IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2007-11-07

p\|	\|R: too much expensive for me i think...	00:00
sp3000	unit42: bug 2226 if yoyu find one and want to dup	00:00
sp3000	you even	00:00
\|R	http://www.powerenz.com/store/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=28 <- i really want a guerilla setup like this :D	00:00
GeneralAntilles	Just buy yourself the fastest 8gb you can find on newegg.	00:00
\|\|cw	how fast is hte n800 controler? the 770 rs-mmc is pretty slow	00:01
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p\|	as i have read on ITT, is better for the battery life, to have relative small SD always inserted	00:02
p\|	and the big one , on the external slot when needed	00:02
GeneralAntilles	Not sure what they're thinking with that.	00:02
p\|	so i think to buy an ultrafast 2gb for internal slot	00:02
alterego	Who said that?	00:03
GeneralAntilles	Just get yourself a pair of 8GB cards	00:03
alterego	That's nonsense ..	00:03
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GeneralAntilles	ITT is full of idiots.	00:03
alterego	Unless they're talking about speed.	00:03
GeneralAntilles	So take anything you hear on there with a huge grain of salt.	00:03
\|R	i know that on the iAudio D2 mp3 player, you had 50h of battery, and 25h with the SD used to read mp3...	00:03
\|R	but you're not reading them all the time on an n800	00:03
alterego	Fast cards for swap may drain battery life quicker if swap is being used lots ..	00:03
timeless	sp3000 you mentioned lowmem signal stuff, can you find that for me? :)	00:04
sp3000	if you have a massive amount of directory entries I suppose that could use some time with metalayer-crawler, but, that's content not capacity	00:04
p\|	ha ok	00:05
p\|	so there isn't relationship with size ?	00:05
GeneralAntilles	Not a meaningful one.	00:06
sp3000	I hear various cards use $random amout of power or something but that's all I know, dunno about correlation with size nor whether it's any sort of signifigant	00:06
alterego	Nice.	00:06
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p\|	ok	00:07
* alterego yawns		00:07
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sp3000	timeless: well, the mozilla keyword is memory-pressure	00:07
timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/search?string=memory-pressure&find=%2Fbrowser%2Fmozilla%2Ftrunk%2Fmicrob-engine%2Fmicrob-engine%2Fdebian%2Fpatches%2F&findi=&filter=&hitlimit=&tree=garage	00:08
sp3000	the arg nothing in mozilla cares about that I noticed	00:08
timeless	no hits	00:08
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sp3000	eal	00:11
sp3000	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/search?find=%2Fbrowser%2F&string=memory-pressure	00:11
sp3000	note the amusing obfuscation of h\0e\0a\0p\0-\0m\0i\0n\0i\0m\0i\0z\0e\0\0	00:11
alterego	Weird.	00:12
Jaffa	UTF-16, perhaps?	00:14
sp3000	sure, but it's /great/ for searches	00:14
timeless	ucs2/uf16, whicever	00:14
timeless	but yeah, what sp3000 said	00:14
timeless	it's murder on searching	00:14
Jaffa	Ah, indeed. Advantage of having a language/compiler which supports UTF-8 in source code (Java, Perl etc.)	00:15
timeless	mxr doesn't compile code	00:15
timeless	which is a good thing, since most of the code it meets won't compile	00:15
timeless	heck, the code in our case tends to be in the form of patches, not even code	00:16
timeless	which makes things even more fun	00:16
* timeless curses debian		00:16
sp3000	a stack of patches is also awesome for understanding how a piece of core works	00:16
Jaffa	Indeed, but if the C compiler/libraries/language supported non US-ASCII source files, that string wouldn't be UTF-16/UCS2, and the source would be nice and searchable.	00:16
timeless	sp3000: no kidding	00:16
timeless	what's more fun is having a set of decks of patches	00:17
timeless	and no idea which cards are actuallly in play	00:17
sp3000	s/core/code/	00:17
infobot	sp3000 meant: a stack of patches is also awesome for understanding how a piece of code works	00:17
timeless	jaffa: um, i don't see how that follows	00:17
timeless	it'd be just as painful for mxr as it is today	00:18
timeless	it'd just have null bytes all over	00:18
sp3000	timeless: hmm, we have indexed patches which are not applied?	00:18
sp3000	of coures, that's a silly question, aa one patch can revert parts of another	00:18
timeless	sp3000: for svn repos i can't possibly know how to apply patches	00:18
timeless	and i don't even bother	00:18
timeless	for the sardine style things, um, "i hink i ry, but i almost certainly fails miserably for browser"	00:19
sp3000	+t+t	00:19
Jaffa	timeless: I'm not explaining myself well (which, TBH, I can't be arsed to do cos I'm about to go to bed); but my point is along the lines of: this is attempting to do modern, multi-byte strings with C/glib. Neither of which are particularly well designed for it. A language which separates bytes and strings (such as Java or Perl) doesn't have these problems when searching, as the tooling is UTF-8 from one end to the other (including mxr equivalents)	00:19
sp3000	have you checked for breadcrumbs? :) those weremurder for my last keyboard over tme ;)	00:19
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timeless	in mozilla, we have macros that protect the source from being unreadable	00:22
timeless	and still alolow multibyte encodings	00:22
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sp3000	the question is, are they stealable?	00:22
timeless	yes, this is basically a glib bug	00:22
timeless	dunno	00:22
timeless	i'm trying to find our pkcs gateway	00:23
alterego	Anyone know why my windows aren't grouped in the task navigator?	00:23
* alterego wonders if it's because he's not registered with OSSO.		00:23
timeless	there's a bug that has a standard suggestion for why	00:24
* timeless can't remember which bug tracker it's in		00:24
timeless	iirc eero filed it	00:24
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sp3000	there's nothing on 'group' in summary on b.maemo.o, so, meh	00:25
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alterego	:/	00:25
alterego	Oh well.	00:25
* alterego showers.		00:25
timeless	i think eero tried to get me to file it	00:25
sp3000	timeless: xfer mgr! bug 1995	00:26
* sp3000 only looked at that b/c of the typo		00:27
timeless	that's a browser bug	00:27
sp3000	or that	00:28
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* timeless grumbles		00:28
timeless	i know there's some code /somewhere/ to read from cs	00:29
timeless	where is it?	00:29
sp3000	counterstrike?	00:29
timeless	curssed storage trash	00:29
* sp3000 doesn't see anything interesting in 'window' for grouping so I guess it's not in this bugzill		00:30
sp3000	a	00:30
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timeless	Unable to switch to Home or another application from a fullscreen application which has not set its WM_CLASS correctly	00:31
sp3000	sounds painful	00:32
timeless	> Yes, it's a "bug" in the application, but only Gtk applications	00:32
timeless	> add WM_CLASS automatically AND it's not documented anywhere	00:32
timeless	> (in Maemo) that WM_CLASS is needed. If you require something	00:32
timeless	> from applications, at least you should document that requirement.	00:32
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timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/browser/mozilla/trunk/microb-eal/src/gmozillaweb.c	00:34
timeless	that's the evil cst file	00:34
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timeless	#1560	00:35
* timeless grumbles		00:35
sp3000	also, I didn't figure out how to smuggle -DFORCE_PR_LOG into a debian build that unpacks a tarball and molests it, not quite today anyway :\	00:35
timeless	garage's xref can't get as many identifiers	00:35
sp3000	maybe micromanaging the deb build steps will help me	00:36
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p\|	what's the difference between an SD class 6 and a Sandisk Extreme III ? (apart from price ;))	00:36
timeless	if you find a way to get a patched source world via micromanageing debs, let me know	00:37
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GeneralAntilles	SanDisk is way ovepriced, p\|.	00:37
p\|	hum	00:38
sp3000	timeless: hmm, am I blind or is there no functional difference between lines 1572 and 1574	00:38
p\|	16gb patriot class6 ? gh (176$!!!)	00:38
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timeless	heh	00:39
GeneralAntilles	Where are you shopping, p\|?	00:40
