IRC log of #maemo-meeting for Tuesday, 2014-07-22

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RzR/exec date -u21:41
RzRTue Jul 22 18:41:35 UTC 201421:41
RzROk 1h to prepare your slides :)21:42
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juicemeo/23:01
RzR\o_23:02
peterleinchen_-o ?23:02
juiceme:P23:03
juicemepeterleinchen_, "wave of hands"23:03
juiceme\o/23:04
juicemeanyway, hows. things?23:04
RzRDocScrutinizer05: hi r u here ?23:04
DocScrutinizer05sorry, I'm sick23:04
RzRwish u fast recovery23:04
juicemeI am pretty wasted, do ne a lot of physical work the last few days (means, I am on my "holiday" == slave work :)23:05
juicemeDocScrutinizer05, wish you better23:05
juicemeso, unless there's a lot to discuss, I'd be off to bed...23:06
peterleinchen_good health to you doc. will you attend?23:06
RzRneildk is missing too23:06
peterleinchen_he IS on holiday23:06
juicemei think neil said he wont attend today23:06
RzRdid we grant a such thing ?23:06
juiceme:)23:06
RzR;)23:06
peterleinchen_NO!!!23:06
RzRso lets start23:07
RzRpeterleinchen_ take your best pen23:07
peterleinchen_okay what's on th elist for today23:07
peterleinchen_my pen is named "log" :)23:07
RzRor if u want i can make the report23:07
juicemehmm irc cloacks was it... does somebody need those?23:07
peterleinchen_I have one aleady, but what is the use for us?23:08
RzRmay i ask what is it ?23:09
DocScrutinizer05won't work. Niels Breet aka xfade is not responsive anymore, and my efforts to regain control over IRC #maemo been not supported by HiFo23:09
RzRbots ?23:09
juicemereally? how's that?23:09
juicemeRzR, cloack means your nick will be visible, but hostname not23:09
juicemelike, it hides the IP address you are from. (I really do not need that, but some people think it mecessary)23:10
peterleinchen_do e.g.  a /whois peterleinchen23:10
RzRyes i didnt know it called cloack23:11
juicemepeterleinchen's IRC guru23:11
DocScrutinizer05*@maemo/community/council/* is on access list of some channels23:11
RzRwell it has some privacy benefit23:11
RzRbut what are the benefits for community23:12
juicemeDocScrutinizer05, what's happened to xfade?23:12
peterleinchen_exactly, just to hide your home address ... ;)23:12
RzRhe is hardly joinable even at meego times23:13
juicemeRzR, just nice to know that council members would have council cloack, but no special benefit23:13
RzRhe is part of jolla now ?23:13
juicemeRzR, you mean xfade?23:14
juicemeif so, then he should be around as most of Jolla people are...23:14
RzRyes i tried to find him when meego c obs was out of service23:14
juicemeokay23:15
DocScrutinizer05irc is still under control of Nokia by proxy aka GC x-fade23:16
DocScrutinizer05only GC can handle cloaks23:16
DocScrutinizer05and we have not even permissions to change access lists of #maemo23:16
RzRGC stands for ?23:17
juicemeokay, then that should be transferred to Council, imho.23:17
DocScrutinizer05/msg chanserv access #maemo list23:17
RzRmay list things not under community control23:18
RzRie nokia stuff23:18
RzRwill help23:18
DocScrutinizer05I negotiated transfer of GC to council or rather techstaff with freenode staff, but HiFo gave no support23:19
juicemewhat would you need from HiFo to accomplish it?23:20
RzRso hifo relationship is something the council should investigate ?23:20
DocScrutinizer05ownership of #maemo* namespace in freenode is an asset handled by GC and owned by Nokia23:20
juicemewhat's GC?23:21
RzRso maemo council is related to nokia at least by its name23:21
juicemeheh :)23:21
DocScrutinizer05I explained to freenode that now HiFo is "owner" of maemo, and that x-fade is not doing stewardship aka GC tasks anymore for #maemo* prolly since Nokia basically orphaned maemo at large23:21
DocScrutinizer05GC == Croup Contact23:22
juicemei thought that was settled, the maemo name is given to us, not NOkia any longer23:22
DocScrutinizer05Group*23:22
juicemeDocScrutinizer05, okay.23:22
RzRis it in orphan state ?23:22
RzRi guess there is an expiracy date23:23
DocScrutinizer05for what? GC? no23:23
peterleinchen_too bad, so what does freenode expect from us / maemo /hifo23:24
