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| Sc0rpius | have you seen that video of running Android applications in Maemo? | 02:02 |
|---|---|---|
| BCMM | Sc0rpius: no, how does it work? | 02:03 |
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| Sc0rpius | http://www.meegoexperts.com/2011/02/myriad-announce-alien-dalvik-enabling-android-apps-run-meego-maemo/ | 02:03 |
| BCMM | VM/user-mode "kernel", or something nice? | 02:03 |
| Sc0rpius | charging you for it, that's how it works | 02:03 |
| BCMM | oh, an actual port of dalvik? | 02:03 |
| Sc0rpius | yes | 02:03 |
| Sc0rpius | I think it's for Meego, not Maemo, but it was demonstrated on a N90 | 02:04 |
| Sc0rpius | N900 | 02:04 |
| Sc0rpius | but that would be definitely a nice addition to MeeGo | 02:05 |
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| BCMM | so is Dalvik open? | 02:07 |
| Sc0rpius | yeah all Android is open, including Dalvik | 02:08 |
| Sc0rpius | I mean the "vanilla Android" of course | 02:08 |
| Sc0rpius | (the one that runs in a Nexus One) | 02:08 |
| BCMM | so is myriad sticking to the license, or what? | 02:09 |
| BCMM | i mean, for how long is it going to be payware-only? | 02:09 |
| Sc0rpius | Myriad is sticking to the license, but the port is not open | 02:11 |
| BCMM | uh, how does that work? | 02:11 |
| BCMM | oh, they haven't released it yet | 02:11 |
| BCMM | when the release it, they'll have to release source, right? | 02:11 |
| Sc0rpius | no they haven't, but it'll be closed and will be commercially avaand that's ok | 02:11 |
| Sc0rpius | commercially available | 02:11 |
| Sc0rpius | not really | 02:11 |
| Sc0rpius | they just have to release the source code of dalvik | 02:12 |
| Sc0rpius | not the port in the layer above it | 02:12 |
| BCMM | i'm not sure i understand about the "layer above it" | 02:13 |
| Sc0rpius | well we would have to be how they implemented it | 02:17 |
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| Jaffa | Morning, all | 09:58 |
| * Jaffa has gone on a triaging spree. Too many bugs listed as "enhancements" under http://j.mp/communityssu-bugs | 10:02 | |
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| Jaffa | Or "do something whizzy which it never did before and no code exists to merge" | 10:04 |
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| _nicolai_ | how to contribute a package for the community ssu? | 11:27 |
| _nicolai_ | I cloned the notification light control panel plugin | 11:27 |
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| Jaffa | _nicolai_: Raise a bug pointing to a gitorious repo, or tarball explaining why your version is better what problems it fixes and whether its functionality is a complete superset of the core one. | 12:43 |
| _nicolai_ | there are some open questions I would like to discuss | 12:46 |
| _nicolai_ | for example, if you clone components from nokia | 12:46 |
| _nicolai_ | should we use the same package name? | 12:47 |
| _nicolai_ | and can we distribute nokias "artwork", icons for example? | 12:47 |
| Jaffa | _nicolai_: Can't distribute, but can depend on the original package and then reuse at runtime | 12:56 |
| Jaffa | _nicolai_: So, no, shouldn't use original package name | 12:56 |
| Jaffa | s/depend on the original package/depend on the package containing the artwork/ (probably part of the theme) | 12:57 |
| _nicolai_ | ty | 13:04 |
| mardy | MohammadAG: ping | 13:19 |
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| mardy | Jaffa: do you know anything about the keyboard handling code recently landed in hildon-desktop? | 13:36 |
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| Jaffa | mardy: No | 14:31 |
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| mardy | Jaffa: I have a bad feeling about it, as if no one even looked at that code | 14:37 |
| Jaffa | The shortcut stuff from Matan? | 14:38 |
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| mardy | Jaffa: yep | 15:20 |
| Jaffa | mardy: It's been in use for quite a while in a number of patched hildon-desktops | 15:21 |
| mardy | Jaffa: that doesn't mean that the code has actually been checked | 15:21 |
