IRC log of #meego for Thursday, 2010-04-01

jusliukksaltsa, seems to be just a terminal that works00:00
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saltsa_jusliukk, can one make phonecalls from terminal? ;)00:00
loolarjan: We want to enable the full stack for .deb as if this was the native format00:00
Jaffathiago_home: I'd rather not to ;-)00:00
slaineHold the meeting in Dublin, then I'll be able to attend :)00:00
thiago_homesaltsa_: yeah, it's just an xterm00:00
w00t_saltsa_: come back in a few months, I'd say00:00
th0br0slaine: i'm for frankfort :D00:00
slainelol00:00
th0br0there must be some place there to fit all the devs into, too.00:01
loolarjan: Make it as easy to build a MeeGo application .deb than a MeeGo application .rpm, or to maintain a MeeGo repository and buildds and ship images using dpkg internally00:01
arjanlool: but this not give you a way to use debian packages or anything00:01
Clayugh00:01
arjanwhat'd be the objective?00:01
loolarjan: The goal is to leverage the Debian technologies, tools, and software catalogs00:01
slaineIt sounds like a proposal for .debs just for the sake of it being based on .debs00:01
loolarjan: If you mean one can't install a package from debian.org on a MeeGo device, no indeed not00:02
* w00t_ agrees with slaine really00:02
arjanyou don't get the software catalogs etc if you just package as .deb00:02
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loolarjan: But many packages will be rebuildable (perhaps without change) in MeeGo/.deb00:02
arjanlool: you can't even take its debian/ directory00:02
tripzeroapt-build is the yummy00:02
loolarjan: Well it depends of which packages you consider00:02
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javispedroToo bad Jaffa's second question will have to wait..00:03
lbtwow 60 minutes and done... nevermind the outstanding Qs... :)00:03
* NishanthMenon groans at http://pastebin.mozilla.org/71190900:03
slainearen't all the .deb tools obviated by the fact that we're using OBS00:03
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lbtslaine: nope00:03
loolarjan: But I do realize what you're saying, I'm a Debian and an Ubuntu developer and there are already some differences between the debian/ between the two, I also created Maemo .debs00:03
Jaffajavispedro: I'll ask it on http://wiki.meego.com/Talk:MeeGo_Summit_2010 (snigger)00:03
thiago_homehow do I unsplit in irssi now?00:03
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arjanlool: meego is very differently structured, even in the very core00:03
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arjanI doubt you could reuse even a single package as is00:03
loollbt: Yes; I'm not sure this is a really good approach, too bad if you are one of the last topics00:03
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javispedroexactly. the differences between debian and ubuntu are... minor compared to the differences between meego and debian00:04
th0br0http://meego.mkdir.name/mirror/ for those interested, NishanthMenon00:04
javispedro(which even though I'm sure MeeGo team denies it, has a Fedora feeling over it ;) )00:04
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arjanjavispedro: it has a very RPM feeling over it ;-)00:04
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tripzeros/feeling/fondling00:04
arjanand yes we borrow various fedora packaging guidelines00:04
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DawnFosterNote: The next TSG meeting will be one hour earlier to accommodate the recent time change: 19:00 UTC (Noon PST / 10pm Helsinki)00:04
alexbezWas it just me, who thought that most of the questions were answered like "Lets discuss it in mailing lists"? Then what's the point to bring themto TSG meeting?00:04
arjansince theyd o make sense00:04
loolarjan: I can't really comment on that by just looking at the architecture diagram; we could go into specifics, but I don't think that makes any sense until we see a public SDK00:04
NishanthMenonth0br0, thx.. 40 mins :)00:05
Stskeepsalexbez: better than 'no'00:05
th0br0there's some typo on the gitorious page ... #  MeeGo Handset UX  MeeGo Hanset User Experience00:05
javispedroarjan: I think not all of them can be explained by the use of RPM :P00:05
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javispedro(but let's forget about this)00:05
julianklool: Acquiring RPM packaging skills can even help.00:05
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lbtyeah... discuss the RWG instead...00:05
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arjanjuliank: and we have tools to help packaging00:06
tekojolbt yes00:06
juliankarjan: Do you mean tools to create spec files?00:06
arjanjuliank: yep00:06
arjancreate and maintain00:06
gcobbRWG: so can someone explain what the Moblin garage is if it isn't the same as Maemo garage?00:06
arjangcobb" moblin garage is basically .. how to say it00:07
arjanan appstore without a store00:07
javispedromaemo.org/downloads00:07
tekojolbt after thinking (with my past 00:00 muddled brain) it might be the the RWG should be tied to the actual structure of MeeGo00:07
juliankarjan: Well, I prefer to write everything myself; and consider auto-generated parts of packaging to be bad.00:07
javispedrogcobb: seen http://garage.moblin.org/ ?00:07
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tekojoso it would not be a WG, but part of the governance model00:07
arjanjuliank: then I think we have some disagreement, at least for about 75% of packages00:07
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gcobbjavispedro: I am looking at it, but I am still not sure I understand the goals00:08
loolarjan: common code != autogenerated00:08
th0br0tekojo: well, eventually it would be pretty high up... even possibly having some other wgs under its ruling00:08
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arjanjuliank: for 75% of packages, packaging is very little more than boilerplate00:08
loolBut I don't think that this RPM versus .deb discussion will lead anywhere00:08
arjanlool: rpm vs deb has been done before here ;-)00:08
loolPeople have feelings and preferences, there is a lot of history to each00:08
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jusliukkwhy not make meego 1.0 with rpm base, and once we have that stable, consider a deb variant?00:08
javispedrogcobb: seems something like http://maemo.org/downloads/00:08
tekojoth0br0 no, the model is not like that, wg:s have a place, but being in the structure removes that need00:08
arjanlool: and to be very blunt about it, rpm and deb are VERY comparable in what you can do with them. it's mostly around preference/taste00:08
loolThe point is: there is a huge amount of people and software for .deb00:08
gcobbIs Moblin garage somewhere to put ported apps from elsewhere? like the GPE apps, or KDE apps, or...00:08
th0br0well, yeah tekojo... that's what i meant more or less with that.00:09
loolAnd it should be possible to ship MeeGo with .debs, and allow people to ship MeeGo apps as .debs00:09
arjanlool: the software is moot if there is no interoperability with that part of the deb universe00:09
th0br0it's just different to discern where there is need for a wg and where there isn't ...00:09
arjangcobb: basically00:09
lbttekojo: sorry, scouring backlog for comments to record00:09
tekojogcobb, it's more like a maintained place where stable ports go in00:09
gaveenlool, so basically it's forking ?00:09
loolarjan: The actual packages are comparable in features, but the development workflow, available tools, and philosophies are quite different IMHO00:09
javispedrotekojo: not only ports I guess, if there was to be a "meego native" app?00:09
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Claylool: Then make a fork thats deb based?00:09
loolgaveen: No; it's giving the choice00:09
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arjanlool: oh no argument... and those actually are reasons we picked rpm for meego00:10
tekojojavispedro right00:10
lbtyes, I agree ... it could become more core... but it has to start somewhere and it gets people (ie non-employees) involved00:10
loolClay: Forks are bad, and it would be considered a lesser MeeGo if done as a fork00:10
julianklool: Good RPM is better than the deb stuff I've seen on maemo.org00:10
looljuliank: That might be true00:10
jusliukkjuliank, agree 100%00:10
arjanlool: would you say that by saying "but there are deb packaged apps that are not in rpm"... you then create a gap between the rpm meego and a hypothetical deb meego as well00:10
tekojolbt but think of it, directly in core with community involved00:10
arjanunless you also commit to conver that to rpm as well00:10
javispedrooh, anything is better than the "freedoms" we take in maemo packaging ;)00:10
Claylool: Well thats the only alternative. They decided on RPM. They're going with RPM.00:11
lbttekojo: I'd take that00:11
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tripzerodoes the meego n900 image have a working modem stack?00:11
tekojolbt so would I, now some prodding the ice with a stick00:11
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lbtthe point about the support/non-support was supposed to aid in positioning Meego to other vendors too :)00:11
loolarjan: I could flip that argument by saying that if there's a gap and we can't offer .deb support in MeeGo upstream, then it's going to be an issue to ship .deb based MeeGo images, even as forks00:11
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aldenwhats the advantages of going with rpm or deb?00:11
w00t_tripzero: I doubt it00:12
Claythis horse is dead. move on.00:12
loolClay: I think we can come up with intermediate contributions00:12
juliankThe thing I worry about is the per-vendor app store concept, instead of a common one.00:12
tripzeroClay, the horse will never die, but move on anyway?00:12
arjanalden: there is very very little difference00:12
lbtjuliank: yes ... I'm trying to address that too00:12
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aldenarjan: yeah im trying to find out what tho..00:12
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arjanalden: especially since you don't have interoperability with packaging universes for either side00:12
Stskeepstripzero: we had ofono going, needed closed binaries, newer ofono doesnt00:12
loolClay: other projects such as GNOME aren't specific to a packaging technology (package manager neutral); I realize it's not a part of their software stack, but still they manage to remain neutral00:12
Stskeepstripzero: so there is hope00:13
Claytripzero: people are trying to revive it? it was killed in the meeting. But yes, move on anyway00:13
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arjan(the myth that if you are .deb you can use debian packages is just false... that only works if you are actually structured like debian)00:13
looljuliank: This will live on00:13
lbtarjan: that, to me, was a mistake00:13
Claylool: Gnome isn't a distribution.00:13
looljuliank: The most downstream software distributor has interest in hosting the store bits and keeping the associated added value00:13
lbtnot the packaging... the making it hard to use the packaging effort of other distros00:13
julianklool: You just need to view MeeGo as two projects instead of something like GNOME.00:14
tripzeroStskeeps, so i'ts missing the closed modem driver bits?00:14
lbtby making the packaging splits different00:14
gcobblool: but maybe only for commercial apps?00:14
loolClay: I wouldn't summarize MeeGo as a distribution00:14
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loolgcobb: Up to them  :)00:14
arjanlool: you're wrong then00:14
* w00t_ wonders if we're back in day 0: packaging discussion! :D00:14
arjanMeeGo *IS* a distribution00:14
javispedro.deb meego is not necessarily compatible with debian or ubuntu; ".deb maemo" is only compatible with around 50% of debian packages.00:14
slaineLook, you' make mrshaver leave00:14
loolarjan: It's not *just* a distribution00:14
Claylool: i'd say it is00:14
slainegive it a rest00:14
arjanlool: most distributions also do upstream tech development. so do we00:15
Stskeepstripzero: by our cut time we didn't include it cos of too much closed stuff - you should be able to build ofono git fine and work without :)00:15
gcobbI mean: I think there will be multiple app stores: the device manufacturers' but also the core MeeGo one for apps which only depend on MeeGo core00:15
Jaffalbt: Question about content now asked on http://wiki.meego.com/Talk:MeeGo_Summit_2010#Content - will ask on meego-community when appropriate00:15
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lbt:)00:15
lbtgcobb: I keep asking that00:16
juliankarjan: MeeGo is an upstream (software project) and its own downstream (distribution).00:16
lbtI asked in the meeting when Meego was announced iirc00:16
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mikhasunrelated: anyone else thinks that this arch diagram is barely readable? less web 2.0 and more svg could help there ...00:16
loolarjan: Would I present MeeGo to anyone, I would mention development of new software as one of its key missions, with the distribution side of things being one item on the stack00:16
arjanjuliank: in that definiton, fedora is too, as is suse00:16
loolAnd to me it certainly seems replaceable00:16
arjanlool: I don't think that characterization is right00:17
loolWhile if I consider Fedora or Ubuntu, their main goals isn't to write new software -- even if they do write some00:17
gaveenhow about someone suggesting right about now for a .rpm based Maemo? :D00:17
arjanmeego is an operating system with an objective, and we'll develop all the pieces that don't exist yet00:17
juliankarjan: No, their developers develop things for upstream projects (kernel, gnome); but MeeGo develops much more for itself (UX, etc).00:17
arjanjuliank: fedora especially develops a WHOLE BUCH for themselves as well00:17
javispedrogaveen: .rpm has had "not-redhat based rpm distros" for much longer so they understand the issue better than us debianites00:18
arjanand so does suse00:18
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arjanjuliank: even ubuntu develops some tech00:18
arjan(yes others pick it up as well, but still)00:18
th0br0arjan: no good one though :P00:18
lbtjuliank, lool... Isn't it that Meego isn't in the desktop space - so it's using relatively unknown apps00:18
julianklbt: No, MeeGo creates apps.00:19
lbtaswell00:19
loollbt: I think it is spending more resources on new software development than the typical integrator00:19
arjanlool: if you consider "ubuntu" teh typical integrator, sure00:19
lbtyes.... by necessity though00:19
arjanbut not if you consider RH or such00:19
arjandistro is more than just integrator00:19
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arjanit's delivering an integrated whole  by combining existing open source software and developing the rest to fill the gaps00:20
javispedrolet's call it a "project".00:20
javispedro:)00:20
slainearjan, wow, that's just what I said to my CEO this morning00:20
