IRC log of #meego for Sunday, 2010-09-05

Stskeepsstephg: yeah, you're right. something's wrong on our side. can't do much to fix it but i'll have our release guy fix it monday00:01
stephgwell it's no big deal for that release obviously as time goes on00:02
stephgbut I guess the cause is important to understand00:02
stephgso it doesn't happen again00:02
Stskeepsyes00:02
stephg'cos 20100831 doesn't build either (as you said, for different reasons)00:02
Stskeepsthere's basically no binaries since 24.100:02
stephgthat's not so good ;)00:02
stephgis it worth me raising the broken build for 1.0.90.0.20100831.1 as well?00:07
stephgor are they all related00:07
Stskeepsthink this is a catch-all00:08
Stskeepsjust added it to the bug report and assigned to Sage00:09
stephgcoolio, I shall say nothing then00:09
stephgthanks for the help00:09
Stskeepsthanks for the report00:09
Stskeepsnext question is how the hell the .ks builds worked in the first place.00:10
stephgI was thinking about that:- they build from exactly this repo?00:10
Stskeepswell, we are supposed to, but it seems like there was a holiday related screwup00:10
stephg20100817 builds and the packages are still there00:11
Stskeepsyeah00:11
stephg20100824 built and then sometime after the packages go awol00:11
Stskeepsguess when vacation started.. :)00:11
stephgbut the *real* oddness is that 20100831 built and again the packages have now gone awol00:11
stephghehe00:11
stephgwonder if something was added/changed to the build process that deletes something it shouldn't do00:12
Stskeepsanother thing i'm slightly worried about00:12
Stskeeps:P00:12
stephgheh00:12
stephgunless it was manual action and only happened recently00:12
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stephganyway is bed time; greatly appreciate the help. Laters00:17
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TSCHAKeee2evening. ;)01:41
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CosmoHillwow, guy who made KDE used COCOMO01:44
CosmoHillhttp://stats.black-flag.co.uk/index.php?disp=dynamic :D01:46
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esmirlinhello! anyone knows how to became a translator for meego?01:48
CosmoHillspeak to Dawn Foster01:49
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* TSCHAKeee2 grabs the latest weekly01:51
CosmoHill20 days until my server hits 300 days uptime01:52
CosmoHill16 days until I start uni01:52
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CosmoHillcrap that's not long at all01:53
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esmirlinjoin(ubuntu-es01:59
CosmoHillfail01:59
esmirlinsorry01:59
esmirlin:P01:59
CosmoHillanyone in here heard of Wayland?01:59
lcukx11 server asskicking!02:02
CosmoHill:)02:03
lcukwe were discussing it amongst other optimisations in #maemo earlier02:03
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lcukor rather, it was brought up in the discussion02:03
npmso i just installed meego on my son's netbook (replacing moblin)... where did openoffice go?? and openjdk??02:05
CosmoHillhey npm02:05
npm(already installed sun's jdk, do i need to DL OOo from openoffice.org?)02:05
npmhi CosmoHill02:05
CosmoHillsomeone installed open office using the Fedora RPM on meego02:06
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lcuknpm, dawnfoster mentioned she got OOs direct from the fedora repos, but I would think if there was already a moblin build somewhere that would be better suited already02:06
lcukdo the moblin repos still exist?02:06
CosmoHillshould moblin users upgrade to meego?02:07
npmbut that could get confusing , adding fedora updates to yum.repos (or is this install direct from http://koji.fedoraproject.org/ from web browser)02:08
lcukthats not whats asked02:08
lcukCosmoHill, for some situations in maemo, its possible to try installing apps and libraries which were built for the previous version of the OS02:08
npmi already had a little fun adding planetccrma's repo ( http://ccrma.stanford.edu/planetccrma/software/ ) but it didn't work quite as expected02:08
lcuki am just thinking out loud tho :P02:09
TSCHAKeee2i install openoffice using the fedora rpms.02:10
npmok, i'll try that. you just "rpm  -ivh" directly right?02:11
npmor do you mean adding fedora to your yum repos02:11
npmand i assume you pull from fedora13 repo?02:11
TSCHAKeee2rpm -ivh the desktop support packages, after running the openoffice installer02:11
TSCHAKeee2there is a rpm's folder02:11
* CosmoHill is watching Take the Lead :)02:12
TSCHAKeee2in the installer package, that has a fedora 13 rpm to provide the desktop files02:12
TSCHAKeee2works just fine02:12
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TSCHAKeee2would be nice if they put oo in the garage though02:12
TSCHAKeee2wth02:12
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TSCHAKeee2:P02:12
npmoh i see. so just grab a compat rpm directly from http://download.services.openoffice.org/files/stable/3.2.1/ not from redhat/fedora repos or koji02:14
npmalternately, what about koffice? seems like that would get some support from the maemo end of things...02:15
npmseems like a major "hole" in the distro ... wonder if oracle did something funky or it's just the usual corporate warfare....02:16
ScottishDuckOracle + Open Source = segfault02:18
npmok downloading... thanks for the advice...02:22
npmothet than no OOo meego looks very nice and it's quite snappy on his netbook02:23
CosmoHilldoesn't koffice require kde?02:27
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CosmoHillmy head phones are making a hiss but it seems to be made by the amp02:50
CosmoHillor maybe the source02:50
