IRC log of #maemo for Monday, 2007-12-31

kpel	we're talking about voice calls over the utran, right??	00:00
ReverseGTR	kpel: I meant not servers, I mean the network and backbone providers. That sort data from different IPs each day. Don't that already have software that helps plot what hops a computer's data takes online to get to the infromation? And yes we did go way off topic	00:01
ReverseGTR	kpel: but why would a device like the N810 need to comply with NSA protocals? I thought it only applied to any device with a cellular chip?	00:02
deejoe	I think it's not NSA, but FCC.	00:02
deejoe	and the requirement is that it not be user-modifiable.	00:03
kpel	they probably can monitor a certain user's traffic but for call interception it's not necessary	00:03
ReverseGTR	deejoe: so if I buy an unlocked cellphone and use with AT&T thats illegal?	00:03
ReverseGTR	I mean an unlocked cellphone like Openmoko Neo or Motorola Ming	00:04
rwhitby	openmoko neo does not have a user modifiable gsm module	00:05
ReverseGTR	rwhitby: really, but I guess it makes sense if they want to make it commercially viable at all. So what are the differences in the DSP in the N770 and 800 series?	00:06
kpel	ReverseGTR,	00:07
kpel	ReverseGTR, http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/07/11/greek_mobile_wiretap_latest/	00:08
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wumpus	yes, the FCC requires any sort of wireless transmitting equipment to be closed source	00:09
wumpus	this applied to wifi as well as gsm firmware	00:09
wumpus	applies*	00:10
torpor	FCC = fingered by NSA	00:10
kpel	no surprise there	00:11
ReverseGTR	kpel: And this is the problem. Once closed source DSP is unlocked for malware purposes it can be allot harder to find a solution. Nokia should just open up N-series DSP on the CPU and any organization that wants to easedrop should put the money where their mouth is and hire some programmers who can constantly update it.	00:11
kulve	the dsp stuff is open except the audio api inside the dsp	00:12
wumpus	it's not really about eavesdropping, you could encrypt the traffic at any point.. the reason is that you can jam and corrupt signals with a modified transmitter	00:12
ReverseGTR	wumpus: if Wifi is closed Linksys was violating it by having users install 3rd party firmware	00:12
kulve	http://dspgateway.sourceforge.net/	00:12
wumpus	ReverseGTR: even in that 3rd party firmware the wifi drivers are closed source	00:13
deejoe	Linksys doesn't "have" users install 3rd party software.	00:13
deejoe	users do it, but linksys doesn't say "go and do this" do they?	00:13
wumpus	it's really fine to install another operating system, as long as there is no open access to the transmitter equipment	00:13
kpel	even openwrt uses closed source code?	00:14
ReverseGTR	ok so I am comparing apples to oranges then	00:14
wumpus	for the wifi drivers, yes	00:14
kpel	ic	00:14
wumpus	the only wifi devices that have open source drivers are the 'smart' ones that have internal firmware that you can't tamper with	00:14
wumpus	the dumb ones that have no firmware need closed source drivers	00:14
deejoe	even with stock linksys firmware, one can set the "wrong" locale, which is probably illegal. But the user does that.	00:14
wumpus	yes, that would be a fcc violation	00:15
wumpus	but locale only makes a slight difference so I don't think anyone cares	00:15
deejoe	different power levels, no?	00:15
wumpus	slightly, and you have some more/different channels	00:16
wumpus	but gsm is more of a concern for jamming devices than wifi	00:17
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wumpus	anyway ,none of these reasons explains why the N800 dsp firmware is closed, as it's not used for any transmitting/radio stuff	00:18
wumpus	so the FCC doesn't care about it	00:18
deejoe	nice save :-)	00:18
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unique311	fecking ey. i need to install python2.5-cairo / -dev can't seem to install the damn thing.	00:34
unique311	error size mismatched	00:34
unique311	Failed to fetch http://repository.maemo.org/extras/pool/chinook/free/p/pycairo/python2.5-cairo_1.4.0-1osso1_armel.deb Size mismatch	00:35
unique311	manually downloaded python2.5-cairo-dev	00:36
unique311	but cannot do the same for python2.5-cairo	00:36
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_\|Nix\|_	Sweeeeet: http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/12/29/1959244	01:15
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* thecrypto blinks a few times as he sees the topic.		01:18
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thecrypto	Well...I just blew away my scratchbox by mistake, are there any mirrors/	01:19
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alterego	Mirrors for what?	01:33
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thecrypto	The maemo repository since the debs are broken. Or has anyone figured out a way to force an install?	01:37
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rm_you	change the /etc/apt/sources.list.d/hildonwhatever.list file	01:41
alterego	thecrypto, use stage.maemo.org	01:41
alterego	Instead of repository.maemo.org	01:41
rm_you	replace "repository.maemo" with stages.maemo	01:41
rm_you	or repostory.maemo (no "i")	01:41
thecrypto	Trying that now	01:42
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Luria	so the weirdest thing happened	02:18
Luria	somehow a virtual "shift" key was being held down.	02:18
Luria	and until i connected my apple bt kybd, and hit shift (not caps)	02:19
Luria	did things go back to normal.	02:19
Luria	now i admit that might not be the wierdest thing ever, but it was odd.	02:19
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Luria	no explanations?	02:30
thecrypto	Okay, finally got scratchbox resetup but now in the chinook_x86 target I get this error	02:30
thecrypto	"/scratchbox/tools/bin/misc_runner: SBOX_CPUTRANSPARENCY_METHOD not set"	02:30
thecrypto	How should I fix that	02:30
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thecrypto	It was working fine before, it just stopped working all of a sudden	02:48
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staulkor	hey	02:54
staulkor	anybody know where i can find libhildonwidgets.so.0	02:54
staulkor	Autoscan needs it to load and I cant find that supid file :P	02:55
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bdogg64	anyone want to test a working build of vlc for maemo?	03:12
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staulkor	sure, ill test for you	03:20
dospod	hey	03:20
bdogg64	ok, i'll send it	03:22
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staulkor	k	03:22
dospod	how is everyone	03:22
staulkor	doing good except for the problem im having with autoscan :P	03:23
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dospod	haha im having trouble configuring phonelink	03:24
staulkor	i cant find a stupid lib	03:24
dospod	i cant get gnokii to work lol	03:25
staulkor	hehe	03:25
dospod	oh well 1 of these days	03:26
staulkor	:P yea	03:26
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\|tbb\|	rm_you: have you patched mplayer allready?	03:33
Luria	there's no gui for that, is there?	03:33
Luria	phonelink that is	03:33
dospod	there is a ui	03:33
Luria	really... then maybe it's worth the struggle	03:34
dospod	its gnokii thats weird	03:36
Luria	dependency hell?	03:36
dospod	kinda adduser	03:37
dospod	but u can install libgnokii3	03:37
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bdogg64	how can I send you the file staulkor?	03:38
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TucosSavior	stage.maemo.org down for anybody else?	03:41
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yabbas	Is there an XF86Config we can tamper with for k-drive?	03:57
yabbas	*s/XF86config/XFOmapConfig :)	03:58
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magicrobotmonkey	i cant get videos shared over upnp to play - the built in player doesnt recognize the format and mplayer doesnt do anything when i try to open one	04:07
GeneralAntilles	What format are the videos in?	04:09
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magicrobotmonkey	a bunch mostly xvid and divx though	04:10
GeneralAntilles	bitrate?	04:11
GeneralAntilles	wrapper?	04:11
magicrobotmonkey	they're avis for the most part bitrates are all over the place ive yet to find one that works	04:12
magicrobotmonkey	whats ideal for the default player?	04:12
GeneralAntilles	400x240 (or whatever aspect fits that, say 320x240 for 4:3) MPEG4 video at no more than 1200Kbps between 20-30fps	04:13
GeneralAntilles	with MP3 audio (so the DSP can be used)	04:13
GeneralAntilles	.avi wrapper works well	04:13
GeneralAntilles	That's pretty much a guarantee	04:13
GeneralAntilles	Could be an issue with your UPnP server, though.	04:13
GeneralAntilles	Try to play some of them off an SD card.	04:14
bdogg64	Here is my link to the VLC deb if anyone wants to try it out -- http://www.megaupload.com/?d=WYGLCSFV	04:14
magicrobotmonkey	yea too bad it takes a minu	04:14
GeneralAntilles	The N800 is picky about video, but will run absolutely fantastically if you tailor media for it.	04:14
magicrobotmonkey	sweet just saw your post!	04:14
GeneralAntilles	bdogg64, is it as optimized as mplayer? :P	04:14
bdogg64	maybe :P	04:15
yabbas	bdogg64, blimeh - and you've played vids back with it? :)	04:15
