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| *** VDVsx changes topic to "Maemo meeting channel | January sprint meeting" | 16:12 | |
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| VDVsx | have a productive meeting guys :) | 16:12 |
|---|---|---|
| * VDVsx is off to the airport | 16:12 | |
| Texrat | anyone else here yet? | 16:12 |
| X-Fade | Sure | 16:12 |
| Texrat | Hey Niels | 16:12 |
| *** Jaffa has joined #maemo-meeting | 16:19 | |
| bergie | hi, all | 16:20 |
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| Texrat | hey bergie | 16:22 |
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| Jaffa | Texrat: well volunteered :) | 16:22 |
| dneary | hi amm | 16:23 |
| andre__ | hi | 16:23 |
| dneary | all, even | 16:23 |
| feri | hi | 16:23 |
| dneary | Are we starting now? Or in 1 hour? | 16:23 |
| Texrat | 7 min I think | 16:23 |
| Jaffa | Indeed. 14:30 UTC is in 7 mins | 16:24 |
| Texrat | I would coordinate but am too much a noob | 16:24 |
| Texrat | I think Daniel was going to... I'll help | 16:24 |
| Jaffa | (according to my clock, which has the advantage of being set to GMT) | 16:24 |
| Jaffa | Texrat: We were all noobs once | 16:24 |
| * Jaffa would volunteer, but will only be vaguely aware of this window | 16:24 | |
| Texrat | I have no idea how to even start | 16:25 |
| Texrat | no sprint experience | 16:25 |
| X-Fade | Texrat: http://maemo.org/maemo-meeting/maemo-meeting-2009-09-01.html | 16:25 |
| X-Fade | Hmm it seems I haven't updated these logs in a while.. Adding to todo list. | 16:25 |
| dneary | Jaffa, Only 6 months of the year | 16:27 |
| dneary | And I keep forgetting which 6 :) | 16:28 |
| Jaffa | dneary: The winter six ;-) | 16:29 |
| *** jeremiah has joined #maemo-meeting | 16:29 | |
| jeremiah | ehlo | 16:29 |
| Texrat | hey | 16:29 |
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| jeremiah | Hey Texrat | 16:29 |
| Texrat | :) | 16:29 |
| tekojo | good day all! | 16:29 |
| Texrat | thanks for LinkedIn invite | 16:29 |
| jeremiah | :) | 16:30 |
| jeremiah | Hi Tero! | 16:30 |
| Texrat | hei Tero | 16:30 |
| jeremiah | Sorry everyone that I can't run the meeting - but I have this conference call thing in a half hour | 16:30 |
| tekojo | have you agreed who's chair? | 16:30 |
| jeremiah | I don't think so | 16:30 |
| jeremiah | I can start and leave and someone else can take over? | 16:30 |
| X-Fade | Texrat: Said he'll try | 16:31 |
| X-Fade | Scroll up ;) | 16:31 |
| jeremiah | Cool | 16:31 |
| danielwilms | Hi | 16:31 |
| tekojo | Ok, but can I steal a few minutes from the start? | 16:31 |
| jeremiah | Hi danielwilms | 16:31 |
| jeremiah | Indeed! | 16:31 |
| Texrat | well, I can make a lame attempt... but again, I am clueless | 16:31 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: Just go through the Sprint tasks | 16:32 |
| jeremiah | After Tero is done | 16:32 |
| Texrat | plus the only reason I can even attend is becuase I'm at home with respiratory infection...lol | 16:32 |
| jeremiah | Peice of cake | 16:32 |
| Texrat | may not last... | 16:32 |
| jeremiah | Stay off the cigarettes then. | 16:32 |
| Texrat | never smoked | 16:32 |
| Texrat | legacy of past injury | 16:32 |
| jeremiah | That is why you have the infection | 16:32 |
| Texrat | ... | 16:32 |
| jeremiah | Tero, do you want to start? | 16:33 |
| tekojo | Yes, just one thing | 16:33 |
| tekojo | I'd like to change the role X-Fade has in the maemo.org paid staff | 16:33 |
| tekojo | to the direction, where he is more of a team lead for the paid staff | 16:34 |
| jeremiah | w00t! A promotion! :) | 16:34 |
| tekojo | i.e. makes sure that everyone is going in the same direction | 16:34 |
| tekojo | (with no pay raise too!) | 16:34 |
| bergie | congrats X-Fade! :-) | 16:35 |
| tekojo | The idea would be to make the whole thing more focused | 16:35 |
| Texrat | good idea | 16:35 |
| tekojo | and no change to any other roles | 16:35 |
| * Stskeeps agrees | 16:35 | |
| andre__ | great | 16:35 |
| jeremiah | Make sense. There is a lot more to do and having a team leader makes sense | 16:35 |
| tekojo | except maybe me being even more invisible | 16:35 |
| jeremiah | Did I mention it makes sense? | 16:35 |
| Jaffa | +1 | 16:36 |
| X-Fade | I guess that opens up the opportunity to set some Sprint goals for me at least ;) | 16:36 |
| tekojo | So X-Fade will have the additional job of chatting with everyone during the next sprint to get the role cleared | 16:36 |
| Jaffa | Cool | 16:38 |
| tekojo | And I'll just add one more thing part off-topic. any delays X-Fade and ferenc (always forget the irc nick) have had are due to server move | 16:38 |
| Texrat | understood | 16:38 |
| tekojo | I mean the tasks they have had to postpone, things went a bit late and that reflected badly on tashs | 16:38 |
| tekojo | s/tashs/tasks | 16:38 |
| tekojo | I guess that was me, on with the meeting (except if this item needs a discussion now) | 16:39 |
| Stskeeps | no objections from me, happy to see direction in efforts | 16:40 |
| * Jaffa would echo the sentiments, however badly expressed, that we need to be better at communicating (maemo-announce et al) the progress of the server move, timescales, expected downtimes etc. | 16:40 | |
| Texrat | +1 | 16:40 |
| andre__ | yes. | 16:40 |
| Jaffa | But that could be AOB. Just thought I'd get it into the minutes there ;-) | 16:40 |
| X-Fade | As we are configuring 10+ servers all at once, it is a bit hard to report exact progress. | 16:41 |
| tekojo | Jaffa agree, but the logic was better keep quite and then just switch | 16:41 |
| X-Fade | We try to switch over as many separate machines as possible, but we're coming to the point of all or nothing. | 16:41 |
| feri | Jaffa: until now me and Niels were doing most of the job. For a month now we are doing nothing, but crappy admin stuff. Sorry that I did not write novels about my daily routine. | 16:42 |
| Texrat | perhaps we need to disnguish level of detail for mass moves vs normal maintenance | 16:42 |
