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| Dantonic | Hey can I video call with google talk from my N800? | 00:03 |
|---|---|---|
| MaceN8x0 | no | 00:04 |
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| wiretapped | To other N800s, yes | 00:04 |
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| MaceN8x0 | not to google talk on a pc | 00:04 |
| lardman | or n810/N900 | 00:04 |
| wiretapped | yeah | 00:04 |
| wiretapped | you can video call a pc with gizmo iirc | 00:04 |
| wiretapped | i know i did once, but it was with a beta gizmo for pc that they later pulled... | 00:05 |
| wiretapped | but i'd hope they've released it by now | 00:05 |
| ArSa | quality really blows though, i did try that too. | 00:05 |
| wiretapped | yeah | 00:05 |
| ArSa | poor n800 can't handle video+audio compression well together, i guess | 00:06 |
| Dantonic | :( but why | 00:07 |
| Dantonic | how sad | 00:07 |
| MaceN8x0 | hey | 00:07 |
| lardman | I didn't think it was too bad, if the network holds up | 00:07 |
| MaceN8x0 | i got a processing email from ai | 00:07 |
| Dantonic | what if I put a google talk friend on gizmo still can't do it? | 00:08 |
| Dantonic | I mean add a friend | 00:08 |
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| ArSa | lardman i tested it on lan of course | 00:12 |
| lardman | I used it on a dodgy connection in India talking to my wife in England, wasn't great, but worked | 00:12 |
| ArSa | Dantonic i think google uses something propriatary for voice/video - you can do xmpp with any client on n8xx, but video/audio are not compatible | 00:13 |
| ArSa | not propriatary, but not widely supported either | 00:13 |
| ArSa | jingle, more specificaly | 00:13 |
| ArSa | hm... | 00:14 |
| ArSa | upon more reading, it should work :) | 00:15 |
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| lardman | lcuk: | 00:18 |
| lardman | lcuk: ping even | 00:18 |
| lardman | :) | 00:18 |
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| lardman | hmm, libcurl doesn't seem able to download pages that don't either have a name or a trailing slash | 00:27 |
| lardman | e.g. http://www.bbc.co.uk/ works, but http://www.bbc.co.uk doesn't | 00:27 |
| woglinde | hm | 00:27 |
| woglinde | maybee its documented | 00:27 |
| lardman | yeah, just looking through now | 00:28 |
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| lardman | doens't help with the odd Amazon urls anyway | 00:28 |
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| lardman | http://curl.haxx.se/libcurl/c/simple.html seems to say that it should work mind you | 00:29 |
| lardman | am getting CURLE_COULDNT_RESOLVE_HOST | 00:30 |
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| lbt | has anyone heard of any privacy/security framework on maemo5 ? | 00:35 |
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| lardman | interesting, that example I linked above also fails with the same error message | 00:37 |
| lardman | not the best choice of example me thinks | 00:37 |
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| lardman | hmm, very odd | 00:43 |
| Jaffa | Hmm, if I want to show a HildonEntry as being disabled, set_property('editable', false) doesn't seem to do it. It *becomes* uneditable but it looks unchanged | 00:43 |
| lardman | must be something wrong on my end I'd assume | 00:43 |
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| frals | sure you got net access where you compile? | 00:45 |
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| frals | err, run even | 00:46 |
| lardman | yeah, that's what screwed up that test | 00:46 |
| lardman | strange though | 00:46 |
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| Jaffa | Aha! The "sensitive" property is what I want | 00:47 |
| lardman | this won't work though, but no error messages: http://maemo.pastebin.com/m7ce16a0a | 00:47 |
| lardman | I wonder if the code isn#t handling redirects | 00:47 |
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| crashanddie | damn | 00:50 |
| * crashanddie just noticed his company lost a pretty major case | 00:50 | |
| frals | lardman: did you forget to set CURLOPT_ERRORBUFFER? | 00:52 |
| lardman | not the one you were singlehandedly handling? | 00:52 |
| lardman | frals: do I need to set that? | 00:53 |
| frals | http://curl.haxx.se/libcurl/c/curl_easy_perform.html | 00:53 |
| lardman | no I didn't set it, just looked up the error code | 00:53 |
| lardman | ah much better | 00:53 |
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| lardman | didn't have re-directs turned on | 00:53 |
| woglinde | hehe | 00:54 |
| frals | :) | 00:54 |
| lardman | no idea why I was suffering from those CURLE_COULDNT_RESOLVE_HOST errors (from N800 with net connection) | 00:54 |
| Jaffa | Quick poll: preference dialogue containing Twitter username field. Auto-capitalisation on (default for HildonEntry) or off? | 00:54 |
| lardman | anyway at least I'm now getting the page I was after rather than an empty buffer :) | 00:54 |
| lardman | off | 00:54 |
| frals | off | 00:54 |
| lardman | 2-0, the off's have it | 00:55 |
| Jaffa | aye | 00:55 |
| Jaffa | carried | 00:55 |
| lardman | :) | 00:55 |
| frals | :) | 00:55 |
| lardman | you know you'll get a bug filed against that now | 00:55 |
| RST38h | http://gizmodo.com/5370341/mit-scientist-explains-oleds-by-electrocuting-a-pickle | 00:55 |
| lardman | looks pretty | 00:56 |
| lardman | hope most screens last longer, with fewer drips and smoke | 00:56 |
| crashanddie | lardman, I don't do law | 00:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, Symbian. | 00:57 |
| crashanddie | lardman, we filed patent infringement against one of our main competitors (in the smart card market) | 00:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | What's the process to get an application into the Ovi Store, by the way? | 00:57 |
| MaceN8x0 | ovi store? | 00:57 |
| * lardman hopes Amazon don't get annoyed with his continued downloads of a single page | 00:58 | |
| frals | GeneralAntilles: https://publish.ovi.com/login | 00:58 |
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| crashanddie | (for any ActivIdentity lawyer wanting to sue me for discussing this, it has been made public, everything is public as disclosed by the US District Court of Northern California, as per: http://biddle.us/uploads/Actividentity_11SEP09.pdf) | 00:58 |
| crashanddie | (cover-my-ass-move because this is a logged channel) | 00:59 |
| frals | lardman: one option is to host the file locally while testing the parser etc... ;) | 00:59 |
| lardman | crashanddie: and on that note, I'd give up, as lawyers are always most interested trying to pick holes | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | frals, wait, it costs money? | 00:59 |
| lardman | frals: indeed, thanks :) | 00:59 |
| frals | GeneralAntilles: yeah :& | 01:00 |
| frals | :/* | 01:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe | 01:00 |
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| RST38h | FAIL | 01:00 |
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| RST38h | Has NGage died by the way? | 01:00 |
| frals | hmm... VAT registration number in EU or TIN number in India. Must not exceed 20 characters. | 01:00 |
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| frals | wtf | 01:00 |
| frals | doesnt really encourage individuals to publish their homemade stuff that way, imo | 01:01 |
| RST38h | Ah who cares | 01:01 |
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| lardman | 20 chars is quite a few combinations | 01:02 |
| RST38h | <sleep> | 01:02 |
| frals | btw ive loaded 3 seconds worth of that oled video now.. was it any good? :P | 01:02 |
| crashanddie | lardman, I recently had a customer for our authentication server | 01:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, the My Symbian guy seems to be approaching the whole "but people wont use Extras!" from a Symbian angle. | 01:02 |
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| RST38h | General: fuck him too. | 01:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, well, he's not unreasonable. | 01:02 |
| frals | extras is enabled in the app manager isnt it? | 01:03 |
| crashanddie | lardman, they asked us to modify the product so that they could create usernames of unlimited length, their actual DB is scoped to support usernames of up to 91 characters!! | 01:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm just trying to explain the differences in the two platforms. | 01:03 |
| RST38h | General: exactly. | 01:03 |
| RST38h | He probably does not know what Extras is, because "people" won't even know where they are downloading from | 01:03 |
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| crashanddie | lardman, now, even though I'm very supportive of my customers, I still can't see how they could possibly imagine they're going to need 12812791067037801813535861463920023688420459946581806614898443403166022432027604764790982498471291829168081659764797779319897827300448335930702969743852139590975488 different accounts | 01:04 |
| lardman | crashanddie: wow, lots of typing | 01:04 |
| crashanddie | (yes, that's how many accounts you can create with 91 characters in our product) | 01:04 |
| frals | lol | 01:04 |
| lardman | but they will only use proper sentences of course | 01:05 |
| lardman | for their usernames | 01:05 |
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| crashanddie | I love wolfram alpha | 01:06 |
| crashanddie | gives you the most useless comparisons | 01:06 |
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| crashanddie | it just told me that the number above is roughly ~~ 2.8x10^(-8) x the number of Go positions (~~ 4.6x10^170) | 01:06 |
| lcuk | crashanddie, for your info, the document "covering your ass" is on US lawbooks. since you are based in the UK - thats not quite the same. | 01:06 |
| lcuk | stop now and consult a lwyer | 01:06 |
| * crashanddie has an MA in Law from University of Orleans | 01:07 | |
| lardman | argh, it parsed my local file once, then segfaulted (expected) and now comes up with error #37 | 01:07 |
| lardman | CURLE_FILE_COULDNT_READ_FILE (37) | 01:08 |
| mvz | is there a listing of components in maemo5 which are non-free/closed source? | 01:08 |
| hupper | Hello, can we know for sure that the n900 has ~16 million colours? | 01:08 |
| crashanddie | I'm guessing, lardman, that it can't read the file | 01:08 |
| lardman | I know, but I can, so why can't it!? :) | 01:08 |
| crashanddie | hupper, don't think anyone ever stopped to count them | 01:08 |
| crashanddie | lardman, permissions? | 01:08 |
| lardman | am root | 01:08 |
| lardman | everyone has r anyway | 01:09 |
| crashanddie | lardman, cuz it created some conf file to tell to start at a later point? | 01:09 |
| crashanddie | and it starts from the end? | 01:09 |
| crashanddie | not finding anything else, it says "couldn't read file"? | 01:09 |
| hupper | crashanddie, that means yes, right? | 01:09 |
| lardman | hmm, I don;t think it's that bright | 01:09 |
| luke-jr | mvz: I wish. | 01:10 |
| crashanddie | lardman, well, it's not bright at all, less than 16M colours | 01:10 |
| luke-jr | mvz: I'd say at least the 3D lib | 01:10 |
| johnsq | lardman: try strace to look what it does | 01:10 |
| lardman | strace into libcurl | 01:10 |
| lardman | *shiver* | 01:10 |
| crashanddie | hupper, Nokia is only echoing the spec of the vendor of the screen | 01:10 |
| crashanddie | hupper, so yeah, you can be pretty sure | 01:11 |
| hupper | ok thanks didnt see that info on official pages | 01:11 |
| lcuk | lardman, did the libcurl download to memory work then? | 01:11 |
| johnsq | lardman: there should be much. only system calls | 01:11 |
| lardman | lcuk: yes, once | 01:11 |
| lcuk | o_O only once | 01:12 |
| * lcuk uses it hundreds of times | 01:12 | |
| mvz | luke-jr: some unofficial voices pointed me to imagination GPU drivers, cellular modem firmware, wifi firmware, battery monitoring driver and of course some userspace stuff (skype, flash, etc) | 01:12 |
| crashanddie | anyway, I'm out | 01:12 |
| crashanddie | take care people | 01:12 |
| lardman | actually, there is quite a lot | 01:12 |
| lardman | still running now | 01:12 |
| mvz | luke-jr: would be nice to have a clearer picture though :) | 01:13 |
| lcuk | gnite seb | 01:13 |
| lardman | night crashanddie | 01:13 |
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| frals | nn crashanddie | 01:13 |
| lardman | opens GTK stuff too, which is the problem I imagine | 01:14 |
| mvz | maemo as shipped on n900 seems to be the most free/open mobile platform by far, even if there is still some way to go. at least nokia seems to "get it" :) | 01:14 |
| johnsq | mvz: gps | 01:14 |
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| luke-jr | mvz: if that were all, I might even consider buying one if it was priced lower | 01:26 |
| luke-jr | mvz: but I imagine "battery monitoring driver" means "battery charger" | 01:26 |
| luke-jr | mvz: PC-Z1's platform is more open, isn't it? | 01:26 |
| mvz | that one should be relatively easy to reverse engineer though ;) | 01:26 |
| lcuk | eek | 01:26 |
| lardman | doh! user error as ever on my part | 01:27 |
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| * lcuk gets you some wine | 01:27 | |
| mvz | luke-jk: just found a recent thread on "How much are Nxxx open?" on maemo-developers with some more information, and some bits of (still) educated guessing | 01:28 |
| lardman | sleep would probably be better tbh | 01:28 |
| * lcuk nods | 01:28 | |
| johnsq | any idea why sound on n810/maemo is broken? speaker and headphones are dead. | 01:29 |
| lcuk | volume? | 01:30 |
| * lcuk ducks | 01:30 | |
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| johnsq | lcuk: advance control and app are at highest level | 01:30 |
| lcuk | johnsq, windows solution - tried rebooting? | 01:31 |
| johnsq | gentoo works | 01:31 |
| lcuk | arg | 01:31 |
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| johnsq | lcuk: yea windows way, reflash = new install | 01:33 |
| mvz | looking forward to n900 availability in germany, I'm fairly excited to get one :) | 01:33 |
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| lbt | night all :) | 01:37 |
| VDVsx | lbt, wait...... | 01:38 |
| lbt | k | 01:38 |
| VDVsx | lbt, saw the schedule ? ;) | 01:38 |
| lbt | mmm | 01:39 |
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| lbt | :) | 01:39 |
| VDVsx | +1 beer for VDVsx :P | 01:40 |
| lbt | thank you very much :) | 01:40 |
| * lbt thinks so... | 01:40 | |
| VDVsx | lbt, np | 01:40 |
| lbt | still writing talks... | 01:40 |
| lbt | trying to get johan to collab on the git too | 01:40 |
| lbt | sadly I have a job atm | 01:40 |
| lbt | :( | 01:40 |
| * lbt preferred being unemployed | 01:41 | |
| lbt | but my bank didn't :D | 01:41 |
| lbt | night all (again) | 01:41 |
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| lardman | aah, all working now, thanks all | 01:44 |
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| MaceN8x0 | haha | 01:47 |
| MaceN8x0 | those damn banks | 01:47 |
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| Jaffa | Gah, bah, humbug. Having threading issue with gtk | 01:52 |
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| lardman | have you init'd them? | 01:55 |
| * lardman realises he hadn't called g_thread_init() | 01:57 | |
| Jaffa | gtk.gdk.threads_init() | 01:59 |
| lcuk | what toy are you making this time jaffa? | 01:59 |
| Jaffa | First thing the thread does via gobject.idle_add seems fine, but the second; when I use gtk.Dialog rather than hildon.banner returns from run() but the mainloop seems to stop | 01:59 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: GUI for my Facebook/Twitter info thing -> EDS | 02:00 |
| lardman | you can't interact with the GUI from a thread | 02:00 |
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| lardman | or at least you're not supposed to | 02:00 |
| lcuk | because the user on his thread can do something to the ui whilst the other thread is working | 02:01 |
| Jaffa | lardman: Indeed. That's why I'm using gobject.idle_add and doing the work in the main thread | 02:01 |
| lcuk | and then the universe implodes | 02:01 |
| lardman | ah I see | 02:01 |
| * Jaffa sticks another gtk.main() in, just to see what happens | 02:02 | |
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| Jaffa | Hmm, that makes it work. How odd. | 02:03 |
| * lardman wonders if there's any way to get the gstreamer pipeline to work decently | 02:03 | |
| Jaffa | Yay. Seems all good. | 02:04 |
| lardman | :) | 02:04 |
| Jaffa | Ish. | 02:04 |
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| lardman | ah, well then no point fiddling with priorities then: http://library.gnome.org/devel/glib/unstable/glib-Threads.html#g-thread-init | 02:05 |
| lardman | "On some systems (e.g. Linux) there are no thread priorities." | 02:05 |
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| * lardman wonders if he should plonk a g_thread_yield() right in the middle of the libdmtx code | 02:08 | |
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| lardman | night all | 02:10 |
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| ArtVanda1ae | Hi guys, I'm trying to find some information in regards to this... Since Nokia now owns the Qt toolkit, and I think I've heard about Maemo moving from GTK+ to Qt in the future, does anyone know if the updated Maemo (with Qt) software will be made available to older phones (i.e. the N900 at that point in time)? | 02:16 |
| Jaffa | ArtVanda1ae: Qt is already available for the N900 | 02:16 |
| Jaffa | And the N810 | 02:16 |
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| ArtVanda1ae | Thanks Jaffa . The Maemo interface though, is that currently using GTK+ though? | 02:17 |
| Jaffa | ArtVanda1ae: 99.99% of apps on Maemo are GTK+, yes. | 02:18 |
| Jaffa | ArtVanda1ae: Some of the desktop is done using Clutter, a few apps are Qt, Ovi Maps seems to be something non-Gtk+ (for example) | 02:18 |
| ArtVanda1ae | Alright thanks Jaffa | 02:18 |
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| MaceN8x0 | ovi market? | 02:20 |
| MaceN8x0 | wtf is an ovi market | 02:20 |
| GeneralAntilles | A place where you go to buy Ovis | 02:21 |
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| VDVsx | did I heard Ovnis ? :P (PT for UFO) | 02:22 |
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| fiferboy_n810 | /query zerojay | 02:29 |
| fiferboy_n810 | heh | 02:29 |
| lcuk | fail | 02:30 |
| fiferboy_n810 | rtcomm doesn't do query... | 02:30 |
| lcuk | im surprised any human can remember the /commands to type manually lol | 02:31 |
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| fiferboy_n810 | I think that is the only one I know! | 02:31 |
| fiferboy_n810 | besides nick and quit | 02:31 |
| lcuk | haha how are you tonight | 02:31 |
| lcuk | i have an X and i click my nick to change it :$ | 02:32 |
| fiferboy_n810 | Good. I'm actually on my way out for about an hour | 02:32 |
| fiferboy_n810 | I should be on later | 02:32 |
| lcuk | im munching hula hoops and gonna try sometihng | 02:32 |
| lcuk | sleeping soon tho | 02:32 |
| fiferboy_n810 | I don't know what any of that meant | 02:32 |
| lcuk | :D | 02:33 |
| fiferboy_n810 | sleep I understand | 02:33 |
| lcuk | hula hoops == crisps | 02:33 |
| lcuk | munching == eating | 02:33 |
| fiferboy_n810 | crisps == chips | 02:33 |
| lcuk | no, i had chips with my tea | 02:33 |
| lcuk | (had fish and chips, was lovely) | 02:33 |
| fiferboy_n810 | chips == fries | 02:33 |
| lcuk | ish | 02:34 |
| lcuk | we need star trek autotranslator | 02:34 |
| fiferboy_n810 | we had a cousin from England staying with us a couple weeks ago | 02:34 |
| fiferboy_n810 | 'rubbish' was his favourite word | 02:35 |
| lcuk | haha | 02:35 |
| fiferboy_n810 | Oops, I'm off | 02:35 |
| fiferboy_n810 | Talk to you latee | 02:35 |
| lcuk | cya fifer | 02:35 |
| fiferboy_n810 | s/latee/later/ | 02:35 |
| infobot | fiferboy_n810 meant: Talk to you later | 02:35 |
| fiferboy_n810 | :) | 02:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, you're the only human here. | 02:36 |
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| lcuk | its ok i understand irc ;) | 02:36 |
| lcuk | o_O | 02:36 |
| lcuk | nahh | 02:36 |
| lcuk | im busy | 02:36 |
| lcuk | actually trying to work out how to predownload map | 02:36 |
| lcuk | for amsterdam | 02:36 |
| lcuk | plan of attack so to speak | 02:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just let it handle it on 3G. ;) | 02:40 |
| lcuk | thats what im afraid of | 02:40 |
| lcuk | ive got no credit | 02:40 |
| lcuk | cant afford to get any more | 02:41 |
| lcuk | so need to predownload | 02:41 |
| * lcuk will be off to the mines soon | 02:42 | |
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| Bobthebuilder | hello | 02:45 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Seen the S60 Windows app to predownload Ovi Map data? Presumably it'll stick it on disk somewhere and then it might be copyable | 02:46 |
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| lcuk | Jaffa, i did see it and i might do some poking around | 02:47 |
| lcuk | im actually used to just getting a big png of the city and using that | 02:47 |
| lcuk | but amsterdam has lots of tiny tiny streets so it needs to be bigger than usual | 02:47 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: http://europe.nokia.com/explore-services/ovi-maps/downloads-and-services#map-loader-steps | 02:48 |
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| Tadthebuilder | I guess all of your are excited about going to amsterdam | 02:49 |
| Tadthebuilder | you* | 02:49 |
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| lcuk | Connect your device to your computer via USB or Bluetooth in PC Suite mode and open Map Loader. | 02:49 |
| lcuk | Jaffa, it needs to connect properly | 02:49 |
| * lcuk tries | 02:49 | |
| Jaffa | lcuk: http://handphone-solution.blogspot.com/2009/07/direct-download-for-ovi-maps-30-without.html | 02:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | I have a question.... | 02:50 |
| lcuk | yeah Tadthebuilder | 02:50 |
| andre__ | just ask :) | 02:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | well its actually for you lcuk | 02:50 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Getting Andorra to test ;-) | 02:50 |
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| Tadthebuilder | I know you have been working on a new liqbase | 02:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | will that be for os2008 | 02:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | or only fremantle | 02:51 |
| lcuk | everything i code (barring the accelerometer) is full compatible with n8x0 :) | 02:51 |
| lcuk | and diablo | 02:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah okay, thats good to know. It has not been released yet has it? (maybe Im blind) I love your old stuff and Id love to try your new stuff | 02:52 |
| lcuk | it works solidly on n8x0 because i spent a long time during its initial inception with n8x0 :) | 02:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah | 02:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | that makes sense. | 02:52 |
| lcuk | its in a slightly different repository | 02:52 |
| lcuk | because its not ready - but you are welcome to add the repository and try | 02:52 |
| lcuk | it runs side by side with the original | 02:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay what repository is it in? | 02:53 |
| lcuk | and the sketches are backwards/forwards compatible | 02:53 |
| lcuk | maemo extras-devel | 02:53 |
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| Tadthebuilder | (ive decided i should try more beta software and report to the makers...haha ive been to much of a leech to the community) | 02:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 02:53 |
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| Tadthebuilder | alright ill add that then. Are you looking for bug reports or anything? | 02:53 |
| lcuk | it might be a good idea to start | 02:54 |
| lcuk | a large chunk of the features are there - but the app is being split into multiple distinct apps | 02:54 |
| lcuk | and thats why ive held off | 02:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah I see | 02:54 |
| lcuk | i have been trying to suss out how all this packaging stuff fits together | 02:55 |
| Tadthebuilder | I thought I read something about the that on talk.maemo.org when I did search to see if I could find the program | 02:55 |
| lcuk | yeah - the one major problem i found with the first version | 02:55 |
| lcuk | was having to step over things and worry about other pieces of apps | 02:55 |
| lcuk | when they didnt have anything to do with each other | 02:56 |
| Tadthebuilder | I could see that being a problem | 02:56 |
| Tadthebuilder | (im not a coder, but I get what your saying) | 02:56 |
| Tadthebuilder | so multiple more streamedline apps tied together with a interface may be more efficient? | 02:56 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: Taking the Andorra zip off that page, unzipping it to cities/ (but not overwriting stuff already there) lets me zoom *right* in to a small street in Andorra, in offline mode. | 02:56 |
| lcuk | yeah - it means that i could create onedotzero (for instance) without worryign about making changes to calendar | 02:57 |
| lcuk | Jaffa, :) | 02:57 |
| Tadthebuilder | understood | 02:57 |
| Tadthebuilder | thanks for all the stuff you have done for the platform. Let me know if I can help with anything (test etc) with any of your programs | 02:57 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: searching seems fubar though | 02:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | Im bobthebuilder on talk.maemo.org (bobthebuilder was taken on freenode) | 02:58 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: Does Ovi Maps allow favourites btw? | 02:58 |
| lcuk | Tadthebuilder, heh :) im sure in the coming weeks ill make another announce of stuff | 02:58 |
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| lcuk | with everything nice and clear | 02:58 |
| lcuk | Jaffa, not sure | 02:59 |
| lcuk | only fired it up once | 02:59 |
| lcuk | when i didnt have net | 02:59 |
| lcuk | and havent looksed since | 02:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | any way have a nice day/night or whatever time it is where you are. Talk to you later | 02:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | bye | 02:59 |
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| lcuk | thanks bob :) | 02:59 |
| lcuk | gnite | 02:59 |
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| lcuk | Jaffa, no amsterdam download tho | 03:00 |
| lcuk | can we coax one out of the server | 03:00 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: There's a Netherlands one | 03:01 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: http://static.s2g.gate5.de/map5/maploaderzip-00.01.22.103/11212.zip | 03:01 |
| lcuk | just grabbing now to see | 03:01 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: I can't find any way of saving a search; or a location any time I've tried it :( | 03:05 |
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| Jaffa | Why aren't I in bed yet? | 03:05 |