bdogg64	yep	04:15
GeneralAntilles	Get yourself a garage account so you don't have to use mediaupload.	04:16
bdogg64	i compiled it just about every flag on ffmpeg i could use	04:16
GeneralAntilles	er, "mega"	04:16
yabbas	sweet :) can't hurt to have more options available	04:16
GeneralAntilles	No sir.	04:16
GeneralAntilles	Should make connecting to VLC transcoding streams a little more straightforward.	04:16
bdogg64	I just signed up on garage	04:16
GeneralAntilles	Who wants to test the transcoding limits of the N800? :P	04:16
GeneralAntilles	Cool, bdogg64.	04:17
magicrobotmonkey	i dont see a link on that page	04:17
yabbas	bdogg64, without installing it - what was the playback like with vlc?	04:20
bdogg64	it was ok... i tried to play the Nokia_N810.avi video that comes OS2008 i supposed and it played for a few seconds and then froze. VLC displayed a message about the cpu being too slow	04:21
yabbas	(as in ... I haven't installed it yet and am asking the obvious ... not "without installing it" )	04:21
yabbas	And was it too slow? :)	04:21
bdogg64	i played a couple other videos and they played fine	04:21
bdogg64	yea	04:21
* yabbas nods		04:22
bdogg64	i also played a video direct from a url and it worked fine too, over wi-fi that is	04:22
yabbas	nice one, so atm it needs optimization	04:22
yabbas	(might wanna mention that in your post btw and show some tasty video screenies)	04:23
bdogg64	yea.. im trying to get some together now :-)	04:23
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magicrobotmonkey	whats the default passwrod to be able to sudo on the n810	04:30
dospod	u need becomeroot to get root	04:31
yabbas	don't think there is one . . . . but don't quote me on that ;) if you install ssh you will be asked to enter a root password	04:31
magicrobotmonkey	k	04:31
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Luria	yeah, thats new	04:32
Luria	rootme is the default password	04:32
Luria	i was pleasantly surprised to see openssh ask for a new password on install	04:33
yabbas	same here ... the simple things impress me :)	04:34
magicrobotmonkey	i was too until it hung in the middle of the installation	04:35
* yabbas sighs, sighs, sighs, sighs, etc, etc		04:36
magicrobotmonkey	heh	04:37
Luria	wow. speaking of which - loook at all the notifications on the ogg-support install	04:38
magicrobotmonkey	whats the shell this is running?	04:39
dospod	ash	04:39
Luria	yeah, it just failed :-/	04:39
dospod	never heard of it till i got this	04:39
Luria	ash?	04:40
Luria	isnt that a shell?	04:40
magicrobotmonkey	well i set a password in the ssh install but i still cant sudo	04:40
dospod	yea i could have sworn i read someone askin bout it	04:41
magicrobotmonkey	but i can certainly ssh to myself	04:41
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Luria	you have to edit sudoers	04:44
Luria	to use sudo	04:45
Luria	google sudo sudoers - there are a couple of ways to do this	04:46
magicrobotmonkey	oh right	04:51
magicrobotmonkey	anyways anyone know if you can get sshfs for os2008	04:52
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magicrobotmonkey	how do you find your ip?	05:00
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dospod	ifconfig	05:01
dospod	if u have iputils	05:01
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magicrobotmonkey	ah	05:02
Luria	ifconfig is in busybox, no?	05:03
dospod	im not sure	05:03
magicrobotmonkey	not that i see	05:04
Luria	yes it does	05:06
Luria	run busybox --help to get a list of functions	05:06
Luria	(yes, i just did)	05:07
bdogg64	busybox ifconfig	05:07
magicrobotmonkey	oh	05:09
Luria	there should be an aliased command tho	05:10
Luria	it does need root privs	05:11
Luria	that might be your problem	05:11
magicrobotmonkey	mmm	05:11
magicrobotmonkey	whats the default pass for user	05:12
magicrobotmonkey	like if i was sshing in	05:12
Luria	iirc, you dont want to tinker with that	05:12
magicrobotmonkey	so should i just ssh as root?	05:13
Luria	yeah, user is passwd -l 'ed	05:13
magicrobotmonkey	gar	05:15
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Luria	i suppose you can do it, but i vaguely recall (disclaimer!) tht it might break apps	05:17
Luria	but i do remember hearing it here from a channel reg	05:17
yabbas	if you add a password, your appmanager will appear to "hang"	05:19
yabbas	when installing stuff	05:19
magicrobotmonkey	eh i can dance around it	05:19
Luria	it's not wise	05:21
Luria	use ssh with keys	05:21
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\|R	http://safetravel.dot.gov/whats_new_batteries.html <- i don't get this... if i have a lithium ion installed in a device (n8x0) in carry-on, i can't use it anyway...?	05:25
magicrobotmonkey	yea working on getting keys set up	05:27
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bdogg64	here is another link -- http://webf1.filecrunch.com/f/f548c082e05b21c32b35572d232d4c83%2F477861ef/20071231/cb42bd2ed22cab3159acf56550d34b56/vlc_0.8.6-1_armel.deb	05:30
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Luria	sigh, i hate using the app manager	05:45
alterego	It's not that pad.	05:45
alterego	~bap	05:45
Luria	dpkg is so much quicker	05:45
infobot	somebody said bap was null	05:45
alterego	~bad	05:45
* infobot whines like a puppy and sulks		05:45
alterego	That was unexpected.	05:45
bdogg64	lol.. nice	05:45
Luria	the spirit of _monkey lives on	05:46
alterego	It's like the matrix, when Neo gets infested with the agent.	05:46
alterego	infobot _is_ Monkey!	05:46
Luria	sorta	05:47
Luria	_monkey	05:47
Luria	see. no response.	05:47
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alterego	You have to fill in the gap: _Monkey == SMonkey == Spunky Monkey.	05:47
Luria	besides infobot was around at the same time as monkey.	05:48
Luria	it just kept its mouth shut.	05:48
alterego	Or we couldn't hear _it's_ bathering through _Monkey's static :)	05:48
bdogg64	is there any way to set connection priority?	05:51
Luria	like windows' wifi client?	05:51
Luria	where it will disconnect and hop?	05:51
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bdogg64	yea... like if i have my phone connection and wifi.... if i want it to connect to the phone before the wifi	05:53
alterego	Why would anyone want their wifi to act like Windows wifi connection manager? That's aweful	05:53
bdogg64	maybe not act like the windows one... but something to that effect	05:53
alterego	What does that mean?	05:57
alterego	Jeez, if you want it to act like Windows, install Windows(tm)	05:57
yabbas	bdogg64, I think it does it automagically. If you setup both accounts - it'll flick between them.	05:57
yabbas	Priority given to wifi connects (for obvious reasons.)	05:58
bdogg64	ok	05:59
alterego	The problem with anything like that. Is that not everyone wants the same behaviour. So creating an easy to use connection manager is hard, when you have so many different opinions on how it should operate.	05:59
alterego	Sure you can add complexity with countless configuration options. But that defeats the point of a simple connection manager :)	05:59
yabbas	alterego, agreed. Personally I wish it'd stop asking me to connect via mobile since it costs me both arms and both legs.	06:00
alterego	:)	06:00
bdogg64	yea. I was just wondering. I know the Nokia E61i has something that provides that	06:00
alterego	Personally, I'd like mine to connect to the known wifi spots. And when not in range of those, to auto connect to my mobile phone. But only in between the hours of 6-8 on a full moon in the month of January.	06:01
* yabbas reads xorg changelogs... Real input drivers in KDrive framework, plus multiple keyboards, multiple devices.		06:01
alterego	Oh, and it has to be a leap year.	06:01
bdogg64	lol... ok maybe the phone was a bad example	06:02
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Luria	wow that was a crash	06:05
Luria	gnumeric didnt want to uninstall	06:05
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Luria	apt-get -f install is having a blast :-/	06:08
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bradsucks	(can't wait to get my n800)	06:35
Vulcanis	has anyone here tried pairing a wii controller to an n800?	06:36
Luria	yes, once, a while ago	06:36
Luria	i hear it's much better now	06:36
yabbas	yes ;)	06:37
bradsucks	is there any google calendar sync stuff on the n800/n810?	06:37
bradsucks	i'm looking around and not finding much	06:37
yabbas	I've ported wminput - it's working well as a controller. I've fixed the wiimote detection code and am currently trying to find a way to get mouse input to X.	06:38
Luria	erminig iirc	06:38
Luria	huh.	06:38
bradsucks	ah ha	06:38
Luria	well, i like mice for my fpses, but...	06:38
bradsucks	thanks luria	06:38
bradsucks	man, i can't wait to play with it	06:38
Luria	i'd try it with quetoo	06:38
yabbas	Luria, same here - but I'd like to see it "complete" :)	06:39
Luria	bradsucks, np	06:39
Luria	id look like such a dork - n800 + wiimote + apple compact bt kybd + q2	06:40
Luria	gots ta have it	06:40
yabbas	lol	06:40
Luria	actually, i have to fix xmodmap with this keyboard	06:41
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Luria	i need a windows right click key	06:41
yabbas	I was mainly interested in the controller side of things. Also looking at accelerometer and ir cam functions for other projects.	06:41
