IRC log of #meego for Sunday, 2010-06-13

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tremnite all, sweet dreams01:42
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CosmoHillcyas02:16
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Tina-hello02:41
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Tina-i curently run a custom kernel 2.6.35-git(my gentoo build kernel) :) so i have ext4 support and run things i miss in meego in a chroot , so i have java in firefox and have some more codecs , but it would be nice if i knew how mee-go is packaged , like just build a repo with bin's09:16
Tina-is that possible userend repo?09:16
Tina-(guess ppl sleep ^.^)09:18
* Tina- ssshsh :x09:18
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Stskeepsyou're early up :P09:19
Tina-aw did i wake you ?09:19
Tina-aint nokia pushing for qt , so why all the gtk+ stuff ??09:20
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Stskeepswell. even in maemo, qt apps existed as a toolkit alongside..09:21
Stskeepsbecause it'd be a shame to let go of all the good stuff made for netbook ux, really09:21
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Tina-the mutter thingie used is it the one that works with metacity or the one that replaces metacity?09:22
Tina-can i generate a list installed packages with yum ? (never used it b4)09:23
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Stskeepsyou'd usually use rpm for that09:24
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Stskeepsrpm -q -a09:24
* Tina- memorizes09:24
Tina-i only know emerge ^.^09:25
Stskeepstook me a while to understand the various commands too, but once i mastered them, i actually liked them better than for example debian counterparts :P09:25
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Tina->> Emerging (27 of 89) gnome-extra/at-spi-1.30.1 from gnome  atm09:25
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Tina-i build everything from source on my desktop and use a bin server to install them on the netbook09:26
Tina-i'm trying to rebuild some  meego my self via this git http://github.com/ramereth/moblin-overlay09:29
Tina-why is the arch i586 , a atom n270 is i686 ^.^09:30
Stskeepsgood question :P09:31
Tina-you know what the login manager is called? or is it a gdm mod?09:32
Tina-seems to load faster then mine gentoo :o09:32
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Tina-see i moved away from rpm , dep, yum, .. long b4 they 'worked' , emerge always worked and it is amazing to see it calculating depandencies :p09:35
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Tina-but when i switched days where differnet lol building gentoo +X on a p3 takes like 1.5 day ^.^09:36
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Tina-feel free to call me insane09:37
Stskeepsnah, each to his/her own09:37
Stskeepsmeego fullfills one purpose, gentoo another09:37
Tina-true09:38
Tina-doesd it run on a android?09:38
Tina-does it ..09:38
Stskeepshard to say, depends on if the android device allows you to boot your own kernel and rootfs as well as having access to 3d accelerator drivers and an up-to-date kernel09:38
Tina-i needs a new phone09:38
Stskeeps:P09:38
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Tina-banshee not works on my install btw :/09:39
Tina-and rhytembox errors on missing some gst-plugin to play mp309:40
Tina-rhythmbox*09:41
Stskeepsopen source sucks that way :P09:41
Tina-^.^09:42
Tina-i likes flac09:42
Tina-too big nah just buy more disks :p09:43
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tmztTina-: un on an android?09:49
Tina-i dont have a fancy phone :o09:49
Tina-i have a eeepc :D09:49
tmztwhat phone do you have?09:49
tmztoh09:49
tmztwhat does that have to do with android?09:49
Tina-that was just a Q09:50
Tina-am i so confizzeling?? O.o09:51
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Tina-how i kill the lowest pannel?09:55
Tina-i no wants it09:55
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anttucould you please help me with getting telnet client to meego (laptop)09:59
anttuthere is no telnet command, and yum install does not find telnet or putty10:00
brokendatapointhi all, is there any chance that the Meego SDK or at least the Meego Simulator will end up as a WIN32 app/exe?10:05
* brokendatapoint notes his long nick...10:05
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anttu?10:06
