface. | 22:58 |
| straind | |R: Not bad. It's a really nice GPS unit as long as you don't lose it. :) | 22:58 |
| FMz | alterego: I like that idea. | 22:58 |
| alterego | FMz, http://maemo.rubyx.co.uk/ruby-maemo/CURRENT/Examples/basic_application.rb.txt | 22:58 |
| alterego | That is a minimal maemo application | 22:58 |
| alterego | Equivalent to the first example in the "official" maemo tutorial but in Ruby not C. | 22:59 |
| FMz | That's.... simple. | 22:59 |
| FMz | o_O | 22:59 |
| FMz | I... I think I love it. | 22:59 |
| Tak | I should add a simple rubygame example | 23:00 |
| alterego | Tak, you write it I'll stick it in the examples directory :) | 23:00 |
| * Tak nods | 23:00 | |
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| FMz | So, is Hildon just a gtk library? | 23:03 |
| alterego | The majority is yes. | 23:03 |
| p| | uaps :) | 23:03 |
| czr | alterego, one advantage of C is also "what is get is what you get", instead of the interpreter doing stuff with memory allocations and like behind your back. | 23:03 |
| czr | that is not achievable with "small extensions written in C". | 23:03 |
| alterego | czr, that's an advantage? | 23:03 |
| czr | assuming you know what you want, yes. | 23:04 |
| alterego | I'd rather forget about memory allocation :P | 23:04 |
| czr | see above. | 23:04 |
| czr | granted, I'd rather write GUI stuff in python as well. | 23:04 |
| czr | GTK+ is just mainly painful with C. | 23:04 |
| alterego | I'm not sure I understand what that statement is supposed to mean. | 23:04 |
| czr | which one? | 23:05 |
| _Monkey | which one is it? :) | 23:05 |
| alterego | Your C advantage about manual memory management | 23:05 |
| alterego | You can manually manage memory in Ruby, but there's not really much point for the most part. | 23:05 |
| czr | no. the advantage being that C does not have runtime stuff running behind your back. this includes memory management, but also other things. | 23:05 |
| hircus | alterego, czr: tried Vala yet? | 23:05 |
| FMz | I think I'm going to install Ruby on my girlfriend's PC to get used to using it with GTK. | 23:05 |
| alterego | hircus, I've heard of it. Not tried it no. | 23:06 |
| czr | hircus, nope. saw the example snippets though. doesn't seem to have too much docs though. looks interesting. | 23:06 |
| alterego | FMz, good plan. | 23:06 |
| hircus | there's a live CD project for Maemo that has Vala bundled with some nice examples | 23:06 |
| alterego | The ruby-gnome2 project (home of ruby-gtk) is really good. | 23:06 |
| hircus | yes, the documentation is still a bit lacking. the last release actually uses devhelp for docs, so it's a big improvement | 23:07 |
| czr | hircus, a tutorial would be nice | 23:07 |
| czr | something that would reimplement the basic stuff from the maemo tutorial for example. just as a comparative thingy. | 23:07 |
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| hircus | czr: true. let me look at what the examples in the live CDs are -- they're more comprehensive than the ones on the Vala site | 23:08 |
| czr | ah. only seen the site really. | 23:08 |
| hircus | czr: http://maemovmware.garage.maemo.org/ | 23:08 |
| hircus | you can just check out the vala code examples from SVN | 23:09 |
| czr | alterego, btw, please don't think that I'm bashing ruby/any other interpreted language. I love them. I just don't agree that you can get _all_ of the advantages (real or perceived) of C in higher-level languages. | 23:09 |
| * alterego debates forgetting about OS2007 for now as OS2008 is so close. | 23:09 | |
| hircus | just checked -- four Hildon examples of varying complexities | 23:09 |
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| alterego | Though, I'd pretty much done that already. | 23:09 |
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| czr | hircus, reading source code is no the same as a tutorial :-) | 23:09 |
