| *** etrunko has quit IRC | 00:00 | |
| *** mcpeepants has quit IRC | 00:01 | |
| *** snorkelyd has left #maemo | 00:02 | |
| *** maddler has quit IRC | 00:04 | |
| *** vivijim is now known as viviout | 00:06 | |
| *** moo_mou has quit IRC | 00:07 | |
| *** Ph3NoMeN0 has quit IRC | 00:07 | |
| *** Ph3NoMeN0 has joined #maemo | 00:08 | |
| *** waite has left #maemo | 00:09 | |
| trenka | sdk contains libbluetooth1 when on device it is libbluetooth2 | 00:16 |
|---|---|---|
| part | trenka: please file a bug | 00:21 |
| koen | sounds like bug 750 strikes again | 00:21 |
| *** Aleksandyr is now known as Aleksandyr|AFK | 00:21 | |
| *** shapr has joined #maemo | 00:22 | |
| myren | is there FUSE support? | 00:23 |
| myren | that'd be righteous | 00:23 |
| suihkulokki | myren: there is a fuse project in garage | 00:23 |
| jhe | libbluetooth1 and libbluetooth2 can actually coexist (as they use different .so filenames), but the -dev packages cant | 00:23 |
| jhe | so if you want to run stuff compiled both against the old and new version you can have both installed on your device | 00:24 |
| trenka | sure, but it looks like -dev rootstrap is a bit incorrect, if I took the right one | 00:25 |
| part | trenka: which one? | 00:25 |
| trenka | maemo-sdk-rootstrap_3.0_armel.tgz | 00:25 |
| *** VRe has joined #maemo | 00:26 | |
| trenka | Hmmm, I checked, should be ok. | 00:26 |
| trenka | Looks that my fault | 00:26 |
| part | the repo doesn't have libbluetooth1 for maemo3.0 | 00:26 |
| framerate | libbluetooth1 is the reason why maemo mapper doesn't work on the N800 :( | 00:27 |
| trenka | framerate: I've just rebuilt it for myself :) | 00:27 |
| jhe | I think you can just take the armel package for libbluetooth1 from an old repo and maemo mapper should be happy with it | 00:27 |
| *** chenca has quit IRC | 00:28 | |
| part | just recompile, what's the big deal? | 00:28 |
| trenka | jhe: imho, it's better to recompile | 00:28 |
| *** __shawn has quit IRC | 00:28 | |
| framerate | trenka you got meamo mapper working on the N800? | 00:29 |
| jhe | trenka: could be, though the risk is quite small since libbluetooth has very few dependencies (basicly just libc) | 00:29 |
| *** peepants has quit IRC | 00:29 | |
| framerate | I tried a few things and had bad luck.. | 00:29 |
| *** hub has quit IRC | 00:30 | |
| *** Ryback_ has quit IRC | 00:31 | |
| trenka | framerate: entering URI | 00:32 |
| *** VRe has quit IRC | 00:32 | |
| *** bergie has joined #maemo | 00:32 | |
| jhe | trenka: ah, you mean recompile maemo mapper (and not libbluetooth1), yes, that's the best option if you have an environment set up to do the compiling (I was thinking of people without scratchbox) | 00:33 |
| framerate | can you email me a working libbt1 and mapper? I'd like to try it but don't have sdk installed yet :( | 00:33 |
| trenka | framerate: email please | 00:34 |
| framerate | mapper was one of the reasons I bought the platform, very eager to try it out | 00:34 |
| framerate | framerate@gmail.com will suffice | 00:34 |
| framerate | doh.. should not have put the @ symbol, forgot these are chatlogged heh | 00:35 |
| * framerate is trusting to think people wont' send him N800 bricking .deb's... | 00:35 | |
| jhe | somebody could just try to install http://repository.maemo.org/pool/maemo2.1/free/b/bluez-libs/libbluetooth1_2.25-cvs20060428_armel.deb before installing maemo mapper (haven't tried it myself) | 00:35 |
| *** VRe has joined #maemo | 00:35 | |
| trenka | framerate: check it | 00:36 |
| framerate | ggot it | 00:36 |
| framerate | dang I don't have libsqlite0 installed and no wifi (VPN here) | 00:37 |
| framerate | But this is working on your N800 if I install it @ home? | 00:37 |
| framerate | You should contact gnuite, he seemed to be having a hard time with the dependencies, but he doesn't have a N800 yet | 00:38 |
| *** Piega` has joined #maemo | 00:42 | |
| framerate | installed manually.. dang no luck | 00:42 |
| framerate | there we go.. got it to load. thanks trenka | 00:46 |
| *** VRe has quit IRC | 00:51 | |
| trenka | you are welcome | 00:51 |
| *** HGFB has joined #maemo | 00:59 | |
| framerate | where can I find more info on the URI stuff? Like what exactly: http://mt.google.com/mt?n=404&v=w2.29&x=%d&y=%d&zoom=%d is doing? | 01:00 |
| *** Ph3NoMeN0 has quit IRC | 01:00 | |
| trenka | http://mt.google.com/mt?n=404&v=w2.33&x=%d&y=%d&zoom=%d | 01:01 |
| framerate | I'm well versed in web programming, so I understand the format, but what is mt? n,v,etc variables stand for? Do we even need to care? hah | 01:02 |
| trenka | check source of the maps.google.com page. I do not know, what are they for | 01:03 |
| pigeon | mapki.com might have some info on those... | 01:04 |
| *** moo_mou has joined #maemo | 01:05 | |
| framerate | thanks guys, I'm gonna go try to find some wifi to play with this, see how it works :) | 01:06 |
| *** framerate is now known as framerate|afk | 01:06 | |
| *** bergie has quit IRC | 01:07 | |
| *** obi has joined #maemo | 01:07 | |
| *** VRe has joined #maemo | 01:08 | |
| pigeon | and see if this helps? http://www.codeproject.com/useritems/googlemap.asp | 01:08 |
| *** benzea has quit IRC | 01:13 | |
| *** obi has quit IRC | 01:20 | |
| *** Piega` has quit IRC | 01:20 | |
| *** obi has joined #maemo | 01:21 | |
| *** Piega` has joined #maemo | 01:22 | |
| *** ssvb has quit IRC | 01:22 | |
| *** atla has quit IRC | 01:28 | |
| *** Daelus_ has quit IRC | 01:31 | |
| *** shackan has quit IRC | 01:31 | |
| *** koen_ has joined #maemo | 01:35 | |
| *** koen has quit IRC | 01:36 | |
| *** sabotage is now known as sabotage_afk | 01:38 | |
| *** Piega`_ has joined #maemo | 01:44 | |
| *** |tbb| has joined #maemo | 01:44 | |
| *** Piega` has quit IRC | 01:46 | |
| *** koen_ is now known as koen | 01:46 | |
| *** shackan has joined #maemo | 01:47 | |
| |tbb| | http://europe.nokia.com/accessorieslink?s=N800NavigationKit it seems there is also a navkit available for the n8 | 01:51 |
| *** matt_c has quit IRC | 01:53 | |
| |tbb| | is the n8 heavier as the n770? | 01:53 |
| Milhouse | slightly heavier | 01:54 |
| |tbb| | milhouse do u own one? | 01:55 |
| Milhouse | yes, both | 01:55 |
| |tbb| | i have ordered mine today? | 01:56 |
| |tbb| | -? +! | 01:56 |
| koen | heh | 01:56 |
| |tbb| | will u sell ur n770? | 01:56 |
| Milhouse | plusses and minuses - look at ITT, it's plastered with 'em :) | 01:57 |
| koen | apparently the n770 and n800 are "ultra-sized desktops" | 01:57 |
| koen | according to the carkit propaganda^H^H^H^H^H FAQ | 01:57 |
| *** __shawn has joined #maemo | 01:57 | |
| Milhouse | minus for me are the top buttons (a little awkward) and the loss of the cover "standby" functionality (not the cover itself, I just want a quick way to disable the screen and shut down wireless as if the cover had been put on) | 01:57 |
| |tbb| | Milhouse do u own the navkit? | 01:58 |
| Milhouse | pluses - a lot snappier, more memory, 2x SD slots, better audio, better screen... | 01:58 |
| Milhouse | navkit - no | 01:58 |
| Milhouse | don't have a car :) | 01:58 |
| Milhouse | and it's a bit over the top for pedestrian use! | 01:58 |
| *** __shawn has quit IRC | 01:59 | |
| |tbb| | better screen? i was thinking it is the same | 01:59 |
| Rotund | Milhouse, any other minuses? | 01:59 |
| Milhouse | tbb - no sparkely effect as you get on the 770 | 01:59 |
| Rotund | Do you mean when you "click"? | 02:00 |
| *** moo_mou has quit IRC | 02:00 | |
| Milhouse | rotund - the incompatability issues, but hopefully they'll be sorted. and the webcam is rubbish in low light, hopefully firmware updates will fix that. SDHC support would be nice for 4GB+ cards. | 02:00 |
| |tbb| | sparkely means what? | 02:00 |
| myren | i'm pretty worried about SDHC support | 02:00 |
| Milhouse | rotund - no, look at the screen and you'll see the overlay produces a shimmering/sparkely effect which renders whites more of a pink | 02:01 |
| myren | flash is getting dirt cheap | 02:01 |
| koen | the glimmer from the ts layer | 02:01 |
| myren | no SDHC support puts a serious cramp on any long term usability propsects | 02:01 |
| Milhouse | i'm sure it will come eventually | 02:01 |
| koen | remember kids, 640kB is enough for *everyone* | 02:01 |
| Rotund | I definitely want the SDHC. I'm most intrigued by the support for an IT2007-like update for the 770. I hope they do it. | 02:02 |
| Milhouse | oh, Adobe Flash needs improving - youtube is just about watchable but not really... hopefully better optimisation will fix the poor performance | 02:02 |
| daniels | er, you should be able to rebuild the kernel as-is with the sdhc patches, without breaking any abi | 02:02 |
| Milhouse | hmm... any idea why Nokia didn't do that for us? ;) | 02:02 |
| koen | Milhouse: that will probably involve making a seperate youtube viewer | 02:02 |
| koen | Milhouse: and lauching mplayer of gstreamer to decode the video | 02:03 |
| Milhouse | yeuch | 02:03 |
| Milhouse | the N800 flash player is almost there - just slow | 02:03 |
| Milhouse | either that's a fundamental issue with flash (needs more horsepower) or it needs optimising (i've no idea which it is) | 02:03 |
| * koen bets on "fundamental issue with flash" | 02:04 | |
| Rotund | Milhouse, you mean why no SDHC? | 02:04 |
| Milhouse | yes - daniels suggested the sdhc patches are already available | 02:04 |
| |tbb| | milhouse have u set the quality to lower while watching youtube vidz? | 02:04 |
| Milhouse | tbb: yes, lowest quality and a 1mb cache - didn't help that much | 02:04 |
| Rotund | I heard that they didn't seem to think about it. They tested it at CES. | 02:04 |
| Rotund | That'll probably be fixed in the next OS update. It's only been out for... what 3 days. They're all in Vegas | 02:05 |
| |tbb| | :/ | 02:05 |
| daniels | Rotund: er, the developers are all in helsinki, except that half of them are preparing for a 31 hour helsinki -> london -> singapore -> sydney flight of despair to lca. | 02:06 |
| Rotund | no navkit for US? | 02:06 |
| daniels | not that i'm procrastinating packing or anything ... | 02:06 |
| |tbb| | could u look at http://gpokr.com/ with the n800 and tell me it works | 02:06 |
| Rotund | they going to lca? awesome | 02:06 |
| |tbb| | i hope the navkit which i have bought allready will work on the n800 too | 02:08 |
| Milhouse | tbb: gpokr.com - not looking good | 02:10 |
| |tbb| | do u have minimo browser installed? | 02:11 |
| *** matt_c has joined #maemo | 02:12 | |
| Milhouse | tbb: no | 02:12 |
| Milhouse | tbb: it took a long time, but it looks like it's happening | 02:13 |
| *** soothsay has joined #maemo | 02:13 | |
| *** matt_c has quit IRC | 02:13 | |
| |tbb| | with minimo it runs on the 770 | 02:13 |
| Milhouse | took ages to download the final item, now opera is showing the players and the message/chat windows | 02:13 |
| *** matt_c has joined #maemo | 02:13 | |
| Milhouse | it's very very slow in opera | 02:14 |
| Milhouse | i wouldn't like to risk money on this... :) | 02:14 |
| |tbb| | hehe | 02:14 |
| |tbb| | how about the sound? | 02:16 |
| Milhouse | just noticed i had a kismet_client process consuming 75% CPU, let me try gpokr.com again | 02:16 |
| Milhouse | sound - dunno i'm listening to The Clash streaming via Media Streamer... | 02:16 |
| |tbb| | quality volume ... | 02:17 |
| *** sbaturzio has quit IRC | 02:17 | |
| Milhouse | performance is not surprisingly better now | 02:18 |
| Milhouse | stopped the clash now and i hear noises when hands are played | 02:18 |
| |tbb| | sorry | 02:19 |
| Milhouse | np :) | 02:19 |
| |tbb| | i was meaning how about the sound of the device | 02:19 |
| Milhouse | oh - very good | 02:20 |
| Milhouse | gpokr.com seems ok on the n800 | 02:20 |
| Milhouse | if you zoom out to 80% you can fit the whole table on the screen | 02:20 |
| Milhouse | i'm watching the same game on my desktop/firefox as i am on the n800 and the n800 is a couple of seconds behind the desktop, that could be due to the ajax polling (assuming it uses polling) | 02:21 |
| |tbb| | is the sound louder on the highest level as on the n770 | 02:21 |
| *** vivijim has joined #maemo | 02:22 | |
| Milhouse | also on the n800 you only see the player who is playing his hand whereas on the desktop i see all players in the game | 02:22 |
| shackan | Welcome to Scratchbox, the cross-compilation toolkit! | 02:22 |
| shackan | yay | 02:22 |
| *** sp3000 has quit IRC | 02:22 | |
| *** matt_c has quit IRC | 02:23 | |
| Milhouse | one problem with gpokr.com on n800 - you dont get to see the cards being played, guess that's a bug | 02:23 |
| Milhouse | or limitation of opera | 02:23 |
| *** matt_c has joined #maemo | 02:23 | |
| |tbb| | mil if u hear music at highest level, is it much louder and clearer as on the n770 | 02:24 |
| Milhouse | about the same i'd say, but in stereo | 02:25 |
| shackan | is there a way to see hildon UIs from the SDK ? | 02:27 |
| Milhouse | the n800 battery estimate is pretty crazy - i've been using it heavily a couple of hours, says 1 hour left but still 4 green bars. hmm, which one do i believe, eh? | 02:29 |
| |tbb| | i was wondering that there is no picture capture programm or video recorder functionallity on the n800 | 02:29 |
| |tbb| | the bars sucked on my n770 also | 02:30 |
| |tbb| | i can have 4 bars then doing a reboot and after reboot i only got 2 bars left | 02:31 |
| Milhouse | tbb - i get exactly that, i bet if i reboot the n800 now it will come up on 1 bar and "low battery" alerts within a few minutes | 02:31 |
| Milhouse | not really good enough tbh - batter meter is a waste of time under most circumstances | 02:31 |
| |tbb| | ive heard that the applets r resizable now, is this correct | 02:33 |
| Milhouse | tbb: yes, but not all. So far, RSS, Google Search and Speed Contacts | 02:34 |
| *** atk_ has left #maemo | 02:34 | |
| |tbb| | very nice, i wonder why not all of the applets | 02:35 |
| |tbb| | i would like to see applets with transparent effect | 02:35 |
| |tbb| | that would rock | 02:36 |
| *** k-s has quit IRC | 02:40 | |
| |tbb| | any idea why this isnt implemented yet | 02:41 |
| *** soothsay has quit IRC | 02:41 | |
| *** jpetersen has quit IRC | 02:42 | |
| shackan | whohoooo | 02:44 |
| shackan | this simulator is awesome | 02:45 |
| Milhouse | tbb: transparency? don't know, but the Plankton theme on Sardine appears to have some sort of alpha-blending going on | 02:45 |
| shackan | not quite the real thing, but still.. | 02:45 |
| Milhouse | isn't that the point of simulators? | 02:45 |
| Milhouse | :) | 02:46 |
| |tbb| | sardine is the latest os update for the 770 ? | 02:48 |
| Milhouse | it's a future development of the hildon framework | 02:49 |
| *** hub has joined #maemo | 02:52 | |
| *** MoRpHeUz has joined #maemo | 02:53 | |
| *** lele has quit IRC | 02:54 | |
| *** Piega`_ has quit IRC | 02:58 | |
| |tbb| | gn8 all | 03:00 |
| *** |tbb| has quit IRC | 03:00 | |
| shackan | can I access files outside of the simulated chroot? | 03:01 |
| *** jtokash has joined #maemo | 03:05 | |
| *** pdz- has joined #maemo | 03:17 | |
| *** rkaway has quit IRC | 03:18 | |
| Milhouse | how do we enter bugs into bugzilla for mediaplayer on n800? bugzilla isn't n800 aware, and the only application listed is maemopad | 03:18 |
| *** rkaway has joined #maemo | 03:18 | |
| Milhouse | bug #940 raised to make bugzilla N800 aware. sigh. | 03:21 |
| Milhouse | Just noticed the N800 has gone up £10 in the Nokia Shop since I ordered mine for £269 on Sunday | 03:22 |
| *** pdz has quit IRC | 03:26 | |
| *** spect has quit IRC | 03:31 | |
| *** NickDe has quit IRC | 03:40 | |
| Disconnect | anyone look at a weechat port yet? | 03:46 |
| *** MoRpHeUz has quit IRC | 03:49 | |
| gpd | what about WiiChat -- using accelerometer to type in mid-air by drawing letters? | 03:50 |
| hub | Milhouse: at least you can order one | 03:51 |
| Milhouse | @hub: :( | 03:52 |
| Milhouse | hub - where are you that you can't order one? | 03:52 |
| hub | canada | 03:53 |
| Milhouse | did nokia sell the 770 direct in canada? | 03:53 |
| hub | no | 03:54 |
| Milhouse | that's not good | 03:54 |
| Milhouse | nokia are a worlwide organisation | 03:54 |
| Milhouse | allegedly | 03:54 |
| hub | no biggie | 03:55 |
| Milhouse | it is if you can't get one | 03:55 |
| Milhouse | planning a trip to the US any time soon? | 03:55 |
| daniels | nokia are a worldwide organisation, but nokia direct is not. | 03:57 |
| daniels | remember that the product was only _announced_ about 72 hours ago, so i'm sure availability will improve over time. | 03:57 |
| Milhouse | daniels - i assumed availability of the 770/N800 was so limited nokia direct were the only other option | 03:58 |
| Milhouse | never saw a 770 onsale in a bricks & mortar store in the UK | 03:58 |
| hub | daniels: n770 has been released what. over a year ago? | 03:58 |
| hub | daniels: and here, bupkiss | 03:58 |
| Milhouse | daniels - they've been shipping for almost a week, ask any droid in CompUSA ;) | 03:58 |
| hub | but again no biggie | 03:58 |
| daniels | and the 770 was the first internet tablet nokia has ever made. | 03:59 |
| daniels | you don't go out making five million of something you've never tried before | 03:59 |
| Milhouse | daniels: but if nokia want to sell any, they need to make them available | 03:59 |
| daniels | Milhouse: ... you don't say. | 03:59 |
| Milhouse | yep, i do say - now do you see the problem? | 04:00 |
| daniels | Milhouse: the mechanics of dealing with production for these kinds of things are incredibly complex, and it's not a one-phone-call-to-make-ten-times-more scenario. | 04:00 |
| Milhouse | no stock == no sales. 770's in the UK stores? none. nokia direct is the only option. If nokia direct don't have them, you're stuffed. | 04:00 |
| daniels | as i said, it was only announced 72 hours ago. iphone won't be available _at all_ until july, yet people aren't ragging them for availability. | 04:01 |
| Milhouse | i'm talking about the 770 | 04:01 |
| daniels | give it some time before you make judgements. initial runs are never enormous. | 04:01 |
| Milhouse | 7-7-0 | 04:01 |
| Milhouse | :) | 04:01 |
| Milhouse | how much time, couple of years maybe? | 04:01 |
| daniels | yes, and the 770 was the very first internet tablet nokia ever made. so judging what's going to happen for the n800, based on the 770, is a poor idea. | 04:01 |
| daniels | sigh. g'night. | 04:01 |
| Milhouse | tata | 04:01 |
| Milhouse | strewth... | 04:02 |
| hub | what is that map application Nokia was demoing at CES? | 04:06 |
| daniels | navicore, sells with the n800 navigation kit. essentially the same as runs on symbian. | 04:08 |
| hub | does it include a GPS? | 04:09 |
| daniels | i believe it includes a 2gb mmc card with navicore and maps for most of europe and north america, the car mount kit, and a nokia ld-3w gps (which you can buy separately). but don't quote me on that. | 04:10 |
| hub | ok | 04:10 |
| hub | works over bt for the GPS? | 04:12 |
| * hub google it | 04:12 | |
| *** X-Fade_ has joined #maemo | 04:16 | |
| Disconnect | does navicore+maps sell separately? | 04:18 |
| Disconnect | (does/will/might/...) | 04:18 |
| hub | daniels: hey, that ETA is convenient at least | 04:22 |
| daniels | hub: yeah, the gps is bluetooth | 04:24 |
| *** X-Fade has quit IRC | 04:28 | |
| jtokash | can the n800 and 770 use more than one BT device at the same time? If so, how many? | 04:33 |
| jtokash | Is 3 possible? Keyboard, cellphone/data, gps? | 04:34 |
| *** koen has quit IRC | 04:34 | |
| *** koen has joined #maemo | 04:36 | |
| Disconnect | jtokash: 770 has done it, i don't see why the 800 wouldn't | 04:37 |
| jtokash | cool, thanks | 04:39 |
| jtokash | Just taking that into account as I think about keyboards | 04:39 |
| jtokash | I have the stowaway but it's too big | 04:39 |
| jtokash | I'm thinking about, maybe, the freedom mini | 04:40 |
| *** NickDe has joined #maemo | 04:40 | |
| *** vivijim has quit IRC | 04:41 | |
| *** jaebird has quit IRC | 04:43 | |
| *** jaebird has joined #maemo | 04:44 | |
| nprice | c/quit | 05:03 |
| *** nprice has quit IRC | 05:03 | |
| metajack | jtokash: got a url for the freedom mini? i am thinking about getting a small bt keyboard to use with it | 05:06 |
| metajack | i have a few apple wireless ones, but they are rather large :) | 05:06 |
| jtokash | http://www.freedominput.com/mainsite/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=shop.flypage&product_id=4&category_id=1&manufacturer_id=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=1&vmcchk=1 | 05:10 |
| jtokash | search on google for reviews | 05:10 |
| jtokash | people generally seem to think it's too thick | 05:10 |
| *** pvanhoof has quit IRC | 05:12 | |
| metajack | is it chorded? i don't get it | 05:12 |
| metajack | the mini duo looks a little more like what i was thinking | 05:13 |
| metajack | ah, with a bigger picture frmo the review sites it makes sense now | 05:15 |
| *** mproctor has joined #maemo | 05:24 | |
| *** kwa has joined #maemo | 05:28 | |
| kwa | Hi everyone. Wanting to tinker around with the built in feed reader for the 770, I started browsing the svn repositories at maemo.org assuming that it would be there. Since I haven't found it there, am I wrong in assuming that most of the applications included with the 770 are non-free? | 05:37 |
| kwa | I'm pretty tired from work, so I could just be confused. | 05:37 |
| obra | 'evening | 05:45 |
| kwa | hi | 05:48 |
| *** phil|work is now known as philipl | 05:50 | |
| *** jtokash has quit IRC | 05:51 | |
| *** jtokash has joined #maemo | 06:05 | |
| *** obi has quit IRC | 06:09 | |
| *** k-s has joined #maemo | 06:17 | |
| *** k-s is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 06:17 | |
| *** BasL has quit IRC | 06:25 | |
| inz | kwa, rss reader source can be found from: http://linuxtogo.org/~koen/maemo/unpacked/ | 06:41 |
| *** matt_c has quit IRC | 06:41 | |
| *** matt_c has joined #maemo | 06:41 | |
| *** mako132_ has joined #maemo | 06:48 | |
| kwa | inz: Ah! Thank you. | 06:49 |
| *** mproctor has quit IRC | 06:53 | |
| *** mako132_ has quit IRC | 07:03 | |
| gpd | hah - my DESKTOP nvidia drivers are broken - so i am using my n800 to search ubuntuforums for fixes :) yay for tablets! | 07:04 |