tank-man	ps3 controller is bluetooth	06:42
yabbas	hidd has sixxaxis mentioned in the source. Since I don't have a PS3 controller I haven't tried it.	06:43
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Luria	i dont get it. aptget failed 3 times on a gnumeric install, and the appmanager seems to have done it...	06:46
Luria	spoke too soon	06:46
Luria	whatever, i have an icon, it runs.	06:47
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Luria	dosbox is nice	06:48
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lech	anyone know how to modify the internet radio applet in os2008 so I can stock it with alternate channels instead of only BBC radio links?	06:52
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lech	anyone?	07:01
celesteh	anyone what?	07:02
lech	does anyone know how to modify the internet radio applet in os2008 so I can add alternate channels instead of only the default BBC radio links?	07:02
lech	they appear locked down in media player as well	07:03
lech	:\	07:03
celesteh	sorry. i'm not on 2008 yet	07:03
lech	:\	07:03
celesteh	i've heard all the repos are down for applications	07:03
celesteh	or some of them are	07:03
celesteh	and i was going to wait until they came back up next year	07:03
Luria	if you open a stream in media player, you can then save it - "add bookmark" iirc	07:03
Luria	then it will appear in the drop down	07:04
Luria	in the home screen applet	07:04
lech	Luria, yeah, that doesn't exactly add it to the desktop internet radio applet though	07:05
Luria	it should	07:05
lech	Luria, are you in os2008?	07:06
Luria	for a month and a half	07:06
Luria	its worked on all of them	07:06
lech	ok, in media player jump to Library > Internet Radio	07:07
shack	lech: I was able to add some radios in the default list to the "favorites" list (which is the list with the bbc etc)	07:07
Luria	i have galgalatz on my applet. seems to work for me, no different than os2007	07:07
Luria	no	07:07
Luria	open the url in the browser	07:07
Luria	then let it open in the media player	07:07
Luria	then add bookmark (or some such) in the media player	07:08
Luria	is the quickest way	07:08
lech	ahh, that's a bit backward	07:08
Luria	well, you need the url anyway	07:09
lech	yeah, would be nicer if there was just a way to drag and drop it around media player	07:09
lech	but thanks for helping with that	07:09
Luria	and that way you test whether it can handle the stream	07:09
lech	true	07:09
Luria	its not the only way, iirc, but it is the most certain method	07:09
Luria	the straight forward way is	07:10
Luria	library	07:10
Luria	internet radio	07:10
lech	yeah, that's the way I just did it bypassing the browser	07:11
Luria	file menu->add bookmark	07:11
lech	just wasn't certain what exactly bookmark meant considering it's already in the library	07:11
Luria	but sometimes there is a hidden forward in the stream link	07:11
Luria	for example,	07:11
Luria	on Galgalatz (israeli station)	07:12
lech	yeah, I'm familiar with the proxying some stations use	07:12
lech	BassDrive along with a few others do it to load balance	07:12
Luria	there is a playlisted stream with a station id and then the real stream	07:12
lech	if one stream is overwhelmed it jumps to the next in the playlist	07:12
Luria	i bypass the station id/ad by using the first method	07:12
lech	I don't suppose you can remove certain applets that come in here by default, like "tableteer info" can you?	07:14
Luria	remove as uninstall?	07:15
lech	uninstall or hide	07:15
Luria	or remove from display	07:15
lech	from the list, not the desktop	07:15
Luria	ah	07:16
Luria	short of uninstalling the package, no idea	07:16
lech	hmm, alright	07:16
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BuckWild	umm, I saw they had a fuse port for the N770 tablets, is there any ports for the newer OSs?	08:07
BuckWild	OS2008 in particular?	08:07
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iDS	:D	08:09
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We	:D	08:11
We	morning	08:11
* We sends hordes of lemmings over unique311		08:11
* We throws a keyboard at unique311		08:12
We	:D	08:13
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We	yeah	08:25
We	:D	08:25
shack008n	damn, mplayer can't open network streams	08:25
We	lol	08:25
We	wait	08:25
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shack008n	oh shit, We's here again	08:26
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Vulcanis	[01:25:46] <shack008n> damn, mplayer can't open network streams -- whats streaming it	08:34
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shack008n	Vulcanis: i just paste the url and it won't play,for the file is too small	08:35
iDS	yeah	08:36
iDS	Which One Is Better In Your Opinion? N800 Or N810 ?	08:36
BuckWild	is there any way to mount a fuse share?	08:37
BuckWild	I'd really like to do that	08:37
BuckWild	not exactly sure why that hasn't been attempted since the N770	08:37
Vulcanis	n800 because its cheaper and just as powerful	08:37
Vulcanis	like to do what, buck?	08:37
Vulcanis	nm	08:37
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BuckWild	I'd like to have remote, secure access to my MP3s	08:37
BuckWild	from work	08:37
BuckWild	and it would be cool to access other files too while I'm at it	08:38
iDS	?	08:38
iDS	Which One Is Better In Your Opinion? N800 Or N810 ?	08:38
shack008n	you could run an upnp server over a vnc maybe	08:38
BuckWild	N800, I haven't used the N810	08:38
BuckWild	but the two full sized SDHC slots win me over	08:38
BuckWild	I do like the idea of a built in keyboard tho	08:39
BuckWild	shack008n, hmm	08:39
BuckWild	isn't vnc insecure?	08:39
BuckWild	I know in order to get remote access to my box I usually use X11 forwarding over SSH	08:39
BuckWild	you don't get access to the running X session, but who cares cuz you can run whatever you need anyway	08:40
shack008n	well, it's just songs...	08:40
BuckWild	I had an apache installation with basic authentication setup	08:40
BuckWild	but from my understanding that's basically no authentication	08:40
oil	I was not convinced about the n810 keyboard.. .but once I got it.. it's really great.	08:41
iDS	Well Which One Is Brightest,Loudest And High Video Quality?	08:41
shack008n	ehmm, did i say vnc? i meant vpn of course	08:41
BuckWild	oh	08:41
BuckWild	vpn	08:41
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BuckWild	hmm	08:41
BuckWild	yeah, I hadn't really thought of that route	08:41
iDS	?	08:42
BuckWild	does VPN provide access to NFS shares?	08:42
iDS	Well Which One Is Brightest,Loudest And High Video Quality?	08:42
BuckWild	I haven't really messed with VPN as much	08:42
BuckWild	iDS, no idea, I only used the N800	08:42
BuckWild	but I think it looks nice for videos shrug	08:42
BuckWild	and as far as loudest	08:42
BuckWild	how loud do you expect a built in speaker on a 4"x6" thing to be?	08:43
BuckWild	or whatever it is	08:43
BuckWild	I love my N800, I kinda am envious of the built in keyboard on the N810	08:43
BuckWild	but	08:43
BuckWild	I don't know if I'd buy one of those given the SDHC slots	08:44
BuckWild	I'm planning on getting another 16gb card and putting 24gb of capacity in mine eventually	08:44
shack008n	the speakers on the 800 are fine to use it as a internet radio at home (if it's not too noisy	08:44
BuckWild	nowadays you can get bluetooth head units (which I'm buying)	08:44
BuckWild	and then stream your music directly from the N800 to your car	08:44
BuckWild	which will rule	08:44
iDS	BuckWild so u want the keyboard?	08:44
BuckWild	yeah, I think a pop out keyboard would be nice	08:45
BuckWild	but I don't think it's really worth the loss of the full size SDHC slots	08:45
BuckWild	so I'd probably still buy a N800 now given the choice	08:45
BuckWild	I'm more about capacity than anything else with mobile units	08:45
iDS	no i don't think	08:45
BuckWild	it depends on what you are going to be doing with the device	08:45
BuckWild	if I'm doing a lot of typing, I find I can usually just ssh in to execute commands anyway	08:46
BuckWild	it would be nice for pidgin to have the full keyboard	08:46
BuckWild	but honestly, mobile IMing is not as useful as they make it out to be	08:46
BuckWild	the most typing I tend to do away from a computer is to look up some crap on the internet when I'm out	08:47
BuckWild	and the screen keyboard is good enough for that	08:47
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tank-man	about the loudness, i find the n800 louder than my psp	08:48
iDS	How is the battery life on n800 and n810 which one is better?	08:48
BuckWild	no idea about that one	08:48
BuckWild	I think the N810 is better for music or something	08:49
iDS	cos i want to buy 1 of them and still don't know more :(	08:49
BuckWild	I find that in intense usage situations that the N800 can be a little shorter on battery life than I like	08:49
BuckWild	but	08:49
tank-man	get which ever one you can afford	08:49
BuckWild	when you consider that when I'm using it intensely I'm basically using it like a laptop	08:50
BuckWild	and most laptops have like	08:50
iDS	so n810 operating time for battery life is longer yes?	08:50
BuckWild	2-4 hours battery life	08:50
BuckWild	I think it's pretty good	08:50
BuckWild	umm	08:50
BuckWild	not sure	08:50
BuckWild	I think the N810 has a dedicated music mode that lasts a lot longer than N800 playing music or something	08:50