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CosmoHill 5675 apache    30  10  6236 2164  852 R 99.9  0.3  13:36.13 perl03:21
CosmoHillany ideas?03:22
ShadowJKweb server run amok?03:22
CosmoHillamok?03:22
ShadowJKcrazy03:22
CosmoHillah03:23
CosmoHillyes03:23
CosmoHill 5671 apache    30  10     0    0    0 Z  0.0  0.0   0:00.01 rm <defunct>03:23
CosmoHillwell that's worrying03:23
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CosmoHillkilled perl with signal 903:26
CosmoHillI wonder if it was to do with the wordpress upgrades I did today03:26
ShadowJKprobably.03:26
CosmoHill 01:28:09 up 280 days,  1:58,  2 users,  load average: 0.70, 0.85, 0.6803:28
CosmoHill100% load almost doubles the power useage03:28
CosmoHillone thing I learnt was when that happens, don't restart apache03:35
CosmoHilllast time I did that I couldn't start it again03:35
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ShadowJKload average looks ok-03:38
CosmoHillthey'll settle down to bugger all03:39
CosmoHillthe fact it's up to 0.68 means it's not been running for to long03:39
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CosmoHillconcidering I've compiled and configured all the software on that server it's doing very well03:45
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CosmoHillcyas04:12
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theplicwhy doesnt meego provide torrents for its sdk and images?07:19
sofarthe chrome image can't be distributed that way07:21
sofarit's being worked on too, perhaps in the future this will be an option07:21
thepliccause i just lost my sdk d/l at 75% :/07:22
sofarwget can continue a download07:22
sofarwget -c or -C I think07:22
theplicok07:22
sofar-c07:22
sofarwget -c url07:23
theplicithink its wget -nc url07:23
sofarno, -nc is something else07:24
sofar -c,  --continue                resume getting a partially-downloaded file.07:24
theplicit does say no clobber where clobber = file being over-written07:24
sofar-nc does not imply -c07:24
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theplicyea07:27
theplicok07:27
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lolloohi08:45
lolloohow acan i isntall meego?08:45
lolloohow can I install MeeGo?08:45
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sofarlolloo: usb stick or cdrom08:47
sofarfollow the download links and you'll see instructions08:47
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lollooawesome08:51
lollooso its released?08:52
lolloofull?08:52
lolloobut where is the site?08:52
SwedeMikehttp://meego.com/08:52
lollooIMEI wooot?08:54
lolloodo i have to?08:54
theplic-.-08:54
lolloowhats it going to do?08:54
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lollooguys how do i install meego?09:05
lolloobtw is meego full version or still beta?09:06
lolloohello?09:06
lolloois MeeGo full version or still Beta?09:08
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lolloois MeeGo full version or still Beta?09:10
SwedeMikelolloo: why do you think you will get a better answer just because you repeat yourself every two minutes?09:11
lolloosorry09:11
lolloojust curious09:11
psycho_oreoss/just/too/09:11
lollooi want to install it09:11
lollooand i like it09:12
SwedeMikethen just do that.09:12
lolloois it full?09:12
lolloofull version?09:12
SwedeMikethere is no answer to that.09:12
SwedeMikeit's a work in progress.09:12
lollooalright09:12
lolloocan I use multiboot with it:09:13
lolloo?09:13
theplicyes you can09:13
lolloowow awesome09:13
lolloois there a link for steps with multiboot?09:13
lollooplease?09:14
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theplicyou will be prompted for multiboot whn u are installing meego09:14
lollooOMG09:14
lollooawesome09:14
lolloocan you provide me with the link for steps please?09:15
SwedeMikeit's all there on meego.com09:16
lolloois it on meego wiki?09:16
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LovetrainHi All09:26
Stskeepshi09:26
LovetrainHi Stskeeps09:27
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JaffaMorning, all09:42
Stskeepsmorn jaffa09:42
JaffaStskeeps: Haven't forgottwn bug raising, just need to get an hour to reload MeeGo kernel and write down steps to reproduce09:43
Stskeepsk09:44
JaffaTalking of kernels, NITdroid flashes based on bootmenu selection - can that be done for MeeGo. Or, even better, can flasher on Maemo load the kernel for next boot?09:44
JaffaOr does flasher -l -k only work pre-boot09:44
Jaffa?09:44
Stskeepsali1234 has made a u-boot implementation for n90009:44
Stskeepswe'll probably go for that instead, less hacky09:45
JaffaAh, cool09:45
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Stskeepsmeans it would fall back to normal maemo kernel unless it found a kernel on sd09:45
JaffaStskeeps: Does that mean the card would need removing to boot into Maemo?09:47
Stskeepsright, but we are also looking into a bootmenu09:47
Stskeepsu-boot can draw stuff to framebuffer so09:47
* Jaffa sees.09:48
JaffaHopefully you won't be spending time reinventing the various bootmenus which already exist, though (rather than working on MeeGo itself ;-))09:48
Stskeepsi did look at multiboot but it has the main problem of relying on ubifs and NAND tricks09:49
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Stskeepswe boot straight to sd, so09:49
Stskeepsthey boot to nand first, then chroot09:49
JaffaReally? How... odd.09:50
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JaffaBTW, the mention of call & data - is that going to be in next weekly drop?09:50
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ali1234i now have the keyboard working too09:59