GeneralAntilles	Nemegg has it for $139	00:41
p\|	ebay :)	00:41
timeless	expains this	00:41
timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/search?find=%2Fbrowser%2Fmozilla%2Ftrunk%2Fmicrob-engine%2Fmicrob-engine%2Fdebian%2Fpatches%2F&string=EmbedCertificates.cpp	00:41
timeless	that's clearly patching a file, right?	00:41
timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/find?string=EmbedCertificates.cpp	00:41
timeless	why can't i find that file?	00:41
ds3	where can I find the kernel .config's for the shipped kernel on OS2006? found the sources here http://hsivonen.iki.fi/maemo-src/	00:41
timeless	pj fscl	00:41
timeless	curses	00:41
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sp3000	ds3: I think it says at the top of that page?	00:42
ds3	sp3000: it just says source	00:42
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sp3000	oh, .config	00:43
ds3	I want the config so I can compile modules	00:43
ds3	want iso9660 support ;)	00:43
sp3000	o_O	00:44
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ds3	got the host mode working and a USB CDROM around so...	00:44
Jaffa	oooh	00:44
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ds3	if I can get the .config, I can add a iso9660 module	00:44
Jaffa	ds3: look at fanoush's website? He's recompiled the kernel and compiled modules; bound to have the .config there somewhere	00:45
sp3000	heh	00:45
sp3000	try a list I guess	00:45
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timeless	so3000: dates back to 15 ...	00:45
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ds3	hmmm looks like n770_def is suppose to work; guess I'll try that and see if insmod is happy	00:47
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timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/garage/source/browser/mozilla/trunk/microb-engine/microb-engine/debian/patches/175_MICROB_bad_cert_at_once_lp0.diff	00:48
timeless	that one's fun	00:48
* timeless curses		00:49
timeless	gah	00:49
* sp3000 is amused by the whitespace fix in chunk#1		00:51
ds3	is it just me or does microb take up considerably more memory then the stock opera engine?	00:51
sp3000	sounds likely	00:51
sp3000	but it's also several times more awesome!	00:52
ds3	it is nice that google maps works but it really sucks to have things all crash when I open up too many apps (this is on a 770 so memory is tight to start with)	00:52
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sp3000	swap?	00:54
ds3	swap to what?	00:55
doublec	create a swap file?	00:55
ds3	i rather not wear out the rs-mmc	00:55
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* sp3000 wonders if anyone sells those anymore :\		00:57
ds3	=)	00:57
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alterego	Has anyone actually worn out a memory card here?	01:15
alterego	I've had some inexplicably stop working.	01:15
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p\|	'night to all	01:27
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ds3	I've destoryed some old SM cards but that's pretty much raw nand	01:29
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\|R	anyone know if there is a public bomberman server? :P	01:32
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zerojay	alterego: Got an e-mail address I can reach you at?	02:06
alterego	t-swindell at msn.com	02:07
zerojay	k, I'll send you an e-mail sometime tomorrow outlining the setup wizard app we talked about a few days ago, if you're still interested.	02:08
alterego	Sure	02:08
zerojay	I'm working on the video center stuff right now.	02:09
alterego	Nice.	02:10
alterego	I'm just rewriting the GUI for my Task/Todo list application.	02:10
alterego	Then I'll release it tomorrow.	02:10
zerojay	Cool.	02:10
alterego	Yeah, I'm pretty proud of it. And it is a good example of how to create ruby programs for maemo :)	02:11
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zerojay	http://www.jablet.net/videocenter/test.php - Looking to set up something where users can contribute links, tested by admins to see if they work on the tablets before added... RSS feed can tell people that new shows were added to the database which they can add to video center directly from the RSS reader. :)	02:11
zerojay	Oh.. er.. top link won't work.. alternate audio feed should.	02:12
zerojay	Missed something. ;)	02:12
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alterego	Nice.	02:13
zerojay	There, fixed.	02:13
zerojay	Clicking on the links on the tablet launches video center directly.	02:14
alterego	Nice	02:14
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sciboy	Wow my app manager is broken	02:24
alterego	How badly?	02:26
sciboy	I'm stuck using dpkg and apt-get because it doesn't like something i have installed.	02:28
sciboy	Can't install anything new through it	02:28
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\|R	sciboy : are you sure it's just not a question of repository settings?	02:41
\|R	if one of them(like my tableteer) doesn't work with it's gpg key, it may stop i think	02:41
\|R	Or some other reasons... haven't really invastigated	02:41
sciboy	the key issues never prevented it before.	02:43
GeneralAntilles	What's the log/error?	02:44
sciboy	Can't be bothered right now, i'm just ignoring it	02:45
GeneralAntilles	Then why bring it up? :P	02:46
GeneralAntilles	Why is it that ITT is filled with loonies?	02:47
sciboy	Because i can.	02:47
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GeneralAntilles	Ha. New rule, if you don't want help, please make a note of it: <GeneralAntilles> My x wont work. (I don't want help)	02:49
GeneralAntilles	:P	02:49
* sciboy counts the seconds waiting for 2008		02:51
\|R	hehe	02:54
\|R	GeneralAntilles : what kind of loonies? :)	02:54
GeneralAntilles	All sorts	02:55
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GeneralAntilles	and they're dragging my down with them.	02:55
GeneralAntilles	See, I can't even type right.	02:56
GeneralAntilles	*me	02:56
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* sciboy switches to Jabber exclusively.		03:00
sciboy	It's still called jabber right?	03:00
\|R	uh yes :)	03:01
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* sciboy hugs blender.		03:05
* zerojay hugs Jabber.		03:06
* GeneralAntilles pokes the technophiles with a sharpened stick.		03:06
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* sciboy dies after being speared.		03:08
\|R	GeneralAntilles screams: Thiiiisss isssssss #### MAEEMOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!	03:09
* \|R ducks and covers		03:09
\|R	hehe	03:09
* GeneralAntilles kicks \|R into the well.		03:10
sciboy	If we could get blenders game engine on maemo I could do a whole bunch of awesome	03:10
\|R	hehe a vertical space shooter would be cool, with crazy options and massive weapons ;)	03:11
GeneralAntilles	and a time machine!	03:12
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\|R	the game where you shoot cats?	03:12
\|R	oh no wait, that's the incredible machine ;)	03:12
GeneralAntilles	Actually, I really want the N800 to be a Rube Goldberg machine.	03:13
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deejoe	please stay away from my n800, GeneralAntilles. thank you.	03:15
sciboy	Needs more jigawatts.	03:17
sciboy	GeneralAntilles, They did alot of that stuff in the bullet physics competition using blender.	03:18
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Lateralus	1.21	03:25
sciboy	Woo chinook.	03:27
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javamaniac	is chinook available for n800 right now?	03:38
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* timeless cries		03:45
timeless	could someone help me?	03:45
timeless	apt-cache is being annoying	03:45
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TPC	timeless, you you be more specific?	03:46
sciboy	I require podcast entertainment.	03:46
timeless	timeless@nexenta:~$ apt-cache -c /home/timeless/apt-sb-e.conf search .	03:47
timeless	Segmentation Fault (core dumped)	03:47
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TPC	hm.. thats not good	03:47
timeless	http://pastebin.mozilla.org/237465	03:51
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lcdd	timeless: http://bugs.debian.org/81829 perhaps?	03:53
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fletc900	Hello	04:11
fletc900	Any Python programmers around?	04:12
fletc900	Anyone?	04:13
GeneralAntilles	#python?	04:13
fletc900	yes	04:14
Mikho	probably some people around who know python	04:15