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| lcuk | :) | 03:05 |
| lcuk | are the map folders visible on usb | 03:06 |
| Jaffa | lcuk: yes | 03:07 |
| lcuk | that might be faster then lol | 03:07 |
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| Macer | blah | 03:08 |
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| lcuk | thanks jaffa :) i think having you in the community is better than hid away ;) | 03:08 |
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| Jaffa | lcuk: ta :) | 03:09 |
| Jaffa | Yay, solved my threading problem: I needed to do gobject.threads_init() not gtk.gdk.threads_init() | 03:09 |
| lcuk | that helps | 03:09 |
| Jaffa | Hermes is a packaging job away from being testable :-) | 03:09 |
| lcuk | nice | 03:10 |
| lcuk | i wonder how much work it would be to optify build-essential | 03:10 |
| lcuk | and all the -dev libs | 03:10 |
| lcuk | or just a select few | 03:10 |
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| lcuk | Jaffa, atm, its 80mb just for build-essential | 03:13 |
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| Tadthebuilder | hello all | 03:37 |
| Tadthebuilder | hmm no one seems to be here | 03:38 |
| penguinbait | howdy! | 03:39 |
| Tadthebuilder | hey | 03:39 |
| penguinbait | what do you build? | 03:39 |
| Tadthebuilder | I was hoping lcuk was still here, I just downloaded his new liqbase and I love it | 03:39 |
| Tadthebuilder | haha | 03:39 |
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| Tadthebuilder | I uh came up with the name bobthebuilder because my nephew was watching it when I first posted on ITT a long time ago | 03:39 |
| penguinbait | I used to be a carpenter and a brick layer myself ;) | 03:40 |
| Tadthebuilder | it just so happens that on freenode bobthebuilder is taken | 03:40 |
| Tadthebuilder | so I use my real nickname here with the builder added | 03:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Howdy-ho. | 03:40 |
| Tadthebuilder | hello | 03:40 |
| GeneralAntilles | Europeans with their timezone lies are mostly asleep at the moment. | 03:40 |
| Tadthebuilder | have either of you use liqbase playground? | 03:41 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah that could be it...east coast usa, its not even nine yet... | 03:41 |
| lcuk | you guys actually think i... sleep? | 03:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, you are the only human in the room. | 03:41 |
| Tadthebuilder | I would think at some point in time... | 03:41 |
| lcuk | i cant sleep, tomorrow is the end of my career | 03:41 |
| Tadthebuilder | why is that? | 03:42 |
| lcuk | long story | 03:42 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah okay. | 03:42 |
| Tadthebuilder | (I just started my career 3 months ago) | 03:42 |
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| Tadthebuilder | I just wanted to say I love liqbase playground | 03:42 |
| Tadthebuilder | especially the calendar. Its awesome, a fancy smancy calendar is not needed | 03:42 |
| Tadthebuilder | but that calendar is perfect | 03:42 |
| penguinbait | Last time I lost my job, my salary doubled | 03:42 |
| lcuk | you are not the only one :) | 03:42 |
| Tadthebuilder | but I am having a light problem with the sketch program | 03:43 |
| Tadthebuilder | I checked to make sure it was not happening in your old sketch program | 03:43 |
| lcuk | minor graze or deep flesh wound? | 03:43 |
| lcuk | its because you are in windowed mode | 03:43 |
| lcuk | the aspect ratio is off | 03:43 |
| Tadthebuilder | I thought that might be the case | 03:43 |
| * GeneralAntilles dies a little inside. | 03:43 | |
| GeneralAntilles | http://jalopnik.com/5365954/ten-most-exotic-cars-destroyed-by-cash-for-clunkers/gallery/ | 03:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | A freaking GNX. | 03:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | but the full screen button does not make it go full screen | 03:44 |
| DrIDK | hi! I have a strange idea of application for maemo5! Ask me if it's possible! My idea is to create an application usefull when you lost the phone. You just have to send a SMS code from another phone, and your phone answer automatically by sending geolocalisation in a sms. | 03:44 |
| lcuk | no, there is a workaround | 03:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Talk about political scumbaggery. | 03:44 |
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| lcuk | i needed to have it in windowed mode for london | 03:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | "We don't want these evil cars getting back out in the world and causing global warming!" | 03:44 |
| lcuk | and the n900 - it was a high priority/quick fix :) | 03:44 |
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| Tadthebuilder | the art thing with one dot zero? | 03:44 |
| lcuk | yeah | 03:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah okay | 03:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | I was a little worried that my touch screen was going bad | 03:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | I love my n800.... | 03:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | Id cry if it died | 03:45 |
| lcuk | no, and you arent the only one | 03:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | (cannot afford a n900...Im a pastor dont make much) | 03:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | so can I run it from terminal with a command to make it full screen or anything? | 03:45 |
| lcuk | are you comfortable editing files | 03:45 |
| lcuk | theres a config file that can be edited by hand if you are upto it | 03:46 |
| Tadthebuilder | can it be opened with Kate? and edited | 03:46 |
| lcuk | or bear with me whilst i get these finished http://liqbase.net/liqbase_media.php?username=lcuk&id=369 | 03:46 |
| Tadthebuilder | cause I can do that sorta thing | 03:46 |
| Tadthebuilder | I have in the past atleast | 03:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | well that looks pretty cool | 03:47 |
| lcuk | im sure you can, but why involve your wife | 03:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | you could make a little cash charging for the accounts. | 03:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | maybe you dont need said career...:) | 03:47 |
| lcuk | :) there is hope in lots of places | 03:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | took me a second with the wife commment | 03:48 |
| Tadthebuilder | I meant KDE's text editor | 03:48 |
| lcuk | haha ;) | 03:48 |
| Tadthebuilder | but I think you knew that... | 03:48 |
| lcuk | ~/.liqbase/liqbase.prefs | 03:48 |
| Tadthebuilder | will it work to copy this over to a computer and edit it there? | 03:48 |
| lcuk | if the file is there, great - ifnot, ill give you a 3 line one | 03:48 |
| lcuk | yeah | 03:48 |
| lcuk | i normally use winscp from xp ;) | 03:49 |
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| Tadthebuilder | ubuntu/kubuntu here computer does not like xp...its runs horribley slow on it... | 03:49 |
| Tadthebuilder | not sure why | 03:49 |
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| lcuk | it craves open source obviously :) | 03:50 |
| zerojay | It *needs* the source. | 03:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | could be the 512 megs of ram and the single core processor | 03:50 |
| lcuk | special source | 03:50 |
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| Tadthebuilder | and the fact that I let someone else use it on the windows partition | 03:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | and their is now tons of spyware and adware | 03:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | and Id rather not worry about it | 03:50 |
| lcuk | yikes | 03:50 |
| lcuk | the family all invade this one | 03:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | so I use the ubuntu partition and still access my data | 03:51 |
| lcuk | firefox is quite good at keeping pesky things away | 03:51 |
| Macer | la la la | 03:51 |
| lcuk | you sound better macer | 03:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | it was a college dorm.....I dont think that would of worked | 03:51 |
| lcuk | haha | 03:51 |
| Macer | no.. i still feel like shit | 03:51 |
| Macer | but | 03:51 |
| Macer | i made the touchbook batch cut | 03:51 |
| Macer | and received a processing email | 03:51 |
| lcuk | nice | 03:51 |
| Macer | "... and will be delivered shortly after." | 03:52 |
| Macer | :) | 03:52 |
| Macer | hell eyah. been waiting forever to get 8it | 03:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | file is not found | 03:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | the touch books looks awesome | 03:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | except too expensive.... | 03:52 |
| Macer | $400? | 03:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | I dont have that type of money to spend on expendably | 03:53 |
| Macer | you think that is too expensive? | 03:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | I did not mean | 03:53 |
| lcuk | # liqbase :: liqbase preferences : 20090922_183456 | 03:53 |
| lcuk | begin prefs | 03:53 |
| lcuk | fullscreen=1 | 03:53 |
| lcuk | end | 03:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | its not priced right | 03:53 |
| Macer | heh | 03:53 |
| Macer | it is a little more expensive than a typical netbook | 03:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | I meant I cannot afford it | 03:53 |
| Macer | omap3 | 03:53 |
| lcuk | Tadthebuilder, http://maemo.pastebin.com/m60f7fcb8 | 03:53 |
| Macer | heh | 03:53 |
| lcuk | is probably better | 03:53 |
| Jaffa | Right. I'm going to bed. I'm an idiot, since my alarm is going to go off in 4 hours. | 03:53 |
| lcuk | thats all the file needs | 03:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 03:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | thankyou very much | 03:54 |
| lcuk | in /home/user/.liqbase/liqbase.prefs | 03:54 |
| lcuk | gnite Jaffa | 03:54 |
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| Tadthebuilder | which I just realized the file manger will never get to | 03:54 |
| lcuk | no probs, my silly fault for the change | 03:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | so I have to use the terminal | 03:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | exciting! | 03:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | haha | 03:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | Macer did they fixthe tippin issue with the touch book? | 03:54 |
| lcuk | you arent the first to say this | 03:55 |
| Macer | Tadthebuilder: from what i hear they added more counterweight | 03:55 |
| Macer | but who knows ;) | 03:55 |
| lcuk | and ive pondered a few ways out | 03:55 |
| Macer | i'll just velcro it down or something | 03:55 |
| lcuk | bluetac | 03:55 |
| Tadthebuilder | bluetac? | 03:55 |
| lcuk | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-Tack | 03:55 |
| lcuk | spelt incorrectly | 03:55 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah similar to sticky tack | 03:56 |
| Tadthebuilder | got it | 03:56 |
| Tadthebuilder | how hard would it have been to make the file manager show hidden files if asked too..... | 03:57 |
| lcuk | yeah | 03:57 |
| lcuk | linux is a bit spread out for my liking tho too | 03:57 |
| Tadthebuilder | I guess its possible that its really dificult | 03:57 |
| lcuk | it would just get overwhelming for reg users | 03:57 |
| Tadthebuilder | spread out in what way? the home folder structure? | 03:57 |
| lcuk | and they would break stuff | 03:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | nah | 03:58 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.dangermouse.net/esoteric/piet.html This is clearly the scripting language for the visual generation! Check out the code samples! | 03:58 |
| lcuk | not just home, but everywhere | 03:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | I hooked my parents up with ubuntu....they are good | 03:58 |
| lcuk | theres so many corners | 03:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | they dont ever mess with their file system | 03:58 |
| lcuk | i try not to | 03:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | they install stuff through the add remove programs | 03:58 |
| lcuk | heh | 03:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | and its good enough for them | 03:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | granted | 03:58 |
| lcuk | for months and months i couldnt even get liqbase off the machine | 03:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | the only thing they want is email, internet news, and word processing | 03:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | and an occasional video watching | 03:59 |
| lcuk | eveyrthing was in one folder | 03:59 |
| lcuk | tucked away nice and simple :) | 03:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | haha | 03:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | I can see your frustration | 03:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | I use it because I dont do much with my comp either | 03:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | typical stuff | 03:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | and I dont have to worry as much about spyware and adware and such | 03:59 |
| lcuk | yeah, spyware is new really, some days having no net is a good thing | 04:00 |
| Tadthebuilder | its true | 04:00 |
| Tadthebuilder | think gpe file manager can show hidden files? | 04:01 |
| lcuk | dunno, someone here should tho | 04:01 |
| Tadthebuilder | (I have nnot moved around files in the terminal in forever. | 04:01 |
| lcuk | or just install and try | 04:01 |
| Tadthebuilder | sounds like a good idea | 04:01 |
| lcuk | some folks with liqbase create symlinks | 04:01 |
| Tadthebuilder | (I was going to go for a run tonight but your program is distracting me jk) | 04:01 |
| lcuk | from the hidden folder to somewhere visible | 04:01 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:01 |
| Tadthebuilder | I could that as an option | 04:01 |
| Tadthebuilder | (symlinks can be very helpful) | 04:02 |
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| Tadthebuilder | (it did not distrac me cause of the problem it already distracted me before that...I run outside, its been dark for a bit now. haha) | 04:02 |
| lcuk | did you find liqtorch? :D | 04:03 |
| Tadthebuilder | yeah | 04:03 |
| Tadthebuilder | that will be helpful | 04:03 |
| Tadthebuilder | when unlocking doors | 04:03 |
| Tadthebuilder | in the dar | 04:03 |
| Tadthebuilder | k | 04:03 |
| lcuk | yeah its also a great simple code example | 04:03 |
| lcuk | since you have seen it on n800 | 04:04 |
| Tadthebuilder | is that a hint haha | 04:04 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: the above language is clearly the right language for liqbase scripting :) | 04:04 |
| lcuk | you can see just how much faster the n900 is | 04:04 |
| lcuk | http://mynokiablog.com/2009/09/15/video-nokia-n900-presentation-with-gary-birkett-and-liqbase/ | 04:04 |
| lcuk | Tadthebuilder, it is for certain people | 04:04 |
| lcuk | its illuminating :) it shows them the way.. | 04:04 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, i agree actually | 04:05 |
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| SpeedEvil | Beautiful - but barking mad. | 04:05 |
| Tadthebuilder | I think id miss the missing parts of the screen on the n900 | 04:05 |
| lcuk | missing parts of the screen? | 04:05 |
| lcuk | ahh size | 04:05 |
| Tadthebuilder | yeah sorry | 04:06 |
| *** GAN800 changes topic to "Welcome to #maemo | N900 and Maemo 5 announced @ http://maemo.nokia.com | http://maemo.org | Maemo Community Council http://maemo.org/community/council | http://mxr.maemo.org | http://mg.pov.lt/maemo-irclog | Maemo Community council election -> http://tinyurl.com/n9j9pa | Maemo 5 will not be available for 770/N8x0, use Mer instead" | 04:06 | |
| Tadthebuilder | I should probably speak standard english, but I mess up some times | 04:06 |
| lcuk | its ok, i speak northern most of the time | 04:06 |
| GAN800 | Tadthebuilder, everybody who has one has said you don't notice the size change. | 04:06 |
| lcuk | Tadthebuilder, you have liqbase now | 04:06 |
| lcuk | it runs in windowed mode | 04:06 |
| lcuk | that is the same as me running it fullscreen | 04:06 |
| lcuk | and i mean - the same | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | yes | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | tis true | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | im working on that part.... | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | ah | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | that is interesting | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | dont get me wrong | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | I would love a n900 | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | (should that be "an") | 04:07 |
| lcuk | heh - it just helps to get a comparison of size with something you use | 04:07 |
| Tadthebuilder | Ill get a used one in a few years when they are on a n2300 | 04:07 |
| lcuk | the n810 will still be a useful home computer :) | 04:08 |
| Tadthebuilder | too bad i have a n800 | 04:08 |
| Tadthebuilder | :) | 04:08 |
| lcuk | lol - theres your downfall then | 04:08 |
| lcuk | those will be gone :P | 04:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | N800 is better then an N810 anyway. ;) | 04:08 |
| Tadthebuilder | who needs a keyboard.... | 04:09 |
| Tadthebuilder | or a gps | 04:09 |
| Tadthebuilder | I have a tom tom for that | 04:09 |
| lcuk | i needed the square shape | 04:09 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay gpe does not show hidden files | 04:09 |
| lcuk | the rounded back on the 800 didnt feel/look right | 04:09 |
| Tadthebuilder | grr | 04:09 |
| Tadthebuilder | on to figure out how to do sym links... | 04:09 |
| Tadthebuilder | stop insulting my baby | 04:09 |
| Firebird | hunchback? | 04:09 |
| lcuk | can someone please help tad to make a symlink from /home/user/.liqbase to somewhere in MyDocs | 04:09 |
| lcuk | cos ill write it down too | 04:10 |
| lcuk | and be able to tell others :) | 04:10 |
| Tadthebuilder | well if lcuk needs it | 04:10 |
| Tadthebuilder | I was just going to google | 04:10 |
| Firebird | ln -snf /home/user/.liqbase /home/user/MyDocs/blah | 04:10 |
| Tadthebuilder | hoping my googlefu is on to night | 04:10 |
| lcuk | does blah need to exist | 04:10 |
| Tadthebuilder | is blah a folder or file? | 04:10 |
| Firebird | lcuk, no | 04:10 |
| lcuk | Tadthebuilder, teamwork! | 04:10 |
| lcuk | with maemo you are not alone | 04:10 |
| lcuk | thanks Firebird | 04:11 |
| Tadthebuilder | so blah is the file? | 04:11 |
| Firebird | you could just leave out the blah and it will create a symlink named the original | 04:11 |
| lcuk | which will be a hidden folder still | 04:11 |
| lcuk | which doesnt help lol :P | 04:11 |
| lcuk | but in general that helps :) | 04:11 |
| lcuk | that doesnt need root does it? | 04:12 |
| Firebird | no | 04:12 |
| Tadthebuilder | so I put the file in documents | 04:13 |
| Tadthebuilder | and then type that line replacing blah | 04:13 |
| Tadthebuilder | with the name of the fiel | 04:13 |
| Tadthebuilder | file* | 04:13 |
| lcuk | yeah | 04:13 |
| Firebird | wait what? | 04:14 |
| lcuk | on my computer tho it just failed *eek* | 04:14 |
| Firebird | you would overwrite the file | 04:14 |
| lcuk | ln -snf /home/user/.liqbase /home/user/MyDocs/liqbase_data | 04:14 |
| lcuk | is what i did | 04:14 |
| Tadthebuilder | there is no file | 04:14 |
| Tadthebuilder | in /home/user/.liqbase | 04:14 |
| Firebird | [21:13] <Tadthebuilder> so I put the file in documents | 04:14 |
| * Firebird is confuzled | 04:14 | |
| lcuk | i want to access the hidden folder .liqbase from a visible folder inside MyDocs | 04:14 |
| Firebird | ah | 04:14 |
| lcuk | or rather, tad does | 04:15 |
| Tadthebuilder | sorry to be confusing | 04:15 |
| Tadthebuilder | Im a little out of my league | 04:15 |
| lcuk | i will later | 04:15 |
| Firebird | hm, how does product karma work.. | 04:15 |
| SpeedEvil | ln works like mv | 04:15 |
| SpeedEvil | ln source destination | 04:15 |
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| lcuk | only on the same partition tho o_O | 04:16 |
| lcuk | to do it on new pooter it needs moar | 04:16 |
| SpeedEvil | ln -s is arbitrary | 04:16 |
| SpeedEvil | it's just a string | 04:16 |
| lcuk | so, "ln /home/user/.liqbase /home/user/MyDocs/liqbase_data" is all thats needed | 04:16 |
| SpeedEvil | ln -s /mnt/nfs/whatever/dir dir/ | 04:16 |
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| Tadthebuilder | i thought it was called liqbase.pref | 04:17 |
| lcuk | thats the file | 04:17 |
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| lcuk | you will thank me later when you can get out any pictures you play with or sketches | 04:17 |
| Tadthebuilder | liqbase_data is the folder | 04:17 |
| Tadthebuilder | of course I will | 04:17 |
| Tadthebuilder | thankyou | 04:17 |
| Tadthebuilder | im thanking you now | 04:17 |
| lcuk | the .liqbase folder is everything lol | 04:17 |
| lcuk | before you forget | 04:17 |
| Tadthebuilder | ill go thank a bunch of your posts so you get karma | 04:18 |
| lcuk | lol that scares me - i see it rise but see no recent posts :D | 04:18 |
| Firebird | woohoo, almost 100 end-user downloads :D | 04:18 |
| lcuk | Firebird, its a game | 04:18 |
| lcuk | of course its gonna be downloaded | 04:18 |
| Tadthebuilder | do I first need to make a directory in mydocs called liqbase_data | 04:19 |
| Tadthebuilder | or | 04:19 |
| Tadthebuilder | is that line saying | 04:19 |
| lcuk | i dont think so | 04:19 |
| Tadthebuilder | mydocuments will be treated as if it were liqbase_data | 04:19 |
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| lcuk | make a fake directory called liqbase_data and when you open that directory show the conents of .liqbase | 04:20 |
| lcuk | is how i read ln syntax stuff | 04:20 |
| Tadthebuilder | (if I actually learn whats going on here, I learn something, if I just do it I learn nothing...) | 04:20 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:20 |
| Tadthebuilder | I think I understand whats going on | 04:20 |
| lcuk | glad one of us does :D | 04:20 |
| * lcuk cuddles windows and its archaic filesystem | 04:21 | |
| Tadthebuilder | well | 04:21 |
| Tadthebuilder | ya see | 04:21 |
| Tadthebuilder | im well rested | 04:21 |
| Tadthebuilder | and its not 4 in the morning here | 04:21 |
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| lcuk | that helps - its just past 2 here | 04:21 |
| Tadthebuilder | (I actually have no idea where you are...or what time it is) | 04:21 |
| lcuk | manchester england | 04:21 |
| Tadthebuilder | its about nine thirty | 04:21 |
| Tadthebuilder | for some reason I did not think your accent was british... | 04:21 |
| penguinbait | 21:21 | 04:21 |
| lcuk | best time of the night - im normally most productive then | 04:21 |
| Tadthebuilder | yes penguinbait | 04:22 |
| SpeedEvil | 2AM here too. | 04:22 |
| lcuk | penguinbait, hows council training school coming on | 04:22 |
| penguinbait | im est too | 04:22 |
| SpeedEvil | And I woke up at 1:30 | 04:22 |
| SpeedEvil | :/ | 04:22 |
| Tadthebuilder | same time zone...haha | 04:22 |
| penguinbait | michigan here | 04:22 |
| * SpeedEvil has _no_ idea when he's going back to sleep. | 04:22 | |
| Tadthebuilder | North Carolina | 04:23 |
| Tadthebuilder | small town of 7000 people | 04:23 |
| * lcuk is dreading tomorrow | 04:23 | |
| Tadthebuilder | and not sleeping puts off tomorrow seemingly | 04:23 |
| penguinbait | the revolution starts in the morn? | 04:23 |
| Tadthebuilder | the revolution will not be televised | 04:24 |
| SpeedEvil | Buy some cheese. Everything is better with cheese. | 04:24 |
| lcuk | i wish it was a revolution | 04:24 |
| penguinbait | I love PE | 04:24 |
| Tadthebuilder | PE? | 04:24 |
| penguinbait | Public Enemy | 04:24 |
| penguinbait | the revolution will not be televised | 04:24 |
| Tadthebuilder | oh haha | 04:25 |
| Tadthebuilder | I remember it from some comercial | 04:25 |
| Tadthebuilder | from the 90's | 04:25 |
| Tadthebuilder | when I was like ten | 04:25 |
| penguinbait | ha | 04:25 |
| Tadthebuilder | did not know it was from Public Enemy | 04:25 |
| penguinbait | youngins | 04:25 |
| SpeedEvil | penguinbait: It's the 4chan generation. | 04:25 |
| lcuk | pb, the more local impact of the decision hits tomorrow | 04:25 |
| Tadthebuilder | wait | 04:25 |
| Tadthebuilder | im a little old to be a part of the 4chan generation I think | 04:26 |
| Tadthebuilder | im old enough to do anything but run for president... | 04:26 |
| lcuk | so, what you are about 17? | 04:26 |
| Tadthebuilder | (and I think maybe senate...) | 04:26 |
| Tadthebuilder | 23 | 04:26 |
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| penguinbait | my son is 16 | 04:27 |
| lcuk | my eldest is 14 goin on 20 | 04:27 |
| penguinbait | crazy huh | 04:28 |
| lcuk | yeah | 04:28 |
| lcuk | he asked if i wanted a beer tonight | 04:28 |
| lcuk | not out of the goodness of his heart | 04:28 |
| lcuk | but because he wanted one himself \@/ | 04:28 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:28 |
| * lcuk told him he was a cheeky SOB | 04:28 | |
| Tadthebuilder | the command you gave me a little earlier | 04:28 |
| Tadthebuilder | says | 04:28 |
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| Tadthebuilder | operation not permitted | 04:28 |
| penguinbait | how old r u lcuk? | 04:28 |
| Tadthebuilder | ive never had a beer... | 04:29 |
| Tadthebuilder | (not because I think its wrong, I just dont like the smell) | 04:29 |
| Tadthebuilder | (I might try it one day if I get up the couerage | 04:29 |
| penguinbait | I'v had too much of most everything :( | 04:29 |
| lcuk | yikes! | 04:30 |
| lcuk | symlinks to fat drives fail | 04:30 |
| lcuk | im not old enough to havfe a 14yo | 04:30 |
| Tadthebuilder | wait | 04:30 |
| Tadthebuilder | how is mydocs on a fat ddrive | 04:30 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: Or too old :) | 04:30 |
| Tadthebuilder | shouldnt it be ext? | 04:30 |
| lcuk | i dunno, how do we find out | 04:30 |
| * lcuk hates rabbit holes | 04:31 | |
| Tadthebuilder | its a linux os | 04:31 |
| Tadthebuilder | doesnt it have to run on ext | 04:31 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, dont you read ive got a son that old shurrup | 04:31 |
| penguinbait | I hate red pill's | 04:31 |
| Tadthebuilder | um... | 04:31 |
| Tadthebuilder | red pill mode? | 04:31 |
| lcuk | nahhh | 04:31 |
| lcuk | not needed for this | 04:31 |
| microlith | Tadthebuilder: personally I'd prefer logfs if it were stable :) | 04:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | Tadthebuilder, needs to be able to hook up to a Windows machine. | 04:32 |
| Tadthebuilder | wait what? | 04:33 |
| Tadthebuilder | I need to use windows? | 04:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | MyDocs needs to be able to be mounted on a Windows machine. | 04:33 |
| GeneralAntilles | Thus, FAT. | 04:33 |
| Tadthebuilder | im confused. | 04:33 |
| lcuk | balls - so how have people symlinked stuff inthe past | 04:33 |
