IRC log of #maemo for Friday, 2017-09-08

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freemangordonPali: ok, read it. now, the main question remains - do we aim for sysvinit?00:07
freemangordonor for upstart or for something else?00:08
Paliif you want fully working debian/devuan system and allow installation of any software from repository, then you can use only things supported by debian/devuan00:08
Paliinit daemon is critical00:08
freemangordonbut devuan supports both upstart and sysvinit00:08
freemangordonand parazyd said they will support openrc (or somesuch) soon00:09
Paliif upstart is working, then you can choose upstart00:09
Palibut I think everything (systemd, upstart, openrc...) would just use compatibility layer for sysv init scripts00:09
Palias debian daemon packages install maximally systemd units and sysvinit init.d scripts00:10
freemangordonok, I guess I can remove upstart scripts then00:10
freemangordonan stay with sysvinit only00:10
freemangordonhowever, this doesn's solve the runlevel issue00:11
Paliso basically there would not be functional difference between upstart and sysvinit00:11
Palimaybe... I would play with idea to drop both malf and actdead runlevel00:12
Paliand if something like actdead is needed, then implement it in one of the early script, which would block whole booting?00:13
freemangordonok, but do we really need runlevel 5? as it seems more complicated than that, most-probably ACT_DEAD is defined by Xsession.actead rather than runlevel00:13
freemangordonas I don;t see anybody changing the runlevel on n900 when it is in act_dead state00:14
freemangordonPali: look at what /sbin/telinit does00:15
freemangordonit basically put the next state (if needed) in /var/lib/dsme/saved_state and then reboots or does shutdown00:17
freemangordonno runlevel change really00:18
freemangordonmaybe thoser runlevels are some remnants from maemo 400:18
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DocScrutinizer05freemangordon: quite possible. there's a lot like this, in preinit, in NAND partitions (orphaned initfs), basically everywhere00:49
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* timeless frowns01:52
timelessso, `disown` is apparently bashis01:52
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Enrico_MenottiI was playing around with kernel modules - in particular, I was trying to build the Android binder, which is in mainline kernel. I did make menuconfig. I'm unable to select this driver as a loadable module - just select it or not. Any idea?02:07
Enrico_Menotti(Anyway, now bedtime - I will read eventual comments tomorrow. Bye!) :)02:09
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DocScrutinizer05timeless: (bashism) yes, absolutely. `man disown` -> BASH_BUILTINS(1)02:31
* timeless gave up and used `screen`02:31
timeless(which is what i would normally use anyway!)02:31
timelessi have a slow starting tomcat server behind apache, and i wanted to have apache automatically switch from a `maintenance page` to connecting to tomcat once tomcat is `ready`02:32
timelesssolution: add a private (localhost) vhost mapped to the tomcat ajp, use curl to wait for tomcat to be ready -- once the command finishes, reload apache's config (with the primary tomcat bridge enabled)02:33
timelesswhen it's down, a fallback vhost for the same domain points to static apache content :)02:33
timelessbut... the trick was running this from a calling script and being able to continue doing other things while that waited02:33
timelessscreen -S waitfortomcat -d -m ~/bin/connect-tomcat02:34
* timeless has never used `-m` before02:34
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Alexxxlrusдруги никто n900 не продает?02:42
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DocScrutinizer05never had the idea to use `screen` in scripts02:43
timelesssomeone had a thing describing how to use screen to debug cron jobs02:43
timelessbut i can't find that today02:44
DocScrutinizer05for parallelism in shellscripts I jave a disgusting example (made by me a maybe 10 years ago):
timelesspretty fancy02:49
* timeless read it once but doesn't have the stomach for pieces of it02:49
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* timeless sighs
* timeless sighs03:02
timelessmy "failover" mail server has 1/2 the ram of the supposed "primary" mail server03:02
timeless(i've been failed over to the failover for months)03:02
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DocScrutinizer05lol, "don't use >5!"  OK, 25 then03:03
infobotsomebody said 5! was 12003:03
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timelessDocScrutinizer05: my thoughts exactly03:15
* timeless moved it to 3003:15
timelessMay  4 09:35:22 mail spamd[21809]: prefork: server reached --max-children setting, consider raising it03:16
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timelessindeed, i am hitting that limit03:16
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timelesserr, not "hitting it" so much as pounding against it03:17
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DocScrutinizer05well, aiui it's a question of parallelizing spam filtering. I don't see why this needs any particular number of preforked processes, except for performance optimization. when there are >25 concurrent inbound mails, they will need to get processed in  a serialized way, which is what my system's spamd does anyway03:42
DocScrutinizer05I'd think "hitting the `limit´ " is pretty normal for this sort of things03:44
