IRC log of #maemo for Tuesday, 2007-12-04

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hugolpHi anyone having problems with youtube?00:09
hugolpin os200800:09
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bstocktigert: thx for the info, do you know if the voice-guided is available for purchase yet? on wayfinder's website, it says something about the software being available in december00:19
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pupnikVoice guided RSS browser with speech might be fun00:19
pupnikdrive around, listen to headlines.  well.. maybe00:20
tigertmaybe they know their schedule, I dunno00:20
tigertpupnik: there are blog to podcast services00:20
tigertsomeone in planet gnome had the blog with this "listen to this post" -links that used one00:20
pupniki'm curious about tablets for the blind00:21
tigertit was surprisingly good voice synthesis00:21
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pupnikAT&T has an excellent product - Natural Voices or summat00:21
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doc|homewith added monitoring00:25
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non-screamingN80timeless: ping00:30
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non-screamingN80_Monkey: where's timeless?00:39
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non-screamingN80Useless bot, never there when you want him.00:43
lardmannot sure timeless is a bot ;D00:43
bstockhmm anyone know why xournal doesn't want to work on 2007HE? when i launch from cli it says 'GLIB CRITICAL ** Gtk - gtk_widget_set_events: assertion `!GTK_WIDGET_REALIZED (widget)' failed'00:43
bstockit brings up the window, but as soon as i try to write something it crashes00:44
non-screamingN80No, he isn't. _Monkey should know him though...if he  was aalive.00:44
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lardmanannoyingly this: vd->out_end-=vd->sample_count-vd->granulepos;00:49
lardmanturns into this: vd->out_end = set64_2int(add64_int(add64_64( vd->granulepos, neg64(vd->sample_count)), vd->out_end));00:49
* lardman hopes there aren't too many more 64bit variables to deal with...00:50
xanbstock, that code is broken, so it's strange that it worked before00:51
pupnikthere's 64 bit vars in your vorbis player lardman ?00:53
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lardmanpupnik: there have to be unfortunately00:55
lardmanpupnik: but long long on the dsp is only 40bit iirc00:55
lardmanpupnik: I do wonder if that is enough though...?00:56
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lardmananyway, I've sorted that bit out (hopefully)00:56
lardmanoh no, more of them in vorbisfile.c :(00:58
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lardmanpupnik: you tempted to try your sound generation on the dsp? I think Tak was talking about a different emu (from the code anyway)01:08
pupnikworking on website tonight but yes01:09
pupnikjust not very soon :/01:09
lardmancool, at least the thought it there :)01:09
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non-screamingN80Gargh! Been trying to  (re)install Skype one IT2008 most of the day. This time it got to halfway along the download bar but now its stuck there grinning at me.01:13
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* sp3000 ran out of buses :)02:05
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lardmannight all02:11
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K`zanIs this a good BT Keyboard for the n800?:
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pupnikthe stowaway works well for me - build quality isn't great, but ok02:21
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sp3000oh, where's a bt vera that'll install on 2008?02:23
sp3000my irc hurts with courier ;)02:24
pupniknewer xterm should have better font than courier02:25
pupnikdon't tell me 2008 has that crappy courier for xterm...02:25
_|Nix|_I think so ... not sure though ...02:26
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dick-richardsonHow do i make nano the default text editor?02:30
K`zanpupnik: Thanks, for $30, I think I can live with it :-)!02:31
_|Nix|_dick-richardson: export EDITOR='nano -w' in your .bashrc or .bash_profile02:33
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_|Nix|_Gods below! Could be any slower?02:34
_|Nix|_It's like it's running on a 486 or something ...02:34
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halley_|Nix|_, bash isn't your default shell on the tablet :P02:41
halley.profile is the file you want02:41
K`zan_|Nix|_: Heh, don't think so, should win the award for slowest site on the net :-).  Best here late at night and early in the morning.02:43
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_|Nix|_K`zan: Late at night, you say ...02:45
_|Nix|_I'm not sure whether 02:45 counts as late at night or early in the morning ...02:45
K`zanLOL, patience is a virtue :-)02:46
_|Nix|_So, I'm a flawed human being.02:46
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dick-richardsonthe .profile doesn't exist in ~02:48
dick-richardsonam I in the wrong directory, or should I create it?02:49
K`zanls -a ?02:49
dick-richardsonls -lha02:49
K`zanLemme look at mine...02:49
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K`zanokia-N800-44-4:~# ls -a02:50
K`zan.                .ash_history     .gnome2          .profile02:50
K`zan..               .bashrc          .gstreamer-0.1002:50
K`zanNokia-N800-44-4:~# pwd02:50
K`zan /root02:50
dick-richardsoni'm in /home/user02:51
dick-richardsonI still don't have a .profile in /root02:51
K`zanI have none there either, IIRC, I copied the root one over and hacked it in 2007.02:52 the same in os2008?02:52
K`zanI have one in /root, but none in user.02:52
K`zanIf you want a paste of it, /join #vmmst02:52
K`zanI am running 2008 for the n800 (assuming that makes a difference).02:54
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dick-richardsonI'm working on it...hang on02:54
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K`zanwhy is an nfs mount not working :-/.  Might have to use scp...02:56
K`zansvc: unknown version (3)02:59
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l7can anyone tell me how to use maps downloaded from winmapper in maemo mapper 2.2?03:21
l7it looks like it you have to point to a map .db file, but all i have are little map files03:22
l7the forums are pretty confusing, as they refer to earlier versions :\03:23
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mmillerAnyone else notice that the site is really slow?03:25
l7it's a little slow right now03:27
l7i downloaded os2008 earlier today a 800kb/s03:27
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mmillerDid they release OS2008 for the N800?03:28
l7last week i think03:28
l7supposed to be a good deal faster for browsing03:29
l7how much faster is it than the last release of 2007?03:29
l7i just noticed that my unit arrived with the older 7-26 2007 OS03:29
mmillerSo it's OS2008 is in release or still in Beta?03:29
l7so how do i get external map files into maemo mapper 2?03:30
sp3000I'm starting to think taking a stroll through half of espoo is not the most entertaining way to spend a rainy december 3am03:30
pupniki suggest to take a camera and open your eyes03:32
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pupnik(not meant to be condescending - i'm editing a bunch of pics right now)03:33
pupnikreferring to sp3000's walk03:34
sp3000you haven't been to espoo ;D03:35
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sp3000the camera on the phone isn't good enough for distant rabbits in the dark, either03:36
pupnikpeople say high megapixels aren't necessary and they're kind of right - but i just got a couple of pictures of insects processed in macro mode where you can see their hairs03:39
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halleyI think the real statement is 'megapixels will hurt image quality if the photosensor is too small to get enough photons'.  But that's just too nuanced for the usual "more is better" and the usual counter-cry, "more is not better."03:45
sp3000ah, home.03:45
pupnikcorrect halley - sensitivity / noise floor problems03:45
halleyI prefer to stitch images in the 50~70 megapixels range, so it doesn't really matter what the camera itself does.  Give me GOOD pixels.03:46
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halley - in the actual image, I can easily make out the two mascots at the far end of the field.03:49
db48xyou can't clearly make them out unless you can identify them03:50
halleyWell, this is a web shrunk version.03:50
db48xseeing 6 orange pixels on the green field doesn't mean much03:50
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halleyIn the original, you can read all jersey numbers.03:51
db48xwhere's the full size image?03:51
halleyNot on the web at the moment.  I used to use a zoomify thing to let you scroll around.03:51
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pupnikgood stuff halley04:25
pupnikis it possible to do the stich stuff without tripod?04:25
pupnikcolors are nice too - guessing it's a dslr04:29
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hpg101i've paired my plantronics 320 headset to my n800. i can't seem to figure out how to get the audio output directed to it. Any suggestions?04:49
pupnikdoes the N800 audio jack have a mic-in?04:57
pupnikoh sorry04:57
hpg101hi pupnik, if you're talking to me, nothing is plugged into the audio jack05:00
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hpg101the plantronics doesn't supply a profile. is that a problem?05:07
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pupnikum i dunno how the bluetooth audio works - i think it doesn't at all05:14
K`zanpupnik: I've given up trying to use my BT headset for anything other than the cell phone :-(.05:14
K`zanBeat myself bloody trying to get it to work here, was *briefly* successful with btsco, but was unable to get it working again,05:15
K`zanBetter off getting a decent wireless (non-bt) headset, that is what I finally did here.05:16
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K`zanYeah, QUITE frustrating...05:16
hpg101hi K`zan, you mean an 802.11 audio?05:18
K`zanhpg101: Yes.05:19
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K`zanErr, no, BT audio (as in BT headset)05:19
K`zanSorry, doing three things at once :).05:20
K`zanReplaced it with an RF headset (stereo, no mic).05:20
hpg101i'm surprised nokia, a cell phone company, didn't make bt audio work on the n800. or is it a software thing?05:21
hpg101K`zan: i think i understand your suggestion. a transmitter you plug into the audio jack which sends to a headset05:22
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rip_hola Dora05:34
rip_sorry thats stuck in my head from a show my Daughter watches ;)05:34
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halleyDon't let your kid watch that junk.06:01
zerojayWhat's wrong with it?06:03
halleyFirst, the kid can't speak in a normal voice.  She's always YELLING AT THE TOP OF HER VOICE.06:03
halleySecond, she's a git.  That map is out to kill her.  Every day, it sends her through three terrible dangers just to get her to a place she could see from the beginning.06:04
halleyThird, the songs will rot your brain.  It has already rotted through the brains of the writers, clearly.06:04
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halleyFourth, standing up to a thief by saying "No swiping!" is clearly insane.06:06
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rip_sounds like you have watched it more than once ;)06:08
halleyFifth, a thmall friend who wearth violet vinyl bootth up to hith kneeth, friend... you are thmokin' thumpthin' I want.06:08
pupniki don't think i would allow a TV in the house if I had kids06:10
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Luriaanyone have xchat working on os200808:07
rip_thats where I got mine08:08
rip_same guy who did Xchat for OS200708:09
Luriaoh neat.08:09
Lurianow all i need is abiword, xournal, and gnumeric back.08:10
Luriaand then i can forget os 200708:10
Luriaor rather there will be nothing left to miss from os200708:11
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rip_Im pretty sure gnumeric is running on OS200808:16
rip_no idea about the other oens08:16
rip_other ones08:16
rip_I wouldn't mind abiword either08:16
Luriawith spell check would be nice08:16
rip_then I can have an excuse to get a bluetooth keyboard when im out and about08:16
Luriaadblock for microb would be nice08:17
Luriaprivoxy is a pain08:17
rip_Can't say Ive ever needed to use anything like privoxy08:18
astro76you can use the ad blocking greasemonkey script08:18
Luriaoh nice08:19
Luriaid been looking for one08:19
Luriamost are too site specific08:19
rip_the program i'm dying to check out is Canola208:19
rip_with mplayer for the videos08:20
Luriai like ukmp08:20
Luriathough what happened to the exit button?08:20
timelyxexit violates platform08:20
timelyxit should be quit08:20
Luriaok, ok08:21
Luriabut its a full screen app08:21
Luriai have to de-fullscreen it and click on the close button08:21
Luriawhich is plain silly08:21
astro76Luria, holding the cancel button doesn't work?08:21
Luriahuh. never tried. i didnt realize that was an quit shortcut08:22
astro76also holding home gets you to the home screen08:23
Luriathat i knew08:23
Luriai use it to minimize ukmp08:23
Luriastill, thats cludgy08:23
Luriaa single click *somewhere* should do it08:23
rip_microb's way to scroll is horrid I find :\ for most websites when I want to scroll down I have to hold the dpad down but when I let go it keeps sliding past what im trying to read ;)08:24
