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| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, I mean, wtf?? | 11:54 |
|---|---|---|
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| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: no i mean WTF | 12:02 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: fucking nokias from 2000 can have different colour back doors and themes | 12:03 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, the fact that you expected much more doesn't mean that they promised much more | 12:03 |
| ZogG_lap1op | blackberry LE with just being red and written developer edition on back is ok as it's free | 12:03 |
| faenil | I expected a more exclusive other half myself | 12:03 |
| ZogG_lap1op | look i was pissed i got STL100-1 | 12:03 |
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| faenil | but that doesn't mean you can attack people like that | 12:04 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's shitty, but i can't complain as IT's FREE | 12:04 |
| ZogG_lap1op | let's say i would be angr at blackberry if i get it for paying a lot of money | 12:04 |
| faenil | man, you still paid normal price | 12:04 |
| faenil | but you're getting an *additional* OH | 12:04 |
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| faenil | you can be disappointed and say you expected more | 12:04 |
| faenil | but not that way | 12:04 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: it's priced 5 $ | 12:04 |
| ZogG_lap1op | there is no headphones there | 12:04 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, where 5$? | 12:05 |
| ZogG_lap1op | no screen sticker or anything | 12:05 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's plastic with text and small NFS | 12:05 |
| faenil | screen sticker? what phones comes with a sticker which is not the factory one? | 12:05 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's less than 5$ for each in scale of few thousand for company | 12:06 |
| ZogG_lap1op | device is over priced as it's first one | 12:06 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, did you notice that the only colour available at launch is white? | 12:06 |
| ZogG_lap1op | TOH is advertise as hw addition | 12:06 |
| ZogG_lap1op | make it so | 12:06 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, if it was just the "5$" do you think there wouldn't have been more colours? | 12:06 |
| ZogG_lap1op | for fuck sake, how do i attack people | 12:06 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, no | 12:06 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, on the opposite, TOH on website is just advertised as software | 12:06 |
| ZogG_lap1op | there is no sw either | 12:07 |
| faenil | (and on most reviews as well) | 12:07 |
| ZogG_lap1op | if i get extra preview app or something it would be cool | 12:07 |
| faenil | software as in software-extension, ambiance or whatever that can be | 12:07 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but only fucking theme? | 12:07 |
| ZogG_lap1op | maaaan | 12:07 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, man, I said I agree with that | 12:07 |
| faenil | I was expecting more myself | 12:07 |
| ZogG_lap1op | you know i'm not asking for hw keyboard or camera there | 12:07 |
| faenil | but the way you attack is too strong | 12:07 |
| ZogG_lap1op | all i asked fucking attenton | 12:08 |
| ZogG_lap1op | something interesting | 12:08 |
| ZogG_lap1op | unlike like they say it | 12:08 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: so if i think they making something wrong and pointing it out is attacking? | 12:08 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, no, it's the way you point it out | 12:09 |
| ZogG_lap1op | why everyone so affraid of me telling bad things and making bad advertisment for jolla? all i do is say the fucking facts | 12:09 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, you have the right to be disappointed and to tell them | 12:09 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, yes but you do it like they OWE you the moon | 12:09 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's just colour and theme and it's nothing special for TOH | 12:09 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so if they don't want bad word on internet about them they shouldn't do it | 12:09 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's not my fault man | 12:10 |
| faenil | "don't make me stupid" | 12:10 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: they kind of own me, as i paid for outdated HW | 12:10 |
| faenil | that's aggressive | 12:10 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, outdated HW? it's a freaking Snapdragon400 | 12:10 |
| faenil | how is that outdated? | 12:10 |
| ZogG_lap1op | amd it was told not once " maybe outdated a little but cool OS and TOH" | 12:10 |
| ZogG_lap1op | OS is beta, TOH is colour | 12:10 |
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| ZogG_lap1op | so fo fuck sake, it can't be NOT THAT and NOT THAT and NOT THAT | 12:11 |
| faenil | only because the resolution of the screen? | 12:11 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it has to be at least something | 12:11 |
| ZogG_lap1op | ram resolution | 12:11 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i know that market and shit | 12:11 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i do understand | 12:11 |
| faenil | no that's all I see | 12:11 |
| ZogG_lap1op | talked about it | 12:11 |
| faenil | you've got a last gen chipset | 12:12 |
