IRC log of #maemo-meeting for Wednesday, 2015-02-04

peterleinchennevertheless, no time for referendum or such00:00
pichloYes, this calls for an immediate discussion!00:00
juicemeyes, that will take a bit of time to set up00:01
OksanaOk. Referendum can be held about American and Asian trademarks. European trademarks just need to be renewed-transferred.00:01
Win7Macno need for referendum about TMs00:01
* Oksana doesn't know how Oceania fits into trademarks. And Antarctic...00:02
OksanaWin7Mac?00:02
Win7MacHiFo has about 3000 Euro00:02
Win7MacWe can't cover worldwide00:02
juicemeokay, that's good, it will cover the quick ones00:02
pichloSounds like enough for EU + US00:03
peterleinchenbut what IS the benefit for US?00:03
gerbickIs US even necessary?00:03
pichloLast time I heard - and that was ages ago, possibly 2 years? - HiFo had about 400000:03
pichloSo we do not spend so much00:03
juicemewho's got the right-to-sign-nameof HiFo in bank transfers?00:03
OksanaAre Eu and De same or different? Like, one fee for Eu, one fee for De, or one fee for both of them?00:04
juicemeDE is part of EU, or was at least last time I looked :)00:05
Win7MacDE is 300, EU is another 1.000 Euro iirc00:05
OksanaLet's just renew them both?00:05
pichloAnother? That doesn't sound right.00:06
juicemeI'd say the europe is priority, then comes US and lastly, if at all Asia00:06
pichlo+100:06
gerbickAgree00:06
OksanaAsk Roschier Brands Attorney about cost and such? And yes, Europe is urgent.00:06
Win7Macimho we should keep costs for such stuff minimal and spend it for infra + development00:07
peterleinchenno. DE essential, Then possibly EU,US,Asia00:07
juicemeOksana, good idea. I hope they don't charge for just asking them, huh?00:07
peterleinchenWin7Mac, yes00:07
gerbickAre we 100% sure that DE is not part of the EU in regards to how that paperwork should be done?00:07
Win7Macservers are in DE/Eu so that is mandatorty only imho00:07
juicemepeterleinchen, I am treating DE and EU as one when I talk about EU00:07
pichlogerbick, +100:08
Win7Macgerbick, DE is part of the EU ;)00:08
chem|stWin7Mac: there are only 4 regions up for renewal, and I would keep those. Your note on "having Germany is enough" is doubtfully right as why would Nokia register a special EU TM if an EU country is sufficient?00:08
pichloCan we have that verified?00:08
chem|stand it is not about servers00:08
gerbickIch weiss! But it's strange to hear that DE and EU have separate prices whereas if you do EU, DE should be covered too.00:08
Win7MacHi chem|st ;)00:08
OksanaWin7Mac: I would happily donate to cover cost of EU trademark registration. Since Eu does seem to be expiring soon, too, just like De.00:09
chem|stit is a TM not a note "I am here"00:09
Oksanachem|st: Welcome! 4 regions up for renewal? Eu, De, what else?00:09
juicemechem|st, hi!00:10
chem|stOksana: please read upon where it is registered... it is FI EU US and WO or WL or something00:10
* chem|st waves his hat "Hello!"00:10
chem|stwe could skip FI but that is the origin and I would keep it that way00:11
Oksana:-) Not going to skip anything where it is already registered.00:11
Oksana((FI EU US and WO or WL or something)) Link?00:12
chem|stWO or WL or whatever it is called is a global registry so you only need those countries extra that do not accept that registration00:12
chem|stOksana: google?00:12
chem|stEM FI US WO00:13
peterleinchenchem|st, but re-registering all would exceed available money00:14
chem|stEM is europe WO is some global thing00:14
chem|stpeterleinchen: does it?00:14
chem|stpeterleinchen: how do you know?00:14
MentalistTraceurPersonally, I actually suggest we consider doing EU TM renewal, and not the DE. While it may be cheaper, at least from a general principles standpoint, it seems to me like having the EU one will be legally 'cleaner' than having the DE one. While I have no legal experience on this, I'd imagine there's a fairly united set of treaties and convensions requiring EU countries to respect EU ...00:14
MentalistTraceur... TMs roughly the same across the board. However, there might be some quirk in German law that leads to DE TMs not working the same in Germany as they do in the rest of Europe. On the other hand, I recognize there may be some details I don't know about w.r.t. the same kinds of quirks applying to different European countries' treatment of EU trademarks...00:15
chem|stwe have some $3.5k that could cover at least EM US WO as they are all about 800eur00:15