Luriai just finger drag 90% of the time08:24
rip_I can't stand using my fingers on the screen08:24
Luriascreen protector08:24
Luriaso key08:25
rip_getting a Screen protector in Australia isn't that easy :p08:25
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rip_I have to order from the States08:25
Luriayeah, that sucks08:25
rip_yes... :(08:25
rip_even places that sell n800's online here, don't sell the protectors08:25
rip_which bites08:25
Luriaim just glad that the nokia flagship store started selling n800 accessories08:26
Luriaesp the headset cause bluetooth isnt working for me08:26
Luriaincidentally, is anyone using the proper os2008 beta?08:26
astro76rip_, free shipping here untill tomorrow
astro76worldwide free shipping08:27
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rip_Ill have a read08:27
Luriadunno. there are some odd response issues with the n800 under os200808:28
rip_the Nokia 770 screen protectors fit the N800's fine ?08:28
Luriarip, yeah08:28
rip_sweet, never owned a Nokia 77008:28
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Luriawas happy to see vnc today08:32
Luriaits like major release day, every day, these days.08:32
Luriaanyone try transmission?08:33
astro76just installed it but haven't used it yet... looks nice and spartan08:34
astro76quite opposite the nightmare that is azureus08:34
Luriait works nicely08:34
Luriabetter than using ctorrent08:34
Luriabut needs some ui changes08:34
Luriai think some options arent displayed in prefs given the screen size08:35
astro76oh you mean on the tablet?08:35
GeneralAntillesFor all you poor Canadians:
astro76didn't know about that08:36
Luriai should stress that i *think* this is the case08:36
GeneralAntillesIt's really not a proper port.08:36
Luriabut when you see the pref screen youll see it's very cramped08:36
GeneralAntillesRecompile is a better description.08:36
astro76well looking at the Transmission prefs in Ubuntu, it's not much08:37
LuriaGeneralAntilles, that in and of itself is pretty impressive, how easy that was08:37
Luriayeah, well, im not expecting ktorrent08:37
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Luriawow. lots of people trying to sell their fixies on nyc craigslist08:37
GeneralAntillesWith Gtk now more closely matching upstream, it should be a whole lot easier.08:38
GeneralAntilles"5 minutes" was what the ported said.08:38
GeneralAntillesThis is why all the people bitching about the API breaks don't know what they're talking about.08:38
Lurianow i just need a openvpn frontend08:38
Luriawell, there was good reason to break. it's still a pain, tho.08:39
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GeneralAntillesThe benefits far outweigh the temporary pain of upgrading. ;)08:43
GeneralAntillesThe pain will last a couple months08:43
GeneralAntillesthe benefits will last for years.08:43
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Luriaits like a the reverse of marriage08:47
Luriaerr. scratch one "a"08:47
* timelyx wonders who non-screamingN80 is08:50
Luriaanyone tethered with a sony k850i?08:51
Luriawhy are there (almost) no triband (or better, quad) hsdpa phone08:52
Luriaits like the idiotic old days of triband world phone08:53
GeneralAntillesI like my SGH-A717. :)08:53
Luriayeah, but 1.8 only08:54
GeneralAntillesBattery life is a little low, but it works great with the tablets.08:54
Luriathe slm does better, but no 2100mhz08:54
GeneralAntillesGood point.08:54
Luriamy phone broke a couple days ago08:54
Luriaim using a (freshly unlocked) t68i08:55
Luriait reminds me of the old days with my t39m08:55
Lurianow that was a phone.08:55
timelyxLuria: full screen isn't license to use the wrong words08:55
Luriaother than the stupid ericsson ui08:55
timelyxjust because map breaks one convention isn't a license for it to break the other08:55
LuriaLuria, thats fine. i still would like a "quit" button then08:56
GeneralAntillesI still miss my Nextel i1000. ;)08:56
Luriawhat was great about the t39 was that it had all the electronics of the day...08:56
Luriabut it was black and white08:57
Luriai would *LOVE* a oled/eink/b+w phone with quadband gsm and quadband hsdpa08:57
GeneralAntillesIt was huge, and it only did one thing: make phone calls, but the battery life was incredible and you could spend all day breaking rocks and not put a dent in it.08:57
Luriamake it 7.2 mbs while im smoking crack08:57
timelyxLuria: i have a w950i i use for showing people how a non sucky browser could work08:57
Luriatimelyx, have you seen the k850i?08:58
GeneralAntillesNeed a faster bluetooth, first.08:58
timelyxLuria: auto rotate....08:58
timelyxbut no touch screen?08:59
Luriacapacitance switches tho08:59
timelyxsorry, not buying08:59
Luriawell, its the only triband hsdpa phone without wm608:59
timelyxif i want a classic cell phone, i'll use this n81 8gb which keeps running out of battery08:59
Luriathat i know of, at least09:00
Luriai would love to be wrong.09:00
timelyxhave you read the specs for the w950i?09:00
timelyxdo people really have something against searching for bugs?09:00
GeneralAntillesYes, timelyx.09:01
timelyxthis guy's bug actually was almost well filed09:01
GeneralAntillesIt's difficult and time consuming.09:01
Luriaq&a is like teaching kindergarten.09:01
Luriaits women's work09:01
GeneralAntillesand, of course, is the customer support line09:01
* Luria ducks and covers09:01
GeneralAntillesso they shouldn't have to search. ;)09:01
GeneralAntillesThey have a problem, you guys need to figure it out. :P09:02
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timelyxplease say i was friendly enough09:02
Luriaw950i doesnt have hsdpa09:03
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Luriawtf, 384 gprs?09:03
rip_anyone cracked open the Nokia N800's or equiv and looked what sort of ram it has ?09:03
GeneralAntillestimelyx, I'd say you have free license to be nice or as bitchy as you want. ;)09:04
Luriathere are some interior shots somewhere09:04
timelyxGeneralAntilles: sometimes i'm very bitchy09:04
timelyxbut i try not to always be that way09:04
GeneralAntillesThe attitude used to put me off when I first started using bugzilla, "Who the fuck IS this asshole?"09:05
GeneralAntillesBut then I learned.09:05
Luriagood luck09:06
rip_cool cheers,09:06
timelyxGeneralAntilles: basically w/ me it's russian roulette09:06
timelyxeither i'm nice and you ignore me09:06
rip_was just wondering if its possible to upgrade the ram :p09:06
timelyxor i'm rude, and if you're worth it, we correspond09:06
timelyxand then you like me :)09:06
rip_on my OpenWRT Linksys they are easy enough to desolder ram and put it back together09:06
GeneralAntillesIs that a battery I see in there: ?09:06
Lurialooks like09:07
GeneralAntillesUp next to the external SD pins.09:07
Luriaon the outside of the board, yeah09:07
GeneralAntillesGood to know.09:07
rip_great, everything is covered in metal plates :p hiding the guts09:07
Luriathere were some other take apart pics, i think09:08
GeneralAntillesrip_, the N800 is in no way shape or form remotely similar to the WTR54GL. :P09:08
Luriagah. gl.09:08
Lurialatecomer :-)09:08
GeneralAntillesI have a v1.1 that just died back home. ;)09:09
Luriawrt54gs 1/2 were the best09:09
rip_well, yes i know ;) I was just curious how easy it would be to desolder ram ;) and/or if its possible to swap it out :p09:09
Luriaabout as easy as switching a bga p3 notebook chop09:09
GeneralAntillesIsn't the RAM part of the SOC or somesuch?09:09
Luriaif you can do that, lemme know. i have a cf-m34 that id love to speed up.09:10
GeneralAntillesI've been buying these: in favor of the Linksys stuff.09:10
GeneralAntillesThey work rather wonderfully.09:10
LuriaGeneralAntilles, i dont think so.09:10
Luriatop right corner.09:11
kulvehas somebody extracted the rootfs as tarball from the it2008beta for n800?09:11
GeneralAntillesRight you are, sir. :)09:11
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LuriaGeneralAntilles, i got one of those. flashing alt firmware is a pain.09:11
Luriaotherwise great09:12
mariorzyou guys see this
Luriafun demo09:12
Luriavery zen sand garden09:13
mariorznot open :(09:13
Luriaok. gotta go.09:13
mariorzand not for maemo :(09:13
GeneralAntillesWhere's my OMAP34xx? :(09:13
Luriathat would be fun09:13
Luriawheres my xflective n800 with wimax09:14
GeneralAntillesBe neat if Nokia would stick an iR LED in there somewher.09:14
Luriareal ir or irda09:14
Luriacause irda blows, and it always sucked.09:14
GeneralAntillesYeah, I'd just use it as a universal remote. ;)09:15
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Luriais there a bluetooth module?09:15
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Luriabbl, i think09:17
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GeneralAntillesCool thing about the OMAP34xx is that the LCD controller shouldn't need to be custom.09:17
GeneralAntillesSo we should have plenty of video bandwidth.09:18
rip_I'd love to see what they come up with next on the Tablet series09:18
rip_fullsized SDcards would be a must :p09:18
GeneralAntillesHopefully drivers for the PowerVR, too.09:18
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rip_hopefully they don't cut the sdcards down like in the N81009:19
GeneralAntillesThe N900 is going to be something to see.09:19
limepihey, does anyone have any tips on getting a fabric BT keyboard to play nice with the n80009:19
GeneralAntillesStandard bluetooth HID?09:19
timelyxTue Dec 4 2007 07:17:12 GMT+309:19
timelyxMonkey's are eating my hair09:19
timelyxtoday's quip09:19
timelyxanyone want to add "Monkey's dead, RIP" ?09:20
rip_I think Monkey's are eating my hair is mine09:20
limepithey have some proprietary drivers for everything :(09:20
timelyxi presume you know how to add a quip?09:20
GeneralAntillesOr: "Ding, dong, _Monkey's dead!"09:20
GeneralAntillesDone, timelyx.09:20
timelyxwe'll see how long it takes for me to hit that09:21
timelyxhrm, this sucks09:21
timelyxquips doesn't tell me how many quips there are09:21
limepigoogling "electex maemo" is practically a googlewhack09:21
timelyxshouldn't take too long to hit yours :)09:22
timelyxrip_: ah, the quip i quoted was yours09:22
timelyxsorry, admin prerogative, i peeked :)09:23
rip_yeah im pretty sure thats mine :p I wrote something about monkeys and hair09:23
rip_I can't exactly remember though09:23
GeneralAntillesThe IVA accelerator (along with the PowerVR) isn't being used in the N800, right?09:23
timelyxit tells me who did it, although when only by relative09:23
timelyxi can figure out more detailed by reading the server logs09:23
timelyxthis is partly to remind people that such things are not annonymous09:23
rip_haha fair enough ;)09:24
timelyxif you add abusive quips, they'll be removed and we might send mail to you09:24
GeneralAntilles"Fuck Nokia, and fuck maemo"09:24
timelyxheck, I might give you a phone call :)09:24
rip_oh how nerdy is this,  "my ~ is my castle"09:24
timelyxpersonally i prefer "my name is my password"09:24
limepiplz hope
rip_I had a friend who kept repeating to his mac "My voice is my password"09:25
timelyxlimepi: noisy09:25
rip_to setup some horrid voice lock09:25
timelyxlimepi: BT keyboards should just work09:25
timelyxi haven't heard of any problems w/ them09:25
limepithis is a proprietary nonsense thing I guess09:26
timelyxBT audio comes in a couple of flavors, and they should work partially eventually09:26
timelyxsome parts today09:26
limepiit says it uses the serial port profile09:26
timelyxwhy the ****09:26
timelyxcomplain to the bt linux people that there's no support for this stupid device09:27
timelyxsomeone should be willing to help you fix that09:27
limepii took back a crappy ionic breeze "purifier" that was a gift09:27
limepiat the sharper image09:27
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timelyxlimepi: but seriously, if you file a bug w/ some technical details in bugzilla connectivity:bluetooth09:27
rip_I'm guessing the Hand writing in Maemo is also proprietary ?09:27
timelyxwe can probably order a device and get it implemented09:27
limepiand saw that they had 1) a bt keyboard 2) made of goshdarned fabric09:27
timelyx(no promises)09:27
timelyxrip_: not owned by nokia09:27
limepitimelyx, I'm on it :D09:27
timelyxlimepi: be sure to fill in the url field09:28
timelyxand be sure to quote the bit in 1.4 that mentions serial port profile09:28
timelyxand the bit in 1.6 about dependent/drivers09:28
rip_timelyx: so its OSS?09:28
timelyxrip_: proprietary09:28
rip_ahh ok fair enough09:28
timelyxbut literally not owned by nokia09:28
timelyxso if we wanted to oss it, we couldn't09:29
rip_shame they didn't09:29
timelyxnote: nokia has some strange ideas about when to oss and why09:29
timelyxthis would /probably/ fall into the "don't oss" category09:29
timelyxi'm not sure if i'm allowed to explain the why09:29
timelyxit's probably obvious09:29
GeneralAntillestimelyx, you need to do something about the reproducibility heading.09:29
GeneralAntillesNobody knows how to use it.09:29
timelyxGeneralAntilles: i'm switching people to this:
timelyxthat should solve my problems09:30
rip_fair enough, I'd like to see my bug confirmed :p09:30
timelyxi'm sorry people hacked the primary form instead of just forcing guided09:30
rip_would at least let me know I'm not crazy ;)09:30
timelyxlimepi: also, include contact info (that page's tech support number sounds good)09:31
timelyxlimepi: also, after you buy it, please contact g-tech and tell them you want it to work w/ your n80009:31
GeneralAntillesThe frame for the search is a little awkward.09:31
limepiyeah... I'll do that09:31
