IRC log of #maemo for Wednesday, 2015-10-14

DocScrutinizer05the emphasis in the question however is on "meeting friends", not on "in the pub"00:00
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DocScrutinizer05IOW most pubs have a hard time between boredom and bankruptcy here - possibly actually thanks to the idiotic no-smoking regulations00:01
DocScrutinizer05on a tiny note of common sense: all innkeepers were free to declare their pub non-smoking since beginning of times00:03
DocScrutinizer05if it would have promised higher sales, they probably had done, and some pubs or restaurants actually did and lived fine from it, until this idiotic nanny-ism got a hold on our government00:04
DocScrutinizer05what's next? All pubs and restaurants only may offer vegetarian food? And diet coke and beer without alcohol?00:08
sixwheeledbeast^I don't smoke so ... I quite like not smelling of smoke TBH.00:11
sixwheeledbeast^I still understand it's not an ideal situation of sending people into the outside naughty shed.00:12
sixwheeledbeast^I also agree about the emphasis being on meeting friends etc...00:20
sixwheeledbeast^I feel without meeting and talking the next generation will grow up to be infobots...00:21
infobotthanks, sixwheeledbeast^00:21
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sixwheeledbeast^infobot, yw00:22
infobot[yw] you're welcome00:22
DocScrutinizer05I don't like the smell of hairspray and strong perfume. So I want pubs that don't allow women (not really, just to make a point about regulations)00:39
DocScrutinizer05ooh, and btw some perfumes are more toxic than cigarette smoke00:41
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* Oksana would have liked xchat, but yes, there were issues with SSL support. Can try it again now... By the way, I think that the XChat version in Maemo repositories is not the latest one in existence /vegetarian food... Nice touch. And about smoke and perfumes: I don't like smell of either. Delegating toxic perfumes into smoke-alike category would be nice /00:43
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KotCzarnyinstead of banning women, why not bad hairspray and perfume?01:49
KotCzarny(he he)01:49
ds3the answer to all the problem is a mandatory reduction in population density.01:49
KotCzarnycan we start with china/africa/india etc?01:50
ds3if you look at it, it is really a density issue01:51
KotCzarnydensity comes from uneven distribution of goods/services01:51
OksanaYes, more uniform distribution of everything and everybody would solve a lot of problems...01:56
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DocScrutinizer05yeah, spreading the 500 billion € of the 500 richest persons in germany would make quite some sense04:28
DocScrutinizer05meh, that's almost nothing04:28
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DocScrutinizer05hmm, maybe make that only 10% of their assets, but every year04:30
DocScrutinizer05make it 20% and it would probbaly pay for everybody's health insurance04:31
DocScrutinizer05and I guess somebody who managed to get a billion in a lifetime _must_ make a 20% from their assets every year, easily04:33
DocScrutinizer05amazing! when you start with 20000EUR given to you at your birth and you manage to make a 20% on it every year, you would end as billionaire in the age of 60?04:38
DocScrutinizer05either my math fu or my guts feeling is borked04:39
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KotCzarnydoc: basic thing broken with 'spreading' or 'giving', people who receive things without any effort needed to acquire, often just lose it (buy usuless things), which is  why that money goes back to 'the rich'09:30
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KotCzarnywhat is needed is making non-monetary values priority09:35
KotCzarnyfew days ago s. hawking said that egoism is the main thing that will end humanity (not robots/ai, not aliens or anything else)09:36
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Youbi_Hi ! On my n900, I set up an alarm and shut it down for the whole night, and this morning, when I woke up and turne off the alarm, and chose to turn my n900 up, it just shown the NOKIA boot screen, and then shut down.09:40
KotCzarnylow battery?09:40
Youbi_I had to plug the ac adapter to charge it and make it boot.09:40
KotCzarnyput it on charger for 30 min at least09:40
Youbi_Yep, thinking about that, but the battery level was almost half before shutting it down…09:40
KotCzarnyso?, bad battery can lie about capacity remaining09:41
KotCzarnyie. failing faster09:41
infobot[polarcell] BL-5J Replacement09:41
Youbi_Oh, so bad. Well, I have a spare original battery, will try with it.09:41
Youbi_Thanks, it seems to be a nice replacement ^^09:42
KotCzarnyyes, it was reported multiple times that this brand is solid09:43
Youbi_Is there a way to force the automatic time update? Because it doesn’t seem to take effect here09:46