| *** obi has joined #maemo | 07:07 | |
| *** bmidgley has quit IRC | 07:09 | |
| inz | kwa, don't thank me, thank koen =) | 07:11 |
| *** mako132_ has joined #maemo | 07:11 | |
| kwa | Of course, thank you koen! | 07:12 |
| inz | Otherwise you'd need to d/l all the sources as one big file (http://maemo.org/downloads/IT_source.php ) | 07:13 |
| *** rkaway2 has joined #maemo | 07:15 | |
| kwa | ah, ok thanks for pointing that out. | 07:16 |
| kwa | I appoligize for the being lazy ;-) | 07:16 |
| inz | kwa, there's really no links to either url | 07:17 |
| inz | kwa, the former can be found from maemo-developers list and the latter from "directory contents" page | 07:17 |
| *** bergie has joined #maemo | 07:25 | |
| *** bmidgley has joined #maemo | 07:25 | |
| gpd | i just noticed that if you ssh into somewhere in the osso-terminal and use the keyboard to type a password -- then it remembers it and will appear at random when you typ the first letters of the pw later | 07:26 |
| bmidgley | nice | 07:26 |
| kwa | ouch | 07:27 |
| gpd | pwless keys i guess | 07:27 |
| Disconnect | thats exciting | 07:29 |
| * gpd generates keys on n800 | 07:30 | |
| gpd | i suspect most people would be caught out by that though | 07:31 |
| gpd | i guess the terminal should detect that a password is being entered and stop recording new words | 07:32 |
| *** rkaway has quit IRC | 07:32 | |
| bmidgley | it would be a little better with spaces in your passwords | 07:32 |
| bmidgley | but the pieces would all be there in the dictionary | 07:33 |
| gpd | hmm... ash seems to ignore /etc/hosts for dns lookups ??? | 07:41 |
| gpd | does that mean that i can't block ads using /etc/host either? | 07:47 |
| gpd | google seems to show other people using /etc/hosts on 770 -- odd | 07:48 |
| *** dieguito has joined #maemo | 07:50 | |
| *** matt_c has quit IRC | 07:51 | |
| *** matt_c has joined #maemo | 07:52 | |
| * gpd watches the tumbleweeds | 08:01 | |
| * SuperQ takes flight | 08:03 | |
| * gpd goes to ground | 08:04 | |
| gpd | so there doesn't seem to be a webserver port for maemo - too heavy? | 08:07 |
| dieguito | gpd: python has an example of 20 lines for a web server or something like that | 08:11 |
| inz | gpd, I tried to do that, but didn't really find out how | 08:12 |
| dieguito | http://docs.python.org/lib/module-BaseHTTPServer.html | 08:12 |
| inz | gdp, err, I tried to make the terminal to ignore the pw, that is | 08:12 |
| gpd | i am surprised - it is normally page 1 slashdot -- 'this page served from nokia 770' | 08:12 |
| gpd | [or used to be] | 08:12 |
| inz | gpd, didn't find anything in libvte that would change when "password" mode is enabled | 08:13 |
| gpd | inz: so do you just use pwless keys? or any other method? | 08:13 |
| gpd | inz: and are you finding that /etc/hosts doesn't get read by ssh etc? | 08:13 |
| inz | gpd, I mostly ignore the problem =) | 08:14 |
| gpd | kthanks :) | 08:14 |
| inz | gpd, haven't really fiddled with hosts, I usually flash the device once a week or so | 08:14 |
| gpd | i suppose i can use use .ssh/config instead - but seems wrong to ignore /etc/hosts -- even OSX follows that! | 08:15 |
| inz | gpd, there's khttpd for it2006 listed at test.maemo.org: http://test.maemo.org/applications/product/thttpd/ | 08:16 |
| keesj | hi | 08:16 |
| gpd | very nice -- next on the list is php -- which is less likely | 08:16 |
| tigert | i just keep the text suggesting stuff off in the kbd | 08:18 |
| gpd | tigert: does that stop recording - or stop display? | 08:18 |
| tigert | it probably might still save them, though | 08:18 |
| tigert | doesnt display at least | 08:18 |
| gpd | tigert: would you expect /etc/hosts to work? | 08:20 |
| tigert | i find the too clever stuff annoying since it rarely gets stuff right. especially shell commands - though i mostly just use the thumb keyboard for ssh into my shell and irssi | 08:20 |
| tigert | /etc/hosts to work with what? | 08:21 |
| gpd | 192.1.168.1.42 beasty.midvale.local beasty | 08:21 |
| gpd | ssh beasty | 08:21 |
| gpd | ssh: beasty: Name or service not known | 08:21 |
| tigert | whats on your resolv.conf? | 08:21 |
| gpd | nameserver 127.0.0.1 | 08:21 |
| tigert | but run a bind on your local lan and set dhcp correctly :) | 08:22 |
| tigert | oh | 08:22 |
| tigert | so there is some local caching named? | 08:22 |
| *** bergie has quit IRC | 08:23 | |
| inz | yeah, 770/n800 use dnsmasq | 08:23 |
| gpd | i just connected to my router -- which works fine with th rest of my machines | 08:23 |
| gpd | in any case -- if you explicitly set something in /etc/hosts it should read this as last resort - no? | 08:25 |
| tigert | wasnt there something you could put to resolv.conf? i remember something like "order hosts, bind" or such from years ago? | 08:25 |
| inz | /etc/hosts should be read first | 08:25 |
| tigert | but most of the stuff on the device is just standard linux software. it should work. maybe there is some option turned off or something? | 08:26 |
| tigert | but then again, if one uses hostnames in a lan, setting up a named relay with local zone is not a bad idea. | 08:28 |
| tigert | speeds up networking nicely too when it caches yor lookups locally | 08:28 |
| keesj | gpd, what happens if you ssh to beasty.midvale.local | 08:29 |
| gpd | ssh: beasty.midvale.local: Name or service not known | 08:30 |
| gpd | /etc/hosts doesn't have to be tabs or anything odd like that? | 08:30 |
| keesj | is you connection up? | 08:31 |
| gpd | yes - i am typing this from the desktop ;) | 08:31 |
| gpd | ~ $ ssh 192.168.1.42 | 08:31 |
| gpd | Linux beasty 2.6.17-10-386 #2 Tue Dec 5 22:26:18 UTC 2006 i686 | 08:31 |
| gpd | hold the phone | 08:32 |
| keesj | your typing in the right terminal? | 08:33 |
| keesj | or did you tweak you PS? | 08:33 |
| gpd | no -- the /etc/hosts was 'poorly written' :( | 08:33 |
| * gpd cowers in shame | 08:33 | |
| gpd | 22:21 gpd> 192.1.168.1.42 beasty.midvale.local beasty | 08:34 |
| keesj | vi often messes up on display | 08:34 |
| gpd | ^ spot the errors... | 08:34 |
| keesj | ip wrong? | 08:35 |
| gpd | 192.1.168.1.42 => 192.168.1.42 | 08:35 |
| inz | "oops" =) | 08:35 |
| inz | is that ipv4.2 | 08:35 |
| gpd | i think this indicates that 5 days with little sleep is taking effect... /me wanders off | 08:36 |
| Jaffa | Morning, all | 08:37 |
| tigert | it works for me. | 08:37 |
| tigert | gpd :) | 08:37 |
| inz | meh, should try to fix my vte package for n800 | 08:37 |
| Jaffa | inz: (re terminal and passwords) I guess you'd have to patch libvte to send a new message/callback to the app when echo is turned off (assuming you actually get that character code still coming through these days) | 08:37 |
| tigert | inz, it doesnt work? | 08:38 |
| inz | the b0rkedness is annoying | 08:38 |
| tigert | in what sense? | 08:38 |
| inz | tigert, thumb kb launching doesn't work | 08:39 |
| tigert | it doesnt? how am i doing this then? | 08:39 |
| inz | except via "rocker key" | 08:39 |
| tigert | no, it works fine here | 08:39 |
| tigert | with thumb press | 08:39 |
| *** shackan has quit IRC | 08:39 | |
| inz | well, it doesn't work for me | 08:39 |
| tigert | weird | 08:39 |
| tigert | the only issue i have is wenever i visi the browser | 08:40 |
| inz | and the vkb sometimes thinks that only alphanumerics are allowed | 08:40 |
| tigert | and type an url, the term also shows the url on next keyboard invocation | 08:41 |
| *** BasL has joined #maemo | 08:41 | |
| tigert | inz, i think that is a bug in the kbd. seen it a few times rarely | 08:41 |
| tigert | the space-or-punctuation-not-wrking issue | 08:42 |
| inz | it must be sth w/ my vte | 08:42 |
| inz | w/ maemo.org vte works nicely | 08:42 |
| tigert | this is n800 | 08:42 |
| * Jaffa heads off workwards. | 08:43 | |
| tigert | and your package for xterm | 08:43 |
| *** booiiing has quit IRC | 08:43 | |
| inz | with 770 the same source works, but with n800 there are issues | 08:43 |
| tigert | ~ $ dpkg -l | grep vte | 08:44 |
| tigert | ii libvte-common 0.12.1-1mh9bora4 Terminal emulator widget for GTK+ 2.0 - comm | 08:44 |
| tigert | ii libvte4 0.12.1-1mh9bora4 Terminal emulator widget for GTK+ 2.0 - runt | 08:44 |
| inz | tigert, try to open and close the vkb menu, if i do that, the space gets disabled | 08:45 |
| tigert | vkb or thumbkbd? | 08:45 |
| inz | vkb | 08:45 |
| tigert | affirmative. | 08:45 |
| tigert | but i only use the thumb keyboard whenever i can. | 08:46 |
| inz | and when i tap the terminal widget it gets enabled again | 08:46 |
| tigert | the disablation of space is temporary though | 08:46 |
| tigert | yea | 08:46 |
| inz | but it's annoying nevertheless | 08:48 |
| tigert | but i can invke the thumb kbd with thumb press just fine | 08:48 |
| inz | weird | 08:48 |
| tigert | is the version the same? | 08:49 |
| inz | the thumb press works for me everywhere else | 08:49 |
| inz | and also with tha maemo.org vte | 08:49 |
| inz | yeah, same version | 08:50 |
| tigert | is your "required pressure" set to minimum? | 08:50 |
| inz | yup | 08:52 |
| inz | and, as i said, it works everywhere else | 08:53 |
| tigert | yeah | 08:54 |
| *** booiiing has joined #maemo | 09:02 | |
| *** simon_ has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** pdz- has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** Rotund has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** tchan has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** Disconnect has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** stanlly has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** philipl has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** disq has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** klaatu has quit IRC | 09:10 | |
| *** pdz- has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** Rotund has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** tchan has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** Disconnect has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** stanlly has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** philipl has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** disq has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** klaatu has joined #maemo | 09:10 | |
| *** sp3000 has joined #maemo | 09:17 | |
| *** philipl is now known as phil|sleep | 09:26 | |
| *** konttori has joined #maemo | 09:28 | |
| *** Pio has quit IRC | 09:28 | |
| *** atla has joined #maemo | 09:28 | |
| *** Pio has joined #maemo | 09:30 | |
| *** simon_ has joined #maemo | 09:34 | |
| *** povbot has joined #maemo | 09:43 | |
| *** bergie has joined #maemo | 09:47 | |
| keesj | how is gmail on the n800? | 09:48 |
| keesj | on the 770 i ended up using the "Basic" html version | 09:48 |
| WillySilly | I dont use the basic html of gmail on the 770 | 09:52 |
| metajack | gmail works great on n800 | 09:53 |
| metajack | no complaints at all | 09:53 |
| metajack | google reader seems to work as well, although it's a little awkward | 09:53 |
| metajack | and google calendar seems to function as well, but there is at least one small bug | 09:53 |
| inz | yeah, gmail seems to work pretty well | 09:54 |
| * metajack sleeps | 09:54 | |
| Whiz | I should propably /part as that n800 is getting more interesting day by day.. I really should just cut my visa in pieces or something.. | 09:57 |
| *** jurop88 has quit IRC | 09:57 | |
| *** lele has joined #maemo | 09:58 | |
| dieguito | Whiz: haha | 09:59 |
| Whiz | You should just all say that the n800 is hoax, full of crap and the screen will broke very easily as it doesnt have a proper shield as the n770 had :) | 09:59 |
| *** sabotage_afk has quit IRC | 10:01 | |
| inz | n800 is a hoax and full of crap | 10:01 |
| inz | ;p | 10:01 |
| *** sabotage_afk has joined #maemo | 10:01 | |
| *** sabotage_afk is now known as sabotage | 10:01 | |
| Whiz | thanks :) Now I can start dreaming of OQO2 :) | 10:04 |
| Whiz | And that is ok as my Visa's monthly limit is lower than the price of that :) | 10:04 |
| *** elpaso has joined #maemo | 10:05 | |
| inz | oqo2 is a hoax and full of crap | 10:08 |
| *** jtokash2 has joined #maemo | 10:09 | |
| *** Guardian has quit IRC | 10:13 | |
| Whiz | hmm.. thanks | 10:15 |
| *** jtokash has quit IRC | 10:25 | |
| c0ffee | moin | 10:26 |
| *** fab has quit IRC | 10:33 | |
| *** atla has left #maemo | 10:37 | |
| c0ffee | mhm | 10:42 |
| c0ffee | another piece of information slipped | 10:42 |
| c0ffee | the selection process is not yet over | 10:42 |
| *** ssvb has joined #maemo | 10:44 | |
| *** Guardian has joined #maemo | 10:49 | |
| *** sKaBoy has joined #maemo | 10:51 | |
| *** greentux has quit IRC | 10:53 | |
| *** bergie has quit IRC | 10:56 | |
| jonek | good morning | 10:57 |
| *** jpetersen has joined #maemo | 10:58 | |
| *** tigert_ has joined #maemo | 10:58 | |
| *** tigert has quit IRC | 10:58 | |
| *** greentux has joined #maemo | 11:03 | |
| roope | http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16526122/ that's quite accurate :D | 11:05 |
| Jaffa | c0ffee: or, you could read it another way: it is over, but they haven't been able to announce that yet. | 11:08 |
| Jaffa | c0ffee: although I suspect the first meaning was meant | 11:08 |
| tigert_ | haha | 11:10 |
| tigert_ | "phone" indeed | 11:10 |
| *** tigert_ is now known as tigert | 11:10 | |
| c0ffee | Jaffa, let's be true and replace suspect with hope :) | 11:11 |
| Guardian | morning all | 11:15 |
| *** fab has joined #maemo | 11:17 | |
| dwd | c0ffee: Where was this? | 11:17 |
| c0ffee | mailing list | 11:18 |
| dwd | c0ffee: MDK's post? | 11:19 |
| c0ffee | if MDK is jacub pavelek | 11:20 |
| koen | mdk is M..... D...... K....... | 11:20 |
| c0ffee | Mr. Devesh Kothari? :) | 11:20 |
| c0ffee | no, jacub pavelek said he doesn't like the way the developer program is going | 11:21 |
| koen | "Another thing is the developer program. I'm not too happy with it myself | 11:21 |
| koen | and I agree we should have at least posted the deadline after which the | 11:21 |
| koen | notifications are sent. I still hope we will at least announce that the | 11:21 |
| koen | selection is over." | 11:21 |
| *** greentux has quit IRC | 11:23 | |
| Jaffa | It's the "that". If it were "when"... but non-native English speaker so I'll not be swayed one way or the other. | 11:24 |
| dwd | Oh, yes, I see it now. | 11:24 |
| *** bilboed has joined #maemo | 11:24 | |
| dwd | Jaffa: Yes. Does look like the selection is over from that. "that", and not using the subjunctive, is indeed rather confusing. | 11:25 |
| *** pdz- is now known as pdz | 11:26 | |
| c0ffee | and should have posted looks like past as well | 11:26 |
| Guardian | please, how could i have more details on the meaning of the keys, when creating a .vkb file: how are the alpha,numeric,hexa,tele,special,dead,whitespace keys used ? | 11:26 |
| *** greentux has joined #maemo | 11:28 | |
| c0ffee | somebody working on the maemo website? | 11:29 |
| Jaffa | Guardian: seen? http://maemo.org/platform/docs/howtos/howto_him_bora.html | 11:29 |
| c0ffee | i've put a set of patches for forrest 0.7 in the wiki | 11:29 |
| inz | guardian, input widgets can choose to only get alpha, numeric, hex etc | 11:29 |
| c0ffee | now i have to hurry to work | 11:30 |
| c0ffee | so I'm there before lunch | 11:30 |
| part | c0ffee: it's all going to move to midgard | 11:30 |
| c0ffee | mhm | 11:33 |
| c0ffee | anyway, got to go | 11:33 |
| Guardian | jaffa: yep that's why i asked :) | 11:33 |
| Jaffa | Guardian: just checkin' ;-) | 11:34 |
| Guardian | inz: what about tele and special ? | 11:34 |
| *** AD-N770 has joined #maemo | 11:34 | |
| Jaffa | "tele" will be for telephone numbers, I expect: numerics and maybe + and ' ' | 11:34 |
| AD-N770 | good morning | 11:35 |
| inz | guard, of tele i dunno, it may be for inputting telephone numbers | 11:36 |
| inz | guard, special is special characters | 11:36 |
| inz | writing is way too slow, even w/ thumb kb | 11:36 |
| Guardian | i'm also curious about "multiple" | 11:37 |
| Guardian | is it using "multiple" keys that tabs are achieved | 11:37 |
| Guardian | for example on the thumb keyboard: you have a tab for "ABC" another for "1!+" etc | 11:37 |
| inz | no idea | 11:39 |
| inz | it could also be like the '.,-' button in thumb kb | 11:39 |
| Guardian | i would say '.,-' is a sliding key | 11:40 |
| Guardian | "it has more than one label in a key. The last slided label would be committed" | 11:40 |
| tigert | sounds like the multitap key yeah | 11:41 |
| AD-N770 | Just my opinion of N800: I think that the new device have a sexy hardware (ARMv6 + VFP) | 11:41 |
| tigert | AD-N770: its a lot snappier in use | 11:41 |
| AD-N770 | but compared to N770 I would like to have an screen cover | 11:41 |
| tigert | I personally like the form factor of the 770 more in pocket use | 11:41 |
| tigert | but the N800 is okay in that sense too | 11:41 |
| tigert | and I never used the screen cover on the 770 | 11:42 |
| AD-N770 | I ever use it | 11:42 |
| tigert | if you keep it in its own pocket, not with your keys and other sharp metal objects, | 11:42 |
| tigert | the screen should be fine | 11:42 |
| tigert | its meant for poking at anyway | 11:42 |
| AD-N770 | and the form of buttons for fullscreen/+/-/power dosen't like to me on the N800 | 11:42 |
| AD-N770 | as I said, just my opinion | 11:43 |
| Guardian | brb | 11:43 |
| *** Guardian has quit IRC | 11:43 | |
| tigert | hmm | 11:43 |
| tigert | but that is interesting, I wonder if it would be easy to add ctrl-key for example | 11:43 |
| tigert | to the vkbd | 11:43 |
| tigert | and esc | 11:43 |
| tigert | for vi :) | 11:43 |
| dwd | tigert: I thought twirly-arrow was escape anyway? | 11:45 |
| AD-N770 | tigert I use to carry the N770 in a bag with keys, phone, a portable hard drive and something more :) | 11:45 |
| tigert | dwd: oh maybe yeah | 11:45 |
| tigert | AD-N770: yes. keep it in your butt pocket :) | 11:45 |
| tigert | when walking | 11:45 |
| dwd | Although making the menu/home keys be shift/ctrl when the vkb is shown would be very funky. | 11:45 |
| osfameron | does N(770|800) plug into external hard drives ? | 11:45 |
| tigert | osfameron: not out of the box | 11:46 |
| AD-N770 | no osfameron as I know | 11:46 |
| tigert | you can hack it though, but it needs a powered usb hub | 11:46 |
| dwd | osfameron: It's 770|N800. | 11:46 |
| osfameron | bah! | 11:46 |
| tigert | osfameron: the usb port can work in "host" mode, so it is possible, but it cannot naturally give out enough power for a harddisk | 11:46 |
| dwd | A powered drive would also work, I think. (I have one. Hmmmm) | 11:46 |
| osfameron | like an ipod for e xample? | 11:47 |
| tigert | but I havent tried it - the wiki has some info | 11:47 |
| dwd | osfameron: Ah. That might work too. | 11:47 |
| osfameron | powered hub would be fine for home, but it'd be nice to have something portable | 11:47 |
| * dwd wonders about using a 770 and an external drive to an N800. | 11:48 | |
| *** stanl3y has joined #maemo | 11:48 | |
| stanl3y | good morning all | 11:48 |
| *** seebs has joined #maemo | 11:48 | |
| * jtra would like to have home, end, pgup, pgdn key and ctrl modifier on vkb | 11:49 | |
| seebs | Hey, um, total stupid newbie question: Where would I find documentation on the webcam hardware/driver/etc. for the N800? | 11:50 |
| keesj | ctrl and esc would be nice | 11:50 |
| Jaffa | tigert: can the N800's USB port go into unpowered host mode? There's some question about that on the ITT forums. | 11:51 |
| jtra | I use the 'back' hardware key as esc, that works well | 11:51 |
| AD-N770 | seebs you can use gstreamer | 11:51 |
| AD-N770 | to use webcam in your software | 11:51 |
| seebs | Cool. | 11:51 |
| *** Guardian has joined #maemo | 11:52 | |
| seebs | I am a little confused by scratchbox setup. The maemo setup script insists that I ought to have a scratchbox environment set up, but obviously, there's no rootstrap for me to use until I've installed maemo. | 11:53 |
| seebs | So I assume I should set up an environment without a rootstrap, then run the maemo installer, then re-run sb-menu to pick the newly installed stuff? | 11:53 |
| Guardian | i found the tutorial to be pretty clear | 11:55 |
| AD-N770 | no seebs If you use the scripts everythink is installed | 11:56 |
| seebs | Hmm. Maybe I'm reading the wrong thing; there's both maemo and scratchbox instructions. | 11:56 |
| part | seebs: install scratchbox first, then use the installer | 11:56 |
| AD-N770 | seebs: gst-launch-0.10 v4lsrc ! xvimagesink should work on the N800 | 11:56 |
| seebs | Okay. If I run "maemo-sdk-install_3.0.sh" without my user account set up for scratchbox, it gives warnings and errors, which I was distrustful of. I will attempt to do it cleanly and see what happens. | 11:57 |
| seebs | AD, thanks. | 11:57 |
| seebs | All I really care about is the ability to extract a single frame of video in any recognizeable format, the rest is window-dressing. :) | 11:58 |
| seebs | Hmm. | 12:07 |
| seebs | # /scratchbox/run_me_first.sh | 12:08 |
| seebs | Do you want to use sudo mode? [yes/no] (no): | 12:08 |
| seebs | Give the name of the scratchbox group (sbox): | 12:08 |
| seebs | The group 'sbox' does not seem to exist! | 12:08 |
| seebs | Would you like me to create the group 'sbox' for you? [yes/no] (yes): | 12:08 |
| seebs | Creating group "sbox"... | 12:08 |
| seebs | Stopping Scratchbox: umount, mount: none already mounted or /proc/sys/fs/binfmt_misc busy | 12:08 |
| seebs | mount: according to mtab, none is already mounted on /proc/sys/fs/binfmt_misc | 12:08 |
| seebs | binfmt_misc. | 12:08 |
| seebs | Starting Scratchbox: binfmt_misc, mount. | 12:08 |
| seebs | There is indeed a "binfmt_misc" already; why is this grounds to stop Scratchbox? | 12:08 |
| suihkulokki | it's just restarting it | 12:09 |
| seebs | Oh, okay. | 12:09 |
| seebs | Doh! Now that I read the script, it's obvious. | 12:09 |
| seebs | I must have a caffeine deficiency. | 12:10 |
| tigert | yea, just first time startup | 12:12 |
| seebs | Okay, I'm installed and I've added my user, relogged, now running the maemo script. | 12:12 |