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slaineIs my moblin netbook bugged ?00:20
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th0br0xD slaine00:20
* lbt wonders what you'd see looking at how much RH spent per deployment over the first 2 years cf MeeGo over it's first 2 years00:20
arjanall your kernel are belong to us00:20
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th0br0lbt: not sure you can really compare that00:21
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loolI don't want to go into comparing numbers or distro behaviors00:21
th0br0fedora is rather young, only 5 years old iirc, red hat existed before that00:21
loolI had enough of a .deb versus .rpm flamewar for tonight00:21
arjanhehe me too00:21
arjanand I need to get up to go to the bloody airport in 4 hours00:21
lbtof course not - but it gives you an idea of degree of spend00:21
arjanso I really ought to try to get some sleep00:21
lbtarjan: heh00:21
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* auke takes over from arjan00:22
jusliukk…so i guess it would be rude to wonder why the security parts came with dpkg included..? ;)00:22
loolI hope the MeeGo project will accept people with .deb hats to contribute; let's see what we can technically offer to move this forward00:22
lbthey mr bootchart!00:22
anaZoh… sleep00:22
th0br0gn8 arjan_zzzz00:22
anaZi wish I could00:22
aukehi David :)00:22
lbt:)00:22
w00t_is it "let's gang up on auke" day today?00:22
lbthope that wasn't too harsh for a day-1 email00:22
* w00t_ rubs hands00:22
th0br0NishanthMenon: why can't you?00:22
X-FadeSlaap lekker!00:22
th0br0eeh anaZ why can't you ^^00:22
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NishanthMenonth0br0, about the git clone? no idea.. just dumps me no data.. assuming coz the network is getting hammered00:23
th0br0huh NishanthMenon?00:23
* arjan_zzzz is still amuzed by someone who just wrote "bootchart2" that someone reimplemented bootchart00:23
arjan_zzzz;)00:23
arjan_zzzzs//complaining/00:23
aldengoodnight folks00:23
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th0br0arjan_zzzz: that's not a valid regexp :P00:24
lbtauke: got to admit mmeeks positioned things ....00:24
th0br0aah you meant after "bootchart" :D k00:24
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lbtth0br0: it is... it just segfaulted00:24
NishanthMenonth0br0, i wondered if you pinged me on my pastebin00:24
th0br0NishanthMenon: huh? no.00:24
th0br0lbt: haha, ok.00:24
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th0br0s/haha/ohoh/00:24
infobotth0br0 meant: lbt: ohoh, ok.00:24
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th0br0anyway, i'm going to follow the zZz now, too.00:25
lbtnight00:25
th0br0talk to you tomorrow00:25
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th0br0night00:25
slaineyeah, time I knocked off too00:25
NishanthMenonth0br0, gnite00:26
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slaineI've to be up in 5 hours00:26
DawnFostergnite everyone00:26
w00t_nighty night00:26
teronuppiSomeone successfully installed Meego into N900?00:26
lbtthanks DawnFoster00:26
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w00t_teronuppi: I have no doubt that a few people have. I hope you understand what MeeGo currently is, though :)00:26
w00t_teronuppi: see: http://wiki.meego.com/ARM00:26
* lbt goes back to his dbus/OBS integration...00:27
w00t_lbt: fun fun!00:27
lbtit's like RSS on steroids00:27
teronuppiwould like to see some screenshots :)00:27
lbtteronuppi: of a terminal?00:27
rsalvetiteronuppi: there is only one00:27
microlithimagine twm, only without twm00:27
rsalvetiof a terminal :-)00:27
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teronuppioh.. thought it would have been developed a bit longer :)))00:29
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teronuppiwell, I'll wait...00:29
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aukelbt: mmeeks and me get along really well, he actually is not interested in maintaining bootchart programs in the long run00:35
lbtwhen I read his email - the concepts he puts forward are really important. Sadly bootchart's position is 100% defensible.00:36
aukelbt: of course. there's nothing wrong trying to make me and mmeeks work together00:37
aukelbt: but, don't forget, most of my work was done roughly at the same time mmeeks started with bootchart200:38
lbtyeah - and it's a few lines of C ... frankly I felt bad about the emails.. :)00:38
lbthowever... NIH is something that tends to come from teams that work inside orgs - and I'd like to see it rejected more00:38
aukein this case, NIH is not so relevant, since the need internally here for a tool that doesn't need python or java was the biggest issue00:39
lbtalthough greg kh made some points and michael commented on granularity00:39
lbtyeah, I fully accept I was wrong about that00:39
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auketaskstats are something I did look at, but deemed not needed for what was asked00:39
aukewe can revisit00:40
tremnite all, sweet dreams00:40
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aukehigh resolution data may not be relevant00:40
lbtdoes the the data come out in non-svg format too ?00:40
aukethe svg contains machine-parseble data00:41
aukeso, we can put in anything in there we want00:41
lbtand do all processes get caught? the lo-res doesn't impact that?00:41
aukeno, we don't catch processes that exist in between two sample times00:42
aukefor those, arjan wrote timechart00:42
aukewhich goes beyond bootchart's capabilities00:42
lbtI used to use it for diagnostics to see where things came from ... spawn trees00:42
lbtor fork trees00:42
lbt(when setting up my mythtv diskless box :) )00:43
aukebootchart wasn't meant for that granularity00:43
aukefor me, it's like sticking a thermometer in the turkey and reading "done" or "not done"00:43
lbtsure - if it doesn't show up it's fast enough!!00:44
aukeyes, that's the idea00:44
aukeoriginally I had my bootchart sample 50x per second00:44
aukebut that seemed a bit too much, and not needed to catch most of the data anyway00:44
lbtI guess that hints at the idea that whilst it solves the Meego problem.. it would be nice to support solving other problems too :)00:44
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lbtbut... decisions and resources.... I know00:45
* w00t_ is tempted to say 'patches welcome', but remembers that lbt is in the same country and decides he can't run fast enough00:46
lbtheh00:46
lbtI can throw hard from here...00:47
aukecan you throw patches?00:47
lbt<grin>... not well, they miss00:47
aukedo you actually code? :)00:47
lbtkinda00:47
JaffaHe does better. He hacks (and docs)00:47
aukeooo00:48
JaffaAnd drinks.00:48
lbtI do not drink!00:48
lbtmuch00:48
JaffaDitto.00:48
JaffaHonest.00:48
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lbtauke: http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer/Build/UsingGitorious00:48
aukeI'm a social drinker. if you take a drink, soshall I00:48
Jaffa:)00:48
w00t_auke: best approach, tbh00:48
lbtwhere in the world are you auke?00:49
* thiago_home sees someone suggested Oslo for the MeeGo Summit/Conference00:49
thiago_homeno, no, no, you don't want to come to Oslo...00:49
aukewell, I used to call The Netherlands home00:49
aukenow it's more like Oregon00:49
lbt*nod*00:49
aukesame weather00:49
aukeless flat00:49
thiago_homemy point was price00:50
lbtyeah... Holland was cheap00:50
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lbtauke: let me know if you're int to Helsinki on a monday...00:50
w00t_Oslo would rock anyway, but I'm kind of biased, I want to go there! :P00:50
thiago_homeprice of beer at a regular pub (0.6 L): 6.20 € / $ 8.4000:50
lbteek00:50
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thiago_home'nuff said00:51
* lbt drinks cocktails so that would be even worse!00:51
w00t_thiago_home: i take it you don't go out drinking often then :)00:51
thiago_homejust on payday00:51
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thiago_homewe get enough for rent and 3 beers00:51
w00t_haha00:52
* w00t_ needs to go for a drink next week, purely for social purposes00:52
aukelbt: I'm lucky enough00:53
aukelbt: I'm not important enough to get sent to hell^Hsinki00:53
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lbtheh ... it's my short commute from London00:53
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lbthey, thiago_home, I've been looking for a signal/slot solution for python and you may know one ....  (I've been using louie)00:55
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jattdid someone already manage to install meego on the n900?00:55
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lbtjatt: we're at the point where it's a good idea to know someone with a nokia hardware reflasher before trying...00:56
w00t_jatt: more than likely. see http://wiki.meego.com/ARM00:56
w00t_jatt: make sure you read the top part carefully.00:57
lbt... but feel free to toast your expensive phone in order to run a terminal... :)00:57
lbts//potentially/00:57
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jattI see. so it's dangerous to try it out?00:58
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w00t_it is potentially dangerous, and it doesn't have much to offer00:58
lbtI'm not trying it on day 1.00:58
jattI see00:58
w00t_^00:58
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w00t_if you're an app developer, I'd wait a month or two00:58
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* javispedro notes that Fedora is the MeeGo dev platform of choice00:59
lbtlool: you package louie?00:59
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loollbt: I used to, was a rdep I needed01:05
loolIt's under DPMT01:05
lbtI'm just after some docs/examples...01:05
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loollbt: You could check moovida or coherence?01:06
lbtI'm newish to python01:06
lbtOK... I'd seen coherence uses it01:06
loolWell coherence even has a builting copy   :-(01:07
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* lool bed &01:07
lbtnight - ta01:07
lbtme too .... night all.01:08
CosmoHillcyas01:09
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laurihey guys01:14
lauriI have a proposal for GSoC, please take a look here: http://v6sa.itcollege.ee/wiki/?page=tx-mobile01:14
lauriI am very much interested in feedback!01:14
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anotnacanyone got a link to the meeting transcript from today01:24
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scifianotnac: I guess this is what you are looking for. http://trac.tspre.org/meetbot/meego-meeting/2010/meego-meeting.2010-03-31-19.58.log.txt01:30
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koupsalong long long download... finish before meego2 ?01:34
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microlithis there any word on what input framework MeeGo will be using?02:20
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javispedroharmattan at least has its own one02:21
javispedropart of dui iirc02:21
javispedro(source is on gitoriouououous)02:21
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Tenkawaso... that one nokia image wouldnt run on a 800 by chance would it?03:12
JaffaTenkawa: See Stskeeps' post about it ;-)03:12
Tenkawaok..03:13
Tenkawathanks03:13
JaffaTenkawa: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=590311&postcount=1603:14
Tenkawagot a ponter?03:14
Tenkawathanks03:14
Tenkawaer pointer03:14
JaffaTook a while to dig it up03:14
JaffaSign I should go to bed.03:14
Tenkawayeah I had tried the search on meego.com with no hits so thanks03:14
Tenkawawell.. if the 810 works it "possibly" could on the 80003:15
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Tenkawait would probably be pretty slow though03:16
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javispedroxterm?03:17
Tenkawajavispedro: eh?03:17
javispedroTenkawa: that Nokia image boots to a xterm03:17
Tenkawajavispedro: ahhhh03:18
Tenkawablah...03:18
TenkawaI'll keep diablo03:18
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Tenkawathanks for the info all03:19
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CosmoHillnight monkeys03:20
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GAN900How'd day 1 go?03:24
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javispedroWell, the meeting was the usual.. uh... how to say.03:24
* javispedro decides to shut :)03:25
Pforceim a bit confused, how am i to run these http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/devel/n900/images/03:25
Pforcefrom maemo5 just execute one of those or03:25
Pforcedo i have to modify some bootloader03:25
Pforceto boot into it03:26
arjan_zzzzhttp://wiki.meego.com/ARM03:26
Pforcevery well03:26
Pforce:)03:26
Pforcethat should be linked in the dl page03:26
Pforceor suppose i should have looked at the wiki :P03:27
Pforcereading the warnings on the native install page makes me leave this at this point, haha03:28
Pforcedont wanna brick my n90003:28
arjan_zzzzif all you use your phone for is run xterm... the meego stuff is brilliant ;)03:28
arjan_zzzzit's really good at that.03:29
javispedroGAN900: and you get to say all those TMOers that the MeeGo build only boots to an xterm!03:29
Pforcearjan_zzzz: can you tell, when there is a proper release with ui and stuff, do i still have to remove/flash my maemo5 and put meego there03:29
Pforcelike i cant dualboot when its done03:29
arjan_zzzzthere's the chroot method03:30
arjan_zzzzif you google n900 and dual boot you find many articles03:30
arjan_zzzzsome less true than others03:30
Pforceright, so its possible03:30
Pforcegood to know03:30
Pforcequite interested in this but dont wanna make my phone unusable03:30
Pforcei guess it can always be flashed back to maemo503:30
Pforcesounds like some work anyways03:31
Pforcei wonder if nokia will give the "ok" to install meego, like warranty and stuff if you brick your device :P03:31
arjan_zzzzhahaha doubt it03:31
Pforceyeah, so whos ever gonna put this in but developers03:32
Pforceif that doesent happen03:32
arjan_zzzzyou can use it on a netbook too03:32
arjan_zzzzbit easier around the warranty03:32
Pforcesure, but talking spesificly the n90003:32
Pforceall the blogs and sites talk how this is for the n900 replacing maemo603:33
Pforcebut if there is no proper installer coming to "upgrade my os to meego safely"03:33
Pforcewhats the hype for :P03:33
Pforcemeh should go to sleep03:33
javispedrono, this doesn't replace maemo6...03:34
Pforceright, i tought the projects merged and maemo6 is out03:34
* arjan_zzzz did not think maemo6 was released yet03:34
Pforcei mean replacing in the sense that its not done anymore and meego will be released03:35
Pforcebut im sure im missinformed about this :)03:35
Pforcejust hope there would be a pop up on my N900 some day "update to meego/maemo6 os" which ever :)03:36
Pforcedont really care if it takes 2 months or 2 years03:36
Pforcewhen its done03:36
