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| ivgalvez | Seems that eveyone is on vacaition | 20:58 |
|---|---|---|
| ivgalvez | s/vacaition/vacation/ | 20:58 |
| ivgalvez | X-Fade ping | 20:59 |
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| ivgalvez | ~seen X-Fade | 21:03 |
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| SD69 | hello | 21:07 |
| Woody14619 | hi | 21:07 |
| Woody14619 | Sorry for the late arrival. | 21:08 |
| ZogG_laptop | hey | 21:08 |
| SD69 | i just got here myself | 21:08 |
| Woody14619 | ping ivgalvez | 21:08 |
| ZogG_laptop | i just restarted comp and it reminded me of maemo meeting =P | 21:08 |
| Woody14619 | Ok, so I've been a touch out of the loop..... | 21:09 |
| Woody14619 | Work went into frantic mode, and I can't stay long, as I still have stuff going on. Going to be a busy weekend I think. | 21:09 |
| SD69 | woody14619: me too | 21:09 |
| SD69 | super busy lately | 21:09 |
| ZogG_laptop | Woody14619: not realted to that, but lately meetings are less active | 21:09 |
| ZogG_laptop | maybe there are not mny topics, but still | 21:10 |
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| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer05: hey | 21:10 |
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| Woody14619 | We have a multi-million dollar contract hinging on a deliverable that changed last week, so.... :P | 21:10 |
| ivgalvez | hi all | 21:10 |
| ivgalvez | I thought I was alone | 21:10 |
| * vi__ bump crash! | 21:10 | |
| SD69 | hi | 21:10 |
| Woody14619 | Ok.. So, lets get this rolling shall we? :) | 21:10 |
| vi__ | excuse me, I will just sit up the back here. | 21:11 |
| Woody14619 | #start Maemo Council meeting | 21:11 |
| * ZogG_laptop makes place for vi__ | 21:11 | |
| Woody14619 | On the agenda for today, we have: | 21:11 |
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| Woody14619 | 1> Update on bylaws and presentation/setup for NFP | 21:11 |
| Woody14619 | 2> Infrastructure migration issues | 21:12 |
| Woody14619 | 3> Jolla questions and representation | 21:12 |
| Woody14619 | 4> Misc topics | 21:12 |
| Woody14619 | Topic 1: (Bylaw presentation) | 21:13 |
| SD69 | on bylaws, I looked but was unsure how exactly to change first Board | 21:13 |
| Woody14619 | In what reguard? | 21:13 |
| ZogG_laptop | do you need to change? what is the reason to change? | 21:13 |
| SD69 | are we agreed that we propose that council members are designated as initial Board? | 21:13 |
| Woody14619 | Zogg: In order to have a group to handle handoff from Nokia, we have to setup a new legal entity. | 21:14 |
| ZogG_laptop | Woody14619: i know that, i don't get why he wants to change the board proposal | 21:14 |
| ivgalvez | I thought that next elected Council will be first board | 21:14 |
| Woody14619 | Zogg: That requires having bylaws, which technically the current structure doesn't really have nailed down well. | 21:14 |
| Woody14619 | SD69: I was of the understanding that the election of the first board and the next Council would happen in tandem. | 21:14 |
| ivgalvez | voted at the same time than Legal Entity bylaws referendum | 21:15 |
| ivgalvez | Woody14619: yes I had the same idea | 21:15 |
| Woody14619 | And that running for one would not preclude (or mandate) one from running for the other. | 21:15 |
| ivgalvez | exactly | 21:15 |
| ZogG_laptop | btw i still propose to devide power. maaybe to make devs representor part of board (extra member) | 21:16 |
| ivgalvez | That's up th any dev to run for board | 21:16 |
| Woody14619 | I do think eventually the need for Council will drop away, but for the first cycle it make sense to keep old and new. | 21:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | i'm just worried of last politic issue and affraid of power games | 21:17 |
| Woody14619 | I don't think that's going to change the bylaws as they're written though.. Since it only states that the first board is to be elected in the same mannor as the current Council. | 21:17 |
| SD69 | Do we want to delay the new entity until an election? | 21:17 |
| Woody14619 | Zogg: There will always be power games when there is power to be had. | 21:17 |
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| kerio | oh, neat | 21:18 |
| Woody14619 | SD69: No. I don't think we want to do that. But at the current rate, there probably won't be a need to. | 21:18 |
| ZogG_laptop | Woody14619: never thought of being council as power, it's more responsibility, that i for eample do not want | 21:18 |