| seebs | Man, this is SOOO much nicer than old-school cross-compiling. | 12:13 |
| seebs | Hmm. | 12:22 |
| seebs | + /scratchbox/tools/bin/sb-conf setup SDK_ARMEL --force --compiler=cs2005q3.2-glibc-arm --devkits=perl:debian:doctools:cputransp --cputransp=qemu-arm-0.8.1-sb2 | 12:22 |
| seebs | You dont have active target in scratchbox chroot. | 12:22 |
| seebs | Please create one by running "sb-menu" before continuing | 12:22 |
| seebs | I assume I can just ignore that. | 12:22 |
| c0ffee | yes | 12:24 |
| c0ffee | errors are to be ignored | 12:24 |
| c0ffee | (until you can't ignore them any longer) | 12:24 |
| seebs | I think that's what threw me off before. | 12:24 |
| *** X-Fade_ is now known as X-Fade | 12:26 | |
| *** Pooh22 has joined #maemo | 12:27 | |
| *** keesj has left #maemo | 12:33 | |
| AD-N770 | please, someone with a N800 could give me a valid MAC address in order to download the firmware at http://maemo.org/downloads/nokia_N800.php | 12:36 |
| AD-N770 | the prototype MAC address isn't recognized :) | 12:36 |
| X-Fade | tigert: there? | 12:37 |
| seebs | Sure, hang on a sec. | 12:37 |
| seebs | host nokia800 { hardware ethernet 00:19:4f:d4:e7:93; } | 12:38 |
| seebs | One of the few definite advantages of a DHCP server configured to only respond to recognized hosts. :) | 12:38 |
| tigert | yes | 12:39 |
| AD-N770 | thanks seebs | 12:39 |
| c0ffee | hum nice | 12:39 |
| c0ffee | you know that the channel is logged automatically and published on the net meanwhile :) | 12:39 |
| X-Fade | tigert: About the planet page on test.maemo. What are the plans there? | 12:40 |
| X-Fade | tigert: Style etc? | 12:40 |
| tigert | needs work :) | 12:40 |
| tigert | feel free to suggest something | 12:40 |
| tigert | it needs to show the articles too though | 12:40 |
| tigert | not just headlines | 12:40 |
| tigert | but talk to ferenc about that | 12:41 |
| seebs | I am not aware of anything prohibiting me from telling people the MAC address of a piece of hardware I own. | 12:41 |
| tigert | I dont have admin rights on the site | 12:41 |
| X-Fade | tigert: yeah, first 2 or 3 paragraphs.. | 12:41 |
| tigert | X-Fade: yeah | 12:41 |
| c0ffee | sure, no offense :) | 12:41 |
| X-Fade | tigert: I have been fixing a lot of problems in html lately, but the sync server is borked.. | 12:41 |
| seebs | But yeah, I just assume anything on any IRC channel is public. After the number of times I've seen people react poorly to discovering that something they POSTED ON THE !#@$@ INTERNET became public knowledge, I'm probably immune to the delusion of internet privacy. | 12:42 |
| tigert | X-Fade: right | 12:42 |
| tigert | X-Fade: still? duh. | 12:42 |
| X-Fade | tigert: Yeah, still.. Or again, I don't know. | 12:42 |
| seebs | Doubtless, someone will some day realize that my brilliant "research" on the N800 consisted of hanging out in an IRC channel where smart people told me everything I needed to know. | 12:42 |
| tigert | X-Fade: I think "again" then | 12:43 |
| seebs | I suppose, strictly speaking, crediting the channel in the article is probably working against my reputation for omniscience. | 12:43 |
| X-Fade | tigert: That really slows my activitities down a bit :( | 12:43 |
| tigert | seebs: just say "maemo developer and user community" | 12:43 |
| tigert | X-Fade: ferenc knows a lot more about the serverside | 12:43 |
| seebs | Heh. | 12:43 |
| X-Fade | tigert: Yeah, he knows about it. I'm sure we're going to work it out ;) | 12:44 |
| seebs | My thinking is that referring to the "freenode #maemo channel" will help readers more than just handwaving and saying there's something somewhere. | 12:44 |
| tigert | X-Fade: thanks for help on this btw | 12:44 |
| X-Fade | tigert: I just wanted your take on the layout for the planet. If you wanted some certain styling? | 12:44 |
| tigert | seebs: yeah | 12:44 |
| tigert | X-Fade: well, as long as it looks nice | 12:44 |
| X-Fade | tigert: planet.gnome style ;) | 12:45 |
| tigert | I dont want to be a style dictator here, I did the site basic design | 12:45 |
| tigert | but planet gnome bubbles style could be nice | 12:45 |
| tigert | we cannot snatch the design as-is though | 12:45 |
| tigert | but we can do something similar | 12:45 |
| tigert | I can provide some graphics if you want | 12:45 |
| X-Fade | tigert: I'm not sure how to incorporate it in the current layout.. | 12:45 |
| tigert | but I moderately suck at CSS :( | 12:45 |
| tigert | as you can see from all the breakage | 12:45 |
| X-Fade | tigert: I'll do the css.. | 12:45 |
| X-Fade | tigert: But you are the inkscape master :) | 12:46 |
| tigert | but you can for example draw something very simple | 12:46 |
| tigert | and I can redo the pixels | 12:46 |
| tigert | hackergotchis should be there | 12:46 |
| tigert | it is one of the best inventions in planet gnome | 12:46 |
| tigert | since it makes you know people by face | 12:46 |
| X-Fade | tigert: Do you think you can make some kind of maemo styled bubble? | 12:46 |
| tigert | yeah | 12:47 |
| tigert | let me try | 12:47 |
| X-Fade | Let me check if I can find the source for the planet page :) | 12:47 |
| X-Fade | Hmm, nope. Isn't in svn. I'll mail to the list. | 12:50 |
| tigert | mail it to my nick at gmail | 12:50 |
| tigert | since I cannot access work mail today | 12:50 |
| tigert | working remote today due to a move in the office | 12:50 |
| X-Fade | I'll CC you then.. | 12:50 |
| Jaffa | I think the planet.gnome style bubbles are tacky and space wasting, but that might just be me. | 12:51 |
| Jaffa | The current planet.maemo layout isn't too bad (although a bit old-skool) | 12:52 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: You can always just subscribe to the feed ;) | 12:52 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: ...although not on an N800 | 12:52 |
| X-Fade | Not?!? | 12:52 |
| Jaffa | Although, you could make it a bit feed-like: make the articles collapsible, and remember which have been collapsed by a user in a cookie (all can be done in JS so no server side support needed) | 12:53 |
| Jaffa | Would make it a bit more usable as then you can collapse everything you've read | 12:53 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: people are saying it crashes it - I suggested they file a bug | 12:53 |
| * Jaffa has no N800 to verify, though. | 12:53 | |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Me neither. Can't confirm it :) | 12:54 |
| Jaffa | Actually, a planet enhancement which would be good is a maximum size for images. I've no idea how you'd do it, though. | 12:54 |
| seebs | What do you want confirmed? | 12:55 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: You can javascript that. | 12:55 |
| seebs | My N800 is currently serving as a valuable surface for pulling dust from the air until I finish learning Debian package management. I could test something. | 12:55 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: walk the DOM for IMG elements and check the size, scaling maintaining the aspect ratio if necessary. Yeah, that should work. | 12:55 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Well maximum pixel size. Bytesize, I don't know.. | 12:55 |
| seebs | BTW, this product marks a milestone in consumer product development; it's a portable gizmo with an LCD screen that, so far as I can tell, comes with a good screen protector already on it. | 12:56 |
| X-Fade | seebs: I still have the original protection film on my 1.5 year old nokia phone too ;) | 12:57 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: yeah, I meant pixel size - byte size is annoying but not much can be done there. | 12:57 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: it's just atm there're some large images on planet.maemo which could do with being scaled, but you can't dictate to people what to put in their blog. | 12:57 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: the JavaScrcipt could also register an onclick handler to scale them back up. Oooh, that could be switch. | 12:58 |
| *** alump_ is now known as alump | 12:59 | |
| *** loicm has left #maemo | 12:59 | |
| seebs | I don't think I've ever had a product come with a screen protector you could actually leave on it and use the product before. I've had the loose plastic that's protective but ugly, but never a good one. | 13:00 |
| *** Pio_ has joined #maemo | 13:03 | |
| *** Pio has quit IRC | 13:03 | |
| tigert | I think the bubbles are good in planet gnome | 13:03 |
| tigert | the original design was a LOT larger | 13:03 |
| tigert | this steven-garrity goodness is a lot nicer | 13:03 |
| tigert | I think steven did it | 13:03 |
| tigert | but the idea of associating a bubble of talk with a speaking head is good | 13:04 |
| tigert | as long as its not too large | 13:04 |
| tigert | I can try to make the bubble a bit smaller thouhg | 13:04 |
| X-Fade | tigert: Give it a plankton like look? :) | 13:07 |
| tigert | yeah | 13:08 |
| X-Fade | With the title in the 'statusbar' :) | 13:08 |
| X-Fade | tigert: You should have my mail btw. | 13:08 |
| tigert | ok | 13:08 |
| *** HGFB has joined #maemo | 13:08 | |
| tigert | yea, got it | 13:09 |
| *** Fatal has quit IRC | 13:11 | |
| *** konttori has quit IRC | 13:12 | |
| *** konttori has joined #maemo | 13:12 | |
| seebs | Hmm. The hello world applet doesn't seem to build on the new 3.0 build environment; config.sub has been linked to something in /scratchbox/.../libtool, which is missing. | 13:13 |
| *** konttori_ has joined #maemo | 13:15 | |
| *** konttori has quit IRC | 13:15 | |
| seebs | Looks like it just needs to be relinked. | 13:16 |
| *** Fatal has joined #maemo | 13:16 | |
| *** elpaso has left #maemo | 13:17 | |
| *** Cwiiis has quit IRC | 13:17 | |
| * Jaffa shrugs - although the implementation is nice - I really dislike the planet.gnome theme: it just looks cheesy and gimmicky. Not my call, though ;-) | 13:17 | |
| *** keesj has joined #maemo | 13:18 | |
| *** luck has joined #maemo | 13:18 | |
| *** Fatal has quit IRC | 13:20 | |
| *** Fatal has joined #maemo | 13:21 | |
| *** elpaso has joined #maemo | 13:25 | |
| dieguito | Jaffa: this one is pretty neat: http://planet.hula-project.org/ | 13:25 |
| *** bergie has joined #maemo | 13:27 | |
| *** viviout is now known as vivijim | 13:30 | |
| seebs | Hmm. Can anyone suggest why the hello-world package would be rejected by my N800 as "incompatible"? My one guess is that the architecture should be "armel" instead of "arm". | 13:31 |
| AD-N770 | seebs yes, should be armel :) | 13:32 |
| seebs | Okay. | 13:32 |
| seebs | So, the package comes with a debian/control file which says "architecture any". dpkg-buildpackage creates a package in which it says "arm". | 13:33 |
| koen | surprisingly 'armel' is incompatible with 'arm' | 13:33 |
| *** qgil has joined #maemo | 13:33 | |
| seebs | If I change debian/control to say "armel", dpkg-buildpackage refuses, because it thinks it's building for arm, not armel. | 13:33 |
| tigert | seebs: you have an arm rootstrap? | 13:33 |
| seebs | "sbox-SDK_ARMEL" makes me think armel is correct. | 13:33 |
| tigert | and environment in scratchbox? | 13:33 |
| seebs | The rootstrap I unpacked was the maemo SDK_ARMEL one. I thought. | 13:34 |
| seebs | I have a bunch of scratchbox-devkit files for i386, which makes sense because that's the host environment. I'm not sure where it's getting the idea that the target is arm, rather than armel. | 13:36 |
| dwd | seebs: I like your C IAQ. | 13:36 |
| seebs | Well, wait, cs2005q3.2-glibc-arm... Should that be -armel? | 13:36 |
| seebs | dwd, thanks! | 13:37 |
| seebs | You would not BELIEVE how many people have corrected it. | 13:37 |
| *** Eloi has joined #maemo | 13:37 | |
| lindi- | seebs: strace -o s -f -s4096 dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot && grep arm s to figure out where 'arm' comes from? ;) | 13:37 |
| seebs | One guy made it up through Section 7 correcting tons of errors. Even worse, he was wrong more often than the IAQ was. | 13:37 |
| seebs | That might be overkill. :) | 13:37 |
| dwd | seebs: Section 7 is, I'd have thought, a sufficient giveaway. :-) | 13:38 |
| seebs | Still, better than nothing. | 13:38 |
| seebs | It was amazing. In at least one case, he pointed out that a particularly wrong answer would have been better as a humorous non-answer like one of the others, so he clearly knew there were jokes in the document! | 13:38 |
| *** pvanhoof has joined #maemo | 13:39 | |
| lindi- | seebs: dpkg-architecture seems to print it | 13:39 |
| seebs | [sbox-SDK_ARMEL: ~/0.4] > dpkg-architecture | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_BUILD_ARCH=arm | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_BUILD_GNU_CPU=arm | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_BUILD_GNU_SYSTEM=linux | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_BUILD_GNU_TYPE=arm-linux | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_HOST_ARCH=arm | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_HOST_GNU_CPU=arm | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_HOST_GNU_SYSTEM=linux | 13:40 |
| seebs | DEB_HOST_GNU_TYPE=arm-linux | 13:40 |
| seebs | Well, that's it, sure enough. Now how do I change that, I wonder! | 13:40 |
| *** MoRpHeUz has joined #maemo | 13:41 | |
| *** _k-s_ has joined #maemo | 13:42 | |
| suihkulokki | seebs: try recreating the target | 13:42 |
| dieguito | hmm, silly question: I have this gnome app and I use its ./autogen.sh but it says I'm missing macros (right after printing: Checking for forbidden M4 macros...), why's that | 13:42 |
| Jaffa | dieguito: that seems an almost-as-nice-as-p.g.o implementation of the same, hideous idea ;-) | 13:43 |
| dieguito | ah you don't like the bubble idea | 13:44 |
| Jaffa | Nope :) | 13:46 |
| Jaffa | I think it wastes space and changes the point of the site from an aggregation site to one of a conversation between people who know each other. | 13:47 |
| * Jaffa doesn't mind too much: I can always usercontent.css or Greasemonkey it away ;-) | 13:47 | |
| koen | Jaffa: in case of pgo it is quite try | 13:49 |
| koen | ehm | 13:49 |
| koen | true | 13:49 |
| seebs | WTF. | 13:50 |
| seebs | [sbox-N800: ~] > dpkg-architecture | 13:50 |
| seebs | unable to get login information for username "seebs" at /scratchbox/devkits/debian-sarge/lib/dpkg/controllib.pl line 59. | 13:50 |
| seebs | That's sorta discouraging. | 13:50 |
| tigert | id seebs | 13:50 |
| tigert | try that? | 13:50 |
| seebs | [sbox-N800: ~] > id | 13:51 |
| seebs | uid=1000 gid=100 groups=16,33(www-data),41(gnats),100,1000 | 13:51 |
| seebs | [sbox-N800: ~] > id seebs | 13:51 |
| seebs | id: seebs: No such user | 13:51 |
| tigert | did you copy the etc etc stuff | 13:51 |
| tigert | erm | 13:51 |
| tigert | strange | 13:51 |
| tigert | cat /etc/passwd ? | 13:51 |
| tigert | does it exist? | 13:51 |
| *** _matthias_ has joined #maemo | 13:51 | |
| seebs | Yes, and I'm not in it. Hmm. | 13:51 |
| seebs | It looks very much like the /etc/passwd for the N800; "user" is uid 29999, gid 29999. | 13:52 |
| tigert | so | 13:52 |
| tigert | in sb-menu | 13:52 |
| tigert | Install -> select your target -> | 13:52 |
| tigert | do NOT install libc, | 13:52 |
| tigert | but install /etc, devkits and fakeroot | 13:52 |
| tigert | afaik its like that | 13:53 |
| seebs | That fixed that, I think. | 13:53 |
| tigert | I think the docs said to not install c-library as the rootstrap provides one you need | 13:53 |
| tigert | so I think you missed that step in the installation | 13:53 |
| tigert | now the arch should wrok too? | 13:53 |
| seebs | ... But I still get "arm" rather than "armel" from dpkg-architecture. | 13:53 |
| tigert | oh | 13:53 |
| tigert | weird | 13:53 |
| tigert | DEB_BUILD_ARCH=armel | 13:53 |
| tigert | what did you choose as your cpu-transp method? | 13:54 |
| seebs | No, DEB_BUILD_ARCH=i386, DEB_HOST_ARCH=arm. | 13:54 |
| tigert | ah | 13:54 |
| tigert | i386 target | 13:54 |
| tigert | okay | 13:54 |
| seebs | qemu-arm-0.8.1-sb2. I don't have a qemu-armel. | 13:55 |
| *** shackan has joined #maemo | 13:55 | |
| seebs | Maybe I should? | 13:55 |
| tigert | I dont either | 13:55 |
| tigert | but | 13:55 |
| suihkulokki | seebs: did you select debian-sarge devkit? You should not select it for armel development. | 13:55 |
| tigert | what did the docs say? | 13:55 |
| seebs | OH! | 13:55 |
| tigert | right | 13:55 |
| seebs | I bet I did select debian-sarge. That's probably it. | 13:55 |
| suihkulokki | this is becoming very much a faq.. | 13:56 |
| seebs | Yeah, I guess it is. | 13:56 |
| seebs | Well, my article will warn people. | 13:56 |
| tigert | I just build under qemu :) | 13:56 |
| tigert | but thats silly and slow | 13:56 |
| tigert | but I dont do much compiling, mostly just the theme-tool stuff | 13:56 |
| tigert | which is fast anyway | 13:56 |
| seebs | VICTORY! Thanks. | 13:57 |
| Jaffa | koen: true, that may be colouring my feelings on the concept - it leaves you feeling very excluded as a casual reader. Something which pmo doesn't suffer from. | 13:59 |
| jtra | seebs: are you seebs of C IAQ fame? | 14:00 |
| tigert | Jaffa: the point of planet gnome IS conversation between people who know each other | 14:00 |
| seebs | jtra: Yup. | 14:00 |
| tigert | of course it is also aggregation site | 14:00 |
| seebs | It turns out I am not the only seebs, though. There's a seebs who runs a Sega collectors web site. | 14:00 |
| tigert | but the heads make also new people "know" those who blog there by face | 14:00 |
| seebs | Ironically, I'm active in some video game stuff, so there's actual potential for confusion. | 14:00 |
| jtra | seebs: ah, nice to meet you - it has inspired me to do IAQ for common lisp few years ago :-) | 14:01 |
| seebs | Cool! | 14:01 |
| *** simon_ has quit IRC | 14:01 | |
| qgil | [OT] Relocation - Day 2. All our home sweet home is almost [1] packed in boxes and it's being loaded in a big truck. Sigh. Sun and nearly 20 degrees in the outside. The neighbours coming and wishing us good luck even if we were plain foreigners just 2 years ago. I'm enjoying once more the views from the roof of our house in the top of a cliff - http://desdeamericaconamor.org/blog/files/images//casapanorama-88.XL.jpg | At the same time I'm | 14:02 |
| qgil | [1] The last object left out of the box is the access point, resisting as a captain of the ship, connected to the adsl line and allowing me to send you these lines... | 14:02 |
| seebs | And really, I'm not NORMALLY this stupid. | 14:03 |
| tigert | ".. the same time I'm[clipped the rest]" | 14:03 |
| jtra | seebs: here http://www.cliki.net/Infrequently%20Asked%20Questions | 14:03 |
| tigert | qgil: welcome :) | 14:03 |
| qgil | :) | 14:03 |
| tigert | the snow has stayed so far | 14:03 |
| *** k-s[AWAY] has quit IRC | 14:04 | |
| tigert | but its just 2cm | 14:04 |
| seebs | I love the short bus one. | 14:04 |
| qgil | tigert: thanks, this way we can get used progressively until the 1,50m :) | 14:04 |
| jtra | seebs: yeah, but for most of the questions and answers it requires to know common lisp well | 14:07 |
| seebs | Part of the fun of the IAQ is that many of the most obviously stupid answers are technically exactly correct, they're just phrased in a way that makes them sound stupid. | 14:07 |
| seebs | Hey, another newbie question: What's "osso", apart from "a common enough word that Google isn't helping me as much as I'd like"? | 14:08 |
| dwd | seebs: I did, eventually, notice that. | 14:08 |
| Jaffa | tigert: I guess I don't see the value of pMo readers knowing the bloggers by face. Again, it's just my *very* humble opinion and I'm sure you'll get it looking lovely even if I don't think I like the concept ;-) | 14:09 |
| dwd | seebs: It's a layer around dbus which does Magical Things, mostly to do with making your app behave like a Maemo app. | 14:09 |
| tigert | Jaffa: it comes obvious when you visit something like GUADEC | 14:09 |
| dwd | seebs: As opposed to merely looking like one, which Hildon does. | 14:09 |
| jtra | seebs: most of the questions are technically correct yet totally useless and unhelpful in mine IAQ | 14:09 |
| tigert | "OH, YOU are the guy who was blogging about..." | 14:09 |
| Jaffa | tigert: Yeah, and that's useful for pGo, but pMo? | 14:10 |
| tigert | Jaffa: it helps a lot to recognize newcomers who have been blogging actively | 14:10 |
| seebs | So, osso is maemo-specific, then? | 14:10 |
| tigert | Jaffa: well, it helps also if people meet in person somewhere | 14:10 |
| Jaffa | tigert: indeed :) | 14:10 |
| tigert | Jaffa: we dont have conferences on maemo currently, but people do visit guadecs etc | 14:10 |
| tigert | still, it makes stuff more personal imho | 14:11 |
| dwd | seebs: Yes. | 14:11 |
| Jaffa | tigert: perhaps if instead of speech bubbles it was just an avatar with the headline to the side and the text wrapping/underneath it wouldn't be so bad. The "speech bubbles" concept just seems really tacky, and the heads take up too much room. | 14:11 |
| seebs | Cool. | 14:11 |
| tigert | "osso" is the dept at nokia doing maemo stuff and the internet tablet | 14:11 |
| tigert | the name "osso" is on a lot of code too, but it is kinda silly | 14:12 |
| Jaffa | tigert: it'd help if fewer geeks looked like http://xlcus.com/photos/2000-08-04-bobvisit/half/bobvisit15h.jpg and more like http://images.drobe.co.uk/images/cache/a-1d-1_14_aextraamisssanta.jpgimg-nq8.png | 14:12 |
| dwd | seebs: osso provides some simple dbus wrappings, including the context stuff, without which your app doesn't get into the taskbar and also gets killed shortly after launch. | 14:12 |
| tigert | Jaffa: hehehe | 14:12 |
| tigert | :) | 14:12 |
| dwd | seebs: Or shortly after lunch, if you mistype. | 14:12 |
| tigert | Jaffa: http://planet.gnome.org/heads/ | 14:12 |
| tigert | (beware) | 14:12 |
| tigert | not EVERYONE looks like stallman there | 14:13 |
| seebs | Okay. Is there a good home page for dbus, so I can read up on it? <-- trying to learn the whole Maemo thing very quickly. | 14:13 |
| seebs | As an example of C-iaq madness which is actually correct: | 14:13 |
