IRC log of #harmattan for Saturday, 2012-11-03

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ZogG_laptopjesuschrist_: do you use drugs?00:10
ZogG_laptopdid you use those while reincarnation?00:11
jesuschrist_caffeine and nicotine00:17
jesuschrist_nothing special00:18
jesuschrist_btw zogg do you know any way to do a full n9 backup ?00:18
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ZogG_laptopjesuschrist_: i might be wrong but there was thread on tmo i think about something like that00:25
ZogG_laptopbut what excatly you want to bckup00:25
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ZogG_laptopjesuschrist_: - as i understand you can do image of system with it00:45
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jesuschrist_thanks zogg!00:55
jesuschrist_did you try it ?00:55
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jesuschrist_i want to backup the whole phone00:55
jesuschrist_WHOLE phone00:56
jesuschrist_just to reflash it, no packages reinstalling and stuff like that00:56
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louisdkI've installed Inception on my N9. How do I get a real root shell? I can't use su.00:58
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jonnilouisdk: well inception doesnt install you root shell, but you can get near if you install opensh.01:14
louisdkapt-get install opensh -> package not found01:17
louisdkjonni: I've installed dev mode. But I can't rename /usr/bin/smartsearch01:19
arceanlouisdk, have you tried "ariadne" ?01:20
louisdkarcean: Yes. Stiil can't rename that file.01:24
arceanhmm, why do you want to rename the smartsearch file?01:25
louisdkI've heard that disabling the smartsearch feature would save some battery.01:27
arceanand will probably break some system functionalities :P01:29
arceanchmod -x /usr/bin/smartsearch is what people are using to disable smartsearch01:29
louisdkarcean: thx01:30
louisdkarcean: Would disabling dev mode improve the battery life?01:31
arceanno, I don't think so01:32
arceanbut do you really want to live without terminal :D ?01:32
jesuschrist_better way to improve battery is to not use connections and01:33
jesuschrist_connection related functionalities01:33
jesuschrist_just with wife i got from a idle consumption of 5mA to 21mA01:34
louisdkarcean: I can still use the terminal with dev mode disabled: :)01:35
arceanhere's 6mA01:35
arceanwith cellmo and wifi in idle :D01:35
jesuschrist_maybe i have more bg daemons then01:36
jesuschrist_dont know01:36
jesuschrist_without wifi hows your idle consumption arcean01:36
arceanI have no idea, my devices are always connected to the home's wifi01:36
louisdkWell. I've an N950 and the battery life is very bad compired to the n9.01:37
arceanright now, the N950 has 9mA in idle01:37
jesuschrist_arcean : just rechecked, 20mA with wifi01:37
arceansomething eats your battery :P01:38
jesuschrist_must be something that uses connection01:38
jesuschrist_since when everything is off it goes to 501:38
jesuschrist_any idea ? :p01:39
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arceanmaybe exchange account is going nuts :P01:42
jesuschrist_no sync01:42
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jesuschrist_meh maybe my wifi router is dying and reception signal isnt so good01:44
jesuschrist_dont know01:44
arceansometimes reboot helps me when power consumption in idle rises01:46
jesuschrist_nah its always like that01:47
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DJKillcrazyHello, I am a wanna-be N9 enthusiast.07:47
DJKillcrazyCan anyone help me?07:47
DJKillcrazyI have to buy you sushi first? ;p07:48
bluefoxwouldn't turn you down, but i just don't know everything unfortunately, however i can certainly try07:49
DJKillcrazyI am about this close to plunking down $395 USD for a 64GB model but I have a few lingering doubts . . .07:50
bluefoxwell, what would you like to know? had an N9 for about a year now and an N950 for not nearly as long07:50
DJKillcrazyI see you're in the UK. Know of any US users in here?07:51
bluefoxi'm actually in the US07:52
DJKillcrazyOh. Sweet.07:52
DJKillcrazyHow do I tell if my seller is giving me a 110 compatible charger, and what do I do if they turn out to be lying?07:53
bluefoxpretty much every piece of electronics these days works with 100-240v07:54
bluefoxif the seller is giving you the original charger, it won't have the correct plug of course07:55
bluefoxyou can just use an adapter or a charger of your own07:55
bluefoxit just charges off micro usb, so pretty much anything will do (no barrel connector like older nokias)07:56
DJKillcrazyWas there any truth to the rumor Nokia was selling directly in the US, hence the seller has a unit with an OEM US plug?07:56