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johnxis there a mirror up of the meego images somewhere?05:20
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mza-_anyone got a better mirror for the meego image downloads?05:33
mza-_m2 seems to be broken:(05:34
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johnxis anyone else having trouble with the meego-codedrop-arm-n900-201003311626.tar.gz ?05:42
johnxI get tar: invalid tar magic05:42
johnxwhile extracting ...05:42
johnxPretty sure I have all of it, but I don't see a list of checksums to compare against05:42
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johnxmeego-codedrop-arm-n900-201003311626.tar.gz is corrupt on the server and/or mirror06:30
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asikhello08:21
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Stskeepsmorning!09:25
thiagomorning Stskeeps09:26
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ZEDDYis there a tutorial on how to get meego running on your n90009:33
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Zeddy"meego can be installed from a usb stick or cd disk.." yet there is an image for the n90009:33
Stskeepswiki.meego.com/ARM but do it at your own risk and only if you tried reflashing your device before09:34
Zeddycool thanks!09:34
kadZeddy: http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/devel/n900/images/09:34
Zeddyi got a few test devices to try it on in school09:34
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* thiago is installing on chroot09:35
Zeddyare there btw any videos / screens showing the meego running on a n900+09:35
kadZeddy: google for it. there are some09:36
lpotterZeddy: it boots to xterm09:36
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Zeddyok :D09:36
thiagoyes, very nice screenshots of an xterm09:36
Zeddyso no guis at all09:36
Stskeepsit is actually a video of an xterm, we couldn't get X running ;)09:36
lpotternot even full screen :)09:36
lpotterI might try putting qtopia on it this weekend09:37
* thiago finished downloading the Qt src rpm09:37
thiagofinally09:37
thiago16 patches in09:37
thiagoI'm going to go out in a limb and guess 16 out of 16 were never submitted upstream09:38
thiagook, the first one proved me wrong. It's arjan's patch from February :-)09:39
Zeddybut you can however run applications on a meego system allready09:40
Zeddyby launching them from the terminal like you usually do09:40
thiagothe second one is a webkit patch that was never submitted upstream. I know this because I ended up redeveloping it last week.09:40
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thiagothere are apparently some good patches here09:44
thiagoI'll wait for them to be submitted upstream09:44
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lpotterhmmm09:55
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* mece tips his hat10:15
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Stskeepsbootstrapping work on hardware adaptation for Nokia N8x0: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=59091110:20
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thiagothose are OMAP2, so not officially supported10:21
Stskeepsyes, we know10:21
RST38hStskeeps: Does this mean you are moving Mer to Meego base?10:21
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StskeepsRST38h: mer is dead as such and rest of work is recompilation of fremantle10:22
Stskeepsthiago: nothing stops a community skunkworks project though :P10:22
RST38hStskeeps: Kinda sad10:22
StskeepsRST38h: on the other hand, we have a lot of experience to make meego great now :P10:22
* RST38h kinda started believing that there will really be a community-supported Fremantle for N81010:23
meceIs there some chart somewhere on what is included in the current meego release?10:23
StskeepsRST38h: i am having a OBS instance rebuilding things :P10:23
RST38h...but the things ended up the usual way of course...10:23
lbtwoohoo... I got meego working on the N800 last night - the TI 3D drivers work and that gui is *so* smooth... it's almost as good as the N900!!! :)10:24
lbt\o/10:24
mecelbt, i fuckin hate this day.10:25
thiagoso you got a smooth xterm?10:25
* RST38h makes lbt eat a calendar page with "April 1" written on it10:25
Zeddylol10:25
lbt*nom*10:25
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Zeddyi haven't been fooled yet10:26
Zeddythen again im still s10:26
Zeddysitting at my computer half dressed10:26
meceZeddy, you haven't been fooled that you know of...10:26
RST38hZeddy: Do we really need to know that? =)10:26
meceI sometimes like to irc naked.10:26
meceon freenode.10:27
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ZeddyRST38h, i said half-dressed.. im not naked10:27
mecefreedom ftw :D10:27
RST38hZeddy: Good to know THAT too =)10:27
Zeddyhaha :p10:27
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ZeddyWhat if i was a stunning hot blond young woman.10:28
lbton #meego?10:28
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Zeddyyou never know..10:28
Stskeepsnow, you're assuming there's no women in meego, which there obviously is10:28
Stskeeps:P10:28
lbtyou're thinking of #mer :)10:28
* ferringb notes an april fools day prank involving convincing others it wasn't 04/01 would be good.10:28
Stskeepsactually, i can point out at least one blond woman here10:28
Stskeeps:P10:28
Zeddyok, but point out a hot blonde woman10:28
ZeddyStskeeps, and the fact that somebody claims to be a woman on IRC doesn't make them a woman. We need visual confirmation10:29
Stskeepsthat too, but her fiance would kill me10:29
Stskeeps:P10:29
thiagoit's 01/04 anyway10:29
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meceso anyway. the meego release. Does it have drivers for radios and such for the N900?10:30
Stskeepsbt/wlan's in the closed repositories, but fetchasble10:31
Stskeeps(firmwares)10:31
meceno 3g/gsm?10:31
mecethe phone stuff10:31
Stskeepsofono can handle that now, i think10:32
meceso basically (and inconveniently) you could make phonecalls with meego today?10:33
Stskeepsneeds work, but talk to the ofono peeps :)10:33
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Anssi||are qt and gtk in the the n900 image btw?10:34
Stskeepsrpm -q -a10:35
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lbtactually, can someone show the releasenotes/changelog for the image?10:35
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Anssi||i have only a loan n900, i have not installed it10:35
lbtSome of us aren't nuts enough to flash :)10:35
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Anssi||i am just thinking of it. :)10:36
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* PararaPatxin needs help10:46
PararaPatxinis there anyone alive?10:46
Stskeepsask away10:47
PararaPatxinI've got a Netbook where i had no problem to install Moblin10:47
PararaPatxintoday I've downloaded the USB image for meego10:48
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PararaPatxinbut after doing the following:10:48
PararaPatxinsudo dd if=Descargas/meego-preview-netbook-core-20100330-001.usbimg of=/dev/sdb1 bs=8M;sync10:49
PararaPatxinwhen I reboot the netbook it says that the pendrive has no Operating System10:49
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PararaPatxinthe output for the dd command was:10:52
PararaPatxin49+1 registros de entrada10:52
PararaPatxin49+1 registros de salida10:52
PararaPatxin411041793 bytes (411 MB) copiados, 719,796 s, 571 kB/s10:52
Stskeepsnot sure about netbook personally10:55
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PararaPatxinDid someone in this room install meego on a netbook?10:56
meceAnssi||, you could do this: http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/Meego_chroot_install_on_N90010:58
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PararaPatxinSorry mece, but it seems to be just for the N900 smartphone. I need the instructions for a Netbook11:02
av500it says the netbook release is console only11:03
mecePararaPatxin, yep, I was referring it to Anssi||. I don't have a netbook, and thusly no clue about it's workings11:03
meceall of them are console only11:03
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* av500 does not get the point then11:04
thiagoav500: the point of whaT?11:05
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av500making a "release"11:06
Jaffaav500: Because there's a lot of code under the GUI which defines a system11:06
av500I know :)11:07
thiagobecause developers need something to work with11:07
thiagothey don't need a GUI11:07
thiagothey need a platform11:07
thiagobesides, "release early, release often"11:07
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megabasthi11:09
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megabastsomeone found a link to install usbimg? kind of dd command line? thankx11:09
kadmegabast: http://wiki.meego.com/ARM11:11
Stskeepsthat's not ARM though, that's x86 :P11:11
kadoh11:11
kadsorry11:11
megabasthttp://wiki.meego.com/Image_Creation_For_Beginners11:11
megabast:)11:11
kadmegabast: http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/devel/trunk/images/11:12
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lbtpeter robinson? sheesh11:37
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slainemorning all12:16
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Stskeepsmorning slaine12:21
slaineseems my download timed out last night12:21
slainetrying again12:21
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kebaxpreview seems to have the most recent stable kernel12:41
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* w00t_ yawns13:06
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slaineanyone try out the x86 netbook image ?13:08
JaffaAnyone tried the x86 images in a VM?13:08
slaineYou can't hi-jack my x86 question like that13:09
w00t_he can, and did!13:09
slaineNooooooooooooooooooooo13:10
* RST38h would really love Meego switching to FreeBSD =)13:10
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slaineI guess I need to make my own chroot for dev work13:14
slainedon't seem to be able to yum install anything13:15
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lbtslaine: don't work too hard - OBS will fix all the dev/sdk things13:34
slainelbt, when will I have access to OBS ?13:34
lbtyeah, I know... ask the RWG13:35
Stskeepsslaine: what problems do you have with my images?13:35
slainelol13:35
slaineStskeeps: I can't install gcc13:35
lbtjust saying don't do it  -  just not to put too much effort refining things...13:35
Stskeepsyum install gcc says what, slaine?13:35
lbts/just/not/13:35
infobotlbt meant: not saying don't do it  -  just not to put too much effort refining things...13:35
slaineStskeeps: nothing, it can't resolve the repos13:36
Stskeepsslaine: check your /etc/resolv.conf13:36
slainefecking connman13:36
Stskeepsin the chroot13:36
slaineI'm running live at the moment13:36
slainehow do I get connman to generate a proper resolve.conf from my dhcp13:37
slaineit's got nameserver 127.0.0.113:38
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slaineand options edns013:38
slaineI'll try booting with the cable attached13:39
thiagoslaine: 127.0.0.1 is correct13:42
thiagoconnman is a DNS proxy13:43
thiagoand cache13:43
thiagoso it's the *right* thing, finally13:43
slaineok13:45
slaineit's working now, weird13:46
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slainerebooting with the cable in seems to have sorted it for now13:47
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koupsameego-usb-notebook... i download for 4 hours i put it on usb i boot (live) and i see... a term!!!!13:50
slainekoupsa: congrats13:51
koupsai test install and see noliveetc... i m stupid? :)13:51
koupsahi slaine13:51
Stskeepskoupsa: no, expected13:51
koupsaso meego is nothing for yet13:53
Anssi||koupsa, :)13:54
Anssi||terminal is root of all good things13:54
koupsawhereis firefox? thunderbird? lol13:54
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slainekoupsa: it's not a release yet13:56
Stskeepshttp://wiki.meego.com/ARM/Meego_on_Qemu13:56
slaineit's an os platform for developers13:56
koupsaAnssi|| to late yesterday to test everything. can anybody tell me if 'dev package' is here13:56
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slaineI'm yum installing the installer at the moment, so I can install onto my netbook13:57
koupsaslaine network on meego is ok? or only use in a vm13:58
slainekoupsa: it was after I rebooted with the cable plugged in13:58
koupsaslaine by git ?13:58
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slaineby yum13:58
koupsaarghh i must search a cable in the darkness of my house13:58
slaineyum whatprovides */liveinst13:59
slaineAh, I see it's the installer package13:59
slaineyum install installer13:59
slaineetc. etc.13:59
koupsaah? liveinst doesnt work13:59
JaffaStskeeps: Interesting13:59
w00t_slaine: I heard you like installing an installer so I gave you an installer you can install to install with?13:59
slaineSweet, I love installing13:59
slaine;)13:59
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kebaxI guess nic drivers are not modules14:04
kebaxboth wired/-less adapters seemed to be operable14:05
kebaxbut lsmod did not show driver for my devices14:05
slainenod14:06
slainecompiled in drivers, no initrd, faster kernel14:06
slaines/, /==/14:06
infobotslaine meant: compiled in drivers==no initrd, faster kernel14:06
slainegah14:06
slaineregex fail14:06
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Blacktrackhi all14:21
Stskeepslo Blacktrack14:21
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Blacktrackhiiii what bout new meego???14:24
koupsaBlacktrack meego is a term... a term with 390M for notebook hahahahaha14:25
Blacktrackno gui???14:26
thiagoyes14:26
thiagoX + xterm14:26
Blacktrackmy god... onli xterminal14:26
slainethiago: I couldn't even get that working14:27
Anss|is there fully working qt in meego already?14:27
Blacktrackand... what about a new n900 pr 1.2?14:27
thiagoBlacktrack: yeah... waiting for that too14:27
slaineAnss|: no14:27
Anss|ok.14:27
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Blacktrackmy god...14:28
Anss|maybe this is just 1. of April jokes.14:28
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odin_is the Intel Atom ABI going to be 100% compatible with desktop ABIs ?14:28
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Stskeepsi wish http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1hI1BI_Ua8 was a april fools joke14:29
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niqtsktkeeps in  http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/Meego_on_Qemu i have error14:30
odin_is there going to be a scratchbox but based on the current/recent version?   will sbox be recommended for use, when to build Intel Atom target binaries?14:30
Anss|nice opening shot: "the n900, clueless victim"14:30
Stskeepsniqt: we just fixed some things, refresh and try again14:30
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Blacktrackok meego will be ready i think at the end of this year. its new and its normal... its not normal the maemo pr 1.2... to much wait14:31
