| mfinkle | found HILDON_GTK_INPUT_MODE_AUTOCAP | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
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| mojocafe | good evening everyone :) | 00:01 |
| mojocafe | just a small question - i have seen that there meanwhile are a few poker applications. at the moment i am playing at fulltilt. i would love to see the fulltilt client on my n800 but that is another story..... whom of you play poker? | 00:02 |
| javispedro | lardman: which example are you trying to build | 00:02 |
| javispedro | ? | 00:02 |
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| lardman | all of them | 00:02 |
| lardman | but really just the camera one | 00:02 |
| GeneralAntilles | Lazy UPS | 00:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | They don't even try anymore. | 00:03 |
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| Woolly | lardman: ping | 00:03 |
| lardman | hey Woolly | 00:03 |
| Woolly | evening | 00:03 |
| mojocafe | evening | 00:03 |
| Woolly | lardman: how's the barcode stuff going? | 00:03 |
| lardman | that python code camera.py uses python2.4, and no camera image is shown either | 00:03 |
| lardman | Woolly: cracking on now, been away all week though so just getting back to it | 00:04 |
| Woolly | nice one :) | 00:04 |
| Woolly | camera.py? | 00:04 |
| Woolly | is this using easy? | 00:04 |
| lardman | in maemo-examples svn | 00:04 |
| lardman | easy? | 00:04 |
| Woolly | easy api | 00:04 |
| javispedro | ls | 00:04 |
| javispedro | oops | 00:04 |
| Woolly | javispedro: nice :D | 00:04 |
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| Woolly | lardman; http://wiki.forum.nokia.com/index.php/Using_the_Easy_API | 00:05 |
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| lardman | had not seen that | 00:05 |
| Woolly | lardman: gives camera access | 00:05 |
| Woolly | lardman: have you moved away from gstreamer for taking images? | 00:05 |
| lardman | no | 00:05 |
| Woolly | considering alternative options? | 00:05 |
| lardman | am thinking about it, but as long as gstreamer works, will stick with that for the time being | 00:06 |
| Woolly | cool | 00:06 |
| Woolly | did you get a chance to check if those batoo bindings worked? | 00:06 |
| lardman | no, not had any time yet | 00:07 |
| Woolly | cool | 00:07 |
| Woolly | me neither | 00:07 |
| Woolly | :( | 00:07 |
| Woolly | png compression is so bumslow | 00:07 |
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| Woolly | lardman: I'm working on a window subclass that has a drawable area with a 320x240 camera image, and a cancel button in it, and that's it. Would this be useful? | 00:08 |
| Woolly | my app has a "Tag" button, that will start the camera stuff capturing | 00:09 |
| lardman | yeah that sounds like it might be of use | 00:09 |
| Woolly | that was like the worse sentence structure | 00:09 |
| Woolly | cool | 00:10 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Aw, trodden down by the "groupthink". | 00:10 |
| Woolly | you're still using Python right? | 00:10 |
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| lardman | yep | 00:11 |
| Woolly | cool beans | 00:11 |
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| Woolly | I'm working on Barcode stuff all day tomorrow, you about? | 00:12 |
| lardman | will be for some of it | 00:13 |
| lardman | got the day off, but have to pop into work to sort some stuff out | 00:13 |
| lcuk | lardman, keesj you two are image processing type folks. if a barcode of known size was held above a nokia device. could you estimate its location and disants using only the camera image | 00:13 |
| lcuk | )i use barcode, but it could be any identifying unit square | 00:14 |
| lardman | yeah sure | 00:14 |
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| lardman | for a known camera | 00:14 |
| lcuk | thought so | 00:14 |
| lcuk | i think i just worked out wutoconfigure for liqflow | 00:14 |
| lcuk | autoconfigure | 00:14 |
| Woolly | lcuk: disants distance? | 00:15 |
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| lcuk | yeah - my fingers are a bit busted up | 00:15 |
| Woolly | ahh cool np :D just wondering | 00:15 |
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| lcuk | lardman, the devices wouldnt even need to know how many there are or whether there are "missing" pixeces | 00:16 |
| Woolly | you'd need to do some testing to work out the focal length wouldn't you? | 00:16 |
| lcuk | pieces | 00:16 |
| lcuk | yeah but thats a detail | 00:16 |
| lcuk | once done its done | 00:16 |
| Woolly | yeap | 00:16 |
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| Woolly | right, i'm outta here, peace! | 00:18 |
| lcuk | gnite Woolly | 00:18 |
| lardman | cu tomorrow | 00:18 |
| Woolly | gnite | 00:18 |
| javispedro | bye | 00:18 |
| Woolly | lardman: will do | 00:18 |
| Woolly | cheerio! | 00:18 |
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| lardman | VDVsx: ping | 00:25 |
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| egamonal | hi, I have an old N770 running OS2007HE fiasco | 00:34 |
| egamonal | I got a theme maker | 00:34 |
| egamonal | does it sound familiar to anyone? | 00:34 |
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| lardman | VDVsx: not to worry, worked it out :) | 00:34 |
| lardman | egamonal: never used it but heard of it, and also s/N770/770 | 00:35 |
| egamonal | well, I tried the last version and the packing to a .deb fails, but I made it manually | 00:35 |
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| egamonal | the point is that the software wants me to choose the last version of maemo | 00:36 |
| egamonal | and I have bora | 00:36 |
| egamonal | is there any url where I can find what are the layout differences? | 00:36 |
| egamonal | maybe chinook fits to bora, but I'm not sure and it already crashed once | 00:37 |
| lardman | hmm, no idea I'm afraid | 00:37 |
| lardman | try Talk or the mailing list, or hang around a bit and see if anyone pipes up | 00:38 |
| egamonal | thanks lardman :) | 00:38 |
| egamonal | what I want is to change the background :P | 00:39 |
| VDVsx | lardman, pong ;) | 00:40 |
| lardman | VDVsx: was about Google T-shirts, but I eventually found the right page, np | 00:41 |
| lardman | egamonal: well the screen layout was the same, but the theming might have changed | 00:41 |
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| lardman | no real idea though I'm afraid | 00:41 |
| VDVsx | lardman, ok :) | 00:41 |
| egamonal | nevermind, i'll join the mailing list :) | 00:42 |
| lcuk | VDVsx, add accelerometer control to bluemaemo | 00:42 |
| lcuk | to play games | 00:42 |
| lcuk | using nokia | 00:42 |
| lcuk | :P | 00:42 |
| * lcuk will show you the smoothing code | 00:43 | |
| lcuk | you saw with onedotzero how good it can be :P | 00:43 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, I won a programming contest with a similar thing using my OM ;) | 00:43 |
| * lcuk nods | 00:44 | |
| lcuk | i bet you did sir | 00:44 |
| lcuk | but i still kicked your ass | 00:44 |
| VDVsx | *couf* I've a video *couf* | 00:44 |
| VDVsx | ;) | 00:44 |
| * javispedro doesn't know where to file sdl bugs | 00:45 | |
| lcuk | lardman, VDVsx was one of the few people to get the interaction at onedotzero to insult | 00:45 |
| lcuk | javispedro, which end of sdl is a problem | 00:45 |
| lcuk | ive had my head in there in the past | 00:45 |
| lardman | depends on your lang I guess ;) | 00:45 |
| javispedro | actually, i'm just adding a bug which is on upstream already | 00:45 |
| lcuk | lol yeah lardman | 00:45 |
| lcuk | explain then javis | 00:45 |
| javispedro | since I'd like it to be backported to maemo sdl before it's too late | 00:45 |
| javispedro | lcuk: setting an icon in sdl windows kills input focus. | 00:46 |
| VDVsx | lcuk, I probably will ping you tomorrow about SDL too ;) | 00:46 |
| lcuk | heh | 00:46 |
| lcuk | javispedro, what do you mean kills input | 00:46 |
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| * lcuk had a problem with that and not sdl recently | 00:46 | |
| javispedro | as in "you cannot type in the window any longer" ;) | 00:46 |
| lcuk | do other apps get your input? | 00:46 |
| javispedro | lcuk: i did not discover it, http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31696 | 00:47 |
| javispedro | i consider X11 a black vodoo box | 00:47 |
| lardman | anyone know what the N900 camera res will be (5MPix I know, but what's that in w x h)? | 00:48 |
| Corsac | http://www.flickr.com/groups/1184299@N24/pool/ | 00:49 |
| VDVsx | lardman, there's a video online from one of the ODZ bloggers | 00:49 |
| GeneralAntilles | lardman, uh million by uh million. | 00:49 |
| Corsac | (2576 x 1448) seems so | 00:50 |
| lardman | hmm | 00:50 |
| lardman | thanks | 00:50 |
| lardman | GeneralAntilles: :) | 00:50 |
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| lardman | hmm, have to write some factorisation code | 00:53 |
| javispedro | "To file this bug, you must first choose a component. If necessary, just guess. " yay. | 00:53 |
| * lcuk looks at photos taken with n900 | 00:54 | |
| javispedro | eeneey meeney miney moe | 00:54 |
| lcuk | eeek | 00:55 |
| lcuk | "windows out of virtual memory" | 00:55 |
| lcuk | HOLY FUCK | 00:55 |
| lcuk | acroRd32.exe is using 960mb | 00:55 |
| lcuk | with 1.2gb in vm | 00:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, wrong channel. | 00:55 |
| lcuk | sorry | 00:55 |
| lcuk | ILL SAY SAME IN #WINDOWS CHAN LOL | 00:55 |
| lcuk | :O - caps | 00:55 |
| egamonal | which version of maemo is bora? | 00:56 |
| javispedro | lcuk: ywo faults :) | 00:56 |
| egamonal | it's 2007HE, but there is no forum available :P | 00:56 |
| javispedro | pfft. | 00:56 |
| lcuk | lol | 00:56 |
| javispedro | lcuk: two faults. another one and you're out of the channel ;) | 00:56 |
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| lcuk | let me guess, one was for using windows | 00:56 |
| luke-jr | Maemo 5 = N900? | 00:57 |
| javispedro | eeny meeny mini moe, catch a bugzilla component by the toe. | 00:57 |
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| GeneralAntilles | Maemo 5 is software | 00:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | N900 is hardware. | 00:57 |
| luke-jr | GeneralAntilles: yes, but are they a pair? | 00:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, b.m.o? | 00:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | luke-jr, no. | 00:58 |
| luke-jr | so Maemo 5 is post-N900? | 00:58 |
| javispedro | GeneralAntilles: yeo | 00:58 |
| javispedro | .. yep. | 00:58 |
| GeneralAntilles | javispedro, what are you filing? | 00:59 |
| javispedro | libSDL | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Ah, dunno. | 00:59 |
| lcuk | javispedro | 00:59 |
| javispedro | only I could guess is Product: Multimedia | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Just drop it somewhere and andre__ will pick it up. | 00:59 |
| lcuk | did the fix you suggested work on fremantle | 00:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Should be a Maemo Platform component. | 00:59 |
| javispedro | lcuk: for what? | 00:59 |
| lcuk | and is it a problem on 810 | 00:59 |
| lcuk | the keyboard thing | 00:59 |
| javispedro | lcuk: it is a problem in 810, but the wm doesn't pick it up | 00:59 |
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| lcuk | ok, its a problem but it "works" on n810 | 01:00 |
| lcuk | ie you dont notice a problem | 01:00 |
| javispedro | i don't know why, but marnanel might. | 01:00 |
| lcuk | ok, he said input focus problems | 01:00 |
| javispedro | lcuk: exactly | 01:00 |
| lcuk | without explaining what they were | 01:00 |
| lcuk | i had MAJOR problems with liqbase for almost a month | 01:00 |
| lcuk | i could not use the keyboard | 01:00 |
| lcuk | because when i typed, another app popped up and ate my input | 01:01 |
| lcuk | this was VERY specifically to do with fremantle | 01:01 |
| lcuk | which is why i am trying to ascertain whether it is the same bug | 01:01 |
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| lcuk | which i think it is | 01:01 |
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| javispedro | probably. it seems matchbox2 is more picky or something like that. | 01:01 |
| lcuk | it seems only gtk does the thing it needs to do | 01:01 |
| lcuk | there is a minor change to the way input focus is handled | 01:02 |
| lcuk | because windows are composited | 01:02 |
| lcuk | gtk has inherant fix | 01:02 |
| lcuk | but native x11 apps didnt | 01:02 |
| * javispedro fills the bug in "Multimedia framework", which does not mean MAFW, for some weird reason. | 01:02 | |
| lcuk | no | 01:03 |
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| javispedro | lcuk: actually, native x11 apps get the focus here. | 01:04 |
| javispedro | but I read something about that | 01:04 |
| lcuk | they get focus | 01:04 |
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| javispedro | this bug is about them not being given the input focus | 01:05 |
| javispedro | thus. | 01:05 |
| javispedro | if you open conboy, and then dosbox, | 01:05 |
| javispedro | type something in dosbox, | 01:05 |
| javispedro | conboy gets the input instead. | 01:05 |
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| * javispedro now thinks he should have documented that in the bug report... | 01:05 | |
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| lcuk | javispedro, liqbase would run | 01:08 |
| lcuk | and would be interactable with touch | 01:08 |
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| lcuk | but then when typing it would fallback on the win manager to do stuff | 01:08 |
| javispedro | lcuk: (reading your tmo post) i did reproduce the error | 01:08 |
| lcuk | but theres plenty of sdl stuff and its been available for ages | 01:09 |
| lcuk | and im sure we have done key input in games etc | 01:09 |
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| javispedro | what you mean? that it's weird the error appears in fremantle? | 01:10 |
| lcuk | yeah | 01:10 |
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| * javispedro wonders which wm the sdl bugzilla reporter used | 01:10 | |
| javispedro | either way, I can fully reproduce it now. Add the SetIcon call, it fails; remove it, it works. Exactly like the upstream bug described. | 01:11 |
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| lardman | what do you reckon one can make out of a buffer which is 629760 in size? | 01:13 |
| javispedro | get to the moon and back? :D | 01:14 |
| lardman | thinking more along the lines of what type of 2D image might be contained therein | 01:14 |
| lardman | what res/encoding | 01:14 |
| lcuk | well 800*800 is 640,000 | 01:15 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: by what? | 01:15 |
| SpeedEvil | sounds about hte right size for PAL | 01:15 |
| lardman | 768 * 576 = 442 368 | 01:16 |
| SpeedEvil | yeah | 01:16 |
| SpeedEvil | about | 01:16 |
| lcuk | 2* 640*480 is 614400 | 01:16 |
| SpeedEvil | but not | 01:16 |
| lardman | hmm | 01:16 |
| lcuk | a 16bit screen easily | 01:16 |
| SpeedEvil | It's exactly 615K | 01:16 |
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| lcuk | where is this buffer | 01:16 |
| lardman | random datafile | 01:17 |
| lardman | no header though | 01:17 |
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| ShadowJK | 720x576 YV12 = 622080 bytes | 01:17 |
| lcuk | +an info frame | 01:17 |
| lcuk | sounds feasible | 01:17 |
| lardman | hmm, guess I'll just have to display it and see what I get | 01:18 |
| lardman | which is what I should have done all along | 01:18 |
| lardman | too tired | 01:18 |
| lcuk | lol | 01:18 |
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| lardman | ok thanks chaps, will hit the sack and have a look at the data tomorrow | 01:19 |
| lardman | sleep tight! | 01:19 |
| javispedro | gnite lardman! :) | 01:20 |
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| Mn3m0n1c | will the n900 work with any wireless company or will i be forced to buy a contract with a certain carrier? | 02:22 |
| till- | you can buy it without contract | 02:23 |
| Mn3m0n1c | awsome | 02:23 |
| till- | check amazon or nokia.com | 02:24 |
| Mn3m0n1c | thanks | 02:24 |
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| zerojay | Don't expect it to work at 3G with all carriers though. | 02:31 |
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| SpeedEvil | In some countries - US - it won't work in 3G at all as I understand it | 02:34 |
| SpeedEvil | Err | 02:34 |
| SpeedEvil | Actually - ignore that last - I'm unsure. | 02:34 |
| * dottedmag wonders whether keyboard will vary on devices sold in different countries. | 02:36 | |
| dottedmag | E.g. qwertz / qwerty etc | 02:36 |
| ShadowJK | SpeedEvil, should work with tmobile though? | 02:37 |
| frals | i know the nordic one is having åäö as keys so they are localizing it some atleast | 02:37 |
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| dottedmag | hmm... | 02:37 |
| ShadowJK | dottedmag, yes it will vary | 02:37 |
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| dottedmag | ShadowJK: is there way to figure out exact layout? | 02:38 |
| ShadowJK | there's probably keymap files in the sdk.. maybe | 02:39 |
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| till- | there were some pictures of a finish keyboard layout | 02:40 |
| * dottedmag will avoid asking friend in .de to buy one and send it | 02:41 | |
| zerojay | SpeedEvil: Canada has no 3G on the N900 at all. | 02:43 |
| zerojay | SpeedEvil: Only T-Mobile will have 3G in the US with the N900. | 02:43 |
| RST38h | ShadowJK: It will work with TMobile | 02:46 |
| RST38h | s/ShadowJK/SpeedEvil | 02:46 |
| RST38h | Besides, GSM/EGPRS will work everywhere | 02:47 |
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| dottedmag | Does US variant use the same GSM frequencies as Europeans are? | 02:48 |
| zerojay | As far as we know. | 02:48 |
| RST38h | N900 is quadband gsm phone | 02:49 |
| zerojay | The FCC docs show T-Mobile USA frequencies for 3G. | 02:49 |
| RST38h | Will work everywhere | 02:49 |
| dottedmag | ah, nice | 02:49 |
| RST38h | Of course, you won;t get 3G speed but for mobile browsing, email, IM, and GPS updates it is quite sufficient | 02:49 |
| RST38h | So, don't suicide over that "NO 3G FOR CANADA!" thing | 02:50 |
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| zerojay | I gotta disagree. | 02:52 |
| zerojay | For everything but web... it's fine. | 02:52 |
| zerojay | Also... I think that a lot of packets coming my way are being dropped and retransmitted because I'm seeing way more use than I should be for mostly idle use. | 02:53 |
| zerojay | But even if I did have 3G here, it would be super expensive anyways. :/ | 02:53 |
| smackpotato | gsm is not available in my area till 2010, I hate living in the boon docks | 02:54 |
| LiraNuna | http://tinker.it/now/2009/09/15/rewind-rethinking-old-school-devices-using-the-nokia-n900/ | 02:54 |
| LiraNuna | is it out yet? | 02:55 |
| zerojay | To the public, no. | 02:57 |
| * LiraNuna cries | 02:57 | |
| LiraNuna | must... remain... patient... | 02:57 |
| smackpotato | I'm waiting for a a9 cortex processor | 02:59 |
| zerojay | Have fun waiting. | 02:59 |
| smackpotato | I'll still have my n810 to play with. it is still relevant | 03:00 |
| ShadowJK | by the time a9 is out you'll be waiting for a10 :) | 03:01 |
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| zerojay | I'd probably go nuts if I stuck with just the N810. lol | 03:01 |
| smackpotato | I'ts economical shadow | 03:01 |
| ShadowJK | smackpotato, sure is :) | 03:01 |
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| smackpotato | there are some pereferals on the 900 that would be fun to play with like the accelerometer | 03:07 |
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| Mousey | HEY! | 03:31 |
| Mousey | i just had an idea | 03:32 |
| Mousey | what about putting Palm's WebOS on an n8x0?? it's basically an ARM based linux distro | 03:32 |
| RST38h | what about it? | 03:33 |
| Mousey | or maybe Maemo on a pre! | 03:33 |
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| Mousey | what fun mess-with-the-manufacturer's-intentions hacks those would be! | 03:34 |
| Mousey | i'd make SLASHDOT! | 03:34 |
| * Mousey sets his sights so high | 03:34 | |
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| RST38h | No problem, start on it tonight | 03:35 |
| ShadowJK | palm isn't exactly letting you have webos | 03:35 |
| Mousey | ShadowJK: well the degree to which they lemme hack the phone is pretty impressive tho | 03:36 |
| Mousey | Luna is a bit of a closed thingy tho.. | 03:36 |
| RST38h | oh, that n900 vs samsung comparison shit has hit the real fan now | 03:40 |
| Mousey | lol, like samsung runs a linux distro on their tablet | 03:41 |
| Mousey | *ahem* | 03:41 |
| Mousey | i guess it's a phone now | 03:41 |
| Mousey | nm | 03:41 |
| * RST38h reread the above statement and figured that "fan" could be interpreted in two ways | 03:41 | |
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| zerojay | RST38h: Has it? How so? | 03:43 |
| zerojay | I wasn't really following that whole thing. | 03:45 |
| RST38h | zerojay: Well, Murtazin went to a corporate sponsored trip to Korea, was shown Secret Korean Chocolate Factories, came back impressed and declared that Samsung will overtake Nokia real soon now, and that the upcoming Samsung device (2011) is much better than n900 | 03:46 |
| RST38h | zerojay: That, of course, royally pissed ~70% of t.m.o and made Quim/Peter cringe. | 03:47 |
| zerojay | Yeah, I saw all the spears being thrown his way. | 03:48 |
| zerojay | Is that the extent of "shit has hit the real fan now", or are you refering to something new that's happened? | 03:49 |
| RST38h | more or less this | 03:50 |
| RST38h | look at the number and tone of comments... | 03:50 |
| zerojay | I have to say I was surprised to see even Tim going after him, lol. | 03:50 |
| ShadowJK | srsly, why compare 2009 device with 2011 device? | 03:50 |
| RST38h | he is a journo | 03:51 |
| RST38h | What the hell do you want from him? Journos are often like that | 03:52 |
| RST38h | zerojay: Tim and Qole are acting like true wikipedians! =) | 03:52 |
| zerojay | lol | 03:52 |
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| zerojay | Tim's not usually the kind of guy that snaps at that sort of thing though, so it's a surprise... for me anyways. | 03:53 |
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| * ccooke notes the UK company offering the n900 subsidised | 04:11 | |
| ccooke | They even offer it as a contract upgrade... That's the wife taken care of, then. She's been due an upgrade for the last two months :-) | 04:12 |
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| SpeedEvil | ? | 04:44 |
| SpeedEvil | not voda or 3 | 04:44 |
| GeneralAntilles | Why is it that the Chinese and Koreans are so obsessed with insanely bright blue LEDs? | 04:46 |
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| vladovg | hi | 04:52 |
| lcuk | hi | 04:53 |
| lcuk | question | 04:53 |
| vladovg | can some one help mi install hamachi | 04:53 |
| lcuk | can i recompile the window manager | 04:53 |
| vladovg | wath | 04:53 |
| lcuk | i want to try something | 04:53 |
| lcuk | and i need to recompile the fremantle window manager | 04:53 |
| lcuk | is it possible | 04:53 |
| lcuk | errr and easy | 04:53 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, grab the source, compile. | 04:54 |
| vladovg | donth know | 04:54 |
| vladovg | sorri | 04:54 |
| Proteous_ | every time I read hamachi I get hungry for sushi | 04:54 |
| * GeneralAntilles hands vladovg some y's. | 04:54 | |
| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, "$ apt-get source packagename" ? | 04:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | lcuk, should work. | 04:54 |
| GeneralAntilles | Though the architecture with Clutter and such is a bit weird. | 04:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | I think you may want hildon-desktop | 04:55 |
| vladovg | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=17955&page=1 | 04:55 |