| faenil | but you never say about that eh? | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but at least give something extra for that price | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | lemme give you example | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i worked on few R&D projects at work | 12:12 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, again, I agree geeks were expecting something more | 12:12 |
| faenil | but none ever said they were working on a hw extension | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and there was customer that wanted feature i developed and couldn't QA | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | we told him he can get it for free | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | as beta | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | he didn't liek how it worked | 12:12 |
| ZogG_lap1op | we rolled him back | 12:13 |
| ZogG_lap1op | everyone happy | 12:13 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but i can't imagine what would happen if i ask money for beta version of something and give him nothing | 12:13 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, so what? | 12:13 |
| ZogG_lap1op | the point is if you want to sell something beta, even if it would be awesome one day | 12:14 |
| ZogG_lap1op | at least throw something with it that actually works | 12:14 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, the system works pretty good | 12:14 |
| faenil | I think we're drifting subject here | 12:14 |
| ZogG_lap1op | for now high price ( i get more with N9 for much less price) | 12:14 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, maybe you don't remember BB10 first version? | 12:14 |
| faenil | 3g disconnecting and not reconnecting without reboot? | 12:15 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: no MMS, no landscape, it's beta, some android apps crash | 12:15 |
| faenil | and stuff like that | 12:15 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, no landscape is a design choice | 12:15 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, some androids apps crash? it depends if it's apps' fault | 12:15 |
| ZogG_lap1op | when i got it it was ok | 12:15 |
| faenil | we all know android is not known for it's stability | 12:15 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and agian i got bb10 for free, can't complain | 12:15 |
| faenil | doesn't matter, people bought | 12:15 |
| faenil | the fact that you got it from fre | 12:15 |
| faenil | means nothing | 12:16 |
| ZogG_lap1op | or crash because of support of android | 12:16 |
| faenil | people bought it for 599€ | 12:16 |
| faenil | (or was it more) | 12:16 |
| ZogG_lap1op | they can't as well delete them from 3rd party market | 12:16 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, what? | 12:16 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so it's mine field with android apps then | 12:16 |
| thedead1440_ | faenil: sorry to interrupt but landscape support is being worked on according to woot so it's not actually a design choice ;) | 12:16 |
| faenil | thedead1440_, you're talking about browser I guess | 12:16 |
| faenil | thedead1440_, I didn't specify the word browser anywhere ;) | 12:17 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i don't think only browser as it was a lot of talking about TOH keyaboard | 12:17 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it bought a lot of people | 12:17 |
| thedead1440_ | faenil: he said landscape support isn't present due to sensors not due to design choice ;) | 12:17 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, yes, the fact that people wanted it a lot doesn't mean anything to what jolla promised, imho | 12:17 |
| ZogG_lap1op | don't tell me jolla didn't say anythign so they don't want to scary customers till they buy to find out by themselves that it's too laye | 12:17 |
| faenil | thedead1440_, yes but was that about browser? | 12:18 |
| ZogG_lap1op | jolla did't peomise thing | 12:18 |
| faenil | thedead1440_, landscape works in android apps | 12:18 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it was in silent to just make more rumors with space crafts like TOHs and stuff so people would want it more | 12:18 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, sorry didn't get your long sentence | 12:18 |
| thedead1440_ | faenil: he didn't mention only browser but it was a general comment that due to receiving sensors late they couldn't implement landscape support | 12:18 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i don't get how you don't see it | 12:18 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, yes, because that's the potential, and it's important for people to see it | 12:19 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, but the only thing I heard marc saying was that "we're not working on a hw solution at the moment" or something like that | 12:19 |
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| faenil | hw other half, I don't remember | 12:19 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, of course when you're presenting the other half concept you're presenting the concept (Jolla Love Day) so it's CRITICAL to give people an idea of what it can be done | 12:20 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, but you know, things need time, resource etc | 12:20 |
| faenil | I never heard jolla saying it would have hw TOH at launch | 12:20 |