bluefoxi've seen a few US stores carry it (even newegg for example), but it was always an import model07:56
DJKillcrazyWhat about full size USB? I currently run an iPhone 3GS07:57
DJKillcrazyOr could I go the Euro to US power adaptor route?07:57
bluefoxdoes your charger have a usb port and then you just use one of the apple specific usb cables?07:57
bluefoxcan go either way then07:58
bluefoxjust use the included usb cable in place of the apple one07:58
bluefoxor an adapter07:58
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DJKillcrazyHmmm, nice.07:59
bluefoxi use an HTC charger at work and a sony ericsson one at home07:59
bluefoxcould even charge it off a computer if you were so inclined07:59
DJKillcrazyFunny notion to be plugging into the Apple charger. Hadn't thought of that.07:59
bluefoxif you do go with the adapter route, you'll want to inquire as to what regional variant it is to get the correct adapter07:59
bluefoxmine has a UK plug for example and is a bit inconvenient with an adapter due to the size of the huge grounding pin on it08:00
DJKillcrazyYeah, and hope they actually know. It's a US ebay seller who apparently bought a bulk quantity.08:00
bluefoxi'd just stick with your apple charger for ease of use personally08:01
DJKillcrazyHmmm so I already asked AT&T a while ago and they said yes, but what carrier do you use?08:01
bluefoxsince it is an unlocked and unbranded smartphone, you can actually use their dumbphone data plan with it (medianet)08:02
DJKillcrazyHmmmmm how's the email app work with Gmail?08:02
bluefoxworks just fine08:02
DJKillcrazyNo shit!?08:02
DJKillcrazysorry lol08:02
bluefoxbeen doing that for years08:03
bluefox$10 per line if you have a family plan and it's unlimited as well08:03
DJKillcrazyand still get 3G data speeds?08:03
bluefoxsince you already have an iphone, you'll be on the regular $30 data plan08:03
DJKillcrazyer, no, don't have a family plan. And I'm none too impressed with their latest shared data plan maneouverings08:04
bluefoxyou'll need to call them up after you swap SIM cards to change it if you wish08:04
bluefoxah, well, i think it's $15 then08:04
DJKillcrazySo they'll actually let me downgrade?08:04
bluefoxessentially how it works08:04
DJKillcrazyI'm grandfathered to the $25 2GB plan now.08:05
bluefoxis any at&t branded phone (and the iphone) gets flagged in their system because they have a database of IMEIs (essentially serial numbers for phones)08:05
bluefoxnot in their database and they haven't a clue what it is08:05
bluefox(at which point they'll ask you and it's up to you to tell them what it is)08:05
DJKillcrazy"It's a tuna sandwich."08:06
bluefoxbefore all the lumia devices came out, i told them i had a nokia and they automatically assumed i had a 10 year old POS :P08:06
bluefoxdo note though that if you do use the cheap data plan08:06
bluefoxand swap SIM cards to a phone that is in their database08:07
bluefoxthey'll spam you with SMS about it and then automatically switch you over eventually i think08:07
bluefoxdon't hold me to it though08:07
DJKillcrazyMakes me wonder if the gig would be up if I told them it's an N9, wonder if they'd even bother to look up what it is.08:07
bluefoxi doubt they'd have any idea what it is08:08
bluefoxdoesn't matter what you tell them though...they just need the IMEI when you call up08:08
bluefoxdon't forget to visit a store or get a SIM card cutter too08:09
DJKillcrazyAnd the IMEI doesn't identify that it's a smartphone?08:09
bluefoxno, unless it's at&t branded (or the iphone), they haven't a clue what it is for the most part08:09
bluefoxyeah, your iphone uses a regular SIM card08:09
bluefoxN9 uses a micro SIM (like the newer iphones)08:09
bluefoxthey actually tried to charge me $30 for a micro SIM when i visited a store, but were more than willing to give me a regular one and immediately cut it for me down to micro SIM size...go figure08:10
DJKillcrazyI'm still finding it hard to believe they won't push back on me a little bit downgrading from a smartphone to an alleged non-smartphone but still using data.08:10
bluefoxare you still under contract?08:10
bluefoxif so, stuck with it until that's over08:10
bluefoxif not, you're free to change it as you please08:11
DJKillcrazyNo I'm free and clear.08:11
bluefoxhave at it then08:11
* DJKillcrazy 's hed spins08:11
bluefoxwell, lets face it, at&t kinda screws you normally :P08:12
DJKillcrazyNow, I'm probably in the wrong place for this, but boy do I wish it had PureView phase 1 tech in it!08:12
bluefoxyeah, the 808's camera certainly is nice08:13
DJKillcrazyThat's why I can't imagine them screwing themselves!08:13
DJKillcrazyYeah, I'm rather torn.08:13
DJKillcrazyDefinitely leaning N9, even though what originally wetted my appetite was the 808.08:14