niqti have error: pathspec 'omap3' did not match any file(s) known to git14:31
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Stskeepsniqt: yes, refresh please :)14:31
niqtok, sorry14:31
Blacktrackhey but tresnt a command line to get a guji on meego???14:32
odin_where is the correct place to lodge such questions as above, so that even if an answer is not known by anyone at this time, the various committee's and stakeholders will be looking?14:33
maclaverodin: Intel Atom target binaries are x86, so scratchbox will probably not be needed.14:33
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odin_maclaver, but to restrict, confirm and verify your dependencies you need to educate SDK users on the correct method to work, unless there the Atom version can also be installed onto a desktop without modification (just an extra bunch of packages)14:34
odin_will there be a continuous build server/farm that can be used for non-production/non-stable building to test build project (something lacking in maemo)14:35
Stskeepsi'm hoping we'll have that14:36
Blacktracki wanna know if is it possible to install meego on mini sd card and have it like dual boot..14:36
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koupsaprobably yes14:37
odin_in maemo you had to ask to be maintainer, then declare a new project, then declare yourself maintainer, then fire multiple versions to the build server in the hope it build ok on there, this should not be the case, develop should be able to throw arbitrary payloads at build servers to test they build on the common/shared/community infrastructure, and then fix the problems if they dont14:37
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koupsaa fats way to change keyboard map ? is qwerty14:39
odin_once the contributer/developer has a version back (from the farm) that builds they can test it, then use this to declare project, become maintainer, as the first version of code to published for other peoples use and then re-fire it at a production build server14:39
Blacktracki watched the meego video... its too basic with more conf files... nice work.... but it needs cellular firmware wifi too etc14:39
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w00t_it will advance over the next month or two I would guess14:40
Blacktrackjoin -meego-meeting-questions14:40
odin_is that an IRC channel ?14:41
Blacktrackye14:41
Stskeepsodin_: agree, and OBS14:41
Blacktrackwith #14:41
Blacktrackahahha sorry ahhaahah its #meego-meeting-questions14:41
koupsaoops i test just  "X" ... that is a mistake14:42
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odin_what kind of a channel name is that...14:42
italodanceSRFU14:42
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italodanceSTFU14:42
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Stskeepsodin_: raise your issue on meego-dev or -sdk mailign list14:42
Stskeepsyou're not the only one needing that, so :)14:43
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Blacktracka channel questions i think. but there's not a life in there14:44
odin_thats another thing, how do I subscribe to mailing lists with a different email address to my account...  I guess I signup twice14:45
StskeepsBlacktrack: that place is for questions while a moderated meeting is on14:45
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Blacktrackah got it stskeeps :)14:45
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maclaverodin_ that is a different question from how to buld Atom based binaries.  If you mean binary product images, then we should use the OBS (details apparently come later).14:45
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maclaverAs Stskeeps says, these are good questions for the meego-dev mailing list.14:46
odin_"OBS" ?  thats the 2nd time thats has been used and its a new term to me14:46
odin_ok well the questions won't go away, I shall remember them, while I try to plug into meego community a little more over this easter break14:47
Stskeepsodin_: build.opensuse.org (an instance of the software)14:47
Stskeepsmaclaver: ronan right? good to see you on here too :)14:47
maclaverYes, it's Ronan.14:47
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koupsafuc***** us keyboard!14:49
koupsai can't remember ex amiga key14:50
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koupsahow to setup an azerty keyboard14:51
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koupsaslaine have you install an x?  and what package for install the installer ?14:53
Stskeepskoupsa: on the image?14:53
Stskeeps(N90014:53
slainekoupsa: nah, work's gotten in the way. I'll have a look in a while14:54
koupsayes i just boot on image-netbook and test yum install xfce414:54
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koupsajust type "X" doesn't work :)14:55
slainenod14:55
slainenore did startx14:55
koupsano X ? lol mutt and lynx !  :)14:57
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fonix232hi there15:01
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Stskeepslo15:02
fonix232could you help me? I would like to run the MeeGo emulator if there's one, but the wiki contains no info about installation. And I don't have an N900 if it do15:02
fonix232* if it counts15:03
Stskeepswell, not sure we have one :P15:03
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fonix232and what about the SDK?15:04
Stskeepswe don't really have a sdk yet15:04
koupsafu....  i see a mouse on meego.. and pffft disappearance15:04
koupsanext time may be a window15:05
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Stskeepsfonix232: so, what level are you interested in? system development or app development?15:05
fonix232Currently I just want to see what MeeGo is capable. And after it maybe system developement15:06
megabastI've found on meego website a page which explains how to create a gtk window and insert an active icon on toolbar.. I've lost the url, someone could send it ?15:06
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Stskeepsfonix232: right, on the ARM side?15:07
Stskeepsfonix232: at the moment only thing you'll see is a x terminal15:07
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megabastit's ok I have it : http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_Netbook_and_GTK15:07
fonix232yes, ARM side. I don't have a netbook (at least an Atom based one) and I plan to get an N900 somehow15:07
koupsahave you an error like me on 'yum install xorg-x11-server'  ?*15:08
koupsaslaine, maybe ?15:08
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slainekoupsa: like I said, I'm not looking at it now, I'll check it out later15:08
koupsawoups sorry15:09
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slainenp15:11
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CosmoHillrawr15:12
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fonix232so, any idea?15:13
Stskeepsfonix232: i'd wait a couple of days, qemu with n900 and meego support just came out a couple of hours ago15:14
fonix232oh15:14
Stskeepsit should be feasible to boot a beagleboard image same way15:14
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lbtanyone got Meego on a virtualbox machine?15:26
slainelbt, having problems ?15:28
slaineI could give it a shot later15:28
lbtnot even tried....15:29
lbtwanted to stand on the shoulders of giants :)15:29
slainebut with no way of installing from the live image, you'd have some issues15:29
slainenamely, running from the usb image solely15:29
lbtgetting a prompt would be a start15:29
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slaineI'll try and give it a shot now while I get some lunch sorted15:30
lbtit'd be nice to see some cut'n'paste level HOWTOs on the wiki15:30
lbtsounds good...15:30
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CosmoHillcan't you change the .img to .iso and run it that way?15:33
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koupsaifconfig15:36
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CosmoHillhttp://forums.kustompcs.co.uk/showthread.php?p=470600#post47060015:40
CosmoHilldammit15:40
CosmoHillguest@xkcd:/$ cat15:40
CosmoHillYou're a kitty!15:40
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drizztbsdlol15:43
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slainelbt: kernel panics unfortunately15:44
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CosmoHillslaine: hmm16:00
CosmoHilli have an Idea16:01
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koupsawhat is .ks file ?  kickstarter.py ... ?16:03
lbtyes kickstart16:03
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lbtused by MIC216:03
koupsait s for ?16:03
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koupsaok16:03
koupsathx16:04
lbtthe Meego Image creator16:04
slainesurely they could drop the 2 now16:04
koupsasame as moblin ?16:04
slainekoupsa: one and the same16:04
slaineformerly MoblinImageCreator, MoblinImageCreator2, could go back to mic now as MeegoImageCreator16:05
CosmoHillslaine: does the computer you are using virtual box on run meego natively?16:05
slainenot likely, it's an iMac16:05
CosmoHillthat should work I think as they have SSSE316:06
koupsaslaine, lbt, you are an encyplopedia16:06
slaineCosmoHill: possibly16:06
slaineI'm not shutting down to try though16:06
CosmoHillI'll install virtual box on my laptop and try that16:06
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CosmoHillkernels are statically linked right?16:07
lbtheh16:07
lbtyes16:07
CosmoHillgood16:08
koupsaCosmoHill, i tested vbox . he doesn't work.. or i need an another try16:08
lbtthat kinda makes no sense if you think about it16:08
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CosmoHillare using trying meego or mobin?16:09
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slainewtf is mobin16:10
CosmoHilli think i missed an L16:10
slaineand a 216:10
slaine;P16:10
Bunmeegol?16:10
tekojoslaine I'm trying to build the moblin 2.1 wlan drivers and am getting an error about 'user glen does not exist - using root'16:12
CosmoHillwhat image are you guys trying?16:12
slainetekojo: that's fine, they're really just warnings16:12
tekojobut then I get a bad exit status :(16:12
slainethat means something else is wrong16:12
slainecan you pastebin the output ?16:12
tekojoShould I be running as root or normal user?16:12
slainenormal user16:13
slainetekojo: been to my page lately ? there's a repo16:13
tekojoWith built rpms?16:13
tekojoI'll head over there, Thanks!16:14
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koupsawell... meego is a term and  now moblin2.1bug    "id: x respawn too fast: disabled for 5 minutes  ...16:17
* tekojo notices that it's late and should have been at home by now...16:17
koupsameego have a nice screen boot...  i say that, i say nothing16:19
slainekoupsa: please, stop complaining16:19
CosmoHillslaine: what image are you trying?16:19
slainethe project is only a few hours old as far as public code is concerned16:19
CosmoHillmeego-preview-netbook-core-20100330-001.usbimg ?16:19
slaineCosmoHill: yes16:19
CosmoHillgood16:19
CosmoHillnow I just need to download it16:20
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slaineYou need to convert it to a .vdi so that you can boot it16:21
koupsaslaine, i have no pb with meego i like this project really. i ma disapointed because is today that moblin is going to bug. and i like moblin to16:21
CosmoHillokay16:21
CosmoHillwait, convert?16:21
CosmoHillI was just gonna rename it to .iso16:21
slaineVBoxManage convertdd <path/to/.usbimg> <path/to/.vdi>16:21
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slaineDoes that work ?16:21
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CosmoHillduno, I'm on windows and I've not downloaded it yet16:22
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slaineew, windoes16:22
CosmoHillmeh16:22
CosmoHillsay what you like, it's required16:23
slainerequired for what, college ?16:23
CosmoHilluni16:23
slainebummer16:23
CosmoHillbest laptop I have and i only really use it on fridays16:23
CosmoHillit's not bad16:24
slaineI end up punching screens when I have to use it16:24
CosmoHill£100 for a C2D 2.0Ghz, 4GB DDR2, 250GB HDD, 15" and Win 7 pro16:24
slainenice price16:24
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slaineWin7 ain't have bad actually16:24
CosmoHill£50 for the hdd and £50 for the power adapter16:24
CosmoHillwin7 is free :D16:24
* lbt leaves16:25
CosmoHillto me anyway16:25
slaineI'm usually asked to fix someones fucked up xp box16:25
CosmoHillI've gone from XP to 7 :)16:25
CosmoHillatm it has win7, clfs, lfs and moblin16:26
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RST38hWhy do you need so many?16:26
CosmoHillwhile it's the best computer I own i don't use it to much16:27
CosmoHillclfs and lfs are compiled by hand16:27
CosmoHillso the faster the computer the better16:27
CosmoHillmoblin was just cos I was interested in meego16:28
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slainelfs is a good way to learn about a linux install and how it's constructed16:32
slainebut beyond that I couldn't see myself using it for anything. I've got a life to live ;)16:32
CosmoHillI don't use it16:33
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CosmoHillone of the dev's asked if I'd built it yet16:33
CosmoHillbollocks, my tea :(16:35
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* CosmoHill pours his tea down the sink and starts a new one16:37
slainehate that16:37
CosmoHillin one min I'll go down and get it16:38
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CosmoHillbtw, can I put my virtualbox image online for others to download and run on their PC16:38
slaineif you get it working, that'd be handy alright16:38
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CosmoHillmmm, 60MB/s16:48
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CosmoHillslaine: so i need to convert the usbimg image to a .vdi to boot it?16:53
uhsfso, what are the first impressions about meego on the n900?16:53
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marshelhello all16:55
slaineCosmoHill: I believe so16:55
slainethat's what I did as I couldn't get it to boot off the usbimg file16:55
CosmoHillnow how do I do that on windows >.<16:55
slaineYou should have the commandline tools installed too16:55
slainenot sure they're in your path though16:55
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marshelhello, i dont have a netbook but a notebook with celeron 900 processor. would meego run on my nb?16:58
CosmoHillslaine: found it16:58
slainemarshel: not at the moment16:58
marshelit would be possible on nokia´s n800 neither?16:59
Stskeepsthat might be more possible..16:59
Stskeeps:P16:59
marshelhi Stskeeps16:59
slainethere'll likely be community efforts to provide builds for the n8x0 and for non-ssse3 x8617:00
Stskeepsmarshel: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=48929&highlight=hardware+adaptation17:00
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marshelnice17:00