juicemeprobably we'd need a written statement that Maemo Council is the new GC for maemo* IRC hierarchy.23:25
RzRmay we open a ticket to track the adoption of maemo in freenode23:26
juicemeand since HiFo has this agreement from Nokia that Maemo is now independent entity from Nokia, that should suffice23:26
DocScrutinizer05for sure not to ignore the mails regarding GC transfer that techstaff sends to HiFo and instead bully out techstaff coordinator (who's supposed to handle and guard exactly such permissions, passwords, certs etc)23:26
DocScrutinizer05council can't become GC. only a single person can become GC23:27
juicemecan it be agreed that it is transferred to someone in the Council every 6 months?23:27
RzRany volounter ?23:28
juicemeI mean it cannot be really that rigid, it's just flags in the irc server23:28
peterleinchen_not really a good idea, as all info needs to be transferred and a lot will get lost "Stille Post"23:28
RzRassign this to me if none23:28
DocScrutinizer05right, the agreement been that HiFo explains (to freenode CC techstaff CC council) that maemo[TM] now gets/got transferred to HiFo and thus HiFo owns the maemo namespace on IRC and appoints e.g. Mr Reisenweber for their maemo GC23:29
juicemeRzR, I'd like you to sort it out if you want to volunteer. :)23:29
peterleinchen_rzr: this means you are hijacked for next 10 councils :)23:30
RzRand the GC should ensure it will be xfered each 6 months23:30
DocScrutinizer05forget it23:30
DocScrutinizer05freenode will need 6 months to transfer it23:30
juicemehuh?23:31
peterleinchen_uh oh23:31
RzRpeterleinchen_: hijacked by who ?23:31
juicemethat difficult?23:31
RzRthen what is FN period time ?23:31
DocScrutinizer05btw GC should understand what's a GC23:31
RzRtrue23:32
peterleinchen_absolutely23:32
DocScrutinizer05afk23:32
juicemeah, https://freenode.net/group_registration.shtml23:33
RzRwas reading the FAQ23:33
RzRwho is alternate contact ?23:34
juicemeTry the command "/msg chanserv access #maemo list"23:36
juicemethat shows who has different access levels23:36
DocScrutinizer05my info is that x-fade is maemo* GC. We either convince freenode or xfade to add somebody of community as second GC23:37
DocScrutinizer05juiceme: only xfade is owner of the chan and has rights to edit that access list23:37
DocScrutinizer05only xfade can get new cloaks from freenode23:37
juicemeyes, I see it now23:38
DocScrutinizer05xfade is MIA23:38
RzRwell lets try to contact him again23:38
RzRor someone who knows him23:39
juicemeRzR had information that he'd be with Jolla now23:39
RzRthen shouldnot be a problem23:39
juicemeRzR, maybe you can get in contact with him?23:39
RzRyes23:39
RzRwill keep u up to date23:39
RzRnext topic now ?23:39
RzRthat one will resume on next meeting23:40
DocScrutinizer05you better sort you topics what to ask him for. you might not have the opportuinity to chat with him to find out what you actually want him to do23:40
RzRremmber i am the hunter man ;)23:40
juicemegood :)23:41
DocScrutinizer05so what?23:41
DocScrutinizer05win7mac approach? when one mail doesn't result in right answer, send 20 more?23:41
juicemenext task, wiki page has been updated23:41
RzRjust at least see if he is ok to work with new maemo council23:41
DocScrutinizer05he's not ojk to work for maemo anymore. That's pretty obvious23:42
juicemethen there are some things about harmattan23:42
peterleinchen_he is not ok to work for23:42
DocScrutinizer05and "work" includes answering mails here. Particularly not when it's 20 mails in one week23:42
peterleinchen_but maybe let us do the work23:42
juicemeDocScrutinizer05, if that's so, then he should have no reason to step down, rihjt :)23:43
RzRso there is no reason for him to hold this maemo role23:43
chem|stthe issues about ownership will be solved, either server-certs or irc-namespaces23:43
juicemechem|st, hi23:43
peterleinchen_huh? hi.23:43
DocScrutinizer05there's all reason he will ignore you when you don't know what to ask him for23:43
RzRtell me if i am wrong but to what i read maemo cg is not working anymore23:44