BuckWild	I think it might have a better battery life	08:50
iDS	what about video?	08:52
iDS	umm?	08:53
iDS	Video Operating Time For Battery Life	08:53
metatron	what?	08:54
iDS	read up	08:54
metatron	no, both have the same boards	08:55
metatron	same dsps	08:55
iDS	and guys the screen display size of them is the same?	08:55
metatron	omap 2420	08:55
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iDS	?	08:55
Luria	display size is the same on all ITs back to the 770	08:56
iDS	:D	08:56
Luria	though the panel has been different each time	08:56
iDS	Luria	08:56
iDS	do u prefer n810 to n800?	08:56
iDS	or no	08:56
Luria	ah... depends on usage	08:56
Vulcanis	n810 because of the thumbboard	08:57
Luria	i am on an 810 right now	08:57
Luria	excuse me	08:57
Vulcanis	but if you use a BT KB, they are pretty much exactly the same	08:57
Luria	800	08:57
Luria	ive handled the 810; it's very nice	08:57
Luria	i may get it too	08:57
Luria	but im not selling the n800	08:57
iDS	cos i am hearing about battery life and nb10 is more longer than n800	08:57
Vulcanis	one for each pocket, Luria?	08:58
Luria	simply because of the storage space	08:58
Luria	i also have a 770, fwiw	08:58
Vulcanis	yeah, n810 is max 10gb, n800 is max 16, IIRC	08:58
Luria	no	08:58
Luria	max 16 per slot	08:58
Vulcanis	Oh, its gotten higher?	08:58
Vulcanis	thought it capped at 8	08:58
iDS	??????	08:58
Vulcanis	so 24 and 18	08:58
Luria	32gb cards are available if you can find/pay for them	08:58
iDS	impossible?	08:58
Vulcanis	wait, no. math is bad	08:59
Vulcanis	32 and 18	08:59
iDS	i think both can insert 16 32	08:59
Luria	no 810 = 2gb internal +8gb card	08:59
Luria	max	08:59
Vulcanis	right, thats 10. 16 is n800	08:59
Vulcanis	8 and 8	08:59
Luria	n800 = 2* 16 (or 2*32gb)	08:59
Vulcanis	the OS is whats limiting it, so if one can run 16gb cards, then the other can, too	08:59
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Vulcanis	so n810 can run 16+2	09:00
Luria	Vulcanis, 16gb sdhc cards are 90$	09:00
Vulcanis	if they can at all	09:00
Vulcanis	Luria: Not the point.	09:00
Vulcanis	you're saying n810 can only do 8+2	09:00
Luria	~$170 buys you 32gb of space	09:00
iDS	CONFUSED :S	09:00
Luria	iDS, i know	09:00
iDS	i think n810 can insert 32 g too	09:01
Luria	no, because it doesnt have an sdhc slot	09:01
iDS	impossible! it was newer	09:01
Vulcanis	then it could not be able to run even 8gb... Ohshit, wait.	09:01
iDS	:S	09:01
Vulcanis	is it minisd?	09:01
Luria	essentially, n810 =10gb, n800 32gb	09:01
Vulcanis	or 64	09:01
Luria	if you can find and afford it, yeah	09:02
Vulcanis	I had forgotten that it was not an sdhc thing, because I thought the 8gb cards had to be that.	09:02
Vulcanis	Yay tiredness	09:02
Luria	ids, are you still confused?	09:02
Luria	ill go over that again if you want.	09:03
iDS	yes :S	09:03
Luria	ok, when they built the n810 they made it smaller	09:03
iDS	finally which one can takes more memory space?	09:03
Luria	the n800 by far.	09:03
iDS	but http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_N810	09:04
iDS	Media One slot, compatible with miniSD or microSD cards up to 32GB	09:04
iDS	???	09:04
Vulcanis	that is a sexy, sexy beast, though.	09:04
Luria	one sec, ill explain	09:04
iDS	heheh	09:04
iDS	tnx please :D	09:05
Vulcanis	yeah, I was not aware that it was miniSDHC	09:05
Luria	as i said, they wanted to make it smaller	09:05
iDS	and	09:05
Luria	so while the n800 has two sdhc slots	09:05
Luria	each of which can use cards up to 32gb	09:05
Luria	the n810 has 2gb fixed internal and ONE sdmini slot	09:06
Luria	however, while sh(hc)mini is specced to reach 32gb	09:06
Luria	there are no cards greater than 8gb available	09:06
iDS	oh	09:07
Luria	got it?	09:07
iDS	so ummm n800 is better on this way	09:07
iDS	for moemory card space	09:07
iDS	yes tnx :D	09:07
Luria	very much	09:08
iDS	and guys	09:08
iDS	how is the os 2008?	09:08
iDS	is it better or no different	09:08
iDS	infact between n800 and n810	09:08
iDS	what is news??	09:08
Vulcanis	the OS is the same for both if you update it on the n800	09:09
Vulcanis	the ONLY thing that really changed, is they gave the n810 GPS and a slide out kb	09:10
Vulcanis	only thing other than memory	09:10
iDS	oh yeah :)	09:10
Luria	faster for cpu tasks but clearly not as mature	09:10
Vulcanis	Luria: The cpu is the same	09:10
Vulcanis	oh	09:10
Vulcanis	you mean the os	09:10
Vulcanis	I should sleep	09:11
iDS	yes n810 is the CPU 400 MHz TI OMAP 2420	09:11
Luria	n800s ship with os 2008 now	09:11
Vulcanis	They do? Nice.	09:11
Vulcanis	the same processor is in both, ids	09:11
Vulcanis	atleast, speed	09:11
Vulcanis	don't know about model	09:11
Luria	omap 2420 board, as was quoted	09:12
iDS	the apps games...on os 2007 can work on os 2008?	09:12
Luria	depends, most need to be ported tho because the are so graphical	09:12
Vulcanis	with ALOT of work, until somoene else ports them for you	09:12
Vulcanis	alot of the glade stuff was broken and that has to be fixed	09:12
Luria	iDS, just ignore os2007	09:13
Luria	if you are buying now	09:13
iDS	N800 is The CPU 330 MHz TI OMAP 2420 but i think they are really different	09:13
Luria	ids, the are the same	09:13
iDS	yes i am buying and money is not my problem just wanna to know which one is better for buy?	09:14
Luria	2420 can be clocked from 166mhz -1ghz iirc	09:14
Luria	its firmware controlled	09:14
BuckWild	does anyone here use the x11vnc thing to control their N800 with OS2008?	09:14
iDS	:S	09:14
BuckWild	it seems I can't open the launcher	09:14
iDS	with all sections os cpu battery lige memory keyboard...	09:14
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BuckWild	everything else works, but when I click on the two top side icons nothing happens	09:15
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Luria	essentially n810 is the n800 with kybd, transflective screen, gps, less memory, smaller, and a fixed (not flippable) camera	09:16
Vulcanis	does anyone here have an igo bt kb?	09:16
Luria	yes	09:16
Vulcanis	did it come with the annoying "OPEN THIS THIS WAY" sticker that stuck all over the back of it?	09:16
Luria	i have one with me	09:16
astro76	BuckWild, I've seen those buttons stop working on the actual device on occasion	09:16
Luria	no, cause i got it as a sierra	09:17
astro76	Vulcanis, yeah, needed some rubbing alcohol for that one	09:17
Luria	no, thinkoutside or whatever	09:17
Vulcanis	Ah, ok astro. Was going to ask how to get that off, and one other thing...	09:17
Vulcanis	Anyone else get like, .5 second lag between characters?	09:17
Vulcanis	well, keypresses	09:17
Vulcanis	I'm pretty sure that should not happen	09:18
iDS	i like the n810 bag it is very stylish	09:18
Vulcanis	so was your mot^H^H^H^H^H^H^HThe old bag.	09:18
iDS	what? i don't get it	09:19
Vulcanis	its more of an inside joke.	09:19
tank-man	use some vinager to get sticker residue off	09:19
tank-man	and then use a credit card to scrape it off	09:20
Vulcanis	yeah, I was trying dry with a plastic fork	09:20
Vulcanis	but who the hell puts stickers like that on plastic?	09:20
astro76	Vulcanis, that doesn't sound right	09:20
Vulcanis	esp stickers that will only be used once.	09:20
Vulcanis	astro76: The lag?	09:20
astro76	Vulcanis, yeah, using os2008?	09:21
Vulcanis	didn't think so, I'll try it again tomorrow.	09:21
Vulcanis	yes	09:21
Vulcanis	its ~.5 seconds between keypress and showing up onscreen	09:21
Vulcanis	so much that I can have it lag sentances behind	09:21
astro76	Vulcanis, one major issue some might encounter is if the keys are pressed for more than a moment, you get a bunch of repeated characters	09:21
Vulcanis	no	09:21
Vulcanis	its not that	09:22
astro76	there needs to be a repeat rate setting implemented... vote for this bug ;) https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2670	09:22
Vulcanis	thats not it, though	09:22
Vulcanis	this is before it gets to that point, I'm sure.	09:23
astro76	sounds like it	09:23
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astro76	no if you press one a key it should seem instantaneous	09:24
Vulcanis	right, why I think its a problem with bluetooth	09:24
Vulcanis	and not a repeatrate thing	09:24
Vulcanis	or drivers	09:24
astro76	Vulcanis, of course as we have the same setup I'm not sure what the problem is	09:25
astro76	n800?	09:25
Vulcanis	n800	09:25
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Vulcanis	igo slim thinkoutside thing	09:26
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astro76	Vulcanis, bluetooth net connection at the same time?	09:33
Vulcanis	no	09:33
Vulcanis	no other bt stuff	09:33
Vulcanis	just wifi for webbernets	09:33
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iDS	:D	10:03
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iDS	GUYS I Heard The Video/Audio Quality On os 2008 Is Better Than Os 2007 is it true? or no differrent ?	10:19
iDS	????????????	10:21
iDS	???????	10:24
rm_you	i haven't tried a different encoding scheme yet...	10:27
rm_you	but i know the videos i had already done played perfectly, so i can at least say the quality doesn't go down	10:27
rm_you	sec lemmie try playing one that was too intensive for it before	10:28
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rm_you	still laggy <_<	10:32
rm_you	so seems about the same	10:32
iDS	ok	10:33
iDS	so both are the same	10:33