| * lcuk is too | 04:34 | |
| * GeneralAntilles may have lost context somewhere. | 04:34 | |
| SpeedEvil | you can symlink to FAT | 04:34 |
| lcuk | so things are visible in file manager | 04:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Why are we wonder why MyDocs is FAT? | 04:34 |
| SpeedEvil | you can't symlink _on_ FAT | 04:34 |
| Tadthebuilder | the mydocs | 04:34 |
| Tadthebuilder | is on the n800 | 04:34 |
| Tadthebuilder | but the symlink failed | 04:34 |
| Tadthebuilder | operation not permitted | 04:34 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm unsure how you do 'shortcuts' from linux | 04:34 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh, MyDocs on Maemo 4 is on the JFFS2 partition. | 04:34 |
| lcuk | i shall restate the problem - perhaps mydocs was the wrong target | 04:35 |
| GeneralAntilles | Root? ;) | 04:35 |
| lcuk | there is a folder: /home/user/.liqbase | 04:35 |
| Tadthebuilder | wait | 04:35 |
| Tadthebuilder | do I need to be root | 04:35 |
| lcuk | it is not visible in the file manager on n810 | 04:35 |
| Tadthebuilder | someone earlier said no... | 04:35 |
| lcuk | n8x0 | 04:35 |
| lcuk | i have heard in the past people creating symlinks | 04:35 |
| lcuk | so that they make this folder visible | 04:35 |
| Macer | why do people run from cops on the road in suvs and dirt bikes? | 04:36 |
| Macer | what the hell | 04:36 |
| Macer | GO OFF ROAD! | 04:36 |
| penguinbait | why does my heart race like I am a criminal when they pull behind me? | 04:36 |
| Tadthebuilder | sudo gainroot tried again | 04:36 |
| Tadthebuilder | still operation not permitted | 04:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | penguinbait, because you are a criminal. | 04:36 |
| SpeedEvil | penguinbait: Because of the body in your trunk? | 04:36 |
| GeneralAntilles | penguinbait, in this post-911 world, everybody's a criminal. | 04:37 |
| lcuk | Tadthebuilder, i get no error if i remove the MyDocs folder | 04:37 |
| lcuk | but i dont know if thats accessible in your file manager | 04:37 |
| Tadthebuilder | meaning put it in home user | 04:37 |
| lcuk | ie: ln -s /home/user/.liqbase /home/user/liqbase_data | 04:37 |
| penguinbait | could be because my ex and her boyfriend are cops | 04:37 |
| Tadthebuilder | (am I a nerd if my n800 is called shuttlepod and my desktop the enterprise...) | 04:37 |
| Tadthebuilder | wait | 04:38 |
| lcuk | o_O you can name your tablet stuff | 04:38 |
| Tadthebuilder | I think we want Documents | 04:38 |
| Tadthebuilder | not MyDocs | 04:38 |
| Tadthebuilder | where is MyDocs? | 04:38 |
| * doc|home stabs | 04:38 | |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:39 |
| lcuk | its on my N900 :% sorry it must be a new layout | 04:39 |
| Tadthebuilder | wait | 04:39 |
| Tadthebuilder | I found it in gpe file manager | 04:39 |
| Tadthebuilder | but the one that comes with the n800 says Documents | 04:39 |
| lcuk | without all this messin? | 04:39 |
| * lcuk is glad his mind is taken off things | 04:40 | |
| Tadthebuilder | nono | 04:40 |
| Tadthebuilder | I found MYDocs in gpe | 04:40 |
| Tadthebuilder | not the file | 04:40 |
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| Tadthebuilder | and home/user | 04:40 |
| Tadthebuilder | so let me try that | 04:40 |
| lcuk | penguinbait, you are a criminal | 04:40 |
| penguinbait | as in its criminal how awesome I am? | 04:42 |
| lcuk | s\awesome\insane\ | 04:42 |
| Tadthebuilder | if it worked | 04:43 |
| lcuk | or however im meant to do regex :D | 04:43 |
| Tadthebuilder | should it of given me any feedback? | 04:43 |
| lcuk | no, close app and reopen | 04:43 |
| * lcuk hates fiddling | 04:43 | |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | inside /home/user | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | there is what appear | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | s | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | to be a fiel | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | file* | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | called liqbase_data | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | its 18 bytes | 04:44 |
| lcuk | that should be a folder | 04:44 |
| Tadthebuilder | I was expecting a folder... | 04:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | was I wrong to expect a folder | 04:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | um... | 04:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | symbolic link /home/user/liqbase_data leads to inaccessable file! | 04:45 |
| Tadthebuilder | (the error even has the exclamation point | 04:46 |
| lcuk | o_O | 04:46 |
| Tadthebuilder | wait | 04:46 |
| Tadthebuilder | let me check my typing skills | 04:46 |
| lcuk | i just cd'ed into mine | 04:46 |
| lcuk | ln -s /home/user/.liqbase /home/user/liqbase_data | 04:46 |
| lcuk | and it worked | 04:46 |
| lcuk | cd /home/user/liqbase_data | 04:47 |
| lcuk | ls | 04:47 |
| lcuk | cal historythumb layouts liqbase.prefs liqbasecache ratings sketches tags thumbs | 04:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | its my fault | 04:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | typo | 04:47 |
| lcuk | :D | 04:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | but I need to delete the file | 04:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | and it wont delete | 04:47 |
| Tadthebuilder | maybe I should give up for the evening | 04:48 |
| lcuk | unlink symbolic_link | 04:49 |
| Tadthebuilder | is that literally a command | 04:49 |
| lcuk | mmm noit there | 04:49 |
| lcuk | lol | 04:49 |
| Firebird | you can just delete the simlink, make sure you don't have a trailing / though if its a folder | 04:49 |
| * lcuk is just as frustrated | 04:49 | |
| *** k-s is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 04:49 | |
| Tadthebuilder | terminal command to delete? | 04:50 |
| lcuk | rm liqbase_data without the / | 04:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | what can I say im a gui guy | 04:51 |
| *** penguinbait is now known as TadtheGrassHoppe | 04:51 | |
| *** TadtheGrassHoppe is now known as TadtheGrassHoppR | 04:51 | |
| * lcuk sits with Tad | 04:51 | |
| lcuk | i hate console | 04:51 |
| * Firebird chops lcuk into little pieces and hides him in the wall | 04:51 | |
| lcuk | surprisingly though - liqbase playground has a global search that i want to allow console commands in | 04:51 |
| TadtheGrassHoppR | did you go to Yale Firebird? | 04:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | it worked!! | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | hey | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | someone else named TAd | 04:52 |
| TadtheGrassHoppR | ;) | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | can I copy my prefs file to that folder | 04:52 |
| lcuk | dont worry - its just COUNCIL member penguinbait | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | even if their is one their already | 04:52 |
| *** TadtheGrassHoppR is now known as penguinbait | 04:52 | |
| Tadthebuilder | or do I need to copy that file over to my computer | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | edit it then copy it back | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | (I care less about the rest of my prefs) | 04:52 |
| Firebird | haha | 04:52 |
| penguinbait | we were all pulling for ya! | 04:52 |
| Tadthebuilder | well thank you | 04:53 |
| lcuk | if the file did not exist, then you just copy the tiny one | 04:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | well | 04:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | it turns out it does exist | 04:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | can I just over right it? | 04:53 |
| lcuk | haha | 04:53 |
| lcuk | after all that | 04:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | well | 04:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | I still neded to access it | 04:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | regardless | 04:53 |
| Tadthebuilder | right? | 04:53 |
| lcuk | yeah | 04:53 |
| lcuk | you can replace it - it does hold the list of widgets | 04:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | if I over right it | 04:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:54 |
| lcuk | but you can rebuild it | 04:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | well thats not a problem | 04:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | alright then | 04:54 |
| Tadthebuilder | here goes alot :) | 04:54 |
| lcuk | they can be chosen now :) | 04:54 |
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| Tadthebuilder | I just need to find out where I downloaded | 04:55 |
| Tadthebuilder | the file | 04:55 |
| Tadthebuilder | found it | 04:55 |
| Macer | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJdVqkkW4Wc | 04:55 |
| Macer | hahaha | 04:55 |
| Macer | holy shit | 04:55 |
| Macer | they sure in hell made sure that guy wasn't going to be able to jump out the car :) | 04:55 |
| Tadthebuilder | you cannot move files across file systems? | 04:57 |
| lcuk | mmm from where, to where | 04:57 |
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| Tadthebuilder | is it pref | 04:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | or prefs? | 04:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | I got it | 04:58 |
| lcuk | liqbase.prefs | 04:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | in | 04:58 |
| *** fiferboy has quit IRC | 04:58 | |
| *** Xisdibik has quit IRC | 04:58 | |
| Tadthebuilder | okay | 04:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | just to let you know | 04:58 |
| Tadthebuilder | gpe stinks | 04:59 |
| penguinbait | Macer, ouch!! | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | anyway | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | I got it worked | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | out | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | gotta call my fiance | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | or she will get mad | 04:59 |
| lcuk | lol | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | thanks alot guys | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | talk to you all some other time | 04:59 |
| penguinbait | forget her | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | ID rather not | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | shes hot | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | haha | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | 19 days... | 04:59 |
| lcuk | Tadthebuilder, sorry its been the longest time liqbase hasnt done as intended ;) | 04:59 |
| lcuk | have fun | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | Thankyou | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | im sure I will have fun | 04:59 |
| Tadthebuilder | good bye all | 04:59 |
| lcuk | np - its a learning curve for all | 05:00 |
| Tadthebuilder | :) | 05:00 |
| Tadthebuilder | bye | 05:00 |
| *** Tadthebuilder has quit IRC | 05:00 | |
| penguinbait | man did you see his old lady | 05:00 |
| penguinbait | she was hot!!!!!!! | 05:00 |
| * lcuk just got a wget line setup and everything ;) | 05:00 | |
| lcuk | linux is so rabbitholeish | 05:00 |
| lcuk | how do you cope doing anything substantial | 05:00 |
| penguinbait | thats a fun rabbit hole | 05:01 |
| lcuk | what is ^^^ that | 05:01 |
| lcuk | or the normal stuff | 05:01 |
| penguinbait | you most usually can find your way out of | 05:01 |
| *** z4chh has quit IRC | 05:01 | |
| lcuk | yeah, but its every corner | 05:01 |
| * lcuk will just make sure it does fullscreen next release ;) | 05:02 | |
| Macer | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCz9d2Agi0g&NR=1 | 05:02 |
| Macer | HAHAHHAA | 05:02 |
| *** shdb has quit IRC | 05:02 | |
| Macer | penguinbait: yeah you saw that? :) | 05:03 |
| penguinbait | I just want to go to sleep and wake up when there is some hardware to play with | 05:03 |
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| Macer | they smashed into his car full speed while he wass trying to get out the door | 05:03 |
| Macer | that was pretty funny | 05:03 |
| *** GeneralAntilles has quit IRC | 05:03 | |
| penguinbait | probably not wise to shoot at the police | 05:03 |
| lcuk | expecting a delivery penguinbait | 05:03 |
| *** shdb has joined #maemo | 05:03 | |
| penguinbait | lcuk :( | 05:03 |
| penguinbait | no | 05:03 |
| lcuk | winter hibernation ! | 05:04 |
| penguinbait | I am hoping tmobile usa will have some sort of deal | 05:04 |
| *** GAN8001 has quit IRC | 05:04 | |
| penguinbait | once its available | 05:04 |
| lcuk | yeah | 05:04 |
| *** GAN8001 has joined #maemo | 05:04 | |
| penguinbait | or some dev program I can join | 05:04 |
| lcuk | PAYG was only real option for me here | 05:04 |
| penguinbait | PAYG? | 05:05 |
| lcuk | pay as you go | 05:05 |
| lcuk | buy credit as needed | 05:05 |
| lcuk | rather than a contract | 05:05 |
| penguinbait | but you got a n900 from ? | 05:05 |
| lcuk | apple | 05:06 |
| penguinbait | heh | 05:06 |
| lcuk | ask a silly question lol | 05:06 |
| GAN8001 | Woo, finally have a client with a proper separator. | 05:06 |
| penguinbait | exactly, I'm just waiting for some availability | 05:06 |
| *** GAN8001 is now known as GeneralAntilles | 05:06 | |
| lcuk | yeah | 05:06 |
| penguinbait | I'm still wondering who will ship first pandora or n900 | 05:07 |
| lcuk | whoever ships first, n900 kicks more ass | 05:07 |
| lcuk | its just so rounded and complete :) | 05:07 |
| lcuk | ticks more boxes and is a complete platform | 05:08 |
| lcuk | i see uses for this in so many markets | 05:08 |
| lcuk | pandora is good for gaming | 05:08 |
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| penguinbait | we'll see | 05:09 |
| * lcuk nods | 05:09 | |
| penguinbait | I was not really looking for a phone, so I think a pandora and a n900 would replace my 810 and my phone nicely | 05:10 |
| penguinbait | all kinds of possibilities | 05:10 |
| penguinbait | you could take over the world | 05:10 |
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| penguinbait | or probably the stock market | 05:11 |
| penguinbait | heh | 05:11 |
| lcuk | ive got no hope | 05:11 |
| lcuk | i walk out of a job tomorrow into a massive black hole | 05:11 |
| penguinbait | whats the scoop? | 05:11 |
| lcuk | no scoop really | 05:11 |
| penguinbait | whats the deal? | 05:11 |
| lcuk | ive managed code in my work for last 9 yrs | 05:11 |
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| lcuk | i needed extra time before onedotzero to finish it | 05:12 |
| lcuk | and boss had a massive project at same time | 05:12 |
| lcuk | the only way for me to do onedotzero was to resign | 05:12 |
| penguinbait | OMG | 05:12 |
| lcuk | if i hadnt done the onedotzero stuff the controller wouldnt have worked | 05:12 |
| lcuk | everyone wouldv been :( | 05:13 |
| penguinbait | what about all the maemo positions, nothing fits? | 05:13 |
| lcuk | blck hole right now, ive made applications | 05:13 |
| lcuk | dont know until the openings close | 05:13 |
| lcuk | if that makes sense | 05:14 |
| penguinbait | I got ya | 05:14 |
| penguinbait | so what with old boss, it done or you find out tomorrow? | 05:14 |
| zerojay | penguinbait: Considering Pandora hasn't even started FCC... definitely N900. | 05:15 |
| penguinbait | hey zj | 05:15 |
| lcuk | still civil, i understand his position and mine but tomorrow is my last day | 05:15 |
| lcuk | i then have 2 weeks before i have to take anything local | 05:16 |
| GAN800 | lcuk, did he see onedotzero? ;) | 05:16 |
| lcuk | which will involve me stopping maemo | 05:16 |
| lcuk | he doesnt care about it | 05:17 |
| lcuk | thinks open source is a nonsense | 05:17 |
| GAN800 | Ah, not much reason to work for him then. ;) | 05:17 |
| GAN800 | Give it 10 years and he'll get his. | 05:17 |
| lcuk | ive offered to make him a version of our software on maemo | 05:18 |
| lcuk | completely mobile stuff - i could make a really nice package out of it | 05:18 |
| lcuk | but, thats for another time | 05:19 |
| lcuk | so, gnite chaps - thanks for earbending and help n stuff | 05:19 |
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| penguinbait | get some sleep lcuk | 05:24 |
| SpeedEvil | night! | 05:24 |
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| penguinbait | <----- has swine flu, or bird flu, something, I hate it when the kids go back to school | 05:40 |
| SpeedEvil | penguin flu! | 05:40 |
| penguinbait | my beaks all clogged up | 05:42 |
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| Tadthebuilder | I love liqbase!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 | 05:46 |
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| Tadthebuilder | just thought id let every one know i love liqbase...I also love the monday through sunday calendar, rather than sunday through friday. It makes more sense to me | 05:49 |
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| Proteous | yeah, any calendar without Sat just sucks | 05:50 |
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| Tadthebuilder | true | 05:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | that is so not what I meant though | 05:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | ... | 05:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | Maybe if all calendars didn't have Saturday then employers could never schedule you on it. | 05:50 |
| Tadthebuilder | hmm good thinking | 05:51 |
| Proteous | heh | 05:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | I meant sunday through satursdaty | 05:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | saturday | 05:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | you might understand my excitement | 05:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | if you knew how long it took me to get it to work :) | 05:51 |
| Tadthebuilder | lcuk was helping me out for atleast an hour. | 05:51 |
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| Tired | Heh, a "Sony mylo COM-2 Internet Device" looks lind of like the N810 | 06:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | Minus anything approaching an open platform. ;) | 06:15 |
| Tired | looks fancier! | 06:15 |
| Tired | actually it's also running a linux | 06:15 |
| Tired | I start wondering how many different embedded linuxes there are | 06:15 |
| microlith | lots | 06:15 |
| microlith | some you can't even tell | 06:15 |
| Tired | seems so :) | 06:15 |
| microlith | I know a number of Sharp TVs run Linux | 06:16 |
| microlith | but you can't tell | 06:16 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, Linux doesn't mean anything as far as openness goes. | 06:17 |
| SpeedEvil | hopefully there will be GPL offer in box. | 06:19 |
| SpeedEvil | But even that doesn't help actually open them | 06:19 |
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| zerojay | Tired: I thought about getting a Milo long ago, but it's slow and not very good, even if openness isn't a concern for you. | 06:43 |
| Tired | it also only had 1GB internal space | 06:43 |
| zerojay | Expandable with memory card duo. | 06:43 |
| zerojay | Original had none. | 06:44 |
| Tired | I just came upon it on amazon and thought "that looks familiar" | 06:44 |
| zerojay | NVidia releases their OpenCL drivers, open source: http://twit.ac/x_ud.html | 06:45 |
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| johnx | the mylo 2 hardware felt really nice. too bad it no one hacked it open and updated the kernel | 06:45 |
| zerojay | Oh.. might not be open source. | 06:45 |
| johnx | would make a really nice maemo device | 06:45 |
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| zerojay | It's really underpowered. | 06:45 |
| johnx | is it? thought it had 128MB of RAM and a 400MHz ARM? | 06:46 |
| zerojay | The older one did anyways. Not sure about the newer one. | 06:48 |
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| johnx | the newer one seemed comparable to the N8x0 IIRC | 06:48 |
| zerojay | The COM-2 was one I thought about getting for a while... but eh... | 06:49 |
| johnx | yeah, you made the right choice with maemo | 06:49 |
| johnx | they still never got their own apps running last time I checked | 06:49 |
| johnx | couldn't even get real read access to the whole file system | 06:49 |
| zerojay | No, everything was closed. I think they just got widgets running through it last I checked. | 06:50 |
| johnx | ha! just hit the forums. as of 2009-09-21 the top post in the "hacks" forum is a question about when it'll be hacked with no repies | 06:50 |
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| johnx | really is eye-opening looking at their forums vs the maemo forums | 06:52 |
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| Myrtti | meh | 07:33 |
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| radic | good morning Myrtti | 07:34 |
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| Myrtti | there's different opinions about how good it is ... | 07:35 |
| RST38h | Moo Myrtti | 07:39 |
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| johnx | mornin' | 08:00 |
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| Tired | uh... its running linux, and nobody even got in? | 08:15 |
| Tired | That's kinda disgusting :) | 08:15 |
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| johnx | yeah, well, anyone who cared about openness got an N8x0 or a Zaurus in the first place | 08:16 |
| johnx | Notably: Sony discontinued the Mylo2 while Nokia is running the N810 right up until the N900 is out | 08:16 |
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| wazd | Mornin' world | 08:18 |
| johnx | he wazd | 08:18 |
| johnx | how goes it? | 08:18 |
| Tired | it *does* look more flashy, though | 08:19 |
| Tired | 10 points for looks, -1000 for usefulness :( | 08:19 |
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| wazd | johnx: heya, facing troubles with the internets) | 08:20 |
| Tired | from what you guys said | 08:20 |
| wazd | Moved to my grand dad's appartments, no sane internets there | 08:20 |
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| johnx | wazd, you'll have to settle for that insane internet that connects you to all those crazy #maemo guys | 08:21 |
| johnx | Tired, yeah. I wish Sony would learn from things like this, but I kinda doubt they will | 08:21 |
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| wazd | johnx: yeah) I was away for like 3 days - everyone already panics :D | 08:22 |
| Stskeeps | did you get arrested? :P | 08:22 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: Not yet) | 08:22 |
| chx | hm, opencl. | 08:23 |
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| Tired | guess companies feel scared by openness...possibly rightfully so, from their viewpoint | 08:23 |
| chx | is it just me who yawned and murmured "yeah and when will vdpau be stable, hm" | 08:23 |
| wazd | Can anybody retell me what Eldar wanted from t.m.o?) | 08:24 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: vodka' | 08:24 |
| RST38h | Moo wazd | 08:24 |
| Stskeeps | ? | 08:24 |
| RST38h | wazd: Wanted appreciation | 08:24 |
| wazd | RST38h: heya | 08:25 |
| johnx | Tired, and those companies are getting left by the wayside. Companies should be scared about making their users happy, not trying to lock them into or out of their devices | 08:25 |
| RST38h | wazd: Probably some shreds of classified information too, as he seems to think it is all Nokia conspiracy | 08:25 |
| wazd | RST38h: ah, poor guy :D | 08:25 |
| johnx | RST38h, crap. he found out about the conspiracy? | 08:25 |
| Tired | johnx, you mean companies like... apple with their i-somethings? | 08:25 |
| RST38h | johnx: Looks like he went insane before getting to the bottom | 08:26 |
| wazd | RST38h: We need to tell him that top secret threads are hidden for everyone under 1000 posts)) | 08:26 |
| RST38h | wazd: ah, screw him | 08:26 |
| RST38h | wazd: he has got a new target now, the LJ nokia_ru community | 08:27 |
| wazd | RST38h: oh my) | 08:27 |
| Tired | johnx, they seem to be doing all right - and the iphone e.g is even runnin its own proprietary ipone-os... | 08:28 |
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| wazd | I'm still on my quest «get that freaking travelling passport legaly» :) | 08:29 |
| johnx | Tired, nah, they're selling "just works" to people who want "just works." Sony tried selling "just works" to a market segment that was more interested in an open system | 08:29 |
| wazd | Myst looks like 3yo boy near this quest) | 08:30 |
| Tired | johnx, nothing wrong with things that "just work" from start on, though :) | 08:30 |
| wazd | Stskeeps: have you made some presentations for summit?) | 08:31 |
| johnx | Tired, well, if both systems just work, and one offers a wealth of 3rd party apps and one doesn't, it changes the picture | 08:32 |
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| Tired | true | 08:34 |
| Tired | but if the open one "barely works" that's a totaly different picture | 08:34 |
| johnx | right, hence why the mylo probably sold more than the openmoko | 08:35 |
| Tired | hehe | 08:35 |
| johnx | (no offence to openmoko guys. they really tried, and I respect that.) | 08:35 |
| Tired | past-tense? | 08:35 |
| Tired | did that die? | 08:36 |
| wazd | johnx: like, mylo - 3, openmoko - 2?)) | 08:36 |
| johnx | wazd, mylo probably sold better in japan, where it wasn't up against the n810 | 08:36 |
| johnx | but I doubt the mylo was much competition for the zaurus there, even after sharp discontinued it. heh. | 08:37 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: on my list for this week | 08:37 |
| Tired | it the N810 still produced? It's price on amayon has been $500 for over aweek now | 08:38 |
| Tired | nice to see the price go up since you bought something, though | 08:38 |
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| wazd | Stskeeps: great, I'll try to solve internet problems asap | 08:38 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: haven't really written anything yet but it's mostly in my head :) | 08:39 |
| timeless | has anyone complained that the easy chem ham icon is nearly invisible? | 08:44 |
| wazd | stskeeps: well, in worst case you can just retell danish presentation) | 08:44 |
| timeless | fwiw, one doesn't "tell" a "presentatio" ;) | 08:45 |
| Stskeeps | wazd: nah.. i have two presentations :P | 08:48 |
| Stskeeps | timeless: how's vacation so far? | 08:48 |
| timeless | pretty good, i'm in bratislava, contemplating brno or wandering around here for a bit longer | 08:49 |
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| Stskeeps | wazd: saw my fremantle-on-N8x0 video? :) | 08:50 |
| timeless | have i? url? | 08:53 |
| Stskeeps | http://blip.tv/file/2659691 blurrycam | 08:53 |
| Stskeeps | new hildon-desktop with SW rendering, actually works decently | 08:53 |
| Stskeeps | some more knob turning and it would probably be usable | 08:54 |
| microlith | is the flickering at the top just weird lcd<->camera interaction or? | 08:54 |
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| Stskeeps | microlith: no, a broken n8x0 screen | 08:55 |
| microlith | ah :/ | 08:55 |
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| Stskeeps | i couldn't find a minisd for my n810 to try it so | 08:55 |