| seebs | A: You have to use a loop. For instance, the following code reads | 14:13 |
| seebs | the numbers zero through 99 into the array a. | 14:13 |
| seebs | for (i = 0; i < 100; ++i) | 14:13 |
| seebs | a[i] = (scanf, ("%d", i)); | 14:13 |
| seebs | Make sure to include <stdio.h>, or this may not work. | 14:13 |
| tigert | seebs: a lot of the technologies in maemo are from GNOME desktop | 14:13 |
| tigert | also freedesktop.org | 14:13 |
| dwd | seebs: dbus isn't a Maemo thing, you can find stuff about it at freedesktop.org | 14:13 |
| guerby | anyone tried openssh or dropbear on N800 yet? no mention on http://maemo.org/maemowiki/OS2007_Tested_Applications | 14:13 |
| tigert | I think dbus page is in freedesktop.org | 14:13 |
| seebs | That does, in fact, do exactly what I said it does, it initializes a[x] to x for x in [0,99] | 14:14 |
| seebs | dwd, thanks. | 14:14 |
| tigert | guerby: I pulled ssh from maemo repository for mistral into N800 and it worked okay | 14:14 |
| tigert | I think | 14:14 |
| seebs | guerby: I think I got dropbear working, but there's no root/rootme anymore, so it's not as useful as I hoped it would be. | 14:14 |
| jtra | seebs: yeah, I remember this and know how it works | 14:14 |
| seebs | I'll probably load it again just so I can scp packages over for testing. | 14:14 |
| *** ferulo has joined #maemo | 14:14 | |
| dwd | seebs: Yes, that one is pretty evil. | 14:15 |
| * tigert wonders what the cannabis leaf is doing on the hackers page :D | 14:15 | |
| guerby | tigert, seebs thanks. I'll be waiting a bit more before messing up OS2006/OS2007 repositories, I don't know what is Nokia proposal to handle this community wise | 14:15 |
| tigert | seebs: there is root/rootme | 14:15 |
| Jaffa | tigert: not a lot: it was going to do something but, ya know, it, erm, got.... distracted.... Ooh, a shiny. | 14:15 |
| part | yeah, "sudo gainroot" still works if you havbe R&D mode on | 14:16 |
| tigert | Jaffa: :) | 14:16 |
| tigert | ssh root@localhost works if you dont have R&D mode | 14:16 |
| tigert | and please change your root password when you install ssh | 14:16 |
| tigert | as its open | 14:16 |
| seebs | Hmm. That's odd, it didn't let me in. I had to do R&D mode. | 14:16 |
| seebs | Maybe I did it wrong in some way. | 14:16 |
| tigert | seebs: maybe your hosts was broken at that time? | 14:17 |
| dwd | seebs: Does becomeroot work on N800? | 14:17 |
| seebs | Dunno. sudo gainroot does if you're in R&D mode. | 14:17 |
| seebs | I don't recall a becomeroot. | 14:17 |
| tigert | ssh root@localhost worked on openssh just fine | 14:17 |
| seebs | Huh. | 14:18 |
| dwd | seebs: The 770 has a package somewhere called becomeroot, which stick stuff in sudoers, allowing you to "sudo su" without a password. | 14:18 |
| ferulo | tigert: I got yesterday the python-camera aplication working | 14:18 |
| tigert | the device has standard OS2007 from the sales package even | 14:18 |
| *** shackan has quit IRC | 14:18 | |
| tigert | ferulo: woot | 14:19 |
| seebs | Cool. Didn't think of that, but it seems like it ought to be easy enough to do. I was thinking of making a package with a setuid shell. :) | 14:19 |
| tigert | ferulo: your own code? | 14:19 |
| ferulo | with a record-stop button | 14:19 |
| tigert | ferulo: neat | 14:19 |
| seebs | I once did a plugin for Safari which executed arbitrary shell commands; the pitch was that it provided compatibility with IE. | 14:19 |
| ferulo | sure it's 30 lines of python | 14:19 |
| tigert | ferulo: I wonder how hard it would be to install a flumotion slave on it | 14:19 |
| tigert | and control it from desktop | 14:19 |
| tigert | ferulo: imagine a bunch of N800's as webcam farm | 14:20 |
| ferulo | humm, maybe flumotion is overkilling | 14:20 |
| tigert | maybe | 14:20 |
| ferulo | we could use farsight rtp thing for streaming | 14:20 |
| seebs | Heh. You guys are way ahead of me; I'm trying to figure out all the maemo development stuff so I can write a tiny little webcam app that just uploads the camera frame every ten seconds or so. | 14:20 |
| tigert | yeah | 14:20 |
| tigert | seebs: yea, we are trying to do the same | 14:20 |
| tigert | need to work together :) | 14:20 |
| tigert | seebs: the gstreamer framework worked nicely | 14:21 |
| ferulo | damm! I left the laptop on the office, so I don't have the code here right now :( | 14:21 |
| tigert | it seems just that the device misses encoding plugins for gst | 14:22 |
| ferulo | yeah, and gst-python is cool | 14:22 |
| tigert | ferulo: neat | 14:22 |
| ferulo | need to figure out the signal/key/event when the camera is rotated | 14:22 |
| tigert | I think I need to get my tablet replaced, the camera switch is clearly misplaced or broken | 14:23 |
| tigert | maybe I need to open it and have a look | 14:23 |
| tigert | perhaps there's just some wire loose or such | 14:23 |
| qgil | seebs: maybe someone answered already but osso = OSSO Team = Open Source Software Operations team at Nokia. Hasn't got a website for its own as team but something can be found at http://opensource.nokia.com/ | 14:23 |
| seebs | Ahh! | 14:23 |
| seebs | Thanks, that helps a lot. | 14:23 |
| tigert | ferulo: maybe theres a dbus signal? :) | 14:23 |
| seebs | ARGH. Most annoying thing about being a writer; random strangers write with questions like "What is the most recent version of UNIX?" | 14:23 |
| ferulo | oh even x event, I don't now | 14:24 |
| tigert | seebs: haha | 14:24 |
| tigert | seebs: "I have Linux 6.0" | 14:24 |
| tigert | (this being a SUSE user) | 14:24 |
| tigert | :) | 14:24 |
| tigert | years ago | 14:24 |
| tigert | "But I got version 7, it must be newer!" | 14:24 |
| tigert | ok | 14:24 |
| tigert | X-Fade: around? | 14:25 |
| ferulo | daniels: ping | 14:25 |
| seebs | I know nothing about gstreamer, never even heard of it until today. I don't do much Linux video stuff. :) | 14:26 |
| seebs | Ahh, but it looks like gstreamer is already installed on the N800, so all I have to do is write code which links against it. Whee! | 14:27 |
| *** booiiing has quit IRC | 14:27 | |
| *** _matthias_ has quit IRC | 14:28 | |
| ferulo | seebs: use python | 14:29 |
| ferulo | it's easier | 14:29 |
| *** _k-s_ has quit IRC | 14:31 | |
| *** booiiing has joined #maemo | 14:31 | |
| *** Pio has joined #maemo | 14:31 | |
| *** Pio_ has quit IRC | 14:32 | |
| gpd | seebs: how did you fix your arm -> armel problem? i had the same thing | 14:33 |
| tigert | seebs: yeah | 14:33 |
| tigert | gpd: dont use the debian-sarge devkit | 14:33 |
| tigert | just "debian" I think | 14:33 |
| gpd | where is that big again? in the setup of the target - or before? | 14:33 |
| AD-N770 | seebs: take a look at my tuner tool for the Nokia 770 | 14:33 |
| AD-N770 | I learnt gstreamer enough to write the app in a week | 14:34 |
| AD-N770 | ssebs: was a self learning project for gstreamer with the following goals: | 14:35 |
| seebs | It's during setup of the target. | 14:35 |
| AD-N770 | 1) learnig how to write a gstreamer plugin | 14:35 |
| gpd | so i should remove my targets in sb-menu and start again - ok | 14:35 |
| seebs | My plan is to dive in now, read up on it until my head hurts, go do something else for a few hours, and try to come back and write a first draft that either displays the video stream or uploads snapshots. | 14:35 |
| AD-N770 | 2) learn how to write an small C app to construct the media pipeline | 14:35 |
| seebs | I'll just modify the hello-world app rather than learning all the fidgety stuff for maemo/osso/gtk, if I can. | 14:36 |
| tigert | someone should write a nice camera app | 14:36 |
| tigert | like, so that you can take photos with exif and all | 14:36 |
| tigert | I can help with the ui if someone is interested | 14:36 |
| tigert | and additionally it could push them as a webcam periodically | 14:36 |
| tigert | its just vga cam, but still | 14:36 |
| *** Pooh22 has quit IRC | 14:37 | |
| seebs | Well, if all goes well, I'll have a minimalist webcam app with a "take picture" button by Monday or so. | 14:37 |
| tigert | yea | 14:37 |
| tigert | keep fer and me in the loop | 14:37 |
| qgil | tigert: when doing that interface you should add a x,y,z coordinates in a corner, showing the info taken from the geolocated GPS, in a Terminator-view fashion | 14:37 |
| seebs | I should definitely install dropbear, the virtual keyboard makes me die. | 14:37 |
| tigert | qgil: yeah :) | 14:37 |
| tigert | oh yeah | 14:38 |
| AD-N770 | I can give some help but currently I'm a bit busy with other projects | 14:38 |
| tigert | this should definitely use geoclue so it'd be the first geolocation aware camera app | 14:38 |
| tigert | AD-N770: its always good to have someone around to ask, thanks | 14:38 |
| qgil | tigert: mmm first? don't think so | 14:38 |
| AD-N770 | seebs openssh works fine for me | 14:38 |
| keesj | seebs, better then dropbear I like synergy | 14:39 |
| seebs | Okay, I could do that too. | 14:39 |
| tigert | qgil: on gnome | 14:39 |
| tigert | linux / oss | 14:39 |
| seebs | I just need SOMETHING that'll let me log in to the box. | 14:39 |
| AD-N770 | try the red pill trick and install it from bora repositories | 14:39 |
| qgil | tigert: then yes :) | 14:39 |
| tigert | seebs: apt-get install ssh? | 14:39 |
| tigert | seebs: that doesnt work? | 14:39 |
| seebs | Huh. Didn't think to try it. | 14:39 |
| AD-N770 | seebs are u root in the n800 ? | 14:40 |
| seebs | Yes. | 14:40 |
| seebs | And no, apt-get doesn't work, it says resource temporarily unavailable for dpkg/lock. Maybe I should close the installer. | 14:40 |
| AD-N770 | do you have the bora repository at /etc/apt/source.list | 14:40 |
| AD-N770 | yes you should | 14:41 |
| tigert | seebs: you need to close the installer yeah | 14:41 |
| *** mako132_ has joined #maemo | 14:41 | |
| ferulo | btw tigert, python on N800 is really faster than 770 | 14:41 |
| tigert | seebs: but it is using the same repositories | 14:41 |
| seebs | Hmm, no ssh package found. | 14:41 |
| tigert | ferulo: its available now? | 14:41 |
| tigert | ferulo: cool | 14:41 |
| AD-N770 | openssh | 14:41 |
| AD-N770 | try apt-cache search ssh | 14:41 |
| ferulo | not sure... it's not on the SDK... it is supposed to be released on extras/garage soon | 14:41 |
| ferulo | but I found packages :) | 14:41 |
| tigert | ferulo: ok | 14:41 |
| tigert | nice | 14:41 |
| ferulo | http://www.maemo.org.br/platform/repository/bora/ | 14:42 |
| seebs | Hmm. I have no /etc/apt/source.list at all, it seems. | 14:42 |
| seebs | Oh, sources.list, plural. | 14:43 |
| seebs | No bora repository. Hmm. | 14:43 |
| AD-N770 | seebs add deb http://repository.maemo.org/ bora free non-free extras | 14:43 |
| AD-N770 | to sources.list | 14:43 |
| AD-N770 | after apt-get update | 14:44 |
| AD-N770 | after apt-get install ssh | 14:44 |
| AD-N770 | or if you prefer try the red pill trick with maemo installer | 14:45 |
| Jaffa | keesj: Synergy must do something to enable the mouse pointer? I wonder if a Bluetooth mouse (even if we need a userland driver) is possible. | 14:45 |
| seebs | Hmm. | 14:45 |
| seebs | Uh-oh. I have no ed. So I just started vi... But I have no escape, either. @#$. <-- failure to think ahead. | 14:45 |
| keesj | Jaffa, I opera shows the pointer sometimes (and I used neko ) | 14:45 |
| keesj | Jaffa, http://www.keesj.dds.nl/n770/oneko/index.html | 14:46 |
| jtra | seebs: hardware key with curved back arrow is ESC | 14:46 |
| AD-N770 | seebs echo "deb http://repository.maemo.org/ bora free non-free extras" >> /etc/apt/sources.list | 14:47 |
| seebs | Excellent. :) | 14:47 |
| seebs | I also added a #maemo comment line in the same format in the hopes that it'll make application manager love me. | 14:48 |
| dwd | seebs: This in scratchbox? I usualy use emacs from outside of it. /scratchbox/users/dwd/ ... in my case. | 14:48 |
| keesj | but a port of the gtk front-end would be welcome | 14:48 |
| seebs | No, not in scratchbox, on the actual gizmo. | 14:48 |
| tigert | seebs: sources.list is also used by application installer, so you can add repositories by either that or via text editor | 14:48 |
| ferulo | marketing differences: http://www.lomascurioso.com/img/fot/telefonica_g.jpg <-- they show a computer with Scandisk :) http://nokia770.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/01/10_n800_lowres.jpg <-- they show a linux kernel book and maemo.org :) | 14:48 |
| seebs | This thing really does seem to have made the shift from "it runs Linux, but it's a little crippled" to "this is a pretty viable computer". | 14:49 |
| seebs | The Zauruses and the 770 always felt cramped. | 14:49 |
| *** Pooh22 has joined #maemo | 14:49 | |
| seebs | Hmm. I have repository.maemo.org in sources.list, but I still seem to get no ssh or openssh from apt-get. Hmm. | 14:50 |
| AD-N770 | seebs apt-get update | 14:51 |
| seebs | Doh! I did that, but I didn't spell "free" correctly. | 14:51 |
| seebs | You know, working in computers is probably the best way to stay humble. | 14:52 |
| AD-N770 | I'll be back in 30min see u later | 14:52 |
| *** shackan has joined #maemo | 14:52 | |
| *** etrunko has joined #maemo | 14:54 | |
| dwd | seebs: I have humbleness thrust upon me. My local LUG has people like Alan Cox, and I work somewhere where I'm below average in RFCs authored. | 14:55 |
| seebs | Heh. I've never actually done an RFC. :) | 14:56 |
| *** Pooh22 has quit IRC | 14:56 | |
| dwd | seebs: I've only done one. My immediate boss has over 10, the boss of the company has over 40. | 14:56 |
| seebs | Cool! | 14:56 |
| seebs | Woot! openssh up, and passwords fixed. | 14:57 |
| seebs | You were right, it does start out as root/rootme. | 14:57 |
| *** epx has joined #maemo | 14:57 | |
| seebs | Oh, the pain. | 14:57 |
| seebs | I've been hanging out on a PS3 forum because I'm doing a project with PS3 Linux. | 14:57 |
| dwd | Has Jaffa asked his traditional daily question yet? | 14:58 |
| seebs | John Carmack said the Cell was hard to program for, so now there's hundreds of posts from non-programmers explaining that Carmack is old and slow and lazy. | 14:58 |
| Fatal | forums are teh lose | 14:58 |
| *** chipi has joined #maemo | 14:58 | |
| seebs | See, if he were a REAL man, he'd love the Cell, and he wouldn't "complain" that it's hard to program for. | 14:58 |
| seebs | My favorite so far is the guy who made fun of me for thinking that floating point math is useful for 3D gaming. | 14:58 |
| ferulo | I remember Carmack writing code for the g200 glx project! | 14:59 |
| *** Ryback_ has joined #maemo | 14:59 | |
| dwd | seebs: Carmack might well find things difficult because his goals are rather higher. Minor mortals merely like to get stuff to work, rather than work perfectly first time fully optimized. | 14:59 |
| seebs | See, if I had the knowledge that comes from being a THIRD YEAR computer science major, I'd totally understand that 3D games use VERTEX and LINEAR ALGEBRA operations. Not floating point. | 14:59 |
| gpd | ok - i should have my scratchbox running correctly now - need to find the vpnc source deb and get compiling | 15:00 |
| seebs | Oh, I love Cell to bits, but there's no denying it's a cast-iron bitch to get things done on. Very very powerful, but you can't just write code and expect it to work well. | 15:00 |
| seebs | He never said you couldn't program it, he just said it was more work to target than other systems, but the fanboys can't accept that this could be true. | 15:00 |
| dwd | seebs: Forgive me for thinking that vertex and linear algebra both used floating point. | 15:00 |
| seebs | So you have all these people talking about how lame and derivative his work is, like UT2K7, which was dull. | 15:01 |
| seebs | And yes, I know he didn't write that. | 15:01 |
| seebs | I sent one of these threads to a game developer I know with a warning that he had better not read it if he had to pee. | 15:01 |
| gpd | http://scriptkiller.de/apt/ <- can't find pool or dists in there? | 15:01 |
| seebs | See, the comp sci guy found out that there's cell-based blade servers, so he was arguing that the main use of Cell will be in "server applications" rather than games. | 15:02 |
| tigert | X-Fade? | 15:02 |
| seebs | I'm sure even the most casual user sees how helpful vector floating point math will be for a web server. | 15:02 |
| *** dieguito is now known as dieguito-zetazet | 15:03 | |
| *** _k-s_ has joined #maemo | 15:04 | |
| *** _k-s_ is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 15:04 | |
| dwd | seebs: Well... It could potentially be useful in anti-spam. But that's the only common server application of floating point, and that's only on the weirder cutting edge. | 15:05 |
| seebs | Hee. | 15:05 |
| seebs | It's amusing, anyway. Delightful watching people who know nothing about computers explain what programming is like. | 15:05 |
| dwd | seebs: It's a nice thing about 770-land, actually. The majority of people tend to be old fogies. | 15:06 |
| seebs | Heh. | 15:07 |
| gpd | ok -- found debian stable vpnc source package and compiled -- time to test :) | 15:08 |
| dwd | Actually, I'd hazard a guess that those Cell-based blades might be pretty nifty in a rendering farm. I'd forgotten about rendering farms. | 15:08 |
| seebs | Oh, yeah, rendering farms are great, but I tend not to think of them as a "server" app, really; in a way, they're just clients for a scenery server. | 15:09 |
| tigert | X-Fade: sent you a mockup | 15:09 |
| gpd | vpnc depends on iproute; however: <- ;( | 15:10 |
| dwd | gpd: Hmmm, yes, but that shoudl compile easily, I'd have thought. | 15:11 |
| X-Fade | tigert: I like it ;) | 15:12 |
| gpd | Unmet build dependencies: libatm1-dev | atm-dev libdb4.2-dev | libdb-dev | libdb2-dev | libdb3-dev lynx | 15:13 |
| gpd | oh dear -- this is turning into a goose chase | 15:13 |
| gpd | those are just build-deps - can i just install on the dev machine? | 15:14 |
| X-Fade | tigert: How about adding a drop shadow to the bubble? Like on the menu bar? | 15:15 |
| gpd | seemingly not... /me scratches head | 15:15 |
| sp3000 | you'd install build deps to the build env | 15:16 |
| sp3000 | unless I'm missing something subtle here :) | 15:17 |
| koen | apt-get build-deps <foo> doesn't work? | 15:17 |
| gpd | in the sbox-SDK_ARMEL (sorry very newbie here) | 15:17 |
| Guardian | should i use the install script if i already have various targets inside my apophis setup ? (mistral,scirocco) | 15:18 |
| Guardian | i guess not :) | 15:18 |
| gpd | koen: sp3000 apt-get build-dep iproute --> done -> still no build ? | 15:21 |
| *** jumpula has joined #maemo | 15:21 | |
| gpd | i think i need to RTFM the scratchbox manual | 15:22 |
| tigert | X-Fade: ack, it has, but I think I forgot to move it a bit | 15:22 |
| X-Fade | tigert: I don't see it in svn yet? | 15:23 |
| dwd | gpd: I think you can fiddle so you're building an iproute without ATM support. | 15:23 |
| tigert | committing | 15:23 |
| tigert | now | 15:23 |
| X-Fade | Ok ;) | 15:23 |
| gpd | dwd - i think i'm just not installing the build-dep stuff in the right place | 15:23 |
| dwd | gpd: Yeah, but there's no point in building ATM support into a 770/N800 iproute deb anyway. :-) | 15:24 |
| X-Fade | I only have to work about 30 hours this weekend, so I think can make the mockup html+css page this weeekend... easily :) | 15:24 |
| gpd | dwd: hmm - maybe i should try and find the scriptkiller.de vpnc source package instead of this vanilla debian one | 15:25 |
| gpd | http://scriptkiller.de/apt <- i am failing to get past that url to find the src packages however | 15:25 |
| dwd | gpd: I suspect it'd still need /sbin/ip and friends. | 15:26 |
| gpd | http://scriptkiller.de/cisco_vpnc_with_nokia_770.php <- no mention of iproute there ? | 15:26 |
| Jaffa | dwd: nope, I've been too busy and figured someone would've mentioned it. | 15:26 |
| Jaffa | dwd: feel free to share my burden | 15:26 |
| dwd | Jaffa: Okay. :-) | 15:26 |
| dwd | So... The traditional question of the day - anyone got a developer discount yet? | 15:27 |
| tigert | no | 15:27 |
| seebs | Didn't try. Someone will probably pay me for an article on it, so it'd be sorta cheating to try to get a discount. | 15:27 |
| *** k-s[AWAY] is now known as k-s | 15:27 | |
| tigert | afaik its not decided yet | 15:28 |
| tigert | but I dont know when, ask carlos | 15:28 |
| *** saispo has quit IRC | 15:28 | |
| *** saispo has joined #maemo | 15:28 | |
| *** aCiDBaSe has joined #maemo | 15:28 | |
| dwd | tigert: That almost counts as information. Careful, you'll set a precedent. | 15:28 |
| framerate|afk | gnuite said on a forum post he "head" he was getting one, but it wasn't official | 15:28 |
| seebs | Hmm. So, gstreamer pretty much requires me to write a plugin to accomplish something like "get the most recent frame from this source" or anything similar, yes? | 15:29 |
| tigert | dwd: I dont know details | 15:29 |
| tigert | so whatever I might spew is not anything relevant | 15:29 |
| tigert | seebs: construct a pipeline | 15:30 |
| seebs | Hmm. I should grab the plugins-good set and see if any of those apply to my situation. | 15:31 |
| tigert | seebs: apt-get install gstreamer-tools | 15:31 |
| tigert | and plugins-good | 15:31 |
| tigert | and then try | 15:31 |
| gpd | http://scriptkiller.de/apt/pool/mistral/main/source/ <- this is my best guess - but nothing | 15:31 |
| tigert | gst-launch-0.10 v4l2src ! xvimagesink | 15:32 |
| tigert | try that | 15:32 |
| sKaBoy | seebs, no, you can use "v4l2src ! fakesink", put a probe on fakesink sink and get the latest frame when you want. Read the application development manual :) | 15:32 |
| seebs | Doh! Thanks. I was looking at the plugin manuals, not the app manual. Doh! | 15:33 |
| sKaBoy | np :) good reading! it's cool to use gstreamer! You can also look at how totem-gstreamer does screenshot if you want to copy some code :) Or the totem-gstreamer thumbnailer.. there a lot of gst examples! | 15:34 |
| k-s | does your n800 flickers? At least much more than 770? | 15:34 |
| gpd | k-s: mine flickers when dimmed - not otherwise | 15:34 |
| seebs | Cool. | 15:35 |
| gpd | k-s: more like pulsing | 15:35 |
| *** chenca has joined #maemo | 15:35 | |
| *** sp3000 has quit IRC | 15:35 | |