chem|stMentalistTraceur: EU is not EG is not EEG is not (forgott the fourth abbrev.)00:16
juicemebeautiful, then the situation is not so bad as I feared00:16
chem|stso now please someone send a mail to hifo and ask those folks (not me) to take care of that... roschier is the brands attorney...00:16
chem|stwe have till EOM to claim and renew for the normal price, after that we have 6 months to renew at an exceeded fee, after that we need to register from scratch00:17
chem|stat least that is for europe00:18
chem|stwhat I read00:18
juicemegood00:18
peterleinchensounds good00:19
juicemelet's do that then, who'd like to write da mail?00:19
juicemeit's the board mail address00:19
chem|stin July we loose HK in August we BR CA IN MY TH TW (basically asia)00:19
gerbickStupid question - how do we raise money to avoid losing this in any area?00:20
juicemeI suppose there was probabl no special strategy with Nokia when it registered TM's in those areas?00:21
chem|stgerbick: as soon as we (MCeV) have a bank account we can accept donations, papers are with juice atm00:21
juicemegerbick, ask for donations I'd say, same as before. The current cash is all donations00:21
OksanaOk, so we send letter to Hildon Foundation asking them to renew all trademarks expiring in February.00:21
chem|stI hope this bankaccount thing is over this month once and for all (found a global player)00:21
chem|stOksana: those words are too kind I believe00:22
OksanaOk. But it will be a special paper insanity to transfer trademarks and domain registration from Hildon Foundation to MCeV.00:22
juiceme"send letter to Hildon Foundation demanding them to renew all trademarks" ?00:22
OksanaNot all, just those expiring in February.00:23
chem|stRyan needs to call roschier and ask them what is possible and negotiate, I asked that 3 times now in different ways00:23
juicemeOksana you are right there, and it will probably cost too :(00:23
gerbickWhat would be the impact - beyond extended fees if we go into the secondary renewal (see Chemist notes earlier) in the 6 month phase? Do we risk losing, being challenged by another company or anything else?00:23
Oksanajuiceme: I dearly hope that the bank account will be available for donations soon.00:24
Win7Macchem|st, three times? without CC'ing me or board@ ?00:24
chem|stthis 6 month thing is what "I" read about for EM no idea about the others00:24
juicemeOksana me too, let's see how it goes. I've got a stack of papers I need to go to a bank here with and get them signed to transfer to germany00:25
chem|stWin7Mac: not lately... ever sicne! and you asked about the same didn't you?00:25
chem|stI wrote to board and not to single persons00:25
juicemechem|st so is it tha roschier is unco-operative?00:26
chem|stthe us-hifo is - they sleep00:26
juicemeah00:26
chem|stI know I am not all that responsive myself but when there is a deadline closing up on me I get things done no matter what...00:26
* juiceme yawns... past of my bedtime00:27
OksanaMaybe, somebody from US ( gerbick ? MentalistTraceur ? ) can attempt to contact us-hifo?00:27
juicemeI'll drop off now, so gnite all!00:27
* Oksana if it would make any difference...00:27
chem|stjuiceme: go to be.... I will have a look for the meeting minutes and what is needed for court the next days... as that what you send me won't get accepted (I learned)00:27
OksanaGood night, juiceme !00:28
chem|stbed00:28
peterleinchenjuiceme, gnite00:28
juicemechem|st, okay, I'll wait what you can send00:28
juicemenite!00:28
gerbickIt's 17:28 in the US, so not sure why they'd be "asleep"00:28
chem|stlol00:28
peterleinchengerbick, another rofl00:29
chem|stgerbick: sleeping for months...00:29
gerbickthat's GMT -5 easter standard time, earlier on the West Coast (GMT -2 there)00:29
gerbick...00:29
OksanaDepends on spam filters, transport and other real life...00:29
gerbickwell dang00:29
gerbickThat went over my head00:29
chem|st:D00:29
chem|stryan blinked once... just once00:30
Oksanablinked?..00:30
chem|stI have to admit that it is on me that we are not just putting this through... but waiting for banksters to return calls and check what is possible takes time...00:31
chem|stOksana: I give up...00:31
OksanaDo not, please :-)00:31
gerbickIf you require US communication, I'll gladly assist where I can be of some help.00:32
OksanaI will send out letter to Hildon Foundation board (they have three different emails, right?) and tell them that all Maemo trademarks expiring in February need to be renewed. If they have any problems, they are welcome to reply to council and tell about said problems, asap.00:33