limepibut I want it to work now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!09:31
limepistupid sharper image09:32
timelyxGeneralAntilles: gah, try it on bmo, if you have complaints, talk to #mozwebtools/#bmo09:32
timelyxit should match what they use09:32
timelyxand if that can be improved, it should09:32
astro76limepi, there's the stowaway ultra-slim on amazon for $3009:32
limepiastro76, this keyboard is made of fabric and you can roll it up and it seems to be sweet09:33
limepiif only it worked09:33
astro76ah that would be neat09:33
rip_Just out of curiosity does any ideas bounce between OpenMoko and Maemo ?09:33
rip_if anyone knows.09:34
GeneralAntillesAh, right, not your doing. Rgr.09:34
GeneralAntillesI'd provide some more examples and more descriptive text, though, timelyx.09:35
limepistupid bleeding-edge technology09:35
timelyxGeneralAntilles: is my bug for enabling it09:35
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timelyxif you want to file a bug depend/block that bug and make suggestions09:35
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limepimaybe i can solve my own problem09:38
astro76if you can get the manuf. to give you the protocol and write a driver09:42
astro76unless it's bluetooth HID keyboard you are out of luck09:42
astro76or the nokia one apparently09:42
timelyxafaik the nokia one is hid09:44
timelyxam i wrong?09:44
[pablo]i just noticed that gmail still shows the old version in microb on os2008 because it uses firefox 3 instead of 209:45
astro76timelyx, no it's not09:45
timelyxyou *don't* want to use the ui=2 gmail on n800/n81009:46
timelyxit's way too heavy09:46
timelyxi'm fairly certain google intentionally changed its behavior09:46
timelyxwe used to get ui=209:46
[pablo]it seems snappier than the old version to me09:46
timelyximo it's an impovement09:46
timelyxui=2 is way too heavy for our device09:46
timelyxyou actually want to use in most cases09:47
timelyxyou won't really get much benefit from ui=109:47
timelyxand you should try
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timelyxprobably the only useful feature you get from ui=1 is autosave in mail compose09:48
[pablo]i'll try those, anything to speed it up09:48
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timelyxx/ should be instant fast09:49
limepido you think maybe the keyboard will just work with os 2008?09:49
timelyxlimepi: no09:49
timelyxnot a chance09:49
timelyxif it had any chance they'd have listed linux09:49
limepishould I update to '08 anyway09:49
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timelyxhardware vendors have marketing divisions09:49
limepithey support symbian...09:49
timelyxand marketing would want to list Linux09:49
astro76limepi, well, 08 is much improved with an hid keyboard ;)09:49
timelyxlimepi: use gronmayer and figure out if the apps you use are available09:50
timelyxthen ask yourself if you use the FKB to enter passwords09:50
timelyxif the answer to that last question is yes, then the answer is  NO09:51
timelyxif the answer to the first question is yes, then "maybe"09:51
timelyxbut keep in mind that you'll almost certainly need to reflash for final09:51
GeneralAntillesIt boggles the mind that after two years Nokia still can't get the text entry to be at least mildly reliable.09:51
limepibecause the thing will pair09:51
timelyx(it'd be cool if we tested deb update for final, but i highly doubt that)09:51
limepibut the kb shows up as a phone09:51
timelyxlimepi: a phone? lol09:51
timelyxwhat profiles does it list?09:52
timelyxnote that GPS modules do not show up as phones09:52
timelyxso i believe that's a bug (please file, include bt profile list, and preferably a bt debug dump, search connectivity:bluetooth for the commands)09:52
timelyxthat's all?09:52
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* timelyx ponders09:52
limepiI don't even know what a SPP is09:52
timelyximagine your phone can act like a modem09:52
timelyxserial port profile09:52
timelyxa modem is basically a serial port09:53
limepiso this thing is like a freaking tty09:53
timelyxif your phone really sucks09:53
timelyxit could support just SPP09:53
timelyxand in that case, the guess of a phone icon09:53
timelyxwould be right09:53
* timelyx frowns09:53
timelyxif i was filing, i'd file unco09:54
timelyxand probably include bt mac address, plus info from the vendor for their device range09:54
timelyxso that it could be specifically blacklisted as "not a phone"09:54
limepiokay, total derail here09:54
timelyxbecause i think the guess is /probably/ the right guess unfortunately09:54
limepiis there any way that I can make the boot screen not have the lame nokia photos09:55
GeneralAntillesWhy in the world would they manufacture a bt keyboard that's not HID? :\09:55
limepibut instead the neat linux setup gibberish09:55
timelyxread ./flasher3 --help09:55
timelyxyou want --enable-rd-flags=serial-console or something09:56
timelyxbut you really want to copy from help09:56
timelyxnot from my memory09:56
* timelyx *never* uses that flag09:56
timelyxis it that one?09:56
timelyxor --enable-rd-mode ?09:56
limepiokay... firstly... um... I haven't even gained root on my n80009:56
timelyxone of them gets you ugly green text09:56
limepibecause I haven't tried09:56
timelyxprobably rd-mode09:56
GeneralAntillesRD mode wont get you console09:56
GeneralAntillesjust some version info.09:57
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timelyxthat's how i gained root a few hours ago :)09:57
limepiI'm using OS X and I want to use OS 200809:57
limepiI see the instructions on the wiki09:57
timelyxno flasher required09:57
kulveI've built the tabler-browser-ui and the microb from Is there a way to configure it using a proxy?09:57
timelyxall i needed was http access to that deb (and ssh)09:57
timelyxkulve: connectivity control panel09:57
timelyxwe honor the stupid prefs from that evil icd thing09:58
kulvetimelyx: well, I don't have CP..09:58
timelyxor you can try to disable microb's "read system prefs" and then use standard gecko prefs09:58
limepitimelyx, what do you mean, no flasher required?09:58
kulveor maemo actually..09:58
timelyxlimepi: to root the device? correct09:58
timelyxbut it won't get you any text on the screen09:58
timelyxyou'll just be able to ssh root@127.1 or ssh root@localhost09:59
timelyxsomeone want to explain how to add a package to :)09:59 is a bug. works09:59
limepiah, I wanna update to 2008, too09:59
limepiany caveats, tips, etc?09:59
timelyxwhen i tried this morning didn't work09:59
timelyxlimepi: don't use the FKB to enter passwords10:00
kulvetimelyx: try downlaods10:00
timelyxunless the only key you use in passwords is *10:00
timelyxError 404: Page could not be found.10:00
timelyxThe requested URL /download could not be found on this server.10:00
timelyxinfobot fkb is finger keyboard (aka thumb keyboard), it will use asterisks for passwords in the current 2008 releases [this is a bug]10:01
K`zanNight folks10:01
infobotokay, timelyx10:01
limepithe joys of OSS :D10:01
timelyxinfobot thumb keyboard is <reply> see fkb10:01
infobottimelyx: okay10:01
timelyxinfobot finger keyboard is <reply> see fkb10:01
* infobot raises his middle finger to keyboard is <reply> see fkb10:01
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kulvetimelyx: the URL I gave is working and I even could log in10:01
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limepiis this the right file? RX-34_2008SE_1.2007.44-4_PR_COMBINED_MR0_ARM.bin10:02
kulvetimelyx: to add a project there, first select proper category, then "create maemo app" from the toolbar..10:03
KhertanHi !10:03
timelyxkulve: what license is a file that doesn't install anything under? :)10:03
kulvedon't understand the question..10:04
timelyxanalyze the file w/ dpkg-deb10:04
timelyxit doesn't install anything10:04
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kulveif you are asking what category add it to, then "Communications"? :)10:05
timelyxi chose system, is that wrong?10:05
kulveor add a new group "Root your device"..10:05
kulveno, system is probably just fine (imo)10:06
timelyxwe should do that10:06
timelyxsince there are 4 or more ways now :)10:06
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Khertanfor information i'm adding c / c++ and latex syntax hilight in PyGTKEditor ... if it's interest someone :)10:06
limepiI'm flashing away :D10:09
kulvetimelyx: any hints how to disable the "read system prefs"? Or is it automatically disabled since I built a non-maemo non-debian build?10:09
timelyxload about:config?sprefname=config.use_system_prefs10:10
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GeneralAntillesIs there a list of rd-flags somewhere?10:10
timelyxGeneralAntilles: oddly flasher3's help lists them10:10
timelyxyeah, it's a nokia product, it shouldn't do that10:10
GeneralAntillesOnly flasher-2.0.macosx over here.10:10
timelyxdoes flasher2's help really not list them?10:11
limepiflashing success :D10:11
GeneralAntillesAh, nevermind10:11
GeneralAntillesThere it goes.10:11
timelyxkulve: um10:11
timelyxdoesn't seem like you can do anything10:11
* timelyx likes the download link10:12
timelyxGeneralAntilles / kulve: please don't fix that until they fix the bug i'm about to file :)10:12
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limepiwhoa '08 is a world away from '0710:13
timelyxGeneralAntilles / kulve: :)10:13
* timelyx is evil10:14
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timelyxinfobot capture root is info at
infobotACTION chases root is info at mercilessly for minutes, hours & days on end until he finally captures root is info at ...10:14
timelyxoh brother10:14
timelyxinfobot literal capture10:15
timelyxinfobot help capture10:15
timelyxok. so "finger" and "capture" are reserved words10:15
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* timelyx considers trying to speak infobot to infobot10:16
timelyx(yes, they speak a language, and yes, i used to speak it)10:16
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timelyx is a great haha item10:17
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* GeneralAntilles really wants to disable the boot image now. :(10:22
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limepiso wait how can I make awesome startup screen with flasher210:27
GeneralAntillesI don't see a way, limepi.10:27
limepinot even --enable-rd-mode10:27
GeneralAntillesNot the awesomeness you're looking for.10:27
limepinot like when you start up any other linux box10:28
GeneralAntillesNah, it just shows some version and HW info.10:28
limepiit seems like that would be a trivial hack10:28
GeneralAntillesNo kidding10:28
limepiwell, if it's cooler than the current startup, I'm all for it10:28
GeneralAntillesand something I'd really like to see. :)10:29
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timelyxlimepi: there's a package for os2006 that lets you change the default boot screen to a vista logo10:29
timelyxit's marked as a vista theme10:29
timelyxfind that package and review its contnet10:29
timelyxyou think that's funny? i'm using it :)10:30
limepitoo involved!!! im all about lazyweb10:30
limepijust complain to someone who knows how to fix it :)10:30
GeneralAntillesI don't think the irony value of the Vista theme outweighs having to use it on a daily basis. ;)10:31
limepip.s. elektex still doesn't pair w/os 200810:31
timelyxlimepi: did you find the sample bug?10:33
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timelyxthose two seem to list the tools you'd want to use10:36
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limepiman, os 2008 is much snappier10:39
* timelyx complains10:40
timelyxanother happy user10:40
limepilol, this is like the first 2 minutes of use10:40
limepiI am pretty annoyed that my old software got nuked10:40
limepibut there wasn't much anyway... ukmp black was the only program worth a hoot10:41
GeneralAntillesIt's been ported.10:41
limepiof course it has10:41
kulvelimepi: the 2008 should be able to restore installed apps, so they shouldn't get nuked in the future..10:41
limepiI'm just doing the traditional update bitch10:42
timelyxkulve: not true10:42
GeneralAntillesAh, right, I see.10:42
limepiit's kind of a ritual10:42
kulvetimelyx: oh?10:42
timelyx'll record the list10:42
GeneralAntillesIt just keeps a list10:42
limepilike when mac users went from os 9 to os x10:42
timelyxbut when you try to restore, it won't have the primary catalog enabled10:42
GeneralAntillesso you can restore them with the app manager.10:42
timelyxso it won't ;-)10:42
limepiand all complained about the dock10:42
timelyxread m-vo :)10:42
kulvetimelyx: yeah, well, enable first the disabled repo and restore then10:42
timelyxthat's by far one of the coolest bugs....10:42
timelyxtypical of nokia design :)10:42
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timelyxsorry m-vo: you're a nokian, and that really is typical nokia design10:43
timelyxand in case people think i'm special, the web browser has at least as many warts10:43
timelyxbut thankfully i inherited them10:44
limepiopera was way better than microb10:44
timelyxyour opinion isn't humble and doesn't matter10:44
GeneralAntillesI still don't get why people are saying that.10:44
zeenixtimelyx: nokia is *big* company and 'nokia design' may refer to a lot of different designs10:44
limepiGeneralAntilles, because it didn't mangle the crap out of pages10:44
timelyxzeenix: i challenge you to find me two that are good10:44
timelyxlimepi: that's funny10:44
zeenixtimelyx: define good10:44
timelyxsince opera8.5 is something like 5 years old10:45
timelyxand essentially does mangle modern pages10:45
timelyxlimepi: are you using fit width to view?10:45