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anttuis there some repository to add to meego to get putty or telnet installed?10:08
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brokendatapointanttu: just realised that my nick is tooooo long for small screens10:08
brokendatapointanttu: why do you want telnet? why not use openssh?10:09
Stskeepsbrokendatapoint: i think there'll come a proper qt sdk out that will run on windows too10:09
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anttui just have a router to connect with telnet, there is no ssh started on that10:09
brokendatapointStskeeps: thanks, hate to dev on WIN but is convenient, also my Debian sys runs an Nvidia card on an ATI mobo10:10
Stskeepsbrokendatapoint: did you try to drop in the nvidia libGL* into the chroot?10:10
brokendatapointanttu: then install it... far more secure10:10
anttuthis is just a test router on my desk10:10
brokendatapointStskeeps: no, the docs just said was for Intel- onboard only so did not but...10:10
Stskeepsbrokendatapoint: just because docs say one thing it doesn't mean it isn't possible to hack ;)10:11
brokendatapointanttu: if you have access to it, openssh it, can connect using Putty10:11
brokendatapointStskeeps: fair point!10:11
Stskeepsbrokendatapoint: you do need an atom processor / ssse3 support hough10:12
brokendatapointStskeeps: is there any docs for that? or are you just going off experience10:12
anttubrokendatapoint: there is no putty!10:12
brokendatapointah well, there you go10:12
anttuhow can i get it to meego?10:12
brokendatapointanttu: no, you would use Putty from a windows machine to connect to your server ... so long as it is *nix-based10:13
anttui would like to use my meego laptop10:13
anttudo not want to touch windows machine10:13
brokendatapointanttu: so you have a laptop running Meego? which is a Linux distro...10:13
anttuyes, i have a laptop running MeeGo10:14
anttuand i would like to install putty to it10:14
anttuwhere can i get it?10:14
brokendatapointwhy?10:14
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anttuoh my, brokendatapoint: to get a connection to a server10:15
brokendatapointanttu: what O/S is your server running?10:15
anttuopenwrt, but that does not matter here10:16
anttui know how to start ssh on the server, but i just need fast terminal access for a moment10:16
thiago_homeanttu: you can't get putty for Linux10:17
thiago_homejust open a terminal and use telnet10:17
brokendatapointanttu: just my 2 cents worth ... by the time you find a solution for Putty on Meego, it would have been quicker to install OPENSSH-SERVER and set it to run on boot, then SSH in10:18
thiago_homebrokendatapoint: he can't install OpenSSH on the router10:18
anttuthiago_home: i have putty on my ubuntu laptop10:18
thiago_homeuseless10:19
thiago_homejust use telnet and a terminal10:19
tmztthiago_home: you can get putty for X1110:19
anttuthiago_home: there is no telnet on meego, that is my original problem/question here!10:19
brokendatapointanttu: what he said10:19
tmztnc -t?10:19
thiago_homethere should be a telnet for meego10:19
thiago_homesomeone should package it10:19
anttui agree10:19
anttuin the mean time is there e.g. some fedora repository to add to meego10:20
thiago_homeno10:20
thiago_homethere are no fedora repositories to add10:20
anttuextras/devel/testing etc repos?10:21
tmztif you really need telnet just pull the binary from debian10:23
anttutmzt: how is that done?10:24
thiago_homethe debian one is less likely to work than the fedora one10:24
thiago_homeif you need it, get the sources and build it10:24
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tmztanttu: ftp.us.debian.org/debian/pool find telnet under there10:25
tmztget the package and ar x it, then extract data.tar.gz to a directory10:25
tmztyou'll find your telnet under there10:26
tmztif it works with the meego libs, can't guarantee that10:26
thiago_homewhich is why I said a fedora rpm is more likely to work10:26
thiago_homeboth actions aren't recommended10:26
brokendatapointthe Meego chroot archive, if i drop that ontop of a vanilla Debian Lenny server with full dev libs, should that work?10:27
thiago_homeit's likely to break left and right10:28
thiago_homeyou really want to keep it chroot'ed10:28
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brokendatapointthiago_home: k, thinking, might give that nvidia GL thing a go10:30