| Texrat | s/disnguish/distinguish | 16:42 |
| tekojo | I can promise a novel later on, but maybe back to the agenda? | 16:42 |
| Texrat | sure | 16:43 |
| X-Fade | Texrat: I think #maemork gives an idea at least. | 16:43 |
| feri | Jaffa: but for those who are interested I could compose a log of activites from the server logs... bach history and stuff, with timestamps... | 16:43 |
| feri | s/bach/bash ... | 16:43 |
| Texrat | yes | 16:43 |
| Jaffa | feri: This should be taken offline, but it's not the historical account of the move that is of interest. | 16:43 |
| jeremiah | There definitely is some confusion out there. | 16:44 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: It is just basically, request this port to be opened, wait, request diskspace there, wait. | 16:44 |
| X-Fade | Etc. | 16:44 |
| X-Fade | Configure this postfix instance, configure that apache. | 16:44 |
| Texrat | understood, anad again, different activities should have different level of detail reported | 16:44 |
| Texrat | for heads-up | 16:45 |
| X-Fade | I can send an email when a dns change is requested, but I think that gets old real soon? | 16:45 |
| jeremiah | I think people on talk and #maemo just thought that we had forgotten them. | 16:46 |
| Texrat | this may be better topic for list discussion | 16:46 |
| jeremiah | yeah | 16:46 |
| X-Fade | But I think we can give a optimistic time scale? | 16:46 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: There's no published ETA. There's no published roadmap for when services will get better. | 16:46 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: And when fuck ups occur (like the autobuilder recently, or whatever) there's no headsup or monitoring. | 16:47 |
| Jaffa | I suggest this may have sidetracked the main agenda for too long, unless the top task is the server move ;-) | 16:47 |
| X-Fade | This move is so complex that all our regular tasks are basically on hold. | 16:48 |
| Texrat | I'm sure at least some of you saw the email from disgruntled Joe | 16:48 |
| Texrat | we can look at best practices and see what makes sense | 16:48 |
| X-Fade | But I do that to get this over with asap. | 16:48 |
| X-Fade | Don't want to spend any more time fixing broken servers, while configuring the new ones. | 16:48 |
| X-Fade | So yes, things are bad right now. We're seeing an order of magnitude load increase over the last 3 months or so. | 16:49 |
| X-Fade | This doesn't help. | 16:49 |
| jeremiah | Yeah, we really are. | 16:49 |
| jeremiah | Tons of new packages | 16:49 |
| jeremiah | Kind of amazing | 16:49 |
| X-Fade | extras-devel grew 8.2 GB in 2 weeks. | 16:49 |
| Texrat | all expected, though, right? ;) | 16:49 |
| Texrat | anticipated | 16:49 |
| jeremiah | Expected to some degree yeah | 16:49 |
| jeremiah | This is why the servers were bought in 2009 | 16:50 |
| Texrat | plan for worst, hope for best | 16:50 |
| X-Fade | The timing is just unfortunate, but there is nothing we can do. | 16:50 |
| X-Fade | Holidays didn't help either. | 16:50 |
| Texrat | agreed | 16:50 |
| X-Fade | But things are looking better now. | 16:50 |
| jeremiah | Some of the issues are Akamai too, not just garage | 16:50 |
| Texrat | yes, my logins are mostly persistent now :) | 16:50 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: Indeed. However, the suggestion is that something like what you've said is sent to maemo-announce/developers as an update on the single biggest problem facing maemo.org now | 16:50 |
| Jaffa | "Heads down until its fixed" may get it done slightly faster, but will leave people disgruntled in the process. | 16:51 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Realistally we will switch somewhere next week. | 16:52 |
| X-Fade | wow, nice word ;) | 16:52 |
| Texrat | lol | 16:52 |
| Texrat | something a politician would say | 16:52 |
| Texrat | you will fit your new role well :D | 16:52 |
| X-Fade | We'll switch some services even earlier. | 16:53 |
| X-Fade | But the main maemo.org/garage/repository switch will be in one big bang. | 16:53 |
| Jaffa | X-Fade: Wonderful :) Now to let everyone who's not in this channel know :) | 16:53 |
| X-Fade | Jaffa: Go ahead. I'll concentrate on actually getting it done. | 16:54 |
| tekojo | I'll tell the world, tomorrow | 16:54 |
| tekojo | looks like I'll write blog posts all morning | 16:54 |
| jeremiah | heh | 16:54 |
| X-Fade | Good for karma ;) | 16:54 |
| Texrat | it'll be good for you Tero | 16:54 |
| X-Fade | But let's start the Sprint thing itself. | 16:56 |
| Texrat | I wish it would start itself | 16:56 |
| Texrat | buk ok-- what's protocol | 16:56 |
| X-Fade | 1) REVIEW OF LAST SPRINT | 16:57 |
| feri | 9.08-12: thanks Jaffa for completing it | 16:57 |
| X-Fade | https://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo.org_Sprints/December_09 | 16:57 |
| Texrat | got it up... but again I'm a virgin here so it's a bit awkward | 16:57 |
| Jaffa | feri: Thanks for the prod and bergie pointing out the XML API :) | 16:57 |
| Texrat | do I just rattle off the items and ask for update? | 16:58 |
| bergie | Texrat: yep, call tasks and persons | 16:58 |
| Texrat | awesome | 16:58 |
| X-Fade | Texrat: Only non finished ones though ;) | 16:58 |
| Texrat | ah that helps | 16:59 |
| Texrat | ok task 9.09-01 for Daniel | 16:59 |
| Texrat | Push packaging policy updates | 16:59 |
| Texrat | and Niels | 16:59 |
| Texrat | 60% | 16:59 |
| danielwilms | sorry for that...it is still under review | 16:59 |
| Texrat | scope creep? | 17:00 |
| danielwilms | seems to need more updates than it was expected before | 17:00 |
| Texrat | still at 60%? | 17:00 |
| Texrat | or re-evaluate | 17:00 |
| danielwilms | have to carry it over...unfortunately it is not in my hand I can just ask people to help me out there...so 60 is ok | 17:00 |
| Texrat | ok thanks | 17:01 |
| Texrat | any comments? | 17:01 |
| Texrat | ok moving to 9.10-07 | 17:01 |