fletc900	I am wondering what kind of scientific Python libraries have been ported to Maemo (matplolib, numpyt, etc)....anyone have a clue?	04:16
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skibur_	are the applications on OS2008 tested? If so, is OS2008 out?	07:20
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timeless	it's not yet out	07:43
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nitrogen	I'm having difficulty getting the maemo development environment set up for my N770. Has anybody in here had success with that who could offer some suggestions?	07:46
timeless	find a vmware image	07:46
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nitrogen	timeless: is it that difficult to get things going on, say, ubuntu using scratchbox?	07:50
nitrogen	I have an environment set up, but the UI doesn't behave correctly in xephyr	07:51
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czr	nitrogen, which sdk, which ubuntu?	07:56
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nitrogen	czr: 2.2, I've tried ubuntu 7.04 and 7.10	07:56
czr	hmm. that's odd. are you starting xephyr with the correct parameters? or can you describe the issues that you're having?	07:57
nitrogen	the exact filename is Maemo_Dev_Platform_v2.2_i386-rootstrap.tgz	07:57
czr	(there's a problem with dapper xephyr with 4.0beta sdk, because of 4.0beta wants to use composite, which the dapper xephyer doesn't know how to do properly, but this shouldn't be an issue for you at all)	07:57
nitrogen	well, the people icon is missing, the left border of the hildon screen has some white rectangles where they shouldn't be, and second-level menus cause the entire menu to close	07:58
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czr	hmm	07:58
czr	the last one sounds like the timing bug from 1.0 sdk	07:58
czr	never used 2.2 myself	07:59
nitrogen	i.e. I can open the first menu, but when I try to go to "Applications" or "Web" or whatever the menu closes instead	07:59
czr	because the sdk doesn't come with web or applications?	07:59
czr	the sdk is only meant to build software	07:59
nitrogen	I bought the 770 when they went on sale exclusively so I could develop for it -- is there a better working version?	07:59
czr	you can develop with the sdk	07:59
czr	it's not an emulator	08:00
czr	it's meant to build and test _your_ software	08:00
nitrogen	I know, but according to the tutorial on maemo.org the UI should at least be complete	08:00
czr	hmm, can you make a screenshot of your xephyr now?	08:00
nitrogen	sure	08:00
czr	and put it up somewhere.	08:00
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nitrogen	see http://www.slimetech.com/~nitrogen/maemo_problem_1.png	08:04
nitrogen	vs. http://maemo.org/forrest-images/maemo_tutorial/Graphic6.png	08:05
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* czr takes a peek		08:17
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czr	hmm. never quite seen that before :-)	08:18
czr	have you tried stopping and restarting the af?	08:18
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nitrogen	czr: af-sb-init.sh stop/start ?	08:21
tigert	huomenta \| morning :)	08:21
tigert	random mobility tip of the day: about:config in the mozilla browser,	08:22
tigert	and set	08:22
nitrogen	czr: many times. Could it be my version of scratchbox? (1.0.7)	08:22
tigert	font.min-size.variable.x-western to 16	08:22
tigert	much easier to read the web while walking :)	08:22
tigert	and it still doesnt break layouts too much	08:23
czr	nitrogen, yes (for the former)	08:24
czr	you should check the install doc of the 2.2 sdk to see which version of SB should be used.	08:24
czr	as I said, I never used 2.2	08:24
nitrogen	czr: restarting the interface does nothing to fix the problem - I've tried this on and off for months	08:26
nitrogen	but I've never tried moving to an older version of scratchbox	08:26
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czr	maybe you should hang around and ask someone else who used 2.2. never quite seen that kind of screen	08:27
nitrogen	hm.. I'm using the version recommended on the tutorial, but the instructions in the tutorial don't match that version.	08:28
nitrogen	thanks for your help anyway	08:28
czr	np, good luck	08:30
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L0cutus	re	09:23
L0cutus	gpe calendar have view problem when i try to set an appointment 'weekly'	09:23
L0cutus	it doesn't show all the day i can check	09:24
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omeam	Hi #maemo	10:36
omeam	Is there a gconf-key-reference for the n800 anywhere?	10:37
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florian	good morning	11:16
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omeam	florian: mornin'	11:16
L0cutus	ciao florian	11:17
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omeam	sorry for double'post' - is there a gconf-key-reference for the n800 anywhere?	11:25
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inz	omeam, try gconftooling the keys	11:33
omeam	inz: i would need a reference wich tellst me wich key does what...	11:35
inz	omeam, try reading the schema xml files then, they should have some kind of explanation	11:37
inz	omeam, they're in /etc/gconf/schemas or /usr/share/gconf/schemas	11:38
omeam	where do i find the schemes?	11:38
zuh	Try http://maemo.org/downloads/product/gconf-editor	11:38
omeam	/etc/gconf/schemes??	11:38
omeam	zuh: ty	11:38
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inz	oh yeah, gconf-editor does show the descriptions	11:39
AD-N770	bon dia / good morning	11:39
bedboi	bon dia	11:47
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flip^	I read somewhere about a recent update to theme maker, but can't see anything more recent than june 07.... am i going crazy?	12:11
Jaffa	Morning, all	12:13
L0cutus	does exists 'tailf' for n800 ?	12:29
flip^	as in tail -f	12:31
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L0cutus	woops	12:34
L0cutus	thanks	12:34
flip^	:)	12:36
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rothiel	Hi all :°)	12:37
omeam	dumb question... is there a way to determine the current maemo-version in the scratchbox	12:38
omeam	something like 'uname --maemo'	12:38
inz	why do you want to?	12:41
disq	cat /etc/osso_software_version	12:41
inz	disq, doesn't always work	12:41
disq	earlier os2006 firmwares don't have it tho	12:41
inz	disq, my "mistral" says: "custom_27"	12:42
inz	disq, and my bora target doesn't have it at all	12:42
disq	that's your mistral's problem :P	12:42
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keesj	hmm in scratchbox. perhaps listing the installed packages. I guess that the best thing is to give the targets good names in order for "sb-conf cu" to give a meaningfull result	12:52
keesj	to what packages does /etc/osso_software_version belong :P	12:55
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czr	dpkg -S /etc/osso_software_version ?	12:58
czr	yields nothing?	12:58
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L0cutus	lol: http://n800.gotdns.org:8080/	13:09
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lardman	morning	13:28
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czr	hey lardman	13:36
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lardman	hi czr	13:51
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* zerojay puts L0cutus's site on Digg. :)		13:57
* zerojay watches battery take a nosedive.		13:57
Jaffa	zerojay: Put it on Slashdot and we could watch it physically melt.	13:58
zerojay	This 3rd party repository for video center feeds was such a good idea.	14:00
zerojay	Everything's a one click install.	14:00
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L0cutus	zerojay: lol	14:07
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alterego	Good afternoon guys and girls.	14:12
zerojay	yo.	14:12
zerojay	Time for me to head to work.	14:13
zerojay	Later.	14:13
alterego	See you	14:13
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L0cutus	ciao alterego	14:14
alterego	Hello L0cutus	14:14
alterego	I'll be releasing my first application to day :)	14:15
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czr	hey alterego. time to throw it out of the window finally?	14:16
alterego	My task list app yeah.	14:16
czr	is it easy to install?	14:16
alterego	Provided you have ruby to install.	14:16
alterego	It's just one package.	14:16
alterego	ruby installed ..	14:17
czr	I have stock N800 with IT2007.	14:17