limepiso I can see10:45
timelyxif so, you're *telling* the browser to mangle the page10:45
timelyxand i so don't want to hear about it10:45
* timelyx resolves limepi as invalid10:45
timelyxdon't use that feature10:45
limepium, don't use the internet?10:45
timelyxclearly the check box needs to show a dialog10:45
limepiif I can't see it10:45
timelyx"Enabling this feature will *mangle* all pages. Use it at your own risk. Complaints about mangled pages are not welcomed."10:46
limepilike I wanna read my stolen ebooks in peace, and in big ol' letters10:46
* timelyx sighs10:46
limepiso feh on you10:46
timelyxlimepi: sorry. i hate mind reading10:46
timelyxpeople who come in and say that product X breaks {world}10:47
limepiat least you know your cognitive biases10:47
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timelyxwhen they mean "enabling a feature in X designed to break the world breaks the world"10:47
timelyxis really not nice10:47
timelyxthe browsing engine in microb is much better10:47
limepiit almost ran meebo10:47
timelyxits ability to help small screens render big content is indeed nowhere near as good as opera's10:48
limepiwhile meebo just totally pinned opera10:48
timelyxhowever, opera has been in the embedded space forever10:48
timelyxand while mozilla has been embeddable, most people haven't tried to make os adaptation algorithms10:48
limepi(bad joke)10:48
Big_Bwhere should talk about flash lite . Amy body please!!!10:49
Big_BIa there any flash lite room like Maemo ??10:49
limepi#flash ?10:49
Big_BFlash Lite10:50
timelyxi don't know of anyone playing w/ flash light10:50
flatfacepeople use flash light?10:50
Big_BI m serious . Please10:50
limepiwhere's the canonical list of repositories? tia10:51
flatfaceBig_B: it's pretty unpopular, so I don't think so. and even if there was, we probably don't know about it.10:52
Big_BYa . Thank you10:52
timelyxBig_B: i'm serious10:52
limepiGeneralAntilles, awesome10:52
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GeneralAntillesThat was interesting.10:53
* timelyx ponders10:55
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timelyxwhy is he so interested in flash light?10:55
timelyxnote: i'm personally curious about it10:55
timelyxhowever i can't understand why a normal person would be10:55
timelyxand my definition of normal for that statement includes pretty much everyone here :)10:55
GeneralAntillesIt's an enigma. :P10:55
limepiwhat is flash light?10:56
limepiis it macromedia related10:56
timelyxa second flash impl from adobe10:56
timelyxbeyond that, i really don't know10:56
limepier... adobe10:56
flatfaceit's a watered down version of adobe flash, and I've only ever seen it mentioned on my Noka E62.10:56
timelyxthey seem to be independent10:56
timelyxi mean really independent10:56
GeneralAntillesMaybe he just installed a copy of Adobe CS3, opened up Device Central, and wondered what the hell it was talking about?10:56
timelyxbut why ask in #maemo?10:56
flatfacetimelyx: people stumble into the weirdest irc rooms for even weirder reasons.10:57
GeneralAntillesHe's actually an Adobe engineer who is porting it to the platform?10:57
flatfaceand apparently #maemo is actually #41110:57
GeneralAntillesflatface, IRC is a strange place.10:58
flatfaceGeneralAntilles: got that right.10:58
limepiirc is the sewage system of the series of tubes10:58
GeneralAntillesHmm . . . 41110:58
GeneralAntillesNo, that's AOL's "IRC", limepi. ;)10:58
limepiwe make everything run, but we're also where the s*it flows through10:58
limepioh come on10:58
flatfaceI thought that was somethingawful/4chan.10:59
limepiyou know that all of the most disgusting pictures/disturbing memes started on irc10:59
limepiIRC precedes both10:59
timelyxprecedes has a different ordering10:59
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limepi"To come, exist, or occur before in time"11:00
limepiI might be a tad fail at being a 'leet hax0r, but I simply do not make usage errors11:01
timelyxwrong tense11:01
GeneralAntillespredate is a little less awkward in that context.11:01
timelyxprecedes would be present11:01
timelyxpreceded would be past11:01
timelyxyour word failed more for that reason11:01
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limepiarguable predates is better verbiage11:01
limepibut precedes is still syntactically correct11:02
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timelyxnope :)11:02
timelyxpreceded would have been11:02
flatfaceyour grammar is breaking my mind11:02
GeneralAntillesIRC is where all the grammar nazis come to play. :)11:02
* timelyx frowns11:02
limepithe way you've parsed it is wrong11:03
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limepiand that's why you think it's a usage error11:03
limepiwhat I was trying to articulate is the concept that SA/4Chan are the product of the sort of humor that blossoms on IRC11:04
limepipredates implies independent discovery11:04
limepilulz existed long before encyclopedia dramatica11:04
limepimuch like the newsgroup preceded the blog11:05
* timelyx frowns11:05
limepinote the similarity to "precedent," in the legal sense11:05
limepias in "based upon previous decisions"11:06
timelyxit's 11am, too early in the morning for this lecture11:06
limepiman, you guys almost tricked me into believing I did teh dumb11:06's 1am here11:06
flatface4am here.11:06
* GeneralAntilles high-fives flatface.11:07
limepiGeneralAntilles, am I a grammar nazi?11:07
limepior merely a sympathizer11:07
GeneralAntillesDunno, do you gas AOLers?11:07
limepiif by gas you mean lastmeasure11:08
limepiand actually I lied, I pulled that one in a channel that was relaying a macworld keynote11:09
limepiwith like 600 members and two ops11:09
timelyxlimepi: i'm still uncertain/unconvinced11:09
timelyxbut i'm certain i will not be more convinced w/o coffee (which i don't drink)11:09
limepiwait, convinced that I'm a nazi w/r/t grammar?11:10
timelyxno, your argument about your use of the wor11:10
* timelyx gives up11:10
limepiabout the origins of sick humor on the internet?11:10
timelyxjust "precedes"11:10
timelyxi accept the point you were trying to make11:10
timelyxmy quibble is merely w/ the word11:10
GeneralAntillesI agree on the tense issue.11:11
limepitimelyx, google it and check out the real-world usage11:11
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timelyxthe examples i'm seeing in the first page are all continuous11:12
timelyxi assume you meant the invention of irc11:12
limepiand I mean, it's not "colorless green ideas sleep furiously"11:12
timelyxif you meant continuous use of irc...11:12
limepithe word has connotations of both11:12
timelyxthe first 10 google hits are all for continuous11:13
limepias though there is a continuous flow of technology11:13
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timelyxwell maybe survey war precedes venezuela referendum i suppose11:14
limepi"the invention of the ENIAC computer was preceded by the ENIGMA encryption equipment used by Axis forces"11:14
timelyxthe word is fine, the quibble finally seems to be the tense11:14
limepiwas preceded11:14
limepithat is sloppy11:15
* timelyx dresses merrily or something11:15
flatfaceHoly crap, you're still arguing over this?11:15
limepiwe're not arguing11:15
timelyxflatface: i'm a bad loser11:15
GeneralAntillesThis is IRC, flatface. ;)11:15
* flatface goes back to "studying"11:15
timelyxand we concluded11:15
flatfaceyeah, I know11:15
limepiwe're doing PHILOSOPHY according to wittgenstein11:15
limepiso thbbit11:16
timelyxgah, no you're giving me reading for my vacation11:16
timelyxthat's mean11:16
timelyxhow can i enjoy rome if i have to find out who or what wittgenstein is/was11:16
limepiyou're not familiar with philosophy of language/mind?11:17
timelyxi'm self taught?11:17
timelyxi need to find a woman who can give me more formal schooling11:17
limepiwhy a woman11:17
limepiyou're obviously looking for someone to ask you11:18
red-zackhe is the guy is named jack the ripper ¬¬11:19
red-zacknooo woman noo cryy...*sing*11:19
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GeneralAntillesHowdy, lardman.11:30
lardmanhi GeneralAntilles11:30
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RocketmanAnybody else notice really poor garbage collection on the n810?11:35
Rocketmanor possibly memory leaks?11:35
RocketmanI keep seeing my free memory go down and down11:35
mgedminif it goes down, then it's not a leak :-)11:36
lardmanleaking out11:36
timelyxRocketman: most maemo apps don't use garbage collection11:37
timelyxthe browser does, and python apps do11:37
timelyxnothing else11:37
Rocketmanfor example, will open web browser and then close it11:37
timelyxthe root file system does, but that's not ram11:37
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timelyxRocketman: note that complaining about browser memory behavior will get you nowhere11:37
timelyxif you want to get something done, you need to be on irc.mozilla.org11:37
Rocketmanand will usually have like 15 MB less free11:37
timelyxand you need to read at least pavlov's blog11:38
limepiwhat are the must-have apps?11:38
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lardmanRocketman: it may remain cached11:38
timelyxlimepi: x terminal, ssh11:38
* timelyx wonders if those are included w/ 200811:38
limepixterm is11:38
Rocketmanx term finally is11:38
limepiwhat about music/video/game etc.-wise11:39
GeneralAntillesmaemo mapper, FBReader, mplayer, limepi.11:39
limepialso is there anything akin to netstumbler?11:39
Rocketmanyour question is really broad11:39
GeneralAntillesScummVM, maybe.11:39
limepiI'm not seeing kismet in my app manager11:39
Rocketmanmuch, much better than netstumbler11:39
GeneralAntillesPerhaps mmpc if you have an mpd set up.11:40
wumpusopenttd :)11:40
limepilike, I kind of mean, what are the non-obvious great programs11:40
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GeneralAntillesI covered them for you, limepi. ;)11:41
timelyxsome people get ukmp11:41
flatfaceIs it worth upgrading to 2008 beta now, or should I wait for final? I guess this question only applies if you have to wipe everything when doing the upgrade.11:41
wumpusyou can always look on and see if you find something else interesting11:41
* timelyx doesn't do music11:41
GeneralAntillesmaemodrac, Doom, Quake I/II and gpe-sudok are good for games.11:41
limepiukmp was great on 200711:41
timelyxflatface: you will whipe11:41
timelyx99% certain :)11:41
timelyxcrazy parking is a good game11:42
GeneralAntillesWhat's the matter with UKMP on OS2008, limepi?11:42
timelyxespecially for 4yo'd11:42
limepiGeneralAntilles, nothing at all... I have yet to install it11:42
flatfaceI may as well wait, then. I'm pretty lazy.11:42
GeneralAntillesHa, I played crazy parking with a real set.11:42
timelyxflatface: in theory the backup restore can remember which things you installed11:42
limepiGeneralAntilles, the plastic puzzle11:42
flatfacetimelyx: but from what I read before, it might be useless if the repos change.11:42
timelyxand as long as you're careful and walk through some convoluted steps you can use that app list to restore after you flash11:42
limepi"rush hour"! yeah that game was great11:43
timelyxflatface: doubter11:43
timelyxlimepi: oh, i started w/ real plastic11:43
timelyxbut i didn't have my own set, so when i came to finland11:43
timelyxthis was the best i could find easily11:43
limepibinarts ftw11:43
timelyxawesome company11:43
timelyxi need to buy a couple of that game the next time i'm stateside11:43
limepialthough I think they just changed their name to something else11:44
timelyxi can give it as gifts11:44
limepilike how philip morris became altria11:44
limepiah... they renamed the company ThinkFun11:45
limepiwhich is totally lame compared to binary arts11:45
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limepiwhich sounds like exactly what douglas hofstader would have named the company's puzzles11:45
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timelyxhopefully the dollar will have tanked a bit more before i'm back stateside11:46
timelyxso i can afford to buy their games11:46
limepigee, thanks11:46
* timelyx isn't rich11:46
timelyxi don't have 100usd handy to buy enough games11:47
limepifortunately, I sell gold and silver bullion11:47
* timelyx would think now would be a time to hold instead of buy or sell11:47
limepithe market always kind of calms down before the FOMC meeting11:48
limepibut there's certainly going to be a rate cut11:48
timelyxaww, you ruined my surprise11:48
limepia modest one will take gold back to its previous resistance level11:48
limepiwhile a big surprise one will power it through lord knows what11:48
limepiit closed at 835 a few weeks ago11:49
timelyxok. we know you're smarter than the rest of us11:49
timelyxquit showing off ;-)11:49
limepiso you mean to say that you don't think I'm entirely full of shit11:50
timelyxi mean i know my limits11:50
limepiso that is highly complimentary11:51
timelyxi don't know enough about the financial markets, i certainly don't know much about gold11:51
limepiit's going to be like 192911:51
limepiTIMES 100011:51
limepibut seriously, a million enrons have blossomed11:51
timelyxyeah, it's strictly complimentary11:51
timelyxit's odd, i think you're the second or third person i've seen here who really seems to have some understanding of the financial markets11:52
timelyxeither it's now a popular topic stateside11:52
limepigoldman sachs will make enron look like shoplifting from wal-mart11:52
timelyxor the audience for the n800/n810 really is people who understand (have) money11:53
limepihere, in #maemo?11:53
timelyxi think so11:53