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brokendatapointas a complete newb to development, will there be a steep learning curve using QT Creator?10:31
thiago_homeare you familiar with C++?10:32
brokendatapointno10:33
thiago_homeno programming experience at all?10:33
brokendatapointonly web development... sigh10:34
thiago_homewell, functional and object-oriented programming will be something you have to learn10:34
thiago_homeQt Creator is a tool only -- Qt is the library, and C++ is the language10:34
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gouri'm thinking about meego development, but not by using C++10:35
brokendatapointhmm, gathered that10:35
thiago_homeso there will be a learning curve. The question is only if it's steeper than other alternatives.10:35
thiago_homeOTOH, we're also readying a declarative programming alternative, which should be more familiar to you10:35
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gourwhat are alternatives?10:35
brokendatapointi want to be ale to make some applications, integrate xml feeds into mapping apps etc10:35
brokendatapointable*10:35
thiago_homeQt is the only option in MeeGo API.10:35
thiago_homethat said, MeeGo is X11, so if you find something else that pleases you, you can use it.10:36
brokendatapointk10:36
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digitalsurgeonis it a good idea to package a lib and the app in same deb pacakge ?10:43
digitalsurgeonor do linux ppl package libs and the app seperately ?10:43
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thiago_homeI don't know about deb packages10:44
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gourin general, i'd separate the two10:44
thiago_homebut I'd expect that, if the lib is useful for more than one app, it should be in a separate package of its own10:44
gourif the lib has general use10:44
thiago_homeif it's an app-specific lib, then it's packaged together with the app10:45
Tina-i  run my gentoo apps in a chroot works fine with x11 ^.^10:45
Tina-i has firefox + java that way :)10:45
gourany news about meego under VM (vbox) ?10:45
thiago_homegour: if your VM has the ability to run the binaries, it should work10:46
digitalsurgeonthe lib is qtflickr, i did a search in the n900 appmanager and couldn't find it10:46
thiago_homethat includes SSSE3 and OpenGL10:46
gourthiago_home: moblin worked, but no luck with meego10:47
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gourthiago_home: afaik, ssse3 & opengl were mobling reqs as well...10:47
thiago_homeif you've got those in your VM, it should work10:48
RST38hAnyone knows how I can use textures in GLES?10:50
gourthiago_home: heh, check http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_1.0_Netbook_VirtualBox page & discussion10:50
RST38hThe approach shown in the examples on the web does not work10:51
brokendatapointthiago_home: you are Thiago Macieira from QT?10:51
thiago_homebrokendatapoint: Qt, yes10:51
brokendatapointah cool, just reading the Meego Planet blog...10:51
brokendatapointah sorry, Qt10:51
brokendatapointgour: good link, thanks10:52
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anttubrokendatapoint, thiago_home: i installed fedora 13 repository stuff to my meego laptop10:59
anttuthen just yum installed putty and it works great!10:59
brokendatapointanttu: congrats! admire your tenacity11:00
brokendatapointanttu: what hardware are you using for your Meego?11:01
anttutelnet installed and works this way too11:01
anttuacer aspire one11:01
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anttudual boot with windows 7 and meego works ok11:02
brokendatapointcool, so what do/are you doing with Meego?11:02
anttutesting :D11:02
brokendatapointi run a triple boot WinXP/Debian/FreeBSD but with ATI/Nvidia gear ... need to sort a Virtualbox type solution or else buy an older Intel Core 2 system11:03
anttui am into mobile broadband , so just wanted to see if i can get a usb 3g dongle to work on it11:03
brokendatapointanttu: 8-)11:03
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anttuconnection manager does not quite work but i could get 3g-connected with pon11:04
brokendatapointk11:04
anttuit is described here, but unfortunately in finnish only11:04
anttuhttp://www.siptune.net/siptune.net/tiki-index.php?page=MeeGo&highlight=meego11:04
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anttuthere is also a trick for dual boot11:05
anttuit used extlinux, not grub11:06
