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| sixwheeledbeast | >100k petitions against the snoopers charter. | 00:05 |
|---|---|---|
| CatButts | when am I going to get an n900 so I can draw cat tats at work without getting fired? | 00:15 |
| CatButts | hahahahahaha | 00:15 |
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| brolin_empey | “<DocScrutinizer05> when ISPs would care about their customers' security at all, they'd ship preconfigured DSL routers instead of running a TR-069 infra” | 10:02 |
| brolin_empey | Telus, a DSL provider in Canada, provides to their DSL customers a crappy all-in-one box with DSL modem, Ethernet switch, Wireless LAN access point, and some useless-to-persons-like-me stuff for television/telephone service all integrated into one device. | 10:02 |
| * brolin_empey wants SDSL instead of ADSL. | 10:03 | |
| brolin_empey | The opposite of AM is FM, not PM. | 10:12 |
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| warfare | Short outage due to misbehaving board/nics in blade-b, we're trying one solution now, will try another tomorrow if this didn't work out. | 16:57 |
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| freemangordon | Pali: any idea what to replace maemo hal with on modern distros? | 20:33 |
| Pali | no :-( | 20:33 |
| Pali | maemo apps needs hal | 20:33 |
| freemangordon | isn't udev a replacement? | 20:33 |
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| KotCzarny | yup | 20:34 |
| KotCzarny | udev | 20:34 |
| Pali | no udev, is not replacement | 20:34 |
| freemangordon | I mean - in terms of functionality | 20:34 |
| L29Ah | what do you need hal for anyway? | 20:34 |
| Pali | udev is just subset of hal features | 20:34 |
| L29Ah | most of its functionality are kludges above sysfs, afair | 20:34 |
| Pali | api is incomaptible | 20:34 |
| KotCzarny | udev is versatile | 20:34 |
| L29Ah | that don't deserve to exist | 20:35 |
| KotCzarny | you can do whole lot of tricks | 20:35 |
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| KotCzarny | o.o | 20:36 |
| freemangordon | KotCzarny: if you are knowledgeabe with udev, could you help with https://github.com/fremantle-gtk3/hald-addon-bme | 20:36 |
| freemangordon | KotCzarny: this is the last thing I need to be able to build mce in devuan jessie | 20:37 |
| KotCzarny | um, not that im knowledgeable, bur udev can exec arbitrary scropts/binaries | 20:37 |
| freemangordon | hmm, this is not the point here | 20:37 |
| freemangordon | hal calls callback functions when a device is added/removed etc | 20:37 |
| KotCzarny | what does it needs to do then? | 20:37 |
| KotCzarny | yes, that's what udev does | 20:38 |
| KotCzarny | it can react on events | 20:38 |
| NotKit | freemangordon, hm, what about diffing mce with Mer version? | 20:39 |
| KotCzarny | for example this is my ghetto auto(u)mounter: http://pastebin.com/raw/qVLLpKA5 | 20:40 |
| freemangordon | NotKit: there is no mce in Mer afaik ;) | 20:40 |
| NotKit | https://git.merproject.org/mer-core/mce/tree/master | 20:40 |
| KotCzarny | you can add events by observing udevadm monitor | 20:40 |
| freemangordon | NotKit: mce in fremantle talks to hald_addon_bme | 20:41 |
| KotCzarny | you can have multiple conditions that needs to match (to differentiate betweeen similar events) | 20:41 |
| freemangordon | KotCzarny: that's great, but I am not sure it is the right time to learn a whole new API :) | 20:42 |
| KotCzarny | nah, think of it as a scripting language ;) | 20:42 |
| KotCzarny | api is too big wor | 20:42 |
| KotCzarny | d | 20:42 |
| KotCzarny | but as i've said, it has ability to run arbitrary script depending on events, which means almost unlimited flexibility | 20:43 |
| freemangordon | KotCzarny: but I don;t want a script, but a daemon | 20:43 |
| KotCzarny | explain? | 20:44 |
| freemangordon | look at what the code ^^^ does | 20:44 |
| freemangordon | KotCzarny: what is the udev way of libhal_device_set_property_string? | 20:45 |
| KotCzarny | never used hal, tbh | 20:46 |
| freemangordon | hmm, seems it will be easier to just build hal | 20:49 |
| KotCzarny | \not really, you want to port it to modern system | 20:49 |
| freemangordon | sure, but not now | 20:49 |
| freemangordon | h-d has higher priority imo | 20:50 |
| KotCzarny | temporarily its fine | 20:50 |
| freemangordon | yeah | 20:50 |
| KotCzarny | but for long term you should define functionality | 20:50 |
| NotKit | will mce run without hald_addon_bme as if it had no data? | 20:50 |
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| freemangordon | NotKit: sure | 20:50 |