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ali1234actually nearly all this stuff was already in u-boot, i just had to configure it and make a few tweaks10:00
lollooI hope it will support multi-boot with maemo and NITdroid10:02
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StskeepsJaffa: we need to have permission since we're in feature freeze. but if you build own images (current closed repo broken) there's a page with urls10:25
Stskeepsdata isn't working yet10:25
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theplicok quick question: why is so much screen space used just to advertise "Meego" on the taskbar10:26
theplici mean i know which os im using10:27
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thiago_hometheplic: but we want people looking over your shoulders to know too :-)10:32
theplicthiago_home: :)10:32
theplicbut it hinders the ability to add more quick access buttons10:32
theplicnot to mention why the option to change the wallpaper if i cant be on the desktop anyway10:35
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sivangStskeeps: multiboot?11:07
sivangStskeeps: by the installer?11:07
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KubuntiacHas anyone heard any even vague rumors regarding the Kindle reader app coming to Meego?11:56
Kubuntiac(or not)11:56
Stskeepsno, but that would be nce11:57
Stskeepsnice11:57
* thiago_home would agree11:57
SwedeMikedon't see how that would work, meego isn't trusted computing, so how would the DRM work?11:57
KubuntiacIs Android any different in this respect?11:58
Kubuntiacbtw, I can run ebooks.com's DRM ebook reader just fine under Wine (they even suggest it?!)11:59
SwedeMikeyeah, there at least the manufacturers seem to want to implement signed boot loaders etc11:59
KubuntiacPersonally I'd happily skip it, DRM and all, but I'm trying to convince my wife to go Meego with her next device... and she wants the Kindle reader :/12:00
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SwedeMikeI'm a N900 owner so I just joined this channel because it seems maemo is being abandonded... and from the videos and screenshots I've seen so far, Meego seems to have nowhere the polished look of Android/iOS/Maemo, is this been worked on?12:02
KubuntiacIt's funny, I've seen a bunch of videos where it looks really plain and grey, and a couple where it looks almost black, but very slick and shiny12:03
thiago_homeSwedeMike: you know that there is no official release of MeeGo for handsets yet, right?12:03
Kubuntiac(on the netbook version)12:03
thiago_homeSwedeMike: which means that anything you may have seen is pre-release software?12:03
thiago_homeSwedeMike: you also know that no one does sucky UIs intentionally?12:04
KubuntiacSwedeMike: Have you seen this vid yet? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqeeQd-YNL012:05
SwedeMikethiago_home: errr, have you looked at a classical Ericsson phone? they seem to do it intentionally.12:05
SwedeMikethiago_home: at 2:13 for instance, that doesn't look polished at all to me12:06
KubuntiacPS That vid ^^^ is almost 3 months old... who knows what's happened since then...12:06
SwedeMikeit looks like something Ericsson would do in 2005 long before the iPhone was released...12:06
SwedeMikeor Symbian still was last I looked... or windows mobile 612:07
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thiago_homethat vid was also pre-pre-alpha12:07
thiago_homeso, no, it's not polished at all12:07
thiago_homepolishing is one of the last things that happens...12:08
johdSwedeMike, I believe this is a matter of taste12:08
johdand themes12:08
thiago_homethink about it: when do you polish furniture? When you're done building it, or when the glue isn't dry yet?12:08
SwedeMikethiago_home: like you do software security as an afterthought? I mean, the last you do when you build a house is to put in a door with a lock? I don't buy it.12:09
johdI believe you can rest assured Meego will look at least as shiny as Maemo in the end12:09
SwedeMikeyou make a polished look when you DESIGN the thing, then you might implement it last, but where is the design?12:09
johdand then you can choose a theme with pink and yellow and all these "colors"12:09
johd:p12:09
SwedeMikeI'm not talking colours.12:10
SwedeMikewell, we'll see when it's released I guess.12:10
thiago_homeSwedeMike: no, not like that12:10
thiago_homeSwedeMike: but you have heard of premature optimisation, right?12:10
thiago_homeSwedeMike: it's the same thing with polishing. You polish when the app's functionality is done.12:11
SwedeMikethiago_home: I guess that's why things look like they do in a lot of devices. So again, I don't think that's the right way to go.12:11
SwedeMikethen you end up with a non-polished look because of the 90/90 factor.12:12
thiago_homewe'll have to agree to disagree12:12
thiago_homepolishing isn't done until the apps work12:12
SwedeMike90/10 rule I guess it's called.12:12
thiago_homepolishing is part of the 90. It's easy to do.12:12
SwedeMikeso then you end up with not polishing because you've run out of time and underestimated the polishing work, and now you have to release because "it works" and you don't really care about look12:12
thiago_homethat's a danger, yes12:13
thiago_homeor, the alternative, is that you postpone until you're done12:13
thiago_homepersonally, I prefer working and plain than polished and useless12:13
SwedeMikewell, I guess we'll what happens in the end.12:13
SwedeMikewe'll see12:13
thiago_homeI prefer working and polished, of course12:13