alterego	Then you'll need libruby, ruby and rx-task	14:17
czr	and where can I easily get those from?	14:17
alterego	http://maemo.rubyx.co.uk/ruby-maemo/CURRENT/maemo3	14:17
alterego	http://maemo.rubyx.co.uk/ruby-maemo/CURRENT/maemo3/armel	14:17
alterego	:)	14:17
alterego	Though I've not packaged rx-task yet.	14:18
alterego	Just doing some polishing of the UI	14:18
czr	hmm. if the whole thing will install from one .install file, I'll take it for a spin :-)	14:18
czr	too lazy otherwise :-)	14:18
alterego	I'll look into it.	14:18
czr	if you're announcing it, you might want to add the above points into the mail as well, if you want people to test it.	14:19
czr	not everybody loves ruby to death ;-)	14:19
alterego	:)	14:19
alterego	I'm sure that will all change soon enough :P	14:22
czr	well, if it would be as easy as clicking on the install file on the device to get everything necessary, it could change.	14:23
alterego	Well, I'd love it to be that simple.	14:23
czr	I know :-)	14:24
L0cutus	[13:16] <alterego> Provided you have ruby to install.	14:24
L0cutus	yes i've it already instaleld :)	14:25
L0cutus	installed*	14:25
alterego	Nice one L0cutus you can be my first tester then :P	14:25
L0cutus	lol	14:25
alterego	It wont be released for a few hours yet though.	14:26
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* czr is having fun implementing recursive dynamic state machines		14:39
alterego	That sounds like fun.	14:39
alterego	What for?	14:39
czr	heh. don't ask. over-designing stuff again ;-)	14:39
* alterego is all about recursion.		14:39
alterego	Yeah, don't talk to be about over designing stuff.	14:39
czr	at least I'm not implementing recursive generators/iterators this time	14:39
alterego	I've abstracted this app so much even the app title is in gconf ..	14:40
czr	that was really fun	14:40
czr	heh	14:40
czr	can you modify the apptitle in-flight?	14:40
czr	using gconftool-2 --set ?	14:40
alterego	No	14:40
czr	arr, you haven't over-designed it nearly enough then!	14:40
alterego	Other configuration options can be.	14:40
alterego	But not the app title.	14:41
timeless	sp3000: ping	14:42
sp3000	?	14:42
timeless	timeless@nexenta:~$ cat extras.sources.list	14:43
timeless	deb http://repository.maemo.org/ chinook free non-free	14:43
timeless	deb-src http://repository.maemo.org/ chinook free non-free	14:43
timeless	timeless@nexenta:~$ apt-get -c /home/timeless/apt-sb-e.conf source libmissioncontrol0	14:43
timeless	Get:1 http://repository.maemo.org chinook/free telepathy-mission-control 4.38-1 (dsc) [572B]	14:43
timeless	....	14:43
timeless	rm ...	14:43
timeless	timeless@nexenta:~$ apt-get -c /home/timeless/apt-sb-e.conf source --only-source libmissioncontrol0	14:43
timeless	E: Unable to find a source package for libmissioncontrol0	14:43
timeless	why is that failing? :(	14:45
czr	alterego, a simple recursive if/then/elif/elifnot/ifnot/endif parser/processor really :-)	14:45
czr	scratch the 'then'.	14:46
alterego	Heh	14:46
timeless	alternatively, how do i get a list of source packages?	14:46
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sp3000	timeless: libmissioncontrol0_4.33-1_i386.deb/control.tar.gz/control: Source: telepathy-mission-control	14:47
sp3000	I don't quite recall if it's supposed to do that for you or not	14:47
timeless	yeah, but how do you find that using commands?	14:47
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timeless	showsrc?	14:48
timeless	timeless@nexenta:~$ apt-cache -c /home/timeless/apt-sb-e.conf showsrc libmissioncontrol0\|wc -l	14:49
timeless	0	14:49
sp3000	there's a showsrc command?	14:49
timeless	doesn't seem to do anything	14:49
* sp3000 gets an error		14:50
timeless	man lists i...	14:50
timeless	apt-cache show seems to include a source: line	14:50
timeless	i suppose i can go send everything through tha	14:50
timeless	this is going to be so much fun	14:50
sp3000	yeah, that would be it pretty much	14:51
czr	btw, any idea on why pkg-config --list-all doesn't list all the packages in 4.0beta?	14:51
czr	(the packages/pc-files work when used with --cflags and --libs, but just not listed in the list)	14:51
timeless	timeless@nexenta:~$ apt-cache -c /home/timeless/apt-sb-e.conf show telepathy-feed	14:52
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timeless	i don't see a source: line here	14:52
timeless	what's that mean?	14:52
sp3000	that the src pkg name is the same	14:52
timeless	oh man	14:52
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timeless	this is going to be so much fun	14:52
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rothiel	re	14:55
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omeam	is anyone of you familiar with the soundsystem on the n800?	15:03
omeam	it isn't 'reak' alsa - afaik	15:03
omeam	s/reak/real/g	15:03
infobot	omeam meant: it isn't 'real' alsa - afaik	15:03
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timeless	ok, i'll deal w/ trying to figure out how to handle show later	15:06
timeless	for now, i'll have a chinook something in an hour	15:06
timeless	heh	15:11
timeless	Login name: timeless	15:11
timeless	Directory: /export/home/timeless Shell: /bin/zsh	15:11
timeless	On since Jul 13 18:34:17 on pts/35 from swift-centos	15:11
timeless	82 days Idle Time	15:11
alterego	Heh	15:11
timeless	Login name: timeless	15:11
timeless	Directory: /export/home/timeless Shell: /bin/zsh	15:11
timeless	On since Jul 12 18:17:29 on pts/39 from swift-centos	15:11
timeless	117 days Idle Time	15:11
* timeless wonders where in the world these terminals are :)		15:12
erstazi	timeless: dpkg --get-selections	15:12
erstazi	that will be a huge list	15:12
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timeless	get-selections?	15:12
omeam	do you have a clue about the soundsystem on the n800?	15:12
erstazi	timeless: thats the debian way, I am not sure about the OS200X way	15:12
omeam	how can i control the volume when i stripped the gconf away	15:13
timeless	i'm in nexenta, not maemo	15:13
erstazi	timeless: dpkg --get-selections \| grep foo	15:13
omeam	i stripped nearly everything off....	15:13
erstazi	timeless: is nexenta debian based?	15:13
timeless	yes	15:13
erstazi	then dpkg --get-selections \| grep foo should work technically	15:13
timeless	what would it do?	15:14
erstazi	list the installed packages	15:14
timeless	who said anything about installed pacakges?	15:14
erstazi	um... based off what you were looking for	15:14
erstazi	nm	15:14
timeless	nexenta is performing operations on a maemo (chinook in this case) repository and trying to retrieve sources	15:14
timeless	there's no installing :)	15:14
timeless	installing maemo (linux/arm) onto nexenta (solaris/x86_64) would be a wee bit of a disaster :)	15:15
erstazi	timeless: then what exactly are you doing? I see you are using apt-cache	15:15
erstazi	are you looking for dependencies?	15:15
timeless	building http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/sardine-20071025/source/	15:16
timeless	for chinook	15:16
erstazi	aye	15:16
timeless	i try to grab all sources	15:16
timeless	so i don't really care about dependencies	15:16
erstazi	ok	15:16
timeless	although i don't want more than one version per package	15:16
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erstazi	right, automake has 3 different versions present	15:17
timeless	if i sanitize the script, i can stick a copy up	15:17
timeless	yeah, they're technically 3 different packages	15:17
timeless	the versions being 1.7.8/1.8.5/p6	15:17
erstazi	right	15:17
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timeless	that's fine/expected	15:18
timeless	i just don't want automake1.8 1.8.0,1.8.1,1.8.2,1.8.3,...	15:18
erstazi	right	15:18
timeless	the goal is to provide a usable cross reference	15:18
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erstazi	nexenta seems very active	15:19
* timeless sdhrugs		15:21
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timeless	ok, i got my chinook sources	15:30
timeless	looks like ~277 directories (top level)	15:30
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rothiel	Can I code a fullscreen application	15:45
rothiel	or it has to be in a window ?	15:46
rothiel	(please)	15:46
alterego	Making the app fullscreen in Gtk is easy.	15:46
alterego	Just call the 'fullscreen' method on the window you're using.	15:46
alterego	Probably, gtk_window_fullscreen(window, true); in C	15:47
alterego	Or Hildon::Window#fullscreen in Ruby	15:47
Tak	that's exactly what it is @ C	15:48