| GeneralAntilles | or maybe libmatchbox2 | 04:55 |
| vladovg | traing this for some time lith no luck | 04:55 |
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| lcuk | mm it has ./configure missing | 04:58 |
| lcuk | and when i run autoconf | 04:59 |
| lcuk | it spews errors | 04:59 |
| lcuk | this is in scratchbox | 04:59 |
| lcuk | hiya rm_you | 04:59 |
| rm_you | hey lcuk | 04:59 |
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| lcuk | GeneralAntilles, im glad right now its got bindings to clutter | 04:59 |
| lcuk | thats the feature i want to look at | 04:59 |
| rm_you | lcuk: so you working for nokia yet?: P | 05:00 |
| lcuk | but i need to get it building | 05:00 |
| lcuk | im not working anywhere atm | 05:00 |
| lcuk | but we did put on a hell of a show at the onedotzero adventures in motion festival! | 05:00 |
| * lcuk loved being part of that | 05:01 | |
| lcuk | how are you rm_you | 05:01 |
| rm_you | doin well | 05:01 |
| rm_you | slightly less busy this year | 05:01 |
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| rm_you | will be seeing you at the summit i assume? | 05:02 |
| * lcuk nods | 05:02 | |
| lcuk | if i can find out what day im meant to fly out on i can book tickets | 05:02 |
| rm_you | :p | 05:02 |
| lcuk | i need to know whether i am meant to be there on time | 05:02 |
| lcuk | you got your tix? | 05:02 |
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| GeneralAntilles | I still need to reply to the travel agent's email. | 05:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | It's the most confusing email I've ever read | 05:03 |
| lcuk | yes GeneralAntilles you do | 05:03 |
| lcuk | i lost touch with everyone for nearly a week | 05:03 |
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| * lcuk has never seen a greenroom before, let alone been able to use one | 05:03 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Bleh, they booked me on United | 05:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | Flying a 767 across the Atlantic's gonna suck. | 05:04 |
| SpeedEvil | ccooke: which? | 05:05 |
| SpeedEvil | ccooke: I've looked at O2, voda, 3, t-mobile, and none seem to offer | 05:05 |
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| vladovg | my again | 05:06 |
| vladovg | :) | 05:06 |
| vladovg | with my stupid reqest | 05:06 |
| vladovg | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=17955&page=1 | 05:06 |
| vladovg | follow this | 05:06 |
| vladovg | bud with no luck | 05:07 |
| vladovg | downwoadet the hamachi-0.9.9.9-20-lnx-n770.tar.gz | 05:07 |
| vladovg | and playced in mmc1/tmp | 05:08 |
| vladovg | and /media/mmc1/tmp# tar zxvf hamachi-0.9.9.9-20-lnx-n770.tar.gz | 05:09 |
| vladovg | says premision denaid | 05:09 |
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| vladovg | ay am logged as root | 05:09 |
| vladovg | wath kud bi the problem | 05:10 |
| vladovg | wrog comand | 05:11 |
| vladovg | or somting alse | 05:11 |
| RST38h | you have no permission to write into /media/mmc1/tmp ? | 05:12 |
| vladovg | and sorry for my bad english | 05:12 |
| vladovg | donth know | 05:12 |
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| vladovg | ay am logged as root | 05:13 |
| lcuk | logged in as root does you no good - check you can write to it please | 05:13 |
| lcuk | even root cannot write to a read only filesystem | 05:13 |
| lcuk | mornin RST38h | 05:13 |
| vladovg | yes ay made a new folder | 05:14 |
| vladovg | save a media with no problem | 05:14 |
| RST38h | heya lcuk | 05:14 |
| vladovg | or its some other wai to check | 05:14 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.mobilephonesdirect.co.uk/Brands/Nokia/Nseries-Multimedia-Phones/sb489/n443/p26078.aspx?lpsrc=google&lpcat=NokiaN900l&lpgrp=N900Nokia&lptxt=N900v1&lpkey=n900%20nokia&gclid=CI7E8PeK-pwCFV8B4wodgyBMbg | 05:15 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 05:15 |
| RST38h | ? | 05:15 |
| vladovg | moeveth to the mmc2 | 05:17 |
| vladovg | and now it dos nothig | 05:17 |
| vladovg | wat is the correckt comand | 05:18 |
| vladovg | to untar this packige | 05:18 |
| vladovg | writ this : /media/mmc2/tmp# tar zxvf hamachi-0.9.9.9-20-lnx-n770.tar.gz | 05:21 |
| SpeedEvil | Interesting - the above site gives the sim-free price as 449 - not 499 as nokia.co.uk | 05:21 |
| vladovg | and its back in /home/user # | 05:21 |
| rm_you | lcuk: yeah i got my tix | 05:23 |
| rm_you | GeneralAntilles: yeah they're confusing but i'm used to it by now | 05:23 |
| lcuk | good | 05:23 |
| GeneralAntilles | I'm not sure what language they're using. | 05:23 |
| lcuk | rm_you, i have a small package in liqbase playground | 05:24 |
| lcuk | it contains a graphical brightness widget | 05:24 |
| lcuk | but i cant make it work in fremantle | 05:24 |
| lcuk | know anyone who might be able to help? :D | 05:24 |
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| SpeedEvil | Hmm. | 05:26 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.mobilephonesdirect.co.uk/Brands/Nokia/Nseries-Multimedia-Phones/sb489/p26078.aspx?lpsrc=google&lpcat=NokiaN900l&lpgrp=N900Nokia&lptxt=N900v1&lpkey=n900%20nokia&gclid=CI7E8PeK-pwCFV8B4wodgyBMbg | 05:26 |
| SpeedEvil | 392 on a PAYG SIM | 05:26 |
| rm_you | lcuk: well | 05:26 |
| SpeedEvil | I'm unsure if that'd be locked | 05:26 |
| rm_you | lcuk: i updated abl to work in fremantle, except it doesnt actually change the backlight either >_< | 05:26 |
| rm_you | not sure what they changed but the old DSME code no longer works | 05:26 |
| lcuk | <-> | 05:26 |
| rm_you | need to figure out wtf | 05:26 |
| lcuk | whos been testing for you? | 05:27 |
| rm_you | it looks nice tho | 05:27 |
| rm_you | lcuk: do you have one? | 05:28 |
| lcuk | yes | 05:28 |
| lcuk | ive got nearly 2 | 05:28 |
| rm_you | lol | 05:28 |
| lcuk | i can test for you if you like | 05:28 |
| rm_you | might be useful | 05:28 |
| lcuk | send over code with as much debug info as required | 05:28 |
| rm_you | well tell me what you think of: | 05:28 |
| lcuk | small simple test functions | 05:28 |
| lcuk | where i can paste you the code back | 05:28 |
| lcuk | eerrrr output | 05:28 |
| RST38h | "Clark is depicted as an "unpleasant stickler for the rules who often clashed with researchers and considered the mice cages his personal fiefdom." | 05:28 |
| RST38h | moo rm_you | 05:29 |
| lcuk | rm_you, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yk27PenpAz0 | 05:29 |
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| rm_you | sup RST38h | 05:30 |
| rm_you | lolwtf lcuk | 05:30 |
| lcuk | :D rm | 05:30 |
| lcuk | its in the latest playground | 05:31 |
| lcuk | tho the playground itself will crash lol | 05:31 |
| rm_you | do they know where each other are? | 05:31 |
| lcuk | those dont | 05:31 |
| lcuk | but they will soon | 05:31 |
| lcuk | i have even had it running in a completely different environment | 05:32 |
| lcuk | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyMRTNPCVQM | 05:32 |
| lcuk | and it works there too | 05:32 |
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| rm_you|mobile | hrmrm | 06:09 |
| rm_you|mobile | /me tests irc clients on his G1 | 06:10 |
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| RST38h | rm_you <-- strategically switched to tmobile =) | 06:10 |
| rm_you|mobile | hrmrmrmrm | 06:10 |
| rm_you|mobile | heh | 06:10 |
| rm_you|mobile | i've been on tmo for like 6+ years :) | 06:11 |
| rm_you|mobile | finally paying off | 06:11 |
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| *** johnx has joined #maemo | 06:11 | |
| rm_you|mobile | ono johnx | 06:11 |
| rm_you|mobile | woo johnx | 06:11 |
| johnx | hello mobile rm_you :) | 06:11 |
| rm_you|mobile | so does /me work? | 06:11 |
| rm_you|mobile | /me tests | 06:11 |
| johnx | used to mac keybinding where ctrl-w is back one word | 06:11 |
| johnx | yeah, not so much | 06:11 |
| rm_you|mobile | bleh | 06:11 |
| RST38h | heya johnx, too | 06:11 |
| rm_you|mobile | next client | 06:11 |
| rm_you|mobile | brb | 06:11 |
| johnx | auditioning IRC clients? | 06:12 |
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| johnx | mornin' RST38h | 06:12 |
| RST38h | 23:15 | 06:12 |
| johnx | I live by UGT :) | 06:13 |
| * RST38h patiently waits to catch rm_you | 06:13 | |
| RST38h | Oh | 06:13 |
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| RST38h | Here you are | 06:15 |
| johnx | hey! rm_you! welcome back | 06:15 |
| RST38h | rm_you: How do you achieve Fremantle app menu buttons with descriptions? | 06:15 |
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| johnx | guess that client didn't pass muster either :) | 06:17 |
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| rm_you|mobile | hrm | 06:19 |
| rm_you|mobile | ooo looks better | 06:19 |
| * rm_you|mobile tests | 06:19 | |
| rm_you|mobile | woo | 06:19 |
| rm_you|mobile | ok I found my client I think | 06:20 |
| johnx | congrats! welcome to the early 90s(?) | 06:20 |
| rm_you|mobile | lol | 06:20 |
| rm_you|mobile | early 90s == irc on your cellphone? :P | 06:20 |
| johnx | oooh, saw the best page recently about using an acoustic coupler on a payphone | 06:21 |
| rm_you|mobile | anywho this client is better than the one timeless had at the first summit on his phone :P | 06:21 |
| rm_you|mobile | heh, to do what? | 06:21 |
| rm_you|mobile | oldschool phreaking? :) | 06:22 |
| johnx | nah, get telnet access on my ti83+ :D | 06:22 |
| johnx | basically dialing up a remote shell | 06:22 |
| johnx | and then using that to get out on the internet | 06:22 |
| rm_you|mobile | lol | 06:22 |
| johnx | get some IRC on, surf in lynx | 06:23 |
| rm_you|mobile | that's just... rofl | 06:23 |
| johnx | read some mail (with mail) | 06:23 |
| rm_you | RST38h: erm | 06:29 |
| rm_you | RST38h: I believe using hildon_new_button_with_text | 06:29 |
| rm_you | or something like that | 06:29 |
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| lcuk | rm_you|mobile, have you tried mosaic? its awesome! | 06:48 |
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| RST38h | rm_you: Yea, found it as well | 06:52 |
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| * RST38h got things to a relative perfection | 07:08 | |
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| rm_you|mobile | RST38h: cool | 07:20 |
| rm_you|mobile | lcuk: no, have not | 07:21 |
| johnx | summit ni ikimasu! | 07:23 |
| johnx | rm_you|mobile, sponsored! | 07:26 |
| rm_you | johnx sweet | 07:26 |
| rm_you | johnx: see you thar :P | 07:26 |
| johnx | yup. did you schedule for extra time at the beginning or end this time? | 07:27 |
| rm_you | johnx: my MOTHER was asking me like every day if you were going as well :P | 07:27 |
| rm_you | johnx: didn't, i have schooool T_T | 07:27 |
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| johnx | I'll try and come in at the same time as you | 07:29 |
| johnx | also, I really need to finish my projects O_o; | 07:30 |
| rm_you | yeah T_T | 07:30 |
| rm_you | i want to finish my conference radar :P | 07:30 |
| rm_you | need to start working on that again | 07:30 |
| rm_you | lol | 07:30 |
| johnx | uhm, can you look at something that already exists? | 07:30 |
| rm_you | even though it's google latitude... | 07:30 |
| johnx | yeah, like a lat client? | 07:31 |
| rm_you | yeah but the latitude API is closed still so i can't make a client | 07:31 |
| rm_you | :( | 07:31 |
| johnx | ick | 07:31 |
| rm_you | yeah | 07:31 |
| johnx | there's open source things with example code | 07:31 |
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| rm_you | ? | 07:32 |
| rm_you | for google latitude? | 07:32 |
| rm_you | i'll look into it | 07:33 |
| johnx | not latitude | 07:35 |
| johnx | it's another location server | 07:35 |
| johnx | so we just need a nice client | 07:35 |
| johnx | and the innovating is really client side. not server side ... | 07:35 |
| johnx | canola is kinda killing me here | 07:36 |
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| johnx | it's taking up so much RAM while browsing pictures that it drags the system to a crawl :/ | 07:39 |
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| rm_you | johnx: will look, remind me tomorrow maybe | 07:53 |
| rm_you | sleep time | 07:53 |
| johnx | 'night rm_you | 07:53 |
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| thux | morning | 08:53 |
| microlith | yay, sdk install works | 08:54 |
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| aSIMULAtor | huomenta | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | morning | 09:17 |
| Meiz_n810 | hyvää huomenta | 09:17 |
| RST38h | moo all | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | gf while making my business card: "Can I do it in Comic Sans?" | 09:19 |
| Stskeeps | my response: "NO!" | 09:19 |
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| RST38h | yesss, yessss! | 09:20 |
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| thux | dóbroje útro | 09:21 |
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| aSIMULAtor | comic sans lulz | 09:24 |
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| aSIMULAtor | http://www.forum.nokia.com/info/sw.nokia.com/id/e778ba1f-2507-4672-be45-798359a3aea7/Fremantle_Master_Layout_Guide.html | 09:25 |
| aSIMULAtor | :) | 09:26 |
| aSIMULAtor | now i hope, everyone follows that :D | 09:27 |
| Stskeeps | is it on wiki.maemo.org developer guide? :P | 09:27 |
| johnx | does it require comic sans as the default font? | 09:27 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: worse, Comic Nokia Sans | 09:28 |
| Stskeeps | aSIMULAtor: seriously though - if it's possible to get it on wiki.maemo.org it would get a lot more exposure as well as language fixes by community :P | 09:28 |
| johnx | random: actually a comic sans including east asian characters would look kinda cool | 09:29 |
| aSIMULAtor | yes you're right stskeeps i hope they do publish it there | 09:29 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: seems like we finally have a complete reference to create lo fi fremantle interfaces with :P | 09:30 |
| Stskeeps | aSIMULAtor: good job if it's your document :) | 09:30 |
| aSIMULAtor | http://www.forum.nokia.com/info/sw.nokia.com/id/97e9b8e0-904c-4141-bb8a-91d4f519735f/Maemo_5_Desktop_Widget_UI_Guidelines.html | 09:30 |
| aSIMULAtor | no it's not my document, it has been a group effort | 09:30 |
| aSIMULAtor | but if anyone requires any layout help i'll be willing to lend a hand :) | 09:31 |
| johnx | well, then congrats to you, and tell the rest of the group congrats as well :) | 09:31 |
| RST38h | aSIMULAtor: For god's sake, change the dialog boxes =) | 09:31 |
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| * Stskeeps notes to get himself a dual core as a kernel build is killing him | 09:32 | |
| johnx | Stskeeps, if only you had some lucrative contracting job, you'd be able to afford that kind of thing :P | 09:33 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, open source development is a bitch for the wallet :/ | 09:33 |
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| RST38h | dual core laptop is ~$650 in the US | 09:33 |
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| slonopotamus | morning | 09:34 |
| RST38h | still not free, but far from expensive =) | 09:34 |
| Corsac | especially if you're paid in euros | 09:35 |
| Corsac | :p | 09:35 |
| RST38h | <in scared voice> I think Stskeeps means a dual core ARM machine =) | 09:36 |
| Stskeeps | i wouldn't mind one of those 2ghz arm's | 09:36 |
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| aSIMULAtor | rst: in what way? :) | 09:37 |
| aSIMULAtor | RST38h: | 09:37 |
| johnx | aSIMULAter, just skimmed through the hildon 2.2 style guide: that is going to be massively helpful to a lot of people I think | 09:37 |
| RST38h | aSIMULAtor: Move the confirmation/etc buttons away so that they do not waste space | 09:37 |
| johnx | "away"? | 09:37 |
| RST38h | well, you can put them on top or on the bottom | 09:38 |
| RST38h | on top (as tabs) is actually a good idea | 09:38 |
| thux | first morning here this fall below freezing point, must get diablo hot to warm hands :P | 09:38 |
| aSIMULAtor | i just told the people who mainly wrote the majority of the documents that you guys said thank you :P | 09:38 |
| aSIMULAtor | rst38: eek as tabs hehehe | 09:39 |
| RST38h | aSIMULAtor: Well, anything will be better than the current abomination | 09:39 |
| aSIMULAtor | seriously though, the only dialogs that have tabs are legacy ones and i hope that's being phased out | 09:39 |
| RST38h | hmmm...not according to what I am seeing | 09:39 |
| RST38h | oh you mean tabs | 09:39 |
| johnx | RST38h, have you tried using that style of dialogs before dismissing (ha!) them off hand? | 09:39 |
| qwerty12_N810 | RST38h: Notebooks are frowned upon in Fremantle | 09:39 |
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| RST38h | johnx: Yes. They suck. | 09:40 |
| johnx | use your right thumb to accept | 09:40 |
| johnx | the one's in mer seem nice | 09:40 |
| RST38h | aSIMULAtor: You only have that much screen estate (and it actually depends on the physical screen size rather than resolution) | 09:40 |
| RST38h | aSIMULAtor: Wasting it by having a separate, mostly empty column for buttons is a crime. | 09:41 |
| johnx | they have way more horizontal to waste than vertical | 09:41 |
| RST38h | johnx: True, BUT | 09:41 |
| aSIMULAtor | well the right hand side where these confirmation buttons are do not scroll but the area to the left does | 09:42 |
| johnx | and picture the situation on maemo4 where they have dialogs that are 75% of the screen wide with buttons at the bottom | 09:42 |
| aSIMULAtor | as johnx said | 09:42 |
| johnx | now *that's* a waste | 09:42 |
| RST38h | johnx: Your buttons are normally elongated. So, by placing them into a horizontal container, you are wasting less space | 09:42 |
| johnx | ok, you need to understand the *value* of the space you're wasting | 09:42 |
| RST38h | Now, if Fremantle confirmation buttons had VERTICAL text rather than horizontal, then the current layout would make sense | 09:43 |
| johnx | heh, would be nice to have people use just an icon on buttons actually | 09:43 |
| RST38h | johnx: A config dialog can well take the whole screen, so ALL that space has more or less equal value | 09:43 |
| RST38h | johnx: Although if it were a file request dialog, the space would have different value | 09:44 |
| johnx | RST38h, I bet the nokia line is "those ugly, massive config screens should be redesigned" | 09:44 |
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| johnx | they're breaking from the desktop on purpose it seems | 09:44 |
| RST38h | johnx: In fact, it is almost exactly what they said | 09:44 |
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| RST38h | johnx: "need to have less settings, fewer menu items, etc" | 09:44 |
| RST38h | johnx: But this cannot be mandated by the UI: you have as many settings as necessary for your app | 09:45 |
| johnx | scrollable settings areas | 09:45 |
| RST38h | urgh | 09:45 |
| RST38h | <sleep> | 09:46 |
| johnx | heh :) | 09:46 |
| johnx | I've skeered RST38h into sleep | 09:46 |
| aSIMULAtor | good nite | 09:46 |
| aSIMULAtor | :D | 09:46 |
| aSIMULAtor | ooh night...geez, morning here | 09:47 |
| aSIMULAtor | work..day..ahead...yay | 09:47 |
| johnx | aSIMULAter, so on a scale of 1 to 10, how close were my answers to what Nokia would suggest? or is there a better way to do the those things? | 09:47 |
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| lardman | morning | 09:55 |
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| Stskeeps | morning lardman, jrocha | 09:55 |
| lardman | hey Stskeeps | 09:55 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: think it may be SDK day today | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | you caffeinated up? | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | or not, hmm | 09:57 |
| * Stskeeps hopes | 09:57 | |
| johnx | gah | 09:59 |
| johnx | about to go to bed | 09:59 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, get a good one then | 09:59 |
| johnx | just turned midnight here :P | 09:59 |
| aSIMULAtor | west coast? | 09:59 |
| lardman | I'm caffeinating now | 09:59 |
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| lardman | Stskeeps: SDK release day today was that? | 10:01 |
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| johnx | aSIMULAter, if you read my hostmask you can pinpoint me to ~100 miles even :) | 10:01 |
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| lardman | johnx: so you're not connected via a dozen anonymous proxies? ;) | 10:03 |
| aSIMULAtor | ahh washington | 10:03 |
| johnx | lardman, or I'm trying to frame someone who's machine I use as a proxy :> | 10:03 |
| jrocha | hi Stskeeps | 10:04 |
| lardman | indeed :) | 10:05 |
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| Stskeeps | lardman: the next codedrop for mer project/fremantle final sdk would be good :P | 10:08 |
| lardman | yep | 10:09 |
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| lardman | hmm, interleaved YUV | 10:19 |
| lardman | YUYV in fact | 10:19 |
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| lardman | Does anyone know where that Talk thread about the N900 camera lives? | 10:24 |
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| Jason404 | As Maemo apps are likely to be low in number, compared to Android, is there a way to use Android or normal desktop Linux apps on the N900, when it comes out? | 10:29 |
| johnx | yes no kinda | 10:30 |
| Stskeeps | Jason404: once Ubuntu gets their finger out and releases the Android-on-Ubuntu code they have, maybe | 10:31 |
| johnx | the "kinda" depends on your definition of "use normal desktop linux apps" and the "no" will go away if someone works on an android X11 runtime environment | 10:31 |
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| keesj | is there a generic gobject? | 10:31 |
| johnx | and low in number compared to android isn't necessarily the most fair thing ever. it looks like maemo5 at launch will have lots more apps than android at launch | 10:32 |
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| SpeedEvil | how about iphone apps? | 10:32 |
| SpeedEvil | to throw a silly thing out there? | 10:32 |
| Stskeeps | SpeedEvil: well, Cocoa (not UI) was just ported by some guy actually | 10:32 |
| Jason404 | johnx: why X11 on Android? didn;t you mean Maemo? | 10:32 |
| Stskeeps | Jason404: Easy Debian exists as a chroot environment as well | 10:33 |
| SpeedEvil | I have no idea how iphone apps work. | 10:33 |
| Jason404 | STskeeps: I do not understand. What has Ubuntu got to do with this? Because it is Debian based? | 10:33 |
| johnx | I should have been more clear: "an android-on-x11 runtime" | 10:33 |
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| johnx | SpeedEvil, disturbingly: kinda. look up cocotron | 10:33 |
| johnx | Jason404, ubuntu guys were working on the "android on x11" thing I was talking about | 10:34 |
| johnx | and the "distance" between ubuntu/debian and maemo is a lot less than the distance between maemo and just about anything else | 10:34 |
| Jason404 | so is Andoid just a desktop environment, like kde or gnome? | 10:36 |
| johnx | it's a "platform" that runs on top of the linux kernel | 10:36 |
| SpeedEvil | Running java apps | 10:36 |
| SpeedEvil | (android) | 10:36 |
| johnx | ask google about what android is. you'll get a better answer than we can give :) | 10:37 |
| Jason404 | so basically, out of Android and Maemo, Maemo os definitely more versatile and hackable? | 10:37 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 10:37 |
| SpeedEvil | much | 10:37 |
| johnx | very much so | 10:37 |
| Stskeeps | heck, people ran openoffice on the n810.. | 10:37 |
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| johnx | nokia hands you root access out of the box | 10:37 |
| johnx | (if you want it) | 10:37 |
| Jason404 | cool | 10:37 |
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| johnx | a lot of maemo4 apps will get ported to maemo5 without much pain at all | 10:38 |
| Jason404 | yeah, I read this thing about them having some sort of promotional hacking event for the N900 http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/27105/nokia-push-n900-london-event | 10:38 |