bluefoxwell, most of their employees couldn't care less since there isn't much they can could even lower your minutes and remove SMS if you really wanted to08:14
bluefoxjoys of being contract free (not that you'd want to more than likely)08:14
DJKillcrazyOh I know. I've been contract free all along (with them at least)08:15
bluefoxas nice as the 808 is, i do really prefer my N908:15
bluefoxdo actually have another symbian phone in the house (E7)08:15
bluefoxdecent, but man, hard to beat it...really need to use it to understand08:15
bluefoxand yes, bit biased :P08:16
DJKillcrazyI can definitely appreciate a slick interface.08:18
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bluefoxmain draw for me was that and how it handles multitasking08:18
DJKillcrazyI declare Nokia severe assholes for jumping in bed with MSFT at such a time.08:19
bluefoxwhich symbian does do too, but not nearly as well in my opinion08:19
bluefoxyeah, elop ruined it :(08:19
bluefoxnot that the windows based devices aren't good, but after having seen the unreleased devices that have surfaced recently, rather disappointed08:20
DJKillcrazyAnd who knows what Jolla will do, but it's extremely unlikely Nokia will license them any PureView tech.08:20
DJKillcrazyI'm sure they're nice hardware, but I don't do MSFT anymore, if I can help it.08:20
DJKillcrazyNot for 10+ years.08:21
bluefoxi don't think you'll be seeing the pureview incarnation from the 808 in any other phones for a while08:21
DJKillcrazyFortunate and unfortunate at the same time.08:21
bluefoxdoesn't really fit in for nokia to release more high end symbian devices08:21
bluefoxnor does it really fit in with the form factor and whatnot of all the windows based ones08:22
DJKillcrazyNo, I'm sure the 808 is the last Symbian smartphone ever.08:22
bluefoxwell, high end ones...they keep putting out other ones08:22
bluefoxi was actually half tempted to replace my m4/3 camera with one08:23
bluefoxbut after the large pile of money i spent on acquiring an N950, don't see that happening08:23
DJKillcrazyEh, to me, a smartphone needs to be high end to actually be a smartphone. All those cheap shit Criket phones running Android 1.8 don't count.08:25
DJKillcrazyYou still have it?08:25
bluefoxthe N950?08:25
DJKillcrazyYeah, I didn't think you could buy those, just demo only.08:26
bluefoxyeah, you can't08:26
bluefoxi got lucky08:26
DJKillcrazySo they demo wasn't free?08:26
bluefoxit was...for the original owner08:26
DJKillcrazyAnd Nokia didn't butcher him/her when it wasn't returned?08:27
bluefoxi don't they've been asking for any of them back actually08:27
bluefoxfew floating around on ebay...last one went for $120008:30
DJKillcrazyAre they actually better than N9s, hardware-wise?08:31
bluefoxyes and no08:31
bluefoxit has a keyboard (main draw)08:31
DJKillcrazyAnd can't you dev for Harmattan without one?08:31
DJKillcrazyOh yeah.08:31
bluefoxyou can08:31
bluefoxit does have a smaller battery, no nfc, and a different kind of screen08:32
DJKillcrazyDon't need a physical KB.08:32
bluefoxguess you could swing either way...OLED pentile vs regular lcd08:32
DJKillcrazyWhich is pentile?08:32
bluefoxpersonal preference i think but most would lean towards the N9 there08:32
DJKillcrazyEr, has*08:33
bluefoxinstead of having full RGB subpixels for each one08:33
bluefoxit has green for every one and alternating red and blue for each one08:33
DJKillcrazyNo no, I know what pentile is.08:34
bluefoxoh, right, sorry08:34
bluefoxthe N9 has that08:34
DJKillcrazyWhich one has pentile?08:34
DJKillcrazyOh. Bummer, but then so does the 808.08:35
bluefoxyeah, but so does every high end smartphone these days08:35
DJKillcrazyAnd from what I can tell, N9 has a much better screen than 808, even being pentile.08:35
bluefoxit isn't really bad or even noticeable08:35
bluefoxscreen looks spectacular08:35
DJKillcrazyNot iPhone ;008:35
bluefoxwell, OLED screens08:36
bluefoxnexus line, samsung galaxy, htc's current offering, etc08:36
DJKillcrazyThough I think there is some new megadick 'droid with a non-pentile AMOLED.08:36
bluefoxah well, i don't want a huge 5" phone anyway...08:37
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bluefoxdo have an android phone too for work, but it isn't top of the line08:37
DJKillcrazyI dunno. I'm liking the idea of more screen realestate. And I mostly wear cargo pants so it's not like I'm worried about pocket fit.08:38
bluefoxwell, personal preference there08:39
bluefoxi quite like the 3.7/4" group though08:39
DJKillcrazySee, I just can't imagine having more than one active phone. For work it's understandable, but for me a non-issue and why I'm so torn:08:39
DJKillcrazyKinda pointless having a real camera eliminating 808 if I have to use another smartphone anyway.08:40