limepicool :)11:53
timelyxi'm in a number of channels and my memory's terrible11:53
timelyxso it's possible i'm merging them11:53
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limepiyeah. we're very early adopters11:53
kulvetimelyx: the use_system_prefs was already set to false. I'm now trying to enable the proxies but how can I see if they works (I can access the internet without the proxy too..)? I set invalid url for the proxy, but it doesn't to anything. I tried with type == 1 and setting the proxy and type == 2 and setting the autoconfig url11:53
timelyxkulve: it should be 1 w/ proxyconf iirc11:54
limepiI don't know how the hell to make it, but I like to be adept at using it11:54
limepi(software, that is)11:54
timelyxkulve: oh11:55
timelyxum, hrm11:55
timelyxkulve: is this in a vm?11:55
limepiso this channel is usually a mishmash of devs and then mouth-breathing users like me11:55
timelyxif so, the easiest thing is to break routing11:55
kulvetimelyx: vm? I'm testing it on a device11:55
timelyxkulve: but not running itos?11:55
timelyx[no it's not running itos]11:56
timelyxbreak dns resolution11:56
timelyxuse ssh to setup a forward on localhost11:56
limepi...where can I get kismet for chinook?11:56
timelyxsetup the proxy to be on the forward11:56
timelyxand have no dns11:56
timelyxthat should work well enough11:56
kulvetimelyx: thx, I'll try something like that11:56
timelyxkulve: sorry, i'm having a brain freeze11:57
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timelyxi know i have better approaches than that11:57
timelyxi think proxyconf technically has an alert() functions somewhere11:57
timelyxbut you'd have to figure out where it goes (iirc it goes to *a* console)11:57
limepiokay, there's kismet for os '0611:57
timelyxyou could also use a logging proxy server11:58
timelyxand just view the access logs11:58
timelyxthat's probably what i'd do11:58
timelyxi have a proxy server (apache) and i can grep the logs to decide whether it's being used11:58
timelyxyou could of course use nspr logging11:58
timelyxNSPR_LOG_MODULES=all:5 NSPR_LOG_FILE=/tmp/this_will_be_big11:59
timelyxexport both...11:59
kulvetimelyx: do you know if the microb tries to go directly, if the proxy url is invalid, or should it just show some error dialog?11:59
timelyxshould give an error page11:59
timelyxask someone else here while i go to work?11:59
* timelyx should do that11:59
timelyx> As if the burden of divorce weren't bad enough, people with failed marriages can be blamed for global warming, according to a study by Michigan State University.12:00
limepitalk about crappy science12:01
limepi"can be blamed for"12:01
timelyxyou can blame just about everyone for just about anything and everything :)12:01
limepiI could blame global warming on polar bears if I wanted to12:01
GeneralAntillesAmen to that.12:01
GeneralAntillesI blame global warming on limepi.12:01
GeneralAntillesAll this talk about financial markets means he's an evil witchdoctor.12:02
limepiuh oh12:02
limepiyou don't even want to know what else I talk about12:02
limepiI want to find these other maemo economists12:03
timelyxchannel log is in the topic, good luck12:03
GeneralAntillesI wonder how big that log is.12:03
limepigoogle has encased me forever12:03
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doc|homelimepi: aye, it's going to get very messy (economy)12:04
timelyxyeah, but you have nothing to regret12:04
doc|homewe're only about 10-20% of the way in :(12:04
timelyxnot quite sure i can say the same thing about myself12:04
doc|homeand the fed are making it worse12:04
doc|homecuts = bad12:04
lardmandoes the hailstorm, etc, require planar or packed YUV?12:04
timelyxlardman; you're getting too technical12:04
timelyxwe were just talking about financial markets!12:04
limepidoc|home, the funny thing is, I had dinner at a friend's house, where a fund manager from PIMCO was visiting12:05
timelyxbesides, wasn't that removed?12:05
mgedminGeneralAntilles: fwiw that log is about half a million lines of text12:05
limepihe didn't seem too concerned about the future12:05
lardmansorry, was appealing to everyone else ;)12:05
doc|homelimepi: drinking the Paulson kool-aid?12:05
mgedmin160 megs12:05
limepidoc|home, are you familiar with bill gross?12:05
doc|homenope, can't say I am12:06
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wumpuslardman: packed, I think, but I'm not entirely sure12:06
rothielHi guys :)12:06
timelyxmgedmin: heh, that's nothing, i had much bigger logs from undermac for much less time12:06
limepihe is like the warren buffett of bonds12:06
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lardmanwumpus: I'll have to try and find the spec pdf, somewhere on my computer...:)12:06
* doc|home wikipedias!12:06
limepiwas a student of edward o. thorpe12:06
wumpuslardman: yeah, or look at the kernel module source12:07
wumpusI didn't even know there was a spec pdf of it12:07
limepiand lived as a professional card counter for a while12:07
doc|homelimepi: mind if I ask who you sell for?12:07
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doc|homeI'm looking for cheaper metal :)12:07
doc|homeI get boned by the spread :/12:07
lardmanwumpus: yeah, from Epson12:07
limepilol, what's the spread on a krug12:07
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wumpuslardman: so epson does give out datasheets, how nice12:08
lardmanwumpus: well yes and no, I think they did, but someone had to email to ask for them12:08
doc|homelimepi: hmm, no rates?12:09
doc|homelimepi: I don't buy krugs. They get taxed here. Maple leafs and 1oz bars or silver12:09
* timelyx shakes head12:09
limepier, what's the premium over spot for 1 oz rounds or a maple12:10
* lardman is relieved, found the pile of spec sheets and tips from Serge12:10
limepiin USD, please :)12:10
timelyxnot CAD? :)12:10
limepisame difference :(12:10
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limepithe last time canada broke the dollar was during the civil war12:11
doc|homelimepi: they don't have rounds, just bars, a bar is  803.50m maple leaf 821.7012:11
limepiokay, I know what a maple is12:12
doc|homelocal place, so no delivery12:12
limepiwait, what spot is that off of?12:12
doc|homealso, no paper trail in case the government decide to make it illegal for private holding again :)12:12
limepidoc, what was spot!?!?????????!!#??31241212:12
doc|homeer, I'm not sure to be honest, you can ask them to get an update spot, they don't say12:13
limepiuh, for the prices you just quoted me12:13
limepiyou do not know the value of the underlying asset?12:13
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doc|homegold fluctuates so fast these days they can't keep up12:13
timelyxlimepi: i thought it was 1976 or something12:13
doc|homeit's not a  dynamic site, so you can get updated prices when you go in12:13
limepidoc|home, um... we have a little price ticker12:14
limepifrom kitco.com12:14
doc|homefar too advanced for them ;)12:14
doc|homethey ring up their office12:14
doc|homethese will be prices from earlier today, will update them in the morning12:14
limepi^live spot12:14
doc|homeoh yeah, I know what spot prices are, I just don't know what spot price they based their prices on12:14
limepithey might just use the london fixed one or whatever12:15
doc|homei.e. what the spread is right at the moment12:15
timelyxThe previous time the two currencies traded at par was in November 1976, just after René Lévesque's election victory in Quebec, which sent the Canadian dollar reeling.12:15
limepilike... where are you buying these?12:15
doc|homelimepi: vbce.info12:15
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doc|homeoh, and that's on an conversion rate, however accurate that may be12:16
limepiyeah they got a pretty big spread12:16
doc|homewow, the two have really gotten close together12:16
doc|home(usd and cad)12:16
limepi1 OZ SILVER BAR 14.50 16.5012:16
doc|homethought it'd break 1.10 for a while12:16
doc|homelimepi: yeah, and on the selling I hurt :/12:17
limepiwe're like .70/spot12:17
limepieither way12:17
doc|homebut then shipping costs negate that for me :/12:17
limepisupport your local coin store12:17
doc|homeok, night all12:19
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limepiha, of course... I'm voting for obama but I strongly approve of ron paul12:22
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GeneralAntillesObama. No thanks.12:23
flatfaceare you trying to start a flamewar, limepi?12:23
doc|homeobama? The one who thinks invading pakistan might be a good idea?12:23
GeneralAntillesWay too much socialism there.12:23
doc|homeflatface: no, I pm'd him12:23
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* doc|home gone before heads come off12:24
limepihe doesn't actually think invading pakistan is a good idea12:25
limepibut he thinks the idea of making people believe that the us might invade pakistan if they pissed the us off enough... that's a good idea12:26
GeneralAntillesAnybody in favor of big government is a no-go for me.12:26
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timelyxi hope that includes republicans who grow the gov12:27
limepigovernment and industry have congealed into one institution12:27
timelyxwhile claiming to want to reduce it12:27
limepi"big government" is just big business12:27
GeneralAntillesHaha, I'm not that much of a moron, timelyx. ;)12:27
GeneralAntillesRon Paul is my man.12:28
timelyxhrm, 4 movie tickets for <30eur12:28
timelyxthat doesn't sound bad12:28
limepihe will at worst be like a perot12:28
timelyx(movie tickets are overpriced here)12:28
limepiand at best he'll be the true heir to goldwater12:28
limepior, like... uh... milton friedman?12:28
timelyxGeneralAntilles: sorry... it's an offhand complaint about republicans12:28
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timelyxthey say one thing, and do the opposite12:29
GeneralAntillesDemocrats = Republicans12:29
GeneralAntillesThey're the same party.12:29
limepipigs feeding from the same trough12:29
timelyxdemocrats at least don't say they want small government12:29
GeneralAntillesOne thinks you're stupid and the other things you're evil.12:29
limepiyou could easily swap the two12:29
limepiliberals think you're evil for driving an SUV12:30
dpb_timelyx: where do you get the tickets that cheap?12:30
timelyxmy you guys don't like the us parties much :)12:30
limepiokay, I need to quit fighting the ambien12:30
* GeneralAntilles needs a translation.12:30
limepioff to bed I go12:30
timelyxGeneralAntilles: i hope it's in english12:31
timelyxi can't read finnish12:31
GeneralAntillesUnless my brain is broken.12:31
* GeneralAntilles clicks the Union Jack.12:31
timelyxi guess they cookied me12:31
timelyxtoo bad the cookie doesn't seem to last12:31
timelyxi think normal tickets are 10-11eur12:32
timelyxand they used to advertise 6 for 5 or something12:32
timelyxso this is 4 for 312:32
timelyximagine thinking in terms of usd?12:33
timelyx5 * 10 Euros = 73.69 U.S. dollars12:33
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* timelyx stills thinks about pricing in usd12:33
GeneralAntillesI have the University theater to go to.12:33
dpb_you can get a 9-ticket set for 69 euros all the time, 7.67 each.12:34
* timelyx misses those12:34
GeneralAntilles'course, it just comes out of my tuition.12:34
GeneralAntillesBut the state pays for that, anyway.12:34
timelyxsillicon valley had a place where you could get tickets for something like 1.50 on tuesdays12:34
timelyxand they had double features12:34
timelyxso for something like $3 you got 4 movies12:34
timelyxand a full day12:34
timelyxof course, i ended up buying at least one lunch/dinner for 10-20$12:35
timelyxso it averaged out...12:35
timelyxthe rest of the week it was 3.50 iirc12:35
dpb_and Mon-Fri before 17.00 it's always 6.50 only..12:35
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GeneralAntillesFun stuff:
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mariorzanyonw use the 770 as a media center control of sorts?12:40
GeneralAntillesWhich media center?12:40
mariorzgood question12:40
mariorzxbmx would rock12:41
mariorzbut anything thats available really12:41
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GeneralAntillesWell, I can control my OS X box that I use for home theater/media stuff with a web interface and mmpc for music.12:41
GeneralAntillesIf it has an http interface, then you're set.12:42
mariorzwhat web interface?12:42
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GeneralAntillesDepends on the media center, but in my case,
GeneralAntillesThis might be useful for xbmc:
GeneralAntillesObviously, you'll need MicroB12:45
mariorznice! thanks12:45
mariorzmmpc+mpd seems cool too12:46
GeneralAntillesYeah, it works really well for music playback12:46
GeneralAntillesNot nearly as clunky as http12:46
mariorzdoes mpd work with airtunes or would that be asking too much?12:47
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GeneralAntillesI'm guessing that there's a way to make it work.12:47
GeneralAntillesHonestly, I don't have any experience with the AirPort Express, so I dunno.12:48
mariorzwow that would rock, ill google12:48
mariorzthanks man12:48
GeneralAntillesThere's a number of apps out there that'll route audio to an airport express12:48
GeneralAntillesThe question is whether they would be able to easily grab it from a daemon.12:48
GeneralAntillesYou have darwinports installed?12:48
mariorznow im wont be able to workn until i have all thi set up :P12:49
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GeneralAntillesMaybe that.12:50