KotCzarnyntpdate ?09:46
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Youbi_Ah, yeah, ntpdate. I’ll try it09:50
KotCzarnyyou might need to either compile it or just use debian's armel etch binary09:51
KotCzarnyor squeeze, dont remember09:51
KotCzarnyright, lenny09:51
KotCzarnyextract just the binary from ntpdate_4.2.4p4+dfsg-8lenny3_armel.deb09:52
Youbi_but ntpdate is a daemon, right?09:54
KotCzarnyyou are thinking about ntpd09:54
Youbi_Oh, ok /o\09:54
KotCzarnybut as i said, grab ntpdate and make a desktop shortcut for it09:55
KotCzarnyeasy and wont eat your precious memory for running daemon09:55
Youbi_Ok. It’s strange that the update doesn’t take effect…09:57
KotCzarnyworks for some gsm networks, fails for some09:57
KotCzarnyfor me its not working neither09:57
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Sicelothe polarcell is a normal size battery? no need for 'fancy' cover?12:23
* Luke-Jr got the 'fancy' cover just so the N900 would fit tightly in the N810 case <.<12:23
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KotCzarnyyes, polarcell is standard bl-5j replacement, but bigger in capacity (1500+)12:42
KotCzarnythey have other form factors too12:44
MaxdamantusMine is apparently around 1590 mAh (labelled as 1500 though)12:48
* Sicelo900 needs two12:50
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* DocScrutinizer05 shakes head about youbi leaving IRC. As a matter of fact, one night with enabled 3G connectivity for example easily could cut through 100% of a decent good battery, depending on data traffic via 3G, *both* directions (so you couldn't even take control about the amount of traffic if it's unsolicited inbound). Suggesting "get a new battery" is shooting too short and not really helpful13:35
KotCzarnydoc, have you read it at all? he said he set up and alarm and TURNED DEVICE OFF13:40
KotCzarnybefore you go on preachy beachy, read first13:40
KotCzarnywith comprehension for best results13:41
DocScrutinizer05have you asked what he actually meant by "switch it off"? How would a - however crappy - battery go empty from even a fake 50% charge when device was actually shut down to power-off state?13:45
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KotCzarnymost people use term 'shut down' for, you know, shutdown13:47
KotCzarny<Youbi_> Hi ! On my n900, I set up an alarm and shut it down for the whole night, and this13:47
DocScrutinizer05this is obviously a noob user, have you considered that he might not even know the difference between lock screen and "turn device off"13:48
KotCzarnywe can ask him later, for now its moot13:48
Sicelo900two of you are generating spam. i'm on a metered connection13:48
DocScrutinizer05that's what I said, yes13:48
DocScrutinizer05Sicelo900: what?13:49
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Youbi_Is there a way to install python3.4 on the n900?15:58
KotCzarnyanswer is: maybe15:58
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KotCzarnyalso, out of curiosity, when you've said 'shut down' the device for the night, you meant poweroff or just screen lock?15:59
Youbi_I meant poweroff15:59
Sicelo900it's available in repos15:59
KotCzarnyalso, python3.4 is in extras-devel15:59
Youbi_I added extras-devel to repositories in fast application manager, but I get errors…16:00
infobotit has been said that fap is good16:00
infobotfrom memory, fapman is Faster Application Manager, a frontend for apt which uses own repositories catalog, and shouldn't be used to do system upgrades (like CSSU), or actually for anything since ~speedyHAM. It also does "apt-get autoremove" after every operation, by default. In short, it's been identified as source of system corruption and thus deprecated, or see ~hamvsfam16:00
KotCzarnyinstall cssu and just use ham16:01
KotCzarnyits much faster and more compatible16:01
bencohit's in -testing, not in -stable.16:01
Youbi_ham, the original application manager?16:01
KotCzarnyyes, but from cssu16:01
KotCzarnyits improved greatly16:01
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KotCzarnyalso, what error you get?16:02
bencohis it just me or TMO is quite slow?16:03
Youbi_Well, actually, I can’t find python3.4 using ham. It’s in community-testing, right?16:03
bencoh(accessing subforum index)16:04
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Youbi_Also, I tried to install CSSU thumb (It’s not a problem for me to flash my device if I get problems), but I can’t update my system, the error is16:05
Youbi_“missing package: libspeex1 (>= 1.2~beta3-1)16:06
KotCzarnyquick tip, some package relies on it and blocks the update16:06
KotCzarnyquick tip2: for cssu, install it on clean device16:07
Youbi_Yep, I got it, but the package can’t be found.16:07
KotCzarnyyoubi: you wont see some packages in ham/fam, you can use apt-get install python3.4 etc16:07