bluefoxi was going to use SIP on my N9, but i get SMS spam from all our monitoring stuff, so can't really turn that off like i can another phone08:41
DJKillcrazyI've been wanting each for a while now, but also an iPhone 5 . . . until I found out they expanded the screen size vertically only08:42
bluefoxnot a big fan of the iphone personally, but in terms of looks and form factor, certainly a step up08:43
DJKillcrazyOnly advantage is it gave it native 16:9 video capability08:45
bluefoxso, same as the N9 now :P08:46
DJKillcrazyBut I would rather they'd made it a little wider too AND 16:9, even if that meant making it 4.2-4.3 inch08:46
bluefoxthough i don't think i've ever watched any video on it08:46
DJKillcrazyI watch a fair amount of youtube and other streamed video.08:47
bluefoxah, certainly important then08:48
bluefoxi guess i could do it when i take the train to work, but i tend to just stick to spotify then08:48
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DJKillcrazyI just come across lots of stuff in my mobile browsing, plus social situations.08:50
bluefoxthe N9 does have flash! :D08:50
bluefox(you have to install firefox for it)08:50
DJKillcrazyFlash is a dying beast.08:51
DJKillcrazyGood riddance.08:51
tehdelyevery now and then, it comes in real, real handy08:51
tehdelyone of the reasons i don't want to give up my N9 for a good long while08:51
bluefoxi like terminal better :P08:53
DJKillcrazyYes, every now and then I come across a website thoroughly stuck in a 10 years ago design mentality, and have some problems.08:55
bluefoxtables and frames!08:55
DJKillcrazyThat'd be 15 ;)08:56
tehdelyi had one such website just today08:56
tehdelythanks to my N9 + fennec + flash i was able to watch a livestream...08:56
tehdelyof a gas station in brooklyn08:56
tehdelytalk about lines08:56
bluefoxyou'd be surprised at how much old stuff there's still floating around08:56
bluefoxi saw a production pentium 2 box at one of the datacenters i work in today :(08:57
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tehdelyi feel bile rising just seeing something running rhel408:57
bluefoxyou'd be surprised what people pay to colocate08:57
bluefoxat least it was running windows 2000 instead of NT...i dare not touch it however08:57
bluefoxi can imagine how crazy the situation in NYC still is though08:58
DJKillcrazyIt's cause a lot of the regional gas distribution centers are still closed08:59
bluefoxah, that would do it09:01
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DJKillcrazyParticularly for Brooklyn and Newark.09:04
DJKillcrazyWas a segment about it on NPR on my ride home today.09:04
bluefoxwell, hopefully won't be too long before everything gets back to normal there09:07
DJKillcrazyOkay, need rest. I will likely grill you about apps tomorrow ;)09:09
bluefoxsure thing09:09
bluefoxno problem09:09
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ZogG_laptopbeford: :P16:48
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ZogG_laptopVenemo: sup my old friend :)16:58
Venemohey ZogG_laptop, I'm fine :)16:59
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VenemoZogG_laptop, how are you?17:00
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ZogG_laptopVenemo: not bad17:04
ZogG_laptoptrying to start developing for bb10 :P17:04
Venemome too17:04
Venemobut no bb10 device yet17:05
ZogG_laptopi got playbook as well17:06
ZogG_laptopit's funny how playbook design reminds first version of linux DE's and that it's putted on tablet17:07
ZogG_laptophope they update it to bb10 soon17:07
ZogG_laptopas browser, keyboard and UI elements are much better on bb10 :P17:07
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GeneralAntillesVenemo, when's IRC Chatter development resuming? :P17:30
ZogG_laptopGeneralAntilles: evening17:32
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ZogG_laptopVenemo: btw it would be nice to see it on bb10 as well17:32
GeneralAntillesI keep getting disconnected without it noticing17:32
ZogG_laptopok i asked venemo in private some noob programming related question and i'm gonna repeat it here17:32
GeneralAntillesand there's some weird case sensitivity issue with some channels.17:32
ZogG_laptopGeneralAntilles: on n9 btw?17:33
VenemoGeneralAntilles, hey17:33
Venemoyep, its current state is quite embarassing17:33
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GeneralAntillesIt's quite a slick client17:34
GeneralAntillesJust got a few bugs that need ironing.17:34
Venemowell, it has a bunch of annoying bugs17:34
VenemoI'll look into it when I can, but don't have too much free time nowadays17:34
GeneralAntillesSeems to be the story of everybody's lives these days. :(17:35
Venemounfortunately, yes17:35
Venemoin the meantime, you can file bug reports about the stuff in the Nemo bugzilla17:35