Oksanagerbick: Maybe, chem|st can give phone numbers of members of us-hifo? ;-)00:33
OksanaI do not even remember who is currently members of HiFo...00:34
peterleinchenoksana, Ryan Abel, Gido Griese, ...00:36
peterleinchenoksana, demand all TMs to be renewd, not only Feb expiring00:37
OksanaGido Griese is one of the board email addresses, I recognise it :-) Thank you, peterleinchen00:37
peterleinchenthat was what I understood00:37
OksanaAll TMs to be renewed? Ok, but Feb need to be done NOW, as in, before EOM00:38
OksanaBut yes, having HiFo to renew all TMs at once is better, because later the bank account will be transferred to MCeV, and it would be troublesome for MCeV to renew trademarks which Nokia transferred to HiFo.00:39
peterleinchenyep00:40
gerbick+100:40
peterleinchensorry, but I have to leave now, too. good night/day/evening00:40
OksanaAnd they should consult Roschier ASAP, and tell Council ASAP if there aren't enough funds or something to do it.00:40
OksanaGood night peterleinchen00:40
* pichlo happy to donate towards TM fees if needed00:45
gerbickditto00:45
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Win7MacThere's no need for a bank account anymore if we renew TM worldwide since we're broke then ;)00:45
pichloMy personal monthly allowance is 200GBP. Of those, 50 go to charity. I am happy to donate 50.00:46
Win7MacOur funds could be spent much better i believe00:46
* pichlo waves bye00:48
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Win7MacGood nite o/00:48
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OksanaGood night!00:48
gerbickhey guys, I need to run out of the office - they're shutting off the lights (that's a hint)00:48
gerbickFeel free to send who I need to contact in the US and I'll gladly do so.00:49
* Oksana thinks that bank account will be needed, either way; and if there is something else which needs funds, feel free to point it out. At this moment, we just want to keep maemo trademark protected, for the sake of domain registration, and possible new popularity of Maemo, once it gets ported to newer devices00:50
Oksanagerbick: Will look it up.00:52
gerbicktake care guys...00:53
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MentalistTraceurOksana, that said, we need to be aware that protecting Maemo requires us to not be financially broke as an organization.00:55
MentalistTraceurProtecting Maemo in general is not necessarily best achieved by spending as much of our money as possible on TM renewals.00:55
OksanaDonations.00:55
MentalistTraceurTrue, but those may be better funelled elsewhere, depending on how much of those there ends up being.00:56
OksanaYes. But if the current amount in HiFo bank account is enough for TMs renewal, it will not be difficult to re-fill it.00:57
* Oksana would consider the strain well-worth it.00:57
OksanaMaemo trademark is important not only by itself, but for freenode channels and maemo.org domain registration, too. And I still do not get why MeeGo-something edition of Windows goes unchallenged. It even has elements from Tolkien realm, if I understand the rings correctly.00:59
MentalistTraceurI suspect because those who own the mark don't care enough. Also, probably, because getting your IP rights enforced against anything made in China (which is where the thing I think you're talking about comes from) is notoriously difficult.01:01
OksanaWin7Mac's remarks are a good opportunity to figure out exactly where funds should go in the future. Better hardware for maemo.org? Or something else? Either way, it's a good way to raise awareness and start a donation drive - if he doesn't keep his words as cryptic as "could be spent much better".01:02
MentalistTraceur*Nod* Anyway, I'll be heading out now, since the meeting seems to have wrapped up.01:03
MentalistTraceurI might be back on here later tonight, but if not, g'night.01:04
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warfaremaemo.com KK went through, waiting for maemo.org10:30
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freemangordonHi guys, I am still looking for a big enough window of spare time to assess the thumb target in the autobuilder, hopefully will have such till the end of this week20:48
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OksanaThank you! :-)23:45

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