| johnx | if you want a quick peak of what's available for maemo4 check out http://downloads.maemo.org | 10:38 |
| Jason404 | cheers | 10:38 |
| johnx | yeah, they did some cool stuff for PUSH | 10:38 |
| johnx | and the whole onedotzero display was pretty neat as well | 10:39 |
| Jason404 | so what about normal linuc desktop apps? Can I run rdesktop and access my LAN and stuff? | 10:39 |
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| Stskeeps | i used rdesktop quite extensively | 10:40 |
| johnx | normal linux apps will need at least a recompile, and to really work nicely they'll need some reorganization/new layouts to fit into the OS well | 10:40 |
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| Jason404 | Stskeeps: You have used rdesktop on Maemo? | 10:40 |
| Stskeeps | sure | 10:40 |
| Jason404 | no problems? | 10:40 |
| Stskeeps | acts as rdesktop would | 10:41 |
| Jason404 | that basically means that I can run any Windows app on the N900?! | 10:41 |
| Stskeeps | if you're on 3g / WLAN with it | 10:41 |
| Jason404 | of course | 10:41 |
| Jason404 | that's great | 10:41 |
| johnx | yeah, lots of things have rdesktop and/or vnc clients | 10:41 |
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| SpeedEvil | ^xwindows | 10:42 |
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| SpeedEvil | - to avoid confusion | 10:42 |
| Jason404 | so I can run MS OneNote? You see, I love that program, and there is only a mobile version for Windows Mobile. But it seems with the N900 I can run the full desktop version through rdesktop? | 10:42 |
| SpeedEvil | ms windows no. | 10:42 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, we're talking rdesktop | 10:42 |
| SpeedEvil | oh - sorry - I'm partially aslowwwlp | 10:42 |
| SpeedEvil | eep | 10:42 |
| johnx | Jason404, have you ever used rdesktop before? | 10:42 |
| johnx | it's not gonna be the fastest thing ever... | 10:43 |
| Jason404 | no, but I use RDP all the time, om WIndows | 10:43 |
| johnx | probably not fun to do handwriting and watch the screen slowly refresh | 10:43 |
| johnx | it'll be a different experience over wlan (not to mention 3G) than over a fast wired LAN | 10:43 |
| Jason404 | ah yeah, I will be typing though | 10:43 |
| johnx | I just don't want you to get the wrong impression of what's possible | 10:43 |
| lardman | any thoughts on this odd res? 640 x 492 encoded as YUYV | 10:44 |
| Jason404 | I use RDP over wlan/internet with my laptop, and it's fine | 10:44 |
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| SpeedEvil | lardman: thats a full NTSC frame isn't it? | 10:44 |
| Stskeeps | johnx: i actually did handwriting on onenote at one point over rdesktop | 10:45 |
| Stskeeps | it looked crap but worked | 10:45 |
| lardman | nothing with 492 here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_common_resolutions | 10:46 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: I guess not | 10:46 |
| Jason404 | on the N900, it looks like the portrait position is only used for the phone. Do you think Maemo apps designed to be used in portrait orientation will start appearing once the N900 is out? It would be nice to have some iPhone like apps working on it too | 10:46 |
| SpeedEvil | I would be very surprised if not. | 10:47 |
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| Jason404 | Stskeeps: I was only planning to type notes on OneNote on the N900 anyway | 10:47 |
| Stskeeps | Jason404: yes, there's APIs for this | 10:47 |
| Jason404 | cool | 10:47 |
| Stskeeps | Jason404: rumours claim there's EverNote sharing plugins too | 10:47 |
| Stskeeps | I once made an interface from Xournal PDF -> OneNote import | 10:48 |
| johnx | looks like work is ongoing WRT the android/ubuntu project: http://mjfrey.blogspot.com/ | 10:48 |
| Jason404 | not tried Evernote, but I doubt I will switch, as I really like OneNote | 10:48 |
| johnx | they're having problems because Google didn't really release *all* the source :> | 10:48 |
| Stskeeps | hh | 10:48 |
| Stskeeps | heh | 10:48 |
| johnx | no google login/app store/gmaps | 10:49 |
| Stskeeps | the usual issue of android ports | 10:49 |
| Razumihin | I wish that OneNote would work under wine. | 10:49 |
| Razumihin | I | 10:49 |
| SpeedEvil | Razumihin: what features haven't you found in other similar apps? | 10:49 |
| Razumihin | 've got X41t as my laptop so it would be a absolute killer | 10:49 |
| Razumihin | SpeedEvil: Organization. | 10:50 |
| Razumihin | I nowadays use xournal. | 10:50 |
| Jason404 | Razumihin: I have a X31 and an X40, and I like the X31 much more. I want to get a X200s soon | 10:50 |
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| Razumihin | Tablet version is pretty different. | 10:50 |
| Corsac | problem is that X200s don't have the 1440x900 screen nowadays | 10:51 |
| Corsac | on 1280x800 | 10:51 |
| Corsac | (which sucks) | 10:51 |
| Razumihin | I really like this one, haven | 10:51 |
| Jason404 | I have used a X4xT. Same but just with touchscreen | 10:51 |
| Razumihin | 't had any reason to buy newer. | 10:51 |
| SpeedEvil | I hate the suckifying of displays recently. | 10:51 |
| Corsac | though if you wait for 01/2010 it'll be X210s | 10:51 |
| Razumihin | Hmm... no? X41 is lot smaller. | 10:51 |
| SpeedEvil | Lower DPI, ... | 10:51 |
| SpeedEvil | (in laptop space) | 10:51 |
| Jason404 | Razumihin: yes, I mean to use. The Tablet ones just have higher resolution and the touchscreen, is what I meant | 10:52 |
| Razumihin | Oh yes :) | 10:52 |
| Razumihin | True. I might switch this to x61t some day. Right now i'm pretty happy as it is. | 10:53 |
| Jason404 | yeah Corsac, that is what I am waiting for. the new version. I thought it would be called the X201 though, like the X301 | 10:53 |
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| Jason404 | X201s | 10:54 |
| johnx | hopefully it drives down the price of the plain old x200 in the process | 10:54 |
| johnx | that's kind of my dream laptop even as is | 10:54 |
| Jason404 | heh, all ThinkPad fasn here. cool | 10:54 |
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| Jason404 | my current phone is an ancient Nokia. I have never been intersted in getting a smartphone until I saw this N900 | 10:56 |
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| * chx is on a T400s. Wicked. | 10:56 | |
| Stskeeps | Jason404: it sounds like you'd love this phone | 10:56 |
| Jason404 | it's only now that they are getting intersting | 10:56 |
| Jason404 | yeah, I can;t wait to get one | 10:56 |
| johnx | though I also found this rather cool: http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:S31 | 10:56 |
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| Jason404 | yeah johnx. I rthin kthey only released them in Japan | 10:57 |
| SpeedEvil | My ideal laptop would be a x60s - with a 11" or so 1400*1050 display. | 10:57 |
| Jason404 | you can get them second hand, but they still cost quite a bit. | 10:57 |
| Jason404 | on the unofficial thinkpad forums | 10:57 |
| johnx | Jason404, I saw one for $100 once, but just passed it by thinking I'd see another one later for a better price :) | 10:57 |
| Jason404 | really? they wre much more last time I looked, a couple of years ago | 10:58 |
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| Woolly | morning guys | 10:58 |
| SpeedEvil | I had one similar to that - http://www.ciao.co.uk/Toshiba_Portege_3110CT__17232 | 10:58 |
| johnx | Jason404, give you a hint: I saw it *in person* :) | 10:58 |
| SpeedEvil | very similar specs | 10:58 |
| SpeedEvil | _lovely_ | 10:58 |
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| johnx | and it was really only ~6 months ago | 10:58 |
| Woolly | my tablet just crashed, and now I cant boot from micro-SD :( | 10:58 |
| onion | thanks Nokia! See you at the summit | 10:58 |
| Jason404 | johnx: you were in Japan? | 10:58 |
| johnx | Jason404, yeah | 10:59 |
| Jason404 | nice. I have wanted to visit there for a long time | 10:59 |
| Jason404 | has anybody here got a N800 or N810 or whataver they are called? Do they ever crash? | 11:00 |
| Woolly | mine just crashed :) | 11:00 |
| Jason404 | My brother's Symbian Nokia crashes a lot | 11:00 |
| Jason404 | oh | 11:00 |
| Stskeeps | they crash just like linux systems do when you | 11:00 |
| johnx | got an n800. they'll crash if you install something that crashes them | 11:00 |
| johnx | otherwise they're pretty darn stable | 11:00 |
| Woolly | anyone booting from micro-SD? | 11:01 |
| Jason404 | so they only crash when you have bad app installed. ok | 11:01 |
| onion | sometimes they go crash, sometimes uptimes over 2 months | 11:01 |
| Jason404 | how long does it take to boot up? | 11:01 |
| Woolly | about 20 seconds | 11:01 |
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| Jason404 | ok. not bad | 11:02 |
| Stskeeps | normally you have it stay on | 11:02 |
| Woolly | Stskeeps speaks the truth | 11:02 |
| johnx | it idles *really* well | 11:02 |
| Corsac | I only boot it when I forgot it with wifi on for too long :/ | 11:02 |
| Jason404 | i expect battery will not last longer than a day if you are using it much | 11:02 |
| johnx | say whatever else you want about Nokia and Linux, but they *know* what they're up to about power management | 11:02 |
| johnx | wasn't necessarily a response to you :) | 11:03 |
| johnx | you can idle on wifi mixed with moderate usage and you'll have no problems getting through the day | 11:04 |
| Corsac | especially if the wifi support power management | 11:04 |
| johnx | right, that's the biggest thing | 11:04 |
| johnx | and they'll stay tethered with bluetooth for a good long time too | 11:04 |
| Jason404 | what do you mean? the hardware is fixed? | 11:05 |
| Jason404 | is it quick and easy to turn the wifi and bt radios off? | 11:05 |
| Jason404 | an on | 11:05 |
| johnx | yeah | 11:05 |
| johnx | power btn -> down arrow -> center dpad | 11:05 |
| Jason404 | what did corsace mean about power management. is it not known if the N900 has it? | 11:06 |
| pupnik | heh i never used thayt | 11:06 |
| johnx | Jason404, nah. the battery life on wifi is determined by whether your *router* supports the power management modes | 11:06 |
| SpeedEvil | wifi power managment on the router | 11:06 |
| SpeedEvil | that the wifi is connected to. | 11:06 |
| Jason404 | ic | 11:06 |
| SpeedEvil | It's a mode where the router queues packets for you for a few hundred milliseconds at a time | 11:06 |
| SpeedEvil | then delivers them to you when you poll | 11:07 |
| Jason404 | oh right, I have always wondered what that setting did | 11:07 |
| pupnik | cool | 11:07 |
| SpeedEvil | I tried to find out the limits of that - I want to set it to 120s | 11:07 |
| SpeedEvil | but I couldn't get through the wifi spec I downloaded | 11:07 |
| pupnik | is that a recent feature? PM? | 11:07 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, it gets set it in mer ... somehow... might be able to ask Stskeeps about it | 11:08 |
| SpeedEvil | several years old | 11:08 |
| pupnik | or do normal 802.11g . hmm | 11:08 |
| Jason404 | I will be using the wifi at cafes and bars, etc. a lot of the time, so I will have no control over the power management there | 11:08 |
| pupnik | you can find electric there | 11:08 |
| Jason404 | so, would I ever find myself needing to carry the recharger around with me? | 11:08 |
| pupnik | i have a mini nokia charger for org | 11:08 |
| pupnik | otg | 11:08 |
| SpeedEvil | johnx: I was wondering about it for suspend to RAM for 115/120 seconds - for a laptop but remaining connected | 11:09 |
| johnx | most *decent* APs support it per default | 11:09 |
| SpeedEvil | decent recent | 11:09 |
| SpeedEvil | If it's >3? years old - then no | 11:09 |
| johnx | and then there's the ones that say they support it and crash horribly when the n800 really exercises it | 11:09 |
| johnx | Jason404, depends on usage | 11:10 |
| Jason404 | ic | 11:10 |
| pupnik | oh, bright backlight + torrent download will chew up a batt a bit faster | 11:10 |
| Jason404 | is there a flash on the camera on the N900? | 11:10 |
| johnx | if you keep it "on" but idle with wifi and screen off it stays on for weeks | 11:10 |
| johnx | LED flash | 11:10 |
| pupnik | continuous use case | 11:10 |
| pupnik | nice | 11:10 |
| Jason404 | so what sucks the battery most? wifi, bluetooth, phone use, screen? | 11:11 |
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| johnx | Jason404, yes | 11:11 |
| johnx | those things | 11:11 |
| johnx | and CPU and DSP | 11:11 |
| pupnik | does ram sleep? | 11:11 |
| johnx | pupnik, nope, but it moves to a slower refresh | 11:11 |
| johnx | ...retention mode? | 11:12 |
| Jason404 | I imagine I will be using the wifi for internet quite a lot, during the day | 11:12 |
| pupnik | ah dram | 11:12 |
| lardman | screen bl is a killer | 11:12 |
| Woolly | is anyone booting from micro-SD on an n810? | 11:12 |
| Jason404 | especially for MSN messenger and Skype stuff | 11:12 |
| johnx | DSP should suck less power than the CPU, but we don't know how much the GPU uses... | 11:12 |
| johnx | Jason404, you won't be using it as a cell phone? | 11:12 |
| johnx | Woolly, I'm booting sd on n800. is it a general question? or hardware specific? | 11:12 |
| lardman | johnx: less per unit output, but if the DSP is on the ARM must be too | 11:13 |
| Jason404 | johnx, yes I will be, but I do not talk on the phone for long. | 11:13 |
| johnx | Jason404, what I'm getting at is that the cell radio alone will use less power than cell+wifi probably | 11:13 |
| Woolly | I'm not sure as of yet. My tablet crashed when I was doing some hildon stuff, then when I did a hard reset, I can no longer boot to uSD, I get a "Failed to boot from mmc12" error | 11:13 |
| SpeedEvil | cell radio is _very_ optimised for power typically | 11:14 |
| johnx | Woolly, did you run fsck on the fs on that card? | 11:14 |
| Woolly | not yet, I cant even get it to mount from the internal OS | 11:14 |
| johnx | Woolly, does it "appear" in the file manager? | 11:14 |
| johnx | and just not mount? | 11:14 |
| johnx | or does it not show up at all? | 11:15 |
| Woolly | it's not in the file manager nope | 11:15 |
| johnx | can PCs see it in a card reader? | 11:15 |
| Woolly | unfortunately, I dont have a card reader to check | 11:15 |
| johnx | bummer | 11:15 |
| Woolly | indeed | 11:15 |
| johnx | how comfy are you with the command line? | 11:15 |
| Woolly | fine | 11:15 |
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| Jason404 | one of the things that I really like about this phone, it will at last give me a reason to learn all about linux, as before I have never really needed it (all my CAD, 3D, graphics work stuff is WIndows only, and my home server is WIndows, etc) | 11:15 |
| johnx | cat /proc/partitions when inserted | 11:15 |
| Woolly | johnx: http://pastie.org/621483 | 11:16 |
| johnx | Jason404, for maximum enjoyment of the cool hacks and development stuff you might want to either run linux in a vm on your desktop or put together a pc from spare parts to run linux | 11:16 |
| Woolly | johnx: it would appear that the partitions have disappeared! :D | 11:16 |
| johnx | Woolly, eep. that's not so good | 11:17 |
| johnx | check dmesg for errors maybe? | 11:17 |
| Jason404 | johnx: I have OpenSuSe and Ubuntu VMs running on my Hyper-V ProLiant server | 11:17 |
| johnx | then you're all set to really dig in | 11:17 |
| Jason404 | yeah | 11:17 |
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| Jason404 | I just have not really had the need to dive into Linux, even though I have wanted to | 11:18 |
| * johnx attempts to not start a distro war :) | 11:18 | |
| Jason404 | but this phone is very exciting | 11:18 |
| Woolly | johnx: http://pastie.org/621488 | 11:18 |
| Woolly | johnx: i'm not so sure about what these mean | 11:18 |
| johnx | Woolly, I/O errors on the device aren't all that good | 11:18 |
| johnx | uhm, might want to grab cfdisk and repartition it | 11:19 |
| johnx | also make sure the card is nice and tight in its adapter | 11:19 |
| Woolly | i'll restart after giving it a magic blow | 11:19 |
| Jason404 | johnx: which one shoudl I use then? Ubuntu or OpenSuSE? I also have a trial of SuSE Enterprise Server 11, but I am not sure if I will still be able to update it when the trial runs out. | 11:20 |
| johnx | I'm awfully partial to the "debuntu" distros, but it's personal preference really | 11:20 |
| johnx | ubuntu is good for developing/hacking/compiling for maemo | 11:20 |
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| Woolly | johnx: magic blow fixed it :'( | 11:21 |
| Jason404 | debuntu? | 11:21 |
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| Woolly | stupid micro-sd cards | 11:21 |
| SpeedEvil | Woolly: it'll all be fixed with the nano-SD cards. | 11:22 |
| lardman | bbiab | 11:22 |
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| Woolly | that you have to use tweezers to insert? | 11:22 |
| Jason404 | the charger for the N900 is just a standard micr-USB or is it some proprietary Nokia thing? | 11:22 |
| STiAT | Is it already known if the N900 will be able to run maemo 6 one day (when maemo 6 is done), or won't the old devices be supported? | 11:22 |
| Jason404 | is does ebeybody use a standard these days? my phone is ancient, so I do not know | 11:23 |
| Jason404 | I was womdering that too STiAT | 11:23 |
| Jason404 | I suppose the hacker community would make it happen? | 11:24 |
| johnx | STiAT, no. no one knows, including nokia | 11:24 |
| STiAT | I'm curious, I'm thinking about the phone, but I want maemo 6 one day, and I'm definitely not going to spend 600 euro if It won't happen :D | 11:24 |
| johnx | Jason404, debian or ubuntu :) | 11:24 |
| Jason404 | johnx: ok thnx. I thought Ubuntu was built on Debian | 11:24 |
| johnx | STiAT, then wait two years to find out ;) | 11:25 |
| johnx | Jason404, well...kinda? they're both largely built by the same people with the same packages | 11:25 |
| johnx | I'm perfectly happier with either | 11:25 |
| johnx | though I prefer ubuntu on the desktop and debian on the server | 11:25 |
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| johnx | a case can easily be made for doing things the other way around if one was so inclined | 11:26 |
| Jason404 | I have the feeling that Nokia did not really want to go so open with making Maemo phones, but has chosen to as they have fallen behind with smartphone competition. They say that they want to get back to using Symbian when they can | 11:26 |
| STiAT | johnx: I positive it will be known before maemo6 is done :D .. | 11:26 |
| Stskeeps | n800/n810 was usb 2.0 right? | 11:27 |
| johnx | STiAT, there wasn't a firm decision on whether or not maemo5 would be on the n8x0 until ~6 months ago | 11:27 |
| johnx | Stskeeps, usb2 client: yes | 11:27 |
| johnx | not sure about the host | 11:27 |
| Jason404 | as y cannot control the upgrade cycle if people can hack new Maemo releases to run on older phones., They cannot keep control of anything really | 11:27 |
| johnx | it might be something weird like usb2: full speed | 11:27 |
| johnx | Jason404, don't think of Nokia as one big thing | 11:28 |
| johnx | think of it as a collection of people | 11:28 |
| * Stskeeps wonders if his wife's pc can boot off n800 | 11:28 | |
| johnx | Jason404, and some of those people (the maemo team) are real open source supporters | 11:29 |
| Jason404 | ic | 11:29 |
| johnx | also: maemo started fairly open in 2005 | 11:29 |
| Jason404 | they are not the ones that make the decision though. the marketing suits do that stuff | 11:29 |
| johnx | it looks like their strategy is to slowly push maemo on the high end handsets and let it filter down | 11:29 |
| johnx | yeah, but maemo has their own marketing people ;) | 11:30 |
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| STiAT | johnx: though, i don't see too much difference to the N97 | 11:31 |
| johnx | STiAT, except for the entire inside of the phone? | 11:31 |
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| SpeedEvil | Why can't maemo5 run on the 97 - in principle | 11:32 |
| Jason404 | N97 got bad reviews here, in the intelligent tech press | 11:32 |
| SpeedEvil | Are there any hardware reasons other than the usual driver issues? | 11:32 |
| STiAT | johnx: yea, features are most likely the same, so you can't say it's the "high end" market. which hardware it uses is basically not too important to a user :D | 11:32 |
| SpeedEvil | And obvious hacking issues | 11:32 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, because it needs to run on linux? | 11:32 |
| SpeedEvil | johnx: I mean - if nokia were to choose to | 11:32 |
| johnx | STiAT, uh, ok sure, but user interface is: and the n900 has the guts to run maemo5. the n97 doesn't | 11:33 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, sure, they could port linux to it and run maemo | 11:33 |
| STiAT | johnx: the only thing i could hope is that the n900 doesn't lag as much as the n97 :p | 11:33 |
| Jason404 | SpeedEvil: N900 has more powerful processor | 11:33 |
| SpeedEvil | ah | 11:33 |
| STiAT | johnx: a friend of mine has the n97, and it deserves it's reputation | 11:33 |
| johnx | STiAT, Cortex-A8 vs an ARM11 | 11:34 |
| johnx | it's a whole generational difference | 11:34 |
| Razumihin | I think the real reason is the gpu not the cpu | 11:34 |
| johnx | other phones with the cortex-a8: iphone 3GS, palm pre | 11:34 |
| johnx | and yeah, the pvr sgx helps *a lot* for that cool compositing | 11:34 |
| Razumihin | You could in theory run maemo 5 on ARM11 if it wouldn't rely on so many opengl effects | 11:34 |
| STiAT | johnx: doesn't tell too much, depends on the implementation as well, in example of rotating the phone (N97 -> wait for 3-5 seconds) | 11:35 |
| johnx | Razumihin, or you could take out the part that needed compositing, and replace it with a non-compositing WM | 11:35 |
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| STiAT | johnx: and that's also too long for ARM | 11:35 |
| Razumihin | johnx: You could switch the ui to mer or something yes. | 11:35 |
| johnx | STiAT, what do you want me to say? there's no way to compare the n97 and the n900 in any way that makes sense | 11:36 |
| Razumihin | But you wouldn't be able to run it on n97 anyway. | 11:36 |
| Razumihin | And n97 is a decent phone, i'm pretty happy with it. | 11:36 |
| STiAT | johnx: there is a way, end user experience, where the N97 is incredibly bad. Let's hope the N900 does better :D | 11:36 |
| STiAT | johnx: but as long as they will release Qt for the N900 / Maemo 5 i'll very likely have it :p | 11:36 |
| X-Fade | STiAT: qt is already there. | 11:37 |
| Razumihin | The user experience on n97 is pretty ok. Better than on android imo. | 11:37 |
| johnx | STiAT, I don't really have any doubts about either of those statements :) | 11:37 |
| johnx | Razumihin, mer is/will be fremantle/maemo5 without the compositing WM (and it might have comopositing on devices that have the guts for it) | 11:37 |
| Jason404 | this N900 looks like it pisses all over the iPhone, but iPhone users would never get it, I feel. It really is a geeks phone. It does not look as nice either | 11:38 |
| florian | good morning | 11:38 |
| johnx | dunno. I like the look of the n900 keyboard, over the iphone keyboard :> | 11:39 |
| johnx | but yeah, it's a "power user" device | 11:39 |
| Jason404 | so the end user experience for this sort of phone has differemt requirements | 11:39 |
| johnx | for sure | 11:40 |
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| johnx | especially since they still have to provide a way to get desktop linux apps into it without too much pain | 11:40 |
| Stskeeps | skype calling functionality/google talk/communicator/etc will be a big boon too | 11:40 |
| johnx | and last.fm over cell radio is a neat trick :D | 11:41 |
| Stskeeps | abroad? call home by just clicking skypeout instead of through cell network | 11:41 |
| Jason404 | and Flash! | 11:41 |
| johnx | yeah, but seriously: $&% flash | 11:41 |
| SpeedEvil | Cut the keyboard off, and polish it a bit, and you've got an iphone. | 11:41 |