DocScrutinizer05chem|st: may we ask you to please share a less cryptic statement? one that at least allows some conclusion23:45
RzRso anyone who want to adopt this role will be better than none23:45
chem|stwhen the maemo ownership or licensing is solved, all related issues are solveable by an email23:45
DocScrutinizer05aha. great finding23:46
juicemethat's good to know23:46
DocScrutinizer05iirc that been your statement 6 months ago as well23:46
peterleinchen_I do not get it.23:47
chem|ststill standing23:47
peterleinchen_maemo belongs to ???23:47
chem|stnokia23:47
DocScrutinizer05and still useless to solve our problems23:47
chem|stDocScrutinizer05: get the terms setup...23:47
RzRand nokia belongs to ???23:47
chem|stRzR: nokia23:48
peterleinchen_oh; I thought HiFo already :(23:48
chem|stRzR: nokia did not transfer patents or trademarks, they are licensed iirc23:48
juicemeand "maemo" was not one of those that Microsoft licensed23:49
chem|stwe need to get the website straight or nokia will not grant us anything23:49
RzRand afaik maemo is a nokia TM23:49
RzRis there a reason to xfer it elsewhere ?23:50
RzRwell i may be late in topic23:50
juicemechem|st, is this related to the statement you have here: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=9347623:50
chem|stownership is one thing, licensing another...23:50
DocScrutinizer05the right thing to do: mail x-fade CC freenode staff CC council about missing cloaks and other stuff and suggest that somebody of thechstaff gets a co-GC for maemo namespace, to handle cloaks etc instead of x-fade who obviously isn't interested in doing that anymore23:50
RzRbut maybe he is not supposed to xfer nokia related tech23:51
RzRie irc23:52
DocScrutinizer05I initiated all that and discussed the whole shit with freenode staff, but HiFo completely ignored the whole thing23:52
chem|stjuiceme: that is exactly what we need to have in line (green part), the terms of use might need some love too but everything considered licensing and ownership remains the way it is.23:52
DocScrutinizer05RzR: he needs not transfer, he can grant a co-GC23:52
chem|stDocScrutinizer05: yes on purpose... you are not in a position to request anything23:52
DocScrutinizer05aha, and you are mot in a posiution to utter such nonsense23:53
RzRok lets go in this direction23:53
chem|styou know what doc... I have 4 other councilors to talk to, how about you leave me alone with your utter BS for good?23:53
RzR1st mc member become alt contact23:53
juicemechem|st, do I understand correctly that nothing needs to be done for the 4 last documents at all?23:53
DocScrutinizer05I ask 4 other councilors to instruct chem|st to stop his insult and attacks23:54
DocScrutinizer05and hostile behavior23:54
chem|stjuiceme: the TM is owned by nokia and that did not change23:54
chem|stloll23:54
juicemeI think we all should be calm and not take offence with anything/anybody.23:55
RzRjuiceme: +123:55
peterleinchen_why you two so upset (again?)?23:56
DocScrutinizer05go ahead, speculate and insult all you want. I'm fed up with idiotic behavior of some HiFo members23:56
juicemeI think the approach suggeted by DocScrutinizer05 is what should be tried, to get someone else as deputy GC23:56
chem|stanything else yo need to know atm? for eV I still did not hear from court and guess that is a good sign23:56
RzRlong story id prefer to ignore23:56
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juicemechem|st, no news is good news :)23:57
RzRan other problem to solve23:57
chem|stjust for the record doc was discharged from his duties a while ago and refuses to handover and leave techstaff23:58
RzRi wont take any position on this23:58
juicemeit is too bad there is bad blood between different operatives23:58
chem|stand doc... this is a recorded channel... I know you read it later!23:58
peterleinchen_a short essay would  be nice, not the long story of irc logs or whatever ...23:59
peterleinchen_and not here !23:59
RzRyes i am sure all of us is valuable for maemo community23:59
RzRyes keep this aside23:59

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