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| NeKit | I think packages in the repo are going to be build for armhf | 00:13 |
|---|---|---|
| Zungo | interesting | 00:19 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | netkat: aha | 00:48 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | I really wonder who spread that furfy | 00:49 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | one of the points for devuan _was_ armel | 00:50 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | of we had planned to move all maemo to a new arch, we had been (un)able to accomplish that a 5 years ago already | 00:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | if we* | 00:52 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and indeed iirc it been done, a few times. until the point where it inevitably fails, for the closed blobs | 00:53 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | when you want a working maemo - there is one already. If you want a new kernel, I wonder why | 00:54 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | it's not like *maemo* would work better with a new kernel | 00:54 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | at least not on N900 | 00:55 |
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| NeKit | well, what I'm interested in is running Maemo UI/apps on devices other than N900, so it's a new kernel/different set of blobs anyway... | 00:56 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | then why would you want stuff like system settings or gallery or **fennec**? | 00:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I doubt a new platform would make much use of system settings. And gallery is a PoS only needed because it always been like this and camera-ui needs it | 01:01 |
| NeKit | I just tried them as examples of "old" apps | 01:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | and camera-ui in turn also most likely won't work on another platform | 01:01 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | prolly just like mafw and all that uses it: mediaplayer, all audio stuff at large... | 01:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | on telepathy the jury's still out | 01:04 |
| bencoh | actually I don't really see why mafw wouldn't work on other platforms | 01:12 |
| bencoh | you could very well instantiate mafw and its set of plugins (including mafw-gst-renderer) | 01:12 |
| bencoh | iirc it is opensource | 01:12 |
| bencoh | stock mediaplayer isn't; but we already have a working replacement for it, based on mafw as well (openmediaplayer) | 01:13 |
| Zungo | so, whats the problem, reverse engineer everything | 01:16 |
| Zungo | maemo itself comes with apps | 01:16 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | I just don't get it, no matter how hard I try. You can choose to build a armel or a armhf system. You could use powerlernel or a recent 4.x kernel with poor support for some of N900 peripherals. When you deliberately choose to use incompatible armhf and mainline kernel 4.x, why would you want to run maemo apps on it. Or the other way around: when you want to run maemo apps, why don't you run them on maemo (== armel-powerkernel)? | 03:35 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | even with a 4.x mainline kernel you're still free to choose armel arch | 04:10 |
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| Maxdamantus | Well, in the long run it'll be kind of sucky if people have to use kernels from non-mainline sources. | 05:10 |
| Maxdamantus | like how if you want to use zfs, you're meant to apply some patches first or build some module out of tree. | 05:11 |
| Maxdamantus | or .. nvidia | 05:11 |
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| Maxdamantus | As for "If you want a new kernel, I wonder why", afaik we're sort of forced to use really old software with our current kernel. | 06:07 |
| Maxdamantus | Since recent versions of glibc don't support a kernel this old, and that's what distributors are targetting. | 06:08 |
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| KotCzarny | maxd: for distro makers, maybe. for users there will always be an image with old, smelly kernel, see allwinner situation in case of unsupported socs | 08:25 |
| Maxdamantus | KotCzarny: well, users use what distro makers distribute. | 08:34 |
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| KotCzarny | and sometimes take what they distribute, add some changes and distribute own images | 09:12 |
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| Maxdamantus | Right, but you don't want to depend on that, since those are always outdated and usually only get more outdated. | 09:26 |
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| Maxdamantus | There are already people maintaining the up-to-date systems, which you should be using so you don't have to find some other system that someone has hacked together every few months/years. | 09:27 |
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| freemangordon | any idea how I can get XDG_..._DIR from c code without calling system("xdg-user-dir $DIR"); ? | 19:20 |
| freemangordon | bencoh: KotCzarny: merlin1991: ^^^? | 19:25 |
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| KotCzarny | fmg, is that env var? | 19:42 |
| Wizzup | freemangordon: getenv? | 19:42 |
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| freemangordon | no, it is not env var | 19:47 |
| KotCzarny | what is it then? | 19:48 |
| freemangordon | see $HOME/.config/user-dirs.dirs | 19:48 |
| KotCzarny | if it's custom defined by software and not env var, you would have to mimic the logic to generate them | 19:49 |
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| freemangordon | KotCzarny: there are tools to read and update those files, see xdg-user-dirs package | 19:50 |
| KotCzarny | maybe there is a dir? | 19:50 |
| KotCzarny | s/dir/lib/ | 19:50 |
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| freemangordon | but I can;t find a library to read them :) | 19:50 |
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| freemangordon | there is libxdg-basedir1, but it doesn;t seem to support custom dirs | 19:51 |