| mardy | Jaffa: try pressing the shift screen while in the task switcher | 15:21 |
| Jaffa | mardy: I didn't claim - nor did I on maemo-developers - that the code *had* been checked. | 15:22 |
| Jaffa | mardy: What's the "shift screen"? | 15:22 |
| mardy | Jaffa: a typo :-) | 15:23 |
| mardy | Jaffa: shift key | 15:23 |
| Jaffa | mardy: Ah | 15:23 |
| mardy | Jaffa: I would actually propose a patch to remove that code altogether | 15:25 |
| mardy | Jaffa: and then re-merge them in once it's made more understandable | 15:26 |
| * mardy can't type anymore :-) | 15:26 | |
| Jaffa | Matan won't work on it, given he's descended into trollery | 15:26 |
| mardy | Jaffa: some things of that patch are clear, at least the goals | 15:26 |
| mardy | Jaffa: so I can rewrite some parts | 15:27 |
| mardy | Jaffa: some others (like the edit button which appear if you press shift in the task switcher) are a mystery to me | 15:27 |
| mardy | Jaffa: but we could put them back too, once we know what's their goal | 15:27 |
| Jaffa | The intent is, I think, documented at http://my.svgalib.org/repo/Modified_Hildon_Desktop.html | 15:28 |
| mardy | Jaffa: even though, to be frank, I don't see the point of this keyboard navigation altogether :-) | 15:29 |
| Jaffa | Well, me neither. | 15:29 |
| mardy | Jaffa: then hildon-desktop is sending dbus signals whenever a key is pressed | 15:29 |
| mardy | Jaffa: what if more than one application is listening for the signals? The thing doesn't seem to be well designed | 15:30 |
| Jaffa | I think MohammadAG understands the use cases | 15:32 |
| mardy | MohammadAG: did you follow the conversation? | 15:33 |
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| Sc0rpius | hey there | 18:18 |
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| Sc0rpius | I thought the scrollable buffer in Modest was already fixed by MohammadAG | 18:39 |
| DocScrutinizer | mardy: WUT? edit button? never seen | 18:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | pressing shift alone does nothing here, pressing shift-QWEASD kills the corresponding app | 18:47 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, press shift in the task launcher | 18:48 |
| MohammadAG | Sc0rpius, can't recall that | 18:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | aaah task launcher | 18:48 |
| MohammadAG | actually, task manaer | 18:48 |
| MohammadAG | manager* | 18:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, nuttin | 18:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | what now??? | 18:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | app manager, or task switcher? or app launcher?? | 18:50 |
| MohammadAG | the hildon-home edit button shows in the top area | 18:50 |
| MohammadAG | task switcher | 18:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | NOPE | 18:50 |
| MohammadAG | the "gear" button for widgets | 18:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | not here | 18:50 |
| MohammadAG | custom hildon-home | 18:51 |
| MohammadAG | ? | 18:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | as mentioned before shift alone does nothing, shift-Q kills upper leftmost process | 18:51 |
| DocScrutinizer | MHD | 18:51 |
| MohammadAG | yes, I realize that | 18:51 |
| MohammadAG | but I've seen the bug on at least 5 devices | 18:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | and in app launcher the QWERT/ASDFG shortcuts work fine to start apps or eneter submenues of ApMeFo | 18:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | so any FUD about a shift key I'd like to see pointers to any fishy sourcecode related to that | 18:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | and for the usecases - it's not my fault if you don't like hw kbd. I dare to say it's not only a nice to have but a major design bug when you can't operate the device without touching the screen | 18:56 |
| DocScrutinizer | even a major fail of UI specs as done by Nokia, plus a massive regression from maemo4 to maemo5 | 18:57 |