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| johnx | huh. well that was short-lived. the verizon hub is already discontinued | 08:57 |
| johnx | also of note: another linux-based non-open platform | 08:57 |
| Stskeeps | mm? | 08:58 |
| johnx | this: http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/29/verizon-bubs-flub-hawk-their-last-hub/ | 08:58 |
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| johnx | it was based on a non-open linux-based platform. | 08:59 |
| Stskeeps | i wouldn't mind seeing something like Mer on those always-connected-on-AC devices | 09:00 |
| Stskeeps | like the joggler etc | 09:00 |
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| johnx | yeah. I think that might be kind of a cool fit. not sure about the mass market appeal until the price is a lot lower though | 09:01 |
| johnx | and I'm not sure it needs a phone tied onto it | 09:02 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, the joggler doesn't | 09:02 |
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| Stskeeps | touchscreen, ethernet, wifi, dc, that's it :P | 09:02 |
| johnx | ...in fact, I kind feel like it might have gotten marginalized by being marketed as a phone, rather than a "really cool digital picture frame" | 09:02 |
| johnx | that seems to be a market that's doing just fine | 09:02 |
| Corsac | The OS can work both with a hardware keyboard (isn't available in the N920) and on-screen thumbboard. | 09:03 |
| Corsac | bwaha, they are quite positive about that, | 09:03 |
| Corsac | as if it was already announced | 09:03 |
| Stskeeps | Corsac: url? | 09:04 |
| johnx | Corsac, just FYI, there's already an open sourced fullscreen keyboard that works with Maemo5's hildon-input-method | 09:04 |
| johnx | it's on the bugs page | 09:04 |
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| Corsac | http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5-en.shtml#2 / Text input | 09:04 |
| Corsac | johnx: yeah, but that wasn't my point | 09:04 |
| johnx | oh, about the N920 | 09:05 |
| Corsac | lack of hardware keyboard is a good way to reduce size and weight, for “full touch” people | 09:05 |
| Corsac | but all we have atm is rumors | 09:05 |
| Corsac | (afaik) | 09:05 |
| johnx | rumors and a mention of the RX71 | 09:05 |
| johnx | which we think has a much more limited number of keys than the RX51 | 09:05 |
| Corsac | it wouldn't be wise to announce an n920 before n900 has started shipping, though | 09:08 |
| microlith | can't hurt so long as they say "no hardware keyboard" when doing so | 09:08 |
| johnx | yeah, called "pulling an osbourne" | 09:08 |
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| Corsac | microlith: except that people willing to buy the n900 might wait few months for the n920 :) | 09:10 |
| microlith | only if they're willing to forego the hardware keyboard | 09:10 |
| microlith | and that's a major thing that made me go for the N900 | 09:10 |
| microlith | now if the N920 and N900 both had keyboards, with one just a spec bump, then there'd be trouble | 09:11 |
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| Corsac | I might be interested by a non-keyboard version but I'm not really willing to wait some months more :) | 09:13 |
| microlith | hehe | 09:13 |
| * johnx is done with devices that lack a hardware keyboard | 09:14 | |
| microlith | no hw keyboard is what kept me from going iPhone | 09:14 |
| johnx | I love my N800 but it's no fun trying to IRC from it or use the terminal (without a usb/bt keyboard) | 09:14 |
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| Corsac | yeah | 09:15 |
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| timeless | hey, about http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5-en.shtml | 09:17 |
| timeless | they make some comment about untranslated stuff, anyone know what they're talking about? | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | timeless: probably a pre-release version | 09:18 |
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| timeless | none of their pictures seem to show that... | 09:19 |
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| timeless | seems like unsubstantiated bs | 09:19 |
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| timeless | i'm not saying localization was done or was great, just that the article sucks | 09:21 |
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| * timeless gru bles | 09:25 | |
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| * timeless hadn't seen a certain string before | 09:25 | |
| Corsac | maybe the reviewer expected “Bluetooth” to be translated ;p | 09:26 |
| timeless | that's my guess | 09:26 |
| timeless | or Exchange | 09:26 |
| timeless | both of those are NOT supposed to be translated | 09:27 |
| * timeless frowns | 09:28 | |
| timeless | anyone here familiar w/ SMS in phones? | 09:29 |
| * timeless still likes how the finns screwed up first/second person in chat | 09:30 | |
| timeless | he's also dead wrong on one point | 09:32 |
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| * timeless needs to find the packaging list | 09:33 | |
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| Stskeeps | timeless: he's also claiming to have created a list of all maemo nokians along with claiming wazd is a nokia employee.. so always good :P | 09:33 |
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| luke-jr | Stskeeps: and pizza | 09:35 |
| Stskeeps | what? :P | 09:36 |
| Stskeeps | damnit, don't make me hungry this early | 09:36 |
| * timeless sighs | 09:36 | |
| timeless | the sad thing is that i can see 5 to 10 bugs just from his screen shots | 09:38 |
| timeless | most probably aren't filed | 09:38 |
| timeless | btw, what's "gallery"? | 09:40 |
| luke-jr | Stskeeps: I find it amusing to randomly interject 'pizza'. | 09:43 |
| luke-jr | therefore, pizza is now a nokia employee | 09:43 |
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| timeless | heh | 09:44 |
| * timeless sighs | 09:44 | |
| timeless | i love how he compares microb w/ other apps running against an iphone w/ other apps running | 09:45 |
| luke-jr | timeless: don't like your new co-worker?! | 09:45 |
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| timeless | - truth be told, that doesn't happen | 09:45 |
| luke-jr | what? | 09:45 |
| timeless | luke? is he pareve? | 09:45 |
| luke-jr | you don't think people use multiple apps? | 09:45 |
| luke-jr | timeless: pizza? | 09:45 |
| Sho_ | luke-jr: well not on the iphone since it doesn't really do multitasking | 09:46 |
| Sho_ | i.e. it's an unfair comparison | 09:46 |
| luke-jr | o | 09:46 |
| luke-jr | iPhone ftl | 09:47 |
| Sho_ | yep, indeed | 09:47 |
| timeless | > For comparison, on the Apple iPhone the browser's speed doesn't vary, no matter how many applications are running (although, the truth be told, it doesn't have true multitasking functionality). | 09:47 |
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| timeless | .. the iphone doesn't have fake multitasking either.. | 09:48 |
| Myrtti | ooo qgil ♥ | 09:49 |
| timeless | oh brother | 09:49 |
| timeless | he thinks that back operates on currently open pages | 09:49 |
| timeless | would someone *please* flame this guy? | 09:49 |
| timeless | or his translator | 09:50 |
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| luke-jr | timeless: btw, know of any complete low-level list of non-free components on N900? | 09:50 |
| Myrtti | EXCITING! | 09:50 |
| timeless | i don't know of any price lists | 09:51 |
| timeless | oh gah, i can't read | 09:51 |
| timeless | no, i don't know anything about hardware | 09:52 |
| luke-jr | timeless: I was referring to software... | 09:52 |
| timeless | but typically you have to buy each piece of hardware | 09:52 |
| luke-jr | and I mean free, not gratis.. | 09:52 |
| timeless | "nokia-closed" | 09:53 |
| timeless | is the right string fwiw | 09:53 |
| timeless | totally unambiguous | 09:53 |
| timeless | closed is the opposite of open | 09:53 |
| luke-jr | and open is not necessarily free | 09:53 |
| Myrtti | is he going to announce that they've got a partner for hardware? this is building to something | 09:53 |
| Stskeeps | hmm? | 09:54 |
| luke-jr | the question is if there is a list :p | 09:54 |
| Stskeeps | Myrtti: what's going on? :P | 09:54 |
| liri | my battery has drained out. I connected the power supply to the power socket and then to the n810 though nothing happens (it isn't charging). did this happen to anyone before? | 09:54 |
| timeless | there's a list of packages that are currently listed as closed | 09:54 |
| Myrtti | Stskeeps: listening to the openmind keynote http://openmind.fi | 09:54 |
| luke-jr | timeless: something I can see? | 09:54 |
| timeless | i think quim posted something | 09:55 |
| timeless | the info i have is from memory, out of date and was hopefully going to change | 09:55 |
| Myrtti | oh. | 09:55 |
| Stskeeps | timeless: regarding closed packages you mean | 09:56 |
| timeless | but my list wouldn't differentiate between low and high level packages | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr: there's a spreadsheet laying about if you look hard enough | 09:56 |
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| Myrtti | wohoo | 10:01 |
| Myrtti | overhead projector with N900 | 10:01 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 10:01 |
| timeless | . | 10:01 |
| Stskeeps | what's being reported though? :P | 10:01 |
| timeless | ? | 10:01 |
| timeless | "---"? | 10:01 |
| Myrtti | apparently the "new" thing is maemo 5 final sdk | 10:01 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 10:01 |
| Stskeeps | any date on that? | 10:01 |
| Myrtti | if I understood correctly | 10:02 |
| timeless | ask sp3000 | 10:02 |
| timeless | i'm too lazy to fish for it | 10:02 |
| timeless | and too tired to type into the right window :( | 10:03 |
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| frals | mm final sdk, then we can poke around in messaging *dreams about MMS* | 10:04 |
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| Myrtti | god that looks slick | 10:05 |
| Khertan_ | Hi ! | 10:05 |
| Stskeeps | morning Khertan_ | 10:05 |
| Khertan_ | Does there is a git expert here ? i'm trying to use it on my nit ... but unsuccessfull ... | 10:06 |
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| Khertan_ | seems the version on Diablo didn't support push on https | 10:06 |
| Khertan_ | Morning Stskeeps | 10:07 |
| chx | Text Input. The OS can work both with a hardware keyboard (isn't available in the N920) and on-screen thumbboard. | 10:10 |
| chx | wait what | 10:11 |
| chx | n920? | 10:11 |
| Myrtti | bullshit | 10:11 |
| timeless | that's the least of his stupid bits | 10:11 |
| timeless | at least people can understand tha it's wrong/irrelevant | 10:12 |
| chx | what are the bigger ones | 10:12 |
| Khertan_ | where too ? | 10:12 |
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| timeless | lemme check the maemo site first | 10:12 |
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| johnx | s/N920/RX71/ ? | 10:12 |
| Myrtti | it's not official until the fat lady sings | 10:13 |
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| johnx | but you can make bets at any point you want :) | 10:13 |
| evadne | Hii- I have a question about setting up SSH on my nokia n810 | 10:14 |
| timeless | he indicates we include the ability to open office documents | 10:14 |
| johnx | evadne, hi. :) | 10:14 |
| evadne | I followed this guide: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=23932&highlight=ssh+password and I am unable to login with the password I set up | 10:14 |
| timeless | check his screen shots and you can see it's trialware | 10:14 |
| evadne | hi :) | 10:15 |
| Khertan_ | "set work again on the rx71" ... <<< héhé | 10:15 |
| timeless | i'm not sure how he missed the incredibly long dialogs that explaihed that | 10:15 |
| Khertan_ | I Like the comment on scm | 10:15 |
| timeless | s/hed/ned/ | 10:15 |
| infobot | timeless meant: i'm not sure how he missed the incredibly long dialogs that explained that | 10:15 |
| evadne | 'sudo ./flasher-3.0 --enable-rd-mode -R' => incorrect password | 10:16 |
| johnx | evadne, that's your user password on your desktop | 10:18 |
| johnx | evadne, and hang on for a sec before you do that | 10:18 |
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| johnx | that's a pretty strange thing to be doing | 10:18 |
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| johnx | anyone else having trouble connecting to talk.maemo.org? | 10:19 |
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| evadne | talk.maemo seems to be down every now and then | 10:19 |
| * timeless cries | 10:20 | |
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| evadne | 'sudo gainroot' => enable RD mode to gain root privileges | 10:20 |
| timeless | sp3000: is notes's font picker really that stupid? | 10:20 |
| Khertan_ | johnx: can't connect too | 10:21 |
| Khertan_ | johnx: timeout | 10:21 |
| evadne | bing has a more recent cache than google's, if talk.maemo is down | 10:21 |
| johnx | evadne, ok, the short version is: don't use that howto | 10:21 |
| johnx | have you enabled extras? | 10:21 |
| evadne | where and how? :( sorry im a n00b at this stuff | 10:22 |
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| johnx | evadne, no worries: http://wiki.maemo.org/Extras | 10:23 |
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| johnx | uhm, it sounds like that howto is outdated if it's still talking about something like using flasher to get root access just to install ssh | 10:24 |
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| evadne | okie, extras are enabled | 10:25 |
| slonopotamus_ | Khertan_, !!! | 10:25 |
| johnx | evadne, browser for openssh-server in the applications list and install it | 10:25 |
| johnx | it'll make you set a root password as part of the install process | 10:26 |
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| slonopotamus_ | Khertan_, pygtkeditor 2.4.3-1 is broken | 10:26 |
| Khertan_ | 2.4.3-1 yes it is | 10:26 |
| evadne | its not there - is it because i already installed it? | 10:26 |
| slonopotamus_ | Khertan_, error on any file open | 10:26 |
| Khertan_ | this is why i ve push 2.4.4 | 10:26 |
| slonopotamus_ | oh, didn't see it yet | 10:27 |
| RST38h | reMoo | 10:27 |
| evadne | thats how i set the root password, which WinSCP says its incorrect | 10:27 |
| johnx | evadne, check in your installed list | 10:27 |
| Khertan_ | pygtkeditor_2.4.4-1_armel.deb 28.09.2009 17:01 20824 pygtkeditor_2.4.4-1_i386.deb 28.09.2009 17:01 20820 | 10:27 |
| Khertan_ | this is in extras | 10:28 |
| evadne | yes, its there: openssh -client -sever | 10:28 |
| evadne | -server* | 10:28 |
| Khertan_ | 2.4.3 was push in extras-devel only :) | 10:28 |
| evadne | all 3 of them i mean* | 10:28 |
| johnx | evadne, alright. open up a terminal on the n810 itself and type: | 10:28 |
| johnx | ssh root@localhost | 10:28 |
| Khertan_ | i test before pushing my apps to extras :) | 10:28 |
| johnx | then type the password you setup | 10:28 |
| timeless | don't forget to reboot after installing ssh-server | 10:29 |
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| evadne | went through | 10:29 |
| evadne | password worked on n810 | 10:30 |
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| johnx | evadne, on your windows box, what are you typing for "username"? | 10:30 |
| johnx | timeless, why? | 10:30 |
| RST38h | johnx: does not auto start | 10:30 |
| johnx | news to me | 10:30 |
| timeless | the ssh package i get doesn't start sshd automatically post.inst | 10:30 |
| johnx | is that a recent change? | 10:31 |
| timeless | =most annoying thing | 10:31 |
| timeless | nope, been that way for ages | 10:31 |
| evadne | username=what i set up, so it's 'sana', and the pass is the same | 10:31 |
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| timeless | evadne is this mer or maemo | 10:32 |
| johnx | evadne, there are two users on your N810: "user" and "root" | 10:32 |
| johnx | timeless, it's maemo | 10:32 |
| johnx | unless...wait...did you actually install mer evadne? | 10:32 |
| timeless | as johnx says... you set the password for user "root" | 10:32 |
| evadne | timeless, im using maemo | 10:33 |
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| evadne | 1 sec | 10:33 |
| timeless | johnx: just doing due dilligence and ruling it out :) | 10:33 |
| johnx | timeless, good thinking, it just seemed too much like maemo, though I guess that .install for extras might work just fine in mer these days ... | 10:34 |
| evadne | i tried root, it says access denied | 10:35 |
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| johnx | evadne, do you have an ssh client on your PC (like putty)? | 10:35 |
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| evadne | im using winscp, but i can install putty | 10:36 |
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| timeless | re you sure you have the right ip address/network? :) | 10:36 |
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| evadne | installed,running putty, asks for my password => incorrect again | 10:38 |
| johnx | with user "root"? | 10:39 |
| evadne | yayyyy | 10:40 |
| evadne | i'm in! | 10:40 |
| evadne | Thank you johnx and timeless :) | 10:40 |
| johnx | evadne, ok. now for the second part | 10:41 |
| evadne | yes | 10:42 |
| johnx | in the terminal on the device itself (as "user," not "root) | 10:42 |
| johnx | type: passwd | 10:42 |
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| johnx | err. actually forget that | 10:42 |
| johnx | as root type: passwd user | 10:42 |
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| evadne | new password = anything i would like? | 10:43 |
| johnx | yup | 10:43 |
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| johnx | after that you'll be able to login as "user" from ssh/scp and you don't have to worry about messing up system files or weird permissions | 10:43 |
| evadne | okay! sounds good :) | 10:44 |
| evadne | will i need to reboot either machines now? | 10:44 |
| johnx | nope | 10:44 |
| sp3000 | timeless: font picker wha? | 10:44 |
| evadne | thanks again :) | 10:44 |
| evadne | night | 10:44 |
| johnx | sure. enjoy | 10:44 |
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| johnx | ssh should get started after it's installed | 10:46 |
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| johnx | must be some typo in the postinst I'm not seeing | 10:47 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 11:14 |
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| Stskeeps | morn jaffa | 11:16 |
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| MaceN8x0 | starting to get cold | 11:56 |
| johnx | yeah | 11:57 |
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| johnx | and I am most displeased with it's effect on my commute | 11:58 |
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| MaceN8x0 | heh | 12:02 |
| MaceN8x0 | driving? | 12:02 |
| MaceN8x0 | or taking a train? | 12:02 |
| MaceN8x0 | it is just a little colder out now | 12:02 |
| johnx | I'm in the Seattle area and still people start driving with their asses as soon as it starts raining | 12:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | in seattle? | 12:03 |
| johnx | yeah | 12:03 |
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| MaceN8x0 | i figured people there were used to rain and snow | 12:03 |
| johnx | 30 minute commute becomes 1hr+ | 12:04 |
| MaceN8x0 | i know in texas if it snows the entire state shuts down | 12:04 |
| MaceN8x0 | haha | 12:04 |
| woglinde | johnx so better no snow | 12:04 |
| MaceN8x0 | like it is the end of days | 12:04 |
| woglinde | macer *g* | 12:04 |
| MaceN8x0 | in chicago rain and snow is normal | 12:04 |
| MaceN8x0 | people hardly slow down | 12:05 |
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| MaceN8x0 | can't wait to get this touchbook | 12:05 |
| MaceN8x0 | :) | 12:05 |
| MaceN8x0 | i'm excited | 12:05 |
| johnx | woglinde, nah, then people drive their cars into ditches and I pass them :) | 12:05 |
| Corsac | last news from expansys, oct 22! | 12:06 |
| Corsac | that's exactly as I said | 12:06 |
| Corsac | oct 22 on the morning, oct 29 on the evening | 12:06 |
| MaceN8x0 | expansys? | 12:06 |
| Corsac | http://www.expansys.fr/d.aspx?i=187231 | 12:06 |
| woglinde | macer when will it arrive? | 12:07 |
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| MaceN8x0 | woglinde, they said soon after processing the payment | 12:08 |
| MaceN8x0 | which was done yesterday | 12:09 |
| woglinde | *g* | 12:09 |
| MaceN8x0 | so hopefully by monday at the latest | 12:09 |
| MaceN8x0 | waiting on a tracking number now | 12:09 |
| woglinde | yes | 12:09 |
| woglinde | iegpv are in stock | 12:09 |
| woglinde | s | 12:09 |
| woglinde | args igep | 12:10 |
| woglinde | hm | 12:10 |
| MaceN8x0 | Corsac, media tablet? | 12:10 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 12:10 |
| woglinde | but now I can get an beagle | 12:10 |
| woglinde | for free | 12:10 |
| MaceN8x0 | well | 12:10 |
| woglinde | http://www.igep-platform.com/shop/ | 12:10 |
| MaceN8x0 | tb is a beagleboard laptop ;) | 12:10 |
| woglinde | macer I know touchbook for nearly a year now | 12:11 |
| woglinde | or 8 months | 12:11 |
| woglinde | or so | 12:11 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 12:11 |
| MaceN8x0 | well, they have been shipping since july | 12:11 |
| MaceN8x0 | er. aug | 12:11 |
| woglinde | but you will need a sis-usb for beamers | 12:11 |
| MaceN8x0 | sis-usb? | 12:12 |
| woglinde | yeah no external vga connector | 12:12 |
| glass__ | vga-from-usb(i think in this case) | 12:12 |
| MaceN8x0 | oh | 12:12 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 12:12 |
| woglinde | did you overlook this? | 12:12 |
| MaceN8x0 | i will probably never need that | 12:12 |
| woglinde | hm oh okay | 12:12 |
| MaceN8x0 | i don't hook my laptops to a monitor | 12:12 |
| woglinde | so you never give talks | 12:12 |
| MaceN8x0 | ;) | 12:13 |
| X-Fade | Quim presenting live from the N900 on beamers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYTSFTdF-u8 | 12:13 |
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| ensi | hi | 12:13 |
| woglinde | x-fade how connected? | 12:13 |
| X-Fade | tv-out | 12:13 |
| woglinde | *g* | 12:13 |
| woglinde | oh it has tv-out | 12:13 |
| MaceN8x0 | like n95 | 12:13 |
| woglinde | never looked at this spec | 12:13 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 12:13 |
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| ensi | sorry this is probably a very stupid question, im just starting with maemo and a bit confused. I want do some qt dev, i have to install the qt dev packages on both targets? I added the repos in /etc/sources.list and installed qt packages on X86 target. Works as expected. I tried doing the same on ARM target and i get "/scratchbox/tools/bin/misc_runner: SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD not set | 12:14 |
| ensi | when running atp-get | 12:14 |
| woglinde | ensi yes | 12:14 |
| woglinde | know problem | 12:14 |
| woglinde | look at the qt4 garage side for fix | 12:14 |
| ensi | woglinde: whats the solution? :) | 12:14 |
| woglinde | just setting SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD | 12:15 |
| lcuk | X-Fade, you are aware - now we have such a kickass presentation platform - we will need something new and even more advanced - wireless tv out :P | 12:15 |
| ensi | sorry im very new to this, i tried googling for that but I havent quite figured out how to work it yet... | 12:15 |
| woglinde | lcuk haha | 12:15 |
| lcuk | being stuck to a wire during a presentation is hard :D | 12:15 |
| * lcuk knows | 12:15 | |
| woglinde | lcuk only few beamers have wifi | 12:15 |
| frals | :D | 12:16 |
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| woglinde | hm is qemu working on 32bit chroot on 64bit system? | 12:28 |
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| lardman | morning | 12:36 |
| lardman | thready question for you all | 12:36 |
| lardman | is it really not allowed to alter some gtk+ GUI components from a thread? | 12:36 |
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| lardman | I guess I could add a g_timeout_add_seconds callback from the main code, and poll some flag to see if my thread has finished | 12:38 |
| lardman | is that the recommended route? | 12:38 |
| derf | Generally, manipulating highly stateful objects (like GUI widgets) from multiple threads is a bad, bad idea. | 12:38 |
| RST38h | In fact, keeping all UI in a single thread is a good, good idea | 12:38 |
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| RST38h | (IBM takes it to the next level moving all functionality into command line executables of course :)) | 12:39 |
| lardman | yeah I understand that, just trying to think of a nice clean way to get my web scraper threads to provide info to be displayed on the gui | 12:39 |
| lardman | :) | 12:39 |
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| RST38h | lardman: array =) | 12:40 |
| lardman | well yeah, it is char* data ;) | 12:40 |
| RST38h | lardman: may need to lock individual entries | 12:40 |
| RST38h | lardman: Array of char *s | 12:40 |
| lardman | a global var then | 12:40 |
| lcuk | global variables have problems of read/modify/write cycle - use a mutex | 12:41 |
| lcuk | or find a method that doesnt involve mucking aobut like that | 12:42 |
| lardman | that's the problem | 12:42 |
| derf | Glib has a number of useful facilities (e.g., g_async_queue). | 12:42 |
| * lcuk nods | 12:42 | |
| lcuk | i do know the problem lol | 12:42 |
| RST38h | lardman: You should be ok with a simple array of pointers | 12:42 |
| RST38h | lardman: Do not get more complicated than necessary | 12:42 |
| lcuk | derf, cool! | 12:42 |
| RST38h | lardman: add a simple lock to each entry, this will avoid your threads fromscrewing it up | 12:43 |
| lcuk | RST38h, but if the tools have been written and already abstracted it should be simple | 12:43 |
| Macer | hm | 12:43 |
| Macer | what to do what to do | 12:43 |
| derf | And g_timeout_add is indeed the preferred way to schedule code to be executed in the GUI thread. | 12:43 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Adding more stuff is ALWAYS wrong even if it has already been written | 12:43 |
| RST38h | lcuk: You are adding more variables to the equation basically | 12:43 |
| lcuk | having odd blowups (bitter experience) at random times is bad too | 12:43 |
| lardman | nah, written it myself so no problem there | 12:44 |
| RST38h | lcuk: You can easily avoid this by proper locking | 12:44 |
| lardman | other than that fact of course ;) | 12:44 |
| lcuk | mutex | 12:44 |
| lcuk | yes | 12:44 |
| lardman | g_child_watch_add looks useful perhaps | 12:44 |
| RST38h | lardman: GetEntry(), ReleaseEntry(), AddEntry(), DeleteEntry() | 12:44 |
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| RST38h | lardman: Notice that DeleteEntry() marks entry for deletion and it will get deleted as soon as the last lock is released | 12:45 |
| RST38h | lardman: All these functions are <5lines each | 12:45 |
| ensi | hmm ok i played with the sb-menu tool and set emulation for FREMANTLE_ARMEL target so apt-get starts but now it appears that it cant resolve any adresses ("Temporary failure resolving 'repository.maemo.org'") | 12:45 |