| SpeedEvil | (but better) | 11:41 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, nah, you've got an RX71 ;) | 11:41 |
| johnx | might need to add some numeric keys though | 11:41 |
| johnx | maybe have them slide out | 11:42 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/215002711/Precision_wirewound_resistor_RX71.html | 11:42 |
| SpeedEvil | hmm | 11:42 |
| johnx | depends on how much you polish :D | 11:42 |
| Jason404 | those pissy iPhone apps are a joke | 11:43 |
| johnx | eh, don't dismiss out of hand | 11:43 |
| johnx | there's plenty to be learned from the iphone's success | 11:43 |
| Jason404 | my sister has one. it's crap | 11:43 |
| johnx | and some real gems of apps | 11:43 |
| johnx | also: don't piss off iphone devs. we'd love to welcome cross platform development or "switchers" | 11:44 |
| johnx | the market is ripe for a real power-user/hacker phone to contend with WinMo | 11:44 |
| Jason404 | what are iPhone apps programmed in? Java? Objective-C? | 11:44 |
| johnx | the latter | 11:44 |
| Jason404 | ic | 11:44 |
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| SpeedEvil | Wincene would be interesting. | 11:45 |
| Stskeeps | wtf did i put my microsd.. | 11:45 |
| SpeedEvil | Run wince on it | 11:45 |
| johnx | ...all those sandbox "smartphones" (iphone, android, palm pre) should be just about pushing hackers to the limits of how much control they're willing to give up | 11:45 |
| SpeedEvil | apps | 11:45 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, maybe ones built for .net? | 11:45 |
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| johnx | but yeah, you won't get many people's love talking about running wince on the tablets or even talking about wine/arm | 11:46 |
| johnx | (and I think I'll still be calling the N900 a "tablet") | 11:46 |
| Myrtti | mjam mjam | 11:46 |
| SpeedEvil | I assume you can only get to the iphone store using crypto ID of some sort, and simply downloading apps on a normal browser wouldn't work? | 11:47 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, it also wouldn't help you | 11:48 |
| * lcuk yawns and looks for bacon | 11:48 | |
| Jason404 | lcuk: redditor? | 11:48 |
| johnx | right now the process for getting an iphone app ported would go like: if cocotron supports the functionality you need, then rewrite the whole UI in gtk/hildon or qt/hildon and then compile | 11:48 |
| SpeedEvil | johnx: I was assuming a wine-alike | 11:49 |
| johnx | won't happen | 11:49 |
| lcuk | Jason404, its not been on the bacon reddit for a while now, but it used to be a daily link. thats a good idea tho | 11:49 |
| lcuk | culinary pron for breakfast | 11:49 |
| * lcuk flicks through bacon reddit pretending to read the articles | 11:49 | |
| * SpeedEvil ponders bacon, but decides on bananna. | 11:49 | |
| lcuk | mmm if we are going for the fruit | 11:50 |
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| lcuk | i have to insist upon lemon n lime drizzle cake | 11:50 |
| lcuk | but shockingly, tracy baked a banana cake last night | 11:50 |
| johnx | keylime pie! | 11:50 |
| lcuk | then proceeded to say she didnt like it | 11:50 |
| * lcuk has lots more for himself | 11:50 | |
| Jason404 | baked banana? wtf | 11:51 |
| Jason404 | I had boiled plantains, which are bloody nice | 11:51 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, though the good news is we already have the attention of some iphone devs, one of whom is putting cocotron together as a basis to start porting | 11:51 |
| lcuk | bacon reddit needs thumbnails | 11:51 |
| johnx | and things for the iphone that are mostly opengl 2 es should have even lower barriers to port :) | 11:52 |
| lcuk | text links dont help me when i just have a hankering for the stuff | 11:52 |
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| SpeedEvil | johnx: cocotron if I understand it should be a case of 'take existing iphone app code and rebuild' ? With minimal porting? | 11:54 |
| johnx | SpeedEvil, it aims to implement the backend stuff, but apps would need a new UI made | 11:54 |
| johnx | if the dev keeps things nicely separate it's an issue of writing a new UI instead of rewriting the whole app | 11:55 |
| SpeedEvil | I see. | 11:55 |
| johnx | and for things that are mostly backend and ogl es 2, it should be even less work | 11:55 |
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| Jason404 | aren;t all maemo apps free? why woudl iphone devs want to make maemo apps if they are? | 11:56 |
| andrewgodwin | they don't _have_ to be free | 11:56 |
| Jason404 | is there an apps store? | 11:57 |
| johnx | and iphone devs aren't all in it for the cash | 11:57 |
| SpeedEvil | I'd pay for some apps. | 11:57 |
| johnx | Jason404, probably ovi store eventually | 11:57 |
| andrewgodwin | it's just that before the market wasn't very large | 11:57 |
| andrewgodwin | and yeah, nokia would be silly if they didn't do some kind of optional app store | 11:57 |
| johnx | the guy doing cocotron has an open source iphone app he wants to port AFAIR | 11:57 |
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| johnx | might even see some bigger names take a gamble if nokia can twist their arm ;) | 11:58 |
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| Jason404 | looking at the maemo apps. will OS2006 apps work on Maemo 5? | 11:59 |
| johnx | ...we already have skype, gizmo, boingo, rhapsody, wayfinder maps and ... | 11:59 |
| johnx | nope, not a chance | 11:59 |
| johnx | OS2008 apps: some might work without change, almost all will work with a quick recompile | 11:59 |
| Jason404 | ic | 12:00 |
| Jason404 | so thre are actually no N900 apps yet then? | 12:00 |
| johnx | there are | 12:00 |
| johnx | they're in fremantle/extras | 12:00 |
| johnx | but no, the maemo5 part of downloads.maemo.org isn't open | 12:00 |
| Jason404 | ic | 12:01 |
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| johnx | ha! the first app I saw for fremantle/maemo5 is "rootsh" | 12:02 |
| johnx | a tool to get root :) | 12:02 |
| lcuk | quite symbolic i thought | 12:03 |
| lcuk | it made me smile at least | 12:03 |
| johnx | especially since nokia carries it in their own repo | 12:03 |
| johnx | yup, I'm on the right platform for me :D | 12:03 |
| * lcuk nods | 12:03 | |
| Jason404 | I found it as soon as I could have | 12:04 |
| johnx | looks like other things that came through the fremantle extras autobuilder aren't out on the public repo yet | 12:04 |
| johnx | they'll be there soon though | 12:04 |
| johnx | probably before anyone actually has an n900 | 12:04 |
| Jason404 | I cannot afford to get a luxury item like this, but I will, as this is self development for em | 12:05 |
| johnx | expense it :D | 12:05 |
| Jason404 | self-employed | 12:05 |
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| Khertan | Hi ! | 12:05 |
| johnx | Jason404, so you're saying you know your boss will approve? :P | 12:05 |
| johnx | hi Khertan | 12:05 |
| Jason404 | heh | 12:05 |
| lcuk | mornin hacker Khertan \o | 12:06 |
| johnx | anyways, time for me to actually, really go to bed | 12:06 |
| johnx | 'night all | 12:06 |
| Khertan | hacker ? | 12:06 |
| Khertan | me ? | 12:06 |
| lcuk | gmornin johnx \o | 12:06 |
| lcuk | yes! | 12:06 |
| Jason404 | 'nigth johnx | 12:06 |
| lardman | night johnx | 12:06 |
| lardman | morning Khertan | 12:06 |
| Khertan | morning luck ... | 12:06 |
| lardman | hey lcuk | 12:06 |
| Khertan | morning lardman | 12:06 |
| andrewgodwin | ah, yes, being self-employed does at least mean I can write off tax on it :) | 12:06 |
| lcuk | mornin lardman \o | 12:07 |
| lcuk | you got over the nightmares yet? | 12:07 |
| Khertan | lcuk : or not in the wrong use of the term .. .hacker and not pirate :) | 12:07 |
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| lardman | any SWIG'ers here? | 12:08 |
| lardman | ones who use Python | 12:08 |
| lcuk | ive seen swig in searches | 12:12 |
| lcuk | what is it | 12:12 |
| lardman | wrapper generator | 12:12 |
| keesj | I only played with lua and java swig | 12:13 |
| lcuk | ahhh yes i remember | 12:13 |
| keesj | but I don't want a know :p | 12:13 |
| lardman | http://maemo.pastebin.com/m709bc32c | 12:14 |
| lardman | that's what I get | 12:14 |
| lardman | just umming and arring as to what it is | 12:14 |
| lcuk | dig into the swig and see what it declared that glue function as? | 12:16 |
| lcuk | and what is the low level c function proto | 12:16 |
| lardman | yeah I know, just looking to see if I've made a mistake with my .i file | 12:16 |
| Khertan | lardman: hum... you are trying to make binding for barcode ? | 12:16 |
| Khertan | i'm interested :) | 12:17 |
| lardman | yeah, a small C wrapper around derf's QR code, libdmtx and batoo | 12:17 |
| * lcuk will also closely monitor this computational wizardry | 12:17 | |
| SpeedEvil | Is there an appropriate place to post places that you can get the n900 subsidised? | 12:17 |
| lardman | then I want to use that from Python | 12:17 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, subsidisedfor doing what services? | 12:18 |
| lcuk | and have you found somewhere? | 12:18 |
| Khertan | lardman: once you get some binding for python i ll be happy to help to make a nice interface for it in py :) | 12:18 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: yes - well - ccooke was all cryptic about it - so I googled | 12:18 |
| lardman | well I could certainly do with some help, though I have a fair bit of the interface finished | 12:19 |
| lardman | just some bugs in the treeviews, etc | 12:19 |
| Corsac | SpeedEvil: I guess it might not be correct to put that on the wiki since it might be a bit like advertisement? | 12:19 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: http://www.mobilephonesdirect.co.uk/Brands/Nokia/Nseries-Multimedia-Phones/sb489/n443/p26078.aspx?lpsrc=google&lpcat=NokiaN900l&lpgrp=NokiaN900Vodafone&lptxt=N900v2&lpkey=n900%20vodafone&gclid=CO7z4oTq-pwCFVtn4wod_UiNUg | 12:19 |
| SpeedEvil | Corsac: It's a whole damn huge advert for nokia surely? | 12:19 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: down to 398 with a PAYG SIM | 12:20 |
| Corsac | Deal Price: FREE | 12:20 |
| Corsac | aha | 12:20 |
| SpeedEvil | yes - of course it's not really free. | 12:20 |
| * lcuk has payg sim already | 12:20 | |
| SpeedEvil | But once you crunch the numbers - it's actually cheaper than buying phone + contract | 12:20 |
| lcuk | but is it a payg data sim | 12:20 |
| lardman | no voice? | 12:20 |
| lardman | ah | 12:20 |
| SpeedEvil | At least from any providers I've found | 12:20 |
| lardman | just costs more money on data | 12:21 |
| SpeedEvil | For example - 30/mo for 18 months = 540 - with 500M/mo data | 12:22 |
| lardman | is that a pay monthly one now? | 12:23 |
| SpeedEvil | And you can't get that tarriff for 40 quid for 18 mo. (difference between nokia and that price) | 12:23 |
| SpeedEvil | yes | 12:23 |
| lardman | I;ve got that tariff for £15/month sim only | 12:23 |
| SpeedEvil | On voda | 12:23 |
| Khertan | ouch ... i pay 26 for 90min + illimitted http without any device | 12:23 |
| lardman | yep | 12:23 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: SIM only is a _horrible_ ripoff | 12:23 |
| SpeedEvil | :/ | 12:23 |
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| SpeedEvil | At least twice the price of with-device plans. | 12:24 |
| lardman | only a 30 day rolling contract though, so quite reasonable | 12:24 |
| keesj | all is horible | 12:24 |
| SpeedEvil | Well - only if there was a reasonable alternative for half the price is a rolling 30 day contract actually better | 12:24 |
| SpeedEvil | And there isn't | 12:24 |
| Jason404 | lots of star trek themes for Maemo, lol | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | PADD.. | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:26 |
| Jason404 | how come there is only a short decription? do you get a readme on installation? | 12:26 |
| Jason404 | I like the look of LCARS Bridge | 12:27 |
| Stskeeps | not a n900 theme though | 12:27 |
| Jason404 | for the apps I mean | 12:27 |
| Corsac | Availability: Expected release date 19 Oct 09 | 12:27 |
| Corsac | expansys.com | 12:27 |
| Jason404 | not even a readme for the author into, on themes? | 12:27 |
| lardman | hmm, I can't see any TypeMaps for unsigned char arrays, how should I pass a string back to Python from my C code? | 12:28 |
| lardman | likewise how do I pass an image buffer from Python to C (in the form of a string in Python)? | 12:28 |
| Corsac | same for expansys-usa | 12:28 |
| lupine_85 | humm, I have a Vodafone contract already | 12:29 |
| lupine_85 | might be worth getting the PAYG thingy just to save the extra £50, then pop the contact sim into it | 12:30 |
| lardman | ah, found it | 12:31 |
| lardman | payg will be dear for data though won't it? or is that included somehow? | 12:31 |
| SpeedEvil | It's nice to see the independant shops offering it. It would be nice if it was actually picked up by the carriers | 12:31 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: yes - you don't want to do PAYG for data | 12:32 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: unless you're not using it many days a month, in which case you do. (on voda at least it's 40/mo) | 12:32 |
| lardman | yeah, hence the £15/month being better | 12:32 |
| lardman | ;) | 12:32 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: for contract SIM - at purchase time - 5/mo extra - not cancellable - gets you 500m/mo. | 12:33 |
| Corsac | Tillgång: Expected release date 19 okt 09 | 12:33 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: Well - it depends. I could see 25M/day for 50p being useful for light users | 12:34 |
| kirma | one .fi web shop speaks of 9 Oct | 12:34 |
| lardman | SpeedEvil: that's what I have, £10 contract + the £5 topup | 12:34 |
| kirma | but that might be typo | 12:34 |
| lardman | yeah I guess so | 12:34 |
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| lardman | depends on phone call time too then | 12:34 |
| Corsac | Availability: Expected release date 19 loka 09 | 12:35 |
| Corsac | on expansys.fi | 12:35 |
| kirma | US wholesaler date was 27 Sep somewhere | 12:35 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: It _sucks_ that the seperate the mobile broadband. I can get 15 quid for a gig of data that doesn't expire on the mobile broadband - voda - and I have - but I can't even send SMSs from it | 12:35 |
| SpeedEvil | they seperate | 12:36 |
| lardman | yeah | 12:36 |
| kirma | also, dates between beginning of october and "about mid-october" have been stated by nokia people on various places... | 12:36 |
| lupine_85 | normally they let you send SMSes? | 12:36 |
| lcuk | SpeedEvil, my o2 mobile sim is £15 for 3gb | 12:36 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: it expires though I think | 12:36 |
| lcuk | i dunno | 12:36 |
| lcuk | but its not 1gb for £15 | 12:36 |
| Jason404 | has maemo got a built in dictaphone app, or do you have to use a third party one? | 12:37 |
| kirma | and some .fi physical shop talked about getting first few units maybe on week 44, that is late october | 12:37 |
| SpeedEvil | lcuk: this was for low usage - when a couple of meg a day will see it for ages | 12:37 |
| lardman | voda don't do good data deals | 12:37 |
| SpeedEvil | lupine_85: the mobile broadband - they supply you a USB modem - no, you can't send SMSs - though the hardware is capable of it. | 12:37 |
| lardman | O2 was by far the best, my family use Voda | 12:37 |
| SpeedEvil | lardman: well - a couple of meg a day - this does over a year per topup at 15 quid | 12:38 |
| Myrtti | humdidumdi | 12:38 |
| lupine_85 | odd. My sister had one and the interface allowed for sending SMSes | 12:38 |
| lupine_85 | don't think she ever did, though | 12:38 |
| SpeedEvil | (it's for backup IRC/ssh when my dsl dies nightly) | 12:38 |
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| Khertan | someone win 41 000 Euros to make this political web site : http://desirdavenir.com/ ... | 12:42 |
| Khertan | hum ... | 12:42 |
| Khertan | be carrefull : wear sun glasses to not becoming blind | 12:43 |
| * SpeedEvil clicks on les videos. | 12:43 | |
| Corsac | Khertan: is it really needed to troll on that *even* on #maemo? | 12:44 |
| Khertan | hihi | 12:44 |
| Khertan | Corsac: yep too funny : | 12:44 |
| Khertan | :) | 12:44 |
| Corsac | for some value of funny | 12:45 |
| Corsac | it just piss me off, tbh | 12:45 |
| Khertan | yep :) | 12:45 |
| Khertan | Corsac: its same things everywhere | 12:45 |
| Khertan | here it s just a bit more funny than a report on the number of moskito in camargue | 12:45 |
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| Khertan | maybe it could be a good test for the microb flash integration ? | 12:46 |
| Khertan | :) | 12:46 |
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| Jason404 | has maemo got a built in dictaphone app, or do you have to use a third party one? | 12:50 |
| lcuk | i hope there is one, ive not looked tho | 12:51 |
| Stskeeps | we had maemo recorder in the past in extras i think | 12:51 |
| lcuk | i keep wandering round house holding device and need to get input | 12:51 |
| Jason404 | cheers | 12:51 |
| Jason404 | i see there is a Tombay app called Conboy. Does anybody know of I can export to OneNote using that? | 12:54 |
| Jason404 | and vice versa | 12:54 |
| Jason404 | I guess that is unlike;y | 12:54 |
| ccooke | SpeedEvil: I see you asked about the subsidised UK deal. Did you find it? If not, I can send you the URL :-) | 12:55 |
| SpeedEvil | ccooke: the mobilephonesdirect thingy | 12:58 |
| ccooke | yep | 12:58 |
| SpeedEvil | Interesting. | 12:59 |
| ccooke | Unfortunately, they're saying my wife's phone is not due an upgrade... When vodafone say it is. I suspect vodafone are more flexible about the end of the contract :-/ | 12:59 |
| ccooke | (I'm not sure, because mobilephonesdirect don't actually give any information on the process) | 13:00 |
| SpeedEvil | YIsn't the upgrade price more than a new contract? | 13:00 |
| SpeedEvil | You can do stuff like PAC'ng out to a O2 SIM, then back to voda | 13:00 |
| lardman | yay segfault | 13:02 |
| lardman | at least SWIG is working now :) | 13:02 |
| ccooke | SpeedEvil: PAC? | 13:03 |
| lardman | code to port your number | 13:04 |
| lardman | porting auth code or somesuch | 13:04 |
| ccooke | doh, yes | 13:06 |
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| lardman | if a C fn returns a char *, I understand that SWIG will turn that into a Python string for me, but does it free the array after it's done that? | 13:07 |
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| lcuk | lardman, c functions generally only return char * from preallocated or static content | 13:09 |
| lcuk | in most senses its usual and expected to pass in a * and a length i believe | 13:10 |
| lardman | yeah I know, just trying to work out how to pass some data around | 13:10 |
| lardman | hmm | 13:10 |
| lcuk | swig might have a way to know and identify the return allocation type | 13:11 |
| lcuk | ie result from strdup(in); would need managing and freeing later on down the line | 13:11 |
| lcuk | exactly as if it was malloc(size) | 13:11 |
| lardman | http://www.swig.org/Doc1.3/Python.html#Python_nn49 | 13:12 |
| lcuk | but something like stristr() which returns a pointer within a preallocated string | 13:12 |
| lcuk | must be handled differently | 13:12 |
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| khiraly_mc | hi | 13:12 |
| lardman | When functions return a char *, it is assumed to be a NULL-terminated string. Data is copied into a new Python string and returned. | 13:12 |
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| lupine_85 | SWIG is pretty awesome -when it works. I haven't used it much though | 13:13 |
| lardman | but as strings are immutable, that one must presumably be created in the C fn | 13:13 |
| khiraly_mc | do somebody know that if n900 comes with "tainted" kernel? Im specifically interested if the 3D, the GSM and 3G comes with opensource driver or not | 13:13 |
| lardman | yes it's tainted | 13:13 |
| lupine_85 | khiraly_mc, I don't know, but I'm certain, that it'll be tainted | 13:13 |
| alterego | I think the data modem is OSS, the display driver is not, | 13:14 |
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| lupine_85 | not impossible to get OSS support for in time, probably | 13:14 |
| khiraly_mc | n900 has 3G and GSM too, no? So under data modem you understand the 3G chip as a whole? | 13:14 |
| lupine_85 | (if nouveau can do what they're doing...) | 13:14 |
| * lupine_85 tends not to case as long as OpenGL works | 13:15 | |
| khiraly_mc | nouveau are doing it since 3 years, and still they dont see the end of the tunnel | 13:15 |
| lupine_85 | aye, but they're dealing with a huge messy group of extremely complicated devices | 13:15 |
| lupine_85 | I'm pretty sure the chip in the n900 is quite simple by comparison to what they're doing | 13:16 |
| lupine_85 | not that I'll be the first to volunteer for it. I'm using nvidia's proprietary drivers as it is, now :) | 13:16 |
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| khiraly_mc | thanks | 13:16 |
| Stskeeps | lardman: i thought kernel plus kernel drivers was fully oss for once | 13:19 |
| lardman | hmm | 13:20 |
| lardman | not sure about that then | 13:20 |
| lardman | I assumed that the shims would be open, but still linked against closed stuff | 13:21 |
| lardman | I think the question was a general one about everything being open though, not the exact split points? | 13:23 |
| Stskeeps | well, tainted kernel usually means non-gpl modules | 13:23 |
| lardman | yeah, my mistake | 13:24 |
| Woolly | lardman: right, I'm on to working with the batoo bindings now, do you have any idea how to use them?:D | 13:24 |
| suihkulokki | lardman: not true | 13:25 |
| suihkulokki | khiraly_mc: the n900 kernel is not tainted | 13:25 |
| lardman | Woolly: no, am writing my own as I've wrapped the batoo stuff | 13:25 |
| lardman | suihkulokki: I stand corrected | 13:25 |
| lardman | Woolly: wrapped with some C that is | 13:25 |
| Woolly | lardman: cool, what did you add? | 13:26 |
| lardman | libdmtx and derf's QR code | 13:26 |
| Woolly | ahh right | 13:26 |
| Woolly | I'm just confused as to how analyse row works | 13:27 |
| khiraly_mc | suihkulokki: could you be a bit more specific, if the gsm and the 3G and the 3D part is fully opensource or not? | 13:27 |
| lardman | Woolly: oh right, well you just pass it a single row of data as a char* | 13:27 |
| Woolly | and it returns a upc? | 13:28 |
| lardman | Woolly: so I guess a string from Python.... | 13:28 |
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| lardman | iirc it returns a char array containing raw values for each number, i.e. not ascii | 13:28 |
| Woolly | cool | 13:28 |
| Woolly | I'll have a footer | 13:28 |
| Woolly | do you know how the format of the camera data? | 13:29 |
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| lardman | for which camera? | 13:29 |
| Woolly | the n810 | 13:29 |
| lardman | N8x0? | 13:29 |
| suihkulokki | khiraly_mc: the _kernel_ parts of both gsm/3g and 3d are opensource. but the beef of the 3d driver is in the libGLES* binary-only libraries. and most the gsm/3g stuff happens on modem chip. | 13:29 |
| Woolly | i know it's 640*480 | 13:29 |
| lardman | planar YUV | 13:29 |
| Woolly | cool | 13:30 |
| khiraly_mc | suihkulokki: so its pretty much the nvidia case here, no? | 13:30 |
| lardman | you might want to adjust the caps though as 640x480 is a bit slow | 13:30 |
| suihkulokki | khiraly_mc: exctept that nvidia has closed stuff in the kernel module too | 13:31 |
| lupine_85 | so in theory, you can use the closed-source stuff against any kernel? | 13:32 |
| lupine_85 | handy | 13:32 |
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| Stskeeps | or later versions | 13:33 |
| Woolly | lardman: sorry to be a total PITA, but see inside the analyse_image code, why row=0, row<height row+=4? | 13:33 |
| Stskeeps | which is cool | 13:33 |
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| lcuk | cos scanning every single row of the entire image using row++ takes 4x as long | 13:36 |