SwedeMikeI think Apple (and nokia with Maemo5 on N900) did the correct optimization, screw some of the "necessary" features (like MMS) and look at what people actually use the phone for.12:14
KubuntiacMore recent vid (if you speak German) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILfUHv0mTlc12:14
SwedeMikeonly thing nokia didn't get right was the USSD, that it took so long to get it.12:14
thiago_homeUSSD?12:15
SwedeMike*23*5324535345435#12:15
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SwedeMiketo refill prepaid phone cards etc12:15
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* thiago_home didn't get it12:16
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StskeepsSwedeMike: do keep in mind meego.com is a platform, not a product sold by nokia12:16
SwedeMikeStskeeps: yes? What's your point?12:16
Stskeepsthat said, things do have to look good from both technical and basic looks (lickable UIs sell, so that'd be vendors doing that..)12:17
thiago_homeyep12:17
thiago_homeSwedeMike: polishing has to be done, we all agree12:17
thiago_homewe just disagree on the "when"12:17
SwedeMikeand let's hope it doesn't fragment like android seems to be doing.12:17
StskeepsSwedeMike: yeah..12:17
SwedeMikere-inventing the wheel is inefficient.12:17
StskeepsSwedeMike: the meego handset UX is quite flexible in terms of making differentiation UIs without breaking apps, to my knowledge12:18
thiago_homerepeating the mistakes too12:18
thiago_homewe're being very careful with forward compatibility and ensuring a unique platform12:18
SwedeMikethiago_home: I always get scared when people say unique: <http://www.marcofolio.net/images/stories/fun/imagedump/demotivational_posters/unique.jpg>12:19
thiago_homelol12:19
thiago_homesorry, that's not what I meant12:19
Kubuntiac"Interesting","Unusual" and "Unique". The three death words...12:19
thiago_homeI meant that the platform is unified, no fragmentation12:20
Kubuntiacoh, and "Different"12:20
SwedeMikeread about that some car manufacturers was trying to standardize on Meego when it came to in-car entertainment systems, that'd be nice as well... but I think to fully achieve the potential there manufacturers need to standardize on physical interaction with the car as well12:24
SwedeMikewould be awesome if there basically was a standard form factor and connectors to connect to the rest of the car so the system could be changed every 3-5 years.12:25
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thiago_homeyes, the Genivi alliance chose MeeGo12:27
thiago_homeI think car manufacturers expect you to change cars every 3 years...12:28
achipaSwedeMike: well, CANBUS and OBD(2) kind of point towards that12:30
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SwedeMikethiago_home: yeah, that's their dream... it's also their dream that we fork out 3kEUR for a navigation device.12:31
SwedeMikewhen I can buy one in town for 100-200EUR12:31
dm8tbrSwedeMike: no it's their dream that they can upsell you the software option of navigation for 3k, the hardware being in place anyway ;)12:33
SwedeMikedm8tbr: right.12:33
achipawell, both are going to die when your phone is able to do the same thing, right ? :)12:33
thiago_homeyou can just use your Nokia phone too :-)12:33
achipathiago_home: heh :)12:33
SwedeMikewell, five year old car navigation is still better than the 1 year old phone.12:34
achipaphone is moving faster, having a shorter life-cycle and all12:34
SwedeMikeabsolutely.12:34
sandst1maybe they'll make the phone navigation integrate with the car :)12:34
thiago_homethe N95 navigation was atrocious12:35
SwedeMikesandst1: exactly. standard interface so I can control things via bluetooth or something...12:35
thiago_hometook 10 minutes to lock on12:35
dm8tbralso the car navigation has significant sensoric advantages12:35
thiago_homeon the N97 it was much better, if only laggy12:35
thiago_homeon recent phones, it's very good12:35
achipasandst1: that's the cool thing about meego, actually - imagine you just remote-display the thing :)12:35
SwedeMikeyes, my car navigation knows when the car is rolling and compass direction, so even in tunnels it does the right thing12:35
dm8tbrit can tap into the odometer and the speeds reported by individual tires to correlate position12:35
achipaachipa: or better yet, be able to sync stuff - like plan your route on the phone, at home, and then plug in the car and presto, it knows where you want to go12:36
achipawriting to myself again, time for coffee12:36
SwedeMikeachipa: android already does that, afaik12:36
achipaSwedeMike: I mean, communicate that *to the car*12:36
SwedeMikeachipa: well, if you use your phone for navigation then it's the same thing.12:37
sandst1no if you've got a KITT as the car12:37
thiago_homeGPS speed measurement is more reliable than the odometre12:37
dm8tbrthiago_home: do you have some source to back this up. I'd be interested to read it.12:39
achipathiago_home: you sure about that ? sure, averaged out, over large distances, yes, but given any moment ? GPS accuracy can vary wildly, it's only the statistical functions that make it OK on a micro scale12:39
sandst1i wonder what's the current condition of the GPS network currently, haven't heard much of this since last year: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/5352183/Sat-nav-system-could-break-down-within-a-year.html12:39
dm8tbralso most GPS only report 1PPS12:40
achipasandst1: that's a fundraiser call, government style12:40
dm8tbrhmm maybe the binary modes provide higher resolution, I tend to forget12:40
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SwedeMikethiago_home: GPS works bad in tunnels.12:42