| seebs | Haven't seen any flickering or pulsing on mine. | 15:35 |
| seebs | Except the LED, which I'm going to turn off because I'm sick of having it flash at me for no obvious reason. | 15:35 |
| gpd | hmm. no vpnc source deb in that scriptkiller repository according to apt either | 15:38 |
| AD-N770 | I'm back | 15:38 |
| *** mgedmin has joined #maemo | 15:39 | |
| *** __shawn has joined #maemo | 15:39 | |
| tigert | seebs, the led patterns are defined in a config file | 15:42 |
| tigert | mce.ini in /etc/mce iirc | 15:42 |
| seebs | Ahh! | 15:42 |
| *** waite has joined #maemo | 15:45 | |
| Guardian | which repo should i use to install libhildon-input-method-framework-header-sdk-2.0 package ? | 15:58 |
| *** mako132_ has quit IRC | 15:59 | |
| seebs | Hmm. | 16:00 |
| seebs | The gstreamer docs have me stumped on one tiny little detail. I can figure out how to pass things from one source to another, and all. | 16:01 |
| seebs | What I can't figure out is how to, say, extract a particular frame as actual data in any format. | 16:01 |
| seebs | I think this means it's about time to go get some pancakes. Everything is easier after pancakes. | 16:02 |
| gpd | any ideas if tightvncserver can serve the current running X desktop? | 16:02 |
| gpd | it seems to want to create a new one on :1 | 16:02 |
| *** k-s has quit IRC | 16:03 | |
| seebs | BTW, one other dumb newbie question: How does one extract the SD card from the "removable" slot? | 16:03 |
| *** k-s has joined #maemo | 16:03 | |
| *** k-s is now known as k-s[AWAY] | 16:03 | |
| seebs | (n800) | 16:03 |
| seebs | Most of my SD devices, either you push it and it springs out, or you pull the exposed edge; this one's nicely embedded, but doesn't seem to have a spring. | 16:04 |
| gpd | pulling not working? | 16:04 |
| *** k-s[AWAY] is now known as k-s | 16:04 | |
| *** k-s is now known as _k-s_ | 16:04 | |
| seebs | Can't grip it, not enough exposed edge. | 16:04 |
| seebs | I could try pliers, but any time you have a $400 piece of electronics and you get out pliers, the credit card company weeps tears of blood. | 16:04 |
| mgedmin | gpd: IIRC tightvnc can't, but there are at least three other vnc servers that can | 16:05 |
| alump | my mini/micro sd adapter has been left behind twice now, it's nice to try get it out | 16:05 |
| seebs | Off for pancakes, back later. | 16:05 |
| gpd | seebs: hmm -- i agree looks nasty | 16:05 |
| mgedmin | gpd: vino, x11vnc, rfb | 16:05 |
| gpd | mgedmin: thanks - good to know - will try another | 16:06 |
| gpd | mgedmin: any preference? | 16:06 |
| mgedmin | vino, because it's integrated with GNOME desktop that I use | 16:06 |
| mgedmin | enabling it is a checkbox away | 16:07 |
| mgedmin | and it can pop up a dialog asking for confirmation when somebody wants to connect | 16:07 |
| gpd | ok - switching to gnome :) | 16:07 |
| mgedmin | so you know when you're being spied upon :) | 16:07 |
| mgedmin | I do not think vino requires gnome to be running | 16:07 |
| Guardian | which repo should i use to install libhildon-input-method-framework-header-sdk-2.0 package ? i'm trying to use the sample input method plugin tutorial | 16:08 |
| Guardian | libhildon-input-method-header-sdk-dev and libhildon-input-method-framework-header-sdk-dev packages. | 16:09 |
| gpd | mgedmin: working! :) very cool | 16:10 |
| gpd | actually... some problems -- seems not to be refreshing | 16:13 |
| gpd | ie. windows that have been closed still appear | 16:14 |
| Jaffa | Woohoo! mud's built an AM-compatible deb file (complete with icon) from an automake-based tarball. | 16:15 |
| keesj | Jaffa, nice , what is AM-compatible? | 16:16 |
| *** Ryback_ has quit IRC | 16:16 | |
| *** Ryback_ has joined #maemo | 16:16 | |
| *** kender has joined #maemo | 16:17 | |
| Jaffa | keesj: Application Manager, i.e. Section starts "user/" - it's configurable, but defaults to on. | 16:18 |
| Jaffa | i.e. this is the configuration: https://garage.maemo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/trunk/packages/netcat2.xml?root=mud-builder&view=markup | 16:18 |
| Jaffa | ...which builds the deb installed here: http://www.bleb.org/software/770/netcat2.png | 16:19 |
| gpd | hmm. tried x11vnc server and get similar problems with refreshing - implying that it is the viewer not the server | 16:19 |
| keesj | Jaffa, how to you want to handle patches? | 16:20 |
| Jaffa | keesj: for mud itself or the packages it builds? | 16:21 |
| keesj | the packages. | 16:22 |
| keesj | but thinking of it perhaps it just should not do that. perhaps it is better to create a different tool for creating a tar that will build | 16:23 |
| Jaffa | keesj: it looks for a patch in `packages/patch/<pkgname>.patch` | 16:23 |
| keesj | and how will that work with different versions? | 16:23 |
| keesj | (I ask those question because its the kind of problem I had while trying the same) | 16:24 |
| keesj | I just looks a little to clean to me :) I would really like that the tools really is usable by anybody | 16:25 |
| keesj | just allowing pre/post scripts might be enough | 16:25 |
| *** _matthias_ has joined #maemo | 16:26 | |
| Guardian | so on one has a clue about my dependency pb ? anyone ever tried to follow the tutorial ? http://www.maemo.org/platform/docs/howtos/howto_him_bora.html | 16:26 |
| Jaffa | keesj: as the package moves forward and the patch drifts it'll have to be regenerated. However, given the package version is usually in ththe filename of the upstream tarball there is stuff to change anyway | 16:28 |
| Jaffa | keesj: indeed, I'm hoping to make it as flexible as possible. pre/post scripts might work. | 16:29 |
| dragorn | Jaffa: my build desktop blew up, but you should know I'm installing scratchbox on another server just to get hercules built. :P | 16:29 |
| Jaffa | dragorn: excellent :) | 16:29 |
| keesj | and the different mud would be in once cvs? | 16:29 |
| gpd | anyone know if there might be an option on the vncserver that might help with screen refreshing / repainting problems? | 16:31 |
| * _matthias_ is sad | 16:32 | |
| lle2 | daniels: first debian package has been built using sb2 courtesy of Valtteri Rahkonen | 16:32 |
| _matthias_ | first i don't know how to afford a new 800 and i've lost the 770 desk stand called dt-7 obviously | 16:32 |
| daniels | lle2: nice one! | 16:33 |
| _matthias_ | in my summer holidays | 16:33 |
| lle2 | sb2 doesn't really work yet, but it will soon | 16:33 |
| _matthias_ | since then it does not make fun using my bt keyboard anymore | 16:33 |
| _matthias_ | ... does anyone know where to get a new dt-7? | 16:33 |
| daniels | lle2: rocking | 16:33 |
| daniels | lle2: presumably it'll be completely done and ready to take over the world by the time i get back | 16:33 |
| lle2 | daniels: I think I can fit the whole maemo3.0-with-sb2 howto in less than 15 lines | 16:34 |
| lle2 | including five lines devoted to building sb2 itself | 16:34 |
| Jaffa | keesj: exactly. | 16:35 |
| dragorn | Jaffa: Hmm, 'course, scratchbox seems to hate my current host install, so who knows when I'll get around to figuring that one out | 16:35 |
| gpd | ok -- looks like it was beryl related -- with metacity all is well in vncland :D | 16:35 |
| Jaffa | dragorn: ah, if only you could run scratchbox in MVS ;-) | 16:35 |
| dragorn | Jaffa: oh, in theory, I could run linux390 in hercules then run scratchbox in there :P | 16:36 |
| daniels | lle2: bah, just use autotools ;) | 16:36 |
| keesj | lle2, I have started trying to understand sb2, (buildt it) | 16:37 |
| lle2 | daniels: but I do! I use autoconf | 16:37 |
| lle2 | daniels: but yeah, I /could/ fit sb2 building instructions on one line | 16:37 |
| daniels | lle2: i thought sb2 was using your own build system which resembled gar | 16:38 |
| lle2 | daniels: it DOES NOT RESEMBLE GAR!! | 16:38 |
| daniels | and was using autoconf but didn't use it to, y'know, generate the makefiles, or anything | 16:38 |
| daniels | lle2: heh, okay | 16:38 |
| lle2 | I'll positively kill the next person who claims that | 16:38 |
| koen | Jaffa: btw, your MUD thingie is starting to look a lot like OpenEmbedded :) | 16:38 |
| daniels | /t #maemo ask lle2 about GAR | 16:38 |
| lle2 | daniels: it's using configure to figure out the existence of a large number of functions, but that's about all | 16:39 |
| lle2 | rest of llbuild is pure make | 16:39 |
| daniels | lle2: yeah, i've seen it | 16:40 |
| lle2 | daniels: after I rewrote it? | 16:40 |
| keesj | koen, what is this openembeded thing you keep talking about ? | 16:40 |
| lle2 | daniels: it doesn't call make recursively anymore | 16:40 |
| daniels | lle2: whenever you posted it to maemo-developers | 16:40 |
| daniels | lle2: ah, non-recursive is admirable | 16:40 |
| lle2 | daniels: it's _much_ simpler and more functional now | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | koen: true | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | koen: I don't need any of the crosscompile stuff, since Scratchbox can provide that, though. | 16:41 |
| tzz | has anyone had the RSS reader crash on the planet RSS feed? I've had to remove the cache directory twice now. | 16:42 |
| tzz | with a 770 | 16:42 |
| tzz | I think it's a single post that's triggering it, the problem started on Monday | 16:43 |
| *** hub has quit IRC | 16:43 | |
| Jaffa | tzz: check if there's a bug on bugs.maemo.org, if not save off the current RSS feed and attach it to a new issue | 16:43 |
| tzz | I will, just checking if anyone else has had the problem | 16:43 |
| Jaffa | tzz: yeah, I've heard of it before: https://maemo.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=939 | 16:44 |
| Jaffa | There's no attachment there so providing some additional information to that (fairly useless) bug report would help. | 16:44 |
| *** florian_kc has joined #maemo | 16:44 | |
| florian_kc | re | 16:45 |
| Jaffa | i.e. the RSS is changing continually, unless the RSS which is causing the problem is attached to the bug report, when someone comes to it in 3 weeks the problem may not be reproducible. | 16:45 |
| Jaffa | florian_kc: lo | 16:45 |
| kaatis | tzz, there's a lot of images on current planet.maemo.org page. maybe too much for the rss reader.. | 16:45 |
| lle2 | keesj: sb2 is like sb1 but without the chroot and the /scratchbox hierarchy, it does some interesting things with your file access | 16:45 |
| lle2 | keesj: not entirely reliable yet, but progress seems to be about 100x faster than I thought still in early december | 16:46 |
| keesj | but it still requires the toolchains from sb1 | 16:46 |
| Jaffa | kaatis: does the OS 2007 RSS reader handle images, then? I didn't think the 770 one did. | 16:47 |
| keesj | so where will those end up | 16:47 |
| lle2 | keesj: at the moment partly yes, but that'll get fixed | 16:47 |
| lle2 | keesj: I'm aiming at sb2 being able to use any cross-compiler | 16:47 |
| lle2 | keesj: or any compiler in general, doesn't need to be cross | 16:47 |
| lle2 | keesj: it would simply figure it out by itself, it's not too hard to implement | 16:48 |
| kaatis | Jaffa, don't know | 16:48 |
| keesj | lle2, I have seen mostly the bright side of sb1 , and one of those where that everybody had the same stuff and problems | 16:48 |
| lle2 | keesj: currently you still need to edit sb2.config by hand but that'll change | 16:48 |
| tzz | I added the data to bug 939 | 16:49 |
| lle2 | keesj: that's true, but it's a real bitch to maintain | 16:49 |
| keesj | I can imagine, | 16:49 |
| dragorn | my problem with scratchbox right now is I seem to have gotten my system upgraded beyond the point that it wants to compile cleanly :P | 16:49 |
| lle2 | keesj: you could still simulate the same with sb2 by using chroots with a specific version of debian/ubuntu/gentoo/redhat/slackware in it | 16:49 |
| tzz | kaatis: the bug started earlier, on Monday I think, before that entry with lots of images came up | 16:50 |
| lle2 | keesj: but I think the ability to simply use your host distro is enough to more than offset the loss of single unified environment | 16:51 |
| dragorn | lle2: Have you talked to the openwrt guys, btw? If you're looking at building a more genericized scratchbox system, they might definitely be interested. I was pimping scratchbox to mike the last time I was out there and he was pretty interested in it, they might have some energy to spare to help. (or they might not, who knows) | 16:51 |
| lle2 | dragorn: no, I've not talked to them, probably I should | 16:52 |
| dragorn | lle2: buildroot2 is pretty sane as a crossbuild system, but lacks all the runtime emulation and debugging scratchbox does | 16:52 |
| dragorn | lle2: I work w/ mike baker (openwrt founder) if you want me to connect you two at some point | 16:52 |
| Tak | ooo, new upload queues! | 16:53 |
| lle2 | dragorn: that would be nice, I'll probably want to clean up sb2 a little bit more, there are some structural issues to resolve, but after that. shouldn't take more than this weekend | 16:53 |
| dragorn | lle2: Sure. Ping me some other time. He's out until next week anyhow | 16:54 |
| keesj | lle2, I also had a great laugh when reading all the stuff you can do as "ordinary user"http://rahina.org/sb2/ . I sure did not feel like an ordinary user when doing the git clone http://rahina.org/repos/sbox2.git | 16:54 |
| lle2 | keesj: "ordinary" and "normal" are all relative ;P | 16:55 |
| keesj | but that is the same feeling sb1 gave me . look I am a real developer now | 16:56 |
| dragorn | perhaps the word is "unprivileged" ? | 16:56 |
| lle2 | yeah, that would be it | 16:56 |
| lle2 | I would *never* use sb2 as root | 16:57 |
| lle2 | that's just asking for your entire system to be blown to pieces | 16:57 |
| lle2 | after all you're going to be running things like ./configure --prefix=/usr && make && make install | 16:57 |
| dragorn | lle2: which dynlinking are you looking to do on qemu? | 16:58 |
| lle2 | so doing that as root in sb2 without the protection of the chroot of sb1 is crazy | 16:58 |
| lle2 | dragorn: the qemu binary itself needs to be dynamically linked so that the preloaded libsb2.so can do it's magic | 16:59 |
| dragorn | lle2: 'k... um, mine is, on gentoo :) | 16:59 |
| *** qos has joined #maemo | 16:59 | |
| lle2 | dragorn: yeah, I'm on gentoo as well but my cross-compiler is too new for gentoo's qemu | 17:00 |
| dragorn | lle2: I had to build it under gcc-3.4.6, but, it's dynlinked. | 17:00 |
| *** jpetersen_ has joined #maemo | 17:00 | |
| *** jpetersen_ has quit IRC | 17:00 | |
| dragorn | lle2: Everything I found said it can't be built under gcc4 so I just built gcc346 and compiled it there. Ugly solution, but it'll do the trick | 17:00 |
| *** jpetersen_ has joined #maemo | 17:01 | |
| lle2 | dragorn: yup, but it won't help you when your arm-linuc-gcc spits out instructions your qemu-arm doesn't handle | 17:01 |
| florian_kc | jpetersen_: I made a new libmimedir package that includes your patch. | 17:01 |
| dragorn | lle2: I'm missing part of the equation then, I'll just agree since I'm not following ;P I didn't spend a whole lot of time on it, I needed it working for other things at the time. | 17:02 |
| jpetersen_ | florian_kc: thanks | 17:02 |
| lle2 | dragorn: the goal is to use the qemu that's available on the host system | 17:02 |
| *** Ninolinux has joined #maemo | 17:02 | |
| lle2 | dragorn: there's no desire to bundle qemu with sb2 | 17:02 |
| gpd | florian_kc: did you see my other import problem? | 17:02 |
| dragorn | lle2: Ah, so you don't want to have to use the compiler trick and force the host to mess around | 17:03 |
| lle2 | dragorn: but unfortunately gentoo's qemu isn't working for me, totally unrelated to sb2 | 17:03 |
| lle2 | dragorn: I still want to play the sb2 path mapping games with qemu, but it doesn't need to know it's happening | 17:03 |
| gpd | florian_kc: when importing google mail basic.ics: Error reading calendar file syntax error (missing parameter name) | 17:04 |
| dragorn | lle2: Is the "not working" the gcc4/gcc3 problem? | 17:04 |
| lle2 | dragorn: no | 17:04 |
| dragorn | lle2: Ah | 17:04 |
| florian_kc | gpd: that might be the same | 17:04 |
| gpd | florian_kc: that was after installing jpetersen_'s patched version | 17:05 |
| lle2 | beer time! -> | 17:05 |
| *** jpetersen has quit IRC | 17:05 | |
| florian_kc | oops | 17:05 |
| florian_kc | gpd: oh, that's nasty... | 17:06 |
| gpd | florian_kc: can i be of help in diagnosing? | 17:06 |
| gpd | florian_kc: someone had google subscribe working on n800 - but mine fails - i probably have some fancy date stuff going on | 17:07 |
| *** oleavr has joined #maemo | 17:07 | |
| florian_kc | gpd: sure... unluckily error reporting of libmimedir is quite bad. but if you manage to identify a single event that causes this problem and attach the ics with it to a bugreport that would be really nice | 17:08 |
| *** snorkelyd has joined #maemo | 17:08 | |
| gpd | also - minor display issues - the month dropdown looks weird, and the SMTWTF buttons don't fit on the screen in the add event weekly recurrence | 17:08 |
| tzz | Jaffa: mud-builder looks really nice. | 17:09 |
| Jaffa | tzz: thanks :) | 17:10 |
| gpd | florian_kc: btw. absolutely fantastic suite -- i love it | 17:10 |
| Jaffa | tzz: Obviously once the framework's a bit more stable and featureful the aim is to get a) more people submitting new packages; b) other people to assist with the build/upload cycle. | 17:10 |
| tzz | Jaffa: let me know when it's ready for beta, I first heard about it with your e-mail today | 17:11 |
| Jaffa | tzz: you could play with it now if you don't mind breakage. I'm hoping by the end of the weekend it'll be more stable, featureful and - most importantly - documented. | 17:12 |
| tzz | Jaffa: I'd like to use it to package Emacs, that's going to be my first N800 package | 17:12 |
| *** jpetersen_ is now known as jpetersen | 17:12 | |
| Tak | Jaffa: so at what point are you going to aim it at the main debian source repo? ;-) | 17:12 |
| florian_kc | gpd: right... for some reason some widgets look broken in maemo, we have one bug report about such an issue open since 1.0 | 17:13 |
| *** hub has joined #maemo | 17:13 | |
| Jaffa | Tak: that's where <fetch type="debian" /> comes from by default. But I've no desire to cross-compile Debian as a whole in Scratchbox. | 17:13 |
| tzz | Jaffa: right now I'm trying to reduce the number of unnecessary files in the distro, but it's a LOT of small files so it's a bit difficult. The info manuals, for example, are not really needed IMO. | 17:13 |
| florian_kc | gpd: thanks! | 17:13 |
| Jaffa | tzz: no, agreed. | 17:13 |
| Jaffa | tzz: stripping down packages makes sense, e.g. no man pages (by default) | 17:14 |
| gpd | florian_kc: what are your thoughts on some kind of 'subscribe/sync' to a remote vcard file? | 17:14 |
| keesj | and having keywords like in portage gentoo sounds good to me :) | 17:15 |
| keesj | webcam debug doc | 17:15 |
| keesj | But I am one of those guys who never created his onw linux distro so I don't really know what it takes | 17:16 |
| tzz | Jaffa: I see MUD on garage, I'll play with it. | 17:16 |
| florian_kc | gpd: thoughts... yes: a useful sync tool using OpenSync | 17:16 |
| *** Guardian has quit IRC | 17:16 | |
| Jaffa | tzz: ah yeah, did I snip out the URL from my email today? How poor advertising on my part. | 17:16 |
| tzz | Jaffa: btw, you should put the 770encode.pl on garage too | 17:17 |
| * Jaffa thinks garage might be overkill for a single Perl script | 17:17 | |
| tzz | Jaffa: I made some patches for better usability but they are against an old version | 17:17 |
| Jaffa | tzz: ah, send them anyway and I'll try and merge them | 17:17 |
| *** shackan has quit IRC | 17:19 | |
| *** Guardian has joined #maemo | 17:19 | |
| tzz | Jaffa: the big one for me was putting results in a 770 subdirectory | 17:21 |
| tzz | mkdir "770"; | 17:21 |
| tzz | $outFile = "770/$inFile" unless defined $outFile; | 17:21 |
| tzz | 17:21 | |
| tzz | sorry that was supposed to be one line. | 17:21 |
| stanl3y | iam a newbie to maemo and n770 stuff, but looking for a omap platform i found you guys | 17:22 |
| gpd | florian_kc: opensync looks great - thanks (sorry very new tableteer) | 17:22 |
| stanl3y | my question now is, does the scratchbox emulate the complete cpu including the dsp? | 17:22 |
| tzz | Jaffa: the rest I added was for my own use, now that I look at it... Probably not too many people will find it useful. | 17:23 |
| Jaffa | tzz: yeah, that's not something I want though ;-) Need to come up with a way of having it as an option. Maybe it's time to introduce a ~/.770-encoderc specifying options like that so you don't have to specify it on the command line each time. | 17:23 |
| ||cw | i have a bash script I user for encoding, don't recall where i for it | 17:24 |
| ||cw | go tit | 17:24 |
| * ||cw gives up on the typing | 17:24 | |
| *** jose__ has joined #maemo | 17:24 | |
| tzz | Jaffa: yes, you should definitely make the 770encode.pl script a garage app. I'd like to add a web interface to it, so in an Apache environment you can checkmark a bunch of videos and then Ajaxically you'll see when their conversion is ready | 17:24 |
| tzz | go tit! ;) | 17:24 |
| jose__ | hi all | 17:24 |
| jose__ | i am new to maemo, i just installed the 3.0 sdk to start playing with it... i am getting an error installing ssh | 17:25 |
| jose__ | "" | 17:26 |
| jose__ | Setting up ssh (3.8p1-3osso7) ... | 17:26 |
| jose__ | /scratchbox/tools/bin/chgrp: changing group of `/usr/bin/ssh-agent': Operation not permitted | 17:26 |
| florian_kc | gpd: well... in a perfect world you wouldn't ever get in touch with it as long you don't start developein :-) | 17:26 |
| Jaffa | tzz: it'd make sense from a taxonomy point of view to change Media Converter to support the Java app and the Perl script (there was once talk of this many moons ago), given that Media Converter tends to pick up ideas from 770-encode anyway ;-) | 17:26 |
| tzz | Jaffa: yes, for stuff like the rc file and whatnot, you'll get better collaboration with VCS than by doing your own version releases. | 17:26 |
| Jaffa | tzz: or I just stick 770-encode in my own Subversion server | 17:27 |