| lardman | oh sorry wrong code then | 13:36 |
| lardman | in that case you pass it the image buffer and it does the scanning | 13:36 |
| lardman | didn't want to scan every line, just a quarter of them | 13:36 |
| Woolly | lcuk: durr, what a dolt, i am | 13:36 |
| Woolly | thanks :D | 13:37 |
| lcuk | is that the original horizontal 1d scanner simon? | 13:37 |
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| lardman | yeah | 13:37 |
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| lcuk | :D | 13:37 |
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| lcuk | it was great hacking with that code | 13:37 |
| * zerojay waits by the door with impatience. | 13:38 | |
| Stskeeps | zerojay: waiting for a package? | 13:38 |
| lcuk | http://liqbase.net/liq.20081026_204523.gary.cam.png | 13:38 |
| lcuk | zerojay, got a strippergram coming or as stskeeps says - waiting for a package | 13:38 |
| zerojay | Stskeeps: Yes. Wife stayed home all week for it... and the one time she went out yesterday, she missed it by 10 minutes. | 13:38 |
| lcuk | o_O yikes | 13:39 |
| Stskeeps | zerojay: your preciousss arriving, eh. | 13:39 |
| lcuk | speaking of which | 13:39 |
| lcuk | ive got a delivery on route | 13:39 |
| lcuk | from google i think | 13:39 |
| * zerojay Mr Burns "excellent" finger thingie. | 13:39 | |
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| Stskeeps | microsd are entirely too fucking micro. | 13:48 |
| Woolly | is 8 the lowest framerate for the camera? | 13:48 |
| zerojay | lol.. yes, far too micro. | 13:50 |
| zerojay | I have a 16GB micro. I'm scared to ever remove it for that reason. | 13:50 |
| lcuk | finger nail sized | 13:52 |
| lcuk | quite useful after a trip to nokia | 13:52 |
| Woolly | toe nail sized more like! | 13:52 |
| Woolly | unless you have really small hands, lcuk :P | 13:52 |
| Woolly | :D | 13:53 |
| lcuk | http://liqbase.net/fingerfriendly.jpg | 13:53 |
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| wjt | at least you can *buy* micro, unlike mini | 13:54 |
| lcuk | thats cos micro can be inserted into a shim | 13:54 |
| lcuk | hence making 1 product means it works in both | 13:54 |
| lcuk | if they made mini there is no way they can be used in micro devices | 13:56 |
| lcuk | and they cut out a lot of the market | 13:56 |
| SpeedEvil | Mini used to be cheaper/larger than microSD | 13:56 |
| SpeedEvil | for a short period | 13:56 |
| lcuk | yeah | 13:58 |
| lcuk | then micro really took off | 13:58 |
| lcuk | and why not | 13:58 |
| lcuk | its a usable format that upscales | 13:58 |
| lcuk | best of all worlds as far as the memory manufacturers go | 13:58 |
| SpeedEvil | though the base size is still cheaper in large capacities | 13:59 |
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| lcuk | Myrtti, i found out what the acronym means | 14:05 |
| lcuk | and its one of 2 things | 14:05 |
| lcuk | the first one i wouldnt expect you to say | 14:06 |
| lcuk | the other is nice :) | 14:06 |
| lcuk | in your PM window >>>>>>> | 14:07 |
| Myrtti | lunch omnomnom | 14:08 |
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| lardman | so what do we reckon about /dev/radio | 14:10 |
| lardman | ? | 14:10 |
| * lardman digs out the kernel source code | 14:10 | |
| pupnik | i want xterm to beep | 14:11 |
| lardman | BCM2048_AUDIO_ROUTE_DAC and BCM2048_AUDIO_ROUTE_I2S | 14:15 |
| lardman | interesting | 14:15 |
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| SpeedEvil | I hope there really is a reciever. | 14:15 |
| lardman | there is | 14:15 |
| SpeedEvil | It's implemented in hardware - not just a chip option I mean | 14:15 |
| lardman | hmm, might even do v4l2 output, that would be easier then | 14:16 |
| lardman | yeah it's there | 14:16 |
| lardman | so I was told | 14:16 |
| SpeedEvil | v4l2? Why? | 14:16 |
| lardman | then it can be read as a standard source | 14:16 |
| SpeedEvil | I assume there is no tv-in? | 14:17 |
| lardman | or at least that's what I hope | 14:17 |
| lardman | no, don't think there's TV in | 14:17 |
| lardman | hmm, i2c to allow bt output | 14:17 |
| SpeedEvil | bt? | 14:18 |
| lardman | bluetooth | 14:18 |
| SpeedEvil | I2C is often a bit slow for bluetooth | 14:18 |
| SpeedEvil | I'd expect it to be on USB or SPI | 14:19 |
| lardman | no idea, just reading the diff | 14:19 |
| SpeedEvil | but I2C could work too | 14:19 |
| Woolly | lardman: I'm slightly confused. If I print len(data) where data is the gst.Buffer that was handed off from fakesink, it's 640*480*2 characters long. I cant find in maemo-barcode if you converted this to 640*480 characters long, did you? | 14:19 |
| lardman | yes we read part of the data into a new array | 14:20 |
| lardman | you should be able to just pass the whole buffer and set the width & height appropriately | 14:20 |
| lardman | as the data is YUV and for my testing at least, the Y data was all at the front | 14:20 |
| Woolly | so the width becomes 640*2 and the height remains at 480, right? | 14:21 |
| lardman | no, just 640 & 480 | 14:21 |
| lardman | then trailing that data are two sets of 320x240 for the U/V | 14:21 |
| lardman | but you can ignore those | 14:21 |
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| Woolly | ahh | 14:22 |
| lardman | but check your output, I've been told that the data should be interleaved, they weren;t for me | 14:22 |
| Woolly | will do | 14:22 |
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| lcuk | mornin javispedro, lbt \o | 14:30 |
| javispedro | morning | 14:30 |
| lbt | ADSL down for 90mins :( | 14:30 |
| lcuk | booo | 14:30 |
| Captain_Picard | tobad! | 14:31 |
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| lcuk | just enough time to do a fryup | 14:31 |
| Captain_Picard | lcuk: whats up got any news of n900 | 14:31 |
| Captain_Picard | we dont know about? | 14:31 |
| lcuk | yes | 14:31 |
| lcuk | breaking news: | 14:31 |
| lcuk | n900 kicks ass | 14:31 |
| javispedro | n900 has a builtin bread toaster? | 14:31 |
| Captain_Picard | a shaver for the women | 14:31 |
| lcuk | bacon grill | 14:31 |
| lcuk | just put a (small) rasher on the keyboard | 14:31 |
| lcuk | and close it up | 14:32 |
| SpeedEvil | This is clearly a vital use-case for why we need a larger device. | 14:32 |
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| Captain_Picard | yes | 14:32 |
| SpeedEvil | It has to fit a whole rasher. | 14:32 |
| Captain_Picard | also a fridge | 14:32 |
| Captain_Picard | full of delicious food | 14:32 |
| SpeedEvil | And cake. | 14:33 |
| javispedro | and what if I want to grill bacon while typing? | 14:33 |
| javispedro | obviously we need two keyboards. | 14:33 |
| lcuk | its the principle reason why liqflow needs collaborative grilling capabilities and will operate in a network of upto and over 25 devices ;) | 14:33 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, we need to ensure some components get their elements upto full cooking capacity | 14:35 |
| lcuk | how is the opengles stuff coming on ? | 14:35 |
| lcuk | or havent you looked recently | 14:35 |
| javispedro | not coming for now :) | 14:35 |
| lcuk | roadblock due to anything we can help with? | 14:36 |
| lcuk | you need the book or actual test stuff? | 14:36 |
| lardman | what sort of gstreamer audio sink do I need to use for Fremantle? | 14:36 |
| javispedro | i'm trying to design a better gui for fremantle drnoksnes. I used wazd's sketch for diablo's | 14:36 |
| * lcuk nods | 14:36 | |
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| pupnik | i am verifying that drnoksnes works | 14:37 |
| pupnik | ;) | 14:37 |
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| lcuk | make sure you check all the corner cases pupnik | 14:38 |
| lcuk | its vital people are able to play every level of every game :D | 14:38 |
| lcuk | repeatedly in some instances lol | 14:38 |
| * javispedro found a graphics glitch in a single level of yoshi's island :P | 14:38 | |
| lcuk | can we use accelerometer for control for it for you javispedro | 14:38 |
| javispedro | eh. well, there's no analog input in the snes controller | 14:39 |
| javispedro | at all. | 14:39 |
| javispedro | so it would suck... | 14:39 |
| lcuk | there never was for spectrum or amiga really either | 14:39 |
| lcuk | but that didnt stop analog feeling joysticks | 14:40 |
| lcuk | and everyone would tilt at the corners playing racing games | 14:40 |
| javispedro | well, i could see using a joystick to control a d-pad, but using tilt to control a d-pad... | 14:40 |
| javispedro | well | 14:40 |
| javispedro | it would be cool for mario kart of course | 14:40 |
| lardman | hmm, looks like alsa | 14:40 |
| javispedro | lardman: sorry, pulse | 14:40 |
| lcuk | javispedro, of course it wouldnt be perfect :) but it adds a level of interaction | 14:41 |
| lcuk | lardman, i dunno how it works | 14:41 |
| * lcuk is in the dark | 14:41 | |
| javispedro | lardman: I mean, fremantle uses pulseaudio. either use the autosink (i'd assume it'd work) or the pulseaudiosink | 14:41 |
| lardman | is that a valid type? | 14:41 |
| lardman | ah, can I s/alsasink/autosink then? | 14:42 |
| javispedro | I dunno if that's the name, but yes, you should. | 14:42 |
| lardman | ok cool, thanks | 14:42 |
| javispedro | http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/data/doc/gstreamer/head/gst-plugins-good-plugins/html/gst-plugins-good-plugins-autoaudiosink.html | 14:43 |
| javispedro | I have to wonder if it uses pulseaudio by default in fremantle | 14:44 |
| javispedro | (much like the way they patched sdl to prefer pulse over alsa) | 14:44 |
| lardman | I'll try with "autoaudiosink" in that case | 14:44 |
| javispedro | if not, there's also http://gstreamer.freedesktop.org/data/doc/gstreamer/head/gst-plugins-good-plugins/html/gst-plugins-good-plugins-gconfaudiosink.html | 14:45 |
| javispedro | "outputs sound to the audiosink that has been configured in GConf by the user" | 14:45 |
| lardman | ah ok | 14:45 |
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| lcuk | lardman, is this for audio in again, or are you making outputs now ? | 14:51 |
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| MaceN8x0 | wow | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | mm? | 14:56 |
| MaceN8x0 | what i would give for nokia to take one last official stab at the N8x0 | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | you actually like your n8x0? :P | 14:56 |
| MaceN8x0 | sure | 14:56 |
| MaceN8x0 | it is great heh | 14:57 |
| Stskeeps | so what's bothering you atm? | 14:57 |
| MaceN8x0 | no printing ;) | 14:57 |
| MaceN8x0 | haha | 14:57 |
| lcuk | it can be coaxed into adding printing support | 14:57 |
| lcuk | i think it happened at least once | 14:57 |
| MaceN8x0 | i used to use koffice and print from it | 14:58 |
| MaceN8x0 | but that requires kde | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | MaceN8x0: koffice is coming for n900 | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | according to some | 14:58 |
| javispedro | according to "some"? lol | 14:58 |
| MaceN8x0 | woah | 14:58 |
| MaceN8x0 | that would be beyond awesome | 14:58 |
| MaceN8x0 | with cups? ;) | 14:59 |
| lcuk | DD cups hopefully | 14:59 |
| * javispedro wonders happened with DocsToGo | 14:59 | |
| Stskeeps | http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2009/09/17/office-viewer-for-maemo5-based-on-koffice/ | 14:59 |
| MaceN8x0 | viewer? :/ | 14:59 |
| andre__ | yes. | 14:59 |
| * MaceN8x0 is reminded of android quickoffice | 14:59 | |
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| MaceN8x0 | what a piece of crap | 15:00 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 15:00 |
| * javispedro though the viewer was docstogo. | 15:00 | |
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| MaceN8x0 | docs2go had write support | 15:00 |
| Stskeeps | javispedro: doesn't mean there can't be more viewers | 15:00 |
| MaceN8x0 | at least on android it does | 15:00 |
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| MaceN8x0 | viewers are ugh | 15:00 |
| MaceN8x0 | they were charging $20 for android qoffice | 15:01 |
| MaceN8x0 | what a gyp | 15:01 |
| javispedro | Stskeeps: but I'd suppose Nokia did talk to DataViz for that, and now they're also in talks with KOffice guys.. | 15:01 |
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| Corsac | ha, expansys.fr has now an estimated release date too | 15:01 |
| Corsac | and the price is down to 575€ too | 15:02 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 15:02 |
| MaceN8x0 | preordering? | 15:02 |
| * MaceN8x0 thinks about his touchbook | 15:02 | |
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| MaceN8x0 | still waiting | 15:02 |
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| Corsac | MaceN8x0: nah, no preorder until I know if my carrier will subsidize it | 15:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | tmob is supposed to carry it | 15:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | i hope so... android is disappointing | 15:04 |
| * lcuk now "gets text messaging | 15:04 | |
| kirma | haha, looking at expansys.fr front page... "Le must-have", "Le gadget ultime" ... | 15:04 |
| lcuk | the ui in fremantle on n900 is super slick and integrates well | 15:05 |
| kirma | not about N900 though :I | 15:05 |
| javispedro | "Le must-have"? :PO | 15:05 |
| MaceN8x0 | haha | 15:06 |
| * kirma wonders how nokia web shop and something like expansys usually compare on shipping times | 15:06 | |
| javispedro | easy. according to murphy's law, the gadget arrives just when you no longer need it. | 15:06 |
| MaceN8x0 | sure wish they had left handed stylus holders | 15:07 |
| * javispedro finds fremantle gui layout guide | 15:07 | |
| javispedro | wow. | 15:07 |
| javispedro | just when I needed it. | 15:07 |
| javispedro | take that, murphy's | 15:07 |
| javispedro | ftr, N900's DPI is 265. | 15:08 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh. javispedro sounds like my touchbook | 15:08 |
| javispedro | 4px = 0.4mm | 15:08 |
| MaceN8x0 | it will get here when some godlike arm netbook comes out | 15:09 |
| javispedro | a 32x32 icon is like, 3.1 mm? | 15:09 |
| javispedro | impressive. | 15:09 |
| lupine_85 | maemo is so going to force me to learn Qt | 15:09 |
| * alterego shudders | 15:10 | |
| lupine_85 | I've played a bit in the past but I don't know it very well | 15:10 |
| alterego | I don't see what the problem is with Gtk :'( | 15:10 |
| alterego | And glib stuff :'( | 15:11 |
| lardman | can v4l2 devices be audio rather than video? | 15:11 |
| lupine_85 | no particular problem | 15:11 |
| alterego | lardman: yeah | 15:11 |
| lupine_85 | but choice is always good | 15:11 |
| javispedro | lardman: yes (fm radio) | 15:11 |
| lardman | indeed | 15:11 |
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| lardman | I'm getting some dbus errors, so was wondering if I should use a different source | 15:11 |
| * alterego wonders if the FM Radio is "Visual Radio" though I've never seen that working. | 15:11 | |
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| * javispedro wonders if the screenshots on the fremantle master layout guide are from the final device ui or just mockups. they look good. | 15:13 | |
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| javispedro | the media player looks kickass now | 15:15 |
| javispedro | a bit vista-ish. | 15:15 |
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| lcuk | javispedro, it works well too | 15:25 |
| lcuk | amazing how good something can look and feel with a simple facelift | 15:25 |
| Khertan | You want to pratice your english accent on this four word ? Great, Incredible, amazing, awesome | 15:27 |
| Khertan | ??? | 15:27 |
| Khertan | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vGWI5SY98A | 15:27 |
| Khertan | :) | 15:27 |
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| AndrewFBlack | Anyone know if I make several themes that point to a central icon folder but I don't include the icons in any of those packages then the themes should look in the seconday(or what ever its called) icon theme then I can have an extra package for the icons incase some pople don't want the icons. they don't have to install it | 15:46 |
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| lcuk | AndrewFBlack, wall of unthemed text makes eyes bleed | 15:49 |
| lcuk | i think i know what you mean, but i thought a theme that included icons was exactly that | 15:50 |
| lcuk | can you make 2 distinct packages | 15:50 |
| lcuk | one for the main theme bits but no icons | 15:50 |
| lcuk | and one for the icons but no main theme bits | 15:50 |
| lcuk | and dont try to do your half and half mix thing? | 15:50 |
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| lcuk | you oculd then also have a third meta package which depends upon both halves | 15:51 |
| AndrewFBlack | lcuk, yeah thas what I want a package for theme ad a package for icons | 15:51 |
| AndrewFBlack | but I have 3 themes that use same icons so they could all point to sme icon theme right | 15:51 |
| AndrewFBlack | and save room since I would only use 1 set of icons | 15:51 |
| * lcuk nods | 15:51 | |
| lcuk | 1 icon pack and each of the 3 themes depends on that pack | 15:51 |
| AndrewFBlack | thanks I think that is how I will do it | 15:52 |
| lcuk | cool, got any preview screenies for us to drool over? | 15:52 |
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| AndrewFBlack | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31697 still got some tweaking todo to the colors the first color set just looked really bad | 15:53 |
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| Woolly | lardman: how you getting on? | 15:56 |
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| lardman | barcodes? | 15:57 |
| lardman | segfault, have to check my C wrapper | 15:57 |
| lardman | at least SWIG is ok now though | 15:57 |
| Woolly | cool | 15:57 |
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| RST38h | X-Fade: Here? | 16:04 |
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| lcuk | AndrewFBlack, that looks cool | 16:10 |
| lcuk | the hand drawn background adds a lovely touch :) | 16:10 |
| lcuk | (if thats what it is) | 16:11 |
| AndrewFBlack | lcuk, its the icon set that reall sets this off I didn't do the icons but they are cool | 16:11 |
| AndrewFBlack | just looks hand drawn | 16:11 |
| lcuk | v cool (H) i will have to look in full color later, 256color over vnc may be distorting things lol | 16:12 |
| * lcuk has beergoggle view | 16:12 | |
| Woolly | ah crap, the python bindings I created for batoo want an unsigned char * to be passed as an argument :( | 16:16 |
| Woolly | does anyone know how to do this?:D | 16:18 |
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| ziyourenxiang | woolly: casting | 16:21 |
| Woolly | I'm passing it a string | 16:21 |
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| ziyourenxiang | a python sring? | 16:22 |
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| Woolly | yeah | 16:23 |
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| Woolly | the function in batoo.c takes an unsigned char *, but I'm not sure how to make it work in python, with my bindings | 16:24 |
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| ziyourenxiang | you need to create a wrapper for the C function in python | 16:26 |
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| ziyourenxiang | well, there are at least two ways | 16:26 |
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| Woolly | ziyourenxiang: that's what I did, with Swig | 16:27 |
| ziyourenxiang | hmm, swig should've taken care of the wrapping, i.e., swig should invoke your C func using the unsigned char* extracted from the python string using pystring api | 16:28 |
| Woolly | I get a type error, whenever I try to pass a string to the Python function | 16:28 |
| lardman | make the input type a pointer to an array | 16:29 |
| lardman | char **input_buffer | 16:29 |
| lardman | I've got to pop out, but will be back in ~1hr | 16:29 |
| Woolly | lardman: input type for batoo.c? | 16:29 |
| Woolly | alrighty :) | 16:29 |
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| lardman | try this command in the .i file: http://maemo.pastebin.com/m2ddac968 | 16:30 |
| lardman | that's my rough structure so far | 16:30 |
| lardman | the SWIG works, segfault which I need to track down when I get back | 16:30 |
| * ccooke considers VPN access on the n900 | 16:30 | |
| ziyourenxiang | pass a string back to python, you say? then you need to use the python string API to make a python string out of the char* | 16:30 |
| ccooke | it would mean I could keep an ssh session open, regardless of whether I'm on wifi or wwan :-) | 16:31 |
| lardman | swig should do it automatically I think | 16:31 |
| lardman | http://www.swig.org/Doc1.3/Library.html#Library_nn8 | 16:31 |
| lardman | anyway, bbiab | 16:31 |
| kirma | I considered exactly the same thing today | 16:31 |
| Woolly | cool | 16:31 |
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| kirma | should play with openvpn... interesting question is if one can teach openvpn to re-establish the connection nicely when network config change is observed | 16:32 |
| kirma | no excess polling (either network configuration or over the network) thanks | 16:32 |
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| ccooke | you can | 16:32 |
| kirma | and keeping keepalives rare, like couple times an hour over TCP | 16:33 |
| kirma | 100/10 home connection is more than enough to run a nice openvpn tunnel endpoint for this | 16:33 |
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| cagonto | online boxing game http://www.kobox.org/kobox-fande-Nourine.html | 16:38 |
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| kirma | ccooke: certainly something I, and I bet many others, would want to have :) | 16:39 |
| kirma | although hmm... interaction with web-authenticated wlans is bound to be problematic | 16:40 |
| kirma | in my opinion, that's brain-damaged way of doing things anyway, but unfortunately so widespread | 16:40 |
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| ccooke | bah | 17:02 |
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| ccooke | mobilephonesdirect seem to be confused by my account having two phones on it | 17:02 |
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| ccooke | they tried to upgrade my phone (due for upgrade november next year) instead of my wife's (has been due an upgrade for two months) | 17:03 |
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| Glowball | Hi | 17:07 |
| Glowball | Before I plan buying the new N900, one simple question: | 17:07 |
| Glowball | Does it have an IRC client? | 17:07 |
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| Stskeeps | X-Chat exists :) | 17:07 |
| qwerty12 | It needs uploading, for Fremantle: http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/pool/fremantle/free/source/x/xchat/ is non-existent | 17:08 |
| Glowball | I read XChat's UI has got problems on Maemo | 17:08 |
| Glowball | Though the post is almost 2 months old | 17:08 |
| till- | i'm using xchat on my n800 | 17:08 |
| till- | runs perfectly | 17:09 |
| Glowball | Well, ok | 17:09 |
| Glowball | Thanks ;) | 17:09 |
| qwerty12 | I've been using it on my N900, and while it isn't up to Fremantle UI design standards, it works fine | 17:09 |
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| * Stskeeps passes qwerty12 a cookie | 17:09 | |
| till- | why anybody already has a n900 :/ | 17:09 |
| qwerty12 | Thanks Stskeeps | 17:09 |
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| zerojay | Just got mine 5 minutes ago. | 17:10 |
| zerojay | Broken charger. | 17:10 |
| zerojay | :/ | 17:10 |
| ccooke | is irssi available yet? | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | zerojay: use computer charging? | 17:10 |
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| qwerty12 | zerojay: my charger works, but it's an American one. So, I guess I can say that mine is broken, too :( | 17:10 |
| till- | isn't there an adaptor shipped for using the old nokia chargers? | 17:11 |