Youbi_What do you mean by “clean device” ?16:08
KotCzarnyie. freshly flashed16:08
Youbi_I flashed my device, then installed CSSU stable, then CSSU-testing, and now CSSU-thumb16:09
KotCzarnyif you dont know debian tools well here's a cheatsheet:
Sicelo900the libspeex issue is being tackled. in the meantime, you can install libspeex from the other repos16:09
Youbi_I know a bit about apt-get, but thanks!16:09
infobotrumour has it, repos is "deb ./ ;; deb ./", or see
infobotwell, maemo-repos is
Youbi_But even when I do `apt-cache search libspeex`, I get nothing.16:10
Youbi_Will check those urls, thanks ^^16:10
KotCzarnyfind which package depends on it16:11
KotCzarnyie. find reverse deps on libspeex16:11
Youbi_For mirror lists, I just have to replace the one on my system with the fremantle repos listed on the wiki?16:13
Sicelo900libspeex1 <-- don't leave out the 116:13
KotCzarnyyoubi: you dont really need those nokia repos16:14
Youbi_You mean the standard one (which do not exist anymore, as I understand)16:15
Youbi_Ah, forget about my last sentence.16:16
Sicelo900you need those repos for libspeex :)16:16
Sicelo900or add the sdk repo16:16
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bencohadding the sdk repo isnt really "the proper way" to do it, but ... :)16:19
Sicelo900i'm just saying where to find the package :)16:20
bencohYoubi_: yeah, they're meant as a drop-in replacement16:20
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KotCzarnyin other words, they are mirrors16:25
Youbi_Ok I got it.16:26
Youbi_Mirrors of the original Nokia SSU, now replaced by the Community SSU, but there is no libspeex in the Community SSU?16:26
KotCzarnynokia ssu != community ssu16:27
KotCzarnynokia ssu mirrors == nokia ssu16:27
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KotCzarnycssu is something completely different than nssu16:28
Youbi_But community ssu provides updates that nokia ssu does not provide?16:28
KotCzarnythey might have few common packages, but mostly different16:28
Youbi_I get it.16:29
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zGrrmoin :)16:34
Youbi_Yeah, just installed libspeex116:36
Youbi_(and yes, apt-get is much more easy for me than the graphical UI)16:36
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Youbi_I think I broke my system.16:47
Youbi_I did `apt-get upgrade` and reboot.16:48
Youbi_And now my n900 doesn’t boot anymore :316:48
KotCzarnywild guess, you have extras-devel enabled?16:48
Youbi_Yep :/16:48
Youbi_So I’m going to flash it again16:48
KotCzarnynever upgrade with extras-devel or extras-testing enabled16:49
Youbi_Ok, now I know ^^'16:49
KotCzarnyalso, while you are at flashing, install cssu-thumb16:50
KotCzarnyand only that16:50
Youbi_Ok, after flash, only cssu-thumb.16:50
Youbi_Booting device into flash mode. Suitable USB device not found, waiting. USB device found found at bus 001, device address 007.16:52
Youbi_“found found”16:52
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Youbi_I always wonder, why did Nokia put a bootup video…16:56
KotCzarnybecause they can16:56
KotCzarnysee the slimming_os link if you want to disable it16:57
Youbi_Ok, thanks16:58
Youbi_Ok, now, I only have extras, cssu-testing, cssu-testing-thumb in my repo list.17:04
Sicelo900funny enough i've never bricked my n900 in all these years with always enabled sdk, devel repos.17:09
Sicelo900for a full year i had this "setup" while USB ws broken. no ill effect17:11
Sicelo900i'm not saying people should do it. i guess it's just beginners luck ;)17:12
Youbi_wtf. Hildon-Application-Manager tells me to backup my phone with Nokia PC Suite before thumb update17:12
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bencohYoubi_: "just in case" :)17:12
bencohcssu says that as well iirc17:13
bencohoh and, do not use upgrade/dist-upgrade with apt on maemo17:13
Youbi_I can’t ignore it… It stops the upgrade.17:14
Sicelo900there was a workaround on wiki/tmo. try a reboot first17:16
Sicelo900failing which check wiki .. forgot what you need to do17:17
Youbi_Maybe should I install CSSU and then CSSU-thumb?17:17
KotCzarnystraight to cssu-thumb17:17
KotCzarnytho, i remember it had some dep troubles17:18
KotCzarnysolvable by uninstalling 1 or 2 packages17:18
KotCzarnybut, your device is freshly flashed, so no worries, you can try17:20
Youbi_Ok, getting back home o/17:26
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princefakhanhas ham been replaced by an open source alternative in cssu?18:29
bencohin -testing18:34
princefakhanehm! I was just reading the backlog, I thought it has.18:35
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princefakhan<KotCzarny> yes, but from cssu18:36
princefakhan<KotCzarny> its improved greatly18:36
bencoherrr wait, we have HAM sources18:36
bencohyeah, we do18:38
princefakhanoh right! it was open source already.18:42