| czr | hircus, I might take a look when I have some spare time. | 23:10 |
| lopz | hola | 23:10 |
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| FMz | For anyone with an inquisitive mind, reading source code is better than a tutorial ;) | 23:10 |
| FMz | IMHO, of course.... | 23:10 |
| czr | hircus, btw, do you know whether it's stable enough to be used in a real program? or is it subject to change still? | 23:10 |
| hircus | czr: I agree, though at least it's not as painful. You can generally read a C# tutorial to learn the language (though not the API) | 23:10 |
| czr | FMz, then my mind must be very boring by your standards. | 23:11 |
| hircus | czr: they don't have complete bindings for everything, but there's a binding generator tool to wrap GLib-based libs, you can manually bind C functions, or ask upstream to include new things | 23:11 |
| czr | I was more thinking in general acceptance. not me personally. | 23:11 |
| czr | thinking of even. | 23:12 |
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| hircus | czr: it just outputs C code, so the parts that it can compile should work just fine | 23:12 |
| czr | hircus, that wasn't really the question :-) | 23:12 |
| FMz | Nah, anyone that can do anything with any of this stuff is actually quite respectable to me. | 23:12 |
| Tak | Glade makes GUI stuff equally painless in any language | 23:12 |
| czr | the question was: assume someone uses vala to write a program _now_. what are the odds that the same program will compile and build in the future? | 23:12 |
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| FMz | Is there a good reference for Ruby functions? i.e. php.net's massive centralized list. Google doesn't seen to know about one | 23:16 |
| hircus | czr: ah | 23:16 |
| hircus | czr: there's been one incompatible change made so far, IIRC -- some syntactic change. My impression has been that the language spec is quite stable, but I've not tried writing large apps in it | 23:16 |
| czr | hircus, right. | 23:17 |
| alterego | FMz, http://ruby-doc.org/core & http://ruby-doc.org/stdlib | 23:17 |
| alterego | FMz, everything there is in the standard ruby distribution. | 23:17 |
| FMz | Wow... that's purdy... thanks again Alter... you do well in preaching the good news of the Rubydom | 23:18 |
| alterego | Heh :) | 23:18 |
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| alterego | I try not to preach. | 23:18 |
| czr | he sleeps with ruby :-) | 23:18 |
| alterego | I just try to sound enthusiastic ;) | 23:18 |
| czr | I have a written confession somewhere! | 23:18 |
| alterego | :) | 23:19 |
| straind | Gotta go get the kids dressed and ready to eay. | 23:19 |
| straind | s/eay/eat | 23:19 |
| czr | hmm. can't find the evidence. pity. | 23:20 |
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| alterego | Probably be somewhere near the place I said I'd like a girlfriend called Ruby | 23:20 |
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| alterego | I think you said something about a girl called Python would be a butch lesbian in some prison or something. | 23:21 |
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| czr | "Nov 07 16:36:41 <alterego> All I need to do is find a girl called Ruby .." | 23:22 |
| czr | hmm. somewhere around there :-) | 23:22 |
| czr | although I'm guessing the timestamp is not UTC. | 23:22 |
| czr | alterego, does ruby have working co-routines? | 23:23 |
| suihkulokki | there's 500+ people called ruby on facebook, many seem to be women ;) | 23:24 |
| czr | suihkulokki, what about women called python? | 23:24 |
| * czr gets his hopes up | 23:24 | |
| alterego | Hahah | 23:24 |
| suihkulokki | I | 23:24 |
| suihkulokki | err | 23:24 |
| czr | we all err at some point. | 23:24 |
| suihkulokki | I'm not sure I want to search for that :P | 23:24 |
| hircus | czr: well, if we go to the superclass (Snake) it's a common male nickname :P | 23:25 |
