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| rZr | i'll be there in 2h | 21:00 |
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| rZr | Tue Oct 7 20:00:08 UTC 2014 | 23:00 |
| *** rZr is now known as RzR | 23:00 | |
| juiceme | Hiya everybody o/ | 23:00 |
| Win7Mac | howdy | 23:01 |
| RzR | everybody minus 2 | 23:01 |
| RzR | at least | 23:01 |
| juiceme | yes, maybe that too. :( | 23:01 |
| RzR | 1/ no feedback from community | 23:03 |
| RzR | http://wiki.maemo.org/Talk:Task:Community_Council/Council_Q2_2014/Agenda | 23:03 |
| juiceme | RzR, yes, plenty of feedback to the council <-> ev TMO article, though. | 23:04 |
| RzR | I guess so | 23:05 |
| RzR | this one is on our agenda | 23:05 |
| RzR | so let's start meeting ? | 23:05 |
| RzR | doc and neil are not expected anymore | 23:05 |
| RzR | peter said he wont be available | 23:06 |
| RzR | so I think juiceme and I can open the meeting | 23:06 |
| juiceme | yes. | 23:06 |
| RzR | 2/ about the resignations | 23:06 |
| RzR | is it clear enough to announce to community in this meeting minute report ? | 23:07 |
| juiceme | yes, that will be enough I am sure | 23:07 |
| juiceme | so, we are officially 2 councillors short now | 23:07 |
| juiceme | Niel resigned and went as far as requested techstaff to delete his TMO account | 23:08 |
| RzR | so we must update | 23:08 |
| RzR | http://wiki.maemo.org/Community_Council | 23:08 |
| RzR | sixwheeledbeast, can edit it | 23:08 |
| RzR | well I can too | 23:09 |
| juiceme | Joerg resigned after a heated debate on Council mailing list and requested techstaff to remove him from all mailing lists | 23:09 |
| Win7Mac | oh, he did? | 23:09 |
| juiceme | yes | 23:09 |
| Win7Mac | that's new! | 23:09 |
| Win7Mac | ...to me | 23:09 |
| Win7Mac | still not the official channel though | 23:10 |
| RzR | let me check in the lists | 23:10 |
| Win7Mac | and he knows... trying to fool us | 23:11 |
| Win7Mac | so he later can claim "officially I didn't! | 23:11 |
| Win7Mac | " | 23:11 |
| juiceme | well I did ask him about the declarations on stepping down. He challenged me to find something like that. After I provided about 5 examples of his saying he has left, he attacked me on personal level | 23:11 |
| RzR | yea | 23:11 |
| juiceme | last mesage from him was to the techstaff requesting removal | 23:12 |
| RzR | so we should expect a letter from neil and joerg in | 23:13 |
| RzR | http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/ | 23:13 |
| RzR | ? | 23:13 |
| RzR | right | 23:13 |
| Win7Mac | up to you, like I said in last mail | 23:13 |
| Win7Mac | RzR, basically YES! | 23:13 |
| RzR | who mailed joerg the last time ? | 23:13 |
| juiceme | so after these incidents, the council stands as three | 23:14 |
| juiceme | fortunately we are still operational. | 23:14 |
| RzR | are are there any other trace | 23:14 |
| Win7Mac | juiceme, well that up to councils' consideration | 23:14 |
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| juiceme | on the other hand, the Maemo Community e.V. board is now too small | 23:15 |
| RzR | it would make sense to the others candidate enter the coucil as interim | 23:16 |
| RzR | but this is not the way it worked before | 23:17 |
| Win7Mac | Bylaws ยง 7 (6) "On termination of individual Board members, the duties of the retiring Board member can be taken over by the remaining Board members, provided that these agree. Alternatively, the Board may supplement until the next regular election by board resolution from the number of active members." | 23:18 |
| juiceme | yes | 23:18 |
| RzR | thanks for reminding us our dutties :) | 23:18 |
| juiceme | RzR, that's for the board, not council this time | 23:19 |
| RzR | ah ok | 23:19 |