marshelyet i aknwdg that the os is in early stage yet17:01
Stskeeps:nod:17:01
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CosmoHillslaine: did you get to "kernel_thread_helper"?17:01
slainenot sure17:03
slainestack trace obscured the view17:03
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slainemostly acpi related iirc17:03
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CosmoHillwell I have an old livecd that works with Vbox only17:07
CosmoHillthat was made on one machine and works on another :)17:07
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Votan" ... since the MeeGo User Experiences for the usage models are not yet included in today's MeeGo core" = no GUI include din the Image ?17:10
Votanor jsut not started by default ?17:10
wile_workwhat's the login?17:10
kebaxmeego17:11
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wile_workahh17:11
wile_workthe obvious trips me up every time17:11
wile_work:/17:12
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milliamsVotan: I belive there's no GUI17:12
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wile_worki get splash screens when it boots....and when it shuts down17:13
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CosmoHillffs17:26
CosmoHillall I need is squashfs17:27
* w00t_ /217:28
w00t_er.17:28
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TermanaWhat percentage is it when you have w00t_ over 2?17:34
Termana:P17:34
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* w00t_ was trying to go to window #217:35
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CosmoHilli finally have squashfs17:38
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CosmoHillffs17:42
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pagesix1536so...are there any screenshots or videos of Meego in action yet on a N900 or Atom device?17:43
CosmoHillprobably not17:43
thiagoon N900, yes17:43
thiagobut I don't know how "wowed" you'll be by seeing an xterm17:43
lbta very small xterm at that17:44
thiagounder twm17:44
RST38hwow xterm loooool17:44
RST38htwm rulez haxxorz17:45
CosmoHillson of a whore17:45
* CosmoHill stabs his VM17:45
RST38hBTW, I see no twm at a photo17:45
RST38hlooks like X11 is there but no wm17:46
lcukRST38h, mmm so if an app just expected a fullscreen x11 window it could work17:46
CosmoHillwhy can't I just unpack the squashfs :(17:46
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b0unc3hello, where I can get the meego rootfs mentioned here : http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/Meego_chroot_install_on_N900 ?17:53
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CosmoHillwow17:53
CosmoHillI'm getting 10MB/s from the meego server :)17:53
CosmoHill100%[======================================>] 411,041,793 7.61M/s   in 52s17:54
CosmoHill:D17:54
pagesix1536impressive indeed!17:54
CosmoHillhowever i can't mount it :(17:55
Stskeepsb0unc3: on the repo17:55
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b0unc3Stskeeps, uhm ok, so presumably here : http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/devel/n900/images/ ?  is meego-codedrop-arm-n900-201003311626.tar.gz    the rootfs ?17:58
Stskeepsright17:58
b0unc3Stskeeps, I downloaded it twice but always I get a corrupted .tar17:59
Stskeepsb0unc3: wget it please17:59
b0unc3I only use wget ;)17:59
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Stskeepshmm17:59
b0unc3tar: invalid tar magic <-- this is what I get18:00
Stskeepsoh right18:00
Stskeepsuse gnu tar on maemo18:00
b0unc3oh right! I forgot about it18:00
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b0unc3with the gnu-tar everything works fine, thx Stskeeps18:06
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CosmoHillhow do I unsquash a squash.img?18:06
CosmoHillI use:  sudo unsquashfs squashfs.img mount18:07
CosmoHilland it fails18:07
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kebaxmeego is not in sudoers18:09
Stskeepssu18:09
kebaxokay18:09
CosmoHillI'm trying to get into squash.img to change the kernel18:10
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CosmoHilloh you're shitting me18:17
CosmoHillI've spent all that fucking time getting squashfs 4.0 working and it just has a ext3 image inside it18:18
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TSCHAKeee2guys! congrats on the code drop! :)18:20
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CosmoHillon the plus side, my server now supports squashfs 4.018:21
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slaineCosmoHill: checkout my buddy pixelbeats lomount.sh script. It should loopback mount the partition in the image18:24
slainehttp://www.pixelbeat.org/scripts/lomount.sh18:24
CosmoHillthe problem was the things I were trying didn't support squashfs18:24
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slainedoes the usbimg have squashfs on there ?18:25
CosmoHillI'm now going to compile a kernel for virtual box, put that into the thing and boot that18:25
slainek18:25
CosmoHillsorta18:25
TSCHAKeee2when in doubt look in the packagel ist18:25
CosmoHillI turned usbimg into a vdi, access that via a livecd and got squash.img18:25
CosmoHillcopied that to my server, mounted that and the ext3fs.img that was inside it18:26
CosmoHillthis now gives me the meego root18:26
CosmoHillI'm downloading linux 2.6.33.1 to compile on virtual box18:26
CosmoHilllaptop - power = bad18:28
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CosmoHillwhat's the default FS for meego18:38
tripzerobtrfs?18:38
tripzeroidk for sure though18:38
CosmoHillI'll enable a few18:39
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koupsaCosmoHill ext318:39
CosmoHillthanks18:40
koupsacan anybody test 'yum install xorg-x11-server'18:42
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lcukquestion: since ds has a random shaky version of linux around - is it feasible to consider porting meego to it18:44
lcuknintendo ds ^18:44
Stskeepsno mmu, no dice18:44
Stskeeps:P18:44
lcukso you need an mmu to run xterm now :p18:45
* TSCHAKeee2 laughs18:45
lcukthis arm base that just turned up doesnt need it does it?18:45
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suihkulokkilcuk: x11 on uclinux since when?18:47
lcuksuihkulokki, i dunno, i just saw someone make linux work on ds and wondered18:48
lcukif its not feasible ill put it out of mind18:48
lcukespecially with the large screen version18:48
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slaineok, making a development image using mic-image-creator18:53
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Stskeepsthe .ks i have attached?18:54
kebaxiwconfig wlan0 essid APNAME does not work beforeI say ifconfig wlan0 down18:54
slaineCosmoHill: you can also use the meego image creator tools to convert from one format to another, including a VMDK, which I think VBox understands18:54
slaineStskeeps: Modified with @Development Tools18:55
kebaxafter that works until I configure with ifconfig again18:55
Stskeepsslaine: k18:55
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CosmoHillI saw meego had something about creating a virtual box inage18:55
CosmoHillimage*18:56
CosmoHill*moblin18:56
Stskeepsjesus, the joggler is at 49 pound now?18:56
CosmoHill?18:56
slaineStskeeps: He gets nailed up tomorrow18:57
Stskeepsok, no18:57
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Stskeepsjust realized what day it was today :P18:57
slaineNail'em up I say18:58
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Stskeepswell, 49 pound for a hackable poulsbo device with 512mb ram and atom processor..18:59
Stskeeps:P18:59
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slainepoulsbo, ugh18:59
slaineStskeeps: isn't that including a contract ?18:59
Stskeepsnothing technicall stops us from using a different xserver does it?18:59
Stskeepsslaine: no, without18:59
Stskeepsafaik18:59
slainecool18:59
Stskeepssaw the ubuntu remix vids?18:59
* Stskeeps tries to find19:00
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Stskeepsit's a pretty good value at 49 pound :P19:01
Stskeepshttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1ZV7aD2Wak19:02
TSCHAKeee2where the hell can I get one in the US?19:03
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Stskeepsno idea, they sell them with UK plug in uk for 49 pound :P19:03
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keith_I have a question19:04
Stskeepsslaine: what really stops people from compiling xserver 1.6 for meego btw?19:04
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slaineStskeeps: it's scarey19:04
Stskeepsa couple of handy --excludepkgs..19:05
Stskeeps:P19:05
keith_when I try to boot from my thumb drive it goes to a localhost login19:05
Stskeepskeith_: that's the intent, afaik19:05
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CosmoHillthere is no GUI19:05
keith_I see19:05
CosmoHillor in my case, meego :(19:06
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keith_I was hoping it would be able to run the way moblin did19:07
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TSCHAKeee2noooo faiiiir :(19:08
keith_I really liked moblin and was looking forward to trying Meego19:08
TSCHAKeee2keith_: dude, just chill a bit... it's coming19:09
Stskeepskeith_: i will, in time, but development went open now19:09
Stskeepsit19:09
keith_ok thanks19:09
TSCHAKeee2keith_: this is merely the first drop of code into open development19:09
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keith_I'll go back to my Commodore 6419:09
TSCHAKeee2think of it this way, you get to see an operating system19:09
TSCHAKeee2built from the ground up.19:09
TSCHAKeee2and be able to participate in its development.19:10
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Stskeepsslaine: last moblin supporting poulsbo was 2.0?19:10
slaine2.119:10
slainewith the IVI release19:11
TSCHAKeee2does anyone know where I could get my hands on some moorestown development hardware?19:11
keith_what about the broadcom wireless issue that exsisted with Moblin, will that be resolved?19:11
slaineStskeeps: http://moblin.org/projects/2.1-ivi-project-releases19:11
slainekeith_: If I have anything to do with it, yes :)19:11
keith_sweet19:12
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slainekeith_: in the mean time, if you're using moblin 2.1, you can use my repo's for the broadcom stuff19:12
keith_I got the wireless on my mini 9 to work by switching to an intel card but I really don't want to do any hardware swapping19:12
slainepity you didn't follow my howtow19:13
slaineI've a mini919:13
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* microlith goes to load meego on his aspire one19:13
keith_slaine I tried your howto but there was some issue that kept it from working for me19:13
slainebummer19:14
slaineI'm on IRC most days19:14
keith_the wifi card swap worked much easier19:14
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TSCHAKeee2is it simply not possible for non-first-tier vendors to get their hands on moorestown dev hardware?19:16
keith_the image file in the repository is named ".usbimg" I had to rename it to ".img"19:16
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keith_thanks for the info folks!19:22
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kanibalvCan anybody answer me, what will happend with all those .deb application written for Maemo????19:25
drizztbsdkanibalv: adios19:25
kanibalvnooo!!!!19:25
thiagothe OBS infrastructure replaces all of them19:25
kanibalvOBS????19:26
thiagoOpenSUSE Build Service19:26
kanibalvthat just stupid!!!!!19:26
thiagoorno19:26
thiagoor not19:26
kanibalvyears in the trash19:26
evilrob.deb is just a packaging method.19:26
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evilrobthey can be repackaged19:26
* TSCHAKeee2 just shakes his head19:27
TSCHAKeee2IT'S JUST A PACKAGE FORMAT!19:27
kanibalvyes, by whom?19:27
kanibalvnot me!19:27
thiagothe internal Maemo infrastructure for .deb was a big hack anyway19:27
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TSCHAKeee2kanibalv: you are getting all whacked out of shape over nothing.19:27
kanibalvwhy?19:27
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TSCHAKeee2there are bigger issues to solve19:27
thiagowe're talking about the infrastructure, not the packaged applications.19:27
TSCHAKeee2than, gee, what archive format and metadata is going to be used19:27
thiagothe packaged applications just need to be repackaged.19:27
MiXu-TSCHAKeee2: Amen. I don't understand the whole fuss about rpm vs deb19:28
kanibalvrepackaged by whom?19:28
CosmoHillcompiling a kernel for virtual box shouldn't be so hard19:28
evilrobI'd expect the package maintainers will repackage them19:28
TSCHAKeee2MiXu-: I started with linux before there was a standardized distribution, and have used all the different "package" formats... they all do the same thing... they all make the same patterns of mistakes in different variations... it really...does not...matter....19:29
TSCHAKeee2:)19:29
kanibalvevilrob, that's so not going to happend!!19:29
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evilrobkanibalv: then sell your phone and quit whining, or get off your ass and writ ethe repackager19:29
TSCHAKeee2kanibalv: thank you for being so rational19:29
TSCHAKeee2really19:29
TSCHAKeee2we need more people like yo...wait..no we don't.19:29
TSCHAKeee2:)19:29
kanibalvevilrob, don't be stupid19:30
JaffaYay! MeeGo booting in qemu on Windows :-)19:30
evilrobI have an rpm based box on the left side of my desk and a .deb based box on the right side.19:30
MiXu-TSCHAKeee2: I'm a deb guy, but it's like any other thing. It'll take you maybe a couple of hours to learn and that's it.19:30
TSCHAKeee2kanibalv: this is a meritocracy19:30
kanibalvI just for all applications that are already there19:30
TSCHAKeee2kanibalv: if you see a problem, fix it. don't whine.19:30
evilrobI routinely install .deb's on the rpm-based one, and rpms on the .deb based one19:30
TSCHAKeee2remember, that all of the stuff in the maemo repositories gets built by a builder19:31
TSCHAKeee2what does that tell you?19:31
TSCHAKeee2come on...19:31
TSCHAKeee2you can do it...19:31
TSCHAKeee2put two and two together...19:31
kanibalvlike with alien evilrob??19:31
TSCHAKeee2i can...almost see...the lightbulb come on, you can do it kanibalv....19:31
TSCHAKeee2:)19:31
evilrobhttp://www.google.com/search?q=convert+deb+rpm19:31
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evilrobyes.  like with alien19:31
TSCHAKeee2kanibalv: so really, just chill.19:32
kanibalvit's just sad for all those applications19:32
thiagono it's not19:32
thiagothey just need to be repackaged19:32
* TSCHAKeee2 watches the point fly completely over kanibalv's head19:32
evilrobif a package maintainer wants their package used going forward, they can produce both formants19:32
kanibalvall that work needs to be rebuild19:32
kanibalvrepackaged19:32
thiagoyes19:32
thiagowhich isn't hard19:32
TSCHAKeee2it's not hard in the slightest19:32
TSCHAKeee2and with build servers, that can be automated19:33
thiagomuch better build servers, I might add19:33