| KotCzarny | instead of trying to relearn | 20:50 |
| freemangordon | NotKit: but I don;t wanna start striping functionality | 20:51 |
| KotCzarny | as i understand, something should start on something? | 20:54 |
| KotCzarny | or its bus similar to dbus? | 20:54 |
| freemangordon | both | 20:55 |
| freemangordon | a daemon is started when a device with an "udi" is hotplugged, then this daemon receives events from hal | 20:55 |
| freemangordon | aor something similar | 20:55 |
| freemangordon | *or | 20:55 |
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| KotCzarny | if we dont have hal anymore, it should receive events other way | 21:02 |
| KotCzarny | so there will be porting anyway | 21:02 |
| freemangordon | I'll disable mce battery module for now | 21:03 |
| KotCzarny | what communicates with mce? | 21:04 |
| freemangordon | everything :) | 21:04 |
| KotCzarny | fun | 21:04 |
| KotCzarny | might be good idea to reimplement whole shebang | 21:04 |
| freemangordon | feel free to do it :) | 21:05 |
| KotCzarny | maybe hal should be replaced with udev+dbus mixture | 21:05 |
| freemangordon | maybe | 21:06 |
| KotCzarny | luckily we dont have systemd to worry about | 21:07 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 21:07 |
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| spiiroin | IIRC mce does not actually use the "regular hald battery" properties. there is some even older dbus signaling api that hald-addon-bme just to cater mce's needs | 21:26 |
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| spiiroin | and it should not be that difficult to mod the mce battery plugin to use whatever battery sources you have available | 21:27 |
| freemangordon | spiiroin: correct | 21:29 |
| freemangordon | I just need to find an upstream package that monitors battery/charger and provides dbus interface | 21:29 |
| freemangordon | any idea? | 21:30 |
| KotCzarny | acpi? | 21:30 |
| freemangordon | upower? | 21:30 |
| KotCzarny | apm? | 21:30 |
| KotCzarny | /sys/ interface? | 21:31 |
| NotKit | freemangordon, why not use sysfs? | 21:31 |
| freemangordon | NotKit: from mce? | 21:31 |
| freemangordon | I'd rather not, as there are more plugins that need to monitor the battery/charger status | 21:31 |
| freemangordon | so it is better to have an unified backend that provides dbus interface | 21:32 |
| KotCzarny | fmg, /sys/ interface is standard and good idea | 21:32 |
| spiiroin | for upower there is a plugin in mer mce. the datapipes involved are most likely still the same -> could be used | 21:32 |
| KotCzarny | on thinkpads i have /sys/ interface, on allwinner i have /sys/ interface | 21:32 |
| freemangordon | spiiroin: yep, saw that, thus upower | 21:34 |
| freemangordon | battery applet should be tweaked as well, but thats another story | 21:34 |
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| freemangordon | if it comes to it, then we aleady have working maemo :) | 21:35 |
| spiiroin | the little mce needs is catered by: charger connected, battery percentage (led & power save mode triggering) | 21:35 |
| freemangordon | :nod: | 21:36 |
| freemangordon | and request_charger_status | 21:36 |
| freemangordon | hmm, I'd rather replace hald_addon_bme with a daemon that talks to upower and implements bme interface | 21:38 |
| spiiroin | that might be just due to that legacy^N dbus interface (mce could ask bme & co to resend battery signals it might have missed... which then caused problems for ui side on some circumstances) | 21:39 |
| freemangordon | that way no changes in mce and the other thing that need bme dbus iface will be needed | 21:39 |
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| freemangordon | spiiroin: looking at the code, it is used on init, to get the entry conditions | 21:40 |
| freemangordon | https://github.com/fremantle-gtk3/mce/blob/master/modules/battery.c#L377 | 21:40 |
| spiiroin | freemangordon: yeah, bme starts before mce -> the signals could have gone already | 21:40 |
| spiiroin | side effect that needed some patching somewhere in ui was: restart mce in suitable charging state -> ui sees repeated signaling | 21:41 |
| freemangordon | which is not that bad, given that we are supposed to start services asynchronously | 21:41 |
| spiiroin | sure, but the api is stupid; ask values -> global re-broadcast | 21:42 |
| freemangordon | is it? | 21:42 |
| freemangordon | hmm | 21:42 |
| * freemangordon checks | 21:42 | |
| spiiroin | yes, luckily nobody but mce was listening to those anymore - problem solved | 21:42 |