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rm_you	yeah seems approximately the same... but that's just with one really simple test	10:34
rm_you	you might want to actually do some testing yourself :)	10:35
iDS	but friend	10:37
iDS	i watched them	10:37
iDS	the video on n800 and n810	10:37
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iDS	i think n810 has better quality	10:38
iDS	please watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r20J00CIYqc	10:38
iDS	look the audio and video is exactly like a pc	10:38
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rm_you	yeah, i had the audio/video quality the same as a PC on os20076	10:39
rm_you	*os2007	10:39
rm_you	not sure how much better it can get	10:39
iDS	just look that video i think it's better the os 2008 for n810	10:40
rm_you	i don't know how you can tell from a youtube video >_>	10:41
iDS	yes :s	10:42
astro76	iDS, absolutely no difference in that regards between n800 and n810 with os2008	10:44
astro76	not sure how many ways we can tell you that	10:44
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iDS	:D	10:45
iDS	thank u	10:45
astro76	or if you mean between os2008 and and os2007, then yeah	10:45
iDS	cos i	10:45
astro76	os2008 enabled the 400 MHz on the n800	10:45
iDS	look here too: malaysia.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071223141455AAhVGsX	10:45
iDS	http://malaysia.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071223141455AAhVGsX	10:46
iDS	What I have heard is the videos look much better once you put the OS2008(this is the latest OS released by Nokia for the Nokia N800) OS in your device.	10:46
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astro76	maybe, dunno I can't tell, the whole system is snappier in general	10:47
jga23	anybody get fceu working on os2008?	10:48
astro76	it's a moot point, the n800 now should come with os2008, if not you should put it on right away ;)	10:48
iDS	ummm yes	10:48
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iDS	who have n810 here now?	10:52
iDS	?	10:53
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WISHMASTER	me	10:54
iDS	friend	10:55
iDS	umm	10:55
iDS	well	10:55
iDS	on ur n810	10:55
iDS	there is a demo video for that	10:56
iDS	an advertisem for ur n810ent	10:56
iDS	an advertisement for ur n810 ops	10:56
iDS	yeah the official nokia n800 advertisement video	10:56
iDS	yes? availanle?	10:59
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astro76	the demo video is in the os2008 image, both n800 and n810	10:59
Khertan	Hi !	11:00
iDS	so both have this video ? yes	11:01
unique311	anyone know how i can get sound in scratchbox	11:01
astro76	astro76, that wasn't clear from my statement?	11:02
astro76	iDS, ^	11:02
WISHMASTER	repository still broken?	11:03
astro76	WISHMASTER, yeah	11:03
WISHMASTER	so i'm not the onlyone unble to download from testing maemo extra	11:03
WISHMASTER	and maemo extra	11:04
WISHMASTER	true?	11:04
astro76	true true	11:04
WISHMASTER	:/	11:04
astro76	Nokia is still on vacation apparently until after the 1st	11:04
WISHMASTER	there are non alternative link to download libmad0?	11:04
astro76	you could try stage.maemo.org	11:04
astro76	WISHMASTER, or this http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13721	11:05
WISHMASTER	ill try remuving the "i"	11:06
WISHMASTER	:P	11:06
astro76	which is the same as stage.	11:07
unique311	so any of yous running scratchbox?	11:07
dpb_	which is the same as anything.m.o	11:08
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dpb_	you could use i-want-this-to-work-damnit.maemo.org if you wanted	11:09
dpb_	=)	11:09
WISHMASTER	astro76 seems like working :P	11:09
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WISHMASTER	happy new year to all see you	11:17
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Spacer	yeah just recevied my n810	11:50
X-Fade	Spacer: Bastard ;)	11:51
Spacer	^^	11:51
Spacer	i must say its even better then I imagined	11:52
X-Fade	Spacer: Where did you order it?	11:52
Spacer	actually I bought it from an individual who got it as a gift, new in the box, for a significant discount	11:52
X-Fade	Hmm, too bad :)	11:53
Spacer	now its time to Hack	11:54
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\|tbb\|	what is the most featured hack u will do	12:00
Spacer	planterium program	12:01
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Khertan	arg .... my host ftp is down ... again ...	12:03
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Zic	somebody success to install Canola 2 on OS2007/N800 ?	12:22
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Blafasel	Hi there. Is this the right place to ask general N810 questions (availability in europe overall, seems limited here so far) or even such basic stuff like "Does it support GSM in the first place"? The specs on the site are either hidden or marketingspeech..	12:28
kulve	Blafasel: yup	12:28
kulve	Blafasel: just ask the question and wait hoping that somebody answers..	12:28
kulve	"support gsm"? No, there's not gsm but it connects to the net using the phones gprs/3g nicely	12:29
Zic	other question, where can I find Ekiga for the OS2007 to test videoconf without GoogleTalk/Jingle ?	12:30
Blafasel	kulve: Thanks. So just the availibility stuff left. Seems like all offers here are "7-10 weeks" preorder style and smell like imports	12:32
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kulve	n810 availibility is odd. You can get it from some shops in some countries. In some countries nokia's webstores sells it, in some not.	12:33
\|tbb\|	is it possible to create a remote desktop connection trough an adhoc connection?(n810 - desktoppc)	12:33
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Blafasel	Hmm.. Stupid me. Thank. I didn't check the nokia shop directly. It does ship right away here in Germany. Although I'd prefer to get my service provider to pay for the thing.. ;)	12:38
Spacer	maybe a silly question, but how do I enable the extras repos on the n810? I only get a bunch of nokia-supported tools	12:39
\|tbb\|	Blafasel: got the same problem here, but the service provider say mid january they will eventually get it	12:40
Blafasel	\|tbb\|: Which provider?	12:43
\|tbb\|	imean salepoint	12:44
\|tbb\|	near stuttgart	12:44
Blafasel	For what? A Nokia shop or a point of sale for one of the gsm provider?	12:45
\|tbb\|	got mine from online shop allready mid december	12:45
iDS	anyone from UAE Dubai??????????????????????????????????????????///////	12:45
tsavola	someone might confess if you add one more ?	12:46
Blafasel	\|tbb\|: I want eplus to pay 50-75%, currently still arguing ;)	12:46
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\|tbb\|	ah, k dont have a clue then	12:47
eber_	hi )	12:52
eber_	these nokia look awful when covered with fingerprints :)	12:53
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eber_	is there a reference of all dbus signals & methods in use with IT ?	12:57
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Zic	does exist a solution to see the WLAN MAC Adress without remove the battery from the tablet ?	13:03
eber_	ifconfig ? :)	13:05
Zic	omg, I don't think about it :þ	13:05
Jaffa	Morning, all	13:05
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unique311	morning	13:09
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Spacer	Zic, you can also see it in OS info in configuration screen	13:14
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Zic	Spacer: yeah, but I'm just understanding that MAC Adress must be given without ":" separator :]	13:16
sibbe	zic, control panel -> device info or something like that	13:16
Zic	it was why I wanted to remove battery	13:16
Spacer	wow this n810 is just awesome	13:16
Zic	but it works, thanks :)	13:16
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Zic	Spacer: ^^	13:16
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zs_	Spacer: i am jealous :~)	13:42
Spacer	where are you from zs_ ?	13:43
Spacer	it should be available pretty soon in most countries	13:44
zs_	from Poland and I am not able to buy it here because Nokia doesn't sell it here ;)	13:44
zs_	i don't think so	13:44
Spacer	siema ;)	13:45
Spacer	well I suppose you can order one from germany or the UK?	13:45
zs_	i will buy it when i go to GB	13:45
X-Fade	Beware of hardware keyboard mappings in different countries though ;)	13:46
Spacer	definately	13:47
zs_	yeah i don't want french (azerty) :O	13:47
Spacer	i got one pretty cheap from a guy, new in the box and all, but its french localization	13:47
Spacer	slightly different azerty board	13:48
Spacer	lol	13:48
X-Fade	Yeah and german version will have qwertz ;)	13:48
* Spacer shudders		13:48
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Spacer	the one most obvious and annoying defect i've found is there isn't a simple way to input a '.'	13:49
X-Fade	Spacer: You'd have to use shift. French people don't seem to use a '.' a lot ;)	13:50
Spacer	maybe, but, you'd think for an internet appliance with a lot of browsing you'd like to be able to give in the .com and .org a lot ^^	13:50
X-Fade	Spacer: Nah, in OS2008 they also messed up the underscore..	13:51
Spacer	well, I'm still toying with it only got it since a few hours. In worst case scenario I'll simply map one of the other keys to '.'	13:51
X-Fade	There used to be a - and _ with shift key..	13:51
JussiP	Maybe they use :com aond :org in France.	13:51