| juiceme | of the board's duties, Niel was the cashier | 23:19 |
| RzR | is this a council issue we should care ? | 23:21 |
| juiceme | mmm... not really, true. I was just reminding Win7Mac that this resignation business touches MCeV too. | 23:22 |
| juiceme | but that should not concern us here | 23:23 |
| RzR | so it touch us too | 23:23 |
| RzR | would you cooperate with an organization whose cashier disapeared ? with all the respect i have to neil :) | 23:23 |
| juiceme | indirectly, yes | 23:23 |
| Win7Mac | not important now though | 23:23 |
| juiceme | :) | 23:24 |
| RzR | so we assume both left , they have a week to communicate a public statement | 23:24 |
| juiceme | okay, so back to agenda | 23:24 |
| RzR | are we agrea on this ? | 23:24 |
| RzR | and also need confirmation from peter for next meeting | 23:25 |
| juiceme | well I'm not sure about their will to communicate :( | 23:25 |
| RzR | without any activities they just switch the "resigned state" | 23:25 |
| Win7Mac | my advise would be to kick him officially if he doesn't resign properly within a short timeframe | 23:25 |
| RzR | and we will update the page | 23:25 |
| RzR | I dont want to kick anyone | 23:26 |
| chem|st | o/ | 23:26 |
| RzR | They both said at several place they resigned | 23:26 |
| Win7Mac | they didn't exactly | 23:26 |
| juiceme | How public would you want to see the resignation, I mean apart from happening in mailing lists and TMO postings? | 23:26 |
| RzR | so now if they want to do with their own words or came back in | 23:27 |
| RzR | they have the opportunity | 23:27 |
| chem|st | RzR: there is no need to kick anyone, they stepped down -> if they refuse to announce it properly, council announces it | 23:27 |
| RzR | a single mail to the list will be enough | 23:27 |
| chem|st | joergs email was signed so you are pretty safe on that matter | 23:27 |
| juiceme | chem|st, agree | 23:27 |
| Win7Mac | joerg said "II step down from council..." WTF... Il??? | 23:27 |
| RzR | 2 words and 1st one is only a letter | 23:27 |
| Win7Mac | that is a promise, nothing more... | 23:28 |
| juiceme | Win7Mac, requesting removal from council mailing list is resignation IMHO | 23:28 |
| Win7Mac | i mean, it's not but... whatever | 23:29 |
| chem|st | Win7Mac: he does it like you said, he steps down but leaves doors open -> he revoked his *05 nick from ##maemo-admin but left his *51 nick in the access list... ambivalent... | 23:29 |
| RzR | the "mail alias" email is clear to me | 23:29 |
| chem|st | and announced being gone | 23:29 |
| Win7Mac | ok | 23:30 |
| chem|st | Win7Mac: the mail alias email was to council@ and techstaff@ so you did not get any of it | 23:30 |
| chem|st | I bounce it to board | 23:30 |
| Win7Mac | great | 23:30 |
| RzR | humm this is not fair to fwd private email | 23:31 |
| RzR | anyway we're loosing time | 23:31 |
| RzR | so let's give them a week to post to the community list | 23:31 |
| Win7Mac | private? | 23:31 |
| RzR | not public at least | 23:32 |
| chem|st | RzR: I bounced an official request to the owner's board... what is not fair in that? | 23:32 |
| juiceme | Win7Mac, true, those mailing lists are kind of private... | 23:32 |
| Win7Mac | community should not know *officially*? | 23:32 |
| chem|st | RzR: board alias is not a public mailinglist | 23:32 |
| RzR | yea but he did not write to board in the 1st place | 23:33 |
| RzR | there is no reason that the board read it | 23:33 |
| RzR | unless for legal or historical purpose | 23:33 |
| RzR | well this is not that bad... | 23:33 |
| Win7Mac | he needs to let know community, I believe, that's why it was agreed to do so on community mailing list | 23:34 |
| RzR | anyway the inforrmation is same | 23:34 |