| freemangordon | or I don;t understand how it works | 19:51 |
| KotCzarny | rip the source code out of it? | 19:52 |
| freemangordon | this is hackish :( | 19:53 |
| Wizzup | I thought the values in there had to evaluated on start, so they'd end up in the environment | 19:54 |
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| freemangordon | doesn't seem to work like that | 19:55 |
| freemangordon | for example there is no XDG_DOWNLOAD_DIR in the env | 19:56 |
| KotCzarny | https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/XDG_user_directories | 19:57 |
| KotCzarny | seems you have few predefined dirs | 19:58 |
| freemangordon | the same goes for music, videos etc dirs | 19:58 |
| freemangordon | yes, you have, but how to get them by C code? | 19:58 |
| KotCzarny | parse the ~/.config/user-dirs.dirs ? | 19:58 |
| freemangordon | hehe | 19:58 |
| KotCzarny | it should be easy enough | 19:58 |
| freemangordon | and what if the format changes? | 19:58 |
| freemangordon | I'd prefer to use a library if any | 19:59 |
| Wizzup | the way I do it in my software: if it is not in the env, use the default value | 20:00 |
| KotCzarny | yeah, and if format changes, update | 20:00 |
| Wizzup | That doesn't happen very often, though... | 20:00 |
| KotCzarny | you can also start your own lib too | 20:01 |
| KotCzarny | that's how they often are created ;) | 20:02 |
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| freemangordon | well, seems no other way but to call xdg-user-dir :( | 20:10 |
| freemangordon | oh, and to make things even works, seems xdg-user-dir returns $HOME if there is no definition for what you look for, so you can;t distinguish between no definition for a directory and it is defined as $HOME | 20:11 |
| freemangordon | WTF?!? | 20:12 |
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| Wizzup | freemangordon: I think there's something wrong with your setup if it doesn't end up in your environment | 20:25 |
| Wizzup | The way I understood it, it was as simple as: Check if in env, if not in env, go for the specified default | 20:25 |
| Wizzup | I don't have the file in my .config, so I cannot test it, but can't it simply be evaluated from the shell? | 20:26 |
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| Wizzup | It looks like this should be in /etc/profile or .profile | 20:26 |
| KotCzarny | $XDG_DATA_HOME defines the base directory relative to which user specific data files should be stored. If $XDG_DATA_HOME is either not set or empty, a default equal to $HOME/.local/share should be used. | 20:27 |
| KotCzarny | https://specifications.freedesktop.org/basedir-spec/basedir-spec-latest.html | 20:27 |
| Wizzup | Exactly | 20:27 |
| KotCzarny | it's for DATA, there is another for CONFIG too | 20:27 |
| KotCzarny | $XDG_CONFIG_HOME defines the base directory relative to which user specific configuration files should be stored. If $XDG_CONFIG_HOME is either not set or empty, a default equal to $HOME/.config should be used. | 20:28 |
| KotCzarny | so according to standard, you can just getenv() and if empty, use defaults | 20:28 |
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| freemangordon | Wizzup: my setup is what Canonical have set :) | 20:38 |
| Wizzup | then they just want you to default to the env variables :p | 20:38 |
| KotCzarny | so they've used defaults ;) | 20:38 |
| Wizzup | (and if they are not set, set to defaults) | 20:38 |
| freemangordon | no, because this is what I have in the config fie | 20:39 |
| freemangordon | https://pastebin.com/HpBL6FPX | 20:39 |
| Wizzup | The freedesktop.org spec tells -developers- to use the env, and if it is not in the env, use the defaults. They don't tell you to read the config files | 20:39 |
| freemangordon | XDG_NOKIA_CAMERA_DIR is set by me | 20:40 |
| Wizzup | If the configuration does not end up in the enviroment, that's not -your- problem, but the distro issue | 20:40 |
| freemangordon | the other are "stock" | 20:40 |
| Wizzup | Is that specified by the XDG standard? | 20:40 |
| Wizzup | Or is it what maemo uses? | 20:40 |
| Wizzup | If you want the variables in the env and the distro does not set them, try some wrapper script like: #!/bin/sh source .config/xdg-thingie && exec my_program ? | 20:42 |
| freemangordon | Wizzup: this is what Ubuntu uses | 20:48 |
| Wizzup | What do you mean? I don't understand | 20:48 |
| Wizzup | Do you mean the XDG_NOKIA_CAMERA_DIR? | 20:48 |
| freemangordon | Wizzup: pastebin ^^^ is from my PC | 20:48 |
| Wizzup | I realise; but I think we're not communicating well | 20:48 |
| Wizzup | The *proper* (afaik) way to read any XDG setting from a program is to read the environment and fallback to hardcoded defaults | 20:49 |
| freemangordon | that one I set manually by using xdg-user-dirs-update --set NOKIA_CAMERA | 20:49 |
| Wizzup | If they don't end up in the environment, that's a bash profile issue, but an issue in the program | 20:49 |
| Wizzup | e.g. the fix is not to call system() on the xdg-user-dir program, AFAIK | 20:49 |
| Wizzup | But instead to have the environment variables be set before your program is started | 20:50 |
| Wizzup | s/but an/but not an/ | 20:50 |
| freemangordon | hmm, ok | 20:52 |
| freemangordon | thanks, will see what can be done and why those vars are not there | 20:52 |
| Wizzup | The other question is what ubuntu does with variables that start with XDG that are not defined by the XDG spec | 20:53 |
| Wizzup | I don't know if XDG_NOKIA_CAMERA_DIR is defined in the xdg spec, and what the fd.o website says about vars that start with XDG but are not in the XDG spec | 20:54 |
| Wizzup | Perhaps ubuntu somehow filters unknown ones | 20:54 |
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| freemangordon | Wizzup: nokia_camera is deffinitely out of specs | 21:04 |
| KotCzarny | nokia, the former leader of setting standards! | 21:07 |
| buZz | it just follows alt-specs | 21:11 |
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| TheKit | is XDG_NOKIA_CAMERA_DIR for storing camera pictures? | 22:47 |
| Sicelo | yes | 22:53 |
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| TheKit | SailfishOS uses $XDG_PICTURES_DIR/Camera | 23:26 |
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