| freemangordon | iirc battery applet plugin is listening, but I might be wrong | 21:43 |
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| spiiroin | but that might/should be the hal props? | 21:43 |
| spiiroin | i.e. different set of signals from what mce is listening to | 21:44 |
| spiiroin | I could be wrong / mix devices though - it has been a while | 21:44 |
| freemangordon | it is not that important | 21:45 |
| freemangordon | anyway it is not going to be used | 21:45 |
| spiiroin | well, if the hald is gone -> I'd just make mce use some/any more up to date source | 21:46 |
| freemangordon | or rather - it will be used, but I see no problem in broadcasting of the status, so everybody on the party to have common data | 21:46 |
| freemangordon | spiiroin: isn't it better to have a daemon that talks to whatever backend seems appropriate implementing bme interface? | 21:47 |
| freemangordon | no changes in mce will be needed - we can keep common sources with CSSU | 21:47 |
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| freemangordon | hmm, seem slibupower is supported in all modern distros | 21:49 |
| freemangordon | *libupower | 21:49 |
| freemangordon | ok, solution found, needs some coding :) | 21:50 |
| spiiroin | freemangordon: sure, common api is always good; but I would not start by definiing it as "needs to be bme signal compatible" | 21:50 |
| freemangordon | spiiroin: why to change interface? | 21:50 |
| freemangordon | I mean - unless there is a need? | 21:51 |
| freemangordon | There is lots more stuff to be done first - we talk for porting the whole hildon stack to gtk3 | 21:51 |
| freemangordon | sure, if there were 10 fulltime devs eager to work - np, we can change the interfaces every week :) | 21:52 |
| spiiroin | whichever is less work - migrating to new hopefully standard api, or attempting to keep old api alive | 21:52 |
| freemangordon | spiiroin: oh, I aim for both | 21:53 |
| spiiroin | so did hald-addon-bme ;-) | 21:53 |
| spiiroin | warts and all. even signal sending order was carved in stone | 21:53 |
| freemangordon | well, it is not interface's fault that hal was deprecated :) | 21:54 |
| freemangordon | maybe this should be left undecided for now | 21:55 |
| freemangordon | anyway I am not going to write that daemon today | 21:55 |
| freemangordon | could be that KotCzarny is right and we should deal directly with /sys | 21:55 |
| freemangordon | hoping that /sys/class/power_supply ABI is finally stable | 21:56 |
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| * freemangordon wishes more devs to join the effort :) | 21:59 | |
| KotCzarny | fmg: im hacking at something else atm | 22:00 |
| freemangordon | spiiroin: BTW, in case you've missed it, I was able to run cordia h-d on allwinner tablet | 22:00 |
| KotCzarny | fmg: you should be saying 'on mainline linux tablet' | 22:00 |
| freemangordon | well, yeah, on allwinner tablet running devuan jessie | 22:01 |
| freemangordon | with mainline kernal, GPU and WIFI drivers are out-of-tree | 22:01 |
| freemangordon | *kernel | 22:01 |
| KotCzarny | unfortunatelly, be it x86 or arm, 3d accel is usually blobbed :/ | 22:02 |
| freemangordon | KotCzarny: however, cordia h-d was just a POC, it has too much functionality stripped for my taste | 22:02 |
| freemangordon | well, better than nothing | 22:02 |
| KotCzarny | starting point | 22:02 |
| KotCzarny | adding pieces back, one by one | 22:03 |
| KotCzarny | maybe even stick to gtk2 for now? | 22:03 |
| freemangordon | I meant - having 3d accell blobbed is better than nothing | 22:03 |
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| NotKit | KotCzarny, on Atom tablets, 3D accel is open-source, but otherwise kernel support is still limited | 22:03 |
| freemangordon | well, android808 wants gtk3, and he is half of the work force ;) | 22:04 |
| KotCzarny | ;) | 22:05 |
| freemangordon | also I don;t see gtk2->gtk3 as being that much problematic, at least for now | 22:05 |
| freemangordon | gtk2 would mean clutter 0.8 iiuc | 22:05 |
| freemangordon | so yet another deprecated library | 22:06 |
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| fishbulb | will that neo 900 ever have whatsapp or other things that most people use? | 23:14 |
| fishbulb | is it possible to buy a development license for whatsapp or something like that | 23:15 |
| fishbulb | between my tablet that's faster than most phones and this "phone" I'm still not willing to switch to android without at bare minimum a qwerty keyboard | 23:16 |
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