| czr | heh. can't blame you :-) | 23:25 |
| alterego | czr, yes. | 23:25 |
| hircus | Pythons and Boas are related, and Boa is a female name in Korea, I think | 23:25 |
| czr | hmm. close enough! | 23:25 |
| alterego | You can pass a block to a method and it can yeild to that block whenever. | 23:25 |
| suihkulokki | Elizabeth Python | 23:25 |
| alterego | The block can also cause the method to halt execution. | 23:25 |
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| suihkulokki | czr: seems to be a american cheerleader ;) | 23:26 |
| czr | alterego, so I can have a function implementation where depending on stuff, it can suspend itself, so that externally it can be restarted exactly from the position where it paused itself? | 23:26 |
| alterego | Are you talking about continuations? | 23:26 |
| czr | suihkulokki, thanks. invites to the wedding are already in the mail | 23:26 |
| doublec | ruby has continuations | 23:26 |
| czr | not sure what you want to call them. co-routines is what they were originally called ages ago. | 23:27 |
| suihkulokki | :P | 23:27 |
| czr | maybe co-routines means something else nowadays then :-) | 23:27 |
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| alterego | I don't really use them but I can see how they can be useful in say stream processing etc. | 23:27 |
| czr | stream processing, packet processing, event processing. | 23:28 |
| czr | anything where you don't have all the data available in order to finish the operation. | 23:28 |
| alterego | Right | 23:28 |
| hircus | czr: Python lets you do that too, right? | 23:28 |
| hircus | from 2.4 onwards | 23:28 |
| alterego | Sure, Python has continuations. | 23:28 |
| hircus | I think the term is generators | 23:29 |
| czr | I'd think so. I don't do high-perf stuff in python though. | 23:29 |
| alterego | Python has closures to right? | 23:29 |
| czr | ah, but generators is not the same at all.. | 23:29 |
| hircus | full-scale continuations as used in languages like Scheme, let you capture a control point anytime, and resume to it later | 23:29 |
| hircus | i.e. you can also rewind, not just pause and play | 23:29 |
| czr | that's what I'm looking for. although the rewinding seems tad to much. | 23:30 |
| alterego | I get what czr is saying. He's talking about flip-flop methods. | 23:30 |
| czr | too much even. | 23:30 |
| czr | although transactional cancelling would be ok too. | 23:30 |
| hircus | Python has closures, yes. but its lambda construct is not fully-featured (you can create a function and then pass it as a return value, which does the same thing) | 23:30 |
| alterego | Interestings. | 23:30 |
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| alterego | Ruby's blocks are awesome. | 23:31 |
| hircus | czr: confusing terminology, I guess. Python generator functions are co-routines, and you can pass them arguments when resuming | 23:31 |
| hircus | alterego: have they fixed it in 1.9 though? | 23:31 |
| alterego | Especially with closures. Makes creating event handlers super cool ;) | 23:31 |
| hircus | in Ruby 1.8 you have this problem: | 23:31 |
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| hircus | x = 42 | 23:31 |
| czr | hircus, probably. but python generators are fairly limited imho | 23:31 |
| hircus | {|x| x = 20 } | 23:31 |
| timeless | anyone here want to play a detective game? | 23:32 |
| hircus | if your code block uses names that are defined outside, the internal value leaks out | 23:32 |
| timeless | it's lots of fun | 23:32 |
| alterego | hircus, I thought that was a feature. | 23:32 |
| hircus | timeless: game? | 23:32 |
| _Monkey | it has been said that game is being done in javascript, if I don't have a pixel buffer to prepare svg graphics at the beginning of a level instead of when it comes on screen, I'll have to substitute with prerendered png sprite sheets. | 23:32 |
| alterego | :) | 23:32 |