GeneralAntillesActually, that should work just fine: "System Audio Support - Airfoil will transmit all audio playing on the system"12:50
GeneralAntillesAlthough you'd have to turn it on and off.12:51
mariorzturn what on and off?12:51
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GeneralAntillesStart it forwarding all system audio12:51
GeneralAntillesOr you'll end up with it forwarded all the time. ;)12:51
mariorzoh right12:52
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mariorzGeneralAntilles: hey remote buddy seems pretty cool alas the ajax remote doesnt seem to load ont he device wtf? works fine on localhost13:28
mariorzyou had any trouble?13:28
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mariorzit jsut times out, network conection is fine i can access the regular httpd13:31
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GeneralAntillesFirewall open on that port?13:32
lardmanstill no n810 in the uk nokia shop :(13:34
dpb_It's only the 4th..13:34
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dpb_they said it'll come by the 15th, still lots of time.13:35
lardmandpb_: I'd hoped that date was a backstop13:35
lardman11 days left then13:35
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mariorzahh could be that13:36
mariorzGeneralAntilles: were would i go about opening the port?13:36
dpb_yeah, well, it might come earlier, but I don't expect that..13:36
GeneralAntillesImage Viewer seem a lot faster in OS2008?13:37
mariorzGeneralAntilles: awesome :)13:37
lardmanGeneralAntilles: well it was pretty slow before so that's a good thing13:38
VReDoes somebody else have problems with os2008beta and browser on n800? On mine it crashes constantly. Most often when starting and opening the page from bookmarks or from rss-reader13:38
GeneralAntillesDid you restore from backup?13:38
GeneralAntillesThere's a fix in there.13:38
GeneralAntillesWell, it should fix it.13:38
VReshadows of opera13:39
GeneralAntillesYes, I think OS2008 Image Viewer is a LOT better. Which is great, because the NITs are really awesome photo albums.13:41
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tigerti used it to crop and scale my flickr photos for tablet  size13:43
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kulveI liked the image viewer upgrades too..13:43
tigertits good enough for me to keep using it, nice13:43
tigertso  i have a bunch of my photos in 800x480 size for slideshow if i need to show them to someone13:44
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kulveon a summer trip, we'll check out the images taken during the day by swapping the sd card from the camera to the n800. The display is quite much nicer than in our ixus..13:49
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alteregoGrrr .. My server is acting up :(13:51
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GeneralAntillesBeat it with a hammer, alterego.13:52
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alteregoAll I can do is ping and portscan it :/13:52
alteregoping times are respectable and the open ports are expected. But trying to ssh and it just hangs :/13:52
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alteregoOh, it's working now ^_^13:53
rip_is there a reason by default, that Busybox in Maemo won't let you ping anything unless your root?13:53
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VeggenHm. For ping to work, it needs to be suid root.13:56
alteregoIt's a symlink ..13:56
VeggenAnd you don't want to suid root your busybox binary.13:56
rip_I just find it strange that you need to be root to ping :p13:56
alteregoSeems kind of pointless having a busybox implementation of ping then. Do people actually suid their busybox?13:56
rip_thats all13:56
Veggenalterego: you can always sudo ping ?13:56
alteregoIt's still not exactly pretty :)13:57
alteregoPoint taken though,13:57
rip_sudo ping ? and that works ?13:57
* alterego adds ping nopass to his sudoers.13:57
wumpusrip_: well, ping uses raw ip sockets, which usually requires root permissions13:58
alteregorip_, only if it's in your /etc/sudoers13:58
rip_ahh ok fair enough cheers13:58
rip_I've setup a root account, just thought it was kinda strange is all13:58
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rip_all my other Linux boxes allow regular users to ping, but thats for desktop I guess13:58
keesjdid anyboy try to mail $ lately from outside?13:59
rip_just different from what im used to ;)13:59
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alteregorip_, add this line to /etc/sudoers: user ALL = NOPASSWD: /bin/ping13:59
alteregoThat'll allow you to do: sudo ping13:59
wumpusthen just to alias ping='/usr/bin/sudo /sbin/ping'14:00
wumpus(or whatever the paths are :)14:00
keesjrip_: did you do the olsrd?14:00
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rip_I posted some stuff to MUD14:05
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rip_its just a generic build, the config file by default needs to be changed14:06
rip_but works fine on my N800 with OS2008 :)14:06
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rip_does anyone know if MUD is still an active project ? if thats what you were refering to Keesj14:08
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alteregoUrgh .. Werk, werk werk ..14:14
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rip_cool didn't realise they added to the MUD svn :p cool14:36
* rip_ has contributed14:36
kaltsiI don't know the correct terminology here but is there a tool that would print out an 'object hierarchy' or something like that of the task navigator application menu at runtime?14:38
rip_so programs that are running ?14:40
kaltsino.. that 'runtime' was a bad choise of words :)14:40
kaltsiI'd just like to see how the application menu is constructed14:41
rip_you can move things around and into different menus14:41
rip_if thats kinda what you mean, so you can see what is where, but there is no config file that I know of14:42
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rip_its in Control panel14:43
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rip_and then go down to "Panels"14:43
rip_then on applications you can click on "organise"14:43
kaltsirip_: yes thanks that's too high-level.. I'm looking for something similar to 'xwininfo' or such :)14:44
rip_ahh ok sorry, I have no idea :p14:45
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halleykaltsi, get xwininfo to work on your tablet, then.14:50
halleykaltsi, or, read the source.14:50
halleyIt's likely a spaghetti C abomination.14:51
kaltsihalley: I'm reading it14:51
kaltsiand xwininfo is not what I'm looking for.. just something similar..14:51
kaltsigobject dumper or something like that14:51
kaltsibut putting printf's all over the code is my next step :)14:51
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kaltsi(btw xwininfo is part of the SDK tools so getting it would not be a problem)14:54
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Segnale007hi guys15:02
Segnale007I have tired to set my n800 network static15:03
Segnale007I get dhcp only15:03
Segnale007I have tired to do this
GeneralAntillesJust do it in the GUI?15:03
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Segnale007I have tired also with wlan0 and not eth015:03
Segnale007in /etc/network/interfaces15:04
Segnale007maybe wrong ?15:04
GeneralAntillesRight, have you tried in the GUI?15:04
Segnale007I try15:04
GeneralAntillesConnection Manager15:04
GeneralAntillesedit the connections15:04
Segnale007ok ty15:04
GeneralAntillesturn off DHCP and enter the IP.15:04
rip_you need to use the advanced tab to bring up static IP and that15:05
alteregoGPRS is slooow. It's gonna be nice when I get a new phone tomorrow.15:06
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GeneralAntillesAnybody able to speak to whether DUN is more of a bottleneck than BT?15:08
Segnale007I don't founf nothing for turn off dhcp there15:08
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Segnale007what is advanced tab ?15:09
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Segnale007what wrong ?15:10
GeneralAntillesConnection Manager: Application Menu -> Tools -> Connectivity Settings -> Connections, select your connection -> Edit -> Next -> Next -> Next -> Advanced -> IP Addresses, Uncheck auto-retrieve IP address.15:11
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rip_A few clicks I guess ;)15:14
Segnale007I'm asshole15:14
Segnale007I'm sorry and ty15:14
Segnale007I need to check more better before to ask next time15:14
Segnale007sorry about15:14
rip_No need to be sorry ;) thats what IRC is for15:14
Segnale007ty :)15:14
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Segnale007still ty so much ...15:16
Segnale007I gotta go to get launch15:16
Segnale007see ya15:16
GeneralAntillesRussian mission control?15:18
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pupnik_Downcount to offblast!15:23
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pupnik_  cool.  GPS pdas for the blind.15:28
* pupnik_ ponders grant possibilities15:28
GeneralAntillesSuckling from the government teat? :P15:29
pupnik_Yes, it's the #1 customer in Germany.15:30
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pupnik_In fact, if you're not scheming to get money back from the government, or spending over half your time scheming some way of using the innumerable regulations here to your advantage, you're doing it wroang.15:32
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pupnik_  How a DPAD (directional pad) should work - easy movement to all 8 cardinal directions, low resistance.15:45
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Takthe way ruby's string#split works with subexpressions is making my head explode15:56
alteregoIn a good way right? :D15:56
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Taknot really15:59
Takit's completely unuseful (IMO) to insert the subexpression matches into the result16:00
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alteregoWell, I'm sure it's like that for a reason.16:03
alteregoUnless it's being deprecated of course ;)16:03
sp3000python's returns groups as well16:04
GeneralAntillespupnik_, there are only 4 cardinal points. ;)16:04
sp3000the idea surely being that you can split something to things and delimiters and be able to reconstruct it16:05
Takthe other four directions are orioles16:05
alteregoI thought there were 6 cardinal points.16:05
alteregoOh, 2D :P16:05
sp30001D ftw16:05
Takthere are 2D cardinal points16:06
sp3000hmm, they've invented a C64 joystick16:06
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Taksp3000: then wouldn't it be more useful to return a list of [token,delimiter] pairs?16:07
sp3000[token,group1,...groupn] rather16:08
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Takah, [token, [delimiter0..n]] then - even better16:09
sp3000item[0] and item[1] vs item[0] item[1:]? naah16:11
sp3000but the sucky thing is you end up with [token],[token],... in the simple case16:12
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sp3000unless you make an exception for that16:13
* Tak write my own split - with hookers and blackjack!16:14
TakI'm pretty sure the no-subexpression form is already a special case16:14
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sp3000not in the format of the output in that sense16:15
sp3000(in the sense that you can explain it without 'or')16:16
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bstockhey, i'm running 2007HE on a 770, every time i try to change the language & region from English (UK) to English (US) it says 'device storage memory full. remove data to free memory' but my memory is fine16:20
bstockis there a file i can edit from command line to change this setting or something?16:21
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sp3000how much free space do you have ooi?16:21
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bstockinternal memory has 8.5 MB used, 30.5MB available16:21
bstocki tried to take out my memory card to see if that helped but made no difference (though that card had lots of free space also)16:22
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sp3000this product page claims 128M flash which sounds about right; 8 and 30 sounds a bit odd even with the jffs compression16:23
bstocki'm on a 770, i think it has 64mb memory16:24
bstockthere's also 24.8mb of installed applications16:25
bstockbut overall, it says 30.5mb available, but throwing that stupid error when trying to change language settings16:25
sp3000flash is another thing16:25
sp3000someone called Kaervak had your issue on 2007-11-1816:26
sp3000I suppose it may be an 2007he issue and a bogus message, too16:26
bstockhmm i see that on the logs, no one had any idea though16:27
bstockmust be a 2007he bug16:27
GeneralAntillesDelete the bundled manuals on the internal flash and maybe try again?16:28
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bstockdid that already16:28
bstockalso tried with/without virtual memory16:29
GeneralAntillesOK, learn British? :P16:29
alteregoWhat's British? :P16:31
alteregoWait .. I'm British ..16:31
fysaanyone get a bluetooth mouse working with os2008?16:31
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alteregoA mouse?16:32
alteregoYou're kidding right?16:32
bstocklol, no mostly it's fine, just the dates are backwards from what i'm used to16:32
fysawhy would I ask if I was kidding?16:32
rip_the OS2008 doesn't support mice input16:32
fysaXFCE does.16:32
alteregoXFCE ..16:33
fysamouse would be very helpful to use next to a bluetooth keyboard.16:33
glass_rip_: os2008 different in that regard to previous, so that you can't use 'mouse' with synergy and others?16:33