achipadm8tbr: it's not the question how often the module can tell you the location - it's about receiving the raw data12:42
SwedeMikethiago_home: so it's better to have a device that does GPS+others, than to just have GPS12:42
sandst1achipa: good point. *need more coffee*12:42
timeless_mbpsandst1: you don't prefer KARR?12:42
thiago_homeSwedeMike: true12:43
achipadm8tbr: you can have 1000PPS but if it's just interpolation, it ain't worth much12:43
dm8tbrindeed12:43
dm8tbralso the tunnel problem remains12:43
dm8tbrthere are plenty of tunnels with branches and exits12:44
timeless_mbpdm8tbr:  why should that be a problem?12:44
SwedeMikeso odometer+compass+AGPS+GPS is really the way to go.12:44
timeless_mbpthe car should have a speedometer12:44
timeless_mbpand a compass12:44
timeless_mbpspeed + direction = velocity12:44
sandst1timeless_mbp: KARR is evil. that'd be like preferring T-1000 ^^12:44
timeless_mbpLocation 0 + Velocity (0-1) = Location 112:45
dm8tbrtimeless_mbp: if your gps stops sending data then the navigation has no idea if you just passed the exit or if it's still 200m ahead of you12:45
timeless_mbpdm8tbr: you don't need gps once you have a location if you have working instruments12:45
timeless_mbpbasic physics12:45
dm8tbrtimeless_mbp: that's what we're talking about12:45
achipainertial navigation is fun :)12:45
dm8tbrtimeless_mbp: a phone does not have them12:45
timeless_mbpdm8tbr: actually, they do12:46
timeless_mbpthey have accelerometer + compass12:46
* thiago_home votes for INS12:46
timeless_mbpat least the more modern ones do12:46
timeless_mbpthat they fail to usefully integrate those components is well12:46
dm8tbrtimeless_mbp: those that I saw were horrible12:46
timeless_mbp… typical failure to integrate :)12:46
achipatimeless_mbp: with notable exceptions, where reference frames can make things tricky12:46
timeless_mbpapple will get it right in a few years12:46
SwedeMikeI'm spectial if that's as accurate as the stuff in the cars. and cheap accelerometer isn't good enough to do inertial navigation with12:46
achipabut I guess that's rare enough not to be considered12:46
thiago_homeSwedeMike: it's probably not sensitive enough12:47
SwedeMikesceptical I mean12:47
thiago_homebut it's probably enough for navigating through a tunnel12:47
timeless_mbpsandst1: nah, just the first t101 instead of the second 2 :)12:48
achipaSwedeMike: the more inputs you have, the better your chances to figure out what's going on12:48
achipa(if you have enough CPU power to process it in real time, of course :)12:48
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achipaand nobody mentioned the funniest nav-confusor, the ship/traject things. Some recognise it but others simply refuse to believe you're on water :)12:55
achipas/recognise/recognize/12:56
infobotachipa meant: and nobody mentioned the funniest nav-confusor, the ship/traject things. Some recognize it but others simply refuse to believe you're on water :)12:56
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CosmoHillmorning13:02
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sivangmorning CosmoHill13:17
CosmoHillhi13:17
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theplichi can only qt based apps run on meego?14:16
Stskeepsno, it runs gtk too14:16
Stskeepsor motif14:16
Stskeeps:P14:16
theplicoh14:16
thepliccool14:16
theplicwhat about python?14:19
thepliccan i run python apps?14:19
Stskeepspythons' there but no pyqt or pyside yet14:19
theplicoh14:19
theplicpyqt wud have been cool14:19
Stskeepsagreed14:20
theplicand is there a way to default to the desktop and not to the home tab screen?14:20
Stskeepsno idea sorry14:21
theplicok14:21
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CosmoHillis it just me or are 16:10 monitors becoming harder to find?14:28
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odin_what are 16:10, I know 1920x1200 are pixie dust now, most unhappy, bloody HD14:46
CosmoHillget this 1080p monitor! I don't want one! I want to be able to read two A4 pages side by side without having to scroll a little bit14:48
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DilbertoPetition to pressure Kevin Rose to eat uncured pork bacon live on streaming video and drink COLD BEER with it. Have him prove that simple greed and or incompetence was the reason behind Digg 4.0 and its selling out and not something else, if you get my drift!14:50
DilbertoSign the petition here:14:50
Dilbertohttp://www.petitiononline.com/krbacon/petition.html14:50
CosmoHillgo away14:50
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*** Dilberto was kicked by Stskeeps (please don't spam about bacon. it is sacred.)14:53
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odin_just done another search to find out the state of larger than 1080, my fav brand still does not do 24" bigger than 1080p(athetic) to replace a model they had 18months ago14:53
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CosmoHillmy dell monitor is 1680x1050 (16:10) which is good for work14:54
CosmoHillbut it annoys the hell out of me that I can't have 16:9 on composite and s-video input14:54
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kirma"state of larger than 1080" ?14:55
* kirma has been using 2560x1600 displays for years14:55
odin_whats the made/model ?14:55
kirmawell, indeed, my displays haven't had any other input than dual-link dvi14:56
* SwedeMike has been wanting a 20-24" 2560x1600 for a long time, doesn't seem to be happening though.14:56
kirmaHP LP3065 now14:56
SwedeMike30" is just too big physically.14:57
odin_hmm 30" :(  19" did 1600x1200 no problem, so why is 1920x1080 now 26"  (when it was 24")14:57