| |R | who was looking for a bluetooth adapter suggestion earlier? | 23:32 |
| hircus | alterego: um :P | 23:32 |
| timeless | hircus, i give you a url, and you try to decide what it's doing | 23:32 |
| timeless | https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/mozilla/trunk/microb-engine/microb-engine/debian/patches/660_BUG65511.imgdoc_zoom.diff?root=browser&r1=587&r2=590&pathrev=597 | 23:32 |
| alterego | hircus, my only issue with blocks are a block can't accept a block ;) | 23:32 |
| timeless | that's a url | 23:32 |
| timeless | what's it doing? :) | 23:32 |
| |R | Cirago BTA-3210 works great in linux for me and is the smallest you can get i guess :) (for whoever was asking) | 23:32 |
| timeless | everyone can play :) | 23:32 |
| hircus | alterego: I guess in both Ruby and Python, blocks / lambdas are not 100% equivalent to full-blown functions | 23:33 |
| timeless | https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php?root=browser&rev=590&view=rev | 23:33 |
| timeless | is the "description" for what it's doing | 23:33 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Magic, timeless? | 23:33 |
| alterego | hircus, yeah. But it's a distinction that isn't as bad a side effect in ruby as it is in Python. | 23:33 |
| timeless | well, yes... | 23:34 |
| timeless | but that's not quite helpful :) | 23:34 |
| alterego | God, C++ | 23:34 |
| alterego | That's ugly code :P | 23:34 |
| timeless | this isn't c++ | 23:34 |
| czr | alterego, what bad side effect would that be? | 23:34 |
| timeless | it's patch-ghetti | 23:34 |
| sp3000 | mmm diffs of diffs | 23:35 |
| timeless | sp3000: fun ain'tit? | 23:35 |
| sp3000 | I duppose if you mix some debian in you could possibly manage to get diffs of diffs of diffs? | 23:35 |
| alterego | czr, side effect being the small head ache you get when something doesn't work to your expectations. | 23:35 |
| czr | alterego, can you be more specific how exactly ruby is better in this aspect then? | 23:35 |
| alterego | I didn't mean it in the context of a program ;) | 23:35 |
| sp3000 | but that could get a little hard to follow eventually | 23:35 |
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| timeless | sp3000: click "View Patch Patch" | 23:36 |
| timeless | speaking of hard to follow | 23:36 |
| czr | alterego, maybe I misunderstood then :-) | 23:36 |
| sp3000 | wtfbbq | 23:36 |
| straind | |R: Are you able to remove that BT adapter from a usb port? It's tiny! | 23:36 |
| alterego | Pfft, I've not used Python since 2.4 what would I know :P | 23:36 |
| sp3000 | that's pretty clever :D | 23:37 |
| czr | ruby continuations seem to be the closest thing to "co-routines" I was looking for. | 23:37 |
| alterego | czr, or you could just write a couple of co-routines. | 23:37 |
| timeless | arg | 23:37 |
| sp3000 | somebody is emitting their chrome from the wrong place | 23:37 |
| * timeless kicks garage | 23:37 | |
| timeless | i'm now "timeless -" | 23:37 |
| czr | alterego, please be more specific (what you mean by co-routine). | 23:37 |
| alterego | czr, I'll hack an example hang on. | 23:38 |
| czr | right. just don't use ruby. | 23:38 |
| czr | pseudocode preferred. | 23:38 |
| alterego | Why not? | 23:38 |
| czr | I don't read ruby. | 23:38 |
| alterego | It'll be easy to read don't worry ;) | 23:38 |
| czr | oh, ok then. | 23:38 |
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| alterego | Hmm .. | 23:39 |
| timeless | sp3000: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2238 | 23:40 |
| alterego | I need something that'll become full. So I'm immitating it with a "max_size" variable. | 23:40 |
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| timeless | sp3000, should i reopen https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2136 or file a new bug? :) | 23:41 |
| czr | alterego, np, I'll go out for a smoke, brb. | 23:41 |