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| DocScrutinizer | even WinMo as on Samsung OMNIA allows using the device without touching the screen - though they don't even have hw kbd | 19:03 |
| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, it's not FUD, it's on my device | 19:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | so you introduced sth that isn't present on mine | 19:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | and as on mine there's original MHD afair, I'd suggest checking maemo-ssu rather than mathan's code | 19:04 |
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| DocScrutinizer | don't get me wrong, I won't defend matan or his coding style, but I really get upset when it's suggested he published malware, based on an effect that only appears on mhd as of CSSU, and not when using original matan MHD | 19:06 |
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| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, malware? it's just a bug | 19:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | [2011-02-09 14:25:39] <mardy> Jaffa: I would actually propose a patch to remove that code altogether | 19:07 |
| DocScrutinizer | [2011-02-09 13:37:00] <mardy> Jaffa: I have a bad feeling about it, as if no one even looked at that code | 19:08 |
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| DocScrutinizer | that's not correct behaviour | 19:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | if anybody is feeling bad about code having seen too little review, DARN there's a way to solve that, that does NOT include removing the complete code | 19:10 |
| DocScrutinizer | and spreading FUD for sure won't help. As well as questioning the usecase will | 19:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | not | 19:11 |
| DocScrutinizer | I'm much more concerned about the closed source code in maemo having undergone way too little QA and review | 19:14 |
| DocScrutinizer | and I can list some dozen "bugs" of that severity in apps like mediaplayer and whatnot, but I'm not suggesting to remove those apps from repository, just because | 19:15 |
| * w00t_ doesn't really see how how past possible incompetence excuses continuing said incompetence when it can be avoided | 19:16 | |
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| Jaffa | DocScrutinizer: FWIW, pressing "shift" in the task manager on my N900, running just CSSU, with a couple of apps open showed the "cog" for configuring the home screens | 19:43 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, not here, neither in taskswitcher nor in appstarter | 19:44 |
| merlin1991 | Jaffa, just tested, same result here | 19:44 |
| DocScrutinizer | 1.2 + quite some new stuff on top, original MHD | 19:44 |
| merlin1991 | 1.3 + cssu in my case | 19:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | no CSSU | 19:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | so evidently this crept in lately, maybe even unrelated to MHD | 19:45 |
| merlin1991 | opened phone and sms app taskswitcher and shift brought the cog up | 19:45 |
| merlin1991 | someone with clean 1.3 to narrow down the version? | 19:46 |
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| Milhouse | Shift in task list gives Cog also confirmed here | 19:51 |
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| Milhouse | 1.3+CSSU in my case | 19:52 |
| Milhouse | Was also getting two Modest windows until I rebooted | 19:52 |
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| MohammadAG | DocScrutinizer, which mhd are you using? | 20:45 |
| MohammadAG | Matan has 2 | 20:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | umm, the newer one? | 20:45 |
| MohammadAG | sure about that? | 20:45 |
| DocScrutinizer | what could I do to make sure what I have? | 20:46 |
| MohammadAG | does it have tune-able scrolling in /usr/share/hildon-desktop/transitions.ini | 20:46 |
| MohammadAG | grep for deceleration | 20:46 |
| DocScrutinizer | Ithought more like ls -l foobar and telling you the size, or sth. dpkg --info maybe | 20:46 |
| MohammadAG | well, he changes the hildon-desktop binary in postinst so... | 20:47 |