Spacer	^^	13:51
Spacer	this device really makes me wonder what they'll come up with next	13:52
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X-Fade	Spacer: Multitouch OpenGL ;)	13:53
Spacer	that would be so :o	13:53
Spacer	by the way can anyone here recommend me a nifty IRC client for OS2008?	13:53
kulve	ssh+screen+irssi	13:53
eber_	spacer: xchat	13:53
X-Fade	kulve: Hmm that is what I use too :)	13:53
Spacer	for OS2008??	13:54
Spacer	screen?	13:54
X-Fade	Spacer: Ssh to a remote host ;) That is always on..	13:54
kulve	Spacer: the screen is ofc running on your irc-computer and you just use ssh to log there	13:54
Spacer	i know that I mean xchat-like thing running on the device	13:54
kulve	well, xchat then	13:54
astro76	Spacer, it's not final yet http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/	13:55
Spacer	in case my host is offline again	13:55
kulve	I've never used any irc client on the device	13:55
X-Fade	Spacer: Even pidgin is an option..	13:55
eber_	i've run xchat on os2008 since yesterday, and it's really good	13:55
Spacer	astro76, thanks, I'll check it out	13:55
kulve	pidgin seems to be very popular, but I don't know what protocols are the most used ones	13:55
astro76	pidgin is pretty horrible for IRC	13:55
Spacer	i noticed there is a user called 'irc' in /etc/passwd but no IRC connectivity by default, odd isnt it?	13:56
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sp3000	hmm	14:17
sp3000	repository is being less broken for me today again	14:17
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sp3000	can you confirm or is it just being random?	14:20
hugolp	sp3000: yes, I just check and I just installed load-applet that was broke for me before	14:22
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micko_21	Hello, I tried to install SDK for maemo 4.0 on archlinux, but did not succeed. Is there a livecd with SDK for maemo 4.0? Or does anybody use scratchbox2 on archlinux?	14:32
X-Fade	micko_21: There is a vmware image..	14:34
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X-Fade	micko_21: http://maemovmware.garage.maemo.org/	14:34
jprieur	hi, any Finnish guy around? There's an application form I need to complete and the content of a combo is written in Finnish so I need a little help to select the right thing...	14:35
dpb_	why wont the SDK work on archlinux? should work..	14:35
vegai	dpb_: it does	14:35
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vegai	well, at least I was able to get it work ... and work with it for a couple of years	14:36
micko_21	I get "/lib/ld-linux.so.3: No such file or directory" - don't know how to fix it/what to look for...	14:36
micko_21	I would love to use native version...	14:36
vegai	there might've been tricks to it, though	14:36
X-Fade	Or you could try the SDK+ Alpha. Sb2 is a lot more transparant..	14:37
X-Fade	Although it is an alpha release, people seem to be reporting great results.	14:38
micko_21	I have qemu-cvs-2007-12-31, scratchbox2 1.99.0.22, but dont know how to proceed. It seems to me that there is problem with qemu environment or something like that...	14:38
micko_21	I dod not try to use scratchbox v1 because it is too much debian-based.	14:38
micko_21	And I don't use debian distro right now	14:38
tsavola	how so	14:38
tsavola	the tarballs don't work?	14:39
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micko_21	Which tarballs you mean? I have read that v1 assumes lots of tools which are specific for debian, so I did not even try it.	14:39
tsavola	micko_21: it's distribution-neutral	14:40
micko_21	Hoped to get v2 working...	14:40
tsavola	micko_21: the internals of scratchbox are derived from debian, but that doesn't matter	14:40
Spacer	note this comment, from a reviewer of the n810: "The primary disadvantage of the N810 running Linux is the lack of third-party software."	14:40
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micko_21	So now I have sbox2 and qemu, and SDK, etc. but it is not working. Maybe there is just a small change needed to get it working. Is there some description how to test (not install) environment for meamo?	14:43
zs_	Spacer: what are you using for your N810? ;)	14:44
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tsavola	micko_21: see the url in topic	14:44
tsavola	micko_21: that's all there is, afaik	14:44
Spacer	zs_, do you mean what I use it for, or ... ? sorry don't quite follow	14:45
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micko_21	OK, thanks. will keep trying.	14:46
micko_21	Will try that also, thanks X-Fade	14:48
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micko_21	(I meand vmware image)	14:48
micko_21	=meant	14:48
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jprieur	hi, any Finnish guy around? There's an application form I need to complete and the content of a combo is written in Finnish so I need a little help to select the right thing...	15:35
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kulve	o/	15:36
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jprieur	kulve: can you help me please? :)	15:37
kulve	yes	15:37
jprieur	thanks	15:37
kulve	I wouldn't have raised my hand otherwise ;)	15:38
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jprieur	:)	15:40
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sandyang028	:P	15:57
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magicrobotmonkey	ewc	16:12
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maddler	hi all	16:17
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Spacer	hi maddler	16:23
sk	morning	16:25
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sk	man, im having the worst trouble setting up a dev env for the n770 on debian	16:26
sk	I'm going to throw out my problem(s), if anyone has ideas...	16:27
sk	I am able to invoke Xephyr on SDK_PC only. And ontop of that, I can envoke the n770 GUI ontop of that. However, I cannot run code (sample hello world/hello world GTK) because they are compiled for SDK_ARMEL. I can build them from source though, when I switch scratchbox to SDK_ARMEL. HOWEVER, in ARMEL, I can't boot Xephry, it just fails when I attempt to:	16:27
eber_	sk: maybe you can run xephir from outside scratchbox	16:28
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sk	but how will it know I want it to be invoked for ARM and not PC?	16:29
sk	I can try it now .. I have debian on a VM	16:30
kulve	yeah, don't run xephyr inside a sb target	16:30
sk	really?	16:30
sk	damn	16:30
tsavola	xephyr is an xserver, and apps (for pc or arm target) connect to it by using the DISPLAY env var	16:30
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tsavola	run xephyr outside, and set DISPLAY correctly inside sb	16:31
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tsavola	O_O	16:31
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kulve	sk: and I say this again: I hate running stuff inside the SB, there's always some issues. Instead I just compiled inside the SB, then copy to the device (usually with scp) and then run it on the device (usually from the command line while logged in with ssh)	16:31
tsavola	sk went away	16:32
tsavola	but so do i ->	16:32
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sk	oppz	16:32
kulve	sk: and I say this again: I hate running stuff inside the SB, there's always some issues. Instead I just compiled inside the SB, then copy to the device (usually with scp) and then run it on the device (usually from the command line while logged in with ssh)	16:33
sk	that makes sense, I'll probably move towards that route	16:33
sk	I just can't even get code to compile though	16:33
sk	that's a seperate issue	16:33
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sk	actually that's not totally true, I can compile c inside sb-arm, but not when including the gtk and hildon.h files	16:36
sk	i can see them in the FS, but the #include<> doens't see them	16:37
sk	its been so long since I 've done c	16:37
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sk	alright, so i invoked xeyphr from outside sb	16:41
sk	now should I log in and execute af-sb..display=:2 stuff from sb-arm?	16:41
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eber_	first: export DISPLAY=:2	16:42
sk	yup	16:42
eber_	and then run af-sb-thing	16:42
sk	yup	16:42
sk	can i post my error here or should I use pastebin?	16:42
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sk	i'll use pastebin	16:43
sk	www.pastebin.org/13617	16:44
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alterego	That doesn't look good.	16:47
eber_	When i see things like "Inconsistency detected by ld.so", it doesn't feel good	16:47
sk	heh, yeah i know	16:48
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sk	strange thing is, if i was under sdk-pc, it works ...	16:48
eber_	maybe installation problem (scratchbox and/or SDK). Maybe you can do it again from scratch ?	16:48
sk	ugh	16:48
sk	it's been a real PITA	16:48
kulve	zgrep VDSO /proc/config.gz	16:48
kulve	CONFIG_COMPAT_VDSO=y	16:48
sk	i think i've seen all the damn tutorials around google too	16:48
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kulve	that VDSO thing related to some inconsistency problem	16:49
sk	don't have a proc/config.gz	16:49
kulve	but I think it was when starting SB, not running something	16:49
kulve	/proc/config.gz is the kernel configuration	16:50