DocScrutinizer05actaully _not_ hitting the limit ever would raise concerns03:45
DocScrutinizer05it's not like infinite number of child processes would boost system performance to infinity too. Rather the system eventually hits other limits and a 50 processes that tun from swap are for sure several magnitudes slower than a 25 processes filtering same amount of data in a serialized way within RAM rather than spinning circles in swap hell03:50
DocScrutinizer05s/ tun/ run/03:51
infobotDocScrutinizer05 meant: it's not like infinite number of child processes would boost system performance to infinity too. Rather the system eventually hits other limits and a 50 processes that run from swap are for sure several magnitudes slower than a 25 processes filtering same...03:51
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DocScrutinizer05timeless: however I noticed spamd getting incredibly slow during last maybe 12 to 24 months, must be something about internet connections to servers with spam blacklists or whatever04:13
DocScrutinizer05maybe investigating what exactly is going on, and possibly setting up a transparent proxy or (if spamassassin supports that) a local database cache, might be worth it when you run a system where you need >25 concurrent instances to process all your inbound mail04:15
DocScrutinizer05as a ballpark figure reference, my spamd seems to take random amount of time between 0.5s and sometimes 20s for filtering one email. A 2 or 3 years ago I witnessed it filtering a maybe 20 mails per second, sustainably04:18
DocScrutinizer05I'm running one spamd instance04:19
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* DocScrutinizer05 might try to find out about spamd's internet activities from firewall/NAT logs04:52
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brolin_empeyEnrico_Menotti: DocScrutinizer05: I find the ncdu program useful for determining why a file system volume is full and deleting unnecessary files to free space.  If you have a GUI (X Window System), programs such as WinDirStat that use a (squarified) tree map to visually represent how space is used in a file system are useful too.  Yes, WinDirStat is a Windows program but similar programs are available for *nix (GNU+Linux).12:50
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deepyI gotta say jdiskreport is neat if you got java installed, I prefer it over windirstat15:08
deepyespecially since it's multi-platform15:09
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Enrico_MenottiI'm going to ask a few questions about kernel building, in particular building a single kernel module (a new module to be added to the system). It's a bit off-topic at the beginning, but since my aim is to see whether I may add a couple of modules to the Maemo kernel, maybe it's not that wrong to ask here.22:20
Enrico_MenottiFirst a general question about building the kernel: when I did that for Devuan, I learnt that the first thing to do is to call make against a "pre-cooked" config file, like make rx51-defconfig. Then one may simply invoke make to build kernel (+ modules), or call make against menuconfig, for tweaking the configuration, before actually building the kernel.22:22
Enrico_MenottiNow I was trying to prepare a configuration from scratch. For that, I invoked make menuconfig as first command, and saved the configuration to a file named ".config". Then I tried make, which didn't work, or make .menuconfig, which didn't work either. By googling a bit, I have found that I have to call make oldconfig and make prepare before making the kernel. That led further, but I had other errors about some22:26
Enrico_Menotti scripts, so I searched further and found I have also to call make scripts. I have seen around also a make modules_prepare, which however I didn't use.22:26
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Enrico_MenottiAl this allows a build (really I didn't build the whole kernel, I tried with a single subdirectory, containing sources of a driver.) But I have to admit that I don't understand the various steps I had to take. If anybody could explain or point to an explanation, I'd be happy.22:28
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Enrico_MenottiNow my real point is how to build a single kernel module (without having previously built the kernel). Seems this may be done by cd'ing to the module directory and invoking make -C $(KERNEL_SRC) V=0 M=$$PWD, where KERNEL_SRC has been defined as /lib/modules/$(shell uname -r)/build. I'm on Devuan on an x86 machine, so KERNEL_SRC really is /lib/modules/3.16.0-4-686-pae/build.22:39
Enrico_MenottiIf I got it correctly, I could as well cd to KERNEL_SRC and invoke make V=0 M=<module directory>. Is this correct?22:40
Enrico_MenottiAlso, I don't know what V=0 is. But will investigate about that. In any case, my main question is: what is there in the KERNEL_SRC directory? I didn't install any kernel sources, but I find there some directories which remind me of (some of) the directories which are found in the kernel source tree.22:42
Enrico_MenottiLast thing: this would produce a module for the running system. What if I want to build a module for a different kernel (specifically, Maemo kernel)? Is it enough to substitute for KERNEL_SRC the path to the kernel source directory? Do I need to invoke some make <something> before building the module?22:44
Enrico_MenottiThanks in advance for any answer.22:45
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