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ZogG_laptop7:29   ZogG_laptop: btw about programming17:38
ZogG_laptop17:29   ZogG_laptop: i need small advice17:38
ZogG_laptop17:29  17:29   ZogG_laptop: if i have list of items17:39
ZogG_laptop17:29   ZogG_laptop: and each item have presonal data17:39
ZogG_laptop17:30   ZogG_laptop: should i declare list of data as item or use item with  parameters i need ?17:39
ZogG_laptop17:31   ZogG_laptop: including that i would need to use it twice as i would  display item with all data on single page and in list as  one of items of list with only few values17:39
VenemoGeneralAntilles, you were saying, case sensitivity issues with channel names?17:39
VenemoGeneralAntilles, and disconnecting, yeah, that's an annoying topic.17:39
VenemoI implemented a way of detecting disconnections and automatically reconnecting17:39
Venemowhich always worked when I tested it, but never worked when I actually were using the app17:40
GeneralAntillesConnection migrations usually require restarting the application17:40
VenemoI know17:41
GeneralAntillesI can /msg nickserv info and it'll respond in a second NickServ tab.17:41
Venemothe annoying thing is that it detects disconnections (displays a dialog saying that it's disconnected) but then fails to reconnect...17:41
GeneralAntillesThere's a channel on another network where half the room is in #foo and the other half is in #FOO17:41
Venemothat's very annoying too17:42
GeneralAntillesStripping HTML from highlights so I don't get <span... etc on my MetaWatch17:44
GeneralAntillesand private message notifications should include the sender nick17:44
GeneralAntillesblah blah blah17:44
GeneralAntillesI keep gearing myself to dive in and look at the source but run out of energy.17:45
Venemono problem17:45
Venemonah, let me look at this17:45
GeneralAntillesOnly actual feature request would be tab changing with volume buttons.17:45
GeneralAntillesOtherwise I really like it.17:45
javispedrooh, HTML in notifications?17:45
javispedrodoes it work?17:45
Venemono, it does not.17:45
Venemothat's exactly the issue: the HTML annoyingly appears in the notification texts17:46
javispedroI remember I tried to figure the logic behind the "2 new emailsGARBAGE_UNICODE2 new emails" notifications that I get sometimes17:46
GeneralAntillesThe case sensitivity issue is really the only major irritant17:46
GeneralAntillesThe connectivity issues are easily worked around with ZNC17:46
ZogG_laptopi think it's like irssi proxy17:48
ZogG_laptopas i started to use irssi for a while now i call irc as irssi some times lately :P17:48
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Venemolol at me17:51
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VenemoI don't even remember when I made the last release ans what I did since then17:51
ZogG_laptopand probably u was drunk :)17:52
Venemosometimes I feel like I was lol17:53
Venemoand I just reproduced the most annoying bug ever17:53
VenemoI think arie reported it on Twitter17:53
Venemoapp fails to connect17:54
ZogG_laptopi hate when to work with api you need key and there is no response samples or demo key17:54
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ZogG_laptopVenemo: release it liek that and giv a come name "airplane mode:17:54
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infobotZogG_laptop meant: Venemo" release it liek that and giv a come name "airplane mode:17:55
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GeneralAntillesClearly this calls for a Kickstarter campaign.17:55
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Venemook GeneralAntilles, connection bug now reproduced too17:57
Venemowhat a lucky day this i17:57
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Venemodafuq, the error lies in the underlying library and appears to be a regression18:03
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Venemonah, I need to get away for a little bit, but I'm on the right track. will do some debugging and get back to you18:03
VenemoGeneralAntilles, I'll ping you on twitter once the issue has been solved18:04
ketasi need to reflash my n9 to get sms out of it?18:18
ZogG_laptopwtf is slug?18:22
virtualdslug is akin to snail but has no house18:26
ketasor maybe it's type of lug18:27
ketaslike, location of lug18:28
GeneralAntillesvirtuald, well put.18:28
ZogG_laptopi checked what is slug18:33
ZogG_laptopi mean the slug in web technology or languages18:33
ZogG_laptopBy now, many of you have seen where a URL contains text similar to the the page's title. For example, the URL may look like instead of Text converted from a regular string, that can appear within a URL this way is called a "slug."18:37
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