| ||cw | ah, it's the intereactive one from here http://maemo.org/maemowiki/VideoEncoding , modified to git rid to 2-pass, i didn't see the point when it's going to be shrunk and re-streached so much anyway | 17:27 |
| gpd | florian_kc: i'm not sure i even know what the perfect world looks like with calendar / contacts / email syncing bewteen multiple machines -- google things it is all on their site - but when offline that doesn't help. i suppose we should just expect to be online /all the time/ ;) | 17:28 |
| tzz | Jaffa: that's fine, but you still need a desktop. With a server setup, you can request the video conversion from the 770 and when it's ready you just click on the link | 17:28 |
| tzz | Jaffa: talking about Media Converter here | 17:28 |
| Jaffa | ||cw: I didn't like the interactive angle - I mean, asking for the aspect ratio? I hate telling computers things they already know or could work out. | 17:28 |
| Jaffa | tzz: oh yeah, I meant reuse the garage project, as konttori_ already put mediaconverter under a subdirectory | 17:28 |
| florian_kc | gpd: :-) | 17:28 |
| ||cw | Jaffa: mplayer cna't work that out so well from wmv's | 17:28 |
| stanl3y | did anyone here use omaps dsp in development? | 17:29 |
| ||cw | i think | 17:29 |
| Jaffa | ||cw: it can if it assumes square pixels | 17:29 |
| tzz | Jaffa: regarding SVN: sure, but I thought the point of garage was to keep all the stuff in one place, easy to find, etc. So keeping it on garage, wherever you like, is great by me. | 17:29 |
| Jaffa | tzz: true. I'll have a think over the weekend. | 17:29 |
| *** monteslu has joined #maemo | 17:29 | |
| * Jaffa wants to try out the best presets for an N800, assuming he gets a developer code (<fx:fingers crossed="still"/>) | 17:30 | |
| tzz | Jaffa: about the web conversions: this can be very nice when you can distinguish between 770 and N800 clients, and keep the videos generated for each one separate. Basically you'd have a profile, like the TVersity client profiles, and it would Just Work for everyone. | 17:30 |
| ||cw | hm, how did i work that out in my ruby dvd encoder... | 17:30 |
| *** ferenc has joined #maemo | 17:30 | |
| ||cw | ah, i used lsdvd's output | 17:31 |
| tzz | ferenc: are you bulgarian? | 17:33 |
| *** matt_c has quit IRC | 17:33 | |
| tzz | ferenc: I see the .bg origin :) | 17:34 |
| Jaffa | tzz: VidConvert (http://www.bleb.org/services/vidconvert/) source code might interest you: http://bleb.org/software/770/vidconvert.tar.gz - but it's not quite what you want. | 17:34 |
| tzz | Jaffa: yes, I looked at VidConvert, I have in mind something a lot more interactive, all the work done in the background and live progress bars for each file convrsion you've requested. | 17:35 |
| ferenc | tzz: no, i am Hungarian. just moved to BG for a while. | 17:36 |
| *** bergie has quit IRC | 17:36 | |
| tzz | ferenc: got it. I was born in BG, so I was just curious. | 17:37 |
| *** Ninolinux has left #maemo | 17:37 | |
| Tak | ferenc: it's great having multiple upload queues now! | 17:38 |
| ferenc | Tak: i'm glad you like it. did you test any of them already? | 17:38 |
| Tak | no, I haven't gotten a chance yet | 17:39 |
| *** spect has joined #maemo | 17:39 | |
| *** ntrs has quit IRC | 17:43 | |
| Jaffa | tzz: that'd be very cool. | 17:45 |
| Jaffa | Hmm, I've just realised: I hope Google ranking will be a metric on the developer device programme - a search for "maemo software" puts me top ;-) | 17:46 |
| *** _matthias_ has quit IRC | 17:47 | |
| qgil | Jaffa: gosh! you discovered the s3kr3t system! | 17:47 |
| dwd | Jaffa: I'm the top one for "maemo email" (off maemo.org, anyway) | 17:47 |
| dwd | Jaffa: I feel I ought to say nyah-nyah-ne-nyah-nyah! | 17:48 |
| Tak | hmm, I see a different result | 17:48 |
| Tak | I also see I don't show up in the results :-( | 17:48 |
| framerate|afk | I get the app catalog first in the results | 17:49 |
| dwd | I assumed he meant aside from maemo.org. | 17:49 |
| framerate|afk | well he didn't say :) | 17:49 |
| *** jose__ has quit IRC | 17:51 | |
| *** kender has quit IRC | 17:51 | |
| tko | qgil, funny, we finished packing today as well. I was thinking of making a joke of sorts about iphone announced, osso packing up and closing down but that might be sending the wrong signals.. :) | 17:51 |
| *** ntrs has joined #maemo | 17:52 | |
| qgil | tko: i like your sense of humor | 17:53 |
| Jaffa | dwd: I didn't, but I didn't use quotes around my search term. | 17:53 |
| dwd | Jaffa: Nor me. If I use quotes around my name, though, I have at least the first 100 hits on Google, which is rather alarming. | 17:53 |
| Jaffa | i.e. http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=maemo+software (for framerate|afk / Tak's benefit then) | 17:54 |
| Tak | ah, I searched with the quotes | 17:54 |
| *** HGFB has quit IRC | 17:55 | |
| Jaffa | dwd: Hmm, my name with quotes return 40,200 results all of which are me-related, I think. Scary. | 17:55 |
| *** _matthias_ has joined #maemo | 17:55 | |
| qgil | tko: so big is my new desk that you needed to find a new place? | 17:56 |
| *** jserv2 has quit IRC | 17:56 | |
| tko | qgil, I never thought it that way, but you're probably right :) | 17:57 |
| tko | we should have now at least one quarter of a wing more space, that probably fits your table | 17:58 |
| * qgil 's access point is about to be disconnected - good bye Andalucía, hello Uusimaa! | 17:58 | |
| qgil | bye guys, see/read you on Monday | 17:59 |
| dwd | Jaffa: I get 37,400. But link 132 isn't me, so maybe it's lying. :-) | 17:59 |
| tko | you're just in time, it's getting colder around here :) | 17:59 |
| ferulo | qgil: see you! | 17:59 |
| ferulo | tko: my weather applet says -9 | 18:00 |
| ferulo | so I'm not going shopping | 18:00 |
| qgil | thanks for encouraging! bye noe | 18:00 |
| qgil | now | 18:00 |
| *** qgil has left #maemo | 18:00 | |
| *** matt_c has joined #maemo | 18:01 | |
| Jaffa | dwd: heh :) | 18:03 |
| *** phil|sleep is now known as philipl | 18:07 | |
| *** jpetersen has quit IRC | 18:07 | |
| *** jpetersen has joined #maemo | 18:11 | |
| *** alump has quit IRC | 18:11 | |
| *** oleavr has quit IRC | 18:31 | |
| *** onion has quit IRC | 18:32 | |
| *** sp3000 has joined #maemo | 18:32 | |
| *** fab has quit IRC | 18:32 | |
| *** sp3000 has quit IRC | 18:32 | |
| *** ferulo has quit IRC | 18:36 | |
| *** ferulo has joined #maemo | 18:38 | |
| *** sp3000 has joined #maemo | 18:38 | |
| *** ferulo has quit IRC | 18:39 | |
| *** simon_ has joined #maemo | 18:40 | |
| *** Guardian has quit IRC | 18:40 | |
| sp3000 | and to think I considered gaim on desktop slightly confusing | 18:42 |
| *** sp3000 has quit IRC | 18:43 | |
| ||cw | wtf was that | 18:47 |
| *** qos has quit IRC | 18:49 | |
| Tak | is there a gpilot port? | 18:54 |
| *** pleemans has joined #maemo | 18:54 | |
| tigert | -9 is not cold | 18:55 |
| *** nok has joined #maemo | 18:55 | |
| nok | Hi, is there a way to lock the display and not have it turn on if someone touches it (only turn on by buttons) on the N800? | 18:56 |
| hub | close the lib? | 18:56 |
| * hub runs | 18:56 | |
| hub | s/lib/lid/ | 18:56 |
| nok | or does anyone know to to make it go into sleep mode? | 18:58 |
| tko | give it a pillow? | 18:58 |
| nok | tried that. | 18:58 |
| *** Guardian has joined #maemo | 18:59 | |
| hub | some sedative? | 18:59 |
| hub | ;-) | 18:59 |
| Tak | power button? | 18:59 |
| *** elpaso has left #maemo | 19:01 | |
| *** nok has quit IRC | 19:01 | |
| Guardian | re | 19:03 |
| *** sKaBoy has quit IRC | 19:04 | |
| *** greentux has quit IRC | 19:04 | |
| *** ssvb has quit IRC | 19:08 | |
| *** greentux has joined #maemo | 19:09 | |
| *** kkpaul has joined #maemo | 19:09 | |
| kkpaul | hello | 19:09 |
| kkpaul | is there anybody out there who can tell me waht has happened to all the links referring to dropbear? | 19:11 |
| kkpaul | even the author of dropbear said that he doesn´t know what happened to all those linkt to the maemo port of dropbear | 19:12 |
| Guardian | re | 19:14 |
| Guardian | are there examples of xml file for vkb definition somewhere ? | 19:14 |
| tko | ferenc, oh, how's the new application catalog? does it have all the content, is it ready to replace the wiki page? | 19:14 |
| Guardian | there are such things as <key alpha="ALPHA" size="2"> that seems rather strange to me | 19:14 |
| *** elpaso has joined #maemo | 19:14 | |
| Guardian | alpha="ALPHA" ??? | 19:14 |
| tko | Guardian, didn't mohammad post a link to documentation? | 19:15 |
| Guardian | i'm reading http://www.maemo.org/platform/docs/howtos/howto_him_bora.html#Virtual-kb-xml-file | 19:15 |
| *** philipl is now known as phil|work | 19:15 | |
| Guardian | which is the only documentation about it i'm aware of | 19:15 |
| Guardian | also, it is not clearly explained whether or not HILDON_VKB_LAYOUT_NORMAL layout correspond to fullscreen view (not THUMB) and HILDON_VKB_LAYOUT_SMALL corresponds to windowed view | 19:17 |
| Guardian | i'm just guessing here | 19:18 |
| tko | ah, that's just some xml-dialect for boolean attributes .. some use attr="true" or attr="1" and others use attr="ATTR" or something like that | 19:18 |
| kkpaul | Guardian or tko, may I butt in for a second? | 19:18 |
| Guardian | it seems that in the xml file you define <keysizes> with absolute pixel size but when you switch between fullscreen and windowed view, the same layout gets resized | 19:19 |
| Guardian | kkpaul: don't know about the links | 19:19 |
| kkpaul | k, thanks! I wont ask any further then :) | 19:20 |
| tko | Guardian, there's only two modes I know of, fullscreen aka thumb, and normal | 19:20 |
| tko | kkpaul, if it's about the wiki, see the history? | 19:20 |
| Guardian | tko: however, i just verified with maemopad, when you switch to fullscreen view, the normal keyboard is resized to fullscreen | 19:21 |
| Guardian | well, when switching to fullscreen keys are enlarged a bit | 19:21 |
| tko | Guardian, the app goes fullscreen or the keyboard? | 19:21 |
| Guardian | the app | 19:21 |
| tko | the keyboard is in normal mode | 19:21 |
| kkpaul | tko, its more about if anybody got the dropbear packages for maemo. I searched through all the wikis. from maemo.org to internettablettalk.com and so on :) | 19:21 |
| Guardian | when the app switches to fullscreen, then the keys are a bit larger (to fit the whole width) | 19:22 |
| tko | Guardian, the keyboard has two modes that have nothing to do with the application mode | 19:22 |
| *** oleavr has joined #maemo | 19:22 | |
| tko | Guardian, you can use the thumb keyboard with normal screen app, and also the normal keyboard with full screen app .. they're independent | 19:22 |
| Guardian | however, in the xml file, keysizes are not expressed in terms of percentages, so i wanted to know if those absolute sizes correspond to the im displayed along with an app in windowed mode | 19:22 |
| mgedmin | the vkb xml documentation is very incomplete | 19:23 |
| Guardian | ok so i'm talking about normal mode | 19:23 |
| mgedmin | my experiments show that if you define three keys in a single row, the virtual kb will stretch those keys so they occupy the whole row | 19:23 |
| Guardian | the xml is <keyboard layout="NORMAL" ...> etc | 19:23 |
| oleavr | hi, does anyone know if it's possible to enable USB-networking on the N800 with the latest production image? (the latest developer rootfs is quite broken) | 19:23 |
| mgedmin | I think the sizes are used to determine relative sizes | 19:23 |
| Guardian | inside this markup you refer to keysizes which have absolute pixel sizes (or it seems to so) | 19:24 |
| Guardian | width="35" | 19:24 |
| Guardian | height="35" | 19:24 |
| Guardian | seems to be pixel sizes | 19:24 |
| *** sbaturzio has joined #maemo | 19:24 | |
| Guardian | so, if this normal keyboard gets rescaled when the application switches to fullscreen, does it mean that the sizes in the xml correspond to windowed mode, or the contrary ? | 19:25 |
| sbaturzio | Aloha! | 19:25 |
| mgedmin | Guardian: I think the sizes are relative to each other and do not correspond to any real units | 19:25 |
| mgedmin | as I mentioned, if I made a row with just two keys, both took 50% of the horizontal space of the key section | 19:26 |
| mgedmin | when I made a row with three keys, they all took 33% each | 19:26 |
| Guardian | ok so it's gtk layout management | 19:26 |
| mgedmin | despite both rows using the same size | 19:26 |
| mgedmin | could be | 19:26 |
| tko | the normal layout might force the allocation to be rectangular | 19:27 |
| Guardian | so ... this <keysizes> markup is of no use | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | you can specify relative sizes with it | 19:27 |
| Guardian | or are used only for the thumb keyboard ? | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | no, they are used for both types | 19:27 |
| tko | Guardian, compare the size for Z and X in the example screenshot | 19:27 |
| Guardian | mgedmin: did you succeded in compiling the example given in the tutorial ? i can't manage to satisfy the dependencies on the 2 hildon libs :( | 19:27 |
| mgedmin | Guardian: I didn't try | 19:28 |
| Guardian | tko: yeah right about Z and X, i did not notice that :) | 19:28 |
| mgedmin | tko: any chance of Nokia publishing the XML sources for the default set of .vkb files? | 19:28 |
| tko | but in the end I think the sizes are used relatively anyway, at least horizontally | 19:29 |
| Guardian | ah fuck i have to go :( too bad was an interresting discussion | 19:29 |
| Guardian | tko: would you know how to get the libhildon-input-method-header-sdk-dev and libhildon-input-method-framework-header-sdk-dev packages. ??? | 19:29 |
| tko | mgedmin, hard to see why not, but then again... :) | 19:29 |
| tko | Guardian, you mean they're not installed? | 19:30 |
| Guardian | no they're not | 19:30 |
| Guardian | not on my i386 rootstrap | 19:31 |
| tko | first pkgconfig, now this.. gah | 19:31 |
| mgedmin | the documentation mentions multiple keys and modifier keys, but they are not documented in any more detail | 19:31 |
| Guardian | i decompressed the example, launched autoreconf then configure and it complains about the packages | 19:31 |
| Guardian | i tried to get them with apt without success | 19:31 |
| mgedmin | having a real ctrl key in the vkb would be very useful with xterm | 19:31 |
| Tak | hell yes | 19:31 |
| jtra | yes | 19:31 |
| jtra | and also pgup, pgdn, end and home, which are hard to do with escape sequences | 19:32 |
| Guardian | indeed the .xml files corresponding to the .vkb for each locale would help a lot | 19:32 |
| Guardian | and more details on the key types | 19:32 |
| Guardian | thx for the help, got to go :/ | 19:33 |
| jtra | but that xml doc is not very helpful for those | 19:33 |
| tko | I think the problem with documentation is that the people reviewing the documents aren't trying to is for anything practical, so it would help if you commented on the docs, even if it is a bit late :-/ | 19:33 |
| ferenc | tko: in my opinion the new app catalog is ready. i would appreciate if people started using it and reported problems. | 19:33 |
| *** Guardian has quit IRC | 19:33 | |
| *** florian_kc has quit IRC | 19:33 | |
| tko | ferenc, so it has all the apps from the wiki imported? | 19:33 |
| ferenc | tko: we imported the apps a month ago. | 19:34 |
| tko | oh cool. then we should definitely discourage updates to the wiki | 19:34 |
| *** user__ has joined #maemo | 19:35 | |
| tko | and get it visible in planet and other outlets | 19:35 |
| *** user__ is now known as sp3000 | 19:35 | |
| ferenc | tko: would be nice. somebody at office thought that it is not ready, because we had some IR rendering issues. | 19:36 |
| ferenc | s/IR/IE | 19:36 |
| ferenc | but those are also fixed now.. | 19:37 |
| AD-N770 | I try to flash with bora a N800 prototype | 19:37 |
| AD-N770 | this is the command that I use | 19:37 |
| AD-N770 | ./flasher -F RX-34_2007SE_2.2006.51-6_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin -f -R | 19:37 |
| AD-N770 | sorry flasher-3 | 19:37 |
| AD-N770 | but I'm getting an strange error | 19:38 |
| AD-N770 | USB device found found at bus 005, device address 037 | 19:38 |
| AD-N770 | Found device RX-34, hardware revision 0902 | 19:38 |
| AD-N770 | NOLO version 1.1.0 | 19:38 |
| AD-N770 | Version of 'sw-release': RX-34_2007SE_0.2006.47-9_EX_MR0 | 19:38 |
| AD-N770 | To flash the bootloader, you have to supply the X-Loader image | 19:38 |
| trenka | maemo sdk are cool guys | 19:38 |
| AD-N770 | do you know what I'm doing wrong ? | 19:38 |
| trenka | the flasher has a version not more then 0.x.x | 19:38 |
| tko | ferenc, ugh, the search is always global? I can't search for 'completed' games for 2006 ? | 19:38 |
| trenka | they call it 3. | 19:38 |
| tko | AD-N770, you have a prototype? | 19:39 |
| AD-N770 | I've flasher v0.8.5 (Sep 13 2006) and flasher v0.8.7 (Oct 17 2006) | 19:39 |
| AD-N770 | tko at work | 19:40 |
| AD-N770 | I've one | 19:40 |
| tko | AD-N770, I recall in some cases the flasher wants you to provide the hw revision or something, -h RX-34:<four digit code, probably 0902 in your case> I think | 19:41 |
| sp3000 | ad-n770, sounds like it's not finding a hwrev matching xloader img in the file | 19:41 |
| trenka | AD-N770: you are cool guy too | 19:41 |
| tko | AD-N770, oh, and the public images might lack support for prototypes | 19:41 |
| ferenc | tko: the Keyword is looked up in the description of the application. if you type in game there, then you will not get all the games from the game cetegory :( | 19:41 |
| tko | AD-N770, there's a different image for 'legacy' devices | 19:41 |
| trenka | this is not a discussion for this channel | 19:41 |
| ferenc | tko: which is strange, but that's it | 19:42 |
| AD-N770 | ok | 19:42 |
| tko | ferenc, slightly awkward | 19:42 |
| c0ffee | hoi ferenc | 19:42 |
| ferenc | well, something which we could add, i agree | 19:42 |
| c0ffee | i'll send you the patches tommorow | 19:42 |
| tko | yeah, nothing major anyhow | 19:43 |
| trenka | ferenc: you could not | 19:43 |
| *** oleavr has quit IRC | 19:43 | |
| tko | trenka, yes we can fix the application catalog search | 19:44 |
| *** vivijim has left #maemo | 19:44 | |
| ferenc | trenka: we can fix anything :) | 19:44 |
| trenka | seems I missed the point | 19:44 |
| *** atla has joined #maemo | 19:45 | |
| *** vivijim has joined #maemo | 19:45 | |
| tko | wrong discussion :) | 19:45 |
| ferenc | c0ffee: cool! i'll be waiting for them. | 19:45 |
| trenka | ferenc: anything? try to publish nolo sources | 19:45 |
| * tko wants screenshots! :-9 | 19:46 | |
| ferenc | trenka: OK, you got me. i have no influence on that. pity. | 19:46 |
| ferenc | tko: screenshots of what? N800? | 19:46 |
| suihkulokki | trenka: you are not at beer? | 19:47 |
| suihkulokki | .o( NOLO sources are EMBARASSING to publish ) | 19:47 |
| tko | nah, arguing for opening the sources is always simple. just show how opening the code will bring significant cost savings :) | 19:47 |
| tko | ferenc, screenshots of the applications in the app catalog browse list | 19:47 |
| trenka | suihkulokki: I'm already at home and flaming :) | 19:47 |
| ferenc | tko: ahh yes, i remember now. easy to fix. :) | 19:47 |
| ferenc | tko: but i will forget again unless you add it to the feature requests | 19:48 |
| suihkulokki | trenka: ok :) howabut tomorrow then? | 19:48 |
| *** elpaso has left #maemo | 19:49 | |
| tko | ferenc, ok, looking at the application catalog at the moment, how would I find the place to file requests? (guess I need to file another request about making filing requests easier?) :) | 19:49 |
| trenka | suihkulokki: I like the idea now, would be fine to talk tomorrow ;) | 19:50 |
| ferenc | tko: hmm. you did not read the manual, right? we have a garage project :) | 19:50 |
| *** fab has joined #maemo | 19:50 | |
| trenka | suihkulokki: Goog news from Lennert anyway | 19:51 |
| ferenc | tko: i know.. who reads manuals anyway :) | 19:51 |
| tko | ferenc, just imagine I'm tired, lazy and drunk, and think whether that's something I'd be interested in doing | 19:51 |
| trenka | ferenc: honestly, I read | 19:51 |
| suihkulokki | trenka: yes. very nice news =) | 19:52 |
| ferenc | tko: ok, no probs, you are excused :) | 19:52 |
| ferenc | tko: what happened today after packing? | 19:52 |
| tko | so from the catalog I get to the manual where I can possibly find the garage project or better, a link to the project, and then find the request tracker, ... | 19:53 |
| ferenc | tko: yes, exactly. | 19:53 |
| tko | ferenc, beer and home | 19:53 |
| ferenc | tko: great finish of the hard week ;) | 19:53 |
| tko | rather weird day, really | 19:54 |
| tko | gabriel said it was the first time he left work while it wasn't yet dark :) | 19:54 |
| tzz | someone was asking just now on comp.emacs about a port to the 770. I told them it was planned by me, but I may need help from someone here making sure it works on the 770, since I will only have the N800 to test (just sold my 770), and the older Scratchbox doesn't work on my system. | 19:55 |
| * trenka keeping silent | 19:55 | |
| tzz | actually I assumed that Scratchbox 1.x won't work for developing with Maemo 2.x, is that true? | 19:56 |
| ferenc | tzz: tell me where is it, i will give it a shot and try emacs on 770 | 19:56 |
| *** jtokash has joined #maemo | 19:57 | |
| trenka | tzz: do not worry, they are binary compatible | 19:57 |
| part | tzz: it does work | 19:57 |
| sp3000 | what irc client do people prefer on their it? | 19:57 |
| trenka | ferenc: you are emacs user? | 19:57 |
| sp3000 | irssi is kinda killing me | 19:57 |
| tzz | oh great then, I can build the Maemo 2.x version of Emacs myself :) | 19:57 |
| ferenc | tzz: no, it is not true. we will have a 2.x release which will offer Sbox 1.x, just like bora does it today | 19:58 |
| sp3000 | what with stuck in dumb mode and crashing when I change settings :D | 19:58 |
| part | tzz: you can have 2.x and 3.x in the same scratchbox installation | 19:58 |
| sp3000 | also, don' tell anyone, but, | 19:58 |
| ferenc | trenka: well, xemacs... i like it a lot, but i'm far being a lisp guru | 19:58 |