omeam	when i "dpkg -r --force-all osso-esd" it still plays sound and the volume-app still works as espected... who mixes the sound for the n800 when not esd?	15:51
timeless	sp3000: ok, http://swift/chinook-20071107/source/	15:52
Tak	the underlying audio driver	15:52
timeless	i'll push that to garage as soon as the index builds	15:52
db48x	I think esd just controls sound events	15:52
omeam	Tak: who's that?	15:53
omeam	db48x: but i can still change the volume and it takes affect (for the media player at least)	15:53
db48x	omeam: right, but that's a function of the audio driver, not esd	15:54
omeam	so where is that ominous driver?	15:54
db48x	compiled into the kernel, I bet	15:55
rothiel	thx alterego	15:55
db48x	it's probably an ALSA driver	15:55
omeam	so where is the volume controlled?? i can only find one the entry in the gconf system	15:55
omeam	but it saves the volume somewhere else too	15:56
db48x	what exactly are you trying to do?	15:56
omeam	building a closed system... i need as much free space as possible on the device	15:56
omeam	so the whole osso-stuff gets ripped away...	15:57
omeam	i just need X and SDL	15:57
omeam	and sound	15:57
omeam	right now i have a working 40mb version	15:57
omeam	but i cannot control the volume anymore	15:57
omeam	there are no dbus signals involved with volumecontrol as far as i see	15:58
db48x	I thought you said you could still control the volume?	16:00
omeam	when ripping away esd	16:00
omeam	when i rip: http://pastebin.ca/764688 i cannot control the volume anymore	16:01
db48x	oh, but your minimal system removed too much	16:01
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omeam	db48x: thats the point	16:01
timeless	sp3000: fwiw, the reason apt- was crashing is that i had foopy.sources.list as a symlink to a nonexistent file :)	16:01
omeam	just cee my paste	16:02
sp3000	heh	16:02
db48x	I don't know what package contains the application that has the actual volume control for the user to manipulate, no	16:02
timeless	i guess it didn' approve	16:02
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omeam	db48x: i do not need the app for the gui - i need a possibility to control the volume out of a program/script	16:02
db48x	you could do a binary search over that list to find the package, or you could write your own	16:02
timeless	someday we should trace through apt- and file a bug :\|	16:02
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omeam	timeless: ?	16:02
db48x	I'm sure all it did was use the ALSA api to change the volume level	16:02
timeless	omeam: sp3000+me=we	16:03
omeam	so amixer should do the work?	16:03
omeam	timeless: what bug in apt?	16:03
omeam	s/what/which/g	16:03
infobot	omeam meant: timeless: which bug in apt?	16:03
timeless	oh, it kinda crashes if there's a sources.list pointing to a nonexistent file	16:03
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timeless	at least, it seems to :)	16:03
timeless	giving it a file makes it stop crashing :)	16:03
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omeam	timeless: is the missing file the bug or apt?	16:04
omeam	in a clean repo no files are missing	16:04
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omeam	;)	16:04
omeam	now i have to re-flash my n800 - the 115 time today	16:05
suihkulokki	omeam: err, howabout booting from the mmc instead?	16:06
omeam	gives me what?	16:06
suihkulokki	not needing to flash every time you mess up?	16:06
omeam	s/^/suihkulokki/g	16:06
omeam	suihkulokki: i would not have to reflash but..... ??	16:07
omeam	when i have messed up i have to restore - whatever - the n800 or the mmc - wheres the diff??	16:07
* omeam is stupid - and he knows it!		16:07
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Tak	ugh	16:22
Tak	weekly reboot loop	16:23
keesj	:p	16:23
Tak	time for weekly reflash	16:23
keesj	deja v?	16:25
keesj	vu	16:25
omeam	Tak: time for hourly reflash ;)	16:26
Tak	omeam: yeah, but I'm not modifying the OS on mine	16:26
omeam	Tak: ;)	16:26
Tak	is anybody else having this kind of problem with 2007HE ?	16:27
omeam	?? this kind ??	16:27
Tak	device randomly going into a reboot loop, from which the only salvation is reflashing	16:27
omeam	nvr had that one...	16:28
omeam	...often had it that it kept on rebooting when the progressbar is @~60 -90 percent	16:28
omeam	also had it that the progressbar stopped @ ~75% but ssh server was running	16:29
omeam	but i guess it was my fault most of the time ;)	16:29
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Tak	mine doesn't even display the progress bar	16:30
omeam	that's strange	16:31
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czr	alterego, this is turning out to be more fun that I thought.	16:34
czr	alterego, try to do one when you have the chance :-)	16:34
alterego	czr, good job :)	16:35
czr	smt like cpp directives (more or less), but with nesting	16:35
czr	(cpp has nesting obviously too)	16:35
* alterego shudders		16:35
* czr hugs python		16:35
* alterego sleeps with Ruby :P		16:36
czr	you'll have crazy babies that way	16:36
czr	watch yourself :-)	16:36
alterego	Probably happen anyway ^_^	16:36
alterego	All I need to do is find a girl called Ruby ..	16:36
czr	hmm.	16:36
* czr wonders where all women with names like "Python" hang around.		16:37
czr	probably some biker-club-thingy.	16:37
alterego	Heh	16:37
alterego	Biker, Lesbian club	16:37
omeam	czr: but ruby ensures that the babies will be objects!	16:37
omeam	at leads	16:37
omeam	at least	16:37
alterego	Yes, purely OO family.	16:37
czr	python babies are free to evolve into whatever they need	16:38
alterego	Like Italians	16:38
czr	hope not :-)	16:38
alterego	(joke about spaghetti code)	16:38
alterego	:)	16:38
omeam	lol	16:38
czr	hmm. out of the 250 or so lines, 190 are OO implementation stuff	16:38
omeam	and what are different platforms then?? how do you see the many registers on a arm-baby?	16:38
czr	rest is one function to do the loading and the other is main	16:39
alterego	Ruby has fantastic introspection :)	16:39
omeam	czr: and one is /code should not reach this point - we are fucked!/	16:39
_Monkey	Hmm. No matches for that, omeam.	16:39
czr	omeam, python doesn't support C++ comments ;-)	16:39
czr	and no. just print "UNIMPLEMENTED" things :-)	16:39
* alterego works on the new Table based list view.		16:39
omeam	czr: that may be the reason that my python progs don't compile ;)	16:40
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alterego	Hmm .. Or maybe an actual list would be better.	16:40
czr	that must be it :-)	16:40
alterego	Are you trying to "compile" them with gcc? :)	16:40
czr	also, I never use the f-word in my code. TODO notes yes. CHANGELOG yes. commit logs yes. but not source code :-)	16:40
alterego	Hahah	16:41
omeam	have you ever tried to cd into your kernel-source dir	16:44
omeam	and then find .\|xargs egrep "f..k"	16:44
czr	omeam, google for lxr. much nicer interface ;-)	16:45
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omeam	what is lxr?	16:45
czr	http://lxr.linux.no/source/	16:45
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omeam	i like linux/arch/i386/mm/extable.c line 17	16:47
omeam	extern u32 pnp_bios_is_utter_crap;	16:47
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alterego	Heh	16:48
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czr	well. it is. isn't it :-)	17:04
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omeam	is there something like a documentation for the dspctl tool?	17:20
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lardman	there is source code for it	17:27
lardman	grab it from the dspgateway page, in the arm tarball	17:27
lardman	omeam: why are you interested?	17:28
omeam	maybe i can control the volume via "dspctl setvar xxx"	17:28
lardman	hmm, perhaps, if you could work out what variable to control	17:29
lardman	but iirc there's a fn call which needs to be made too	17:29
omeam	lardman: the alsa on the device is just emulated...	17:30
omeam	so where does the 'real' mixer sit?	17:30
lardman	I'm not sure about that	17:30
lardman	is it possible to play other sounds while the dsp is using the audio codec?	17:31
omeam	lardman: try "cat /proc/asound/oss/sndstat \| grep Sound"	17:31
lardman	no n800 infront of me atm I'm afraid	17:31
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omeam	pastebin.ca/764768	17:32
omeam	emulation code sounds like an emulation to me ;)	17:33
lardman	yeah, but is that in the kernel?	17:34
* alterego curses TreeView		17:34
omeam	i have no idea ;)	17:34