eber_	what is vdso ?	16:50
sk	kulve: i dont have that file	16:50
sk	I went through this before w/someone else, recommened I do the same thing	16:50
kulve	sk: try running on the device	16:50
sk	the n770? I'm at work, its at home	16:51
sk	= [	16:51
kulve	eber_: sorry, I don't know the details around the VDSO thing.. It just became on issue with (older?) sb and 2.6.21 kernel	16:51
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sk	maybe i've been carless about the vesions ... I have a current debian w/not sure version of sb and an n770 as the target..	16:52
sk	is there a magic versions that works best together in this configuration.	16:52
alterego	Well, not magick.	16:52
kulve	sk: the latest SB should be just fine	16:52
alterego	But the versions they use in the tutorials would be good ;)	16:52
kulve	i.e. the latest SB components, libs, core, etc	16:52
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sk	im using all current stuff I believe and /or whatever was mentioned inthe tuts	16:55
sk	h0va.com/index.php/Sk_dev_log	16:55
sk	if anyone cares ...	16:55
sk	its pretty f'n messy though	16:55
sk	Can anyone mention a good tutorial? Maybe I haven't seen it?	16:56
kulve	I'm using the SB the maemo installer script installed for me	16:57
sk	I can't remember if I tried that or not, I've attempted this twice already	16:58
sk	once on Fedora and now on debian	16:58
sk	I may attempt again from scratch on debian	16:58
kulve	are you using SB 0.9 -series..?	16:58
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sk	how can I query the sb version?	16:58
kulve	I don't actually know. I just read the url you pasted	16:59
sk	oh word..yeah im using that then i believe	16:59
kulve	install the thing with the maemo installer script. Works nicely	16:59
kulve	0.9.x is ancient..	16:59
sk	i swore i did that, its in my /scratchbox/ dir ...	16:59
sk	maybe I'll try again	16:59
Zic	I'm maybe blind, but where is osso-xterm in OS2008 ?	17:01
Zic	I can't find it by default, and in maemo's repositories	17:02
kulve	Zic: it's installed by default	17:02
kulve	under Utilities	17:02
kulve	I liked the old one better though	17:02
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X-Fade	menu->utilities -> scroll down :)	17:02
Zic	it's what I'm think ... but it is not :]	17:02
Zic	hmm	17:02
kulve	but now I'm off for the rest of the year	17:02
Zic	yes, I'm blind :]	17:03
sk	heh	17:03
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Zic	their is a hack to get the old style of menu ?	17:16
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shackan	kulve: so from what I'm reading, the dsp can actually process more streams in parallel?	17:30
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Zic	heh, since I'm on OS2008, I can't connect to my GMail account	18:13
Zic	can you, please, give me your configuration ?	18:13
Zic	It says that "Authentification failed to pop.gmail.com"	18:13
zoran	I think they work on port 995	18:14
Zic	yes, it is	18:14
zoran	socat?	18:14
Zic	but don't want to work ...	18:14
zoran	I use mail via getmail	18:15
zoran	first browse itusing poppy	18:15
zoran	and there is some fuse extension like gmailfs	18:15
zoran	are you using browser?	18:16
Zic	no	18:16
zoran	what is the app?	18:16
Zic	the mailing apps by default of OS2008	18:16
muu	is not working with gmail	18:17
zoran	point it to port 995	18:17
muu	you must use 'modest' or claws-mail	18:17
zoran	ssl?	18:17
Zic	muu: he ? but it works in OS2007 !	18:17
xan	Zic, is date/time correctly configured?	18:17
Zic	zoran: yes, all it's clean, port 995, and TLS	18:17
Zic	(not SSL, it's timeout)	18:18
muu	oops	18:18
Zic	xan: yes ...	18:18
muu	i mean imap :)	18:18
Zic	:)	18:18
zoran	hm, why not just take getmail and fetch it?	18:18
Zic	zoran: because I prefer a client for mailing ...	18:19
zoran	:)	18:19
Zic	and, it's more integrated now in OS2008, apparently	18:19
Zic	(blue flashing on new email ...)	18:19
zoran	smoke and all other signals?	18:21
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eber_	zoran: can you explain how you use poppy ?	18:41
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Cymor	Is there anything you can do to fix a 770 screen once it goes white then grey? The device seems to be working, but the display is just a bunch of grey bars after it boots.	18:49
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sampbar	hello all, could you help me with a problem i am recieving while trying to upgrade my nokia 770 from 2006 to 2007he?	19:13
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sampbar	i get this error: "Sending request 0x83 failed: Cannot send after transport endpoint shutdown" when trying to flash 2007he on to the 770	19:22
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cancerbero_	someone speak spanish??	19:45
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hugolp	cancerbero_: a bit	19:49
hugolp	un poco chaval	19:49
christopher	hello, i have a question concerning map (navicore) on os2008. it always crashes with error " attempt to allocate widget with width -24 and height 0"	19:49
christopher	any ideas, i didnt find much on the net	19:49
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cancerbero_	i have a question: why n800 enduring 2g (for slot) and not more???	19:53
Jaffa	2G?	19:55
christopher	as far as i know it can handle 4g per slot	19:55
cancerbero_	2gb	19:55
rm_you	it can do 16g per slot	19:55
rm_you	it supports SDHC	19:56
Jaffa	8GB SDHC is officially sujpported IIRC, and 16GB works too, apparently.	19:56
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rm_you	oh hey, Jaffa :P	19:56
BuckWild	what is the best way to share files between windows and the N800 wirelessly?	19:56
Jaffa	Should do 32GB per slot when such cards are available.	19:56
cancerbero_	The manual appears to 2 gb	19:57
rm_you	BuckWild: I use WinSCP	19:57
rm_you	cancerbero_: the manual is for os2007	19:57
cancerbero_	oooo	19:57
Jaffa	rm_you: just got back from a pre-0000 dinner/lunch	19:57
rm_you	:P	19:57
cancerbero_	jajajja	19:58
BuckWild	rm_you, ah, so you use winSCP to connect SSH to the N800 and transfer that way?	19:58
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rm_you	BuckWild: yes	19:58
BuckWild	yeah that'll work	19:58
rm_you	it works great	19:58
BuckWild	right now I have a headless windows box performing downloads and I want a way to transfer them off without having to connect cables	19:58
cancerbero_	with os2008 enduring to 32 gb???	19:58
BuckWild	I think that should work nicely	19:58
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rm_you	hrm	19:58
rm_you	well... if the windows box is headless	19:58
BuckWild	VNC =P	19:59
rm_you	that could be more difficult?	19:59
rm_you	ah	19:59
rm_you	ok :P	19:59
rm_you	then yeah	19:59
BuckWild	it's great	19:59
rm_you	headless WINDOWS!?	19:59
rm_you	random	19:59
BuckWild	I set the resolution to 640x480	19:59
BuckWild	so the whole thing fits on the N800's screen	19:59
rm_you	i still can't comprehend windows servers.... they're like... useless	19:59
rm_you	can't even ssh into them >_>	19:59
BuckWild	this is just for downloading	19:59
BuckWild	utorrent, etc.	19:59
rm_you	i run utorrent in wine ;P	20:00
BuckWild	I mean, I thought about installing linux	20:00
rm_you	also, rtorrent works excellently headless	20:00
BuckWild	but I might eventually end up putting media center on the computer and hooking it up to my TV	20:00
rm_you	have it set up to auto open and DL any torrent files in a samba shared directory	20:00
BuckWild	or mythTV	20:00
BuckWild	hehe	20:00
rm_you	so i shove torrents and it DLs them	20:00
BuckWild	oh	20:00
BuckWild	wow	20:00
rm_you	yeah, mythTV wins :P	20:00
BuckWild	yeah, that's a nice setup	20:00
BuckWild	what's funnier is I actually run linux on my main two computers	20:00
rm_you	lol	20:01
BuckWild	I'm running linux right now	20:01
BuckWild	haha	20:01
BuckWild	I have a windows partition for games, but I hardly ever even boot into it	20:01
rm_you	I have four computers in my dorm room... a mythTV box, a file server running old ubuntu (i'm slacking on updating... breezy >_>), a dualboot box for gaming and work, and my n800 :P	20:02
rm_you	oh, err... 5, cause i have a tabletPC too, also for work	20:02
rm_you	but that one doesn't run linux at all, so it doesn't really count ^_^	20:02
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rm_you	do you have a build environment set up for chinook?	20:03
rm_you	i need someone else to try to compile armel mplayer	20:03
rm_you	and see if it gives the same ridiculous errors i'm getting	20:03
rm_you	i have a theory about fixing a2dp+alsa playback, but i can't get it to build, with or without my patch <_	20:04
rm_you	<_<	20:04
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* Jaffa just created a Windows partition on my main box for the first time, solely to play Half Life 2 and Portal		20:05
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rm_you	heh	20:08
rm_you	portal wins.	20:08
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Jaffa	Finished the main non-gbonus levels yesterday. I want more, it's soooo cool.	20:09
Jaffa	I'm not much of a gamer but that, and Burnout 3 were killer games for me.	20:10
ssvb	rm_you: you can run 'make deb-n8x0' to compile mplayer	20:11
rm_you	ah, not the normal dpkg-build thing?	20:12
rm_you	Portal was pretty much the best game i've played ever,.	20:13