| RST38h | lardman: And do not require glib | 12:46 |
| lardman | RST38h: yeah, basically mutexes, but I'd prefer to not have to poll and wait for the thread to finish | 12:46 |
| lardman | though I can also see the appeal of not getting too closely linked to glib | 12:47 |
| RST38h | lardman: You will not | 12:47 |
| RST38h | lardman: Yu are having a writer thread and a reader thread | 12:48 |
| lardman | yep | 12:48 |
| RST38h | lardman: reader won't have to wait longer than it takes writer to add a new entry, writer does not wait at all, as both add and delete happen instantly | 12:48 |
| lardman | but reader must wait for writer to download then parse the file before it can read | 12:49 |
| RST38h | lardman: why? | 12:49 |
| RST38h | lardman: the array of entries is notlocked while the writer is downloading and parsing | 12:50 |
| lardman | because that's what the thread does, goes off and downloads a file, parses it and extracts useful info | 12:50 |
| RST38h | lardman:reader only needs to wait for a brief moment while writer updates the actual array with info | 12:50 |
| lardman | I'm not bothered about the locking, just scheduling when the reader thread should actually read | 12:50 |
| RST38h | lardman:this should account for about 10-20 assembly instructions for the writer :) | 12:51 |
| lardman | but the reader needs to wait until the writer has finished, somehow, and that will lock up the ui, etc | 12:51 |
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| lardman | unless I add a timed callback to poll some global var that the writer sets once it has written | 12:52 |
| derf | lardman: No, the writer can add a callback with g_timeout_add() that executes once. | 12:52 |
| derf | But it executes in the main GUI thread. | 12:52 |
| lardman | ah! | 12:52 |
| lardman | great, exactly what I need then | 12:53 |
| lardman | thanks chaps, sorry for not explaining myself better | 12:53 |
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| javispedro | hello #maemo morning shift :) | 12:58 |
| lardman | morning javispedro | 12:58 |
| Stskeeps | morn | 12:58 |
| * javispedro watches live n900 presentation ... cool. | 13:00 | |
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| woglinde | hi javis | 13:02 |
| lardman | bbl chaps | 13:02 |
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| javispedro | hiyo | 13:03 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, hey dayshift guy | 13:13 |
| javispedro | lol | 13:13 |
| Macer | Woody Allen, Pedro Almodovar and Martin Scorsese have "demanded the immediate release" of fellow filmmaker Roman Polanski, who was arrested in Switzerland on a U.S. arrest warrant related to a 1977 child sex charge. | 13:13 |
| Macer | HAHAHA | 13:13 |
| Macer | a bunch of perverts | 13:13 |
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| javispedro | for sure :D | 13:14 |
| Macer | the perverts want their fellow pervert released | 13:14 |
| Macer | like nambla | 13:14 |
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| zerojay | wtf have I stumbled into here? | 13:27 |
| Stskeeps | o_o? | 13:28 |
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| woglinde | re | 13:46 |
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| javispedro | re wog | 13:47 |
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| woglinde | hm tasty dueruem doener for lunch | 13:50 |
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| Macer | the closer is actually pretty good | 13:52 |
| woglinde | macer? | 13:53 |
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| Macer | i'm watching the closer | 13:53 |
| woglinde | ah | 13:53 |
| woglinde | wasnt it a woman? | 13:53 |
| Anunakin | Hi All! | 13:53 |
| Anunakin | hey! any here knows how to change keyboard layout on easy debian? | 13:53 |
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| Macer | damn it's freezing here | 13:54 |
| Macer | i guess saying "shit" on tv is a big thing nowadays? | 13:54 |
| Macer | is there a limit to how many times they can say it or something? | 13:54 |
| woglinde | Anunakin the channelsname is easy debian? | 13:55 |
| Macer | when they say it.. it seems so scripted | 13:55 |
| woglinde | macer yeah its freezing here too | 13:56 |
| woglinde | but we have blue sky too | 13:56 |
| Macer | it isn't freezing yet ;) | 13:57 |
| Macer | but it is getting there | 13:57 |
| Macer | soon snow will come again | 13:57 |
| swc|666 | Macer, no sure... but they can say "fuck" in a pg-13 movie once | 13:57 |
| Macer | swc|666: heh. i think there is a limit to how they can say it or how many times they can say it on normal television | 13:58 |
| Macer | it is very scripted | 13:58 |
| Macer | like everybody goes silent when someoen gets ready to say shit on television | 13:58 |
| swc|666 | yea i know :| | 13:58 |
| woglinde | hihi yes censorship is a wide topic | 13:59 |
| woglinde | and very very differently in the countries | 13:59 |
| woglinde | *waiting for eclipse upate* | 14:02 |
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| woglinde | fornatly in these days updating minor release with eclipse isnt pain anymore | 14:03 |
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| Macer | i wonder if the actual effort to solve crimes is as strong in real life | 14:11 |
| Macer | i doubt it | 14:12 |
| woglinde | macer hm? | 14:12 |
| woglinde | there is not such a think like csi in real life | 14:13 |
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| lcuk | woglinde, of course there is, i think more police officers aspire to be chief wiggum tho :D | 14:15 |
| Macer | Prosecutors have consistently argued that it would be a miscarriage of justice to allow a man who "drugged and raped a 13-year-old child" to go free. | 14:16 |
| Macer | hollywood is full of pervs | 14:16 |
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| lcuk | s\hollywood\the world\ | 14:16 |
| Macer | lcuk: yeah. that too | 14:17 |
| Macer | but hollywood has the ones that get away with it | 14:17 |
| SpeedEvil | The victim should get some say though. | 14:17 |
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| Macer | the rich have a different system of everything :) | 14:17 |
| Macer | this is Polanski | 14:18 |
| Macer | http://www.cnn.com/2009/SHOWBIZ/Movies/09/29/polanski.filmmakers.protest/index.html | 14:18 |
| zerojay | Forget about the 13 year old. This is the guy that made The Pianist. | 14:18 |
| Macer | wha tmakes it so bad is they are not arguing that he did or didn't do it | 14:18 |
| zerojay | He should be killed for that reason alone! | 14:18 |
| glass__ | hehe yeah | 14:18 |
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| Macer | they are arguing that he shouldn't have been tricked into being arrested | 14:18 |
| Macer | hahaha | 14:18 |
| woglinde | macer yes polanski is special | 14:19 |
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| Macer | like "how could they arrest him while he was going to a party we were throwing?" | 14:19 |
| woglinde | but now I think there are more people, besides gadafhi, which belevies that swiss should be destroye | 14:19 |
| glass__ | "fuck the investigations, WE WANT THE TAPE!" | 14:19 |
| woglinde | d | 14:19 |
| zerojay | Something I learned while working with a Hollywood writer. People there just don't live in the real world. | 14:20 |
| Macer | zerojay: haha | 14:20 |
| Macer | they sure don't | 14:20 |
| glass__ | zerojay: if they did, they'd have easier time making intresting films | 14:20 |
| woglinde | zerojay nothing new | 14:20 |
| Macer | i never saw the pianist | 14:20 |
| glass__ | i saw enough of the pianist to not see it | 14:21 |
| zerojay | No, nothing new because we have heard it many times before... what was new was some of the stories he's told me about being in Hollyweird. | 14:21 |
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| kynde | Has someone gotten the iptables nat working on n810 diablo? | 14:32 |
| woglinde | kynde you are trying to make your nxx a router? | 14:33 |
| adeus | which way | 14:33 |
| Stskeeps | kynde: i think someone did | 14:34 |
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| kynde | along those lines, yes. I've built the modules needed for nat. And iptables -t nat works, but anomalously the forwarded packets miss the postrouting MASQUERADE rule. | 14:35 |
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| kynde | I've been poking around with google, but haven't found a proof of concept. | 14:35 |
| ShadowJK | Miss or are packets just not routed at all? | 14:37 |
| kynde | They're routed all right, but without source IP change (i.e. nat masquerade) | 14:38 |
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| SpeedEvil | you've set the iup_forward thing in /proc | 14:38 |
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| ShadowJK | Pastebin your rules? | 14:39 |
| kynde | yup, they pass through forward alright. but somehow the iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -j MASQUERADE doesn't catch packets going out through wlan. | 14:39 |
| ShadowJK | iptables -vnL ; iptables -t nat -vnL | 14:40 |
| ShadowJK | (pastebin) | 14:40 |
| kynde | -o wlan0 doesn't help either. I have numerous -j MASQUERADE varying rules that should work. | 14:40 |
| kynde | there: http://pastebin.com/d54d1988a | 14:41 |
| adeus | you have allowed routing from proc? | 14:42 |
| kynde | yup. they wouldn't even forward otherwise. | 14:42 |
| * SpeedEvil has just woken up and is simply operating on reflex | 14:44 | |
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| SpeedEvil | may the router be screwing things up/ | 14:44 |
| ShadowJK | What are you trying to make your n800 do? | 14:44 |
| ShadowJK | What other interface than wlan do you have on it? | 14:45 |
| kynde | act as an netboot server. got the udhcpd and tftpd working, but this forwarding (that's usually trivial) is becoming problematic. | 14:45 |
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| kynde | usb-nic | 14:45 |
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| ShadowJK | So all devices connected to ethernet should have the n810's wlan IP? | 14:46 |
| kynde | they should. | 14:46 |
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| ShadowJK | No rules matching -o wlan0 seems strange then | 14:49 |
| kynde | it's really bizarre, since I can see that for example the icmp echo requests hit the MASQUERADE rule in packet counts, but n810 tcpdump on n810 wlan0 shows them with the ip source from which they originated. | 14:49 |
| ShadowJK | i forget if tcpdump on wlan0 would show sensible and correct info | 14:50 |
| ShadowJK | Much better to tcpdump on something else on wlan.. | 14:50 |
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| kynde | done that, too. an icmp ping from n810 shows up on the otherside with the n810 wlan0 ip. but a ping from behind the n810 ups the packet cound in said MASQUERADE rule but even then shows up on the otherside with original IP unaltered. | 14:53 |
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| kynde | Now, what I'm thinking is that just about the only explanation that I have is that it has everything to do with the wlan driver. Isn't it closed source? | 14:54 |
| Stskeeps | not the relevant part | 14:54 |
| jeremiah | kynde: Do you how more than on dhcp server on your network? | 14:55 |
| jeremiah | s/how/have | 14:55 |
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| kynde | not on said network. | 14:56 |
| jeremiah | If there is more than one it often causes problems. | 14:56 |
| jeremiah | But I guess that is not the issue. | 14:56 |
| kynde | I don't think the issue is dhcp related, since the machine "behind" n810 can ping the n180 (heck, it boots from it!). | 14:57 |
| jeremiah | kynde: Good point. | 14:57 |
| kynde | s/n180/n810/ | 14:57 |
| infobot | kynde meant: I don't think the issue is dhcp related, since the machine "behind" n810 can ping the n810 (heck, it boots from it!). | 14:57 |
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| * kynde beat the bot. :) | 14:57 | |
| jeremiah | :) | 14:58 |
| kynde | Ok, let's rephrase the original question. Has someone compiled an n810 diablo kernel in scratchbox with CONFIG_NF_CONNTRACK_ENABLED that actually works? | 14:59 |
| jeremiah | Getting right to the heart of the matter. :) | 14:59 |
| kynde | yup. :) | 15:00 |
| kynde | Since, I ran into some problems during that stage. A kernel where that was set =n works flawlessly in n810, but even if I set it to =m the bugger won't work. Hangs if I hit the network selector. | 15:00 |
| lardman | Macer: just reading the backlog, he admitted to a lesser charge in the US then fled before sentencing, that's why he's in trouble | 15:00 |
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| kynde | So I compiled the kernel with that flag set to n and then recompiled the modules straigh after that. insmodded them and got the iptables "working" but it's just that they fail to "masquerade". | 15:01 |
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| kynde | Which begs for the question: "has anyone gotten masquerading working on an n810?" | 15:02 |
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| lardman | kynde: try the maemo-developers list | 15:04 |
| lardman | larger audience | 15:04 |
| kynde | I think I will. I thought I'd ask you guys first. | 15:04 |
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| lardman | I've never tried, and you may have to wait for a while as this is work time in Europe, so we should all be working ;) | 15:05 |
| lardman | wait for a reply that is | 15:05 |
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| * kynde is lucky enough to be able to actually work with nits. :) | 15:06 | |
| jeremiah | Yeah, we should all be working! ha ha ha! Working! | 15:06 |
| SpeedEvil | kynde: shiny. | 15:07 |
| SpeedEvil | (or do you not mean the optical unit) | 15:07 |
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| lardman | jeremiah: I can put you to work... need to know how to install icons and other random items | 15:09 |
| lardman | but will probably just grab a random deb and see how it's done, rather than waste your time | 15:09 |
| jeremiah | lardman: Did you include your icon in your package? (i.e. control file?) | 15:10 |
| jeremiah | lardman: You never waste me time! =] | 15:10 |
| lardman | I've not even created a debian directory yet | 15:10 |
| jeremiah | Maemo has a kinda cool innovation where the icon for an app is included in-line as it were. | 15:11 |
| lardman | have source + Makefile so far | 15:11 |
| jeremiah | lardman: Ah, okay. | 15:11 |
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| lardman | which package would you recommend looking at to copy? | 15:11 |
| jeremiah | lardman: I have a sample deb dir for you; | 15:11 |
| jeremiah | hold on one sec . . . | 15:11 |
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| jeremiah | lardman: https://garage.maemo.org/svn/maemoexamples/trunk/dummy-package/debian/ | 15:12 |
| jeremiah | ^^ That is from garage | 15:12 |
| jeremiah | And it is pretty good because it is so minimalistic | 15:12 |
| jeremiah | Maemo doesn't use all the debian stuff, so it is easier to _add_ things that remove them. | 15:12 |
| jeremiah | At least in my opinion. | 15:12 |
| lardman | great, I'll give that a go this evening and pester you tomorrow when I break it ;) | 15:13 |
| lcuk | jeremiah, thats the icon for the app manager isnt it | 15:13 |
| lcuk | not the icon for the app after installation | 15:13 |
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| jeremiah | lcuk: Yes. | 15:13 |
| * lcuk nods | 15:13 | |
| lcuk | ill have to learn how to do that myself | 15:13 |
| jeremiah | I thought that is what we were referring to - maybe I'm confused. | 15:13 |
| lcuk | is your talk on packaging then | 15:13 |
| lardman | ah yes, so what about the .desktop files, etc? | 15:13 |
| lardman | where should they be placed? | 15:14 |
| jeremiah | lcuk: Yeah, I'll speak on packaging. :) | 15:14 |
| lcuk | excellent | 15:15 |
| jeremiah | lardman: I usually don't add a .desktop file in maemo, but I'll see what the practice is. For me it s more a debian thing | 15:15 |
| lardman | aren't they needed to add it to the menu? | 15:15 |
| * lardman normally writes DSP code and other stuff that doesn't get run directly | 15:15 | |
| lcuk | lardman, liqtorch has quite a straight forward makefile + basic structure for all the required files | 15:15 |
| lcuk | its not hidden or covered with autotoolisms | 15:16 |
| lardman | ok lcuk, will grab the source for that too and take a look-see | 15:16 |
| lcuk | and we know it puts everything in the right places | 15:16 |
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| jeremiah | Yeah, that might be a good place to start. :) | 15:16 |
| * lcuk nods | 15:16 | |
| lcuk | it should be illuminating | 15:16 |
| * lardman wishes for an auto-debianiser | 15:16 | |
| lardman | oh dear! | 15:16 |
| lcuk | and if its not, blame qwerty :D | 15:16 |
| lardman | right, lunch time, bbiab | 15:17 |
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| woglinde | jepp with .desktop file no menu entry | 15:17 |
| jeremiah | lardman: There is an auto-debianiser: debhelper | 15:17 |
| woglinde | args without | 15:17 |
| jeremiah | lardman|lunch: Do a 'man dh_make' | 15:17 |
| jeremiah | lardman|lunch: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing#Packaging | 15:19 |
| lcuk | how about "jeremiah dh_make" :D and we get a little avatar of you popping up on tablet | 15:19 |
| jeremiah | lcuk: Heh - :P | 15:19 |
| lcuk | have fun folks, bbl | 15:19 |
| lcuk | \o | 15:20 |
| jeremiah | o/ | 15:20 |
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| lcuk | :P too # | 15:20 |
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| luke-jr | Stskeeps: by "low level", I meant packages rather than general concepts :P | 15:41 |
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| Stskeeps | luke-jr: yeah, and i mean packages too | 15:43 |
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| Stskeeps | luke-jr: google site:maemo.org filetype:ods oss | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | that should find you the spreadsheets | 15:48 |
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| luke-jr | Stskeeps: both ODS files are too old to realisticly be N900 | 15:50 |
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| vanksi | is maemo 5 the same as OS2008 on maemo.org, ie the apps under OS2008 will work on maemo 5? | 15:53 |
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| Stskeeps | luke-jr: oh, this is for n8x0. i don't know about n900 | 15:54 |
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| vanksi | oh, apparently it's not the same | 15:55 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr: i wouldn't mind a n900 list really | 15:55 |
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| aol_ | if I want to install screenshot through application manager to N900 what do I need to do ? | 15:56 |
| aol_ | http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo5.0beta/free/s/screenshot-tool/ | 15:56 |
| aol_ | add new catalogue ? | 15:56 |
| aol_ | or? | 15:56 |
| Stskeeps | i'd personally use the load applet | 15:56 |
| X-Fade | aol_: Just install load-applet. | 15:56 |
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| aol_ | hmm it says conflicting application packages, with maemo5-load-applet ... so already installed? | 16:00 |
| aol_ | 0_o | 16:00 |
| aol_ | I'm such a noob :) | 16:00 |
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| aol_ | ok it WAS already installed ... anyway, thanks for help! | 16:02 |
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| Jaffa | Anyone played with maemo5-load-applet? | 16:03 |
| RST38h | it is broken and interferes with load-applet | 16:03 |
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| aol_ | seems to work | 16:04 |
| Jaffa | Right. | 16:04 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: from the comments on http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/maemo5-load-applet/0.2.9-1 it seems the package should be deleted. | 16:04 |
| aol_ | but right, load-applet did not install when there was already maemo5-load-applet | 16:04 |
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| X-Fade | Jaffa: Indeed, let me do that then. | 16:08 |
| Jaffa | Hmm. Either Vodafone is denying me access to the Internet, or something's broken between my device and extras | 16:11 |
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| SpeedEvil | APN problems? | 16:15 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Worksforme[tm] ? | 16:15 |
| Jaffa | SpeedEvil: Seems to have just started. Reboot not sorted. | 16:15 |
| Jaffa | Working now | 16:17 |
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| lopz | gm ;) | 16:30 |
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| pupnik | How Palm Pre's "App Store" is clashing with open-source: http://www.precentral.net/submitting-palms-app-catalog-how-difficult-it | 16:35 |
| pupnik | " JWZ's tip calc brought up a lot of teeth-gnashing because he didn't care to implement the features that other people wanted on his app. But he posted the source, other people made the changes, re-posted his app, and everyone went their separate ways. | 16:36 |
| pupnik | "Under the conditions of the App Store contract, this isn't possible - it violates the clause about the App Store being the sole means of distribution. And *that* is absolutely unacceptable. | 16:36 |
| RST38h | Actually, Handango and friends also insist on clauses like this | 16:37 |
| RST38h | Another reason not to use app stores | 16:37 |
| pupnik | Yep. Managers are herds. They see Apple making money with something and say 'lets try that too'. | 16:37 |
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| pupnik | IIRC, Nintendo was defeated in US courts on similar clasuses. (You may only release for Nintendo) | 16:39 |
| pupnik | *clauses | 16:39 |
| derf | RST38h: Easy money is still money. | 16:39 |
| RST38h | derf: What easy money? | 16:39 |
| derf | Copying a proven formula for success. | 16:40 |
| RST38h | derf: Do you get paid for copying or for success? =) | 16:40 |
| ab | pupnik, what case are you referring to w.r.t. Nintendo? | 16:40 |
| derf | I'm a Ph.D. in industry. I get paid for copying. | 16:40 |
| RST38h | derf: So your employer still loses on it? | 16:42 |
| derf | Probably. But everyone expects R&D to lose money. | 16:42 |
| frals | :D | 16:43 |
| derf | Fortunately I have one of the highest direct ratios in the department, so no one will come looking my way. | 16:43 |
| RST38h | derf: AFAIK, the guys rolling out app stores are in productization =) | 16:43 |
| RST38h | or some other vague department, services etc | 16:44 |
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| derf | RST38h: Sure, but my point was, success breeds competition. | 16:44 |
| derf | If something makes money, people will try to imitate it, and no one cares about being "original". | 16:45 |
| lardman | jeremiah: ok, will give that a go, thanks | 16:45 |
| RST38h | derf: ah, no argument there, I agree | 16:46 |
| Jaffa | Ah, my Python GUI works: | 16:47 |
| Jaffa | http://www.flickr.com/photos/30863507@N02/3968349651/in/set-72157622487386764/ | 16:47 |
| RST38h | derf: the real question is why all these guys (Palm, Nokia) think they will be successful by blindly copying apple | 16:47 |
| RST38h | "me too" job is not competition, it is just catching up | 16:47 |
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| lardman | Jaffa: I can see you took alot of time over that GUI, all the complex elements ;) | 16:48 |
| RST38h | also, if I were doing it, I would make getting as many apps as possible my top priority - weird that these guys do not | 16:48 |
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| pupnik | ab: i can't recally specifics atm. i believe it was durin the 16-bit console era. | 16:49 |
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| ab | http://vimeo.com/5592233 :) | 16:49 |
| ab | *not related to a previous discussion* | 16:49 |
| Jaffa | lardman: There's some complexness in the accounts dialogue. And the progressbars. And the block-for-facebook-auth | 16:49 |
| RST38h | ab: Wisdom Tree | 16:50 |
| lardman | Jaffa: don't worry, was only joking | 16:50 |
| RST38h | ab: actually, taking it back, different case | 16:50 |
| Jaffa | lardman: I'll get my revenge... :-p | 16:51 |
| lardman | ah, didn't notice there were more screenies either, doh! | 16:51 |
| lardman | go for it, I hate GUIs :) | 16:51 |
| lardman | will get mbarcode packaged up then you can abuse | 16:51 |
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| pupnik | Reminds me of http://records.viu.ca/~johnstoi/kafka/beforethelaw.htm Kafka: Man before The Law | 16:54 |
| frals | ab: pretty cool concept :) | 16:54 |
| frals | lardman: lol didnt notice until you said it either | 16:54 |
| ab | frade, yep. It is also quite close to Mii concept on Nintendo Wii, which is what prompted me to show this link :) | 16:55 |
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| ab | sorry, that was for frals | 16:56 |
| frals | :) | 16:56 |
| lardman | hmm, just retuned and now have 2 of ITV2, both showing different programs, odd | 16:58 |
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| RST38h | ab: Do you believe people will use something like this? | 16:58 |
| qwerty12 | lardman: One ITV2 is one too many :/ | 16:58 |
| lardman | quite true | 16:59 |
| ab | RST38h, teens? Most probably. :) | 16:59 |
| RST38h | ab: oh god, I no longer understand teens... | 16:59 |
| ab | RST38h, what I see with Wii -- people do use it for fun, sure. | 16:59 |
| lardman | though I like the sound of eventual HD, must go buy that 46" TV | 16:59 |
| RST38h | ab: To me this looks like the phone is trying to force me into certain behavioral patterns | 17:00 |
| ab | RST38h, my daughter is now only few years away from teenage | 17:00 |
| RST38h | i.e. can't access private stuff in the work mode, can't access work items in the home mode, etc | 17:00 |
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| ab | RST38h, but isn't your regular phone is actually doing exactly that? :) | 17:00 |
| ULS0 | hey all | 17:00 |
| RST38h | ab: Not really | 17:00 |
| RST38h | ab: it is more like a toolbox | 17:01 |
| RST38h | I need a tool, I pull it out, whatever "mode" I am in | 17:01 |
| ab | RST38h, the way this toolbox is organized is something that forces you to follow the UI anyway | 17:01 |
| RST38h | ab: Not here | 17:02 |
| RST38h | ab: S60 simply presentes me with a menu of app icons, I can choose whatever app I need | 17:02 |
| lardman | At the party John makes a new friend..... | 17:02 |
| lardman | without alcohol! never! | 17:02 |
| ab | RST38h, and it is restricting the way you interact with application and between applications :) | 17:03 |
| RST38h | ab: There is of course the Status Screen in S60, but it is pretty useless on E70 | 17:03 |
| ULS0 | anyone with N97? | 17:03 |
| RST38h | ab: Well, that depends on the apps ui | 17:03 |
| RST38h | ab: But I would say the lack of screen estate restricts me much much more than the UI | 17:04 |