| timeless | https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2239 | 23:43 |
| sp3000 | do you have a first name? | 23:45 |
| sp3000 | oh, they're both required fields, meh | 23:46 |
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| timeless | it's stupid | 23:48 |
| timeless | the right fix is to make them not required fields | 23:48 |
| timeless | but instead, they wallpapered over the problem in one of N places | 23:48 |
| alterego | czr, http://pastie.caboo.se/115634 | 23:48 |
| timeless | otoh, i feel right at home | 23:48 |
| timeless | a browser engineer would have done the same thing :) | 23:48 |
| timeless | I think this is what's called "problem based requirement design" | 23:48 |
| alterego | czr, that's one approach to what I think you're talking about ;) | 23:48 |
| * czr looks | 23:49 | |
| milhouse | timeless - got a bugzilla question | 23:49 |
| timeless | n.b. in this context "engineers" and "browser engineers" are people working for Nokia | 23:49 |
| milhouse | Am seeing posts such as "*** This bug has been confirmed by popular vote. ***" | 23:49 |
| timeless | and should not be confused with Mozilla engineers or Gecko engineers | 23:49 |
| alterego | czr, it should be pretty self explanatory. | 23:49 |
| timeless | milhouse: ok... | 23:49 |
| czr | alterego, what is |var| ? | 23:49 |
| alterego | They're parameters to the block. | 23:49 |
| milhouse | apparently it's due to a bugzilla setting and appears whenever someone votes for a bug... i personally find it freaking annoying | 23:49 |
| sp3000 | milhouse: generally that means the reporter voted for it | 23:50 |
| alterego | Just like: func(var, var, var); as a prototype in C. They declare the parameter names for use in the block | 23:50 |
| czr | alterego, ah. | 23:50 |
| milhouse | yeah, i thought it was someone being a smartass at first but apparently it's a bugzilla setting | 23:50 |
| timeless | oh man, that's stupid | 23:50 |
| milhouse | someone must have enabled it recently - never used to do that | 23:50 |
| milhouse | and frankly i don't think it adds any value | 23:50 |
| timeless | i enabled it, halfway | 23:50 |
| sp3000 | recently as in months at least | 23:50 |
| timeless | i forced people to file bugs as unconfirmed | 23:51 |
| milhouse | maybe - i've just noticed it then! :) | 23:51 |
| timeless | but i didn't set a useful threshold | 23:51 |
| czr | alterego, generator do |buffer| = ? | 23:51 |
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| alterego | czr, So the bottom bit. That calls the 'generator' method supplying itself as a block. Which is then called at the end of each loop with a buffer full of num's. | 23:51 |
| alterego | yield calls the do ... end stuff from within the generator method. | 23:51 |
| timeless | https://bugs.maemo.org/buglist.cgi?query_format=advanced&long_desc_type=substring&long_desc=has+been+confirmed | 23:52 |
| timeless | there are only 15 such bugs | 23:52 |
| milhouse | yeah | 23:52 |
| timeless | ok, so an explanation | 23:52 |
| timeless | 1. i don't want people who don't know what they're doing filing bad bugs | 23:52 |
| timeless | 2. see 1 | 23:52 |
| milhouse | and a lot of them for the same guy - john rudd - hence my initial thought someone was being a smart ass | 23:52 |
| czr | alterego, "supplying itself as a block"? | 23:52 |
| milhouse | check bug 2087 for instance | 23:52 |
| _Monkey | Bug 2087 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2087 | 23:52 |
| milhouse | oops, bug 2097 | 23:53 |
| _Monkey | Bug 2097 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2097 | 23:53 |
| alterego | czr, it's quite a simple concept but I'm a retard when it comes to explaining things. When you call a method in Ruby. You may also supply a complimentary block. That block can be invoked using 'yield' or stored in a variable. | 23:53 |
| timeless | 3. the best way to do that is to force people who don't know what they're doing not to file bad bugs is to force them not to have canconfirm | 23:53 |