| faenil | I only heard it encouraging people to be part of the development because you can do cool things with the TOH | 12:21 |
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| ZogG_lap1op | first of i saw people ddosing their twiitter with questions about toh and it's specs for a while | 12:25 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and they didn't got reply for a long time | 12:25 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so don't tell me encourage | 12:25 |
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| ZogG_lap1op | it maybe stupid example, but if you know Animal Farm or anything about communism, you can understand that on words and promises you can be anything and future is bright | 12:26 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but in ral world it's not always liek that | 12:26 |
| ZogG_lap1op | again if you come to someone and not keeping too much secret and telling actually what;s going on person may understand you | 12:27 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but for now we had no info on what state and what it would be and how we would get it | 12:27 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so it was assumable tht it's end user project | 12:27 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and it would be end user finished project | 12:27 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i knwo that we would have bugs | 12:28 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but bugs vs not finished is different things | 12:28 |
| ZogG_lap1op | as well don;t compare to iphone 1 or android 1 | 12:28 |
| ZogG_lap1op | or even bb10 | 12:28 |
| ZogG_lap1op | even bb10 had more apps, invested in people and hackatons for reason | 12:29 |
| ZogG_lap1op | while jolla didn;t communicate on proces and revelant nothing | 12:29 |
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| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, oh right, jolla and blackberry same resources.. | 12:29 |
| faenil | nice point there, ahahah | 12:29 |
| ZogG_lap1op | how are resources relevant man? | 12:30 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, you have no idea how much bb invested in those events and devices | 12:30 |
| faenil | are you kidding me? | 12:30 |
| ZogG_lap1op | someone forced jolla to sell to whole EU? | 12:30 |
| faenil | 12k devices handed out | 12:30 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so? | 12:30 |
| faenil | so read again above | 12:30 |
| ZogG_lap1op | jolla had other ways and had community it could use | 12:30 |
| faenil | yeah, but no devices to hand out at the moment | 12:30 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and i by community i mean community that supported n900 by itself | 12:31 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, so, jolla sells only in finland --> boooo only finland? | 12:31 |
| ZogG_lap1op | ota updates and shit | 12:31 |
| faenil | jolla sells in EU ---> boo, no free devices? | 12:31 |
| ZogG_lap1op | they didn't use those resources | 12:31 |
| faenil | I mean, seriously | 12:31 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and didn't work coolabarated | 12:31 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, they WANT to use those resources | 12:31 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: please don't jump from topic to topic | 12:31 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, it's you doing that, I'm replying only | 12:32 |
| ZogG_lap1op | anything i say i hear "BUT jolaa is ..." | 12:32 |
| ZogG_lap1op | no one forced them to do what they do and the way they do | 12:32 |
| ZogG_lap1op | there are always few options | 12:32 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and ways | 12:32 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, also using communtiy means PLANNING for that, and making sure it is done the right way | 12:32 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i don't ask for free device | 12:32 |
| faenil | and you know what? it would find familiar to you, planning takes time | 12:32 |
| faenil | and you know what else? don't know if you heard marc's speech at launch | 12:33 |
| faenil | jolla had a chipset until few months ago | 12:33 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i paid fucking 500+ $ for not end HW and no apps and no eco system | 12:33 |
| ZogG_lap1op | even no headphones in box | 12:33 |
| ZogG_lap1op | no MMS | 12:33 |
| faenil | and then they had to rebuild everything in 6 months | 12:33 |
| faenil | I'm sure you *can* understand that not everything is possible in that timefrime | 12:33 |
| faenil | frame* | 12:33 |
| ZogG_lap1op | all the noise was made and for now it's nothing special | 12:33 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, seriously, you're blaming for no headphones in the box | 12:34 |
| faenil | that is really......aww... | 12:34 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: it's nothing, but this and this and that | 12:34 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, it's the OS in a good state | 12:34 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: that telll me at least one thing that is good about jolla phone and its not abscract and it's not future planned thing | 12:34 |
| faenil | reliable enough in my opinion | 12:35 |
| ZogG_lap1op | straight away | 12:35 |
| faenil | a very good start for something which keep developing | 12:35 |
| ZogG_lap1op | NOT ABSTRACT | 12:35 |
| faenil | exactly, not abstract, a shipped product | 12:35 |
| ZogG_lap1op | by product you mena plastic that turns on | 12:35 |