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| ab | RST38h, and this is what I'm saying: you already following the UI provided by a platform or an application, not the UI follows your activities | 17:04 |
| RST38h | ab: Yes, I guess it is unavoidable | 17:04 |
| ab | RST38h, compare this to Sugar or this Mii-like experiment. | 17:04 |
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| RST38h | ab: The only system that honestly tried to avoid it was original macOS | 17:05 |
| RST38h | ab: It failed :) | 17:05 |
| RST38h | Can't say much on Sugar, but this experiment looks unnecessarily restrictive to me: you do not really NEED to box the user into those "modes" but still do | 17:06 |
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| RST38h | With S60 the designer can at least claim that he is forcing you into a single app because the screen is so small (and even then I am used to clicking the blue button all the time, pretty much like in Unix "screen") | 17:07 |
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| Anj | hi everybody | 17:07 |
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| ab | RST38h, from what I saw in past, like 5 years, and what I continue to experience these days, many designers and companies are exploring this "virtual environment" approach with persona representatives and a context assigned to a specific environment. It is inevitable, at least in console gaming it is already there. | 17:09 |
| ab | RST38h, the question to get this popular is not in how it limits but how easy it is to get new "world" constructed for a "regular" person, without any artistic skills | 17:09 |
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| RST38h | ab: It looks like a cute idea, I guess this is why the interest... | 17:10 |
| ab | RST38h, interaction is already explored and there are quite good results from it, again, see Wii's experience | 17:10 |
| * RST38h not sure Wii experience can be applied to the real life...mhm | 17:10 | |
| lardman | hmm, can't get memory card to turn up under windows My computer, but device says it's in use for mass-storage | 17:10 |
| RST38h | ab: There are two alternatives though | 17:10 |
| ab | RST38h, nobody thought that this primitivism will be selling devices like hot cakes as well :) | 17:11 |
| RST38h | ab: First is the original MacOS idea - give the user an abstract desktop (or some other workspace) and let him do what he wants, no restrictions by mode | 17:11 |
| RST38h | ab: Second the context-sensitive idea - somehow teach the device sense the context the user is in and compose environment accoridngly | 17:12 |
| RST38h | aka augmented reality :) | 17:12 |
| ab | the latter one is something that is hot in research now | 17:12 |
| pupnik | lardman: are you running a VM with the usb mounted? | 17:12 |
| RST38h | Yea, with Tracker being one of the byproducts | 17:12 |
| ab | for past few years many vendors tried and failed with it :) | 17:12 |
| lcuk | we should use the accelerometers to detect strong dissatisfaction with the device and close the application | 17:12 |
| pupnik | lol | 17:13 |
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| RST38h | ab: Unfortunately, yes. And with the first, original idea too. | 17:13 |
| RST38h | ab: I actually think it is too early to discard the original workspace idea, maybe with *some* augmentation | 17:13 |
| * RST38h looks for the linux tool that did that, a moment | 17:14 | |
| pupnik | for most work tasks, there's no useful information in a 3d perspective view | 17:14 |
| lcuk | the problem with augmentation has always been lag - its like standard vr | 17:14 |
| lcuk | and having to wear a big head unit | 17:14 |
| RST38h | lcuk: *different* augmentation :) | 17:14 |
| lcuk | if we could augment reality using a laser field | 17:14 |
| lardman | pupnik: no, think it's just windows being a pita as the drive letter it wants to use is already in use | 17:15 |
| lcuk | :D | 17:15 |
| RST38h | lcuk: Augmentation as in "you meet a person, your phone detects his phone's BT id, andpulls info on the guy to the screen" | 17:15 |
| lcuk | ahhh like the happy feeling in pants when you meet and detect an attractive female | 17:16 |
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| lardman | lol | 17:16 |
| lardman | would be useful for conferences | 17:16 |
| ab | RST38h, even that will be devastating to device's performance. Power consumption will be way forbidding | 17:16 |
| lardman | or possible for GSoC meetings, according to the mailing list ;) | 17:16 |
| lcuk | ab - at onedotzero i had n900 round next and it could quite easily have a list of known bluetooth adapters | 17:17 |
| SpeedEvil | ab: in principle, with phones that know the time maybe not. | 17:17 |
| RST38h | ab: Depends =) | 17:17 |
| lcuk | round neck | 17:17 |
| SpeedEvil | ab: In principle it might send out a wifi ping at the top of the minute forex. | 17:17 |
| SpeedEvil | So any phones only need to turn on wifi at 0-1s of the minute | 17:18 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, no ned for just top of the minute | 17:18 |
| lcuk | its just a matter of being on same router and using multicast | 17:18 |
| ab | even that is not something you would consider if doing power management savings | 17:18 |
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| SpeedEvil | lcuk: I mean ad-hoc mode ping | 17:19 |
| lcuk | that implies disconnecting from network you are on | 17:19 |
| lcuk | losing internet etc | 17:19 |
| lcuk | rather than just being on the same router | 17:19 |
| lcuk | /networkl | 17:19 |
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| SpeedEvil | lcuk: I was assuming that this was for the 'wandering round town' use-case | 17:19 |
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| lcuk | bluetooth | 17:19 |
| RST38h | ab: One consideration is that you do not want to compute and present all the data at once, so you can spread analysis over time, cache it, present the end result when the user actually clicks something | 17:19 |
| SpeedEvil | BT has some nastiness. | 17:20 |
| lcuk | yeah it always does - but for random interactions its one of the only ways | 17:20 |
| ab | RST38h, sure, would be good to have this actually done in applications. | 17:20 |
| lcuk | i can see whos knocking at the door most days without going downstairs | 17:20 |
| lcuk | just by looking at the bt list | 17:20 |
| RST38h | ab: In fact, in that BT example, good privacy rule suggests that it should only be done if the other guy initiates the connection =) | 17:20 |
| ab | :) | 17:21 |
| RST38h | ab: I remember having seen something similar, googling for it now | 17:21 |
| SpeedEvil | Well - it depends. | 17:21 |
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| SpeedEvil | There may be some information you're quite happy to share with everyone within 10m. | 17:21 |
| lcuk | bbl agian | 17:22 |
| ULS0 | afk | 17:23 |
| lardman | wasn't this the reason the zeroconf/bonjour thing was created for wifi? | 17:24 |
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| RST38h | ab: Shit, can't find it :( I first thought about Samurize but it does not seem to have the proper plugins | 17:26 |
| RST38h | ab: Anyways, the exact idea was as follows: | 17:27 |
| * ab has to go, bus cannot wait | 17:27 | |
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| RST38h | ab: next time then | 17:27 |
| ab[out] | I'll read in a morning. | 17:27 |
| RST38h | I am leaving in 30 minutes myself | 17:28 |
| lardman | hmm, sounds like it's catching, I may have to leave too | 17:28 |
| AndrewFBlack | I'm thinking of doing a set of gnome-color icons to match the Fremantle Theme I'm doing for Diablo think they will match it good? | 17:33 |
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| pupnik | i am testing suspending firefox when not using it | 18:26 |
| pupnik | hasn't broken any websites so far | 18:26 |
| pupnik | hint... might be doable on tablet | 18:27 |
| pupnik | a webbrowser that sends my laptop into screaming-fan mode while *IDLING* is ... *not* ... acceptable | 18:28 |
| javispedro | true | 18:30 |
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| zemm | i think someone should register & utilize maemo-look.org | 18:31 |
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| X-Fade | zemm: Yes, let's fragment the community more. Great plan ;) | 18:32 |
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| zemm | well do a redirect to existing theme-stuff, and make an effort to bring all into one place ;) | 18:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | Users, users, users. | 18:32 |
| zemm | my main point was that before the domain is in hands of someone.. not from here | 18:33 |
| javispedro | Users.... | 18:34 |
| wjt | zemm: would that be something like hel-looks.com ? | 18:34 |
| X-Fade | zemm: You can register the whole ascii range then. | 18:34 |
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| zemm | let's not be black and white now >:| there are active kde- xfce- gnome- s60- etc looks.org:s and sooner or later there will be something | 18:35 |
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| X-Fade | zemm: I wonder why people always register separate domains instead of just using a host under the original domain. | 18:36 |
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| qwerty12 | *cough* AdSense *cough* | 18:36 |
| X-Fade | qwerty12: Yeah, it just makes no other sense. | 18:37 |
| javispedro | *pun intended* | 18:37 |
| X-Fade | Different ssl, different cookie, forget about one login.. | 18:37 |
| jeremiah | AdCents | 18:37 |
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| coldboot | I've managed to get SBOX_REDIRECT_IGNORE=/usr/bin/python working ONLY IF you have /usr/bin as the first thing in your $PATH, if it's at any other position, even if anything before it doesn't exist, it breaks REDIRECT... Oh how I love how well-designed scratchbox really is. | 18:39 |
| javispedro | well, I don't remember that. | 18:40 |
| woglinde | hm pc-connectivity | 18:40 |
| coldboot | This isn't from running python directly, it's when I use SCons. | 18:40 |
| coldboot | Scratchbox has got to be one of the worst development environments out there. | 18:40 |
| woglinde | coldboot *g* | 18:40 |
| Stskeeps | ^ | 18:40 |
| *** k-s is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 18:40 | |
| coldboot | I've never known what *g* means... | 18:41 |
| * javispedro likes it | 18:41 | |
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| woglinde | *grin* | 18:41 |
| coldboot | ha | 18:41 |
| coldboot | javispedro: I've managed to break ARM builds for Qt, and clean installing scratchbox won't fix it. | 18:41 |
| coldboot | javispedro: So when I run the program in Xephyr, every picture and button gets rammed into the corner of the screen. | 18:42 |
| woglinde | coldboot how that? | 18:42 |
| zemm | X-Fade as a user i just would be more glad to find some real theme-stuff (be it redirect to theme section @maemo.org ";)") there rather than spam/ads | 18:42 |
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| coldboot | woglinde: I have no idea, I can't reproduce it because once it's happened it doesn't ever go away. | 18:42 |
| javispedro | coldboot: but how can such an evil act of black magic be sbox's fault? | 18:42 |
| zemm | since it was my first intuition to look after failing to see such at the main site | 18:42 |
| coldboot | javispedro: I'm guessing that it is. | 18:42 |
| javispedro | purge your computer from the evil spirits ;) | 18:42 |
| coldboot | javispedro: Because it fails in so many other ways. | 18:42 |
| woglinde | ~lart n810 internal gps | 18:43 |
| * infobot tries to shut n810 internal gps up | 18:43 | |
| woglinde | no | 18:43 |
| qwerty12 | GeneralAntilles: If I invent a way to be able to shoot Talk members over the internet, will you be my first customer? | 18:43 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: Make sure you add a safeguard so your tool can't turn against you. | 18:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12, I ought to patent my neck-taser idea at some point. | 18:44 |
| Jaffa | Rule #1 of desinging lethal systems :) | 18:44 |
| rkirti | :D | 18:44 |
| Jaffa | See RoboCop for potential loopholes to be aware of. | 18:44 |
| javispedro | qwerty12: gimme too. | 18:44 |
| javispedro | there's a recent craze all over tmo I don't understand. | 18:44 |
| qwerty12 | Ah, yeah, I can imagine that there's a long list of people wanting to shot me. | 18:45 |
| qwerty12 | <-- annoying prick | 18:45 |
| lardman | ocr app for N900 so it jangles whenever you see a target at the summit? | 18:45 |
| qwerty12 | *shoot | 18:45 |
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| javispedro | why people seem to think suddenly all of the software designed for the n810 is going to misteriously *disappear* and that the n900 needs brand new software developed from ground 0 | 18:45 |
| Jaffa | javispedro: Which one? | 18:45 |
| Jaffa | Ah. | 18:45 |
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| coldboot | javispedro: Well one thing is true, the n810 sucks in absolute terms, and the n900 is actually good. | 18:46 |
| Stskeeps | Jaffa: cos that's what happens on other platforms? :P | 18:46 |
| Stskeeps | err | 18:46 |
| Stskeeps | javispedro: | 18:46 |
| lardman | coldboot: rubbish | 18:46 |
| coldboot | So I would imagine the amount of n900 users will become way larger than the number of n810 users | 18:46 |
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| javispedro | Stskeeps: heh, that makes sense :P | 18:46 |
| coldboot | lardman: The n810 keyboard is impossible to type on. | 18:46 |
| lardman | well that's also due to better "user" appeal | 18:46 |
| coldboot | lardman: It's one of the worst qwerty keyboards on the market. | 18:47 |
| jeremiah | I kinda like the N810 keyboard. | 18:47 |
| jeremiah | I have no problems with it. | 18:47 |
| javispedro | coldboot: if this craze is any kind of indicative, then yes, for sure. | 18:47 |
| Jaffa | coldboot: In *absolute* terms, the N810 is amazing. It's a pocket computer. 400MHz ARM chip. I paid over 700gbp in 1994 or thereabouts for a 12MHz ARM computer. | 18:47 |
| woglinde | coldboot I can type on the n810 bettern then on cell phone | 18:47 |
| Jaffa | In *comparitive* terms, the N810 sucks. | 18:47 |
| jaska | and its pretty damn high dpi the display :) | 18:47 |
| coldboot | woglinde: You're comparing it to T9. | 18:47 |
| jeremiah | I agree with jaffa on that one. | 18:47 |
| coldboot | The iPhone and Blackberry are much better than the n810 | 18:48 |
| cmug | the screen of n810 is larger than n900 | 18:48 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa: Acorn? | 18:48 |
| coldboot | If you use a Blackberry, you wouldn't think the n810 has an even useable keyboard. | 18:48 |
| jeremiah | No - the iPhone has no worthwhile software | 18:48 |
| woglinde | coldboot I cannt type on t9 | 18:48 |
| jaska | iphone has an incy wincy screen and no kbd | 18:48 |
| Jaffa | qwerty12: Yup. Finally upgraded from my BBC Model B to an A3010 :) | 18:48 |
| woglinde | I am to dumb | 18:48 |
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| woglinde | and my actual cellphone dont have T9 | 18:48 |
| woglinde | haha | 18:48 |
| coldboot | I bet you people can type faster on the iPhone screen keyboard than on an n810. | 18:48 |
| qwerty12 | Jaffa: Hehe, I used to remember playing on one in school... :D | 18:48 |
| coldboot | jaska: But the iPhone is designed well. | 18:49 |
| jaska | haha | 18:49 |
| jaska | i just had a friend come by that was cursing his 3gs'es | 18:49 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: What does the n810 have in terms of software that you can't get the equivalent on the iPhone? | 18:49 |
| jeremiah | Lots of stuff from debian | 18:49 |
| woglinde | coldboot itunes connect? | 18:50 |
| cmug | i see ppl everyday that curse their nokia devices | 18:50 |
| qwerty12 | Linux | 18:50 |
| woglinde | hide and duck* | 18:50 |
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| jaska | yeah, i wouldnt touch anything running symbian with anything othe than a sledgehammer | 18:50 |
| lardman | coldboot: no way, iphone kb is crap | 18:50 |
| coldboot | woglinde: What is iTunes connect? I imagine it's crap because it has the word "iTunes" on it. | 18:50 |
| jeremiah | Lots of the software I want to use when I run my iPhone just doesn't work - that is not necessarily Apple's fault | 18:50 |
| coldboot | lardman: You're right, it is. | 18:50 |
| glass | you don't have to wait for a crack when a new fw comes out to get ssh | 18:50 |
| coldboot | lardman: But it's faster to type on than an n810. | 18:51 |
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| lardman | no | 18:51 |
| lardman | at least not for me | 18:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, multitasking. | 18:51 |
| glass | expandable memory | 18:51 |
| woglinde | hm diablo has no connection to ovi? | 18:51 |
| jeremiah | Plus, my iPhone has _never_ worked with the cell phyone network I have, due to locking etc. | 18:51 |
| jeremiah | EIPHONEFAIL | 18:51 |
| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: Yeah, that's true. | 18:51 |
| lardman | jeremiah: EiPHONEFAIL surely ;) | 18:52 |
| coldboot | I mean, I think the iPhone is inferior to a blackberry. | 18:52 |
| woglinde | jeremiah bought a cdma one? | 18:52 |
| jeremiah | Furthermore - you _have_ to develop in Objective C! | 18:52 |
| jaska | objc makes java look verbose :) | 18:52 |
| jaska | err, terse | 18:52 |
| jeremiah | woglinde: I got one as a birthday present. | 18:52 |
| coldboot | They do have their own independent strengths. | 18:52 |
| jeremiah | The apps for the iPhone are embarrassing | 18:52 |
| jeremiah | I mean, farts, beer, sports girls | 18:52 |
| qwerty12 | jeremiah: I'd break contact with that person for not knowing you well enough :p | 18:52 |
| jeremiah | Come on man | 18:52 |
| jeremiah | qwerty12: =] | 18:53 |
| woglinde | qwerty *g* | 18:53 |
| woglinde | qwerty a reason to dismiss your girlfriend? | 18:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | Clearly. | 18:53 |
| lardman | beer, sports girls, what's wrong there? | 18:54 |
| jeremiah | lardman: Heh | 18:54 |
| lardman | must grab my wife's iTouch and install those | 18:54 |
| jeremiah | Nothing - but I prefer them in the flesh, not fake on a phone. | 18:54 |
| woglinde | wow I got gps connect inside a building | 18:54 |
| jeremiah | Most of them anyway. | 18:54 |
| lardman | lol yeah | 18:54 |
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| coldboot | jeremiah: Criticizing a few stupid applications is making a straw-man argument. I would even say it indicates how much software there is, shedding light on how much good software there might be. | 18:54 |
| qwerty12 | woglinde: Of course. :p Now, if she (I wish) was to buy me an N900... | 18:54 |
| jeremiah | Happy to skip the farts | 18:54 |
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| woglinde | qwerty he both have sms function | 18:55 |
| lardman | lightsabre was good for 5s | 18:55 |
| jeremiah | coldboot: Okay, fair enough. But there is one powerful argument you cannot contradict: | 18:55 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: They're kind of cornering the market on mobile application development. Tons of web services have made iPhone apps, like Zipcar and Mint.com | 18:55 |
| jeremiah | The iPhone is a closed platform | 18:55 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: That's true, and annoying. | 18:55 |
| jeremiah | The N900 is one of the most free platforms out there | 18:55 |
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| jeremiah | That is huge | 18:55 |
| coldboot | Yeah the n900 is a lot better. | 18:55 |
| lardman | and the N810 is still cool | 18:55 |
| jeremiah | I would much rather participate with that community than work for Apple | 18:55 |
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| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, problem is, that doesn't follow. The shit $0.99 software has made it impossible to sell good software. | 18:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | Since nobody will buy anything for a reasonable price. | 18:56 |
| coldboot | Me too, but if you want to make an app that reaches a wide audience, you're stuck supporting popular platforms. | 18:56 |
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| AndrewFBlack | just read about an hour of log since i've been afk and I don't think we need maemo-look.org but it would be nice to have a place on maemo.org dedicated to theme alot of people don't know what themes there are or how to make new ones could be a usefull section | 18:56 |
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| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: I'm not sure that flooding the market with $1 crap is going to bring the market price down for good software. | 18:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | AndrewFBlack, wiki page with screenshots linking to Downloads? | 18:57 |
| coldboot | Nobody ever bought mobile applications in large numbers for even $10. | 18:57 |
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| jeremiah | Didn't Palm once have a lively app community? | 18:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, there aren't many complex high-quality applications out there for the iPhone. | 18:57 |
| lardman | people get used to the low prices and the poor quality sw so don't want to pay more? | 18:57 |
| coldboot | I mean consumers, not businesses deploying an app to mobiles in their organization. | 18:57 |
| AndrewFBlack | GeneralAntilles, yeah I guess your right | 18:58 |
| lardman | businesses buy iPhones?! | 18:58 |
| AndrewFBlack | GeneralAntilles, but your average user has no idea how to find anything in the wiki | 18:58 |
| coldboot | I just mean that the market price for mobile apps has never been "reasonable", ie above $5. | 18:58 |
| zemm | AndrewFBlack: yeah, by looking themes for the first time, all i found was some talk-threads about new themes, and separate blogs listing them. which is not good solution | 18:58 |
| qwerty12 | lardman: yes. Surprising (and total utter bollocks), but true | 18:58 |
| coldboot | Unless it's highly specialized. | 18:58 |
| javispedro | jeremiah: yes. with hundreds of thousands of apps. | 18:58 |
| javispedro | and I wonder how MANY times they pissed everyone of them. | 18:59 |
| lardman | qwerty12: need better managers to stop them arsing around and make them do some work | 18:59 |
| AndrewFBlack | infact I wouldsay alot of uses don't know we have a wiki since its not easy to find from front page | 18:59 |
| jeremiah | javispedro: Didn't they used to charge for them as well? | 18:59 |
| jeremiah | AndrewFBlack: You have a point, the wiki can be a little hard to find | 19:00 |
| javispedro | jeremiah: there was a bunch of app stores and not a single one | 19:00 |
| zemm | also i like the way how nowdays platforms have ability to fetch community provided artwork straight via settings (and i find gnome so ancient for not supporting this) | 19:00 |
| javispedro | and also a lot of freeware. | 19:00 |
| jeremiah | javispedro: Ah, okay. | 19:00 |
| lardman | AndrewFBlack: I guess this is a good way to get people involved, submitting themes, etc., might be worth a section somewhere | 19:01 |
| javispedro | apps were distributed usually as single-file (installers or executable files) | 19:01 |
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| javispedro | what about a download section for themes? :) | 19:01 |
| coldboot | I wonder why they didn't make the n900 multi-touch. | 19:01 |
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| Jaffa | AndrewFBlack: Seen wazd's proposal? | 19:04 |
| zemm | don't underestimate wallpapers either, specially with that panorama-desktop-thingy, and supposedly wider audience with n900.. | 19:04 |
| AndrewFBlack | Jaffa, proposal on what? | 19:04 |
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| Jaffa | It basically boiled down to, after some discussion here, http://design.maemo.org/ redirecting to a "Design" forum under tmo. Some stickies in there pointing to the best themes & tools on downloads.maemo.org, + a link to the "Themes" section on downloads.maemo.org | 19:04 |
| Jaffa | AndrewFBlack: What, effectively, the discussion around maemo-look.org is | 19:05 |
| AndrewFBlack | javispedro, I asked about theme section for downloads along time ago I think they decided it wasn't needed | 19:05 |
| AndrewFBlack | Jaffa, thats good but I've been asking for a theme section of tmo for almost 2 years and always been told it didn't need its own section same wih the Themes section under downloads.maemo.org | 19:06 |
| Jaffa | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31177 | 19:06 |
| lardman | well that could be in the feed as usual of course | 19:07 |
| lardman | but would need a showcase | 19:07 |
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| lardman | the wonders of TalkTalk | 19:07 |
| * lardman checks the archive to see when he dropped out | 19:07 | |
| Jaffa | lardman: You didn't miss a thing. Your last stmt was "It would need a showcase" | 19:08 |
| lardman | ah | 19:08 |
| lardman | we can then embrace .install files once again | 19:08 |
| lardman | is kontorri (spelling?) doing a theme maker again? | 19:08 |
| lardman | ~lart TalkTalk | 19:08 |
| * infobot explains, ever so gently, that if TalkTalk doesn't give the channel more information, they can't help | 19:08 | |
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| lardman | anyone know if a header is attached if I try to GET a jpeg? | 19:10 |
| AndrewFBlack | Jaffa, I like the ideas of the tmo section and all is this moving forward or ust talk so far? | 19:10 |
| Jaffa | lardman: Been done | 19:11 |
| lardman | good good | 19:11 |
| Jaffa | AndrewFBlack: Just talk. I think a few people need to say "yeah, this is a good idea" - then we can prod X-Fade for the redirect and get Reggie to create the section. Then it's just a question of who moderates (you, wazd & timsamoff?) and takes on creating the stickies | 19:12 |
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| AndrewFBlack | well as one of the most active theme makers I'm saying its a good idea. | 19:13 |
| Jaffa | AndrewFBlack: Cool :) | 19:13 |
| lardman | Jaffa: I still think something pretty, i.e. pages with the theme stuff displayed would be good | 19:13 |
| Jaffa | lardman: Yeah, but isn't that basically screenshots in downloads.maemo.org? | 19:14 |
| lardman | dunno, never ever visited it | 19:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | AndrewFBlack, well, wiki for content and layout, you can link to that page from anywhere else. | 19:14 |
| lardman | apt-get all the way | 19:14 |
| * GeneralAntilles hits lardman with the ceremonial beating trout. | 19:15 | |
| jeremiah | heh | 19:15 |
| lardman | :) | 19:15 |
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| jeremiah | The Ceremonial Beating Trout! | 19:15 |
| jeremiah | Has appeared! | 19:15 |
| AndrewFBlack | I think we could have a sticky that was lock that showed all the current themes with say two screen shots each that way someone can go there and get an overview of all the themes | 19:16 |