TSCHAKeee2this is merely a logistical problem19:33
kanibalvok19:33
TSCHAKeee2not a technical one in the least.19:33
* TSCHAKeee2 hands kanibalv a happy pill.19:33
kanibalvthanks19:33
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TSCHAKeee2trust me, meego has bigger issues19:34
TSCHAKeee2much bigger ones19:34
TSCHAKeee2this one's easy.19:34
kanibalvitś just because a plataform is bigger and good by their applications19:35
TSCHAKeee2o_O19:36
TSCHAKeee2*Scratch-head*19:36
TSCHAKeee2i thought we were all on the same side19:36
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kanibalvand a good plataform with no applications is nothing19:36
TSCHAKeee2hm19:36
TSCHAKeee2silly me19:36
* thiago decides not to go into this discussion *again*19:36
thiagothe decision is made.19:36
TSCHAKeee2mhmm19:36
thiagowe don't need to discuss DEB vs RPM every week.19:36
kanibalvthiago ok19:36
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TSCHAKeee2thiago: maybe a canned-bot would help here19:37
* thiago points to infobot 19:37
TSCHAKeee2thiago: that scans for the words WHY RPM and DEB19:37
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TSCHAKeee2:P19:37
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TSCHAKeee2oh ok19:37
TSCHAKeee2:)19:37
* TSCHAKeee2 laughs19:37
kanibalvis not the package format I'm talking about is for applications availability19:37
TSCHAKeee2...19:37
TSCHAKeee2it's linux19:38
* TSCHAKeee2 looks19:38
TSCHAKeee2lots of apps for linux last time i looked19:38
thiagoif an application is needed, package it, done.19:38
TSCHAKeee2almost two decades worth19:38
kanibalvok, thanks19:38
* TSCHAKeee2 does his Harvey Keitel in Reservoir Dogs impression, "IT'S GONNA BE OKAAAAAY!!!"19:39
TSCHAKeee2;)19:39
TSCHAKeee2(yes, I am a smartass) ;)19:40
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CosmoHillcosmo@meander:~/linux-2.6.33.1$ time (make -j15 ARCH=i386; )19:41
CosmoHill:)19:41
tripzeroj15 eh?19:42
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tripzerohow many cores you got hiding in that beast CosmoHill19:42
CosmoHill819:42
tripzerowouldn't make -j9 be faster?19:42
TSCHAKeee2heheheh19:42
* thiago uses -j6019:42
TSCHAKeee2i'm jealous19:42
CosmoHillthiago: :o19:42
tripzerothiago, compile farm?19:42
tripzeroicecc ftw19:42
thiagoyes19:43
TSCHAKeee2i've not used icecc19:43
evilrobjsut use "-j" it will fire off as many is the makefile will allow19:43
TSCHAKeee2is that like distcc?19:43
thiagobut not icecream19:43
thiagoTSCHAKeee2: better, since it has a scheduler19:43
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evilrobmight wedge your box, but what's the fun in that if you don't try  :)19:43
TSCHAKeee2thiago: oh nice, that was something i wanted out of distcc :D19:43
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* thiago wonders why19:44
thiagoicecream has existed for at least 6 years19:44
CosmoHillreal    2m2.577s19:44
tripzerochocolate icecream is a bit newer19:44
TSCHAKeee2thiago: because, I work on a large project (LinuxMCE) as one of the core devs.. we did use distcc for a while, but ran into weird little problems.19:44
TSCHAKeee2(which really, had more to do with the bizarre setups of my own than anything else... no fault but my own.) :)19:45
TSCHAKeee2I am currently investigating moving the entire LinuxMCE stack (DCE) and reengineering our Orbiter distributed UI using Clutter, putting it all atop MeeGo as a "House UX"19:46
tripzerothiago, i imagine you do a lot of compiling qt?19:46
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thiagotripzero: yes19:46
tripzeroin that case -j60 would be very nice to have :)19:47
TSCHAKeee2I have to churn through a little over a million lines of code, regularly in our own code base.19:47
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nhamoudiHello - does anyone know when source code for layers on top of middleware layer will be available? Looking for example for the telephony stack19:48
thiagonhamoudi: ofono is already available19:49
thiagobut that's still at the middleware layer19:49
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* CosmoHill twitches19:52
TSCHAKeee2people REAAAALLLY wanna get meego running on their n900's huh?19:52
TSCHAKeee2;)19:52
* TSCHAKeee2 is also an n900 user.19:52
CosmoHillmeego is just fucking with me19:52
TSCHAKeee2this is what happens when you give the kids a funny name19:53
TSCHAKeee2:P19:53
slaineStskeeps: what's the problem with the installer ?19:54
TSCHAKeee2they develop small emotional mismatches that develop into full blown adult neuroses19:54
slaineas in, why was is removed from the kickstart file19:54
CosmoHilli tell my server to mount things as rw and it does ro19:54
nhamoudiI'm pretty sure that ofono is not the stack that is running on N900 - it is not yet mature enough.19:55
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thiagothe N900 doesn't run ofono19:56
thiagoMeeGo does19:56
slaineit's installed by default to my knowledge, but they have got it working on the n90019:56
TSCHAKeee2ofono still needs loooooooooooooooooooooooots of work19:56
Stskeepsslaine: hmm?19:56
TSCHAKeee2and i have a feeling it may need some little binary blobs for the gsm parts before it's all over19:56
tripzeroTSCHAKeee2, rely? i thought it was getting pretty close?19:57
TSCHAKeee2tripzero: has it matured in the last couple of months?19:57
TSCHAKeee2I need to check again19:57
TSCHAKeee2i am very interested in it.19:57
Stskeepsslaine: in the developer images it's meant to be as close to OBS packages, it isn't the old 'developer tools' ones19:57
nhamoudithere are already images for N900 w/ Meego (http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/devel/n900/images/) so are you saying that Ofono is part of this meego...?19:57
tripzeroofono is part of meego19:57
TSCHAKeee2nhamoudi: dude, if you're asking this question19:57
TSCHAKeee2nhamoudi: it is too early for you to participate.19:58
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TSCHAKeee2nhamoudi: there isn't much more than the base system and X running on the n900 images.19:58
redI have a error about missing dependencies, libqtcore for one19:58
slaineStskeeps: I don't follow ?19:58
Stskeepsslaine: installer problem?19:58
redtrying to use apt-get -f to fix them doesnt do anything19:58
* Stskeeps is missing context19:58
redoops, was supposed to talk in #maemo :)19:59
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milliamsred: Careful with that "apt-get" talk in here :)19:59
nhamoudiTSCHAkee2: thanks19:59
slaineStskeeps: it seems it's got failed deps20:01
slaineinstaller pulls in system-config-date which pulls in gnome-python-canvas which ain't there20:02
CosmoHillyay20:02
Stskeepsslaine: not involved with that sorry20:02
CosmoHilli got something to compress it20:02
slainecareful kid, you could go blind20:02
Stskeepsslaine: report as bug i guess20:03
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slaineStskeeps: yup20:05
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rascalhi all!20:07
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CosmoHillrawr!20:07
rascali m running meego on my netbook but i don t remember login localhost and password..... could u help me please. it s in the first boot step on "live usb"20:08
CosmoHilltry "root" as the username20:08
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redmilliams: yes I was talking on wrong channel :)20:09
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redkeybind for meego/maemo next to eachother20:10
rascalok first step  root and next? password?20:10
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thiagomeego20:10
rascalok login root and pass meego20:11
rascalnext , i have no gfx interface20:11
thiagostart X now20:12
rascalhow to start the desktop please? start X dont work ..... :(20:13
CosmoHillstartx20:13
thiagowhat desktop?20:13
thiagoyou can start X20:13
thiagoyou can even run xterm inside it20:13
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rascalxterm , no20:14
rascalcommand not found20:14
rascalstrange ?20:15
CosmoHillthiago: do you know what controls the boot loader?20:15
thiagono20:15
CosmoHillkk20:15
rascalwell20:16
rascal:(20:16
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slaineCosmoHill: what do you mean ?20:16
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CosmoHilllike menu.lst for grub20:16
CosmoHill-.-20:16
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* CosmoHill grabs slaine so he stays in the channel20:17
CosmoHilllike menu.lst for grub20:17
slainesorry20:17
slainecmd+w in the wrong app20:17
rascali try meego on live usb but i cant start gfx interface.....20:17
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rascalneed command20:17
thiagorascal: there is no GUI20:17
thiagothere's X20:17
thiagothat's all20:17
slaineCosmoHill: the liveusb is using sysconfig20:17
CosmoHilltry "startx"20:17
slaineso there should be a syslinux.cfg file20:18
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rascalno gui ..... oh that explain my problem20:18
slainesorry, I said sysconfig above, meant syslinux20:18
slaineforce of habit20:18
NishanthMenonthiago, same "startx" on n900? all i see is http://www.myimagespace.com/public/view/324820:20
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rascalmany thanks , bye bye all !!!! ;)20:21
CosmoHillbye20:21
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NishanthMenonno startx either20:21
slaineI couldn't get X to start20:21
slaineon x8620:21
koupsacan anybody test 'yum install xorg-x11-server'20:21
thiagoNishanthMenon: yes, that's what you get20:21
abhijeethi gues...20:21
slainekoupsa: what happens when you run it20:21
thiagoNishanthMenon: X is already running. You're on an xterm.20:21
abhijeeti want to learn programming in meego.. can anyone help to get set go20:22
NishanthMenonthiago, thx.. i had expected GUI :D20:22
koupsadependance fails20:22
thiagoNishanthMenon: there isn't one yet.20:22
thiagoNishanthMenon: feel free to write one.20:22
thiagoor use an existing one.20:22
Stskeepsslaine: intel side doesn't boot into x afaik20:22
slaineabinader: http://meego.com/developers/getting-started20:22
NishanthMenonthiago, ;) i miss hildon-desktop :)20:22
slaineStskeeps: no, it doesn't, but starting X kills it20:22
thiagothere's no Hildon in MeeGo20:22
abinaderslaine: ?20:22
* NishanthMenon has much to relearn :)20:23
abinaderslaine: i think it's for abhijeet :D20:23
slaineoops, sorry20:23
slaineabhijeet: http://meego.com/developers/getting-started20:23
abhijeetslaine: ok20:23
slaineabinader: sorry20:23
slainetab completion fail20:23
abhijeetguys do you think meego is going to survive in the competition with android.20:23
* CosmoHill creates a squashfs img20:23
abinaderslaine: no prob :D20:24
thiagoabhijeet: the objective is to kill android.20:24
thiagoand the rest of the commpetition :-)20:24
abhijeetthiago: :)20:24
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slaineabhijeet: you're really asking the wrong people20:24
abhijeetslaine: just an opinion.20:24
slaineI personally think meego is doomed to failure, that's why I'm spending all my time here participating :P20:25
CosmoHillhttp://stats.bluesquarelinux.co.uk/index.php?disp=dynamic my poor server20:25
abhijeetslaine: :)20:26
ScorpiionHello everyone!20:26
StskeepsSamir Faci in here?20:26
ScorpiionIs Meego a part of GSoC?20:26
thiagoScorpiion: no, but Maemo is20:26
drizztbsdand moblin?20:27
slainedrizztbsd: don't think so20:27
thiagoMaemo submitted as Maemo because the MeeGo name was too new20:28
abhijeeti checked on the QT site and found that there are two version of QT IDE available.. one is 45MB while the other one which mentioned inte meego site is 450MB....i have installed the 45mb version on my ubuntu desktop.... what is the differene between them20:28
thiagotreat it as Meego20:28
thiagoabhijeet: Qt20:28
Scorpiionthiago: yeah I know, but that's a little confusioning since Maemo will be Meego.. :P20:28
thiagowhat exactly did you download?20:28
slaineabhijeet: QT == QuickTime20:28
abhijeetthiago: one sec i will give u the link20:28
lcukabhijeet, the 405mb is padding bytes20:28
lcukto ensure your download isnt damaged in transit20:28
slainelol20:28
slainethe padding may include some useful bytes like demos and docs20:29
lcukthat too20:29
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* thiago goes to the Qt website and finds out that the only thing that is 45 MB is the Qt Creator binary20:31
thiagoso you downloaded the IDE20:31
thiagoyou didn't download Qt, nor the rest of the toolchain20:31
slaineOn your ubuntu desktop all you had to do was apt-get install qtcreator20:32
abhijeetthiago: http://qt.nokia.com/downloads go down to the "Qt Creator IDE"20:32
slaineabhijeet: that's a tool20:32
slainenot the Qt stack20:32
thiagoyou've got a nice text editor now20:32
slaineOpen a terminal and type in20:32
slainesudo apt-get install qtcreator20:32
slaineit's already packaged in the ubuntu repositories20:33
abhijeetyes.. also my programes are also getting built.20:33
slaineI installed it on my netbook and it works fine20:33
abhijeeti have created small application using that ide...20:33
slainecool20:33
abhijeetit worked...20:33
slaineyou must have had the rest installed20:33
abhijeetmean Qt libraries are already there in my system.20:34
slaineyup20:35
slaineand compilers etc20:35
abhijeetso Qt libraries are 400MB...20:35
abhijeetok20:35
abhijeetthat's quite huge..20:35
slainethere's a lot of documentation too20:35
abhijeetgnome does not need so much library....20:35
slainebut yes, it's a massive set of frameworks20:35
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slaineerm, it probably does, 'cause gnome is a desktop environment and includes a lot of packages20:36
thiagothe Qt libraries aren't that big20:36
slaineand 400Mb is more than just the libs20:36
thiago400 MB includes the compiler toolchain and probably more too20:36
abhijeetok...20:37
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abhijeetso meego applications are same as normal Qt applications...20:39
thiagono20:39
thiagoMeeGo applications are Linux applications20:40
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thiagowhether they are made with Qt or not, it doesn't matter20:40
abhijeetthiago: i did not get you...20:40
thiagook20:41
* TSCHAKeee2 hugs thiago20:41
thiagoMeeGo is Linux. Any Linux application for X11 will run on MeeGo.20:41
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thiago(ok, I'm exaggerating a bit, but you get the point)20:41
abhijeetthiago: yeah.......20:41
thiagonow, we recommend you use Qt20:42
abhijeetthiago: are you a meego professional or what.20:42
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abhijeetthiago: because nokia is in it  :)20:43
* TSCHAKeee2 is still deliberating on whether to use Qt's canvas or Clutter...20:43
* thiago works for Nokia20:43
abhijeetoopsss..20:43
thiagofor Qt Development Frameworks, more precisely20:44
aldenqt > gtk imo20:44
TSCHAKeee2Qt is the only C++ toolkit I can stand20:44
TSCHAKeee2which is ironic as hell, because the project i lead is built entirely on STL *facepalm*20:45