| Texrat | Server migration, ferenc | 17:01 |
| Texrat | a Must, at 30%... any update? | 17:02 |
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| Texrat | hello Tim, welcome | 17:02 |
| X-Fade | Texrat: Finishing this Sprint, probably next week ;) | 17:02 |
| timsamoff | Hi, sorry... An interview came up! I'll be leaving in a few minutes. | 17:02 |
| Texrat | then it's over 30% now? | 17:03 |
| feri | 30% yes | 17:03 |
| Texrat | awesome Tim, don't let us hold you up from that! | 17:03 |
| feri | will update it as we progress... | 17:03 |
| Texrat | thanks ferenc | 17:03 |
| tekojo | sorry, I need to disappear, but I'll get the details later :-) | 17:03 |
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| Texrat | which brings us to 9.11-01, Refresh maemo.org intro for Quim, at 0%...? | 17:04 |
| timsamoff | Just wanted to report my task. Other than more feedback, it may be complete. But, I'll ask one more time on the list(s). | 17:04 |
| timsamoff | Please move it to next months' tasks. | 17:04 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: I think Quim is still on vacation | 17:04 |
| Texrat | ok | 17:04 |
| jeremiah | But I may be mistaken. | 17:04 |
| jeremiah | Still, he rarely attends these meetings. :p | 17:04 |
| Texrat | well, I doubt anyone else has an update so we'll move on | 17:05 |
| jeremiah | okay | 17:05 |
| Texrat | which is unfortnate given the urgency of that one... | 17:05 |
| Texrat | next one is mine, 9.11-02 maemo Greeter's program | 17:05 |
| Texrat | I just updated to 95% | 17:05 |
| dneary | I said I'd help Quim with that one too | 17:05 |
| Texrat | this one worked out mUCH better than expected | 17:05 |
| dneary | But it kind of passed us by this month | 17:05 |
| Texrat | ok thanks Dave | 17:05 |
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| Texrat | I have some more to tweak documentation wise on Greeters program but it's implemented and working well | 17:06 |
| * timsamoff is on his way. Bye, everyone. | 17:06 | |
| *** timsamoff has left #maemo-meeting | 17:06 | |
| *** guenther is now known as karstenb | 17:06 | |
| Texrat | I'll keep it at 95% for now | 17:06 |
| Texrat | next is 9.11-04 for Stskeeps | 17:07 |
| Texrat | Openness data, Must, 99% | 17:07 |
| Stskeeps | 9.11-04 .. my favourite activity, - openness data is generated but it is proving more and more interesting to find exact definition of what Maemo platform actually is and what the difference between what a device OS contains and it's 'platform is' | 17:08 |
| jeremiah | keepsie? | 17:08 |
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| Stskeeps | been spending a lot of time buried in the old maemopackages list to find a pattern and i've mostly found looking-like-randomly-removed packages to construct a maemo distro/platform | 17:08 |
| archebyte | hello all. | 17:08 |
| Texrat | could the sprint task description be expanded to add more detail? | 17:08 |
| Texrat | or maybe add a link to an explanation | 17:09 |
| Stskeeps | basically it's a web site containing the various status of openness of packages and components in the maemo OS | 17:09 |
| Texrat | I can add that ;) | 17:09 |
| Stskeeps | including where they are developed openly, if they are, etc | 17:09 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Did you talk to Soumya about some of these packages? | 17:10 |
| lcuk | the same info should be available inside too (with the appropriate links) | 17:10 |
| Texrat | description updated, thanks | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: it's only my list of things to do this month, christmas kinda came in the way :) | 17:10 |
| Jaffa | Texrat: BTW, on greeters - if it's up & running - suggest 100% and a sub-task for anything you require additionally. Biggest problem with agile IME is not clearly defined completion criteria which mean tasks drag on and on never reaching 100% | 17:10 |
| Texrat | ok | 17:10 |
| X-Fade | Stskeeps: Ok, keep Soumya in mind as she is responsible for the sdk contents. | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | i will probably be ending up releasing a version with the device OS statistics only and avoid any totals or percentages of openness for the entire thing as it is difficult to compare with Diablo | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | X-Fade: yeah - been basing on the old materials | 17:12 |
| Stskeeps | anyway, moving on to -05, status is as says - open sourcing queue, a place for people to go to request the open sourcing of a component and how do we evaluate it | 17:12 |
| Stskeeps | as a starter i have been adding my info to the idea of using brainstorm for it, and blogged one out of a few posts about the open sourcing process of maemo | 17:13 |
| jeremiah | I saw that post, good one. | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | and how we approach it: http://mer-project.blogspot.com/2010/01/on-perceived-openness-of-maemo-part-one.html | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | next up is using brainstorm for real examples and streamlining the process - which needs BS to be a little faster, so waiting for server move to complete :) | 17:14 |
| Stskeeps | -06 has more movement (SSU), - TI 3d drivers have been showing teasers, spent a while hacking at them to make them show pretty things. jeremiah has helped getting ready for new diablo-SSU repositories | 17:15 |
| bergie | Stskeeps: BS will be a lot faster, we found quite good optimization targets there :-) | 17:15 |
| Texrat | that one is really exciting | 17:15 |
| Texrat | thanks bergie | 17:15 |
| Stskeeps | -07: 0.17 of Mer is around the corner after a lot of trouble. | 17:16 |
| Stskeeps | In general, i handed in my master's thesis in december, so i was bogged down with that for a while | 17:16 |
| jeremiah | Congrats! | 17:16 |
| Texrat | hope that goes well for you Stskeeps | 17:16 |
| Stskeeps | january will be my last month on part-time, so i will be able to take on more activities | 17:16 |