| SD69 | An initial Board has to be determined at the time that the NFP is created. | 21:18 |
| Woody14619 | zogg: You and I agree on that. Others have seen it differently. | 21:18 |
| ivgalvez | So then the question is: to form the legal entity as soon as possible with current Council or set it up with first Board elected and paired with referendum | 21:19 |
| SD69 | So, a transitional Board lasting a short period of time and then one that is elected? | 21:19 |
| ZogG_laptop | maybe you can make election earlier so Board will work on forming the future and current will help making it as smooth as possible? | 21:19 |
| SD69 | any election takes at least 1 month... | 21:20 |
| Woody14619 | sd69: My understanding is that to get the bylaws for the new NFP established, we're going to want to hold an election for approval anyway, yes? | 21:20 |
| ZogG_laptop | Woody14619: btw i think it's little bit unfair for them, but maybe we can ask the oldschool council memebers to run for election for first time, those who had most exp. | 21:20 |
| Woody14619 | zogg: you are free to ask anyone you like to run. Most of the older folks are gone or not interested... | 21:21 |
| ivgalvez | we must decide and set up dates for that transition, and publish the bylaws in Coucil blog | 21:21 |
| ZogG_laptop | =\ | 21:21 |
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| ZogG_laptop | but povbot is not here - no log | 21:37 |
| Woody14619 | well, yes, but some are lurkers that pipe up on occasion. ;) | 21:37 |
| ivgalvez | perfect, so let's move on to next step | 21:37 |
| ZogG_laptop | =\ | 21:37 |
| Woody14619 | Ok, lets get those bylaws updated, and up there asap and get things moving on that. | 21:38 |
| SD69 | sorry for my delay on bylaws, been very busy | 21:38 |
| Woody14619 | Topic 2: Infrastructure migration | 21:38 |
| ZogG_laptop | i think first review by community ASAP before changes | 21:39 |
| ZogG_laptop | as there would be more changes anyway | 21:39 |
| Woody14619 | zogg: there are already changes based on what we _just_ said... and from the mailing list. | 21:39 |
| Woody14619 | No reason to present them to community without those fixes. | 21:39 |
| Woody14619 | So, on migration, apparently merlin1991 and X-fade didn't meet up on Tuesday as planned? (OBS meeting reference, where both agreed to chat on Tuesday and get setup) | 21:40 |
| Woody14619 | I've been semi-out of the loop since Tuesday, as that's when stuff hit the fan here.... | 21:41 |
| ZogG_laptop | i think the progress should be more public coz of those reasons | 21:41 |
| Woody14619 | I'll confir again w/ X-Fade and merlin1991 and see if we can't get this done asap. :P | 21:41 |
| Woody14619 | zogg: progress in what? for what reasons? | 21:42 |
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| ZogG_laptop | Woody14619: migrations (OBS and so on) | 21:42 |
| Woody14619 | zogg: You keep saying that... Understand, *we* do not control the hardware. | 21:42 |
| ZogG_laptop | Woody14619: as it's only few we depend on and most meeting i see the lack of status on that(correct me if i wrong or missed something) | 21:43 |
| Woody14619 | It's not that we're "hiding" anything, or trying to prevent people from getting access. | 21:43 |
| SD69 | zogg: nothing's happening; nothing is what you see when nothing is happening | 21:43 |
| Woody14619 | We have limited (and in most cases NO) acess ourselves. Everything done on this front is public. | 21:44 |
| SD69 | as to the specific discussion to transfer admin rights, it can be private so not to help someone hack the server | 21:44 |
| ZogG_laptop | that's true | 21:44 |
| ZogG_laptop | but is it working? tested (new OBS and fremantle support?) | 21:45 |
| Woody14619 | Right now one of the larger issues is that the one point person for dealing with out servers is doing so mainly on his free time, since Nokia stopped paying for his services outside of general maintainance. | 21:45 |
| Woody14619 | And his free time has been lacking the past week or so. | 21:45 |
| Woody14619 | This is a public project, but it's being done on privately owned hardware, by a small group of poeple who know how to do it. You keep saying more people should be working on it, but frankly, there are few people that know HOW to do this, and most of them in this community are working on it and have access. | 21:47 |
| ZogG_laptop | that's why i thought other people could help with | 21:47 |