| lardman | luckily I'm wearing the stolen Council hat of power, so it just bounced off with a vaguely sulphurous smell | 19:16 |
| AndrewFBlack | sticky could have link to the thread for each theme as well | 19:17 |
| jeremiah | That thing needs to be washed | 19:17 |
| qwerty12 | Bounce this. | 19:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | Seriously. | 19:17 |
| * qwerty12 shoots lardman | 19:17 | |
| jeremiah | I ain't going anywhere near that hat. | 19:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman, you don't know where that's been, but let me tell you. . . . | 19:17 |
| lardman | just a flesh wound | 19:17 |
| jeremiah | heh | 19:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman, beware gangrene. | 19:17 |
| qwerty12 | It's been on lardman's head. Anywhere else is pale in comparison | 19:18 |
| lardman | yeah, but I should be able to kill qwerty12 with a cleaver before that gets me | 19:18 |
| Jaffa | lardman: http://maemo.org/downloads/OS2008/desktop-environment/ for exmaple | 19:18 |
| lardman | "Waiting for maemo.org...." | 19:18 |
| AndrewFBlack | Jaffa, any way to get a section just for themes? | 19:18 |
| lardman | ah yes, is quite pretty | 19:19 |
| AndrewFBlack | alot of other stuff in that section that well eally don't belong like diskusage | 19:19 |
| AndrewFBlack | and what the heck is fbreader doing in that section | 19:19 |
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| javispedro | AndrewFBlack: programmers. It costed me a few years to understand a File manager is a "System" app and not an Utility. | 19:20 |
| lardman | really | 19:20 |
| lardman | no wonder I have troubles finding things | 19:20 |
| javispedro | er... yeah. | 19:21 |
| javispedro | well, going out. cy. | 19:21 |
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| Jaffa | lardman: I don't see why not. Makes sense if there's a push and ownership in this area. | 19:21 |
| Jaffa | s/lardman/AndrewFBlack/ | 19:21 |
| infobot | Jaffa meant: AndrewFBlack: I don't see why not. Makes sense if there's a push and ownership in this area. | 19:21 |
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| Jaffa | I don't remember any discussion saying "Theme" is really bad to have | 19:22 |
| Jaffa | Those categories probably haven't been touched since OS2005 | 19:22 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade is the man in the know, I guess | 19:22 |
| AndrewFBlack | ok someone needs to get pushing on xfade and reggie I got a new theme coming out on friday and I would like it done by them lol | 19:22 |
| Jaffa | AndrewFBlack: Well volunteered ;-) | 19:23 |
| Jaffa | No one better placed than someone who wants an itch scratched | 19:23 |
| * frals starts scratching the MMS-itch | 19:24 | |
| zemm | oh so there were themes in that desktop section.. just thinking about the supposed wider audience with n900. i'd bet some of those people will be at some point specially look for -> themes, not browsing through some ambigious sections with single hits | 19:25 |
| Jaffa | zemm: No doubt. | 19:25 |
| AndrewFBlack | really needs to be someon from council to get with Reggie that way he will be more likely to add it | 19:27 |
| coldboot | I'm not saying iPhone is the best keyboard, it certainly sucks. But I bet you can't type faster than this on an n810: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBKkxkYl8jo&feature=PlayList&p=A31AE13E6DD4D9E8&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=14 | 19:27 |
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| lardman | no, I also can't do a backflip | 19:28 |
| lardman | but I can type faster on an N810 than an i-thingie | 19:28 |
| qwerty12 | Not surprised... | 19:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, not an the N810's hardware keyboard, but definitely on the finger keyboard on my N800. | 19:29 |
| lardman | hey! once I start moving there's no stopping me | 19:29 |
| derf | "An object at rest cannot be stopped!" | 19:29 |
| lardman | you saying the entire galaxy rotates around me? | 19:30 |
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| lardman | maybe true | 19:30 |
| coldboot | Here's the blackberry: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Egie4ApwoUg | 19:30 |
| derf | I am just quoting the Mad Midnight Bomber what Bombs at Midnight. | 19:30 |
| lardman | :) | 19:30 |
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| Macer | got a tracking number for my touchbook | 19:31 |
| Macer | heh | 19:31 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, get back to me when a Blackberry has a reasonably sized touchscreen. | 19:31 |
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| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: Yeah that's definitely a limitation, and the storm failed. | 19:32 |
| * lardman goes into intensive N810 kb training | 19:33 | |
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| coldboot | Wow, check this out: ack-grep --cpp "const int" | 19:34 |
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| coldboot | In Ubuntu: sudo apt-get install ack-grep | 19:34 |
| coldboot | It's better than grep. | 19:34 |
| AndrewFBlack | Jaffa, I send Reggie an IM on forums don't know if he will respond but maybe he will get working on it. | 19:35 |
| AndrewFBlack | I could just hold the bug fixes i"m doign ot minimalist theme hostage until he does it lol | 19:35 |
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| lardman | off, out bbl | 19:42 |
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| coldboot | http://betterthangrep.com | 19:42 |
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| sneakret | ack is awesome | 19:57 |
| sneakret | just saying | 19:57 |
| sneakret | ... I wonder why I don't have it on my NIT. | 19:58 |
| sneakret | I guess cuz I don't do a lot of grepping. | 19:58 |
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| sneakret | so... I see there's one whole app in the N900 app store. :) | 19:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | sneakret, welcome to an unreleased product. | 19:59 |
| sneakret | :) | 19:59 |
| sneakret | I'm not complaining! | 19:59 |
| sneakret | Just noticing. | 19:59 |
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| penguinbait | Quim is the Antichrist, ahhhhhhhh we are all doomed | 19:59 |
| derf | Can I put my GPL software in the Nokia app store? | 20:00 |
| derf | I'll happily take money from fools. | 20:00 |
| sneakret | Is Nokia working on making a cross-platform development environment for Maemo 5? | 20:00 |
| frals | costs 50€ to sign up to be able to publish thou | 20:01 |
| sneakret | ... I'll rephrase that. Where can I read about Nokia's plans for the Maemo 5 SDK? | 20:01 |
| derf | Oh, screw that then. | 20:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | frals, same terms for Maemo? Too bad. | 20:01 |
| sneakret | Is it still easy to release free software for the N900? | 20:01 |
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| sneakret | I mean, as easy as it was on the N8x0... | 20:02 |
| frals | GeneralAntilles: I assume it's the same for everyone, just going on what's at publish.ovi.com | 20:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | sneakret, easier than ever. | 20:02 |
| sneakret | Oh yeah? | 20:03 |
| sneakret | How is it easier? | 20:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | https://garage.maemo.org/extras-assistant/index.php | 20:03 |
| sneakret | Does that also apply to N8x0? | 20:04 |
| sneakret | (so it's just improved overall?) | 20:04 |
| sneakret | looks that way | 20:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yes | 20:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | There's a whole QA process now, too. | 20:05 |
| glass | you don't HAVE to use the store if thats the q | 20:05 |
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| sneakret | Awesome. | 20:05 |
| sneakret | what about my SDK question? | 20:06 |
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| sneakret | Is Nokia making it easier to get going? | 20:06 |
| Stskeeps | sdk should improve yeah :P but not sure about fremantle one | 20:06 |
| glass | hmm well. thats matter of opinion i'd think? i'm under impression that now you can just download a vmware/virtualbox/whatever image and go rolling | 20:07 |
| glass | which is a hell a lot better than hmm.. some other mobile platforms | 20:07 |
| luke-jr | Stskeeps: you have a N900, don't you? | 20:07 |
| sneakret | Yeah, being able to download a VM is handy. Not necessarily ideal, though. | 20:07 |
| Stskeeps | luke-jr: i honestly can say i don't | 20:07 |
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| sneakret | You've been able to grab a scratchbox VM for quite a while. | 20:08 |
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| GeneralAntilles | So who's going to be the first to boot from a microSD/eMMC RAID? ;) | 20:17 |
| lcuk | fuck, im out of money completely. im not going to the summit, im not able to pay bills. http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=32253 | 20:18 |
| sneakret | Wow, bummer. | 20:19 |
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| sneakret | Uh... only half a paycheck?\ | 20:19 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, take him to court? | 20:19 |
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| lcuk | that does not help now | 20:20 |
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| sneakret | How does that work? | 20:20 |
| sneakret | I mean... paying you only half...? | 20:20 |
| sneakret | What's the justification? | 20:20 |
| lcuk | i have not worked the 6/12 months this year but used more holidays | 20:20 |
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| sneakret | Is your ex-employer at all interested in you doing any more work? | 20:22 |
| javispedro | ow, sorry to hear that lcuk | 20:22 |
| sneakret | I guess that would defeat the purpose of leaving, but at least you'd be paying the bills. | 20:23 |
| lcuk | i can do some more tidying up and could collaborate on other things, but he was unwilling to allow me the freedom to do the open source stuff with me being a fulltime employee - which was where the problem came from in the first place | 20:25 |
| lcuk | but right now im pissed with him | 20:26 |
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| woglinde | hm food goes first, then opensource | 20:28 |
| woglinde | thats my motto | 20:28 |
| RST38h | argh | 20:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, Engadget! | 20:28 |
| GeneralAntilles | http://www.engadget.com/2009/09/30/video-snes-runs-beautifully-on-n900-makes-out-hearts-flutter | 20:28 |
| RST38h | repository is not accepting my ssh key again =( | 20:28 |
| javispedro | W.T.F. | 20:29 |
| javispedro | oh god. | 20:29 |
| woglinde | hehe javis | 20:29 |
| javispedro | and I though Youtube was bad enough already :P | 20:29 |
| woglinde | javis will you write an opengl plugin for snes-emu? | 20:29 |
| woglinde | on n900? | 20:29 |
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| javispedro | I'll try, I have some ideas | 20:29 |
| RST38h | javis: btw, what API are you using to show screen in full-screen mode? | 20:30 |
| woglinde | okay | 20:30 |
| woglinde | will leave now | 20:30 |
| woglinde | bye all | 20:30 |
| woglinde | till later | 20:30 |
| javispedro | RST38h: want to guess? still SDL + XShm :) | 20:30 |
| javispedro | cy wog | 20:30 |
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| RST38h | Ah ok | 20:30 |
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| javispedro | RST38h: and your pixel doubler. If you're interested, on N8x0 using a barebones unrolled C scaler is a 10 fps hit, while your pixel doubler is only a 5fps hit. | 20:34 |
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| javispedro | (inlined, not a function call for every scanline) | 20:34 |
| RST38h | javis: As expected | 20:34 |
| RST38h | Actually, I do not think you need to unroll it | 20:35 |
| javispedro | 16 src pixels / iteration I tried in the C version iirc | 20:35 |
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| RST38h | oh you mean unrolling the 16-pixel part | 20:36 |
| javispedro | yeah, like your one does :) | 20:36 |
| javispedro | btw, thanks! | 20:36 |
| RST38h | yea, that is definitely worth unrolling in C | 20:36 |
| RST38h | Ah you are welcome, thanks for the app =) | 20:36 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It's finally started to turn cool for Fall. | 20:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | Beautiful 75°F out. | 20:45 |
| SpeedEvil | :/ | 20:46 |
| SpeedEvil | There are the first hints of autumn colours here. | 20:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hehe, that we don't get. | 20:46 |
| GeneralAntilles | I should say "Winter" since we only have 2 seasons here. | 20:47 |
| SpeedEvil | (Fife, Scotland) | 20:47 |
| GeneralAntilles | Florida, USA ;) | 20:47 |
| SpeedEvil | :/ - as I've still got lots of outside work to do | 20:47 |
| konttori__ | GeneralAntilles: lol! thanks! | 20:47 |
| frals | 9C here... fuckin freezing to get to the metro in the morning :( | 20:49 |
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| RST38h | General: Rain and No-Rain? | 20:50 |
| RST38h | 2C. Is it a record for this channel? | 20:50 |
| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, nah, it rains all year. | 20:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Hot and hummid, cold and hummid. | 20:51 |
| RST38h | oh | 20:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/hummid/humid/g | 20:51 |
| infobot | GeneralAntilles meant: Hot and humid, cold and humid. | 20:51 |
| konttori__ | I had no idea that simple video would end up on engadget. I would have taken another take, now it was just like, eh. let's do it and get it to youtube quickly. | 20:52 |
| VDVsx | 26C here, almost night ;) | 20:53 |
| SpeedEvil | Someone needs to invent CTCP HEATPUMP | 20:53 |
| javispedro | konttori__: yeah, weird things happen lol | 20:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, they're good at picking their stories. ;) | 20:54 |
| konttori__ | Jaffa, AndrewFBlack : Haveng a themes section would make a lot of sense. | 20:54 |
| konttori__ | we are going to make it so for pr1.1 or pr1.2 that in the choose theme selector, there will be a direct link to app man to list all available themes. Same also for sharing plugins, backgrounds and some other things. There will be a new api to do such filtering on appman. | 20:55 |
| konttori__ | we might also have maemo.org weblink there, but it's undecided. | 20:55 |
| aSIMULAter | wow konttori u're the man | 20:56 |
| javispedro | so user/themes cat is needed? | 20:56 |
| GeneralAntilles | ohgod Sharing Plugins. | 20:56 |
| javispedro | or does it already exist? | 20:56 |
| AndrewFBlack | konttori__, talking to teggie about a theme section of forums now | 20:56 |
| konttori__ | great! | 20:56 |
| VDVsx | konttori__, now you have a story to tell to your child when he/she grown up (not a very good one, but still) ;) | 20:56 |
| konttori__ | heh! true! | 20:56 |
| javispedro | lol. true. | 20:56 |
| konttori__ | javispedro: we don't need to add a new category. | 20:57 |
| konttori__ | we just use text based filtering. | 20:57 |
| sneakret | CTCP CASH | 20:57 |
| AndrewFBlack | anyone got a link to wazds purposal on forums about design section of forums reggie wants to see it | 20:57 |
| konttori__ | so, descriptions must include certain keywords, or package name must have some logic - undecided yet. | 20:58 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31177&highlight=design.maemo.org | 20:58 |
| frals | VDVsx: yeah, konttori__ can go like "you were on engadget when you were but ... (5?) months old! see here *plays the video and hears the crying*" | 20:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's bad enough having your parents pull out the old VHS. How much worse do you think it'll be for these YouTube kids to have them pull up a video with 50 million views. | 20:58 |
| konttori__ | we are like *this* close to sales release and we are now listing the content to add to the pr releases, next starting to do the detailed implementation plans | 20:58 |
| konttori__ | so, those are still open issues. | 20:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, hopefully somebody gets on -community with all of these proposals. | 20:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, the /opt thing and the insanity with the categories hasn't been going well so far. | 20:59 |
| konttori__ | sure, will do once we have some meat on top of bones. | 20:59 |
| konttori__ | well, see above, I told you guys when we had the bones and the announcement with the meat came some time later. | 20:59 |
| konttori__ | insanity with categories? those were completely defined by community | 21:00 |
| * konttori__ has to say that he does not like the split of categories. | 21:00 | |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, yes, then Nokia decided to come in and add their own. | 21:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | "Sharing Plug-Ins" | 21:01 |
| X-Fade | GeneralAntilles: But that one is dead now ;) | 21:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia Manager: Man, we need some Ovi integration in this shit. Let's add a Sharing Plug-Ins category. That'll be so rad! | 21:01 |
| konttori__ | what, we haven't added sharing plugins category? | 21:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | (1 month later during random SDK review) Community: "Sharing Plug-Ins" WTF? | 21:01 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: noone uses it anyway | 21:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, these things should be discussed out in the open while the bones are still being put together. | 21:02 |
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| konttori__ | oh, like that. well, slipups happen. the people doing that didn't know of the agreement. | 21:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, not once Nokia has already unilaterally decided on the structure and then needs the community to step in line. | 21:02 |
| SpeedEvil | Remember, when sharing plugins, always wash thouroughly in hot water and bleach first, and then rinse thouroughly. | 21:02 |
| javispedro | yeah, I'd say the /opt issue was done a bit late in the game. | 21:02 |
| konttori__ | well, if you have a comment on the proposal I gave, I'm all ears | 21:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, right, that's why the whole "code over the wall" thing doesn't work. | 21:03 |
| SpeedEvil | GeneralAntilles: that was the major failing in openmoko. | 21:03 |
| konttori__ | well, we will bring code to the other side after sales start | 21:03 |
| SpeedEvil | Though nokia at least seems to be developing actual software that works. | 21:03 |
| konttori__ | or earlier | 21:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | SpeedEvil, unfortunately learning the whole "open source" thing has been a slow and arduous road. :\ | 21:03 |
| SpeedEvil | GeneralAntilles: yeah. It's _really_ hard for companies to 'get it'. | 21:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Nokia's better than most, but just when you think they're starting to understand something like this pops up. | 21:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Especially when normally hidden stuff - like a manager three levels up deciding on something they wouldn't normally have input on, and being implemented - would be hidden in a normal release. | 21:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, clearly certain things can't be discussed. But something harmless like a link to additional themes seems like it could be designed out in the open. | 21:05 |
| SpeedEvil | And the WTF's would be all internal | 21:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | konttori__, then you don't have the community having to be in reaction all of the time. | 21:06 |
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| konttori__ | sure, I agree. And that is why we are really going to push a lot more to stage soon. | 21:07 |
| konttori__ | also, on the pr plans, I'm pretty sure I'll write a blog outlining the plan until the end of the year for the applications framework. | 21:07 |
| javispedro | GeneralAntilles: you get it wrong! A link to themes will give Nokia all the competitive advantage they need to triumph over its overseas enemies, it has to be closed! :) | 21:07 |
| X-Fade | Pushing is not the hard part, accepting contributions back in. Now that will be great. | 21:08 |
| konttori__ | so, you guys will know at least 70% of the plans (you know, some surprises must remain ;) | 21:08 |
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| * frals is holding his breath for MMS being the surprise! | 21:08 | |
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| javispedro | X-Fade: that's why I once said Maemo should be based on Mer and not otherwise (sorry I know this doesn't make any sense in the current situation) | 21:08 |
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| konttori__ | anyway, the plan for the new api is that apps can make a dbus call to appman with a string. This will be used to filter packages with regexp. Thus, for your random app, you can get list of available extra content (e.g. canola themes, mediabox themes, and so forth) | 21:09 |
| javispedro | <nitpick>what about package tags?</nitpick> | 21:10 |
| X-Fade | javispedro: Useless for searching. | 21:10 |
| X-Fade | javispedro: great for describing a package. | 21:10 |
| javispedro | X-Plugin-For: canola ? | 21:11 |
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| konttori__ | sure, as said, this call is currently agreed with me, product management and UI management. Developers have not been quoted yet, so some meat will come to make more sense for this. | 21:11 |
| konttori__ | but, mostly to not to unnecessarily move the eyes from the ball, we really will start the meat part of the discussions when the software is ready | 21:12 |
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| * luke-jr proposes companies start sticking to hardware development, and instead of developing software for the devices, post a $ total for "software development" the development community can "bid" on, and the owner community can vote for | 21:15 | |
| luke-jr | development projects with the most votes and lowest bid win the funding | 21:15 |
| GeneralAntilles | Yeah, that doesn't work for the government, why would it work here? | 21:15 |
| tigert | design by committee, no thanks! | 21:16 |
| luke-jr | why wouldn't it work? | 21:16 |
| tigert | too different opinions | 21:16 |
| luke-jr | the only difference from the current setup is the community gets paid and is responsible for software quality | 21:17 |
| luke-jr | unless someone actually *likes* the in-house software? | 21:17 |
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| X-Fade | Design by committee, ugh ;( | 21:17 |
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| RST38h | yea, not good | 21:17 |
| konttori__ | you guys don't like the new desktop? | 21:18 |
| luke-jr | what committee? | 21:18 |
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| konttori__ | it was designed and implemented in-house | 21:18 |
| Stskeeps | konttori__: love it | 21:18 |
| SpeedEvil | I for one would prefer fvwm95! | 21:18 |
| SpeedEvil | :) | 21:18 |
| konttori__ | I really won't comment on some of the apps though. | 21:18 |
| luke-jr | konttori__: I just want to run KDE myself | 21:18 |
| X-Fade | heh ;) | 21:18 |
| luke-jr | in such a system, I would probably throw all my votes on hardware support for Linux | 21:19 |
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| luke-jr | perhaps an integrated GPS guidance system | 21:20 |
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| X-Fade | luke-jr: You are just a too small market. | 21:20 |
| * tigert likes the n900 software | 21:20 | |
| tigert | some stuff is crap | 21:20 |
| tigert | but its not because of being designed so | 21:20 |
| X-Fade | luke-jr: No sane company would make hardware just for your needs. | 21:20 |
| RST38h | dialogs, tigert | 21:20 |
| luke-jr | X-Fade: then I would be a minority of the votes for software funding | 21:21 |
| konttori__ | I think pretty much everything is at least ok, but not as good as I would like | 21:21 |
| tigert | but rather of focusing effort on other thingd | 21:21 |
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| konttori__ | e.g. I like notes, but I love conboy | 21:21 |
| konttori__ | I like the image viewer, but I love canola | 21:21 |
| RST38h | konttori: something to take care about in the next 6 months =) | 21:22 |
| RST38h | I mean before bugs start being marked "fixed in harmattan" | 21:22 |
| tigert | notes is mostly from diablo | 21:22 |
| javispedro | RST38h: what for? they'll have to rewrite most apps in Qt. | 21:22 |
| tigert | same with sketch | 21:23 |
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| fiferboy | Is it possible to get a package removed from extras-devel and maemo.org/packages? | 21:39 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: Yes | 21:39 |
| fiferboy | And preferably, from everyone's memory :( | 21:39 |
| AndrewFBlack | Jaffa, tmo Design Forum Section http://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=46 | 21:40 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: What's up? | 21:40 |
| fiferboy | X-Fade: Actually, it is not even in extras-devel right now | 21:40 |
| fiferboy | My new package has a typo in the name :( | 21:40 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: Hey! fiferboys-porn is an awesome package | 21:40 |
| fiferboy | X-Fade: personal-grps-mon should be personal-gprs-mon | 21:40 |
| fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: Don't you ever get tired of being so cheeky? | 21:40 |
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| RST38h | what is the point in not being cheeky? | 21:41 |
| fiferboy | X-Fade: If I can have that removed, I will upload the corrected package | 21:41 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: I am #maemo's self-appointed prick, so no :) | 21:41 |
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| GeneralAntilles | qwerty12_N810, hey! I'll fight you for it! | 21:42 |
| fiferboy | I vote we demote qwerty12 and get a much less vocal/omnipresent prick! | 21:42 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: STFU, you wannabe prick | 21:43 |
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| frals | fiferboy: nice widget, cept for the typo :) | 21:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | Oh, right. | 21:43 |
| fiferboy | frals: Thanks. I can't beleive I did that | 21:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, you still want some Bugzilla products. right? ;) | 21:43 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: Yes. Preferably with the correct spelling :) | 21:44 |
| fiferboy | countdown-home and personal-gprs-mon would be fantastic | 21:44 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: should've played it down with a "that's what they call it this side of the pond..." | 21:44 |
| frals | :D | 21:44 |
| fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: Or invented a new acronym | 21:44 |