truent	lol you obviously never played air-bud on nintendo.	20:13
e-squizo	folks... anybody knows whether there are ALSA bindings for python on maemo?	20:15
rm_you	ssvb: wahg... this is trying to dpkg-source it again and unpack a clean copy... but i am trying to apply my own patch	20:15
ssvb	rm_you: it is normal dpkg-build, except that you need to set target device via environment variable 'DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=n8x0 dpkg-buildpackage ...'	20:16
rm_you	also, that fails as well	20:16
ssvb	rm_you: did you install libmad and theora develoment packages?	20:17
rm_you	i did apt-get build-dep mplayer	20:18
rm_you	and i believe it did, yes	20:18
rm_you	the errors it is throwing are about assembly instructions not being available	20:18
ssvb	rm_you: such errors show up if mplayer is built with incorrect -mcpu option	20:19
rm_you	hrm	20:19
rm_you	how do i set that correctly?	20:19
ssvb	rm_you: did you really run 'make deb-n8x0' to compile it?	20:20
rm_you	yes	20:20
rm_you	just now	20:20
rm_you	not the first time	20:20
rm_you	but they both failed	20:20
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rm_you	-mcpu=arm1136jf-s	20:21
rm_you	is that right?	20:21
ssvb	yes	20:22
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rm_you	well, it's working the third way	20:22
rm_you	DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=n8x0 dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -b	20:23
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BuckWild	rm_you, can't you get a VM with the environment already intact?	20:25
BuckWild	I wish they'd release that for virtualbox too	20:25
BuckWild	but whatevs	20:25
BuckWild	I think the player is free	20:25
Jaffa	VMware Server and Player are both free-to-use	20:30
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BuckWild	yeah	20:33
BuckWild	workstation isn't tho, which is the only thing I would need to use really	20:33
BuckWild	virtualbox is free tho, so whatever	20:33
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meierei	,/xchat_2.6.4-2_armel.deb has no fullscreen ?	20:46
Mousey	you got it working!?	20:51
deejoe	so, hmmm.	20:51
Mousey	wait, nm. i haven't tried hard enuff yet. sry	20:51
deejoe	I seem not to have saved the password I entered when I installed openssh-server on my n800 under OS2008	20:52
deejoe	is there any reasonable way to get root now, short of reflashing?	20:52
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meierei	sudo gainroot from xterm	20:54
deejoe	is there a default password for the 'user' account?	20:55
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meierei	frgot	20:56
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meierei	deejoe, can u use xterm?	21:01
deejoe	yes	21:01
meierei	try sudo gainroot	21:01
deejoe	I did. it prompts for a password.	21:02
meierei	ok	21:02
deejoe	no, wait.	21:02
meierei	mine doesnt	21:02
deejoe	hold on	21:02
deejoe	cal_read_block(r&d_mode): size zero, block not found?	21:02
deejoe	Enable RD mode if you want to break your device	21:03
deejoe	that's the error I get.	21:03
meierei	hmm	21:03
deejoe	googling suggests "flasher-3.0 –enable-rd-mode –reboot"	21:04
deejoe	I've got flasher on my laptop at home, I might try that.	21:04
deejoe	though I'm leary of RD mode.	21:04
meierei	that can worrk	21:04
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deejoe	I might just flash the whole thing.	21:04
deejoe	again.	21:04
meierei	duno gainroot from xterm google becomeroot	21:05
meierei	!becomeroot	21:05
meierei	stupid bot	21:05
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oil_	happy new year 2551 to everyone. let the new year be good for the maemo development. let there be a lot of new features, new releases and free internet connection.	21:07
* Vulcanis wants aircrack ported for that very reason		21:08
oil_	stability of the platform, bug fixes for existing problems and maps of thailand.	21:08
meierei	frohes neues	21:10
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deejoe	meierei: success! thank you.	21:12
meierei	yw :>	21:13
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sampbar	just incase anybody saw my post earlier - ive managed to sort it	21:17
sampbar	am now running 2007he on 770 :D	21:17
meierei	on mmc?	21:17
sampbar	nope flashed straight onto the 770 i believe	21:18
sampbar	ended up using the mac gui flasher utility in the end instead of ubuntu	21:19
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sampbar	is there a list of good repo's some where?	21:19
Jaffa	cool, glad it worked for you ;-)	21:19
Jaffa	http://www.gronmayer.com/it/	21:20
sampbar	ah... Thanks! thats the one i found earlier but lost :D	21:20
mrgusernewbie	Tets	21:20
* Jaffa would improve the Mac GUI flasher if he still had his Mac		21:20
sampbar	Jaffa, you could pick up an old g3 on ebay for £40 or so? or try freecycle	21:21
sampbar	seemed to work ok for me though	21:21
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Jaffa	Yeah, but I did it with Platypus and wanted to learn ObjectiveC. Sold my Mac mini, tho	21:22
sampbar	ah ok	21:22
Jaffa	still, keeping it online and it being useful contributes towards acceptance in device programmes, so it's always good to hear it's proved useful :-)	21:24
sampbar	just gotta install flash, canola and pidgin now :)	21:24
sampbar	Jaffa, yeah def. useful trying to use the linux flasher kept giving me errors	21:24
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sampbar	and cant forget to install maemo mapper	21:26
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p\|	hello	21:34
p\|	does exists rdiff-backup for os2008 ?	21:34
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Mousey	hi, is there an app somewhere that'll rotate my wallpapers?	21:35
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macluvjay	kulve: you suggested that I disable life guard	21:37
macluvjay	with the linux flasher	21:38
macluvjay	i don't see any swith for that	21:38
macluvjay	switch*	21:38
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blithe	Is there an irc client for OS2008 yet?	22:15
blithe	I can't seem to find one on maemo.org	22:15
blithe	Or if there's a repo that has xchat for it...	22:18
* blithe shrugs		22:18
astro76	http://zeus.rm-fr.net/~skyhusker/xchat-chinook-betas/	22:18
blithe	Thanks astro76.	22:20
* blithe smiles		22:20
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Mousey	ty	22:28
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Mousey	what awesomeness	22:32
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hahlo	what program i need os2007 to get dpkg-reconfigure working?	22:38
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evangineer	hey there, anybody on here played with Garnet VM yet?	22:52
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evangineer	I'm wondering if anyone has managed to get Garnet VM running on an Internet Tablet to sync with a linux desktop using J-Pilot?	22:54
* evangineer reads the internettablettalk forums while waiting for a response		22:55
GAN800	repository.maemo.org seem to be working again for anybody else?	22:56
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tank-man	evangineer, are you using os2008? garnet vm doesnt work for me	23:02
evangineer	I don't have a tablet yet, but I might get one if garnet vm does the stuff I need it to do. tank-man, you probably need to install the binary for the N810 as that will have been built for os2008.	23:06
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tank-man	i might try that	23:12
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eido	hey folks, asked this a while ago, but i figure the N810 noise is burbling pretty strong. Has anyone come up with a Bluetooth handsfree profile for the N810 - meaning the nokia functions as a headset to a bluetooth phone? My ideas is to use the N810 as my primary audio device, listening to music, and using it to answer the phone if a call comes in.	23:30
GAN800	Not that I know of.	23:31
Mousey	that's cool	23:31
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milhouse	isn't it easier to pick up the phone?	23:32
Mousey	it would have to support HSP	23:33
Mousey	i guess	23:33
Mousey	or HFP, not really sure	23:33
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Mousey	ok, [after reading more] the least you'd want is HSP, but you ought to shoot for HFP cuz then u could dial too	23:35
* Mousey shuts up		23:35
Mousey	wow that would be a cool app	23:35
* \|R wishes there was HFP support		23:36
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Mousey	isn't bluetooth a stack? since the hw already has it, someone could theoretically just write it, right?	23:38
sampbar	wooh! have installed skype and is working on my 770	23:38
eido	yah, everytime i bring this up, someone goes "that would be cool" but doesn't exist. I may have to get a-codin :)	23:41
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Mousey	are you kidding? an HFP app? with a little dialpad and everything? it'd truely be a unlocked/any network cellphone then. ;)	23:43
eido	well, only if you had a network connection to work from :)	23:44
eido	that's the idea of having a dopey bt enabled cell phone stashed in your backpack.	23:44
Mousey	well by "any network" i meant any -cell- network, but yah	23:45
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