digitalsurgeonhow can i get rid of this error: Packaging Error: Command 'dh_shlibdeps' failed. Output was: c:\nokiaqtsdk\maemo\4.6.2\madbin\dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: couldn't find library libqtflickr.so.0 needed by debian/easywallpapers/usr/local/bin/EasyWallpapers (its RPATH is 'C:/usr/lib'). Note: libraries are not searched in other binary packages that do not have any shlibs or symbols file. To help dpkg-shlibdeps find private libraries, you might need to set LD_LIB11:06
thiago_homedigitalsurgeon: you're asking the wrong channel11:06
digitalsurgeonqt ?11:06
thiago_homeno11:06
thiago_hometry #maemo11:06
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digitalsurgeonwhat about the nokia qt sdk, is #maemo also the correct place to ask those q's ?11:08
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thiago_homemaybe, otherwise try finding an SDK channel11:08
thiago_homethis here is not it and neither is #qt11:08
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fqhHas anyone ever installed meego in vmware? It's dead when I set the user and password for it, and can't boot it.11:10
brokendatapointis there any chance that Meego wil support Nvidia GPUs?11:12
thiago_homebrokendatapoint: yes11:14
thiago_homefind someone to make that work11:14
thiago_homefor example, I know of one company that is very interested in NVidia GPUs working11:14
thiago_homethey're called NVidia :-)11:14
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brokendatapointthiago_home: hahahaha11:15
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thiago_homeyou just need to convince them to do some work11:16
thiago_homeor anyone who is going to ship a device with an NVidia GPU11:16
brokendatapointthiago_home: i'll have a crack then...11:16
gouri'd only want to have meego running under VM - it would provide nice dev environment11:23
* thiago_home wants a non-VM dev environment11:24
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thiago_homedeveloping inside a VM is slow11:24
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gournot if you have quick machine...and definetely quickwer than under average netbook machine11:26
thiago_homea VM is slower than outsid eit11:27
thiago_hometherefore, I want to develop outside it11:27
gourdoes emulator provide the same experience as when runninng an app natively?11:28
gouri got a feeling that running sdk & emnulator is much slower than it was my experience running moblin under vbox11:29
thiago_homeemulator vs device?11:30
thiago_homeI don't know, I'd expect mostly the same experience11:30
thiago_homebut personally I'd never settle for emulator only -- I'd need to test on device.11:31
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gourthat's why i think that running under VM provided quite good experience when lacking real device...much better than sdk's emulator11:32
thiago_homeemulator != simulator11:34
thiago_homesimulator is for very quick code-and-test cycles11:34
thiago_homebut given the option, I'd skip the emulator and go from simulator to device11:34
thiago_homein the absence of a device, emulators will have to do11:35
gouri'm not sure how do you call sdk's startmeego, but it's slow...and i'm sure that running meego under VM would be way quicker11:35
gourotherwise, i'm not sure how is one supposed to develop? on native device only?11:35
thiago_homedevelop on your workstation/laptop, build native code and run on the simulator11:36
thiago_homethen when you're satisfied, cross-compile for the device and deploy there11:36
thiago_homeif the build+deploy cycle is close to local builds and as easy to use, then go for device straight on11:37
gourhaving meego under VM would enable one to merge 1st two steps into one11:38
thiago_homewith Qt Creator and in the absence of a compile farm, it should be11:38
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thiago_homeI do have a compile farm11:38
thiago_homeI don't want to build in a VM because it's slow11:38
brokendatapointthiago_home: so it would be possible to develop using Qt Creator on a full specced Linux then port an app to the Meego simluator?11:39
gourwell, i've 8G/i7, and can dedicate enough resources to VM not to be slow...much quicker than testing with simulator11:39
thiago_homeyou shouldn't need to port11:39
thiago_homeit should just run on the simulator11:39
thiago_homesimulator = native code, pretending to be the device11:39
brokendatapointsorry, wrong word ... transfer11:40