| faenil | which hasn't even had a reboot from what I've read so far | 12:35 |
| ZogG_lap1op | ? | 12:35 |
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| faenil | just so you appreciate a minute | 12:35 |
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| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, are you kidding me? plastic that turns on? | 12:36 |
| ZogG_lap1op | let's try again | 12:36 |
| ZogG_lap1op | what is so special and not abstract about jolla phones | 12:36 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: all phones that are released shipped product | 12:36 |
| ZogG_lap1op | what makes jolla special | 12:37 |
| faenil | the OS? and its design and the otherhalf? | 12:37 |
| ZogG_lap1op | otherhalf for now is just colour and theme (so it's abstract) | 12:37 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, no, there are pins on the phone for I2C | 12:37 |
| faenil | -> it's REAL | 12:37 |
| faenil | now go on ;) | 12:37 |
| ZogG_lap1op | pin there, is it used? | 12:38 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i heard that N9 had led but it was never released and support for messages :) | 12:38 |
| faenil | not currently, as I guess there hasn't been time to develop a full os, make a full switch of the whole graphics and mw stack in 6 months | 12:38 |
| ZogG_lap1op | notifications* | 12:38 |
| faenil | but it's just missing a proper other half | 12:38 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so it's abstract for now | 12:39 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so now we don't have finished product right? | 12:39 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, no, the pins are there, the OtherHalf support is done | 12:39 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and the price is high right? | 12:39 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and it's okay as it's first product | 12:39 |
| faenil | it's just missing a company to produce a oh which USES that REAL concept | 12:39 |
| faenil | nobody said Jolla would be making hw extensions itself | 12:39 |
| faenil | that could be the case, but you don't have to give that for granted just because you like to believe so | 12:39 |
| faenil | jolla gives you the platform to do that innovation | 12:40 |
| faenil | i.e. the phones, with the connections and handling of OH | 12:40 |
| faenil | that's what jolla promised, afaik | 12:40 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, why no finished product? I don't get it... | 12:40 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but again, don't tell me i'm not thankful, as Jolla has to be MORE thankful for people who pay that much money for something that can be bright future or can fail in a month. where no support for a lot of things was announecent officially while fan boys just dream of space crafts as TOHs and jolla wouldn't approve/disapprove just to keep noise around it. | 12:40 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, are you saying that since you ship an HDMI port with your phone you also have a to ship a monitor using it?? | 12:40 |
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| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, I don't think that's being done because they're sadic (is that english? :D) | 12:41 |
| faenil | it's just lack of time because of the reasons I said above | 12:42 |
| faenil | and everything keeps being developed | 12:42 |
| faenil | as all products evolve | 12:42 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: do not compare IO ports and actuall part of device | 12:44 |
| ZogG_lap1op | they don't have to ship geek TOHs | 12:45 |
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| ZogG_lap1op | even not for all preorders | 12:45 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but at least for those 450 first | 12:45 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, it's you who're saying that they had to make a hw oh | 12:45 |
| faenil | otherwise you're not happy | 12:45 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, that still takes time and resources | 12:45 |
| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: even if not HW | 12:45 |
| ZogG_lap1op | at least something SW | 12:45 |
| ZogG_lap1op | with something special | 12:46 |
| ZogG_lap1op | that makes it LE | 12:46 |
| faenil | I agree, I think I told you many times already that I expected something myself | 12:46 |
| ZogG_lap1op | LE is limited right? | 12:46 |
| faenil | yes, colour is limited | 12:46 |
| faenil | so stop saying it's not limited, please | 12:46 |
| faenil | just because your idea of limited is different | 12:46 |
| ZogG_lap1op | if i can print it on 3d printer and download theme files from other phone it makes it no LE at all | 12:46 |
| faenil | look up dictionary and clear your doubts :P | 12:46 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, you must be kidding me xD now 3d printing? | 12:47 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, oh let me know how much you'll pay for a decent quality OH btw when you print it, okay? ;) | 12:47 |
| faenil | (that's unrelated though) | 12:48 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's back door of phone what is so "quality" abut it? | 12:49 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, the material and the way it's actually created, I don't think a botmaker (or whatever was the 1k$ printer) can do that, for example | 12:53 |
| faenil | even if you clean it with acetone steam | 12:53 |