| zerojay | I am using my computer to charge. Lucky I had the cable. | 17:11 |
| zerojay | They sent me a broken european charger. lol | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | zerojay: did your room flood from drooling too much yet? | 17:11 |
| zerojay | Can I boot it up while charging? | 17:11 |
| zerojay | lol. | 17:12 |
| zerojay | more or less. :D | 17:12 |
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| Stskeeps | should work | 17:12 |
| zerojay | Orange charging light.. can't seem to boot it. | 17:13 |
| zerojay | power button's doing nothing. | 17:13 |
| andrewgodwin | zerojay: how did you snaffle one arealy? | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, it's a bit quirky at times | 17:14 |
| Stskeeps | battery pop ftw | 17:14 |
| zerojay | I'll try that. | 17:14 |
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| qwerty12 | zerojay: I sometimes have success in booting it from the power button and then shoving in the cable afterwards... | 17:14 |
| zerojay | Oh.. faint Nokia logo now. | 17:14 |
| qwerty12 | I need to bring my /proc/bootreason hack to the N900, infact... | 17:14 |
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| lardman | re | 17:15 |
| zerojay | Is it just the right side switch to unlock the back door? | 17:15 |
| Stskeeps | nah, you'll have to break your nails | 17:15 |
| qwerty12 | No, pull the back door off with the ridge on the right; the switch locks the tablet | 17:16 |
| zerojay | Ouch. | 17:16 |
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| lardman | so people are now talking openly about N900.....? | 17:16 |
| Woolly | oh hey again lardman | 17:16 |
| zerojay | guess we shouldn't, eh? | 17:16 |
| Woolly | I had absolutely no idea what you were talking about before you left :D | 17:16 |
| lardman | dunno | 17:16 |
| lardman | Woolly: hi | 17:16 |
| zerojay | Ooooowwwww. | 17:16 |
| lardman | Woolly: lol | 17:16 |
| Woolly | i've to modify my interface file? | 17:17 |
| lardman | yes, and probably the C source too | 17:17 |
| lardman | did you see that pastebin entry | 17:17 |
| lardman | ? | 17:17 |
| lardman | zerojay: well it's pretty obvious anyway, just not sure people are supposed to shout about it, etc. | 17:17 |
| Woolly | yep | 17:17 |
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| lardman | that looks like the best way to pass a string in and out | 17:18 |
| lardman | so I return a string which is the decoded data, plus a flag to say that I've decoded something | 17:18 |
| lardman | you may be able to skip that, I'm decoding different types, so need to know which is which | 17:18 |
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| Woolly | alright | 17:19 |
| lardman | but the char** is the way that doc says to handle the return type anyway | 17:19 |
| Woolly | I have no idea about C, so am unsure as to how to modify analyse_row :( | 17:19 |
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| lardman | and inside your C code you do *output = (char *)malloc() | 17:19 |
| lardman | oh I see | 17:19 |
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| lardman | hang on a tick then, let me find the code | 17:19 |
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| lardman | https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/trunk/maemo-barcode.c?revision=39&root=maemo-barcode&view=markup | 17:22 |
| lardman | look at analyse_image() | 17:22 |
| lardman | I'd keep that fn on the C side, and call that from python | 17:22 |
| lardman | that fn scrolls through the data and calls analyse_row repeatedly | 17:22 |
| Woolly | gotcha | 17:24 |
| Woolly | but analyse image takes an unsigned char * as argument one | 17:24 |
| lardman | then change the def of analyse_image() to something like this: int analyse_image(char *input, char **output) | 17:25 |
| lardman | you need to pass the height & width too of course | 17:25 |
| Woolly | the python def? | 17:25 |
| lardman | no, the C code | 17:25 |
| Woolly | I am so confused | 17:25 |
| lardman | you'll have to re-SWIG it | 17:25 |
| lardman | lol | 17:25 |
| Woolly | :D | 17:26 |
| lardman | email me what you have and I'll change it to what I think, then we can debug from there | 17:26 |
| Woolly | will do | 17:26 |
| Woolly | thanks :) | 17:26 |
| lardman | np | 17:26 |
| Woolly | do you still have the tar.gz that I sent you? | 17:26 |
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| Woolly | sent my .py file | 17:27 |
| lardman | hmm, somewhere I imagine | 17:28 |
| lardman | yes I do | 17:28 |
| Woolly | resent | 17:29 |
| Woolly | oh | 17:29 |
| lardman | thanks anyway :) | 17:29 |
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| lardman | do you have any python code, other than the wrapper stuff? | 17:30 |
| lardman | i.e. how do you plan to call it? | 17:30 |
| Woolly | did you get my first mail? | 17:30 |
| Woolly | barcode.py? | 17:30 |
| lardman | ah, just got that one | 17:31 |
| Woolly | (Y) | 17:31 |
| Woolly | I call that in find_a_barcode() | 17:31 |
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| lardman | you've taken every 2nd element of the frame? | 17:32 |
| lardman | l.69 | 17:32 |
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| Woolly | 2 tics | 17:33 |
| Woolly | finder crash | 17:33 |
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| lardman | np | 17:33 |
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| Woolly | yup | 17:33 |
| Stskeeps | wb qwerty12 | 17:33 |
| Woolly | as it's UYVY | 17:33 |
| lardman | why? | 17:33 |
| lardman | is it really? | 17:33 |
| Woolly | I take all the Ys | 17:33 |
| lardman | you've tested? | 17:33 |
| qwerty12 | Thank you, Stskeeps | 17:33 |
| Woolly | yeah | 17:33 |
| Woolly | yeah | 17:33 |
| lardman | ah, you've set the FOURCC | 17:34 |
| Woolly | I'm not sure what that is :D | 17:34 |
| lardman | fine, if you don't set it, you seem to get out planar data (on the n800 at least), which is probably less computationally intensive to use | 17:34 |
| Woolly | ahh | 17:34 |
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| lardman | l.50 | 17:34 |
| Woolly | the maemo-barcode revision had it | 17:34 |
| lardman | in the caps argument | 17:34 |
| Woolly | yeah | 17:34 |
| lardman | yeah I know, confused me too :) | 17:35 |
| lardman | anyway that's ok | 17:35 |
| Woolly | :D | 17:35 |
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| Woolly | does it make sense? | 17:39 |
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| lardman | yeah, just changing stuff | 17:39 |
| lardman | try something like that | 17:40 |
| lardman | just emailed | 17:40 |
| lardman | I've added in a cameraHeight argument from Python, I'm guessing that exists | 17:41 |
| lardman | see if it SWIGifies | 17:41 |
| lardman | also note that you'll need to check the analyse_image() fn (which I just threw in the bottom of batoo.c) | 17:41 |
| lardman | well see if it compiles and runs, etc | 17:41 |
| lardman | just sent the python again as it looks like I didn't save the changes | 17:42 |
| lardman | oops | 17:43 |
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| Woolly | haha | 17:45 |
| Woolly | alright, I'll try swigifying it | 17:45 |
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| lardman | is there a mixer on Fremantle? | 17:50 |
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| Woolly | http://pastie.org/621844 | 17:53 |
| lardman | oh yes | 17:53 |
| Woolly | prototype? | 17:54 |
| lardman | yes, that will solve the first bit | 17:54 |
| lardman | there are also some #defines missing for the voting done in analyse_image to try to reduce false positives | 17:54 |
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| Woolly | winning and max votes should be in batoo.c? | 17:55 |
| lardman | yeah | 17:55 |
| Woolly | as what, 10 or something? | 17:55 |
| lardman | as I stuck the other code in there too | 17:56 |
| lardman | yeah, I just sent you an email with the values I was using | 17:56 |
| Woolly | ah cool ta | 17:56 |
| Woolly | those two functions need to go in here too i take it? | 17:56 |
| lardman | yes, or you can write your own | 17:57 |
| lardman | as the data comes back from analyse_row as an array with each element containing the value at that pos in the barcode | 17:57 |
| lardman | e.g. {9,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,0} | 17:57 |
| Woolly | cool | 17:58 |
| lardman | so I wanted a way to quickly compare the returned data, and turn that into a string | 17:58 |
| Woolly | cool | 17:59 |
| Woolly | what is scanning status? | 17:59 |
| lardman | ah, gstreamer is threaded | 17:59 |
| lardman | and the scanner takes longer than the frame update freq | 18:00 |
| lardman | so I needed a way of stopping the code from being called repeatedly while it was still processing | 18:00 |
| Woolly | alright | 18:00 |
| Woolly | should that be defined somewhere? | 18:00 |
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| lardman | Woolly: depends on your use case | 18:02 |
| lardman | probably do that stuff in the python code | 18:02 |
| Woolly | cool | 18:03 |
| Woolly | and just do the fetchin' with batoo? | 18:03 |
| lardman | so only call the batoo.analyse_image() if you're not already scanning, etc | 18:03 |
| Woolly | yar | 18:03 |
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| lardman | well just hand off the whole frame and let it go through the lines and decide if there's somerthing there | 18:03 |
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| lcuk | lardman, would the barcode stuff require massive changes to handle recognising multiple codes per frame | 18:05 |
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| lcuk | ie, if i took a picture of all shopping (or a video..) could it be processed to list all identified codes | 18:05 |
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| Woolly | lardman: swigified successfully, I think | 18:09 |
| Woolly | right, then you just pass the yBuffer in | 18:09 |
| Woolly | let's see if it works :D | 18:09 |
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| Woolly | cheeeese :( TypeError: analyse_image() takes exactly 3 arguments (2 given) | 18:13 |
| Woolly | according to the c code however, analyse_image takes 4 arguments | 18:15 |
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| Woolly | lardman: wb | 18:23 |
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| lardman | ~lart TalkTalk | 18:24 |
| * infobot puts TalkTalk into a headlock and administers a mighty noogie, rubbing half of TalkTalk's hair of | 18:24 | |
| Woolly | haha | 18:24 |
| Woolly | i've modified it to result = batoo.analyse_image(yBuffer, self.cameraWidth, self.cameraHeight) | 18:24 |
| Woolly | which appears to work | 18:24 |
| Woolly | however, I get a GC Object already tracked | 18:24 |
| Woolly | and it fatals | 18:25 |
| lardman | I've no idea what that even means :) | 18:25 |
| Woolly | it seems to be working now | 18:26 |
| fureddo | andre__: Hi, if you're there, let me know please. I would like to ask you a question concerning the comment you wrote a few minutes ago. | 18:26 |
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| Woolly | sort of | 18:27 |
| Woolly | it gives me all the barcodes that it finds, is that right? | 18:27 |
| MaceN8x0 | hm | 18:27 |
| MaceN8x0 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_netbooks | 18:27 |
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| fureddo | I will ask my question anyway, maybe someone will know... | 18:28 |
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| fureddo | On Fremantle, my application depends on a package which its status is "testing". | 18:28 |
| lardman | Woolly: should give you one barcode per image | 18:28 |
| lardman | whichever one it finds more of | 18:28 |
| andre__ | fureddo, pong? | 18:28 |
| Woolly | cool | 18:28 |
| coldboot | Any progress on processing the qt-maemo him-proxy merge request? | 18:28 |
| MaceN8x0 | NPX-9000 | 18:28 |
| MaceN8x0 | ? | 18:28 |
| fureddo | andre__: It's about the tomotko application. | 18:28 |
| MaceN8x0 | wtf is that? | 18:28 |
| Woolly | lardman: I'll have another footer :D | 18:29 |
| MaceN8x0 | and wtd is a geode? | 18:29 |
| MaceN8x0 | a geode cpu? | 18:29 |
| lardman | footer as in a second barcode? | 18:29 |
| fureddo | The package libqt4-core is in testing for Fremantle but is not in the QA queue... | 18:29 |
| Woolly | lardman: haha nah, footer as in a play about :D | 18:30 |
| fureddo | So I wonder... | 18:30 |
| lardman | ah ok | 18:30 |
| lardman | sorry not really with it today :) | 18:30 |
| andre__ | fureddo, it's not your fault. it was just a comment for other potential testers | 18:30 |
| andre__ | nokia to blame... | 18:30 |
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| fureddo | Ah ok... So eventually, libqt4-core will be available. | 18:31 |
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| andre__ | definitely | 18:31 |
| MaceN8x0 | oh | 18:31 |
| MaceN8x0 | a geode is an amd atom wannabe | 18:31 |
| fureddo | I thought that if it was not in the QA queue that it was lost somewhere. | 18:31 |
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| MaceN8x0 | blah. x86 crap | 18:31 |
| fureddo | And that it could take long time for libqt4-core to be available in extra. | 18:32 |
| lcuk | ~lart o2 "im sorry sir, your phone is coming up as unknown handset i do not know how to get 3d working on your sim" | 18:32 |
| * infobot gets a hotmal account and SPAMs o2 "im sorry sir, your phone is coming up as unknown handset i do not know how to get 3d working on your sim" | 18:32 | |
| fureddo | andre__, Thanks for your explanations. | 18:32 |
| andre__ | np | 18:32 |
| fureddo | andre__, Do you have a device running diablo? | 18:33 |
| andre__ | yes | 18:33 |
| Woolly | lardman: unfortunately, the return value of analyse_image always seems to be [0, ''], even when a barcode is detected | 18:33 |
| andre__ | fureddo, err... "yes, also" to be correct | 18:33 |
| Woolly | I'll have another play about with it though :) | 18:33 |
| fureddo | andre__, Because some people reported to me that the application works properly on diablo. | 18:34 |
| lardman | how do you know one has been detected? printf from the C code? | 18:34 |
| Woolly | yeah it's printing out | 18:34 |
| andre__ | fureddo, i don't talk about "app working properly". i talked about deps. | 18:34 |
| lardman | ok, not sure, but let me know when you find out as I'll have the same issue once I track down my segfault | 18:35 |
| Woolly | cool beans :) | 18:35 |
| fureddo | andre__, Ok. | 18:35 |
| andre__ | not your fault | 18:35 |
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| fureddo | Time to sleep here. Good night! | 18:37 |
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| lcuk | o_O lardman fixed data browsing on regular sim | 18:56 |
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| lardman | lcuk: question or statement? | 19:01 |
| lcuk | statement | 19:02 |
| lcuk | o2 didnt know what to do | 19:02 |
| lcuk | i found | 19:02 |
| lcuk | how to | 19:02 |
| lardman | ah I see | 19:02 |
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| Woolly | lardman: I'm really not getting anywhere with this at all, total pain :( | 19:05 |
| Woolly | lardman: if only zbar was decent enough to use | 19:05 |
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| lardman | Woolly: you might have more luck with zbar 0.9, supposed to be less false hits | 19:06 |
| lardman | s/be/have | 19:06 |
| lardman | s/less/fewer | 19:06 |
| lardman | why do I bother? | 19:07 |
| lardman | :) | 19:07 |
| Woolly | haha | 19:07 |
| Woolly | i don't know :P | 19:07 |
| Woolly | : | 19:07 |
| Woolly | :D | 19:07 |
| lardman | well the deb is on my site, so you#'re welcome to try | 19:08 |
| lardman | what is the problem with batoo atm out of interest? | 19:08 |
| lardman | http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/nokia770/temp/ | 19:08 |
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| lcuk | lard_bar english word detection system is currently managing 75% correct syntax and grammar parsing of your postings lardman | 19:14 |
| lcuk | in v 0.9 it is expected to rise to at least 80% | 19:14 |
| luke-jr | so is KOffice shipped on N900 or just an add-on? | 19:14 |
| GeneralAntilles | lol . . . | 19:15 |
| Corsac | luke-jr: addon for the start | 19:15 |
| lardman | it's because I was just oop North, my English should become more Queenly soon enough | 19:15 |
| lcuk | yes, you are a queen | 19:15 |
| lcuk | im surprised they let you out of blackpool | 19:15 |
| jaska | lol | 19:15 |
| lardman | hmm, should have seen that one coming | 19:15 |
| lcuk | theres a roaring trade up there for transvestites with mustaches and b&w artsy photos on the frontpage of websites | 19:16 |
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| qwerty12 | a.k.a lcuk's reason for staying up north | 19:16 |
| lardman | speaking from experience? | 19:16 |
| lcuk | of course, they wouldnt let me go | 19:16 |
| lardman | wondered what he was doing for a job these days ;) | 19:16 |
| lcuk | i arrived one day and made the mistake of going out in public wearing a dress | 19:17 |
| Woolly | lardman: I cant figure out how to get the return value to work correctly, in result = batoo.analyse_image() | 19:17 |
| qwerty12 | "Hi, I'm Gary. Call me the Northern Gigolo." | 19:17 |
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| lardman | Woolly: ok, let me debug my code and I'll ping you once I've got it worked out | 19:18 |
| Woolly | alrighty, cool, thanks :) | 19:18 |
| Woolly | lardman: in the mean time, I'll try get zbar .9 working, see how that fares | 19:18 |
| lardman | good plan | 19:19 |
| lcuk | and ill get the beers in | 19:19 |
| lcuk | for everyone except for qwerty | 19:19 |
| Mousey | yay beer! | 19:20 |
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| lardman | mmmm beer | 19:20 |
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| coldboot | I just got a demo n900. | 19:29 |
| luke-jr | why | 19:29 |
| coldboot | Because we're writing software for them. | 19:30 |
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| frals | what kind of software do you do? :) | 19:30 |
| frals | also - is it as good as it seems? ;) | 19:30 |
| coldboot | Educational assessment. | 19:30 |
| coldboot | It's pretty good. | 19:30 |
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| MaceN8x0 | a "demo" ? | 19:32 |
| MaceN8x0 | what does that mean exactly? | 19:32 |
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| johnsq | Hi | 19:33 |
| coldboot | Yeah, it's really good. | 19:34 |
| coldboot | I guess it's a production copy. | 19:34 |
| coldboot | But it's not being sold yet. | 19:34 |
| coldboot | I suppose I can't say too much about it. | 19:34 |
| Woolly | ok, I've started Xephyr on my macbook, but I cant remember what to set display to in scratchbox to make it send the fake desktop to my xephyr window | 19:34 |
| ShadowJK | coldboot, can you keep it or do you have to give it back? | 19:34 |
| Woolly | is it IP:2 | 19:34 |
| coldboot | ShadowJK: Not sure. I don't personally get to keep it, but we probably get to keep it at our office and not give it back to Nokia. | 19:35 |
| ShadowJK | Woolly, sounds right | 19:35 |
| Woolly | hmm | 19:35 |
| johnsq | Woolly: export DISPLAY=localhost:1 or such | 19:35 |
| coldboot | So I thought the n810 was total crap, and I like the n900 quite a bit. | 19:35 |
| Woolly | inside scratchbox? | 19:35 |
| johnsq | Woolly: yes, some commands have -display localhost:1 | 19:36 |
| Woolly | i want to do this af-pb stuff | 19:36 |
| Woolly | bingo | 19:37 |
| Woolly | stupid me was putting in the wrong IP address | 19:37 |
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| coldboot | Wow I might actually buy this thing if it wasn't really expensive. | 19:40 |
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| johnsq | coldboot: thats the problem, have you seen viliv s5? | 19:42 |
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| coldboot | johnsq: Can you give me a link? | 19:42 |
| johnsq | coldboot: http://www.engadget.com/2009/04/24/viliv-s5-reviewed-is-mostly-smiles-with-good-video-playback/ same problem its expensive | 19:43 |
| coldboot | johnsq: What OS? | 19:43 |
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| johnsq | coldboot: any, its x86 based, bundled with XP | 19:44 |
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| coldboot | johnsq: Yeah but nobody's bothered to put Linux on it and make a good interface, so it effectively is stuck with XP. | 19:48 |
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| johnsq | coldboot: XP isn't any better than linux in this point. you can but mer on it. | 19:50 |
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| coldboot | heh, I'm saying XP is worse than Linux. | 19:51 |
| coldboot | But for any operating system on any embedded device, after getting the OS to boot on the thing, there's still lots of work to be done to make the device seamlessly work. | 19:52 |
| coldboot | Like, mapping button behaviour, accounting for screen size. | 19:52 |
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| coldboot | So if Intel hasn't done all that work for Linux on their device, you can't practically use Linux on it without smoothing out all those rough edges yourself. | 19:52 |
| MaceN8x0 | coldboot, no qwerty? | 19:53 |
| MaceN8x0 | win7 is actually pretty good and i've heard battery life compared to xp has improved | 19:54 |
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| MaceN8x0 | but i wouldn't get something without a qwerty | 19:54 |
| johnsq | coldboot: yes that the problem, the interface and application should be written for small screen size and touchscreen. | 19:54 |
| woglinde | macer but you need a 20 gig | 19:54 |
| woglinde | partition | 19:54 |
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| woglinde | 4 days for updates from vista | 19:54 |
| woglinde | hahah | 19:54 |
| woglinde | a | 19:54 |
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| MaceN8x0 | haha. not that much ;) | 19:54 |
| MaceN8x0 | how much space does it have? | 19:55 |
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| MaceN8x0 | i hope for $599 it is at least 16G | 19:55 |
| johnsq | MaceN8x0: you mean keyboard? | 19:55 |
| MaceN8x0 | well | 19:55 |
| MaceN8x0 | i mean for carrying the device | 19:55 |
| MaceN8x0 | i hate vkbs | 19:56 |
| johnsq | MaceN8x0: I prefer them without keyboard, there too much alternatives which are better. | 19:56 |
| MaceN8x0 | like an n900? :) | 19:56 |
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| MaceN8x0 | well. virtual keyboards are an absolute pain | 19:57 |
| * Mousey agrees | 19:57 | |
| GeneralAntilles | Depends on the virtual keyboard | 19:57 |
| lardman | hmm, how does one get a segfault when your main() does nothing? | 19:57 |
| MaceN8x0 | no it doesnt | 19:57 |
| Mousey | so far they universally suck | 19:57 |
| johnsq | MaceN8x0: but only if bad solution. | 19:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | They can be adapted to. | 19:57 |
| MaceN8x0 | they all suck ;) | 19:57 |
| coldboot | MaceN8x0: The n810 has a qwerty, of course. | 19:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | MaceN8x0, . . . _for you_ perhaps | 19:57 |
| Mousey | it's all downhill after the n810 | 19:57 |
| GeneralAntilles | I get sustained speeds of over 40 wpm on the finger keyboard on my N800. | 19:58 |
| MaceN8x0 | yeah. ever since i got my g1 i would never get anything that didnt have at least a qwerty | 19:58 |
| MaceN8x0 | GeneralAntilles, haha | 19:58 |
| coldboot | Blackberry keyboard is still the best. | 19:58 |
| Mousey | thinkpad keyboard still the best | 19:58 |
| Mousey | *ahem* | 19:58 |
| MaceN8x0 | yeah but you require extra steps | 19:58 |
| coldboot | Well yes. | 19:58 |
| coldboot | What's the default user password on nokias? | 19:59 |
| MaceN8x0 | last thinkpad i had was in 1999 | 19:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | IBM Model M or bust. | 19:59 |
| MaceN8x0 | when ibm actually made them | 19:59 |
| lardman | Woolly: am getting segfault in my code, when I compile without the SWIG/Python wrapper C code, and with nothing in main() | 19:59 |