CosmoHillI've sat in front of a 27" iMac14:57
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CosmoHillif I used that for a while I'd end up with a stiff neck14:57
CosmoHillyou shouldn't have to move your head to look at things at eaither end of the monitor14:58
odin_opps typo 1920x120014:58
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odin_you don't have to use all the space of the monitor :) just pick a bit and make your window small enough so you dont have to move your head14:59
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CosmoHillwhat brand monitors do you have?15:10
odin_iiyama15:12
CosmoHillI was looking at them, couldn't find a 16:1015:14
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CosmoHillI think one of my problems is the current use of my monitor15:18
CosmoHillVGA, DVI, composite and S-Video are all used15:18
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CosmoHillI could move to VGA, DVI and HDMI but I'd need to replace my DVD player and skybox15:19
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CosmoHillI have one Dell and one LG15:29
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CosmoHillhttp://forums.kustompcs.co.uk/showthread.php?t=4936215:36
CosmoHilloh my that was a big crash on iITV415:38
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sivang /away out16:01
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magerquarkhi16:05
CosmoHillhey16:06
magerquarkdoes anyone of you know, if meego fully supports the acer aspire one?16:06
magerquarkhey cosmahill16:06
magerquarkhey cosmohill16:06
CosmoHilliirc the apsire family has been going on for many years16:07
CosmoHillthere is a list of supported devices on meego.com16:07
magerquarkmy one wasnt listed on this page16:07
CosmoHillwhat processor do you have?16:07
magerquarkbut it should work, it is a standard-netbook16:08
magerquarkatom n2?016:08
CosmoHillprocessor?16:08
magerquark270 perhaps?16:08
CosmoHill*graphics card16:08
lordheavyhi16:08
magerquarkthe normal intel thing16:08
magerquarkgma 9something16:08
CosmoHillan good16:08
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CosmoHillyou can boot meego off a memory stick so give that a go16:09
lordheavywhat about support for 3g modems ? mine is not detected16:09
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CosmoHillultimately that's the only way to find out if meego works on your computer16:09
CosmoHilllordheavy: no idea about that, no one has mentioned that so far16:09
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lordheavyit seem the connextion manager doesn't handle them16:10
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CosmoHillsupport for 3G USB modems might not be implemented yet16:10
magerquarki will install it 10 minutes to go16:11
magerquarkdoes anyone know if there is virtualbox package in the meego repositories16:12
CosmoHillnope16:12
magerquarki want to virtualize win 98 and win xp16:12
magerquarkah ok16:12
magerquarkthen i have to setup a dualboot system16:12
CosmoHillI must admit I'd never even thought about running VM software on a netbook16:13
magerquarkthank you very much16:13
magerquarki also never thought about it, but me and my friends are playing some old games once in a while, so it would be useful16:13
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magerquarki tried some opersting systems on my netbook, but none satisfied me16:15
CosmoHillcan virtualbox run windows 98?16:16
magerquarkah is someone here, who belongs to the meego development team?16:16
magerquarkit is possible, but it is a pain in the ass16:16
magerquarkvmware is much better for win 9816:16
CosmoHillI got 98 running on QEMU16:16
magerquarki never tried qemu16:16
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magerquarkthere is a broken link in the meego wiki16:18
CosmoHilllink me16:19
magerquarkhttp://launchpad.net/win32-image-writer/0.2/0.2/+download/win32diskimager-RELEASE-0.2-r23-win32.zip16:19
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magerquarkdoesnt work anymore16:19
CosmoHillwrong link?16:19
CosmoHillcan you link me to the wiki page?16:19
magerquarksi16:19
magerquarkhttp://meego.com/devices/netbook/installing-meego-your-netbook16:19
magerquarkund er windows instructions16:19
magerquarkunder windows instructions16:19
CosmoHilllink 1?16:20
CosmoHills/link/step/16:20
infobotCosmoHill meant: step 1?16:20
CosmoHilllink works for me16:20
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magerquarkah strange16:20
CosmoHillit happens16:20
CosmoHillfew people can't download from meego but can download from my server16:21
magerquarkah now it also works on my computer16:21
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CosmoHillanyone else watching the BTCC?16:22
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magerquarkno16:23
CosmoHillwatching the marshals is funny16:24
CosmoHillthey've towed one car backwards into a barrier16:24
CosmoHilland almost got another car beached on a flatbed16:24
magerquarki am not interested in motor sports16:25
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magerquarka few years ago i watched formula 116:25
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magerquarkbut since schumacher left, i wasnt really interested anymore16:25
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CosmoHillthink guy speed bumper cars :)16:25
CosmoHillhigh*16:25
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magerquarkhow much space shall i give meego?16:33
CosmoHillhow much spare do you have?16:34
magerquarki have 100 gb16:34
CosmoHill5 ~ 10GB?16:34
magerquarkah cool16:34