| danielwilms | Stskeeps congrats! | 17:17 |
| Stskeeps | (i've really found out how difficult it is to move from part time to full time to part time, it really messes up your ability to estimate how long time things will take) | 17:18 |
| Stskeeps | .. any comments? | 17:18 |
| Texrat | from me, just great work and thanks :) | 17:18 |
| jeremiah | ditto | 17:19 |
| Texrat | so are we ready to move on? | 17:19 |
| jeremiah | I think so | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | that's it from me then, i'll be carrying on my activities. if anyone would like a breakdown of my public activities in hours, i can easily provide them :) | 17:20 |
| dneary | Me next? | 17:20 |
| Texrat | 9.11-08, Dave Neary, Must, 30% | 17:20 |
| Texrat | No orphaned pages and revise Wiki navigation | 17:20 |
| dneary | 30% is a little low, but wiki work has been BAU this month | 17:20 |
| dneary | We got orphaned pages down pretty far (about 40 - 45), and it's drifted up again over the holidays | 17:20 |
| dneary | The documentation track during the Barcelona weekend was good too | 17:21 |
| Texrat | do you know why orphaned pages increased? | 17:22 |
| Texrat | that seems odd at this point | 17:22 |
| dneary | Texrat, Because people are creating pages with no links going to them | 17:22 |
| Texrat | ah | 17:23 |
| Stskeeps | is there a wiki changes notification list or something? like, a cronjob checking each night for orphans | 17:24 |
| dneary | We're at 68 now | 17:24 |
| Texrat | bergie, is there any way to implement a publishing protocol to prevent that? | 17:24 |
| dneary | Perhaps we didn't get under 50 | 17:24 |
| dneary | Texrat, There's no need | 17:24 |
| bergie | Texrat: this is Mediawiki, not a CMS :-) | 17:24 |
| Texrat | yeah, I know | 17:24 |
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| dneary | Texrat, Just better wiki maintenance :) | 17:24 |
| Texrat | well, it would be nice IF some preventive measure could be implemented | 17:24 |
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| Texrat | better to avoid it upfront | 17:25 |
| dneary | Anyway, I'm wondering if it makes sense to keep this as a task, or whether this just counts as BAU | 17:25 |
| jeremiah | Or perhaps just make a mentin of it | 17:25 |
| Texrat | but maybe it's just an educational issue | 17:25 |
| dneary | X-Fade, Boss, what do you think? | 17:25 |
| Texrat | ^ | 17:25 |
| dneary | :) | 17:25 |
| Texrat | I think since it's ongoing it's BAU | 17:25 |
| jeremiah | I think the Boss has his feet up and is smoking a cigar | 17:26 |
| X-Fade | I think you should just monitor recent changes every once in a while to see what's up? | 17:26 |
| X-Fade | The javascript version of that page is pretty decent? | 17:26 |
| Texrat | whole lotta thinking going on | 17:26 |
| Texrat | or maybe not | 17:28 |
| jeremiah | heh | 17:28 |
| X-Fade | Let's keep the task for this month and review if there were a lot of changes. | 17:28 |
| X-Fade | For better or worse. | 17:28 |
| Texrat | move on? | 17:29 |
| jeremiah | Yes. | 17:29 |
| jeremiah | That would make me next | 17:30 |
| jeremiah | 9.11-10 | 17:30 |
| jeremiah | This is done, http://shadowfax.dlinkddns.com/nokia.html | 17:30 |
| Texrat | shows 100% | 17:30 |
| jeremiah | ^^ Fun little prototype | 17:30 |
| jeremiah | Designed to be viewed in the N900 | 17:30 |
| Texrat | nice work | 17:30 |
| jeremiah | but I suspect people won't be filing ITPs on the device. :P | 17:31 |
| bergie | maybe that could be later integrated to maemo.org/packages ? | 17:31 |
| jeremiah | bergie: It already is | 17:31 |
| bergie | ah, cool | 17:31 |
| jeremiah | It scans an index of package names | 17:31 |
| jeremiah | And then says: wait! We already have that | 17:31 |
| Texrat | cool | 17:31 |
| jeremiah | But this will have to wait to the new servers so I can deploy it | 17:31 |
| jeremiah | But the code is done | 17:31 |
| X-Fade | Technically that should say 'uses' and not 'integrated' ;) | 17:32 |
| Texrat | good to know | 17:32 |
| jeremiah | X-Fade: Okay, I'll change that | 17:32 |
| bergie | ok, so from "uses" to "integrated" maybe later :-) | 17:32 |
| Texrat | anything else? | 17:32 |
| jeremiah | 9.11-11 | 17:32 |
| jeremiah | I have installed reprepro on the new repos server | 17:33 |
| jeremiah | it has a kernel inotify scheduler built in | 17:33 |
| jeremiah | and some other goodies | 17:33 |
| jeremiah | So I think it will keep the size of the repos smaller | 17:33 |
| jeremiah | Which hopefully means faster | 17:33 |
| jeremiah | Plus it will be easier to add / remove / manage things | 17:33 |
| jeremiah | I think Niels will have me testing a lot of this stuff soon | 17:34 |
| Texrat | once he's into full Boss mode | 17:34 |
| jeremiah | That's it for now for those two. | 17:34 |
| Texrat | ok thanks jeremiah | 17:34 |
| Texrat | any questions? | 17:34 |
| jeremiah | I think he has a list for me this month. :) | 17:34 |
| Texrat | 9.12-1, Working bugzilla 3.4, migration path notes, Must, Andre and Karsten | 17:34 |
| X-Fade | Yes, let's move the server first and then get reprepro tested. | 17:34 |
| jeremiah | okay | 17:34 |
| andre__ | karstenb is on that one | 17:35 |
| Texrat | 70% still? | 17:35 |
| karstenb | Yes -- making progress, but got delayed, due to infra changes (which is very good in the long run), holidays, and generally only having a few hours per week. | 17:35 |
| karstenb | Depending on the time I'll get to spend on the tasks this month, I hope to get it (near?) finished. Proposing must, must and should respectively for 9.12-1, 5 and 7. | 17:35 |
| feri | karstenb: what's wrong with test.maemo.org wher testzilla is running? | 17:36 |
| karstenb | feri: Nothing is wrong. | 17:37 |
| jeremiah | test.maemo.org is moved | 17:37 |
| feri | today, or tomorrow i will proceed withe moving bugs.maemo.org... | 17:37 |
| karstenb | It's just that moving stuff costs time... | 17:37 |
| karstenb | Hence some part of the delay. | 17:37 |