lardman	Is it possible to get things like screen taps out while gstreamer is using the dsp? that would determine whether the mixing happens before the dsp or not	17:34
omeam	lardman: speak with me like if i would have no clue what you are talking about	17:36
omeam	screen tap == screenshot??	17:36
* omeam 's english is bulls**t		17:36
lardman	no no, screen tap, the noise it makes when you tap on the screen	17:36
omeam	you mean if i head clicks while listening to a mp3?	17:37
lardman	yes	17:37
omeam	yes, i hear them	17:37
lardman	interesting	17:37
omeam	but only when i set a low volume inside the media-player	17:37
omeam	otherwise the music is too loud	17:37
omeam	;)	17:37
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lardman	I wouldn't expect that - I assumed the DSP opened the sound hardware for exclusive access	17:38
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lardman	There is also an ARM-side interface in the kernel iirc, you don't have to go through the DSP	17:39
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lardman	therefore I assume the hardware itself does the mixing, though I don't know for sure. See what the spec sheet says	17:39
zoran	how could I contact operator of repository.maemo.org server? it is probably at ossostage.cidercone.com.	17:41
robtaylor	lardman: the dsp is doing the mixing, iirc	17:42
lardman	robtaylor: really, so the standard stuff also goes through the dspsink?	17:43
omeam	lardman: robtaylor: who controls the volume?? afaik the mixer	17:43
robtaylor	lardman: though the alsa emulation, again iirc	17:43
omeam	but when i kill esd i can still control the colume	17:43
omeam	volume	17:43
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robtaylor	my memory on this is pretty fuzzy and things changed between OS's	17:43
omeam	just apt-get sourced the kernel source	17:44
omeam	maybe i can find something there :(	17:44
robtaylor	omeam: probably the best reference point :)	17:44
Robot101	what's the query?	17:44
omeam	Robot101: how can i control the volume - when i removed a lot of stuff	17:45
* lardman doesn't know anything about alsa		17:46
lardman	but would be interested to hear if anyone does know how it works	17:46
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omeam	basically all osso packets but dsp	17:46
lardman	?	17:47
zoran	somebody from "maemo.org" server on the channel?	17:47
lardman	all the data are sent to the DSP you mean?	17:47
lardman	zoran: what's up with the repo?	17:47
zoran	I have a prob with domain authorization	17:47
lardman	zoran: mailing list might be the best bet	17:48
zoran	k, donna try	17:48
zoran	*gonna	17:48
omeam	kernelsourcedirectory/sound is weird!	17:51
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lardman	got to pop out, let me know what you find re alsa	17:55
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L0cutus	seems xchat doesn't support sound on maemo ?	17:57
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omeam	lardman: pastebin.ca/764799	18:02
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lopz	hola	18:04
L0cutus	ciao lopz	18:05
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b0unc3	there is any way to make the app manager automatically install the dependencies for a packet ?	18:12
fysa	can you disable quit/join messages with xcghat?	18:13
fysa	xchat	18:13
omeam	b0unc3: it should per default	18:13
omeam	b0unc3: apt-get does, dpkg does not	18:13
omeam	fysa: use iirc	18:13
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fysa	you may need to add a repository	18:13
b0unc3	omeam: but the app manager seems to not do it	18:14
b0unc3	fysa: the repo is present	18:14
omeam	i mean ircii	18:14
zoran	maybe some missing libs	18:14
omeam	b0unc3: what repos are present (pastebin.ca your sources.list)	18:14
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omeam	and what do you want to install	18:14
fysa	for the req pkg. ie, libgtk and such are in a generic repo not added by most .install scripts	18:14
fysa	iirc is a horrible thing to google for ;)	18:16
b0unc3	omeam: I'm creating an app that have some dependencies... the app manager found these dependencies but not install them...	18:18
b0unc3	the necessary pkg are in the standar maemo extras repo... that is in my sources.list	18:18
omeam	b0unc3: ok...	18:19
omeam	fysa: i meant ircii	18:19
zoran	why don't you install them manualy?	18:19
omeam	zoran: too easy ;)	18:19
omeam	b0unc3: scnr	18:19
b0unc3	zoran: cause them are not listen in the installable application list...	18:20
zoran	ah, "not installable"?	18:20
b0unc3	no... sorry for my english... I mean that these pkg are not showed in the app manager... but I can install them with apt	18:21
zoran	could you refresh the lists?	18:22
fysa	maybe version reqs don't match then. apt is very good at handling dependants	18:22
b0unc3	zoran: one of the pkg is rx-34-kernel-nfs-modules... and it is not listed...	18:22
zoran	cool, get it on the device and install with apt-get install	18:23
fysa	oh yes nfs needs manual install	18:24
b0unc3	yep... manual installation work fine... but I want to know if the app manager can do it automatically	18:24
fysa	no. don't worry. just use dpkg --install	18:24
fysa	get root with becomeroot packag	18:24
fysa	then sudo gainroot and you're good	18:25
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b0unc3	fysa: I think that normal user don't want do it	18:26
zoran	b0unc3, normal user is win user	18:27
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fysa	agreed.	18:28
fysa	maybe os2008 fixes nfs	18:28
b0unc3	zoran: I know... but I think I must consider them...	18:28
zoran	he-he	18:28
fysa	use cifs maybe. i think that is conpiled in	18:29
fysa	silly thumbboard	18:29
b0unc3	fysa: cifs is for smb I think... and I'm using it...	18:29
fysa	we need a network fs gui..	18:29
b0unc3	fysa: it's what I'm working on	18:29
b0unc3	https://garage.maemo.org/projects/wizard-mounter/	18:30
zoran	some1 played with gammu app?	18:30
fysa	then i suggest you make your own repo	18:30
fysa	maybe we can use fuse-nfs	18:30
alterego	sshfs ftw!	18:31
b0unc3	fysa: maybe it not fix my problem... I think the problem is the app manager	18:31
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zoran	alterego, what is your exp with fuse? interested	18:31
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fysafysa	OK, a real keyboard is much nicer ;)	18:32
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alterego	I use fuse to mount my N800 whilst developing ruby apps.	18:32
fysafysa	http://maemo.org/community/wiki/settingupnfs/	18:32
alterego	I use emacs on my laptop to edit the files mounted by fuse. Then use a separate ssh connection to run the apps whilst testing them.	18:32
zoran	ssh in base?	18:33
zoran	ah, see	18:33
b0unc3	fysafysa: I read it...	18:33
fysafysa	so here is my thinking..	18:33
fysafysa	you basically need to deconstruct those packages and make your own	18:33
fysafysa	then there will be no dependency issues	18:33
fysafysa	"However, nfs-common is currently broken and it needs to be installed by hand instead of apt-get or the application manager."	18:34
b0unc3	fysafysa: yes... but I think it's the worst way... beacause if these pkg are updated I need to realease a new ver of my app...	18:35
b0unc3	but maybe it's the only way... or the simplier way :-)	18:35
zoran	it should work as you want if files are in the same directory	18:35
fysafysa	I think you will be fine..	18:35
fysafysa	there are no major architectural changes in updates usually	18:35
fysafysa	the same binaries will probably work, and you can install to /usr/local/	18:35
fysafysa	the only way your packages would break is if Maemo fixed NFS..	18:36
fysafysa	which solves the problem anyway :)	18:36
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b0unc3	fysafysa: exact...	18:36
fysafysa	or build .sh script	18:37
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fysafysa	into your GUI..	18:37
fysafysa	with "Install NFS" button..	18:37
b0unc3	uhm...	18:37
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fysafysa	you can script 'sudo gainroot'	18:37
fysafysa	there is no password prompt	18:37
fysafysa	so make your package depend on becomeroot	18:37
fysafysa	then automate wget/dpkg -x nfs-common/et al	18:38
b0unc3	yeah... sounds good :-D	18:38
fysafysa	lsmod \| grep nfs first to check for installation	18:38
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fysafysa	probably the path of least resistance..	18:38
fysafysa	win is os2008 released?	18:38