| fiferboy | No, it means "General Radio Produced Signal" | 21:45 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, email this info to me at rabelg5 at http://gmail.com. http://wiki.maemo.org/Bugs:Adding_Extra_products | 21:45 |
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| Jaffa | AndrewFBlack: Cool :-) | 21:46 |
| X-Fade | AndrewFBlack: With a proper proposal, asking for a redirect won't be a problem. | 21:47 |
| AndrewFBlack | X-Fade, want something in email or on forums? | 21:47 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: Thanks! | 21:48 |
| fiferboy | At least I was consistant. EVERY SINGLE location in every file | 21:48 |
| X-Fade | AndrewFBlack: Something discussed in public. maemo-community or talk is fine. | 21:48 |
| AndrewFBlack | X-Fade, I'll put it outon maemo-community later today | 21:48 |
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| X-Fade | fiferboy: http://maemo.org/packages/view/personal-gprs-mon/ | 21:53 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: Just renamed the package ;) | 21:53 |
| qwerty12_N810 | You are not making allowances for fiferboy's inability to spell inside the actual program, however :p | 21:54 |
| fiferboy | I am uploading the fixed package! | 21:54 |
| X-Fade | qwerty12_N810: No, I'm not renaming the files or altering the deb ;) | 21:54 |
| fiferboy | As long as no one ever installs the old version, and we burn all IRC logs and internet transcripts, I am fine | 21:55 |
| * GeneralAntilles heads over to Kinkos. | 21:55 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Muahaha! | 21:55 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Does going to a printing shop fill you up with that much excitement? | 21:56 |
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| fiferboy | No! GeneralAntilles, I was going to vote you head prick because you never irritate me :( | 21:56 |
| javispedro | fiferboy: I have a problem with personal-grps-mon, it tries to monitor gprs instead of my grps! | 21:57 |
| Stskeeps | GeneralAntilles: making Fixed In Fremantle tshirts? | 21:57 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Stskeeps, Tim's job! | 21:57 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Stskeeps: I want my Fixed in Mer T-Shirt. | 21:57 |
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| Stskeeps | qwerty12_N810: if you get a FiF tshirt i have a bunch of mer stickers .. | 21:58 |
| fiferboy | Fixed package is building | 21:58 |
| fiferboy | X-Fade: Is there any way to push the correct package into extras-devel as soon as it is built? | 21:58 |
| fiferboy | Or does that require a bribe? | 21:58 |
| X-Fade | Hehe, RST38h's package is pretty lonely in the queue. http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing_non-free_armel/ | 21:58 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: That is all done automatically. | 21:58 |
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| timeless | non-free? | 21:59 |
| X-Fade | Yep | 21:59 |
| X-Fade | I have code ready to merge the queues into one view. Should make it better. | 22:00 |
| javispedro | btw, what about a Contrib section for packages that may never be built with the autobuilder but are OSS (think Fennec, Java, Mono,....) | 22:00 |
| timeless | qhat's he doing there? | 22:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | timeless, being closed-source? | 22:00 |
| X-Fade | Yeah, RST38h likes to write evil software :D | 22:01 |
| timeless | javis: i thought we settled the fennec ossue | 22:01 |
| javispedro | timeless: ah, sorry. one fixed, two to go ;) | 22:02 |
| konttori__ | out of curiosity, why could they not be built with autobuilder? | 22:02 |
| X-Fade | konttori__: compiler issues. | 22:02 |
| javispedro | I don't know the specifics, but Jalimo had a lot of problems with sbox. | 22:02 |
| X-Fade | konttori__: sdk used too old compiler. | 22:02 |
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| konttori__ | cannot we upgrade that? | 22:02 |
| X-Fade | and sbox using busybox .. | 22:03 |
| javispedro | X-Fade: wha? | 22:03 |
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| fiferboy | X-Fade: Thanks for the fix! :) | 22:03 |
| qwerty12_N810 | X-Fade: sbox isn't a device ;) | 22:03 |
| javispedro | [sbox-FREMANTLE_X86: ~] > ash --> bash: ash: command not found | 22:03 |
| X-Fade | qwerty12_N810: Well sorry, scratchbox isms etc. | 22:04 |
| javispedro | for example, jalimo is also using their own .deb packaging tools. | 22:04 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Although, if it did use busybox, it'd make lcuk happy and means he would have slightly more hair... :p | 22:05 |
| javispedro | and OE as build system :P | 22:05 |
| fiferboy | Is anyone here able to rename talk.maemo.org threads? | 22:05 |
| javispedro | fiferboy: you also made the typo on tmo? | 22:05 |
| javispedro | heh. | 22:05 |
| fiferboy | javispedro: I made it ABSOLUTELY EVERYWHERE :( | 22:05 |
| fiferboy | The model of consistancy | 22:05 |
| javispedro | or a jedi mind trick. | 22:05 |
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| javispedro | :) | 22:05 |
| X-Fade | javispedro: I'd just put them in non-free and add source ;) | 22:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, hit the report button on your post. | 22:06 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: :) | 22:06 |
| javispedro | X-Fade, well, ok for me :) | 22:06 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: This is ONLY to be used to report spam, advertising messages, and problematic (harassment, fighting, or rude) posts. | 22:07 |
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| timeless | it was rude! | 22:07 |
| fiferboy | I guess it is an advertising message... | 22:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, it notifies the mods, too. | 22:07 |
| fiferboy | The good kind | 22:07 |
| qwerty12_N810 | "or a post made by fiferboy" | 22:07 |
| timeless | generally risky promiscuous services | 22:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, slightly obnoxious, but it will get you a response fast. ;) | 22:07 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: Okay, I'll risk it | 22:07 |
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| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, I don't see anybody here or on AIM handy, so. . . . | 22:08 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: Thanks, I sent a report :) | 22:08 |
| fiferboy | But I'll blame you if I get banned for life from all maemo and maemo related websites and activities | 22:08 |
| GeneralAntilles | Fair enough. ;) | 22:09 |
| qwerty12_N810 | GeneralAntilles: AIM? No surprise that no one is online there... | 22:09 |
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| Proteous | I just use the report buttons to send spam to the mods | 22:09 |
| Proteous | eventualy one of them will be interested in \/14gr4 | 22:10 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Isn't the point of spam to reach a large audience as possible? | 22:10 |
| fiferboy | Targeted spam is the new wave | 22:10 |
| Proteous | I like very targeted audiences | 22:10 |
| Proteous | maemo mods totaly have size and performace issues | 22:11 |
| Proteous | in bed | 22:11 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Proteous: c'mon, they're mods? Are they really likely to be getting any? | 22:11 |
| qwerty12_N810 | *. | 22:11 |
| Proteous | heh | 22:11 |
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| fiferboy | Hopefully in a few short minutes our long, international nightmare will be over - my GPRS typo | 22:13 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: And why is it GPRS counter anyway? | 22:13 |
| fiferboy | :( | 22:13 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: Cellular data counter? :) | 22:13 |
| fiferboy | I hope I haven't made another mistake, but that is the data it is counting from the system | 22:14 |
| Stskeeps | ~flashing | 22:14 |
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| infobot | hmm... flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 22:14 |
| qwerty12_N810 | X-Fade: He's in Canada. They haven't heard of 3G yet... | 22:14 |
| RST38h | fiferboy: you dput over gprs? | 22:14 |
| frals | :D | 22:14 |
| fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: We will have 3G within the next two decades! | 22:14 |
| qwerty12_N810 | :) | 22:15 |
| fiferboy | Of course, it will be entirely controlled by three large companies that price fix way above the global rates... | 22:15 |
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| RST38h | what is a global rate? =) | 22:16 |
| X-Fade | New merged QA queue: http://maemo.org/packages/repository/qa/fremantle_extras-testing/ | 22:16 |
| X-Fade | Now RST38h's app isn't alone anymore ;) | 22:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | I liked being able to hiss at RST38h :( | 22:16 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol | 22:17 |
| fiferboy | RST38h: 50% less than Canadians pay | 22:17 |
| RST38h | eh. | 22:17 |
| fiferboy | countdown-home needs four more thumbs up! | 22:17 |
| RST38h | X-Fade: is every minor update going to require 10 pts etc to get into extras? | 22:18 |
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| tigert | countdow-home was neat | 22:18 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: For now, it is. | 22:18 |
| * qwerty12_N810 gives countdown-home the middle finger | 22:18 | |
| RST38h | X-Fade: Oh. Trouble. | 22:18 |
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| GeneralAntilles | RST38h, 10 will be a lot less when we actually have testers. | 22:18 |
| X-Fade | RST38h: When we have 10M users, I expect there not to be any problems ;) | 22:19 |
| fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: trouble maker | 22:19 |
| RST38h | dunno... | 22:19 |
| X-Fade | And the 10 is all open for debate. But let's see what happens when the device is in the shops. | 22:19 |
| X-Fade | Can be set to 50 too, you know :) | 22:20 |
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| fiferboy | X-Fade: Is there a ten day quarentine in place right now? | 22:20 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | X-Fade: That threat doesn't work so well at this moment in time when Nokia would like Extras to be populated ;) | 22:21 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: that is not active yet. Still have to finish a bit of code. | 22:21 |
| X-Fade | qwerty12_N810: It can be 1 too ;) | 22:21 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Yes please | 22:21 |
| fiferboy | X-Fade: How are things promoted to extras right now? Automatically on some criteria or does the user choose to promote again? | 22:21 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: promotion is unlocked when there is enough karma. | 22:22 |
| fiferboy | X-Fade: Ah. Thanks. | 22:22 |
| X-Fade | fiferboy: you then can decide to promote to extras or not. | 22:22 |
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| Mek | will there also be a way to bypass the karma/quarentine period to upload critical security fixes and stuff like that? | 22:23 |
| Proteous | all this data counter stuff is worthless. We all know that what your phone things you transfered and what the phone complany is going to bill you for are totaly unrealated | 22:23 |
| X-Fade | Mek: Yes. | 22:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | Proteous, hey, just like the utility company! | 22:23 |
| Proteous | heh | 22:23 |
| SpeedEvil | Proteous: yeah. | 22:24 |
| X-Fade | Mek: You will be able to select some options when promoting. (soon) | 22:24 |
| Mek | okay, good | 22:24 |
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| SpeedEvil | Proteous: I had a nice byte counter on my ppp transfers - which matched perfectly with what the utility reported for the first hundred meg. | 22:24 |
| SpeedEvil | Proteous: then there was a 50p unexplained loss. | 22:25 |
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| SpeedEvil | Proteous: Of course if I ask them, the response will be 'we don't support linux'. | 22:25 |
| Proteous | lol | 22:25 |
| Proteous | I'm just remembering the story of Adam Savage of Mythbusters fame and using his iphone in canada | 22:26 |
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| Proteous | he was keeping a very close eye on his data meter and somehow managed to get billed for double the data usage as his phone said | 22:26 |
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| Proteous | which put him way over his limit and he got charged like $1500 or something | 22:27 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Sounds about right for Canada... | 22:28 |
| frals | lol | 22:28 |
| lizardo | hi, is it only me of is the garage SVN down? | 22:28 |
| X-Fade | lizardo: try again | 22:28 |
| * luke-jr wonders whatever happened to ensuring all billing was authorized by the payer. | 22:29 | |
| lizardo | X-Fade: worked now :) | 22:29 |
| tigert | theres been crazy shit with roaming data bills | 22:29 |
| luke-jr | if further network use will incur charges, they should redirect to an authorization page portal | 22:29 |
| lizardo | tks | 22:29 |
| fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: One more smart remark about Canada and I'll not let you test my apps for me anymore! | 22:29 |
| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: Are you _crazy_? | 22:30 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: Thanks! | 22:30 |
| SpeedEvil | luke-jr: that might mean people don't get billed huge amounts of money. | 22:30 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Canada. Meh. | 22:30 |
| fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: :| | 22:30 |
| luke-jr | SpeedEvil: well, I dream of reasonable data plans too | 22:30 |
| * RST38h yawns and suggest using prepaid | 22:30 | |
| luke-jr | 5 GB is pathetic | 22:30 |
| tigert | like someone had a minilaptop with gsm modem prefer the stronger cell network accross the border | 22:31 |
| RST38h | This way nobody can bill you more than you pay | 22:31 |
| luke-jr | RST38h: they can. | 22:31 |
| tigert | without the user realizing | 22:31 |
| RST38h | no they can't | 22:31 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: They can charge you shitty rates though | 22:31 |
| luke-jr | RST38h: companies can do anything | 22:31 |
| RST38h | qwerty: this they can | 22:31 |
| luke-jr | RST38h: and generally get away with it unless you have $$$ for a lawyer | 22:31 |
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| RST38h | qwerty: but I can just switch company | 22:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Prepaid means you run out of credit, and it stops working. | 22:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Which does limit your bill. | 22:33 |
| RST38h | Speed: Correct. | 22:33 |
| SpeedEvil | I cannot transfer over 900m more without putting in more money | 22:33 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: True. Until they all have shitty rates :) | 22:33 |
| RST38h | Speed: And if stops working too often I change the provider | 22:33 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah | 22:33 |
| SpeedEvil | RST38h: the suckyness is that often it's crap per byte charges compared with a contract | 22:33 |
| RST38h | Speed: Well, don't use crap deals | 22:34 |
| fiferboy | <qwerty12_N810> RST38h: True. Until they all have shitty rates :) <-- I thought I asked you to stop talking about Canada! | 22:34 |
| luke-jr | :D | 22:35 |
| RST38h | fiferboy: Your cryptosocialist government should smite them | 22:35 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: Ah, now this is one thing (surprisingly) not limited to Canada :p | 22:35 |
| fiferboy | :) | 22:36 |
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| SpeedEvil | RST38h: _there_are_no_good_prepaid_rates_ | 22:37 |
| RST38h | Speed: There are | 22:37 |
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| SpeedEvil | Countries vary. | 22:37 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm paying 15 quid for a gig that does not expire. - pay-as-you-go. | 22:37 |
| SpeedEvil | If I pay the same per month, I would get 3 gig/month. | 22:37 |
| RST38h | Sounds decent | 22:38 |
| RST38h | Unless it is on top of some hideous voice package | 22:38 |
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| SpeedEvil | well - that's another annoyance. | 22:38 |
| SpeedEvil | You can only get that PAYG plan on a plan that does not allow texts or voice | 22:39 |
| Proteous | ATT had an unlimited plan for $20 a month for a while | 22:39 |
| SpeedEvil | But... | 22:39 |
| Proteous | tmobile flexpay had a reasonable unlimited data plan | 22:39 |
| GeneralAntilles | I pay $15/mo for mine | 22:39 |
| fiferboy | qwerty12_N810: You act as though you had a bad experience with data rates where you live ;) | 22:39 |
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| qwerty12_N810 | I just have a bad experience with Canadians | 22:40 |
| fiferboy | You've probably never met a Canadian | 22:41 |
| penguinbait | qwert12_N180, its not just you | 22:41 |
| penguinbait | heh | 22:41 |
| penguinbait | Blame Canada!! | 22:41 |
| qwerty12_N810 | fiferboy: True. What can I say? I guess I am lucky after all! | 22:41 |
| fiferboy | penguinbait: I don't know what you are talkin' aboot | 22:41 |
| penguinbait | I'll meet ya at the beer store | 22:42 |
| penguinbait | eh | 22:42 |
| penguinbait | burrrrrrp! | 22:42 |
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| * RST38h is restless now | 22:51 | |
| RST38h | All the packages compiled, SlideRule fixed for the new screen size, and no upload =( | 22:52 |
| javispedro | no upload? | 22:53 |
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| RST38h | cant dput to extras-devel | 22:55 |
| Proteous | the thinkie with the little slidy box is stuck | 22:55 |
| javispedro | ah, I see. | 22:55 |
| javispedro | :P | 22:55 |
| Proteous | I tried the clicky thing on the glowie round thing but it did nothing | 22:55 |
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| RST38h | Proteous: you are supposed to lick it | 23:04 |
| Proteous | hmm | 23:04 |
| Proteous | okay | 23:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Wow! | 23:04 |
| SpeedEvil | Clearly that's the new innovation. | 23:04 |
| SpeedEvil | multi-taste screens. | 23:04 |
| Proteous | nope, didn't work, although I did get a taste of last nights dinner | 23:04 |
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| RST38h | wazd: Around? | 23:09 |
| javispedro | fingers, tongues, what are we going to put next all over screens? | 23:09 |
| qwerty12_N810 | It does have a vibration feature ;) | 23:10 |
| Proteous | ew | 23:10 |
| GeneralAntilles | fiferboy, they're open. | 23:10 |
| fiferboy | GeneralAntilles: Thanks! :D | 23:10 |
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| lardman | bally, my Toppy has just gone tits up | 23:11 |
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| * lardman wonders how he typed "y" rather than "s" | 23:11 | |
| * GeneralAntilles hits lardman with the ceremonial beating trout again. | 23:11 | |
| SpeedEvil | What's a topps? | 23:12 |
| lardman | GeneralAntilles: you reckon you'll get that on the flight? | 23:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | What's a balls? ;) | 23:12 |
| lardman | topfield, hard disk recorder | 23:12 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman, getting on isn't an issue. Getting back is if my passport doesn't show up. | 23:12 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Something you lack | 23:12 |
| * GeneralAntilles hits ping pong balls at qwerty12_N810. | 23:12 | |
| * qwerty12_N810 steals them | 23:13 | |
| * GeneralAntilles activates the remote detonator. | 23:13 | |
| * lardman considers buying a new media centre | 23:14 | |
| qwerty12_N810 | Sunshine State my ass... | 23:14 |
| pupnik | heh | 23:14 |
| lardman | before his wife kills him because she'll miss True Blood next week | 23:14 |
| javispedro | http://openandroidalliance.com/ | 23:14 |
| javispedro | specially http://openandroidalliance.com/about/ | 23:15 |
| qwerty12_N810 | javispedro: But I thought it was already open?!!!! | 23:15 |
| javispedro | ask GAN :) | 23:15 |
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| javispedro | Maemo is to Mer what Android is to ... Androider? | 23:16 |
| qwerty12_N810 | Funny though, xda-developers have been cooking up WinMo roms for years now and MS haven't batted an eyelid AFAIK | 23:16 |
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| javispedro | Because there are actual smart people working in MS. | 23:17 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman, clearly you need to build an i7 rig. | 23:18 |
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| fiferboy | Yay, my thread has been renamed! | 23:24 |
| lardman | GeneralAntilles: yeah | 23:24 |
| ULS0 | maemo can support python??? | 23:24 |
| Stskeeps | yes!!! | 23:25 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 23:25 |
| ULS0 | awesome! | 23:25 |
| Stskeeps | nono. awesome!!! | 23:25 |
| ULS0 | jajajaja | 23:25 |
| ULS0 | is already realesed? | 23:25 |
| Stskeeps | pymaemo.garage.maemo.org i think | 23:26 |
| Proteous | The only reason MS doesn't crack down on third party ROMs is because if they did they would loose 90% of their users | 23:26 |
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| fiferboy | Now if only my version 0.2-3 were imported to extras-devel so I could promote... | 23:27 |
| fiferboy | It is sitting in "Build Succeeded" land | 23:27 |
| SpeedEvil | Also - 100% of the third party ROM users have an actual legal copy of MS on the device originally surely | 23:28 |
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| Proteous | anyway, the only issue google had was the redistribution of some non free parts like maps | 23:28 |
| javispedro | Not to mean that MS wants their products to be used no whater at what cost. monetizing will come later. | 23:28 |
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| GeneralAntilles | lardman, get one of the Gigabyte MiniATX P55 boards. | 23:32 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman, drop in an i5 or i7 Lynnfield. | 23:33 |
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| lardman | gets expensive though | 23:41 |
| lardman | + quiet case, etc | 23:41 |
| woglinde | re | 23:41 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman, sure, but it'll last a while. ;) | 23:41 |
| lardman | I am tempted, but really need to get up and running before the weekend | 23:42 |
| lardman | :( | 23:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | More expensive to buy brick'n'mortar. :P | 23:42 |
| lardman | what about dvb-t cards? | 23:42 |
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| lardman | that was always the big problem | 23:42 |
| GeneralAntilles | Dunno, I do ATSC/ClearQAM over here. | 23:43 |
| lardman | is that cable? | 23:43 |
| Proteous | bittorrent+rss FTW | 23:43 |
| GeneralAntilles | ATSC is digital broadcast, ClearQAM is cable. | 23:43 |
| lardman | ah ok | 23:43 |
| lardman | Proteous: yeah | 23:43 |
| Proteous | slightly less legal though | 23:44 |
| lardman | am considering Humax 9300T, mainly as the wife wants stuff recorded next week | 23:44 |
| lardman | ~£170 | 23:44 |
| Proteous | wow, that's better then 0day | 23:44 |
| lardman | considerably cheaper than a build your own | 23:44 |
| Proteous | that's like -7day | 23:44 |
| Proteous | if you can record next weeks shows today you will be a scene god | 23:44 |
| lardman | lol | 23:45 |
| woglinde | lardman consider to buy a dreambox | 23:45 |
| woglinde | but dont know if it will work in england | 23:45 |
| qwerty12_N810 | woglinde: they should | 23:45 |
| lardman | that's sat only isn't it? | 23:46 |
| woglinde | http://www.dream-multimedia-tv.de/en | 23:46 |
| woglinde | nope | 23:46 |
| qwerty12_N810 | dboxes work nicely... | 23:46 |
| woglinde | dual tuner | 23:46 |
| woglinde | could be dvb-t cable sat | 23:46 |
| woglinde | what combination you want | 23:46 |
| woglinde | qwerty hehe | 23:46 |
| woglinde | where did you get a dbox? | 23:46 |
| woglinde | I have 3 | 23:46 |
| woglinde | 2 cabel one sat | 23:46 |
| javispedro | http://www.internetnews.com/infra/article.php/3841671/US+Cedes+ICANN+Control+to+the+World.htm | 23:47 |
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| RST38h | THE END IS NEAR | 23:47 |
| RST38h | -= REPENT! =- | 23:47 |
| javispedro | my thoughs exactly | 23:47 |
| Proteous | DRINK YOUR OVALTINE | 23:47 |
| lardman | does sat need separate cable to terrestrial? | 23:47 |
| woglinde | lardman dreambox runs linux and software is build with oe | 23:47 |
| qwerty12_N810 | woglinde: Don't have one anymore, but I had a cable one from eBay once... | 23:47 |
| lardman | oh right, that's quite tempting then :) | 23:47 |
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| woglinde | lard what you mean with cable to terrestrial? | 23:48 |
| lardman | I have one aerial which does both sat & terrestrial | 23:48 |
| woglinde | cable and dvb-t has same connector | 23:48 |
| lardman | no cable though | 23:48 |
| woglinde | never heard of that | 23:48 |
| lardman | "cable" that is | 23:48 |
| lardman | I live in a block of flats | 23:49 |
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| woglinde | *sigh* | 23:49 |
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| javispedro | but who, which are the fortunate nations in control of the icann now? | 23:49 |
| lardman | sp I'd need a 7025 for 2x TVB-T? | 23:50 |
| lardman | s/sp/so | 23:50 |
| lardman | s/TVB/DVB | 23:50 |
| lardman | why do I bother!? | 23:50 |
| lardman | :$ | 23:50 |
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| woglinde | lardman yes or dm 8000 | 23:51 |
| woglinde | which cost more | 23:51 |
| woglinde | hm I should change my profession to salesman for nerds | 23:51 |
| lardman | wow, super expensive anyway | 23:51 |
| lardman | >£450 | 23:51 |
| woglinde | sure | 23:52 |
| lardman | for 7025 | 23:52 |
| woglinde | n900 cost nearly the same | 23:52 |
| lardman | yeah, but I can buy a PC and stick it under the TV for less and it can do more | 23:52 |
| woglinde | hm still 450 for 7025? | 23:52 |
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| woglinde | hm | 23:52 |
| lardman | different class of device | 23:52 |
| woglinde | I think you can get it cheaper on ebay | 23:52 |
| woglinde | let me see | 23:52 |
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| woglinde | maybee the softcames still held the prices up | 23:53 |
| lardman | probably low volume too | 23:53 |
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| woglinde | hm 360 euros | 23:54 |
| woglinde | on ebay in germany | 23:54 |
| woglinde | 2xsat | 23:54 |
| lardman | still pretty dear when converted to £, plus that's sats not dvb-t | 23:55 |
| woglinde | http://cgi.ebay.de/Dreambox-DM-7025-Plus-PVR-Twin-DVB-T-Tuner-DM7025_W0QQitemZ360193236357QQcmdZViewItemQQptZDE_Elektronik_Computer_TV_Video_Elektronik_TV_Receiver?hash=item53dd309d85&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14 | 23:56 |
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| woglinde | you could bye it on sunday | 23:56 |
| woglinde | haha | 23:56 |
| woglinde | args buy | 23:56 |
| lardman | lol yeah | 23:56 |
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