| sp3000 | I like guis | 19:59 |
| *** jtokash2 has quit IRC | 20:00 | |
| trenka | ferenc: anyway you are not a debian developer. All debian developers around about to hate me | 20:00 |
| *** onion has joined #maemo | 20:01 | |
| part | trenka: why is that? | 20:01 |
| AD-N770 | It's enough for me today | 20:01 |
| sp3000 | ok, um, so if I say /win ct^: uh, what was my prev line? | 20:01 |
| *** mlpug has joined #maemo | 20:01 | |
| AD-N770 | see u in monday | 20:01 |
| *** _k-s_ is now known as k-s | 20:01 | |
| trenka | part: I use emacs | 20:01 |
| *** AD-N770 has quit IRC | 20:01 | |
| ferenc | AD-N770: have a good one, | 20:01 |
| trenka | they use vim | 20:01 |
| tzz | part: to install the Maemo 2.x stuff inside Scratchbox 1.x, I just run the install script? Will it overwrite my existing SDK_* targets? | 20:02 |
| sp3000 | also, editing lines in dumb mode is teh fun. | 20:02 |
| MDK | re | 20:02 |
| obra | Do folks generally actually turn their tablets all the way off when they're pocketing them? | 20:04 |
| mgedmin | I don't | 20:04 |
| *** sp3000 has left #maemo | 20:04 | |
| mgedmin | it takes too long to power off and especially to power on | 20:04 |
| mgedmin | way too long | 20:04 |
| obra | I need to figure out the right balance between "actually sync mail now and then" and "actually have enough battery to use it" | 20:05 |
| gpd | i find it a little annoying - first offline -- then lock keys... | 20:05 |
| framerate|afk | obra: I just lock my screen | 20:05 |
| framerate|afk | I leave it in online mode o.O | 20:05 |
| gpd | online mode wastes battery :( | 20:05 |
| gpd | or so i am told | 20:06 |
| framerate|afk | I still get a good 6 hours on one charge, which meets my expectations | 20:06 |
| *** framerate|afk is now known as framerate | 20:06 | |
| gpd | trying to connect to a friends bluetooth phone -- i have paired with it - but don't see it in the connections list? | 20:06 |
| obra | if it was usb- chargable, that would totally be sufficient ;) | 20:06 |
| gpd | i don't have to have a driver for it i hope? | 20:06 |
| obra | but having to carry around a charger is kind of a pita | 20:06 |
| framerate | Oh if anyone was around yesterday when I couldn't get it to dial up wap.cingular on my blackberry pearl, I tried on my sony ericcson and it worked first time | 20:06 |
| framerate | so it's a blackberry issue, or issue's with my provisioning on my plan (sony is my girlfriends, same account) | 20:07 |
| part | trenka: emacs is included in debian, lots of people use it, even developers | 20:07 |
| mgedmin | I bought an extra charger and keep one at home and one at work | 20:08 |
| mgedmin | well, I actually bought several chargers | 20:08 |
| mgedmin | because the one that came with my 770 broke | 20:08 |
| part | tzz: not sure on the current 2.x sdk on sbox 1, I can check on Monday | 20:08 |
| *** koen has quit IRC | 20:12 | |
| *** eno has left #maemo | 20:12 | |
| vol | framerate: i tried to associate with a blackberry too and it didnt work | 20:13 |
| vol | i am trying the new pulse application that allows you to tether to a blackberry using bt | 20:13 |
| framerate | vol: new pulse application? | 20:15 |
| *** koen has joined #maemo | 20:15 | |
| vol | its a blackberry app that allows you to use normal blackberry data account to tether over bluetooth | 20:15 |
| framerate | vol: Hmm. Does it install ON the blackberry? or a maemo app? I can use my blackberry on my laptop (found a script) | 20:16 |
| vol | it installs on the blackberry | 20:16 |
| framerate | You trying now? Let me know if you have success | 20:17 |
| vol | to add tethering to my account it would be an extra $30/mo but with this tool it just tunnels to a proxy server | 20:17 |
| framerate | yeah I called cingular and they told me the 74.95 plan, which sucks | 20:18 |
| vol | yea thats rediculous, i already have the unlimited data plan, it doesnt make sense to get charged more | 20:18 |
| vol | it works on the laptop, but the 770 does not see the "standard modem" the app shows up as through bluetooth | 20:19 |
| vol | i pair it with the 770 and it gives me a message saying the 770 cannot use any of the services on the blackberry and doesnt let me pair at all | 20:20 |
| vol | I have a bb 8700c | 20:20 |
| framerate | hmm. I pair it with my 8100 (pearl) and it dials, just says "remote server error" | 20:21 |
| hub | what is "thetered" ? | 20:21 |
| hub | I mean "tethered" | 20:22 |
| vol | hub: using the blackberry as bluetooth modem for the 770 | 20:22 |
| hub | ah | 20:22 |
| *** wasabi_ has quit IRC | 20:24 | |
| vol | is there an extra package required to utilize modems over bluetooth? | 20:25 |
| framerate | No, mine worked right out of the box | 20:26 |
| vol | framerate: you might want to look into this app too because it doesnt actually use it as a modem, it emulates a modem for the laptop or other device and just vpns to a proxy server and lets you get out to the internet from there. So to cingular it looks like regular blackberry data traffic | 20:27 |
| *** gummibaerchen has joined #maemo | 20:28 | |
| gpd | hmm -- i'm trying to use a motorla - got it to start 'packet data' on the phone - but it says authentication failed -- it is set to use verizon... do i have to setup all this manual crap? dial up number etc? | 20:29 |
| vol | yea | 20:29 |
| gpd | vol - was that yeah to me? | 20:30 |
| vol | gpd: yea, im not sure of the info cause ive never used verizon but you usually have to provide a # and login/pass to use it | 20:30 |
| gpd | crap - well he doesn't know any of that inifo - so i guess we are screwed | 20:31 |
| vol | you could probably just google it | 20:32 |
| *** Eloi has quit IRC | 20:32 | |
| vol | i found the cingular info on a discussion list | 20:32 |
| gpd | any particular keywords that spring to mind -- verizon bluetooth nokia 770 password dialup... would be my guess | 20:33 |
| gpd | Verizon Wireless intentionally cripples Bluetooth DUN on the Motorola e815, and possibly others. <-- oh dear | 20:34 |
| vol | yea verizon is nice like that | 20:38 |
| gpd | tried ##DIALUP (or the numbers that make dialup) but still no joy... dials -- says 14.4 data on the pohone - then connection failed -- user and pass must still be wrong :( | 20:40 |
| * gpd orders iPhone | 20:41 | |
| * gpd runs | 20:41 | |
| *** ssvb has joined #maemo | 20:41 | |
| *** |tbb| has joined #maemo | 20:43 | |
| |tbb| | hi all | 20:43 |
| * tko kicks gpd | 20:44 | |
| |tbb| | anyone good at perl | 20:44 |
| tko | the interpreter? | 20:44 |
| tzz | I know Perl | 20:44 |
| tko | I know to avoid perl | 20:45 |
| tzz | I know to avoid language wars :P | 20:45 |
| framerate | gpd: they probably cripple it. Verizon is NOT the provider to have to have "hackable" dialup | 20:45 |
| *** koen has quit IRC | 20:47 | |
| *** |tbb| has quit IRC | 20:47 | |
| *** |tbb| has joined #maemo | 20:47 | |
| tzz | tbb: so do you have a Perl question? | 20:48 |
| *** dwd has quit IRC | 20:48 | |
| |tbb| | how can i execute a program from perl not using system cmd | 20:49 |
| MDK | there is one extremally advanced feature of N800 I recently noticed | 20:49 |
| MDK | when you setup an alarm, it will always ring through the speakers | 20:49 |
| MDK | even if you have headphones conntected ;) | 20:49 |
| tzz | why wouldn't you use system()? Do you need a pipe or something? | 20:50 |
| *** wasabi has quit IRC | 20:50 | |
| *** bilboed has quit IRC | 20:50 | |
| MDK | inz: what's the correct way of installing maemo-hackers terminal on bora now? I used to have a custom libvte compiled... | 20:52 |
| MDK | is this still needed? | 20:52 |
| *** dwd has joined #maemo | 20:52 | |
| |tbb| | tzz have u notized the pm? | 20:52 |
| vol | does anyone know if bluetooth DUN has been updated in sardine/herring? | 20:53 |
| tzz | no, I haven't seen a PM. I use ERC on Emacs, maybe it doesn't support it. | 20:53 |
| |tbb| | sial.org/pbot/22330 | 20:55 |
| Disconnect | MDK: there is a new version that works w/o the custom libvte | 20:55 |
| |tbb| | tzz any idea? | 20:57 |
| tzz | tbb: http://sial.org/pbot/22332 | 20:59 |
| * sbaturzio is away: Dinner time... | 20:59 | |
| gpd | http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/cellphones/verizon-slapped-with-wet-noodle-for-crippling-bluetooth-150376.php <-- exactly the phone he has pictured :( | 21:02 |
| |tbb| | tzz the comman runs and the program starts the only problem is that the path of the bitmaps doesnt work, ithink thats because i started it with the system cmd | 21:03 |
| *** obi has quit IRC | 21:03 | |
| tzz | tbb: I understand. Use the full version of system() as I said in my pbot message: system("wine", "pis.exe", "/product:Personal Germany Alps" ...and so on...) | 21:04 |
| tzz | tbb: when you say system("wine pis.exe /product:Personal Germany Alps") that's really 5 arguments as far as Perl is concerned. | 21:04 |
| tzz | tbb: I have to go so good luck with it :) | 21:05 |
| |tbb| | thx | 21:06 |
| |tbb| | i think it works now | 21:06 |
| |tbb| | anyone using navkit? | 21:07 |
| *** matt_c has quit IRC | 21:07 | |
| suihkulokki | system() sends the command to /bin/sh -c | 21:08 |
| |tbb| | i was thinking many ppl here using the navkit :/ | 21:10 |
| *** tzz has quit IRC | 21:10 | |
| *** tzz has joined #maemo | 21:12 | |
| Tak | omg, I totally need to put DON'T PANIC on my 770 cover | 21:14 |
| gpd | Tak++ :D - i had that on my dad't psion 1 thing | 21:14 |
| trenka | part: sorry to back to that topic (about emacs), not here, in Finland :) | 21:14 |
| gpd | found this page: http://wireless-internet-access-provider.com/dun-bluetooth-cingular-verizon-sprint-alltel.html | 21:16 |
| gpd | but still no authentication with verizon -- must be crippled | 21:16 |
| *** Pio has quit IRC | 21:17 | |
| gpd | Tak: in addition to the logo - you need wikipedia on there syncing daily -- or even the BBC HHGG wiki thingy | 21:17 |
| gpd | they also have all the flash games of the HHGG adventure stuff on their site -- | 21:18 |
| *** matt_c has joined #maemo | 21:19 | |
| *** Pio has joined #maemo | 21:20 | |
| *** Tahitibob has joined #maemo | 21:22 | |
| Tak | yeah, it would need wikipedia to merit the phrase | 21:24 |
| gpd | nokia should release an 'ubergeek' version with the Nokia hands replaced with Large Friendly Letters | 21:25 |
| metajack | groupchat in the im app doens't seem to work very well | 21:26 |
| metajack | i just got a white screen and then i couldn't use any of my chats | 21:26 |
| *** user__ has joined #maemo | 21:26 | |
| metajack | (other apps worked fine though) | 21:26 |
| mgedmin | hm, a boot screen with "DON'T PANIC" in large friendly letters would be just the thing when my 770 spontaneously reboots | 21:27 |
| Pio | heh | 21:27 |
| * shapr grins | 21:30 | |
| *** user__ is now known as sp3000 | 21:31 | |
| *** Ryback_ has quit IRC | 21:32 | |
| |tbb| | i have written a perl script which converts kismet logged data (gps) to a suitable format which can be imported to navicore , it parts the data into open networks and closed :) | 21:35 |
| dwd | metajack: I've never got groupchat (As in Jabber MUC) working on the 770 either. | 21:38 |
| metajack | sort of unfortunate since i use MUC _a lot_ | 21:42 |
| dwd | metajack: I use it for work quite a bit. | 21:42 |
| gpd | |tbb|: sounds genius: any idea if Garmin eTrex USB would be compatible in any way with 800? | 21:42 |
| metajack | dwd: you could try the chesspark client. it doesn't seem to work on the n800, but it works on opera on the wii | 21:42 |
| metajack | it has groupchat support and you can use it with any jabber account, even if it was built for chess :) | 21:42 |
| dwd | metajack: Oh, I could use gaim, I think. | 21:42 |
| dwd | metajack: It's just that having gaim solely for MUC seems a bit silly. | 21:43 |
| metajack | yeah. i asked on the dev list (but no one answered yet) if there is some way to hook into the IM functionality | 21:43 |
| metajack | would be nice to be able to just fix that app | 21:43 |
| * dwd ponders looking at the Telepathy XMPP provider and hacking MUC in. | 21:43 | |
| metajack | not having the contacts be sortable is annoying :) | 21:44 |
| metajack | i have to page through like 3 pages of offline people to see who is online | 21:44 |
| * sbaturzio is back (gone 00:45:10) | 21:44 | |
| dwd | metajack: There's a smartgroup for online contacts, though. | 21:45 |
| metajack | dwd: ah, didn't know about that. | 21:45 |
| dwd | metajack: And you can also sort by presence. | 21:47 |
| metajack | ah, i supposed i haven't explored enough yet | 21:49 |
| metajack | i just got it a few days ago :) | 21:49 |
| |tbb| | is it possible to cache the allready readed mails so i dont have to be onlin anytime? | 21:49 |
| shapr | I want to find a picture of the onscreen thumb-board, what keywords should I use in google images? | 21:50 |
| mgedmin | the ones that work :) | 21:51 |
| dwd | A lot of the N800 PR pictures have that showing. | 21:51 |
| mgedmin | I would try nokia 770 thumb keyboard | 21:51 |
| shapr | Too easy - http://www.jan-jansen.be/picture_library/gadgets_post_20060715_5.jpg | 21:51 |
| shapr | :-) | 21:51 |
| gpd | jezus -- turns out this phone is an E815 and there is a whole world of pain associated with DUN and bluetooth -- using the cable is ok it seems. You can flash the thing but that is HACK -- howardforums.com is the place for info. Shame as it is EVDO and we have EVDO signal :( | 21:52 |
| *** s-ndh-c has joined #maemo | 21:52 | |
| shapr | Seems like the smart approach is to check to see if your phone is linux compatible before you buy it :-) | 21:52 |
| s-ndh-c | what are some must have apps for the 770? | 21:53 |
| mgedmin | I don't think linux compatibility is the problem here; rather verizon crippling the bluetooth support on the phone | 21:53 |
| Tak | fceu | 21:53 |
| gpd | shapr: nothing to do with Linux -- it is Verizon cripling the DATA over Bluetooth -- | 21:53 |
| shapr | s-ndh-c: maemo-mapper, xterm, vi, ssh | 21:53 |
| Tak | canola | 21:53 |
| |tbb| | ssh | 21:53 |
| shapr | gpd: Oh | 21:53 |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: xchat | 21:53 |
| Tak | ssh, xterm | 21:53 |
| inz | MDK, Disconnect seems to have answered, but from bora repository it should work | 21:53 |
| |tbb| | kismet gpsd | 21:53 |
| mgedmin | s-ndh-c: FBReader | 21:53 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 21:53 |
| s-ndh-c | what is maemo-mapper? | 21:53 |
| shapr | gpd: I had an unlimited data option with Cingular, but at 1200 baud it wasn't worth $20/month | 21:53 |
| * Disconnect is on tmob, loves it for data | 21:54 | |
| gpd | EVDO is 2mb/s i think - so would be /quite/ tasty | 21:54 |
| s-ndh-c | is it possible to use hid devices with the 770 like a usbkeyboard? | 21:54 |
| mgedmin | s-ndh-c: gps navigation/map viewer that can use google maps | 21:54 |
| shapr | I wonder if upgrading my phone would help... | 21:54 |
| * shapr calls Cingular | 21:54 | |
| |tbb| | i have written a perl script which converts kismet logged data (gps) to a suitable format which can be imported to navicore , it parts the data into open networks and closed :) no1 has answered :/ | 21:54 |
| s-ndh-c | mgedmin: sounds cool | 21:54 |
| shapr | |tbb|: I'd use it. | 21:55 |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: usb host needs (mild) hardware hacking | 21:55 |
| gpd | |tbb|: i answered -- but with a question Oo | 21:55 |
| s-ndh-c | Disconnect: ok will google for that | 21:55 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 21:55 |
| shapr | |tbb|: I don't have a GPS widget, but I'd like to be able to get geoip from open APs. | 21:55 |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: 800 and 770 use the same methods btw | 21:56 |
| gpd | I have a Garmin eTrex Legend C - but no idea if it is compatible -- and looking that up now would lead me into distraction #32 :) | 21:56 |
| |tbb| | where to post somthing like that on internettablet forum? | 21:56 |
| framerate | shapr: what's the problem with Cingular? | 21:56 |
| shapr | s-ndh-c: If you just bought a 770, send it back and get an N800 :-) | 21:56 |
| shapr | framerate: My data speed was a trickle | 21:56 |
| |tbb| | is it possible to upload files there? | 21:56 |
| gpd | |tbb|: how about maemowiki? | 21:57 |
| framerate | if it's EDGE that's probably normal :( | 21:57 |
| shapr | framerate: Birmingham, AL doesn't have UMTS yet, it's only available in Portland, Atlanta and a few other major markets. | 21:57 |
| MDK | inz: yeah, thanks. Works. | 21:57 |
| framerate | shapr: I have a blackberry through them and apparently it won't dialup from the 800 at all, although I can dialup thorugh my laptop.. | 21:57 |
| framerate | and the iPhone being EDGE only as well, Cingular is on a roll to piss off the geeks | 21:58 |
| s-ndh-c | shapr: i have it for 9 month or so | 21:58 |
| shapr | framerate: So I should probably wait until HSDPA is available for Birmingham. | 21:58 |
| s-ndh-c | but i never used it before | 21:58 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 21:58 |
| shapr | s-ndh-c: Oh, ok. I've had mine for a year. | 21:58 |
| shapr | s-ndh-c: Oh no! I used mine ALL THE TIME! | 21:58 |
| shapr | er "use" | 21:58 |
| shapr | I put a bunch of stickers on the hardcover and they're nearly worn off. | 21:58 |
| *** pcfe has quit IRC | 21:58 | |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: got it a year ago and didn't use it till now? thats kinda silly given that the new one is out now :) | 21:58 |
| s-ndh-c | hehe | 21:58 |
| shapr | s-ndh-c: It's worth learning how to use, it's a great tool for me. | 21:59 |
| * Disconnect is gonna turn the 770 into a car nav/music/web system | 21:59 | |
| s-ndh-c | usb keyboard would be very cool | 21:59 |
| shapr | I keep my todo list with gpe-todo, I grab directions with maps.google.com, I talk to my girlfriend with google talk... | 21:59 |
| s-ndh-c | shapr: how does that work? | 21:59 |
| shapr | s-ndh-c: Which? | 22:00 |
| s-ndh-c | i didnt see any micro on the headphones | 22:00 |
| mgedmin | the microphone is built into the tablet itself | 22:00 |
| shapr | There's a mic hole next to the power hole. | 22:00 |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: micro on the 770 (that thing that looks like a reset hole) | 22:00 |
| Disconnect | don't stab the mic with a pin :) | 22:00 |
| shapr | Don't push a paperclip in there! | 22:00 |
| mgedmin | the little hole next to the charger slot | 22:00 |
| |tbb| | is it allowed to put files from navicore to public download? | 22:00 |
| framerate | |tbb|: probably not, but I wish it were.. I already have BT GPS and they're gonna make me buy the whole package :( | 22:01 |
| shapr | framerate: I wish Cingular would give me a GSM bluetooth widget that works like the GPS bluetooth widgets. It would be cheap, I could use my 770 as the front end, and I'd be encouraged to upgrade when UMTS is available. | 22:02 |
| |tbb| | bad what nav software u use? | 22:02 |
| shapr | Hm, maybe I should start making GSM bluetooth widgets... | 22:02 |
| s-ndh-c | shapr: does google maps have maps for other countrys than US too? | 22:02 |
| Tak | yes | 22:03 |
| s-ndh-c | hm i should look at that maybe | 22:03 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:03 |
| mgedmin | s-ndh-c: yes, but they don't have street maps for all the countries in the world, sadly | 22:03 |
| Tak | I was browsing google maps all over europe and australia the other day | 22:03 |
| s-ndh-c | mgedmin: iam from germany, maybe they have some maps from there | 22:04 |
| s-ndh-c | will have a look | 22:04 |
| Disconnect | someone needs to fix maemo-mapper for bora. (yeah, it could be me, if nobody does it soon i will) | 22:04 |
| *** kender has joined #maemo | 22:04 | |
| *** mgedmin has quit IRC | 22:04 | |
| Tak | I'm sure gnuite will once he gets an 800 | 22:05 |
| *** konttori_ has quit IRC | 22:05 | |
| keesj | Disconnect, but also with the new gps api | 22:05 |
| *** mlpug has quit IRC | 22:05 | |
| s-ndh-c | is coding stuff for maemo easy? | 22:05 |
| framerate | Disconnect: someone did, kinda | 22:06 |
| s-ndh-c | compared to pure gtk c/c++ for desktop computers | 22:06 |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: its basically a modified gtk | 22:06 |
| |tbb| | how does the plugin tool called which let u easily connect to a gps module? | 22:06 |
| Disconnect | and some gtk apps work work out of the box | 22:06 |
| framerate | I cant' remember who, but someone yesterday recompiled it and I got it working on my N800 | 22:06 |
| framerate | I can email it to you if you'd like | 22:07 |
| s-ndh-c | Disconnect: yeah it looks like that, hildonapp and hildonwindow seem to be somekind of subclass or modification of gtkapp and gtkwindow | 22:07 |
| Disconnect | cool yah (dc.disconnect gmail) that'd rule :) | 22:07 |
| s-ndh-c | is the new tablet thing much better? | 22:08 |
| dwd | s-ndh-c: That's basically it. Most apps need the menus changing, and in general, a desktop UI isn't quite right on the device. | 22:08 |
| s-ndh-c | maybe i will buy it too, if begin to like the 770 | 22:08 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:08 |
| framerate | Disconnect: should be sent | 22:09 |
| *** dwd has quit IRC | 22:09 | |
| Disconnect | rock, thanks :) | 22:09 |
| Disconnect | just ooc does the gps functionality work? | 22:09 |
| s-ndh-c | but first i have to figure out how to become root | 22:09 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:09 |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: becomeroot package is simple and easy | 22:10 |
| framerate | Yep, I used it last night :) | 22:10 |
| Disconnect | yah it works on 800 too | 22:10 |
| framerate | I think I needed an sql library that wasn't in the repo, but I googled for it and got it and it worked | 22:10 |
| Disconnect | framerate: yah i'm installing it now | 22:11 |
| Disconnect | sqlite db | 22:11 |
| ntrs | Is there an app on the N800 that can dial up through a cell phone and connect to a remote modem? | 22:11 |
| framerate | I wish I knew who it was yesterday who recompiled it :( | 22:11 |
| Disconnect | ntrs: not afaik but minicom (or whatever) could prolly be ported | 22:11 |