| Woody14619 | What they mainly do not have right now is time. | 21:47 |
| Woody14619 | Zogg: Do you know how to setup and OBS? | 21:47 |
| Woody14619 | Zogg: Do you know how to setup and OBS? | 21:48 |
| ZogG_laptop | i don't and i'm not asking for access, but i think there might be few people who can figure it out. | 21:48 |
| Woody14619 | Yes, and for the most part, they ALL have access. | 21:48 |
| Woody14619 | The problem is, they ALL also lack time right now, since they have other projects going on. | 21:48 |
| Woody14619 | Or work is being demanding, or holiday, or travel.... | 21:49 |
| ZogG_laptop | i think they make great job, if you understood me wrong | 21:49 |
| ZogG_laptop | and i rely on them | 21:49 |
| Woody14619 | There are 3 (or 4) people in this room that have the knowledge to do this work. And AFAIK, all but one has access to said server. (And we're working on getitng him access to the repos...) | 21:50 |
| Woody14619 | So please stop saying "make it more public so people can work on it".... It's not helpful. | 21:50 |
| ZogG_laptop | but i just know there are enuf people on TMO not actively following issue and that;s why not tyring to help, but let's just agree to disagree | 21:50 |
| javispedro | I agree with Woody14619 in that there's no public new information because there's no new information | 21:51 |
| Woody14619 | Anyway... I'll follow up with merlin1991 and X-fade on the repo topic Monday. :P | 21:51 |
| SD69 | zogg - that's not transparency, that's promotion and volunteering | 21:51 |
| Woody14619 | Topic 3: (Jolla questions) | 21:52 |
| Woody14619 | This is a topic Ivan wanted introduced... | 21:52 |
| SD69 | I've made contact with Jolla CEO via LinkedIn | 21:52 |
| Woody14619 | Ivan has been collecting a series of questions for Jolla, from TMO, the mailing list and other places. | 21:53 |
| SD69 | I don't have his jollamobile.com email address if that exists | 21:53 |
| Woody14619 | I think there is a desire to have this list sent on behalf of Council, to be made public with their replies. | 21:54 |
| SD69 | I think we should start a relationship before asking questions and requesting information | 21:54 |
| Woody14619 | Awesome news SD69! :) | 21:54 |
| Woody14619 | I agree... It would be nice to have a chat with them. I think most of the questions are really foundational in nature anyway. | 21:54 |
| SD69 | Jolla is competitive company - our focus should be on whether we can serve as a community adjunct... | 21:54 |
| Woody14619 | What their goals are, targets, etc. | 21:54 |
| SD69 | not on asking them to make sensitive information public as the first overture.. | 21:55 |
| Woody14619 | I don't know that they're competative with us though... Even if they manage to put out a release for Maemo hardware, I don't think there will be a huge flock to it enough to damage the NFP we're trying to setup. | 21:56 |
| Woody14619 | And frankly, if their software is that good... power to them. :) | 21:56 |
| SD69 | too many of the questions that I was aren't appropriate for establishing a relationship | 21:56 |
| SD69 | *saw | 21:56 |
| Woody14619 | ok. :) Well, that's a good starting point. Maybe we can prune or order the list a bit, into ones that are suitable for starting off with and those that are not? | 21:57 |
| Woody14619 | Reguardless, we should setup a time to meet and chat with them. | 21:57 |
| SD69 | we should say "hello" first and "how can we work together" | 21:58 |
| Woody14619 | Agreed. :) | 21:58 |
| SD69 | don't bring a list of questions to the first meeting even if our intention is good.. | 21:58 |
| Woody14619 | So, let's consider that and try to setup a meeting... Or chat via e-mail, or whatever works. | 21:59 |
| Woody14619 | Topic 4? (Misc) | 22:00 |
| SD69 | I will email and cc council ML | 22:00 |
| Woody14619 | awesome. :) | 22:00 |
| Woody14619 | I want to thank Ivan for posting the meeting minutes in my absense last week. | 22:01 |
| Woody14619 | Things here are tight, but I will get the minutes out today for todays meeting and try to post tomorrow or Sunday. | 22:01 |
| SD69 | That everything for me | 22:01 |
| SD69 | thanks woody | 22:01 |
| Woody14619 | Otherwise I have no further topics. | 22:01 |
| Woody14619 | Thank you sd69. :) | 22:02 |
| Woody14619 | One side note: as a reminder, I will be here next weekend, but the following two weeks I will be on holiday. | 22:02 |
| SD69 | I think Ivan got dropped, so maybe he can email asynchronously | 22:02 |
| SD69 | I will be on holiday August 19-25 | 22:02 |