| MaceN8x0 | GeneralAntilles, i still have my M | 19:59 |
| GeneralAntilles | Seriously, if it isn't buckling spring it's not worth wasting your time. | 19:59 |
| MaceN8x0 | with its clunk keys | 19:59 |
| Woolly | lardman: ouch :( | 19:59 |
| MaceN8x0 | awesome keyboard | 19:59 |
| lardman | Woolly: will now retire to the TV and beer to consider what is going on | 20:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | MaceN8x0, I upgraded to a new-manufacture model with USB. http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/ | 20:00 |
| lardman | :) | 20:00 |
| Woolly | good plan :D | 20:00 |
| Woolly | lardman: enjoy! | 20:00 |
| coldboot | Does anyone know the default user password for a Nokia n810? | 20:00 |
| MaceN8x0 | they still make them? | 20:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | There is no default password. | 20:00 |
| johnsq | coldboot: did i have one, just become root. | 20:00 |
| MaceN8x0 | wow | 20:00 |
| coldboot | Then how do you use sudo? | 20:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | MaceN8x0, yes, Unicomp picked up the patent from Lexmark and they make them. | 20:00 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, you don't. | 20:00 |
| coldboot | I'm trying to run su, and it says "must be suid" | 20:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not out of the box, anyway. | 20:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | You want sudser or rootsh. | 20:01 |
| MaceN8x0 | haha... those things are beasts | 20:01 |
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| MaceN8x0 | actual mechanical keys | 20:01 |
| johnsq | coldboot: gainroot, install sshd and set one self | 20:01 |
| MaceN8x0 | no cheap rubber lining crap | 20:01 |
| GeneralAntilles | Silicone nipples represent the downfall of our society. | 20:01 |
| coldboot | johnsq: I installed sshd already with app manager, but it hasn't been started. | 20:02 |
| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: Can't find sudser or rootsh from the available catalogues on the n900 | 20:02 |
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| coldboot | What catalogue could I add? | 20:02 |
| johnsq | coldboot: service menu you can enable it, but still you must become root to set a password. | 20:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | GeneralAntilles, hahaha | 20:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | yeah | 20:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | it was the sign of an end to an era | 20:03 |
| VDVsx | coldboot, rootsh is the first app in maemo5 extras | 20:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | no more quarter inch thick steel computer cases | 20:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | :( | 20:03 |
| VDVsx | coldboot, according to planet maemo | 20:03 |
| MaceN8x0 | everything went china cheap | 20:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, rootsh should be getting into Extras soon. | 20:03 |
| GeneralAntilles | If not, it's in Extras-testing. | 20:03 |
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| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: Boob nipples? | 20:04 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, silicone keyboard actions. | 20:04 |
| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: oh, haha | 20:05 |
| coldboot | I have silicone nipples on my Logitech UltraX, and I really like the feedback. | 20:05 |
| coldboot | It's smooth like a laptop. | 20:05 |
| MaceN8x0 | it is ok | 20:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | When was the last time you used buckling spring? | 20:05 |
| GeneralAntilles | Or even Alps? | 20:05 |
| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: You went to that site and ordered an IBM clicky keyboard, didn't you? | 20:05 |
| MaceN8x0 | i like the mechanical clunk | 20:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | I've been using buckling spring or Alps since forever. | 20:06 |
| GeneralAntilles | Silicone nipples bring on hand pains. | 20:06 |
| Woolly | here's a general nubs question: if I download the source of a package, say zbar-0.9, run the configure script, then make, then make install, is there any way to get everything that's been created onto the tablet, or do I need to make a .deb first? | 20:06 |
| lardman | Woolly: just grab the deb from the url I gave you | 20:06 |
| coldboot | GeneralAntilles: rootsh and sudser aren't in maemo-extras or extras-testing for freemantle. | 20:07 |
| Woolly | the deb? | 20:07 |
| Woolly | you gave me one? | 20:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | coldboot, rootsh is. | 20:07 |
| GeneralAntilles | s/freemantle/fremantle/g | 20:07 |
| lardman | yeah, somewhere up above | 20:07 |
| qwerty12 | coldboot: http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/fremantle/free/r/rootsh/ says different. | 20:07 |
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| lardman | http://people.bath.ac.uk/enpsgp/nokia770/temp/ | 20:07 |
| Woolly | ahh got it :D | 20:07 |
| Woolly | missed that one, sorry! | 20:07 |
| qwerty12 | *otherwise | 20:07 |
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| lardman | np | 20:08 |
| lardman | :) | 20:08 |
| MaceN8x0 | burn notice is funny | 20:08 |
| MaceN8x0 | the first one where he is explaining how to ditch a tail by driving like an idiot | 20:08 |
| MaceN8x0 | had me in tears laughing | 20:08 |
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| coldboot | woo I'm in | 20:10 |
| coldboot | Reboot and got ssh working. | 20:10 |
| coldboot | What's the best way to go about making more space on your root on a Nokia tablet? | 20:12 |
| lbt | delete things | 20:12 |
| johnsq | coldboot: rm -rf / | 20:12 |
| coldboot | lbt: That's hard to do. | 20:12 |
| * lbt is helpful | 20:12 | |
| wjt | rip it apart and replace the SD | 20:13 |
| lbt | boot from SD is the most sane | 20:13 |
| lbt | what tablet? N800 ? | 20:13 |
| coldboot | It's the n900 now. | 20:13 |
| coldboot | And it's the same deal as the n810, the OS is on a 230mb partition. | 20:13 |
| * lbt ignores coldboot and sulks | 20:13 | |
| coldboot | haha | 20:13 |
| lbt | have you read the opt thread in maemo-dev ? | 20:14 |
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| coldboot | This thing is pretty good, a serious contender to other overpriced computers with phones. | 20:14 |
| coldboot | lbt: Nope. | 20:14 |
| coldboot | lbt: Throw everything in opt/ | 20:14 |
| lbt | no | 20:14 |
| lbt | but close | 20:14 |
| lbt | mount an SD partition as /opt | 20:14 |
| coldboot | The way I did it on my media pc is just strategically make symlinks. | 20:14 |
| lbt | and 'optiify' packages | 20:14 |
| lbt | using.... | 20:14 |
| MaceN8x0 | ugh | 20:14 |
| lbt | symlinks | 20:15 |
| MaceN8x0 | with this opt | 20:15 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 20:15 |
| coldboot | lbt: Yeah so you just opt things as you go along, right? | 20:15 |
| Stskeeps | coldboot: maemo-optify | 20:15 |
| lbt | packagers are supposed to do it | 20:15 |
| lbt | I think it makes sense to provide a runtime too | 20:15 |
| coldboot | Stskeeps: What does that do? | 20:15 |
| coldboot | Can you put Fremantle on an n810? | 20:18 |
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| lbt | coldboot: Mer is the best attempt at fremantle on n810 | 20:20 |
| rm_you|mobile | coldboot: no | 20:20 |
| coldboot | ah okay, now I know what mer is. | 20:20 |
| lbt | heh | 20:21 |
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| coldboot | Do you guys get laggy connections over wifi when sshing to your devices? | 20:22 |
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| Woolly | coldboot, change the wifi power settings | 20:22 |
| lbt | coldboot: it says so right here: http://wiki.maemo.org/Mer#Goals | 20:22 |
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| coldboot | Woolly: Where? | 20:23 |
| MaceN8x0 | all mer needs is an outstanding qt based gui | 20:23 |
| MaceN8x0 | :) | 20:23 |
| * MaceN8x0 hides | 20:23 | |
| Stskeeps | MaceN8x0: i'm not disagreeing with that | 20:24 |
| coldboot | Posting some screenshots would be nice, for Mer. | 20:24 |
| Woolly | coldboot: connectivity settings > connections > your connection > edit > next * 3 > advanced > other | 20:24 |
| Woolly | Power Saving: Off | 20:24 |
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| johnsq | MaceN8x0: the gui isn't the problem, what you need are applications | 20:24 |
| MaceN8x0 | Stskeeps, can't you just steal the n900 ui? | 20:24 |
| MaceN8x0 | :) | 20:24 |
| Stskeeps | get us 3d drivers and maybe | 20:24 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 20:25 |
| MaceN8x0 | ask ti | 20:25 |
| MaceN8x0 | or nokia =) | 20:25 |
| coldboot | Woolly: It's already set to 100 mW | 20:25 |
| johnsq | coldboot: timeout? | 20:25 |
| MaceN8x0 | they probably might build against your mer kernel and give bins | 20:25 |
| Woolly | coldboot: is power saving turned on? | 20:26 |
| MaceN8x0 | protecting their precious ip | 20:26 |
| MaceN8x0 | johnsq, not really. most of what people use is there | 20:26 |
| MaceN8x0 | xchat, a browser, wifi ui, ssh | 20:26 |
| johnsq | MaceN8x0: i haven't found any usable touchscreen application. | 20:27 |
| MaceN8x0 | xchat :) | 20:27 |
| johnsq | MaceN8x0: useable! irssi | 20:27 |
| coldboot | Woolly: Yeah, that's on, how does intermediate compare to off and on? | 20:27 |
| MaceN8x0 | heh | 20:27 |
| Woolly | not sure about intermediate, but off makes my ssh connection faster :) | 20:27 |
| MaceN8x0 | i thinks apps will follow quickly once mer has a valid ui | 20:28 |
| johnsq | MaceN8x0: picture viewer , music player, browser nothing useable | 20:28 |
| MaceN8x0 | tear seemed ok | 20:28 |
| MaceN8x0 | almost all the maemo4 apps seem pretty usable | 20:28 |
| MaceN8x0 | and like i said, the main ui is probably a lot more important as it will entice devs to create apps for mer | 20:29 |
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| Woolly | lardman: success with zbar | 20:36 |
| Woolly | it's pretty slow though | 20:37 |
| Woolly | doesn't help that the camera is pretty crap quality | 20:38 |
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| lardman | Woolly: false positives down? | 20:43 |
| Woolly | I'm only looking for books | 20:43 |
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| Woolly | so I can just weed out everything that doesn't start with 978 | 20:43 |
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| Woolly | and maybe 976 too, cant remember :D | 20:43 |
| lardman | well with 0.8 I was recognising ean8s wherever I looked, barcodes, my t-shirt, my face | 20:43 |
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| Woolly | haha | 20:43 |
| Woolly | not this time | 20:44 |
| Woolly | it's better | 20:44 |
| lardman | perhaps try reducing your input frame size? | 20:44 |
| lardman | 320 x 240 might be a better bet | 20:44 |
| Woolly | surely that would give lower resolution, and a worse image? | 20:44 |
| lardman | but faster processing | 20:46 |
| coldboot | Woolly: It's still laggy with ssh on my n900 and n810, could be my connection. | 20:46 |
| * SpeedEvil tries to remember the film with barcodes over everything. | 20:47 | |
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| Woolly | hmm | 20:48 |
| coldboot | Nevermind, it's my stupid company's Wifi. | 20:48 |
| Woolly | :( | 20:49 |
| lardman | so, segfault with an empty main(), any thoughts? | 20:50 |
| johnsq | lardman: gdb, wrong binary type, emu bug | 20:50 |
| lardman | gdb does nothing, returns nothing of use | 20:50 |
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| lardman | on-device testing | 20:50 |
| johnsq | lardman: file exe its arm? | 20:51 |
| lardman | all good | 20:51 |
| johnsq | lardman: strace | 20:52 |
| lardman | # strace ./barmix | 20:53 |
| lardman | execve("./barmix", ["./barmix"], [/* 63 vars */]) = 0 | 20:53 |
| lardman | --- SIGSEGV (Segmentation fault) @ 0 (0) --- | 20:53 |
| lardman | +++ killed by SIGSEGV +++ | 20:53 |
| lardman | hmm | 20:53 |
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| johnsq | lardman: wrong linked? start address is 0? | 20:54 |
| lardman | yep, messed up makefile | 20:54 |
| lardman | doh! | 20:54 |
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| lardman | thanks | 20:55 |
| lardman | was driving me mad | 20:55 |
| SpeedEvil | Aha | 20:55 |
| SpeedEvil | http://www.buried.com/moviereviews/virtual-nightmare-2000/1071/ | 20:55 |
| SpeedEvil | (barcodes everywhere) | 20:55 |
| lardman | what type? | 20:55 |
| coldboot | It seems I can't install libqtgui4 in fremantle... | 20:56 |
| lardman | zbar will return an array listing all the barcodes it could find in an image | 20:56 |
| lardman | batoo is much more simplistic | 20:56 |
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| Woolly | lardman: zbar appears to be working alright | 21:01 |
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| lardman | cool | 21:01 |
| Woolly | want the code? | 21:01 |
| lardman | I've got some working zbar stuff, thanks though | 21:02 |
| Woolly | cool | 21:02 |
| lardman | next month I'll look at adding libdmtx support to zbar | 21:02 |
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| Woolly | cool | 21:02 |
| lardman | 0.9 misses out the QR code stuff, but that will come back in too | 21:02 |
| Woolly | cheers for the help earlier | 21:02 |
| Woolly | tea time :D | 21:02 |
| lardman | np, keep us informed about your code/project :) | 21:02 |
| Woolly | will do | 21:03 |
| javispedro | helloo, conspirators :) | 21:03 |
| Woolly | cheerio guys | 21:03 |
| Woolly | javispedro: hi/bye | 21:03 |
| lardman | cu Woolly | 21:03 |
| javispedro | cy Wolly :) | 21:03 |
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| lardman | hi javispedro | 21:03 |
| coldboot | Where do I get libqtgui4 on Fremantle? | 21:03 |
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| javispedro | yay weekend. this week's been a long one for me. | 21:03 |
| * javispedro opens sbox | 21:03 | |
| * Myrtti opens pizzabox | 21:04 | |
| * johnsq starts xbox | 21:04 | |
| * jeremiah looks in the icebox | 21:04 | |
| * javispedro kicks you all into a box | 21:05 | |
| * qwerty12_N810 smokes the chronicbox | 21:05 | |
| * bilboed calls the removal guys to get rid of the boxes | 21:05 | |
| lardman | and relax, the C code is now apparently working | 21:06 |
| lardman | supper time for me too, bbiab | 21:07 |
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| AndrewFBlack | do oither people have trouble staying loginin extras assistant or is it just me at work? | 21:10 |
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| coldboot | Where can I get libqtgui4 for Fremantle? | 21:18 |
| coldboot | The apt-cache policy for libqtgui4 in diablo is this: 'http://repository.maemo.org diablo/free Packages' | 21:18 |
| coldboot | This maemo page falsely reports libqtgui4 here: http://maemo.org/packages/view/libqtgui4/ | 21:19 |
| coldboot | It doesn't even mention a version for diablo. | 21:19 |
| coldboot | Does the packages list site even wrok? | 21:19 |
| RST38h | Umgh? | 21:20 |
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| javispedro | coldboot: the packages list does not show diablo packages | 21:21 |
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| javispedro | at all. | 21:21 |
| javispedro | (that would be a nice feature request, actually ;) ) | 21:21 |
| coldboot | It would also be nice if it told you literally what to put in your sources.list to get the package. | 21:22 |
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| javispedro | there are only three reposç | 21:22 |
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| javispedro | just add them all and ... profit :) | 21:23 |
| coldboot | javispedro: What would I put in my sources.list to get libqtgui4 for fremantle? | 21:23 |
| coldboot | I've put in several fremantle repository lines, and it still won't find it. | 21:23 |
| javispedro | extras-devel, according to packages.org .P | 21:23 |
| javispedro | http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras-devel_free_armel/libqtgui4/4.5.0-0maemo1/ | 21:24 |
| coldboot | deb http://repository.maemo.org/extras-devel/ fremantle free non-free ? | 21:24 |
| javispedro | there you have direct http link to the .dev file | 21:24 |
| javispedro | s/.dev/.deb/ | 21:24 |
| infobot | javispedro meant: there you have direct http link to the .deb file | 21:24 |
| javispedro | coldboot: yes, iirc. | 21:24 |
| coldboot | Package has been removed... | 21:24 |
| coldboot | And there's no reason. | 21:25 |
| coldboot | Great. | 21:25 |
| javispedro | lol 404 | 21:25 |
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| coldboot | Status: | 21:25 |
| coldboot | Package has been removed | 21:25 |
| javispedro | pft. dunno then. | 21:25 |
| G1zmog0 | Hi, I'm having trouble getting os2008 onto my n800, the error I'm getting (ubuntu)is "Suitable USB device not found, waiting | 21:25 |
| G1zmog0 | ", I also tried using nokia update wizard (Windows vista 64bit) it never detects my n800 either... any help is appreciated | 21:25 |
| coldboot | javispedro: Do you think I could just install the diablo version? | 21:25 |
| javispedro | coldboot: not really. there have been a shitload of changes in h-i-m afaik, but I think you'll know that better than me :P | 21:26 |
| coldboot | javispedro: I actually don't, but I can imagine. | 21:26 |
| coldboot | javispedro: HIM was pretty hacky and crappy in diablo. | 21:26 |
| coldboot | And using the n900 it seems a lot better at response. | 21:26 |
| javispedro | coldboot: one moment, i found something | 21:27 |
| javispedro | deb http://qt4.garage.maemo.org/ fremantle extras | 21:27 |
| javispedro | ? | 21:27 |
| javispedro | http://qt4.garage.maemo.org/fremantle.html | 21:27 |
| javispedro | pfft. | 21:27 |
| javispedro | "These instructions are readable only in the Nokia LAN" (Intranet I'd say) | 21:28 |
| coldboot | There should be a search page, where you can search for a package, and it tells you exactly what to put in your sources.list. And if that package has been removed, it should say when, why and what the line used to be for sources.list. | 21:29 |
| coldboot | It's really annoying trying to find packages on Maemo. | 21:29 |
| javispedro | coldboot: it does, when it works | 21:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | G1zmog0, holding down the Home key while starting up? | 21:29 |
| javispedro | it does *that. | 21:29 |
| GeneralAntilles | ~flashing | 21:29 |
| infobot | hmm... flashing is http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_tablet_firmware | 21:29 |
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| coldboot | W: Failed to fetch http://qt4.garage.maemo.org/dists/fremantle/extras/binary-armel/Packages 404 Not Found | 21:30 |
| G1zmog0 | GeneralAntilles: Yes | 21:30 |
| G1zmog0 | GeneralAntilles: the usb icon is displayed in the upper right image and the power is diconnected | 21:30 |
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| javispedro | coldboot: according to nearly every source, it should be on extras-devel (http://qt4.garage.maemo.org/packages.html), but it is not there. ... :P | 21:31 |
| G1zmog0 | Im using ubuntu 8, "try it out first function" as a boot cd, since i do not have linux fully installed on any of my systems | 21:31 |
| G1zmog0 | is that an issue? | 21:31 |
| coldboot | javispedro: Lovely. | 21:31 |
| coldboot | fucked again | 21:32 |
| coldboot | Who looks after these repositories? | 21:32 |
| G1zmog0 | Everything went according to the instructions i read on maemo.org cept for the update after waiting message... | 21:32 |
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| coldboot | javispedro: Who do I talk to to get it fixed? | 21:35 |
| javispedro | coldboot: dunno, maintainer field is empty in packages interface... | 21:36 |
| javispedro | X-Fade: ping? | 21:37 |
| jeremiah | coldboot: Well, there are a bunch of people who look after the repos | 21:37 |
| jeremiah | What do you need help with? | 21:37 |
| javispedro | http://maemo.org/packages/view/libqtgui4/ but is not physically in repo. | 21:38 |
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| jeremiah | javispedro: I'll check | 21:38 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: libqtgui4 is missing from fremantle. | 21:38 |
| G1zmog0 | Can anyone point me to better documentation for trouble shooting flashing os2008 to the n800? | 21:39 |
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| jeremiah | coldboot: You looking for libqtgui in fremantle _extras_? | 21:39 |
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| coldboot | jeremiah: Here's all the repositories I've tried to find it on: http://pastie.org/622088 | 21:40 |
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| jeremiah | coldboot: Cool, thanks. | 21:41 |
| jeremiah | I can tell you right now it is not in extras fremantle | 21:41 |
| coldboot | Yeah I gathered that. | 21:41 |
| coldboot | How would you figure out where it is? | 21:41 |
| jeremiah | coldboot: I am doing ls on garage. | 21:42 |
| javispedro | wait. | 21:42 |
| javispedro | I think they changed names. | 21:42 |
| jeremiah | coldboot: Where did you get this list of repos? | 21:42 |
| jeremiah | Looks a little weird | 21:42 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: Just by searching for libqtgui4, and copying the format from some diablo repos. | 21:42 |
| jeremiah | ah | 21:42 |
| jeremiah | aha | 21:42 |
| javispedro | coldboot, jeremiah, yes, it seems it has a new name now: | 21:43 |
| jeremiah | Well, here's the deal | 21:43 |
| javispedro | http://maemo.org/packages/view/libqt4-gui/ | 21:43 |
| jeremiah | There is almost nothing in fremantle extras right now | 21:43 |
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| jeremiah | and libqt4 I think is free now | 21:43 |
| coldboot | So it's gone from libqtgui4 to libqt4-gui | 21:44 |
| jeremiah | So, I think we'll find it in free, not non-free | 21:44 |
| jeremiah | But I will physically check the machine to see where it lives | 21:44 |
| jeremiah | And make sure that the external info is correct | 21:44 |
| javispedro | jeremiah: don't worry, I think the old package was deprecated and its skeleton left in the packages interface | 21:45 |
| javispedro | it seems the new one in free is libqt4-gui | 21:45 |
| jeremiah | Cool, let me just make sure . . . | 21:45 |
| coldboot | libqt4-gui: Depends: libqt4-core (= 4.5.2-git20090622-0maemo1) but 4.5.3~git20090723-0maemo2+0m5 is to be installed | 21:46 |
| Firebird | hey, javispedro can you try the latest version of slysics for me? Everyones apparently getting seg faults except me :o | 21:46 |
| javispedro | Firebird: k | 21:46 |
| Firebird | thanks | 21:47 |
| coldboot | Can I get version 4.5.3~git20090723-0maemo2+0m5 of libqt4-gui? Currently it's 4.5.2 with that sources.list. | 21:47 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: ^ | 21:48 |
| javispedro | coldboot: i installed qt4-gui in fremantle sdk, | 21:48 |
| javispedro | so maybe it's time to remove a few repos now :) | 21:48 |
| coldboot | 4.5.3 version of core is coming from https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com ./ Packages | 21:48 |
| jeremiah | That sounds right. | 21:49 |
| javispedro | ah, device... | 21:49 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: Yes but libqt4-gui is 4.5.2.. | 21:49 |
| coldboot | I need libqt4-core to be a lower version. | 21:49 |
| johnsq | the fun of package managements | 21:50 |
| jeremiah | coldboot: You can't use a _later_ version? | 21:50 |
| javispedro | johnsq: the fun of nokia releasing half the packages | 21:50 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: libqt4-gui says it needs =4.5.2, not >= | 21:50 |
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| jeremiah | What are you guys trying to do? | 21:50 |
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| coldboot | Trying to install Qt on the n900 | 21:51 |
| coldboot | Which has fremantle. | 21:51 |
| jeremiah | Ah, okay | 21:51 |
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| coldboot | So I can install our application that uses qt... | 21:51 |