| DocScrutinizer | IroN900:~# apt-cache policy modified-hildon-desktop | 20:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | modified-hildon-desktop: | 20:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | Installed: 3.1 | 20:48 |
| DocScrutinizer | so, any *.so to ls -l | 20:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | or sth? | 20:49 |
| MohammadAG | nope | 20:49 |
| MohammadAG | check the transitions.ini file | 20:49 |
| DocScrutinizer | or... http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Joerg_rw/tools guess that's what I did | 20:50 |
| DocScrutinizer | no decel in that file | 20:51 |
| MohammadAG | old mhd | 20:52 |
| DocScrutinizer | hmm, are you sure? I don't think installing mhd automatically replaced that file | 20:53 |
| DocScrutinizer | NB I'm on 1.2 | 20:54 |
| MohammadAG | it should | 20:55 |
| MohammadAG | idk | 20:55 |
| MohammadAG | could be triggered by 1.3's hildon-home | 20:55 |
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| DocScrutinizer | -rw-r--r-- 1 user root 221010 2010-10-03 21:44 modified-hildon-desktop_3.1_armel.deb | 20:57 |
| DocScrutinizer | ^^^that's what I installed | 20:58 |
| DocScrutinizer | ans what I got by wget http://my.svgalib.org/770/n900/hd-2.2.141/modified-hildon-desktop_3.1_armel.deb | 20:59 |
| Gadgetoid | DocScrutinizer: where do I read about USB host on SSU? | 21:03 |
| DocScrutinizer | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=921203#post921203 | 21:04 |
| Gadgetoid | DocScrutinizer: ++ Thanks! | 21:04 |
| DocScrutinizer | yw | 21:04 |
| Gadgetoid | Haha, hostmode-easy-now ;D | 21:07 |
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| Gadgetoid | Right, in way over my head for the current burned out state of my brain. I shall have to try this latr! | 21:09 |
| DocScrutinizer | Gadgetoid: install Hostmode Gui h-e-n in AppManager, from -devel repo | 21:11 |
| Gadgetoid | DocScrutinizer: you underestimate just how burned out I am ;) But, yeah, I'll get there eventually! Thanks | 21:12 |
| Gadgetoid | Haha, I love how my wife finds the most mundane of chilli hot, whilst I proceed to add extra bhut jolokia sauce on top | 21:18 |
| BCMM | Gadgetoid: one builds a tolerance to chilli, or so I find | 21:25 |
| BCMM | sometimes quite quickly | 21:25 |
| Gadgetoid | She's "indian" for crying out loud! | 21:28 |
| Gadgetoid | But, yes, you're right... chilli is extremely problematic in that respect, as is salt | 21:28 |
| Gadgetoid | You build a tolerance, or taste tolerance to it, and thus have to bias your food to such extremes that no other human being can eat it | 21:29 |
| BCMM | Gadgetoid: heh, point proved... contrary to appearances, indians aren't actually genetically immune to the stuff | 21:32 |
| BCMM | it's just that some of them eat insanely hot things from early childhood | 21:33 |
| Gadgetoid | I think insanely hot stuff is much more a western pursuit | 21:33 |
| BCMM | eating things that are insanely, painfully hot *to you* is a western thing | 21:34 |
| BCMM | indians just eat stuff that would be insanely, painfully hot to most other people | 21:34 |
| Gadgetoid | Or rub them in their eyes to set world records... ouch! | 21:34 |
| Gadgetoid | Is the ability to make one batch of insanely, criminally hot curry that everyone can eat too much to ask for... *cries* | 21:35 |
| BCMM | gotta wonder if that record-breaking woman was actually congenitally insensitive in some way | 21:35 |
| Gadgetoid | I hope so... otherwise that's going to hurt for the next decade! | 21:36 |
| Gadgetoid | You'd have to train with pepper spray on a daily basis... or just some sort of liquid based pure capsaisin extract | 21:36 |
| BCMM | but yeah, eating stuff that's too hot for you, either to demonstrate football-yob toughness or some sort of sophisticated appreciation of foreign food is stupid; means you can't taste anything else | 21:37 |
| Gadgetoid | BCMM: I do it because it makes me high | 21:37 |
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| Gadgetoid | I wonder if I can compile sixpair on the n900 | 21:59 |
| Gadgetoid | And pair a PS3 controller using hostmode | 21:59 |
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