| karstenb | The new machine is *much* faster, so hacking on it will be more productive and fun now. :) | 17:38 |
| andre__ | feri: if that means a break in service availability, please tell me before :-P | 17:38 |
| feri | but i think you can complete 9.12-1 on test.maemo.org | 17:38 |
| feri | i will update you about the live server, don't worry | 17:38 |
| karstenb | feri: Yes. | 17:38 |
| feri | but what stops you working on test.maemo.org? | 17:39 |
| feri | that's what i don't get | 17:39 |
| karstenb | I didn't say that, did I? | 17:39 |
| feri | if there is something pls let me know. | 17:39 |
| jeremiah | I personally can't reach test.maemo.org | 17:39 |
| jeremiah | I mean, the old server is gone. | 17:39 |
| feri | i understood the comment in the wiki page like that | 17:39 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah: No, it is still there. Only dns changed. | 17:40 |
| feri | 9.12-1: Making progress, some lagging due to new infra (which is very good in the long run) | 17:40 |
| karstenb | Hmm. :/ No, there's nothing stopping me from using test.m.o, and I did use it. | 17:40 |
| feri | so maybe a wiki update then? | 17:40 |
| feri | ;) | 17:40 |
| Texrat | alway a good thing ;) | 17:40 |
| karstenb | feri: Yes, a lag -- moving stuff between machines cost time, and thus I was lagging... | 17:40 |
| feri | ok. | 17:41 |
| Texrat | any further discussion? | 17:41 |
| Texrat | ok... | 17:41 |
| Texrat | 9.12-2 SSO: Testing/deployment user-management backend Must indeyets 90% | 17:41 |
| Texrat | updates? | 17:42 |
| Texrat | brb-- need to get cough medicine quickly | 17:42 |
| bergie | Texrat: indeyets sent some emails about that to community list, but is IIRC now on holiday in Riga | 17:43 |
| danielwilms | Texrat this is the mail I won't be able to participate this time (there is a chance, but it is highly unlikely). I will try to update status on wiki. Here is the summary: "must" task is done, "should" task is almost done, but needs a final touch and deployment | 17:43 |
| Texrat | back | 17:43 |
| Texrat | ok thanks | 17:43 |
| Texrat | any discussion? | 17:44 |
| Texrat | if not... | 17:44 |
| Texrat | I'm up again | 17:44 |
| Texrat | 9.11-3 Maemo event flyer (initial) Must texrat 90% | 17:44 |
| Texrat | I have a version 3.2 floating around for feedback | 17:44 |
| jeremiah | Saw that - and Tim helped out a bit too | 17:45 |
| Texrat | but will be followed by a 4.0, and it will come down to one of those two | 17:45 |
| Texrat | yes | 17:45 |
| Texrat | unless someone else proposes their own ;) | 17:45 |
| Texrat | but anyway what I have will work for now, and we can refine/replace as we go | 17:45 |
| anidel | it should be localized | 17:45 |
| Texrat | absolutely anidel | 17:45 |
| Texrat | here's plan in a nutshell: | 17:46 |
| anidel | good.. I was thinking of localizing it in Italian for the upcoming (hopefully) Maemo Italian Weekend | 17:46 |
| Texrat | I will pilot in Texas, and as the process is developed... | 17:46 |
| anidel | and distributing it around | 17:46 |
| anidel | cool | 17:46 |
| Texrat | I will ask for coordinators in other regions | 17:46 |
| Texrat | and start cultivating formal volunteer outreach | 17:46 |
| X-Fade | We need to see if we can speed up a bit guys ;) | 17:47 |
| Texrat | Just have to get Nokia to agree to fund it once it's rolling | 17:47 |
| Texrat | ok | 17:47 |
| Texrat | anyway any questions on this one? | 17:47 |
| Texrat | please review proposals as they come and provide feedback | 17:47 |
| X-Fade | Texrat: There was a lot of visible progress, so tha is good. | 17:47 |
| Texrat | yes | 17:47 |
| Texrat | I do still need suggestions on back side, whoch will summarize developer details | 17:48 |
| Texrat | I have something, but i would prefer help from sone oen with expertise | 17:48 |
| Texrat | so any volunteers welcome | 17:48 |
| Texrat | on to next item | 17:48 |
| Texrat | 9.11-4 CLI application icon for HAM Must timsamoff 80% | 17:48 |
| Texrat | Tim said earlier he will update | 17:49 |
| * Jaffa has used it on his TinyFugue package | 17:49 | |
| jeremiah | I saw the links to the logo and they look good | 17:49 |
| joppu | Hi everyone! I'm probably a uninvited guest here, but I'd like to give so feedback on timsamoff's icon. I really think it looks a bit 90ish and it's not really fitting the Fremantle UI. I would personall prefer something more like this: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/805039/maemo/cli_mockup.png | 17:49 |
| Texrat | he is interviewing for a job right now and let's all be hopeful! | 17:49 |
| Jaffa | joppu: Fancy replying to the mailing list thread? | 17:49 |
| anidel | Jaffa: yeah, I saw Tim's tweet about it | 17:49 |
| * anidel wishes the best to Tim | 17:50 | |
| Texrat | joppu: as Jaffa said, there is a list discussion and Tim has expressed disappointment in feedback lack | 17:50 |
| Jaffa | I still think the icon solution is the best one in the short term to the CLI apps problem | 17:50 |
| Texrat | agreed | 17:50 |
| Jaffa | So more icon choices to get a design feedback loop going is a Good Thing[TM] | 17:50 |
| Jaffa | joppu's has many positives :) | 17:50 |
| jeremiah | They're both good. | 17:51 |
| joppu | Thanks, I'll continue this discussion on the mailing list | 17:51 |
| Texrat | awesome, thanks | 17:51 |
| jeremiah | thanks joppu | 17:51 |
| Texrat | moving on | 17:51 |
| Texrat | 9.09-10 Implement SSO sync-API endpoint for garage Should danielwilms 50% | 17:51 |
| danielwilms | it is almost done, restarted working on this, have to figure out with indeyets how to test it properly | 17:51 |
| Texrat | then higher than 50%? | 17:52 |
| danielwilms | 80 | 17:52 |
| X-Fade | I kind of stole Daniel's hardware. | 17:52 |
| X-Fade | Sorry. | 17:52 |
| jeremiah | heh | 17:52 |
| danielwilms | hehe X-Fade still running on machines under my desk | 17:52 |
| Texrat | I just updated | 17:52 |
| feri | X-Fade: which remonds me to request a new VM for SSO :( | 17:52 |