alteregoSure, I can understand the appeal.16:33
fysadon't care abouit it for the Hildon interface that much, but when I take this on the road I'd like to try to have a 'laptop mode'16:33
fysaso I can do some reasonable coding.16:33
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alteregoYeah, I get it, if you're using a normal desktop WM you probably need a mouse.16:34
fysaanyway, I'll keep tracking16:34
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alteregoOR at least are more used to it that way.16:34
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rip_ahh ok fair enough,16:34
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Rich_dyHi.  When I attempt to install ukmp, I get dependency errors, saying that I'm missing libsdl-ttf2.0-0 and libreadline4.0.   Where can I find these?16:36
Rich_dy(this is bora)16:36
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Taklibsdl-ttf should be in the extras repo16:36
Rich_dyTak, I don't see it in bora-extras.16:37
Rich_dyand I am in red pill mode16:37
Takmeh, what's the apt command to show what repo a package is in?16:38
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fysaI think apt-cache showpkg does16:39
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Takthere it is, thank you16:39 bora free16:39
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Rich_dyPackage: libsdl-ttf2.0-016:41
Rich_dytak, how can i make sure i'm pointing at the correct repo?16:42
Takcheck the repo list in the application manager?16:42
Takif you have the correct repo listed, it should install the dep automatically, even in blue pill mode16:43
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Rich_dyokay.  i see bora extras and maemo hackers16:46
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Rich_dy...adding maemo16:48
Rich_dythere it is!16:49
Rich_dyweird that I wouldn't have that16:49
* Tak chills the champagne16:49
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Rich_dythe media player was driving me nuts.  takes forever to refresh the list16:50
* Rich_dy is in denial his n800 is not an iPhone16:50
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GeneralAntillesYeah, it's so much awesome. ;)16:52
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rip_has anyone tried fowarding X with ssh in Maemo?17:10
rip_I can't seem to get it to work, and wonder if anyone knows why17:10
pupnik_"in maemo"?17:11
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rip_yeah OS200717:11
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rip_I haven't tried it in OS2008 yet but I am assuming its the same17:11
rip_ok doesn't work in OS2008 either ;)17:12
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pupnik_what ssh do you have17:12
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rip_might have something to do with busybox maybe17:13
rip_I could be grasping at straws :p17:13
rip_just would be nice to foward X from the nokia to my Linux box from time to time17:13
rip_I can foward from my Linux box to the Nokia17:16
rip_but not the other way around17:16
rip_using ssh -X user@host17:16
pupniksome xhost problem?17:17
pupnikxauth ?17:17
rip_well, I don't really know alot about xauth or xhost17:19
rip_from Linux to Linux its always worked for me ;)17:19
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timelesshello world17:31
timelessin case people are looking for a lesson in bugzilla, bug 339 comment 12 has one17:32
mgedminthat's not a url...17:34
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dpb_timeless: wont work if you click comment 13, as there is no 13.. :)17:47
timelessit will work eventually17:47
timelessa coworker will probably fix the code to use something closer to my suggestion17:48
timelessunfortunately at that point, the link i gave won't match my comment, but gah17:48
timelessand anyone foolish enough to comment saying "i can't click on comment 13" would look really funny :)17:48
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sp3000mgedmin: it is if your irc client doesn't suck :)17:54
sp3000(but yes, bots that urlify and summarize are reasonably useful)17:54
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* mgedmin is tempted to quote RFC 1378 at sp3000, but that would be a lowly dictionary flame, so /me won't17:55
sp3000...The PPP AppleTalk Control Protocol (ATCP)?17:56
sp3000that would be weird17:56
zoranmaybe some bible quotes?17:56
sp3000but cz doesn't linkify the comment n part ;(17:56
sp3000it totally should17:56
sp3000odd, I don't see a bug for that on bmo17:58
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* mgedmin should really use copy & paste instead of trying to type 4-digit numbers... RFC 1738 is the one that defines URLs18:02
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* sp3000 files18:05
GeneralAntillesAppleTalk is funny.18:05
GeneralAntillesIt's the only network protocol that you can tell which computers are using it at the router.18:05
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lophytehey all, libmediaplayer0 got removed somehow... is there a way to re-install it?18:09
lophyteit doesn't look like its in any repos18:09
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Screamingtimelyx: Just to put you out of your misery as of 8am-ish Screaming,Not-ScreamingN80 and ScreamingN800(who first saw that the N810 image might work on the N800) are one and the same.18:29
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ivanzWhere can I find unison for N800 ?18:42
lophytewhere can I find libmediaplayer0? it got removed and I can't re-install it...18:43
ivanzor rsync?18:44
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timelesslophyte: gronmayer in the topic.18:46
ivanzWhat;s the root password for ITOS2008 ?18:46
ivanzno longer "rootme" ?18:47
timelessit's still rootme18:47
timelessbut you need to have r&d mode enabled18:47
timelessor do things some other way18:47
ivanzah correct forgot to enable red pill mode18:47
timelessred pill has no relation18:47
timelessyou could use
timelessinstead of r&d mode if you want to18:48
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Screamingpupnik: re X forwarding..maybe something to do with the no-tcp switch when Xomap starts? You wanna nother reboot cycle?18:48
timelesslibmediaplayer0 is a nokia thing18:48
timelessif you manage to delete it, you're mostly out of luck18:48
timelessit's not provided in a repository18:48
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timelessyou can imagify your device, reflash, and play some merging games18:48
timelessif you're feeling adventurous and have a friend you can try to generate an artificial package18:49
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timelesshas note on how to make packages from a device...18:50
timeless(designed for a different purpose, but, a script's a script)18:50
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Screamingtimeless:  You know that the irclog of this channel kills IT2008 browser in Fit view  to width?18:51
timelessi so don't care about fit width to view18:52
timelesspeople using it do so at their own discomfort18:52
hugolpSince yesterday I cant play flash videos with OS2008, anyone having the same problem?18:52
timelesshugolp: flash is probably disabled18:52
* sp3000 would kinda like an "act normal" mode18:53
ivanztimeless: I've just enabled red pill mode but I still can;t ssh with "rootme"18:53
hugolptimeless:  its marked as its able18:53
ScreamingCan't blame you. Its useful crap though.18:53
lophytetimeless, its not in any of those repos18:53
GeneralAntilles[11:47am] <timeless> red pill has no relation18:53
timelesslophyte: "it"?18:53
timelessivanz: i said that, and gave you a url for capture-root18:54
timelesslophyte: i explained that18:54
timelessis everyone ignoring me?18:54
GeneralAntillesHah, I don't thing they're paying any attention to what you're saying, timeless. ;)18:54
lophyteoh I didn't see that18:54
lophyteI was looking through gronmayer18:54
lophyteI wasn't reading and thought you were talking to someone else18:55
timelesssorry, the url was for ivanz probably18:55
timelessrather gronmayer18:55
timelessblah, whatever18:56
sp3000timeless: "like fx3"18:56
timelesssp3000: ??18:56
timelesssp3000: is that not normal?18:56
sp3000microb w/o fitwidth likes to display pages wider than the screen when zooming18:56
lophytes'pose I have to reflash my n80018:56
sp3000when normal wrapping would do18:57
timelessi think there's a pref for that18:57
sp3000that has its drawbacks, but I'm fairly sure I prefer it to pure paper zoom18:57
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sp3000(and to fitwidth, but I usually end up with fitwidth, feel my pain)18:58
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sp3000yes fitwidth is kinda hardcore for 800px, imo18:58
sp3000my desktop browser windows are usually about 800px wide and they do fine :)18:59
timelesssp3000: about:config?sprefname=zoom18:59
Screamingsp3000 I feel, it, I feel it. Hence the nick18:59
timelessi think you want to twiddle the true.zoom pref19:00
timelesssp3000: documenting this somewhere useful would be good19:00
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* sp3000 is documenting it at :|19:00
* timeless too19:01
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timelessi suppose you could spell out the full pref name :)19:01
timelessbut only do that after you test :)19:01
sp3000but, yeah, as much as I like to avoid organizing things too much, that may be pushing it ;)19:01
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timelessremind me tomorrow morning to yell at whomever is holding back my documentation release19:02
* timeless grumbles19:02
timelesscould someone please explain the point of autoconf?19:02
timelessrsync requires autoconf19:02
timelessautoconf requires m419:02
timelessi got those requirements and ran configure19:02
timelessthat passed19:02
ivanzok the .deb fails to install19:02
timelessthen i built, and it failed because19:02
ivanzwith the application manager19:02
timelessivanz: right, you need to read the description19:02
ivanzwhat description ?19:03
timelessor the log message (tools>log)19:03
timelesswhen you install a deb it has a details button w/ a description tab19:03
timelessyou really shouldn't install debs w/o reading about them19:03
ivanzright it says that /home/user/.ssh must exist in order for it to work19:03
ivanzand it does19:03
timelesshrm it says that? it should say there should be an authorized_keys in that directory :o19:03
sp3000it could create the key if it's missing, right?19:03
* timeless goes looking for the right box19:03
ivanzit says something inconsistent19:04
timelessyeah, but czr argued against that19:04
sp3000there should be a id_*.pub I think19:04
timelessi wanted that behavior19:04
ivanz"at least one of /home/user.ssh/ or /home/user.ssh/ must exist"19:04
timelesshe said "beware of exploits that enable people to retrieve ~/.ssh/identity19:04
timelessivanz: ok, sorry, read the description while i fix the package :)19:05
ivanzso I have to put my public key in order to login ?19:05
ivanzis that how this works?19:05
timelessit's "simple" but it works relatively well19:05
ivanzrsa or dsa?19:06
ivanzor does it not matter19:06
timelessit doesn't care19:06
timelessit's just copying the file from ~/.ssh to ~root/.ssh/19:06
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timelesswhich is something you can't do w/o root19:06
timelessi could let you have the file in ~/MyDocs instead of just ~/.ssh/19:06
timelesswould that help?19:06
timelessif i did that, you could have the file on your desktop19:07
ivanzit;s consistent to keep your keys in .ssh19:07
* timeless goes back to fixing postinst19:07
ivanzbut then again there is this issue with getting the key on the device19:08
timelessusb, bt send, https19:08
timelessi've used bt send19:08
timelessi've also used ssh-keygen -t rsa on the device19:08
ivanzi used http :)19:08
timelesskinda depends on your needs/goals/trusts19:08
timelessok, newer package uploaded19:09
timelessexcept, it's buggy :(19:09
sp3000oh, crap, I think I'm loading about:config at max zoom fitwidth19:10
* sp3000 kills19:10
pupnikthere has to be a good ffmpeg package for .deb out there that's not patent-crippled19:10
timelesssp3000: you want to use sprefname urls where possible, i really should consider making the setpref page force an sprefname19:10
timeless echo and contain an authorized_keys or authorized_keys2 file 1>&219:11
timelessthat line was added to postinst19:11
timelessivanz: thanks for being a tester :)19:11
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lophytecould I pull the libs out manually from rootfs.jffs2?19:14
timelessif you can read jffs2, yeah19:15
timelessthe script in my url would probably be vaguely helpful, maybe :)19:15
lophyteI'll take a look19:15
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lophyteI almost have it, except I'm getting "no space left on device" problems19:15
timelesssince you really want to resurrect and reinstall the package instead of just having the file19:15
lophyteyeah, you're right19:16
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lophytethat assumes I can access jffs properly...19:17
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lophytewhich I can't seem to on my pc19:18
lophyteyou can't mount a jffs image with loopback, but even using mtdblock kernel modules its not working..19:18
lophyte dd if=rootfs.jffs2 of=/dev/mtd019:18
lophytedd: writing to `/dev/mtd0': No space left on device19:18
lophytere-flashing the device is probably easier...19:20