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| ZogG_lap1op | you don't have to use cheap one | 12:55 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's enuf that you have ebay account and expensive one you can sell things out | 12:56 |
| ZogG_lap1op | so i bet in few weeks we have old kind of limited TOHs on ebay | 12:56 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i even can give you idea of chipest simplests limited edition toh | 12:57 |
| ZogG_lap1op | cheapest | 12:57 |
| ZogG_lap1op | for those first 450 people :) | 12:57 |
| ZogG_lap1op | that will as well makes person more happy and promote how jolla is open | 12:58 |
| ZogG_lap1op | simply add your name | 12:58 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it would sync to jolla | 12:58 |
| ZogG_lap1op | you have extra app with gnu liscense or about jolla that only on limited phones | 12:59 |
| ZogG_lap1op | and there is 450 names in thanks and about :) | 12:59 |
| ZogG_lap1op | or those names can go to about of end user phone | 12:59 |
| ZogG_lap1op | as thanks | 12:59 |
| ZogG_lap1op | it's smae only colour TOH but makes it personal | 13:00 |
| ZogG_lap1op | exclusive | 13:00 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, I think you missed the *hand-written* thank you card in the 450 preorders box | 13:00 |
| ZogG_lap1op | simple like that | 13:00 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, but yes, according to you that's not limited, as I can write it myself and put it in the box XD | 13:00 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, yeah the names would have been a good idea imho | 13:01 |
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| ZogG_lap1op | faenil: as well 32GB version (again even not for all but 450 first) would be good idea, as with today prices i don't think the difference would be that great | 15:40 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, don't make assumptions, they usually don't work if you're expert in the manufacturing field :P that's what I learned | 15:41 |
| faenil | if you're not* | 15:41 |
| ZogG_lap1op | still the difference in price wouldn't be that huge | 15:43 |
| ZogG_lap1op | on other hand when end user will buy device price would probably drop by that time | 15:43 |
| ZogG_lap1op | sooooo :( | 15:43 |
| faenil | ZogG_lap1op, I'll go deeper, don't assume it's just a price difference | 15:46 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i know what you mean | 15:49 |
| ZogG_lap1op | but i'm talking about part that do not reuire extra drivers/space | 15:49 |
| ZogG_lap1op | most phones have few variant, but i would prefer 16 + microsd than 32 with no microsd slot | 15:49 |
| ZogG_lap1op | i'm just talking about them showing more attention to people who upport them | 15:50 |
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| pa | by the way, is sailfish os available for N9? some long time ago i remember Jolla saying they would have made a somewhat unofficial version available for developing on N9 | 18:32 |
| pa | (since i'm not gonna pay 400€ for a jolla phone, i think this is the only way i can do development for sailfish) | 18:32 |
| pa | ok maybe this is not the best channel to ask such question :p | 18:33 |
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| thedead1440_ | pa: nope. The closest you get to a sailfish image is sourenaya(spelling)'s work on tmo which is just the sdk image. I guess you need to wait now that the actual device is out for him to try to get something better | 19:16 |
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| pa | so they will not release the sailfish os version they themselves used thus far for the development? | 19:20 |
| pa | bad bad bad | 19:20 |
| pa | for them mostly. | 19:20 |
| pa | I'm not gonna buy a device to develop for jolla. and since i believe this is the same for most of the N9 developers, not gonna buy a jolla phone to run android applications worse than on an android phone (which already sucks) | 19:21 |
| pa | besides, i'd prefer a N9 image rather than a free dev device from jolla.. It's so very ugly.. | 19:23 |
| pa | at least this one | 19:23 |
| thedead1440_ | They did say they would help porting efforts but not release a port themselves due to legal issues. Also things have changed since then with the use of libhybris becoming more of a permanent measure and possibilities of sailfish running on most android devices | 19:25 |
| thedead1440_ | Personally I am waiting it out, their conflicting messages somehow put me off from pre-ordering and although I hope they succeed I will be waiting it out for a few months to see how they progress from now on | 19:26 |
| thedead1440_ | My one main suspicion of their browser being shit is almost right and since I use Firefox on my i9305, I don't see why I should use it on a lower specced phone knowing that Firefox is a resource hog even on a 2gig device | 19:28 |
| thedead1440_ | If ever I can try sailfish on my i9305 and I can live with it, I would show my support by purchasing their device otherwise I am simply tired of working round things for them to work... | 19:29 |
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| GeneralAntilles | It's Gecko, not Firefox. | 21:33 |
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| ZogG_laptop | DocScrutinizer51: ping | 23:20 |
| beford | pong | 23:20 |
| ZogG_laptop | beford: i need you too :) | 23:22 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | hmm? | 23:33 |
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