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magerquarkwhich file system?16:35
magerquarkext3 or btrfs?16:35
CosmoHilllatter16:36
magerquarkgracias16:37
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CosmoHillhmm, i thought you could deply a img on a usb using Disk Utility on mac16:45
magerquarkseems to work flawlessly16:45
magerquarkbut my cpu fan is constantly blowing16:48
CosmoHillcheck your load?16:49
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magerquark..17:23
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juliankIs it possible to boot MeeGo from the internal eMMC on the N900 instead of using a MicroSD?17:29
juliank/dev/mmcblk0 would be a MicroSD (which is not inserted), so I thought that /dev/mmcblk1 might be the eMMC17:30
juliankBut this did not work, the kernel could not find the partition17:31
Stskeepsjuliank: yes, but you will have to destroy your emmc partition which isn't fun17:31
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juliankStskeeps: I put the rootfs into /home (which has enough free space).17:32
juliank(and it's ext3 just like the normal root)17:32
Stskeepsjuliank: hmm, it should detect it if microsd isn't there17:32
Stskeepsmmcblk0p1 is /home right?17:32
Stskeepsjuliank: how did you copy it?17:32
juliankStskeeps: mount on the computer, and rsync to the N900.17:33
Stskeepsk17:33
Stskeepsshould work..17:33
Stskeepsit should find mmcblk0p1 without issue by default17:33
Stskeepsif the microsd isn't there17:34
juliankStskeeps: In Maemo, mmcblk0p2 is /home. But running flasher-3.5 with -b"root=/dev/mmcblk0p2" did not work (and mmcblk1p2 did not either)17:34
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Stskeepsjuliank: add 'rootwait'17:36
Stskeepsgrep CONFIG_CMDLINE /boot/config* to see the whole line you should use17:37
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magerquarkdoes meego use grub?17:38
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Stskeepsmagerquark: usually asking does meego on <X> use grub? would be a better question :)17:39
magerquarkah scusa17:39
magerquark i forgot17:39
magerquarkx86 artom platform17:40
magerquarkis here someone from the development team17:40
magerquark?17:40
Stskeepsmagerquark: x86 netbook traditionally uses syslinux17:41
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magerquarkah merci17:41
magerquarkis ist possible to change to root17:41
magerquark?17:41
magerquarki am more familiar with grub17:41
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Stskeepsnot sure sorry17:42
magerquarkok, i will try it aout17:42
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juliankStskeeps: Seems to work as long you do things in the right order:start flasher, insert battery -> device starts and boots MeeGo17:45
juliankThanks17:45
Stskeepsnp17:46
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Stskeepsjuliank: so exploring it out of curiousity or hoping to contribute?17:46
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magerquarkis there a sync tool integrated, that syncs my gmail-account with meego :)?17:47
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juliankStskeeps: both17:47
Stskeepsjuliank: cool, feel free to hang in #meego-arm then17:47
Stskeepsthat's where most of the meego/n900 related action happens :)17:48
dm8tbrmagerquark: gmail speaks imap. I'd expect a mail client to surface at some point.17:50
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magerquarkthx dm8tbr17:52
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dotblankhmm I can't seem to create a vm image with the image creator because it can't find the kernel image17:53
dotblankis there anyway to fix that?17:53
* CosmoHill has specced up what he thinks is a meego capable computer for £205.6317:56
Stskeepsdotblank: what command line are you making and instructions used?17:56
dotblanksudo mic-image-creator --config=meego-preview-shcdk-core.ks --format=raw --arch=i586 --cache=mycache17:57
dotblankhttp://pastebin.com/phjiYq8d17:58
Stskeepswhy shcdk?17:59
dotblankwell I want a handset image. also that was the image provided on the website18:00
dotblanknot too sure what shcdk means18:00
magerquarkah cool, evolution is able to sync gmail contacts18:00
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Stskeepsdotblank: hmm, try kernel-mrst or kernel-netbook18:00
Stskeepswhat website url?18:01
dotblankhttp://meego.com/downloads18:01
dotblankif you clcik the download for moorestown18:02
dotblankhttp://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/0.9.80.1.20100330.1/core/images/meego-preview-shcdk-core/18:02
Stskeepsok, that .ks seems wildly out of date..18:02
Stskeepssec18:03
Stskeepscould you try http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/1.0.90.1.20100903.1/handset/images/meego-handset-ia32-mtf/ instead?18:03
dotblanksure one sec18:03
Stskeepsdotblank: also.. when you do get a handset UX up, could you do me a favour? try the desktop in 800x480 instead of 854x48018:04
dotblankStskeeps, sure.. what branch of image creator are you using.. its telling me that .ks has a syntax error18:05
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dotblankim on .1718:05
Stskeepsget 0.1918:05
Stskeeps(at leas)18:05
Stskeepst18:05
Stskeepsor best, git master ;)18:05
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dotblankok that seems to be working18:06
dotblankoh fun18:07
dotblankhuge list of missing deps18:07
Stskeepsdotblank: reason for me asking is because we have some odd problems on n900 and it would be good if someone could 'dismiss' them as a resolution independence problem18:07