thiago_homeemulator = running cross-compiled code, on a device sysroot11:40
thiago_homeso, of course that the simulator will give you worse experience in terms of edge cases11:40
RST38hAh, the ages old argument...11:40
gourotoh, not forget i'm not speaking about writing C++...for haskell, i only need ghc & qthaskell which was running nicely under moblin11:40
lbtanyone meeting up in Helsinki tonight? http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Eerikinkatu+24,%20Helsinki  at about 6pm local time11:40
thiago_homethe idea is just to be for quick development11:41
RST38hNeither emulator nor simulator is very helpful for development though11:41
thiago_homelbt: I'll look you up when I'm next in Helsinki :-)11:41
gourin any case, not being able to run meego under VM is step backwards from moblin11:41
thiago_homeRST38h: they are helpful. Maybe not for everyone, but they have their use-cases.11:41
lbtthiago_home: 1 night in 14 sadly :)11:41
thiago_homeRST38h: and of course they don't replace on-device testing.11:41
thiago_homelbt: where are you based mostly?11:42
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lbtReading, UK11:42
lbtnear Newbury (Vodafone HQ)11:43
* thiago_home will be in the UK in September11:43
thiago_homeNokia Developer Summit11:43
lbtcome over :)11:44
timelesshrm, will nokia pay for nokians to go?11:44
thiago_hometimeless: to NDS?11:44
timelesssure11:44
thiago_homeif you want to go somewhere, ask to go to Qt Dev Days11:44
thiago_homeit's a bigger event, with more presentations11:44
timelesspresentations aren't interesting11:45
timelesspeople are interesting11:45
thiago_homewell, you choose11:45
timelessi'll be on the 'isles for about a month sometime around late september, i believe11:45
thiago_homeI'm probably going to be in all 4 events11:45
thiago_homethe only one I'm skipping is Symbian Expo & Exchange11:46
timelesswho's covering you?11:46
thiago_homeQt11:46
thiago_homebut that's because I'm going to be presenting in all 4 events11:46
thiago_homeor, rather, I know I will be presenting in 311:47
gourtopics?11:47
thiago_homebut I am part of the organisation in MeeGo conf.11:47
timelesslinks?11:47
thiago_homethe agenda isn't published yet11:48
thiago_homewe're going to do it this week hopefully11:49
thiago_homefor Dev Days. For NDS they are preparing separate native (Qt), web and design tracks11:49
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thiago_homefor NDS I'll present a Qt overview (introductory level)11:51
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thiago_homefor Dev Days, I'll talk about Qt on MeeGo11:51
gourare all qt-supported languages welcome for meego development?11:52
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lbtgour: not out-of-the box11:54
lbtbut they may be via community support11:54
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gourlbt: if i want to use e.g. qthaskell, it means qt will be there, i've to provide for qthaskell bindings only, right?11:55
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lbtand haskell11:55
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lbtI don't think that's in core MeeGo :)11:56
gourof course, haskell or ghc runtime11:57
timelessis there QtLogo?11:57
RST38hWho knows, it may well happen that Nokia decides on haskell as the language for MeeGo scripting11:57
lbtwell, best to be clear11:57
* lbt is pushing erlang at the minute11:57
RST38hAnd then we will all be writing in haskell while python people bitch at tmo for being abandined11:58
gourRST38h: too good to be true...otoh, haskell is not, imho, for scripting only ;)11:58
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gourin any case, considering we do not want to play with apple, nor like java (which rules out android), meego looks as the only mobile platform forth to develop for12:01
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amol12hi all , i have created netbook kvm image.but after running #kvm -m 512 -boot c -hda meego-1.0.80-meego-preview-netbook-core-201006081824-raw/meego-1.0.80-meego-preview-netbook-core-201006081824-sda.raw i am not getting any GUI12:05
amol12or meego OS12:06
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LinDonhello how can i add an link to thunderbird?20:24
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LinDonhow can i set thunderbird to open when i click on mail?20:26
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