* TSCHAKeee2 goes to bash his skull against a brick wall20:45
abhijeetthiago: so there is a posibility of other tool kits for meebo :like gnome..20:45
abhijeetsince this is linux it can run anything..20:45
TSCHAKeee2abhijeet: dude, you can use whatever the @#($#@($ you want :)20:45
thiagoabhijeet: GNOME is not a toolkit20:45
pippinthiago: and neither is Qt ;)20:46
slaineYou can use Clutter or GTK+ if you like20:46
abhijeetTSCHAKeee2: ok20:46
thiagopippin: heya20:46
slainepippin: Oooooo20:46
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TSCHAKeee2hehehe20:46
slaineThough he's right20:46
slaineit's grown past a toolkit20:46
slaineit's not a set of frameworks20:46
TSCHAKeee2it's...something of a juggerkit20:46
thiagoyou can even use wxWidgets or raw libX11 if you'd like20:46
thiagoMotif20:47
TSCHAKeee2i'd have to shoot the person who still uses Motif20:47
slaineMotif for the win20:47
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TSCHAKeee2put them out of their (#@$#@($@ misery20:47
abhijeetthat's nice..20:47
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abhijeetnot like android.. which is restricting the developers to there apis...20:47
TSCHAKeee2Xt supporters are a bit like the confederate revivalists that do civil war simulations in the US20:47
TSCHAKeee2"someday the south will rise"20:47
pippinthiago: hi :)20:48
TSCHAKeee2*banjo-music*20:48
TSCHAKeee2:P :)20:48
aldenhehe20:48
aldenwhats their argument for sticking with Xt tho?20:48
* CosmoHill is getting somewhere20:48
* slaine is getting no where20:48
mrechmm does meego work with qemu?20:48
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aldenoh yeah, has anyone run meego in a vm yet?20:49
slainemrec: the arm one does20:49
thiagonow, use the toolkit you think is best for you20:49
mrecI'm getting a pci bus error with qemu20:49
slainethe x86 one has kernel issues in VirtualBox for me20:49
slainenot spent any time investigating20:49
TSCHAKeee2I really love the way clutter works as far as its canvas20:50
mrecslaine: something like pci kernel error?20:50
TSCHAKeee2I can't wait to see how Qt's equivalent works...20:50
aldenslaine: the atom netbook image?20:50
slainesomething liek that20:50
slaineyes20:50
mrecslaine: then I'm getting the same with qemu20:50
slaineinteresting20:50
slainelog a but20:50
slainebug even20:50
CosmoHillI've been focusing on the actually image itsell and not the live image20:50
CosmoHilloh ohh oh holy shit20:53
CosmoHillI have a shell20:53
CosmoHillI have a meego shell in virtual box20:53
aldenCosmoHill: nice :)20:54
CosmoHillnot quiet there yet20:54
CosmoHillneed to sort out20:55
CosmoHill  INSTALL arch/x86/kernel/test_nx.ko20:55
CosmoHill  INSTALL drivers/scsi/scsi_wait_scan.ko20:55
lcukCosmoHill, now, to make a call on real device, its simple!20:56
lcukyou just have to login, cd /usr/bin;  make-a-call < /home/users/contacts/friends/mom.contact20:56
* TSCHAKeee2 thwaps lcuk :P :)20:56
lcuk:D20:57
TSCHAKeee2good thing you didn't put that on the maemo forums20:57
TSCHAKeee2or they'd be trying it20:57
TSCHAKeee2"DAMN IT, IT DOESN'T WORK!"20:57
TSCHAKeee2"NOKIA SUCKS!"20:57
* TSCHAKeee2 shakes head20:57
lcuk:)20:58
TSCHAKeee2i watched20:58
TSCHAKeee2as almost hundreds of people20:58
Shapeshifterlcuk: that works?20:58
TSCHAKeee2went to the meego site, and downloaded the image20:58
TSCHAKeee2and flashed their bricks, and shriek in sheer terror, as their brick became a brick :P20:58
TSCHAKeee2:)20:58
* lcuk prefers to think of users as valuable assets20:58
CosmoHillerm20:59
TSCHAKeee2"WHAT IS THIS WHITE WINDOW WITH WORDS?! WHERE ARE THE PICTURES?!?!"20:59
TSCHAKeee2:P :)20:59
CosmoHillwhat FS is initrd0.img ?20:59
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mrecgood to know that meego uses 2.6.33.120:59
mrecthe release which is fucked up by suse :(20:59
TSCHAKeee2CosmoHill: probably the initrd format21:00
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CosmoHillan initrd is a small image that is loaded with the kernel21:03
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arauhoanybody testing the netbook image here?21:08
slaineyes21:09
aldenCosmoHill is21:09
aldenand slaine21:09
aldenim still downloading :(21:09
slainenot really a lot we can do21:09
arauhoslaine: any way to get a gui working there in the current state of things?21:09
arauhomm,, i see21:09
* CosmoHill is also eating dinner21:09
slainethere's lots of stuff almost there, but lots of stuff missing that breaks it21:09
cyberkonsultI was booting it on a netbook with a celeron processor! Worked!! Tryed to boot in VirtualBox , fail.21:10
aldenCosmoHill, after you get it running in VirtualBox, maybe u could blog the steps to get it working?21:10
cyberkonsults/Tryed/Tried21:10
slaineinteresting21:10
slaineis that a newish celeron ?21:11
cyberkonsultyes, acer 141021:11
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DawnFosteralden - how's the download speed?21:11
mrecI'll try replacing the kernel + initrd image21:12
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DawnFosterI think we got some additional mirroring set up to handle the load - is it helping?21:12
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cyberkonsultslaine: 'Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU  743  @ 1.30GHz'21:13
slainecan you cat /proc/cpuinfo21:14
slaineand paste the cpuflags somewhere please21:14
cyberkonsultslaine: sure, couple of rows there...21:15
aldenDawnFoster: yesterday was 4.6KB/s now getting 30KB/s21:15
aldenDawnFoster: and im on 256 so thats good..21:15
DawnFosteralden: ok, good. I was getting worried.21:16
DawnFosteralden: glad to hear it's better today21:16
cyberkonsultVirtualBox couln't boot the image.. (usb-image) working on fooling VB to think its a HD..21:16
aldenDawnFoster: yeah.. maybe next time we should have a torrent?21:16
CosmoHillhey DawnFoster21:16
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DawnFosterhey cosmohill21:17
CosmoHillhmm21:18
CosmoHillcrap21:18
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CosmoHilltwo of the servers I'm using don't want to talk to each other21:18
DawnFosteralden: I'll ask about torrents. I think there was a reason we didn't do that, but not sure about the details.21:18
CosmoHillDawnFoster: I'm working on meego for virtual box21:19
CosmoHillI think I'm about one server connection away from fixing this21:19
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DawnFosterCosmoHill: cool!21:20
lcukDawnFoster, for the nokia images i can see the eula section getting in the way  but for free images i dont think that matters?21:20
aldenCosmoHill: how are u booting?21:20
CosmoHillI converted the usbimg image to a vdi image like slaine told me too21:20
CosmoHillI'm then access parts of that image via a livecd and making changes21:20
slaineDawnFoster: I'm getting 14Kb/s from the repo's21:21
CosmoHillTSCHAKeee2: you're right, it was an initrd format (cpio gunzip)21:21
DawnFosterslaine: ick. that doesn't sound good. what's your connection speed?21:21
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slaine4Mb leased line21:22
DawnFosterslaine: yeah, not good.I'll let them know.21:22
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slainewas getting full bandwidth on downloading the image this morning (UTC)21:22
slainethis is from the yum repo's though (think it's the same server)21:23
mrecI'm able to boot meego with the ubuntu kernel lol21:23
mreclittle bit fiddling around but it seems to work21:24
slaineDawnFoster: scrap that21:24
slaineI just logged into the firewall and someone's obviously left something downloading21:24
slaineas it's maxed out there21:24
aldenmrec: nice :)21:25
slaineI bet I know who it is too21:25
DawnFosterslaine: oh good (for me maybe not for you) :)21:25
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DawnFosterwe were afraid something with the mirrors was screwed up.21:26
slaineI figured I'd better check the local net first before you go bothering mshaver21:26
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DawnFosterI was already on IM with mrshaver (as usual) - he's also happy that it was on your end, not ours :)21:27
slaineTell him sorry for the false alarm21:27
DawnFosterslaine: will do.21:28
slaineActually, can you ask him about mirror requests21:28
DawnFosterlet me see if he can pop into irc21:28
slaineI got someone from http://ftp.heanet.ie/ to contact him last year about mirroring Moblin21:29
slaineIt never happened21:29
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slaineI'd like to see an Irish mirror of MeeGo if possible21:30
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DawnFosterslaine: I have to drop off IRC for a bit, but it looks like mrshaver is here for you :)21:33
mrshaverslaine: how are things?21:34
slainesweet, thanks DawnFoster21:34
slainemrshaver: not too bad21:34
slaineI know you're probably crazy busy21:34
mrshavernot sure I'm the right person, but I can try to answer mirror questions21:34
slaineWell, not sure if you remember, but last year, I tried to get a mirror for moblin setup with the guys at http://ftp.heanet.ie/21:35
slaineI was given your contact details iirc and passed them on, Gareth Eason was probably the chap that contacted you21:35
mrshaverI do recall that21:35
slainecool21:35
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slaineWell, basically, wondering if we could try again for Meego and the repo's etc.21:35
slainenot sure how the mirrors are structured21:36
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slaineis it feasible even ?21:36
mrshaverI don't know exactly what is planned at this point, but we are much better prepared this time to accept additional mirrors21:36
mrshaverwe'll also be mirroring on kernel.org, like moblin was21:37
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mrshavertheir mirror network is smart and will pick the correct mirror for location21:37
slaineyeah, I'm not sure how the kernel.org mirrors work. heanet have a mirror of kernel.org, but mirrors.kernel.org seems like different infrastructure21:37
slaineand I'm not sure there is a local node for that.21:38
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mrshaverI don't know exactly where their nodes are?21:38
slaineme neither21:38
slainewe'll broach this again if there's a need21:38
mrshaverbut they are bandwidth heavy, which is good21:38
slainethanks for you're time21:38
CosmoHillrawr!21:38
mrshaverslaine:  np21:39
aldenmrshaver: we should put up a torrent21:39
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CosmoHilldamn thing21:39
slaineheanet have tonnes of bandwidth and space and are only a hop or two away from me, so that's nice :)21:39
mrshaveralden: it was discussed with moblin and it's worth exploring for Meego for sure21:39
CosmoHillthe initrd0 was vfat21:40
CosmoHillbut not it's not21:40
milliamsIs it possible to install one of the images from http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/devel/trunk/images/ in VirtualBox?21:41
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CosmoHillmilliams: I've been on it since lunch time :(21:42
prenzohi, has anyone tried meego on atom yet?21:43
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aldenCosmoHill: you accessed parts of the image from livecd?21:43
CosmoHillyes21:43
aldenCosmoHill: livecd is a tool of some sort?21:43
milliamsCosmoHill: Hmm, ok then. Perhaps for the next image drop they could provide an VB image for us.21:43
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CosmoHillI'm working on a vdi file21:44
prenzowhat do you use to burn an usb?21:44
tripzeroprenzo, dd works21:45
koupsaaprenzo dd21:45
prenzocool21:45
tripzeroalso, ubuntu has a usb image gui thingy21:45
tripzerousb-image-creator or something of the sort21:45
tripzeroit's just a frontend to dd iirc21:45
slainethat's for iso's to usb disks iirc21:45
tripzeronope, that's a different tool21:45
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tripzeroImageWriter21:46
prenzoI'll try it tonight. I'd been trying to download the image since yesterday and I finally got it minutes ago.21:46
aldenusb-creator-gtk21:46
tripzeroding21:46
tripzeroalden wins!21:46
slainepretty sure that takes an iso21:46
aldenwoho!21:46
tripzerooh, yep21:46
prenzohave anyone tried flashnul?21:47
tripzerothat one does take the iso21:47
tripzero2 secs21:47
aldenthe dropdown shows cd imagees and disk images21:47
slaine"Ubuntu Live USB Creator (usb-creator) is an official tool to create Live USBs of Ubuntu from the Live CD or from an iso image. "21:47
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tripzerousb-imagewriter21:47
tripzeroslaine ^^21:47
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slainenever seen that one21:47
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* slaine goes look21:47
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slaineyeah, that's a new one21:48
slainebasic gui over dd as you said21:48
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slaineright, I've been at work for 12 hours now21:49
slaineI think it's time to head21:49
slainecatch you all tomorrow21:50
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aldenlater21:50
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cyberkonsultAt least I got to grub, and started to boot...21:57
* CosmoHill twices21:58
cyberkonsultscreenshot: http://www.cyberkonsult.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/snapshot1.png21:58
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CosmoHillyou're trying to get meego to work on virtual box?22:00
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cyberkonsultYes.. crazy... but it booted on my celeron....22:00
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cyberkonsultCosmoHill, have a real image for me???22:01
CosmoHillno22:02
cyberkonsult;(22:02
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CosmoHilldon't make me hurt you22:02
lbtCosmoHill: what processor do you have?22:02
CosmoHillCore 2 Duo22:02
CosmoHillI have my own kernel22:02
lbtdoes it have ssse3 ?22:02
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cyberkonsultlbt: my celeron 743 got it22:04
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CosmoHillI think so22:04
CosmoHillIt has SSE3 and SSE422:04
CosmoHillit can run moblin22:04
lbt3s's22:05
lbtssse322:05
* microlith boots meego from usb22:05
CosmoHilli know22:05
cyberkonsultmicrolith: WHAT?22:05
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* microlith shudders as he realizes the only way to configure the wireless at this time is via iwconfig22:08
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microlithhmm, only the N900 version has X?22:08
cyberkonsultmicrolith: I only got this far... http://www.cyberkonsult.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/snapshot2.png22:09
cyberkonsultany ideas?22:09
microlithstack dump, nice22:09
microlithoh, you're doing it in virtualbox22:10
cyberkonsultYes, assumed You did to.... :(22:10
microlithno, I booted it on my aspire one22:10
microlithwhich runs an Atom N27022:10