dotblankStskeeps, I would be glad to help with that once I get this working18:08
Stskeeps:nod:18:08
Stskeepswhy do you need to generate your own, out of curiousity?18:08
dotblankunless you have a .raw I can just download18:08
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dotblankfor qemugl18:08
Stskeepsthere's one in that directorry18:08
dotblankwhat?18:09
Stskeepshttp://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/1.0.90.1.20100903.1/handset/images/meego-handset-ia32-mtf/ would contain a 'raw', i believe18:09
Stskeepsin the tar.bz218:09
dotblankoh ok downloading it now18:09
dotblankand btw http://pastebin.com/sKDke7fA18:10
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Stskeepsyeah, need mic2 upgrade18:10
Stskeeps:P18:10
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dotblankStskeeps, it just had the boot image18:16
dotblankand sda1 image18:16
dotblankno raw18:16
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dotblankI wonder if qemu can boot from an image and have sda1 as the hd18:16
Stskeepshmm18:17
Stskeepssda1 image should be whole sd i believe18:17
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Stskeepsbut not sure18:17
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dotblankhmm can't boot of sda118:21
dotblankoff of*18:21
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CosmoHillmagerquark: you're missing some  fun here18:24
CosmoHilllots of cars have just gone flying off at the first corner18:24
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magerquark^^18:25
magerquarksunday is my electronic device day18:26
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magerquarksetting up my netbook, my computer and my mobile phone has also some problems18:26
magerquarki hate it18:27
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dotblankStskeeps, I got the sdk image working18:35
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magerquarkhow am ia ble to switch between running applications in meego18:37
gabrbeddmagerquark: On my netbook, Alt+Tab works... but you can also use the application switcher thingie...18:39
gabrbeddmagerquark: which is the circle divided into 4 parts.  When you touch that icon, it will show you your running apps.18:40
magerquarkgracias gabrbedd18:40
gabrbeddde nada.18:43
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lollooHow do you take screenshot of your N900?19:35
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lollooHow do you take screenshot of your N900?19:35
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CosmoHilllolloo: http://www.blogsdna.com/9161/how-to-take-screenshots-in-n900.htm19:42
lollooCosmoHill: Thanks Bro!19:44
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thiago_homeit also works to VNC in to your N90020:03
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CosmoHillwhy the hell am I still watching transformers when I have sky movies >.<21:14
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th0br0:P CosmoHill21:16
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* CosmoHill changes to Transporter 421:19
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Nitialthere's fourth?21:20
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tybollt_transporter? w/ statham?21:21
tybollt_gimme a break :21:21
tybollt_)21:21
CosmoHillyes21:21
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CosmoHill*321:21
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CosmoHillI watched one recently so I was doing maths21:21
th0br0http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drE5cHe6c3s&feature=PlayList&p=D53C52973A681677&index=0&playnext=1 maths ? :D21:24
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Jaffare21:24
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JaffaStskeeps: Isn't "phone application doesn't start and allow user to make calls" a 'bug'? ;-)21:25
CosmoHillyou'd think so but no21:26
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StskeepsJaffa: hmm? it started for me last time21:38
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lcukStskeeps, thats cos you are using the newer build that you made a call with that no1 else can21:41
Stskeepslcuk: not true21:41
Stskeeps:P21:41
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lcukisnt that what you said on friday?21:41
Stskeepsin fact, all the repos are open to public to build an image for themselves21:41
lcuk<TomaszD> is that in the build?21:42
lcuk<TomaszD> (I'm guessing it isn't :P)21:42
lcuk<Stskeeps> not yet, we need to get it approved as we patch pulseaudio21:42
lcuk<Stskeeps> nothing closed source though21:42
lcuknot at all implying its closed, its just not in the builds humans can actually install :P21:43
TomaszDanyone can build it, as long as they're a wizard, is what Stskeeps is implying21:43
TomaszDhere, take it21:43
TomaszD;)21:43
* lcuk nods21:44
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* Stskeeps plays openttd21:46
* CosmoHill loves Stskeeps 21:46
* CosmoHill now regrets saying that21:46
CosmoHillanyway: openttd yay21:46
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* TomaszD bought minecraft yesterday and is beginning to get hooked21:47
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lcukStskeeps, do you expect a long upstreaming process to get PA patches merged?21:47
lcukor should it be in the weekly when it rolls round?21:48
Stskeepslcuk: good question21:50
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Stskeepsi don't have an answer, otherwise it'd be in the page21:50
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* lcuk nods again21:53
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