| Woody14619 | I'm out 17-25, so, similar situation. | 22:03 |
| Woody14619 | I believe Niel is back on the 12th? | 22:03 |
| SD69 | I think so | 22:04 |
| Woody14619 | Ok. So we should still have at least two for a meeting. | 22:04 |
| Woody14619 | Sooner we can get those bylaws up the better... | 22:05 |
| Woody14619 | Also, we need to consider when to announce the elections, since they have to be announced a month ahead of time. | 22:05 |
| Woody14619 | If we're planning on doing them in September (which is my current plan), we need to announce some time this month. | 22:05 |
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| Woody14619 | I'm looking into the voting machine to see if I can help out by creating the scripts needed, so all X-fade needs to do is load the machine and generate/mail the tokens. | 22:06 |
| SD69 | gtg | 22:06 |
| SD69 | sorry | 22:07 |
| SD69 | bye | 22:07 |
| Woody14619 | no prob.. same here. | 22:07 |
| Woody14619 | bye! | 22:07 |
| Woody14619 | #end Maemo Council Meeting. | 22:07 |
| Woody14619 | javispedro, good to see you back btw. Hope to see you at Monday's OBS meeting next week? :) | 22:08 |
| javispedro | yep, I'll definitely be there | 22:08 |
| javispedro | my holidays started, so I have some free time these days :) | 22:08 |
| javispedro | hope that I'll be able to get up to speed. | 22:08 |
| Woody14619 | Thanks. :) I don't think much changed since you left to be honest.... | 22:08 |
| javispedro | yeah | 22:08 |
| Woody14619 | Shortly after your trip started Nokia imploded and X-Fade has been swamped with consolidating and spindown on other projects. | 22:09 |
| javispedro | me, and to think my original plans included diablo.. | 22:09 |
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| Woody14619 | lol :) Well, I'd still like to see that, honestly, but lets call that a stretch goal for now. ;) | 22:09 |
| ivgalvez-N900 | Hi | 22:10 |
| Woody14619 | hello Ivan! :) We just closed the meeting a bit ago... Did you have additional topics? (We did discuss the Jolla topic btw) | 22:10 |
| ivgalvez-N900 | Trying to reconnect | 22:10 |
| ivgalvez-N900 | Nope, I'll read it later | 22:11 |
| Woody14619 | SD69 had to go in either case, but can re-open if there's a pressing topic... | 22:11 |
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| ivgalvez-N900 | Any AI for me? | 22:11 |
| Woody14619 | K. I need to get back to work... but it sounds like things are going to press forward a bit better next week. | 22:12 |
| ivgalvez-N900 | Ok | 22:12 |
| ivgalvez-N900 | See ya | 22:12 |
| Woody14619 | I think the only real one would be to consideration ones... And that you'll be running the meeting (with Niel) on the 17th and 24th... | 22:12 |
| Woody14619 | As Rob and I will both be on holiday those days. | 22:13 |
| Woody14619 | k. See you all later. Again, if there are concerns or topics one would like to see addressed in Council meetings or considered by Council, you can mail us at Council@maemo.org | 22:14 |
| Woody14619 | Thanks everyone. :) | 22:14 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I see Stskeeps in here not commenting on topic 3 Jolla - why? | 23:11 |
| Stskeeps | i was actually spending my time in front of the tv with my wife for once | 23:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | aiui Stskeeps is one of the "key" characters in jolla | 23:12 |
| Stskeeps | nah, just another employee | 23:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and for sure could shed some light on the questions raised here | 23:12 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | well I spent the last 2h at BBQ with my freinds down at the garden | 23:14 |
| Stskeeps | that sounds nice | 23:14 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | Stskeeps: I however detect a certain desire of council to get in touch with jolla, so maybe you could facilitate that? | 23:15 |
| Stskeeps | from what i know they've already reached out | 23:15 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | have you guys already managed to put up a web presence nowß | 23:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | ? | 23:16 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | jollamobile.com? | 23:16 |
| Stskeeps | not to my knowledge, either way, i'm not dealing with that part | 23:16 |
| * Stskeeps gets the good job of working on mer | 23:16 | |
| DocScrutinizer05 | :nod: | 23:16 |
| ZogG_laptop | ;P | 23:33 |
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