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sp3000timeless: layout.full.true.zoom.mode true -> false works but doesn't seem to persist19:23
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* sp3000 goes edit it behind the browser's back19:23
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sp3000grumble :(19:28
sp3000it resets it on startup19:28
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GeneralAntillesNow that just makes me laugh.19:33
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pupnik  VIVE:  An ffmpeg GUI for video encoding. Supports DVD and files and converts to all formats allowed by ffmpeg, including the iPod, PSP, and other popular formats.19:33
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sp3000but I think I rather like this mode better than the two we ship :)19:37
bstockanyone know a good online store with the n810 in stock in US?19:42
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lardmanC help needed19:45
lardmanerror: expression must be a pointer to a complete object type19:46
lardmanvoid ptr = (s->q_val + entry  s->q_pack);19:46
lardmanvoid  ptr = (s->q_val + entry   s->q_pack);19:46
lardmanhmm, markup19:46
lardmanvoid <asterisk>ptr = (s->q_val + entry <asterisk> s->q_pack);19:46
lardmanany ideas?19:47
elbyou can't declare a variable of type void19:47
elbperhaps you mean void *ptr19:47
elboh, that's what you mean by <asterisk>19:47
derfYou can't do arithmetic on void pointers.19:48
elbis s->q_val an incomplete type?19:48
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elb(that is, either an object of unknown size declared as a pointer for storage of some library-internal state, or a void *)19:49
lardmanderf: ah, I see19:49
lardmanelb: I don't know what an incomplete type is19:49
elbI explained that in the parenthetical19:50
lardmanoops, let me read that, was called to the kitchen to chop an onion19:50
lardmanso the answer is, quite possibly19:51
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lardmanpresumbly I should cast them to something other than void to allow the arithmetic?19:51
elbwhat are you actually trying to compute?19:51
elbis s->q_val actually the head of an array?19:51
timelesssp300: ping19:51
timelesssp3000: ping19:51
lardmanelb: I have't the faintest idea, deep in codebook.c for tremor lowmem no-byte19:51
timelessshould i intentionally drop pieces from pool?19:52
elbif so, and you know the type that it contains, cast s->q_val to a pointer to that type19:52
* timeless doesn't like the idea of indexing pools19:52
elboh ... let me suggest not doing pointer math on objects you don't understand ;-)19:52
timelessbeing a much worse example19:52
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derflardman: Oh, you should've said so.19:54
lardmanelb: I agree with your thinking, I thought it might just have been a peculiarity of the dsp compiler19:55
lardmanderf: sorry19:55
derfReading the code, you should just move the ptr assignment inside the subsequent if's.19:55
sp3000timeless: I'm not sure I follow19:55
sp3000but pools are mostly slightly hard-to-index stuff19:55
timelesssp3000: basically, if i index pool19:55
timelessthen you'll get lots of useless hits19:56
timelessbasically garabge19:56
derfDrop the s->q_pack multiple and cast things to the actual type they are.19:56
sp3000the .dscs could be some flavor of helpful, maybe19:56
lardmanderf: ok, let me have a look at that19:56
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sp3000do you want a filename exclude rather?19:57
timelessconsider that19:57
timelessideally, i'd only have 2 files in the entire dir19:57
derflardman: I mean, if you look at case 2: above that, the meaning of what they _actually_ meant to do should become pretty clear.19:57
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sp3000I don't have your upstream urls mapped20:01
derfgcc lets you do arithmetic on void *'s as if they were char *'s, despite the fact that it is illegal. I have no idea what happens when you do that on a machine without an 8-bit char, and apparently neither does your compiler.20:01
timelesssp3000: ok, next problem20:03
timelessi'm trying to use rsync20:03
timelessand i need to make sure it's "niced"20:03
timelessideas? ":)20:03
lardmanit worries me that the code, although supposed to be nobyte, has two different paths with either (unsigned char *) or (ogg_uint16_t *)20:03
lardmanboth of which are the same with no 8bit bytes20:03
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lardmanunless it decides at runtime: if(s->q_bits<=8)20:04
lardmanI just cast s->q_val as (unsigned char *)20:06
timelesssent 127402662 bytes  received 107782 bytes  201597.54 bytes/sec20:07
timelesstotal size is 198766205  speedup is 1.5620:07
timelessthat's how expensive adding browser-extras was20:07
sp3000timeless: at the other end? no... unless you can limit the user at the other end, or do some daemon dance that I knw nothing about20:07
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timelesssp3000: i'm wondering if i can use --rsync-path20:07
timelessmaybe something like20:07
timeless--rsync-path="nice -n 19 bin/rsync"20:08
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lardmanthis compiler obviously doesn't like void* -> lots of errors caused by trying to cast a value of type "int" cannot be assigned to an entity of type "ogg_uint16_t *"20:09
lardmanso presumably it assumes void=int20:09
sp3000yeah, the manpage examples sound like that might be possible20:09
sp3000or, pretty surely is, since there are shelly things in the example strings20:09
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* sp3000 wonders why he didn't see it in the options list20:12
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timelessit's burried near -e ...20:15
timelesssadly it does have the word "remote" in the help too20:15
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timelessgah, blizzard gave me homework20:17
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derflardman: That's why I think casting q_val as (unsigned char *) is the _wrong_ thing to do.20:45
derfThe right thing is not to multiply by s->q_pack, but to cast to the correct pointer type in each of the branches.20:46
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derfAnyway, you should post a log of the errors.20:48
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Takthat would just produce a constant.21:19
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sven-tek2hi! does anyone here user v4l2 with os2008? I tried using motion-3.2.9 with it, but it does not work. Something seems to have changed in kernel/camera-driver.21:24
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lardmanhmm, it appears to have successfully compiled21:44
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lardmanstep one complete...21:45
TakIf it compiles, it's done.  Any other problems are user error.21:46
lardmanwe'll see21:46
lardmanstep 2 is pub21:46
lardmanstep 3 is testing21:46
lardmanonto step 2, see you all a bit later21:46
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cbx33hey alterego22:24
cbx33that £1 for a day browsing22:24
cbx33limited to 30Mb22:24
alteregocbx33, yeah I know.22:24
alteregoYou think you'll use over 30M ?22:24
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alteregoI used it yesterday loads and I only got to 4M22:25
cbx33doing what?22:25
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alteregoBrowsing, IM, Mail22:25
cbx33how did you measure it?22:25
alteregoOh, and SSH22:25
alteregoThe connection manager shows data counters.22:26
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alteregoWould be a lot better with EDGE though.22:26
alteregoI was only using GPRS (slow as hell)22:26
alteregoSo I'm gonna buy a new phone tomorrow or Thursday :)22:27
alteregoYes & no, no video calling.22:27
alteregoIt's a Nokia 730022:28
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cbx33is that a payg sim?22:29
alteregoYeah, it's cheap.22:29
alteregoQuite a nice phone for the price though22:29
alterego~80 GBP22:30
cbx33did you ring them up this morning?22:30
alteregoNo, I'm not going to buy it from Orange.22:30
cbx33no for the £1 bundle22:30
alteregoI want it unlocked.22:30
alteregoNo, I've been at home all day so I've not needed to.22:30
cbx33so how did you activate the bundle?22:31
alteregoThat was yesterday22:31
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alteregoI rang up 450, and followed the automatic instructions.22:32
alteregoBasically choosing the right menu options.22:32
cbx33i thught it only activated it for that day though?22:32
alteregoIt does.22:32
alteregoIt works for 24 hours.22:32
alteregoThen you have to do it again if you want if for the next day.22:33
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timelessGeneralAntilles: that fmradio thing is a bug in the program listing data for the region?22:35
GeneralAntillesI don't have a damn clue.22:35
GeneralAntillesWere you able to interpret the description?22:35
GeneralAntillesI'm less inclined to believe it's a problem with the program than with the person. ;)22:36
timelessthat is my interpretation22:36
timelessthere's a channel list that the app can download22:36
timelessif it has the wrong frequency listed for a station22:37
timelessyou'd get a user w/ that reaction22:37
timelessat least, istr one22:37
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GeneralAntillesI guess you could compare the frequency listed on the station's website with the one the applet shows.22:38
GeneralAntillesWhere does Nokia pull the station data from?22:38
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K`zanAnyone got a pointer where I can possibly figure out why every time I find an open WIFI hotspot and try to connect to it, the n800 tries for a bit and returns a network error?22:53
GeneralAntillesMAC address filtering?22:53
GeneralAntillesLow signal?22:53
GeneralAntillesShitty router?22:53
K`zanLow signal might be it. possible...22:53
alteregoLow transmission power too ..22:54
K`zanOne might think that if the signal is too low to connect to, it wouldn't be listed.  My only real experience is with the router about 522:54
K`zan' from the n800 :).22:54
alteregoIf not already at 100mw try setting it to that.22:54
K`zanSset at 100mW.  It would be nice to be able to set that on a per-connection basis - sure don't need 100mW here.22:55
alteregoI've successfully connected to AP's ~100M away22:55
GeneralAntillesYeah, some of it might be blamed on the N800 seeing the router, but the router not hearing the N800.22:55
K`zanDunno, suspect there are a number of issues involved here but with just the bars, it is hard to diagnose.22:55
K`zanNot to mention my ignorance of the subject :-(.22:56
K`zanUnf no open sites within my range here.  Using the "Site Survey" off the tomato firmware gives me a pretty good idea of what is going on though.22:57
amranyone here got an Asus EEE pc?22:58
GeneralAntillesReally, K`zan, you need AT&T and a 3G phone. ;)22:58
K`zanGeneralAntilles: Got both and can't afford to use it :-/.22:58
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K`zanAT&T really rapes you for using it.22:58
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GeneralAntilles(stupid damn Colloquy wont give up focus >:()22:59
K`zanI looked at the wireless rates and nothing around $20 that I found, but even that seems excessive :-/.22:59
K`zanWill go take another peek.22:59
jeff1f$20 will get you unofficial tethering23:00
jeff1f$60 is the official rate23:01
fysathrough where?23:01
GeneralAntillesYeah, I'm using the unofficial plan.23:02
GeneralAntillesWorks great.23:02
jeff1fdid you have to change any settings, GeneralAntilles23:04
GeneralAntillesisp -> wap23:04
fysaVBA/GBA emu working for OS2008 yet?23:05
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alteregoCool, azureus tunned through SSH. :)23:09
alterego~tunnelled :)23:09
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timelessdunno, i suppose i could look....23:14
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K`zanBT Keyboard and BT GPS will hopefully be here by the end of the week!23:28
guerbyhi, is there a way to see what proxy microb is currently using?23:28
guerbyon OS200823:29
GeneralAntillesGoddamn, I'm installing Perl modules and for some reason one of them needed to test the text-to-speech.23:29
GeneralAntillesScarred the bejesus out of me.23:29
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K`zanAh, meant to ask where one finds flite for maemo mapper?23:31
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GeneralAntillesDon't think the package is working under OS2008.23:32
GeneralAntillesBut it's probably linked on Gnuite's website if you want to give it a go.23:32
K`zanAh, ok, thanks.  Still wondering if going to 2008 was the wise thing to do :-/.23:32
GeneralAntillesK`zan, it's the future.23:33
K`zanI wonder how many apps are really out there for 2008.  Finding them is exciting.23:33
GeneralAntillesNow or in 2 weeks.23:33
GeneralAntillesIt doesn't really matter. :P23:33
K`zanGeneralAntilles: Unfortunately I live in the present :).23:33
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K`zanFrom 30 to 55 apps for it in a very few days, not shabby :-).23:34
GeneralAntillesK`zan, have you tried mmpc?23:34
K`zanFiguring out what they are from the 2008 downloads is a bit challenging though.23:34
K`zanmmpc ?!?23:34
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GeneralAntillesJust install all the repos and use the app manager.23:35
GeneralAntillesMaemo Media Player Client.23:35
GeneralAntillesIt's fantastical for music playback.23:35
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