| X-Fade | He should get a new VM soon. | 17:52 |
| feri | s/remonds/reminds | 17:53 |
| jeremiah | Redmonds? | 17:53 |
| Texrat | no! | 17:53 |
| X-Fade | danielwilms: Yeah, but I actually stole the new hardware. Or repurposed it at least. | 17:53 |
| feri | jeremiah: no way | 17:53 |
| * Texrat exorcises redmond demon that jeremiah invoked | 17:53 | |
| danielwilms | X-Fade heard about that ;) | 17:53 |
| jeremiah | :) | 17:53 |
| Texrat | it was updated to 80%, anythign else? | 17:54 |
| danielwilms | not from my side | 17:54 |
| Texrat | ok I assume we skip Quim again? :D | 17:54 |
| Texrat | 9.10-13 Distribute 'Fixed In Fremantle' shirts to contributors that didn't make it to the Summit Should qgil 0% | 17:54 |
| Texrat | or is that one left to die passively? | 17:55 |
| Texrat | ah well | 17:55 |
| Texrat | 9.10-14 Create a RFP (Request for Packaging) interface just like the ITP Should jeremiah 60% | 17:55 |
| dneary | Is there a lot of past tasks left? I'd like feedback on tasks for the next month | 17:55 |
| anidel | it's probably only on hold... | 17:55 |
| jeremiah | Yeah, that is pretty much a copy of the ITP | 17:56 |
| Texrat | dneary: we're almost done | 17:56 |
| *** VDVsx has quit IRC | 17:56 | |
| Texrat | tryign to speed up | 17:56 |
| jeremiah | So once I get access to a public CGI dir, should be ready to go | 17:56 |
| Texrat | over 60% then? | 17:56 |
| jeremiah | Still, it might get pushed down the list depending on the upcoming tasks. | 17:56 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: Sure - 80% | 17:56 |
| *** VDVsx has joined #maemo-meeting | 17:56 | |
| Texrat | 9.12-5 BMO: maemo.org custom features backport, Nokia patches Should Andre, Karsten 0% | 17:57 |
| X-Fade | It is a should, not a must ;) | 17:57 |
| Texrat | right | 17:57 |
| andre__ | but where's the request for my 9.10-15 feedback? :-P | 17:57 |
| andre__ | 9.12-5 has been covered by Karsten before here already | 17:57 |
| karstenb | Texrat: I covered all 3 tasks in my initial comment :) | 17:57 |
| Texrat | oh right, sorry | 17:57 |
| Texrat | <-- noob | 17:58 |
| karstenb | Depending on the time I'll get to spend on the tasks this month, I hope to get it (near?) finished. Proposing must, must and should respectively for 9.12-1, 5 and 7. | 17:58 |
| karstenb | Still proposing that. :) | 17:58 |
| * andre__ just posts what he wants to write about 9.10-15 | 17:58 | |
| andre__ | 9.10-15: bugday went okay. was definitely nice to talk to the bugsquadders and community members, and we have the IRC channel #maemo-bugs now which is great for community building, but basically there were no "new" people around that had never taken a look at bugzilla before. Planning to repeat it this month, wondering how to improve announcing it and whether to set a topic (and how to define it - a poll in talk maybe?). Nice that | 17:58 |
| andre__ | Tero offered to also announce the bugday on internal mailing lists | 17:58 |
| Texrat | ok | 17:58 |
| jeremiah | Bug day rocked | 17:58 |
| Texrat | sorry I missed it :( | 17:58 |
| andre__ | np :-) | 17:59 |
| anidel | it's a very good one indeed | 17:59 |
| Texrat | I am assuming we can move past 9.12-6 SSO: midgard syncing with usermanagement-server Should indeyets 30% | 17:59 |
| jeremiah | yep | 17:59 |
| Texrat | which brings us to 9.10-09 Prototype library.maemo.org Could dneary 0% | 17:59 |
| dneary | Unchanged - no progress this month | 18:00 |
| Texrat | ok | 18:00 |
| Texrat | 9.10-10 Add extra info fields from control files to interface - Changelog Could X-Fade 0% | 18:00 |
| dneary | Although I hear that there's a working prototype inside Nokia | 18:00 |
| Texrat | good t know | 18:00 |
| X-Fade | No progress, carrying on to next month | 18:00 |
| Texrat | and no Quim for 9.11-16 Update Fremantle roadmap Could qgil 0% | 18:00 |
| Texrat | so daniel is up for 9.11-17 Implement new UI for the application-downloader Could danielwilms, wazd 40% | 18:01 |
| X-Fade | Looking nice! :) | 18:01 |
| Texrat | still at 40%? | 18:01 |
| danielwilms | got the last ui-changes just before christmas | 18:01 |
| danielwilms | but backend is improved a lot | 18:02 |
| danielwilms | new REST-API changes are implemented | 18:02 |
| jeremiah | Will we be able to update more than one package at a time? | 18:02 |
| anidel | can we do that already ? | 18:02 |
| anidel | you meant "install" ? | 18:02 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah: It is not used for updating. | 18:02 |
| jeremiah | ah, okay | 18:03 |
| danielwilms | this is still done by the HAM | 18:03 |
| danielwilms | as soon as the new servers are online I will put a version into extras devel | 18:04 |
| danielwilms | jeremiah then you can try it ;) | 18:04 |
| Texrat | danielwilms: is progress stil at 40%? | 18:04 |
| jeremiah | :) | 18:04 |
| danielwilms | let's say a bit more, 60 % is done | 18:04 |
| Texrat | updated to 60% | 18:05 |
| Texrat | ok, that's it for the outstanding list... | 18:05 |
| Texrat | would someone else like to lead for the rest? | 18:05 |
| jeremiah | okay - on to January tasks | 18:05 |
| jeremiah | I am happy to do it if you like | 18:05 |
| Texrat | please, thanks | 18:06 |
| Texrat | I may have to bail... not feeling well | 18:06 |
| jeremiah | Get some rest Texrat | 18:06 |
| jeremiah | And thanks ! | 18:06 |
| Texrat | I'm goign to try to stay | 18:06 |
| jeremiah | Niels - is there stuff you have on your priority list? | 18:06 |
| bergie | I've got some things | 18:06 |
| jeremiah | Things that you think should be taken up first? | 18:06 |
| jeremiah | go for it bergie | 18:06 |
| anidel | have a nice rest Texrat and get well soon | 18:07 |
| X-Fade | Extras-testing / package interface improvements for me. | 18:07 |
| Texrat | I'm going to stay on... I have one item to add when we get to it | 18:07 |
| jeremiah | okay | 18:07 |
| X-Fade | But VDVsx will probably make a list and I'll add separate tasks for that. | 18:07 |