| jeremiah | coldboot: Those packages are not on garage. | 21:51 |
| coldboot | See this transcript: http://pastie.org/622104 | 21:51 |
| jeremiah | I have no control over Nokia repos, just garage. | 21:51 |
| coldboot | Reload, I changed the highlighting. | 21:52 |
| javispedro | Firebird: crashes | 21:52 |
| javispedro | Firebird: have debug package? | 21:52 |
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| jeremiah | coldboot: Looks like Nokia has shipped some broken packages. :( | 21:53 |
| coldboot | Wonderful. | 21:53 |
| jeremiah | You can download libqt-core yourself and compile. | 21:53 |
| coldboot | This should fix it: `apt-get install libqt4-core=4.5.2-git20090622-0maemo1` | 21:53 |
| jeremiah | That is not a version number | 21:54 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: Yeah it is. | 21:54 |
| coldboot | It worked. | 21:54 |
| jeremiah | Version numbers should not have '=' | 21:55 |
| coldboot | jeremiah: That's how you tell debian to install that particular version number.... | 21:55 |
| coldboot | apt-get install package=version | 21:55 |
| jeremiah | Yeah, taht is a shortcut to pinning. | 21:55 |
| jeremiah | But why didn't it bring it in in the beginnging? | 21:56 |
| Firebird | nope javispedro , gonna go stick printf stuff after each file load | 21:56 |
| jeremiah | You may have conflicting repos | 21:56 |
| javispedro | Firebird: making -dbg packages is good practice in armel :D. Either way i'm going to build it myself and try to get a backtrace | 21:56 |
| jeremiah | hmm, you already had Installed: 4.5.3~git20090723-0maemo2+0m5 | 21:56 |
| Firebird | alright, thanks javispedro | 21:57 |
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| jeremiah | coldboot: You are asking for trouble if you mix those repos: | 21:58 |
| jeremiah | *** 4.5.3~git20090723-0maemo2+0m5 0 | 21:58 |
| jeremiah | 500 https://downloads.maemo.nokia.com ./ Packages | 21:58 |
| jeremiah | 4.5.2-git20090622-0maemo1 0 | 21:58 |
| jeremiah | 500 http://repository.maemo.org fremantle/free Packages | 21:58 |
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| coldboot | jeremiah: Because the downloads.nokia one is a higher version, so it grabbed that automatically. | 22:00 |
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| CShadowRun | does maemo have an emulator? | 22:00 |
| coldboot | CShadowRun: Scratchbox is the best we have. | 22:01 |
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| CShadowRun | aww :( | 22:01 |
| CShadowRun | could you not run it in virtualbox or something | 22:02 |
| johnsq | CShadowRun: its qemu what do you want more? | 22:02 |
| CShadowRun | oh thats cool too | 22:02 |
| CShadowRun | i thought scratchbox was just something for compiling | 22:03 |
| coldboot | What's that debian program that tells you if one version number is greater than another? | 22:03 |
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| CShadowRun | any instructions on how to get it running in qemu? | 22:03 |
| javispedro | CShadowRun: if you want to see the n900 gui, you are going to be disappointed. | 22:03 |
| javispedro | (generic warning :P ) | 22:03 |
| CShadowRun | but i don't like being dissapointed :( | 22:04 |
| CShadowRun | why will i be disappointed? | 22:04 |
| javispedro | because if you don't have a n900 you can't download the final ui version | 22:04 |
| javispedro | so you're left with the sdk gui. which is good already, but there are no apps. at all. | 22:04 |
| javispedro | builtin apps I mean. | 22:04 |
| SpeedEvil | qemu would be - probably - about 5-10% of the speed of the real device - if there was a worthwhile target | 22:04 |
| CShadowRun | :o | 22:04 |
| CShadowRun | why can you not download the final ui version? | 22:05 |
| SpeedEvil | I mean a target that supported the CPU and GPU and stuff | 22:05 |
| jeremiah | coldboot: dpkg --compare-versions | 22:06 |
| CShadowRun | so theres no real way to try before you buy in short | 22:06 |
| CShadowRun | (shops seem to think your hacking the phone if you do anything more than stare at it from the opposite side of the shop) | 22:07 |
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| johnsq | CShadowRun: where do you live? in europa you can order try and give back. | 22:08 |
| CShadowRun | yea, i'm in england | 22:08 |
| CShadowRun | so i can buy it and try it out for a week if i don't like it i get my money back? | 22:08 |
| johnsq | CShadowRun: why you order online, it should be so. look at amazon agb. | 22:09 |
| johnsq | why=when | 22:09 |
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| CShadowRun | agb? | 22:10 |
| SpeedEvil | I assume that's meant to be amazon gb | 22:10 |
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| johnsq | CShadowRun: allgemeine geschäfts bedingungen (sorry german :) | 22:10 |
| CShadowRun | o.O | 22:10 |
| SpeedEvil | CShadowRun: http://www.mobilephonesdirect.co.uk/Brands/Nokia/Nseries-Multimedia-Phones/sb489/n443/p26078.aspx?lpsrc=google&lpcat=NokiaN900l&lpgrp=N900Nokia&lptxt=N900v1&lpkey=n900%20nokia&gclid=CI7E8PeK-pwCFV8B4wodgyBMbg | 22:11 |
| johnsq | CShadowRun: the small print. | 22:11 |
| SpeedEvil | CShadowRun: down as low as 396 with the | 22:11 |
| SpeedEvil | CShadowRun: a PAYG SIM - or some not too unreasonable contract prices | 22:11 |
| CShadowRun | SpeedEvil, yea, that's alot better than £500 :D | 22:12 |
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| javispedro | CShadowRun: if what you're doing is considering hacking, then you may be more than happy with the sdk, which le | 22:13 |
| javispedro | ts you try cmd line functionality and all that. | 22:13 |
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| CShadowRun | ah | 22:13 |
| SpeedEvil | CShadowRun: the contract prices seem to be OK - as in comparable bargains to other phones | 22:13 |
| CShadowRun | yea | 22:14 |
| CShadowRun | i was actually pondering if i could install ubuntu on it, that'd be fun | 22:14 |
| CShadowRun | while keeping all the dialing capability and stuff | 22:14 |
| CShadowRun | either that or just installing lots of fun stuff on the default os, since i hear it can take ARM debs anyway | 22:14 |
| * RST38h ehlos javispedro | 22:14 | |
| RST38h | javis: Can I offer a trade? =) | 22:15 |
| javispedro | 250 Hello RST38h, glad to meet you | 22:15 |
| javispedro | :P | 22:15 |
| javispedro | RST38h: what you have in mind? | 22:15 |
| RST38h | javis: I write you an assembly function that does 400x240 ==> 800x480 copy and you add it to OpenTTD? =) | 22:16 |
| CShadowRun | hehe i'm not that familiar with the mobile plans, does the insurance cover theft? | 22:17 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, what for? | 22:17 |
| ShadowJK | I mean.. why | 22:17 |
| RST38h | does it cover "theft" of mobile "services" by the insured? | 22:17 |
| johnsq | RST38h: why not use 800x480 direct? | 22:17 |
| ShadowJK | yeah | 22:17 |
| RST38h | johnsq,ShadowJK: google for "n900 screen size" | 22:17 |
| RST38h | then weep. | 22:17 |
| javispedro | johnsq: maemo layout guide says 32px in n900 is "3.1mm" | 22:17 |
| ShadowJK | It's fine | 22:17 |
| CShadowRun | RST38h, i mean theft of the handset :P | 22:18 |
| ShadowJK | RST38h, if they double PPI again I'll stop seeing the pixels | 22:18 |
| javispedro | which means the news bar (where the news ticket scroll!!) is less than 1mm tall. | 22:18 |
| ShadowJK | need sharper stylus :) | 22:18 |
| * javispedro envisions playing openttd with a magnifier | 22:18 | |
| SpeedEvil | CShadowRun: The insurance will generally be totally variable depending on provider. | 22:19 |
| CShadowRun | i see | 22:19 |
| RST38h | javis: a little assembly x2 magnifier, delivered to you in an .s file ? =) | 22:19 |
| SpeedEvil | But theft is almost always covered - though may have some exclusion clauses | 22:19 |
| javispedro | RST38h: ok, will see what can I do. but then I can use it for drnoksnes? :D | 22:19 |
| javispedro | either way | 22:19 |
| RST38h | javis: yeah, I do not mind at all | 22:19 |
| javispedro | fun stuff will happen to the toolbar | 22:19 |
| CShadowRun | yea, i'm just thinking if i lock myself into a 2 year contract, and after the first month someone pulls a knife and steals it, i'm stuffed for the next 15 months lol | 22:19 |
| * javispedro will need to check out that code used by the DS port to halve it | 22:20 | |
| CShadowRun | (welcome to london \o/) | 22:20 |
| RST38h | javis: will have to try making it vertical, in two columns... | 22:20 |
| javispedro | 400x240 sounds a bit on the lower side | 22:20 |
| RST38h | it is, but then OpenTTD works on S60 phones | 22:20 |
| javispedro | my plan was to wait for 0.8.0 and reflowable dialogs | 22:21 |
| javispedro | but then i don't know when is it going out and if does what I think it does ;) | 22:21 |
| ShadowJK | as long as any screenshrinking can be turned off and on :) | 22:21 |
| RST38h | javis: I see no other easy way to deal with the smaller screen size | 22:21 |
| RST38h | javis: Except for adding keyboard controls maybe | 22:21 |
| javispedro | pft. | 22:21 |
| RST38h | What? Kbd controls will work | 22:22 |
| ShadowJK | I remember playing openttd on my P3-733MHz.. it was a bit underpowered for serious games :) | 22:22 |
| javispedro | RST38h: how? | 22:22 |
| javispedro | ah | 22:23 |
| javispedro | because you consider the problem to be toolbar icons | 22:23 |
| javispedro | na, but then the dialogs are still smallish | 22:23 |
| RST38h | javis: Well with the small touchscreen your main problem is touching the tiny spots | 22:23 |
| RST38h | javis: If you have got a cursor you can move with arrow buttons, that is no longer the problem | 22:23 |
| javispedro | ~curse small screen | 22:23 |
| infobot | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, small screen ! | 22:23 |
| RST38h | javis: you will still have to squint, but at least you wont need lcuk's finger surgery | 22:23 |
| javispedro | RST38h: there's code for even enlarging the font size in openttd | 22:23 |
| javispedro | but then I need reflowable dialogs... | 22:24 |
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| javispedro | s/dialogs/widgets. | 22:24 |
| RST38h | javis: yes but what do you do with the playfield? | 22:24 |
| javispedro | :P | 22:24 |
| javispedro | good question... | 22:25 |
| javispedro | other than 2x scaling... | 22:25 |
| RST38h | Yep | 22:25 |
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| RST38h | or kbd controls. | 22:25 |
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| RST38h | each approach is fucked up in its own original way | 22:25 |
| javispedro | were to choose between those two horrors, I'd choose 2x . | 22:25 |
| RST38h | javis: I agree more or less | 22:26 |
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| * javispedro will open a thread in openttd forums for brainstorming.. | 22:28 | |
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| * GAN800 just plunged a Corona bottlecap out of his bathtub drain. | 22:29 | |
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| RST38h | javis: Maybe magnify playfield x2 and use kbd shortcuts for menus? | 22:32 |
| RST38h | javis: Better yet: implement menus with plain vanilla GtkMenu | 22:32 |
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| javispedro | brb | 22:36 |
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| andre__ | Dear Lazyweb, as I want to split up "Home applets" in Bugzilla: Anybody having better proposals than "Desktop widgets" and "Statusbar applets"? | 22:40 |
| andre__ | refering to the wording actually, not the idea :-P | 22:40 |
| GAN800 | No | 22:40 |
| andre__ | okay. do you agree with the idea? :-) | 22:41 |
| GAN800 | "Big widgets" and "Up-top widgets" | 22:41 |
| andre__ | hehe | 22:41 |
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| lardman | hmm, autofocus | 22:42 |
| lardman | or rather, how to change the focus | 22:42 |
| lardman | any thoughts people? | 22:42 |
| ShadowJK | Oh yeah, can the N900 camera autofocus while recording video? :P | 22:42 |
| * RST38h doubts it | 22:42 | |
| lardman | dunno | 22:42 |
| ShadowJK | It doesn't on my E75, and it's annoying | 22:43 |
| ShadowJK | can't do near shots | 22:43 |
| andre__ | i'd only answer your question if you answer mine (but i have no clue anyway) :-P | 22:43 |
| CShadowRun | SpeedEvil, that's intresting, the Combi 25 + Web'n'Walk works out at £528.40 (£29.36 * 18), The n900 is £500, so that means £28.40 for 300 minutes/texts per month, unlimited data, and insurance for 18 months | 22:43 |
| lardman | go on, what do you want to know andre__? | 22:43 |
| CShadowRun | not a bad deal o.O | 22:43 |
| * RST38h thinks Nokia devices need "I am NOT a camera" disclaimer | 22:43 | |
| andre__ | lardman, haha, okay :) | 22:43 |
| andre__ | as I want to split up "Home applets" in Bugzilla: Anybody having better proposals than "Desktop widgets" and "Statusbar applets"? | 22:43 |
| andre__ | (the wording, not the idea itself) | 22:44 |
| lardman | nope, sounds good to me | 22:44 |
| ShadowJK | sounds good... | 22:44 |
| andre__ | thanks | 22:44 |
| lardman | anyway, onto focusing ;) | 22:44 |
| ShadowJK | lardman, what are you working on? | 22:44 |
| andre__ | (feels a bit better to not to the decisions on my own with my drunken mind) :-P | 22:44 |
| lardman | just thinking about things.... | 22:44 |
| lardman | doing barcode stuff actually | 22:44 |
| ShadowJK | is this a UI question or a "How the hell do I convince gstreamer to tell v4l to tell the camera to focus"-type question | 22:45 |
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| lardman | the latter | 22:45 |
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| ShadowJK | ah | 22:45 |
| lardman | it can alter focus can it? | 22:46 |
| ShadowJK | I'd assume so | 22:46 |
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| lardman | V4L2_CID_FOCUS_AUTO | 22:48 |
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| lardman | ah good, an ioctl | 22:50 |
| lardman | and indeed also some v4l2 stuff | 22:50 |
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| lardman | hmm, autofocus logic/processing in the chip do you reckon? | 22:52 |
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| ShadowJK | I guess | 22:53 |
| ShadowJK | Either that or FOCUS_AUTO sets it to some "stuff 2-3 m infront if you mostly in focus" mode | 22:53 |
| lardman | looks like it, lots of exciting defines but no code | 22:53 |
| lardman | nah, I think that is called when you press the button | 22:54 |
| lardman | other options are choosing a fixed focus | 22:54 |
| lardman | but arbitrary between 0 and 1023 iirc | 22:54 |
| ShadowJK | Do you think the button is two-stage? | 22:54 |
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| lardman | yes | 22:55 |
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| lardman | I only think though, not sure | 22:55 |
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| mojocafe | good evening :) | 22:57 |
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| lardman | in fact I definitely think it is | 22:58 |
| G1zmog0 | does anyone have experience with flashing the n800 to os2008? I need help flashing | 22:58 |
| Myrtti | G1zmog0: the instructions are pretty straightforward | 22:59 |
| G1zmog0 | I followed the instructions for both linux and windows to the letter | 22:59 |
| G1zmog0 | it doesn't seem to detect my n800 | 22:59 |
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| mojocafe | G1zmog0, are you certain that the device is recognized by your pc ? | 23:02 |
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| G1zmog0 | mojocafe: no, but im not sure how to check in ubuntu | 23:04 |
| G1zmog0 | ill try and check in windows now | 23:04 |
| johnsq | G1zmog0: dmesg | 23:04 |
| mojocafe | G1zmog0, on win it worked like a charm with the nokia software. | 23:05 |
| G1zmog0 | mojocafe: ya thats the problem, once it time for it to recognize the device it never finds it... it just sits there | 23:05 |
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| mojocafe | G1zmog0, just a dumb idea but try an other usb port. i am always ahving some trouble with some of mine. | 23:06 |
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| G1zmog0 | mojocafe: good idea, but ive tried this on both computers | 23:07 |
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| mojocafe | G1zmog0, the device should also work even without the nokia software. as soon as you plug the cable in, you hear that typical "xp sound" informing you that the device is connected. | 23:09 |
| mojocafe | G1zmog0, maybe the cable ? | 23:10 |
| G1zmog0 | johnsq: can you clearify? dmesg? | 23:10 |
| G1zmog0 | mojocafe: I'll swap out some cables now, good idea | 23:10 |
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| johnsq | G1zmog0: dmesg is a command on your desktop pc under linux, where you can see the hardware log | 23:15 |
| johnsq | G1zmog0: when you plugin the n810 you should see something like usb 2-2.1: Product: Nokia N810 (Update mode) in it | 23:16 |
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| johnsq | G1zmog0: perhaps "tail -f /var/log/messages" does the same, but depends on the distribution or switching to console 11/12 | 23:18 |
| keesj | can I booth charge the N900 and still have it in usb host mode? | 23:18 |
| G1zmog0 | Mojocafe: It was the cable... I didnt think to check it because it works with my phone. | 23:18 |
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| G1zmog0 | johnsq: I checked up on Dmesg I will use it in future thanks you | 23:19 |
| MrGoose | G1zmog0: God speed time traveler | 23:19 |
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| mojocafe | G1zmog0, good to hear :) | 23:23 |
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| G1zmog0 | mojocafe: Thanks for responding and helping me btw :) | 23:24 |
| jeremiah | RST38h: ping | 23:25 |
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| airtonarantes | does anyone here is using fring on n810? I have installed and uninstalled many times, but when I'm on account setup of fring the app show a screen saying: Logging in.... and nothing happen..... | 23:34 |
| airtonarantes | it's very strange, because I have already used the fring on my N95. | 23:35 |
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| ArSa | erm... the point? | 23:35 |
| keesj | pupnik_: ping | 23:36 |
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| mojocafe | airtonarantes, web connection online ? | 23:41 |
| airtonarantes | mojocafe, yes | 23:42 |
| mojocafe | airtonarantes, you want to use it due to the avail. chat clients or because of skype ? because in case of the IM's then pidgin is a good alternative. | 23:44 |
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| airtonarantes | mojocafe, I wanna use it because it has many clientes in one program:skype,IM,twitter,jabber | 23:45 |
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| zerojay | All integrated. With much more on the way. | 23:45 |
| mojocafe | airtonarantes, i can imagine. but as skype works like a charm on my n800, i use pidgin for the others. | 23:45 |
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| zerojay | Pidgin loses all the integration though. | 23:46 |
| mojocafe | StOrM_NW,boa noite :) | 23:46 |
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| mojocafe | zerojay, yeah... right. | 23:46 |
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| zerojay | Well, it does. | 23:48 |
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| zerojay | Gotta have pidgin running all the time... meh.. | 23:48 |
| zerojay | Rather just let RTCOMM handle all of that. | 23:48 |
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| mojocafe | zerojay, sorry if you missunderstood me but i meant that you are correct - in my opinion :) | 23:49 |
| zerojay | :) | 23:49 |
| zerojay | No prob. | 23:49 |
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| ArSa | rtcomm kinda sucks though - incoming messages don't pop up right | 23:50 |
| ArSa | i'd prefer it, probably has better power saving | 23:50 |
| zerojay | They don't pop up right? What does that mean? | 23:51 |
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| GeneralAntilles | rtcomm is great | 23:51 |
| GeneralAntilles | Not perfect, but a helluva lot better than Pidgin or Fring. | 23:51 |
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| RST38h | So is Allah! | 23:52 |
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| Firebird | hurray ,my tablet has been charging for 14 hours and still isn't done | 23:52 |
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| ArSa | zerojay when new message comes in i have to dig into window list to bring it up and "accept" it | 23:53 |
| * lcuk yawns | 23:53 | |
| ArSa | for some reason... i use my own openfire server to aggregate the IM's | 23:53 |
| MrGoose | lcuk: cover your mouth please | 23:53 |
| RST38h | Anyone from Nokia around? | 23:53 |
| MrGoose | lcuk: why do you hate people with n800s so much? | 23:53 |
| * lcuk covers his mouth | 23:53 | |
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| * lcuk then farts instead | 23:53 | |
| lcuk | MrGoose, what on earth do you mean | 23:54 |
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| zerojay | ArSa: I used to run an Openfire server for the tablet community a while ago. | 23:54 |
| MrGoose | drawing with liqbase playground seems to point at an invalid resolution | 23:54 |
| zerojay | ArSa: Had something like 100 people online at the same time at any given moment.. 3000 accounts. | 23:54 |
| *** krutt has quit IRC | 23:54 | |
| MrGoose | so when you're drawing on the right, it seems that its off by a centimeter or so | 23:54 |
| lcuk | MrGoose, windowed mode latest version? | 23:55 |
| * lcuk nods if so | 23:55 | |
| MrGoose | lcuk: I dont think so | 23:55 |
| lcuk | can you see the normal maemo titlebars etc | 23:55 |
| *** stv0 has joined #maemo | 23:55 | |
| MrGoose | lcuk: actually yes, why is that? | 23:55 |
| lcuk | cos its in windowed mode | 23:55 |
| lcuk | cos i made a quick change recently | 23:55 |
| lcuk | i needed to get it in windowed | 23:56 |
| lcuk | and it screwed the aspect ratio up | 23:56 |
| ArSa | zerojay well, good. so when i get new IM through it it keeps forgetting my contacts are all authorized. | 23:56 |
| MrGoose | aah right | 23:56 |
| lcuk | and i have been lazy | 23:56 |
| ArSa | zerojay by "it" i mean rtcomm | 23:56 |
| lcuk | i have had many things to deal with | 23:56 |
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| zerojay | ArSa: That's an Openfire issue, not RTCOMM. | 23:56 |
| MrGoose | lcuk: I went as far as downloading your code in order to contribute but I suck at committing | 23:56 |
| lcuk | ~/.liqbase/liqbase.prefs and "fullscreen=1" | 23:56 |
| MrGoose | not saying that you dont do an awesome job already | 23:56 |
| lcuk | did you find the required patch? | 23:57 |
| lcuk | its embedded terribly eep | 23:57 |
| lcuk | deep | 23:57 |
| lcuk | i know where it is | 23:57 |
| ArSa | zerojay Psi has no such issues, neither does Pidgin in fact, all with same server login | 23:57 |
| zerojay | ArSa: I had the same issue when I first started using it, but I remember fixing it somehow. I did it before the server went live... would have drove everyone batty otherwise. | 23:57 |
| lcuk | its just having to find a new job changes priorities | 23:57 |
| MrGoose | patch for fullscreen? | 23:57 |
| lcuk | ~/.liqbase/liqbase.prefs and "fullscreen=1" | 23:57 |
| lcuk | just add that | 23:58 |
| lcuk | and it goes back to fullscreen | 23:58 |
| lcuk | its not a fix for windowed mode | 23:58 |
| lcuk | but when i put windowed mode in i made sure fullscreen was still available | 23:58 |
| lcuk | and its what ive been running with so didnt notice | 23:58 |
| MrGoose | lcuk: ah okay | 23:58 |
| lcuk | the version you have isnt very stable tho | 23:59 |
| javispedro | Firebird: slysics updated entered -devel and works :) | 23:59 |
| lcuk | i should update it tonight | 23:59 |
| lcuk | when i set off for london i noticed a major crash | 23:59 |
| lcuk | and fixed it on the train | 23:59 |
| lcuk | ahhh maybe you wont have it | 23:59 |
| * lcuk ponders | 23:59 | |
| woglinde | he lcuk | 23:59 |
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