fysafysa	couple of weeks?	18:39
fysafysa	..	18:39
fysafysa	when	18:39
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lardman	omeam: thanks, will take a look	18:39
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omeam	cyaall	18:42
omeam	g2g	18:42
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zoran	hm, could 770 listen to nokia sdp service? something comparabile to l2cap shoud do the job.	19:03
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timeless	http://news.google.com/news/url?sa=t&ct=us/0-1-0&fp=4731db6d23f7ceaf&ei=xfAxR53FNIz2qgP0q4jMCg&url=http%3A//thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/11/07/a-deadly-school-shooting-this-time-in-finland/%3Fhp&cid=1123272544&sig2=Uo9GbFqr2lymcljh0X42uQ	19:07
timeless	eep	19:07
timeless	http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/11/07/a-deadly-school-shooting-this-time-in-finland/?hp	19:07
czr	yes. another 4.0beta tester gone crazy	19:09
alterego	Something is very broken in my task app :/	19:09
* timeless tries to resist responding		19:09
alterego	It randomly segfaults.	19:09
czr	timeless :-).	19:09
timeless	ok, i'm sending a chinook xref to dh now	19:10
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L0cutus	alterego: oops:)	19:11
alterego	Yes .. Oops ..	19:12
Tak	alterego: does it have a treeview? ;-)	19:12
alterego	It segfaults even without the tree view.	19:13
alterego	The problem is either my model infrastructure. Or it's ruby REXML module :/	19:13
alterego	I'm gonna make a few deep test suites to find out which.	19:13
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alterego	Interesting.	19:27
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penguinbait	thats debatable?	19:27
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alterego	You don't even know what I'm talking about :P	19:28
alterego	Whilst looking for whatever is causing my program to segfault. I think I've found out why my hildon windows don't group.	19:28
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timeless	ok, so, operator error, i'll push chinook xref tomorrow i think	19:30
penguinbait	thats why its debatable?	19:31
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zoran	hm, in fact, on 770 I shluld use obex client to put/get files to/from card in the phone?	19:38
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kenny-la-teub	#Lelombrik	20:56
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timeless	ok, fwiw chinook xref is uploading now	21:08
timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook-20071107/source/	21:08
timeless	the index needs to be rebased, and i never remember the command to do that :)	21:09
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timeless	sp3000, so, i finally figured out why i don' like this url	21:15
timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook-20071107/find?string=glib	21:15
timeless	now i just need to figure out how to fix it	21:15
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_\|Nix\|_	Hi! How do I take a screenshot on the 770?	21:45
_\|Nix\|_	I tried installing load-applet but it didn't work. It installed fine, but it never showed up on the status bar.	21:45
red-zack	try reboot ur device	21:45
_\|Nix\|_	OK ...	21:46
_\|Nix\|_	.o0o.o0o.o0o.	21:46
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_\|Nix\|_	Oooh! Worked! Sweet! Thanks!	21:48
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red-zack	_\|Nix\|_: your welcome!	21:49
red-zack	;)	21:50
_\|Nix\|_	Great ... now it refuses to connect to any kind of WLAN ... it just blinks and blinks and blinks and ...	21:50
p\|	re	21:51
massoud	ehlo there /win 14	21:52
_\|Nix\|_	Yaaaay! Another reboot ... feels like Windoze ...	21:54
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KevinVerma	hey folks is there any eta for os2008 release ?	22:02
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alterego	~1 week	22:04
alterego	Maybe closer to 2 weeks	22:05
KevinVerma	ok thats good to know, thanks	22:05
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timeless	sp3000: 50 lines to go!	22:17
sp3000	heh	22:17
timeless	B. Click the bottom right button in the toolbar (it looks like a magnifying	22:18
timeless	glass, but it's really an overloaded kitchen sink button) > Components >	22:18
timeless	Default plug-in, RealPlayer, Windows Media.	22:18
timeless	* Plug-ins has been renamed to Components.	22:18
timeless	(Editor's note: the reason is that in theory you're supposed to be able to see	22:18
timeless	extensions in this list, in testing, this may not actually work...)	22:18
timeless	This affects both the application menu and the find button on the toolbar.	22:18
timeless	(Editor's note: you might be wondering what a Plug-ins or Components menu item	22:18
timeless	is doing in a toolbar, that's a good question, it's the closest thing we have	22:18
timeless	to a UI approved kitchen sink outside of the Settings dialog. Keep in mind that	22:18
timeless	the N810 has moved the application menu button to a very inconvenient location,	22:18
timeless	so if you use full screen mode and want to quickly stop Flash, all you have to	22:18
timeless	do is click the Find button on the toolbar, Components, and then uncheck Flash)	22:18
timeless	hrm, i guesss i already mentioned the kitchen sink once, oops	22:19
timeless	oh right, i should try that...	22:19
timeless	um, i can't load google.com	22:20
timeless	Operation temporarily disabled due to low memory	22:20
timeless	(microb was asked to load stress.html before lunch)	22:20
timeless	Unable to install grasemonkey-webaddon	22:23
timeless	[Close]	22:23
timeless	:(~	22:23
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p\|	anyone know if there is a script that can 'disable/stop/kill' a service in maemo ?	22:26
timeless	services on the device are lifeguarded	22:26
p\|	instead to modify all rc.X/ scripts	22:26
timeless	you need to disable the lifegaurd	22:27
p\|	hu ?	22:27
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timeless	well, most are	22:27
timeless	kinda depends what you'r thinking of	22:27
timeless	ssh wouldn't be	22:27
p\|	i have installed a webserver	22:27
timeless	but media services iirc are	22:27
timeless	oh	22:27
p\|	(nginx)	22:27
massoud	I am looking for the official sources.list for Nokia-770-36 2.6.16.27-omap1	22:27
p\|	and now it restart at every boot :)	22:27
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timeless	ah.... you want a gui xinetd configurator or something	22:28
massoud	as my GPG chek is giving me an error	22:28
p\|	so i need to stop it	22:28
p\|	timeless: not necessary a gui	22:28
p\|	also command line is ok	22:28
massoud	and my apt-get update is then messed up	22:28
p\|	i've see there is 'update-rc.d'	22:28
p\|	but no help on how to use it	22:28
timeless	um	22:29
timeless	OS 2005 Edition version 3.2005.51-13	22:29
timeless	OS 2005 Edition version 5.2006.13-7	22:29
timeless	OS 2006 Edition version 1.2006.26-8	22:29
timeless	OS 2006 Edition version 2.2006.39-14	22:29
timeless	OS 2006 Edition version 3.2006.49-2	22:29
timeless	which is 36?	22:29
* b0unc3 wizard-mounter-1.0 is out https://garage.maemo.org/frs/?group_id=444		22:30
* timeless chuckles		22:31
timeless	http://hsivonen.iki.fi/	22:32
timeless	Maemo Source Code	22:32
timeless	To save others the trouble of requesting the source, here are the contents of the package called .2.2006.39-14-srcs..	22:32
p\|	when OS2008 comes, will be possible to have OS2007 to boot from mmc and OS2008 to boot from internal flash ?	22:34
alterego	p\|, should be possible yes. Though I don't know who'll make the initfs.	22:35
p\|	ok	22:37
p\|	http://tuomas.kulve.fi/blog/2007/01/27/maemo-service-handler/	22:37
massoud	I have SU-18_2007HACKER_4.2007.36-2_PR_F5_MR0_ARM.bin	22:38
massoud	on my N770	22:38
timeless	um	22:38
timeless	that's hacker edition	22:38
massoud	and I seem to have the wrong sources.list	22:40
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massoud	where can I a clean sources.list ?	22:42
keesj	get?	22:43
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massoud	get	22:47
* timeless didn't know there were any sources.list files for any maemo versions		22:47
* massoud likes to forget get		22:47
timeless	apt-forget	22:47
GeneralAntilles	There aren't any sources.list files for maemo.	22:48
GeneralAntilles	Unless you find one floating around on an FTP somewhere.	22:48
timeless	have you?	22:48
keesj	apt-dislike	22:48
GeneralAntilles	Just clear yours and use SSH to enter the repos on maemo.org again.	22:48