cyberkonsultbooted on a celeron 743 (aspire 1410)22:11
microlithwhat cpu does the virtual box machine have?22:12
TSCHAKeee2well, from that early in the spewage22:12
TSCHAKeee2that would either indicate the host CPU does not have SSE322:12
TSCHAKeee2or22:12
TSCHAKeee2there is ACPI spewage22:12
TSCHAKeee2VirtualBox is a hypervisor22:13
TSCHAKeee2so it exposes whatever CPU the main CPU is22:13
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TSCHAKeee2although, virtualbox exposes its own ACPI stuff22:13
cyberkonsultAh.. will try to turn off ACPI then...22:13
cyberkonsultno change;(22:15
microlithwhat's the cpu of the host?22:15
cyberkonsultceleron 74322:16
microlithoh right22:16
microlithit booted when run directly22:16
cyberkonsultand it boots the usb when run directly too22:16
cyberkonsultso it SHOULD boot in VB22:16
microlithshould, doesn't mean there isn't some subtle compatibility issue22:17
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bfreeanyone manage to get the N900 image working in qemu?   I get "qemu: fatal: VS[LR]I.64 not implemented" at a random time after the (serial) login.  Maybe it really wants a "make install" rather then just ./qemu-system-arm ?22:27
TSCHAKeee2http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/Meego_on_Qemu22:27
mrecI have meego booting up with an ubuntu kernel although it only drops into the meego shell22:28
bfreeTSCHAKeee2: I'm afraid that's what I was trying :-(22:28
RST38hbfree: you have got a wrong cpu arch configured22:28
mrecin a virtual machine22:28
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mrecI guess the initscript isn't complete yet22:28
mrechow can someone start the gui with meego?22:28
mrecI can upload the modified initrd and ubuntukernel for it afterwards22:29
bfreeRST38h: thanks ... I guess it's loading some stuff from the installed qemu which it should be getting from the git compiled one :-/   "man qemu" here I come22:30
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* CosmoHill does a little dance22:31
mrecmeego is a stupid redhat release oh dear22:32
prenzoI'm afraid nobody is going to get a gui yet: "The downloaded images will boot from a USB stick or directly flashed on the device from your Linux PC, but since the MeeGo User Experiences for the usage models mentioned previously are not yet included in today's MeeGo core, these images will boot into terminal.  "22:32
microlithcertainly22:33
microliththe N900 version at least has X11 though...22:33
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CosmoHillon x86 how do I set the screen resolution from the boot menu?22:35
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mrecwell if anyone wants to boot it http://www.sundtek.de/support/syslinux.tar.gz just replace the existing syslinux tree on the usb stick with that one and boot it up with qemu or virtualbox22:38
CosmoHillwhat did you change in it22:38
mrecthe kernel22:38
mrec2.6.33 is shit22:38
mrecthey should at least use 2.6.31 or 2.6.3422:39
CosmoHillwhat did you change in initrd0.img?22:39
mrecit's using an ubuntu kernel with all the modules22:39
CosmoHillI've changed the kernel and can get it to boot into bash only22:39
mrecCosmoHill: 21:32 < prenzo> I'm afraid nobody is going to get a gui yet: "The downloaded  images will boot from a USB stick or directly flashed on the  device from your Linux PC, but since the MeeGo User Experiences  for the usage models mentioned previously are not yet included  in today's MeeGo core, these images will boot into terminal.22:39
CosmoHilli know22:40
CosmoHilli mean like init=/bin/bash22:40
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mrecah22:40
CosmoHillI have /bin and /sbin and bugger all else22:40
mrecwell I replaced the kernel ubuntu is well tested unlike the meego/redhat kernel22:40
CosmoHilland I've been working on his for hours so I'm in a bad mood22:40
mrecCosmoHill: continue with the ubuntu kernel ...22:40
CosmoHillmeh22:41
mrecit's the kernel from ubuntu 9.1022:41
CosmoHillI'm going to uninstall virtual box and it can go fuck itself22:41
mrecthey have all the modules compiled in so it's the best choice22:41
mrecmeego is a hype like all the other linux eeepcs before22:41
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cyberkonsultCosmoHill: I give up as well, mostly bq I cant get VB to log the output of the boot-process...22:41
mrecAcer even shut down their acer aspire one netbook website for the netbook which I have22:41
CosmoHillmy laptop fans are going nuts with bugger all going on22:42
cyberkonsultCosmoHill: Do you know how I can get the messages log from the VB-booting (screenshots doesn't work...)22:43
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CosmoHillnope22:44
CosmoHillif the kernel panics that tends to be it22:44
CosmoHillonly way to log it is via a serial cable22:44
bfreewill vbox do a serial port?22:44
cyberkonsultlol.. eh... not a bad idea.. lol22:44
prenzoI see lots of people complaining all they get is a terminal22:44
CosmoHillterminal is no problem22:45
cyberkonsultterminal was fine... the login meego pw meego to easy to hack...22:45
CosmoHillthe fact that I've wasted half a day pissing about with things that simply just don't want to work annoyes me22:45
prenzowhat is next? have anyone tried any of the repositories? http://meego.gitorious.org/22:45
cyberkonsultGet a Pint, I will22:45
mrechttp://sundtek.de/meego/index.txt meego with virtual machines22:45
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cyberkonsultmrec: Thanks! May try that modded image tomorrow in VirtualBox...22:48
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prenzoGoing for a Pint too. Take care23:00
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trumeeguys any idea if joggler can run meego?23:21
Stskeepstrumee: GMA500 graphics causes a bit of problem but with a bit of xserver hackery, maybe23:22
Stskeepsi just got elilo patches so i can get that part building 'freely' again23:22
trumeeStskeeps:does joggler user GMA500? i have hunting for this info like crazy. no online review mentions the video chipset!23:23
javispedroah, youtube now follows the engadget rule of web development23:24
Stskeepstrumee: OK, so, it has a EFI bios, it's 1.6ghz atom board with ~1 or 2 gb internal MMC, can boot from usb. There's some problems with updated kernel (sound noise) and GMA500 / Poulsbo chipset23:24
Stskeepsyou will need to use IEGD drivers23:25
trumeei hope to run mythtv SD content on this. Any idea if that is possible?23:25
Stskeepsi haven't tested video, personally23:25
Stskeepssaw the ubuntu remix videos?23:25
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trumeeStskeeps: yes i did.23:26
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Stskeepsyou will need to hack this device though to make it any remotely useful though23:27
trumeeStskeeps: what do you mean?23:27
trumeeif i can install some linux distro on it. it should be all good.23:28
Stskeepsas in you need to do considerable leg work yourself :P23:28
Stskeepsbut at 49 pound.. that is a steal23:28
Stskeepsit is not a traditional bios, so :P23:28
RST38hStskeeps: depends on what Atom chip is being used23:29
RST38hStskeeps: on netbooks, there will be an actual BIOS23:29
StskeepsRST38h: no bios, it has efi only23:30
RST38hEFI is pretty advanced as far as these chips go23:30
trumeei dont mind working on it as long it is known that it will work at the end :)23:30
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Stskeepsi have elilo booting a linux kernel and we had gl acceleration with closed source, good enough? (booting from usb)23:32
Stskeepsand some kernel sound issues (electric clicking, we may have a patch)23:32
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trumeeStskeeps: that sounds fantastic. gl accelaration will definitely be needed to run mythtv23:35
TSCHAKeee2yeah, i really wouldn't care23:36
Stskeepsah, 1.33ghz23:36
TSCHAKeee2just as long as GL worked23:36
Stskeepsoh, and it's mono sound23:36
trumeeStskeeps: i guess any linux distro would be good.23:36
TSCHAKeee2oh gee, that's a deal breaker :P23:36
Stskeepsit does have speaker output in back23:36
TSCHAKeee2not :P23:36
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TSCHAKeee2i just want some moorestown hardware :(((23:36
Stskeepsalso, please remember it's connected strictly to DC :)23:36
Stskeepsnot a battery-able device23:37
TSCHAKeee2I would be using it as a nightstand orbiter23:37
trumeeStskeeps:not a fan of ubuntu. will probably like it as a dedicated mythtv client running twm or something.23:37
TSCHAKeee2trumee: http://www.linuxmce.org/ :)23:38
TSCHAKeee2^^ -- the project i work on.23:38
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Stskeepstrumee: yeah, well, boot your own flavour :P23:39
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: can linuxmce connect to a mythtv backend23:39
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TSCHAKeee2trumee: yes, but you should use ours, migrate over the old data23:39
TSCHAKeee2trumee: we are a highly advanced smart home platform.23:39
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TSCHAKeee2which can use either mythtv or vdr for TV functions.23:40
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TSCHAKeee2and do a lot of stuff mythTV could never dream of doing on its own23:40
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: uh, oh! that will be a problem. my backend run gentoo with mythtv 0.2223:40
TSCHAKeee2:)23:40
TSCHAKeee2big deal, the database is migrateable23:40
TSCHAKeee2as is the data.23:40
TSCHAKeee2:)23:40
TSCHAKeee2but whatever23:40
TSCHAKeee2we solve a lot of problems that a lot of people spend years duct taping stuff together23:40
TSCHAKeee2:)23:41
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trumeeTSCHAKeee2: what about the frontend. is there  touchscreen support for the frontend?23:41
TSCHAKeee2trumee: we allow for the use on on-screen, and non-onscreen orbiters of various shapes and sizes23:41
TSCHAKeee2trumee: ranging from using remotes pointed at screen, to dedicated touch screen displays running either on tablets or PDAs, as well as some cell phones.23:42
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TSCHAKeee2trumee: myself, i use a mix of WebDT 366 tablets, and a Nokia N900 that I carry around (I also have a Nokia N810 as backup)23:42
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: can i not install linuxmce in gentoo?  i dont want to get rid of gentoo since it serves other things as well. happy to get rid of mythtv base install and install linuxmce though.23:42
TSCHAKeee2and my old Nokia N70 ran the symbian orbiter23:42
TSCHAKeee2trumee: currently no23:42
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TSCHAKeee2trumee: our system is completely self contained, but can be extended.23:43
lbtTSCHAKeee2: sounds interesting23:43
TSCHAKeee2trumee: the system is intended to be used as an appliance.. set it up and forget about it23:43
lbtTSCHAKeee2: all GPL?23:43
TSCHAKeee2as it controls virtually all of the house23:43
Stskeepslbt: just sent you elilo diff for joggler23:43
TSCHAKeee2lbt: it will be eventually. there are some pieces that are under a pluto public license which prohibits bundling of hardware and software for sale.23:43
lbt\o/23:43
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: i have asterisk/freepbx running on that box (along with nfs server), will it be possible to install these on linuxmce?23:43
TSCHAKeee2sigh23:44
TSCHAKeee2dude23:44
TSCHAKeee2you're not listening23:44
TSCHAKeee2and you're being like a linux geek :)23:44
TSCHAKeee2stop it23:44
TSCHAKeee2trumee: we already provide a complete asterisk system, fully integrated into every single aspect of the house.23:44
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: hmm. need to look at it :)23:44
TSCHAKeee2trumee: this isn't some duct taped together media center23:44
TSCHAKeee2it is a smart home platform23:44
TSCHAKeee2:)23:44
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: your N900 can play live TV from linuxmce backend?23:45
TSCHAKeee2trumee: it has the power to, but we're not going to do that until we re-engineer the entire orbiter infrastructure23:45
TSCHAKeee2trumee: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2176025602905109829&ei=4QW1S6OSE4idlAfQtIimBw&q=linuxmce+demo <-- watch that23:45
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lbtStskeeps: £49 ?23:46
TSCHAKeee2trumee: the system replaces your router, and gateway23:46
TSCHAKeee2trumee: and becomes your central file server for the entire house23:46
Stskeepslbt: http://www.hotukdeals.com/item/646001/o2-joggler-49-99-now-with-free-app-23:46
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Stskeepsfound 1 day 7 hours ago, so not april fools :P23:47
trumeeStskeeps: i might go into an O2 shop to buy it tomorrow. any idea if it is available instore?23:48
Stskeepsno clue.23:48
Stskeepsi'm living in poland23:48
lbtStskeeps: what's the boot time on Joggler ? is it still the orig kernel?23:48
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Stskeepslbt: i just got it booting straight to elilo (without keyboard)23:48
Stskeepslbt: i haven't gotten any meego material on there yet23:49
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lbtat £50 it becomes a remote control23:49
Stskeepsyeah23:49
TSCHAKeee2i could port the linuxmce orbiter to the joggler pretty easily.. my problem is, trying to get one here in the US...23:50
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lbtTSCHAKeee2: I'll ship you one :)23:50
lbtseriously23:50
TSCHAKeee2lbt: okay23:50
TSCHAKeee2lbt: I am spending our next dev cycle to port LinuxMCE to run atop MeeGo23:51
TSCHAKeee2so that we can shed a lot of the stuff we won't need anymore23:51
tremnite all, sweet dreams23:51
TSCHAKeee2and push more stuff upstream23:51
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TSCHAKeee2MeeGo is the PERFECT system stack for LinuxMCE23:51
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lbtTSCHAKeee2: PM23:55
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: saw the video,  this looks like powerfull stuff. can i have linuxmce frontend on my regular gentoo box, or do i need to wipe out the disk like the backend?23:55
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: i use my desktop as mythfrontend sometimes.23:55
TSCHAKeee2trumee: well, we provide diskless boot for what we call "media directors"23:56
TSCHAKeee2this is an intrinsic part of the system23:56
TSCHAKeee2where it boots up into the LinuxMCE stack, with Orbiter as the environment.23:56
trumeeTSCHAKeee2: so i connect a regular mythtv frontend to talk to a linuxmce backend?23:56
TSCHAKeee2dude23:57
trumee /s/connect/cannot connect/23:57
TSCHAKeee2you are thinking WAY TOO HARD23:57
TSCHAKeee2stop it23:57
TSCHAKeee2:P :)23:57
TSCHAKeee2you can23:57
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TSCHAKeee2but our system takes care of everything so you wouldn't HAVE to duct tape things like that23:57
trumeeah! that is good. cant imagine wiping all my PC's to install linuxmce!23:57
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