| bergie | 1) Set up maemo.org on top of Midgard2 on internal for testing purposes | 18:07 |
| jeremiah | Alright, I thought I saw VDVsx here | 18:07 |
| bergie | 2) Midgard optimizations on new servers | 18:08 |
| danielwilms | I will take over the tasks and see if I can install it then on the VM that we can start with the testing at some point | 18:08 |
| jeremiah | alright. | 18:08 |
| bergie | 3) Quim wanted a location-based view of maemo.org users | 18:08 |
| jeremiah | bergie: That'll be cool | 18:08 |
| jeremiah | Tero wants some one to write a Gowalla client, but that is off-topic | 18:09 |
| jeremiah | So andre__; What is on the sprint list for you in January? | 18:09 |
| jeremiah | I'm going to go through alphabetically. | 18:09 |
| andre__ | as lame as it sounds: another bugday, plus trying to cope with the flood of reports? :-/ | 18:10 |
| jeremiah | That doesn't sound lame to me. | 18:10 |
| andre__ | heh | 18:10 |
| judetomi | i could do some site building stuff. | 18:10 |
| jeremiah | danielwilms: What is on your plate? | 18:11 |
| dneary | I want to improve the documentation of what we do | 18:11 |
| andre__ | well. the huge amount of bug reports currently really pushes me to the limits... but I don't want to complain :-P | 18:11 |
| dneary | Which means I need to know what needs documenting, and annoy the hell out of everyone for a while | 18:11 |
| jeremiah | dneary: I have you seen the internal wiki about the servers? | 18:11 |
| dneary | jeremiah, No | 18:11 |
| dneary | There's an internal wiki? | 18:11 |
| jeremiah | That is quite useful | 18:11 |
| dneary | (see, this kind of stuff) | 18:11 |
| jeremiah | Well, sorta internal | 18:11 |
| danielwilms | finishing the tasks from the last month and see if I can install the SSO stuff then on the VM that we can start with the testing at some point | 18:11 |
| jeremiah | It really is just a place to organize who has logins to what IP and what software is running there. | 18:12 |
| jeremiah | danielwilms: Okay, cool | 18:12 |
| jeremiah | So we'll carry over your tasks? | 18:12 |
| danielwilms | yep | 18:12 |
| jeremiah | awesome | 18:12 |
| dneary | jeremiah, URL? | 18:12 |
| jeremiah | dneary: I pull it up for you in a sec. :) | 18:13 |
| jeremiah | feri: What do you have cooking? | 18:13 |
| jeremiah | Aside from tons and tons of server config? | 18:13 |
| X-Fade | jeremiah: feri will finish server move and then take a well deserved vacation. | 18:13 |
| jeremiah | :) | 18:13 |
| jeremiah | Cool, good for him | 18:13 |
| jeremiah | indeyets may not be here? | 18:13 |
| feri | jeremiah: just like X-Fade said. thanks X-Fade., | 18:14 |
| jeremiah | So next is me | 18:14 |
| jeremiah | reprepro has to be up and running | 18:14 |
| jeremiah | I have to do a lot of testing to make sure the repos run smoothly | 18:14 |
| jeremiah | And I want to be available for X-Fade if he wants me to do stuff | 18:14 |
| jeremiah | So that is what I am going to have for January. | 18:14 |
| X-Fade | Sounds like a good goal. It is really needed. | 18:15 |
| jeremiah | Quim isn't here | 18:15 |
| jeremiah | Keepsie? | 18:15 |
| jeremiah | What are your plans? | 18:15 |
| Stskeeps | my plan is to finish up 0.17 release and work on the open sourcing queue | 18:15 |
| jeremiah | Awesome | 18:15 |
| jeremiah | Love to play with Mer when .17 comes out | 18:15 |
| Stskeeps | also flying to a cold place so i will be catching up on some issues | 18:15 |
| dneary | Plus, I have the co-ordination of Maemo presence in FOSDEM this month | 18:15 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: Are you still here? | 18:16 |
| Texrat | yes | 18:16 |
| jeremiah | dneary: That will be fun, FOSDEM! | 18:16 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: Plans for January? | 18:16 |
| Stskeeps | dneary: i've (sadly) have to back down on that as my thesis defense is the day before | 18:16 |
| dneary | jeremiah, In the end, I put in a proposal for the distro track on the community council as a governance model | 18:16 |
| jeremiah | Stskeeps: You're not going to Brussels? | 18:16 |
| jeremiah | dneary: Interesting. | 18:16 |
| dneary | I'd be happy to co-present with a council member, or even cede my place, if it's selected | 18:16 |
| dneary | Stskeeps, What do you mean? | 18:17 |
| bergie | I'll be in FOSDEM too, BTW | 18:17 |
| jeremiah | Maybe Valerio? | 18:17 |
| dneary | If it was the day after I could understand | 18:17 |
| dneary | The day before is perfect! | 18:17 |
| Texrat | I'll go to FOSDEM if it's sponsored :D | 18:17 |
| jeremiah | Otherwise everyone else on the council is in North America(?) | 18:17 |
| X-Fade | dneary: No, because you miss the beer event then ;) | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | dneary: was originally planning on going to FOSDEM and proposing a talk etc, but i have to present a master's thesis day before and won't be very representative :) | 18:17 |
| dneary | There are a few maemo-related proposals that went into the mobile-embedded track - none that I know of in the desktop track, though | 18:17 |
| jeremiah | Stskeeps: But you'll be there? | 18:17 |
| Stskeeps | jeremiah: no, it'll be too crazy | 18:17 |
| jeremiah | bummer | 18:18 |
| dneary | Texrat, Not everything can be a free ride | 18:18 |
| Texrat | I know, I know | 18:18 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: okay, if you have no January stuff I'll move on to timsamoff | 18:18 |
| jeremiah | tim? | 18:18 |
| Texrat | I do | 18:18 |
| jeremiah | Not here | 18:18 |
| Texrat | I will mark Greeters launch as 100%, and start subtask to fix documentation | 18:18 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: cool | 18:18 |
| Texrat | Also need to finish outreach flyer | 18:18 |
| jeremiah | VDVsx: Do you have anything for January that you want to mention now? | 18:19 |
| Texrat | and new task... | 18:19 |
| jeremiah | Texrat: But wait there is more textrat! | 18:19 |