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sixwheeledbeast^princefakhan: it's FOSS already but speed improvements have been made in latest version19:04
infobotextra, extra, read all about it, speedyham is 30 times faster than HAM
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KotCzarnyswb, for newbies it doesnt say much, better to just tell that ham in cssu (any flavour) is just better than stock-ham or fapman19:24
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sixwheeledbeast^meh, newbies should be on cssu-stable as far as I am concerned.19:25
bencohI wonder why it's not in -stable19:28
bencohespecially considering stock HAM is barely usable with extras19:28
KotCzarnyits not in -stable?19:31
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bencoh16:01 < bencoh> it's in -testing, not in -stable. 18:34 < bencoh> in -testing19:36
buZzehw, what is HAM? :P19:37
Sicelo900will likely be in the next stabe19:37
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sixwheeledbeast^because there hasn't been a stable release since it was put in devel19:44
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YoubiI don’t know what I did, but now my n900 is not booting. After the NOKIA white boot screen, I get the 5 dots, endlessly.22:09
YoubiI removed the /etc/X11/Xsession.d/10hildon_welcome file to avoid nokia hands. May it be the source of my problem?22:10
KotCzarnyunless you did more than that22:10
YoubiI don’t remember doing anything else.22:10
YoubiAnything else related to boot*22:11
KotCzarnyi got 5 dots syndrome by simply having error in ~/.profile22:11
YoubiOh. I modified my ~/.profile22:11
KotCzarnyso it might be anything, missing libs, wrong version etc22:11
YoubiThat’s completely dumb -_-22:12
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KotCzarnya bit22:12
KotCzarnystill, i prefer that kind of dumbness to failed booting and no way to flash without serial cable22:13
YoubiFlashing is the only solution? I can’t access /home/user when n900 is down?22:14
KotCzarnyyou can22:15
infobotrescueos is, like,
KotCzarnybut read the documentation first22:15
KotCzarnyin short, you can boot (not flash) using flasher22:15
YoubiI’m reading the documentation. It’s quite a good stuff22:17
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YoubiI’m using NetBSD on my laptop, so I’ll try to build the fiasco flasher and use rescueOS to edit ~/.profile22:36
KotCzarnyerm, check 0xFFFF22:37
infobot[0xffff], or
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KotCzarnyits opensource flasher replacement22:37
KotCzarnydont know if it will work on netbsd22:37
YoubiYep, I’m trying to build it.22:37
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YoubiThe only dep is which seems cross platform. So I have good hopes.22:39
YoubiI’m so happy22:41
YoubiIn the of 0xFFFF22:42
Youbi# NetBSD stuff22:42
Youbi#CPPFLAGS += -I/usr/pkg/include22:42
Youbi#LDFLAGS += -L/usr/pkg/lib -Wl,-R/usr/pkg/lib22:42
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Paliyes 0xFFFF is clean C99 code with just libusb0 dependency22:49
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artetahi, how to classify apps when we hit twice the windows logo on the top left of the screen pls (like when we use the app manager)? after flashing my n900 « all » the apps are in one "page"22:54
KotCzarnyum, you probably had some classifier app installed22:55
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KotCzarnyby default there are no categories22:55
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YoubiWell. It seems that it doesn’t work very well.22:58
artetaok, thx, maybe it was catorise22:58
YoubiI sucessfully built 0xFFFF on my NetBSD laptop. When I run it, as root, it waits for my device to be plugged in. So I remove battery and plug it, then put the battery back in my n900. Then my n900 is detected, but the result is quite strange, and then, my computer reboot…22:59
KotCzarnyask pali, i think he maintains it (or is even the author)23:00
Sicelocomputer reboots? heh23:01
Palido not know how netbsd works... but there is not reboot...23:02
KotCzarnycould be some usb woe?23:05
YoubiWhen I run 0xFFFF -I23:05
Youbi(as root)23:05
PaliYoubi: Two reasons: 1) your system has slow usb enumeration or 2) N900 is in very bad state23:06
Palitry to press U key on n90023:06
YoubiWhen booting it unplugged?23:06
Palipress key, plug cable and hold it when 0xFFFF identify23:07
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YoubiSame result, But the led on the n900 stays yellow23:10
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YoubiOk, without the -l (load to ram) option, 0xFFFF (with -m option for image and kernel, and -b 'rootdelay root=/dev/ram0') just print the same message as 0xFFFF -I. And then, I get my prompt back23:39
YoubiAnd the n900 boot, but I get the 5 dots.23:40
bencohhave you fixed your .profile?23:44
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