| framerate | I'd love to give him credit, and pass the info on to gnuite | 22:11 |
| ntrs | yes, like minicom | 22:11 |
| keesj | the default look and feel of the 770 already starts to feel "old" . The only reason for that i that i have been staring at n800 pictures for to long | 22:11 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:12 |
| ntrs | So minicom is currently not available? | 22:12 |
| ntrs | Can somebody please port it? | 22:12 |
| dragorn | it's a terminal app, ought to be relatively simple to compile if you download sandbox | 22:12 |
| Disconnect | ntrs: it shouldn't be hard to build. or try unpacking the debian-arm deb and copying the bin over, that works remarkably well sometimes | 22:13 |
| |tbb| | is it possible to use the n800 default them on a n770? | 22:13 |
| ||cw | oh dear $deity why | 22:14 |
| ntrs | Disconnect, ok, do you know what is the device that I should use? | 22:14 |
| Disconnect | ntrs: /dev/rfcomm0 probably | 22:14 |
| ntrs | It says "Depends: libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-4), libncurses5 (>= 5.4-1)" | 22:15 |
| ntrs | Are those two already on the n800? | 22:16 |
| ||cw | 770 has a lot of things going for it, but an atractive and usefull theme is not one of them | 22:16 |
| Tak | I will agree with that | 22:16 |
| |tbb| | ? | 22:17 |
| Tak | I was talking with a friend about the n800 - he was basically wetting himself over it, and was literally planning to buy two | 22:17 |
| Tak | he went to his local compusa and used one for a while | 22:17 |
| Tak | the experience totally turned him off (for three reasons) | 22:17 |
| *** framerate is now known as framerate|afk | 22:17 | |
| Tak | 1) he didn't like the ui | 22:18 |
| Tak | 2) he reported that every app took 5-10s to open | 22:18 |
| Tak | 3) he reported that the handwriting recog was unusable, even after he tried to customize it | 22:18 |
| keesj | I do agree with all these points | 22:19 |
| ||cw | I cna't just hand someone my 770 have expect them to do anything usefull with it. I have to train them on what the 3 icons on the left do first | 22:19 |
| |tbb| | 4) it wont cook coffee, cause no coffee machine is integrated:) | 22:20 |
| metajack | do you have to configure the n800 to use either hte keyboard or the recognition, or is there a way to pull up one or the other? | 22:20 |
| *** koen has joined #maemo | 22:21 | |
| obra | I found the handwriting recognition to suck. but the on-screen keyboard...is impressivley good. | 22:21 |
| Disconnect | ||cw: re themes, aqua isn't bad | 22:21 |
| keesj | but I must say that the feature I want the most is skype | 22:21 |
| obra | keesj: have you played with the gizmo client? | 22:21 |
| Disconnect | metajack: if I understand you correctly, yes, you can switch between them on the fly | 22:22 |
| keesj | obra, yes a lot | 22:22 |
| ||cw | i got gizmo to work once. then never again | 22:22 |
| Tak | the onscreen kb is great for me, particularly the thumbboard | 22:22 |
| metajack | Disconnect: how? :) | 22:22 |
| ||cw | I still have a 24 cent credit | 22:22 |
| |tbb| | keejs is it faster as on the 770? | 22:22 |
| Disconnect | metajack: the menu (bottom-left) and input method | 22:22 |
| * pahartik does not understand why persons deliberately get tangled to closed protocols | 22:22 | |
| Disconnect | select keyboard or handwriting | 22:22 |
| keesj | |tbb|, I don't know | 22:22 |
| obra | pahartik: because the implementors do a really fantastic job with the user experience. | 22:23 |
| |tbb| | what do u own? | 22:23 |
| obra | pahartik: it's not ideologically pure. but sometimes practicality trumps ;) | 22:23 |
| keesj | |tbb|, I own a 770 | 22:23 |
| pahartik | obra: damn that | 22:23 |
| Disconnect | pahartik: used a cellphone recently? (or anything with a bios?) ooh, and don't forget those evil internet routers with all their closed source... if you are out here communicating with the world, you too are using "closed" protocols, devices, etc. some people set their acceptability standards differently than you. deal with it. | 22:24 |
| keesj | I like the look of gizmo it was a bit slow | 22:24 |
| obra | pahartik: I build opensource for a living. You're preaching to the choir ;) But in the end, "works" matters. | 22:24 |
| keesj | I't really an application that I have to start etc. | 22:24 |
| |tbb| | i hope it will be faster on the n8 | 22:25 |
| pahartik | Disconnect: yes, I use GPRS for uplink... :) | 22:25 |
| Disconnect | pahartik: its closed, chances are very, very good your phone (or at a minimum the radio/phone portions) are closed, all but maybe 1 or 2 of the devices between you and the irc server are closed...... | 22:26 |
| keesj | I don't follow the conversation any more | 22:26 |
| keesj | it is about skype or gizmo? | 22:27 |
| obra | keesj: I'm going to presume he's talking about skype, since Gizmo is all SIP ;) | 22:27 |
| obra | has anyone had luck installing telomer on an n800? | 22:27 |
| pahartik | Disconnect: and I have not directly used anything with "BIOS" recently, but I have probably used many things with closed firmware | 22:28 |
| Tak | I think the difference is that we don't have a choice where our packets get routed | 22:28 |
| pahartik | Disconnect: ...including partially closed Nokia 770 | 22:28 |
| obra | pahartik: what's the bootloader on your PC? | 22:28 |
| obra | er. below the bootloader | 22:29 |
| obra | actually. there's no way anyone is going to convince the other in this coversation. | 22:29 |
| Disconnect | pahartik: your pc runs without a bios? thats quite a trick. (ditto for your tv, any settop boxes, your radios, etc) | 22:29 |
| obra | "how about that lovely local sports team?" | 22:29 |
| Disconnect | pahartik: unless you've got something productive to say about running skype on the tablet, leave it alone. random "oh no you are teh dumba55 for using closed evil!" is just stupid | 22:30 |
| pahartik | obra: this one I am typing at... OpenFirmware and "yaboot"... others: OpenFirmware and "silo", OpenFirmware with "quik", SRM with "aboot"... RedBoot... | 22:30 |
| obra | pahartik: I'm impressed | 22:31 |
| Disconnect | pahartik: what about the video bios? hdd firmware? monitor firmware (ESP on lcds but its in crts too) .... your phone | 22:31 |
| Disconnect | if true, thats progress, but you still "deliberately get tangled to closed protocols" | 22:32 |
| *** epx has quit IRC | 22:33 | |
| pahartik | Disconnect: SIP is not closed, XMPP is not closed, H.323 is not closed... AFAIK | 22:33 |
| pahartik | Disconnect: it was not supposed to be... flaming(?) | 22:34 |
| Disconnect | ok.. then what did it add to the conversation other than elitist "your a dummy" BS? | 22:35 |
| keesj | But I guess skype will be a real problem once released. because people will try to run it on any device | 22:36 |
| pahartik | Disconnect: I think my point was to increase awareness of less closed alternatives | 22:38 |
| * Disconnect looks around.. anyone here that hasn't heard of jabber before? or google talk? etc? | 22:38 | |
| Tak | can we just call it a misunderstanding and let it go? | 22:38 |
| Disconnect | pahartik: you didn't mention less closed alternatives, you mentioned how you were (presumably) cooler than anyone who was using closed protos | 22:38 |
| Disconnect | and ftr maemo-mapper on n800 works with gps :) but it uses its built-in gps stuff | 22:39 |
| obra | Tak++ | 22:39 |
| s-ndh-c | how am i supposed to get my wlan key into the 770? | 22:42 |
| pahartik | Disconnect: I am unemployed and not too productive... but at least I can pretend to be "cool" on IRC networks | 22:43 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:43 |
| Disconnect | lol | 22:43 |
| Disconnect | s-ndh-c: just select the network and it should prompt | 22:43 |
| s-ndh-c | Disconnect: yeah, but seem to fail at entering it without tipos into the device | 22:43 |
| Jaffa | re | 22:43 |
| s-ndh-c | i seem to have entered a wrong key 3 times now | 22:44 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:44 |
| Disconnect | thats possible too :) | 22:44 |
| s-ndh-c | try no.4 | 22:45 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:45 |
| keesj | perhaps first write it on the notepad and then copy paste it? | 22:46 |
| s-ndh-c | hm thats a good idea | 22:47 |
| keesj | plug it into a pc and copy a file containing the key | 22:47 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 22:47 |
| *** pleemans has quit IRC | 22:52 | |
| s-ndh-c | if i get displayed a red questionmark on the globe icon does that mean something bad? | 23:05 |
| s-ndh-c | i got a popup saying iam conncted to my app using link local ip address | 23:05 |
| Tak | OMG you got the red questionmark! | 23:05 |
| s-ndh-c | but i cant access anything on the internet | 23:06 |
| * Jaffa 's had a genius thought to make patch management in mud-builder easier (given what keesj was saying earlier): Subversion. Add `mud unpack <package>' which unpacks the original tarball, creates a temporary subversion repository from it, and then checks it out, applying any patch over the top and allowing you to svn diff to get a new patch, or svn revert. Bingo. | 23:06 | |
| kender | Jaffa, ;D | 23:06 |
| Jaffa | Maybe even a `mud mkpatch <package>' for the final step to make it even easier. | 23:07 |
| Tak | s-ndh-c: link-local basically means you didn't get a good connection | 23:08 |
| keesj | that does not require svn just diff (like debian doen) but the idea it alright | 23:09 |
| s-ndh-c | the app is two rooms next to me | 23:09 |
| Jaffa | keesj: I'm thinking of revert in particular. | 23:10 |
| s-ndh-c | i have 94% link strength with my builtin intel 11mbit wlan in my laptop | 23:10 |
| s-ndh-c | AP | 23:10 |
| keesj | it's about having a well described workflow with the different steps and a nice structure | 23:10 |
| Jaffa | keesj: indeed, a simple wrapper around diff may be sufficient | 23:10 |
| s-ndh-c | wow it works | 23:11 |
| s-ndh-c | the key has been wrong | 23:11 |
| s-ndh-c | :) | 23:11 |
| Jaffa | keesj: That was my original thought, but then I thought about all the different commands I'd want to add: revert, diff, add (not all new files should be included in the diff) and then realised - hang on, that's svn | 23:11 |
| keesj | Ok! , like when you have to run autogen or similar? | 23:12 |
| Jaffa | keesj: exactly. And so you don't have to faff around with `make clean' or `make distclean' or "doh, this package doesn't have either, ok I'll find . -type f -name '*.o' -exec rm {} \;" etc. | 23:13 |
| *** kw1 has joined #maemo | 23:13 | |
| Disconnect | ok am i just dumb or is there no good way to import poi into maemo mapper? | 23:15 |
| tzz | Jaffa, I like that idea with the temporary package for mud | 23:15 |
| keesj | 1 unpack 2 in svn 3 (edit) 4 (run mud create patch level1) 5 run autogen 6 edit 7 (mud pcreate patch 2) something like that? | 23:16 |
| tzz | jaffa: there isn't much good stuff out there to replace Makefiles anyhow, just ant and scons IIRC | 23:16 |
| Jaffa | keesj: something like that. I'll have a play (maybe this evening when Mrs Jaffa's in bed) and try a few workflows out. | 23:17 |
| Jaffa | Simple. Memorable. Reliable. Those are the keywords :) | 23:17 |
| keesj | sexy | 23:17 |
| Jaffa | Ah, you've met Mrs Jaffa? Oh no, it was another keyword :) | 23:17 |
| Disconnect | simple? | 23:18 |
| Jaffa | Not Mrs Jaffa, mud ;-) | 23:18 |
| *** CraHan has joined #maemo | 23:18 | |
| tzz | I'm playing with the N800 right now. Fast, screen feels weird (too new maybe). I miss the cover already. | 23:19 |
| * Jaffa 's confused so goes to have a nice cup of tea and a sit down and see if Day 5 of 24 is any repetitive. | 23:19 | |
| CraHan | does anyone know if there's a way to press return on the finger keyboard to execute a command in the terminal? | 23:19 |
| Jaffa | s/any /any less / | 23:19 |
| Jaffa | CraHan: there's a backwards L "enter" key below the minimise keyboard and above delete | 23:19 |
| CraHan | yes, but that key doesn't execute the command | 23:20 |
| keesj | CraHan, you can even enter multiple command and only after that press the "send" key | 23:20 |
| CraHan | like the enter key on the regular keyboard does | 23:20 |
| CraHan | send key? | 23:20 |
| Jaffa | CraHan: you sure? I'm sure it does on my 770 using inz's maemo-hackers.org version of the Terminal app | 23:20 |
| *** tbb has joined #maemo | 23:21 | |
| keesj | the thing on the "top right" | 23:21 |
| CraHan | jaffa yeah htat's the one I'm using | 23:21 |
| CraHan | the patched version with font selection support | 23:21 |
| *** |tbb| has quit IRC | 23:21 | |
| tbb | how to add something to maemowiki? | 23:21 |
| CraHan | in my case pressing enter goes to the next line | 23:21 |
| Jaffa | tbb: Just go to http://maemo.org/maemowiki/MyNewPage - and then add links in from an appropriate place | 23:22 |
| Jaffa | CraHan: and it hasn't been executed in the background when you shrink the keyboard back down? | 23:22 |
| tzz | does video work with Google Talk on the N800? | 23:23 |
| *** MoRpHeUz has quit IRC | 23:23 | |
| CraHan | lemme check | 23:23 |
| CraHan | no | 23:23 |
| Disconnect | tzz: it should. send me your talk id and we can test it | 23:23 |
| CraHan | when I press the hide key, the input is in the commandline, but hasn't been executed | 23:23 |
| Disconnect | CraHan: it worked for me | 23:24 |
| CraHan | aaah | 23:24 |
| CraHan | hang on | 23:24 |
| CraHan | yes indeed | 23:24 |
| CraHan | that's it | 23:24 |
| CraHan | keyboard stays visible, but the command was executed | 23:24 |
| CraHan | how stupid of me | 23:24 |
| CraHan | sorry to bother you with this quite evident thingy :) | 23:24 |
| tzz | hmm the camera looks awful in low light | 23:26 |
| Disconnect | yah it does | 23:26 |
| tzz | the image from the camera I mean :) | 23:26 |
| *** vivijim is now known as viviout | 23:27 | |
| tzz | disconnect: try teodor.zlatanov@google.com (I sent you a /msg but don't know if it works in ERC) | 23:27 |
| Disconnect | ah i'm dumb, used gmail.com cuz i wasn't paying attention | 23:28 |
| Disconnect | and yah i got the msg | 23:28 |
| *** andrunko has quit IRC | 23:28 | |
| *** tbb has quit IRC | 23:29 | |
| tzz | disconnect: ok, thanks. Someone earlier said they sent me a PM and I didn't get it in ERC, so I'm kind of wary of that. | 23:31 |
| Tak | freenode autoblocks PMs from people that aren't identified | 23:31 |
| gpd | so is LAMP on the tablet silly or very silly? | 23:31 |
| Disconnect | gpd: could be quite useful actually | 23:31 |
| gpd | Disconnect: what is most limiting factor in the porting? | 23:32 |
| Disconnect | gpd: on the 770, i'd say memory and browser capabilities. | 23:32 |
| Disconnect | on the 800, meh, dunno. seems like it can do anything but thats cuz i'm comparing it to the 770 ;) | 23:32 |
| Disconnect | tzz: you get my pm? | 23:32 |
| keesj | I would say the A and M , I don't see apache and mysql running on such a device | 23:32 |
| gpd | I ran LAMP on a virtual server with 64M - quiet easy | 23:33 |
| Disconnect | gpd: with a gui already running? | 23:33 |
| Disconnect | 770 starts somewhat memory-starved just at the desktop | 23:33 |
| gpd | no - but 800 has 256 - which is quite reasonable | 23:33 |
| tzz | disconnect: no PM here :( | 23:33 |
| Disconnect | 128 not 256 | 23:33 |
| tzz | oh I see tak's message | 23:33 |
| keesj | openwrt has nice php packages | 23:33 |
| *** luck has quit IRC | 23:34 | |
| Disconnect | tzz: dc.disconnect gmail try calling me instead | 23:34 |
| gpd | lighttpd with cut down sql might work | 23:34 |
| * Disconnect is mad at openwrt right now. openvpn is too big if you do any updates. and ipkg fails to do anything sane on out-of-space (at least it didn't trash the status file this time) | 23:34 | |
| gpd | are there any problems with the ARMEL chip with any of LAMP stuff? | 23:35 |
| Disconnect | gpd: if you drop mysql in favor of sqlite or some such it'll be a lot easier to fit | 23:35 |
| Disconnect | gpd: performance, but i can't imagine trying to run hotmail on a tablet, so it should be ok | 23:35 |
| *** lasala has joined #maemo | 23:36 | |
| keesj | Disconnect, I only use midge http://midge.vlad.org.ua/wiki/ but i am quite happy. | 23:37 |
| tzz | disconnect: dc.disconnect@gmail.com doesn't work | 23:37 |
| *** etrunko has quit IRC | 23:37 | |
| Disconnect | it won't add you to the contacts list | 23:38 |
| tzz | weird, oh well, thanks for trying | 23:39 |
| *** kender has quit IRC | 23:39 | |
| Disconnect | says you are offline | 23:40 |
| keesj | Disconnect, back to "Simple". if there is a well described workflow, don't you think that it would be simple? | 23:40 |
| *** gummibaerchen has left #maemo | 23:40 | |
| Disconnect | keesj: was referring to Jaffa calling Mrs Jaffa 'simple' :) | 23:40 |
| Disconnect | ok so it worked but not well :) | 23:43 |
| * Disconnect probably needs a faster uplink for proper video | 23:44 | |
| Disconnect | although it looked like i got either passable video or passable audio, never both | 23:44 |
| keesj | ok | 23:45 |
| tzz | disconnect: either my uplink was bad or yours, but initially it worked all right. I got the invitation eventually, and when I accepted it things clicked. | 23:45 |
| tzz | disconnect: the video went bad after about 10 seconds on my end. | 23:45 |
| guerby | hmm, I set an alarm this morning on my N800, pushed "cancel" after a while, and now I'm in the clock application and on-off toggles the press "d-pad" but when I press d-pad it doesn't work, anyone sharing this? | 23:45 |
| Disconnect | thats about when the audio went bad on mine | 23:45 |
| Veggen | ,, | 23:46 |
| Veggen | N800 has troubles also? | 23:46 |
| tzz | disconnect: I'm on FIOS, 2 mbps uplink, so probably it wasn't my end | 23:46 |
| Disconnect | Veggen: no, its absolutely perfect :) | 23:46 |
| tigert | hey. everything has bugs | 23:46 |
| Disconnect | heh | 23:46 |
| Veggen | tigert: sure. | 23:46 |
| tigert | file them if you find | 23:46 |
| * Disconnect has fios in his yard, but its not hooked up yet (parts of hte neighborhood are on, but not my part) | 23:46 | |
| Veggen | tigert: my 770 is on service with the WSOD. | 23:47 |
| Disconnect | cablemodem still here | 23:47 |
| tigert | Veggen: yea, 770s had those screen issues | 23:47 |
| tigert | I luckily encountered none | 23:48 |
| Veggen | My N800 has apparently passed through Arnheim, Holland 20 hours ago. | 23:48 |
| guerby | ok battery removal on its way | 23:48 |
| Disconnect | still no webcam/photo app? I'm disappointed | 23:49 |
| tzz | hmm, my favorites playlist didn't make it with the backups. I'll have to recopy it from the MMC card. Otherwise the migration was smooth as silk. I just need my xterm, evince, and mplayer fix now :) | 23:49 |
| *** k-s has quit IRC | 23:49 | |
| * Disconnect should go to the bar where there is decent bandwidth | 23:49 | |
| Tak | hmm - I guess mplayer can't consume the webcam stream yet? | 23:49 |
| Disconnect | Tak: good point, it probably can. | 23:49 |
| tigert | Disconnect: I think there will be a project soon | 23:49 |
| Tak | once it does, automatic webcam -> photo app | 23:49 |
| tigert | one can do it easily with python + gst | 23:50 |
| tigert | try this | 23:50 |
| tigert | apt-get install gstreamer-tools | 23:50 |
| tigert | gst-launch-0.10 v4l2src ! xvimagesink | 23:50 |
| tigert | :) | 23:50 |
| Tak | ah, if it's v4l2, mplayer can (in theory) consume it | 23:50 |
| *** metajack has quit IRC | 23:50 | |
| tigert | yeah | 23:51 |
| tigert | but you can do it a lot nicer with gstreamer | 23:52 |
| tigert | I think we can have a nice community camera hack | 23:52 |
| tigert | it can even use geoclue / gpsd to get exif coords :) | 23:52 |
| tigert | and optionally upload stuff to a server | 23:52 |
| tigert | its a good idea | 23:52 |
| tigert | and not hard to do | 23:52 |
| Tak | actually, if the mono port reaches semi-maturity, it could be plugged into f-spot and turtle | 23:53 |
| ||cw | does Nokia market maemo and the garage and such at all? | 23:54 |
| Disconnect | tigert: as expected, that worked (although without orientation fixing) | 23:55 |
| *** lasala2k has joined #maemo | 23:55 | |
| ||cw | actualy, gstreamer and mplayer use a lot of the same libs and codecs | 23:55 |
| Disconnect | any info on the battery effects of enabling the camera? | 23:55 |
| ||cw | except mplayer is less modular and thus feels easier to use | 23:55 |
| tigert | Disconnect: yeah | 23:56 |
| * Disconnect isn't looking for mw/h or anything, but a vague "it'll die in minutes instead of hours" or whatnot :) | 23:56 | |
| keesj | thats a quite negative way to say it | 23:56 |
| tigert | Disconnect: the orientation signal is somewhere, I think dbus or such | 23:56 |
| Disconnect | cool | 23:56 |
| Disconnect | just ooc is it only a rotation sensor or will it handle portrait/landscape also? | 23:57 |
| tigert | but I am looking forward in helping with the UI and awesome artwork for a camera app | 23:57 |
| *** dieguito-zetazet has quit IRC | 23:57 | |
| tigert | I would love a camera software that did EXIF writing too, and set the gps /geoclue coordinates | 23:57 |
| tigert | onto image exif | 23:57 |
| tigert | and other fun things | 23:57 |
| tigert | stuff like whitebalance presets etc shouldnt be hard to do | 23:58 |
| tigert | of course its a very crappy camera (just 640x480 afaik) | 23:58 |
| tigert | but it would still be fun | 23:58 |
| tigert | very small files too | 23:58 |
| Disconnect | maybe a 'portrait' mode that takes 3-5 pics and despeckles them | 23:58 |
| tigert | yea | 23:58 |
| tigert | fer was looking onto the gimp iwarp plugin | 23:58 |
| tigert | we could do pretty easily a "photobooth" like thing | 23:59 |
| Disconnect | since its about 50% noise right now... :) | 23:59 |
| tigert | with some fun warp effects | 23:59 |
| tigert | most cheap cameras have bad noise on low light | 23:59 |
| tigert | its not THAt bad on good light | 23:59 |
| Disconnect | depends on your definition of good light i guess - its fairly bright in here and its total junk | 23:59 |
| *** keesj has left #maemo | 23:59 | |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.1 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!