| Texrat | whitepaper for "user experience" infrastructure | 18:19 |
| jeremiah | Yikes. Sounds ambitious | 18:19 |
| Texrat | have started, but need MUCH developer help | 18:19 |
| Texrat | yes, it's soemthign people keep clamoring for but doesn't get started | 18:19 |
| Texrat | something* | 18:19 |
| jeremiah | SOunds like a mailing list thing | 18:19 |
| Texrat | well | 18:20 |
| Texrat | first attila77 and i will construct a proposal | 18:20 |
| jeremiah | Well, I already hit X-Fade, so that is everyone. | 18:20 |
| Texrat | then start discussion around it | 18:20 |
| jeremiah | Anyone else with a suggestion? | 18:20 |
| Texrat | so anyway that whitepaper is it for me | 18:20 |
| jeremiah | IF not, we can close and people can discuss other stuff. | 18:20 |
| dneary | Any feedback from me? Stuff I need to be working on? | 18:20 |
| dneary | I hope that by the end of the month we'll have all the UI guidelines and the user guide available as HTML | 18:21 |
| jeremiah | That would be good. | 18:21 |
| dneary | One other thing I wanted to raise with the council as an AOB | 18:21 |
| * jeremiah waits two seconds before Any Other Business . . . | 18:21 | |
| jeremiah | okay - Adjourned! | 18:21 |
| jeremiah | Thank you everyone | 18:21 |
| Texrat | thanks | 18:22 |
| jeremiah | Please update the wiki with details on the sprint for January. | 18:22 |
| dneary | AOB | 18:22 |
| bergie | thanks! | 18:23 |
| dneary | Maemo documentation is all published under GNU FDL | 18:23 |
| judetomi | i check out maemo.org site related bugs and try to fix them on January | 18:23 |
| dneary | The wiki legal got set to CC by-sa | 18:23 |
| dneary | They're incompatible licences | 18:23 |
| jeremiah | judetomi: Awesome - thanks. | 18:24 |
| jeremiah | Always need bug fixing, or just more details on bugs | 18:24 |
| jeremiah | GNU FDL and CC by-sa are not compatible? | 18:24 |
| jeremiah | That kinda sucks | 18:25 |
| danielwilms | sorry guys I have to leave...bye bye | 18:25 |
| jeremiah | Bye danielwilms! | 18:25 |
| anidel | bye bye Daniel | 18:25 |
| *** danielwilms has left #maemo-meeting | 18:25 | |
| Stskeeps | dneary: there was something relevant about that recently | 18:25 |
| Stskeeps | hang on | 18:25 |
| dneary | So it looks like we need to clear up the legal framework around the wiki | 18:25 |
| Stskeeps | http://www.gnu.org/licenses/fdl-1.3-faq.html | 18:26 |
| judetomi | i could be more efficient when able to fixing bugs on internal site. hope we will get it running soon | 18:26 |
| Stskeeps | dneary: there was the huge wikipedia changeover recently from fdl to cc sa 3.0 so | 18:26 |
| feri | judetomi: what is wrong with the internal site? | 18:26 |
| Stskeeps | http://lwn.net/Articles/305892/ | 18:27 |
| feri | i installed that like 2 weeks ago or so | 18:27 |
| dneary | Stskeeps, Ah, interesting | 18:27 |
| Stskeeps | dneary: that may be a loophole we can use | 18:27 |
| feri | got to leave now anyway... thanks for the meeting. bye all. | 18:27 |
| judetomi | there are some packages missing and it is not identical to actual site | 18:27 |
| dneary | Maemo stuff is GNU FDL 1.2 | 18:27 |
| Stskeeps | "or later"? | 18:27 |
| feri | judetomi: yeah, packages that are not existing... | 18:27 |
| feri | they can only be built from svn.. | 18:28 |
| feri | and we will end up in a maintenance nightmare if we do that | 18:28 |
| feri | but let's talk about the "right way" of doing things elsewhere, and some other time... | 18:28 |
| feri | by all. | 18:28 |
| *** feri has left #maemo-meeting | 18:28 | |
| jeremiah | ciao feri | 18:29 |
| jeremiah | Just missed him. :) | 18:29 |
| jeremiah | Well, I'm going to go too. Thanks everyone and see you around #maemo-devel :) | 18:29 |
| jeremiah | Bye! | 18:29 |
| * andre__ also goes back to the long "old unread bugmail" queue | 18:30 | |
| *** judetomi has quit IRC | 18:31 | |
| Texrat | I'm out too... thanks all | 18:31 |
| anidel | hi to everyone then | 18:31 |
| *** Texrat has quit IRC | 18:31 | |
| dneary | Bye all | 18:31 |
| dneary | Thanks | 18:31 |
| Stskeeps | dneary: https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4877 as well | 18:31 |
| povbot` | Bug 4877: Request clarification of license for API documentation published | 18:31 |
| bergie | ok, time to head out | 18:33 |
| Stskeeps | dneary: http://maemo.org/legal/terms_of_use/licenses/ Permission is granted to copy, distribute and/or modify such documentation under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License, Version 1.2 or any later version published by the Free Software Foundation. - there's your loophole | 18:33 |
| *** karstenb has quit IRC | 18:33 | |
| dneary | Stskeeps, See the footer of maemo.org/legal though | 18:34 |
| andre__ | bergie: do you know if https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=2085 is fixed already? | 18:35 |
| povbot` | Bug 2085: Same logged in and https behavior as in Garage | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | dneary: well, with a bit of a leap you can argue the other documentation is GNU FDL >= 1.2 which means it does make it all CC.. but have lawyers look into it | 18:36 |
| dneary | Stskeeps, It makes it compatible with CC by-sa 3 | 18:36 |
| dneary | Not identical | 18:36 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 18:37 |
| Stskeeps | true | 18:37 |
| X-Fade | What is the real practical difference between the two licenses? | 18:37 |
| dneary | X-Fade, No real practical difference - just can't mix them | 18:54 |
| dneary | X-Fade, They both require you to give exactly the same rights to people you distribute to that you get | 18:54 |
| dneary | X-Fade, And they both allow you to modify the original work any way you want | 18:55 |
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| VDVsx | back | 19:12 |
| VDVsx | please upload the logs and updates the January sprint page with the new tasks, thanks | 19:13 |
| VDVsx | *update | 19:13 |
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