GeneralAntilles	timeless, well, yeah, on my FTP. ;)	22:49
timeless	strange	22:50
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timeless	compare:	22:50
timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook-20071107/source/chinook.sources.list?raw=1	22:50
timeless	http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook-20071107/source/chinook.sources.list	22:50
timeless	when i tried the non raw version, i got connection refused	22:51
* timeless wonders why		22:51
timeless	i guess that's a sources.list file :)	22:51
GeneralAntilles	Non-raw works fine for me.	22:51
timeless	yeah, i wonder if the server was rebooting?	22:51
* GeneralAntilles wants Chinook.		22:51
timeless	well, you can read the sources :)	22:52
GeneralAntilles	Hehe	22:52
timeless	[sanjay]$ uptime	22:52
timeless	12:52:20 up 35 min, 5 users, load average: 4.76, 1.89, 0.76	22:52
timeless	poor box	22:52
GeneralAntilles	Is Chinook MicroB totally gonna kick ass?	22:52
timeless	timeless@swift:/export/home/svn/lxr-root/lxr-data% uptime	22:52
timeless	11:44pm up 199 day(s), 5:05, 31 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00	22:52
timeless	it's currently kciking my ass	22:53
timeless	i have 50 lines left to go	22:53
massoud	works better with the chinook list :)	22:56
massoud	timeless : thanks, gracias, merci	22:56
GeneralAntilles	Also: you can ignore the GPG errors.	22:56
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massoud	ah yes ?	22:56
timeless	um, i wouldn't try mixing chinook w/ 2007he	22:58
timeless	unless i really wanted a brick	22:58
GeneralAntilles	Then you could clobber somebody with it!	22:58
* GeneralAntilles goes off to put the Chinook repos on his 770.		22:58
timeless	oh, actually, you're right, i do have people to clobber	22:58
timeless	please send me your brick when you're through with it	22:59
timeless	i'll put it to good use	22:59
GeneralAntilles	Just be sure to wipe it for fingerprints afterwards.	22:59
timeless	nah, i'll wear gloves and leave the original owner's prints :)	23:00
GeneralAntilles	Hehe	23:00
massoud	eheh	23:00
* timeless hopes people understand that this is meant humorously...		23:00
czr	people might..	23:01
* czr hopes there are no lawyers around		23:01
GeneralAntilles	It's IRC, how else could it be taken.	23:01
timeless	i hope never to find out	23:03
alterego	Hahah	23:03
alterego	I don't think IRC should be taken that way timeless ;)	23:03
timeless	touche?	23:03
czr	gezundheit	23:04
massoud	how can I ignore the GPG errors BTW ?	23:04
GeneralAntilles	Just ignore them. ;)	23:04
GeneralAntilles	I don't think you can suppress the warnings.	23:05
timeless	close your eyes	23:05
GeneralAntilles	maemo.org needs to fix those at some point, though.	23:05
massoud	I close them now ?	23:05
massoud	can u read me ?	23:06
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alterego	Feed me seymour	23:09
timeless	doublec, fwiw, http://timeless.justdave.net/mxr-test/chinook-20071107/source/	23:10
doublec	thanks timeless	23:10
timeless	it's a snapshot, i don't claim to understand if these things will even change	23:11
alterego	Is it preferable to use osso state saving over gconf for settings that aren't really that important?	23:13
alterego	Basically UI state ..	23:13
alterego	I'm just wondering if it's better to use osso's state saving over gconf for storing information on list ordering and which group is currently being viewed.	23:14
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czr	alterego, if you need to save something between reboots -> gconf. otherwise state saving might be better. not sure though.	23:16
alterego	Hmm.	23:16
alterego	I have this feature. Where the app remembers the group your viewing (different groups of tasks/todo items) and also the order in which the group is being displayed (priority, date due ..)	23:17
czr	that sounds like user preference	23:17
alterego	I think maybe having this in gconf is a bit over kill ..	23:17
czr	-> gconf.	23:17
czr	unless you explicitly want the user to set the setting each time when they use the app.	23:17
czr	which sounds slightly silly to me :-)	23:18
alterego	No, not each time.	23:18
alterego	Maybe once after a reboot :P	23:18
alterego	Which wouldn't be that often on an always on device.	23:18
czr	why do you think it's always on?	23:18
alterego	Mine is.	23:18
czr	mine isn't :-)	23:18
alterego	Lots of other peoples are.	23:19
czr	really?	23:19
czr	hmm. maybe I'm weird.	23:19
alterego	Sure, why would you turn it off?	23:19
czr	to conserve battery-life	23:19
alterego	Mine lasts for days.	23:19
czr	hmm. interesting. maybe I should revise my usage patterns then	23:19
alterego	Sure, I turn on flight mode when I'm not using wireless/bluetooth	23:20
alterego	But unless you're actually doing something with the device it's likely to last for days idling.	23:21
czr	ah nice. my weird vmware setup will work for tomorrow	23:21
alterego	Maybe even a week or two if you're lucky ^_^	23:21
czr	I have a vm in the laptop. but I don't want to expose the laptop to a potentially hostile network	23:21
czr	but exposing the vm is ok	23:21
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czr	so, just tested whether running bridged network in vmware works even if the host doesn't have any IP on the real interface. it does.	23:22
alterego	Nice	23:22
* czr yays in a somewhat tired fashion.		23:22
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czr	now, I need to figure out what to do resolution wise.	23:23
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czr	widescreen laptop with 4:3 vm reso = not fun	23:26
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czr	ah. very nice fullscreen mode now.	23:27
* czr yays once more		23:28
alterego	Heh	23:28
alterego	I'm having a problem.	23:28
* alterego growls a little.		23:28
czr	what's the problem?	23:30
alterego	gconf delay	23:30
alterego	I'm using gconf to store a list of groups.	23:30
alterego	When the user creates a new group I'd like to select that group.	23:30
alterego	Unfortunately it's not possible as there appears to be a slight delay which breaks concurrency in my program :/	23:31
alterego	I have a solution though.	23:31
alterego	Instead of calling 'create_group' then 'select_group'	23:32
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czr	well. gconf is client-server after all.	23:32
alterego	create_group will generate a signal notifying my app that a new group has been added to that variable. So I can then select the new item.	23:32
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alterego	I just need to work out how to filter the event properly ;)	23:32
czr	strcmp ftw ;-)	23:33
alterego	Heh	23:33
czr	anyhow, need sleep. good luck with the release :-)	23:33
alterego	Yeah, have a good snooze :)	23:33
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czr	I will.	23:33
czr	I think I even have a can of beer somewhere.	23:33
GeneralAntilles	Why not just leave it plugged in when you're not using it? :\	23:34
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alterego	Right, think I've done it ..	23:53
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alterego	Nice :)	23:53
GeneralAntilles	I disagree.	23:54
GeneralAntilles	It's mediocre at best.	23:54
GeneralAntilles	Wait, what?	23:54
_Monkey	Wait, is nflick an uploader?	23:54
alterego	Heh	23:54
GeneralAntilles	Why has _Monkey got to ruin everything?	23:54
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alterego	It's not _Monkey's fault. He doesn't know what he's saying.	23:55
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GeneralAntilles	The where's Dr. Frankenstein so I can throw some torches at him? :P	23:55
* alterego stops trying to be clever and starts hacking.		23:56
alterego	I've had every aspect of this application working fine.	23:57
p\|	what about kerez ?	23:57
alterego	Just not at the same time.	23:57
GeneralAntilles	Ha	23:57
GeneralAntilles	Obviously you should split the individual components into a hundred different little apps.	23:58
p\|	this is not very secure i think: cp /etc/sudoers /etc/sudoers~ && echo user ALL = NOPASSWD: ALL >> /etc/sudoers	23:58
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alterego	That depends if you let other people use it and they can access the terminal.	23:58
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alterego	But no, it's not safe at all.	23:58
alterego	Best just add the programs you plan on using.	23:59
p\|	yes	23:59

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