| czr | bleh. I think I see what you mean though. that's a generator in python. not the thingy I'm really looking for. | 23:53 |
| timeless | 4. maemo uses voting, which is fine (20 votes per person per product, 1 vote per bug) | 23:53 |
| alterego | czr, it's sort of syntactic sugar for supplying an anonymous function. | 23:53 |
| timeless | 5. the default votes to confirm is 1 (which is stupid, it should be 2, sp3000 or i could file a bug upstream) | 23:53 |
| czr | alterego, ah, anonymous function then ;-) | 23:54 |
| timeless | now, the first bug you showed had 3 votes | 23:54 |
| timeless | my first reaction to complaints would have been to set the value to 3 | 23:54 |
| timeless | but that wouldn't have helped here | 23:54 |
| timeless | so the follow on question is how many votes should it take | 23:54 |
| milhouse | timeless - re 5, could you? it would be better if the threshold was higher, having it set at 1 is nuts | 23:54 |
| czr | alterego, suppose you have some method in some object that will be called from 'generator' and it cannot return immediately. if it yields (internally), what will happen? | 23:55 |
| timeless | yeah, i cna change it, but i need to pick a number | 23:55 |
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| timeless | is 5 a better number? | 23:55 |
| sp3000 | stats? | 23:55 |
| alterego | czr, nothing. Unless generator supplies a block to that method. | 23:55 |
| milhouse | yeah i didn't mean 2087 - i meant 2097, it has only one vote and one comment... | 23:55 |
| milhouse | timeless - 4 or 5 sounds ok to me | 23:56 |
| milhouse | go with 5 | 23:56 |
| milhouse | :) | 23:56 |
| timeless | oddly, jake voted for 1458 and then removed the vote | 23:56 |
| timeless | so he gamed voting | 23:56 |
| czr | alterego, ok. I'm looking for an "effortless" way to suspent the execution of some function/method call chain. until data is available to the method at the bottom level and it can continue. | 23:56 |
| sp3000 | heh | 23:56 |
| czr | alterego, hence, continuations looked much more fit for that use. | 23:56 |
| alterego | czr, ah. | 23:57 |
| timeless | jake kinda sorta *owns* bugzilla | 23:57 |
| milhouse | timeless - i think even 3 would be ok to be honest | 23:57 |
| sp3000 | 5+ is 54 bugs apparently | 23:57 |
| timeless | i'm thinking 3 | 23:57 |
| alterego | czr, asynchronously? | 23:57 |
| czr | alterego, of course :-) | 23:57 |
| timeless | sp3000: oh, interesting point | 23:57 |
| alterego | czr, not entirely sure it's possible without threads :) | 23:57 |
| czr | alterego, but nevermind, don't break your head thinking about it. I have an engine that does this using C and micro-contexts. very similar to how erlang does its magic, but much faster. | 23:58 |
| timeless | sp3000: please remind me to find an engineer working on bug 2053 | 23:58 |
| _Monkey | Bug 2053 might be found at https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2053 | 23:58 |
| timeless | they need to be yelled at | 23:58 |
| czr | theres some asm involved, standard C doesn't allow interesting stuff. | 23:58 |
| alterego | czr, sounds neat :) Why do you get all the interesting stuff ;) | 23:58 |
| czr | alterego, I'm weird enough? it's not work related though. not directly at least. | 23:58 |
| sp3000 | https://bugs.maemo.org/report.cgi?y_axis_field=votes&format=table&action=wrap | 23:59 |
| alterego | Ah | 23:59 |
| timeless | i'm leaning to 3 | 23:59 |
| czr | alterego, I get >5M context switches from cold cache situation on a 2GHz P4 (random ones) | 23:59 |
| czr | although it's slightly unfair as each coroutine doesn't actually do anything. | 23:59 |
| alterego | Heh | 23:59 |
| czr | >20M with hot-caches. | 23:59 |
| timeless | yeah, john rudd is gaming the system | 23:59 |
| czr | per second that is. | 23:59 |
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