| RzR | we told you what he told us | 23:34 |
| juiceme | Win7Mac, of course the community _should_ know *officially* but the events leading to it are private IMHO | 23:35 |
| RzR | so can we try to agrea on giving them both one week to post on the community@maemo.org list | 23:35 |
| RzR | before we just announce they offically resigned | 23:35 |
| Win7Mac | +1 | 23:36 |
| Sicelo900v6 | aye | 23:36 |
| chem|st | RzR: mail them please, and don't use aliases for "To:" | 23:36 |
| Win7Mac | putting it ultimatly should suffice | 23:36 |
| RzR | ok | 23:36 |
| RzR | let me draft it now | 23:37 |
| juiceme | RzR good | 23:37 |
| RzR | what about peter voice ? | 23:37 |
| RzR | well I can email them personally and peter will confirm the announce of the resignation | 23:37 |
| juiceme | well peter is in the loop, he had all the same mails as we did, and he did say something to Joerg in german that I did not understand... | 23:38 |
| RzR | sounds fair ? | 23:38 |
| chem|st | RzR: joerg never cared about my voice when there was him and jussi in a meeting only | 23:38 |
| chem|st | and it is a 2/3 majority anyway | 23:38 |
| RzR | but 2/5 | 23:38 |
| chem|st | RzR: you are only 3 | 23:38 |
| RzR | officially we are 5 | 23:39 |
| juiceme | RzR, technicaly so. I'd say we consult Peter first. | 23:39 |
| RzR | so I am mailing them my own | 23:39 |
| chem|st | technically you are 3, just because something wasn't announced yet does not make the system go woo | 23:39 |
| Win7Mac | until next week, because you are soo kind to give them another week | 23:39 |
| juiceme | Win7Mac, we do not need to take a week. | 23:40 |
| RzR | well I think I'll email the draft to peter | 23:40 |
| RzR | and if he's ok we send it asap | 23:40 |
| RzR | or he will send it | 23:40 |
| juiceme | even as Peter's not here he is reachable by emai lomorrow | 23:40 |
| juiceme | tomorrow I mean | 23:41 |
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| RzR | no problem we can wait a couple of days | 23:41 |
| Win7Mac | RzR, great, you're very well allowed to decide via email! | 23:41 |
| Win7Mac | no "real" meeting required really | 23:42 |
| RzR | yea that's what we intend to | 23:42 |
| juiceme | okay, so anything else on agenda today? | 23:44 |
| RzR | there are this pending irc cloak | 23:50 |
| RzR | action | 23:50 |
| RzR | any feedback from genant ? | 23:50 |
| juiceme | good question. I actually thought it was sorted out | 23:51 |
| Win7Mac | not fully | 23:52 |
| juiceme | since I remember Joerg saying there had been a change on the group | 23:52 |
| Win7Mac | another topic: CoC | 23:52 |
| Win7Mac | +1 | 23:52 |
| Win7Mac | +1 on CoC | 23:52 |
| chem|st | within a few days we are able to contact freenode staff directly, then we can sort that out | 23:52 |
| juiceme | okay | 23:53 |
| RzR | ok thx | 23:53 |
| RzR | So CoC ? | 23:53 |
| Win7Mac | sorry, am half-AFK | 23:53 |
| RzR | next topic will be karma check | 23:53 |
| chem|st | wasn't there an attempt for a code of conduct some years ago? (sidenote CoC is chain of command where I come from) | 23:54 |
| RzR | joerg was responsive on this idea | 23:54 |
| RzR | debian one was wrongly linked | 23:55 |
| juiceme | that was talked of a bit previously I recall. | 23:55 |
| juiceme | yes, that was the thing | 23:55 |
| RzR | juiceme, check your private im I sent you a draft to send to peter | 23:56 |
| juiceme | checking | 23:58 |
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| juiceme | darn, I never commented on that :) | 23:58 |
| chem|st | juiceme: can we have a short meeting after the meeting (mcev board) | 23:59 |
| juiceme | chem|st, sure | 23:59 |
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